[12:22] <dholbach> good night everybody, i'm off to bed
[12:35] <unkn0wn2u> hey I can't get alsa to work as a normal non root user and when gnome starts it says something about hal failing
[12:39] <crimsun> this belongs in #ubuntu, thanks
[12:39] <unkn0wn2u> crimsun, thanks for all the help
[01:08] <bddebian> Heya bmonty 
[01:09] <bmonty> hi bddebian 
[03:08] <infinity> phlaegel : pong?
[03:12] <bddebian> infinity: phlaegel was wondering why mythplugins built but wasn't showing in the archive
[03:15] <infinity> bddebian : Ahh.  I assume someone explained it to him?
[03:15] <evilryu> ola tem algum brasileiro qui?
[03:23] <phlaegel> infinity: nope.
[03:24] <phlaegel> infinity: bddebian pointed me to you or to lamont
[03:26] <infinity> Well, if I had to guess, I'd say that mythplugins has started generating a new binary package that was never in the archive before.
[03:26] <infinity> So, that needs to be processed before it can be installed.
[03:29] <phlaegel> hm. I guess that would be mythplugins, which seems to be a new metapackage
[03:30] <infinity> Looks that way, yep.
[03:30] <infinity> No big deal, it'll get processed.
[03:30] <phlaegel> ok, thanks
[03:30] <bddebian> infinity: Sorry, I thought that but I wasn't sure.
[03:52] <infinity> w/ii jorton
[04:21] <nihi1> hi people. ;-)
[04:21] <bddebian> Hello nihi1 
[04:22] <nihi1> hello bddebian!
[04:22] <nihi1> are you a developer?
[04:22] <nihi1> obviously in ubuntu
[04:22] <nihi1> ?
[04:23] <bddebian> Not exactly no.
[04:23] <nihi1> oh... why are uhere?
[04:23] <nihi1> :-(
[04:23] <bob2> haha
[04:23] <bddebian> I like to bug people :-)
[04:23] <nihi1> wow
[04:23] <nihi1> lol:
[04:24] <nihi1> bob2: you?
[04:25] <bob2> not really
[04:25] <nihi1> ok
[04:25] <bob2> if you have a question, tho, it's way less annoying if you just ask it
[04:27] <nihi1> what time is it now?
[04:27] <nihi1> there!
[04:27] <bob2> breakfast time
[04:27] <nihi1> ok... well here 4.27 night!
[04:28] <nihi1> not yet breakfast time!
[04:29] <nihi1> i have a Centrino do you know if it works whit latest ubuntu default kernel?
[04:30] <bob2> it works with every ubuntu default kernel
[04:30] <bob2> but this is a #ubuntu discussion, not here
[04:30] <nihi1> i agree!
[04:30] <nihi1> sorry!
[04:31] <nihi1> i'm going!
[06:00] <infinity> Wow, that was some brilliant conversation I missed.
[06:04] <bddebian> ??
[06:08] <bddebian> infinity: libsdl-erlang_blah-1ubuntu1 will push out libsdl-erlang_blah-1 even with an existing dep-wait right?
[06:09] <infinity> -EPARSE
[06:10] <bddebian> Right now libsdl-erlang_0.95.0630-1 is in Dep-Wait for xlibmesa-gl-dev.  I just uploaded libsdl-erlang_0.95.0630-1ubuntu1.  It should replace that in the queue right?
[06:10] <bddebian> Though will probably have to have the dep-wait cleared?
[06:12] <infinity> Right.  The upload will happily go through, but it won't build until the dep-wait is manually whacked.
[06:12] <infinity> Which I can do for you.
[06:12] <Lathiat> hrm.. does anyone else have the large style battery applet, for me it shows empty while its 100% full (and the text tag says 100%, so its not seeing it wrong)
[06:12] <bddebian> infinity: Yeah I knew that, I'm just waiting for my ubuntu1 version to show up. :-)
[06:13] <bddebian> Lathiat: I don't have that problem currently
[06:13] <infinity> bddebian : Looks like it's gone in already.
[06:14] <bddebian> Hmm, I don't see it.
[06:15] <infinity>   Version             : 0.95.0630-1ubuntu1
[06:15] <infinity>   State               : Needs-Build
[06:15] <infinity> (etc)
[06:15] <infinity> I cleared the dep-wait just now.
[06:15] <bddebian> Thank you
[06:16] <Lathiat> why dont old dep-waits clear on new packages?
[06:16] <infinity> It's an intentionaly feature, though probably outmoded in Ubuntu's use case.
[06:16] <infinity> s/aly/al/
[06:17] <infinity> The idea is that you don't want to waste bandwidth and/or CPU on building a new package until all the dep-waits are satisfied.
[06:17] <bddebian> Aye
[06:18] <infinity> So, if libfoo is broken on archbar, and I dep-wait packagequux on libfoo (>> 1.2.3-1brokenver), then no matter how many times packagequux is uploaded, I won't bothere trying to rebuild it until libfoo is uploaded with a (presumably) fixed version.
[06:18] <infinity> (Insert other use cases here)
[06:19] <bddebian> Kinda like my axiom, which I still don't understand :-(
[06:19] <infinity> However, we can use it for more clever things too, like intentionally holding back packages so they don't build against known-incorrect dependencies, etc (for fear they they WILL build, WILL be uploaded, and WILL be buggy)
[06:20] <infinity> Hrm.  What's the deal with axiom/gcl?
[06:21] <bddebian> infinity: I don't know.  It built/installed locally without ever complaining about the gcl version (and it should have).  I have asked elmo to sync the newer gcl. :-(
[06:22] <infinity> Oh, libsdl-erlang built fine everywhere, BTW.
[06:23] <bddebian> Awesome, thx
[06:23] <infinity> If it doesn't actually need the newer gcl, you could just relax the build-dep.
[06:24] <bddebian> Yeah but it's just a -6 release update and should sync better next go-round.
[06:24] <infinity> True.
[06:25] <infinity> Looks like Camm bumped the build-dep due to his changes in how gcl/axiom and friends pull in binutils-dev and do evil things with it.
[06:25] <infinity> (Very evil things, for the record)
[06:25] <bddebian> axiom is fully evil period :-)
[06:26] <bddebian> Took like 5/6 hours to build after several attempts at getting the X libs crap straightened out :-)
[06:26] <infinity> Most of the packages Camm maintains are evil.  To be fair, it's the nature of complex math software to be evil, it's not really his fault. :)
[06:27] <bddebian> Oh aye, I wasn't blaming him.
[06:38] <bddebian> Gnight folks, thanks again infinity 
[06:42] <fabbione> morning
[07:10] <pitti> Good morning
[07:15] <fabbione> morning pitti
[07:15] <pitti> Hey fabbione 
[08:01] <jkrogh> morning.
[08:02] <jkrogh> I've tried to use the ltsp-setup from breezy.. it seems to work flawless and I got to the 
[08:02] <jkrogh> gdm login screen of the server in the first shot. 
[08:02] <jkrogh> But my clients looses the keyboard when X starts.
[08:06] <fabbione> jkrogh: do you mean they lose the layout, or the keyboard just doesn't work?
[08:07] <jkrogh> The X-server doesn't respond to the keyboard at all. 
[08:08] <jkrogh> I can press "disconnect" using the mouse and get a shell on the client if I press alt+F2 before the X-server starts again. 
[08:08] <fabbione> jkrogh: hmm interesting.. could you please boot up a client, switch to console before login and take a copy of /etc/X11/xorg.conf ?
[08:08] <fabbione> i wonder if the X config is doomed
[08:08] <fabbione> but i suggest to collect these info and put them in a bug on bugzilla.ubuntu.com
[08:08] <fabbione> Component: ltsp
[08:09] <fabbione> it might not be X at fault here
[08:09] <fabbione> but some generated config files
[08:11] <bob2> is ubuntu express happening for breezy?
[08:14] <fabbione> afaik is there already, isn't it?
[08:14] <jkrogh> How do I get xorg.conf out of there? 
[08:15] <fabbione> jkrogh: you should be able to scp it from the workstation to the server
[08:21] <pitti> siretart: ping
[08:23] <siretart> pitti: pong
[08:23] <siretart> did I break something (again)?
[08:26] <pitti> siretart: no, don't worry :-) Just replied to your tabextensions mail on security-review
[08:26] <siretart> puh :)
[08:26] <bob2> win46
[08:27] <bob2> siretart: thanks for moving so quickly, btw :)
[08:27] <siretart> bob2: hehe, just 1 borked upload ;)
[08:27] <siretart> bob2: btw, do you happen to know when debian will switch over to python 2.4? 
[08:28] <bob2> siretart: not until after the C++ transition is done, I gather
[08:28] <jkrogh> http://pastebin.com/374405 -> xorg.conf from the client.
[08:28] <siretart> okay
[08:28] <bob2> so you'll have to have that diff for a while
[08:28] <siretart> will do
[08:28] <siretart> I fear there are still issues with lyx
[08:28] <fabbione> hey siretart 
[08:28] <siretart> will look after them
[08:28] <siretart> hi fabbione!
[08:28] <bob2> siretart: hm, how so?
[08:28] <siretart> fabbione: I see igor is building packages :)
[08:29] <fabbione> siretart: yup :)
[08:29] <siretart> bob2: there is no /usr/bin/lyx for me. (huh?)
[08:29] <fabbione> i did set it up saturday
[08:29] <siretart> :)
[08:29] <fabbione> siretart: but i had no problems at all to upgrade to 2.6.12-9 and brezzy
[08:29] <fabbione> breezy even
[08:29] <fabbione> (yeah sarge was too boring ;))
[08:29] <bob2> oh, crap
[08:29] <bob2> maybe I broke the alternative thing
[08:30] <siretart> fabbione: hehe, I've seen that :) - it did survive the reboot :)
[08:30] <jkrogh> Can I find the X-servers log anywhere? 
[08:30] <bob2> jkrogh: /var/log
[08:30] <fabbione> siretart: yeah.. no problems at all
[08:30] <siretart> fabbione: just one question, won't the sparc buildlogs show up on p.u.c/~lamont/buildLogs/?
[08:31] <fabbione> siretart: no, they show here: http://bld-3.mmjgroup.com/buildLogs/
[08:31] <siretart> aah
[08:31] <fabbione> we are working on getting them all together
[08:31] <siretart> aah. okay. I was confused because ia64 is appearing at lamonts site
[08:32] <fabbione> siretart: that's because ia64 is builded at the DataCenter
[08:32] <fabbione> hppa and sparc no
[08:32] <siretart> aah. this explains
[08:32] <fabbione> we can't use all the infrastructure yet
[08:32] <fabbione> anyway we got some install test
[08:32] <siretart> okay, okay. Now I understand
[08:32] <fabbione> there are 2 glitches in the installer (nothing fancy to fix)
[08:33] <fabbione> and that's it.. we need a xorg upload to get ubuntu-desktop installable
[08:33] <fabbione> so we are looking very very good for breezy
[08:33] <siretart> cool! :)
[08:33] <fabbione> anyway.. i need to go offline a few minutes
[08:33] <fabbione> bbl
[08:34] <siretart> bob2: there really seems to be some foo in the ubuntu package
[08:34] <siretart> bob2: with that alternatives
[08:35] <siretart> bob2: shouldn't lyx-qt.postinst install the alternatives?
[08:35] <bob2> yes
[08:36] <siretart> there is just the snippet about update-menus in there, no call to install-alternatives
[08:37] <bob2> guess that's a bug then
[08:37] <siretart> and in the source package, there is no debian/lyx-qt.postinst even
[08:37] <jkrogh> Should I be able to login to the console using the standard logins from the terminal server? 
[08:37] <bob2> siretart: yes, debhelper generates it
[08:38] <siretart> ah. hm
[08:39] <bob2> it'd be great if you could file a bug in Debian
[08:40] <siretart> first I'll see if that bug even exist in debian
[08:40] <siretart> but will do
[08:41] <bob2> thanks a lot :)
[08:41] <siretart> bye, bob2 
[08:50] <fabbione> re
[08:50] <jkrogh> Seems like a regular X-bug to me. crtl+alt+backspace doesn't work either. 
[08:51] <sivang> Hhowdy all
[08:52] <fabbione> jkrogh: yes, you can login on standard console
[08:52] <fabbione> jkrogh: please file a bug on bugzilla and add the xorg.conf as i asked before
[08:52] <jkrogh> I've done that. 
[08:53] <fabbione> jkrogh: ok, bug number?
[08:53] <jkrogh> 16355
[08:54] <fabbione> jkrogh: gdm?? our ltsp doesn't use gdm at all
[08:54] <siretart> bug filed, I'm off to uni. cu
[08:54] <jkrogh> No.. but it makes an X -query terminalserver
[08:54] <jkrogh> where I get the gdm/ubuntu prompt over XDMCP
[08:55] <fabbione> nah
[08:55] <fabbione> you have something really wrong on your setup
[08:55] <fabbione> we don't use XDMCP at all
[08:56] <pitti> Good morning jane_ 
[08:57] <fabbione> jkrogh: the Xorg.0.log is not complete afaict
[08:58] <jkrogh> Ok.. then I've accidentially tested the SERVER option of lts.conf
[08:58] <fabbione> don't use them
[08:58] <fabbione> there is no need to
[08:58] <\sh> mdz: please assign all amarok issues via bugzilla to my account, and put riddell as CC, thx
[08:59] <fabbione> \sh: you can do that yourself i think
[08:59] <jkrogh> fabbione: Then is the ltsp-setup not a thin but a rather "thick" setup? 
[08:59] <\sh> fabbione: i did now...but mdz is assigning sometimes the bugs ;)
[09:00] <fabbione> jkrogh: i dunno all the details of ltsp. i use to test it here once in a while, but i never had the need of that
[09:00] <jkrogh> Ok, I'm not interrested in running the applications on the client. 
[09:01] <jkrogh> I need the old-fashined xdmcp-way where all application run on the server. 
[09:01] <JaneW> hi pitti
[09:01] <jkrogh> But that should really be a trivial change to the other setup. 
[09:01] <fabbione> jkrogh: our ltsp executes apps on the server
[09:01] <jkrogh> Using ssh and X-forwarding? 
[09:01] <fabbione> jkrogh: you just did something wrong in your setup
[09:01] <fabbione> jkrogh: yes. 
[09:02] <fabbione> jkrogh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThinClientHowto
[09:02] <fabbione> that's all you need
[09:07] <jkrogh> fabbione: You're right.. Deleting the lts.org changes the setup to the ssh and X thing and now the keyboard works. 
[09:07] <fabbione> jkrogh: hehe ok, please close the bug than :)
[09:08] <jkrogh> .. I belive it is a bug anyway. There is no reason in not being able to work within exising xdcmp-setups like LTSP usually does. 
[09:08] <jkrogh> But that's a feature request. 
[09:08] <jkrogh> :-)
[09:08] <fabbione> jkrogh: well whatever :) just adjust the bug to what you think is the right thing..
[09:09] <jkrogh> KDE isn't available in the menu (probably since KDE isn't installed in the chroot).
