[12:33] <Jeromee> hmm
[12:35] <ogra> Jeromee, ?
[12:35] <Jeromee> is checkinstall included in edubuntu?
[12:37] <ogra> its in universe afaik
[12:37] <Jeromee> k
[12:37] <Jeromee> from what I hear
[12:38] <Jeromee> its a rather sweet thing
[12:38] <Jeromee> heh
[12:38] <ogra> not really
[12:38] <ogra> it produces broken stuff...
[12:38] <Jeromee> no?
[12:38] <Jeromee> hm
[12:38] <Jeromee> bummer
[12:38] <ogra> it doesnt work out dependencys... 
[12:39] <ogra> the only advantage is that you can easily uninstall the software through the package manager
[12:39] <Jeromee> gotcha
[12:40] <ogra> if you want to produce packages, have a look at the debian new maintainer guide... 
[12:41] <smykes> no live cd huh?
[12:41] <ogra> nope
[12:41] <ogra> next release
[12:41] <ogra> we needed to get the stuff in shape first
[12:42] <smykes> next release meaning drak?
[12:42] <smykes> drake
[12:42] <ogra> yup
[12:42] <ogra> if i find a lot of sparetime (very unlikely) i'll remaster a ubuntu CD ... 
[12:42] <smykes> is that when content filtering is going to make its appearance as well?
[12:43] <ogra> yes
[12:43] <ogra> content filtering with a nicely integrated gui is one of my main targets for dapper
[12:43] <smykes> its HUGE
[12:43] <smykes> all the pcs at my school have content filtering on them
[12:44] <smykes> so I dont let the kids on the ubuntu box
[12:44] <ogra> why dont you have a centralized solution ? 
[12:44] <smykes> i think there is
[12:44] <smykes> but then there is content filtering on top of that
[12:44] <ogra> its a lot of wasted administration time to have one on every pc
[12:45] <smykes> Im not the administrator
[12:45] <smykes> Im the Music teacher :D
[12:45] <ogra> heh.. then current edubuntu will suck for you, sorry... we have no sound support in ltsp yet
[12:46] <smykes> yeah I installed ubuntu on my biggest fastest computer in my room
[12:46] <smykes> the rest were shitty boxes and wouldnt run it
[12:46] <smykes> its allright as the screen isnt virtually flat so I cant look at it for more then 10 minutes at a time
[12:47] <ogra> grmpf...
[12:47] <smykes> wb
[12:47] <ogra> wrong key
[12:47] <smykes> does it have gnome baker standard?
[12:48] <ogra> nope
[12:48] <ogra> we have serpentine for audio
[12:48] <ogra> and nautilus for data...
[12:48] <ogra> no need to duplicate the functions
[12:49] <smykes> and rhythm box for audio?
[12:49] <ogra> and gnomebaker in main would mean to rip out the nonfree codecs and functions, i think its better to keep a full equipped gnome baker in univese
[12:49] <ogra> *universe
[12:49] <ogra> yes, rhythmbox fr audio
[12:50] <smykes> be nice if someone just wrote a complete app\
[12:50] <smykes> itunes eske
[12:50] <smykes> that did everything out of the box
[12:50] <ogra> i heard amarok shall be wuite good..
[12:50] <ogra> quite
[12:50] <ogra> its a KDE app though...
[12:50] <smykes> does alexandria come standard or do you have to apt-get it?
[12:50] <crimsun> (I love how gnomebaker 0.5.5 was released two days after Breezy. Sigh.)
[12:51] <ogra> but since we have a mixed environment in edubuntu anyway, it wouldnt hurt
[12:51] <smykes> i had big issues with alexandria in hoary
[12:52] <ogra> smykes, we only targeted a single classroom with this release... bibshelf would be my suggestion for this usecase rather than alexandria
[12:52] <ogra> alexandria is rather for big setups... 
[12:52] <smykes> yeah or small, depending on what your scope is
[12:53] <ogra> we'll consider it for dapper... depending on free diskspace on the CD
[12:53] <smykes> i doubt its very valuable to anyone else
[12:53] <ogra> currently you need to get it from universe
[12:53] <smykes> what I really need is something that will catalog my sheet music
[12:53] <ogra> its valuable for all librarys
[12:54] <smykes> i wish i had more time at work to tinker at school
[12:54] <ogra> it should be better in breezy... if it isnt, please report it to me and i'll trigger a backport from dapper
[12:55] <smykes> well im not very advanced so it just didnt work for me
[12:55] <ogra> yes, and my target is to make it "just work" ;)
[12:56] <smykes> heh so I might be your perfect target ;)
[12:56] <ogra> ... for people like you
[12:56] <smykes> as I am primarily an OS X user
[12:56] <ogra> great
[12:56] <smykes> but the school has no mac hardware
[12:56] <ogra> and linux has no qbase :)
[12:56] <smykes> qbase?
[12:57] <ogra> isnt that the state of art for musicians ? 
[12:57] <smykes> I use logic
[12:57] <smykes> you are thinking of cubase
[12:57] <smykes> i got confused with the q
[12:58] <smykes> a good gui for lilypond would be nice heh
[12:58] <ogra> oh, yes... non musician here, just consumer :)
[12:58] <ogra> cu indeed
[12:58] <smykes> logic and protools are the defacto
[01:00] <smykes> lilyponds output is beautiful though
[01:07] <alison> hi, I'm trying to follow the directions at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThinClientHowtoNAT to enable internet access on my clients, and when I do sudo echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward, I get "permission denied."
[01:09] <ogra> heh, thats a wrong comand from someone used to use root :)
[01:10] <alison> so what should I do instead?
[01:13] <ogra> try: sudo sh -c 'echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward'
[01:14] <ogra> tell me if it works, i'll correct the wiki later...
[01:14] <alison> terminal gave no complaint
[01:14] <ogra> cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward
[01:14] <ogra> should give 1
[01:15] <alison> yup
[01:15] <ogra> great :)
[01:19] <ogra> wiki fixed
[01:28] <alison> excellent. I got the internet access going.
