=== sven-tek [n=sven-tek@p508E5E60.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #edubuntu [12:45] Hi guys! I could connect a thin client to the edubuntu server, and I could log in. However, when I log off (from the client), I can't log in anymore. Any hint? === konfuzed [n=KonfuzeD@H129.C72.B0.tor.eicat.ca] has joined #edubuntu === apokryphos [n=apokryph@70.85.216.98] has joined #edubuntu === sven-tek [n=sven-tek@p508E5E60.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #edubuntu === Orandic [n=asd@stjhnf0122w-142163131063.nl.aliant.net] has joined #edubuntu === gand [n=gand@62-101-126-208.ip.fastwebnet.it] has left #edubuntu [] === chang-xi [n=chang@Kitchener-HSE-ppp3571377.sympatico.ca] has joined #edubuntu === chang-xi [n=chang@Kitchener-HSE-ppp3571377.sympatico.ca] has left #edubuntu ["Leaving"] === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-252-84-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu [03:49] hi [03:49] arkan0x: holas [03:49] mhz, holas ! === zakame [n=zak@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #edubuntu === kjcole [n=kjcole@pchb1f.gallaudet.edu] has joined #edubuntu === mhz is going off === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu [06:09] ogra: hi there === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === robitaille [n=robitail@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #edubuntu === Burgundavia [n=corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #edubuntu === zakame [n=zak@210.213.70.216] has joined #edubuntu === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === juliux [n=juliux@141.30.211.85] has joined #edubuntu === JaneW [n=JaneW@wbs-146-182-174.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #edubuntu [09:24] hi JaneW [09:24] hello highvoltage [09:24] hi JaneW, highvoltage [09:24] hi ajmitch_ [09:24] hi JaneW highvoltage ajmitch_ [09:25] hi juliux [09:25] heh [09:25] hi ajmitch_ [09:25] hi juliux [09:25] :) [09:30] JaneW, greetings === P3L|C4N0 [n=gcamposm@201.240.251.151] has joined #edubuntu [09:32] hi burgie [09:32] this channel is full of greetings tonight [09:33] I really should be going to bed. It is midnight here === crimsun extends further greetings [09:35] hi Burgundavia [09:35] hm here it is 9:30 in the morning [09:35] hi crimsun [09:35] hi JaneW [09:35] Burgundavia: how's Canada - cold yet? [09:36] we don't get snow where I live [09:36] part of the reason I live here [09:36] Victoria, not Canada in general [09:37] JaneW, what is your involvement with LaptopTesting? [09:39] Burgundavia: oic [09:39] Burgundavia: I am not particularly involved at all [09:39] darn, I hoped you could get me another laptop ;) [09:39] JaneW, who at canonical leads that little band of merry men [09:39] ? [09:39] claire, isn't it? [09:40] she did the initial work, I just wondered if she was continuing with the day to day stuff [09:40] Burgundavia: mjg59 [09:40] ok [09:40] Matthew Garret [09:40] but I thought Matthew didn't work for you guys [09:41] I wouldn't think there'd be much day to day stuff to continue with at the moment === \sh_away is now known as \sh [09:41] somewhat [09:41] just the technical side with mjg59 does [09:41] morning \sh [09:42] I am thinking mostly of the social stuff about getting people involved and keeping them involved [09:42] defining a clear goal, etc. [09:42] I didn't hear much after I got the laptop === \sh is now known as \sh_away [09:42] just some reminders on irc to keep the wiki updated === \sh_away is now known as \sh [09:43] ya [09:43] I'm out of the team for now though :) [09:43] unless you want me to pull out the old latitude junker [09:43] is there any value is getting it to work? [09:44] no, it was working fine with breezy [09:44] but the latch holding the battery in broke & I'll have to tape/glue it in === ajmitch_ took it to UDU [09:44] hmm, new Suse 10.1 alpha 3 screenies [09:45] nothing much to write home about [09:45] an odd mix of kde and gnome === ajmitch_ will hopefully get a new laptop in the next 2-3 weeks [09:46] I can see why they are pushing for Tango [09:46] since I'll need it before mid-january & LCA [09:51] well, night all === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #edubuntu === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === coolio_za [n=hilton@rndf-146-41-05.