[09:10] <fabbione> the chroot is used only to boot the client and give you a login prompt. i don't even think gnome is installed there
[09:10] <fabbione> iirc it's the server that offers the list of window managers, since they are executed after you login
[09:10] <fabbione> but not the chroot itself
[09:11] <fabbione> also Ubuntu doesn't install KDE by default
[09:11] <fabbione> (that would be Kubuntu)
[09:11] <fabbione> so it's unlikely to find such entry in the menu ;)
[09:11] <jkrogh> I did an apt-get install kubuntu-desktop 
[09:11] <jkrogh> The users want the choiche :-) 
[09:12] <fabbione> jkrogh: where? in the chroot or the server?
[09:12] <jkrogh> On the server. 
[09:12] <jkrogh> I have not modified the chroot
[09:12] <fabbione> ok
[09:12] <fabbione> hold on a sec..
[09:12] <jkrogh> It is available on the gdm on the "physical" screen. 
[09:15] <\sh> infinity: ping 
[09:16] <janimo> Kamion, the installer seems to leave /debootstrap/debootstrap.log on the root fs after done is that intentional?
[09:19] <fabbione> jkrogh: you will need to file an enanchment bug for that.
[09:20] <fabbione> jkrogh: the ltsp login manager (ldm) has an hardcoded menu in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/lib/ltsp/greeters/greeter.glade
[09:20] <fabbione> jkrogh: at least AFAICS
[09:20] <jkrogh> Will do.. 
[09:21] <infinity> \sh : gnop.
[09:22] <\sh> infinity: I just try to fix enigmail ;) I only have to add an entry for mozilla 1.7.12, right?
[09:23] <\sh> infinity: in debian/rules and debian/rules.mailnews
[09:23] <infinity> \sh : It's a bit more irritating than that.
[09:24] <\sh> infinity: hmm...I think 1.7.12 has the same API version then 1.7.10 && 1.7.11
[09:24] <fabbione> \sh: don't break enigmail or you will phear the wrath of fabbione
[09:25] <infinity> \sh : Oh wait, no, that's all it takes.  I have to re-read it every time I do this.
[09:25] <infinity> \sh : Yo uhave to alter all the OTHER stanzas in debian/rules to exclude 1.7.12 as well.
[09:25] <infinity> (such an intuitive packaging system..)
[09:26] <\sh> infinity: yeah..it's really nice to read those rules files...it's too early in the morning for that...and I'm 10 cups of coffee behind
[09:26] <infinity> \sh : Oh, and regenrate debian/control, when you have the right build-deps installed.
[09:27] <infinity> \sh : So, install build-deps, make sure they're what you want, then run "debian/rules update_control"
[09:27] <\sh> fabbione: hmmm...do u want to fix the unmet deps? ,-)
[09:27] <infinity> \sh : Alternately, just let me upload it.  I did the last couple. :)
[09:28] <\sh> infinity: that's why I pinged you ... but give me 10 mins to figure out the build system here...;)
[09:30] <infinity> \sh : I was probably going to hold off until we have a new Thunderbird, but if the new Tbird isn't in sight yet, two uploads makes more sense.
[09:31] <\sh> hmm..pitti is doing tbird, right?
[09:31] <infinity> Yeah, but upstream still hasn't released 1.0.7.  They announced it "soon".
[09:32] <infinity> (Actually, I may end up doing Tbird, I did last time, but... Whatever... No one will do it if it doesn't release)
[09:32] <\sh> infinity: k..two uploads makes sense then :)
[09:32] <infinity> Yup.
[09:33] <infinity> Do test builds before you upload, and check the final debs with "dpkg-deb -c foo.deb" (to make sure the contents look sane) and "dpkg-deb -I foo.deb" (to make sure the control info is sane)
[09:33] <infinity> The build should fail on the former, but the latter will break if you mess up. :)
[09:33] <\sh> infinity: I'm testing it anyways..:)
[09:33] <infinity> (ie: The build won't fail, but you'll make uninstallable binaries and I'll laugha at you)
[09:33] <\sh> even on amd64...
[09:33] <infinity> So, test. :0
[09:34] <\sh> hmm...I think it's a good day to break something ... after my 3rd tft died here :(
[09:34] <infinity> In other news, enigmail's build system is teh suck, and I keep meaning to talk to asack about making it less so.
[09:36] <\sh> infinity: after the mess with jdongs backported firefox package...well nothing will shock me anymore
[09:37] <jsgotangco> mirrormax?
[09:37] <\sh> yepp
[09:37] <jsgotangco> *scary thought*
[09:39] <infinity> Anyone in here have OSX installed and care to carry out an experiment?
[09:39] <\sh> well...think about this: 10 people who are supporting actively the german ubuntu community, being hit by an uncounted ammount of people complaining...well, it was fun on saturday and sunday
[09:42] <jsgotangco> \sh, that was nasty, good thing on our side, people are just discovering linux itself...
[09:43] <sivang> seb128: bon jour :)
[09:44] <fabbione> hey seb
[09:44] <seb128> hi sivang fabbione
[09:45] <fabbione> seb128: you mentioned something about new gnome crack coming in today
[09:45] <fabbione> is there any specific build sequence we need to care about?
[09:45] <seb128> fabbione: GNOME 2.12.1 tarballs due today, why ?
[09:45] <seb128> no
[09:45] <fabbione> so no new gtk crack or stuff.. right?
[09:46] <seb128> probably a new GTK and stuff
[09:46] <seb128> but nothing that require a special change or build order
[09:46] <fabbione> seb128: well i was asking because sparc is now installable.. and sort of breaking it at 3 weeks from release would be annoying :)
[09:46] <seb128> just bug fixes tarballs
[09:47] <fabbione> perfect
[09:47] <dholbach> good morning
[09:47] <sivang> dholbach: Moins 
[09:47] <dholbach> hey sivang 
[09:48] <sivang> hey vuntz 
[09:48] <vuntz> hi sivang
[09:48] <\sh> infinity: hmm...looks ok here
[09:48] <seb128> hey dholbach
[09:48] <seb128> hey vuntz
[09:49] <dholbach> morning seb, how are you?
[09:49] <vuntz> hey seb128
[09:49] <seb128> dholbach: great :)
[09:49] <vuntz> seb128: you're not sleeping? You're waking up early ;-)
[09:49] <seb128> dholbach: my mailbox is bug flooded to change
[09:49] <\sh> infinity: only the postinst of enigmail for thunderbird is complaining something about "find"....but it looks like that's thunderbird chrome update util 
[09:49] <seb128> vuntz: GNOME 2.12.1 ...
[09:50] <infinity> \sh : Yeah, that's a different bug. :)
[09:50] <\sh> infinity: ok..so it's not mine :) installation is smooth...so I think I can upload...:)
[09:50] <vuntz> seb128: 2.12.1 is next week
[09:50] <\sh> oh damn...it's main ;)
[09:50] <\sh> I don't upload ;)
[09:50] <seb128> vuntz: grumpf
[09:51] <seb128> vuntz: you sure?
[09:51] <vuntz> http://live.gnome.org/ReleasePlanning_2fTwoPointEleven
[09:51] <seb128> crap
[09:51] <seb128> a bug replying borring week again
[09:51] <vuntz> ahah
[09:51] <seb128> I'll bother some upstream to get bug fixed
[09:52] <seb128> let's start with this recent files bug ... vuntz ? :)
[09:52] <vuntz> seb128: you should add "a bug replying borring week again" to all the comments you make in bugzilla
[09:52] <dholbach> seb128: you can get the new gtkhtml and rsrv in :)
[09:52] <dholbach> rsvg
[09:52] <seb128> dholbach: free to you
[09:52] <seb128> dholbach: I want to keep my job
[09:52] <vuntz> seb128: well, I won't look at it before 2 or 3 days
[09:52] <dholbach> hahahaha
[09:52] <seb128> the new librsvg breaks the ubuntu bug
[09:52] <seb128> and gtkhtml is 2.11
[09:52] <\sh> mdz / Kamion: ok for you to upload enigmail to fix the unmet dep?
[09:53] <seb128> and it's dobey's tarball
[09:53] <seb128> s/bug/theme/
[09:53] <seb128> vuntz: k, I'll mail markmc :)
[09:53] <dholbach> seb128: won't your patch make it work nicely?
[09:53] <seb128> dholbach: the purpose of this version is to not need the patch
[09:53] <dholbach> ah right
[09:53] <seb128> they changed 100 by 1024 for the tag
[09:53] <dholbach> that seb... always brilliantly informed :)
[09:54] <seb128> dholbach: BTW did you track this amd64 crasher?
[09:54] <dholbach> seb128: in g-s-t?
[09:55] <dholbach> seb128: there are a couple of amd64 issues in g-s-t, especially the user part of it - none of my tests made it work or showed the actual problem
[09:55] <seb128> users-admin
[09:55] <seb128> k
[09:55] <\sh> infinity: please have a look over the debdiff for enigmail...just need to be sure, that I don't break anything...
[09:55] <infinity> \sh : Heh, okay..
[09:55] <dholbach> seb128: it's not improper xml handling, it's not the signedness warnings and not the password generation :-/
[09:55] <infinity> \sh : Mail?
[09:56] <zyga> hello :-)
[09:56] <zyga> we hit slashdot again
[09:56] <seb128> dholbach: so what is it? BTW if you have cleanup patch fell free to bugzilla them upstream :p
[09:56] <\sh> infinity: http://linux.blogweb.de/uploads/engimail.diff.gz (please unzip to apply) it's debdiff against ubuntu3 
[09:56] <\sh> gunzip even
[09:57] <\sh> argl
[09:57] <dholbach> seb128: i have no clue what it is
[09:57] <\sh> infinity: sorry...this is the right url: http://linux.blogweb.de/uploads/enigmail.diff.gz
[10:00] <infinity> \sh : That should work.
[10:01] <infinity> \sh : A slightly more verbose changelog entry is always nice, though.
[10:01] <infinity> \sh : Even if it's just a copy and paste of my previous one with s/11/12/ :)
[10:05] <jkrogh> fabbione: Have you used the terminal setup or just tested it? 
[10:05] <fabbione> jkrogh: i only test it. I have no need of such setup on a regular base
[10:05] <jkrogh> The client has trouble keeping up the nfs-mounted-root-fs here. 
[10:06] <fabbione> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=12942 <- is this problem by any chance?
[10:06] <verwilst> hellow!
[10:07] <verwilst> anybody having problems with laptop-detect hanging when it's being installed?
[10:07] <verwilst> during first bootup ( ubuntu breezy preview iso )
[10:07] <verwilst> it starts to install laptop-detect, but just sits thre
[10:07] <verwilst> there
[10:08] <verwilst> on the console i can't see anything strange
[10:08] <verwilst> it just stops
[10:08] <fabbione> verwilst: it's quite unlikely that laptop detect can hang...
[10:08] <verwilst> fabbione: it's not laptop-detect that hangs
[10:08] <verwilst> it's apt
[10:08] <verwilst> well, it doesn't really hang
[10:08] <verwilst> since when i do ctrl - c on the console where apt is shown, it just re-does apt-get install laptop-detect
[10:09] <verwilst> and hangs at the same place
[10:09] <verwilst> ( last lines are when it shows NEW pkgs that will be installed
[10:09] <fabbione> verwilst: that's weird.. did you install from CD?
[10:09] <verwilst> yip
[10:09] <verwilst> i installed a system correctly with it too
[10:10] <verwilst> this is on a Dell PowerEdge 2850
[10:10] <fabbione> verwilst: i have no idea sorry.. open a bug 
[10:10] <verwilst> just thought i'd ask here first ;)
[10:12] <jkrogh> fabbione: Thanks .. i'll investigate. 
[10:12] <\sh> infinity: ok will do :)
[10:13] <fabbione> jkrogh: no problem
[10:14] <\sh> infinity: now I will need the ok of mdz/kamion, or?
[10:14] <infinity> \sh : No, you're just resolving unmet deps.  Blame it on me if you get yelled at.
[10:15] <\sh> infinity: your word in gods ear ;)
[10:15] <\sh> uploaded
[10:24] <infinity> \sh : Hah, you actually DID copy-n-paste my changelog entry. :)
[10:25] <infinity> \sh : You owe me a beer at UBZ for taking me too literally.
[10:28] <\sh> infinity: fck...I missed the mozilla SDK s/1.7.10/1.7.11/ 
[10:28] <infinity> No, that's correct as it is.
[10:28] <\sh> infinity: how many beers I owe you now? ,-)
[10:28] <infinity> It's using the 1.7.10 SDK.
[10:28] <infinity> There is no .11 or .12 SDK in the orig.
[10:28] <\sh> elmo - 5 ; infinity - ?? 
[10:29] <Treenaks> \sh: elmo - 5 = infinity ?!
[10:29] <infinity> Likely a few dozen.
[10:29] <infinity> You can stop buying after you get sexy.
[10:30] <\sh> infinity: I'm not going to get sexy ;)
[10:30] <infinity> Hey, if I get drunk enough, anything's possible.
[10:30] <\sh> infinity: I'm already sexy ,-)
[10:31] <jkrogh> I seem to be hit by the "rsize=32k" bug but the client doesn't seem to respect my changes in pxelinux.cfg/default
[10:32] <dholbach> i can't change "upstream ubuntu" bugs in malone *cry*
[10:33] <dholbach> Diziet: ok, if i assign the firefox in malone to you?
[10:33] <Kamion> janimo: kind of, but that'll be fixed before release anyway (by merging debootstrap 0.3.1.6)
[10:34] <dholbach> hi janimo :)
[10:34] <Kamion> verwilst: what kind of install are you doing? I assume it's a server install, to start with
[10:34] <\sh> dholbach: u r spamming ,-)
[10:35] <verwilst> Kamion: yep
[10:35] <verwilst> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16365
[10:35] <verwilst> maybe server installs haven't been tested as much ;)
[10:36] <Kamion> verwilst: did you skip anything in the first stage of the installer?
[10:36] <Kamion> like "copy packages to hard disk"?
[10:36] <verwilst> Kamion: nope
[10:36] <verwilst> the packages are there
[10:36] <mvo> can a english native speaker please have a look at #16295?
[10:36] <dholbach> seb128: ok, if i change the "gnome team" bugs in malone to be sent to ubuntu-desktop@?
[10:36] <verwilst> in /var/cache/apt/archives
[10:37] <seb128> dholbach: no
[10:37] <dholbach> morning mvo :)
[10:37] <dholbach> seb128: hm, why?
[10:37] <seb128> dholbach: it's already too much flooded with desktop bugs
[10:37] <mvo> hey dholbach 
[10:37] <Kamion> verwilst: then please attach /var/log/installer/syslog, /var/log/base-config.log, and /var/log/base-config-pkgsel.log to the bug
[10:37] <seb128> dholbach: that's not possible to catch with the universe bugs too
[10:37] <dholbach> i see
[10:37] <dholbach> hmhmhmhm
[10:37] <Kamion> verwilst: it's probably a duplicate of other bugs though - there's a standing problem with apt media-check messages which I know is not resolved yet
[10:37] <dholbach> i'd like to have them on a list too
[10:37] <seb128> yeah, but a motu one
[10:37] <verwilst> Kamion: ah damn, i rebooted and installed packages manually :p
[10:37] <seb128> we need to keep the desktop one useful
[10:38] <dholbach> seb128: jdub will cry if i will force him to open a ubuntu-universe-desktop@ list :)
[10:38] <verwilst> Kamion: but i'll reinstall again tomorrow, and attach those files, oki?
