[12:59] <gand> hi I did a test of my first screentutorial on KEduca with edubuntu. Could someone plese test video? http://www.freesmug.org/usex/index.php?/archives/16-KEduca-ScreenTutorial-TEST.html
[01:01] <gand> Thanks in advance
[01:09] <rejden> gand, .avi works
[01:09] <gand> are you on ubuntu?
[01:10] <rejden> yep
[01:10] <gand> what player are you using?
[01:10] <rejden> mplayer + w32codecs
[01:10] <rejden> playing in mozilla-mplayer plugin
[01:11] <gand> nice, does works also h264?
[01:11] <rejden> gand, with what you made the video?
[01:11] <rejden> second i check
[01:11] <gand> little bit complicate :)
[01:12] <rejden> hehe, the h264 works but every 2-3seconds something blink at the top
[01:12] <gand> nice to know, are you on x86?
[01:13] <gand> animation don't work?
[01:13] <rejden> yes x86
[01:13] <gand> My edubuntu is on PPC so the only free screenreconrder (Xvidcap and istanbul) dont' work
[01:13] <rejden> it works, but during playing something blinks at the top of the screen
[01:14] <rejden> i mean at the top side of video
[01:14] <gand> you mean "animation" have the same problem of H264?
[01:17] <gand> next step I'll add audio, and changing language I can do in italiand and in english
[01:17] <gand> I mean changing system GUI language :)
[01:19] <gand> thanks a lot rejeden, 1.20 am here, I go to sleep
[01:27] <rejden> same time here, sleep well
[01:27] <rejden> i'm going to discover more of quanta plus
[05:49] <john_b> hello, anyone got some edubuntu specific links on sound they can point me too?
[05:50] <john_b> specificly looking for info on sound on terminals
[07:17] <shaga> I didn't use workstation-install for this workstation. was that important?
[07:17] <shaga> and good morning all :)
[07:18] <jsgotangco> well you installed ltsp and dhcp
[07:19] <jsgotangco> hehe
[07:23] <shaga> okay, so no problem then :)
[09:38] <unimatrix9> hi theer
[09:38] <unimatrix9> you are not making live cd's? of edubuntu?
[09:38] <unimatrix9> or planning to make one...
[09:38] <unimatrix9> ?)
[12:12] <jsgotangco> hi all
[12:13] <shaga> hello
[12:14] <jsgotangco> JaneW: our docs are ready for packaging/uploading
[12:14] <JaneW> WooHOO
[12:15] <jsgotangco> me and jbailey have been slaving over it this morning and we got some stuff uploaded
[12:15] <jsgotangco> just let me fix the remaining stuff and its ready by tommorow
[12:15] <shaga> whynot make www.ubuntuguide.org official and add as a homepage for new ubuntu-installs?
[12:16] <jsgotangco> shaga: we have that for 5.10
[12:16] <jsgotangco> but removed the crack
[12:16] <shaga> oh
[12:16] <ogra> shaga, because ubuntuguideis a mess...
[12:17] <jsgotangco> shaga: we made an faq but made sure its not as crackful as ubuntuguide.org itself
[12:17] <shaga> sounds great, what about adding opera to sources now that is free?
[12:17] <jsgotangco> define free
[12:18] <jsgotangco> it can be added into multiverse why not
[12:18] <shaga> it's not open source, but least it doesn't have advertises and it doesn't pay anything..
[12:19] <shaga> multiverse sounds more reasonable
[12:19] <jsgotangco> opera isn't difficult to install really
[12:19] <shaga> for it
[12:19] <shaga> it's not, but it's very common browser for older machines so that's why I thought it..
[12:19] <shaga> stating firefox takes about 15seconds on this computer and for opera, the time is only under one second
[12:20] <shaga> s/stating/starting
[12:20] <ogra> jsgotangco, does it have a free distribution license for third partys (re: multiverse) ?
[12:20] <jsgotangco> ogra: probably, PC-BSD has a PBI for it
[12:20] <ogra> i dont think youre allowed to redistribute it without explicit permission
[12:20] <jsgotangco> im actually on bsd at the moment and using it
[12:21] <jsgotangco> http://www.pbidir.com/packages.php?code=59
[12:21] <jsgotangco> so yeah i guess 3rd parties can redistribute it
[12:22] <ogra> License:  	Commercial 
[12:22] <ogra> *shug*
[12:22] <ogra> we probably should just ask them :)
[12:23] <shaga> :)
[12:23] <jsgotangco> yeah
[12:23] <jsgotangco> the whole opera thing became  free because of google funding
[12:23] <magnon> Opera wouldn't be very appropriate for Ubuntu and at least not Edubuntu
[12:23] <jsgotangco> free as in no pay
[12:23] <magnon> it shows advertising
[12:23] <ogra> magnon, in multiverse 
[12:23] <ogra> it doesnt
[12:23] <magnon> since when?