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #edubuntu === aeon17x [n=aeon17x@58.69.16.151] has joined #edubuntu === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === Katsumoto [n=teraflop@bbned225-210-100.dsl.hccnet.nl] has joined #edubuntu === aeon17x [n=aeon17x@58.69.16.151] has joined #edubuntu === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #edubuntu === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === coolio_za [n=hilton@rndf-146-41-05.telkomadsl.co.za] has left #edubuntu [] === aeon17x [n=aeon17x@58.69.16.151] has joined #edubuntu === jane_ [n=JaneW@wbs-146-171-20.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #edubuntu === ealden [n=ealden@219.90.94.61] has joined #edubuntu === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has left #edubuntu [] === zakame [n=user@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #edubuntu === zakame [n=zak@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #edubuntu === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-252-84-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu [02:40] hi [02:40] ogra: ping [02:40] ogra: I got a question [02:40] mhz, pong [02:41] There's someone with a DB on linux relate questions (for training) [02:41] Keduca is default in Edubuntu [02:41] and moodle will be [02:42] so, what would you suggest [02:42] either make them work under Keduca or make them availbale for moodle in the future? [02:44] i think keduca will stay for a while, but how hard is it to make it available for both ?# [02:45] don't know much about DB. what should I ask him about? (in order to find out best way) [02:46] all you will need is a script to convert from one to the other format i guess [02:46] ok [02:47] I'll see what Keduca needs [02:47] ro be feeded [02:47] ro = to [02:48] ogra: thx [02:48] welcome :) [03:03] ogra, did you get any e-mails from the essener linuxtage? [03:05] not today, nope [03:05] ogra, no in the past [03:05] yes.. [03:06] ogra, can you forward it to me? [03:06] ogra, they think that you are the one who manag the both [03:06] heh [03:06] so the send all e-mails to you and not to me [03:07] address ? [03:07] and in the irc they said to me, why you didn't know it, we send you an e-mail [03:07] juliux@ubuntu-de.org [03:08] forwarded [03:08] i guess they meant the kubuntu mail ... [03:08] ogra, thanks [03:08] i dont have anything else looking official her [03:08] e [03:08] ogra, ok [03:16] ogra: hmm, I have a doubt. For EdubuntuSoftwareList, I am trying (am now) to list them as a table. The idea is we can easily see: Application Name, Languages we tried it in for both Audio (when applicable) and Menus, Ages group we can use it, Category we can use it (Mat, Chem, Lang, Biology, etc) [03:17] ogra: I never thought i'd say this but i guess Moin is not a good candidate for such a table, or is it? [03:17] :) [03:17] no idea :) you are the wiki specialist [03:17] hi mhz [03:17] mhz, we don't will do lightscribe, you need for every cd/dvd 30min [03:17] juliux: hi [03:17] ask JaneW, she has a lot experience with huuge wiki tables :P [03:18] juliux: coool! so freedom will be? [03:18] ogra: oh, good [03:18] JaneW: [03:18] JaneW: ping [03:18] mhz, printing on the cd/dvd [03:19] juliux: good [03:19] mhz, but there ist no guarantee that it works under linux [03:19] juliux: why? [03:19] mhz, at first we have to find someon who will buy such a printer ;) [03:19] juliux, talk to amu, he uses it under linux afaik [03:20] mhz, don't aks me ask epson [03:20] which printer do you need? [03:20] mhz, i think it will be a epson stylus photo r220 [03:20] mhz, it only cost 99 [03:20] which reminds me, i need to talk to him about selling edubuntu CDs :) [03:20] is that cheap in Deutschland? [03:20] mhz, yes that is cheap [03:21] ogra, you really want this? [03:21] ogra: he's selling edubuntu cds? [03:21] :) === juliux dislike amu [03:21] juliux, sure, why not ? he has the shop and the equipment to make them professional ... [03:21] i'm not happy at all with self printed B/W covers and self burned unlabeled CDs [03:22] ogra: are they