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| Amaranth | It doesn't take advantage of the fact that you can do things differently (sometimes better) with a GUI. | 12:05 |
|---|---|---|
| infinity | Riddell : Around? | 12:05 |
| infinity | seb128 : Are you working or vacationing right now? | 12:05 |
| Riddell | infinity: hi | 12:07 |
| infinity | Riddell : Hey, care to peruse some build failure with your name on 'em? (The one that jumped out at me was koffice, but I'm sure there are others) | 12:08 |
| infinity | The dust is starting to settle from the sync messes, so most of the failure now are Real Problems. | 12:09 |
| seb128 | infinity, something on the middle of that I guess | 12:09 |
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| infinity | seb128 : Righto. Well, gnome* seems to be all sorts of angry right now, if you're in the mood to track down why it seems your library chain is uninstallible and either make uploads to fix it, or give me some build order instructions to unsnag it, that would be spiffy. | 12:10 |
| Riddell | infinity: you'll be pleased to know I uploaded a new koffice just some moments ago | 12:10 |
| infinity | seb128 : If you don't have the time, don't worry too much about it. :) | 12:10 |
| infinity | Riddell : That's service with a smile. Thanks. | 12:10 |
| the--dud | hmm, could someone quickly tell me where gnome-terminal is in breezy? in the application menu that is | 12:11 |
| the--dud | I'm doing a CLI howto, but I'm using fluxbox myself | 12:11 |
| infinity | Accessories -> Terminal | 12:11 |
| seb128 | infinity, any example of stuff beeing broken? | 12:11 |
| the--dud | excellent, thanks infinity | 12:11 |
| seb128 | infinity, it works fine for me (my laptop runs dapper) | 12:12 |
| Riddell | infinity: I'll be going over others, let me know if anything else jumps out at you | 12:12 |
| infinity | seb128 : Check failed logs for gnome-print, libglade, gdk-pixbuf, gnome-utils, rhythmbox, etc, etc. | 12:13 |
| seb128 | rhythmbox was due to a soname changes waiting for promotion | 12:13 |
| seb128 | let me look on others | 12:13 |
| infinity | seb128 : I assume I just need to get a good build order going, but since the build-deps don't seem to be doing that for us, some direction would be nice so I don't have to hunt down every one myself. | 12:13 |
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| tseng | spayne: ping | 12:14 |
| infinity | Riddell : kdenetwork, digikamimageplugins | 12:14 |
| Riddell | infinity: lamont just fixed kdenetwork, I'll look at digikamimageplugins | 12:15 |
| seb128 | infinity, I would blame libpng12-dev | 12:15 |
| tseng | sigh | 12:15 |
| infinity | Riddell : Nope, lamont's upload fails too. | 12:16 |
| infinity | Riddell : Just later. :) | 12:16 |
| seb128 | infinity, I've the issue with my debian experimental pbuilder, apt doesn't sort it I've to apt-get install libpng12-dev by hand | 12:16 |
| infinity | seb128 : ? | 12:17 |
| infinity | seb128 : What's the issue? | 12:17 |
| lamont | infinity: sigh | 12:17 |
| infinity | seb128 : If it's the issue I saw on debian lists lately about "Build-depends: libpngXX-dev | libpng-dev", that doesn't effect ubuntu's sbuild. | 12:18 |
| infinity | seb128 : Ours is patched to pick the first available, instead of the first period. | 12:18 |
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| seb128 | infinity, k, so I've no clue on the issue | 12:24 |
| HiddenWolf | seb128, rhythmbox hasn't hit the archive yet. | 12:24 |
| infinity | seb128 : Alright, I'll dig deeper later, then. | 12:26 |
| seb128 | HiddenWolf, I know thanks | 12:27 |
| infinity | seb128 : I can usually unsnag this stuff, I'm just trying to pawn off my work on you right now, cause I have to pack for UBZ at some point. :) | 12:27 |
| HiddenWolf | seb128, ok, sorry. | 12:27 |
| seb128 | infinity, usually I can too, but I'm on my laptop from the hotel here and I've no chroot/pbuilder to track it | 12:27 |
| infinity | I'll probably end up unsnagging GNOME between BOFs or something. :) | 12:27 |
| infinity | seb128 : No chroots on your laptop?... Tsk. | 12:28 |
| infinity | Oh well, you can use mine when I come. :) | 12:28 |
| infinity | Between my "laptop set up as a full buildd", and elmo's archive mirror he's bringing (I hope), it should be alright. | 12:28 |
| mvo | jbailey: where is the bzr-tools package nowdays? | 12:29 |
| pitti | mvo: bzrtools!!! | 12:29 |
| tseng | hi pitti :) | 12:30 |
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| JaneW | seb128:ping | 12:30 |
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| seb128 | JaneW, pong | 12:30 |
| JaneW | seb128: help - please. I just upgraded to Breezy. I loaded up evolution and nearly all my e-mail is there and looks normal, but my inbox is gone.... any idea what happened? | 12:31 |
| seb128 | JaneW, is that imap? | 12:32 |
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| JaneW | seb128: yes | 12:32 |
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| seb128 | JaneW, that's a known subscribtion issue with some server, there is a workaround... a sec I find the bugzilla number | 12:33 |
| JaneW | seb128: the other IMAP folder sare there, and all the 'on this computer' folder are there too. | 12:33 |
| JaneW | seb128: great, thanks | 12:33 |
| seb128 | JaneW, could you try to go to Folders, subscribtion and to unsubscribe/subscribe to the INBOX folder? | 12:34 |
| JaneW | seb128: aha - it was unchecked! It's back now.... Thanks so much :) | 12:36 |
| seb128 | JaneW, you're welcome, glade it works again ;) | 12:36 |
| === JaneW too | ||
| dredg | 'glade'. auto fingers strike again? :) | 12:36 |
| seb128 | s/glade/glad/ | 12:36 |
| tseng | he just uploaded glade | 12:37 |
| seb128 | yeah, thanks to GNOME :p | 12:37 |
| dredg | know the feeling. there's a list of words i can't just type, i have to correct them | 12:37 |
| infinity | Somewhere along the way, my fingers decided that I should always type "server" when I mean "serve", and it's very irritating. | 12:49 |
| === psusi [n=phreak@103.202.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| psusi | so I did an apt-get source to get the source to a package... what was the right way to build it again? | 12:51 |
| infinity | cd foo-1.2.3 && dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -uc -us -b | 12:52 |
| psusi | ahh... dpkg-buildpackage... question... what does that do differently than simply ./configure and make? | 12:53 |
| infinity | It makes debian packages? | 12:53 |
| infinity | (it runs debian/rules clean && debian/rules build && debian/rules binary) | 12:53 |
| infinity | debian/rules is what's responsible for doing the more interesting things. | 12:53 |
| infinity | And this probably belongs in #ubuntu-motu | 12:54 |
| infinity | Or somewhere else that's not here. | 12:54 |
| === psusi is attempting to solve the mystery of why a lot of breezy amd64 libs have been build with a rediculous 1 MB alignment requirement which is wasting tons of memory | ||
| psusi | ok, I understand what it means... but -DOPENSSL_NO_IDEA just looks funny | 12:58 |
| infinity | Too bad there isn't a patent-encumbered algo called CLUE, too. | 12:59 |
| psusi | hehe | 12:59 |
| psusi | I don't suppose you would have any idea what kind of specs setting or command line option would get gcc/ld to emit a binary with a 1 MB alignment requirement eh? ;) | 01:00 |
| infinity | -DIRRITATE_PSUI | 01:00 |
| infinity | (No, no idea) | 01:00 |
| psusi | lol | 01:00 |
| psusi | didn't think so... | 01:00 |
| infinity | PSUSI, too. | 01:00 |
