[12:23] <Tm_T> DiabloD3: "soon" ;)
[12:24] <Tm_T> g++ transition was yesterday, so maybe any day now
[02:32] <\sh> Tm_T: g++ transition was not yesterday
[02:33] <\sh> Tm_T: a new gcc toolchain was uploaded...but the transition didn't start now
[02:33] <\sh> Riddell: ping
[02:43] <Tm_T> oh
[02:43] <Tm_T> \sh: my smitake, sorry
[02:43] <Tm_T> I can type
[02:49] <Tm_T> \sh: so transition will happen this week?
[02:50] <Tm_T> or during next month?
[02:50] <\sh> depends on doko and when he is saying: "go" 
[02:50] <Tm_T> ok
[02:50] <\sh> Tm_T: we have actually >100 packages for universe and a couple in main
[02:51] <Tm_T> ok, thanks :)
[03:02] <raphink> \sh & Riddell : any of you has time to review my KDE packages today?
[03:03] <\sh> raphink: I can't build anything anymore
[03:03] <raphink> why? :(
[03:04] <\sh> because I dist-upgraded and have unmet deps, new libstdc++ hitted me as well...and all
[03:04] <raphink> ooo :(
[03:05] <raphink> I can't build either if that makes you feel better ;) My comp died yesterday as I was working on it though ssh. I guess (and hope it's only my secondary HD) but I have no way to know as long as I don't go see it... and it's 350km from there....
[03:06] <raphink> \sh: so I just don't even know if my comp is alive anymore :s
[03:23] <\sh> Riddell: what solution is good for this error: "undefined reference to `kdemain'  "
[03:24] <Riddell> \sh: no idea, where is this problem?
[03:25] <\sh> Riddell: linking...kdemain() is not found..
[03:25] <\sh> Riddell: I googled for this...and it looks like it has something to do with -fvisibility=hidden or something
[03:26] <Riddell> I'd need to look at the code i think
[03:26] <\sh> Riddell: ksynaptics...
[03:26] <\sh> right now, I can't build anything ... debhelper is MIA
[03:27] <Riddell> ksynaptics 0.2.0-1ubuntu1?
[03:27] <\sh> ksynaptics_0.2.2
[03:27] <\sh> (-1ubuntu1) or the debian one...
[03:27] <\sh> debian is prefered 
[03:27] <\sh> but both (merge and orig) are complaining about the same issue
[03:31] <Riddell> \sh: debian version compiles fine for me in dapper chroot with KDE 3.5 packages
[03:31] <\sh> Riddell: and with 3.4.x?
[03:32] <\sh> grmpf...brb
[03:42] <Riddell> \sh: I don't have a 3.4 chroot just now and I guess I can't make one if libstdc++ et al is broken
[03:42] <Riddell> \sh: but send me the package you have and I'll check it and upload
[03:42] <Riddell> _pef: did you get konversation notification that I uploaded?
[03:44] <\sh> Riddell: no rush...I'll install this evening a flight-1 and everything will be fine :)
[03:52] <_pef> Riddell: when di you upload it ?
[03:54] <Riddell> _pef: yesterday
[03:57] <_pef> Riddell: nothing, and nothing on dapper-changes
[04:00] <Riddell> _pef: this is why I don't like uploading with other people's e-mail addresses
[04:01] <_pef> Riddell: I will upload it this evening when back from office
[04:01] <Riddell> _pef: you can't, it's in main
[04:01] <_pef> right
[04:01] <Riddell> I'll upload it with my e-mail address in changelog
[04:01] <Riddell> and yours credited of course :)
[04:02] <_pef> Riddell: all is ok :)
[04:34] <raphink> desktop-profiles package doesn't work under breezy
[04:34] <Riddell> what's that?