easy-to-access CDs? [03:22] ogra, yes i know [03:22] mhz, whats "easy-to-access" ? [03:22] juliux: selling cds is another biz model. it is not a bad idea, as long as the price you charge is 'easy-to-access' [03:23] ogra, the problem i have with this where is advantage for the community? [03:23] its about 2 (which is about $2.50) === vmarks [n=vmarks@adsl-065-015-231-005.sip.rmo.bellsouth.net] has joined #edubuntu [03:23] ogra: IMHO easy to access = reasonable prize someone would be happy to pay for, mainly because he'll get good quality [03:23] juliux, they get CDs [03:23] ogra, you also can download it [03:24] juliux, we are planning a official vendors page for the edubuntu page ... [03:24] ogra, i dislike it if there is a person who realise profit with freesoftware [03:24] and as long as you cant get them through shipit, people lkike amu are important for distributing them in a professional way [03:25] ogra, in my opinion there is no advantage for edubuntu [03:25] it was the same with kubuntu, which you couldnt get thrugh shipit [03:25] juliux: Tecnocimiento biz model includes the idea of returning a % of the profits to the Community Memebers (active ones) [03:25] juliux, for the many compynys that ask me for pressed CDs its the best alternative [03:25] ogra, kubuntu is something total differents [03:26] nope, not at all [03:26] ogra, it is, because amu develops on kubuntu [03:26] if we cant ship CDs its our responsibility to make them available somehow ... [03:26] juliux, this doesnt matter [03:26] ogra, i think that is matter [03:27] juliux: oh, so your point is you are against of biz out of work people have not put effort in? [03:27] mhz, no im against biz if there is no backflow to the community [03:27] oh, i see your point [03:27] there is a flowback ... [03:27] mhz, i have no problems that there are kubuntu cds/dvds in amus shop [03:28] ogra, where it is? [03:28] ogra, where is the problem that you burn the cds yourselfe? [03:28] juliux, people with no access to CD writers and with no opportunity to download get Cds [03:28] juliux: but unfortunately, that is Ethics issue. Ethics is not specified in "freedom" manifesto. [03:28] ogra, but you also need an internet access to buy this cds [03:28] juliux, i work 14h a day, whne should i care about shipping CDs ? [03:29] ogra, i didn't said that you should to it [03:29] juliux: hence Tecnocimiento (I lead the small group) will send $% back to community. [03:29] ogra: waah [03:29] juliux, sitting in a shag in africa with modem connection i can order them, but cant download [03:29] hm [03:29] juliux, and thats the majority of edubuntu users [03:30] they have no CD writer, have no fast internet access ... [03:30] anyway i dislike it if there is no backflow to the community, there is some guy who makes money with something he didn't make [03:30] my main target is to get my CDs to the users ... there amu helps a lot [03:30] ogra, of course [03:31] and, in Chile, institutions do prefer professional look over "hand-written" cds [03:31] juliux, he makes about 0.20 per CD for the time he invests... [03:31] ogra, klein vieh macht auch mist [03:31] i dont think he earns *anything* by making the CDs .... [03:31] ogra, if it so its ok [03:31] ogra: however, i still do not have funds to have professional cds printed out nor to order from amu :( [03:31] the money comes from merchandise, not selling CDs [03:32] mhz, we'll have a bunch of pressed CDs in dapper ... [03:32] ogra, if i burn a cd and print it cost not more than one euro! [03:32] ogra: yup, I am pacient (i guess :D ) [03:33] juliux, and packing, labelling and goint to the post office is for free ? [03:33] you invest time ... [03:33] juliux: maybe with the money amu makes from selling he can spend time in contributing to kubuntu ? [03:34] for example :) [03:34] mhz, ogra it is something generally not especially for amu [03:34] hehehe [03:34] well, i dont know [03:35] I think that we should always encourage biz models around freedom of IT access [03:35] juliux, its business ... [03:36] ogra, but there diffrent kinds of business [03:36] juliux, without business models around free software, we wouldnt be here [03:36] juliux: how