| infinity | Maybe it's intentional, so all those people with dual-core amd64 machines with 4G of RAM can feel like it's being well-used, despite only running a web browser and a mail client? | 01:01 |
| psusi | lol | 01:02 |
| psusi | yep... ok... the image I built also has 1 MB alignment... now... pin the tail on the toolchain breakage | 01:03 |
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| Keybuk | I'm just wondering which aligment you're looking at ... | 01:05 |
| Keybuk | usually it's 8 bytes ... not 1MB | 01:05 |
| Keybuk | that's going to use a _lot_ of memory | 01:05 |
| psusi | aye.... | 01:05 |
| psusi | exactly | 01:05 |
| Keybuk | so struct { char a; char b; char c; char d; }; is using 4MB of memory? | 01:05 |
| pitti | you just have to use 4 GB for *something* ... | 01:05 |
| psusi | clock-applet is using 111 megs of memory | 01:05 |
| psusi | that ai't right | 01:05 |
| Keybuk | *shrug* it's _mapped_ 111 megs of memory | 01:06 |
| Keybuk | map != using | 01:06 |
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| psusi | it is mostly due to 2 1 MB mappings that would otherwise be like 8 kb from 40 different shared libs | 01:06 |
| mvo | 111 looks fine to me | 01:06 |
| Keybuk | are you really sure those aren't just the stack? :) | 01:06 |
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| psusi | yes.... | 01:06 |
| psusi | they are mappings of the sections of the .so | 01:06 |
| psusi | when I do an objdump -x on the .so, it shows this: | 01:06 |
| Keybuk | ok | 01:06 |
| Keybuk | libpanel-applet-2.so.0.1.10 | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | 00002aaaaabcf000 1024 ----- 000000000000d000 0fe:00004 | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | libpanel-applet-2.so.0.1.10 | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | 00002aaaaaccf000 8 rw--- 000000000000d000 0fe:00004 | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | libpanel-applet-2.so.0.1.10 | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | those two? | 01:07 |
| psusi | LOAD off 0x0000000000000000 vaddr 0x0000000000000000 paddr 0x0000000000000000 align 2**20 | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | right, that's just the alignment within the map | 01:08 |
| Keybuk | that means nothing, it's just the spacing of the magic numbers that mean sod-all | 01:08 |
| psusi | naw, it is causing the section to be 1 MB according to pmap | 01:08 |
| psusi | when it really should be much smaller than that | 01:08 |
| Keybuk | *shrug* that's just a 1MB _gap_ | 01:08 |
| Keybuk | it's not readable or writable, and not backed by a page | 01:08 |
| psusi | not according to pmap | 01:08 |
| Keybuk | the same one backed by a page follows it and is just 8KB | 01:08 |
| Keybuk | ^^ that's your pmap output I pasted | 01:08 |
| Keybuk | seriously, ignore the VSZ of a process, it means absolutely nothing | 01:09 |
| Keybuk | it's like load average, it should only be taken in the context of anything else | 01:09 |
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| psusi | oh wait a second... you're right... it's ---- | 01:09 |
| Keybuk | if clock-applet had 111MB *larger* VSZ than any other applet, there would be a problem | 01:10 |
| psusi | well, that memory counts towards the commit limit, doesn't it? | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | no | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | only memory backed by page counts to that | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | and if multiple processes use the same page, it only counts once | 01:10 |
| psusi | hrm... I see... so it is only reserved address space then? | 01:10 |
| psusi | not committed | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | yeah, it's just mapped | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | looking at that, I think that's just the relocation table | 01:10 |
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| Keybuk | the .so has 2MB reserved for relocation table, only 8KB of which was actually needed | 01:11 |
| psusi | hrm.... well it still results in system monitor showing simple things like clock-applet to be using rediculous amounts of memory | 01:11 |
| Keybuk | so 8KB is mapped | 01:11 |
| Keybuk | *shrug* system-monitor was written by somebody who didn't understand how memory mapping works | 01:11 |
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| Keybuk | and thought he'd just copy the ps output | 01:11 |
| Keybuk | or who did understand, and forgot that most other people don't | 01:11 |
| psusi | hrm... maybe you'll know the answer to this one then... what's the difference between cache and buffers in the output of free? | 01:13 |
| Keybuk | there isn't really one in 2.6 | 01:13 |
| Keybuk | cache is the page cache | 01:13 |
| Keybuk | the bits of memory that correspond to files on disk, or shared maps | 01:14 |
| psusi | aye... | 01:14 |
| psusi | so what's buffers? | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | buffers is stuff loaded for the page cache but not yet used | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | iirc. | 01:14 |
| psusi | hrm... that's strange... | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | it's usually very small | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | cached is usually huge | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | on a modern system, you want as much of your memory as possible used by cached | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | and as little as possible in free | 01:14 |
| psusi | seems to grow for me quite a bit while updatedb is running... and system monitor counts buffers as used memory it seems ;) | 01:14 |
| psusi | aye | 01:15 |
| Keybuk | yeah, that makes sense | 01:15 |
| Keybuk | pre-loading the next page of the file on disk so it's there when you want it | 01:15 |
| psusi | that's one reason I hated linux memory management for a long time... it would just let apps eat up all free memory until there was none left in the cache or free, and only THEN start paging out unused data | 01:15 |
| Keybuk | so you don't get a performance hit because the disk has moved on when you do want it | 01:15 |
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| Keybuk | define "free memory" | 01:16 |
| psusi | on the free/zeroed list | 01:16 |
| Keybuk | there are various configuration options to define when the system considers itself low on memory | 01:16 |
| Keybuk | you can tinker with them so your machine behaves how you'd like | 01:16 |
| Keybuk | the defaults are a compromise between server and desktop iirc | 01:16 |
| Keybuk | (desktop you don't want to kill processes just because you have used up the really-free memory) | 01:16 |
| Keybuk | really-free should be as near to zero as possible | 01:17 |
| Keybuk | otherwise you've got too much ram in your machine | 01:17 |
| psusi | all I know is that it used to just keep eating up the cache until there was like 2 MB of cache left, and 2 MB of free left, and THEN throw the 2 gigs of data that hasn't been touched in a week out to swap | 01:17 |
| psusi | heh | 01:17 |
| === Gman is now known as GmanAFK | ||
| Keybuk | it doesn't quite work like that ... cached is actually not really "cache" | 01:17 |
| Keybuk | cached actually includes the code of the apps you have loaded and stuff | 01:18 |
| psusi | yea.... all of the memory mapped pages that are resident | 01:18 |
| psusi | some of which may be mapped into user processes, and some only by the kernel cache manager, no? | 01:18 |
| Keybuk | you'd be amazed how many people complain X uses 256MB of memory <g> | 01:18 |
| infinity | Oh, X is a special and wonderful case. | 01:20 |
| infinity | Since it mmaps directly to your video RAM, and that gets counted against it. | 01:20 |