[12:23] <jsgotangco> magnon: it doesn't anymore
[12:23] <ogra> they freed it
[12:23] <magnon> it used to
[12:23] <magnon> ah well
[12:24] <ogra> since the latest release
[12:24] <shaga> that's the day I started using it everywhere
[12:24] <jsgotangco> magnon: similar to the deal with themozilla foundation on firefox
[12:24] <magnon> I never liked Opera that much anyway
[12:25] <ogra> but some people do... and we want to do everything that the user doesnt need to edit his sources.list :)
[12:25] <shaga> I like how opera has "real back" function
[12:25] <ogra> so getting it into multiverse is a goodplan
[12:26] <shaga> it doesn't reload the page and goes right into same spot, loads the page from the cache
[12:26] <shaga> and it's faster(lightweight), those are my main reasons..
[12:27] <jsgotangco> i actually like it
[12:27] <magnon> ogra: sure, I thought it still had advertising
[12:28] <magnon> but to me it's just another browser that does things a little bit incorrect in another way that firefox does things a little bit incorrect
[12:28] <jsgotangco> i know some devels actually use it
[12:29] <JaneW> jsgotangco: thanks for your hard work on the docs.
[12:29] <ogra> the only thing i dont like about it since the ads are gone it that it uses QT ;)
[12:29] <jsgotangco> JaneW: look where? we just uploaded it
[12:29] <JaneW> jsgotangco: not linked in Edubuntu Docs?
[12:29] <jsgotangco> not yet
[12:29] <jsgotangco> ogra: are you going to include ubuntu-docs in the package?
[12:30] <ogra> depends on the size...
[12:30] <jsgotangco> proably a meg
[12:30] <ogra> powerpc is at 704 MB...
[12:30] <jsgotangco> ouch it overflowed
[12:30] <ogra> i'm not sure when it explodes
[12:30] <JaneW> jsgotangco: oic
[12:30] <ogra> not yet
[12:30] <shaga> 800 MB cds rocks :)
[12:30] <jsgotangco> JaneW: give me a day or two
[12:31] <jsgotangco> About Edubuntu is already done
[12:31] <ogra> but its near the edge and i havent looked what i can drop additionally from ppc
[12:31] <JaneW> jsgotangco: oh alright ;)
[12:31] <jsgotangco> we've tested the package today
[12:31] <jsgotangco> fixing the entities are a pain so we're fixing our svn as well
[12:31] <ogra> i probably wont be able to do anything edubuntu related this week anyway... my highest proi task is still xss
[12:31] <ogra> so take your time
[12:32] <jsgotangco> ogra: sure take your time
[12:32] <ogra> heh
[12:32] <jsgotangco> i can have JaneW test the package tommorow
[12:32] <jsgotangco> heh
[12:37] <JaneW> ok
[12:38] <JaneW> it's a bit chaotic here, because Mark is here, and as a local celeb things are a bit manic
[12:38] <ogra> lol
[12:39] <ogra> hey, isnt it his own office ? 
[12:39] <ogra> employees should be used to their boss *g*
[12:39] <jsgotangco> heh
[12:39] <jsgotangco> how influential is mark to the overall SA scene?
[12:39] <jsgotangco> VERY?
[12:39] <ogra> sure :)
[12:46] <JaneW> jsgotangco: yes very
[12:47] <JaneW> jsgotangco: he couldn't walk down the street without being stopped
[12:47] <jsgotangco> wow
[12:47] <shaga> :)
[12:47] <JaneW> ogra: it;s not the employees that are the problem is the other people, and all the hype that is here
[12:47] <shaga> so whos he then?
[12:47] <jsgotangco> so he has bodyguards when in SA?
[12:47] <JaneW> jsgotangco: I don;t think so, I think he just keeps a low profile
[12:47] <jsgotangco> JaneW: that's nice to know
[12:48] <jsgotangco> but his face is very familar nowadays so...
[12:48] <JaneW> jsgotangco: I would say that the list of well known SA celebs includes Madiba, Charlize and Mark...
[12:49] <jsgotangco> mmm charlize
[12:50] <JaneW> ogra: I asked about CDs
[12:50] <ogra> adn ? 
[12:50] <ogra> and
[12:50] <jsgotangco> any luck?
[12:50] <JaneW> ogra: new answer is we can make a few hundred, and we have to arrange it ourselves
[12:50] <jsgotangco> arrange what?
[12:50] <JaneW> ogra: still don;t know what to do about packaging...
[12:50] <ogra> ok... lets do it post release then
[12:51] <jsgotangco> yeah
[12:51] <JaneW> ogra: yes, let's get through the release and then try to make a plan
[12:51] <JaneW> at least it is something
[12:51] <ogra> a simple paper hardcover should be enough...
[12:51] <ogra> like kubuntu has them
[12:51] <jsgotangco> who did that? amu?
[12:51] <jsgotangco> or riddel
[12:53] <shaga> masochists gui=kde :D
[12:53] <jsgotangco> shaga: shhhh
[12:53] <shaga> ;)
[12:53] <jsgotangco> i remember ogra giving me dagger looks during udu because i was using kde
[12:53] <jsgotangco> hehe
[12:53] <ogra> ;)
[12:54] <shaga> hehe
[12:54] <shaga> not for nothing tho, heh
[12:58] <JaneW> ogra: I haven't actually seen a Kubuntu CD
[12:58] <jsgotangco> its a blue disc with the 3 dragons
[12:58] <JaneW> jsgotangco: is there an image somewhere?
[12:58] <jsgotangco> hmmmm
[12:59] <shaga> dragons, wow!
