[01:24] <Seveas> !meeting set CommunityCouncil 11 Oct 14:00
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Bad chan: #ubuntu-meeting
[01:24] <Seveas> !meeting set CommunityCouncil 11 Oct 14:00
[01:25] <Seveas> Couldn't resist writing python at midnight :)
[01:28] <FLeiXiuS> brb
[01:54] <JaneW> **Reminder** 5 mins to Edubuntu Update Meeting i
[02:00] <flint> JJane is too damn eary
[02:00] <flint> sorry Janew are you floating arount here?
[02:00] <JaneW> hi flint
[02:01] <flint> you are a mean woman...I need my beauty rest!
[02:01] <JaneW> hehehe
[02:01] <flint> morning ollie!
[02:01] <ogra> flint, come on, youre beautiful enough
[02:02] <flint> elkner just woke me up with a call from his classroom
[02:02] <JaneW> flint: actually I was thinking of moving the meeting forward 2 hours, would you prefer that?
[02:03] <flint> he is operating smoothly and is content with the pix fix that Jane and you suggested Ollie. 
[02:03] <flint> no...ok yea!
[02:03] <JaneW> flint: glad to hear it :))
[02:03] <JaneW> ok let's get this show on the road
[02:04] <flint> jane 2 hours + will place it at your nap time,  What good would that do?
[02:04] <ogra> no jsgotango ?
[02:04] <JaneW> hehe, no 2 hours forward is 10UCT (12:00pm here)
[02:05] <JaneW> apartently he is at Burger King
[02:05] <ogra> hmm
[02:05] <flint> ah another floater...
[02:05] <JaneW> so it's the 3 of us?
[02:05] <ogra> looks like
[02:05] <JaneW> well the main victory of this week was getting rid of JessicaX^
[02:05] <flint> I am humble in the presence of such power...
[02:05] <ogra> i already sent my weekl report to jane, but will post it again here
[02:06] <JaneW> ogra: flood away
[02:06] <ogra> Serious blocker bugs we have:
[02:06] <ogra> - #12942 - NFS timeout * solved !!!
[02:06] <ogra> not *this serious*
[02:06] <ogra> - #15244 - logins timeout if you try to relogin within the minute you logged out
[02:06] <ogra> open LTSP bugs:
[02:06] <ogra> - ltsp-server postinst needs to generate the dhcp.conf file dynamically according to the selected IP adress 
[02:06] <ogra>   (currently the most important bug we have, makes the install fail if a wrong IP range was selected)
[02:06] <JaneW> ogra: it;s up in the meeting notes already too
[02:06] <ogra> - PATH variable doesnt contain the /usr/games PATH
[02:06] <ogra> cosmetic LTSP bugs:
[02:06] <ogra> - Locale selection in the login manager need fixing or must be ripped out
[02:06] <ogra>   (could get ripped out since it will use the server locale by default)
[02:06] <ogra> - Session selection in the login manager need fixing or must be ripped out 
[02:06] <ogra>   (we dont have sessions yet so the latter is the best option)
[02:06] <ogra> open Installer Bugs (all cosmetic):
[02:06] <ogra> - error message about IP selesction
[02:06] <ogra> - ltsp-client-builder.udeb progress reporting is missing (removing the progressbar and adding a text will do here)
[02:06] <ogra> open Extra bugs:
[02:06] <ogra> - one small xscreensaver bug where screensavers start in random mode where they shouldnt start at all
[02:06] <ogra>   (can be worked around by not selecting random mode, but should better be fixed) 
[02:06] <ogra> - artwork must be packaged new, the mozilla homepage (about edubuntu) handling changed completely, fixing this will get 
[02:06] <ogra>   very tricky since we cant cover all translations and will have to replace them *all* with the same page i have no 
[02:06] <ogra>   idea how to solve that yet and didnt know it was planned.
[02:06] <ogra> - i decided to disable all sound components for now since we dont support sound on the thin clients and it will confuse 
[02:06] <ogra>   the users (soundserver and volume control in the panel) needs to be added to the artwork package
[02:06] <ogra> Package bugs (not solved due to xscreensaver hacking, ajmitch took over but getting it past mdz on the CD at 
[02:06] <ogra> this point seems hard (but not impossible)):
[02:06] <ogra> - moodle www-config-common bug
[02:07] <ogra> - moodle security bug needs upgrade to v1.5.1
[02:07] <ogra> CDs:
[02:07] <ogra> - the powerpc CD now exploded completely (17MB to big), i'm not yet sure what to rip out from it to make it usable, sugestions for not needed package
[02:07] <ogra> - due to a broken acpi-support package in ubuntu todays daily isnt installable on all arches.