[04:34] <raphink> because it's not sync with the kommander version breezy uses
[04:34] <raphink> it's a tool developped initially for Skolelinux (Debian-edu)
[04:34] <raphink> to set preferences for users
[04:34] <raphink> like kiosk
[04:35] <raphink> except it's more powerful than kiosk (imo) and deals works with freedesktop to try to configure both gnome and kde at the same time
[04:35] <raphink> I'm going to see if the Debian version builds in breezy so it could be synced
[04:38] <raphink> Riddell: any time to have a look at my packages (tell me if I'm insisting too much on it ...)
[04:40] <raphink> ?
[04:40] <raphink> ^^ I lacked the `?' ;)
[06:23] <\sh> Riddell: can we adjust kmail to use cursor keys for the message list pane?
[06:24] <\sh> Riddell: and leave pgup and pgdown for message up/down scrolling ?
[06:25] <Riddell> \sh: what does it use at the moment?
[06:26] <\sh> Riddell: n and right-cursor...which is strange...
[06:26] <\sh> for next message
[06:28] <\sh> and previous message is P or left
[06:29] <Riddell> that is strange
[06:31] <\sh> previous unread is - and next unread is +
[06:32] <\sh> which is also a bit difficult for uk keyboards ;) , and . like evolution or ctrl+cursor down/cursor up would be a better combination IMHO...
[06:32] <\sh> even for german ones 
[07:21] <\sh> Riddell: multiple continous select messages in the message list pane..should be accessed via shift+cursor up/down, too
[08:16] <Tm_T> hello seth
[08:17] <seth_k|lappy> hi Tm_T :)
[08:18] <Tm_T> Failed to fetch http://se.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/dapper/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz  403 Forbidden [IP: 130.239.18.142 80] 
[08:18] <Tm_T> hmm
[08:19] <allee> \sh: - and + only keypad are quite handy on de and uk keyboards even ;)
[08:19] <allee> s/only/on/
[08:20] <\sh> allee: no...it means on de keyboards I have to jump from the 3rd level (+) back to the first level (-)
[08:20] <\sh> and on the uk keyboard i have to press shift to reach +
[08:21] <allee> ah, notebook without 'physikal' keybad 
[08:22] <allee> sorry, used too much to use the laptop with an the external keyboard
[08:32] <\sh> allee: even with a external keyboard..i think the most natural keystrokes for navigating through a list is cursor up and down
[08:33] <\sh> brb
[08:35] <jjesse> haven't been following sorry
[08:36] <jjesse> but that has been a frustration to me is the kyes
[08:43] <jpatrick> Riddell: ping
[08:44] <Riddell> jpatrick: pong
[08:45] <jpatrick> Riddell: could you take a look @ http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=987
[08:45] <jpatrick> ..please
[08:47] <Riddell> jpatrick: what is it?
[08:47] <jpatrick> http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=14423
[08:54] <Riddell> jpatrick: I'll do it in a bit
[08:54] <jpatrick> Riddell: thank you
[10:05] <Riddell> \sh: new patch https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/4538
[10:06] <\sh> it's fixed 
[10:06] <\sh> already
[10:06] <\sh> i found it last time I uploaded the stuff
[10:08] <Riddell> cool
[10:09] <\sh> set to fixed
[10:09] <\sh> well...I have to upload the whole python chain again for 3.5
[10:10] <\sh> doko should hurry up with the new toolchain :) 
[10:11] <Riddell> I think new toolchain is in, he just has to announce it
[10:11] <Riddell> or something
[10:12] <\sh> Riddell: no..libgcj6 is not there...
[10:12] <\sh> or its there, but some deps are missing...gcc-4.0-base or something
[10:12] <\sh> Riddell: btw...it's quite nice if you play around with other desktop envs.
[10:13] <\sh> Riddell: we should have a look what usability features of gnome and kde and xfce are really really cool, and others, we should improve...