[10:38] <seb128> dholbach: ha ha
[10:38] <\sh> elmo: please sync rrdcollect_0.2.3-2 from debian unstable (universe that is) thx
[10:39] <verwilst> hell, i'll reinstall now, brb
[10:40] <Kamion> verwilst: that'd be good, thanks
[10:40] <jdub> dholbach: *CRY*
[10:40] <Kamion> mvo: #16295 confirmed
[10:40] <ogra> dholbach, jdub, hey what about a ubuntu-universe-desktop-backports-and-other-crack list
[10:40] <seb128> hey hey jdub :)
[10:40] <ogra> morning btw
[10:41] <dholbach> ogra: do my ears deceive me? you said the b* word?
[10:41] <dholbach> eyes that is
[10:41] <ogra> hey, they are official now :)
[10:41] <dholbach> yeah, but i'd like to keep that on a separate mailing list ;)
[10:41] <mvo> Kamion: thanks
[10:42] <ogra> dholbach, see my request ;)
[10:42] <ogra> (just joking indeed)
[10:43] <\sh> ogra: please do not start again with this crap...I had enough of it the last weekend...
[10:43] <\sh> ;)
[10:43] <ogra> heh
[10:46] <zyga> mvo: why does running synaptic uses different prompt for password than running any other program?
[10:46] <dholbach> Riddell: is there a KDE team in malone yet?
[10:47] <fabbione> Kamion: dunno if you read the scrollback, but there is a bug in the debootstrap script for breezy when using buildd variant...
[10:47] <\sh> dholbach: I don't think so
[10:47] <dholbach> \sh, Riddell: there should be one
[10:48] <Kamion> fabbione: no, what?
[10:48] <fabbione> Kamion: but i am not sure how to fix it.. hounestly.. line 20 of /usr/lib/debootstrap/scripts/breezy 
[10:48] <Kamion> well, I did read the scrollback, but may have missed some
[10:48] <fabbione> Kamion: it chokes on packages with a "-" in the name
[10:48] <fabbione> i think it's something you did.. because i couldn't find it in any other script
[10:49] <siretart> libxp6 was moved to main?
[10:49] <pitti> siretart: yes
[10:49] <fabbione> and i could reproduce it on any arch..
[10:49] <Kamion> it's not something I did originally, but it may not be in any of the other scripts *any more*
[10:49] <fabbione> Kamion: ok.. i didn't track the origin to be hounest.. 
[10:49] <Kamion> actually yes, it's still in the etch script, look there
[10:50] <fabbione> Kamion: that's weird.. because it does choke badly
[10:51] <Kamion> oh, hum, I see the problem
[10:51] <Kamion> will fix
[10:51] <Kamion> I got the arguments to add wrong
[10:51] <fabbione> ok thanks :)
[10:51] <siretart> pitti: there is a upgrade issue, hoary version 6.8.2-10.1 beats breezy 6.8.2-10ubuntu1
[10:52] <pitti> siretart: what's that, Xorg?
[10:52] <pitti>       xorg |   6.8.2-69 | http://archive.ubuntu.com breezy/main Sources
[10:52] <pitti>       xorg | 6.8.2-10.1 | http://security.ubuntu.com hoary-security/main Sources
[10:52] <siretart> hoarys libxp6 was build from xorg sources, breezy libxp6 is an own sourcepackage, libxp
[10:52] <pitti> that looks fine to me
[10:52] <pitti> ah, libxp
[10:53] <fabbione> oh
[10:53] <fabbione> meh
[10:53] <fabbione> pitti: i can fix that...
[10:53] <pitti> siretart: right, so we need to bump the version number in breezy
[10:53] <siretart> and now its in main, so I cannot fix that anymore :)
[10:53] <fabbione> siretart: no problem.. i will do it
[10:53] <fabbione> i will bump the epoch
[10:53] <siretart> okay
[10:53] <pitti> fabbione: uh, epoch?
[10:53] <pitti> fabbione: why not just -11ubuntu1?
[10:53] <dholbach> siretart: you should request upload privileges for main
[10:53] <siretart> I was quite unsure about upstream version anyway
[10:54] <fabbione> pitti: yeah that would work too
[10:54] <Kamion> fabbione: fixed in 0.3.1.6ubuntu1, thanks
[10:54] <siretart> dholbach: do you really think I deserve it? ;) - seriously, I can do enough work in universe, when I get to my limits I will apply for main, for sure
[10:54] <dholbach> siretart: i think you do
[10:54] <seb128_> pitti: what do you call "double-sided"? page 1 3 5 and then 2 4 6 ?
[10:54] <seb128_> etc
[10:55] <seb128_> 7 9 8 10 ... :)
[10:55] <pitti> seb128_: I rather guess "1 2" on one page, then "3 4" on the next, and so on
[10:55] <seb128_> oh, k
[10:55] <fabbione> Kamion: thanks to you :) sparc will appreciate a lot..
[10:55] <fabbione> Kamion: btw we got jbailey to test the install CD.. it works like a charm except the ramdisk_size option.
[10:55] <fabbione> Kamion: i think the changes we did for hoary aren't good enough.. 
[10:56] <fabbione> Kamion: but if we can't fix them for breezy, a release note will do
[10:57] <siretart> fabbione: install cd for sparc?
[10:57] <fabbione> siretart: yeps
[10:57] <siretart> sweeet! :)
[10:57] <verwilst> Kamion: ok done
[11:00] <fabbione> Kamion: permission to upload libxp.. no changes.. only a version bump to make it upgradable from hoary
[11:03] <Kamion> fabbione: approved as long as it isn't an epoch
[11:03] <fabbione> no epoch
[11:03] <fabbione> just normal bump
[11:03] <Kamion> sure
[11:03] <fabbione> done
[11:03] <pitti> Kamion: do we need to have all uploads approved now?
[11:03] <Kamion> 10.1ubuntu1 would do fine
[11:03] <Kamion> pitti: no, I'm not quite sure why fabbione's asking
[11:03] <fabbione> Kamion: that would break at the next Xorg security upgrade :)
[11:03] <pitti> Kamion: no, that would conflict to the next Xorg security update to hoary
[11:03] <Kamion> or I suppose 11ubuntu1, yes
[11:03] <fabbione> Kamion: 11ubuntu1 is ok
[11:03] <pitti> fabbione: :-)
[11:03] <fabbione> eheh
[11:03] <verwilst> Kamion: files added
[11:04] <verwilst> if anything else, let me know ;)
[11:04] <sivang> seb128_: I guess you've not had time to upload my pkg / review it?
[11:04] <seb128_> sivang: no, I would have say so
[11:04] <sivang> seb128_: (I don't want vuntz slapping me for not removing the items from the clock applet ;-) )
[11:05] <verwilst> Kamion: since ubuntu 5.10 will be installed on 10s of servers, it would be nice to have it fully working ;)
[11:05] <sivang> seb128_: k
[11:05] <seb128_> sivang: but you should have send a mail when I asked for it
[11:05] <seb128_> sivang: without a bugzilla or a mail it's not listed on my stuff to do
[11:05] <Kamion> verwilst: I've tested my CD releases with server installs as it happens, and they worked fine for me :P
[11:05] <Kamion> but let's see
[11:07] <verwilst> hehe
[11:08] <Kamion> verwilst: that is not the preview release you're using
[11:08] <Kamion> Sep 26 10:42:23 cdrom-detect: Detected CD 'Ubuntu 5.10 "Breezy Badger" - Alpha i386 (20050831)'
[11:08] <Kamion> preview was released 20050908
[11:08] <verwilst> goddamn
[11:08] <verwilst> i took the wrong cd
[11:09] <verwilst> ugh
[11:09] <verwilst> ok, i'll reinstall again :p
[11:09] <sivang> seb128_: sure, sending now
[11:09] <Kamion> was fixed before preview, closing the bug
[11:09] <\sh> pitti: du u have to approve membership to security-review ML?
[11:09] <Kamion> (archive-copier 0.3.1)
[11:10] <pitti> \sh: yes
[11:10] <janimo> Kamion, which is the minimal amount of RAM required by the installer
[11:10] <Kamion> verwilst: thanks for the logs
[11:10] <verwilst> Kamion: bbiab ;
[11:10] <verwilst> ;)
[11:10] <janimo> I get OOM for debconf with 64M server install
[11:10] <Kamion> janimo: I thought it was under 64MB; I'll check it out
[11:10] <verwilst> Kamion: np :d sorry for the stupid mistake ;)
[11:10] <\sh> pitti: ok...I thought it was an error on my side :)
[11:10] <Kamion> janimo: at what stage?
[11:10] <janimo> when trying the network module
[11:10] <Kamion> "the network module"?
[11:10] <janimo> I do not have any network
[11:10] <pitti> \sh: I approved you
[11:10] <verwilst> Kamion: i'll retry again now, and let you know the outcome
[11:10] <janimo> ethconfig
[11:11] <Kamion> oh, netcfg
[11:11] <janimo> I have no network at all
[11:11] <janimo> pcmcia NIC but not inserted
[11:11] <Kamion> that's very surprising; we may have to tweak lowmem
[11:11] <janimo> that gets it stuck at that pahse
[11:11] <\sh> pitti: thx ..
[11:12] <janimo> and if I stick it in it repeatedly displays the progressbar (load linux-kernel...-nic module)
[11:12] <janimo> and gets killed in a cycle
[11:12] <Kamion> yes, standard out-of-memory installer symptoms
[11:13] <janimo> elmo, when you have time theres xubuntu-meta in NEW (universe) pending upload approval,thanks
[11:14] <Kamion> elmo looks at new packages regularly; I don't believe he needs reminders for each
[11:14] <Kamion> one of the archive maintenance programs produces a report of them
[11:15] <janimo> Kamion, ok, the return mail said once a week
[11:15] <Kamion> xubuntu-meta             | 0.2             | source       | 1 hour old
[11:15] <Kamion> that's a bit early to be worrying ;)
[11:15] <janimo> Kamion, I did not know when the week is supposed to start, or if at this stage the standard rules still apply
[11:15] <janimo> I wasn't worrying though :)
[11:16] <Kamion> quick rule is "don't nag" ;)
[11:16] <janimo> ok ;)
[11:17] <janimo> especially not elmo :)
[11:17] <Kamion> hmm, I can reproduce that 64M problem here
[11:17] <Kamion> bah
[11:17] <sivang> bob2: have you sorted out that vmware issue you had with breezy?
[11:17] <bob2> sivang: apparently the any2any patch fixes it
[11:17] <bob2> tho I've not been game to try it again
[11:18] <sivang> bob2: any2any? kernel patch ?
[11:18] <bob2> no, vmware "source" patch
[11:18] <sivang> vm source? LOL
[11:18] <sivang> s/vm/vmware
[11:20] <Kamion> god, the installer is using 91MB of memory in lowmem mode before it gets to swapon
[11:20] <Kamion> that's absurd
[11:20] <Kamion> it used to be half that
[11:23] <janimo> hi (belatedly) dholbach :)
[11:23] <dholbach> :)
[11:25] <Kamion> doesn't even fit in lowmem mode (77MB footprint). what on *earth* happened?
[11:25] <ogra> 77MB ? 
[11:25] <ogra> phew
[11:27] <verwilst> Kamion: works flawlessy
[11:27] <Kamion> verwilst: good good :)
[11:27] <verwilst> Kamion: hehe
[11:28] <verwilst> Kamion: thanks for the fast response ;)
[11:39] <Kamion> somebody has utterly hosed the l-r-m udebs
[11:40] <infinity> If all else fails, blame me.
[11:40] <infinity> What's hosed about them?
[11:40] <fabbione> Kamion: they are not hosed
[11:42] <Kamion> fabbione: they so are
[11:42] <Kamion> look at their contents
[11:43] <Kamion> -rw-rw-r--  1 katie katie   139954 2005-04-04 23:50 nic-restricted-modules-2.6.10-5-386-di_2.6.10.5-1_i386.udeb
[11:43] <Kamion> -rw-rw-r--  1 katie katie  4971190 2005-09-23 13:35 nic-restricted-modules-2.6.12-9-386-di_2.6.12.4-7_i386.udeb
[11:43] <fabbione> Kamion: yes yes i am looking
[11:44] <Kamion> they contain lots of stuff that does not belong in the udeb, such as the fglrx and nvidia modules
[11:45] <fabbione> meh
[11:48] <pitti> Hi sabdfl 
[11:48] <fabbione> hey sabdfl 
[11:48] <sabdfl> greetings all
[11:48] <sabdfl> good to be back
[11:48] <sabdfl> jdub, seb128: where's the "About Ubuntu" entry?
[11:51] <seb128> sabdfl: ask to the docteam, the GNOME part has not changed
[11:51] <sabdfl> ok
[11:51] <sabdfl> mdke: ping?
[11:52] <jsgotangco> sabdfl, think he's out
[11:53] <jsgotangco> what's up?
[11:53] <jsgotangco> oh
[11:53] <jsgotangco> on Yelp?
[11:53] <sabdfl> jsgotangco: System -> [No About Ubuntu] 
[11:54] <jsgotangco> i did an email before on how to register the doc in yelp but i guess jbailey hasn't done that yet
[11:55] <seb128> jsgotangco: seems that /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/C/about-ubuntu.xml has been dropped
[11:55] <jsgotangco> gyahhh
[11:56] <infinity> Kamion : Oh joy.  I can fiddle with that after dinner.
[11:58] <JaneW> infinity: ping
[11:58] <JaneW> infinity: I see you are now working on LRM
[11:58] <JaneW> infinity: is everything on track there?
[11:59] <\sh> pitti: do u think it's worth to updated clamav for hoary as security update? it's a universe package 
[12:00] <fabbione> \sh: why via security?
[12:00] <jsgotangco> seb128, the updated file is at https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/branches/breezy/gnome/aboutubuntu/C/ on our svn but i believe jbailey hasn't gotten around to uploading it yet at all
[12:00] <fabbione> if the package really really needs an update, we can propose it as hoary-updates ...
[12:00] <fabbione> \sh: given that there are enough reasons to do so
[12:00] <infinity> JaneW : Define "on track".
[12:01] <infinity> JaneW : It seems to work well enough right now, modulo Kamion's complaint. :)
[12:01] <\sh> fabbione: well...cause for me it belongs to "security tools" ;) but update is ok, too :)
[12:01] <fabbione> security tool doesn't mean security repository
[12:01] <Nafallo> \sh: security tools != security bugs :-P
[12:01] <JaneW> infinity: ok, sounds ok.
[12:01] <\sh> fabbione: yeah..I just realized ;)
[12:01] <seb128> jsgotangco: k, thanks
[12:02] <fabbione> \sh: plus it is an antivirus.. rarely viruses affect unix machines.
[12:02] <\sh> fabbione: what is the correct way to propose those updates?
[12:03] <fabbione> \sh: it depends what kind of update do you need and why...
[12:03] <fabbione> \sh: usually you ask the release managers..