ever, i do agree with you on the fact that we need sustainable development of it [03:36] ogra, lehmans spend at debian for every debian dvd the sell [03:37] thats fine, but their decision [03:37] so we should also encourage more community backflow of profits [03:37] ogra, and such business is ok for my [03:37] and be sure, for a 10 dvd pack they still earn more than amu [03:37] s/my/me [03:37] even if they give money to debian [03:37] and why should amu give money to canonical ? [03:38] ogra, not to canoncial [03:38] ogra, to the foundation [03:39] the foundation ? haha [03:39] ogra, or to the community or something else [03:39] ogra, yes i think so [03:39] ogra, the foundation needs money in the future [03:39] i think [03:40] as long as canonical exists, the foundation wont do much active work i guess ... [03:40] since there is no need to ... [03:42] ogra, it is not my decision who makes edubuntu cds or dvds [03:42] mine neither, they are freely availale ;) [03:43] but i like to know my distributors.... [03:43] ogra, i know, but i want to tell my opinion, and yes i knwo that i am a idealist. [03:43] and amu did a huge amount of work for ubuntu/kubuntu already ... === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #edubuntu [03:44] JaneW: ping [03:44] jsgotangco: hi [03:44] hello [03:44] ogra, yes and he is one of the radical kde/kubuntu people in germany [03:44] mhz: evening m8 [03:44] hi jsgotangco [03:44] juliux, whats wrong with this ? [03:44] jsgotangco: could you take a look at EdubuntuSoftwareList? [03:45] ogra, i will tell it to you in essen [03:45] sure === jsgotangco has time [03:45] jsgotangco: I gotta decide what is simpler to admin/contribute [03:45] juliux, there are radicals in gnome as well ... [03:45] mhz: Active Directory [03:45] ogra, but not in germany [03:45] jsgotangco: either table layout or simple listing === jsgotangco hides [03:45] ogra, and not such radical [03:45] juliux, sure there are [03:45] jsgotangco: ?? [03:45] ogra, who? [03:45] even more radical [03:45] ogra, in germany? [03:45] go to guadec :) [03:45] ogra, i was there [03:46] you'll meet germans that are more radical and meet the ones that are less radical ... [03:46] ogra, who? [03:46] radigal germans/ [03:46] ? [03:46] or pick a random gnome or kde message at heise and look at the forum :) [03:46] ogra, i was the last years on the fair both of gnome [03:46] juliux: in Chile people call me "Taliban" [03:46] ogra, that are only trolls [03:47] juliux, urban legends have roots, as well as trolls have .... [03:47] mhz: Celestia can be used for Astronomy [03:47] jsgotangco: oh i see, admin/contribute is simple via Active Directory :) [03:47] jsgotangco: ok. [03:47] ogra, the point is that amu made a lot for gnome in germany and everybody said thanks amu thanks amu, and at the next point he said gnome is shit [03:47] they are only a mirror of the cummunity ...< [03:47] mhz: although i don't really know if its workable in an ltsp environment [03:47] and you have the same trolls on both sides [03:48] (it requires opengl) [03:48] jsgotangco: but my doubt is oriented to Table v/s Listing [03:48] juliux, thats politics ... he wants to build a business around KDE ... [03:48] i like the listing [03:48] mhz: that looks like wicked moin syntax especially on the toc [03:49] and the table [03:49] ogra, and he made it also work for guadec and the foundation said thanks amu, and then hey said no i don't want to make fair both with ubuntu because there are gnome foods [03:49] ogra, the same with the german ubuntu forum [03:49] trouble in paradise? [03:49] jsgotangco: my problem with listing is that so far I'll need to repeat stuff many times [03:49] :( [03:49] jsgotangco, germany != paradise :) === mhz misses DB's there [03:50] ogra, amu thinks at first on it selfs and the what is the best for the users [03:50] how cold is 2 deg C? === jsgotangco sees that seoul temp is less than 10 deg C nowadays [03:50] juliux, amu wants to build a business arond free software.... [03:50] ogra, and this is i the wrong way if you do publicwork for something, i think [03:51] ogra, yes but then i have to make business both and not community boths on fairs [03:51] jsgotangco: cold, very cold but not like antartica [03:51] thats the only way to do it if you want to earny your life with it ... [03:51] ogra, no there is also an other way === jsgotangco is doing badger badger badger tour asia next week [03:52] ogra, you can directly speak with the people you need to make something [03:52] juliux, then you should tell it to the business people who try to make a business around oss [03:53] ogra, this business people didn't need a free community both on a fair, they paid for it [03:53] ogra: do you have edubuntu roadmap for dapper online? === jsgotangco needs it to update his slides [03:53] juliux, do you really think canonical or ubuntu would exiist without marks money ? look at the existing models [03:53] jsgotangco, nope, not yet ... [03:53] <\sh> juliux: they don't [03:53] ogra, i find it totaly ok that there is oss business [03:53] <\sh> juliux: redhat goes to big fairs like cebit...but they send only marketing stuff to people who are going to small fairs in their spare time [03:53] jsgotangco, but the roadmap will only be "breezy +polish polish polish" [03:54] \sh, but they didn't get a free!!! both! [03:54] jsgotangco, there wont change much ... [03:54] <\sh> juliux: booth...yes they get [03:54] \sh, but not for free! [03:54] juliux, sure [03:54] ogra, where? [03:54] juliux, as long as they come as fedora [03:54] ogra, not in the community area [03:54] <\sh> juliux: as fedora yes...as redhat no [03:54] but go to the fedora booth, they will promote redhat [03:55] <\sh> juliux: thats why everbody is doing community distros now [03:55] juliux, and *thats* a unclean business model imho [03:55] ogra, i didn't said that it is ok [03:55] ogra: yeah i understand the polish thing, but we're still having some new software changes right, but not changes that will break the whole build... [03:56] <\sh> juliux: btw..did "ubuntu deutschland e.v." paid any trademark fees, to use ubuntu? [03:56] but i dislike it if there is somebody who want to make buisness but said it is a free community project [03:56] \sh, we made a agreement [03:56] jsgotangco, i'd like to avoid bigger SW changes if possible [03:57] \sh, we can use it for free but we don't have any rights [03:57] <\sh> juliux: see..and others have to pay for the trademark usage :) ... amu is also not using ubuntu on any product he is doing...only kubuntu..and he's using ubuntu only with permission [03:57] \sh, he use the ubuntu logo [03:57] <\sh> juliux: thats licensing..no rights but using it...but this is OT [03:57] juliux, and ? [03:57] \sh, you want to see a picture of it? [03:57] <\sh> juliux: no...not on cups e.g. [03:57] \sh, as a sticker [03:57] <\sh> juliux: well..the domain is mine :) [03:58] juliux: we call the guys who take advantage from community efforts "Articulators" [03:58] \sh, i have on my laptop [03:58] ogra: i'm trying to find on lp and wiki on big dapper features, but most i saw are polish, polish, polish, with the exception of a new kernel, xorg 7, new de, etc [03:58] <\sh> juliux: I know what he's selling...because he is using my domains :) [03:58] jsgotangco, exactly ... edubuntus polish will happen mostly in ltsp [03:58] <\sh> juliux: and there is no need for a war between the distros... [03:59] \sh, what do you mean with this? [03:59] juliux: i guess we can 'educate' people in terms of Community Ethics. I believe backflow of some $% from incomes is a good idea, so we can all continue contributing [03:59] http://www.linuxshop.de/shop/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=31&products_id=123 [03:59] <\sh> juliux: if there is a problem...let's have a drink with amu and talk about it...he's a nice guy believe me [03:59] \sh, i dislike amu very much [03:59] <\sh> mhz: he is doing that [03:59] hmmm? [03:59] juliux, things like the trademark shit, lkeagl issues etc made me run away from debian ... id really appreciate if ubuntu wouldnt become debian in the future ... === jsgotangco thinks amu is really nice [04:00] \sh: good [04:00] juliux, but the road the ubuntu e.V. goes is exactly the debian leagal road [04:00] ogra, i have no problem with amus work [04:00] ogra, what does you mean? [04:00] \sh: however, I understadn