[01:05] <apokryphos> koffice doesn't bring in kexi, and it's even especially advertised on breezy release notes that it does :P
[01:06] <Riddell> it's because kexi is released separately as well as with koffice
[01:06] <Riddell> the separate kexi is more up to date so we package that
[01:06] <apokryphos> but don't package the one that comes with koffice?
[01:07] <apokryphos> shouldn't the newer package depend on koffice anyhow?
[01:12] <Riddell> koffice should maybe depend on kexi
[01:12] <Riddell> I don't know if kexi 
[01:12] <Riddell> blurg
[01:12] <Riddell> I don't think kexi works in koshell though 
[01:13] <apokryphos> ah yes, could be an issue
[07:24] <Tm_T> hmm
[07:24] <Tm_T> yes
[09:26] <pef> hello
[11:30] <\sh> Riddell: ping
[12:54] <Riddell> \sh: hi
[12:54] <Riddell> who's running breezy and wants to do a dist-upgrade?
[12:58] <pef> Riddell: why not :)
[12:58] <JRe> Riddell: why ?
[01:01] <Tm_T> ?
[01:01] <Tm_T> dapper \o/
[01:01] <Tm_T> ;)
[01:04] <JRe> i am planning to put my laptop on dapper
[01:08] <Riddell> JRe: because there are HAL and GPG updates in today
[01:08] <Riddell> make sure you have breezy-upgdates enabled
[01:09] <JRe> Riddell: ok
[01:09] <Tm_T> Riddell: :o
[01:09] <Tm_T> hmm, why I can't see them
[01:10] <JRe> Riddell: there is the konsole font fix also???
[01:10] <Riddell> JRe: of course
[01:10] <pef> is dapper open ?
[01:11] <JRe> Tm_T: I can't see them too
[01:12] <CaiN_SA> Riddell, why is the packages with south african languages for kde empty ?
[01:13] <JRe> ok it's good they are there ;)
[01:14] <JRe> Riddell: I'm dist-upgrading
[01:17] <Tm_T> heh
[01:19] <JRe> Riddell: ok so
[01:19] <JRe> Riddell: konsole font cleaned, hal fixed, and gpg working great
[01:19] <JRe> Riddell: no errors
[01:19] <JRe> Riddell: that's a cool update ;)
[01:19] <JRe> (amd64)
[01:22] <Tm_T> uih!
[01:22] <Tm_T> maybe I'm using slow mirror os something?
[01:22] <Tm_T> s/os/or
[01:23] <JRe> Tm_T: I did it from archives.ubuntu.com
[01:23] <Tm_T> hmm
[01:23] <Tm_T> ?
[01:23] <JRe> Tm_T: lirror
[01:23] <JRe> s/l/m/
[01:23] <Tm_T> :)
[01:24] <Tm_T> breezy-updates it is?
[01:24] <JRe> Tm_T: deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy-updates main restricted
[01:25] <Tm_T> "gksu kubuntu-default-settings" are upgrades I did find now
[01:32] <Tm_T> JRe: ok, what I need to do to get hal working?
[01:32] <JRe> Tm_T: kdebase_kio_plugin
[01:32] <Tm_T> hmm
[01:32] <JRe> Tm_T: you need to upgrade this package
[01:33] <Tm_T> lemme see
[01:33] <Tm_T> apt-get install kdebase_kio_plugin -> E: Couldn't find package kdebase_kio_plugin
[01:33] <Tm_T> :(
[01:33] <Riddell> CaiN_SA: which packages specifically?
[01:33] <JRe> Tm_T: wait a sec it's not the exact name
[01:34] <Tm_T> =)
[01:34] <Tm_T> JRe: I'll wait :)
[01:34] <JRe> kdebase-kio-plugins
[01:34] <JRe> Tm_T: fixed version is 4:3.4.3-0ubuntu5
[01:34] <Tm_T> don't get it yet
[01:35] <Tm_T> hmm
[01:35] <Tm_T> :(
[01:35] <JRe> Tm_T: sudo apt-get update ?
[01:35] <Tm_T> doing it allthetime
[01:35] <JRe> :)
[01:35] <Tm_T> I do always apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
[01:35] <Tm_T> no point to do upgrade without update
[01:35] <JRe> Tm_T: mmm strange
[01:36] <JRe> Tm_T: you have set the mirror I told you ?
[01:36] <Tm_T> yup
[01:36] <pef> fr.archive.ubuntu.com doesn't seems to be synced
[01:36] <pef> I get updates on archive.ubuntu.com I don't have on fr.archive.ubuntu.com
[01:37] <Riddell> only archive.ubuntu.com seems to be synced
[01:37] <JRe> pef: yes it's the case
[01:37] <seaLne> i don't have it yet and i just updated my mirror from archive.u.c
[01:37] <Riddell> well, being the master it can't really be synced
[01:37] <Tm_T> :)
[01:37] <Riddell> there's 4 machines behind a.u.c so they might not all be synced
[01:37] <Tm_T> ok
[01:39] <pef> Riddell: round robin dns ? I have 404 on one
[01:39] <seaLne> very weird i get different things from each host
[01:39] <CaiN_SA> Riddell, in pvt plz
[01:39] <JRe> Riddell: anyway, thanks for the update ;)
[01:41] <seaLne> they are very out of sync
[01:53] <Tm_T> Riddell: ok, how long I have to wait until I can share repository to beta2?
[01:54] <Tm_T> uhm, share url of repository ;)
[01:55] <Tm_T> ok, I really need more caffeine ->
[01:55] <Riddell> Tm_T: go ahead, distrowatch already has
[01:56] <Tm_T> uhm
[01:56] <Tm_T> and url is?
