[12:04] <mherweg> I'll just take my own /opt/ltsp
[12:05] <amu> moin 
[12:06] <ogra> hey amu !!!!
[12:06] <ogra> mherweg, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/multiarch/
[12:07] <ogra> copy the ltsp-build-client and ltsp-update-kernels to your system ... (/usr/sbin/)
[12:07] <\sh> hey amu :)
[12:07] <ogra> then ltsp-build-client has an --arch i386 option
[12:07] <amu> ogra: wanna check if you converted to a kde guy, heard you wanna replace gnome, here i'm ;)
[12:07] <ogra> haha
[12:08] <ogra> i'll never convert ;)
[12:08] <ogra> but its good to see you here :)
[12:08] <amu> :) we'll see  
[12:08] <ogra> i converted once .... to GNOME :)
[12:10] <amu> checkput the kiosktools a wounderfull thing for edubuntu, especially for schools *g* 
[12:12] <amu> s/checkput/checkout  
[12:19] <ogra> amu, they cant cope with sabayon
[12:22] <Absorto> ogra, i upgraded to backported kde3.5 packages. The bug is fixed.
[12:22] <ogra> great :)
[12:22] <ogra> glad you got it running 
[12:23] <Absorto> yes! I'm glad too. 
[12:23] <ogra> :)
[12:30] <Burgwork> is there a complete list of applications included in edubuntu on the wiki?
[12:30] <ogra> yes ...
[12:31] <ogra> not on the wiki though 
[12:31] <Burgwork> do I have to cut apart edubuntu-meta?
[12:31] <ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/seeds/edubuntu-breezy/desktop
[12:32] <mherweg> can I use a ISDN card to go online with an edubuntu-server ?
[12:32] <ogra> there is a section = EduBuntu specific Software =
[12:32] <ogra> mherweg, yup
[12:32] <Burgwork> ogra, cheers
[12:32] <ogra> Burgwork, thats the desktop part ...
[12:33] <ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/seeds/edubuntu-breezy/server
[12:33] <ogra> thats for the server
[12:34] <Lord_Athur> mhz_stuff, !!!!
[12:35] <Lord_Athur> 
[12:46] <Burgwork> ogra, thanks
[12:46] <Burgwork> ogra, is there also a list of rejected apps?
[12:46] <ogra> there are none 
[12:47] <ogra> thats the list we worked out with the teachers at the first edubuntu summit ...
[12:47] <ogra> we'll have another summit (i hope) for dapper+1
[12:48] <ogra> the prob is that i'm already at 680MB with this list ... there is not much space left
[12:48] <Burgwork> cool
[12:49] <ogra> i'd love to drop th ekdeedu stuff if there were some equivlent in gnome ... then i could get rid of the kdelibs and the kde language packs ... they take a hell lot of space
[12:50] <ogra> Absorto, yes, but mixing gnome and KDE is not a good idea space wise 
[12:51] <ogra> amU, is probably building a kedubuntu ...
[12:51] <mherweg> good idea
[12:52] <Absorto> ogra, now that you mention it... how would one go about removing all things gnome now that i've setup kubuntu-destkop?
[12:52] <ogra> remove th elowest level... i.e. look for libgtk or libgnome ...
[12:53] <ogra> it will take the depending stuff with it
[12:53] <Absorto> let's see...
[12:56] <Absorto> why, that seems about right! removing libgnome2-0...
[12:58] <mherweg> Absorto: how did you install kde ? do you use kdm ?
[12:59] <Absorto> mherweg, i apt-got kubuntu-desktop. And yes, kdm.
[12:59] <mherweg> ok
[01:00] <Burgwork> ogra, we are just talking at work here about including some education software and the lead developer has just about vetoed any kde libs
[01:00] <ogra> heh
[01:00] <ogra> that gets hard ... kdeedu is a great suite ....
[01:00] <Burgwork> yes
[01:00] <Burgwork> have you looked at childsplay (I haven't, just wondering)
[01:00] <ogra> yes
[01:01] <Burgwork> how does it compare to gcompris?
[01:01] <ogra> its as big as gcompris and aims to be the successor
[01:01] <ogra> but crrently i thing gcompris has more contributors ...
[01:09] <mherweg> LTSP became very similar ti lessdisks since MueKow, i did not read the ltsp website & ML for a while 
[01:10] <mherweg> /usr/sbin/ltsp-build-client: line 274: debconf-get-selections: command not found
[01:10] <mherweg> ?