| Keybuk | it's always funny when you suggest that might be the RAM on your video card <g> | 01:20 |
| Keybuk | people get this "ooooooh" look | 01:21 |
| psusi | aye | 01:21 |
| Keybuk | VSZ is a lie, news at 11 | 01:21 |
| Keybuk | I remember someone particularly complaining about it, and hadn't noticed that if they totalled the VSZs on their machine, it came to something like 80 times the memory they actually had | 01:21 |
| psusi | hrm... ok... so the real problem then is that system monitor is counting reserved but not committed memory, and it shouldn't do that... | 01:21 |
| infinity | Probably not, if it's meant to be useful to "normal" users. | 01:22 |
| Keybuk | you don't even want to do that | 01:22 |
| Keybuk | you want to just count writable non-executable non-shared memory that's not backed by file | 01:22 |
| psusi | well... I'm a normal user... and when I go looking at the "Virtual Memory" column, I expect it to indicate the amount of memory that the process THINKS it is using ;) | 01:22 |
| Keybuk | pmap -x $(pidof clock-applet) | grep " rw---.*anon" | 01:23 |
| Keybuk | that stuff, in fact | 01:23 |
| Keybuk | and that tells me the clock is using 3MB, which is still wayyyyyy too much for a clock | 01:23 |
| psusi | actually, no... see that's what windows task manager does for it's "VM Size" field... which I found out today | 01:23 |
| psusi | and that makes no sense to me | 01:23 |
| Keybuk | but then I know most of that is actually the calendar integration, and known bug | 01:23 |
| psusi | I don't care how big it's heap is... I want to know ALL the memory it is using... shared or otherwize | 01:23 |
| psusi | paged out or not | 01:24 |
| Keybuk | that's VSZ | 01:24 |
| psusi | Keybuk: 3 MB is a lot less than 111 MB ;) | 01:24 |
| Keybuk | the total amount of memory that the process could access if it wanted | 01:24 |
| psusi | it can't access the sections that are not read, write, or execute | 01:24 |
| psusi | they are only reserved address ranges, so shouldn't count | 01:24 |
| Keybuk | right, but the kernel still counts them against the process | 01:25 |
| psusi | in windows terms, it is the difference between MEM_COMMIT and MEM_RESERVE | 01:25 |
| psusi | what for? they don't use any actual resources | 01:25 |
| Keybuk | to be honest, why do users care how much memory a process is using | 01:25 |
| Keybuk | that very caring suggests they're not really users | 01:25 |
| psusi | looking for the bloat | 01:25 |
| Keybuk | why would a user do that? | 01:25 |
| psusi | cause they are sick of their computer being so slow ;) | 01:26 |
| infinity | Generally, they wouldn't, unless processes start refusing to run due to lack of free memory. :) | 01:26 |
| psusi | or run very slowly due to all the thrashing | 01:26 |
| Keybuk | run very slowly, you want to look at the RESIDENT size them :p | 01:27 |
| psusi | ok... so just to make sure now... the sections that are ----- don't count towards the commit limit, but do count towards the process' vsz? | 01:27 |
| Keybuk | because that's the bits that are left to swap | 01:27 |
| Keybuk | there's no real commit limit in Linux, you know ... | 01:27 |
| Keybuk | but yes, those bits wouldn't count, and in addition it's backed by file anyway, so it wouldn't count | 01:27 |
| psusi | unless you mess with overcommit_ratio there isn isn't there? | 01:27 |
| psusi | hrm.... true... | 01:28 |
| psusi | I still have to wonder though where the 1 MB alignment came from... it's just... weird... | 01:29 |
| Keybuk | *shrug* not especially | 01:29 |
| Keybuk | it just makes the addresses look nicer | 01:29 |
| Keybuk | makes sure there's at least that much room for that, in case you really do end up needing that much space for the relocation table | 01:30 |
| psusi | the relocation table's size isn't dynamic | 01:31 |
| psusi | it fits in the .reloc section, doesn't it? | 01:31 |
| Keybuk | I don't actually know that's what you have | 01:32 |
| === psusi goes for a smoke to contemplate | ||
| dilinger | (18:11:27) Wes Chow: I never saw it, but in that Jet Li movie "The One", they have something called the multiverse | 01:33 |
| Keybuk | it doesn't actually match any particular section in the library | 01:33 |
| Keybuk | it's somewhere in the hash table though | 01:34 |
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| infinity | I'm wondering if perhaps a phone with a 102-page manual is perhaps a bit too feature-rich for me... | 01:48 |
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| Kinnison | ciao all | 02:24 |
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| Riddell | elmo: can you sync libkexif from debian please | 05:04 |
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| bob2 | don't syncs happen automatically? | 05:09 |
| Riddell | bob2: not if the package has an ubuntu version number | 05:09 |
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| elmo | Riddell: in which case you need to add the magic phrase "ok to override ubuntu changes" ... | 05:14 |
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| Riddell | elmo: add to my request to you? | 05:15 |
| elmo | yes | 05:15 |
| Riddell | elmo: can you sync libkexif from debian, ok to override ubuntu changes | 05:16 |
| \sh | *g* | 05:16 |
| \sh | oh god...i'm looking like draco malfoy in the half blood prince.../me needs a "don't be afraid of take off and landings" therapy somehow | 05:19 |
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| elmo | Riddell: done | 05:26 |
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| Riddell | thanks | 05:26 |
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| Amaranth | hmm, if the breezy upgrade notes in the wiki say gnome-panel leaks ram during the upgrade wouldn't that mean gnome-menus is leaking while talking to gamin? | 05:59 |
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| blueyed | I have a problem running chroot on Ubuntu breezy.. "cannot run command `/bin/ls' : No such file or directory". Of course /bin/ls exists in the jail. I've used makejail to create the jail, but makejail also does just one iteration (probably of that problem). It used to work with Hoary. | 07:25 |
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| minghua | blueyed: maybe you can try debootstrap instead? that's how I set up my chroot anyway | 07:38 |
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| blueyed | minghua: thank you, but I'd rather use makejail. It seems to provide less files etc (when functional). | 08:04 |
| blueyed | What is "execve" in strace? It's result's output format seems to have changed.. | 08:05 |
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| zakame | hi all | 08:05 |
| blueyed | hi zakame. | 08:05 |
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| blueyed | Do you know what "execve" in strace output is? | 08:06 |
| zakame | you mean the first line in that output? | 08:06 |
| Treenaks | blueyed: sudo apt-get install manpages-dev; man execve ;) | 08:07 |
| blueyed | No, I've meant what execve is. But just found it's man page. It's output format (for not-found-files) seems to have changed. (makejail parses this). | 08:08 |
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| rob^laptop | is anyone else getting an md5sum mismatch on http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy-security/main/source/Sources.gz | 08:23 |
| bob2 | you can check that yourself | 08:23 |
| bob2 | the checksum is in the Releases file | 08:23 |
| Yagisan | rob^laptop: occasionally, it seems to depend on what server the dns points me to | 08:25 |