[02:07] <ogra> -------------------
[02:07] <ogra> gcompris is fixed completely, upstream tested it and thanked for the fixing :)
[02:07] <ogra> i was mainly busy with sabdfl's xscreensaver whishes last week... over the weekend i fixed gcompris...
[02:07] <JaneW> nod, you have been very busy
[02:07] <JaneW> and productive
[02:08] <mhz> moin
[02:08] <JaneW> hi mhz
[02:08] <flint> damn...
[02:08] <ogra> currently my greates drawback is that i still had no time to work on my bazaar skills, but mdz doesnt accept patches to ltsp anymore...
[02:08] <ogra> else the ltsp stuff would be fixed today :/
[02:08] <flint> mdz is a weenie
[02:08] <JaneW> ogra: has mdz seen edubuntu yet?
[02:09] <ogra> JaneW, no idea, he knows toutstanding he ltsp problems...
[02:09] <ogra> *the outstanding
[02:09] <flint> I would opine that he is buzy with the final coat of paint on breezy
[02:09] <JaneW> what can be done?
[02:09] <flint> jane, what you have is releasable.  
[02:09] <mhz> JaneW: and all of you:  I am sorry, but I do have to go to a meeting (about Gov. and its tries to implement IT on education). When will the final Ubuntu Cd covers be ok?
[02:09] <ogra> JaneW, nothing except me learning bazaar to get the fixes merged
[02:10] <ogra> but it wont be ready for RC i fear
[02:10] <JaneW> mhz: I am waiting for them....
[02:10] <JaneW> mhz: I ask again today and will mail you as soon as we have something
[02:10] <mhz> edu-cool!
[02:10] <mhz> :)
[02:10] <ogra> flint, it isnt as long as the dhcp.conf generation is missing
[02:11] <ogra> flint, if you select a different IP in the installer, the install fails at the end
[02:11] <flint> that dhcp.conf just means that you have only one range to use, the 192.168.1.whatever i thought.
[02:11] <ogra> thast not releasable
[02:11] <mhz> Again, I am very sorry I have to leave. Best regards to ALL of you and hope you get enlightened enough to work and be happy at the same time :D
[02:12] <mhz> by!
[02:12] <mhz> bye!
[02:12] <ogra> flint, yes, but people select other ranges at the beginning of the install are bitten
[02:12] <flint> ollie keep in mind how pissed off I was that I culd not weedle the lotr patch in.
[02:12] <JaneW> adios
[02:12] <flint> thanks mhz
[02:12] <ogra> flint, its release critical imho... your change was cosmetic, but the lort login works at least
[02:13] <flint> okey dokey, but we share a common goal, getting this stuff on the CD.  What ho Joan (Jane) of Arc?
[02:14] <ogra> flint, yes, but installer issues are way more important
[02:14] <flint> ollie you are a poet broken is lort fixed is lotr...
[02:15] <ogra> :)
[02:15] <flint> mdz will argue that a fixed non routable dhcp ip stanza is fine... (BTW I am not trying to piss you off :^)  Just being a devils advocate...
[02:15] <JaneW> jsgotangco was complaining that no one is helping (collaborating) on the docs on the wiki
[02:15] <ogra> flint, it prevents edubuntu-server from being installed
[02:15] <ogra> its not a routing prob
[02:16] <flint> I would imaging that acerbic comment is directed at me jane... :^)  send me a nag email.
[02:16] <flint> ...and you have to go and edit the dhcp.conf file manually. right olllie?
[02:16] <ogra> JaneW, i'm complaining that i have to redo edubuntu-artwork because nobody notified the changes in the default firefoix homepage...
[02:17] <JaneW> ogra: can you explain that a bit
[02:17] <JaneW> I am not sure I understand the issue
[02:17] <ogra> flint, yes, and afterwards you have to reinstall every single package edubuntu-server depends on manually
[02:18] <ogra> JaneW, last week th default omepage (click the house in firefox to see it) was moved out of ubuntu-artwork and into ubuntu-docs...
[02:18] <ogra> thats no prob so far
[02:18] <flint> in practice you can run with the edited dhcp.conf file ok.