[01:10] <mherweg> serios or not ?
[01:11] <ogra> heh... intresting ...
[01:13] <ogra> try to comment line 274 
[01:17] <Absorto> ogra, is it very difficult to net-boot a thick client? I was thinking i could use nss-mysql to take care of authentication etc. and with a P4 and 256MB ram this clients aren't very thin.
[01:17] <mherweg> now it starts to download everything again :-(  i need some kind of proxy
[01:19] <mherweg> Absorto: knoppix terminalserver is for diskless fat clients
[01:19] <Absorto> mherweg, i tried that, but its knoppix flavour. A kubuntu flavour would rock!
[01:20] <ogra> mherweg, use --mirror file://cdrom if you gont a CD
[01:20] <ogra> *got
[01:20] <mherweg> try to use the knoppix technology (unionfs) on top of kubuntu
[01:20] <ogra> it will be in dapper 
[01:20] <Absorto> i think remastering knoppix to make it kubuntu is too much effort...
[01:20] <ogra> (unionfs)
[01:21] <ogra> its been highly unstable until some weeks ago
[01:21] <mherweg> ogra: cool ! thanks - MUCH faster
[01:22] <ogra> :)
[01:22] <Lord_Athur> hi
[01:30] <Lord_Athur> bye
[01:31] <mherweg> the terminal is booting to console login:   - but it takes a lot of time, LTSP becomes slower with every Version
[01:31] <ogra> nope
[01:31] <ogra> it becomes faster
[01:31] <ogra> it *can* only become faster
[01:32] <ogra> since we started off with 90sec ;)
[01:32] <ogra> my current setup boots in 61sec ... and for dapper release it will be down to 45sec
[01:32] <mherweg> ltsp 2.x was the first and the fastest that I know: a kernel , a script, an X-server - nothing more
[01:33] <ogra> yes, but non upgradeable ...
[01:33] <mherweg> i know
[01:34] <ogra> the prob in breezy is (as you see on all the error mesages while booting) that we install a normal bases system 
[01:34] <ogra> for dapper i made a lot of tweaks to make a real minimal system out of it ...
[01:35] <ogra> indeed you have to pay for a default ubuntu kernel and 100% X autodetection...
[01:35] <mherweg> i see
[01:35] <ogra> as well as hrdware detection in general
[01:36] <ogra> the advantage is that you can plug in *every* client into ubuntu ...
[01:36] <ogra> classic ltsp boots in less than 20sec
[01:36] <ogra> but has a non modular kernel and no X detection
[01:38] <ogra> compare http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/breezy-20051113-1.png with http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/dapper-20051205-1.png , thats my work of the last weeks ...
[01:40] <mherweg> ic
[01:43] <ogra> we'll cut down the X detection by about 10 sec and we'll achieve ~15sec from the normal ubuntu bootprocess speedup going on ...
[01:43] <ogra> and there is still space to optimize more in dapper+1
[01:57] <JayAllen> Sigh.
[01:58] <JayAllen> Bought a NetGear FA311. Plugged it in. STILL no network.
[02:09] <mhz_stuff> re
[03:07] <paolob> Hi ogra 
[03:07] <paolob> hi mhz
[03:08] <mhz> paolob: hi man
[03:10] <paolob> mhz, ogra, I keep having problems with the clients' boot. After "nfs-premount...Done" some client (sometimes a bigger number, sometimes a lesser one) waits a very very long time: 10-15-30 minutes!!!! What could be the reason? what could I do?
[03:10] <mhz> hmmmmmmm
[03:10] <Lord_Athur> how can I umount the cd-rom when the cd is being used for something
[03:10] <paolob> Lord_Athur: I think you definitely must stop using it.
[03:11] <mhz> Lord_Athur: usually, you have to make sure the /cd dir is not being used by someone
[03:11] <Lord_Athur> using what?
[03:11] <paolob> or kill the program that is using it
[03:11] <mhz> then, you'll be able to umount it
[03:11] <Lord_Athur> then, how can I know what's using it?
[03:11] <mhz> hmmm, good question
[03:12] <Lord_Athur> jajaja
[03:12] <mhz> if you are the only user...
[03:12] <mhz> simply changing to your home dir will do
[03:12] <Lord_Athur> and the root
[03:13] <Lord_Athur> I work more as root
[03:13] <mhz> ??????????/
[03:13] <mhz> Lord_Athur: you should not do that
[03:13] <Lord_Athur> why?