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| rob^laptop | bob2, just checked it, they match ok | 08:28 |
| rob^laptop | apt-get update still gives the error though | 08:29 |
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| mojo | i am wondering if the new GNOME 2.14 will have its own menu editor? | 08:34 |
| Treenaks | I heard rumours like that | 08:35 |
| mojo | Treenaks: I saw some post in bugzilla with mockup GUI, look promising, if GNOME 2.14 does have, then we can deprecate SMEG | 08:36 |
| ompaul | mojo, was that alacarte the replacement for smeg? | 08:37 |
| mojo | ompaul: I can't tell for now, it's just rumour, if the GNOME menu editor is better than SMEG then we replace smeg orelse we stick with smeg then | 08:38 |
| ompaul | smeg is dead there is this by the guy who wote smeg http://dev.realistanew.com/alacarte/releases/0.8/alacarte_0.8-0ubuntu1_all.deb | 08:38 |
| ompaul | s/wote/wrote/ hmm | 08:39 |
| === ompaul puts his fingers away before he does some damage | ||
| bob2 | ugh | 08:39 |
| mojo | ompaul: alacarte seems not to be a good replacement, because it's not intergrated with GNOME | 08:40 |
| ompaul | mojo, true, but at least it is better than no editor | 08:41 |
| bob2 | you should start a thread on the forums | 08:42 |
| mojo | ompaul: let's just wait and see what GNOME 2.14 will bring to us | 08:42 |
| bob2 | and quote random other threads from the forums | 08:42 |
| ompaul | :) | 08:42 |
| ompaul | bob2, and then stop the thread and start a new one | 08:43 |
| Treenaks | bob2: and IGNORE the mailing list | 08:43 |
| bob2 | now you're getting the hang of it! | 08:43 |
| Treenaks | bob2: you sound bitter | 08:43 |
| bob2 | don't forget to post "LOLZ" followups | 08:43 |
| bob2 | Treenaks: not at all | 08:43 |
| Treenaks | LOLZ is the new AOL! | 08:43 |
| bob2 | I respect and appreciate the immense contribution the forums have provided to the social and technical development of ubuntu | 08:43 |
| Treenaks | bob2: will you be/are you in Canada? | 08:44 |
| bob2 | no | 08:44 |
| mojo | ompaul: there is a debate on whether gnome should have menu editor or not, there are 2 sides, both sides are very agressive and determined with their ideal, I think there is only 1 solution, create a configure flag to enable or disable the menu editor features and leave the rest up to distro maker decide | 08:44 |
| Treenaks | I need that brainwashing kit | 08:44 |
| mojo | ompaul: there is a debate on whether gnome should have menu editor or not, there are 2 sides, both sides are very agressive and determined with their ideal, I think there is only 1 solution, create a configure flag to enable or disable the menu editor features and leave the rest up to distro maker decide | 08:44 |
| Treenaks | mojo: please only say stuff once :) | 08:45 |
| bob2 | so I shant get to meet such luminaries | 08:45 |
| bob2 | haha configure flag | 08:45 |
| ompaul | Treenaks, I needed to read it twice helped me | 08:45 |
| bob2 | that's not taking a stand at all, that's deciding not to decide | 08:45 |
| mojo | Treenkas: sorry, my xchat suffed, words are cut, so I just post it twice | 08:45 |
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| Treenaks | mojo: so you're making us suffer for your client's brokenness? | 08:46 |
| ompaul | bob2, and if you choose not to decide you still have made a choice (some $song by some $band circa 1980) | 08:46 |
| Treenaks | sounds familiar in way :) | 08:46 |
| crimsun | freewill, by rush | 08:46 |
| crimsun | </offtopic> | 08:46 |
| mojo | oh yes, is the gnome-torrent in CVS as same as gnome-bt (used in current Breezy)? | 08:47 |
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| tsume | oi | 09:03 |
| tsume | question, is everything in breezy release compiled with gcc4? qt3? | 09:03 |
| tepsipakki | mostly gcc4, kernel with gcc3.4 i think | 09:06 |
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| tsume | :( then this error ews me | 09:07 |
| tsume | tepsipakki: do you know if there are differences in libtool I'll need to watch out for? | 09:08 |
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| tepsipakki | no | 09:13 |
| tepsipakki | I don't | 09:13 |
| tsume | then I find this error intresting :) | 09:15 |
| tsume | libtool: link: AGE `92' is greater than the current interface number `3' | 09:15 |
| tsume | libtool: link: `3:4:92' is not valid version information | 09:15 |
| tepsipakki | #ubuntu is probably the place to ask.. | 09:16 |
| tsume | tepsipakki: actually #C++, #ubuntu is just full of users.. mainly knot anyone who is intelligent in programming | 09:17 |
| tsume | tepsipakki: its kinda like asking #redhat how to use YasT ;) | 09:17 |
| tepsipakki | well, I think the ones who can answer are either asleep or partying ;) (at UBZ) | 09:18 |
| tsume | tepsipakki: UBZ? | 09:18 |
| [Chameleon] | Ubuntu Below Zero | 09:18 |
| tsume | oh | 09:18 |
| tepsipakki | in Montreal | 09:18 |
| === tsume is in Alaska | ||
| [Chameleon] | and I'm intelligent in programming and also am in the #ubuntu channel. | 09:18 |
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| tsume | [Chameleon] : you are also in here though | 09:19 |
| [Chameleon] | but, I don't know much about how the library stuff works. | 09:19 |
| [Chameleon] | true | 09:19 |
| tsume | [Chameleon] : not just library.. but libtool.. libtool is a known hell :) | 09:19 |
| [Chameleon] | oh, I thought Windows' DLL Hell officially claimed that title | 09:19 |
| tsume | I just hacked the compile, I know how to fix it. I want a answer to why it happens though | 09:19 |
| [Chameleon] | hmm, wish I could help | 09:20 |
| [Chameleon] | really, I do | 09:20 |
| tsume | well I set it to 3:4:3, I don't know why it gets set to 3:4:92. What is 92 magic to? | 09:20 |
| zyga | morning | 09:21 |
| tsume | oi zyga | 09:21 |
| bob2 | w.t.f. | 09:24 |
| bob2 | the totem plugin crashed firefox | 09:25 |
| bob2 | which apparently crashed X | 09:25 |
| tsume | bob2: cute :) | 09:25 |
| bob2 | which apparenytly got in a loop of being unable to restart | 09:25 |
| bob2 | requiring a reboot | 09:25 |
| tepsipakki | mininova.org crashes my firefox, for some reason ;) | 09:25 |
| minghua | tsume: I think I've _heard_ something about this | 09:25 |
| tepsipakki | but not with a clean profile, go figure | 09:25 |
| tsume | minghua: I've seen it before, but I just keep "fixing" it | 09:26 |
| minghua | tsume: perhaps libtool only accepts one-digit numbers there? | 09:26 |
| tsume | 3:4:92 | 09:26 |
| tsume | the third digit is not supposed to be more than the first digit | 09:27 |
| bob2 | where was it 92? | 09:27 |
| tsume | bob2: 92 is what I recieved when I built qtruby from source | 09:27 |
| bob2 | where "source" = "ubuntu source package"? | 09:28 |
| tsume | I know its supposed to be 3. I'm still curious where it recieved 92 :) | 09:28 |
| tsume | bob2: no, from tarball source. qtruby is outdated on the ubuntu tree for bugs | 09:28 |
| bob2 | "clueless about library versioning" is a common condition for software developers who aren't in Debian | 09:28 |
| [Chameleon] | bob2: so are you saying it's the qtruby dev's fault? | 09:29 |
| === tsume doesn't think richard dale would screw up code like that | ||
| [Chameleon] | bob2: otherwise, please enlighten us. I admit that I'm clueless about library versioning. | 09:30 |
| bob2 | I'm just bitter | 09:30 |
| bob2 | let me check | 09:30 |
| tsume | would have been nice if rdale released his qt4 bindings for qtruby though before the ubuntu release :/ | 09:31 |
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| zyga | bob2: totem always crashes ff | 09:43 |
| zyga | bob2: but X ... that's another story | 09:43 |