[02:18] <ogra> JaneW, but the new page gets set by language packs to the translated version now... which means we have 90 different versions of it
[02:18] <ogra> in different locations
[02:19] <flint> Ladies and gentlemen, I feel need to unlock from the breezy release, or have network based patches.  
[02:19] <ogra> so if you have edubuntu-artwork installed (which exchanges the default page with about-edubuntu) and install a language pack afterwards, it gets overwritten with the localized about-ubuntu page
[02:20] <ogra> flint, thats technically not possible
[02:20] <JaneW> ogra: oic!
[02:20] <ogra> mdz already explained that
[02:20] <JaneW> ogra: I always change my default home page immediately ;)
[02:21] <ogra> JaneW, my prob is that i havent palnned a minute to touch -artwork again, but its a big prob i dont know how to solve yet
[02:21] <JaneW> ogra: why was it moved?
[02:21] <flint> the network based patch thing is.  you built one ollie...
[02:21] <ogra> JaneW, ask the -doc team... its was a surprise for me when jdub removed the page from ubuntu-artwork....
[02:22] <ogra> JaneW, diziet was bitten by it as well (ff maintainer), but for him its solved... 
[02:22] <JaneW> so what do we have to do?
[02:23] <flint> kids the issue appears we will need to patch any actual installation of edubuntu if we cannot change the release cd.  Is that it?
[02:23] <JaneW> move ours out of the artwork package too?
[02:23] <ogra> JaneW, nope
[02:23] <ogra> JaneW, it doesnt matter in which package the page is
[02:23] <ogra> if it gets overwritten by langpack changes ....
[02:24] <flint> I get it.  the langpack and the actual pages are not quite synced up.
[02:24] <JaneW> so we'd need our own lang packs!?
[02:24] <ogra> the prob is that we dont have 90 versions of the page... and that i cant make sure all occurences of it get replaced with ours
[02:24] <ogra> that would be a solution but not in this timeframe
[02:24] <JaneW> right, do we have any translations of about edubuntu
[02:24] <JaneW> ?
[02:25] <ogra> nope
[02:25] <ogra> not to my knowledge
[02:25] <JaneW> can we force the english page to stay there?
[02:25] <ogra> ut we cant prevent localization
[02:25] <ogra> nope
[02:25] <ogra> not as its designed now
[02:25] <JaneW> is there any solution?
[02:26] <JaneW> and how NB is it?
[02:26] <ogra> NB ?
[02:26] <JaneW> what is there's a link on each about ubuntu page to the english about edubuntu page?
[02:26] <ogra> JaneW, and what if i use ubuntu ? 
[02:26] <JaneW> Nota Bena (or whatever) latin for important
[02:27] <ogra> theer wont be a about edubuntu page
[02:27] <JaneW> then you;d ignore it, or read it for interest sake
[02:27] <flint> warty sucked this bad out of the gate...  The cool thing here is that most every copy of edubuntu will have a net feed.  Nota bene  Jane.
[02:27] <ogra> read what '? 
[02:27] <ogra> you get an error massage if its not there
[02:27] <ogra> message
[02:27] <JaneW> ogra: right
[02:28] <JaneW> on-line link?
[02:28] <ogra> and i doubt the doc team would be happy with a edubuntu link
[02:28] <JaneW> agreed, but I
[02:28] <JaneW> 'm thinking of an solution
[02:28] <JaneW> any
[02:28] <ogra> me too, we still have time... i wont touch -artwork this week, probably i can come up with a solution the next days
[02:29] <flint> jane, in comparison to the fundamental IP type problem that ollie is alluding to this artwork stuff is small.  You will not connect with the dhcp.conf bug.
[02:29] <ogra> flint, nope
[02:29] <ogra> flint, you will not be able to *install*
[02:30] <ogra> its not about connection
[02:30] <JaneW> ok well the good news is that sabdfl has commited to funding us to print off some CDs
[02:30] <ogra> its only the thin client side that isnt connected by default anyway
[02:30] <flint> ollie, i mean that under certain situations your workstations and the server will not talk.
[02:30] <JaneW> the bad news is if we *cough*cockitup*cough* that will be it for edubuntu
[02:30] <ogra> flint, yes, because no ltsp is installed
[02:31] <flint> jane we did not screw up.  we have the patches we just cannot get them in the stream.
[02:31] <ogra> flint, that doesnt matter....
[02:31] <flint> we consultants are great at standing holding the seat belt and watching the auto crash.
