[12:06] <mpt> grrrrr freenode
[12:07] <mpt> anyone: What's the bzr equivalent of baz diff rocketfuel@canonical.com/launchpad--devel--0?
[12:08] <mpt> http://bazaar.canonical.com/IntroductionToBzr doesn't have an example of diffing against another branch, and "bzr diff -r ../archives/rocketfuel/launchpad" returns an error
[12:09] <bradb> mpt: bzr diff -r branch:/path/to/branch. It's a hidden feature, as best I can tell.
[12:10] <mpt> hmm, that doesn't return an error, but it doesn't return anything else either
[12:10] <mpt> I thought I made some changes ...
[12:10] <bradb> I haven't yet managed to sell the bzr developers on bzr diff behaving like svn diff is not a feature.
[12:10] <mpt> thanks bradb, I'll try fixing a bug and see if it works :-)
[12:10] <bradb> np
[12:12] <bradb> (or that if it doesn't behave like svn diff, there should at least be some other zero-thought-required way of finding out what you've changed on a branch.)
[12:12] <bradb> s/doesn't/does/
[01:15] <lifeless> beb0s: I'm not sure
[01:15] <lifeless> url ?
[01:16] <beb0s> https://launchpad.net/products/gcc/+series/head
[01:16] <beb0s> i've inadveritely linked to gcc-4.0 ... :-/
[01:16] <beb0s> now i've linked to gcc-snapshot package
[01:17] <lifeless> I see a 3.3 and 3.4 and snapshot links
[01:19] <lifeless> beb0s: is that wwhat you see ?
[01:19] <beb0s> yes, in this form https://launchpad.net/products/gcc/+series/head/+ubuntupkg i can't set empty package
[01:19] <beb0s> yes, I see gcc-3.3 gcc-3.4 and gcc-snapshot links
[01:21] <lifeless> ok
[01:21] <lifeless> the 3.3 and 3.4 ones are historical. AFAICT
[01:21] <lifeless> is the gcc-snapshot one correct ?
[01:22] <beb0s> I think so, gcc-snapshot_20051112-1 is in univese, so it's quite updated
[01:22] <lifeless> then I think its fine
[01:24] <beb0s> ok
[01:25] <beb0s> what will happen if I link a product release series (which does not correspond to any ubuntu source package) to a wrong source package ? can I remove that link ?
[01:26] <lifeless> does not look like it ;0. Could you file a bug ?
[01:27] <beb0s> ok, I'll do.
[01:28] <lifeless> thanks!
[01:29] <beb0s> another question : in this form https://launchpad.net/products/gcc/+series/4.0/+addrelease where should i put the url to tar.gz ?
[01:34] <beb0s> it's Bug #4556
[01:34] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #4556: can't remove link beetween products and source package Fix req. for: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New http://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/4556
[02:53] <HiddenWolf> Guys, I don't want to file a bug, but really, yellow on white isn't a good plan for anything.
[02:53] <HiddenWolf> please don't make people use it in specs or so. :P
[03:35] <jblack> heh. Hi. I have an anouncement: announce. Kthx bye
[03:57] <jbailey> I can't imagine why (s)he wouldn't want to file a bug.
[03:57] <jbailey> Filing a bug raises karma. =)
[04:17] <lifeless> jamesh: ping
[04:27] <jamesh> lifeless: pong
[04:35] <lifeless> can you kick off a review run?
[04:35] <lifeless> and did you see elmos message about SIGSTOPing your processes on macquarie ?
[04:39] <jamesh> there is a pending-reviews run going right now
[04:40] <lifeless> cool
[04:40] <jamesh> https://chinstrap.ubuntu.com/~jamesh/pending-reviews.new/robertc/launchpad/tests/ <- is that what you're looking for?
[04:41] <lifeless> :)
[04:41] <jamesh> (it'll go from pending-reviews.new/ to pending-reviews/ once the run is finished)
[04:41] <lifeless> yes, I know ;)
[05:14] <jamesh> lifeless: btw, here's a hack I wrote to get bzr to use openssh for sftp connections: http://people.ubuntu.com/~jamesh/bzr-openssh-plugin/
[05:14] <lifeless> -> #bzr dude
[05:50] <jordi> I have a msg here highlighted, but it's not in my buffer
[05:50] <jordi> can anyone tell me what was it?
[05:53] <lifeless> not I
[06:15] <jblack> I put my ubz pics up. http://gallery.linuxguru.net/ubz
[06:15] <jblack> Jordi! You live!
[06:20] <jordi> I do!
[06:20] <jordi> jblack: many, many, many thanks for all you did
[06:20] <jordi> I wish I could have said good bye
[06:20] <jordi> but you did right fleeing when you could
[06:20] <jblack> It was my pleasure, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat.
[06:20] <jblack> That was Paul's suggestion.
[06:20] <jordi> have you replaced the wheel tire?
[06:21] <jblack> Well, oddly, the tire has been fine since then.
[06:21] <jblack> I have a can of tire-inflater if it goes flat again.
[06:21] <jordi> jblack: tyre, anyway.
[06:21] <jordi> jblack: good
[06:22] <jordi> hmm. tire is valid too
[06:22] <jordi> strange
[06:22] <jblack> Tired as we were though, I've had a great story here at home about how I smuggled a spaniard and a brit across the US border. :)
[06:22] <jordi> jblack: haha, yes.
[06:22] <jordi> jblack: the tour was crazy since you left. mako being involved doesn't help :)
[06:24] <jblack> How's he doing?
[06:56] <jordi> jblack: as always :)
[06:56] <jordi> ok
[06:56] <jordi> 7AM
[06:56] <jordi> let's pretend I'm adapted to the TZ and go to work as normal
[06:57] <jordi> my brain will be fried in a few hours tho
[07:12] <jblack> jordi: You have to be up in 5.8 hours for the lp meeting anyways.
[08:41] <jordi> jblack: I'll be here at office :)
[08:41] <jordi> want it or not :)
[11:09] <stub> jamesh spiv: Ping
[11:09] <jamesh> stub: pong
[11:10] <stub> jamesh: What have you got on your plate after the bugzilla migration?
[11:10] <jamesh> stub: I'm looking at ErrorReportManagement right now
[11:11] <stub> Cool. 
[11:12] <stub> SteveA has asked me to coordinate infrastructure stuff while he concentrates on UI work, so I need to keep tabs on outstanding tasks, priorities, blockers etc. and to help out as needed.