| tsume | zyga: heh.. I used to play games with people. I would crash their X session by sending emails to all my coworkers using kmail | 09:44 |
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| bob2 | zyga: jah, x bug | 09:45 |
| bob2 | zyga: but that doesn't stop me directing hate in the direction of totem | 09:45 |
| [Chameleon] | tsume: that brings new meaning to the term "mail bomb" | 09:46 |
| tsume | [Chameleon] : I only sent 1 email to each coworker :) | 09:46 |
| tsume | [Chameleon] : the bad part is they couldn't even delete the mail out of kmail without removing it through command line. Even if you clicked on it without the viewing pane it would crash :) | 09:47 |
| khakionion | hey guys | 09:47 |
| zyga | strange | 09:48 |
| zyga | tsume: what did that mail contain? an embedded video? | 09:48 |
| khakionion | madsen: you up? | 09:48 |
| tsume | zyga: a special encoded string :) | 09:48 |
| zyga | tsume: you hacker, fix kmail and stop damaging | 09:48 |
| [Chameleon] | tsume: I know, that's what I meant. | 09:49 |
| tsume | zyga: excuse me? no need to get insulting calling me a hacker | 09:49 |
| [Chameleon] | tsume: the single email was a bomb | 09:49 |
| zyga | tsume: hacker is a very positive word | 09:49 |
| tsume | zyga: I think kiddy, not coder when I think of the word. Hollywood has ruined it for me. | 09:50 |
| zyga | tsume: ah, I don't watch many movies, I'm not spoiled yet | 09:50 |
| khakionion | madsen: Hope you see this when you get up. Someone walked in with Evan Williams *86* proof whiskey, so I'm not coherent, but it was just the insight I needed to get Wacom pressure sensitivity working in GIMP/GNOME. | 09:50 |
| khakionion | madsen: When we coincide here in ubuntu-devel, let's see if my fix works for you, or if you | 09:51 |
| bob2 | tsume: I can't see where it's defining the soname at all | 09:51 |
| khakionion | madsen: found your own workarouund for your....what? volitas? Or something? Must sleep. TTYL. | 09:52 |
| tsume | bob2: I haven't exactly looked at the qtruby source.. yet | 09:52 |
| bob2 | tsume: huh? | 09:52 |
| tsume | bob2: what code were you looking at? | 09:52 |
| khakionion | madsen: I remembered. VOLITO. Okay, I'm out for reals. Later. | 09:52 |
| bob2 | tsume: the qtruby source | 09:53 |
| tsume | then my very exhausted self was correct to say the statement above | 09:53 |
| bob2 | what were you looking at before if not the source? | 09:54 |
| khakionion | Oh wait...is this Ubuntu-Devel or Ubuntu-Offtopic? | 09:54 |
| tsume | I just edited the makefile | 09:54 |
| bob2 | khakionion: ...devel. | 09:54 |
| tsume | bob2: I knew where to fix it right off. I just edited the makefile which had the 3:4:92 | 09:55 |
| bob2 | tsume: as in the one configure generated from the Makefile.in that was generated by automake from Makefile.am? | 09:55 |
| khakionion | bob2: thanks, couldn't tell with my current GTK+ theme. | 09:55 |
| khakionion | I'm out | 09:55 |
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| tsume | bob2: the location of the file is smoke/qt/Makefile | 09:56 |
| bob2 | libsmokeqt_la_LDFLAGS = -version-info 3:4:92 -no-undefined $(all_libraries) $(GLINC) | 09:57 |
| bob2 | right | 09:57 |
| tsume | bob2: where does 92 even come from however? | 09:59 |
| bob2 | the author set it | 09:59 |
| tsume | I'll think about it tomarrow after sleep when I can actually not just think ruby | 10:02 |
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| ploum | Hello | 11:00 |
| ploum | I'm trying to solve this | 11:00 |
| ploum | https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/3204 | 11:00 |
| ploum | I have this bug on all Breezy I have upgraded from Hoary | 11:01 |
| ploum | But nobody has it too | 11:01 |
| ploum | so can someone tell me if there's some symlink changes or font handling change between breezy and hoary ? | 11:02 |
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| Seveas | ploum, are you sure you have ubuntu-desktop installed? | 11:43 |
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| ploum | Seveas, yes, I have it | 11:54 |
| ploum | Can someone explain me what must be the content of : | 11:54 |
| ploum | /etc/X11/fonts , /usr/share/fonts/ , /usr/share/X11/fonts | 11:54 |
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| ploum | I have three very different things | 11:55 |
| ploum | In fact, lot of people have the problem and solve it by installing gsfonts-x11 and msttcorefont. As I had it for quite some time, I think that they install their font in a directory that must be symlinked somewhere for the flash plugin | 11:57 |
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| ploum_ | tiens, un kikidonk :-) | 01:00 |
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| pitti | good morning | 02:07 |
| HiddenWolf | morning. :) | 02:08 |
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| ajmitch | morning pitti | 02:17 |
| fabbione | morning guys | 02:19 |
| ajmitch | hi fabbione | 02:19 |
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| mdke | does anyone know any docs for installing and setting up planet? | 02:37 |
| zakame | hello all | 02:37 |
| === mdke can't see anything obvious on the website | ||
| zakame | mdke: there was a recent blogpost about planet on planet debian | 02:38 |
| mdke | lookin | 02:39 |
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| mdke | not recent enough :/ | 02:39 |
| bob2 | eh? | 02:39 |
| zakame | hmm? | 02:40 |
| bob2 | planet includes setup documents | 02:40 |
| mdke | bob2, i don't have planet | 02:40 |
| mdke | so no setup docs either | 02:40 |
| bob2 | ... | 02:41 |
| bob2 | http://www.planetplanet.org/, download, read INSTALL | 02:41 |
| mdke | bob2, that is fine, but there is no download link | 02:42 |
| bob2 | 'A nightly snapshot of the code is available from here.' | 02:42 |
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| mdke | that would imply that it is not a stable version | 02:43 |
| mdke | and also, I don't know how to work arch | 02:43 |
| mjg59 | There is no stable version | 02:43 |
| mdke | ah thanks mjg59 | 02:43 |
| bob2 | it would also imply theree has never been a stable version | 02:43 |
| bob2 | it's a tarball | 02:43 |
| bob2 | you don't need to use arch | 02:43 |
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| mdke | bob2, ok, i'd love it if you would show me the tarball | 02:44 |
| mdke | the link to scott's page is broken, and jeff's one seems to be a mixture of patches | 02:44 |
| bob2 | ? | 02:44 |
| bob2 | 22:42:46 bob2 | 'A nightly snapshot of the code is available from here.' | 02:44 |
| bob2 | 'from here' is a link to http://www.planetplanet.org/planet-nightly.tar.bz2 | 02:44 |
| mdke | argh | 02:45 |
| mdke | thanks | 02:45 |
| mdke | so the nightly version is ok? | 02:45 |
| bob2 | that's all there is, so yes | 02:46 |
| bob2 | jdub: do a release already | 02:46 |
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| mdke | thanks bob2 | 02:48 |
| === mdke goes off to experiment | ||
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| jdub | mdke: no, the nightly is not useful | 03:01 |
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| mdke | atgh | 03:01 |
| mdke | jdub, what should I get? | 03:01 |
| jdub | mdke: just baz get http://www.gnome.org/~jdub/arch/planet--devel--1.0 | 03:01 |
| mdke | ok | 03:01 |
| mdke | would be cool to make a tarball at some stage though | 03:02 |
| === mdke installs baz | ||
| mdke | thanks jdub, got it | 03:07 |
| jdub | would be nice to make a release at some stage | 03:08 |
| mdke | yeah | 03:08 |
| mdke | failing that, explain on planetplanet.org how to get the software for people like me | 03:09 |
