[02:49] <mantiena> Hi all
[02:54] <mantiena> are someone of launchpad developers alive ?
[02:57] <spiv> mantiena: I am, but I'm about to go have lunch :)
[02:57] <spiv> mantiena: What's up?
[03:00] <mantiena> https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/3550
[03:00] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #3550: There are no way to register a new distribution on https://launchpad.net/distros In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/3550
[03:01] <mantiena> spiv, could you help me to register new distribution at lauchpad ?
[03:02] <spiv> I think the URL you want is https://launchpad.net/distros/+add, but it's not linked that I can see..
[03:07] <mantiena> spiv, could you write about this at this bugreport?
[03:08] <jamesh> you need admin privileges to add distros
[03:08] <mantiena> :(
[03:08] <jamesh> and I don't know what the current rules are for adding them.
[03:09] <mantiena> jamesh, so, what knows if I can used launchpad for Ubuntu-Based Baltix GNU/Linux distribution ?
[03:09] <mantiena> s/what/who
[03:11] <jamesh> probably steve or kiko would
[03:11] <jamesh> but they aren't up at this time of day
[03:12] <mantiena> jamesh, SteveA ?
[03:12] <lifeless> mantiena: you definately can, but the exact means to get different distros INTO launchpad are not yet defined in policy let alone code
[03:13] <lifeless> mantiena: so I suggest talking to SteveA (GMT - 3) or kiko (GMT - 10) 
[03:13] <mantiena> lifeless, jamesh: thanks, I know SteveA - he lives in the same country like I ;)
[03:13] <lifeless> lithuania ?
[03:13] <mantiena> yea ;)
[03:13] <lifeless> cool
[04:55] <jamesh> lifeless: btw, I added a "time" column to the pending-reviews page, showing how long each branch took to process
[04:55] <lifeless> cool
[04:56] <jamesh> there's quite a big variance in run times
[04:58] <jamesh> I don't know whether that's to be expected or now
[04:58] <jamesh> s/now/not/
[05:00] <lifeless> some yes
[07:21] <lifeless> SteveA: ping
[07:42] <SteveA> morning
[07:42] <SteveA> labas rytas, mantai
[07:44] <lifeless> hey
[07:44] <lifeless> so
[07:44] <lifeless> bzr and bzrtools for launchpad
[07:44] <lifeless> bzr's test suite runs bzrtools test suite. bzrtools requires testresources to run its test suite. Is it ok if I include testresources in the launchpad config ?
[07:45] <SteveA> what is "testresources" ?
[07:45] <lifeless> a unittest extension I wrote over a couple of weekends based on some common performance issues I have observed
[07:45] <lifeless> it manages expensive resources such as databases, sample VCS trees etc.
[07:46] <jblack> jjjj
[07:47] <SteveA> no package in universe?
[07:47] <lifeless> not packaged at the moment
[07:47] <lifeless> the api has not changed since creation.
[07:47] <lifeless> I believe trial HEAD uses it now, though I'm not sure.
[07:48] <lifeless> I can package it up though.
[07:48] <lifeless> are you saying you'd like it to be a package ;)
[07:48] <SteveA> why does bzr's test suite run bzrtools' test suite?
[07:48] <lifeless> because bzrtools is a plugin and thats the way we have structured it
[07:48] <lifeless> plugins cannot run their own test suites
[07:48] <SteveA> does launchpad depend on bzrtools?
[07:49] <lifeless> ddaa's conversion script that will be running over the next month or so does.
[07:49] <SteveA> ok.  my concern is that if we run tests that we don't care about for launchpad, then we're slowing down pqm for no reason.
[07:49] <SteveA> so, there is a reason over the next month
[07:49] <SteveA> there may be no reason after that
[07:50] <lifeless> SteveA: the test suite takes 1 minute to run
[07:50] <lifeless> for bzr and bzrtools
[07:50] <lifeless> so I dont think its of significant impact compared to the other issues that are around. We have choices:
[07:51] <lifeless> we could say that ddaas script is not part of any launchpad deployment and create a different config for it, that runs only his scripts tests & the bzr ones
[07:51] <lifeless> we could disable the bzrtools tests and or the bzr ones
[07:52] <SteveA> i think it is good to have only tests-passing bzr trees in the launchpad config
[07:53] <SteveA> but, do we need to run bzr tests on every launchpad merge?
[07:53] <lifeless> at this point no, because bzr is a strict no-deps-on-lp layer
[07:54] <lifeless> that said, we do need to run the bzr tests and the bzrtools tests as I develop the baz2bzr for importd code.
[07:55] <SteveA> where does baz2bzr live?
[07:55] <lifeless> in bzrtools
[07:57] <SteveA> so, can we have bzrtools and bzr in RF, and run the bzrtools and bzr tests when merging into either of those.  i don't mind whether "testresources" is a package or a tree.
[07:58] <lifeless> yes
[07:58] <lifeless> we have bzr already
[07:58] <lifeless> I put bzrtools in earlier today (because I thought we had had this discussion a couple weeks back)
[07:58] <lifeless> I was testing an upgrade of bzr when this arose
[07:59] <lifeless> I'd like to start with testresources as a tree, because that way if the api changes, our old trees will still be verifiable
[07:59] <SteveA> as we can avoid running bzr / bzrtools tests on merging launchpad, i'd like to avoid that
[07:59] <SteveA> find
[07:59] <SteveA> infe
[07:59] <SteveA> fine
[07:59] <lifeless> :)
[08:00] <lifeless> I would like to run the tests on all commits for now, and put a TODO item to change that, because - 1 minute is not long, and its non trivial to change it safely.
[08:00] <lifeless> by safely I mean that commits to bzr/bzrtools *can break launchpad*.
[08:00] <lifeless> so they have to run the lp test suite. But also run theirs. 
[08:01] <lifeless> so I need to figure out how to usefully get that behaviour
[08:01] <SteveA> okay, file a bug please
[08:01] <lifeless> k
[08:02] <lifeless> interfaceverification - did you get a chance to read it ? (I've updated it)
[08:05] <SteveA> no, not read it yet
[08:07] <lifeless> ok
[08:07] <lifeless> I have some useful profiling data now
[08:07] <lifeless> if I read it right we spend ~ 3 minutes in the launchpad test suite
[08:07] <lifeless> and 27 minutes in postgresql
[08:09] <lifeless> bug 5378
[08:09] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5378: dont run the bzrtools and bzr tests on make check_merge In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/5378
[09:23] <sivang> morning all
[10:02] <lifeless> SteveA: ping
[10:02] <SteveA> spiv: hello
[10:02] <SteveA> lifeless: hello
[10:02] <lifeless> meeting time
[10:03] <SteveA> so it is
[10:07] <sivang> development meeting?