[01:56] <Tm_T> :p
[02:03] <apokryphos> wow, ubuntuforums have given us a whole section now for kubuntu
[02:03] <apokryphos> maybe they want to make it *the* kubuntu forum after seeing the competition :-O
[02:03] <Tm_T> :p
[02:12] <Tm_T> ah got it
[02:15] <Tm_T> brew more coffee to get head working ->
[02:46] <_Tonio_> hi everyone
[02:47] <Tm_T> hullo
[02:47] <Tm_T> what's up _Tonio_ 
[02:47] <_Tonio_> fine Tm_T  ?
[02:47] <Tm_T> I'm ok :)
[02:48] <_Tonio_> I'm a bit hill....
[02:48] <_Tonio_> I can see a kde update on breezy ;)
[02:48] <Tm_T> :)
[02:48] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: any information if that resolves the hal issue un mdia:/ ?
[02:48] <_Tonio_> in media:/
[02:49] <Tm_T> 14:08 < Riddell> JRe: because there are HAL and GPG updates in today
[02:49] <Tm_T> I still don't get those packages though
[02:49] <_Tonio_> ah ?
[02:50] <Tm_T> but, beta2 !
[02:50] <_Tonio_> fr.archives.ubuntu.... main has it
[02:50] <_Tonio_> did you already install kde 3.5 beta ?
[02:50] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: yesterday
[02:50] <_Tonio_> I think I will wait for RC tu update.....
[02:50] <Tm_T> :(
[02:51] <Tm_T> why?
[02:51] <Tm_T> where's your adventurous attitude?
[02:51] <_Tonio_> I have had many BIG problems in the past with kde beta....
[02:51] <Tm_T> :o
[02:51] <_Tonio_> where is it ?
[02:52] <Tm_T> :p
[02:52] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: not that far, but I actually have a lot of pressure at work, I cannot take the risk to have a non working environnement....
[02:52] <Tm_T> ah yes
[02:52] <_Tonio_> I had to fight to get the right to use linux instead of windows, so.....
[02:52] <_Tonio_> but I may try 3.5 on my desktop toonight ;)
[02:53] <_Tonio_> beta testing it can be usefull for riddell
[02:53] <_Tonio_> and the kde team of course ;)
[02:53] <_Tonio_> okay need to restart kde, seya in a few minutes
[03:06] <Tm_T> :)
[03:06] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: works great with the update ;)
[03:07] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: about kde 3.5, is the beta complete with all software, or just kde core ?
[03:07] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: I think there was nice bunch of packages
[03:07] <_Tonio_> okay ;)
[03:08] <_Tonio_> but really I cannot take the risk to update my laptop....
[03:08] <Tm_T> don't ask from me, I just advertise ;)
[03:08] <_Tonio_> hehe
[03:09] <_Tonio_> why not adding the repo in the channel's subject ?
[03:11] <Tm_T> I have no rights
[03:11] <_Tonio_> ah okay ;)
[03:11] <_Tonio_> and according to what tou've seen, is it nice, I mean are the changes interessting ?
[03:12] <_Tonio_> I didn't follow the news on that point, I am more interessted in e17 at the moment
[03:14] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: many improvenments
[03:14] <Tm_T> small fixes here and there
[03:15] <_Tonio_> k
[03:15] <_Tonio_> I hope (but no chance.....) that knetworkconf will be less buggy ;)
[03:16] <Tm_T> =)
[03:16] <Tm_T> what bugs?
[03:16] <_Tonio_> I don't know how it is developped, but it has many bugs affecting debian based distros, while debian is perfectly managed...
[03:16] <_Tonio_> hum
[03:17] <_Tonio_> if you try to use fixed IP address, the default route doesn't apply
[03:17] <_Tonio_> and the broadcast address is wrong
[03:18] <_Tonio_> it is a very old bug that afects many debian based distros, like kubuntu, xandros or mepis
[03:18] <_Tonio_> but well, maybe with guidance we will get a new network config tool ;)
[03:18] <_Tonio_> I saw a possible frontend to networkmanager was discussed also
[03:30] <Tm_T> :(
[03:34] <Tm_T> Riddell: some people have artsd crash in every boot
[03:36] <apokryphos> on this computer I've never compiled kde without artsd crashing, though the packages seem to get it right
[03:38] <Tm_T> well, now one says artsd crashes allthetime
[03:38] <Tm_T> autorepeat
[03:38] <Tm_T> must be nice effect ;)
[03:40] <Tm_T> apokryphos: should we advertise that beta2 repository in #kubuntu?
[03:40] <apokryphos> Tm_T: probably a good idea; it solves a few problems, and it's already announced on the forum I see 
[03:40] <Tm_T> ok
[03:40] <apokryphos> would be nice if there was a kubuntu.org announcement
[03:41] <Tm_T> apokryphos: I think riddell is doing it
[03:41] <Tm_T> sorry, sir Riddell
[03:41] <apokryphos> hehe
[03:41] <apokryphos> cool; we'll link to it as soon as it's up
[03:42] <hunger> Tm_T: I have artsd crash about once a day here.
[03:42] <apokryphos> I thought you meant advertise in /topic, but sure :P
[03:44] <Tm_T> hunger: that's "normal"
[03:44] <Tm_T> apokryphos: yes, I meant that too
[03:44] <Tm_T> apokryphos: but I don't feel I'm right person to touch topic ;)
[03:45] <apokryphos> why ever not? ;-) Anyone can edit; but no worries, I'll put the mention in
[03:46] <Tm_T> good
[03:46] <Tm_T> apokryphos: it's like "you haven't do it good enough, lemme show..."
