=== mgalvin [n=mgalvin@cpe-69-205-47-165.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === lips [n=lips@132-bem-14.acn.waw.pl] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === lips [n=lips@132-bem-14.acn.waw.pl] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === manicka [n=grant@203-217-90-215.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Chipzz [i=chipzz@noa.ulyssis.student.kuleuven.be] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === siretart [i=siretart@ubuntu/member/siretart] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === slomo [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === sladen [i=paul@starsky.19inch.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Treenaks [n=martijn@messy.foodfight.org] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bob2 [i=rob@crumbs.ertius.org] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Riddell [i=jr@kde/jriddell] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === JanC [n=janc@lugwv/member/JanC] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bmonty_laptop [n=bmontgom@wsip-68-15-230-31.om.om.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === MarioMeyer [n=meyer@ubuntu/member/mariomeyer] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ajmitch [n=ajmitch@port161-157.ubs.maxnet.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === uniq [n=frode@213.184.199.55] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === vuntz [n=vuntz@fennas.vuntz.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === spacey_ [n=spacey@flits101-191.flits.rug.nl] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mjg59 [n=mjg59@cavan.codon.org.uk] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === smurf [n=smurf@debian/developer/smurf] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === \sh_away [n=nsh@ubuntu/member/backslash-sh] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ubuntugeek [i=brandx@vr0.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === asw [n=asw@karuna.med.harvard.edu] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === cyphase [n=cyphase@adsl-68-127-138-235.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === hunger [n=hunger@p54A63560.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === cyphase [n=cyphase@adsl-68-127-138-235.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@59.92.39.32] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rhcpd [n=rhcpd@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Kamion [n=cjwatson@83-216-156-196.colinw664.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rhcpd [n=rhcpd@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === rhcpd [n=rhcpd@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rob1 [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mgalvin [n=mgalvin@cpe-69-205-47-165.nycap.res.rr.com] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === robitaille [n=robitail@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === hunger [n=hunger@p54A60181.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:robitaille] : gendas: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingAgendas | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/ | 18 Nov 14:00 UTC: DocTeam | 22 Nov 22:00 UTC: Community Council | 23 Nov 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 24 Nov 14:00 UTC: Dapper Development Status === vuntz [n=vuntz@fennas.vuntz.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === dholbach [n=daniel@i577B09CF.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mvo [n=egon@ip181.135.1511I-CUD12K-01.ish.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Simira [n=rpGirl@214.84-48-74.nextgentel.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === hunger_ [n=hunger@p54A639A7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Chipzz [i=chipzz@noa.ulyssis.student.kuleuven.be] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === Hirion [n=Hirion@p5487F41D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === jbailey [n=jbailey@modemcable139.249-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rhcpd [n=rhcpd@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === kjcole [n=kjcole@pchb1f.gallaudet.edu] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === jjesse [n=jjesse@mail.ftpb.