[01:01] <shaga> they shouldn't be cute tho 
[01:03] <jsgotangco> let me find that
[01:03] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[01:04] <jsgotangco> i couldn't find it
[01:04] <jsgotangco> i'll just brb later and have dinner first
[01:57] <Zaheer> hello :)
[01:57] <Zaheer> what version of ubuntu is edubuntu based on?
[01:57] <Zaheer> well the preview at least
[01:59] <ogra> on the preview indeed :)
[02:00] <Zaheer> sorry i see now its 5.10
[02:00] <Zaheer> my bad
[02:00] <Zaheer> thats breezy right?
[02:00] <shaga> yap
[02:01] <ogra> Zaheer, a daily edubuntu is always identical with a breezy daily... (modulo the edubuntu addons)
[02:02] <Zaheer> cool cause i wanted to DL breezy... would be abit silly if i already have edubuntu :D
[02:03] <ogra> yup
[02:04] <ogra> to install breezy from the CD, do a "server" install and just put ubuntu-desktop on top ;) 
[02:04] <Zaheer> is there anything specific that i can help with?
[02:04] <ogra> testing,testing, testing...
[02:04] <ogra> find the evil bugs ;)
[02:05] <Zaheer> :D  i found one y/day with the terminal server client.
[02:07] <ogra> one thats not known yet ? 
[02:07] <Zaheer> dunno... where do i check?
[02:07] <ogra> bugzilla, look for ltsp
[02:08] <ogra> you could also describe it, i know all known ltsp bugs ;)
[02:11] <Zaheer> ok firstly i installed edubuntu as a workstation,i can terminal serve to windows pc but when i close it down with the little "x" i get an error message.
[02:11] <Zaheer> give me 5 secs to get the extact message for.
[02:11] <ogra> the workstation version has no ltsp functions at all
[02:12] <Zaheer> its not ltsp it the actuall terminal server client that comes with edubuntu.
[02:12] <ogra> err, what else ? 
[02:13] <Zaheer> ok the message : "NOT IMPLEMENTED : System pointer message 0xf00"
[02:13] <Zaheer> mouse related i think
[02:13] <ogra> no idea what you are using there ? 
[02:14] <ogra> what is that what you use as client ?
[02:15] <Zaheer> i get to the application by clicking on the following menus Applications -> Internet -> Terminal Server Client
[02:15] <ogra> ahhhh
[02:16] <Zaheer> :)
[02:16] <ogra> ok, that has nothing to do with edubuntu
[02:16] <Zaheer> oh ok.
[02:16] <ogra> file a bug in bugzilla agains tsclient so we can get it fixed in ubuntu ;)
[02:20] <Zaheer> okie dokie :D
[02:27] <Zaheer> whats the address to post bugs?
[02:29] <JaneW> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/
[02:31] <Zaheer> thanks
[03:05] <wmaulik> ogra: hi olliver, you here?
[03:06] <wmaulik> this is jelkner writing as one of my students
[03:07] <wmaulik> anybody here?
[03:07] <wmaulik> JaneW: hi Jane, are you here?
[03:07] <JaneW> wmaulik: hello, yes
[03:07] <JaneW> wmaulik:  hi Jeff
[03:07] <ogra> wmaulik, soryy, give me a minute... i'm afk for a moment
[03:08] <wmaulik> here is the situation with which i need help
[03:09] <wmaulik> we have encountered a bug in edubuntu
[03:09] <wmaulik> and we wanted to report it
[03:10] <wmaulik> Writesh, the student i am loggin in as, volunteered to report the bug himself
[03:10] <wmaulik> which i thought was great
[03:10] <wmaulik> so he created a launchpad account
[03:10] <JaneW>  https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/
[03:10] <JaneW> great
[03:10] <wmaulik> we want to use malone
[03:10] <wmaulik> if that is ok
[03:10] <JaneW> think so...
[03:10] <wmaulik> i don't want too many different ways to do things
[03:10] <wmaulik> launchpad is looking better all the time
[03:10] <JaneW> I think they are running in parallel atm
[03:10] <JaneW> nod
[03:11] <wmaulik> i call it "software development for human beings" ;-)
[03:11] <ogra> wmaulik, please use buzilla, malone is only for universe packges
[03:12] <ogra> nobody of the main devs looks in launchpad yet
[03:12] <wmaulik> ogra: when will that change?
[03:12] <wmaulik> it is not the best situation
[03:13] <wmaulik> i want to grow the edubuntu users, testers, etc group
[03:13] <ogra> if malone is ready its lacking a lot of features
[03:13] <wmaulik> and encourage people to report bugs
[03:13] <wmaulik> most new users don't know whether something is in universe or not
[03:13] <wmaulik> and they shouldn't have to
[03:13] <ogra> but i suspect sabdfl will force us to use it for main after release
[03:14] <ogra> everything installed in edubuntu is in main
[03:14] <wmaulik> ok
[03:14] <ogra> only stuff you installed additionally can be from niverse
[03:14] <wmaulik> if Writesh created a launchpad account, can he use bugzilla?
[03:15] <ogra> i'm not sure if they already work together this deep.... try it
[03:18] <wmaulik> ok, i've gotta run
[03:18] <ogra> bye and thanks...