[10:07] <lifeless> bazaar-launchpad meeting
[10:07] <sivang> lifeless: is anybody free to watch?
[10:07] <daf> morning
[10:08] <sivang> morning daf
[10:08] <lifeless> its not a particularly open meeting no.
[10:08] <daf> hmm, should I be able to see https://staging.ubuntu.com/errors?
[10:08] <lifeless> given its mainly about whos doing what when
[10:08] <lifeless> its also not particularly interesting ;)
[10:08] <sivang> ok :)
[10:15] <SteveA> spiv: ping
[10:25] <SteveA> spiv: if you're online, please come onto #c-m
[10:38] <mantiena> SteveA, Hi
[10:38] <SteveA> hi.  i'm in a meeting right now.
[10:38] <mantiena> SteveA, in POV ?
[10:38] <SteveA> no
[10:38] <SteveA> on irc
[10:39] <mantiena> SteveA: jamesh told me, that you could help me to register Ubuntu-Based Baltix GNU/Linux distribution on launchpad
[10:42] <SteveA> yes.  i'll need to talk with some people who will be online in a few hours.  they're working on that part of launchpad right now.
[10:43] <mantiena> SteveA, I've registered bugreport about this, look at https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/3550
[10:43] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #3550: There are no way to register a new distribution on https://launchpad.net/distros In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/3550
[10:44] <SteveA> thanks
[10:44] <SteveA> i'll assign it to kiko
[10:50] <mantiena> SteveA, thank you, I wanna use launchpad for Baltix development and bugreporting, this would give improvements not only to Baltix, but also to launchpad, because then it will be translated to lithuanian language ;)
[10:50] <SteveA> cool
[10:51] <SteveA> although, the launchpad team have some work to do to make launchpad internationalizable
[10:51] <SteveA> localizable
[10:51] <SteveA> make it internationalized
[10:51] <SteveA> wow.. .such long words, and so confusing ;-)
[10:51] <SteveA> mantiena: how many people work with you on baltix?
[10:55] <SteveA> jamesh: hello.  i see that ErrorReportManagement is "merge-conditional".  what's left to do before it lands?
[11:00] <mantiena> SteveA, on developing (programing, patching, etc) mainly only I, but on translating, bugreporting and making artwork/documentation there are working about 4-6
[11:03] <SteveA> mantiena: bradb will be visiting vilnius for a week, to work with me on malone.  it would be good if you can visit, and show us how you use launchpad, particularly for bug tracking, and what you want improved
[11:04] <mantiena> SteveA, when exactly bradb will be in Vilnius ?
[11:05] <SteveA> next week, working with me monday to friday
[11:06] <jamesh> SteveA: I'm just fixing the things stub mentioned.  The other thing that is necessary is to decide what the new config values should be set to for staging, production1, production2, etc
[11:19] <SteveA> jamesh: what do you recommend they are set to?
[11:21] <jamesh> SteveA: copy_to_zlog can be off for production and staging.  probably just assign error code prefixes A,B,... for production systems, maybe 'S' for staging
[11:21] <jamesh> SteveA: I don't know what directory would be safe to get the error logs written to
[11:21] <SteveA> ok
[11:21] <SteveA> there is a directory for that already
[11:22] <SteveA> launchpad@gangotri:/srv/launchpad.net/production-logs$ ls
[11:22] <SteveA> launchpad-access1.log  launchpad-access2.log  launchpad1.log  launchpad2.log
[11:23] <SteveA> so, the logs for production can all just go in there
[11:24] <SteveA> that directory is rsynced to chinstrap often
[11:25] <SteveA> jamesh: where would error logs go on development machines?
[11:27] <jamesh> SteveA: at the moment they go into a directory under /var/tmp
[11:28] <SteveA> what happens if the chosen directory doesn't exist?
[11:29] <jamesh> it gets created
[11:29] <Kinnison> SteveA: How does one get at tracebacks on staging?
[11:29] <SteveA> Kinnison: wait until jamesh's latest stuff lands...
[11:29] <daf> https://staging.ubuntu.com/errors yields a 403
[11:29] <daf> ah, hmm
[11:30] <daf> SteveA: I can't reproduce the oops you found locally
[11:30] <SteveA> that's good.
[11:31] <SteveA> there's a team you need to be in
[11:31] <SteveA> to see tracebacks
[11:31] <SteveA> this team was changed from launchpad-admins recently to some other less powerful team
[11:31] <SteveA> bug maybe you're not in that team
[11:31] <daf> aha
[11:32] <daf> I can't see any teams you're in that I'm not in, other than "ShipIt Administrators" and "Ubuntu Drivers"
[11:34] <SteveA> i don't see TBs either
[11:34] <SteveA> what's stub in?
[11:35] <daf> he's in Zope Developers
[11:35] <SteveA> ?
[11:37] <daf> in addition to LP Admins and LP Developers, which we're also in
[11:39] <SteveA> are you in the team whose name is 'launchpad' ?
[11:40] <daf> yes
[11:40] <SteveA> they are ones who should see tracebacks
[11:40] <daf> (that's the "Launchpad Developers" one)
[11:40] <SteveA> something about the traceback showing is broken
[11:40] <SteveA> please file a bug about it
[11:41] <daf> ok
[11:43] <SteveA> i'll sort out some visibility of staging logs on chinstrap
[11:45] <daf> https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/5381
[11:45] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5381: Launchpad doesn't show tracebacks for oopses to Launchpad developers In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/5381
[12:02] <mantiena> SteveA, I don't know if I will have free time to come to Vilnius next week, but there are chances, that I will come to Vilnius tomorrow
[12:02] <SteveA> or maybe the weekend?  brad will still be around on saturday 17th
[12:04] <mantiena> ok, please write me (mantas@akl.lt) a lettter, when brad will come to Vilnius
[12:04] <SteveA> ok
[12:05] <SteveA> i'll check with brad when he arrives on irc in a few hours
[12:07] <SteveA> hi niemeyer 
[12:07] <SteveA> ddaa will be sending a summary of this morning's meeting
[12:07] <niemeyer> Good morning!
[12:07] <Kinnison> Hi niemeyer 
[12:07] <niemeyer> Great! Thanks
[12:07] <SteveA> there wasn't much discussed, except making progress on the various tasks
[12:08] <niemeyer> Kinnison: Greetings!
[12:08] <niemeyer> Kinnison: Feeling better?
[12:08] <Kinnison> niemeyer: Much better thanks
[12:08] <SteveA> daf, Kinnison: soon, there will be logs from staging appearing on chinstrap in /srv/asuka-logs.  these logs are kinda crappy right now.  as soon as jamesh's error reporting code lands, they'll be vastly better.