[03:47] <Tm_T> about respect
[03:47] <Tm_T> that's how I feel it
[03:47] <apokryphos> no need to :P
[03:47] <Tm_T> I know
[03:48] <Tm_T> well, if I do topic, it will be way shorter than it's now
[03:48] <Tm_T> and I think we need separate page for channel rules
[03:49] <Tm_T> where faq and pastebin is mentioned
[03:49] <Tm_T> etc
[03:50] <apokryphos> so a link with a page to a link of all of those? 
[03:50] <Tm_T> more like short rules how to behave etc
[03:50] <apokryphos> dunno; seems like we're creating extra steps for them when there's space in the /topic
[03:50] <apokryphos> we could link to the CoC I guess
[03:51] <apokryphos> though no-one would ever read it, really :P
[03:51] <Tm_T> what's that?
[03:51] <Tm_T> most of the people doesn't read topic at all
[03:51] <Tm_T> thos who do, they will check rules too if it's mentioned there
[03:51] <Tm_T> that's how we do it in many channels
[03:51] <apokryphos> CoC = Code of Conduct
[03:52] <Tm_T> hmm?
[03:52] <apokryphos> some ops like to refer to it. i.e. "The Ubuntu Code of Conduct applies here <link>"
[03:53] <Tm_T> ah
[03:53] <Tm_T> conduct = ?
[03:53] <seaLne> and people need to stick new stuff at the front of the topic not the end :)
[03:53] <Tm_T> true
[03:54] <apokryphos> with new announcements that's what I normally do; more likely to read 'em
[04:00] <Tm_T> aah!
[04:00] <Tm_T> unix_connect: can't connect to server (unix:/tmp/ksocket-aleksi/localhost.localdomain-1cc7-4354fdfc)
[04:00] <Tm_T> Segmentation fault
[04:01] <Tm_T> that what artsd says in my friends pc
[04:01] <Tm_T> and crashes allthetime
[04:01] <Tm_T> repeatedly
[04:30] <Riddell> pitti: there's a mistake in kde-i18n-af which means the .mo files etc don't get included
[04:30] <pitti> Hi
[04:30] <pitti> only in that package? or also other languages?
[04:30] <Riddell> pitti: if I upload a fit to breezy-updates will the language scripts pull out those .mo files never to been seen?
[04:30] <Riddell> only that package
[04:30] <Riddell> s/fit/fix/
[04:31] <pitti> Riddell: lemme look where the files got lost
[04:31] <pitti> ah, wait
[04:31] <pitti> kde-i18n-af???
[04:31] <pitti> it isn't supposed to have mo files
[04:32] <Riddell> why not?
[04:32] <Riddell> I think it's a new package that was added in kde 3.4.2
[04:32] <Riddell> http://kubuntu.org/~jr/tmp/kde-i18n-af.debdiff  is the fix
[04:34] <pitti> Riddell: but we strip kde-i18n-* and put the translations into language-pack-kde-af
[04:34] <Riddell> well firstly there is no language-pack-kde-af
[04:35] <Riddell> because -af is a new addition as I recall
[04:35] <verwilst> Riddell: did you use my kdenetwork? :d
[04:35] <Riddell> and secondly my packaging is broken which means the .mo files don't get into the .deb to be stripped anyway
[04:35] <Riddell> verwilst: yes I did thanks
[04:35] <verwilst> Riddell: it was good?
[04:35] <Riddell> and whoever's kdeedu it was
[04:36] <Riddell> verwilst: had to be updated for beta 2 of course but it helped yes
[04:36] <verwilst> yeah ofcourse
[04:36] <verwilst> cool, brb!
[04:36] <Tm_T> Riddell: what's that artsd crashes all the time?
[04:36] <Tm_T> many fellows got such problem
[04:37] <Tm_T> allthetime == repeatedly every 5s or so
[04:37] <Riddell> Tm_T: no idea, kill knotify
[04:37] <Riddell> or tell knotify not to use arts
[04:37] <pitti> Riddell: ah, I see
[04:37] <Tm_T> Riddell: ok
[04:38] <pitti> Riddell: would the only difference for the -updates upload be the mo files?
[04:38] <Riddell> pitti: so I'm wondering what will happen if I upload a fixed kde-i18n-af
[04:38] <Riddell> pitti: yes
[04:38] <verwilst> man arts must die :d
[04:38] <verwilst> can't wait for kde4 ;)
[04:38] <pitti> Riddell: but I'm not actually interested in *.mo
[04:38] <pitti> Riddell: I need .po files
[04:38] <pitti> Riddell: but you can send them to me even without an upload
[04:39] <pitti> Riddell: I can just stuff them into langpack-o-matic and build a new l-p-kde-af for breezy-updates
[04:42] <Riddell> pitti: but the .mo files get stripped at some point don't they?
[04:43] <pitti> Riddell: they do
[04:43] <Riddell> ok, I'm not going mad then
[04:43] <pitti> Riddell: we just don't use them for building langpacks, we want the source
[04:46] <Riddell> pitti: sources now up at http://kubuntu.org/~jr/tmp/
[04:48] <Riddell> the -ubuntu2 package includes the /usr/share/locale/af/entry.desktop files as well
[04:56] <pitti> Riddell: btw, it's breezy-updates, your debdiff says "breezy"
[04:57] <Riddell> pitti: well spotted :)
[04:58] <Riddell> but I don't think I need to upload it if you're uploading a language-pack-kde-af
[04:58] <spstarr_work> hrm bug in webpage
[04:58] <spstarr_work> http://www.kubuntu.org/announcements/kde-35beta2.php
[04:58] <spstarr_work> you didn'
[04:58] <spstarr_work> you didn't 'announce' it publically yet
[04:58] <spstarr_work> :-)
[04:58] <pitti> Riddell: ah, right, the .desktop file should be in l-pack-kde-af-base, too
[04:58] <spstarr_work> i just found it by changing http://www.kubuntu.org/announcements/kde-35beta1.php to 2 :)
[04:59] <Riddell> spstarr_work: I havn't announced it on kde.org or dot.kde.org either
[04:59] <Riddell> spstarr_work: link fixed, thanks
[05:00] <Riddell> pitti: yeah
[05:01] <pitti> Riddell: hmm, I wonder why there is no language-pack-kde-af...