[03:18] <wmaulik> writesh left already to go to his next class
[03:18] <wmaulik> now i've got to teach mine ;-)
[03:18] <ogra> :)
[03:18] <wmaulik> we'll try bugzilla tomorrow
[03:19] <ogra> ok
[03:19] <wmaulik> but i have to say that if it is easy we can to these things
[03:19] <wmaulik> if it is not we can't
[03:19] <wmaulik> thanks!
[03:19] <wmaulik> bye
[03:19] <ogra> then mail me about the bugs
[03:19] <wmaulik> ok, thanks
[03:19] <ogra> so i can forward them to bugzilla to assign them the right people
[03:30] <JaneW> sigh
[03:30] <JaneW> do flint or jelkner ever stay for longer than 10 mins?
[03:40] <Zaheer> highvoltage - why so quiet :)
[03:46] <highvoltage> Zaheer: very busy :)
[03:55] <JaneW> highvoltage: watching idols *duck*
[04:01] <highvoltage> JaneW: i wasn't *really* watching, I just came buy because vicki said we must :)
[04:05] <JaneW> highvoltage: nod, I was also only there for 5 mins or so...
[04:05] <JaneW> highvoltage: it's too cold to stand out there for long
[04:06] <highvoltage> yep. my word i'm tired. i ordered an dsl line from telkom today. took 45 mins.
[04:06] <highvoltage> the wireless connection in my area is just too dodgy.
[04:07] <JaneW> highvoltage: pity, but our ADSL ahs been good, except for the intl problems, but that had nothing to do with ADSL...
[04:08] <highvoltage> i think adsl is the best option locally. they just didn't have it in my area when i moved there (telkom didn't even have phone lines there).
[04:09] <highvoltage> Zaheer: so, how are things?
[04:11] <JaneW> highvoltage: where do you live? in the karoo? ;)
[04:12] <highvoltage> hehe. new area just outside bellville and kuils river (next to bottelary).
[04:15] <JaneW> highvoltage: ok, I got married near there (one of the wine farms)
[04:15] <highvoltage> where do you live at the moment?
[04:15] <JaneW> Rondebosch
[04:16] <Zaheer> cool man, looking forward to sysadmin classes starting ;)
[04:16] <Zaheer> any word on the venue yet?
[04:16] <JaneW> Zaheer: lol, I read that as SysAdmin clashes - I thought there was a battle of the SysAdmins or something ;)
[04:17] <Zaheer> he he :D
[04:17] <highvoltage> Zaheer: it's at pentech. i'm getting the maps tomorrow, will forward on.
[04:18] <Zaheer> im glad to see there a quite a few cape townians around :)
[04:18] <highvoltage> Zaheer: ah, so you know who i am now ;)
[04:18] <Zaheer> yes i do :D .. you had me worried for a while!
[04:19] <Zaheer> how'd you know it was me tho' or did you take a guess?
[04:26] <Zaheer> orgra : posted the bug in bugzilla, thanks :)
[04:26] <highvoltage> Zaheer: you use telkom adsl, so i know you're local, and the zahedoll kind of gave it away.
[04:27] <Zaheer> aaahhh cunning!!!  i didnt even see that.
[05:01] <highvoltage> ok. bye!
[05:07] <Zaheer> anyways guys have a good one! see ya
[05:13] <ogra> hi
[05:13] <gilv> hi
[05:14] <ogra> gilv, so if you got any questions regarding edubuntu feel free to ask anytime :)
[10:35] <JessicaX^> Heya
[10:35] <JessicaX^> Been a while since i was in here
[10:35] <JessicaX^> How is everything
[10:36] <JessicaX^> Like the new logo, btw
[10:37] <JessicaX^> By the way ; are the projects under way.. or still in planning?
[10:38] <shaga> I installed just hoary-server, upgraded to hoary, then added edubuntu-desktop
[10:38] <shaga> smooth as silk ;)
[10:39] <JessicaX^> eh?
[10:40] <shaga> s/second hoary/breezy
[10:40] <shaga> I think they are doing fine with edubuntu
[10:40] <shaga> at least from the looks
[10:40] <JessicaX^> Eh?????
[10:41] <JessicaX^> I didnt say they weren't
[10:41] <JessicaX^> o.O
[10:41] <shaga> you asked how is everything
[10:41] <shaga> I just said that seems fine for them ;)
[10:41] <shaga> don't pick on my words so easily :)
[10:41] <JessicaX^> I wasn't
[10:41] <shaga> hehe
[10:41] <JessicaX^> I was just wondering what the hell you're talking about oOl
[10:42] <JessicaX^> Projects as in
[10:42] <JessicaX^> "what WILL be in edubuntu"
[10:42] <JessicaX^> " What's going to be in Edubuntu?"
[10:42] <shaga> at least gnome-screensaver instead of x-s-s :p
[10:42] <ogra> nooo
[10:42] <shaga> huh
[10:42] <ogra> it was dropped a week ago
[10:42] <JessicaX^> ehh?
[10:43] <JessicaX^> did i say xss?
