=== mhz printing === mhz printing === mhz printing [01:05] re === spacey [n=spacey@flits101-191.flits.rug.nl] has joined #edubuntu === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #edubuntu [02:17] ogra: so, jdub told me he was talking to you about "my case". any news? [02:19] not really.... i was in the TB meeting [02:19] ping him again... [02:19] he should still be on [02:19] oh [02:20] *sighs8 === paolob [n=donpaolo@151stb41.codetel.net.do] has joined #edubuntu [02:23] paolob: welcome / bienvenido [02:23] mhz: ciao hola hi [02:23] hehehe [02:24] how long have you been using edubuntu? [02:26] Hi guys! I have a problem with dhcp. I have 40 clients. The first time I run edubuntu all is well. However, after a few server reboot, When the clients try to connect to the dhcp server, a messagge "no IP address" appears, and in syslog there is a corresponding "no free leases". It seems like all the dhcp leases are occupied, but really there are not clients connected. What's the hell is this strange thing? [02:26] mhz: I'm at my first edubuntu experience [02:26] mhz: before I installed a 12 clients ltsp system with a debian testing server [02:27] paolob: what dhcpd.conf file are you editing? [02:27] in which /dir, i mean [02:27] mhz: I didn't edit any dhcpd.conf file [02:27] oh [02:28] paolob, see http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes [02:28] are you sure the settings in dhcpd.conf correspond to the settings you need for your network? === mhz is taking daughter to bed and be back [02:29] btw, 40 clients require a HUGE server [02:29] indeed [02:29] 128 MB per lient is the default ... [02:29] plus ~256MB for the server itself [02:31] ogra: till now I have no problem with 2GB ram [02:31] with the default desktop ? [02:31] gnome and KDE setups always require values along this line ... [02:32] did you ever run all 40 clients at the same time ? [02:33] ogra: well I could get the graphic login for all, and entered 3 or 4 client. I could see that if the same program is used in all the clients, running another instance of it in another client doesn't affect memory usage [02:33] yes, they share memory ... but 40 is a huge amount [02:34] the biggest setups i've seen so far with 2GB were 25 clients ... [02:34] ogra: is there any script to autogenerate user accounts in edubuntu. I mean accounts like n1, n2, n3, etc.? [02:34] where all were running at the same time ... [02:35] nope [02:35] this will be there in the overnext release ... [02:35] next release is mostly polish of breezy [02:36] i.e. thmeable login .. speedup of the bootprocess, bootsplash for the clients, sound support, some additional gui tools... [02:37] ogra: but will edubuntu 6.04 correspond to ubuntu 6.04? [02:38] sure, as edubuntu 5.10 does to ubuntu 5.10 [02:38] edubuntu is developed inside ubuntu.... [02:39] ogra: but the "no free leases" thing.... what could it depend on? [02:39] did you set up the dhcpd.conf as described in the install notes ? [02:39] this file is not generated by default [02:40] ogra: now I remember I configured it as in the install notes [02:40] hmm, with a range that is big enough ? [02:42] the range is ok, because the first edubuntu run is ok, and so the 2nd, 3rd, etc. But there comes a moment in which appears the "no free leases" in the dhcp log [02:43] it seems that dhcp allocates the leases but it doesnt de-allocate... [02:43] try setting the value for max-lease-time lower in /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf [02:43] its set to 7200 by default [02:44] try setting it to 700 or 1000 and do a sudo /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart afterwards [02:45] /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf or /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf ? [02:45] the main config in /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf for this [02:46] if it doesnt work try the ltsp config, but the main one should work [02:47] The edubuntu install notes speak of configuring the second [02:47] yes, i know [02:47] indeed [02:47] (i wrote them ;) ) [02:47] ogra: felicitaciones! [02:47] paolob: but your lease issue could be slved by editing the first [02:47] hehehe [02:48] mhz: could or must? [02:48] mhz, i'm not sure it get read at all ... === mhz wonders how ogra's spanish is [02:48] so if the first doesnt work, try the second === paolob possibly he understands it! [02:48] mhz, not much beyond hola and gracias [02:48] hehehehe [02:48] ogra: and ubuntuero? [02:48] ok, entonces no podemos hablar espaol [02:49] paolob: lamentablemente [02:49] mhz, thats a designed word... surely i understand it ;) [02:49] aunque pronto podriamos en #edubuntu-es [02:49] mhz, for registering channels contact Seveas ... [02:49] mhz: but there such few active people here... imagine it in a spanish channel! [02:50] but he is in .nl ... its 3am in europe :) [02:50] but still awake :) [02:50] hehe [02:50] ogra: okis, and what time is Seveas around (to ping him and not waking hime) [02:50] Seveas: hey [02:50] anyone can register channels, no approval is needed [02:50] Seveas: i'd like to proceed with #edubuntu-es [02:50] Seveas: sure, but it is best if we follow some 'conduct' here :) [02:51] paolob: I know. the isuee, at least in Chile, is that some teachers have complained about all stuff in english [02:51] and therefore they say "they dont participate much" [02:52] mhz, by all means, proceed the way you see fit. No channel registration is 'official' and in fact: the Ubuntu channel group does not even cover #edubuntu* channels :) [02:52] but, in the end, that of the "no free leases" is a bug or what is it? [02:52] Seveas: oooh [02:52] Seveas: good to know [02:52] paolob: let's see once you edit any of those files :) [02:53] paolob, rather a misconfiguration... i have to inspect it if i'm more awake ... havent seen it yet [02:53] mhz, but this was a good reminder to sort this out with lilo asap ;) [02:53] I generated the edubuntu-es channel! [02:53] heh [02:53] I think a /join #edubuntu-es is all is needed [02:54] Seveas: please. I think that, specially now, that we are getting more activity (Marketing team, doc team, evanelisation teams, loco teams, etc.) [02:54] mhz: ogra: well, I'll do it tomorrow [02:54] Seveas: it is not bad if there are some minimum guidelines [02:54] mhz, working on those :) [02:54] paolob, if its registered, the channel will be owned by the resistrant, so if you have a troll in there, the channel master can kick him [02:55] *registrant [02:55] ogra: ah, ok [02:55] Seveas: I have finally gotten reply from ubuntu.cl guys but they say they will answer me fully during the week (i made like 7 questions) and that so far, no plans for evangelisation, only the forum. [02:55] ogra, in such occurences they can also ask me to let the freenode guarddogs loose on the subversive elements ;) [02:55] Seveas, cool, good to know ... [02:56] i'm in the admin list for #ubuntu buthave not even the slightest clue how to kick someone :) [02:56] as long as we dont bite our own tails :D [02:56] ogra, ;) [02:57] ogra: right click on a user [02:57] mhz, first i have to get op status ;) [02:57] Seveas: so, I'll wait for you to register or shall i ? [02:58] oh [02:58] ogra, /msg chanserv op #ubuntu [02:58] and then /kick the_user [02:59] hmm, doesnt work here ... [02:59] it seems that #edubuntu-es has already been registered by someone [02:59] .oO(there should be a /slap the_user too) :D [02:59] really? [02:59] Seveas: see? [02:59] -ChanServ- Contact: P3L|C4N0, last seen: 4 weeks 1 day (23h 38m 23s) ago [02:59] do you know this person? [03:00] pelicano ? [03:00] If not, I'll contact lilo to make you channel contact [03:00] he's sometimes around here [03:00] ah ok [03:00] but very seldom [03:00] then i'd suggest that you try and settle it yourself [03:00] my only concern is that newcomers tend to think this is "official" and if op has no 'conduct'.. problems will arrive. [03:01] Seveas: I have seen him around a couple of times but can't remember when [03:01] guys, one of the 40 clients downloads the vmlinuz and the other file (initrd.img?) very slowly. What could it be due to? [03:01] or where [03:01] I've seen him in #ubuntu a few times [03:01] paolob, thats a drawback of breezy ... will be improved in dapper... [03:01] dapper will rock :) [03:01] while all clients download vmlinuz in 3 seconds, one client lasts about 30 seconds. [03:02] ogra: explain me [03:02] the reduced speed is not due to overload on the server [03:02] hmm [03:02] network contention? [03:02] that rather sounds like a network issue [03:02] Flipping bits in the switches? [03:02] Solat flares? [03:02] Seveas: can we wait for him (say 2 days to show up) and if not, could you talk to lilo? Our Chilean plans for EdubuntuChileanTour should start in no longer than 2 weeks [03:02] Phase of the moon? [03:02] gramlins [03:03] *gremlins === Seveas is reading BOFH :) [03:03] is it always the same client ? [03:03] a nic issue (but the connection is at 100 Mb/s)? a cable issue? [03:03] ogra: yes [03:03] nic [03:04] then it sounds like NIC or cable [03:04] paolob: did you swithc cables? [03:04] mhz: even if the 100 Mb led is on? [03:04] yup [03:04] mhz: I'm going to try [03:04] try chaning the cable from another NIC [03:04] ogra: ok [03:04] I had same issue once. then it was cable [03:05] if its not it, use a NIC from another client ... [03:05] if that solves it, it was the NIC ... [03:05] mhz, I'll contact lilo on friday [03:05] just ping me then to remind me ;) [03:05] Another issue is that a client always get an error while booting the ltsp kernel, and stops booting. Could it be a ram problem or what? [03:05] .oO(we should have a machine that we use to ping cables, so we can know what segment of the cable is nor working properly) :D [03:06] paolob: always same client? [03:06] mhz: yes [03:06] paolob: do they boot on a set order? [03:06] or randomly? [03:06] Seveas: ok, thx [03:06] they boot all together [03:06] but the error occurs even if it boots alone [03:06] oh [03:07] sounds like a HW issue [03:07] paolob: 1st time i hear that [03:07] if all other work fine .. [03:07] "the curse of a client" [03:07] mhz: I saw it various times in installing thes 40 clients [03:08] Guys, when all is ok I could prepare a testimony of my install [03:08] cool [03:08] paolob: please do! [03:08] that'd very appreciated [03:08] paolob: you really got me [03:08] +be [03:08] paolob: I had heard strange things but that [03:09] where should I put or send it? [03:09] wiki it please [03:09] in ubuntu wiki? [03:09] the wiki is perfect for that [03:09] are you subscribed to edubuntu-devel ? [03:09] no [03:09] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel [03:09] paolob: when you create an account in LaunchPad, you'll login to any ubuntu wiki [03:09] but wiki is ok too ... [03:10] all ubuntu wikis share same /data dir [03:12] ogra: nothing to do but... do you know of any desktop independant addressbook that imports/exports from/to .vcf ? [03:12] and let's you share data on network [03:12] only evolution [03:12] (ldap, maybe) [03:12] ldap might wokr too [03:12] evolution does that indeed [03:13] but aint that gnome libs dependant? [03:13] yup... [03:13] hmm. === paolob is going to bed [03:13] thunderbird should do it too === ogra too [03:13] thunderbird looks good [03:13] Well, good night to all of you! [03:13] paolob: sleep well [03:13] night as well [03:13] paolob: maybe 2morrow that client will work [03:13] Buenas noches a todos, que sueen con los angelitos! [03:14] ogra: ok, go to bed, please [03:14] .oO(ogra needs to be rested to produce good work/ideas [03:14] ogra: BTW, meeting tomorrow? [03:14] heh [03:15] sure [03:15] i didnt see it in topic [03:16] its in the topic of #ubuntu-meeting [03:16] abd on the fridge [03:16] http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event [03:16] *snd [03:16] grrt [03:16] 30 Nov 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu [03:16] *and [03:16] hmm [03:16] thats 13 CET? [03:17] yup [03:17] i can do that [03:17] spacey, sorry, didnt upload the content filter stuff yet [03:17] ogra, take your time [03:17] i'm