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === rhcpd [n=rhcpd@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === bshumate [n=bshumate@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:53] mm let's wait a bit before we start [02:57] are we set? [02:57] i am :0 [02:58] great let's aim for quality then [02:58] heh [02:58] Here physically and virtually, but on my schedule, not mentally. ;-) [02:58] is it too early to be here mentally kjcole [02:58] ? [02:58] kjcole: are you on campus? [02:58] Yep. [02:59] do you have the agenda somewhere? [02:59] ok [02:59] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamMeetingAgenda [02:59] who's here? [02:59] me === jsgotangco -> Jerome Gotangco [02:59] jsgotangco: Perhaps I should say I'm on MY campus: Gallaudet University... === dholbach is Daniel Holbach [03:00] kjcole = Kevin Cole [03:00] kjcole: -color please === bshumate is Brian Shumate [03:01] err anyone else? === jsgotangco grabs bhuvan === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] [03:02] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamMeetingAgenda is our agenda [03:02] mdke told me, that my attendance was required regarding the future packaging of the ubuntu docs? === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] [03:02] i believe so [03:02] hmm what's wrong with bhuvan [03:02] anyways [03:02] dholbach: are you in charge of the packaging now? [03:03] yes [03:03] or will you be mentoring someone? [03:03] awesome... [03:03] i had a brief look at the complete source of the svn, but was not able to figure it out yet [03:03] i will investigate a bit more at the weekend === bhuvan [n=ubuntu@b14.gw.maa.collab.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [03:03] okay bhuvan seems to be having problems on connecting === Riddell is JonathanRiddell [03:03] regarding the one-source-package-story: i heard it somewhere and thought it was decided on already [03:04] bhuvan: you ok now? [03:04] yeah [03:04] yes [03:04] ok let's tackle 1 and 3 first since bhuvan will be leaving soon [03:04] any feedbacks/suggestions about w.u.c/ServerGuide ? [03:04] bhuvan current wrote the spec for the server guide [03:04] its located at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerGuide [03:04] i haven't read it yet but it looks pretty comprehensive based on the TOC [03:04] today i wish to discuss about the topics, finalize couple of terminologies we may use in our serverguide [03:05] ok [03:05] bhuvan: with whom do you work on this? [03:05] bhuvan: do you plan to diverge from MAIN repos? [03:05] bhuvan: just scanned it and it looks good [03:05] jsgotango, no [03:05] ok so its all MAIN stuff then [03:05] dholbach, it's based on rhel admin guide [03:05] jsgotango, yes [03:06] jjesse, ok [03:06] bhuvan: who are you working with at the moment, do you have a draft already? === jsgotangco just svn up [03:06] jsgotangco, no [03:06] bhuvan: can we know your whole name if you don't mind? [03:06] i do've a template at http://puggy.symonds.net/~bhuvan/ubuntu-doc/build/generic/serverguide/C/ [03:07] bhuvan: you might want to talk to fabbione, because he works on the server edition on the distro side [03:07] Bhuvaneswaran Arumugam [03:07] dholbach, sure [03:07] shit my seat just fell [03:07] bhuvan: and infinity, but i'm not quite sure [03:07] dholbach, ok [03:08] yes [03:08] anyways [03:08] bhuvan has been contributing a lot with patches and stuff [03:08] and one page template at, http://puggy.symonds.net/~bhuvan/ubuntu-doc/build/generic/serverguide/C/serverguide-all.html [03:08] i'd like to request svn access for him... [03:09] bhuvan: what else do you need to help you on the project? [03:09] resources, etc.? [03:09] jsgotangco, ok .. but, before that let me discuss about the terminologies we may use in our server guide [03:10] okay [03:10] shoot [03:10] A question from someone new to the whole process: I keep seeing svn. bzr/launchpad not ready enough for prime time? (Or am I so new to this that the question doesn't make sense?) [03:10] first, the editor. the choices are vi/vim/emacs. i prefer vim [03:11] i dont think we ship a plain vi [03:11] kjcole: we've been using svn from the very start, a bzr transition will take time and planning and we'll need the lp team's help [03:11] kjcole: at the time svn was set up baz had a steep learning curve. bzr should be really good now but I think this cycle will stick with svn [03:11] bhuvan: what do you mean? like rteferring to an editor in examples and such? [03:11] kjcole: but we're going there [03:11] how about nano? [03:11] its pretty easy enough even for newbies imo [03:11] at least that the default [03:11] I was going to mention nano... [03:12] bhuvan: quanta, kate and presumably gedit are also choices === mgalvin [n=mgalvin@host-66-202-95-170.spr.choiceone.