[10:13] <\sh> e.g. konversation..moving channels with alt-left and right
[10:13] <\sh> => cool
[10:14] <\sh> xchat - switching channels with ctrl+pgup/down => uncool
[10:14] <\sh> s/moving/switching/
[10:14] <\sh> evolution/thunderbird - scrolling through the message list with cursor up/down keys...=> cool 
[10:15] <\sh> kmail moving with something else then that => notcool
[10:16] <\sh> when i'm visiting the essener linuxtage..I think I will sit there and do some real life usability tests with girls and young people...how they want to use the applications..
[10:19] <\sh> what do u think about it?
[10:20] <Riddell> sounds good
[10:35] <Riddell> raphink: here is good
[10:35] <\sh> Riddell: kde-3.4.x in dapper and breezy is compiled without -fvisibility-inlines-hidden, right?
[10:35] <raphink> yop :)=
[10:35] <Riddell> \sh: yes
[10:35] <raphink> Riddell: I had a look @ knmap
[10:35] <\sh> Riddell: then I have the problem why ksynaptics is not building
[10:36] <raphink> it seems the remaining files are already in the source
[10:36] <raphink> so maybe the issue is with running a make distclean or so
[10:36] <raphink> but the rule distclean is not defined in this source
[10:36] <raphink> what do you think?
[10:38] <Riddell> raphink: it'll be differences in the automake version we use and the upstream uses.  just add rules to rm the file
[10:38] <raphink> in debian/rules?
[10:39] <raphink> this package uses automake1.6
[10:39] <raphink> while the default ubuntu version is 1.4 I think
[10:40] <Riddell> 1.9 is the best to use
[10:40] <Riddell> yes, debian/rules  clean target
[10:40] <raphink> I guess
[10:40] <\sh> Riddell: do u actually know, if it's decided that we should test the canonical laptops as well with kubuntu cds?
[10:40] <raphink> but this package depends on 1.6
[10:40] <raphink> Riddell: do you think having this package depend on 1.9 would fix that pb ?
[10:40] <Riddell> raphink: I don't think it would fix it no
[10:40] <raphink> ok
[10:41] <Riddell> raphink: why does it depend on 1.6?
[10:41] <Riddell> \sh: nothing has happened in that respect
[10:41] <raphink> because taht's what it told me when i tried to build it ;)
[10:41] <raphink> it said automake1.6 was required to build this app
[10:41] <raphink> so I just put this dependency
[10:41] <raphink> ;)
[10:41] <Riddell> raphink: it's probably using some ancient admin/ directory then.  1.6 will be fine
[10:41] <raphink> ok
[10:41] <\sh> Riddell: who is responsible for this decision?
[10:41] <Riddell> \sh: us?
[10:41] <raphink> Riddell: then what exactly do i need to clean?
[10:42] <Riddell> raphink: any files that mess up the .diff
[10:42] <raphink> I might be wrong Riddell but actually when I look at the diff I don't see remaining stuff
[10:42] <\sh> Riddell: I would like to have an official statement from canonical for this issue...because "canonical" can adjust the "little contract" they gave us :)
[10:42] <raphink> configure, src/Makefile.in etc. are listed
[10:43] <raphink> but they are no different really
[10:43] <raphink> just spaces removed or so
[10:43] <\sh> which is different from the original
[10:43] <raphink> most lines are like :
[10:43] <raphink> -    echo "configure: 30656: $i/$j" >&5
[10:43] <raphink> +    echo "configure: 30497: $i/$j" >&5
[10:43] <raphink> oh well
[10:43] <raphink> hehe there's a diff number
[10:44] <raphink> hehe
[10:44] <raphink> but if i remove these files
[10:44] <raphink> then the diff will be even bigger
[10:44] <raphink> since there'll be no file at all
[10:44] <raphink> no?
[10:44] <\sh> raphink: are u recreating the makefile.in/makefile etc?
[10:44] <raphink> no
[10:45] <raphink> \sh: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=974
[10:45] <raphink> that is the incriminated package
[10:45] <\sh> cdbs
[10:45] <raphink> ?
[10:46] <raphink> I use cdbs
[10:46] <\sh> do u see any "aclocal/automake/autoconf/intltool" lines during building the package?