quite busy [03:17] the TB meeting took nearly 3h (unplanned) [03:17] thats quite long [03:18] yup [03:18] some difficult points? [03:18] hide admin tools [03:18] and two big opinions [03:18] i remember that spec from ubz [03:18] one party that wanted to solve it by patching sudo ... [03:19] and one (the one i am in) that wants to solve GUI tasks in the GUI... not in an admin tool [03:19] yeah latter one sounds much better [03:19] patching sudo bleh [03:19] yup [03:20] it already was done ... pitti reverted it after the meeting [03:20] not even sure how that would work out, but it must be dirty [03:20] :P [03:20] not really, but its evil on server installs ... [03:20] ah [03:20] and we wont ship two sudos [03:21] ogra: please do not hide it from sudo [03:21] being able to test the users rights with sudo -t without being logged is not nice [03:21] ubuntu is know for usinf sudo [03:21] using [03:21] ah [03:21] mhz, the thing is that users who are no admins see all admin tools ... we want to avoind that for dapper [03:22] hmmmmmmmmmm [03:22] wasn't it something like that switch was already in upstream? [03:22] *digs his memory* [03:22] ogra: they can be warned [03:22] so students only have apps in their menu in edubuntu ;) [03:22] but no admin tools [03:22] ogra: GUI hidding is fine, very fine [03:22] yup [03:22] but not from command line I meant [03:22] gnome-menu shall handle it ... === sm|IDLE is now known as sankarshan [03:23] i thought you meant from command line [03:23] ogra, different from now? [03:23] i think xfce uses gnome-menu too [03:23] since its already in breezy but not used [03:23] spacey, sure ... currently a non privileged user sees sll admin tools [03:23] ogra, yeah but if you add thingy to .desktop file it dissapears [03:23] and gksudo just dies silently if he has no rights [03:23] not yet [03:24] it does [03:24] the patch is missing ... [03:24] really ? [03:24] i'm pretty sure the patch was in [03:24] seb even showed me [03:24] its just not used [03:24] ut the patch for checking the admin group isnt [03:24] because none of the desktop files include that line [03:24] they will [03:24] oh [03:24] but you also need to check the users rights ... [03:25] that part was missing ... [03:25] .oO(another reason why /me is so happy with simpler desktops) :) [03:25] i think the thing was that it checks on group now but that its not universal enough [03:25] and pitti wanted to solve it through calling sudo -t for every entry [03:25] but its late now, so might recall badly [03:25] ogra, yeah [03:26] ogra: wouldn't that pitti solution be too expensive? [03:26] which produces a mail to root for every .deskop file on every login ... [03:26] ogra, hehe, small detail :) [03:26] *g* [03:27] and thats why sudo had to be patched? [03:27] i assume [03:27] nope.... that already was the patch :p [03:27] oh [03:27] he reverted the behavior [03:27] now -t doesnt exist anymore [03:27] k:) [03:28] and the check for the admin group will be used ... [03:28] which breaks on systems that were upgraded from warty [03:28] which doesn't really matter :P [03:28] i.e. it doesnt hide the entrys [03:28] yup [03:29] since warty doesn't have an admin group [03:29] iirc [03:29] exactly [03:29] and it doesnt get added on upgrades [03:29] but thatmeans it simply wont change for these users :) [03:30] but no new breakage is introduced ... so its way safer [03:30] yup [03:31] ogra: we'd need a 'teacher' group in 6.04 so teachers can handle users -> menus based on the subject his teaching [03:31] nope ... we'll have configurable menu profiles in 6.10 .... :) [03:31] oh btw you don't need to hurry with that willow stuff, i'll install and try it out end of this week and see (willow itself), because our customer caught little kids surfing for porn. so i see how it works. and then next week look into your stuff. [03:32] sabayon?:) [03:32] ogra: cooler [03:32] spacey, yes, i wanted tobase i on sabayon ... but that might not even be necessary [03:32] *it [03:32] but sabayon might be nice anyway [03:32] quite nice