[01:28] <ogra> yay
[01:28] <ogra> :)
[05:13] <pax> guys, I uninstalled edubuntu-desktop but it's still shows the art-work at boot, what's the package(s) to remove to cmpletely make edubuntu go away?
[07:40] <HiddenWolf> Hey guys, Is there some half-decent mindmap program in the archive?
[07:40] <jsgotangco> mmm
[07:40] <jsgotangco> i know theres something...
[07:41] <jsgotangco> let me check..
[07:43] <jsgotangco> hmmm i can't find it
[07:44] <jsgotangco> i know its there somewhere
[07:44] <jsgotangco> i don't even remember
[07:44] <HiddenWolf> I saw this freemap wiki the other day, and that was just way too much bother for me. :)
[07:45] <HiddenWolf> And yes, there we go, blackboard is down yet again.
[07:52] <HiddenWolf> :( only mindmap tool that turns up in the archive is kdissert.
[07:52] <HiddenWolf> Why, oh Why?
[07:53] <Jeromee> because, life sucks
[07:53] <Jeromee> then you die
[07:53] <Jeromee> :-(
[07:55] <HiddenWolf> Oh, I'll die anyway.
[07:55] <Jeromee> me too
[07:55] <HiddenWolf> The piont is doing someful useful before then. :)
[07:55] <Jeromee> I've been smoking cigarettes since i was 9
[07:55] <Jeromee> its been 9 years now
[07:55] <Jeromee> I'm sure my lungs are done
[07:56] <Jeromee> I'll probably have lung cancer at 22
[07:56] <HiddenWolf> You're 18 and so cynical?
[07:56] <Jeromee> damn this world.
[07:56] <Jeromee> heh, indeed.
[07:56] <Jeromee> whats wrong with being cynical?
[07:56] <Jeromee> :-)
[07:56] <HiddenWolf> You could just prove it to yourself and quit. :)
[07:56] <Jeromee> its hard
[07:56] <Jeromee> I'm working on it though
[07:57] <Jeromee> believe it or not
[07:57] <HiddenWolf> Well, cynisism usually hides other things. :)
[07:57] <Jeromee> I'm illergic to the patch, and the gum.
[07:57] <Jeromee> I hide nothing
[07:57] <Jeromee> I'm so cynical because my father died when I was 16
[07:57] <Jeromee> I watched him die for 2.5 years, and cared for him for 2.5 years.
[07:57] <Jeromee> thats why I'm so cynical.
[07:57] <HiddenWolf> youch.
[07:58] <Jeromee> yeah.
[07:58] <Jeromee> kinda fucks with your head yanno?
[07:58] <Jeromee> but theres kids whose dads died of the same shit, and have turned out worse, so I'm not so concerned.
[07:58] <HiddenWolf> Jeromee, I can get into that.
[07:59] <Jeromee> what is a mindmap tool anyway?
[07:59] <HiddenWolf> Jeromee, you're the one who rules your life. You decide where you end up.
[07:59] <HiddenWolf> Jeromee, mindmapping is a way of storing information. Summarising in a graphical way, rather than written.
[07:59] <Jeromee> I know this, and this is why I'm back in school, getting my diploma, and going to college with a scholarship
[08:00] <HiddenWolf> Did you drop out?
[08:00] <Jeromee> yeah, I was supposed to graduate two years ago
[08:00] <HiddenWolf> I don't get the US system. Here you wouldn't be allowed to.
[08:00] <Jeromee> well
[08:00] <Jeromee> you're allowed to skip grades here...
[08:01] <Jeromee> I skipped 2nd
[08:01] <Jeromee> and 7th grade
[08:01] <Jeromee> heh
[08:01] <Jeromee> started early too
[08:01] <Jeromee> haha
[08:01] <HiddenWolf> Yeah, here too, but you're not allowed to leave school before you're 17, and you better damm well have a diploma.
[08:02] <Jeromee> lol.
[08:02] <Jeromee> I might be doing dual enrollment next year, I plan to get out of college asap.
[08:02] <Jeromee> next semister rather.
[08:02] <HiddenWolf> University is good. :D
[08:03] <Jeromee> I'll be going to community college
[08:03] <Jeromee> but our community college here, is on par with alot of Universities
[08:04] <Jeromee> where are you from?
[08:04] <Jeromee> UK?
[08:04] <HiddenWolf> Netherlands.
[08:04] <Jeromee> ah
[08:05] <Jeromee> gotcha
[08:05] <Jeromee> should have noticed... being in the NL ubuntu channel :-)
[08:05] <HiddenWolf> *chuckle*
[08:05] <HiddenWolf> Go WHOIS. :)
[08:05] <Jeromee> yeah
[08:06] <Jeromee> I'm like
[08:06] <Jeromee> still half asleep though
[08:06] <Jeromee> girlfriend woke me up, went and got some cigarettes, just got back in
[08:06] <HiddenWolf> heh, yeah. I had 5 hours of sleep tonight, and it's 8.06am.
[08:06] <Jeromee> debating on when to go back to sleep
[08:06] <Jeromee> lol.
[08:06] <Jeromee> its 2:04 am
[08:06] <Jeromee> I feel asleep at 12:10
[08:06] <Jeromee> woke up at 1:20
[08:06] <Jeromee> =P
[08:06] <HiddenWolf> I slept at 2, was up at 7.
[08:07] <Jeromee> werd
[08:07] <Jeromee> you're only 6hrs ahead of me
[08:07] <Jeromee> w00t.
[08:07] <HiddenWolf> I've got 2 lectures today, and a meeting. Need to shop and cook too. :)
[08:07] <Jeromee> lol.
[08:07] <Jeromee> are you a teacher?
[08:07] <HiddenWolf> No, student.
[08:07] <Jeromee> gotcha
[08:07] <Jeromee> whats your major?
[08:07] <Jeromee> I assume you're in college
[08:08] <HiddenWolf> System is slightly different here, I'm in university.
[08:08] <HiddenWolf> International Business.
[08:08] <Jeromee> oh, fun fun
[08:08] <Jeromee> I'll be majoring in Computer Programming/Computer Network Management
[08:08] <HiddenWolf> One can actually pay for higher education here. :)
[08:09] <Jeromee> its insane here
[08:09] <Jeromee> honestly
[08:09] <Jeromee> if I don't have a scholarship
[08:09] <Jeromee> I won't be attending anything.