[02:31] <ogra> what is in on release date must work
[02:32] <JaneW> so here's what sabdfl wants
[02:32] <JaneW> Document the shipping
[02:32] <JaneW> plan, and ask teams to document their distribution plans ON THE SAME
[02:32] <JaneW> PAGE. So, I want to see a wiki page that says we are shipping 500 CD's
[02:32] <JaneW> to Germany (and to whom), and beneath that, where that team plamns to
[02:32] <JaneW> distribute those 500 CD's. And then on the same page, the plans for
[02:32] <JaneW> Nigeria. So on a single page we can see how those 8,000 CD's will be use
[02:32] <flint> we gotta fix the dhcp then.
[02:32] <highvoltage> i'm here i'm here
[02:32] <JaneW> hi highvoltage 
[02:32] <ogra> flint, exactly
[02:32] <flint> hi hi hivoltage...
[02:32] <flint> god i love recursion....
[02:33] <highvoltage> hi JaneW and flint 
[02:33] <highvoltage> :)
[02:34] <flint> do you guys want me to bell the cat, or do you want elkner to write the sabdfl and say what we have is not complete technically?
[02:34] <ogra> flint, eeek, please dont... 
[02:34] <highvoltage> ogra: is there an easy way to get a summary of packages and their sizes?
[02:34] <ogra> highvoltage, what for ? 
[02:35] <flint> gotcha ollie, but we got to do something.
[02:35] <highvoltage> ogra: removing the best selection of packages for PPC.
[02:35] <highvoltage> i'm tending to think gcompris, just because it's so big.
[02:35] <highvoltage> but there's probably a better selection of software to remove.
[02:35] <highvoltage> blender3d is possibly one of them.
[02:35] <ogra> but gcompris is quite essential
[02:36] <highvoltage> true, it's one of the things that make edubuntu edubuntu.
[02:36] <ogra> blender would be a candidate
[02:36] <highvoltage> how about evolution?
[02:36] <ogra> flint, but that doesnt involve sabdfl
[02:36] <highvoltage> most schools will probably use web based clients.
[02:36] <flint> In the annals hivoltage, you name shall be "The Butcher of PPC"!  I salute you!!!
[02:36] <highvoltage> flint: ;)
[02:36] <highvoltage> flint: I solute you too, and most people in this chanel, for that matter.
[02:36] <ogra> highvoltage, i'm not sure how easy that is... i have to look at it
[02:36] <highvoltage> ok.
[02:37] <ogra> but blender is a good guess... 
[02:37] <ogra> probably scribus
[02:37] <highvoltage> apologies for just barging in and flooding, i nearly forgot about this meeting.
[02:37] <flint> ogra, sabdfl will be the one disapointed.  this is expectation management pure and simple.
[02:37] <highvoltage> do we have a set agenda or do i have permission to babble for just a bit longer?
[02:37] <flint> no worries hv, your thoughts on Butchery are well received in this meeting.
[02:38] <ogra> flint, the release is good, as you said in the beginnig, but the dhcp.conf bug needs to get solved, its a mdz thing
[02:38] <ogra> my prob is that i lost 10 days
[02:38] <highvoltage> the website.
[02:39] <ogra> due to screensaver flipping back and forth
[02:39] <highvoltage> hno73 has the wiki theme done. it's beatiful. we also have our basic html edubuntu page(s)
[02:39] <ogra> s/screensaver/screensaver packages/
[02:39] <highvoltage> the site and wiki will look different, but with a very, very similar theme. i think it's looking good.
[02:39] <flint> ogra, the damn thing will work attached to a dedicated switch if you patch the files according to the (still unwritten) documentation, correct?
[02:40] <highvoltage> elmo has been scarce again since thursday, all i need him to do is change some dns and apache settings, and we're good to go.
[02:40] <ogra> flint, the thing will work if you go with the suggested IP range
[02:40] <highvoltage> flint: the 'cookbook' exists.
[02:40] <JaneW> highvoltage: yes what you and hno73 have done is looking great, did you get my mail?
[02:40] <ogra> flint, if you change that, the dhcp.conf needs to pick up this change
[02:40] <highvoltage> JaneW: i might have, i'm a bit behind with mail, we've had a two-day meeting over monday and tuesday.
[02:41] <JaneW> highvoltage: elmo is on leave,,,
[02:41] <JaneW> highvoltage: oic
[02:41] <highvoltage> crap.
[02:41] <highvoltage> when is he back?