[05:01] <Riddell> pitti: I think there just wasn't a kde-i18n-af at the time
[05:02] <Riddell> although there's no kde-i18n for zulu and that has an (empty) language-pack-kde
[05:03] <freeflying> Riddell: will next release use qt-4
[05:03] <pitti> Riddell: -zu just contains gwenviewlmo
[05:03] <pitti> Riddell: s/l/./
[05:03] <Riddell> freeflying: no, KDE 4 won't be ready in time for dapper
[05:03] <pitti> Riddell: so it's not completely empty :-)
[05:04] <Riddell> so it does :)
[05:06] <pitti> Riddell: yes, I know the reason - I had to throw out much of the latest buildd data due some technical problems while working "under the gun"
[05:06] <pitti> Riddell: is it very urgent? or can we update it together with the next regular langpack update in some weeks?
[05:08] <verwilst> ouch, kate/kwrite keeps on crashing every time i open a document :p
[05:09] <Riddell> pitti: I think cain_sa from implinux will want it sooner than that
[05:14] <pitti> Riddell: ah:
[05:14] <pitti> [05:14] <pitti> E: cannot determine locale from KDE i18n source package name kde-i18n-af
[05:15] <pitti> Riddell: it wasn't imported
[05:17] <spstarr_work> thankx
[05:17] <spstarr_work> thanks
[05:32] <cmvo> Riddell: Hi! Sorry to bother you with this, but I'm curious if the use of sudo for the GUIAPPS is just a config change or a patched kdesu?
[05:32] <Riddell> cmvo: it's a patch
[05:32] <Riddell> in kdelibs and kdebase
[05:34] <cmvo> Riddell: Thanks. I see the reasons for the use of sudo, but I just haven't gotten used to it...
[05:36] <hunger> kdeedu-doc-html fails to install here in the kde 3.5 beta2 deb.
[05:36] <cmvo> Riddell: Hoped I could undo the use of sudo with a config change :-)
[05:37] <hunger>  /usr/share/doc/kde/HTML/en/kmessedwords/.dhelp does not exist.
[05:39] <Riddell> cmvo: you can
[05:40] <Riddell> hunger: thanks, I'll look at that
[05:43] <cmvo> Riddell: Oh! Is it documented somewhere?
[05:44] <Riddell> only in the patch
[05:44] <Riddell> [super-user-command] 
[05:44] <Riddell> super-user-command=su
[05:44] <Riddell> should do it
[05:44] <Riddell> in kdeglobals
[05:46] <cmvo> Riddell: Thanks I give it a try...
[06:26] <pef> Lathiat: got kcheckgmail working :)
[06:27] <Riddell> hi pitti 
[06:27] <pitti> Riddell: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/
[06:27] <pitti> Riddell: I built kde-af[-base] 
[06:28] <pitti> Riddell: I also added the extra files
[06:28] <pitti> Riddell: I'll ask elmo about uploading/seeding NEW packages
[06:29] <pitti> Riddell: I'm not sure whether uploading to -updates will cause any trouble or so
[06:29] <Riddell> "Goed"  seems to woek
[06:29] <Riddell> thanks pitti 
[06:29] <pitti> cheers
[06:30] <Tm_T> :)
[06:40] <Tm_T> ok, this is annoying
[06:41] <Tm_T> in kcontrol ->> system notifications: player settings
[06:41] <sebas> Is the "kmail build with gpgme deps and fix encryption stuff" anywhere near being released and mirrored?
[06:41] <Tm_T> when I try to use external player, it won't use player if it uses some switches
[06:41] <Tm_T> or, even alias won't work
[06:42] <Tm_T> hmm, please don't say I have to reboot
[06:46] <Riddell> sebas: it's released and on some mirrors
[06:46] <Riddell> it's in breezy-updates
[06:46] <sebas> Ah, funky.
[06:46] <sebas> Thx-a-bunch.
[06:48] <sebas> The US one has updates for PIM, which is what I was looking for I suppose.
[06:48] <JRe> Riddell: Ariya sent me speedcrunch 0.6beta2 I have packaged it
[06:50] <Riddell> JRe: rocking
[06:50] <Riddell> sebas: you use the US mirror?
[06:53] <sebas> Riddell: Yeah, I don't even know why.
[06:54] <sebas> I've changed it on one machine already today, so don't burn me! ;)
[06:54] <sebas> Ah, what a relief, the gpg buttons are back!
[07:09] <Riddell> and /now/ 3.5 beta 2 is out
[07:10] <Sime> hi sebas, Riddel
[07:10] <sebas> Hi Sime!
[07:20] <Sime> sebas: any word from Jan about the GUI review?
[07:20] <sebas> Sime: None since last week.
[07:21] <Sime> sebas: i was thinking that we could i18n() all of the strings in user/mount/serviceconfig if the UI is 'stable'.
[07:22] <sebas> Sime: Hm, guess it's not, Jan mentioned a couple of things where the wording could better be changed.