[08:10] <Burgundavia> http://www.gnomefiles.org/app.php?soft_id=691
[08:10] <HiddenWolf> I'm waiting for the supermarket to open.
[08:10] <Jeromee> awesome
[08:10] <HiddenWolf> I'm hungry, and out of bread. :)
[08:11] <Jeromee> lol
[08:25] <enyc> 0000
[08:25] <jsgotangco> hi JaneW 
[08:25] <JaneW> morning jsgotangco 
[08:26] <dabaR> Hi. Is there somewhere you can log in to the edubuntu wiki? I can not seem to find a place to log in.
[08:30] <dabaR> All the pages say locked page for me, even though I am logged into the ubuntu wiki, with the rosetta login, I think.
[08:31] <dabaR> Is that how it should be? locked?
[08:41] <Oly> just a quick quesstion of intrest, are we going to see a forum for discussing edubuntu ?
[08:41] <jsgotangco> we could probably ask the forums to add one
[08:42] <jsgotangco> given enough interest
[08:42] <Oly> yeah, seems like a good idea to me, especially as IRC does not work at school because the provider blocks the portds
[08:43] <Oly> while i am here may as well ask a quick question, installed edubuntu last friday before i finished work 
[08:43] <Oly> got it to network boot a laptop, but it booted to a terminal
[08:44] <Oly> and said it needed an nfs server, do i need to install this seperate ?
[08:44] <Oly> i assumed it would just boot to a gui with out any other work
[08:44] <jsgotangco> JaneW, is it possible to add Edubuntu to the official forums?
[08:44] <Oly> not really had chance to look into it more, thought i would ask now while i can :p
[08:45] <juliux> Oly, it should boot a gui by default
[08:45] <jsgotangco> well by default it should boot gdm
[08:45] <Oly> i thought that might be the case
[08:45] <Oly> which means something went wrong somewhere 
[08:46] <juliux> Oly, check if the gdm is running
[08:46] <Oly> will look into it when i get to work, 
[08:46] <Oly> it did not look like it got that far
[08:46] <Oly> from what i remember 
[08:47] <juliux> Oly, ps aux |grep gdm helps
[08:47] <Oly> i will try later, see if its there 
[08:47] <juliux> Oly, if the gdm is not running you can start it with sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start
[08:48] <Oly> but i think a service is bumming out and stopping the boot
[08:48] <Oly> okay i will try starting it manually, and see if it is launched
[08:48] <Oly> also write down any of the errors
[08:49] <\sh> good morning 
[08:51] <jsgotangco> moin \sh
[08:51] <juliux> moin \sh 
[08:52] <\sh> ok...I don't know if you heard about it, ogra and I were testing amd64 ltps server + i386 client :) works now with a couple of lines of patches 
[08:52] <jsgotangco> wow
[08:52] <jsgotangco> how about the ppc client?
[08:53] <\sh> jsgotangco: ppc iso were fcked up because of a kernel install thingy..
[08:54] <\sh> good morning JaneW :)
[08:54] <JaneW> \sh morning
[08:55] <\sh> JaneW: I think ogra will be back to normal this week...after this weekend ,-)
[08:58] <dabaR> so noone knows about my wiki issue where I can not log in to make changes?
[09:02] <JaneW> dabaR: does it not offer a place to log in?
[09:03] <dabaR> I can not see one, no.
[09:04] <JaneW> um... my logon is automatic... I will try to replicate...
[09:04] <JaneW> are you using the orange and red edubuntu wiki skin?
[09:05] <dabaR> afai can see
[09:06] <dabaR> that makes even my ubuntu wiki locked.
[09:06] <dabaR> wait, maybe not, let me check here...
[09:06] <DemisM> what is the difference between edubuntu and ubuntu?
[09:07] <JaneW> both use the launchpad login
[09:07] <JaneW> access through ww.edubuntu.org
[09:07] <dabaR> No, it does not, just the edubuntu wiki pages are locked.
[09:07] <dabaR> JaneW: you see a login screen or textboxes at edubuntu anywhere?
[09:08] <JaneW> and click on wiki linkg - you should get a login link in the top of the orange bar at the top
[09:08] <JaneW> try go to http://wiki.edubuntu.org/UserPreferences
[09:09] <dabaR> Hah, never saw it. thank you.
[09:18] <JaneW> dabaR: you sorted now?
[09:20] <Yagisan> G'day ogra - haven't seen you for a few days
[09:23] <ajmitch_> hi JaneW, Yagisan 
[09:24] <JaneW> hi ajmitch_ 
[09:24] <JaneW> Yagisan: I don;t think ogra is up yet
[09:24] <ajmitch_> probably still sleeping off the effects of having \sh visit
[09:25] <Yagisan> G'day ajmitch_
[09:25] <\sh> hehe
[09:25] <Yagisan> \sh what did you do to him ??
[09:26] <\sh> Yagisan: we had a nice weekend with a lot of drinks, extreme after release relaxing :) 
[09:26] <\sh> when I counted right
[09:27] <Yagisan> cool - are you going to demo the multi-client-arch edubuntu at UBZ ?
[09:28] <\sh> 1 bottle glen grant, 1 bottle glen fiddich, half a box of beer (12 bottles) and a half bottle of rum...
[09:28] <\sh> Yagisan: I think we should show it to the world :)
[09:31] <Yagisan> \sh - yeah- we know what you drank :) but what about ogra :-P
[09:31] <\sh> Yagisan: i had the beer and the rum ;)
[09:31] <Yagisan> \sh - have you noticed that the clients don't have a volatile directory or non-free modules ?
[09:32] <\sh> Yagisan: no....we were happy that it was working like this...and now ogra can have a closer look what's there and what not
[09:34] <Yagisan> \sh: I noticed it a few days ago, none if my i386 clients got a nvidia.ko module
[09:34] <Yagisan> \sh: for systems that need firmware - it may be an issue
[09:34] <\sh> Yagisan: the only thing which is really annoying is the fade out effekt during logoff
[09:35] <\sh> effect even
[09:35] <Yagisan> \sh: that goes so sssssssslllllllllllooooooowwwwwwwwwww on my p2 clients
[09:35] <\sh> because it takes a hell of a lot of bandwidth
[09:35] <Yagisan> \sh: even on crossover it is dog slow
[09:36] <\sh> and it looks like an old dia-show of hires boob pictures on c64
[09:36] <Yagisan> \sh: you think we can get a c64 working as a client ?