[03:13] <mhz> esp. if you dont know how to stop and umount your cd :D
[03:13] <Lord_Athur> my user is not in the sudo group
[03:14] <Lord_Athur> this does not allow me to work very well
[03:14] <pc22> Lord_Athur u using edubuntu now?
[03:14] <mhz> Lord_Athur: mounting or umounting is not 'dangerous'
[03:14] <mhz> so you could let all users do that
[03:14] <Lord_Athur> pc22, no, I am using debian
[03:15] <Lord_Athur> mhz, 
[03:15] <mhz> what?
[03:15] <Lord_Athur> the terminal told me that only the root can umount the cd-rom
[03:17] <Lord_Athur> from tomorrow I will not have debian
[03:17] <Lord_Athur> :D
[03:17] <mhz> Lord_Athur: then, as root, do this: adduser tu_mismo cdrom
[03:17] <pc22> is edubuntu cool?
[03:17] <mhz> pc22: indeed
[03:17] <mhz> of course!
[03:18] <mhz> pc22: edubuntu = Ubuntu + LTSP (modified) + educational apps.
[03:18] <mhz> so it is ubuntu
[03:18] <mhz> and if you like ubuntu... edubuntu is cool
[03:18] <paolob> Lord_Athur: fuser /cdrom
[03:19] <paolob> mhz: no idea about that delay problem?
[03:20] <mhz> paolob: I was googling about it
[03:20] <mhz> but no ida yet :(
[03:20] <mhz> did you ask the #ltsp guys?
[03:20] <paolob> Some client boot quite rapidly, others last very much to get the graphic login. 
[03:21] <mhz> and if you change the boot order is the same thing?
[03:22] <paolob> mhz: what boot order?
[03:22] <paolob> I boot all the clients together
[03:23] <mhz> per clients. I mean if you boot #3 , #4,  #5 and then boot all over again #4, #3, #5 ?
[03:23] <mhz> (was an example)
[03:23] <pc22> mhz whats ltsp?
[03:24] <mhz> Linux Terminal Server Project
[03:24] <paolob> mhz: is it wrong to boot all the clients together?
[03:24] <mhz> pc22: 1 central server (powerful) connected to # of thin old clients (with no HD)
[03:25] <mhz> paolob: mhhh, i dont know, that's why I suggested that option
[03:25] <mhz> to find out if the problem still existed in that booting sequence
[03:25] <mhz> :)
[03:27] <paolob> mhz: tomorrow I'm going to try out booting the clients one at a time
[03:27] <mhz> good idea
[03:27] <mhz> or boot group of 2 or 3 at the same time
[03:28] <mhz> the idea is to get a picture of what the possible causes may be
[03:34] <paolob> Well, thanks all! Good night!
[03:34] <mhz> paolob: sleep well
[03:34] <mhz> count some sheeps?
[03:34] <paolob> :-) Voy a soar con los angelitos :-)
[03:34] <mhz> oh de veraas?
[05:40] <mhz> hi all
[05:53] <mhz> highvoltage: awake?
[05:54] <highvoltage> mhz: barely
[05:55] <highvoltage> mhz: just arrived at work
[05:55] <mhz> cool
[05:55] <mhz> I am about to go to bed
[05:55] <mhz> and wanted to know if you saw what hno73 did to TOC site? (you helped him?)
[05:56] <mhz> re
[05:56] <mhz> sorry, bad mouse!
[06:01] <highvoltage> mhz: sorry, got distracted. no, i didn't help him.
[06:01] <highvoltage> link?
[06:06] <mhz> http://new-www.theopencd.org/Welcome
[06:06] <mhz> gee
[06:06] <mhz> that url was hard to get
[06:06] <mhz> I really think he (they?) did an amzing job
[06:06] <mhz> and it's moin! :D
[06:10] <mhz> highvoltage: so, what you think?
[06:15] <highvoltage> it looks nice!
[06:16] <mhz> ok
[06:16] <mhz> highvoltage: when do you think it will be possible to test/help Drupal for Edubuntu?
[06:16] <highvoltage> but like hno73 said, you can do anything visually, it's just a matter of editing the stylesheets.
[06:16] <mhz> yup
[06:17] <mhz> and he also did some tweaking here and there
[06:17] <mhz> and used some naughty boy tricks :)
[06:24] <highvoltage> heh
[06:28] <mhz> highvoltage: when do you think it will be possible to test/help Drupal for Edubuntu?