[07:23] <sebas> Not too much, though.
[07:23] <spstarr_work> =)
[07:23] <Sime> we could still add i18n() and then allow translation after Jan's stuff
[07:24] <sebas> Jup, that's certainly possible.
[07:24] <sebas> I'll not have too much time the next month, btw.
[07:25] <sebas> I'll move houses begin of november. :)
[07:25] <sebas> erm, move myself to another house, you get the point :)
[07:26] <Sime> which day?
[08:08] <Tm_T> Riddell: btw, artsd crashes are highly complained
[08:09] <Tm_T> working \o/
[08:09] <dholbach> hi
[08:10] <dholbach> anyone who volunteers to help young probable kubuntu bug triagists on thursday in #ubuntu-bugs?
[08:12] <allee> Riddel, jre: about speedcrunch, I found today that with breezy all multimedia keys now have a keycode (no keysym)
[08:12] <dholbach> i'll shortly announce http://ubuntu.gplan.info/mail.html
[08:12] <dholbach> that's why i ask
[08:13] <Tm_T> hm?
[08:13] <allee> what's the recommended way to define them and more important to share them with be kubunties? (I used lineak up to now)
[08:15] <pef> http://dev.erodia.net/ubuntu/kcheckgmail-0.5.4/kubuntu_01_authentication_problem_fix.diff does this url works for you ?
[08:15] <dholbach> yes
[08:16] <pef> thanks ! (conplex bind views setup :] 
[08:16] <dholbach> so what do you guys think about a kubuntu bug team?
[08:16] <dholbach> do you need one?
[08:37] <dholbach> i will announce it now and HOPE somebody of you will be there
[08:42] <chimaera> hi. 
[08:43] <chimaera> how can i make kcontrol using kdesu instead of sudo to gain admin-rights?
[08:43] <allee> chimaera: kdesu uses sudo (not su in kubuntu)
[08:44] <chimaera> allee: i see. and how to change that behaviour? 
[08:44] <pef> bye !
[08:44] <allee> bye pef
[08:45] <allee> no idea. Why??  AFAIR Riddell worked on the kdesu su -> sudo patch
[08:46] <chimaera> allee: because it causes gaining admin-rights in to kcontrol to break. 
[08:46] <chimaera> s/in to/in/
[08:47] <chimaera> at least i assume that much. never had those issues w/ debian..
[08:48] <_Tonio_> hi
[08:48] <allee> Here it works ;)  kdesu failing to work is I guess one of the most reported bugs
[08:48] <_Tonio_> what's up with the kde update ? has it been removed from the servers ?
[08:48] <_Tonio_> allee: hi ;)
[08:49] <allee> hi _Tonio_ 
[08:49] <_Tonio_> allee: any information with today's kde update ?
[08:49] <_Tonio_> it seems to have been removed from the servers....
[08:49] <allee> what update? beta2?
[08:49] <_Tonio_> no, last kde update, to correct hal issue and many more
[08:50] <_Tonio_> I updated my laptop today at work, and impossible to update my desktop now.... no updates found
[08:50] <allee> Riddell: said it's upload and on it's way to the mirrors.  Have not check it.
[08:50] <allee> s/://
[08:51] <_Tonio_> well it was this afternoon yes, but now..... impossible to find it...
[08:51] <_Tonio_> maybe it is just due to replication between the servers, I'll wait.
[08:51] <chimaera> _Tonio_: using the same mirror?
[08:51] <_Tonio_> allee: did you try xen finally ? :)
[08:51] <_Tonio_> chimaera: yep
[08:51] <_Tonio_> I tried both fr.aarchive and archive, but no updates found.....
[08:52] <_Tonio_> chimaera: or maybe I have a local cache problem.... I'll check
[08:52] <chimaera> well, it's not on the de or main mirrors..
[08:52] <_Tonio_> yep..... it was a few hours ago.....
[08:53] <allee> _Tonio_: not yet.  I even had no time to install sid in vmware. Work is a bit crazy lately :(
[08:53] <_Tonio_> allee: okay...
[08:54] <_Tonio_> allee: I just wanted to make one point clear according to one of the last phrases you said before leaving : with xen you don't emulate the hardware, except the network card
[08:54] <_Tonio_> each vm is ussing the real hardware
[08:55] <allee> _Tonio_: yeah, that's my understanding.  AFAIU networking works with some sort 'bridging' to map real to virtual interfaces
[08:56] <_Tonio_> yep
[08:57] <allee> _Tonio_: What I could not figured in the web in the last time slice was the sort of kernel you can run 'in' xen...
[08:57] <allee> _Tonio_: my current understanding is that each vm has to run a xen aware kernel, not a 'native' one from the distribution
[08:58] <chimaera> to change from sudo to su: http://www.mail-archive.com/kubuntu-bugs%40lists.ubuntu.com/msg00543.html
[09:04] <_Tonio_> allee: concerning the kernel, you have perfectly understood ;)
[09:05] <Tm_T> still can't see hal fix
[09:05] <Tm_T> :(
[09:05] <_Tonio_> this is the reason you can use the same hardware with different machine without any conflict, because the kernels are patched to work together
[09:05] <allee> _Tonio_: 'k thx
[09:06] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: the update has been removed from the servers aparently....
[09:06] <_Tonio_> I have uploaded to machines this afternoon, but impossible to update anymore....