[12:05] <\sh> fabbione: regarding this anti-virus tool, it's used by <insert your fav. ammount of server installs> and should stay updated as long as hoary e-o-l support lasts..but this is only my opinion :)
[12:05] <JaneW> infinity: and SoundEvents? I know we are going to tackle this at a UBZ BOF, but the last bit you were going to do was "make sure that all the apps have their default sounds updated to point at common locations" is that done?
[12:06] <fabbione> \sh: i know what clamav is.. i use it here too ... but than.. the virus list is updated via clamav-fresh service at runtime
[12:06] <fabbione> \sh: so exactly what kind of problem would you like to address?
[12:07] <Treenaks> fabbione: sometimes the clamav server gets updated
[12:07] <\sh> fabbione: https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/2463
[12:07] <Treenaks> fabbione: and then you get big warnings when you run freshclam
[12:07] <\sh> fabbione: e.g.
[12:07] <fabbione> Treenaks: ok.. so it starts to make more sense...
[12:08] <\sh> fabbione: and regarding hoary -> breezy package diff is hoary:
[12:08] <\sh> 0.83-2ubuntu1 vs. breezy: 0.86.2-5 
[12:08] <fabbione> Treenaks: so the clamav servers are not always backward compatible?
[12:08] <\sh> and debian unstable has 0.87 something 
[12:08] <fabbione> \sh: that's called UVF :)
[12:08] <Treenaks> fabbione: old daemons are not guaranteed to understand the new datafiles after a new engine version is released
[12:09] <\sh> fabbione: New logcheck line for clamav-daemon (closes: #323132)
[12:09] <\sh> (from 0.87) 
[12:09] <JaneW> infinity: If so, I'll update the goals page to reflect this...
[12:09] <\sh> fabbione: I know :) that's why I ask, if it's worth 
[12:10] <fabbione> \sh: it's a universe package.. so in theory there is no issue to update it, but be aware of the consequences.
[12:10] <fabbione> \sh: pushing it to main (as you mention in the bug) will only make it worst.
[12:10] <\sh> fabbione: breezy universe it's not the problem :) I just requested a sync by elmo yesterday :) 
[12:10] <fabbione> \sh: because main is close for business or almost
[12:11] <\sh> fabbione: and pushing to main is dapper wishlist :)
[12:11] <\sh> fabbione: but I'm only interessted now, if it's worth to update those "universe hoary" packages ;)
[12:11] <bob2> wtf
[12:11] <bob2> something blanked X and won't go away
[12:12] <fabbione> \sh: this is the same problem that volatile.debian.org is trying to address afaik
[12:12] <fabbione> \sh: it's an endless / chicken-egg problem
[12:13] <\sh> fabbione: well...if the solution to this problem is, that I eat the egg, so no chicken is born, I'll eat the egg ;-)
[12:13] <fabbione> \sh: i think a package like clamav can last 6 monhts.. after that we can consider to sugget users to update to the new stable version
[12:13] <fabbione> \sh: for hoary/breezy i really don't see the big need to address the issue
[12:14] <fabbione> i would consider instead important to get it right for dapper
[12:14] <fabbione> (given the longer support)
[12:15] <fabbione> \sh: we can take the talk in a bit.. ;)
[12:15] <fabbione> bah horrible english.. but you get the point
[12:15] <pitti> jdub: here?
[12:16] <\sh> fabbione: well..we should raise those issues as BoF for UBZ :)
[12:16] <bob2> ah, my fault, I hit the bios "swap display output button"
[12:17] <\sh> fabbione: my english is bad enough to understand all sorts of slang ,-)
[12:18] <pitti> \sh: you mean update to fix the recent vulnerabilities? or to fix signatures?
[12:19] <\sh> pitti: to avoid those messages to users https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/2463
[12:20] <\sh> pitti: and even vulnerabilities in the sources yes
[12:20] <pitti> \sh: CAN-2005-2919 and -2920 are open
[12:21] <ajmitch> fabbione: clamav has had a new upstream version a couple of times since UVF, seems to be needed to match new signatures
[12:21] <\sh> pitti: clamav (0.87-1) unstable; urgency=low
[12:21] <\sh>   * New upstream version
[12:21] <\sh>     - Fixes CAN-2005-2920 and CAN-2005-2919 (closes: #328660)
[12:21] <\sh> pitti: requested sync from unstable yesterday for clamav universe
[12:21] <pitti> \sh: oh, me too :-)
[12:21] <ajmitch> heh
[12:21] <\sh> pitti: hehe :) but what about hoary?
[12:22] <\sh> pitti: the version from hoary is completly 1) outdated and 2) between hoary and breezy there were some CANs closed, too
[12:22] <pitti> shawarma: if you insist, prepare a package for hoary-updates; you must test it thoroughly, it must not change and build/install dependencies
[12:22] <pitti> erm, \sh ^
[12:23] <pitti> shawarma: sorry, that wasn't for you
[12:23] <pitti> shawarma: I'd recommend to patch the vulns and just update the data files
[12:23] <pitti> \sh: ^ (darn)
[12:23] <\sh> pitti: I don't insist, I only want to know the right way how to deal with this...I mean if it would be in main, there is no issue at all, you'll take care, but universe is not "officially supported" 
[12:25] <pitti> \sh: or is the hoary version unable to read the current signature files?
[12:25] <pitti> \sh: as I said, just updating the scan signatures is fine for me (and patching the holes, of course)
[12:25] <\sh> pitti: let me check the latest packages against hoary...
[12:27] <\sh> damnit..now my cablemaster ticket is lost
[12:37] <fabbione> re
[12:48] <Diziet> Can I prevent people from replying to a bug report ?  I have tried to move the discussion to ubuntu-devel but the lame whiners won't shut up.  Bugzilla is _such_ and _awful_ mailing list system it's untrue and I don't want to use it like that.#
[12:48] <pvanhoof> ugh
[12:48] <pvanhoof> when I do groups username as root
[12:48] <mjg59> Diziet: You can't, no. It's intensely frustrating.
[12:48] <pvanhoof> I have other groups than when I do groups , as user
[12:49] <pvanhoof> which is fine, sure
[12:49] <pvanhoof> however
[12:49] <pvanhoof> the second command looses the group sbox, (scratchbox group)
[12:49] <pvanhoof> which makes it impossible for me to use scratchbox
[12:49] <pvanhoof> since using it as root is also impossible
[12:49] <Diziet> Maybe I'll just close the report with INVALID and reassign it to an account whose email goes to a black hole.
[12:49] <mjg59> Diziet: It's even more irritating when you're the original bug filer
[12:50] <mjg59> Because you *can't* unsubscribe
[12:50] <pvanhoof> root@lort:/scratchbox # groups freax
[12:50] <pvanhoof> freax : freax audio video sbox
[12:50] <pvanhoof> root@lort:/scratchbox # exit
[12:50] <pvanhoof> logout
[12:50] <pvanhoof> freax@lort:~ $ groups
[12:50] <pvanhoof> freax cdrom audio video plugdev
[12:50] <pvanhoof> freax@lort:~ $
[12:50] <pvanhoof> so, wtf did you guys do with the group-system of ubuntu breezy?
[12:50] <pvanhoof> so that I can correct this
[12:51] <Robot101> pvanhoof: not a pam thingy to give you plugdev if you're local?
[12:52] <pvanhoof> yes
[12:52] <Robot101> oh right, missing a group. you know you only gain auxilliary groups at logon, right?
[12:53] <pvanhoof> oh? :
[12:53] <pvanhoof> :)
[12:53] <sivang> can anybody tell me the difference between accept() and socket() ? i.e. they both create a socket and return a file descriptor right?
[12:53] <Robot101> pvanhoof: aha :)
[12:53] <Robot101> pvanhoof: log out/in :)
[12:53] <pvanhoof> so I have to log out?
[12:53] <Robot101> pvanhoof: or su to yourself
[12:53] <pvanhoof> and starting a shell?
[12:54] <Robot101> pvanhoof: no its a function of pam_unix I think
[12:54] <pvanhoof> aha!
[12:54] <pvanhoof> freax@lort:~ $ su - freax
[12:54] <pvanhoof> Password:
[12:54] <pvanhoof> freax@lort:~ $ groups
[12:54] <pvanhoof> freax adm dialout fax cdrom floppy tape audio dip video plugdev lpadmin scanner sbox
[12:54] <pvanhoof> freax@lort:~ $
[12:54] <pvanhoof> ok
[12:54] <pvanhoof> thanks :)
[12:54] <pvanhoof> -- strange pam --
[12:54] <Robot101> np :)
[12:54] <tseng> could we please get less pasting of huge blocks
[12:54] <Robot101> anyway that's in no way an ubuntu development discussion
[12:54] <pvanhoof> I'll try
[12:54] <Robot101> so *fwap*
[12:54] <pvanhoof> *auwch*
[12:55] <Robot101> sivang: accept is for incoming connections
[12:55] <Robot101> sivang: incoming: bind -> accept
[12:55] <Robot101> sivang: outgoing: socket -> connect
[12:55] <sivang> Robot101: ok, thanks
[12:56] <Robot101> sivang: sorry, a little misleading, to listen for connections: socket -> bind -> listen, and then to accept one (get a fd for each incoming connection) use accept
[12:57] <sivang> Robot101: ah! Now I get it :)
[01:01] <zyga> hello
[01:03] <pitti> Hi zy
[01:03] <pitti> Hi zyga
[01:03] <fabbione> seb128: ping?
[01:04] <fabbione> seb128: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/g/gst-plugins0.8/0.8.11-0ubuntu4/ <-
[01:04] <fabbione> seb128: you might be interested to look at it
[01:35] <mvo> I need a replacement for "The languages are installed now" in language-selector. it should cover both install and removal. does "The languages on the system are changed now" sound ok? suggestions welcome :)
[01:36] <Znarl>  /changed/updated/ ?
[01:37] <Kamion> "The languages" at the start of that sentence reads awkwardly
[01:37] <Kamion> "The set of available languages on the system has been updated." (too mathsy?)
[01:38] <ogra> looks good from a german POV 
[01:38] <Treenaks> The list of available languages has been updated." ?
[01:38] <Diziet> `Your changes to the available languages have been completed.'
[01:38] <Kamion> Treenaks: works for me
[01:38] <Kamion> Diziet's version works but seems somehow a bit indirect?
[01:38] <Kamion> makes me think of d(available languages)/dx :-)
[01:39] <Kamion> (maybe I'm strange)
[01:40] <mvo> thanks a lot everyone. I personally like ""The list of available languages on the system has been updated." the most. if that's ok I'll go with it 
[01:49] <infinity> Kamion : Do we want all these fcdsl drivers and such in here, or just madwifi/ath?
[01:49] <infinity> Kamion : And do you need a copy of lrm-manager in the udeb, or will you do that magic yourself some other way?
[01:51] <Kamion> infinity: just madwifi/ath
[01:51] <Kamion> infinity: personally I'd rather desupport those modules for installation than have to have a binutils-static-udeb
[01:52] <infinity> Well, unsupporting them is even easier, I just comment out all the udeb generation..
[01:52] <infinity> Not sure how well that'll fly, though, since ath is on a lot of laptops.
[01:52] <Kamion> easier than that, I just drop the priority on jackass
[01:52] <Kamion> I'll talk to mdz
[01:52] <infinity> Though, mostly laptops that should also have wired ethernet.
[01:52] <Kamion> but for now if you could just do the size fixup, that would be fine for the moment
[01:53] <infinity> Right, easy enough.  Ish.
[01:53] <Kamion> what happened to ath, ath_rate, and net80211?
[01:53] <Kamion> I only see ath_hal in the current udeb
[01:54] <infinity> Your guess is as good as mine, I don't see them in the fulle-sized .deb either.
[01:55] <infinity> Either madwifi doeswn't build them anymore, or something's broken.  I don't have an ath to test with, but I've also seen no complaints so far.
[01:55] <Kamion> at least binutils-static is only about a megabyte, in case we end up going down that road
[01:56] <infinity> If it's static, why does it depend on binutils? :)
[01:57] <Kamion> that's so wrong
[01:57] <Kamion> oh, for the documentation directory
[01:57] <Kamion> lrwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2005-09-01 02:55:52 ./usr/share/doc/binutils-static -> binutils
[01:57] <infinity> Oh, that's just retarded.
[01:58] <infinity> I think I'll have a chat with jbailey about that. :)
[02:01] <Mithrandir> doko_: around?
[02:01] <doko_> Mithrandir: yes
[02:02] <Mithrandir> doko_: 7916 just disappears with a recompile, any ideas about it from a toolchain perspective?
[02:02] <Mithrandir> doko_: it looks to me like we've had some silent breakage in the toolchain which gives us icky bugs like that one.
[02:04] <Mithrandir> doko_: I can of course just close my eyes and upload a new version and go "la, la, la", but it's not a very nice thing to do. :-)
[02:07] <doko__> Mithrandir: for gstreamer itself, unlikely. the last upload was after the last toolchain update
[02:07] <Mithrandir> doko__: the problem goes away when recompiling swh-plugins, not gstreamer.
[02:07] <zyga> hey I think I might have found a bug
[02:08] <zyga> I modprobe for cloop with the proper file
[02:08] <zyga> and then mount /dev/cloop0 
[02:08] <doko__> Mithrandir: swh-plugins was uploaded Sep 13 ...
[02:08] <zyga> as a result I've got endless stream of hpdaram.dev and hotplug stuff going on and everything hangs hard
[02:09] <infinity> Kamion : Kay, I need to examine reports of (possibly) missing files (or just drivers that have changed, who knows?) before I mangle this thing any more than it's already been.
[02:09] <zyga> sorry, udev instead od hal
[02:09] <infinity> Kamion : If you discuss dropping installer support for ath at the same time, we'll meet in the middle.
[02:09] <Mithrandir> doko__: doesn't look like that to me, given that it's the same version in breezy and hoary?
[02:10] <seb128> fabbione: pong
[02:10] <doko__> Mithrandir: ooh, right, the 0.4.13-1 upload did FTBFS on all archs ...
[02:11] <fabbione> seb128: yo.. gst-plugins is FTBFS
[02:11] <seb128> fabbione: that just say "waiting for a ftpmaster to move the accepted packages to the right place"
[02:11] <Mithrandir> doko__: well, that version was uploaded March 6th in Debian and possibly synced in later?
[02:11] <Kamion> seb128: hmm? what ftpmaster action needed?
[02:11] <fabbione> seb128: ok :)
[02:12] <seb128> Kamion: libcdio-dev and libmms-dev to main 
[02:12] <seb128> Kamion: gst-plugins0.8 Build-Depends on them now which make it FTBFSing
[02:13] <Mithrandir> doko__: hm, ok, so it might just be fixed upstream between those versions.  I'll fix the ftbfs rather, then
[02:15] <Kamion> seb128: done
[02:15] <seb128> Kamion: thanks
[02:17] <\sh> seb128: u remember my crash with evolution and this strange mail? (http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=316777) 
[02:17] <seb128> \sh: yeah, thanks for sending the bug and the bt upstream :)
[02:18] <seb128> \sh: have you tried the patch?