[11:14] <jamesh> spiv posted to the list that he was sick today
[11:14] <stub> Ahh.. I see. Ta.
[11:14] <stub> I suspect he has his hands full with supermirror stuff
[11:15] <sivang> does anyone know if Martin Pool should come online sometime? 
[11:16] <jamesh> sivang: try #bzr
[11:16] <sivang> jamesh: k, thx
[11:38] <cprov> morning guys
[11:46] <Nafallo> morning Celso :-)
[12:02] <cprov> Nafallo: did I miss something ? or worst, did I do something wrong ?  I have this feeling when people reffer to me by my name and not my nick, in fact I remember my mother ;)
[12:05] <matsubara> good morning!
[12:11] <Nafallo> cprov: hehe. nope. I just like names from time to time :-).
[12:11] <Nafallo> also, with me there is no difference ;-)
[12:12] <cprov> Nafallo: right, I don't mind too ... just a thought 
[12:15] <Nafallo> :-)
[12:47] <SteveA> meeting in about 13 minutes
[12:47] <sivang> SteveA: in this channel right?
[12:49] <SteveA> yes
[12:53] <spiv> stub: pong
[12:53] <spiv> stub: Yeah, my main focus is supermirror stuff atm.
[12:55] <spiv> That, and to stop catching plagues...
[12:59] <SteveA> MEETING TIME
[12:59] <SteveA> who is present today?
[12:59] <jblack> moan
[01:00] <SteveA> good moaning to you too
[01:00] <jamesh> me
[01:00] <BjornT> me
[01:00] <ddaa> them
[01:00] <spiv> I'm here, surprisingly...
[01:00] <niemeyer> Here
[01:00] <matsubara> here
[01:00] <salgado> me
[01:01] <SteveA> kiko is on vacation
[01:01] <mpt_> me
[01:01] <lifeless> SteveA: hi
[01:01] <lifeless> SteveA: isn't this 45 minutes early ?
[01:01] <SteveA> steve@einheit:~$ date -u
[01:01] <SteveA> Thu Nov 17 12:02:12 UTC 2005
[01:01] <lifeless> oh, no its not, my bad.
[01:02] <jamesh> lifeless: you're on DST now
[01:02] <lifeless>     *
[01:02] <lifeless>       Thursday 17 November 1200 UTC - 1245 UTC
[01:02] <lifeless> I read that as starting at 1245UTC
[01:02] <SteveA> hi brad
[01:02] <bradb> hih
[01:02] <bradb> s/h$//
[01:02] <lifeless> anyway, I'd like to beg off and go crash, my eyelids are falling down
[01:02] <SteveA> == Agenda ==
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Roll call
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Agenda
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Next meeting
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Activity reports
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Production / staging (stub)
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Production gina run (stub)
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Robert's new role (lifeless)
[01:02] <SteveA>  - Importing stuff unofficially into rosetta. (mpt)
[01:02] <lifeless> $jetlag
[01:03] <SteveA>  - Keep, Bag, Change (Kinnison)
[01:03] <SteveA>  - Three sentences
[01:03] <SteveA> 
[01:03] <SteveA> lifeless: okay, but can you say a few words about your new role first?
[01:04] <lifeless> 1/2 time project helping/improving the quality of what we do - test frameworks, coding techniques, review processes etc. Cross-team launchpad/bazaar/distro.
[01:04] <stub> Yo
[01:04] <jordi> sorry guys, I am here
[01:04] <SteveA> hi jordi
[01:04] <lifeless> I have a short list of 15 odd things that should make development easier.
[01:05] <sivang> lifeless: what are you going to work on distro-team wise?
[01:05] <lifeless> once they are knocked over, I'll start looking at the broader picture stuff
[01:05] <SteveA> okay.  so lifeless is the new testing and quality czar
[01:05] <lifeless> sivang: on my plate is to read up the test plans, automated-testing and testing-server-hardware specs.
[01:05] <SteveA> lifeless: please (later on) schedule a meeting where we can talk about things to do with testing in launchpad
[01:05] <lifeless> sivang: related to that is making point-n-click review stuff for mdz to review changes to packages.
[01:06] <sivang> wow, cool
[01:06] <lifeless> SteveA: it can be part of next weeks lp meeting if you like, or are you saying one with me and you ?
[01:07] <SteveA> me + you + other interested people.  although it could be part of the development meeting, if it will not take long
[01:07] <lifeless> well, lets you and I have a small one tomorrow, 0800UTC ?
[01:07] <SteveA> ok
[01:07] <lifeless> anyone else thats wants to be around is cool. And we can take the output of that -> next weeks lp meeting.
[01:08] <SteveA> okay, great.
[01:08] <niemeyer> That's 6AM here.. :(
[01:08] <SteveA> there's also the meeting on thursday, niemeyer 
[01:08] <sivang> s/l$//
[01:08] <ddaa> Early bird takes the patch.
[01:08] <SteveA> so, you won't be missing anything. 
[01:08] <lifeless> its not a small topic, nor one that one meeting will finish.
[01:09] <niemeyer> SteveA: Huh?
[01:09] <lifeless> so there is plenty of time to put input in and discuss etc etc.
[01:09] <niemeyer> SteveA: Ah, sorry..
[01:09] <lifeless> ok, thanks, night.
[01:09] <SteveA> niemeyer: some people will talk about it tomorrow.  everyone can also talk about it next thursday
[01:09] <niemeyer> SteveA: I've read one word wrongly.. :)
[01:09] <niemeyer> Ok
[01:09] <SteveA> == Agenda ==
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Roll call
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Robert's new role (lifeless)
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Agenda
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Next meeting
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Activity reports
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Production / staging (stub)
[01:09] <niemeyer> Save the logs somewhere, please
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Production gina run (stub)
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Importing stuff unofficially into rosetta. (mpt)
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Keep, Bag, Change (Kinnison)
[01:09] <SteveA>  - Three sentences
[01:09] <SteveA> 
[01:10] <SteveA> sure.  fabionne's logging bot does it
[01:10] <SteveA> next meeting: thursday 1200 UTC? 
[01:10] <stub> fine here
[01:10] <SteveA> all not in favour, shout loudly in the next 10 seconds
[01:10] <bradb> LOUDLY
[01:10] <jordi> but, are we continuing with this one?
[01:10] <bradb> er, n/m
[01:11] <bradb> that works for me
[01:11] <SteveA> jordi: pardon
[01:11] <SteveA> ?