[12:08] <Kinnison> niemeyer: although my left hip hurts
[12:09] <SteveA> Kinnison: diodes?
[12:09] <daf> SteveA: groovy, thanks
[12:09] <Kinnison> SteveA: brain
[12:09] <Kinnison> I am *so* good without caffeine
[12:10] <daf> NotFoundError: (None, 'title')
[12:10] <daf> seems to be the culprit
[12:10] <Kinnison> daf: Coo
[12:10] <daf> well, we do have caffeine
[12:10] <Kinnison> daf: It's all wrong
[12:10] <Kinnison> daf: Nescaf? Yuck
[12:10] <Kinnison> daf: Earl Grey? (asthma inducing mugs of death)
[12:10] <daf> yes, it is all wrong
[12:11] <Kinnison> daf: PG Tips? (I'd rather drink my own vomit)
[12:11] <SteveA> Kinnison: bergamot gives you asthma?
[12:11] <Kinnison> SteveA: aye
[12:11] <SteveA> cripes
[12:12] <matsubara> good morning!
[12:12] <SteveA> daf: the error is caused by a page template doring foo/title
[12:12] <SteveA> um, doing
[12:12] <SteveA> where we don't know what 'foo' is, but its value is None
[12:12] <SteveA> whereas it is expected to be something else
[12:13] <daf> right
[12:13] <daf> sadly, the log doesn't seem to offer any clues about where the foo in question might be
[12:13] <SteveA> jamesh: have you seen the stuff that the warning handler does in launchpad to find out useful stuff about what page template and view etc. has been involved in the warning?
[12:13] <SteveA> daf: next, look at the page template in question, and look for /title in it
[12:13] <jamesh> SteveA: no.  Do you have a pointer?
[12:14] <SteveA> these are the candidates for causing the error
[12:14] <SteveA> jamesh:  launchpad/warninghandler.py
[12:14] <SteveA> jamesh: it is horridly crufty hackery
[12:14] <SteveA> but might provide useful extra info for error logging, if you want to polish it later
[12:16] <daf> the error doesn't state which page template it is
[12:17] <SteveA> daf: right.  but, you can work it out, because you know the URL
[12:17] <daf> but we think it might be binarypackagerelease-index.pt, which doesn't have any direct occurrences of 'title'
[12:17] <daf> is there a sure way of mapping URLs to page templates that I've forgotten about?
[12:18] <SteveA> if you can get the page to render locally
[12:19] <mantiena> SteveA, hehe, it seems I don't come to Vilnius tomorrow, Baltix will be awarded later in this week or in next week ;)
[12:19] <daf> I've got http://localhost:8086/distros/ubuntu/hoary/i386/pmount/0.1-1 rendering locally
[12:19] <mpt> Gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooood morning
[12:19] <daf> hi mpt
[12:20] <mpt> hi daf, welcome back :-)
[12:20] <mpt> (somewhat belatedly)
[12:20] <SteveA> mantiena: awarded what exactly?
[12:22] <SteveA> well, congratulations anyway ;-)
[12:22] <daf> mpt: thanks
[12:26] <mantiena> SteveA, thanks, I can't find info about Infobalt awards in english :( I can just provide a link for news in Lithuanian:
[12:26] <mantiena> http://www.2005.infobalt.lt/?&r=622&i=6626
[12:26] <mpt> arg
[12:29] <mpt> hmm, actually, that's my fault
[12:34] <kiko> hey SteveA 
[12:55] <SteveA> mantiena: a truputi galiu skaityti
[12:55] <kiko> SteveA, should view classes use results.count()?
[12:55] <kiko> or should they assume they are not using SQLObject things?
[12:55] <SteveA> o, a inau apie infobalt
[12:56] <daf> SteveA: we've discovered that running the publisher fixes the oops
[12:56] <SteveA> kiko: it is a vague contract.  whatever is easiest
[12:56] <SteveA> daf: it means that something is returning an object, or None.  And the view is not expecting the None.
[12:56] <kiko> okay.
[01:02] <Kinnison> Indeed, I'm betting Mark's magic code doesn't play well with PENDING packages
[01:04] <SteveA> kiko: adding a new distro to launchpad.  can we just do it?  anything to worry about wrt the other infrastructure?
[01:04] <kiko> let's not do it now
[01:04] <kiko> there's a lot to worry about
[01:05] <kiko> I'm recommending creating a product for now
[01:05] <kiko> we can move bugs and translations over
[01:05] <kiko> we won't have support for anything fancy for distros anyway
[01:05] <SteveA> the baltix guys want to have their distro in launchpad, so that they can do bug tracking, translating etc .for it
[01:05] <SteveA> they're an ubuntu derivative
[01:05] <kiko> I know
[01:05] <kiko> so is Impi
[01:06] <SteveA> this is put off until we open dapper properly?
[01:06] <kiko> until we understand the consequences of creating new distros and releases better
[01:11] <mpt> Serious question: How are we going to understand it without trying it?
[01:12] <kiko> mpt, by reading the code and thinking about the consequences.
[01:13] <SteveA> and by trying it on dogfood / staging
[01:14] <kiko> for which you don't need the link
[01:14] <kiko> note that dogfood/staging don't do some of our production tasks last I checked
[01:25] <SteveA> mantiena: you won the "best alternative" award at infobalt?  that's really cool.  you should get it announced on fridge.ubuntu.com
[01:27] <SteveA> mantiena: fridge-devel@lists.ubuntu.com
[01:54] <daf> SteveA: https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/5390
[01:54] <Ubugtu> Error: I cannot access this bug
[01:55] <SteveA> daf: no need for it to be private
[01:55] <daf> ok
[02:06] <mpt> SteveA, in mpt/2005-12-layout/ I've turned +logout into a separate logout confirmation page, but I don't know how to make it work (the submit button currently takes you back to where you were but doesn't log you out)
[02:06] <kiko> mpt, a /separate/ logout page?
[02:07] <mpt> kiko, as requested by Mark
[02:07] <kiko> wtf?
[02:08] <mpt> because the button was taking up too much space
[02:08] <kiko> huh?
[02:08] <kiko> what does that have to do with a separate logout page?
[02:09] <mpt> making it a link requires confirmation, because links by themselves don't do anything
[02:09] <kiko> can't we break that rule there?
[02:09] <kiko> I mean, a separate logout page will mean I will never use it
[02:09] <mpt> I know *sigh*
[02:09] <mpt> Perhaps we can persuade Mark to let it be an image instead
[02:09] <SteveA> mpt: i'm about to go get lunch. would you file a bug on me for it, and leave it as an immediate link for now
[02:10] <kiko> mpt, how would an image be better than a button? why don't you just style the button as a link?