[10:43] <ogra> (sorry i'm in a meeting)
[10:43] <JessicaX^> *thin air picking*
[10:43] <shaga> I'll just stay quiet :D
[10:43] <JessicaX^> I dont know what the hell you're talkjing about XD
[10:43] <JessicaX^> I said
[10:43] <JessicaX^> "What projects"
[10:43] <JessicaX^> And you're like ; "YA IM USING GNOME-SCREENSAVER"
[10:44] <JessicaX^> o__O
[10:44] <JessicaX^> "Nice Day today eh!"
[10:44] <JessicaX^> "Yeah, i like banana boats"
[10:45] <shaga> *sights*
[10:46] <ogra> JessicaX^, kdeedu, gcompris, schooltool, the new and shiny ltsp classroom server we developed, moodle (hopefully, its currently a bit buggy)
[10:46] <JessicaX^> sounds nice
[10:46] <ogra> coulorful artwork and icons...
[10:46] <JessicaX^> Still using GNOME, right?
[10:47] <ogra> yup
[10:47] <ogra> but with kde bits...
[10:47] <ogra> kdeedu has no counterpart on the gnome side yet
[10:49] <JessicaX^> iono, i tried using kubuntu
[10:49] <JessicaX^> After ubuntu
[10:49] <JessicaX^> and kubuntu ran faster
[10:49] <JessicaX^> o.O
[10:50] <ogra> i never tried kubuntu...
[10:50] <ogra> :)
[10:51] <ogra> but i was told by several people that kde is a lot slower via ltsp... which is our main app...
[10:51] <JessicaX^> Hmm
[10:51] <JessicaX^> Yeah, but iono
[10:51] <ogra> i'll test that for next release
[10:51] <JessicaX^> I think KDE looks more unified.. I dont like Epiphany
[10:51] <ogra> i dont like KDE ;)
[10:51] <JessicaX^> Obviously
[10:51] <JessicaX^> :P
[10:51] <ogra> way to cluttered
[10:52] <JessicaX^> Well, it is out of the box
[10:52] <JessicaX^> But gnome is completely the opposite
[10:52] <JessicaX^> Nice to get up and running, but iono
[10:52] <ogra> gnome is totally out of te box :)
[10:52] <JessicaX^> o_O
[10:52] <ogra> but we could discuss that endless... lets drop it
[10:53] <JessicaX^> I know, i know
[10:53] <ogra> and i have to attend the meeting in #ubuntu-meeting :)
[10:53] <JessicaX^> :P
[10:53] <JessicaX^> you should use TuX :)
[10:53] <JessicaX^> Very sexy indeed
[10:53] <ogra> ??
[10:53] <JessicaX^> Kernel HTTPd
[10:54] <ogra> yes, but why ? people are familiar with apache :)
[10:55] <magnon> kernelspace httpd makes me shudder
[10:55] <JessicaX^> :D
[10:55] <JessicaX^> Put IIS on there then ;)
[10:55] <JessicaX^> Some schools in UK kiss that 
[10:55] <shaga> hehe
[10:56] <JessicaX^> TuX uses Apache as a secondary webserver
[10:56] <magnon> again
[10:56] <magnon> why, when you have apache?
[10:56] <magnon> the whole concept of putting http serving in kernel land is crazy
[10:56] <JessicaX^> Not really
[10:56] <magnon> if you say so. ;)
[10:57] <JessicaX^> Apache is nice, but there are HTTPd's that are faster than it
[10:57] <JessicaX^> Well, i do ;)
[10:57] <JessicaX^> Ask Igno Molnar why he made one
[10:57] <JessicaX^> remember him? :P
[10:57] <JessicaX^> Ingo :/
[10:57] <magnon> yes.
[10:57] <ogra> did he run it on a ltsp server with 25 thin clients that started openpffice simultaiously ? 
[10:58] <JessicaX^>  Ingo Molnar has been contributing to Linux kernel development since 1995 with an impressive list of accomplishments. Most recently his O(1) scheduler was merged into the 2.5 development kernel
[10:58] <JessicaX^> Not that i recall
[10:58] <JessicaX^> But that scheduler is uber clever
[10:58] <magnon> just because I love his scheduler doesn't mean that I like kernelspace http-serving
[10:58] <JessicaX^> :P
[10:59] <JessicaX^> Have you used it?
[10:59] <magnon> I tried it a long time ago
[10:59] <magnon> and never touched it again
[10:59] <magnon> it scares me
[10:59] <shaga> :D
[10:59] <JessicaX^> :P
[10:59] <JessicaX^> I love it
[11:00] <shaga> couldn't live without it I assume? ;)
[11:00] <JessicaX^> Not really
[11:00] <JessicaX^> It's good
[11:00] <JessicaX^> but not that good
[11:00] <JessicaX^> Linux yes, that no
[11:01] <shaga> :)
[11:02] <JessicaX^> Hmm, would i be able to make a KDE based version of edubuntu?
[11:02] <JessicaX^> Or a strictly dinge-o-rama ? :/
[11:03] <JessicaX^> Also magnon
[11:03] <JessicaX^> http://slashdot.org/articles/00/07/20/1440204.shtml
[11:03] <JessicaX^> Enjoy :)
[11:04] <shaga> you are a fan or something?