[01:11] <lifeless> SteveA: EARLIER
[01:11] <jblack> lifeless: you sould die
[01:11] <lifeless> its an 11pm start. Which is why this one has me beat.
[01:11] <SteveA> bradb: what time is it now for you?
[01:11] <bradb> 7:11
[01:11] <jordi> SteveA: hmm. I dunno, I thought this was being postponed until next week
[01:11] <bradb> (AM)
[01:12] <SteveA> jblack: for you?
[01:12] <jblack> Its 7am right now. earlier than that, and I get whiny. :)
[01:12] <lifeless> I'm typically up at 6am.
[01:12] <SteveA> jordi: you're getting confused with the distro meeting, i think
[01:12] <sivang> lifeless: is anything of what you're going to do is at the direction of https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+spec/launchpad-qa-management ?
[01:12] <SteveA> okay.  next week, 1200 UTC thursday.  with an agenda item to talk about moving 1 hr earlier.
[01:12] <lifeless> given that the northern hemisphere just went off daylight savings, and the southern onto, why dont we move it 12 hours ?
[01:13] <SteveA> next, activity reports
[01:13] <jblack> up to date
[01:13] <mpt> up to date except for yesterday's
[01:13] <SteveA> who is up to date (in the three or so days since the conference)
[01:13] <ddaa> up to date (but date who?
[01:13] <sivang> hehe
[01:14] <spiv> behind (already!).  Have sparse notes for the three days, though...
[01:14] <stub> I might have missed one - jetlag has made for strage hours
[01:15] <SteveA> one suggestion from jbailey is to pick a local time, say 5pm.  and then always send an activity report at that time.
[01:15] <jordi> not up to date since a week before ubz
[01:15] <SteveA> don't worry if you do stuff after that time.  put that into the next day's report
[01:15] <jblack> I do it each night to celebrate going off the clock
[01:16] <bradb> same here
[01:16] <ddaa> I do it last thing when I call it a day.
[01:16] <SteveA> to all those who are bang up to date, very well done.  i am impressed.
[01:16] <SteveA> to all those who are reasonably up to day, well done indeed.
[01:16] <SteveA> to all others (myself included), let's see if we can do better for next week's meeting
[01:17] <SteveA>  - Production / staging (stub)
[01:18] <stub> I'll roll our HEAD as of now next Tuesday to production, unless others scream
[01:18] <niemeyer> ddaa: Have you managed to merged the branch changes?
[01:18] <niemeyer> to merge
[01:18] <ddaa> niemeyer: check your inbox
[01:18] <ddaa> niemeyer: not yet pushed
[01:18] <stub> I will kick start the automatic staging updates again if people can confirm that it is no longer needed for testing bugzilla/gina/publishing
[01:18] <stub> (tomorrow)
[01:19] <ddaa> stub: I would really like to get the BranchDataStorage patch in prod by monday
[01:19] <jamesh> so a gina run is going to be done on Production?
[01:19] <SteveA> i noticed a thread going by about bugzilla -> malone.  not read it yet.  any show stoppers?  do we need to keep testing it on staging?
[01:19] <stub> jamesh: I have no idea - it is a meeting point for that reason ;)
[01:19] <SteveA> jamesh: next agenda point
[01:19] <ddaa> stub: but it's not merged yet, though it's should be ready for merge about just now
[01:20] <stub> SteveA: It has triggered Timout errors on pages that neglected to implement batching, and maybe some other timeouts not related to batching
[01:20] <SteveA> stub: can we get  those pages made into bugs?
[01:20] <stub> ddaa: By monday? On Monday is doable if it lands soon.
[01:20] <stub> SteveA: The one I'm aware of has been
[01:21] <SteveA> bradb, BjornT, jamesh: any other bugzilla migration issues that mean we'll want to do another run on staging shortly?
[01:21] <bradb> dunno. I haven't been able to check.
[01:21] <ddaa> stub: it'll land as soon as I can get pqm to listen to me...
[01:22] <jamesh> SteveA: after the gina run on production, it might be worth doing another run on staging with a copy of the gina data
[01:22] <BjornT> SteveA: none that i know of, but i haven't checked closely yet. i'll check today, though
[01:22] <jamesh> SteveA: but I'm fairly happy with the current output
[01:22] <bradb> The RequestExpired problems on some key pages are making it hard to verify. That's one of the things I plan to try and sort out today.
[01:23] <jamesh> bradb: the "/malone/bugtrackers/ubuntu-bugzilla" page isn't really a key page
[01:23] <SteveA> moving along...
[01:23] <stub> Ok. So to update..
[01:23] <stub> I will rollout HEAD as of ddaa's landing on Monday
[01:24] <bradb> stub: Can you wait until my X-Malone-Bug patch lands please? It's been dragging through code review for the last few days, but should be landed today.
[01:24] <stub> I will update staging code tomorrow to help with Bugzilla migration confirmation, but not nuke the database
[01:24] <stub> bradb: If it lands before or near Davids
[01:25] <stub> bradb: Is it blocking anything?
[01:25] <bradb> only blocking me from doing more work on InitialBugContacts on that branch. but it'd be a big favour to the users to get it in there ASAP
[01:25] <SteveA> it's a nice cosmetic change.
[01:25] <bradb> BjornT: can you have a look at that today please?
[01:26] <SteveA> not critical, but very nice to have
[01:26] <BjornT> bradb: it's not hard to create a new branch. but yeah, i'll look at it today.
[01:26] <SteveA>  - Production gina run (stub)
[01:26] <stub> We are going to try to stick to a more regimented schedule for rollouts - weekly rollouts may be delayed, making a fourtnightly rollout, if nothing considered urgent is landed.
[01:26] <stub> Also no cherry picks unless deemed 'urgent' either.
[01:27] <stub> I don't want to define urgent so we can maintain some flexibility
[01:27] <jordi> we all love the cherries
[01:27] <stub> Ok. As for Gina. I want to know what is currently blocking a production run.
[01:28] <stub> I'm aware of landing basic Librarian garbage collection, or more disk space on Macaroni.
[01:28] <stub> I'm not aware of anything else. I think I need Kiko to answer that though.
[01:29] <stub> Gina is blocking a number of other things, including Bugzilla bug migration, Debbugs migration, I believe some Rosetta stuff (?).
[01:29] <SteveA> making dapper open on launchpad...
[01:30] <ddaa> duck dissection?
[01:30] <SteveA> who says it is a duck?