[09:37] <Yagisan> \sh: would look cool :)
[09:37] <\sh> Yagisan: hmm...there is a tcp/ip stack for a c64 via userport
[09:38] <\sh> and if there is a running implementation of the X protocol for c64...
[09:39] <Yagisan> \sh: booting from tape may take a while ..
[09:39] <\sh> coffee....brb
[09:53] <Gand_> hi all
[09:55] <Gand_> my gnome icons on bottom bar are little messed up (bin is placed left to desktop) no problem with a new created user. How can i fix it? thank
[09:57] <Gand_> I've oslved dragging them, thank
[09:58] <Gand_> oslved/solved
[09:58] <Gand_> just wonder why after upgrade icons were messed up
[10:01] <Yagisan> Gand_: were you logged in twice ?
[10:01] <Yagisan> Gand_: sometimes that happens if you are logged in twice at the same time
[10:07] <Gand_> YYagisan you mean logged twice on my machine? no, I did never
[10:08] <Yagisan> Gand_: I had it happen to me when I logged in from a few terminals at once
[10:09] <Yagisan> Gand_: It cleared up for me when I logged them all out, then did a single log in
[10:11] <Gand_> I restarted computer, so all logged user were logged out, and I didn't log twice, anyway I solved, no prob, thanks
[10:11] <Gand_> As my school students are about 14/18 years old, where can I find previous edubuntu desktop (little bit less K12 style :)
[10:11] <Gand_> http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=434&slide=4
[10:13] <Gand_> not yet available here: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/Preview_Wallpaper_Examples
[10:13] <jsgotangco> JaneW, no habla espanol
[10:13] <jsgotangco> he
[10:14] <Yagisan> Gand_: I don't know -  try right clicking the desktop to change it
[10:14] <Yagisan> Gand_: The current one was what was voted for - that's why they shipped it
[10:15] <jsgotangco> i don't think we'll be able to put up wallpapers of boy bands and hip hop groups to cater that age group for legal reasons :)
[10:15] <jsgotangco> joke
[10:15] <jsgotangco> :)
[10:16] <JaneW> jsgotangco: no
[10:16] <JaneW> Gand_: I'll u/l it for you....
[10:17] <Gand_> thank
[10:18] <Gand_> just have it available
[10:18] <Gand_> as I find other one, but not the previus shipped
[10:19] <JaneW> Gand_: er I just need to find it again...
[10:19] <Gand_> :)
[10:19] <Gand_> lost in space :)
[10:20] <JaneW> Gand_: on ogra's page somewhere ;)
[10:21] <ajmitch_> jsgotangco: throw some this way :)
[10:21] <Gand_> I think it had to be added on "Preview wallpaper example" page on edubuntu site
[10:22] <JaneW> Gand_: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/wallpaper/
[10:22] <JaneW> Gand_: I'll u/p it to  "Preview wallpaper example" now
[10:22] <Gand_> thank
[10:23] <JaneW> no problem
[10:23] <JaneW> :)
[10:32] <magnon> morning!
[10:32] <highvoltage> morning, got to run again, so bye!
[11:43] <enyc> meep
[11:43] <enyc> erm
[11:43] <magnon> meep.
[11:44] <enyc> amybody know why my edubuntu 5.10 i386 install asking me for ip address ??
[11:44] <enyc> its connected to dhcp network....
[11:45] <magnon> yes, you're installing the server, apparently
[11:45] <magnon> that means it will BE the dhcp server thus needs an IP
[11:45] <enyc> well yes
[11:45] <enyc> but i didnt ask for server
[11:46] <magnon> hm
[11:46] <magnon> I don't have a recent installation here, I don't know
[11:46] <magnon> edubuntu is server by default I think
[11:47] <jsgotangco> yes
[11:47] <magnon> just do the installation and then configure it for dhcp later if you can do that
[11:47] <jsgotangco> on boot type workstation so as not to install the server components
[11:48] <ogra> morning everybody
[11:48] <enyc> errrrm
[11:48] <jsgotangco> hi ogra 
[11:49] <ogra> JaneW, i uploaded the wallpaper already to art.ubuntu.com... waiting for moderator approval...
[11:49] <ajmitch_> hi ogra 
[11:49] <ajmitch_> how's the head? ;)
[11:49] <enyc> it says type 'server' for server install
[11:49] <magnon> morning ogra
[11:49] <magnon> enyc: umm, probably a bug. That's inherited from Ubuntu proper
[11:49] <JaneW> ogra: oic... 
[11:49] <ogra> enyc, yes, there are som cosmetic bugs in the installer
[11:49] <JaneW> ogra: morning
[11:49] <ogra> :)
[11:50] <enyc> so i need to select 'workstation' at boot prompt ???
[11:50] <ogra> enyc, like http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes says ;)
[11:51] <jsgotangco> enyc, yes
[11:51] <jsgotangco> :)
[11:51] <ogra> if you want a ubuntu with an edubuntu-desktop only workstation is right
[11:53] <ogra> i think so... they are in the default install, arent they ? 
[11:53] <enyc> kk
[11:53] <jsgotangco> yes
[11:53] <jsgotangco> i'll try it later i guess
[11:53] <enyc> loading...
[11:53] <jsgotangco> the oem will install server hehehe
[11:53] <jsgotangco> its pretty neat actually
[11:54] <ogra> lol
[11:54] <jsgotangco> the only instruction for oem avaialble was the one i wrote about and published in planet
[11:54] <ogra> i'll check it... i only know the hwdb client doesnt work...i didnt even know he used it until release day
[11:56] <magnon> thursday is my departure for eventually ending up in Montreal =)
[11:57] <bluefrog-10> hi all
[11:58] <bluefrog-10> anyone could help with xserver pb on thin client?