juliux feeling because in Chile I have seen MANY people just using the community for his own benefit [04:00] <\sh> juliux: believe me when I tell you, that amu is not doing anything against canonical or ubuntu or mark in general...he always asked about permission...he even asked maddog to do his business without paying linux trademark fees [04:00] and taking all credits [04:00] wanting to sue people for misusage of the logo etc [04:01] shit my english is to bad to say what i want [04:01] imho it was a wrong decision from canonical to give the trademar authority away [04:01] ogra, i didn't get it [04:01] juliux: shoot in deutsch [04:01] <\sh> mhz: in germany we have many so called linux iso shops etc. and they don't give anything back to the community....amu is doing this...read riddells blog...about a strange german kubuntu fan with unlimited bandwidth...I think it's amu...and I didn't ask him...but he is one with a big pipe [04:01] ogra, we are only allowed to use it [04:02] oh, that sounded different when you were upset about the berlin booth [04:02] ogra, what does you mean? [04:02] \sh: does not give back? [04:03] <\sh> ogra: canonical didn't give anything away [04:03] <\sh> jsgotangco: amu is giving back...others not [04:03] \sh: i am happy amu is spreading this, i am not complaining, I am just trying to understand juliux feeling and compare it to Chilean reality. I am also trying to build a biz model here. [04:03] \sh, thats how i understood the announcement ... but seems i was wrong [04:04] ogra, the problem with the berlin booth was that at this point there was some people in germany who said ubuntu isn't a community project so the shouldn't get a both at the community area at fairs [04:04] well amu also has gnoppix to begin with... [04:04] <\sh> ogra: canonical aggreed of the usage of the name and "logo"? i think...but they didn't give away any other things...canonical is allowed to revert the agreement at any time whenever they want without any questions...only in written form ,) [04:04] \sh, since i saw that kubuntu wants to join the booth in essen, i guess we'll see amu [04:04] ogra, that isn't true [04:04] juliux, what ? [04:04] <\sh> ogra: I hope so :) [04:05] ogra, amu doesn't come to essen [04:05] juliux, sure ? [04:05] he lives around the corner [04:05] ogra, he said it to me so at the linuxworldexpo last week [04:05] ogra: what "canonical give away" are you all talking about? [04:05] :) [04:05] <\sh> mhz: trademark rights [04:05] <\sh> mhz: but they didn't give away any trademark rights [04:06] they still own the name and logo for all i know [04:06] \sh: when? [04:07] ogra, amu don't want to have both with kubuntu and ubuntu [04:08] juliux, the mail i just forwarede to you asks for jioning the ubuntu/edubuntu/kubuntu booths [04:08] ogra, but this are people form a local lug [04:08] which is a wonderful idea imho [04:08] jsgotangco: eureka! maybe if I list it by Application, and then add subheadings (Subejcts, Ages, Languages tried, etc) I'll end up writing less ? [04:09] mhz: it sure looks like a good idea to me [04:09] ogra, i have ask several kubuntu people but nobody want come to essen [04:09] ogra: yes! xBuntu communties should all be one huge thing [04:09] <\sh> mhz: http://verein.ubuntu-de.org/files/agreement.pdf === zakame [n=zak@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #edubuntu [04:09] <\sh> juliux: i'm there :) [04:10] \sh: oh, thx. I can read now [04:10] <\sh> juliux: that's why I said...i don't want an ubuntu or a kubuntu shirt := [04:10] ogra, \sh i also said amu that i think there are many problems if we have at one fair an ubuntu both and a kubuntu both, but amu only think on his own project and on it own profit [04:11] \sh, why? [04:11] \sh, the problem is that ubuntu is the only distro who make differens in the names [04:11] juliux, i'd very much appreciate a joined booth ... [04:11] and i'll care that we'll have one at fosdem ... [04:11] yup, it is nonse to have diff booths [04:11] ogra: in which format do I have to enter vertrefresh and horzsync? [04:11] (if i can go) [04:12] ogra, i also want to have on big both === Katsumoto [n=teraflop@bbned225-210-100.dsl.hccnet.nl] has joined #edubuntu [04:12] actually, AFAIK, the BASE is exaxctly the same for all buntu flavours [04:12] ogra, what is fosdem? [04:12] lucasvo, i guess XX-YY [04:12] ogra, that you have to said the kubuntu guys not me [04:13] the booth should be just one, maybe with colored (or only logo based) areas [04:13] juliux, http://www.fosdem.org/2006 [04:13] lucasvo, i can past you my xorg.conf [04:13] ogra, thxs [04:13] <\sh> juliux: where is ubuntu doing differences? the names are only flavours...the base is the same..and the base is the most important thing...i don't care about gnome or kde or xfce or whatever anymore...I'm using what I want..and both have their rights...and amu and riddell are the two people who created kubuntu [04:13] juliux, i'll talk to riddell and amu [04:13] lucasvo: you can also read /etc/X11/xrog.conf [04:13] lucasvo: you'll find examples there === jsgotangco doesn't get the story at all [04:14] \sh, on the names, for example there is no gdebian or kdebian there is only debian, why we can do that with ubuntu? [04:14] mhz: so it is the same way, ok thanks [04:14] ogra, thanks [04:14] <\sh> juliux: this is marketing...and this is good... [04:14] \sh, i think that it isn't good for the users [04:14] juliux, because they are completely different in this regard ? [04:15] ogra, sorry that i didn't understand [04:15] juliux, so you would prefer a 10 CD set coming with all flavous instead of a single CD coming with one desktop flavour ? [04:15] <\sh> juliux: of course..that's why we have edubuntu and will get xubuntu in future...every user has their own need...and he wants by default his desktop and his favorite colour..so give the user his free will...OSS is the freedom to choose [04:16] ogra, i want to have on cd that install the base system and and extra cd where is kde and gnome on it [04:16] *shudder* [04:16] \sh, but for this you didn't need extra distro names [04:16] ogra, that is more better than have 10 or more ubuntu versions [04:16] <\sh> juliux: and this is not what ubuntu/kubuntu wants...because it's too expensive and the user is going to opensuse or fedora, because they have it there [04:17] juliux, mark aims to have hundrets of flavors at some point [04:17] ogra, i know [04:17] juliux: I am still a huge Debian fan. However, the good point of Ubuntu is that it provides a debian-like environement with a desktop on top and tech support that can also be paid if needed.. [04:17] thats one of the targets of launchpad ... [04:17] ogra, i think that this isn't very good for the community [04:17] you'll be able to build your own flavour on the fly [04:17] <\sh> juliux: think about that...chocolate is chocolate...but u have different flavours...and one girl likes nougat, the other girl likes zartbitter...do u think removing those flavours and delivering only "chocolate" is better for the user? [04:18] juliux, so canonicals business model is bad ? [04:18] ogra, no [04:18] ogra, from the technical side it is very great [04:18] note that we will only earn money through a proprietary product (launchpad) [04:18] juliux: so for an newbie or quick install, ANY Ubuntu flavour is ok because it gives you the chance to either install Server or Desktop pre-setup [04:18] ogra, but from the community aspect isn't very good [04:19] \sh, for choclate you don't need any support [04:19] \sh: of course not, I want all the girls [04:19] :) [04:19] its perfect if you can just click together your iso without having deep technical knowledge iho [04:19] <\sh> juliux: of course...u never went to the chocolate museum in cologne :) [04:19] mhz, for newbies it isn't good because there a to much irc channels and to much forums [04:20] \sh, i went [04:20] \sh, i was there [04:20] <\sh> juliux: and thats why we had a spec about it [04:21] \sh, the best words i can find for this situation is: 2 herzen schlagen ach in meiner brust [04:21] juliux: hmmm, right. Maybe we should modify the way we want to help newbies ge ttheir info. However, any one can start at #ubuntu (i did) [04:21] \sh, i find the technical process very great but i see the problems the you have to give very good support [04:22] \sh, and i see the splitting in the community [04:23]