[02:18] <\sh> seb128: they provided a patch...u think it's going to make it into 2.12.1?
[02:18] <\sh> seb128: not now...I'll do it this evening..
[02:18] <seb128> \sh: 2.12.1 is due next monday, one week ... should be fine if somebody confirm that the patch works
[02:20] <\sh> seb128: evolution-data-server or evolution directly?  libical was data-server, right?
[02:20] <seb128> \sh: evolution-data-server/calendar/libical
[02:21] <\sh> k...I'm doing it now...lets see :)
[02:21] <seb128> cool, thanks
[02:23] <sivang> seb128: got my email?
[02:24] <seb128> sivang: yep, thanks
[02:29] <sivang> seb128: thank you :)
[02:29] <seb128> thanks to you for the patch
[02:34] <Mithrandir> seb128: is gst able to change a user's password for you on amd64?
[02:34] <Mithrandir> seb128: it just crashes for me
[02:35] <seb128> Mithrandir: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15428
[02:35] <seb128> Mithrandir: I've started debugging it from a liveCD since I've no amd64 install atm and gave it to dholbach ... he did some work on it but with no luck for the moment
[02:36] <seb128> Mithrandir: I'm sure he would appreciate you giving him a hand with it if you want to track it :)
[02:37] <Mithrandir> seb128: I could give it a shot, sure.
[02:45] <mdke> sabdfl, pong, if you're still here
[02:46] <sabdfl> mdke: hi. just curious as to the status of the "About Ubuntu" icon in the System menu? And the doc?
[02:47] <mdke> sabdfl, it's being translated
[02:47] <mdke> sabdfl, it hasn't been uploaded yet to my knowledge, jbailey is dealing with that aspect of the documentation
[02:47] <mdke> but it looks good
[02:48] <sabdfl> cool!
[02:48] <sabdfl> could we get at least the current stuff uploaded for testing and feedback?
[02:48] <sabdfl> i'd like to avoid a last-minute rush to get it in, and the attendant "oops!" issues
[02:48] <mdke> better speak to jeff, I think he had intended to do it by now
[02:49] <mdke> but we've been over the doc and fixed any typos, I hope
[02:49] <mdke> the translators pointed some things out, which we fixed
[02:50] <sabdfl> jbailey: ^^ how's it looking? issues? status?
[02:50] <mdke> i gtg
[02:51] <sabdfl> thanks mdke
[02:51] <mdke> np, catch you again
[02:54] <doko> infinity, lamont-away: eclipse is only built on i386
[02:56] <Diziet> It's clear to me, now, why everyone in the bugzilla always sounds annoyed - even more than you might expect from them having found a bug.  It's because everyone who's typing into that bugzilla box is ... fighting bugzilla.
[02:58] <tseng> thats quoteworthy
[02:59] <Robot101> already saved :P
[03:03] <jkrogh> Does anyone have a guess at the problem in #12942 - mysterious NFS timeouts.. ? 
[03:03] <sivang> lol
[03:03] <sivang> that's why I think we need to switch to malone as soon as it becomes productionable
[03:04] <tseng> sivang: malone is worse
[03:04] <tseng> more people need to be pointing out usability problems
[03:05] <tseng> there is some kind of malone users bof in that vein
[03:06] <ogra> jkrogh, yes, every edubuntu user
[03:06] <seb128> Mithrandir: #7916 is fixed by a new version of what package?
[03:07] <ogra> jkrogh, you write in the bug that it works after 5 minutes ? 
[03:07] <Mithrandir> seb128: swh-plugins
[03:07] <Mithrandir> seb128: which is in universe, so I can't reassign it.
[03:07] <seb128> Mithrandir: so that's not a gst bug? I can close it on bugzilla.gnome?
[03:07] <Kamion> jkrogh: does mount -onolock help?
[03:07] <Mithrandir> seb128: yes.
[03:08] <seb128> k, thanks
[03:08] <dholbach> YAY for Mithrandir! :)
[03:08] <Mithrandir> dholbach: what have I done now? :-)
[03:09] <dholbach> swh-plugins :)
[03:09] <seb128> oh
[03:09] <Mithrandir> ah, that one.
[03:09] <seb128> I thought this was about the users-admin crasher
[03:09] <Mithrandir> it was just fixing the ftbfs. :-P
[03:09] <Mithrandir> seb128: no, that one isn't fixed by gstreamer stuff. :-)
[03:10] <seb128> Mithrandir: yeah, but it would make dholbach happy too :p
[03:11] <ogra> Kamion, can one put that in the bootoptions ? 
[03:11] <ogra> (its the mounting of / that fails there)
[03:12] <seb128> sivang: your autotools patch is bugged
[03:13] <ogra> oh, and apparently jkrogh already tried that...
[03:13] <Kamion> ogra: no
[03:13] <ogra> (according to the bug)
[03:13] <sivang> seb128: bah, does it break on building ?
[03:14] <seb128> gnome-panel/panel-context-menu.c:289: undefined reference to `launchpad_integration_add_items
[03:14] <seb128> sivang: I'm fixing it don't worry
[03:14] <sivang> seb128: ah man, I probably removedd too much PKG_CHECK_MODULES from the patch, I tried to make it cleaner, funny it worked for me
[03:15] <sivang> seb128: I guess both launchpad-integration and lpint-bonobo are required there
[03:22] <bddebian> Morning
[03:22] <bddebian> doko: ping?
[03:22] <pitti> Hi bddebian 
[03:22] <bddebian> Heya pitti
[03:23] <doko> bddebian: ?
[03:23] <bddebian> doko: Do you see a problem with brining in a newer zipios++ from Debian?
[03:28] <doko> bddebian: why? what did the Debian NMU change
[03:28] <doko> ?
[03:30] <bddebian> doko: I dunno but there is a bug on Malone about wesnoth that it supposedly fixes
[03:38] <doko> bddebian: ok, after reading the changelog and #314602, it indeed fixes the problem with wesnoth. requesting the sync now. btw, nothing, what you couldn't have found out yourself ;-)
[03:39] <jkrogh> ogra: My mistake.. it works at most for 5 minutes then are broken for some time .. and eventually it resumes connection again. 
[03:39] <bddebian> doko: I know but I saw that you made the ubuntu changes for the current version so I didn't want to just do it.  Sorry.
[03:40] <jkrogh> Will try "nolock". 
[03:40] <ogra> jkrogh, thats about booting ? 
[03:41] <ogra> or about login ? 
[03:42] <ogra> login == 15244, booting == 12942
[03:42] <ogra> 15244 is something weird going on with sshd i suspect
[03:43] <Mithrandir> seb128: the segfault goes away if I disable optimisation. :-/
[03:43] <jkrogh> it is 12942 but it is about the root-NFS in general not only booting. 
[03:43] <seb128> Mithrandir: how nice
[03:44] <ogra> i have no problems at all (except the fisrt boot timeout) neither have other testers in #edubuntu 
[03:44] <jkrogh> I can get the error about NFS not responding on the shell (crtl+alt+F2)
[03:44] <Mithrandir> seb128: yeah, and it seems like there's stack corruption shit in the md5 code.
[03:44] <seb128> dholbach: read that?
[03:47] <ogra> jkrogh, do you use edubuntu or the ltsp from breezy with a self set up NFS server ? 
[03:47] <jkrogh> ltsp in breezy
[03:48] <ogra> hmm, k... i didnt hear about anything like that in #edubuntu yet, even test schools are running it happily... probably your setup is at fault..
[03:48] <ogra> i wont be able to do much edubuntu testing this week, but i'll check it...
[03:48] <jkrogh> Yes there is definately something wrong. 
[03:49] <jkrogh> The setup did run Debian/Sarge + LTSP 4.0 lasts week just fine.. so I dont think it is hardware problems. 
[03:50] <ogra> debian/sarge's ltsp has zero in common with the breezy ltsp, its a totally new implementation
[03:51] <ogra> debian/sarge == exported X TCP session, breezy ltsp == ssh tunnel, they both use tftp and nfs though
[03:51] <jkrogh> Yes. but the core principels are the same. 
[03:51] <jkrogh> Boot over PXE.. root-on-NFS
[03:52] <ogra> oh, and debian doesnt use itiramfs at bootime at all i think
[03:52] <ogra> *initramfs
[03:52] <jkrogh> No.. those scripts are really nice in Ubuntu .. easy and modifiable :-) 
[03:52] <ogra> 2.6.10 still is initrd afaik
[03:53] <sabdf1> jbailey: ping
[03:53] <ogra> jkrogh, but you could join #edubuntu and track the issue with other ltsp users ;)
[03:59] <bddebian> elmo: ping?
[04:02] <Mithrandir> seb128: ok, I've found the bug.  Casts are evil.
[04:02] <Mithrandir>     ((uint32 *) ctx->in)[14]  = ctx->bits[0] ;
[04:02] <Mithrandir>     ((uint32 *) ctx->in)[15]  = ctx->bits[1] ;
[04:02] <Mithrandir> Don't do this.
[04:03] <Mithrandir> at least not without making sure ctx->in is big enough
[04:05] <seb128> Mithrandir: what are ctx->in and ctx->bits?
[04:07] <Mithrandir> ctx->in is a char[64] 
[04:08] <seb128> bad
[04:08] <Mithrandir> and with sizeof(uint32*) == 8, that goes boom.
[04:08] <seb128> yeah
[04:08] <seb128> thanks for tracking it
[04:08] <Mithrandir> the easy and ugly fix is just to make ctx->in a char[128] 
[04:08] <Mithrandir> it stops segfaulting, at least.
[04:09] <Mithrandir> openssl uses a "OPENSSL_LONG" which is minimum 32 bits and can be bigger and does some shit around that.
[04:09] <Mithrandir> since I don't think we'll be generating the right data just by changing that
[04:09] <seb128> I'm wondering who is upstream for this code
[04:10] <seb128> carlos said he copied the md5.c file from somewhere else
[04:10] <Mithrandir> oh, excellent; "somewhere else" :-P
[04:10] <Mithrandir> for security-related code, I really don't like that.
[04:11] <seb128> imho using g-s-t is far from beeing optimal
[04:11] <seb128> there is a lot of work and upstream is busy
[04:11] <seb128> making it working on every distro around is a lot of work too
[04:11] <seb128> and perl is .. <no comment>
[04:12] <Mithrandir> it's linuxconf is all over again, really.
[04:12] <seb128> we should rewrite the tools using pygtk one day
[04:12] <sivang> seb128: and rewrite the backend in python :)
[04:12] <Treenaks> perl can be nice.. but the code you're referring to obviously isn't :)
[04:12] <seb128> Mithrandir: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10742 ... users-admin didn't crash but the password was not working neither for hoary
[04:13] <Mithrandir> seb128: I guess that's because half of the thing it's stuffing into the password field is garbage.
[04:13] <Mithrandir> seb128: I guess I should just fix md5.c to at least work.
[04:16] <bddebian> Heya sivang
[04:16] <seb128> Mithrandir: that would be nice if you want to do it :)
[04:18] <sivang> hey bddebian  :)
[04:18] <sivang> bddebian: 'sup?
[04:18] <bddebian> sivang: UnmetDeps and bugs as usual :-)  You?
[04:21] <zyga> hmmmm
[04:22] <jbailey> sabdf1: pong
[04:23] <jbailey> sabdf1: I was beating on the docs at the end of last week, and realised that my branch didn't keep in mind KDE docs.
[04:23] <sabdf1> jbailey: ok
[04:24] <sabdf1> can we get the current snapshot in, even if its broken, so we get bugs filed and can track them to release?
[04:24] <bddebian> sabdf1: Oh, you are still here.  Mind if I ask a quick question about Universe and apt-get.org packages?
[04:24] <jbailey> sabdfl: Will do by end of today.
[04:24] <sabdfl> jbailey: cool, thanks muchly
[04:24] <sabdfl> bddebian: sure
[04:24] <Riddell> jbailey: what's all this?
[04:25] <zyga> could someone help me with strange udev behaviour
[04:25] <jbailey> Riddell: kubuntu-docs
[04:25] <zyga> I don't know if this is a bug really
[04:25] <zyga> I mount a cloop image
[04:25] <bddebian> sabdfl: I know of at least two packages currently in the archive from Marillat that are depending on other Marillat packages that are not in the archive.  Should I bring in the deps or morgue the packages for now, or do nothing?
[04:25] <zyga> and unmount it immediatly
[04:25] <zyga> I also rmmod cloop
[04:25] <zyga> that spawns couple dozen of udev and hdparm.dev processes
[04:26] <zyga> that hang indefinitly unless killed -9
[04:26] <zyga> they also take all available CPU
[04:26] <sivang> bddebian: stil with that cupsys thingy, it's a bit elusive where the sockets are opened and closed 
[04:26] <zyga> I can reproduce this easily
[04:27] <bddebian> sivang: :-(
[04:27] <zyga> the strange thing is they seem to scan my /dev/hdc which corresponds to the CD drive
[04:27] <sivang> bddebian: plus, SIGHUPing cupsd appears to just shut it down instead of actually reloading the configuration
[04:27] <sivang> bddebian: nah, things are cool :) it's all much fun!
[04:27] <bddebian> Is that what you call it? ;-)
[04:28] <sabdfl> bddebian: if the deps *can't* be in Ubuntu universe/multiverse, then the packages themselves should also not be here
[04:28] <sabdfl> if they can, we should sync them in
[04:28] <sabdfl> so the archive is consistent, either way
[04:29] <sabdfl> sond good?
[04:29] <bddebian> Sure but what does *can't* be mean? :-)
[04:35] <Diziet> Is there anyone here who uses a non-Latin character set ?  It would be nice to have some idea of what the right response is to http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15942.
[04:37] <bddebian> elmo: I know you are there!! :-)
[04:37] <zyga> Dilago: I do
[04:37] <sivang> lol
[04:37] <dholbach> sivang: don't you use hebrew locale?
[04:38] <sivang> Diziet: you have bugspam :)
[04:38] <sabdfl> bddebian: w32codecs, for example, *can't*
[04:38] <sivang> dholbach: already added comment to that bug :)
[04:38] <zyga> hmmm
[04:38] <seb128> pitti: do you have a reference bug to explain why we don't use alsasink? I've an another "A/V sync sucks by default"
[04:38] <dholbach> ah ok :)
[04:38] <sabdfl> i think
[04:38] <Diziet> sivan: Thanks.  Um, do you mind if I quiz you about this ?
[04:39] <zyga> can anyone assist me with utterly strange udev behaviour?
[04:39] <sivang> Diziet: feel free, I'm at your service
[04:39] <sabdfl> bddebian: the process is to ask elmo, who will ask me if he's not sure
[04:39] <sivang> Diziet: btw, I can that with hoary as well
[04:39] <elmo> Kamion/benc/fabbione: around?
[04:39] <bddebian> sabdfl: OK, thx.  I'm trying to catch elmo but I bug the crap out of the poor guy :-)
[04:40] <zyga> Diziet: I can confirm that bug too
[04:40] <Kamion> elmo: yo?
[04:40] <zyga> anyone about udev weirdness?