[09:29] <jeffbuntu> hi, i've a little problem with evince (edubuntu5.10) it can't open one pdf file ==> evince-thumbnailer take 100%cpu endless (but acrobat can open this file) ?
[09:49] <ulinskie> is there a live cd for edubuntu available for download?
[10:25] <konfuzed> actually just saw an interesting article regarding http://opencd.org which is based on ubunutu plus some extras and you can easily add the edu package to after the primary install
[10:25] <konfuzed> uh rather
[10:26] <konfuzed> uf you choose to install
[10:26] <konfuzed> it also runs ubuntu live cd I suppose
[12:30] <JaneW> **Reminder** Weekly Dev Update meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 30 mins
[12:41] <crimsun> crap, I'd better get coffee right now then :)
[12:41] <ogra> heh
[01:14] <janeW> highvoltage: ping -> #ubuntu-meeting please
[01:16] <zakame> edubuntu meeting now?
[01:21] <ogra> yes
[01:22] <zakame> heya mhz :D
[01:22] <mhz> hey..
[02:45] <highvoltage> janeW: pong, been in important meeting
[02:45] <highvoltage> (not that edubuntu is unimportant)
[04:39] <Lord_Athur> ogra, or ogra_
[04:39] <Lord_Athur> what's the person that made edubuntu8?
[04:39] <lucasvo> Lord_Athur: ogra :D
[04:39] <ogra> edubuntu8 ?
[04:39] <Lord_Athur> ok
[04:39] <ogra> we are only at edubuntu1 yet ;)
[04:39] <Lord_Athur> jejeje the number was an error
[04:40] <lucasvo> Lord_Athur: Shuttleworth
[04:40] <Lord_Athur> what's that lucasvo ?
[04:40] <lucasvo> Lord_Athur: the man who pays ogra
[04:40] <lucasvo> Lord_Athur: canonical?
[04:41] <Lord_Athur> I know something about canonical
[04:41] <Lord_Athur> but is  Shuttleworth here?
[04:43] <Lord_Athur> well i was only searching mhz
[04:43] <Lord_Athur> and he is not here
[04:44] <Lord_Athur> I'll see in the channel after any minutes
[04:44] <Lord_Athur> by
[04:44] <Lord_Athur> e
[04:45] <lucasvo> ldm themes aren't gdm compatible, are they?
[04:46] <ogra> not really
[04:47] <ogra> i mean it uses similar wording for the pics, so GDM themes may work on ldm ... but not the other way around, since i dont use xml files 
[04:48] <lucasvo> ok
[06:37] <paolob> hi ogra 
[06:37] <ogra> hi
[06:37] <highvoltage> hi ogra and paolob 
[06:37] <paolob> You know, I keeps having problems with the clients' boot
[06:37] <paolob> hi highvoltage 
[06:37] <juliux> hi paolob highvoltage ogra 
[06:37] <juliux> ;)
[06:37] <paolob> hi juliux 
[06:38] <highvoltage> hi juliux :) (and everyone else)
[06:38] <paolob> ogra: they have a loooooooooong delay (15-30 minutes!) after executing the script nfs-remount.
[06:38] <highvoltage> geepers, i would've gotten impatient after 10 minutes.
[06:38] <paolob> Some client never arrive to present the gui
[06:38] <ogra> i have no idea, sounds rather like a network thing ...
[06:39] <highvoltage> sounds like some kind of lookup not happening, to take a guess.
[06:39] <paolob> I think the problem is in the nfs script, in the nfsmount instrccions: I may guess it is expecting something like a IP address.
[06:39] <highvoltage> did you enter a hostname instead?
[06:40] <paolob> I saw another strange thing too: the server's syslog reports me that every client, after receiving its IP, negotiates another during the first stages of the boot. Is it normal?
[06:40] <highvoltage> yep.
[06:41] <highvoltage> etherboot or pxe will request an address.
[06:41] <highvoltage> and when linux starts up, it will request an address again.
[06:41] <paolob> highvoltage: but then, what of the two is going to be the client's IP?
[06:42] <highvoltage> both, they should be the same.
[06:42] <paolob> ?!?
[06:42] <highvoltage> dhcpd will create a lease period for that client based on the network card's mac address
[06:42] <highvoltage> so it will get the same IP address both times when it requests an address.
[06:43] <paolob> no, they are different!
[06:43] <highvoltage> that's very, very strange.