| highvoltage | i think i'll download it too, and use it for my local lug. | 03:09 |
| === pitti [n=pitti@66.103.220.252] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mdke | i can tar it up and send it if you prefer not to install bazaar | 03:10 |
| highvoltage | me? | 03:11 |
| mdke | yes | 03:11 |
| highvoltage | i'd like an excuse to play with baz :) | 03:11 |
| mdke | okay | 03:11 |
| highvoltage | but if that fails, i'll ask for the tar. thanks. | 03:11 |
| === Keybuk [n=scott@66.103.220.195] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| bob2 | monsier Keybuk | 03:11 |
| Keybuk | ah, monsieur wier, a va? | 03:12 |
| bob2 | oui | 03:12 |
| === seb128 [n=seb128@66.103.220.254] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| ajmitch | hello Keybuk, seb128 | 03:14 |
| seb128 | morning | 03:14 |
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| Keybuk | ello | 03:15 |
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| tseng | morning mdz | 03:17 |
| === ajmitch guesses everyone is going online after breakfast :) | ||
| Keybuk | heyyy emmmdeeezeee | 03:19 |
| zakame | hey Kaloz seb128 mdz | 03:19 |
| zakame | and Keybuk too | 03:19 |
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| tseng | jdub: would you please moderate my mail to -devel | 03:27 |
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| Keybuk | BenC: ping? | 03:34 |
| Mez | keybuk, ping | 03:35 |
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| Mez | Keybuk, you there? | 03:35 |
| Mez | I need to speak to someone who's arranging the whole UBZ thing | 03:35 |
| Keybuk | Mez: I am | 03:35 |
| Keybuk | I'm most definitely here | 03:35 |
| Keybuk | though I'm not "arranging" | 03:35 |
| Mez | cause I need to fly out tomorrow | 03:35 |
| Mez | do you have contact details (phone or similar) for someone who is | 03:36 |
| tseng | Mez: Claire? | 03:36 |
| Mez | I dont have anything other than an email address though | 03:36 |
| bob2 | Mez: you're being sponsored to go to ubz? | 03:36 |
| Mez | yes | 03:36 |
| Keybuk | why tomorrow? | 03:36 |
| Mez | bob2 - BA have changed my flight for tomorrow for me | 03:37 |
| Mez | Keybuk, I managed to leave my passport in birmingham | 03:37 |
| Keybuk | d'oh | 03:37 |
| Keybuk | that was very silly, wasn't it :p | 03:37 |
| Mez | I've got to go back and get it and there isnt a flight till tomorrow | 03:37 |
| Mez | yes | 03:37 |
| Keybuk | just turn up tomorrow then | 03:37 |
| Mez | BA have kindly, free of charge changed my flight | 03:37 |
| Mez | I'm just wondering about the hotel and stuff | 03:37 |
| === spayne [n=spayne@i-195-137-120-148.freedom2surf.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| tseng | spayne: ping | 03:38 |
| spayne | hey tseng | 03:38 |
| === spayne prepares for a bollixing | ||
| tseng | hi | 03:38 |
| Mez | Keybuk: you assume that everything will be ok ? | 03:38 |
| Keybuk | Mez: I don't see why not | 03:38 |
| spayne | tseng: what's up? | 03:38 |
| tseng | spayne: i sent a reply to you, you should have got it but it got moderated to -devel (wrong address) | 03:38 |
| Mez | so there shouldnt be any problem at that end - even though I'm due to check in tonight? | 03:38 |
| spayne | tseng, i got it | 03:39 |
| spayne | tseng, that is a great diea | 03:39 |
| tseng | spayne: Mez is right here. | 03:39 |
| tseng | so hopefully we can stop trying to all make some kind of seperate peace | 03:39 |
| spayne | according to calvin (from novell), communications broke down as both Mez and Calvin went away for a while | 03:39 |
| Mez | tseng ... ? | 03:39 |
| spayne | hey Mez | 03:39 |
| Mez | spayne, yes, we've been talking recently | 03:39 |
| Keybuk | Mez: right, I don't see why not, I'll let claire know you're going to be late, but I doubt it'd matter | 03:39 |
| Keybuk | you'll just end up with an extra breakfast voucher or something | 03:40 |
| Mez | ok, cool | 03:40 |
| spayne | Mez, basically, what boyd and the team said was they can work out something with the Flaim guys so we can get iFolder into universe/multiverse | 03:40 |
| spayne | Mez, because, IIRC, the idea was to have a 3rd party repo, was it not? | 03:40 |
| Mez | spayne, yeah I know, been talking to calvin about it | 03:40 |
| tseng | spayne: great.. anything on the other points? | 03:40 |
| Mez | Keybuk - extra breakfast voucher ? :P | 03:40 |
| spayne | tseng, other points? | 03:40 |
| tseng | yes.. like Debian | 03:40 |
| === carstenh [n=carstenh@p54A61D5E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Mez | hmm | 03:41 |
| Mez | it might be better for me to get a coach back | 03:41 |
| spayne | tseng, i haven't heard yet - i have emailed the guys | 03:41 |
| Mez | keybuk: lucky I didnt check in online eh ? | 03:41 |
| spayne | tseng, but i can't imagine being a problem | 03:41 |
| tseng | spayne: great, thanks. | 03:41 |
| === xTina [n=xTina@p54A1D7EF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| spayne | tseng: see, i do have my uses ;) | 03:41 |
| Keybuk | Mez: let me teach you the holy mantra of regular travellers | 03:42 |
| Keybuk | as you walk out of the door, and before you shut it, repeat these words | 03:42 |
| Keybuk | "tickets, money, passport" | 03:42 |
| fabbione | Keybuk: and repeat that out lod jumping on one foot only | 03:43 |
| ajmitch | & for UBZ, laptop | 03:43 |
| fabbione | loud even | 03:43 |
| fabbione | ajmitch: one you have money you don't need the laptop :) | 03:43 |
| === Mez sighs | ||
| fabbione | it's enough you got tickets, passport and money :) | 03:43 |
| ajmitch | if you have enough money :) | 03:43 |
| Keybuk | you can always borrow a laptop, there are usually spares | 03:44 |
| fabbione | ajmitch: you can always go back and sell the old laptop | 03:44 |
| Keybuk | you can't borrow a passport | 03:44 |
| Keybuk | unless you're a terrorist | 03:44 |
| ajmitch | sadly I can't sell this laptop off | 03:44 |
| ajmitch | as it belongs to canonical & all | 03:44 |
| Mez | Keybuk: *sighs* I had it all ready ... I just didnt put it in the fecking bag | 03:44 |
| lamont | dear ftpmasters: libbeecrypt6-dev | 03:45 |
| lamont | needs to move to main for rpm. kthxbye | 03:45 |
| Keybuk | lamont: when do you arrive? | 03:46 |
| lamont | sunday 1710 | 03:47 |
| fabbione | hey lamont | 03:48 |
| Mez | for feck sake | 03:48 |
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| Mez | it's going to cost me an extra 40 aswell to do all this | 03:48 |
| Mez | and I doubt I can claim that | 03:48 |
| fabbione | Mez: next time remember to connect the brain :) | 03:49 |
| Mez | fabbione: *sighs* | 03:49 |
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| Mez | ARGH | 03:55 |
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| carstenh | pitti: hi, your name is not longer on the firewall spec page. does this mean anything? | 03:57 |
| pitti | carstenh: no idea, but the names on the wiki page are irrelevant | 03:57 |
| pitti | carstenh: the LP assignment is the definitive place now | 03:58 |
| carstenh | pitti: that is what i meant with spec page. just wondered why it has disappered, but when you have no idea why it should not matter | 04:00 |
| Nafallo | pitti: why doesn't sshd work on my server after todays update? :-P | 04:00 |
| Nafallo | ssh_exchange_identification: Connection closed by remote host | 04:00 |
| carstenh | s/it// | 04:00 |
| Nafallo | pitti: hi btw :-) | 04:01 |
| pitti | Nafallo: I'm not running dapper yet | 04:01 |
| Nafallo | pitti: I'm running breezy (+security) on the server and dapper on the client :-) | 04:02 |
| Nafallo | I can log in to other servers from the client | 04:02 |