[10:46] <raphink> no idea
[10:46] <raphink> I use 
[10:46] <raphink> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
[10:46] <raphink> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk
[10:46] <raphink> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/kde.mk
[10:46] <raphink> in debian/rules
[10:46] <\sh> raphink: ah...well...cdbs is magic
[10:46] <raphink> + the docbook stuff
[10:46] <\sh> raphink: it sometimes recreates the autotools chain
[10:46] <papo> hello everyone.  I have tried to update my kubuntu and this is what happened:
[10:46] <papo> Se encontraron errores al procesar:
[10:46] <papo>  /var/cache/apt/archives/xrgb_0.99.0-5_i386.deb
[10:46] <papo> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
[10:47] <raphink> papo: this is devel channel
[10:47] <raphink> did you ask on #kubuntu ?
[10:47] <papo> ok, sorry
[10:47] <raphink> no pb 
[10:47] <raphink> \sh: you mean it could be cdbs screwing up my build ?
[10:48] <\sh> raphink: jupp...
[10:48] <\sh> well actually yes
[10:48] <raphink> and what shall be the solution to this?
[10:49] <raphink> how so,
[10:49] <raphink> ?
[10:50] <raphink> Riddell: apart from that, I answered on REVU about kenigma
[10:50] <\sh> autotools-dev
[10:51] <\sh> automake1.6
[10:51] <raphink> yep
[10:51] <\sh> remove them from debian/control
[10:51] <raphink> cdbs and docbook2x
[10:51] <raphink> I can't
[10:51] <raphink> if I remove automake1.6 it won't build
[10:51] <raphink> or will it?
[10:51] <\sh> argl...
[10:51] <raphink> maybe autotools-dev coudl be removed
[10:52] <raphink> but automake1.6 is required for this package
[10:52] <\sh> for what if you don't recreate the stuff/
[10:52] <\sh> ?
[10:52] <raphink> well I don't know
[10:52] <raphink> lol
[10:52] <raphink> I just know I needed it to compile this app
[10:52] <\sh> it is not doing something like make -f admin/Makefile.common or something?
[10:52] <raphink> I can try without
[10:52] <raphink> never knwo ;)
[10:53] <raphink> mhm
[10:53] <raphink> I'll try
[10:53] <\sh> https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml important readers input :)
[10:53] <\sh> ok..CC meeting just starts in 7 minutes
[10:53] <raphink> let's see
[10:54] <raphink> who is to go to this meeting?
[10:55] <Riddell> raphink: everyone, are you a member yet?
[10:55] <raphink> Riddell: i'm registered on launchpad if that's what you mean?
[10:56] <Riddell> raphink: ubuntu membership is regonition by the CC of a commitment to ubuntu, hang around at the meeting and see what happens to people then you can go for it next time
[10:56] <raphink> \sh: as i think of it, Riddell advocated kio-sword, konq-toutf8 and konq-kim . If you have time, could you please look at them too?
[10:56] <raphink> Riddell: ok
[10:56] <raphink> where is it Riddell ?
[10:56] <Riddell> raphink: then once you have membership you can hang around some more and then get maintainership which lets you upload and revu and stuff
[10:56] <Riddell> raphink: #ubuntu-meeting
[10:57] <raphink> ok
[11:00] <allee> raphink: didn't you told me you need run make -f Makefile.cvs?  this calls admin/Makefile.common as \sh suggested
[11:01] <raphink> this was in another package allee 
[11:01] <allee> uh, sorry
[11:01] <raphink> in this one I didn't have to run make -f Makefile.cvs
[11:01] <raphink> ;)
[11:01] <raphink> no pb 
[11:01] <Riddell> make -f Makefile.cvs is only needed if you edit Makefile.am's
[11:01] <raphink> the package seems to build without autotools-dev and automake1.6
[11:02] <raphink> Riddell: I needed it for kalcul and libeduwidgetclock0 because they had not been done by annma
[11:02] <raphink> Riddell: the diff is clean now :)
[11:02] <raphink> i'll see if it builds
[11:02] <raphink> and if it does i'll upload it again
[11:06] <raphink> hmm
[11:07] <raphink> \sh: debuild worked but then I tried to pbuild the package and it crashed with :
[11:07] <raphink> ./admin/cvs.sh: line 11: autoconf: command not found
[11:07] <\sh> yeah it's calling cvs.sh
[11:07] <\sh> which is a snapshot package
[11:07] <raphink> so I need autotools-dev at least
[11:08] <\sh> yes...but u have to put something in the packagename that it is not a final release or stable release or whatever...more to follow after the meeting
[11:08] <raphink> I'll try with autotools-dev but still without automake1.6
[11:08] <raphink> ok \sh 
[11:16] <raphink> putting autotools-dev back brings the pb back...