[04:40] <elmo> Kamion: oh, nm, it's generic FTBFS, not d-i related as I thought
[04:41] <pitti> seb128: sounds like a dup of #15438
[04:41] <seb128> pitti: thanks
[04:41] <pitti> seb128: there I explain the issue, and it's about a/v desync
[04:41] <elmo> Kamion: (sorry)
[04:41] <pitti> Hi elmo 
[04:41] <bddebian> elmo: I know you're busy as hell but if you get a chance would you mind looking at the licenses for babytrans-common and ffmpeg2 on Marillat? (apt-get.org)
[04:41] <Kamion> ok
[04:42] <zyga> hmm I feel helpless
[04:42] <pitti> elmo: can you please remove mozilla from hoary-backports? it's obsoleted by h-security and vulnerable
[04:42] <mjg59> bddebian: ffmpeg2 is a patent problem rather than a freedom one
[04:42] <bddebian> mjg59: I'm sorry, I'm not sure what you mean?  Ohh, you mean because of mpeg?
[04:43] <elmo> pitti: will people have an upgrade path, assuming they have both in their sources.list?
[04:43] <mjg59> elmo: Would it be possible to sync hotkey-setup?
[04:44] <pitti> elmo: yes, hoary-security has the same package name, but a more recent version
[04:44] <Kamion> Mithrandir: did you ever get anywhere with the x86emu fixes for amd64?
[04:44] <seb128> elmo: please sync gnomemeeting (GNOME desktop component) pwlib h323lib (required by the new gnomemeeting) from Debian
[04:44] <pitti> elmo: upgrading to breezy is flawless too (unlike the mozilla-firefox -> firefox name change)
[04:45] <Mithrandir> Kamion: no, my dvd burner is broken at the moment (or, one of them is, the one at work where I have a POSTable graphics card)
[04:45] <Mithrandir> Kamion: so I can't really test it more until I get that back.
[04:45] <\sh> seb128: sorry for the delay, but our digital tv headend is producing problems...but the patch works
[04:45] <bddebian> Heya \sh
[04:46] <pitti> elmo: speaking of which, did you read about the trouble with firefox? is it possible to upload a transition package manually to h-backports at all? or do all uploads need to be synced from breezy?
[04:46] <bddebian> elmo: If ffmpeg2 can't be brought in can you please drop gpac from the archive?
[04:46] <elmo> pitti: mozilla removed
[04:47] <seb128> \sh: cool, could you comment to say so on the upstream bug?
[04:47] <elmo> mjg59: done
[04:47] <bddebian> mjg59: Do you happen to know about babytrans-common license?
[04:47] <pitti> elmo: thanks
[04:47] <\sh> seb128: already done :)
[04:47] <elmo> seb128: I assume you mean openh323 ?
[04:48] <mdz> morning
[04:48] <bddebian> Heya mdz
[04:48] <elmo> seb128: if so - ok to override ubuntu changes?  same question for gnomemeeting
[04:48] <\sh> seb128: so u think they will include it in 2.12.1?
[04:48] <ogra> elmo, while youre at it, mediawiki hit debian today... please sync :)
[04:48] <mjg59> bddebian: No
[04:48] <mjg59> bddebian: Let me check
[04:48] <bddebian> mjg59: Thx
[04:48] <mdz> \sh: Riddell can set up default assignees for you
[04:49] <elmo> [NOT Updating - Modified]  mediawiki_1.4.7-2ubuntu2 (vs 1.4.10-1)
[04:49] <elmo> ogra: ok to override?
[04:49] <seb128> elmo: pelase sync pwlib and openh323 with overwritting, I'll merge gnomemeeting ... thanks for asking :)
[04:49] <elmo> pitti: rules of backports are that it's unmodified breezy source only
[04:49] <mjg59> bddebian: Uh. Babytrans appears to be under the GPL.
[04:49] <seb128> s/pelase/please/
[04:49] <ogra> elmo, sure :)
[04:49] <\sh> mdz: ok thx :)
[04:50] <elmo> pitti: you'll need mdz or higher to override that
[04:50] <seb128> \sh: yeah
[04:50] <pitti> elmo: so it's technically possible? ok, then we can at least discuss that option. thanks!
[04:50] <mdz> pitti: what's the situation?
[04:50] <pitti> Hi mdz 
[04:50] <elmo> seb128: done
[04:51] <\sh> seb128: cool :)
[04:51] <pitti> mdz: you know the mozilla-firefox -> firefox renaming in breezy
[04:51] <tseng> mdz: do you need to approve larger patches for main (mono bug fix backport)?
[04:51] <tseng> mdz: 12k
[04:51] <Riddell> \sh: needing an assignee setup?
[04:51] <seb128> elmo: thanks
[04:51] <pitti> mdz: problem is, in hoary-backports the package is called firefox as well, although it should be mozilla-firefox
[04:51] <bddebian> mjg59: Oh *face turns red*
[04:51] <mjg59> bddebian: Oh, hang on
[04:51] <mjg59> bddebian: babytans-common is the dictionary file
[04:51] <ogra> mgji think the wordlists arent
[04:52] <pitti> mdz: that means that installing hoary (m-f), then h-backports (firefox), then hoary-security (m-f again) breaks since the packages overwrite each other's files without a conflict
[04:52] <ogra> mjg59, indeed
[04:52] <pitti> mdz: I did not think about adding a conflict to firefox in the security update, and it would not even completely resolve the situation
[04:52] <mdz> pitti: why not?
[04:52] <mjg59> bddebian: There appears to be no permission whatsoever to distribute that
[04:52] <bddebian> Nice
[04:52] <bddebian> WTF
[04:53] <pitti> mdz: once you have ffox installed, merely declaring a conflict in m-f to f won't automatically upgrade f to m-f
[04:53] <pitti> mdz: so we would need an empty firefox transition package in h-backports that depends on m-f
[04:53] <pitti> mdz: alternatively, folks have to manually purge firefox and reinstall m-f
[04:54] <pitti> mdz: but since in breezy we have the exactly reverse situation, we can't do this migration in the breezy package
[04:54] <mdz> pitti: I don't think we want to transition back to m-f
[04:54] <bddebian> mjg59: So we should drop babytrans too?
[04:54] <sivang> elmo: if you are too busy , I might wait for the DB2 certification CD to arrive and not bother you anymore with the files, I'm afraid to lack soem of the needed files, as he forgot to upload on one smack...
[04:54] <mdz> why not keep firefox in backports and sync the latest version from breezy?
[04:55] <pitti> mdz: the current breezy package does not work on hoary any more (major changes like cairo and stuff)
[04:55] <ogra> pitti, wasnt it a request from the mozilla foundation to change the name anyway ?
[04:55] <ogra> iirc
[04:55] <mjg59> bddebian: babytrans should be fine, you just can't distribute the dictionary
[04:55] <pitti> ogra: right, but it breaks hoary
[04:55] <bddebian> mjg59: But babytrans-common is a dep (or build-dep) I don't recall atm
[04:55] <ogra> pitti, dont tell me, it cluttered my weekends mailbox badly ;)
[04:55] <mdz> pitti: it should be possible to get it building on hoary again
[04:56] <mdz> pitti: this is for the backports team to handle though
[04:56] <pitti> mdz: hmm, release-dependent build deps?
[04:56] <Mithrandir> seb128: it helps that the md5 implementation is broken and doesn't give out the right answer.  I wonder why this wasn't discovered...
[04:57] <mjg59> bddebian: It's a dependency. I've no idea why.
[04:57] <mjg59> That file is plainly not required
[04:57] <bddebian> mjg59: OK, I'll just drop the dep then.  Thanks for your time!
[04:57] <pitti> mdz: if they manage to do that, that would be a good solution, of course
[04:58] <mdz> pitti: usually this can be fixed simply with |-ed build-deps
[04:58] <pitti> mdz: ok, I tell the bp team to try that
[04:59] <seb128> Mithrandir: how "wasn't discovered"? There is a bug for some time, the issue is that it's amd64 specific and some people don't run an amd64 install ... :)
[04:59] <sivang> pitti: what's the bp team?
[04:59] <sivang> pitti: ah, backports
[04:59] <pitti> sivang: backporters
[05:00] <Diziet> sivang: Thanks for your help.  I hope you don't mind that I'm going to punt, given that it's outstanding upstream and looks nontrivial.
[05:00] <dholbach> mdz: if you talk about gnome-sudoku... elmo already "told" me :)
[05:00] <sivang> Diziet: on the contrary, please do :)
[05:00] <mdz> dholbach: yes
[05:01] <ogra> wow, a novel :) 
[05:01] <Mithrandir> seb128: gnnnr
[05:01] <Mithrandir> seb128: *grumble*
[05:10] <ogra> thanks elmo
[05:11] <mdz> eek, firefox is crashing on bugzilla for me
[05:11] <mdz> the certificate dialog (or what I assume is the certificate dialog) flashes up and then the whole thing goes down in flames
[05:12] <seb128> Mithrandir: carlos says than the md5 stuff comes from pam
[05:13] <mdz> fun, both an oops and a SCSI bus reset in syslog
[05:13] <mdz> time to reboot
[05:19] <jkrogh> ogra: FYI, booting to the LTSP 2.6.9 kernel solves the NFS issues in my setup. 
[05:19] <jkrogh> There must be something strange with the NFS-client.. 
[05:20] <ogra> jkrogh, 2.6.9 on the client with a newly generated initramfs ??
[05:20] <jkrogh> on the client. 
[05:20] <jbailey> initramfs should fail to generate for anything less than 2.6.12
[05:20] <jkrogh> with the initramfs from LTSP.org
[05:20] <jbailey> And beyond that shouldn't boot if you convinced it to build.
[05:20] <jbailey> Ah.
[05:22] <ogra> jkrogh, what bothers me is that you seem to be the only person having probs with NFS here
[05:23] <jkrogh> ogra: That really borthers me too. 
[05:23] <ogra> jkrogh, (beyond the boot timeout indeed)
[05:24] <ogra> jkrogh, thats a new plain breezy install ? no foreign packages etc at all ? 
[05:24] <sivang> jkrogh: do you have nfs-common installed?
[05:25] <jkrogh> ogra: The boot timeout was rare.. 
[05:25] <ogra> sivang, yes, else NFS wouldnt work at all for him
[05:25] <jkrogh> Most of the time it got the NFS mount successfully but then timed out later in the system. 
[05:26] <ogra> jkrogh, it only occurs on the first boot of the first client...
[05:26] <jkrogh> approximately 15 seconds later.. 
[05:26] <ogra> jkrogh, again my question, thats a new plain breezy install ? 
[05:26] <sivang> ogra: I ad a problem with NFS delay on boot, installing 2 more packages solved it, probably not nfs-common
[05:26] <jkrogh> Yes. plain breezy install
[05:26] <jkrogh> Fresh from d. 23
[05:27] <ogra> and nothing foreign in there, no debian packages etc ? 
[05:27] <jkrogh> Not at all. 
[05:27] <ogra> hmm, strange
[05:27] <j^> could it be portmap? not having poartmap can cause long timeouts
[05:27] <ogra> it would choke on every boot without portmap
[05:28] <sivang> ogra: it blocked for half an hour on boot until I installed those pakcages, don't recall which they were
[05:28] <ogra> you'd see it on the clients...
[05:28] <sivang> ogra: riught, portnao
[05:28] <sivang> grr, portmap even
[05:30] <ogra> sivang, its not possible to install nfs-kernel-server without portmap
[05:30] <ogra> its a dependency
[05:30] <sivang> ogra: yes, but I didn't install kernel-server at first, I only wanted to mount remote file systems :)
[05:30] <ogra> jkrogh, did you use ltsp-server-standalone or only the ltsp-server package
[05:30] <sivang> ogra: so portmap wasn't pulled in
[05:31] <jkrogh> -standalone
[05:31] <ogra> sivang, we talk about ltsp-server/-standalone ... its a dependency
[05:31] <ogra> there are no missing packages
[05:31] <ogra> jkrogh, and followed the ThinClientHowto from the wiki ?
[05:32] <sivang> ogra: ah ok, sorry for the noise
[05:33] <ogra> sivang, additionally it works for all others who tried ltsp until now...
[05:33] <jkrogh> ogra: There migt be something here.. nfs statd actually fails. 
[05:33] <ogra> oh
[05:34] <jkrogh> Nope.. It just fails to start, when it is started allready. 
[05:34] <jkrogh> Yes. I followed the ThinClientHowto. 
[05:35] <ogra> hmm
[05:36] <ogra> jkrogh, all i can tall you now is that i'll do a edubuntu install later today, but it still may take some hours before i find the time for it... probably its a new but that was introduced last week...
[05:36] <jdong> hey guys, Breezy firefox needs build depends on libcairo1-dev
[05:37] <Diziet> Joy.  A bug report about a website that makes firefox crash metacity.  And the site is pretty vile.
[05:37] <jdong> >=1.1.17, too :)
[05:37] <jbailey> Diziet: microsoft.com?
[05:37] <jkrogh> Well, lets stop debugging for now.. I'll be using the LTSP.org kernel/ramdisk/userland  and try out Ubuntu's when 6.04 is about to release again. 
[05:37] <ogra> Diziet, makes firefox crash metacity ??
[05:37] <jdong> jbailey: LOL
[05:37] <hughsie> ogra: is pitti around?
[05:37] <jkrogh> ogra: Or just poke to me if you want something tested out. 
[05:37] <ogra> jkrogh, oki
[05:37] <ogra> jkrogh, lets see what i find tonight :)
[05:38] <Diziet> 15995.  I've reproduced it.  But the site is not by any means what one would normally consider work-safe - even if it didn't crash your session.
[05:38] <jbailey> I kills the session manager?
[05:39] <Diziet> No, just metacity.
[05:39] <Diziet> You can log out, but you can't regain control.
[05:42] <j^> i would blame it on the TITLE element 
[05:42] <j^> its too long
[05:42] <j^> metacity should not crash if an app tries to set a too long title
[05:42] <Robot101> it could be duff unicode
[05:44] <seb128> Diziet: nice bug :)
[05:44] <j^> Diziet title is 34921 chars long
[05:44] <jkrogh> Otherwise.. I'd really like to thank you guys for Ubuntu, It is by far the most "friendly" distribution at the moment. 
[05:45] <ogra> i wonder if a 34921 char long title works in windows
[05:46] <j^> hehe
[05:48] <sivang> jkrogh: just spread the word , make many people use it :)
[05:48] <Diziet> Yep, it's the overly long <title>, all right.
[05:49] <jdong> would that be a buffer overflow type of thing? ;)
[05:49] <seb128> Diziet: I can forward it to bugzilla.gnome if you want
[05:51] <Diziet> seb: Do you want me to try to debug it first ?  We should perhaps check it's not already reported.
[05:51] <Diziet> I consider this a security bug, although a minor one.  It might also be a major one.
[05:52] <ogra> hughsie, sorry missed ou... pitti is already gone ... dunno if he'll come back
[05:53] <seb128> Diziet: do you have a backtrace? That would make easy to figure if it's known upstream
[05:53] <j^> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=315070
[05:54] <seb128> thanks
[05:54] <j^> so its cairo-based pango/gtk+ 
[05:54] <Diziet> That looks like our bug.