| Nafallo | hmm, todays update was sudo btw. sorry :-P. | 04:03 |
| === Nafallo becomes even more confused now. | ||
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| pitti | Nafallo: no idea, on my breezy boxes ssh works | 04:03 |
| Nafallo | pitti: yea, my mistake. I had s/sudo/openssh-server/ in my mind ;-) | 04:04 |
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| ProN00b | can i change the bootlogo ? | 04:05 |
| mjg59 | ProN00b: Check the usplash source package. At the moment, the answer is not easily | 04:05 |
| ProN00b | ok, thanks (change it in next release plx ^^) | 04:06 |
| === ProN00b [n=dot@pD951A563.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["...] | ||
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| Keybuk | I wonder whether he realises what "pron" is | 04:07 |
| lamont | morning JaneW | 04:09 |
| JaneW | hi lamont | 04:09 |
| ogra | hey guys | 04:10 |
| JaneW | hey ogra | 04:10 |
| === ogra wonders why the heck spammers think he wants the same wristwatch george bush wears .... | ||
| lamont | Keybuk: that's why there's a capital N, you doof. | 04:16 |
| === lamont goes to watch people test, back much later. | ||
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| mdke | jdub, playing with planet is fun! | 05:39 |
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| Keybuk | I'm trying to decide whether the lifts really do hit -3g when they rest, or whether it's just my bird flu | 05:48 |
| === mdke informs customs not to let Keybuk back into the UK | ||
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| jsgotangco | hey Mez on the road? | 06:08 |
| Mez | jsgotangco, see http://www.sourceguru.net/ | 06:20 |
| Mez | arriving tomorrow | 06:20 |
| Mez | I need to go back to birmingham and get my passport | 06:21 |
| Mez | am on the way back there | 06:21 |
| Mez | leaving tomorrow morning to fly to UBZ | 06:21 |
| jsgotangco | Mez: Oh WOW | 06:22 |
| Mez | jsgotangco, yes, indeed | 06:23 |
| Mez | I'm an idiot | 06:23 |
| mdke | heh | 06:26 |
| mdke | watford twice on two days? | 06:27 |
| mdke | painful | 06:27 |
| Mez | nah | 06:28 |
| Mez | am going to get coach tomorrow | 06:28 |
| Mez | am on coach now | 06:28 |
| Mez | I wanna know why the seats have network leads coming out of them though | 06:28 |
| Mez | (not connected to anything, just there for some reason | 06:28 |
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| mdke | coach lan parties? | 06:29 |
| Mez | lol | 06:31 |
| Mez | would be fin | 06:31 |
| Mez | cept theres barely enough space to sit with my lappy | 06:31 |
| Mez | and the leads are like 10cm long at the bottom of the seats | 06:31 |
| Mez | weirdness | 06:32 |
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| jdub | #ubz for conference discussion | 07:13 |
| tseng | you better register ubz.com before lilo shuts you down | 07:14 |
| jdub | haha | 07:14 |
| tseng | ah some jokester owns it | 07:14 |
| tseng | spam domain | 07:14 |
| Lathiat | haha tseng | 07:15 |
| jdub | fascists | 07:16 |
| spayne | hey jdub | 07:17 |
| jsgotangco | heh | 07:18 |
| mdke | can we idle in there even if we're not at the conf? | 07:21 |
| tseng | no | 07:22 |
| tseng | just me and bob2 | 07:22 |
| jsgotangco | haha | 07:25 |
| jsgotangco | seriously? | 07:25 |
| Riddell | anyone can join, it just won't help me find someone to go for lunch with if you're not in montreal | 07:26 |
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| === ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:Riddell] : Ubuntu Development (not support, even with dapper) | #ubz for UbuntuBelowZero | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | MOM/NDA producing bad diffs | Ubuntu 5.10 released: http://www.ubuntu.com/newsitems/release510 | yes, dapper | ||
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| JaneW | who handles fonts, esp chinese fonts? | 08:37 |
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| seb128 | JaneW, "nobody"? | 08:37 |
| JaneW | I have a request which needs to be evaluated. | 08:37 |
| JaneW | I am not sure what to do with it | 08:37 |
| seb128 | JaneW, I'm not sure we have somebody knowing about chinese fonts ... | 08:38 |
| JaneW | is it a community issue? | 08:38 |
| JaneW | it's a hand written fax, which was sent to head office | 08:38 |
| seb128 | that's an issue for sure, I would not say a community one but I don't know who to point about that | 08:38 |
| JaneW | seb128: hmm.... I'll make it a BOF ;) | 08:39 |
| seb128 | good idea | 08:39 |
| jdub | JaneW: what's the request? | 08:43 |
| jdub | MORE BOF! MORE COWBELL! | 08:43 |
| JaneW | jdub: e-mail on the way! | 08:43 |
| jsgotangco | chinese fonts.... | 08:45 |
| JaneW | jsgotangco: you know about them? | 08:45 |
| jsgotangco | well i can read mandarin... | 08:45 |
| JaneW | jsgotangco: HZ, Big5 etc... | 08:45 |
| jsgotangco | yes Big5 especially | 08:46 |
| JaneW | and Guobiao | 08:46 |
| jsgotangco | what's the issue specifically? | 08:46 |
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| JaneW | jsgotangco: I'll send it to you. | 08:47 |
| jsgotangco | sure i only have 1 chinese keyboard though..hehehe i don't really use it much | 08:48 |
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| jdub | JaneW: right, thtat's all about input modules | 08:51 |
| jsgotangco | yes | 08:52 |
| jsgotangco | the fonts are available really | 08:52 |
| jsgotangco | the question is more of a default input mode | 08:52 |
| jdub | JaneW: he's just wanting input module stuf to work by default, which is something we're (roughly) working on | 08:53 |
| seb128 | use scim :) | 08:53 |
| JaneW | jdub: ok, so should I tell him to just install and try? | 08:53 |
| jdub | JaneW: hmm | 08:54 |
| jsgotangco | i believe our starter guide has a rough guide to install the support | 08:54 |
| JaneW | it would help if he had an EMAIL address... who faxes!? | 08:54 |
| jdub | weird americans | 08:54 |
| jsgotangco | well he can accept snail mail... | 08:55 |
| JaneW | yay | 08:55 |
| === JaneW wants to send a hand written response in mandarin.. | ||
| jsgotangco | well mandarin describes the spoken language rather than the written one :) | 08:59 |
| JaneW | jsgotangco: sigh, well there you go ;) | 09:00 |
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| jsgotangco | like seb128 said a while ago, there was a recent thread about scim on the list... | 09:00 |
| === jsgotangco digs that up | ||
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| jsgotangco | JaneW: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-October/012452.html | 09:03 |
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| === mdke bashes his head against planet | ||
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| zul | hey people | 09:37 |
| zul | ping pitti | 09:37 |
| zul | is everybody jetlagged? :) | 09:38 |
| zul | pitti: here is fabbione.. in what room are you dude? | 09:40 |
| pitti | Hi zul | 09:40 |
| pitti | zul: in 338 | 09:40 |
| pitti | zul: welcome! | 09:40 |
| zul | ok we are on the way down | 09:40 |
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| jdub | tseng: we totally have to get f-spot in the desktop seed | 09:50 |
| seb128 | jdub, yeah | 09:53 |
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| tseng | jdub: agree | 10:46 |
| tseng | jdub: (can you please moderate my ifolder mail to -devel) | 10:46 |
| jdub | tseng: ok | 10:47 |
| tseng | thanks | 10:47 |
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| Simira | weeehaa! | 11:06 |
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| pitti | MOO | 11:13 |
| seb128 | hey pitti | 11:13 |
| pitti | hi seb128, long time no see | 11:14 |