[02:10] <mpt> that's not possible afaik
[02:11] <SteveA> i want to get this new layout landed in some form as soon as possible
[02:11] <mpt> at least, you could make the border and background transparent in some browsers, but not decrease the height as a result
[02:11] <SteveA> if that means cutting some corners and fixing them up later, that's okay
[02:12] <mpt> SteveA, so you want me to revert it, or can you just finish off the sitemap and land it without merging from me again?
[02:12] <mpt> (that requires you to have already branched from my layout branch)
[02:12] <SteveA> mpt: is it possible to make the LHS of the site map work, just as it is?
[02:13] <SteveA> for the link / logout page, make it work as a link rather than a button.  that should require no code change.
[02:13] <mpt> SteveA, only with lots of URL-related tal:conditions in main-template.pt
[02:14] <SteveA> you could do it with no highlighting, though
[02:14] <mpt> oh, right
[02:14] <SteveA> it will be quite fast to get the code done to make it work, and to do something better with the logout functions
[02:14] <SteveA> i'd rather get this landed, than it be on a branch until it is perfect
[02:15] <jordi> kiko: did you fixup your bzr?
[02:16] <kiko> jordi, yes, I did. I am still busy but will be free as the week progresses
[02:17] <kiko> salgado, https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/5389
[02:17] <kiko>  -- who is going to work on this? matsubara?
[02:17] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5389: System error if you specify an inexistent assignee in any advanced search for bugs In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/5389
[02:18] <jordi> ok kiko
[02:18] <jordi> kiko: just replied, btw
[02:19] <kiko> I saw that, thanks
[02:30] <salgado> kiko, could be
[02:31] <kiko> salgado?
[02:32] <salgado> kiko, yes, matsubara can work on that
[02:34] <kiko> cool.
[02:34] <kiko> salgado, assign it?
[02:39] <salgado> assigned
[03:20] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: [trivial]  Fix https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/4041 ('Change' and 'Deactivate' buttons are shown twice in a membership page) (r2891: Guilherme Salgado)
[03:25] <kiko> mpt, is there a bug reported on Launchpad help?
[03:51] <mpt> kiko, I think so
[03:51] <mpt> there's a spec on it, anyway
[03:51] <mpt> though iirc the spec and the bug aren't linked
[03:56] <sivang> mpt: do you have the link to the spec?
[03:56] <sivang> mpt: btw, have you produced any glade UI for HUB ? :)
[03:56] <sivang> (I recall you told me you were trying to roll something on SAT)
[03:56] <mpt> what's SAT?
[03:57] <mpt> oh, Saturday
[03:57] <mpt> not yet, sorry, I was trying unsuccessfully to cram-study Portuguese
[03:57] <mpt> sivang, https://wiki.launchpad.canonical.com/LaunchpadPageHelp
[03:58] <mpt> It's really low priority for me as long as Launchpad itself is so very ... improvable
[03:58] <mpt> because time spent improving Launchpad is a much better investment than time writing help
[03:58] <sivang> mpt: yes, I understand :)
[04:03] <ddaa> mpt: you just made a landmark in political correctness.
[04:03] <mpt> hmm?
[04:04] <ddaa> English: foo sucks. Politically Correct: foo is very much improvable :)
[04:04] <mpt> :-)
[04:04] <sivang> mpt: I might undergo some substantial real life changes soon ;-) , if so I might attempt something like that for launchpad, I've been pervertly interested in that since LP boomed in size, complexity and number of components, views etc.... and so this could be a nice way to actually learn about all what it can offer
[04:05] <sivang> ah nice, he just vanished
[04:40] <SteveA> bradb_: hi
[04:42] <bradb_> SteveA: Hi. I've got Skype set up.
[04:43] <SteveA> cool.  let's try it
[04:52] <sivang> bradb_: cool :)
[04:55] <bradb_> powerbook++ # kickass built-in mic
[04:55] <LarstiQ> bradb_: hah, talking to your laptop? ;)
[04:58] <sivang> bradb, SteveA : using the QT statically linked version?
[04:58] <bradb> sivang: OS X for me
[04:59] <bradb> Je rcompense l'utilisabilit
[05:00] <sivang> bradb: ah right :)
[05:01] <sivang> hmm I wonder if there is a word "utilisability"
[05:01] <sivang> (/me used altavista's babel fish to find out what that means)
[05:02] <bradb> usability
[05:09] <ddaa> okay that's offtopic, but still...
[05:10] <sivang> ddaa: true, sorry.
[05:10] <ddaa> does anybody knows if there's a way to tell postfix to _completely_ skip DNS lookups for a relayhost, so I can set the relayhost to "[smtp] " and configure the address in my /etc/hosts?
[05:10] <ddaa> sivang: that ^ is offtopic :)
[05:11] <sivang> ddaa: lol
[05:12] <lamont__> ddaa: [hostname]  will look for the A RR, according to /var/spool/postfix/etc/nsswitch.conf
[05:13] <SteveA> jamesh: still around?
[05:13] <ddaa> lamont__: hu... okay the issue is when I'm on one specific network, I have to relay mail through my ISP, but on other networks I want to use direct delivery because the ISP won't let me use its SMTP from outside.
[05:13] <jamesh> SteveA: just about to go to bed
[05:13] <ddaa> And since I'm switching networks using the GUI network configuration tool, I want to set the actual relay address there.
[05:14] <SteveA> jamesh: okay.  can you say a few words about where you feel the bugzilla import is at?
[05:14] <lamont__> ddaa: you could edit /var/spool/postfix/etc/hosts, and use that nsswitch.conf, I expect.
[05:14] <ddaa> haha... "disable_dns_lookups"...
[05:14] <lamont__> it still takes hostnames, not IP's
[05:14] <ddaa> lamont__: AFAIK the GUI network config does not know about postfix at all
[05:15] <lamont__> prolly not
[05:15] <ddaa> I'd rather keep the network switching logic all in there...
[05:15] <jamesh> SteveA: pretty good.  I've got to finish off the milestone migration code (should be finished tomorrow morning), but I think it'd be okay to run on production soon (I should do a final run on staging first though)
[05:16] <jamesh> SteveA: assuming there aren't any test failures I didn't catch, the ErrorReportManagement code should merge tonight
[05:16] <SteveA> that's awesome
[05:17] <SteveA> i'll talk with kiko and see when we can do a gina run, so we can get bugzilla merged
[05:17] <ddaa> Yay!