[05:54] <Diziet> I'm not convinced that patch is right.
[05:55] <Diziet> I don't know what the X limit is that's referred to, but won't it be in bytes and not characters ?
[05:56] <Mithrandir> seb128: hmm, the bug is something else, but I'm not sure and my head is threatening to fall off, so I'll make dinner and look at it later.
[05:57] <seb128> Mithrandir: k, thanks for the work on that, enjoy your dinner
[05:57] <ogra> Mithrandir, and have some pillow around in case your head falls off :)
[05:58] <jkrogh> Oh.. where do I file stuff about the "planet" (http://planet.ubuntulinux.org) ? 
[05:58] <jkrogh> http://krogh.cc/~jesper/ubuntu.png
[05:58] <jkrogh> looks like .... in MSIE. 
[05:59] <ogra> jkrogh, jdub maintains it... probably there is a product under "website" in bugzills
[05:59] <ogra> s/s/a
[06:02] <Diziet> I assume that if someone has errors from the packaging system because of braindamage in ubuntu-backports.mirrormax.net, I can just RESOLVE INVALID ?
[06:03] <jdong> Diziet: yeah, go ahead -- and I personally apologize for all the trouble it's caused
[06:07] <ogra> Diziet, please point him to the backports forum for the inofficial backports, we shouldnt just drop it..
[06:09] <jdong> yes, please try to point them to the forums or ubuntu-backports@lists.ubuntu.com -- we're currently working on fixing the problem
[06:12] <Diziet> jdong/ogra: Willdo.
[06:14] <Kamion> Could a French speaker review #16303 for me, please? Note that the actual msgid is "Erase entire disk and use LVM: ${DEVICE}"
[06:15] <jdong> Diziet: I'm working on a 1.0.7 backport with various team members, so this should be all resolved by mid week
[06:15] <Diziet> jdong: Right.  FYI, the bug is 16228.
[06:18] <seb128> Kamion: what po files are to update ?
[06:18] <seb128> Kamion: one of the string has a small error and I want to update the other installed stuff too
[06:19] <desrt> what email address does mjg59 use on bugzilla?
[06:20] <mdke> mjg59 will catch him
[06:20] <mdke> bugzilla autocompletes
[06:20] <bob2> yay for 250KB of javascript!
[06:20] <desrt> hey
[06:20] <desrt> that's sweet!
[06:21] <ogra> j^, because its in production and development power goes to malone...
[06:22] <bob2> I'm pretty sure no one from canonical added that feature to bugzilla
[06:22] <bob2> it certainly had it back in like may last year
[06:22] <ogra> yup
[06:22] <j^> ogra malone would also need some ajax love
[06:22] <bob2> ajax is the most annoying buzzword of the year
[06:22] <ogra> j^, tell that to #launchpad ;)
[06:23] <bob2> this conversation has made it overtake "podcast"
[06:23] <j^> but ubuntus bugzilla is the first with such a large list of products
[06:24] <Kamion> seb128: the installer po files are all in http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/installer-po/, http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/base-config-po/, http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/shadow-po/
[06:25] <seb128> Kamion: thanks, I'll send you updated PO for all of those later
[06:25] <Kamion> seb128: cheers
[06:26] <Kamion> seb128: I've pulled a few updates from Rosetta, but probably not everything
[06:26] <seb128> k
[06:26] <Kamion> if there are particular things already done in Rosetta that I should grab, let me know ...
[06:26] <seb128> I'll have a look on what rosetta has yep
[06:26] <Kamion> unfortunately the way the po-export stuff is now "POST to URL, wait for mail, go to URL in mail" makes it a lot less automatable than it used to me
[06:27] <Kamion> used to be
[06:27] <Kamion> I used to have a script which could extract translations from Rosetta to stdout
[06:27] <Kamion> but I suspect it's only me who cares because everyone else can use language packs
[06:28] <Kamion> seb128: oh, those base-config and shadow directories are very out of date, sorry - I'll update them now
[06:29] <seb128> let me know when the new version is online, so I grab the correct one :)
[06:33] <Kamion> seb128: done
[06:33] <seb128> thanks
[06:35] <Diziet> Is there anything I need to watch out for if I decide to change the default fonts in Firefox ?
[06:36] <ogra> webpages mostly define sans-serif or serif in their CSS i dont know if you should change it in firefox...
[06:37] <ogra> rather the assignment serif -> Nimbus Sans should be changed to serif -> Bitstream Vera Sans
[06:37] <Diziet> There are two things I want to change, I think: firstly, the default if the site doesn't specify is to use serif, and I want to change that to sans.
[06:37] <ogra> err s/serif/sans-serif/
[06:37] <ogra> Diziet++
[06:37] <Diziet> Secondly, if the site just asks for sans-serif they get a pretty unpleasant font.
[06:38] <ogra> for sans too...
[06:38] <ogra> Nimbus looks weird here....
[06:39] <Diziet> Right.  Nimbus seems to be the default.  I don't know yet where that's controlled.  If no-one knows easily then I will find out for myself :-).
[06:39] <Diziet> No, I'm wrong, the default is Bitstream Vera Sans.
[06:39] <ogra> normally in local.conf of fontconfig, but last time i looked there was Bitstream selected already, there must be something inbetween...
[06:39] <Diziet> FreeSans is much nicer.
[06:40] <ogra> nope, not here... it looks like Nimbus...
[06:40] <ogra> blurry character borders
[06:40] <Diziet> Maybe I should post to ubuntu-devel and let the bikeshedders argue it out :-).
[06:41] <Diziet> Yes, I think I will do that.
[06:41] <j^> who would i talk to about changes on packages.ubuntu.com?
[06:41] <ogra> anyway it hould be Bitstream 
[06:41] <Diziet> It looks here like it is.
[06:41] <ogra> j^, see packages.ubuntu.com, there is a address
[06:41] <ogra> ;)
[06:42] <Diziet> Bitstream Vera Sans, which is rather spindly.
[06:42] <ogra> Diziet, nope... something sets it to Nimbus
[06:42] <ogra> switch explicitly to Bitstream, you'll see te difference
[06:42] <Diziet> Hmm.  This machine was upgraded from hoary.
[06:42] <Diziet> Yes, I did and it's just the same.
[06:42] <ogra> hmm, not on my new installs...
[06:43] <ogra> and here on my upgraded system neither...
[06:43] <Diziet> Perhaps it depends whether you tell it you have an LCD 
[06:43] <ogra> nope, i have both here...
[06:44] <ogra> it looks crappy with the default on both unless i explicitly select a bitstream font...
[06:44] <ogra> ... probably a bitstream conspiracy on my side here :)
[06:45] <Diziet> Is the default font chosen via Firefox or via some other package ?
[06:45] <Diziet> I mean, the default sans and the default serif.
[06:50] <ogra> Diziet, it uest to be set by local.conf from fontconfig, but that may have changed with cairo... i guess seb128 can give some insight
[06:50] <ogra> s/uest/used
[06:51] <ogra> abarbaccia, sorry, seems jdong is gone already...
[06:51] <abarbaccia> ogra no worries - i'll get him later
[06:51] <seb128> that has no changed afaik
[06:52] <ogra> seb128, hmm, why is the default font in firefox for sans not bitstream vera sans then ? 
[06:53] <ogra> at least here its either Free Sans or Nimbus ... it only gets readable if i explicitly select Vera Sans
[06:56] <seb128> ogra: no clue, I don't use firefox
[06:59] <dholbach> seb128: epiphany love? :)
[06:59] <ogra> bah, use a *real* browser :)
[06:59] <dholbach> :)
[07:00] <ogra> dholbach, epiphany was the first thing i droppen in edubuntu when i needed space ;)
[07:00] <ogra> dropped even
[07:00] <dholbach> ignorant %$"$!&
[07:00] <dholbach> :)
[07:00] <seb128> dholbach: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EpiphanyDefaultBrowser
[07:00] <dholbach> yeah, i read that :)
[07:00] <seb128> I would pick it only for the translations
[07:02] <ogra> dholbach, to be fair, the second thing dropped was thunderbird :)
[07:14] <Diziet> What can I do to get a bug reporter a telling-off ?  I referred them to `How to Report Bugs Effectively' and they seem to have replied with a rant without having read it.
[07:14] <Diziet> (And, to be fair, marginally more info.)
[07:16] <ogra> hmm, just set it to needinfo and tell him you cant do anything without more info...?
[07:16] <Diziet> I want to be a bit more constructive.  I'll try telling him off myself.
[07:17] <ogra> but if he already rants, pure bureocracy is probably the best...
[07:18] <Diziet> Well, if it's a real bug I'd actually like to nail it down.
[07:19] <ogra> thats hard without the reporter giving all info
[07:20] <mjg59> Diziet: Which bug?
[07:20] <dholbach> do we still need the euro-support package for any reason?
[07:21] <ogra> not really
[07:23] <Diziet> 16132
[07:23] <Diziet> (I have to go very soon.)
[07:25] <ogra> Diziet, ask him if he has libxp installed ...
[07:26] <Diziet> I'll try that - tomorrow, I have to go now :-).
[07:26] <Diziet> Thanks.
[07:26] <ogra> :)
[07:26] <Diziet> TTFN all
[07:27] <\sh> ogra: do u have an ipod?
[07:28] <ogra> heh, nope
[07:28] <ogra> i have a HIFI without any pod ;)
[07:29] <\sh> how should I solve this bug then ;)
[07:29] <ogra> buy an ipod ? 
[07:29] <ogra> forward it to someone who has one ?
[07:30] <\sh> ogra: the former: whuahaha ;) the latter: let's see
[07:30] <thesaltydog> \sh, I have one, but I am not sure to risk the 15 MB of music I have on!! Maybe I should make a DVD backup...
[07:31] <\sh> thesaltydog: if you have the time...amarok-1.3.1 from breezy and try to confirm http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16375
[07:31] <thesaltydog> \sh ok.. I'll have  a look at it.
[07:31] <\sh> thesaltydog: thx :)
[07:31] <thesaltydog> \sh np
[07:33] <thesaltydog> \sh it claims to install a lot of kde shit
[07:33] <\sh> thesaltydog: yes...it's a kde app...
[07:33] <\sh> thesaltydog: sry for that ;) 
[07:33] <thesaltydog> \sh, :-)
[07:34] <dholbach> jdub: ping
[07:34] <dholbach> jdub: ready to unveil ubuntu-desktop@ ?
[07:36] <ogra> thesaltydog, be careful if you help \sh with bugs he'll secretly install more and more KDE stuff on your deskop until he has taken it over wih KDE completely ;)
[07:37] <\sh> ogra: pscht
[07:37] <ogra> *g*
[07:38] <thesaltydog> ogra, Thanks! I will take care..
[07:38] <ogra> heh
[07:38] <\sh> ogra: frank installed even on his sony laptop ubuntu ;)
[07:38] <\sh> ogra: and now  I have to take over your job, to fix it up again ;)
[07:38] <ogra> zimmermann ? 
[07:38] <\sh> ogra: sure
[07:39] <ogra> ithought your boss :)
[07:39] <\sh> ogra: no..he runs suse on his server at home
[07:39] <ogra> bah
[07:39] <ogra> convert him
[07:39] <\sh> ogra: but saturn has again linksys wrt54g on special for 55 
[07:39] <ogra> yay
[07:40] <\sh> s/this/these/
[08:07] <bddebian> infinity: ping?
[08:18] <segfault> there's some untranslated strings in the post-install of ubuntu (that screen which starts after it has copied all packages, and reboot). does anyone know which package is that?
[08:18] <segfault> tried casper, but is unlikely to be it
[08:20] <ogra> casper is the live CD
[08:20] <Mithrandir> segfault: base-config, mostly
[08:21] <ogra> segfault, you mean after reboot ? 
[08:21] <segfault> yes
[08:21] <ogra> thats base-config, yes
[08:23] <segfault> ok, i'll look into that
[08:28] <segfault> is there any plan to translate the boot messages?
[08:29] <segfault> that ones which appear when using usplash
[08:30] <zyga> segfault: hmm interesting 
[08:31] <zyga> segfault: I'll be glad to assist with that
[08:31] <\sh> infinity / lamont: can one of you have a look on i486-linux-gnu-gcc -shared  -Wl,--whole-archive data-types/.libs/libdata-types.a low-level/.libs/liblow-level.a driver/.libs/libdriver.a main/.libs/libmain.a engine/.libs/libengine.a -Wl,--no-whole-archive  -llockfile -pthread /usr/lib/libdb-4.2.so /usr/lib/libgnutls.so -lgnutls-openssl /usr/lib/libsasl2.so  -Wl,-soname -Wl,libetpan.so.3 -o .libs/libetpan.so.3.0.0
[08:31] <zyga> s/ll/d/
[08:31] <\sh> crap
[08:31] <segfault> that should be easy to do
[08:31] <\sh> I hate sometimes this copy&paste
[08:31] <bddebian> :-)
[08:32] <\sh> infinity / lamont: sorry, can you have a look at http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/libe/libetpan/0.38-2/libetpan_0.38-2_20050926-1616-i386-failed.gz 
[08:32] <\sh> it build ok in my local pbuilder...
[08:33] <segfault> like... source /etc/usplash/$LANG.msg... and then, echo $VARs... etc.
[08:34] <zyga> segfault: the messages are not from usplash itself
[08:35] <segfault> from the init scripts?
[08:35] <zyga> segfault: yes
[08:36] <zyga> that's what I think at least
[08:37] <segfault> ogra: i think it's not base-config either
[08:37] <segfault> it's fully translated to pt_BR, and in colony 5 appeared as untranslated
[08:38] <ogra> then its probably something base-config loads
[08:38] <segfault> are you sure that the new progress bar (which was all text-mode in hoary) is configured there?
[08:38] <zyga> mdz: is there any usplash4kubuntu or edubuntu?
[08:39] <segfault> it has strings like "Unpacking PACKAGENAME", "Configuring PACKAGENAME", "Installed PACKAGENAME"
[08:40] <mdz> zyga: yes
[08:40] <ogra> zyga, http://www.grawert.net/edubuntu/edusplash.png
[08:40] <ogra> as well as http://www.grawert.net/edubuntu/edu_isolinux.png
[08:40] <mdz> segfault: it's still text mode, but it's a progress bar rather than scrolling inscrutable text
[08:41] <ogra> i'm just waiting for jbailey to enable the usage of different pic in usplash
[08:41] <segfault> mdz: yeah, i meant without that dialog stuf... do you know which package holds it?
[08:41] <zyga> mdz: BTW: how many colours can the image use? less than 16?
[08:41] <Riddell> zyga: KubuntuArtwork has the kubuntu one
[08:41] <ogra> the isolinux one is already in
[08:41] <mdz> segfault: those strings are in apt
[08:42] <mdz> segfault: base-config runs the progress bar
[08:42] <mdz> zyga: 16 in total, including the background, progress bar and status messages
[08:42] <zyga> mdz: could the strings in /etc/init.d/rc be translated? I mean - UTF8 support and such
[08:43] <mdz> zyga: the boot process isn't internationalized yet, but in theory it's possible
[08:43] <mdz> it would be a significant amount of work to internationalize it
[08:43] <zyga> mdz: well, it's trivial to i18n most common messages (unless they are really broken)
[08:44] <zyga> will usplash handle utf8?