[11:58] <ogra> bluefrog-10, sure
[11:59] <bluefrog-10> got a fatal error unrecognized option vttty1. don't know where from this thing is coming
[12:00] <ogra> did you create a lts.conf ? 
[12:00] <bluefrog-10> yes
[12:00] <bluefrog-10> copied it from k12ltsp which is working ok
[12:01] <ogra> did you look for the line it complains about in this file ? 
[12:02] <bluefrog-10> trying to switch to low vesa server as my server card is intel 915 and got a nvidia on client. no vttty1 in my conf. getting from somewhere else but am not good enough with grep to find out where
[12:02] <ogra> this is no string our ltsp uses anywhere, it must be something you added... i.e. through lts.conf
[12:03] <ogra> you dont need to configure X that happens automatically, did you try without lts.conf already ? 
[12:03] <bluefrog-10> haven't fiddle for sure with a vttty1 anywhere
[12:03] <ogra> we have native i915 support ....
[12:03] <bluefrog-10> without lts.conf was telling me lts.conf was mising
[12:04] <ogra> and you are sure you use edubuntu with edubuntu ltsp ??
[12:04] <ogra> it shouldnt bother with a missig lts.conf... our ltsp surely doesnt give such a message
[12:05] <bluefrog-10> not for certain. as i had pb with dhcp i fiddle a bit with packages. going to reinstall and have a look now that i know how to run dhcp.
[12:06] <bluefrog-10> when i install from scratch do i have to run ltspadmin afterwards?
[12:06] <ogra> did you follow the http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes ?
[12:06] <ogra> you only have to replace the IP range in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to match the IP you selected on install... restart the dhcp server and thats all... no further action needed
[12:07] <bluefrog-10> ok then a clean reinstall should do the trick ty. will come back if same problem
[12:07] <ogra> yup....
[12:08] <ogra> just follow the instructions from the wiki (and from the linked pages there)
[12:08] <ogra> gah, to slow
[12:16] <jsgotangco> brb
[01:34] <enyc> hmmmmmmm
[01:34] <enyc> im having dhcp trouble
[01:34] <bluefrog-10> dhcp won't start?
[01:34] <enyc> dhcp-client....
[01:35] <enyc> but nettwork works etc....
[01:35] <enyc> trying knoppix
[01:37] <bluefrog-10> hi all. made clean install. switch on client. getting at the ltsp display manager. trying to log on, keeps throwing me back at the display manager. haven't touched anything yet on the server. can anyone help pls
[01:38] <Yagisan> bluefrog-10: select gdm off the menu
[01:38] <bluefrog-10> selected GNOME
[01:39] <Yagisan> bluefrog-10: soory - I don't have a box handy - At least it starts with G :)
[01:39] <bluefrog-10> :)
[01:39] <bluefrog-10> done that but no luck. is there a log somewhere on the server?
[01:40] <Yagisan> bluefrog-10: sounds like you have the ssh key problem then
[01:41] <Yagisan> bluefrog-10: on the server run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys and see if that helps
[01:41] <ogra> bluefrog-10, did you see the known issues list on the wikipage ? ;)
[01:41] <ogra> the menus in the loginmanager dont work... dont waste time to select stuff :)
[01:42] <bluefrog-10> seen something like that yes. tried for the sake of it
[01:42] <ogra> :)
[01:42] <ogra> is sshd running on the server ?
[01:43] <Yagisan> ogra: the menus doesn't work - odd, sometimes picking gnome worked for me
[01:43] <ogra> Yagisan, we dont use gdm in ubuntu ltsp :) its called ldm...
[01:43] <bluefrog-10> apparently yes as i can ssh test@edubuntu
[01:43] <Yagisan> ogra: I'm tired and can't spell - I got the right first letter
[01:44] <ogra> bluefrog-10, and you log in with the same userdata via ldm ? 
[01:45] <bluefrog-10> yes
[01:45] <ogra> hmm, k.... 
[01:45] <bluefrog-10> tried the  sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys. no change
[01:45] <bluefrog-10> have created a user test pwd test
[01:45] <bluefrog-10> trying as well with the install created user
[01:45] <ogra> you can set a rootpw for the client and look into the ldm.log there
[01:46] <ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
[01:46] <ogra> ^^^sets a root pw...
[01:46] <ogra> you can then log in on console on the client as root... look at the last lines of /var/log/ldm.log
[01:47] <ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd -l locks the password again afterwards
[01:48] <bluefrog-10> permission denied publickey,password
[01:48] <ogra> hmm...
[01:49] <bluefrog-10> trying private key /root/.ssh/id_rsa
[01:49] <ogra> does /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts exist and contain the right key ? 
[01:49] <ogra> else delete it and run ltsp-update-sshkeys again
[01:51] <ogra> note that this command is run by the installer at the end of the install... if you run it afterwards, you may have the same key twice in there... 
[01:51] <bluefrog-10> done rm and run again no luck
[01:52] <ogra> can you scp the log file to the server and post it to a pastebin service ? 
[01:52] <bluefrog-10> setting up a password for root on server wouldn't help would it? (guess it's a stupid question)
[01:52] <ogra> nope, it wouldnt
[01:53] <bluefrog-10> wow wow scp pastebin, u talk chinese to me. give me a url where i can post the log
[01:53] <ogra> the only place where a root pw helps is in the chroot to read the logfile... but it should contain the explicit error
[01:53] <bluefrog-10> btw the client took an awful long time to boot, is that normal for now?
[01:55] <ogra> http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl
[01:55] <ogra> yes, we'll improve boot time for dapper and also add the bootsplash to the thin client boot
[01:56] <bluefrog-10> hang on am in with the install created user right now
[01:56] <ogra> there is also a next generation ldm already that didnt make the freeze date for breezy... it is themeable and looks not as ugly as the current one
[01:56] <ogra> wow, great news :)
[01:57] <bluefrog-10> as for the uesr i created am gonna try again but it seems to be an Xauthority lock pb
[01:57] <ogra> how did you create the user ? 
[01:57] <bluefrog-10> sudo useradd
[01:58] <ogra> hmm... rather take the gui tool for that.... it has user profiles ...