[09:08] <dholbach> ok... i hope some of you can make it on thursday... there's a little section on HelpingWithBugs for team-specific stuff
[09:09] <dholbach> announce is out
[09:10] <allee> dholbach: I'll find some time thursday night
[09:10] <dholbach> excellent
[09:11] <allee> dholbach: btw. best to ping the 'famous' guys here explicitely ;)
[09:12] <dholbach> i wanted to invite everybody :)
[09:12] <allee> and I thank you and accept gladly ;)
[09:13] <_Tonio_> hi dholbach ;)
[09:13] <dholbach> i think we all need a healthy bug squad
[09:13] <_Tonio_> dholbach: you here ? the gnome fan ?
[09:13] <_Tonio_> ^^
[09:13] <dholbach> it's where we will get new ubuntu members from
[09:13] <jjesse> what do i need to install and run kde3.5 beta 2 for breezy?
[09:13] <dholbach> _Tonio_: i announced the bug day on thursday and wanted to hear what the kubuntu team thinks of it
[09:14] <_Tonio_> ah okay ;)
[09:14] <dholbach> _Tonio_: and how they will participate
[09:15] <_Tonio_> dholbach: okay ;)
[09:15] <dholbach> okay
[09:21] <chimaera> any plans to crank out beta2 for ppc?
[09:26] <allee> _Tonio_: something else: do you happen to know kubuntus recommended method to define multimedia keys? And if/where there a place to share them?
[09:27] <allee> kmenuedit needs keysym so does not work with most multimedia keys
[09:27] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: hmm, any idea why?
[09:28] <_Tonio_> allee: I generally use xev to see if there is a signal on the key, first
[09:29] <allee> _Tonio_: done already ;)  All have keycodes, no keysym
[09:29] <allee> lineakd allows to work with keycodes.  But I don't know if this is the route kubuntu plans to go
[09:29] <_Tonio_> okay, did you use setkeycode to give an ascii code to those keys ?
[09:29] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: no idea why....
[09:30] <allee> _Tonio_: no.  hoary -> breezy update did it for me ;)
[09:30] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: all I know is that the packages where in "main" which surprised me a lot....
[09:30] <Tm_T> s/where/were
[09:30] <Tm_T> ;)
[09:31] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: forget, they where in breezy-updates main, which is normal :)
[09:31] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: thanks for the correction ;)
[09:31] <Tm_T> just looks funny with "where"
[09:31] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: well, no idea why it has been removed.... need to wait for Riddell's informations :)
[09:31] <Tm_T> yup
[09:32] <_Tonio_> allee: after that I don't know how to define a kde keyboard profile....
[09:32] <allee> Problem is not to get the keys working. question is how to do it the way (k)ubuntu want to go so other others can (re)use them without installing 'excotic' software from universe ;)
[09:32] <_Tonio_> yep, you want to create a keyboard profile, and not configure each key manually, is that correct ?
[09:33] <allee> _Tonio_: AFAIU the kde keyboard stuff parses xorg xkb files.
[09:33] <allee> _Tonio_: I want to do it once and then share it so others don't have to do it again
[09:33] <_Tonio_> allee: okay, didn't knew that ;)
[09:34] <_Tonio_> allee: so you want to learn how to create a xkb file ? not sure to understand what you exactly want ;)
[09:34] <allee> I once wrote xkb files for a logitech keyboard with MM keys.
[09:35] <allee> _Tonio_: I want to know how (k)ubuntu plans to integrate MM key handling.  If it's lineak I write a lineak file ...
[09:35] <allee> if it's xkb. I'll write one. If it is .... (but what is it really)
[09:35] <_Tonio_> allee: okay ;)
[09:36] <_Tonio_> allee: don't they refer only to xorg on that point ? I meen, is there a plan or do they only use xkb provided with xorg ? ;)
[09:37] <allee> _Tonio_: that's excatly what I wanted to know.  What the plan is;)
[09:38] <_Tonio_> allee: or "is there a plan ?" ;)
[09:38] <allee> _Tonio_: that's also interesting 
[09:38] <_Tonio_> anyway, you can create an xkb file and submit it to the xorg crew in any case ;)
[09:39] <_Tonio_> that would be interesting for all distros and not only ubuntu
[09:40] <allee> _Tonio_: but will xorg integrate 'thousands' of little different symbols extentions files?  With dozends coming every day?
[09:41] <_Tonio_> allee: why not ? ;) I would personnaly appreciate to have a configuration file for each keyboard on the market ;)
[09:41] <allee> lol
[09:41] <_Tonio_> allee: the only problem for the xorg team would be to test the files.....
[09:41] <_Tonio_> unless they by a biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig box full of keyboard ;)
[09:42] <_Tonio_> keyboard+s
[09:44] <allee> Well, a tool like the KDE keybindings that allows to use keycodes (not only keysyms), assign a XF86<whatever> to it and then supply a list of prefinied actions for it.
[09:44] <allee> Save and optionally submit upstream would be great ;)
[09:48] <allee> _Tonio_: I will first add it here for now: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LaptopKeycodes
[09:49] <allee> well it's an usb keyboard, but connected to a laptop ;)
[09:52] <_Tonio_> okay ;)
[09:57] <pef> Riddell, ping
[10:08] <chimaera> _Tonio_: the kde-updates reached my mirror. hal's still missing, though.
[10:08] <_Tonio_> chimaera: strange ;)
[10:08] <_Tonio_> chimaera: what is your mirror ?
[10:08] <_Tonio_> de ?
[10:09] <chimaera> _Tonio_: jepp.
[10:09] <Tm_T> :(
[10:09] <_Tonio_> jepp ??
[10:09] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: yes
[10:10] <chimaera> err, yes. slang. that is, is there a .jepp TLD?
[10:10] <Tm_T> ?
[10:10] <chimaera> just talking nonsense. sorry. 
[10:11] <_Tonio_> ahhhhhhhhh updates are back on the main servers
[10:11] <_Tonio_> that's a bit strange....