[06:43] <paolob> I tried with only one client. Syslog shows:
[06:43] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPDISCOVER
[06:44] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPOFFER 192.168.0.250
[06:44] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPREQUEST 192.168.0.250
[06:44] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPACK 192.168.0.250
[06:44] <paolob> mountd: authenticated mountrequest from 192.168.0.177 for /opt/ltsp/i386
[06:45] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPOFFER 192.168.0.249
[06:45] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPREQUEST 192.168.0.249
[06:45] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPACK 192.168.0.249
[06:45] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPREQUEST 192.168.0.249
[06:45] <paolob> dhcp: DHCPACK 192.168.0.249
[06:45] <paolob> 
[06:46] <paolob> What does it mean? In particular that 177 from mountd in the middle....
[06:46] <highvoltage> i don't know. i wish i could be there to check in person, i haven't seen that before.
[06:47] <highvoltage> was only one client switched on at this point?
[06:47] <highvoltage> and do you only have one dhcp server running on the network?
[06:49] <paolob> highvoltage: there was only one client, and the server is one computer.
[06:50] <paolob> highvoltage: the server has a /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf and a /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf . Are there two dhcpd servers?
[06:52] <ogra> dont touch the latter ....
[06:52] <ogra> its the generic dhcpd file ...
[06:53] <ogra> what ip did the booted client have in your above example ?
[06:53] <ogra> apparently 192.168.0.177 mounted the rootfs 
[06:54] <ogra> so i'd guess the clients ip was the same
[06:54] <paolob> ogra: that was before the nfs-premount delay
[06:54] <ogra> the nfs-* scripts are just empty dummys 
[06:55] <ogra> the problem must be somethjing else
[06:55] <paolob> ogra: but they are there, and are executed! They are in (let me try to remember) /usr/share/......./scripts/nfs-***
[06:56] <ogra> look into such a script...
[06:56] <ogra> and they are not executed from /usr/share ;)
[06:56] <paolob> ogra: actually I saw the script i have the delay in there
[06:56] <ogra> its empty ...
[06:56] <paolob> I am not on the server, the server still isn't on the internet
[06:57] <ogra> none of the nfs-* scripts have any content ...
[06:58] <ogra> after the nfs-* scrpts are executed the nfs script is run, but that also only contains one line that matters ...
[06:58] <paolob> ogra: but I _did_ open the script/nfs file, and it wasn't empty. It called script/nfs-top, then script/nfs-premount, then had a nfsmount <parameters>, and then called script/nfs-bottom
[06:58] <ogra> read what i wrote
[06:59] <paolob> ogra: but then what the hell did I see?
[07:00] <ogra> the nfs script (note, not the nfs-* scripts) has one valid line, thats just calling nfsmount 
[07:00] <paolob> I think that the delay is there
[07:00] <ogra> the rest is empty and thought for possible enhancements in the future
[07:01] <ogra> yes, but that can only be the nfsmount command ...
[07:01] <ogra> which would either indicate a network problem or something being wrong with the nfs server
[07:01] <paolob> How can I get more information on that nfsmount? Syslog doesn't tell me anything till the mount is done. I must understand why it lasts so much
[07:02] <ogra> you have the mount attempt in your log above ...
[07:02] <ogra> mountd: authenticated mountrequest from 192.168.0.177 for /opt/ltsp/i386
[07:02] <paolob> Actually I could see various DHCPOFFER/REQUEST/ACK with various IP
[07:02] <ogra> ignore that
[07:03] <ogra> the only intresting piece is the mountrequest line
[07:03] <ogra> or do you run any other dhcp server in the network ? 
[07:03] <paolob> ogra: but apparently the client doesn't find a valid IP to mount, apparently it tryed many IP before finding the right one
[07:04] <paolob> ogra: when I installed edubuntu I was in a net with this pc, I think it has a dhcp server... let me see
[07:04] <ogra> tzhere is only one mount attempt in your log above
[07:04] <paolob> ~$ ps ax|grep dhcp
[07:04] <paolob>  7584 ?        Ss     0:00 /usr/sbin/dhcpd3 -q eth0
[07:04] <paolob> Yes I have
[07:05] <paolob> better, I had when I first installed edubuntu and had it working with a client
[07:05] <paolob> now the server only is connected to its clients
[07:07] <ogra> the above looks like you have running two ...
[07:09] <paolob> ogra: i.e I have two dhcpd server on the same edubuntu server?