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [03:12] Riddell: for servers? heh [03:12] Riddell, depends if you want to write the guide for servers with GUI [03:12] dholbach, i meant the editor we use to configure [03:12] dholbach, ie.. to edit conf files [03:12] Riddel, server wont have X. so we cant rely on gedit [03:12] bhuvan: i'd go for nano, its pretty easy for beginners [03:12] jsgotangco, for edubuntu (a server distro) it would be appropriate [03:13] i would say "edit bla file" and maybe in the first paragraph mention howtos for the editors *shrug* [03:13] (If nano's in the mix a "-bkw" would be a useful default/alias somewhere.) [03:13] vi/vim is like a chapter on linux in a nutshell :) [03:13] and probably make a back up of the default conf files first before editing.. [03:14] jsgotangco, ok [03:14] bhuvan: I would assume nano then but have small chapters for vim and emacs as well [03:14] dholbach, i prefer to be specific with the editor to use [03:14] yeah, that was merely my own opinion ;) [03:14] dholbach, ok [03:14] bhuvan: maybe mention that in the beginning that you're going to use nano but you're free to use any editor... [03:14] at least you'll have a scope/limitation on the editor part [03:14] jsgotangco, ok [03:15] ok [03:15] k anything else bhuvan? [03:15] next, package manager [03:15] choices are apt-get/aptitude. i prefer apt-get [03:16] it would make sense on the server to use apt-get, no gui is instaleld by default [03:16] me too, but aptitude is far more beginner friendly [03:16] (Sorry: -Bkw (-B=backup, -k=kill from cursor to line end instead of entire line, and -w=no unsolicited wordwrapping.) [03:16] jjesse, i agree [03:16] aptitude at least has a gui of sorts [03:17] why is aptitude considered more newbie friendly? when i started using linux it was debian and i learned apt-get [03:17] jjesse, me too.. [03:17] I could never get the hang of aptitude [03:17] me either [03:17] jjesse, imagine a win 2000 adim in such a environment [03:17] *admin [03:17] bhuvan: will there be a general introduction to the command line chapter? [03:17] imo, if he is used to command line, then apt-get would be a cake-walk [03:17] ogra i am a windows admin [03:17] he'd kiss your feet for at least some gui love [03:17] that's what i do for a living [03:17] ogra: he's want to use adept/synaptic then [03:17] Riddel: general introduction ? [03:18] jjesse's dirty secret :) [03:18] jjesse, but *you* know debian based systems ... [03:18] your toc contains aptitude or maybe its still wip? [03:18] but i started using linux after i was a windows admin [03:18] bhuvan: yeah, introducing GUI users to the command line [03:19] in any case, we may give an introduction about all possible package manager [03:19] jjesse, sure, i mean the guy who heard about linux and wants to try out the one a friend recommended it to him... to probably adopt it for his setup [03:19] Riddell, ok [03:19] well apt is definitely more popular than aptitude... [03:19] sure [03:19] Will the average admin use much more than update, upgrade, dist-upgrade and install? (Once in a while remove or clean.) Doesn't seem too complex... [03:19] so, shall we decide on apt-get ? [03:20] +1 from me [03:20] i'd go for apt [03:20] as i said intially, i prefer it personally... but for newcomers i'd suggest aptitude .. [03:20] cool [03:21] ok so we're cool on apt? [03:21] + 1 for apt, -1 for aptitude including for beginners [03:21] heck if its in the guide then the "newbies" will learn apt :) === jane_ [n=JaneW@wbs-146-188-200.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [03:21] ok [03:21] nice [03:21] next regarding contribution ? [03:21] sure [03:21] contribution on what? [03:21] i may cover most part of sys conf/network related applications [03:21] any takes for windows networking/misc stuffs ? [03:22] s/takes/($1)ers [03:22] samba for example? [03:22] jsgotangco, exactly [03:22] hmmm if you can finalize your TOC i can make a draft of samba stuff... [03:23] as a windows admin i can look into it [03:23] cool [03:23] and probably some on bind and dncp [03:23] ok [03:23] hope you meant dhcp ? [03:23] yes [03:23] bhuvan: the synaptic chapter should really be an adept chapter when included in kubuntu, I wonder if it's possible to use profiles for that [03:24] Riddell: i guess, we're going to have one generic server guide [03:24] Riddell: if i recall we tried to use profiles at one time and it messed things up? [03:24] bhuvan: are you planning to add gui stuff? i assume this is all cli [03:24] bhuvan: the doc would be included on the kubuntu install if the person typed server at the install [03:24] Riddell, you'll stay with adept ? [03:25] apt-get/aptitude> note that aptitude provides a perfectly good command-line replacement for apt-get; consider that as well as its UI [03:25] bhuvan: yes, kubuntu docs should include