[10:11] <chimaera> _Tonio_: including hal?
[10:11] <_Tonio_> I'll wait for the updates to come back on fr to update... no need to overload the source servers....
[10:11] <_Tonio_> chimaera: let me check
[10:12] <_Tonio_> chimaera: what is the package concerned by hal ?
[10:12] <chimaera> well, good question, isn't it (lib)hal itself?
[10:12] <_Tonio_> chimaera: don't think so
[10:13] <_Tonio_> hal works, but the kio media:/ soedn't use it....
[10:13] <_Tonio_> the solution is in kde updates
[10:13] <_Tonio_> chimaera: I'm gonna update, reload kde, plug a usb key and let you know ;)
[10:13] <chimaera> well, then it'll be fine i guess. restarting kde to check.. brb
[10:14] <_Tonio_> chimaera: argh !!!!!!!!! 404 on downloading
[10:14] <_Tonio_> I now can see updates but not upgrade.... what the hell is happeing with server sync ? !!
[10:15] <_Tonio_> okay, it works with fr....
[10:17] <froud> Riddell: ping
[10:18] <chimaera> re
[10:18] <chimaera> _Tonio_: working ;)
[10:18] <_Tonio_> yep ;)
[10:19] <chimaera> just checking gpg..
[10:20] <chimaera> also working. great.
[10:23] <chimaera> now only hotplugging for my wifi-stick is missing..
[10:23] <Tm_T> hal is broken, you mean?
[10:24] <chimaera> regarding th wifi-stick? nono, i think that's another problem. i have to check how to connect hotplug, interfaces and the like..
[10:26] <chimaera> also there's the "mount storage devices on boot" problem. udev is started _after_ the fstab entries are executed. therefore this won't work. i wrote a small script which i added to bootmisc.sh on my othe rbox, maybe i'll stick with that.
[10:43] <pef> Riddell, can you have a look please ? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=800
[10:47] <allee> pef: on debian-mentors I've learned s/3.6.2.1/3.6.2/
[10:48] <pef> allee, oh ?
[10:48] <pef> I usually take latest version of package debian-policy
[10:48] <allee> as I know .1 is only for a fix no change
[10:48] <pef> and I see numerous packages using 3.6.2.1
[10:53] <allee> I checked http://www.de.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Standards-Version
[10:53] <allee> 3 and 4 digits are okay.
[10:53] <allee> So what I 'learnt' on debian-mentor was more a suggestion
[10:54] <allee> pef: as policy states the 4 digit has no influence to pkgs (and can therefore ignored)
[10:56] <allee> pef: why is there a debian/Makefile (and you patch it?)
[11:02] <allee> pef: I'm sure debian/dirs can be removed
[11:03] <allee> pef: debian/README.Debian is not really needed
[11:04] <allee> pef: so diff looks okay, I only can resist nitpicking ;)
[11:04] <allee> s/can/can't/
[11:10] <Tm_T> hmm, we need dummy package
[11:10] <Tm_T> to libqt3c102-mt
[11:11] <Tm_T> too many apps have dependencies to it
[11:11] <Tm_T> two good examples: skype and openwengo
[11:11] <allee> Tm_T: noooo.  this dependency is due to g++ 3.4 and g++ 4.0 both don't coexists
[11:12] <Tm_T> hmm
[11:12] <allee> Tm_T: same code diffent API :(
[11:12] <Tm_T> ok, so I can't get openwengo then
[11:13] <Tm_T> :(
[11:13] <Tm_T> I don't care about skype myself
[11:13] <Tm_T> actually I can't even compile openwengo myself, complains about qt3 :p
[11:14] <allee> Tm_T: well then the check is broken (and or out of date)
[11:15] <Tm_T> prolly out of date
[11:16] <allee> Tm_T: :)
[11:16] <Tm_T> even if its svn stuff
[11:16] <allee> Tm_T: does configure fail?  then check config.log for the reason
[11:17] <Tm_T> well, it use scons
[11:17] <allee> oh, oh.  New fun ;)
[11:17] <Tm_T> yes
[11:17] <Tm_T> it's ok as long as it works
[11:17] <allee> What's the excat error message?
[11:18] <Tm_T> scons: warning: Could not detect qt, using moc executable as a hint (QTDIR=/usr)
[11:18] <Tm_T> and that's just beginning...
[11:18] <Tm_T> prolly need to change some files
[11:18] <Tm_T> File "wengoscons/wengoscons/qtsupport/qtenv.py", line 35, in WengoSConsQt3Environment
[11:19] <Tm_T> etc
[11:23] <allee> Tm_T: sorry can't help never tried to build a pkg using scons. I've check sid and wnpp both no sign of openwengo yet
[11:24] <allee> maybe kde svn trunk has a better verion of qtenv.py
[11:24] <Tm_T> yu
[11:24] <_Tonio_> allee: I can't wait for openwengo to come to 1.0 with video support ;)
[11:24] <Tm_T> haha
[11:24] <_Tonio_> this will be the skype killer ;)
[11:25] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: it already is, if you can use it
[11:25] <allee> really?
[11:25] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: well.... no paying services at the moment
[11:25] <_Tonio_> only PC2PC
[11:25] <Tm_T> allee: http://www.openwengo.com/index.php?yawl[S] =wengo.public.whatIsIt&yawl[K] =wengo.public.aboutFeatures
[11:25] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: so?
[11:25] <_Tonio_> services will be opened by the end of the year
[11:25] <Tm_T> :)
[11:26] <_Tonio_> well concurencing skype means giving all the possibilities skype does ;)
[11:26] <Tm_T> ah yes
[11:26] <Tm_T> to me, video is all I need
[11:26] <_Tonio_> for my usage openwengo is already better than skype (alsa support...)