actually [03:33] i'm in contact with the menu editor author ... i'm poking him since a while to add profile support [03:33] nice [03:33] so we might get it cheaper :) [03:33] yeah that would be nice [03:33] oops, so admins will have more work on school needs [03:33] i'm still not sure if the xnest issue is solvable [03:34] mhz, nope, less work [03:34] ogra, we can ask sabayon mailinglist [03:34] you have a menu predefined for every class you have ... [03:34] ogra: nope, more work taking care of each teacher needs for students in lab [03:34] i can ask if you want, subscribed anyway [03:34] spacey, i guess so ... but its a technical issue [03:35] spacey, yes, do it :) [03:35] i think the sabayon list is quite technical?:) [03:35] ogra: admins today are not touching menus based on profiles :) [03:35] but i think its a limitation of ssh forwarding we cant work around [03:35] ogra, ah could be [03:35] anyway i'll throw it at them later this week. [03:36] mhz, they'll have a little gui that says "math", biology", "english" ... [03:36] first get my thin client working :o) [03:36] mhz, based on your work ;) [03:36] ogra: yup, I mean they will have one more task. today they dont care about profiles :) [03:36] mhz, they only need to select the class [03:36] ogra: cool [03:37] then we could also bind it to the teacher that is logged in ... ;) [03:37] so they dont need to select [03:37] ogra: my concern there, is at least in Chile, I'll only have 2 weeks to evangelise teachers [03:37] ogra: good [03:37] i'm planning some good gui tools for dapper+1 [03:37] ogra, hmm that would limit it heavily on classroom use i think [03:38] for example we use edubuntu school wide (secretly ;)). [03:38] ogra: so I hope I can motivate enough teachers to help on the curriculum crossing thing [03:38] we'll have 3 months development time then and the base system should be fine enough that there gets no time drawn in ... [03:38] ogra: today I usually use update-menu command. Will that interfere with your menu setting plans? [03:39] spacey, its still just a slight idea of mine that needs to get worked out right ... [03:39] k :) [03:39] we can design it on schooll level ;) [03:39] just pointing out :) [03:39] don't want to make it too complex [03:39] ehhhehe [03:39] already is [03:39] :) [03:39] not too much [03:40] mhz, our menu system will be based on .desktop file selections ... i think update-menus is working with them too [03:40] mhz, whats complex? :P [03:40] so it should work in any environment followint the freedesktop specs [03:41] spacey: I am no coder, so I was thinking from teacher/admin POV. Each country has differences on curriculum [03:41] each curriculum, diff menus [03:41] spacey, my idea is only a frontend solution ... if the backend is a ldap server or a simple textfile wont matter then ;) [03:41] so you can use it in a classroom as well as in a school [03:42] lets see ... its still far future :) [03:42] GF calls ... i have to go to bed ;) [03:42] nearly 4am again :) [03:42] night all [03:43] nite [03:44] spacey: you work in a school? [03:46] mhz, no [03:46] ok [03:46] but [03:47] i have my own business with a friend of mine. and one of our customers is a primary school, were we take care of the IT stuff [03:47] and we are migrating them from windows to edubuntu [03:47] a bit complex because its a mixed enviroment [03:48] ooops [03:48] mixed env. are always a pain in the back [03:48] but we worked it out pretty well, users have the same data if they log in on windows or with edubuntu thin client [03:48] smart === mhz has no idea about M$ stuff [03:48] but migrating the profiles from w2k ADS to Samba is a bit tricky [03:49] to say the least :) [03:49] hehehe [03:49] what is w2k ADS? [03:49] active directory service [03:49] its nasty [03:49] sounds like it [03:50] its ldap with nasty stuff on top [03:50] passwords? [03:50] and if you touch anything it breaks ;o [03:50] hehehLOL [03:50] and then your screwed [03:50] hehehLOL [03:50] hehehLOL [03:50] it does remind me why I run away from M$ [03:51]