the server guide, synaptic is the only chapter I can see that ought to be changed somehow, not a huge issue though [03:25] for kubntu yeah we will [03:25] ogra: of course, why not? [03:25] ogra: will the default edubuntu install still have gnome running on the server? [03:25] Riddell, good point. we can include it [03:25] jsgotangco, yes [03:25] any target date to freeze the toc ? [03:26] jsgotangco, it needs a installed desktop... (no need for a running one though... but gdm doesnt cost much) [03:26] bhuvan: there's no LTSP on the TOC [03:26] jsgotangco, ok [03:26] Riddell, its UI reminds on bugzilla :) [03:27] lol [03:27] jsgotangco, i'll add [03:27] bhuvan: great [03:27] what else [03:27] i repeat, any target date to freeze the toc ? [03:27] mgalvin: anything to say on the server doc? [03:27] bhuvan: its your call [03:27] This is where I should probably dig myself a bigger hole: Jeff Elkner and I are theoretically working on an Edubuntu Cookbook based on the tuxLab Howto... The LTSP stuff will be in there, no doubt. [03:28] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerGuide looks good at the moment [03:28] jsgotangco, ok [03:28] kjcole, thats fine ... [03:28] fine [03:28] kjcole: sure [03:28] kjcole: Cookbook? "How to fry your thin client: Just add water" [03:28] guess, we can move on to (3) [03:28] haha :) [03:28] 1 [03:28] kjcole, the server guide they are talking about is rather "how do i install all ltsp stuff manually on a non-edubuntu" [03:28] ok since bhuvan will be leaving let's jump to 3 [03:28] doh wrong window [03:29] kjcole, while edubuntu comes preconfigured ;) [03:29] Quicktour - XML or HTML [03:29] ? [03:29] yeah, we're maintaining the html version in our svn [03:29] jsgotangco: I have only been partly following the meeting, is the server guide going to be about ubuntu-server or ubuntu as a server [03:29] imo, it's odd. let's convert it into xml ? [03:30] mgalvin: ubuntu-server [03:30] i thought it was about ubuntu-server [03:30] + howto use ubuntu as a complete server [03:30] ok, just clarifying for myself, thnx [03:30] bhuvan: mgalvin has been working on "instant server" along with fabbione and others you might want to talk with them too [03:30] ubuntu-server doesn't have synaptic then [03:31] jsgotangco, yeah, i'm aware of it === Hirion [n=Hirion@p5487F41D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [03:31] jsgotangco, sure i'll [03:31] ok can we jump on 3 then? [03:31] i already had :) [03:31] ok [03:31] what's wrong with the html [03:31] :) [03:31] what's the issues for XML or docbook? HTML can't be translated easily presumably but docbook needs clever stylesheets and might restrict layout? [03:32] it looks odd, let's convert it into xml and maintain the uniformity accross the repo [03:32] i believe its in xhtml so its can be translated [03:32] i don't have any suggestions atm, i will read the meeting log when i have time and post any comments to the list (i am busy back and forth a bit atm) [03:32] xml gives flexibility to convert between html/pdf .. [03:32] if need be.. [03:32] but if its going to be converted to xml, it can be flexible [03:33] mgalvin, thankx [03:33] jsgotangco, yes [03:33] it was converted before, but its a very simple document really [03:33] but anyways, [03:33] The html issue is that there's no trivial way to associate other languages with it. In docbook, you can have multiple omf files that give links to the right languages. [03:33] jbailey: right... [03:33] So it's not the document itself so much as the things *using* the documents. [03:33] scrollkeeper lovely :) [03:33] Right. [03:34] anyayws, docbook always was the choice we're smart enough to transform any xml document :) [03:34] so, we can maintain xml ? [03:34] That said, if what you're producing is documentation, there shouldn't be so much need for crazy styling - docbook is good enouhg to produce books. =) [03:34] yes [03:34] It's mostly when you're doing things like the firefox about page that converting from docbook will always suck. [03:34] cool [03:34] i think the only question is how the quicktour will look then right? [03:35] jjesse: sure but that would be voodoo css then heh [03:35] we have 5 more months [03:35] ok so we settled on xml then [03:35] its only 1 document [03:35] :) [03:35] jsgotangco, thankx [03:36] * time to start to "HARRY POTTER and the gobert of fire" [03:36] bhuvan: can you update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects to reflect your changes [03:36] lol [03:36] thanks bhuvan [03:36] we'll request svn access for you [03:36] jsgotangco, ok [03:36] jsgotangco, ok [03:36] bhuvan: have your gpg key ready [03:36] jsgotangco, yes [03:36] in lp [03:36] yes [03:36] ok we go back to 2 [03:37] Packaging - single source package to be used for {edu}{k}ubuntu? (mdke and dholbach) [03:37] bye bye [03:37] dholbach? [03:37] yeah... it was my misunderstanding... i thought that "one source package for all the docs" was decided on already [03:37] does this mean all docs will be in one package? [03:37] if there are no shared chapters between docs, it might make sense to have them separately [03:38] edubuntu will have pretty specific docs [03:38] yeah [03:38] as will kubuntu [03:38] no... one source package can build a huge lot of binary packages [03:38] this doesn't make sense to me really [03:38] we aren't profilling [03:38] so a additional edubuntu-docs package should be fine [03:38] they only have shared libs on svn [03:38] but not on the doc itself [03:38] i'm talking about a SOURCE package :) [03:38] there are shared docs too, like server guide [03:38] You can also make an ubuntu-docs-common [03:38] For shared bits [03:38] yeah === dholbach hugs jbailey [03:39] Just make sure you update the DapperStandardsBase bits if you do that, please. [03:39] although, kubuntu might want different stylesheets and output compated to ubuntu [03:39] For branding, we specifically said that ubuntu-docs could be overridden. [03:39] very different stylesheets [03:39] yeah... let's just drop the idea [03:39] jbailey: because its possible that oems would want to do their own docs right? [03:39] it was my misunderstanding, sorry [03:39] jsgotangco: Right. [03:39] the -coomon package idea sounds very cool [03:40] *-common [03:40] yes [03:40] ogra, Riddell: so the three of us will take care of the packages? [03:40] we can dump all the libs and license stuff on -common i guess [03:40] dholbach, i'll care for edubuntu-docs [03:40] cool [03:40] dholbach: ok, but if you set up e.g. scripts to do weekly uploads then mind and include us [03:40] How I would do it, I think, for a -common would be to have that in a separate repo, decide on those styles and lock 'em down early if you can. Any change to those will start to affect a lot of packages. [03:41] Riddell: same goes for you :) [03:41] jbailey: the -common would probably start on the svn itself... [03:41] i would be fore setting up styles and everything, that way i wouldn't have to always bug riddell over and over again :) [03:42] is *-common good for us? [03:42] or needs further discussion [03:43] I think further. [03:43] well are we going to have diff [03:43] sorry [03:43] wrong window [03:43] I've seen people say 'yay' and people say 'kubuntu and ubuntu might want different styles' [03:44] edubuntu as well :) [03:44] ok [03:44] I don't think -common would work with different styles [03:44] its a good base of discussion though [03:45] ok so we'll move this on the list then [03:45] Riddell, do you use lsb-release ? [03:45] Removal of "K" from the front of Kubuntu documents [03:45] ? [03:46] ogra: for what? [03:46] like my original kquickguide.xml? [03:46] Riddell, to set it to Kubuntu insterad of Ubuntu [03:46] Well, the wiki allows me to change styles, and lots of HTML comes with alternate styles... Is it a silly idea to have multiple styles and some scripts for each variant (k-, edu-) set a default style while offering up the alternatives? [03:46] Riddell, see lsb_release -a [03:47] jjesse: ? [03:47] ogra: no, the kubuntu /etc/lsb-release file is the same as for ubuntu [03:47] Riddell, we could add a debconf setting to select the right style based on lsb-release, if we both would start setting the right value there [03:47] sorry work called missed [03:47] jjesse: removal of K? [03:47] yes please :) [03:48] does it bork the doc? [03:48] the documents are already in the kubuntu directory as a namespace [03:49] also the Makefile targets are hard to understand acronyms like kak, which should be changed to e.g. make about-kubuntu [03:49] I think that affects the ubuntu docs too, it's just a wee thing to make it less user friendly [03:50] well that's true and kak sounds like turd [03:50] yep :) [03:51] so that's agreed, just a question of if me or jjesse does it and does the ubuntu Makefile follow [03:51] anyways, i was just having fun back then when i did the kname on the doc [03:51] ah hah, it's all jsgotangco's fault :) [03:51] heh [03:51] sorry back from work [03:52] the kname doesn't really affect much of the doc itself unless there were some magic involved that i didn't see at all :) [03:52] like i said over email only thing to do would be to change the make file and rename the docs on svn right? [03:52] yes basically [03:52] jjesse: yes. so me or you to do