[07:09] <ogra> that doesnt work 
[07:09] <ogra> nope, i mean you have two servers running in the net
[07:11] <paolob> ogra: but the server isn't connected to the net :-)
[07:14] <ogra> what ip does the server have ? 
[07:17] <paolob> ogra: 192.168.0.15
[07:18] <paolob> I put that address because I think to connect it in the future to a local net where the IP 192.168.0.1-10 are already in use
[07:18] <ogra> thats fine 
[07:19] <paolob> ogra: how can I debug the nfsmount process?
[07:20] <ogra> thats 
[07:20] <ogra> how a normal dhcp handshake looks on n edubuntu http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/5486
[07:24] <paolob> ogra: I can try to bring here a copy of syslog. Or is some better log file?
[07:24] <lucasvo> gaim is so buggy
[07:24] <lucasvo> *crap* !
[07:25] <ogra> paolob: you can paste it anywhere 
[07:25] <ogra> but i'm running out of time
[07:25] <ogra> we have a developer meeting at 3am (my time) today and i have to prepare a lot
[07:25] <paolob> ogra: anyway it will be tomorrow
[07:26] <ogra> use pastebin, as the topic suggests
[07:26] <lucasvo> ogra: 3am? poor ogra :D
[07:27] <ogra> yup, rotating time ...
[07:29] <paolob> bye all
[08:41] <Absorto> hello! say... i just logged into a thin cilent and there's no loopback interface
[08:41] <Absorto> i believe that's making things difficult to the portmaper. how come there's no lo?
[08:42] <Absorto> I read /etc/network/interfaces and it's there, but it's down.
[08:48] <Lord_Athur> anybody know anything about mhz?
[08:49] <ogra> he is from chile :)
[08:49] <Lord_Athur> jajaja
[08:50] <Lord_Athur> but I had to meet him this morning and he did not call me
[08:50] <Lord_Athur> and he is not here
[08:50] <Lord_Athur> :S
[08:51] <ogra> he was shotrly in the edubuntu meeting today and sent his update to the mailing list since he couldnt stay until the end of the meeting
[08:51] <ogra> dunno what he did during the day
[08:51] <Lord_Athur> what does the word shotrly mean?
[08:51] <ogra> shortly
[08:51] <Lord_Athur> has it got a synonim?
[08:51] <ogra> was a typo
[08:52] <ogra> short ...
[08:52] <Lord_Athur> jajaja
[08:52] <Lord_Athur> ok
[09:00] <Gnimsh> hi
[09:00] <Lord_Athur> hi
[09:01] <Gnimsh> Just wondering what the difference is between ubuntu and edubuntu?
[09:01] <ogra> mainly LTSP 
[09:01] <ogra> the educational apps 
[09:02] <Gnimsh> I don't know that is
[09:02] <Gnimsh> what that is*
[09:02] <ogra> and different artwork
[09:02] <Gnimsh> oh
[09:02] <ogra> the linux terminal server project
[09:02] <ogra> by default the CD installs a terminal server you can use with diskless clients in a classroom
[09:02] <Gnimsh> oh I see. the artwork does look like its for kids
[09:02] <Gnimsh> cool
[09:04] <Lord_Athur> ogra,will we be able to make our own graphical enviroment for edubuntu?
[09:05] <Lord_Athur> someone with an unique and special artwork
[09:05] <Lord_Athur> can this be possible as an official edubuntu project?
[09:05] <ogra> not offical, but thats possible ...
[09:06] <Lord_Athur> :D
[09:07] <Lord_Athur> then, does edubuntu want to continue with gnome officially ?
[09:07] <Absorto> how about edkubuntu?
[09:08] <Lord_Athur> edubuntu with kubuntu?
[09:08] <Absorto> yeah, perhaps!
[09:08] <Lord_Athur> I'd be same to edubuntu with gnome
[09:09] <Lord_Athur> kde & gnome are of other projects of ubuntu, It would not be in edubuntu
[09:09] <ogra> not officially ...
[09:09] <ogra> but feel free to create it ;)
[09:09] <Absorto> yeah, i guess you can have it if you really want it. In fact, I do. I installed edubuntu and am enjoying ltsp much. But then installed kubuntu-desktop and am in bliss.
[09:09] <Lord_Athur> :D
[09:10] <Lord_Athur> is there a way to download a version of edubuntu to modify?
[09:10] <ogra> cdimage.ubuntu.com
[09:10] <ogra> grab the iso and modify it
[09:12] <Lord_Athur> mmm
[09:12] <Lord_Athur> haven't you got a wiki page (or a howto) to visit and learn about modifying distros?