[11:04] <shaga> :D
[11:05] <JessicaX^> I like clever things :)
[11:05] <shaga> hehe
[11:06] <shaga> perhaps too clever? ;)
[11:06] <JessicaX^> Not really
[11:06] <JessicaX^> I modify everything 
[11:06] <JessicaX^> To exactly how i like it
[11:06] <shaga> agreed
[11:06] <JessicaX^> And then, once i've played, i look at what everyone else wants, strike a compromise, make it, sell and be happy
[11:10] <magnon> it's really not that clever.
[11:11] <magnon> it's putting something in kernel-land that SHOULD NOT be there
[11:11] <magnon> better when it works pretty close to that from the start :P
[11:11] <JessicaX^> Rofl
[11:11] <JessicaX^> Nah
[11:11] <JessicaX^> Kernel land :P
[11:11] <shaga> I agree with magnon about kernel land
[11:11] <shaga> :p
[11:12] <JessicaX^> It handles file transfers anyway, why should it be coupled with that which handles files
[11:12] <shaga> why to implement?
[11:12] <shaga> I don't see any reasons
[11:13] <JessicaX^> I agree with the creator, tbh
[11:13] <JessicaX^> " The biggest advantage i see is to have encapsulation, security and performance available to dynamic web applications *at the same time*"
[11:22] <magnon> security + kernel land just doesn't fit normal security theory for me
[11:22] <JessicaX^> :P
[11:22] <shaga> :D
[11:22] <JessicaX^> So, the kernel is insecure?
[11:22] <shaga> I love that "kernel land"
[11:23] <shaga> by browsing files on the web through kernel he meant I think
[11:23] <JessicaX^> Not really
[11:23] <shaga> it's too close to the core
[11:23] <JessicaX^> HTTPd isnt about browsing
[11:23] <shaga> damned, not too close, it's in the core
[11:23] <shaga> nope, not really.. but you got my point I assume?
[11:23] <JessicaX^> Yeah
[11:25] <magnon> JessicaX^: it just means that if there first is a security breach, it's more fatal
[11:27] <JessicaX^> But then again, if you got breached with apache running as root, then you'd have the same level of problems
[11:27] <JessicaX^> The worst they can do is really lock you out or format everything
[11:27] <magnon> then why not run a lightweight http server in user land? :)
[11:27] <shaga> fatal.. I'd call it devastating
[11:28] <shaga> :p
[11:28] <JessicaX^> :P
[11:28] <JessicaX^> Like i say
[11:28] <JessicaX^> If you code securely
[11:28] <magnon> ...there will always be a bug.
[11:29] <JessicaX^> So, the same of edubuntu, then
[11:29] <JessicaX^> Or is that exempt of these criticisms
[11:29] <JessicaX^> ?
[11:29] <shaga> yeah, everybody always try to code securely.. but even in the mouse cursor in windows, there is bug with security flaws :D
[11:29] <JessicaX^> You're using windows as an example o.O
[11:30] <shaga> I just used as an example for a bug, it's good base for flaws :D
[11:30] <JessicaX^> lol Usually, it's like "even the best can have problems" 
[11:30] <JessicaX^> Not
[11:30] <JessicaX^> "windows has problems"
[11:30] <JessicaX^> :P
[11:30] <shaga> hehe, yeah
[11:31] <JessicaX^> Well, i'm building a distro up right now
[11:31] <JessicaX^> :/
[11:31] <shaga> I use most extraordinary ways to use examples
[11:31] <shaga> people are always laughing at me about it :)
[11:31] <JessicaX^> Heh
[11:31] <JessicaX^> I never use windows as a good example
[11:31] <shaga> I used as a worst
[11:31] <JessicaX^> Also - does edubuntu have a page for schools perhaps wanting to change to Linux? eg - benefits?
[11:32] <JessicaX^> If not, i could make one, i used to have to do presentations along the same lines all the time
[11:32] <ogra> JessicaX^, we have a wiki, feel free to make a page :)
[11:32] <JessicaX^> err
[11:32] <JessicaX^> I'll type it as a document
[11:32] <magnon> ogra: do we have anything _else_ than a wiki? ;)O
[11:33] <ogra> we'll have a website before release... 