[05:18] <ddaa> lamont__: disable_dns_lookups = yes
[05:18] <ddaa> relayhost = [smtp] 
[05:18] <ddaa> that works
[05:18] <lamont__> cool
[05:18] <ddaa> Dunno if that qualifies as a gross hack, though :)
[05:29] <SteveA> lamont__: do you have a secret stash... of documentation on how to set up postfix on ubuntu to use an authenticated smart host?
[05:31] <lamont__> SteveA: remind me of your email addr, and I'll toss you what lifeless sent me... :-)
[05:32] <SteveA> lamont: steve @ canonical.com
[05:33] <kiko-fud> SteveA, I know how to do it if you like
[05:33] <lamont__> tossed at you
[05:34] <kiko-fud> SteveA, short answer: when the publisher test finishes.
[05:34] <kiko-fud> long answer: AAR#H#@Y*#@HFEWIOFJEW
[05:39] <kiko> bradb, what's the status with the InitialBugContacts work?
[05:40] <lamont__> kiko: picking on Jew's again?
[05:40] <lamont__> nm
[05:41] <lamont__> :-)
[05:42] <bradb> kiko: I'm blocked on adding sample data. I've backseated it for other things too (like status changes and bug fixes for pages raising exceptions.) I can submit the sample data changes today though and should be able to land it this week, if nothing else comes up.
[05:42] <kiko> that would be ideal
[05:47] <SteveA> bradb: hotel all booked.
[05:47] <bradb> SteveA: got the confirmation email, thanks
[05:47] <cprov> matsubara: are you happy with my suggestion for fixing typo within the current CoC, did you get the key tricky to re-sign it ?
[05:51] <SteveA> lamont__: i don't actually have postfix installed yet.  what installation option should i use when installing, to then follow these instructions?
[05:51] <lamont__> SteveA: I'm betting on 'internet site'
[05:51] <lamont__> or rather, internet site with smarthost
[05:52] <SteveA> ta, i'll give it a go
[06:08] <SteveA> lamont__: any idea how to convert a sasl_passwd into a sasl_passwd.db ?
[06:08] <lamont__> no clue - prolly just a hash map
[06:09] <kiko> postmap
[06:09] <SteveA> ta
[06:18] <SteveA> lamont__: thanks for the docs.  i think i have it working!
[06:19] <lamont__> SteveA: infinity? is creating something to let us piggy-back ssl certs on the machine, and then I'm supposed to automate that setup
[06:20] <SteveA> i have my own smarthost, so i just use that from everywhere
[06:20] <BjornT> SteveA, kiko, salgado: any of you available for code reviews today?
[06:20] <SteveA> so long as there aren't annoying semi-transparent proxies (negligee proxies...) that jump on port 25
[06:20] <SteveA> BjornT: i'm doing reviews for ddaa and mpt today
[06:21] <kiko> BjornT, I'm very overbooked, how big are they?
[06:21] <BjornT> SteveA: ok
[06:23] <BjornT> kiko: the ones i have up for review are 1300 and 1500 lines.
[06:23] <kiko> I think I am going to hide under my bed
[06:24] <salgado> BjornT, I'll take your ticket-tracker-outgoing-email today
[06:24] <lamont__> SteveA: never heard that term for them before, but i like it.
[06:24] <SteveA> they're considered kinda rude in some more conservative communities
[06:25] <SteveA> but you get them a lot in the less savoury hotels
[06:25] <lamont__> and HP
[06:25] <lamont__> :-(
[06:26] <ddaa> SteveA: I'm still around if you have quick questions while reviewing
[06:26] <SteveA> ddaa: i have a couple of other things to do before i get stuck into the reviews
[06:27] <ddaa> NP, not rushing you, busing writing the meeting summary.
[06:30] <BjornT> kiko: in case you didn't get it before my connection died: < BjornT> kiko: the ones i have up for review are 1300 and 1500 lines.
[06:30] <kiko> I got it
[06:30] <kiko> and I said
[06:30] <kiko> I think I am going to hide under my bed
[06:32] <BjornT> kiko: ok :) i understand that you have a lot to do atm
[06:33] <BjornT> thanks salgado 
[06:35] <SteveA> kiko: is mpt around?  i just reviewed his new layout branch.
[06:36] <kiko> he should be
[06:36] <salgado> BjornT, you're welcome
[06:36] <salgado> kiko, SteveA, he's not here
[06:36] <salgado> maybe he went for his pt_BR classes
[06:37] <kiko> probably
[06:53] <SteveA> ddaa, BjornT: i just reviewed the productseries doc stuff from david.  then i noticed that bjorn had already reviewed it.  did i have an old pending-reviews page or something?
[06:54] <ddaa> it's merge-approved on BjornT's section on the PendingReviews page I have.
[06:54] <SteveA> yeah
[06:55] <SteveA> so now it is doubly approved
[06:55] <SteveA> i think i made one different comment
[06:55] <ddaa> Too much honor for a trivial doctest...
[06:55] <ddaa> Anyway, thanks, I love people to comment on my code.
[06:55] <ddaa> What I do not like is sometimes having to fix my code after the comments ;)
[06:56] <salgado> what's that "[06:56] <ddaa> mh... that probably means that a merge attempted to rename a file to a name that was already used.
[06:57] <ddaa> The right thing to do would be putting the stuff from productseries.txt.moved into productseries.txt
[06:58] <ddaa> Or maybe... that the merge created a file and moved an existing file away.
[06:58] <ddaa> anyhow, that looks like a name conflict
[06:58] <SteveA> ddaa: the setup_module branch
[06:58] <SteveA> i do not think it makes the code clearer
[06:58] <SteveA> it makes the code *shorter*
[06:59] <SteveA> but i don't think it becomes clearer
[06:59] <ddaa> Mh. Right.
[06:59] <SteveA> actually, it doesn't make the code shorter
[06:59] <SteveA>  ftests/helpers.py                     |   89 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
[06:59] <SteveA>  ftests/test_keyringtrustanalyser.py   |    9 ---
[06:59] <SteveA>  ftests/test_librarianformatter.py     |   11 +---
[06:59] <SteveA>  ftests/test_po_attach.py              |   12 +++-
[06:59] <SteveA>  tests/test_librarianformatter_noca.py |   10 ---
[06:59] <SteveA>  tests/test_rundoctests.py             |    4 -
[06:59] <ddaa> I just do not like to have a slightly different and subtly wrong boilerplate in everyfile.
[06:59] <ddaa> It does not make the code shorter because all the files were not converted
[06:59] <SteveA> it is a valid point
[07:00] <SteveA> i think there is too much magic in your solution
[07:00] <ddaa> only a few, to illustrate the point
[07:00] <SteveA> we need to find a way to do something like what you propose, but that keeps things from being magical, or too implicit
[07:00] <ddaa> yeah, the zope doctest infrastructure is making my life really hard
[07:00] <ddaa> It's magic to work around the zope magic.