[11:26] <_Tonio_> but not globally
[11:27] <_Tonio_> I have a friend of mine working for 9telecom, the french company that is developping openwengo
[11:27] <Tm_T> oh
[11:27] <_Tonio_> an,d according to what I know, it'll be ready for a real skype concurence at the very beggenining of 2006
[11:27] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: you should force him to get their scons work reasonably
[11:28] <_Tonio_> lol I didn't say I knew the developper ;)
[11:28] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: can't remember what app it was, but it did things far better with scons
[11:28] <_Tonio_> 9telecom is a big, big company, and openwengo is a very, very little project for them ;) I just have fresh informations ;)
[11:28] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: yes, guy inside company can send message more powerful than me
[11:28] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: you can post on their forums if tou want...
[11:29] <_Tonio_> the developpers are ALWAYS responding
[11:29] <Tm_T> hmm
[11:29] <Tm_T> maybe I should
[11:29] <_Tonio_> for example, it was originally designed to use OSS
[11:29] <Tm_T> I did the other scons install just saying one command, and it asked at the end do I like to install it :p
[11:30] <_Tonio_> some people complained about alsa support and it has been implemented in a few days only....
[11:30] <Tm_T> hmm
[11:30] <_Tonio_> they are very "receptive" (dont know if this is correct english) to users reports
[11:30] <Tm_T> playing around with scons ->
[11:31] <allee> Tm_T: they have a deb so they somewhere have a orig.tar.gz, diff.gz.  Pester them to make it available and at least 99% of the problem are solved
[11:31] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: as I'm not a developper, can you explain me what is scons ?
[11:32] <_Tonio_> in a few words
[11:33] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: building system using python, when used right, far better than autotools
[11:33] <_Tonio_> okay
[11:33] <_Tonio_> allee: I think the sources are only available on SVN
[11:33] <Tm_T> yup
[11:33] <_Tonio_> and a source snapshot has been posted to the forums
[11:33] <Tm_T> hmm
[11:33] <allee> Tm_T: and no debian dirs in there?
[11:33] <_Tonio_> let me check.....
[11:33] <_Tonio_> allee: dunno
[11:33] <Tm_T> allee: haven't checked yet
[11:34] <allee> when they build debs for sarge/kubuntu (hoary I assume) building for breezy should be no problem (assumed openwengo likes g++ 4 and vice versa)
[11:34] <_Tonio_> allee: according to what I remember, the kubuntu package doesn't work on breezy
[11:34] <allee> _Tonio_: svn co <what-here-tonio>
[11:35] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: it doesn't
[11:35] <_Tonio_> deps problem with qt3-mt ;)
[11:35] <allee> _Tonio_: yes. Same for all hoary pkgs.  they don't work in breezy
[11:35] <_Tonio_> exactly...
[11:35] <allee> that the fun when g++ changes binary API
[11:35] <_Tonio_> but i'm sure if you ask for a breezy compatible package on the forum, they might post it....
[11:36] <Tm_T> hmm, why am I whining here, it's their job to do package to breezy!
[11:36] <Tm_T> ] ;=
[11:36] <allee> Tm_T: it's their job to make the source available (including the debian dir!)
[11:36] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: just compile within svn and use checkinstall ^^
[11:37] <Tm_T> _Tonio_: hey, I'm trying to compile, but this f*ing scons has some issues with me
[11:37] <Tm_T> 00:33 < Tm_T> _Tonio_: building system using python, when used right, far better than autotools
[11:37] <Tm_T> when used _right_
[11:38] <Tm_T> they really have done something wrong
[11:38] <_Tonio_> http://openwengo.com/support/forum/viewtopic.php?t=146&highlight=sources
[11:38] <_Tonio_> you have a source snapshot available here
[11:39] <_Tonio_> but you may not have the debian dir in it.........
[11:40] <Tm_T> and, may have same issue with scons
[11:41] <_Tonio_> certainly yes....
[11:44] <Tm_T> oh great
[11:44] <Tm_T> :(
[11:44] <Tm_T> why oh why
[11:45] <Tm_T> there must be some way to prevent konqueror opening (or trying to open) compressed files in web browsing profile
[11:46] <_Tonio_> Tm_T: if you find, let me know ;) I'm searching that info for a while ;)
[11:47] <Tm_T> just got nice crash in my Konqi
[11:47] <Tm_T> :(
[11:50] <allee> Tm_T, _Tonio_: how about using Shift-click.  Always saves to file instead of loading a link
[11:50] <Tm_T> allee: I can't remember it every time
[11:52] <allee> Tm_T: he, I do it automaticly. And sometimes I'm surprised because I downloaded only a list of mirrors ;)
[11:53] <allee> unfortunately tar does not know how to handle them and complains
[11:54] <_Tonio_> allee: nice ;)
[11:55] <_Tonio_> but is there a way to make konqueror doing like this by default when using the webbrowsing profile ?
[11:56] <allee> _Tonio_: I doubt that you can only disable it for a konqueror profile.  Disabling can be done is file associations but affects all apps then
[11:56] <_Tonio_> allee: that's the problem ;)
[11:57] <_Tonio_> I would like konqueror to have to different way to work, filemanager, and webbrowser...
[11:57] <_Tonio_> for example having 2 homepages would be nice ;)
[11:57] <allee> _Tonio_: holeheartly agreed
[11:58] <_Tonio_> s/to have to/to have two ^^
[11:58] <_Tonio_> in fact it would maybe be better splitting konqueror in two applications ;)