[11:16] <raphink> and it still requires automake too
[11:34] <Riddell> uniq: joining us?
[11:47] <jdong>  kdevelop3 | 4:3.2.3-0ubuntu2 | breezy-updates | source, i386
[11:47] <jdong>  kdevelop3 | 4:3.2.3-0ubuntu1 |        dapper | source, i386
[11:47] <jdong> now, shouldn't breezy-updates be always << dapper?
[11:48] <raphink> one would think so jdong 
[11:48] <Lathiat> eh htf did that happen
[11:48] <Lathiat> arent udpates supposed to be like 1.1
[11:49] <Lathiat> i guess no one uploaded the update to dapper at any rate
[11:49] <jdong> umm, yeah it is an issue
[11:49] <jdong> similar problems were causing upgrade issues with mozilla packages, thanks to hoary-security....
[11:49] <Lathiat> yeh that was fixed tho werent it
[11:49] <jdong> later via breezy-updates
[11:50] <jdong> though I sort of object to the way that was fixed
[11:50] <jdong> (IMO bumping breezy/main version up would've been wiser)
[11:50] <jdong> since -updates is turned OFF by default
[11:50] <Lathiat> well your objection si fairly useless
[11:50] <jdong> even breezy == dapper is a concern during upgrading...
[11:50] <Lathiat> since its already done ;)
[11:50] <jdong> lol, yeah :)
[11:50] <jdong> but just wanted to give a heads-up on -updates
[11:51] <jdong> kubuntu seems to be the heavy users of -updates (not a bad thing, I rather like it)
[11:51] <jdong> but at times it seems like there are packaging concerns
[11:51] <Riddell> jdong: uploading to dapper has been waiting on c++ transition
[11:51] <Lathiat> the libstdc++ transition?
[11:51] <jdong> Riddell: ah, ok
[11:52] <Riddell> Lathiat: yes
[11:52] <Riddell> raphink: think you could manage that for membership?
[11:52] <raphink> Riddell: what do you mean?
[11:52] <raphink> manage what?
[11:52] <Riddell> raphink: one of those meetings :)
[11:53] <raphink> sure I'm reading with great interest :)
[11:53] <raphink> I've just begun my wiki page actually ;)
[11:53] <Riddell> yay
[11:53] <raphink> there's not much so far lol 
[11:53] <raphink> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Raphink
[11:55] <Riddell> Ichthux?
[11:55] <Riddell> raphink: you should list the package you've made
[11:55] <raphink> yes I will
[11:56] <raphink> ichthux is a project I administrate
[11:56] <raphink> it's a bit stalled now
[11:56] <raphink> it's developed as a CDD
[11:56] <raphink> we've got a page on alioth
[11:57] <Riddell> raphink: link to the page
[11:57] <Riddell> CDD?
[11:57] <raphink> yep
[11:57] <raphink> Custom Debian Distribution
[11:58] <raphink> a set of metapackages to tune Debian (or Ubuntu) fastly into a specilized distro
[12:02] <raphink> Riddell: is that getting better ? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Raphink
[12:02] <raphink> ;)