[07:00] <SteveA> i think you're exaggerating
[07:00] <SteveA> i think it is a minor annoyance
[07:01] <ddaa> Feel free to say "interested, but not now"
[07:01] <ddaa> I mostly wanted to raise the issue for discussion.
[07:01] <SteveA> the other thing is, those 89 lines in ftests/helpers.py are not tested
[07:01] <ddaa> They are tested.
[07:01] <ddaa> When running the tests :)
[07:02] <SteveA> so, i think we should talk about this sometime, and work out what your frustrations with the infrastructure are, and how to fix it
[07:02] <SteveA> probably in a similar way to that which you have prototyped
[07:02] <ddaa> I'm happy to remove that stuff from importd2bzr
[07:02] <ddaa> as long as this branch stays in someone's queue for discussion
[07:03] <ddaa> maybe that would make a meeting item for wednesday :)
[07:03] <SteveA> i think the best thing would be for you to file a bug on this, and reference the branch in the bug
[07:03] <ddaa> Who should I assign the bug to?
[07:03] <SteveA> me
[07:03] <ddaa> Fine.
[07:04] <ddaa> after dinner :)
[07:05] <SteveA> ok
[07:07] <SteveA> mpt: i reviewed your new layout branch.
[07:07] <SteveA> mpt: the menus branch hasn't been mirrored fully, or something like that
[07:10] <mpt> SteveA, is PQM off chinstrap now?
[07:10] <mpt> if so I can finish my mass conversion
[07:12] <elmo> no, it's not
[07:12] <kiko-afk> nope
[07:14] <mhz> hi
[07:14] <kiko-afk> hey mhz 
[07:14] <kiko-afk> did you ever get your problem sorted out?
[07:14] <mhz> hi kiko-afk 
[07:15] <mhz> nope. However, the platform still works
[07:15] <mhz> it is just that the annoying email error still lives :)
[07:17] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: stage 1 of ErrorReportManagement, r=stub (r2892: James Henstridge)
[07:17] <SteveA> hurrah
[07:17] <SteveA> jamesh: congratulations
[07:18] <kiko-afk> jamesh, ROCK ON
[07:18] <kiko-afk> mhz, remind me what the problem is.
[07:19] <mhz> kiko-afk: okis. Basically, I created a team, I was asked to confirm email-address and Kapooom! error.
[07:19] <mhz> hoever, people could still join
[07:19] <kiko-afk> and what lingering effect has it had?
[07:20] <mhz> could you rephrase that, please?
[07:22] <kiko-afk> mhz -- what problem has remained?
[07:23] <mhz> kiko-afk: BTW, nothing to do but.. Is there anyway one can actually create a 'new specification' from a Team that is already part of a distro? Instead of creating it from the whole listing of specs page?
[07:23] <mhz> kiko-afk: BTW, nothing to do but.. Is there anyway one can actually create a 'new specification' from a Team that is already part of a distro? Instead of creating it from the whole listing of specs page?
[07:23] <mhz> kiko-afk: mail confirmation is the problem I saw the last 2 days i tried to get confirmed
[07:24] <matsubara> mhz: is this bug 5122
[07:24] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5122: Validate email in team In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Diogo Matsubara, Status: Accepted https://launchpad.net/bugs/5122
[07:24] <matsubara> ?
[07:24] <matsubara> mhz: if it is, it's already fixed. Landed on RF and will be on production soon.
[07:25] <mhz> matsubara: kiko-afk: indeed. same problem
[07:25] <kiko-afk> mhz, you can only create specs if you attach them to targets -- distros or products.
[07:26] <mhz> kiko-afk: oh, ok.
[07:27] <mhz> So, what is the objective on having DistroTeams (example: EdubuntuStudyContent team) ?
[07:28] <mhz> Where do they list all the team activitity/ToDo's ?
[07:28] <salgado> matsubara, I guess bug 5389 is the root cause of what mhz is experiencing
[07:28] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5389: System error if you specify an inexistent assignee in any advanced search for bugs In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Diogo Matsubara, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/5389
[07:28] <salgado> bug 5398, even
[07:28] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5398: When creating a new team, we need to check if the given contact email address is not already registered in Launchpad In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Diogo Matsubara, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/5398
[07:29] <matsubara> salgado: I'll check, just a min.
[07:32] <salgado> matsubara, how are you going to check that?
[07:33] <matsubara> salgado: I meant I was going to check the bug description. :)
[07:58] <pablo> hi?
[08:02] <mhz> pablo: hey
[08:02] <mhz> kiko-afk: So, what is the objective on having DistroTeams (example: EdubuntuStudyContent team) ?
[08:02] <pablo> i need some help with evolution
[08:02] <pablo> (the mail client for ubuntu)
[08:03] <kiko-afk> mhz, a team is an arbitrary grouping of people
[08:03] <mhz> kiko-afk: yup
[08:03] <kiko-afk> it can be used to restrict access to certain things
[08:03] <kiko-afk> and to direct messages
[08:03] <kiko-afk> that's essentially it.
[08:03] <kiko-afk> pablo, try #ubuntu
[08:04] <pablo> ok- thanks
[08:04] <mhz> kiko-afk: and how people (groups) can use LP to cordinate work?
[08:04] <mhz> pablo: o bien, #ubuntu-es
[08:04] <kiko-afk> mhz, that's a very open question -- essentially, it depends on what they are doing.
[08:04] <mhz> pablo: o bien, #edubuntu-es if you need edubuntu help
[08:06] <mhz> kiko-afk: indeed. I thought LP was meant for groups to cordinate their work. Something like Tuto, maybe?
[08:06] <pablo> ah, mejor, me voy al espaol. muchas gracias
[08:06] <kiko-afk> mhz, Tuto?
[08:06] <mhz> yes, oh, let me provide URL, they have done hell of a job
[08:08] <Lord_Athur> take your time...
[08:08] <Lord_Athur> xD
[08:09] <Ireul> hi
[08:09] <Ireul> I've ordered free ubuntu pc cds... Is there a way to get em on dvd????
[08:09] <kiko-afk> Ireul, no. 
[08:09] <Ireul> :(
[08:09] <Ireul> are the cds totally free?
[08:09] <Lord_Athur> yes, the Cds are
[08:10] <Ireul> Lord_Athur: yoda's speaking habit??? :)
[08:11] <Lord_Athur> a?
[08:11] <Lord_Athur> jajaja
[08:11] <Ireul> failed I am, in exile I must go...
[08:12] <mhz> Ireul: but you could download them
[08:12] <Ireul> mhz: already ordered
[08:12] <mhz> the DVS?