[01:58] <bluefrog-10> stupid me it no home for test
[01:58] <ogra> heh :)
[01:59] <ogra> that explains the error in the log :)
[02:00] <bluefrog-10> yep sure helps to have a home. going alright. there was still this key pb solved by rm and recreating it
[02:01] <ogra> if you want to tweak it, you could now transfer the essential parts to /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf from your former lts.conf...
[02:02] <ogra> it should have existed in the first place if you didnt run ltsp-udate-sshkeys manually
[02:02] <ogra> as i said above, that might add the same key twice...
[02:02] <bluefrog-10> am abit baffled though as ther's no lts.conf in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc.
[02:02] <ogra> it will be read if you create one...
[02:03] <bluefrog-10> where does it take the conf from right now?
[02:03] <ogra> ubuntus autodetection mechanisms :)
[02:03] <bluefrog-10> k fair enough :)
[02:04] <ogra> the file is only necessary if you got values that arent detected or detected wrongly...
[02:04] <bluefrog-10> if i remember what i read no use trying to get the sound work on client correct?
[02:04] <ogra> yes...
[02:04] <bluefrog-10> ah..
[02:04] <ogra> next release... i plan to integrate something like a streaming server fo audio... 
[02:05] <ogra> so we can forward the audion compressed through a ssh tunnel if the latency doesnt get to evil...
[02:05] <ogra> s/audion/audio
[02:06] <ogra> for local devices i plan to have a tunneled dbus/hotplug/hal combination so you can just plug in your camera or scanner on the thin client and it gets used as its now in ubuntu
[02:07] <enyc> so.....
[02:07] <bluefrog-10> k
[02:08] <enyc> when does ubuntu tree next 'sync with deb unstable then start ubuntu-paching again etc....?'
[02:08] <ogra> for this release the target was mainly to have a base to build on for the future
[02:08] <bluefrog-10> got u
[02:08] <ogra> the archive for dapper opens tomorrow... no idea if the automerges start immediately
[02:09] <enyc> i wonder how that workos, etc....
[02:09] <CuriousCat> so, edubuntu will still follow the six-month release plan, right?
[02:09] <magnon> yes
[02:09] <ogra> the time to get new features in will a bit shorter this release, since we'll have to do more stabilization work for a 3/5 year supported release
[02:09] <ogra> CuriousCat, yes
[02:10] <enyc> ;-)
[02:10] <ogra> that way we can benefit from the fast reease cycle ubuntu has an get newest stuff in very fast
[02:10] <enyc> get on with it then ;p
[02:11] <ogra> and i only have to care for the edubntu specifics, the rest is done reliably by the ubuntu team....
[02:11] <enyc> so....
[02:11] <CuriousCat> So, will it still be the same? I mean, whatever major changes they have in store for ubuntu dapper will also be seen on edubuntu? Just curious since I have plans to use edubuntu for my project next year. :)
[02:11] <enyc> ace you planning for a late 5.10-ppc edubuntu cd once stupid-problem in ltsp fixed ?
[02:12] <ogra> enyc, its quite easy... all packages that have ubuntu specific changes have a ubuntuX version number... the autosync tool (MOM or merge o matic) doesnt sync them ... but creates a bug with the differences of the packages...
[02:12] <enyc> hmm
[02:12] <ogra> so all packages with a ubuntuX version require manual merging... the rest gets in right away from debian
[02:13] <ogra> CuriousCat, yes, it will always have ubuntu as underlying architecture... 
[02:13] <Yagisan> ogra: ppc broke ?
[02:13] <ogra> Yagisan, yes :(
[02:14] <Yagisan> ogra: I don't feel so bad about qemu being unable to process it now
[02:14] <ogra> enyc, nope we wont hae a fixed iso... but the release iso is on http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/ (with the bug in ltsp indeed)
[02:15] <Yagisan> ogra: I can wait for qemu to get better before implementing ppc client with i386/amd64 server
[02:15] <ogra> so if you dont want to use a ppc server, you can still do a workstation install from it...
[02:16] <Yagisan> ogra: what was the problem with ppc ltsp ?
[02:16] <ogra> there is no linux package in ppc
[02:17] <Yagisan> ogra: so it can't get a kernel ?
[02:17] <ogra> so theltsp client builder from the installer breaks on it ... as well as ltsp-build-client does...
[02:17] <ogra> yes
[02:17] <ogra> which breaks the install
[02:18] <Yagisan> ogra: I see, is it missing from the cd or the archive completely ?
[02:18] <ogra> ltsp-build-client needs an arch check and set the package name accordingly
[02:19] <ogra> there was no ppc CD released... we only have the last daily (which is identical with the release but wasnt blessed QA wise)
[02:19] <Yagisan> ogra: hmm - that would make it a bit more difficult re multi-client-arch
[02:19] <ogra> why ? 
[02:20] <Yagisan> ogra: I would have to add extra ppc logic
[02:20] <ogra> if the base arch is ppc or the --ppc option for the client building is set, it uses the right linux package...
[02:20] <ogra> its not complicated...
[02:20] <Yagisan> ogra: what package does ppc use instead of linux
[02:21] <ogra> linux-powerpc :p
[02:21] <ogra> or linux-powerpc64
[02:21] <Yagisan> ogra: bug against linux-powerpc for failure to provide meta-package linux
[02:22] <ogra> its a question of setting one variable based on autodetection...
[02:22] <ogra> i'm not sure if its a bug or a feature... that'll need discussion with the kernel team :)
[02:23] <Yagisan> ogra: or bug against linux-i386 for providing meta-package linux - the achive isn't consistant
[02:23] <ogra> yes... 
[02:23] <Yagisan> ogra: Did you notice that the kernel volotile mount is created on the clients ?
[02:24] <Yagisan> isn't
[02:24] <ogra> nope...
[02:24] <Yagisan> ogra: I noticed that on a p2 - it displayed an error while booting
[02:25] <ogra> we'll fix that.. 