[11:33] <JessicaX^> Well, i could make a website for you
[11:33] <JessicaX^> I'm not brilliant with designs, but i "inspire" myself off template sites ;)
[11:33] <ogra> and a plone cms was planned, but i'm not sure highvoltage has come around to do it in time
[11:33] <JessicaX^> Or with HTML or CSS o.O
[11:34] <JessicaX^> I can make it in Drupal
[11:34] <ogra> *shudder
[11:34] <magnon> eek
[11:34] <JessicaX^> Oh geezus
[11:34] <ogra> i'd like to avoid php
[11:34] <magnon> I think ubuntu has some good infrastructure already
[11:34] <JessicaX^> You don't like drupal? :/
[11:34] <JessicaX^> rofl isnt Moodle PHP
[11:34] <JessicaX^> ;)
[11:34] <ogra> i dont like php
[11:34] <JessicaX^> you don't like much
[11:34] <JessicaX^> :/
[11:34] <magnon> ogra: as long as it's php5, I'd be fine
[11:34] <ogra> i dont use moodle, i just listened to our users ;)
[11:34] <JessicaX^> It is php5
[11:35] <JessicaX^> ogra
[11:35] <JessicaX^> Thank geebus for that
[11:35] <JessicaX^> Otherwise it'
[11:35] <magnon> it isn't started up as php5
[11:35] <JessicaX^> it would probably be just a non-graphical boot
[11:35] <JessicaX^> :/
[11:35] <ogra> and i build a distro, i#m not the guy who does the web stuff... only a poor developer builing a CD here :)
[11:35] <JessicaX^> I like skirts, and shopping, but it doesnt mean everyone else does
[11:35] <JessicaX^> :P
[11:36] <JessicaX^> I wear them =)
[11:36] <shaga> I love skirts on girls as well
[11:36] <JessicaX^> but, like i say
[11:36] <magnon> pff, girls are overrated
[11:36] <ogra> lol
[11:37] <shaga> time for some pizza and the 4400 episode
[11:37] <JessicaX^> I like pink and girly stuff, and there's stuff i know i like, but it doesnt mean everyone else will love them because i do
[11:37] <shaga> :D
[11:37] <shaga> pink
[11:37] <shaga> she said pink
[11:37] <JessicaX^> hint hint hint
[11:37] <magnon> and that does NOT mean edubuntu should have a default pink theme
[11:37] <shaga> anyway, off I go :) 
[11:37] <JessicaX^> Didnt say it should
[11:37] <ogra> JessicaX^, we have a server infrastructure where everything is python based already... everything else generates extra effort...
[11:38] <JessicaX^> Go with the flow of the people ;)
[11:38] <JessicaX^> Just saying, every school i spoke to - chose KDE
[11:38] <ogra> adding php stuff would mean we'd need extra servers etc
[11:38] <JessicaX^> Not really, i would have hosted it
[11:38] <JessicaX^> But i cant be bothered now you've ranted :P
[11:38] <ogra> we'd like to hots it in our datacenter :)
[11:39] <JessicaX^> Congrats
[11:39] <ogra> and the decision for gnome was not my personal decision we had a 4 day summit with lots of people and discussed apps and stuff to an end
[11:39] <magnon> gnome was a very wise decision
[11:39] <JessicaX^> :)
[11:39] <JessicaX^> Sure sure
[11:40] <magnon> if it was KDE I'd be using fc or even nld and still be unhappy
[11:40] <ogra> its simply that the support in ubuntu for gnome is bigger, we have a lot more developers wotrking on gnome stuff and only one for kde
[11:40] <JessicaX^> Well, thats fair enough
[11:40] <ogra> edubuntu is 90% ubuntu...
[11:40] <JessicaX^> But, when i worked at doing this kinda thing for money
[11:40] <ogra> i cant do everything alone ;)
[11:41] <JessicaX^> A lot of the schools we spoke to said KDE over Gnome, or other WM's
[11:41] <ogra> the demand for a "like ubuntu" system in africa and southamerica is very high... that includes gnome
[11:42] <JessicaX^> hm
[11:42] <magnon> JessicaX^: Oh, easy problem. "This is ubuntu, like it?" "yes" "ok."
[11:42] <linescanner> We have the same here in the UK.  Most we have shown prefer KDE
[11:42] <JessicaX^> "this is ubuntu like it.. er.. well, actually" "tough shit"
[11:43] <JessicaX^> linescanner: I worked in the UK with it
[11:43] <JessicaX^> Even the LEA we spoke to said KDE just looked a lot cleaner than Gnome, and fluxbox
[11:43] <magnon> if you say "gnome is simple and streamlined, whereas kde has too much cruft", they'd choose gnome
[11:43] <ogra> its no probem to install kde  in edubuntu its just not the default install...
[11:43] <JessicaX^> Not really
[11:43] <magnon> so it's a matter of how you say it :P
[11:43] <JessicaX^> We didnt force KDE
[11:43] <linescanner> Which LEA ?
[11:43] <JessicaX^> Thats just absolutely the most idiotic thing possible
[11:44] <JessicaX^> The North Yorkshire, and the Cheshire
[11:44] <linescanner> Did you get anywhere with them ?
[11:44] <magnon> I force GNOME and can't see anything wrong with it
[11:44] <magnon> since it's what I support. :P
[11:44] <JessicaX^> Forcing is retarded
[11:44] <magnon> no
[11:44] <JessicaX^> I didnt force, i let them choose
[11:44] <ogra> we too
[11:44] <magnon> choosing a stable system that you can support is nonretarded
[11:44] <magnon> giving too many options which creates more work for _you_ in the end, is retarded.
[11:44] <JessicaX^> You dont go to a school and say YOU HAVE TO HAVE UBUNTU or we wont support you
[11:45] <ogra> and since the summit was in london, there were a lot british teachers :)
[11:45] <JessicaX^> Like it or not , it's similar to what Microsoft does
[11:45] <magnon> well, actually, we do
[11:45] <JessicaX^> Not really
[11:45] <JessicaX^> Because we could work with either
[11:45] <magnon> it's not, because they can always go wherever they want
[11:45] <JessicaX^> I didnt want to force them
[11:45] <magnon> I couldn't 
[11:45] <magnon> I know jack about KDE
[11:45] <JessicaX^> because it's their choice
[11:45] <JessicaX^> If they didnt want it, i didnt say "oh well, up yours"
[11:46] <JessicaX^> or "Oh, not KDE?? GRRR"
[11:46] <magnon> I would. :D
[11:46] <JessicaX^> Then you're an idiot
[11:46] <magnon> thanks
[11:46] <JessicaX^> With Schools, you have to give choice
[11:46] <magnon> why?