[01:31] <mpt> the Fridge majority
[01:31] <SteveA> okay.  no decision on gina today.  i'll check with mdz, elmo and others later today.
[01:31] <stub> ok.
[01:31] <SteveA>  - Importing stuff unofficially into rosetta. (mpt)
[01:31] <mpt> (though, majorities can be wrong)
[01:32] <mpt> So, I saw on rosetta-users a couple of people independently wanting to translate apt
[01:32] <jordi> mpt: did you have something prepared for this one, or should I explain what's going on?
[01:32] <jordi> oh ok
[01:32] <mpt> I asked jordi about it and he said he wasn't sure what to do about debian stuff
[01:32] <mpt> where nobody from debian has approached Rosetta
[01:32] <mpt> is that a fair summary jordi?
[01:33] <jordi> I talked to SteveA, Kiko and Mark about unofficial stuff (ie, import requests which are not done by the upstream authors, or against upstream author's will)
[01:33] <SteveA> carlos appears not to be here 
[01:33] <jordi> for now, I had been trying to get them contact upstream to see if they were ok, but that normally ends up in they not coming back
[01:33] <SteveA> i think we want carlos here to discuss this
[01:34] <jordi> yeah... hm. Should I explain the rest so it's in the log?
[01:34] <SteveA> ok
[01:35] <ddaa> Mh... that's interesting, with bzr we can abuse pqm to merge between arbitrary branches, and so make it run test suites for us...
[01:35] <jordi> SteveA and kiko were ok with this approach. If there was no agreement from upstream, not import it (to avoid stale, rotting products owned by some random dude)
[01:35] <jordi> when I asked mark, he said we should import it, but mark them as "not official" prominently, so people can know that the work might or might not be used upstream
[01:35] <jordi> for Debian requests, that's another story
[01:36] <jordi> people want to import apt into a product translation
[01:36] <jordi> I think they should be assigned to a "Debian translators" group. APT translations are very well managed by bubulle@debian.org, for example
[01:36] <jordi> so stomping on this resource is wasting time in this case, and many others where bubulle is involved (d-i, dpkg...)
[01:36] <jordi> and that's it.
[01:37] <SteveA> jordi: please make a page on the wiki for RosettaNewTranslationPolicy (or some such name), and write the policy and the reasons for it there.  then, our next discussion on this is about improving or changing the policy on that page.  and it saves you from repeating yourself.
[01:37] <SteveA> thanks for making the explanation
[01:37] <jordi> SteveA: okie dokie
[01:37] <SteveA> time marches on...
[01:37] <SteveA>  - Keep, Bag, Change (Kinnison)
[01:38] <salgado> ddaa, I don't think that's optimal when chinstrap is pretty overloaded. :-(
[01:38] <SteveA> in the distro team meeting at UBZ, jeff bailey ran a session where people could bring up a topic, and say if it is something they want to Keep (a good thing we're doing)
[01:38] <ddaa> salgado: never said it was a good thing to do. Just that it was an interesting side effect.
[01:39] <SteveA> something they want to Bag (a thing we're doing that we shouldn't be), or something we want to Change (here's a better way of doing something)
[01:39] <SteveA> in future development meetings, bring a list of anything you want to Keep, Bag or Change, and bring them up during the meeting.  You may have nothing to bring up, which is fine.
[01:40] <SteveA> Kinnison: anything you want to say about this
[01:40] <SteveA> ?
[01:40] <SteveA>  - Three sentences
[01:40] <SteveA> fire your sentences into the channel!
[01:41] <salgado> DONE: Code review and wrote the new +packages page (after learning how SP, SPR, DRSPR & others work together)
[01:41] <salgado> TODO: Finish the new +packages and start with ShipItReporting
[01:41] <salgado> BLOCKED: No
[01:41] <ddaa> DONE: BranchDataStorage through review and final fixes
[01:41] <ddaa> TODO: get it merged and rolled out, rollout importd, bzrsync cronjobbing, update TheBazaar, BazaarTaskList
[01:41] <ddaa> BLOCKED: Nope
[01:41] <jblack> DONE: documents, advocacy
[01:41] <mpt> DONE: Lots of Launchpad bug report cleanup, getting to know bzr
[01:41] <mpt> TODO: preparatory fixes for new page layout, week's holiday
[01:41] <mpt> BLOCKED: no
[01:41] <jblack> TODO: same
[01:41] <jblack> BLOCKED: none
[01:41] <BjornT> DONE: UBZ. review. started on implementing DefaultAffectsTarget
[01:41] <BjornT> TODO: reviews. finish implementing DefaultAffectsTarget. finish implementing ticket-tracker-outgoing-email.
[01:41] <BjornT> BLOCKED: no
[01:41] <spiv> DONE: jet lag, flu, figure out temporary work environment until I get new laptop...
[01:41] <spiv> TODO: main focus is supermirror push server.
[01:41] <niemeyer_> DONE: Synchronizing since UBZ, polishment on bzrsync, starting local deployment
[01:41] <niemeyer_> TODO: Finish soyuz setup, continue the plan of world domination.
[01:41] <niemeyer_> BLOCKED: Nope
[01:41] <spiv> BLOCKED: not exactly, but it would be nice to get a new laptop, which depends on insurance money.
[01:41] <stub> DONE: Jetlag, LibrarianGarbageCollection
[01:41] <stub> TODO: Jetlag, LibrarianGarbageCollection
[01:41] <stub> BLOCKED: No
[01:42] <jamesh> DONE: jetlag / get bzr env setup on desktop / some bugzilla import fixes / start on ErrorReportManagement
[01:42] <jamesh> TODO: more work on ErrorReportManagement / code reviews
[01:42] <jamesh> BLOCKED: no
[01:42] <jordi> DONE: potemplatename reviews, email, ubz
[01:42] <jordi> TODO: imports for pending (mostly non-official) stuff, docs
[01:42] <jordi> BLOCKED: launchpad-experts
[01:42] <SteveA> lifeless: DONE - pqm ready to move to bellany, pqm community patch merging, sourcerer & hct fixes for pybaz usage.
[01:42] <SteveA> lifeless: TODO: wheeeooo. long list.
[01:42] <SteveA> lifeless: BLOCKED: elmo to get a i386 chroot for pqm to use when it moves to balleny
[01:42] <SteveA> DONE: various management things.
[01:42] <SteveA> TODO: convert website to moin (with henrik).  fix Vary header stuff.