| seb128 | indeed | 11:14 |
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| jdub | tseng: dude | 11:40 |
| jdub | tseng: we won't be talking about beagle at UBZ, but it's still on the agenda (there's no one here to talk about it) | 11:41 |
| jdub | tseng: if you want to write up the spec and stuff, we can push it through approval :-) | 11:41 |
| jdub | tseng: not sure where we'll get a chance to cover f-spot either, but i think that'll just be a main inclusion and seed inclusion task | 11:42 |
| seb128 | f-spot on the CD? | 11:44 |
| pitti | argh - mono on CD? | 11:44 |
| jdub | hi boys :-) | 11:44 |
| === pitti pats his gthumb | ||
| jdub | seb128: i thought you said yeah earlier | 11:44 |
| pitti | hey jdub | 11:44 |
| ogra | isnt mono on the CD already ? | 11:45 |
| jdub | no | 11:45 |
| jdub | it's just in main | 11:45 |
| seb128 | jdub, I like the idea a lot, I just have pitti in the same root we wants to hurt me to get the CD place for his language-packs now :p | 11:45 |
| ogra | f-spot is the only app that can import from my new camera | 11:45 |
| seb128 | s/we/who/ | 11:45 |
| seb128 | s/root/room/ | 11:45 |
| === seb128 hates laptop's keyboard | ||
| ogra | if gthumb doesnt keep up, we'll have to use it | 11:45 |
| pitti | ogra: that's libgphoto, not gthumb | 11:46 |
| jdub | gthumb is a different kind of app, less interesting as a default app | 11:46 |
| ogra | yup | 11:46 |
| pitti | ogra: don't tell me that f-spot has developed a new library | 11:46 |
| ogra | i'd really prefer f-spot | 11:46 |
| jdub | pitti: NO | 11:46 |
| jdub | oops | 11:46 |
| jdub | sorry | 11:46 |
| jdub | caps lock :) | 11:46 |
| ogra | no idea... but it can import from any place... its not bound to gphoto... gthumb would need such a feature... | 11:47 |
| pitti | ogra: so if both f-spot and gthumb use libgphoto, it should work with either one | 11:47 |
| seb128 | jdub, who does the spec assignment? | 11:47 |
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| seb128 | jdub, ie: who should I poke to get the " Rhythmbox iPod integration should Just Work without configuration" assigned to me instead of pitti? | 11:47 |
| ogra | pitti, it doesnt work at all... i have to mount the camera as usb storage device and select the place to import from... gthumb cant do that | 11:48 |
| jdub | seb128: mdz, who is sitting next to me | 11:48 |
| seb128 | k | 11:48 |
| jdub | seb128: poked :-) | 11:48 |
| seb128 | thanks ;) | 11:48 |
| pitti | ogra: ah, usb-storage | 11:48 |
| ogra | (and gthumb doesntrecognize it as usb storage) | 11:48 |
| mdz | seb128: punched | 11:48 |
| jdub | seb128: and mdz punched me! | 11:48 |
| seb128 | ah ah | 11:48 |
| ogra | heh | 11:48 |
| pitti | ogra: gnome-volume-manager-gthumb | 11:48 |
| seb128 | jdub, don't blame me for that :p | 11:48 |
| pitti | ogra: gnome-volume-manager should recognize it | 11:48 |
| pitti | ogra: I agree, gthumb isn't totally good with usb-storage | 11:49 |
| pitti | but it works | 11:49 |
| mdz | seb128: so you will draft/implement and pitti can approve? | 11:49 |
| ogra | pitti, it does, and then gthumb breaks on import... | 11:49 |
| seb128 | mdz, right | 11:49 |
| mdz | seb128: you can't approve your own spec ;-) | 11:49 |
| pitti | mdz: works for me | 11:49 |
| mdz | done | 11:49 |
| seb128 | thanks | 11:49 |
| pitti | thanks seb | 11:49 |
| seb128 | np | 11:49 |
| seb128 | pitti, did you try f-spot already? | 11:50 |
| pitti | seb128: no | 11:50 |
| seb128 | it really rocks, that a cool stuff that we should have on the default installation | 11:50 |
| ogra | pitti, i'll come down and show you .... and can test the wireless in the elevator while i'm at it... what was the room number ? | 11:50 |
| jdub | pitti: i'll give you a demo later - it's completely rad | 11:50 |
| pitti | ogra: 338 | 11:50 |
| ogra | k, on my way | 11:50 |
| pitti | jdub: would be nice :-) | 11:50 |
| pitti | let's see what ogra shows off | 11:51 |
| jdub | pitti: i have silly pictures of mdz and mark in my 'demo reel' | 11:51 |
| pitti | jdub: WANNA SEE, WANNA SEE, WANNA SEE | 11:51 |
| seb128 | ogra, you can just go away, jdub has cooler pictures :p | 11:51 |
| ogra | :p | 11:52 |
| Keybuk | f-spot sucks because it won't import existing albums properly | 11:52 |
| seb128 | oh Keybuk | 11:52 |
| ogra | hmm | 11:52 |
| Keybuk | so if you want to use it, you need to spend three months recataloguing your already catalogued photos | 11:52 |
| ogra | wireless drops in the elevator | 11:52 |
| seb128 | Keybuk, mvo was looking for you :) | 11:52 |
| Keybuk | yes, we did that one | 11:53 |
| seb128 | k, cool | 11:53 |
| Keybuk | ogra: dunno about the wireless, my innards drop in the elevator | 11:53 |
| jdub | Keybuk: existing albums? old f-spot albums? | 11:53 |
| ogra | lol | 11:53 |
| Mithrandir | Keybuk: it should just use exif metadata, including the comments field. | 11:53 |
| Mithrandir | my hypotetical web gallery generator will do that | 11:54 |
| infinity | mdz : Speaking of not being able to approve one's own spec, I find it fascinating that I'm assigned as "approver" on a spec that's apparently already "approved" (and not by me..) | 11:54 |
| mdz | pitti: you have seen this photo already | 11:54 |
| infinity | mdz : https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad-upload-and-queue/+spec/upload-queue-management | 11:54 |
| Keybuk | jdub: no, just directories of photos | 11:54 |
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| jdub | Keybuk: yeah, it'll do that no problem | 11:55 |
| jdub | Keybuk: that's how i imported most of mine | 11:55 |
| Keybuk | jdub: no it won't, it just imports them, and ignores the directories they're in | 11:55 |
| mdz | infinity: that's a launchpad spec, someone else's problem :-P | 11:55 |
| Keybuk | so I have to go through again and say what they actually are | 11:55 |
| infinity | mdz : :) | 11:55 |
| Keybuk | the directories are named after the date, and the event, and where it was, and stuff | 11:55 |
| jdub | Keybuk: you want it to use directories as tags? | 11:55 |
| === infinity decides to go catch a plane. | ||
| Keybuk | jdub: yeah, for the initial import | 11:55 |
| jdub | it'll pull date from exif and so on | 11:55 |
| jdub | but yeah, won't make up tags based on dir name | 11:56 |
| jdub | might be an interesting option to raise with larry | 11:56 |
| mdz | infinity: safe travels | 11:56 |
| Keybuk | I've never bothered to set my camera's date and time | 11:56 |
| Keybuk | so that'll all be wrong anyway | 11:56 |
| jdub | you are soft | 11:56 |
| Mithrandir | infinity: have fun, see you tomorrow. | 11:56 |
| Keybuk | I'm not a photogeek, I'm just a random joe who happens to take a few pictures | 11:56 |
| jdub | you can't reset dates atm, which has mucked some of mine up a bit | 11:57 |
| Keybuk | and my camera is annoying, it forgets the date and time every time the battery runs flat | 11:57 |
| Mithrandir | Keybuk: get a camera where that is not a problem? :-P | 11:57 |
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| Keybuk | Mithrandir: why? | 11:57 |
| === Mithrandir has a P150 which takes a few hundred pictures on one charge. | ||
| Keybuk | it takes plenty of pictures, it just forgets the date and time if I forget to charge it for weeks | 11:58 |
| mdz | jdub: can you say "import all this stuff and set this tag on it"? | 11:58 |
| Keybuk | and seeing as I don't _use_ that for anything (I just name the directory when I copy the files off it) it's never bothered me <g> | 11:59 |
| jdub | mdz: you can for some types - one sec, i'll check | 12:00 |
| === jdub demos f-spot to mdz | ||
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