[11:46] <magnon> why more choice to them than to anyone else?
[11:46] <JessicaX^> Otherwise they just think you're trying to shove it down their throats
[11:46] <linescanner> The desktop aint the issue though it is what you do with it
[11:46] <magnon> because THEY should sacrifice support over others?
[11:46] <JessicaX^> magnon
[11:46] <ogra> JessicaX^, thast exactly what we did... we invited interested eachers of schools wanting to adopt edubuntu what ever it should be and followed their choices
[11:46] <magnon> are businesses more important?
[11:46] <JessicaX^> magnon
[11:46] <JessicaX^> What the hell are you talking about
[11:46] <JessicaX^> i'm on about the look and feel
[11:47] <JessicaX^> We had 4 laptops
[11:47] <JessicaX^> And we let them and CHILDREN
[11:47] <JessicaX^> from ages of 5 - 16
[11:47] <JessicaX^> Look around them
[11:47] <magnon> JessicaX^: that if you run support, you need to go with a system and support it the way YOU can, if you don't, you're going to use more resources on it, and that heightens prices.
[11:47] <JessicaX^> On gnome, even the LEA said as default it looks too dark
[11:47] <JessicaX^> well, like said
[11:47] <JessicaX^> I'd help with a KDE port of it
[11:47] <linescanner> JessicaX you working in schools still ?
[11:48] <JessicaX^> I think choice is important, otherwise we'd all be using windows
[11:48] <JessicaX^> linescanner, no i left
[11:48] <JessicaX^> But, i'm helping a friend re-start the business
[11:48] <magnon> ah well, my business is external of schools and I work with both schools and SMBs
[11:48] <magnon> so, no choice.
[11:48] <magnon> the choice is "find another vendor", which is entirely their choice, of course.
[11:49] <JessicaX^> But like i said, when we spoke with a phsychology lecturer
[11:49] <JessicaX^> And other related professionals
[11:49] <linescanner> JessicaX you seen what we do at Cutter ?
[11:49] <JessicaX^> they said about colour schemes, and how crucial they are to children of young ages
[11:49] <JessicaX^> Cutter?
[11:49] <linescanner> www.cutterproject.co.uk
[11:49] <JessicaX^> I heard of that
[11:49] <ogra> JessicaX^, have you even seen edubuntus gnome desktop yet ? 
[11:49] <linescanner> Linux thin client for schools
[11:50] <JessicaX^> There are no Screenshots from what i can see
[11:50] <ogra> nope
[11:50] <ogra> install it ;) 
[11:50] <ogra> help testing ;) 
[11:50] <JessicaX^> Err
[11:50] <ogra> we'll release screenshots before release
[11:50] <linescanner> Ogra: you get anywhere with the bootig issue ?
[11:51] <linescanner> booting even
[11:51] <ogra> linescanner, the mptscsi stuff ? 
[11:51] <linescanner> no the thins looping at nfs
[11:51] <JessicaX^> Hehe, suse
[11:52] <ogra> linescanner, nope, some people are trying to track it now....
[11:52] <JessicaX^> Ahh, linescanner
[11:52] <JessicaX^> Good work on the cutter project
[11:52] <JessicaX^> :)_
[11:52] <linescanner> Thanks
[11:53] <JessicaX^> I watch Working lunch sometimes
[11:53] <JessicaX^> :)
[11:54] <linescanner> Cool.  The Deputy head there is turning into a media star :)
[11:54] <JessicaX^> downloading the coverage of it now :D
[11:54] <linescanner> we are looking for more people to push it
[11:54] <JessicaX^> I'd be happy to help :)
[11:55] <linescanner> drop me an email
[11:55] <JessicaX^> Sure
[11:55] <JessicaX^> i'd need the email :P
[11:56] <linescanner> andy.trevor@cutterproject.co.uk
[11:56] <JessicaX^> :) Okay, will do
[11:57] <linescanner> my priv is blocked at the mo
[11:57] <JessicaX^> Ah, righty
[11:57] <JessicaX^> Unregistred user?
[11:59] <linescanner> yeah, keep meaning to sort it out
[11:59] <JessicaX^> lol
[11:59] <linescanner> :)
[11:59] <JessicaX^> Can't wait to watch this :)
[11:59] <JessicaX^> I love it when linux gets mentioned on television
[12:00] <linescanner> ogra: re mptscsi stuff I need to put some time aside this week to get some feed back to you guys
[12:00] <linescanner> JessicaX :)
[12:00] <JessicaX^> hm? :>
[12:01] <ogra> linescanner, try to get jbailey directly, we have other sun fire users, would be nice if that could be solved
[12:02] <JessicaX^> Holy mackkarel
[12:03] <JessicaX^> mackarel
[12:03] <JessicaX^> 4000+ for Windows
[12:03] <JessicaX^> Geebus
[12:03] <rejden> *eeek*