[02:41] <highvoltage> how can he choose a time like this to be on leave!? it's like, a freakin' week before release!
[02:41] <JaneW> can;t find it now but I think he said he is off till thurs (tomorrow)
[02:41] <JaneW> I know
[02:42] <JaneW> but Karl is there
[02:42] <highvoltage> ok, that at least is managable
[02:42] <ogra> highvoltage, because he worked much harder than anybody else the last weeks
[02:42] <highvoltage> ogra: ok :)
[02:42] <JaneW> requests must go to: "Now that there's two admins, please email all admin requests to: rt@admin.canonical.com"
[02:42] <highvoltage> no harm intended to elmo, for the record.
[02:42] <ogra> and had to introduce karl 
[02:42] <ogra> ...to his job 
[02:42] <highvoltage> i'll send it to request tracker. anyone have Karl's e-mail too?
[02:43] <flint> and the change in dhcp.conf has to flow to all the client configurations, got it.  Highvoltage, where is this "cookbook" got a url?
[02:43] <JaneW> highvoltage: so mail the queue and it should get done, in fact it's much more likely to get done like that (more official)
[02:43] <highvoltage> brb
[02:43] <JaneW> flint: in our wiki
[02:43] <JaneW> flint: look in the docs section
[02:44] <flint> jane, you can tell a lot about a girl by the size of her wiki :^)
[02:44] <flint> where on the wiki?
[02:44] <flint> ok I will go look... sorry.
[02:44] <ogra> n n
[02:45] <JaneW> flint!
[02:46] <JaneW> what else?
[02:46] <flint> i'm looking! i'm looking (i'm laughting :^)
[02:48] <flint> when we go live with this thing jane, the only thing that will help us hold the line is this wiki of yours.  I will find the time to help with it.
[02:48] <flint> ...getting documentation correct on the page i mean.
[02:50] <flint> my conculsion is that since we are powerless to change the release cd, our only option is to mitigate any rough edges in the documentation.  this we can do.
[02:50] <JaneW> flint: great thanks
[02:51] <JaneW> nod
[02:51] <JaneW> and get a nice CD cover and label design
[02:51] <JaneW> mhz is in carge of that, so collaborate with him
[02:51] <JaneW> flint: also we can do some good press releases
[02:52] <flint> I have compelte faith in your graphic design capabilities young lady.
[02:52] <ogra> sorry, my keaboard went mad, i had to reset
[02:53] <flint> the linux world interview of sabdfl mentions edubuhntu almost as one leg of the tripod, ubuntu, kubuntu, and edubuntu.
[02:55] <flint> regarding press, I can see what kind of bother I can cause in DC.  Ollie, am I bad to say that the dhcp.conf fix is most important?
[02:55] <JaneW> ogra: what is it with the KB of yours?
[02:55] <ogra> its going mad sometines... i already ordered a new one... but wont recieve it before UBZ
[02:56] <flint> jane, it says "Underwood" at the top and is very pretty.  
[02:56] <ogra> flint, nope, youre absolutely right
[02:56] <JaneW> I think it is agreed that the DHCP thing needs to be fixed - ogra but is there any chance of it being fixed before the 13th?
[02:56] <ogra> flint, all other stuff is minor annoyance and cosmetic stuff
[02:56] <ogra> JaneW, absolutely
[02:57] <JaneW> cool. done
[02:57] <ogra> JaneW, else i'll resign myself :)
[02:57] <flint> agreed.  Note that we have patched around this in all the installations we have done.
[02:57] <JaneW> ok is there anything else to discuss?
[02:57] <ogra> i want to have it fixed locally today, the question is how to get it in... i need a bazaar training
[02:57] <JaneW> lets get our A's into G and get this release wrapped
[02:57] <JaneW> literally and figuratively
[02:58] <JaneW> ogra: can we bribe someone?
[02:58] <flint> Jane-of-arc, get your armor on, grab yous sword and lets go fight for dhcp.conf
[02:58] <ogra> JaneW, i'll ask jblack, he offered one to me... but the sad thng is that the patch wont be in for RC
[02:59] <JaneW> that's tomorrow right?
[02:59] <ogra> i'll jum right on it now to make it ready here
[02:59] <JaneW> does jblack have time to help?
[02:59] <JaneW> ok
[02:59] <JaneW> and the WSIS thing?
[02:59] <ogra> JaneW, i'll ask him
[02:59] <JaneW> should I talk to mdz about making it ubuntu olnly?