[02:26] <ogra> we'll have some BOFs about ltsp, multiarch support local devices etc at UBZ
[02:26] <ogra> its mdz's babay, so all stuff will need his approval
[02:26] <Yagisan> ogra: well, no one needs anything that needs it yet (until someone gets a new nvidia or ati card anyway)
[02:27] <ogra> i have a nvidia card and tested also the binary driver.... worked fine... but i'm not sure if that was before or after the tmpfs for the volatile stuff was added
[02:30] <Yagisan> ogra: any idea why they did tmpfs for volatile ?
[02:30] <ogra> nope
[02:31] <Yagisan> ogra: The old system was working well, but now, I can't see on my filesystem the stuff that is in volatile
[02:32] <Yagisan> ogra: and it's not good on low memory systems
[02:32] <ogra> ask the kernel team ... #ubuntu-kernel :)
[02:33] <ogra> hehe http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/BootingClientWithoutPxe
[02:37] <highvoltage> ogra: hi
[02:38] <ogra> hey
[02:38] <highvoltage> ogra: what would happen if you installed ldm on a normal ubuntu system?
[02:38] <highvoltage> could you connect to the server through that?
[02:38] <ogra> you cant
[02:38] <highvoltage> ah
[02:38] <ogra> there is no separarte package
[02:38] <Yagisan> ogra: you noticed that now ???
[02:39] <highvoltage> ogra: if there were a seperate package, would it work? or if you install ltsp-thin-client and fix things up, would it work?
[02:39] <ogra> Yagisan, the wikipage ? yes :)
[02:39] <Yagisan> ogra: I need to clean it up and add more instructions later for hard disk boot, but I'm to busy now
[02:40] <Yagisan> ogra: You wouldn't believe how many people I've tried to help while you were hungover er resting
[02:41] <ogra> highvoltage, yes, it *could* work, no promises though... we also planned to put it in a separate package
[02:41] <ogra> Yagisan, thats great news... we need more community... 
[02:52] <magnon> ogra: know where claire davis works, and if she's on irc at the moment under some strange name?
[02:54] <JaneW> magnon: her nick is cvd
[02:54] <JaneW> magnon: and she is in London
[02:55] <magnon> ah, thanks
[02:55] <JaneW> she should be on-line now, I have been chatting to her throughout the day
[02:56] <magnon> ok
[03:03] <highvoltage> hi JaneW 
[03:28] <mhz> hi you all
[03:29] <magnon> hey
[03:29] <mhz> hi magnon 
[03:44] <mhz> JaneW: could we talk about the CD stuff?
[04:36] <enyc> meep
[04:36] <enyc> got udubuntu 'workstation' going...
[04:40] <enyc> errr edeubuntu
[04:41] <enyc> id really like to have a specified user login automatically....
[04:41] <enyc> password can be used when sudoing...
[04:42] <enyc> i.e. for a standalone non-multiuser-setup
[04:42] <enyc> which is what i want *at the moment*
[04:43] <ogra> you can set this up in the loginmanager settings for gdm...
[04:47] <Yagisan> enyc: that's not such a good idea from a security point of view ... but it's your call
[04:53] <enyc> yes i know this
[04:53] <enyc> i am well aware of the consequences etc...
[04:54] <enyc> laooe,rpe
[04:54] <enyc> oops
[04:57] <enyc> im in "login screen setup"
[04:57] <enyc> aha
[05:03] <enyc> hrrrrm
[05:04] <enyc> autologin didnt work
[05:04] <enyc> laoo,rpe
[05:04] <enyc> argh wrong keyswitch setting
[05:28] <juliux> ogra, ping
[05:28] <ogra> juliux, pong
[05:29] <juliux> ogra, do you know where i can manipulate the log out prozess from gnome?
[05:29] <ogra> manipulat ? in which way ? 
[05:30] <enyc> hrmmmm
[05:30] <enyc> questidon ;-)
[05:30] <juliux> ogra, ich want that if a user log out that the home dir of the user is backspace to a default content
[05:31] <juliux> s/ich/i
[05:31] <enyc> if i plug edubunte/ubuntu box into a duifferent  DDC (plug/pray) monitor......
[05:31] <enyc> and boot it....
[05:31] <enyc> will the x-server detect the new freq. range settings ??
[05:32] <ogra> enyc, you'll probably have to run "sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg"
[05:32] <enyc> hmmmmmmm
[05:32] <ogra> to generate a new xorg.conf
[05:32] <enyc> i see i see
[05:32] <ogra> depending o the monitor
[05:32] <enyc> thats what i suspected
[05:32] <ogra> *on
[05:33] <enyc> ill get out a worse monitor then do that ;p
[05:33] <Yagisan> enyc: the clients should auto detect
[05:33] <juliux> ogra, it is clear what i mean?
[05:33] <enyc> or set ranges manually
[05:33] <ogra> juliux, yes....
[05:33] <enyc> this is standalone/workstation for now
[05:33] <ogra> enyc, ... the above only applies for non ltsp indeed... ltsp clients autodetect the settings
[05:35] <enyc> kk
[05:35] <enyc> kk
[05:35] <enyc> kk
[05:35] <enyc> ;-)
[05:35] <ogra> juliux, the only thing that comes to mind would involve ugly ldm hacks...
[05:36] <juliux> ogra, i think that there was a simple shell skript that runs if you log out
[05:36] <juliux> ogra, but i did not know where i should start my search
[05:37] <ogra> for gdm, yes... but ldm doesnt have such a function yet
[05:37] <juliux> ogra, ldm?
[05:37] <ogra> ltsp display manager ...
[05:37] <juliux> ogra, ok
[05:37] <ogra> the login manager
[05:38] <juliux> ogra, but isn't there a log file which logs which user logs in and out?
[05:38] <ogra> what we do is to run /etc/X11/Xsession through a ssh tunnel... you could also hack on this file or the files in /etc/X11/Xsession.d
[05:39] <juliux> hm
[05:39] <ogra> /var/log/auth.log ?