[08:12] <Ireul> mhz: is debian based? At what point?
[08:12] <Ireul> mhz: 5 pc cds
[08:13] <mhz> Ireul: what are you talking about? 2 Ubuntu CD's
[08:13] <mhz> oh, I see
[08:13] <mhz> you ordered 5 pieces
[08:13] <mhz> you'll get 10 CD's (5 install and 5 livecd)
[08:14] <Ireul> yes I don't need 64 and macos one
[08:29] <Ireul> mhz: ok
[08:46] <bradb> SteveA: ping (quick q about defining a custom exception)
[08:48] <SteveA> ok
[08:49] <bradb> SteveA: I want to define a custom exception, DuplicateBugContactError(ValueError) and put this in interfaces/distributionsourcepackage.py. This will allow me to provide a more clear error message ("DuplicateBugContactError: foo is already a bug contact for bar."), and more fine-grained error handling. Is this approach okay with you?
[08:49] <SteveA> it is a good idea.  not sure why it would be a ValueError though
[08:50] <bradb> Because the type is correct, but something about the value itself is not.
[08:50] <bradb> (in this case, that the person is already a bug contact on the package)
[08:50] <SteveA> i can imagine this error being raised due to many circumstances, and not exactly because it was an inappropriate argument value 
[08:50] <SteveA> just make it an Exception
[08:50] <bradb> ok
[08:50] <SteveA> also
[08:51] <SteveA> if an error is named so that it obviously sounds like a problem, you don't need to say "Error"
[08:51] <SteveA> i don't think DuplicateBugContact qualifies
[08:51] <SteveA> but if you can think of a way to say it that is definitely an error, then you can use that name
[08:53] <bradb> I can't think of anything better right now. I think I'll just go with DBCE for now.
[08:53] <salgado> bradb, this makes me wonder if we shouldn't have a new vocabulary for bug contacts
[08:54] <bradb> That might be useful as well.
[08:55] <salgado> and you wouldn't need neither this check nor the new exception
[08:57] <bradb> The exception would still be needed.
[08:58] <bradb> e.g. there's a race condition there
[08:58] <salgado> that's right. the exception is in database code
[08:58] <salgado> I misread that as a ValidationError
[09:12] <kiko-afk> nice meeting summary ddaa 
[09:14] <SteveA> ddaa: i reviewed importd2bzr.  it's good.
[09:15] <SteveA> ddaa: one reason that using sys.exit() anywhere except the "i'm a script, run me" entry-point is that it makes it very hard to test parts of the code that might call sys.exit()
[09:17] <ddaa> SteveA: why so, it's just throwing an exception...
[09:19] <SteveA> dealing with it means catching SystemExit, which is evil
[09:19] <kiko-afk> ev1l
[09:19] <kiko-afk> bradb, tell me all about bug 3620
[09:19] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #3620: Default bug list should include Pending Upload bugs In: malone (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: NeedInfo https://launchpad.net/bugs/3620
[09:20] <ddaa> SteveA: why is it evil? The only thing that can throw that exception is sys.exit... you mean some code _not_ to exit, catching SystemExit is exactly what you want.
[09:20] <kiko-afk> uhhh
[09:20] <kiko-afk> whoa
[09:20] <ddaa> I'm not arguing, I'm curious.
[09:21] <bradb> kiko-afk: Malone makes it easy to file duplicate bugs. The "default bug listing" is not the right one to use to search to see if your bug has already been reported.
[09:21] <bradb> That the default listing doesn't include bugs of $status isn't itself a bug thing, but the UI doesn't make obvious what one *should* do to answer the question "Has my bug already been reported."
[09:21] <SteveA> searching for bugs already reported is an important part of the workflow we want people to adopt
[09:22] <bradb> Hence, in response to 3620, I think just doing a guided bug form is best.
[09:22] <SteveA> what about having a page optimised for that?
[09:22] <SteveA> or a mode of a page optimized for that.  mpt: what do you think?
[09:22] <kiko-afk> bradb, okay. agreed. but remember it is not a blocker for the migration, and that some of the top priorities are still TBD
[09:22] <kiko-afk> SteveA, mpt, bradb and I worked on a guided bug form 11 months ago
[09:23] <bradb> kiko-afk: That it's not a blocker for migration was already pretty clear to me.
[09:23] <kiko-afk> okay
[09:23] <kiko-afk> I just want to make sure you are focused on the migration priorities -- IBC being the main one
[09:24] <bradb> That's what I had been working on before this context switch. ;)
[09:24] <kiko-afk> ooooooookay I am going to be quiet now
[09:26] <mpt> go pagetests go
[09:53] <niemeyer> kiko: It should be a blob column, not a string.
[09:54] <mpt> SteveA, new page layout is in PQM
[09:54] <kiko> niemeyer, librarian.
[09:54] <SteveA> mpt: woo
[09:54] <kiko> which means...
[09:55] <ddaa> SteveA: what about a montly shiny award?
[09:55] <ddaa> we've got a winner for this month :)
[09:55] <SteveA> who is Montly Shiny and what's he doing in this channel?
[09:55] <ddaa> Monthly...
[09:57] <kiko> lol
[10:01] <LarstiQ> ddaa: I think I understood you, but my thinking has been proven wrong before
[10:02] <ddaa> Yeah, people say that to me... ;)
[10:03] <niemeyer> kiko: Nice.. let's read more crippled data into the database.
[10:03] <mpt> ddaa, awards are often named after people, such that a misspelled word in that position could be assumed to be a name
[10:03] <kiko> niemeyer, using the librarian is definitely safe
[10:03] <ddaa> you breaker of dreams
[10:04] <ddaa> mpt: I was imagining all sorts of unspeakably kinky and borderline distateful things.
[10:04] <niemeyer> kiko: Indeed.. That's the right way to do it.
[10:04] <kiko> SteveA, have you read the answer to "What exception should I raise when something passed into an API isn't quite right?" in LaunchpadHackingFAQ?
[10:04] <ddaa> mainly involving baby jesus butt plugs...
[10:04] <niemeyer> kiko: I have.. and got review problems following the rules there. :)
[10:05] <kiko> heh
[10:06] <SteveA> kiko: it is out of date.  the advice there is more attuned to library or framework code than to application code such as makes up most of launchpad
[10:06] <kiko> SteveA, what should I do?
[10:06] <kiko> I could just nuke it and replace with your suggestion
[10:07] <SteveA> kiko: leave the section about docstrings.  mention canonical.launchpad.interfaces.NotFoundError
[10:07] <SteveA> nuke the rest
[10:07] <mhz> kiko: ooops, finally. I was mistaken about the name. It's not tuto but TUTOS http://www.tutos.org/homepage/
[10:07] <kiko> rock and roll
[10:08] <kiko> hey, when was ubuntite renamed to ubuntero?