[09:13] <ogra> i gave it to you ... 6 or 8 times in the last 2 weeks ...
[09:13] <ogra> search the wiki, for install CD customization
[09:14] <Lord_Athur> :D
[09:15] <Lord_Athur> But i am asking about change programs create other delete any applications, change the distro and save the new one in a cd
[09:15] <ogra> yes
[09:15] <Lord_Athur> But i am asking about change programs, create other, delete any applications. change the distro and save the new one in a cd
[09:15] <ogra> exactly
[09:16] <Lord_Athur> ?
[09:16] <Lord_Athur> what's that?
[09:16] <ogra> you grab the iso and modify it ...
[09:16] <ogra> add/remove apps etc
[09:17] <Lord_Athur> :D
[09:17] <Lord_Athur> jejeje
[09:17] <Lord_Athur> I will not ask it again 
[09:17] <Lord_Athur> :P
[09:17] <ogra> just read the wiki page any try it ;)
[09:19] <Lord_Athur> jejejei will
[09:21] <Absorto> I have a question! I read in ltsp that you can run apps localy. I don't want to run nis, I want nss-mysql. So, for the time being, I just added a line to my /etc/passwd and created a /etc/shadow with my encrypted password. I then tried to mount /home from the app server and... well, I couldn't find an easy way to do it!
[09:22] <Absorto> so i just added a line in ltsp-client-setup, to append the appropiate line in fstab. It worked!
[09:22] <Absorto> but I don't understand how. 'cause /etc/exports says nothing about /home! how did it mount it if it is not being exported?
[09:23] <Absorto> is it more of that ssh tunneling magic?
[09:26] <ogra> nope... ssh is unrelated 
[09:27] <Absorto> then... how does it do it?
[09:27] <ogra> i'm pretty sure you broke it already with installing KDM
[09:27] <Absorto> well... I didn't! but i had to hack a bit.
[09:27] <ogra> so you wont be using any ssh tunnel anymore ...
[09:27] <Absorto> oh, yeah, no ssh tunneling anymore
[09:27] <Absorto> but... what about the nfs? i don't understand!
[09:27] <ogra> me neither 
[09:28] <Absorto> well, anyways, it mounted /home ro so I had to modify /etc/exports to add rw
[09:28] <Absorto> but then, even tho it mounted rw it was terribly slow.
[09:29] <Absorto> well, i did this: i chrooted to /opt/ltsp/i386 and apt-got kubuntu-desktop
[09:29] <Absorto> then I booted the client and logged in. I added startkde to .xinitrc and ran startx -- :1 
[09:29] <Absorto> I had a terribly slow kde session!
[09:30] <ogra> sure
[09:30] <ogra> you dont run *any* ltsp anymore
[09:30] <Absorto> i suspected the portmap, since I saw some errors on boot
[09:30] <ogra> you run a netbooting fullclinet
[09:30] <Absorto> well.. yes. I do. Did I just reinvent the wheel?
[09:31] <ogra> nope
[09:31] <ogra> highvoltage does the same for his thick clients... 
[09:31] <Absorto> well... you see, this clients arent quite thin, having pentium 4s and 256 mb ram...
[09:31] <ogra> but you need a big client for that 
[09:31] <ogra> thats not much
[09:31] <Absorto> yeah, i have 'em!
[09:31] <Absorto> well, it's enough to run kde :)
[09:32] <ogra> they will break if you dont add a kind of network swapping
[09:32] <Absorto> oh, I thought so.
[09:32] <Absorto> I will.
[09:32] <ogra> they will just shut down if the 356M are used up
[09:32] <ogra> *256
[09:32] <Absorto> just shut down? wow!
[09:32] <ogra> yup
[09:32] <Absorto> sound pretty interesting to me :)
[09:32] <ogra> the kernel has not enough ram anymore, so it kills the X server
[09:33] <ogra> with no warning
[09:33] <Absorto> just like that? awesome!
[09:33] <ogra> i highly suggest you have a look at nbd
[09:33] <Absorto> ok, I'll add some swap, i think that shouldn't be too difficult.
[09:33] <Absorto> what is nbd?
[09:33] <ogra> it will be slow ....