[01:42] <cprov> DONE: soyuz UI, richer and faster pages
[01:42] <cprov> TODO: more soyuz UI (batching, urls, etc)
[01:42] <cprov> BLOCKED: none
[01:42] <SteveA> BLOCKED: no
[01:42] <matsubara> DONE: fixed bugs, migrate from baz to bzr, reported bugs.
[01:42] <bradb> DONE: (holiday 11/11), X-Malone-Bug, added some feedback messages to the Malone UI, partly landed. Lots of bugmail exchanges and exchanges with Nexenta.
[01:42] <matsubara> TODO: fix bugs
[01:42] <bradb> TODO: Finish InitialBugContacts and add many more feedback messages.
[01:42] <matsubara> BLOCKED: no.
[01:42] <bradb> BLOCKED: Not really.
[01:42] <SteveA> jordi: what does "BLOCKED: launchpad-experts" mean?
[01:44] <jordi> SteveA: I need launchpad-experts to be landed (kiko's patch) so I can tweak product details
[01:44] <SteveA> jordi: let's talk about that after the meeting
[01:44] <jordi> SteveA: ok
[01:44] <SteveA> same for your blockers, cprov 
[01:44] <SteveA> that's all folks.
[01:45] <SteveA> END OF MEETING
[01:45] <cprov> SteveA: sure
[01:45] <cprov> SteveA: uhm .. BLOCKED: None ?
[01:45] <SteveA> jordi: do you know what branch this is on?
[01:45] <jordi> SteveA: nope
[01:46] <SteveA> cprov: oh!  i read it wrong.  i read that you were blocked on : more soyuz UI (batching, urls, etc)
[01:46] <jordi> SteveA: it's not high priority
[01:46] <SteveA> jordi: can it wait until kiko is back from vacation?
[01:47] <cprov> SteveA: ehe kind of, but not really, plenty time to work on soyuz UI this week, let's rearrange the binaries path as I did for sources
[01:47] <jordi> SteveA: toally
[01:48] <SteveA> i'm off to get some lunch.  back later.
[01:48] <niemeyer_> SteveA: There was a missing "of soyuz" in my DONE sentence, if you're going to use it.
[01:56] <carlos> hmmm
[01:56] <carlos> SteveA, dude, sorry!! I forgot that the meeting was moved one hour before....
[02:09] <stub> jamesh's pending reviews script seems to be having issues
[02:09] <carlos> ok, it's a bit late but...
[02:10] <carlos> SteveA, I'm lacking the activity reports since a week before UBZ
[02:10] <carlos> SteveA, and my three sentences:
[02:10] <carlos> DONE: TranslationUploads
[02:12] <carlos> TODO: fix, small problem with a test on TranslationUploads, Rosetta bugs triage, language packs from Rosetta at 100%
[02:12] <carlos> BLOCKED: no
[02:27] <Nafallo> jbailey: rock on! :-)
[02:27] <jbailey> Nafallo: eh?
[02:27] <Nafallo> jbailey: "autobuilt package on commit"
[02:27] <jbailey> Nafallo: Oh, sorry.  That's not accurate. =)
[02:27] <jbailey> It's going to be, and I'm getting ready for it.
[02:28] <Nafallo> hehe
[02:28] <Nafallo> oki
[02:29] <jbailey> Nafallo: Part of it was moving to minutes precision on the timestamp.
[02:29] <jbailey> Which means I can now update this again with no problems. =)
[02:29] <Nafallo> :-)
[04:05] <DeCenT_DuDe> hello people
[04:05] <DeCenT_DuDe> anybody out there 
[05:15] <niemeyer> Anyone here knows what is an "overbroad except"?
[05:15] <niemeyer> ddaa: Besides you.. :)
[05:15] <stub> niemeyer: I haven't heard the term before, but I can understand its meaning
[05:16] <bradb> BjornT: are you sure about this being-able-to-break-expected-output-on-whitespace thing?
[05:16] <stub> I don't think 'overbroad' is actually an English word
[05:17] <stub> 'overly broad exception handler' would be correct
[05:17] <bradb> BjornT: e.g. related to this, it is expected that if >>> foo(bar) should return [1, 2] , writing the doctest output accidentally as "[1,2] " will fail.
[05:18] <BjornT> bradb: yes, pretty sure, i use it all the time. the example you just gave doesn't break at a whitespace.
[05:19] <bradb> BjornT: no but, as i say, it's related. i.e. the output must be literally exact, IME.
[05:20] <BjornT> bradb: not if NORMALIZE_WHITESPACE is used, which is the default in our tests. [1,    2]  would match [1, 2] 
[05:20] <bradb> hm, i may have gotten it to work this time, though i'm not sure why
[05:26] <bradb> wow, even:
[05:26] <bradb>     ['product=firefox; status=New; priority=None; assignee=None;',
[05:26] <bradb>      'distribution=debian; sourcepackage=mozilla-firefox;\n\tcomponent=None;       status=New; priority=None; assignee=None; '] 
[05:26] <bradb> works
[05:26] <bradb> er, there was a linebreak there before status=New in the example I copied
[06:02] <carlos> SteveA, hi
[06:03] <carlos> SteveA, did you see my messages this afternoon?
[06:04] <SteveA> carlos: no.  my computer crashed :-(
[06:04] <SteveA> it always goes flaky after an acpi package upgrade
[06:06] <SteveA> so, what's up?
[06:07] <ddaa> lifeless: if you are here, please authorise me to commit to rocketfuel/pybaz/devel
[06:08] <carlos> SteveA, I forgot the time change....
[06:08] <carlos> SteveA, so I was late for the meeting, sorry
[06:08] <SteveA> i saw about the time thing
[06:08] <SteveA> i keep a UTC clock around on my desktop as well as a local time one
[06:08] <SteveA> i find that helps with international meetings
[06:09] <carlos> SteveA, I added my report status and my three sentences bingo, let me look for them and send you it again
[06:09] <carlos> SteveA, well, evolution warns me, the problem is that I forgot to change the timezone for it 
[06:10] <carlos> SteveA, so I got the warning when I woke up (at .ca time) and didn't pay attentition...
[06:11] <carlos> carlos ok, it's a bit late but...