[05:39] <juliux> i will look there if i find time
[05:43] <juliux> ogra, but a daemon that look the hole time on the log file is not very nice
[05:43] <ogra> thats what i meant with weird ldm hack :)
[05:44] <juliux> ogra, hm
[05:44] <ogra> look in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/sbin/ldm
[05:44] <ogra> find the ssh_remote_command array
[05:44] <juliux> ok
[05:44] <juliux> at first i will boot the server
[05:45] <ogra> add your script before 'kill -1 $PPID'] 
[05:45] <juliux> ogra, thanks
[05:45] <ogra> now it will get executed before the session is killed
[05:45] <juliux> ok 
[05:45] <ogra> but its very ugly and will get overwritten on upgrade 
[05:45] <juliux> i know
[05:46] <ogra> (not that i'd expect upgrades to ltsp ruing breezy)
[05:46] <juliux> but no risk no fun
[05:46] <ogra> juliux, there is also a beatified version of the login manager with theme support... http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/
[05:48] <Yagisan> ogra: There have been sec updates already - I've updated my ltsp chroots - libssl anyone ?
[05:55] <pere> Suvarov[work] : hi. :)
[05:55] <Suvarov[work] > pere: hello!
[05:56] <pere> Suvarov[work] : good evening. :)
[11:08] <bluefrog-10> hi all. where can i find the conf used by ltsp in edubuntu pls?
[11:27] <ogra> bluefrog-10, there is none, its autodetected...
[11:28] <bluefrog-10> oh sad
[11:29] <ogra> bluefrog-10, if you want a specific conf, create /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf on the server, there is a example in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/
[11:29] <ogra> most of the values from the original ltsp (found on wiki.ltsp.org) will work
[11:30] <ogra> bluefrog-10, whats not working right for you ? 
[11:30] <bluefrog-10> it's just that i installed ltsp on ubuserver as i'd like ti install it at my kid's school but i like the way edubuntu detected the thin client hardawre
[11:30] <bluefrog-10> i guess it's coming from the kernel
[11:30] <ogra> oh, you installed the legacy ltsp ? 
[11:31] <bluefrog-10> yes, no offence to your work but having no sound yet prevents me from installing edubuntu right now
[11:31] <ogra> yes, i understand that very well... i'm also quite sad that we dont have sound yet
[11:32] <bluefrog-10> and i'd like to get away from redhat k12
[11:32] <ogra> but for sound the ugly ways k12 or legacy ltsp use might work in edubuntu too
[11:32] <ogra> i didnt have the time to test such stuff sadly
[11:33] <bluefrog-10> so so far ubuserver with ltsp works quite well excepts for the hardware detection. throws me to low vesa while edubuntu finds the correct graphic card apparently
[11:33] <ogra> but dvelopment for the next release just starts ... in april we'll hopefully have a rocking audio and local device support
[11:33] <bluefrog-10> yes u told me that yesterday
[11:33] <ogra> thats an xorg/kernel/hotplug thing...
[11:34] <ogra> we use kernel 2.6, legacy ltsp uses 2.4 ... 
[11:34] <ogra> i think k12 also still uses xfree86 ... 
[11:34] <bluefrog-10> well it was just for the sake of research as they will have crappy graphic card at the scholl anyway
[11:35] <bluefrog-10> am using 269 with ubuserver but u use 2612 in edubuntu
[11:35] <bluefrog-10> i mean in /tftpboot
[11:35] <ogra> yes...
[11:36] <ogra> but you most likely dont ues initramfs and the latest xorg that has many improvements...
[11:36] <bluefrog-10> i tried to copy the all stuff but then i have a mount /dev/.static/dev problem
[11:36] <ogra> especially for autodetection
[11:42] <bluefrog-10> sry am not linux guru (far far far from it). last question. if i compile new ltsp kernel to have 2612 instead of 269 in tftpboot would the autodetection improved or has it nothing to do with it?
[11:44] <mhz> ogra: hi. Just wanted to tell you that your ltsp-update-sshkeys worked fine.
[11:44] <mhz> Clients do login based on .xsession now
[11:44] <ogra> cool
[11:45] <ogra> bluefrog-10, thats rather a thing that has to do with initramfs
[11:46] <bluefrog-10> ok then that's chinese to me i'll stick with what i have and will do an upgrade to dapper next year. ty for your time
[11:46] <ogra> you wont win anything with a higher kernel version... there is a lot integration wok gone into initramfs/udev/hotplug/kernel combnation
[11:47] <bluefrog-10> k the server working ok for me. next big step is ldap. no pb in FC4 but i struglled and quit several times in ubuntu.
[11:48] <bluefrog-10> at least with hoary, haven' tried yet in breezy
[11:49] <ogra> thats on my list for dapper too... but there was a thread in the ubuntu-devel mailinglist yesterday i think where many people showed off their favorite ldap tools
[11:49] <bluefrog-10> :)
[11:50] <bluefrog-10> ain't got noone. so i wont bother u with that. doing it by hand following idealx.org tuto
[11:55] <viator> hello do i need two nick cards for edubuntu to work as a terminal server?
[11:55] <bluefrog-10> not necessarily
[11:56] <bluefrog-10> u can set it up with one
[11:56] <viator> i have two but id be robbing from peter to pay paul ie then one of the other pc's would be missing one
[11:56] <bluefrog-10> one is fine
[11:56] <ogra> in fact its way easier with only one card
[11:57] <mhz> ogra: have you had come to a decision about CD printing_
[11:57] <mhz> ?
[11:58] <viator> i have a couple of REALLY old pc's  whats the minimum specs for them as clients
[11:58] <ogra> mhz, nope... we'll have our regular meeting on wednesday, lets tlak about it there :)
[11:58] <mhz> ok
[11:58] <viator> i mean "usable"
[11:59] <ogra> viator, i'd think 64MB 133Mhz pentium should work fine
[11:59] <viator> really  great
[11:59] <viator> the only think that stinks about them is ill have to use floppy
[12:00] <viator> cause theres no option in bios
[12:00] <bluefrog-10> or a cd if it boots on cd
[12:00] <viator> one is eltorito the other isnt
[12:00] <ajmitch_> the main issues with old PCs as clients is usually the video card
[12:00] <viator> so yeah i can do cd
[12:01] <viator> on one
[12:03] <viator> yeah ones an old ibm 166 which is currently running damn small linux the other is a toshiba laptop which is also 166
[12:03] <viator> i hate to throw them out if they could be used in anyway so ill try this i guess