[09:34] <ogra> so slow that you will need 1-2 minutes to move the mousepointer from one corner of the screen to the other
[09:34] <ogra> but it will not shut down
[09:35] <ogra> nbd = network block device
[09:36] <ogra> kernel 2.6 has no other option to swap over the network anymore
[09:38] <Absorto> but what about the swapfiles mounted thru nfs?
[09:38] <ogra> not anymore 
[09:38] <ogra> that was an awful hack to kernel 2.4
[09:38] <ogra> doesnt work wth 2.6
[09:39] <Absorto> hm!
[09:39] <ogra> the way to go is nbd ...
[09:39] <ogra> we have it in the ubuntu kernel by default ...
[09:40] <ogra> the ltsp scripts are prepared to use it
[09:43] <Absorto> or I could use local swapfiles...
[09:45] <Absorto> perhaps I can mount the fat32 and create a swapfile there?
[09:45] <ogra> sure, but then you need harddisks  and could make local installs and just mount /home from a cerntral server
[09:45] <Absorto> theres no support for swapfiles whatsoever?
[09:45] <ogra> sure there is
[09:45] <Absorto> just not over nfs...
[09:45] <Absorto> yeah, i have drives. Its just much easier to admin if they net-boot.
[09:47] <francoisb> Bonsoir  tous
[09:48] <Absorto> hello!
[09:48] <Absorto> brb
[09:49] <francoisb> Trying in french first : J'ai install edubuntu dans une ecole de 3 classes avec 3 utilisateurs. Ets il possible de connecter 2 clients avec le meme utilisateur?
[09:51] <francoisb> Trying in english : is it possible to use 2 thin client with the same user id?
[09:51] <ogra> there is a bug in gnome-settings-daemon which will break the themes ...
[09:51] <ogra> its solved in the next release of gnome ...
[09:52] <francoisb> I've noticed it.
[09:52] <ogra> so yes, but you have to live without themes on the second login
[09:53] <francoisb> I've tried to use Openoffice and the two text opened in the same screen.
[09:53] <ogra> indeed, its the same desktop ...
[09:54] <lucasvo> francoisb: the same is with gstreamer apps(also totem)
[09:54] <francoisb> Wil it be corrected?
[09:54] <lucasvo> is it possible to use same homedir for 2 users?
[09:54] <lucasvo> francoisb: it is quite hard to do it
[09:54] <ogra> francoisb: thats no bug
[09:55] <lucasvo> one would have to change the whole program, let's say it is not the purpose of the programm to run on two machines with one user
[09:55] <ogra> if you log in with the same user twice you are logged in to the same desktop twice 
[09:55] <lucasvo> one could try to use same homedir for 2 users
[09:56] <ogra> or a shread folder 
[09:56] <lucasvo> shread?
[09:56] <ogra> shared
[09:56] <lucasvo> ah
[09:56] <lucasvo> yes
[09:56] <francoisb> I thought that different processes would sent to the two IP of the thin clients.
[09:56] <lucasvo> there will be problems with chown
[09:56] <ogra> but using the same user twice on the same machine gives you the same desktop, thats expected behavior and logical ...
[09:57] <ogra> nope, everything runs on the server 
[09:57] <ogra> only the display is exported to the clients
[09:58] <ogra> imagine a PC with two monitors, keyboards and mice ... 
[09:58] <ogra> (or more than two)
[09:59] <francoisb> It's for pupils aged 7, I don't want to create one user per person.
[10:01] <francoisb> So, I think I'll make one user per client, with a shared folder...
[10:02] <ogra> yup
[10:02] <ogra> sounds sane
[10:06] <francoisb> Another question : is it planed to have a preconfigured samba?
[10:07] <ogra> a samba server ?
[10:07] <francoisb> Just to exchange files with a Windows PC.
[10:08] <ogra> you can use nautilus as client for a windows PC/network
[10:08] <ogra> and the samba server is also installed by default 
[10:09] <ogra> just configure it with the shared folders admin 
[10:10] <ogra> it would be a bit pointless to have a preconfigured samba server if you want to integrate it in a windows network .... you need to adjust it anyway to work with the existing net
[10:11] <francoisb> Installed, yes, but there are lines to write  (chmod for a samba folder, create a samba user.)
[10:11] <ogra> nope
[10:11] <ogra> just use the shares admin tool from the menu
[10:11] <ogra> no need to touch configs
[10:12] <francoisb> All right, I'll try
[10:12] <ogra> have to reboot, bbl
[10:14] <francoisb> Goodbye.
[10:22] <mhz> re
[11:59] <Lord_Athur> hi