[06:11] <carlos> carlos SteveA, I'm lacking the activity reports since a week before UBZ
[06:11] <carlos> carlos SteveA, and my three sentences:
[06:11] <carlos> carlos DONE: TranslationUploads
[06:11] <carlos> carlos TODO: fix, small problem with a test on TranslationUploads, Rosetta bugs triage, language packs from Rosetta at 100%
[06:11] <carlos> carlos BLOCKED: no
[06:13] <carlos> SteveA, about "- Importing stuff unofficially into rosetta. (mpt)"
[06:14] <carlos> what should we do? have an specific meeting? wait for next Thursdays' meeting?
[06:14] <SteveA> okay.  i'll add those details into the meeting summary.
[06:16] <carlos> SteveA, thanks
[06:16] <salgado> hey SteveA, might you have some time for a quick review today?
[06:17] <SteveA> salgado: sure
[06:17] <salgado> SteveA, should I mail you the diff?
[06:17] <SteveA> okay, unless it is on the pending reviews page
[06:18] <salgado> no, it's not there yet
[06:22] <salgado> SteveA, sent
[06:22] <SteveA> carlos: so, what do you think about the issue of importing stuff into rosetta?
[06:23] <carlos> SteveA, I agree that it's a problem
[06:23] <SteveA> let's examine the problem
[06:23] <bradb> BjornT: I'm about to reply. Do you want the whole diff or just the diff of the changes made for my reply?
[06:23] <carlos> SteveA, and I don't know the best solution for that...
[06:23] <SteveA> here's an example of the issue
[06:23] <SteveA> some folks in lithuania want to translate roundup into lithuanian
[06:24] <carlos> SteveA, the idea of creating a Debian translation team is more or less how we are solving that issue with GNOME and KDE
[06:24] <SteveA> roundup doesn't have its pot or po files in rosetta yet, although it does have a product in launchpad
[06:25] <SteveA> so one of the lithuanian translators comes to jordi and says "can we have this in rosetta"
[06:25] <BjornT> bradb: diff of the changes will be fine
[06:25] <niemeyer> Will be back in 1h or so..
[06:25] <SteveA> if jordi says "yes, fine" and does it, what bad things can happen?
[06:26] <carlos> SteveA, that there are other translations for other languages that other Rosetta users add
[06:27] <carlos> and upstream never get them or they have a conflict there with the official translator for roundup
[06:27] <carlos> we try to prevent the missing languages asking for all .po files
[06:28] <carlos> but that will end with an out of sync after sometime because we don't care about updates, only for the initial import
[06:28] <bradb> BjornT: reply sent
[06:29] <SteveA> carlos: okay, so we get some translations happening in rosetta.  and meanwhile, there are other translations happening upstream.
[06:29] <carlos> righ
[06:29] <carlos> right
[06:29] <SteveA> can't that just be fixed by re-uploading the official ones, and letting rosetta merge?
[06:30] <carlos> SteveA, yes, but who will do it?
[06:30] <carlos> also, that only solves the upstream -> Rosetta path. We still lack the Rosetta -> upstream one
[06:31] <carlos> SteveA, with bazaar integration we would do the updates automatically
[06:31] <SteveA> so, is it a problem with expectations?  translators using rosetta are doing this work, and they expect it to be used upstream.  but often in this case, it won't be used.
[06:31] <SteveA> so people will be disappointed.
[06:31] <carlos> right
[06:32] <carlos> Mark added a tag to note that upstream is not using Rosetta officially
[06:32] <carlos> but I don't think it's good enough
[06:32] <SteveA> okay.  disappointment is a problem, because it makes people wary of using rosetta.
[06:33] <Nova> hey can anyone hel me 
[06:33] <carlos> SteveA, and upstream angry because we are duplicating their work
[06:33] <SteveA> tell me about how our policy solves this problem.
[06:33] <Nova> im newbie from here
[06:33] <carlos> Nova, hi
[06:33] <SteveA> hello Nova 
[06:33] <carlos> Nova, just ask what you need and we will try to answer you
[06:33] <SteveA> "Nova" means "newbie" doesn't it? ;-)
[06:34] <carlos> SteveA, the problem is our lack of policy here... that's what jordi/mpt want to solve
[06:34] <carlos> SteveA, in Spanish: 'it doesn't work' ;-)
[06:35] <carlos> well, 'No va' not 'Nova'
[06:35] <SteveA> i asked jordi to write a wiki page giving the current policy, and explaining why
[06:35] <SteveA> i think that's important, so we can point people at that page, and also change the page if we change the policy
[06:35] <carlos> ok
[06:36] <SteveA> what is a good policy for now?
[06:36] <SteveA> if the upstream agree, then fine
[06:37] <SteveA> we need things there if there are ubuntu packages
[06:37] <carlos> The best one is a conservative approach, only import what upstream maintainers ask to import
[06:37] <salgado> SteveA, how much work is it, to have custom error messages for each vocabulary. I mean, customize that "Invalid value" message you get when you try to file a bug on a package that doesn't exist, for instance
[06:37] <carlos> SteveA, ubuntu packages are unrelated to this issue, at least IMHO
[06:38] <SteveA> i think the localization teams need ubuntu packages in order to localize ubuntu 
[06:38] <SteveA> salgado: talk with stub.  he's done work in that area
[06:38] <carlos> SteveA, but those are not products, and we are directly upstream in that case
[06:38] <salgado> stub, still around?
[06:39] <carlos> SteveA, of course, we still have the problem of not sending back the updates from Ubuntu
[06:39] <SteveA> carlos: is having po files for packages very different from having po files for products?  is the issue that these are changes being made just for ubuntu (although the translated strings are available in the general pool) 
[06:40] <SteveA> salgado: it sounds like a fine idea, although maybe it should be per field and not per vocabulary.
[06:40] <salgado> SteveA, yeah, that would be even better
[06:40] <carlos> SteveA, the main thing is that ubuntu packages are sync automatically into Rosetta and exported to upstream "Ubuntu" also automatically
[06:40] <carlos> SteveA, with products, we do all manually 
[06:41] <SteveA> so product maintainers don't get much direct benefit from people translating on ubuntu packages.
[06:41] <carlos> SteveA, no, only if the translation team sends their changes directly to upstream or upstream uses Rosetta too
[06:42] <SteveA> i want us to be able to explain this to upstreams and translators
[06:42] <SteveA> i think this is tricky to understand, at first
[06:43] <carlos> I suppose we could add that to the same page that Jordi is writting at the moment
[06:43] <carlos> and add references to it from the Rosetta's about page
[06:46] <SteveA> okay.  i think i understand the issue
[06:47] <SteveA> i drew a diagram on a piece of paper.  i'll convert it into a picture, then we can talk about it and see if i understand right.