[08:44] <Keybuk> mdz: aren't those strings in base-config from dpkg ?
[08:44] <Keybuk> I thought it listened on the status-fd and translated it into messages
[08:44] <ogra> Keybuk, the progressbar reads apt output
[08:45] <ogra> and displays it...
[08:45] <Keybuk> apt doesn't display Unpacking or Configuring though ... those seem to correspond to dpkg events
[08:45] <ogra> yes, but driven by apt...
[08:46] <Keybuk> really?
[08:46] <ogra> it just reads from a pipe
[08:46] <Keybuk> ah, so apt listens to the dpkg status-fd things and then produces those strings which base-config reads?
[08:47] <ogra> base-config or rather the progressbar reads stdout from the apt command... iirc
[08:47] <ogra> its some weeks ago that i dealt with it...
[08:48] <mdz> Keybuk: yeah, I guess it uses strings from both apt and dpkg
[08:49] <mdz> Keybuk: hmm, no
[08:49] <mdz> Keybuk: I think they are all in apt
[08:49] <zyga> mdz: does the system in general have a locale?
[08:49] <mdz> zyga: the system-wide default is in /etc/environment
[08:50] <zyga> mdz: thanks, I'll play with some trivial i18n for usplash :-)
[08:50] <mdz> Keybuk: the table in dpkgpm.cc maps dpkg status stuff to human-readable strings
[08:51] <Keybuk> ah, ok
[08:54] <spayne> jbailey: ping
[08:54] <spayne> jdub: ping
[08:54] <ogra> does anyone else think the -devel list should be read only from the forums ? 
[08:54] <ogra> the noise raises daily
[08:55] <jbailey> spayne: Are you looking for me in particular, or just anyone named Jeff? =)
[08:55] <zyga> segfault: do you plan to i18nlize boot messages?
[08:56] <dilinger> attention all Jeffs: there is black bmw in the parking lot with its lights on.  the license plate says "JEFF".
[08:56] <jbailey> I'll take it.
[08:56] <jbailey> Anyone got a screwdriver for the ignition?
[08:56] <spayne> yes, here you go
[08:56] <dholbach> dilinger: don't let ddaa hear you about BMWs :)
[08:56] <segfault> yeah, that would be nice
[08:56] <dilinger> dholbach: is that a sore topic?
[08:57] <dholbach> dilinger: he referred to a french saying that included BMWs and hemorrhoids
[08:57] <segfault> from boot to user interface, everything translated.
[08:58] <zyga> segfault: actually getting the default install translated would be nice
[08:58] <zyga> segfault: grep for uslpash in /etc and /lib
[08:58] <zyga> segfault: the real work needs to be done in /etc/init.d
[08:58] <dilinger> heh
[08:58] <zyga> and getting the i18n stuff somewhere
[08:59] <jkrogh> If the installer framebuffer looks strange.. what should i put at the bootprompt? 
[08:59] <segfault> i see, and define some place to store the translated strings.
[09:00] <jkrogh> Nevermind. 
[09:00] <jkrogh> Oh.. not the first framebuffer, but the only the one the installations starts in. 
[09:01] <zyga> segfault: yes, I've got a small utility that simplifies i18n of shell scripts
[09:02] <zyga> segfault: could you locate the messages that get displayed after default install?
[09:02] <segfault> humm, not right now
[09:02] <segfault> i left my laptop home
[09:05] <segfault> can you send me that script? and as soon as i get home i'll send you those strings
[09:08] <jkrogh> Is it a bug when I need to specify vga=771 on the installer prompt to get a decent installer (readable)
[09:08] <zyga> segfault: I don't have it packaged as a .deb yet - it's pure bash though
[09:08] <zyga> if you want it badly I can just give you an export of the CVS archive
[09:11] <Kamion> jkrogh: if it's a bug, it's in the kernel
[09:11] <Kamion> jkrogh: I cannot do anything about that in the installer
[09:12] <Kamion> zyga: what's wrong with /usr/bin/gettext? ;)
[09:12] <Kamion> (or trivial shell functions on top of that)
[09:12] <segfault> zyga: yah, if you can please
[09:13] <segfault> so i can play with it later
[09:13] <zyga> segfault: one moment
[09:15] <zyga> segfault: www.suxx.pl/tools/i18n
[09:16] <jkrogh> Kamion: Ok.. I filed it on "UNKNOWN". 16387
[09:17] <jkrogh> How far should I go in the testing of the installer? Is a "Because of an unknown readon it is impossible to resize this partition" .. a bug that should be filed? 
[09:22] <zyga> readon?
[09:22] <jkrogh> sorry "reason"
[09:25] <mdz> jkrogh: check the log; it should contain the reason
[09:26] <jkrogh> mdz: Where is the log? 
[09:26] <mdz> jkrogh: alt+f3 or so, and /var/log
[09:34] <bddebian> Heya slomo
[09:35] <slomo> hi bddebian :)
[09:36] <ogra> OMG
[09:36] <spayne> does this error mean anything to anyone
[09:36] <spayne> usb 3-3: device not accepting address 3, error -71
[09:36] <spayne> when i try my WiFi adaptor in BReezy
[09:36] <slomo> jbailey: ping?
[09:37] <ogra> why the heck is there a backport of k3b in the unofficial backports ?
[09:37] <jbailey> slomo: pong
[09:37] <ogra> it obviously breaks kubuntu-desktop
[09:37] <ogra> ^^^^ Riddell 
[09:37] <ogra> Riddell, you should talk to jdong
[09:38] <slomo> jbailey: ony news on the ppc/xfs bug?
[09:38] <jkrogh> Am I the only one that gets this strange behaviour from the bugzilla.. when I enter information on one bug and submits it, I end up at a totally different bug. 
[09:38] <jbailey> slomo: Not beyond a brief conversation that colin and I had.
[09:38] <Riddell> ogra: how does it break kubuntu-desktop?
[09:38] <slomo> jbailey: ok :(
[09:38] <jbailey> slomo: The best gues sis that yaboot might load extra crap onto the end that isn't important with cramfs but is with an cpio.gz
[09:38] <ogra> Riddell, k3b depends on all the c2 packages which arent in hoary
[09:39] <jbailey> slomo: So a bug in the XFS reader in yaboot.
[09:39] <ogra> Riddell, one requirement for giving them the bandwith, server and buildd access was that they shut down the unofficial repos...
[09:40] <jkrogh> Hm. That seems to be a feature. 
[09:40] <slomo> jbailey: hmmm... wonderfull ;) maybe i'll just create a ext2 boot partition...
[09:40] <ogra> pitti i and several others had a hard weekend because of the firefox crap they made already
[09:40] <jbailey> slomo: That would be the simplest path, but it still needs to be fixed.
[09:40] <jbailey> slomo: Up to you.
[09:41] <Riddell> jbailey: what's the status of customisable usplash?
[09:41] <slomo> jbailey: sure... the ext2 partition would be just to have it really working again... but i'll help you however i could ;)
[09:42] <jbailey> Riddell: Testing.  Just need to upload the artwork for you.  sladen had said that the one he provided me didn't have the right colours on the right pallettes.  I should poke him for an updated one.
[09:43] <Riddell> jbailey: he's left my flat so I can't physically poke him any more, but the file is on KubuntuArtwork anyway
[09:43] <jkrogh> mdz: How do I take a screenshot of the installer? 
[09:43] <tseng> jkrogh: run it in vmware
[09:44] <mdz> jkrogh: if you're writing documentation, qemu
[09:44] <jbailey> Riddell: Cool.  I had given him some pallette numbers that he needed to use for foreground/background/"RED"
[09:44] <mdz> jkrogh: if you're reporting a bug, a digital camera pointed at the screen
[09:44] <jkrogh> mdz: It for the bug on the X30 you just commented. 
[09:44] <jkrogh> Oki.. 
[09:44] <mdz> jkrogh: a screenshot wouldn't help; we need a photo
[09:46] <mdz> jkrogh: since you mentioned it, please use a descriptive summary when reporting bugs
[09:46] <seb128> Kamion: where are the "please press one of these keys" (auto-keymap selection) and "Resize IDE" (partitions modifications) strings from the installer?
[09:46] <mdz> jkrogh: "Installation using PXE" didn't say anything about the problem you experienced
[09:46] <jkrogh> mdz: I'll do my best. 
[09:59] <jcohen85> jbailey, hey, did you get a chance to make a new initramfs-tools package
[10:00] <Keybuk> hmm... odd explosion noises from outside
[10:00] <Treenaks> Keybuk: Alien invasion?
[10:01] <Keybuk> could be
[10:01] <concept10> did the redhat networkmanager make it into breezy?
[10:01] <Keybuk> sounds a bit distant to be my mail server's hard disk blowing up again
[10:02] <Nafallo> Keybuk: your neighboors then? :-)
[10:03] <Nafallo> concept10: no
[10:03] <Nafallo> concept10: or rather... it's in universe :-P
[10:03] <jbailey> jcohen85: This is for debug timing?
[10:03] <concept10> Nafallo, thanks, what is the pkgname?
[10:04] <Nafallo> concept10: network-manager ofcourse.
[10:04] <jkrogh> Should I use a special installation method to be allowed to specify a local "mirror" for installing packages? 
[10:04] <concept10> Nafallo, okay..heh didnt see it...but thanks
[10:05] <jcohen85> jbailey, well, i sent you sent me one that created a debug file with timing and it showed that my IDE drives were taking 5
[10:05] <jbailey> jcohen85: Right, which doesn't explain the 15 seconds you're reporting. =(
[10:06] <jcohen85> you said you would need to do something more to find out what the problem is
[10:06] <jcohen85> what would you have to do?
[10:06] <jbailey> jcohen85: Lace the whole initramfs-tools with "date" commands and output it to a file.
[10:08] <jcohen85> jbailey, are you planning to do that?
[10:08] <Keybuk> Nafallo: bit fireworks display in the city centre
[10:09] <jbailey> jcohen85: Begrudgingly. =)
[10:09] <jbailey> jcohen85: I had hoped that perhaps I would get some inspiration on how to do this in a non-sucky way.
[10:12] <lool> mdz: ping?
[10:16] <mdz> lool: yes?
[10:18] <lool> mdz: (query)
[10:25] <jkrogh> There are several "installer" components.. which one should I file feature-requests for the mirror-selection part on? 
[10:28] <fabbione> elmo: pong?
[10:29] <elmo> fabbione: nm, sorry - got benc instead
[10:29] <mjg59> elmo: Hello?
[10:29] <elmo> mjg59: ?
[10:29] <fabbione> elmo: perfect, did you get everything sorted?
[10:29] <elmo> fabbione: yeah, thanks
[10:29] <fabbione> no problem
[10:30] <mjg59> elmo: You were looking for me earlier?
[10:30] <mjg59> Except it turns out that Freenode blocked my reply to you
[10:30] <Robot101> thfreenode.
[10:30] <elmo> are you registered now?
[10:31] <mjg59> Yes, but I can't remember my password
[10:31] <janimo> is there a simple way to find out recursive depends of a package (something like germinate does I think)
[10:31] <mjg59> And can't be arsed getting it reissued
[10:31] <tseng> janimo: apt-cache rdepends foo
[10:31] <janimo> not reverse, recursive :)
[10:31] <tseng> umn
[10:32] <janimo> want to find out why gaim brings in bonobo, even it's not in it's immediate depends
[10:32] <mvo> janimo:   --recurse
[10:32] <Robot101> janimo: gaim-evolution plugin?
[10:33] <janimo> mvo, Robot101 thanks guys
[10:35] <janimo> Robot101 gaim does not seem to depend on evo plugin, where do you see that?
[10:35] <Robot101> it suggests evolution-data-server
[10:36] <Robot101> is it installing new, or just upgrading?
[10:36] <janimo> I assume Suggested packages are not installed right?
[10:36] <janimo> new install
[10:36] <Robot101> if it suggests: foo (>ver), and you have an old foo, it might upgrade it
[10:36] <janimo> or was there a recent change in apt re suggest: field?hmm
[10:46] <j^> a52dec prints "No accelerated IMDCT transform found" to stderr, this is of no interest to anyone, would a patch be acccepted?
[10:46] <j^> looking at the code it will allways print that 
[10:47] <j^> liba52-0.7.4
[10:52] <bddebian> infinity or lamont-away: ping?
[10:53] <zyga> yay - my first SMP box is online :D
[11:03] <slomo> jbailey: found a similar bug probably... https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=156488
[11:10] <Kamion> seb128: the first would be cdebconf except smurfix forgot to actually make it translatable; I'm fixing that now
[11:10] <janimo> seb128, ping
[11:11] <Kamion> seb128: I'm not sure exactly what you mean by the second message
[11:11] <bddebian> infinity: If you come around, can you please clear the dep-wait for bayonne?
[11:11] <Kamion> jkrogh: if in doubt, use 'debian-installer' as a catch-all for installer bugs. In this particular case, a more accurate component is probably 'choose-mirror'.
[11:13] <jkrogh> Kamion: Ok.. This one should actualy have been assingen to "go to bed, you're tired".. since I actually just found the feature where it should be. 
[11:13] <Kamion> fair enough :)
[11:16] <jbailey> slomo: Ah, interesting.
[11:17] <slomo> jbailey: but that was the only similar bug i found with google... but yaboot has other problems with xfs it seems ;) when the kernel is a fragmented file everything breaks
[11:18] <seb128> Kamion: the partionner list of options
[11:18] <seb128> * Resize IDE
[11:18] <seb128> * use LVM
[11:18] <seb128> * ...
[11:20] <slomo> jbailey: maybe we should forbid installing on xfs in the installer when we can't fix it for the release
[11:34] <Kamion> seb128: oh, you confused me because that isn't an accurate quote
[11:35] <jbailey> slomo: I expect it will be fixable.
[11:35] <Kamion> seb128: the "IDE" there is part of a substitution, so searching for "Resize IDE" won't find anything
[11:35] <jbailey> slomo: HAving narrowed it down to this makes it easier to hack on at least.
[11:35] <jbailey> slomo: Also, I know the guy who's been doing xfs for grub2, I can ask him for thoughts.
[11:35] <seb128> Kamion: sorry, that's what I've noted from my install ... the "Resize" is not translated
[11:35] <slomo> jbailey: sounds good... did you already talk to the yaboot people?
[11:36] <Kamion> seb128: it's partman-auto - trying to figure out why it's not showing up in installer-po
[11:36] <Kamion> _Description: Resize ${PARTITION} and use freed space
[11:36] <squirrelpimp> anyone knowing, when the dri version mismatch will be fixed in the breezy repos?
[11:36] <seb128> Kamion: yeah, that's probably this one 
[11:37] <Kamion> seb128: the .po file's there in the partman-auto source package, anyway
[11:37] <Kamion> slomo: forbidding it's an option but it's a last resort
[11:37] <squirrelpimp> i know theres this workaround... but will it be fixed proberly?
[11:38] <seb128> Kamion: 'night
[11:38] <sabdfl> gnight kamion
[11:39] <sabdfl> actually, night all ;-)