[02:59] <ogra> no idea, i gave you all my views
[03:00] <ogra> we probably should talk with him 
[03:00] <JaneW> ok
[03:00] <ogra> to see his opinion
[03:00] <flint> ollie, do you have to use bazaar to generate the iso at this point?  That would be most cool.  what do you mean ubuntu only?
[03:00] <ogra> flint, i have to use bazaar for all of my job
[03:00] <ogra> so mdz can merge my changes
[03:00] <ogra> (and not only mdz)
[03:00] <flint> I can tell you he is most disinclined to change anything in the current release.
[03:01] <ogra> but he knows the problem with ltsp 
[03:01] <ogra> this fix he will accept, be sure
[03:01] <flint> Note that the LTSP rewrite was his baby this summer.  
[03:01] <ogra> its just the technical part on my side that needs to be ok... 
[03:02] <ogra> flint, as if i wouldnt know that
[03:02] <ogra> its not a problem with him not liking my changes, its a problem on my side that i cant provide the changes as he wants them
[03:03] <ogra> and thats what i have to fix...
[03:03] <flint> I can live with a dog that dances and looks a little scruffy, especially a newborne one, they are always cute.  But it must dance.
[03:03] <ogra> exactly
[03:04] <flint> ogra,  I will probably call matt and harass him about this issue, after talking to elkner.  Elkner and I call him at lunch on a cell phone.
[03:04] <flint> and elkner is back online today.
[03:05] <ogra> flint, dont do that, he surely gets annoyed
[03:05] <ogra> i wouldnt like to annoy him before i have anything in my hands
[03:05] <JaneW> flint: don't irk him more than necessary!
[03:05] <flint> yea...  I really look forward to hearing him sputter...
[03:06] <flint> I can be gentle and diplomatic, moreover he listens to jeff and I can put him on the phone...
[03:06] <ogra> flint, being gentle to a guy that hasnt slept enough doesnt help :)
[03:07] <flint> mdz is one of the best sputter-ers I know.  His first sputter is normally about the lack of testing response....
[03:07] <ogra> flint wait until i have the fix ready and have talked to him, he knows how critical the fix is for us
[03:07] <flint> ogra,  this is important.  Has he been online all night?
[03:08] <ogra> i guess so... we're short before RC, he doesnt sleep much at this times...
[03:08] <ogra> (as i do :) )
[03:08] <flint> I will not poke him with a stick when he is sleeping.
[03:08] <flint> gotcha.  let me ruminate then.
[03:08] <ogra> flint, just wait until i have prepared the patch and have talked to him
[03:09] <flint> get this one last bug slayed and go to the fair.  I would be most interested in your patch ollie.  can I look at it?
[03:09] <flint> I might actually learn something valuable.
[03:09] <ogra> flint, yes, if its done...
[03:10] <JaneW> ok ladies I must go
[03:10] <ogra> i'll send it to you... but note that its only important for the CD (installer)
[03:10] <JaneW> ogra see you in a bit
[03:10] <flint> I actually liked your lotr patch, and I sent back an embelishment
[03:10] <JaneW> lets get this DHCP thing whacked
[03:10] <ogra> yup
[03:10] <flint> jane your f-a-b-u-l-o-u-s
[03:11] <ogra> flint, note too that its a patch for the deb, it has nothing to do with ltsp itself...
[03:11] <JaneW> ogra: thanks for the great and detailed report :)
[03:11] <flint> thanks for being here janew
[03:11] <ogra> (its really only about installation)
[03:11] <ogra> JaneW, my job... i shuld have started earlier with them :)
[03:11] <flint> email me what you can when you can ollie. merely for my own education.
[03:12] <ogra> flint, this evening/night (my time) it shoudl be ready
[03:12] <JaneW> ogra: agreed, but better late than never ;)
[03:12] <ogra> sure :)
[03:12] <flint> I will brief elkner this day.
[03:12] <ogra> i'll do that on a regular basis before the meetins now
[03:14] <flint> good luck to all and good day/evening/morning/afternoon.  Remember Howard Hughes once flew the worlds largest wooden plane 175 yards in order to say it worked.  Working is a matter of perception.
[03:14] <JaneW> thank oli
[03:14] <highvoltage> sorry about that, lots of interuptions here.
[03:15] <highvoltage> not that i'm in a position to ask either, but anything that i can do to help still, or find someone to do?
[03:17] <flint> I'm outa here.  Thanks again to all.