[06:47] <SteveA> carlos: will you be here in 45 mins / 1 hour?
[06:48] <carlos> SteveA, yes, I will be working 3 or 4 hours more
[06:48] <SteveA> okay
[06:54] <stub> salgado: Yo
[06:55] <carlos> stub, dude... which one is your current timezone?
[06:55] <salgado> stub, https://chinstrap.ubuntu.com/~dsilvers/paste/fileVuX5R7.html
[06:55] <carlos> stub, shouldn't you be sleeping atm? ;-)
[06:56] <stub> carlos: Yes, I should be sleeping. I actually got three hours before waking up again. Bloody jet lag.
[06:57] <stub> carlos: I'm currently on utc+7
[06:57] <salgado> stub, does that means we're having changes reverted in rocketfuel?
[06:58] <carlos> oh, still jet lagged? poor stub :-(
[06:58] <stub> salgado: Looks like it :-(
[07:02] <salgado> why aren't these reverted changes shown in the commit message?
[07:03] <stub> salgado: I'm not sure how to make a distinct validation message per vocabulary - I've only created custom validation messages with custom validators. You might be able to do it by applying a custom validator to the choice field, but that will only work if your custom validator is called before the builtin choice validator (is this item in this set)
[07:03] <stub> salgado: No idea. Maybe that tree just isn't updating. I'm checking.
[07:10] <stub> salgado: Oh - that is actually 'normal'.
[07:10] <stub> salgado: When pqm merges stuff, the working tree appears to be stuffed.
[07:10] <stub> salgado: However if you copy it and run 'bzr revert' in it, it is fine.
[07:11] <salgado> eh?
[07:11] <stub> salgado: The tree at chinstrap:/home/warthogs/archives/rocketfuel-built/launchpad/ is fine
[07:11] <stub> salgado: The 'archive' is all in the .bzr directory, and is fine. The other files are all messed up.
[07:12] <stub> salgado: If you rsync that tree somewhere, and run 'bzr revert' in the copy it will be 'fixed'.
[07:12] <stub> salgado: It is possible to just rsync the .bzr directory and run 'bzr revert' and the working tree will all be built
[07:13] <stub> I think it is a bug
[07:15] <salgado> this sounds too evil to me. I'd expect that the contents of the files inside chinstrap:/home/warthogs/archives/rocketfuel/launchpad/devel would be the real content I'll see if I branch or merge from there
[07:16] <stub> salgado: Indeed.
[07:20] <salgado> stub, matsubara just tried adding a custom validator to the choice field, but it's called after the builtin one
[07:20] <ddaa> gah... conflict during merge...
[07:20] <ddaa> I have to leave for a family appointement... will try to make the merge work when I come back.
[07:20] <ddaa> niemeyer: feel free to resolve the conflict and submit the merge with [r=SteveA]  :)
[07:21] <ddaa> feel free not to, if you're busy
[07:21] <niemeyer> ddaa: I'll do that
[07:21] <niemeyer> ddaa: Will be nice to go through all the path
[07:21] <niemeyer> ddaa: Is it pushed in the std location?
[07:21] <ddaa> warthogs/archives/david/launchpad/branches
[07:22] <niemeyer> Cool, thanks
[07:22] <stub> salgado: There is a chance the choice field already supports what you want, although it would involve wading through the Z3 source to discover it. Otherwise, doing this will require upstream work (adding a custom error message to a Choice field if the value is rejected by the given vocabulary)
[07:26] <shawarma> Is there any way to browse specifications? The spec tab only lists the 10 most recent ones..
[07:32] <SteveA> carlos: http://people.ubuntu.com/~stevea/rosetta-flow.png
[07:33] <carlos> and looks at it ;-)
[07:34] <carlos> SteveA, I think that diagram is more or less what we talked about, yes
[07:35] <carlos> thanks for it!
[07:36] <SteveA> carlos: okay.  so, the "source" openoffice doc for that is in the same directory
[07:37] <SteveA> i think the important thing is to make sure we get a feedback loop happening at the top of the diagram
[07:37] <SteveA> we should import stuff into rosetta, and encourage its use, only if it looks likely we'll get a feedback look happening
[07:38] <carlos> SteveA, ok, will tell jordi it so he can add the image to the wiki page
[07:38] <carlos> SteveA, ok, I think that's what jordi was thinking on 
[07:39] <carlos> and I think it's the more 'polite' solution with upstream
[07:40] <SteveA> so, practically speaking, we can offer keen translators to translate anything we have an ubuntu package that we build
[07:40] <SteveA> and any upstream product where the upstream is okay with it
[07:40] <SteveA> the upstream doesn't have to use rosetta primarily, and doesn't have to use rosetta exclusively
[07:41] <SteveA> but they must be aware that people are using rosetta to translate their product, and be agreeable to this, and to taking work from rosetta and using it in their product
[07:41] <SteveA> any specific policy is based on these principles.
[07:42] <SteveA> does that all sound good, carlos ?
[07:43] <carlos> SteveA, yeah
[07:43] <carlos> I think it's a good plan
[07:43] <SteveA> okay.  please make sure all this gets written on the wiki.  There are three points of view here that we need to take care of -- three kinds of people.
[07:44] <SteveA> we have upstream product maintainers.  we have package maintainers and language pack builders.  we have translators.
[07:45] <SteveA> to upstream product maintainers, we can say that we want to help people to translate their products.  we often want to do this anyway for ubuntu, so that we get good translations in ubuntu releases.
[07:45] <SteveA> but, we'd like to improve the translations that everyone else who uses their product gets too.
[07:45] <SteveA> if they want to do that, they need to accept translations contributed via rosetta.  here's how....
[07:46] <niemeyer> SteveA: I think Rosetta is one of the parts that may get easy adoption by upstreams..
[07:46] <carlos> SteveA, ok
[07:46] <SteveA> some projects have chosen to make rosetta their main way of managing the translation effort for a product.  if you want to do this, here's how...
[07:46] <niemeyer> Maintaining .po files by hand is a boring task..
[07:47] <carlos> niemeyer, specially when we are able to do the integration with bazaar so they just need to merge from a branch.
[07:47] <SteveA> to translators: if you want to translate something that does not have pot files in rosetta, then if there's an ubuntu package, you can translate that, and have your work get into the next language pack.
[07:47] <niemeyer> carlos: Uh.. that's a dream..
[07:49] <carlos> niemeyer, it's planned but not in the next months
[07:49] <SteveA> to translators: also, you may want to translate "upstream", meaning to translate the latest strings for a particular software product.  To do that, and make the work count, we need to get agreement from the maintainers of the software product that they want to get translations from rosetta.  So, contact the maintainers and say... (supply an example email).  then, if the product maintainers agree, tell the rosetta admins that they can add those pot files 
[07:49] <SteveA> and po files by doing...
[07:49] <SteveA> niemeyer: yes, you're right.  it does help a lot.
[07:50] <SteveA> carlos: let's lay this out, separately for each kind of user, and get an example of what the email could look like to help people with this.
[07:50] <carlos> ok
[07:51] <carlos> sounds like a plan
[07:51] <SteveA> once you and jordi have put this together, let me know and we'll go through it and see how it all hangs together.
[07:52] <SteveA> as i said at UBZ, i'm making UI and user-facing stuff my main focus now.  this kind of documentation is important, as it helps people see what we're offering, and understand how they can best interact with what we're offering.
[07:54] <carlos> SteveA, I'm planning to request elmo to create lists.launchpad.net so we can move the launchpad related mailing lists there (rosetta and malone ones)
[07:55] <carlos> SteveA, and perhaps we should move too wiki.launchpad.canonical.com to wiki.launchpad.net
[07:55] <carlos> and add those pages there
[07:55] <carlos> instead of use wiki.ubuntu.com
[07:56] <salgado> stub, actually, the custom validator is called before the builtin one (value in vocab). the problem is that the call to SimpleInputWidget.getInputValue() will end up calling vocab.getTermByToken(value), and it will then raise a ConversionError("Invalid value", e)
[07:56] <carlos> SteveA, would that be part of your 'UI and user-facing stuff' ?
[07:56] <SteveA> carlos: i think we need a place for launchpad user documentation.  this is not the same thing as having the development-related docs.
[07:57] <carlos> SteveA, so wiki.launchpad.canonical.com and wiki.launchpad.net ?
[07:57] <carlos> instead of move it?
[07:58] <SteveA> maybe.  i want to think about this, and discuss it with others
[07:59] <carlos> ok, I will wait then
[08:24] <salgado> hey SteveA. any news on that code review?
[08:26] <SteveA> salgado: i have a problem -- can't read my email
[08:26] <salgado> ouch. :-(
[08:26] <SteveA> there's some networking broken, which means the mail server isn't on the network right now
[08:28] <salgado> SteveA, https://chinstrap.warthogs.hbd.com/~salgado/person-packages.diff :)
[08:30] <SteveA> okay
[08:30] <SteveA> what does it do?
[08:32] <niemeyer> SteveA: .../archives/rocketfuel/launchpad/devel is the one considered the development trunk?
[08:32] <niemeyer> SteveA: In other words, is that the one we should merge if we want to get code in production?
[08:34] <salgado> SteveA, put something useful in the person/+packages page. 
[08:34] <salgado> niemeyer, yes, for both questions
[08:35] <niemeyer> salgado: Thanks! :)
[08:37] <salgado> niemeyer, you're asking bzr or pqm?
[08:38] <niemeyer> salgado: bzr.. there are known conflicts.. must fix them first.
[08:40] <Aiste> hi, I want to translate roundup into lithuanian
[08:40] <Aiste> or rather I'm more than halway through doing that
[08:40] <Aiste> s/halway/halfway/
[08:40] <Aiste> how do I get that translation up into Rosetta?
[08:47] <matsubara> Aiste: Have you tried https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RosettaFAQ ?
[08:48] <Aiste> i did in fact
[08:49] <Aiste> the problem is , that roundup is not there
[08:49] <Aiste> so I need as your software helpfully explain, to contact someone from rosetta admins and get them to put the relevant po files up there
[08:49] <Aiste> that is the reason I am here
[08:50] <salgado> carlos, ^^
[08:51] <carlos> Aiste, the RosettaFAQ describes the procedure to request an upload
[08:51] <carlos> salgado, thanks for the ping
[08:51] <carlos> Aiste, the problem is that we are moving into a policy that we will not add new products unless the maintainers want to use Rosetta so we are sure that the translations are used
[08:51] <Aiste> carlos: thanks, missed taht bit :)
[08:52] <Aiste> yeah, i will email Richard Jones about that too
[08:52] <Aiste> don't worry :)
[08:52] <carlos> Aiste, ok, thanks!
[08:58] <Aiste> carlos: an interesting thing is that when I go to launchpad, find roundup there and click on translation
[08:58] <Aiste> i get a message suggesting that I should ask the Rosetta team to set it up by sending an email to the Rosetta mailing list. You should give them the URL to the Roundup Issue Tracker.pot and .po files. You will be able to start translating once they are imported.
[08:58] <Aiste> there is no link to the relevant portion of FAQ or anything like  that
[08:58] <Aiste> quite confusing
[08:59] <carlos> Aiste, yeah, I will update that page soon, don't worry
[08:59] <Aiste> ok :)
[08:59] <Aiste> that is why i did not see the relevant bit of FAQ
[09:31] <lifeless> ddaa: 
[09:31] <lifeless> [/home/pqm/archives/rocketfuel/pybaz/devel] 
[09:31] <lifeless> published_at=sftp://chinstrap.ubuntu.com/home/warthogs/archives/rocketfuel/pybaz/devel
[09:31] <lifeless> commiters=canonical
[09:31] <lifeless> ddaa: you are already authorised.
[10:13] <salgado> SteveA, around?
[10:22] <carlos> SteveA, hi, around?
[10:41] <SteveA> carlos:hi
[10:43] <carlos> SteveA, don't worry I got some problems with tests but I fixed it already. Thanks
[10:46] <SteveA> ok
[10:47] <lifeless> SteveA: hows the z3 snapshot progress ?
[10:49] <SteveA> not started yet
[10:52] <lifeless> I'm hesitant about ripping up the test runner until thats done. Is there an eta on it? Or is it something I can get the ball rolling on ?
[10:55] <SteveA> i'll need some help making bzr work for me, unless paramiko / other sftp stuff is up to it.  other than that, it won't take me all that long to do.
[10:59] <lifeless> ok. so if you can do it at a time that has me awake, we can collaborate on any issues.
[10:59] <SteveA> okay
[10:59] <lifeless> we should ensure we forward port our bugfixes at the same time
[10:59] <lifeless> I can definately help with that
[10:59] <lifeless> night