[10:08] <kiko> no email ever went out to me on this
[10:08] <kiko> mhz, that page uses the <blink> tag
[10:09] <kiko> mhz, and no, we don't support project management in launchpad (yet)
[10:09] <lifeless> morning!
[10:09] <mhz> kiko: so why would a Team (inside a distro) register for? What are the advantages?
[10:10] <kiko> mhz, mainly for ownership purposes.
[10:10] <kiko> and bug-subscriptions
[10:10] <kiko> etc
[10:11] <mhz> kiko: yup, my concern is the 'etc'. I have only noticed Bugs and 'ownership' as the only advantages.
[10:11] <kiko> there's also translation teams
[10:12] <mhz> if a team is in fact commited to work, they need to create teams related specifications members can work on (submit to). Also, they would need to set and coordinate work. 
[10:13] <kiko> launchpad doesn't support those use cases yet.
[10:13] <mhz> oooh, i see
[10:13] <kiko> and as I said, specs are attached to products/distros
[10:13] <kiko> so if your team is working on a product or a distro
[10:13] <kiko> you'd probably register the spec on the product
[10:14] <kiko> and then assign it to a team
[10:15] <mhz> kiko, ok, thx for the enlightening. I'll se if we can use it that way or keep working via wiki for some cases.
[10:16] <kiko> mhz, what is your team working on?
[10:17] <mhz> I started EdubuntuStudyContent, and we'll start working on creating edu files to be used by edubuntu applications after install. So Admins will just apt-get install  mat_primary-cl.deb
[10:18] <mhz> or something
[10:20] <kiko> I'd attach that to the edubuntu product (does it exist already) and assign your team to it
[10:20] <kiko> perhaps assigning individual team members to subparts of the spec
[10:21] <mhz> hmm. yup, I was figuring out something like that.
[10:21] <mhz> but, IMHO end-users (teachers this time) will probably feel wiki is easier to work on (coordination).
[10:22] <mhz> Which I dont like in this case, because I was planning to offer "EduPoints" (instead of karma)
[10:24] <kiko> I see
[10:26] <mhz> so, anyways, I wanted to do it all via LP so I'll have teacher decide
[10:27] <niemeyer> cprov: celso.providelo@canonical.com-20051202164451-f7c9d780f7bd040f
[10:39] <bradb> SteveA: Is there an easy way to say that a menu exists in more than one facet? facet = ('foo', 'bar') raised some kind of inhuman error.
[10:39] <SteveA> don't do that
[10:40] <SteveA> one menu class to one facet
[10:40] <bradb> If not, I guess I'll just have to inherit
[10:40] <bradb> ok
[10:40] <SteveA> subclass if you want more
[10:40] <kiko> RFC: https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/3952
[10:40] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #3952: Typo in Ubuntu Code of Conduct 1.0 In: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Diogo Matsubara, Status: Accepted https://launchpad.net/bugs/3952
[10:44] <kiko> mpt, wtf were you doing when you changed the description of that bug? :)
[11:30] <lifeless> hmm
[11:30] <lifeless> kiko: are you still here ?
[11:31] <kiko> I am, lifeless 
[11:31] <kiko> what's up?
[11:31] <lifeless> teams and email addresses
[11:31] <lifeless> just setup a team for packaging opensync (debian-opensync) in debian, me, ajmitch & azeem
[11:32] <lifeless> I *thought* that each team had an email alias in launchpad that we could use as the packaging address
[11:32] <lifeless> was I confused ?
[11:35] <kiko> lifeless, not exactly. the team /can/ have an email address; if not, all /Launchpad/ email is sent to all members.
[11:36] <kiko> there is no external interface to the team though
[11:37] <lifeless> that is my confusion
[11:37] <lifeless> we want an email address to reach the team, for the package.
[11:37] <kiko> make a mailing list somewhere else
[11:37] <kiko> and set that as your team's contact email
[11:37] <lifeless> obviously we have to
[11:37] <kiko> that's the only way
[11:37] <kiko> yes
[11:37] <lifeless> but it would -really nice- not to have to go external for that
[11:37] <lifeless> the group chose launchpad for the bzr support
[11:37] <kiko> it would but we're not doing that right now :)
[11:38] <lifeless> policy or time? I.e. should I setup a spec for this ?
[11:38] <kiko> policy and time both
[11:38] <kiko> mark was reluctant to provide mailing lists (or aliases) to teams
[11:38] <kiko> I'm happy for a spec to be produced
[11:38] <lifeless> I remember that, I also remember his crack pipe going off and talking about programmitaclly driving mailman from launchpad
[11:39] <lifeless> ok. I'll do a spec, on my todo now.
[11:39] <kiko> I can smell the crack from here
[11:40] <lifeless> my use case is simple - one stop shop for package collaboration which requires a maintainer address ;)
[11:40] <kiko> :)
[11:43] <mpt> Eu escrevei o bug mais simples, kiko 
[11:44] <kiko> mpt, qual deles?
[11:50] <mpt> kiko, o bug que voc perguntou, 3952
[11:53] <kiko> ah, beleza
[11:53] <kiko> mpt,  isso mesmo -- voc "simplificou"
[11:53] <mpt> certo
[11:53] <mpt> -er, no -ar
[11:54] <kiko> hmm?
[11:56] <mpt> "escravar" would be "eu escrevei", but "escrever" is not
[11:57] <kiko> escrever -> eu escrevi
[11:58] <mpt> eh, then why did you say escrevou?
[11:58] <mpt> voc escrevou, eu escrevi?
[11:58] <kiko> voc escreveu
[11:58] <kiko> I didn't say anything like escrevou!
[11:59] <mpt> oh, wait
[11:59] <mpt> ok, simplificou
[11:59] <kiko> righ
[11:59] <kiko> t
[12:01] <jblack> anybody doing gnomemeeting?
[12:01] <kiko> I meet using proprietary software
[12:01] <jblack> can it call h323? 
[12:02] <kiko> I don't know anything about codecs
[12:02] <niemeyer> kiko is the proprietary-software kind of guy..
[12:02] <kiko> that is so unfair
[12:03] <jblack> dude? You're a proprietary-software kind of guy?
[12:03] <kiko> well
[12:03] <niemeyer> He even made a thesis about the open source model so that he could apply it on proprietary development..
[12:03] <kiko> jblack, what do I have to do to get out of this conversation?
[12:03] <jblack> You're out. 
[12:04] <jblack> Just remember that when I get stuck in an awkward conversation, you owe me one. :)
[12:04] <mpt> It's all network effects