it? [03:52] they don't link back to the other docs [03:53] i can do it today [03:53] groovy [03:53] ogra: NOOOOO [03:53] it looks like a slow day at work :) [03:53] ogra: lsb-release is not going to be polluted by debconf madness [03:53] ok that's settled then [03:53] Moving locale C --> en? [03:53] hmmm [03:53] this is a gnome thing [03:53] dholbach: ping? [03:54] pong [03:54] is locale C really required instead of en? [03:54] ogra: nor can it possibly return different values for Ubuntu and Kubuntu, since both are built out of the same archive [03:54] jsgotangco: what do you want to change? [03:54] Kamion, i dont want to pollute it, i wanted to read from it [03:54] The C locale is the fall back one. [03:54] en isn't usually the fallback. [03:54] Kamion: and presumably same for edubuntu [03:55] jbailey: this messes up other installs say FR? [03:55] if the fallback isn't C? [03:55] Well, you'd have to teach scrollkeeper that the fallback was en instead. [03:55] Riddell: yes, hence ogra should know this [03:55] jbailey: nice [03:56] that'll probably bork the other upstream stuff then [03:56] why would you want to change it in the first place? [03:57] well one member raised it before [03:57] mh [03:57] i think it messes up transformation of sorts [03:57] don't really remember the technical details [03:57] we can move this to list [03:57] i see [03:57] I'd be inclined to put it with a "provide technical reasons, come again soon" [03:58] jeff schering isn't here... [03:58] jbailey: i'll make a comment on that then [03:58] anyways [03:58] not much members came anyways [03:58] i'd like to discuss docteam member stuff [03:58] and get opinion from those here [03:58] :) [03:58] if there's nothing you want with me right now, i'd leave to grab something to eat and take my dog out [03:59] dholbach: Woking the dog? [03:59] dholbach: cool i think we're done [03:59] dholbach: don't work your dog man [03:59] jbailey: errrr no :) [03:59] poor murphy [03:59] jbailey, hey, we are not in chinatown anymore [03:59] ... [03:59] this is the right time to leave :) [03:59] heh [03:59] see you later guys and thanks for the meeting [03:59] anyways [03:59] https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-doc has the current membership [04:00] obviously its restricted membership [04:00] but i'd like to ask if its reasonable that we make members with svn access to sign the coc [04:00] mandatory :) [04:00] besides we upload too in ubuntu servers [04:01] I would be inclined to simply restrict svn commit access to members. [04:01] Anyone who's contrib'd a bunch of things can qualify as a member. [04:01] i think members should sign the CoC [04:01] but don't give svn access to all members [04:01] jbailey: of course...but i'm inclined that team members sign the coc too [04:01] not all members commit correct? === Riddell notes dual use of word "member" here [04:01] Riddell: Right, sorry. [04:02] I meant, restrict SVN commit to Ubuntu members. [04:02] jbailey: ahhhh [04:02] And encourage folks who are active contributors to get their Ubuntu membership anyway, since it integrates them into the Ubuntu community in general. [04:02] In my blundering around in launchpad, I've created teams that were probably better left uncreated, one of which was the Edubuntu Cookbook team. [04:02] good point [04:03] kjcole: sure go crazy in lp anyways... [04:03] or like the team of all jonathans that one day i was a member of :) [04:03] So, speaking of docs, there needs to be more Launchpad docs for people like me. ;-) [04:03] jjesse: you arn't any more? changed your name? [04:03] jbailey: i probably got 1 or 2 people in the team list with commit access but not an ubuntu-member though... [04:04] kjcole: well https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects has a sampling of current work [04:04] (Edubuntu used to be there btw) [04:04] jsgotangco: Right, but if they've contributed enough to get svn access, then they've certainly done enough to become an Ubuntu member [04:05] sure if it interests them at all (one don't) [04:05] Do you really think it would be a blocked? [04:05] blocker, rather? [04:06] not really, but i'd have them sign the coc since they do work in ubuntu servers for one [04:06] being a -member is their own choice [04:06] only blocking would be a time issue, 2 weeks to next CC meeting then however long to get an SVN account is a hassle [04:06] but any current -member can easily get svn access sure [04:07] boss was around, Riddell i'm no longer amember of that team [04:07] i didn't change name or antying [04:08] what team? [04:08] the all jonathan's team [04:08] jjesse: I don't seem to be either, wonder where it's gone [04:08] lol ok [04:08] didthe team get deleted? [04:08] anyways [04:08] this needs more discussion [04:08] and more ubuntu-doc members [04:08] its probably a good cc topic too, not just for ubuntu-doc but for other teams [04:08] I agree with jbailey though, just make sure everyone is an ubuntu member [04:09] can i just say that AS/400 query sucks [04:09] jjesse: This isn't news. =) [04:09] But sometimes I miss green text on a black background. =) [04:09] not news for me either, but i hate working w/ it :( [04:09] jsgotangco: Will you bring it up with the CC? [04:09] they want to move here from green screen to in the web browser [04:09] Riddell: that's really a good suggestion and makes sure the one who commits actually went through the acid test [04:10] jbailey: i need to ask the other guys (burgundavia, mdke, rob, etc.) [04:10] jsgotangco: And the you don't necessarily need to worry about CoC for people without SVN because it's always getting filtered through someone who has. [04:10] jjesse: ah https://launchpad.net/people/jouuamaoe [04:10] i would vote for svn access go to members [04:10] my subscription has been deactivated [04:10] ubuntu-members is already settled they're whitelisted then [04:11] the question now is svn access be restriected to ubuntu-members, meaning potential contributors need to become an ubuntu-member === jsgotangco is warming up on the thought just now... [04:12] based on the amount of patches they submitted to the mailing list they would be good canidates for inclusion to ubuntu-members, shows theyare dedicated [04:12] yes [04:12] kjcole: what's the plan on the cookbook? [04:13] Sorry, stepped away for a minute. [04:13] jsgotangco: Plan? We don't need no stinking plan! [04:13] that's the spirit! [04:14] bshumate: you there mate? you got any questions while we're still here? [04:14] we can wrap up now [04:14] hmm [04:14] alright [04:14] has any work started on the ubuntu desktop doc? [04:14] Honestly, I don't know. As I mentioned at the Edubuntu meeting two days ago, I wasn't at the table when I got committed to doing it. (I was off in another room with the LTSP people.) [04:14] i am here...no questions. very professional bunch ya got here! [04:15] jsgotangco: can i e-mail you later with any other questions though? [04:15] Riddell: last time i looked at it, a lot of screenshots got moved [04:16] bshumate: sure dude [04:16] So, I'm learning about things like XML, docbook, LTSP, revision management, and oh... Edubuntu. None of which I've used. Jeff who's the other member of the team has at least used LTSP. [04:17] kjcole: i started with zero too last year when i joined the project really [04:17] anyways we had a good meeting [04:17] hopefully the next will have more people (mdke, burg, etc.) [04:17] Riddell: i've started a little on the kubuntu desktop guide but nothing ready to be commited [04:18] Well, I'm willing, and hopefully able, just not quite ready. Soon though. [04:18] i'll post the minutes tommorow [04:18] next meeting in 2 weeks, 22:00UTC!!!! [04:18] keep the launchpad calendar updated [04:18] See ya. [04:18] oh crap dec. 2 [04:18] i'll be in seoul [04:18] jeezz [04:18] anways [04:18] dec. 2, 2200UTC! [04:19] adjourned! === jjesse [n=jjesse@mail.ftpb.com] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] [04:19] jjesse: would you be able to commit anything? just so we have a template to play with for setting up the packaging? === bshumate [n=bshumate@adsl-21-151-159.clt.bellsouth.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] [04:19] bah === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Konversation] === jeffsch [n=jeffsch@fatwire-204-28.uniserve.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === hunger [n=hunger@p54A647F8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fadumpt [n=fadumpt@adsl-068-159-113-247.sip.gsp.bellsouth.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === jbailey [n=jbailey@modemcable139.249-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === doko_ [n=doko@dslb-084-059-084-248.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === hunger [n=hunger@p54A60F99.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === kjcole [n=kjcole@pchb1f.gallaudet.edu] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === kjcole [n=kjcole@pchb1f.gallaudet.edu] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mvo [n=egon@wtli-d9b99b06.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === kjcole [n=kjcole@pchb1f.gallaudet.edu] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === lamont [n=lamont@mib.fc.hp.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting