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| makx | Md adds the initramfs-tools hooks to udev. | 12:58 |
|---|---|---|
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| makx | much smaller diff now.. :) | 12:58 |
| infinity | makx : Excellent. That should give me some motivation to look over the remaining diffs. | 04:06 |
| === fabbione [n=fabbione@port49.ds1-van.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #ubuntu-boot | ||
| === HiddenWolf [n=HiddenWo@136.169.dynamic.phpg.net] has joined #ubuntu-boot | ||
| makx | infinity: would be cool if ubuntu's land again in bzr. | 09:58 |
| makx | my archive is public. | 09:58 |
| makx | infinity: the evms split is the next step, already spoken with the evms maintainer. | 09:59 |
| makx | bzr branch http://debian.stro.at/bzr-test/initramfs-tools/ | 09:59 |
| infinity | makx : Oh, you rule, I'll happily take that change. | 10:02 |
| infinity | makx : As for bzr, it'll happen. I'm just terminally lazy when it comes to such things. | 10:02 |
| makx | infinity: i try to sync with ubuntu whenever possible. | 10:03 |
| makx | there were some minor errors in Keybuk's latest changelog | 10:03 |
| infinity | That's because you're a far more diligent person than I am. :) | 10:03 |
| makx | s/changelog/changes/ | 10:03 |
| infinity | (Or you have more spare time... Pick one) | 10:04 |
| infinity | Have you told him about them? | 10:04 |
| makx | he removed support for the resume conf. | 10:04 |
| makx | when splitting udev out. | 10:04 |
| infinity | I'm sitting around waiting for him to show up so I can give him shit about something in udev. :) | 10:04 |
| fabbione | Kamion: assuming i want to test my rescue hook stuff.. i guess i will need the udeb in the archive for anna to merge the templates properly.... | 10:48 |
| fabbione | otherwise it won't show up.. right? | 10:49 |
| Kamion | fabbione: easiest way is probably to build a monolithic image from debian-installer with your changed udeb in build/localudebs/ | 10:50 |
| Kamion | type 'make' in build to see the image list; if monolithic isn't there then add it to config/blah, it's usually there but commented out; then 'fakeroot make build_monolithic' or similar | 10:51 |
| fabbione | Kamion: ok.. thanks | 10:55 |
| makx | Kamion: is there a nice howto build udeb? | 11:01 |
| makx | (looked at several rules ssh, udev everyone does it his way) | 11:02 |
| Kamion | not really, but I'd recommend using XC-Package-Type: udeb in the appropriate binary stanza in debian/control and letting debhelper (>= 4.2) do most of the work | 11:04 |
| Kamion | after that it's just a matter of adjusting what files end up in the package; debhelper will take care of avoiding documentation etc. | 11:05 |
| makx | Kamion: ok thx. | 11:06 |
| Kamion | installer/doc/devel/modules.txt in the d-i repo documents what features are/aren't supported in udebs | 11:06 |
| Kamion | oh, and it has a two-minute primer at the end which is essentially what I just said :) | 11:06 |
| Kamion | http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/d-i/trunk/installer/doc/devel/modules.txt?op=file&rev=0&sc=0 | 11:07 |
| Kamion | libraries that need to go in the d-i initrd are the main tricky case, because they need to play nicely with library reduction | 11:08 |
| fabbione | Command failed with status 1 : objdump --private-headers ./tmp/monolithic/tree/lib/md5client/checkpkg | 11:13 |
| fabbione | With output: objdump: ./tmp/monolithic/tree/lib/md5client/checkpkg: File format not recognized | 11:13 |
| fabbione | HMMMM | 11:13 |
| fabbione | file checkpkg | 11:13 |
| fabbione | checkpkg: ASCII English text | 11:13 |
| fabbione | that's correct.. it's a shell lib | 11:13 |
| fabbione | Kamion: any idea of what i am doing wrong? | 11:15 |
| Kamion | put it in /usr/lib instead | 11:24 |
| fabbione | hm ok | 11:25 |
| fabbione | strange that it doesn't barf on lib/rescue.d | 11:25 |
| Kamion | hmm | 11:25 |
| Kamion | where exactly is it failing? | 11:25 |
| Kamion | as in, a bit more context | 11:25 |
| fabbione | at lib reduction | 11:25 |
| fabbione | monolitich build | 11:25 |
| Kamion | the three preceding lines of the output would be useful | 11:25 |
| Kamion | oh, never mind | 11:26 |
| Kamion | fabbione: put #! /bin/sh at the top | 11:26 |
| Kamion | even if it isn't executed, that makes mklibs ignore it | 11:27 |
| fabbione | ah ok | 11:27 |
| fabbione | works for me | 11:27 |
| Kamion | then it should be fine in /lib | 11:27 |
| fabbione | yeps | 11:30 |
| fabbione | thanks a lot | 11:30 |
| === fabbione sighs | ||
| fabbione | it's not my lucky day apparently | 11:39 |
| fabbione | Kamion: can you tell me when you have 10/15 minutes to help me? i am need of help here :( | 11:40 |
| Kamion | fabbione: now's fine | 11:45 |
| fabbione | Kamion: ok thanks! | 11:46 |
| fabbione | well i did build the monolith mini.iso | 11:46 |
| fabbione | i boot with rescue/enable=true | 11:46 |
| fabbione | or rescue from syslinux | 11:46 |
| fabbione | but there is no rescue menu at all | 11:46 |
| fabbione | i get pushed to the partitioner | 11:46 |
| Kamion | did you include rescue-mode in your initrd? | 11:46 |
| fabbione | if i <go back> to the main menu i can't see anything like rescue.. | 11:46 |
| Kamion | I bet you only have rescue-chekc | 11:46 |
| Kamion | ck | 11:46 |
| fabbione | yeps | 11:47 |
| fabbione | ok.. i guess that explain | 11:48 |
| fabbione | why isn't it included by default? | 11:48 |
| Kamion | I'll fix that upstream now; in the meantime, put rescue-mode in pkg-lists/monolithic/local | 11:48 |
| fabbione | (given that we offer the rescue option at boot i mean) | 11:48 |
| fabbione | yes i can do that.. | 11:48 |
| fabbione | thanks | 11:48 |
| Kamion | mostly I just forgot to include it there | 11:48 |
| fabbione | ahhh ehehe | 11:48 |
| Kamion | fixed | 11:49 |
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| fabbione | i am building right now | 11:50 |
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| fabbione | Kamion: it starts to look better but i still don't get my menu.. do i need to use one of this isinstallable thingy? | 12:23 |
| fabbione | i can see there are no templates from my pkg.. | 12:24 |
| Kamion | does the rescue operations menu show up? | 12:24 |
| fabbione | the rescue does | 12:24 |
| fabbione | my entry in it doesn't | 12:24 |
| Kamion | can you put your udeb somewhere? | 12:24 |
| fabbione | sure | 12:25 |
| fabbione | brz clone http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/archives/md5client/ | 12:26 |
| fabbione | just a sec.. it's still pushing | 12:26 |
| fabbione | damn adsl | 12:26 |
| fabbione | i need to kill my isp sooner or later | 12:26 |
| fabbione | ok done | 12:26 |
| Kamion | oh, just the udeb would do fine, if you could put it on rookery | 12:26 |
| Kamion | but ok | 12:26 |
| === Kamion gets | ||
| fabbione | doing | 12:27 |
| fabbione | people/~fabbione/md5client-udeb_0.1-0ubuntu1_all.udeb | 12:27 |
| Kamion | bzr mv debian/md5client.templates debian/md5client-udeb.templates; sed -i 's/md5client/md5client-udeb/' debian/po/POTFILES.in; debconf-updatepo | 12:28 |
| === fabbione sighs | ||
| === fabbione feels hutterly dumb | ||
| Kamion | oh and: echo '2 utf8' > debian/po/output | 12:29 |
| fabbione | thanks Kamion | 12:29 |
| Kamion | ... while you're at it | 12:29 |
| Kamion | cdebconf can only deal with UTF-8 templates so forcing it is a good idea | 12:29 |
| fabbione | thanks a lot | 12:29 |
| Kamion | np | 12:29 |
| fabbione | do i need to echo at build time? or just once? | 12:30 |
| Kamion | no just once, then bzr add debian/po/output | 12:30 |
| Kamion | that's fine in the source tarball | 12:30 |
| fabbione | cool done | 12:31 |
| === fabbione tests again | ||
| infinity | Keybuk : Feel like having someone be irrtated in your direction? | 12:32 |
| Keybuk | are they cute? | 12:35 |
| infinity | I dunno, am I? | 12:35 |
| Keybuk | :) | 12:37 |
| Keybuk | what's your problem? | 12:37 |
| Kamion | nicely dodged | 12:38 |
| infinity | Hrmph. | 12:38 |
| infinity | I feel so rejected. | 12:38 |
| infinity | Anyhow. | 12:38 |
| infinity | udevplug appears to suck in some way I haven't yet fully diagnosed. | 12:39 |
| infinity | I suspect 'udevplug -W' doesn't actually work as advertised. | 12:39 |
| infinity | (Well, I'm pretty positive of that) | 12:39 |
| infinity | When I boot with the normal udev initramfs setup, I get a race where coldplugging is still in progress when ide-generic loads, it grabs my drive first, and it gets named 'hda' instead of 'sda' | 12:40 |
| infinity | So, being the clever sort I am, I changed the script to call "udevplug -W" before the modprobe. Which changes nothing. Same race happens. | 12:40 |
| infinity | (If I remove the modprobe or put a massive sleep before it, all is just fine, for the record... it's just when the modprobe happens before libata gets around to owning my drive that the world ends) | 12:41 |
| === fabbione sends some love over IP to Kamion | ||
| Kamion | works? | 12:42 |
| fabbione | yup | 12:42 |
| Kamion | rock on | 12:42 |
| fabbione | it takes a long time to do a test | 12:42 |
| fabbione | mainly because i need a CDreader in a machine | 12:42 |
| Kamion | qemu isn't too bad for stuff that's early in the installer | 12:42 |
| Kamion | for anything like full installs I find it way too slow | 12:43 |
| Keybuk | infinity: right, so how this works (in theory) is this | 12:43 |
| infinity | Keybuk : How is it actually meant to work?... Does 'udevplug -W' check for a semaphore file, loop on that, and return when it's gone? | 12:43 |
| fabbione | the main issue is that to run the md5sum stuff can take WAYYYYY longer than install | 12:43 |
| fabbione | + i still need an installed system to test against | 12:43 |
| Keybuk | udevd exposes it's queue of events its received from the kernel, but not yet completed processing of | 12:43 |
| infinity | Keybuk : In which case, 'udevplug -anythingelse' can't return until after it writes said semaphore, or you have a race. | 12:43 |
| === fabbione wonders if qemu works on amd64 | ||
| Keybuk | it does that as a directory called /dev/.udev/queue which contains symlinks to the sysfs paths queued | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | now, udevplug "in normal operation" does the following | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | 1) wait for this directory to vanish | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | 2) make it again | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | 3) touch all the uevents | 12:44 |
| Keybuk | 4) wait for this directory to vanish | 12:44 |
| infinity | At which step does it return? | 12:45 |
| Keybuk | so it "waits for there to be nothing in the queue" before going ahead, then waits for there to be nothing in the queue before resuming | 12:45 |
| Keybuk | step 5 | 12:45 |
| Keybuk | udevplug -W just does step 4 | 12:45 |
| Kamion | fabbione: works on an amd64 *host* emulating i386, I'm not sure if it does amd64 targets yet | 12:45 |
| infinity | Keybuk : So it's udevd at fault here, not udevplug? | 12:45 |
| Keybuk | it's hard to define "at fault" | 12:45 |
| infinity | Keybuk : In that it clearly must have something in the queue, but it's not advertising it... Or something. | 12:46 |
| Keybuk | no, it's not that | 12:46 |
| Keybuk | it might be simply that it DOESN'T have anything in the queue | 12:46 |
| Keybuk | if the modprobe returns successfully, it's possible for the queue to become empty | 12:46 |
| Keybuk | while the IDE controller is still waking up, and rubbing the sleep out of its eyes | 12:46 |
| infinity | It's forked-and-forgot 20 modprobes that aren't done? | 12:46 |
| infinity | Hrm. | 12:46 |
| infinity | (returned, but not "done"...) | 12:47 |
| Keybuk | and then when the IDE driver is ready, and spits out the "I found this shit" events, udevplug has moved on because the queue was empty | 12:47 |
| fabbione | Kamion: that would be perfect | 12:47 |
| Keybuk | it's the "no way of knowing an IDE/SCSI/USB controller is busy" problem | 12:47 |
| infinity | Keybuk : Then we have a problem... That ide-generic load just plain can NOT happen there. | 12:47 |
| Keybuk | right | 12:47 |
| Keybuk | now, that ide-generic modprobe is interesting | 12:47 |
| Keybuk | it was there because of a bug in our kernels | 12:48 |
| Keybuk | which I fixed | 12:48 |
| Keybuk | so in theeeory we can take that away now | 12:48 |
| Keybuk | but we still need it for cases where we don't have an IDE controller we know about | 12:48 |
| Keybuk | and again, we come to this "need to wait for the kernel" thing | 12:48 |
| infinity | Well, the world certainly doesn't blow up for me if I take it away, but I'd like to ask someone who's not on SATA to confirm. :) | 12:48 |
| fabbione | d if=/dev/urandom of=hda bs=4G count=1 | 12:49 |
| fabbione | dd: memory exhausted | 12:49 |
| fabbione | suck! :) | 12:49 |
| infinity | Keybuk : Hrm. Non-PCI controllers become an issue here, I guess. | 12:49 |
| Keybuk | yup | 12:49 |
| Keybuk | also I'm not sure, but I think we need ide-generic loaded to cope with pcmcia IDE devices too | 12:50 |
| infinity | Can we do a few-second loop, waiting for the root device to appear, and if it doesn't show up, load ide-generic under the assumption we needed it? | 12:50 |
| infinity | (Then load it again WAY later in the root filesystem, should people need it for non-root devices and we haven't loaded it yet) | 12:51 |
| Keybuk | right, that's kinda where I'm thinking of going for this | 12:51 |
| Keybuk | it had to wait until today, and the -7 kernel to be -meta | 12:53 |
| Keybuk | the trouble is "how long do we wait" ? :p | 12:53 |
| infinity | Yeah, scanning a real SCSI bus can take ages. | 12:53 |
| infinity | Any guarantees that SCSI devices will get scanned after IDE/SATA, perchance? | 12:54 |
| Keybuk | not currently | 12:54 |
| infinity | So we can "wait long enough for a reasonable full ATA scan, then give up" | 12:54 |
| infinity | Meaning it wouldn't matter if we're stuck in SCSI-land. | 12:54 |
| infinity | If we get stuck scanning a SCSI bus before we hit SATA, then load ide-generic, we're back where I am now. | 12:55 |
| Keybuk | I increasingly see why nobody else has tried to make a generic initramfs :p | 12:55 |
| infinity | We will prevail. | 12:56 |
| infinity | Somehow. :) | 12:56 |
| infinity | For now, though, I'd recommend any hack that doesn't land people like me where I am. | 12:56 |
| Keybuk | so here's my current theory | 12:57 |
| infinity | Real SCSI busses, while an important case to work on, are probably a corner case for people testing dapper right this instant. | 12:57 |
| Keybuk | we plug storage controllers, if we find at least one, we don't load ide-generic | 12:57 |
| Keybuk | if we don't find any, we load ide-generic | 12:57 |
| infinity | That's touchy. | 12:57 |
| Keybuk | why? | 12:57 |
| infinity | If you find my shitty SCSI card I have my scanner attached to, but not my root filesystem controller, I cry. | 12:58 |
| Keybuk | meh, good point | 12:58 |
| infinity | (In theory... I haven't had a SCSI scanner for years) | 12:58 |
| Keybuk | and I bet you $10 that your SATA controller doesn't advertise as one | 12:58 |
| infinity | Do they have a specific PCI class? | 12:59 |
| Keybuk | they tend to pretend to be PCI_CLASS_STORAGE_SCSI :p | 12:59 |
| Keybuk | or, more hilariously, PCI_CLASS_STORAGE_RAID | 12:59 |
| infinity | How would I find this out, out of curiosity? | 12:59 |
| Keybuk | lspci -n | 01:00 |
| Keybuk | (use ordinary lspci first if you don't know which line is your controller) | 01:00 |
| infinity | 0000:00:1f.2 0101: 8086:2653 (rev 03) | 01:00 |
| Keybuk | wow, it actually claims to be an IDE controler | 01:00 |
| Keybuk | most don't | 01:01 |
| Keybuk | yay Intel | 01:01 |
| === jbailey [n=jbailey@modemcable139.249-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #ubuntu-boot | ||
| makx | Keybuk: the kernel bug you mentioned is related to modular ide? | 01:03 |
| infinity | Anyhow, my local initramfs is hacked to just not load ide-generic at all, but I happen to know I'm not the only person with this sort of controller. :) | 01:03 |
| infinity | makx : yes. | 01:03 |
| makx | need to look up what you did with that strange Xu legacy. | 01:03 |
| Keybuk | infinity: right, the upstream solution is "don't load ide-generic unless you need to"; we just need to find a way of determining need | 01:03 |
| Keybuk | makx: http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/fixed-ide.patch | 01:04 |
| Keybuk | makx: this is still the same bug we're discussing, the patch just makes it fixable | 01:04 |
| === jbailey phases into the discussion. | ||
| jbailey | The final problem that we hit was for controllers without a sexy chipset and that don't appear on the PCI bus. | 01:05 |
| Keybuk | jbailey: whiteholespewingtimeidedriverscansbusbutidegenericloadsandclaimsthedevicesbeforescanhascompleted | 01:05 |
| jbailey | Near the end of the breezy cycle, Matt had me always oad ide-generic no matter what because a class of devices existed that weren't getting an IDE controller at all. | 01:06 |
| makx | Keybuk: why am i not hit with debian's udev? | 01:06 |
| infinity | And that's fine, but it has to happen way AFTER everything else it detected. | 01:06 |
| Keybuk | makx: ya know, I was never entirely sure of that | 01:06 |
| jbailey | Keybuk: Yeah, well. I've said more than once that that I want bus scanning state to be visible from userspace. | 01:07 |
| jbailey | Even if ther kernel's bus scans were. | 01:07 |
| jbailey | I knwo that HW ones will always suck. | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | yeah, the problem with just waiting for devices to appear is the "what if there aren't any on that bus?" problem | 01:07 |
| Keybuk | oooooooh | 01:09 |
| Keybuk | does something appear in sysfs after the scan has completed, in the ide case | 01:09 |
| Keybuk | the scan takes place in the middle of the init | 01:09 |
| Keybuk | we could WAIT_FOR_SYSFS that | 01:10 |
| jbailey | Well, hmm. You're not waiting for the scan of the IDE bus, right? | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | we are | 01:10 |
| jbailey | Just the PCI bus so that all the DMAable controllers are found. | 01:10 |
| Keybuk | no, we're waiting for the IDE bus scan to complete | 01:11 |
| Keybuk | so we don't carry on and load ide-generic while the scan is still going on | 01:11 |
| jbailey | What does it interfere with there? By that time, shouldn't the other controller have already allocated all the resources? | 01:11 |
| makx | Keybuk: i saw no check of /dev/.udev/queue in your udev hooks. | 01:11 |
| Keybuk | the problem is that if we load ide-generic, while a scan is still going on, then ide-generic can become the favourite to win the devices | 01:12 |
| Keybuk | the ide scanning stuff doesn't hard-code the winning driver | 01:12 |
| Keybuk | makx: that's what udevplug does | 01:12 |
| makx | that's the part requiring > 2.6.14 | 01:12 |
| makx | ? | 01:13 |
| jbailey | Keybuk: Wha? That's crazy. | 01:13 |
| jbailey | I would've thought the IDE devices would be recognised as subdevices of their controller, and not be interfered with. | 01:13 |
| Keybuk | apparently not | 01:13 |
| Keybuk | at least, not where ide-generic is concerned | 01:14 |
| Keybuk | I need to sit down with the ide subsystem code, I think | 01:15 |
| jbailey | The libata stuff isn't 2.6.15-bound is it? | 01:16 |
| infinity | Keybuk : I think the breakage happens in my case before libata is even loaded. | 01:16 |
| infinity | Keybuk : It goes something like "PCI scan starts, while other devices (like tg3) are being loaded, we modprobe ide-generic, then libata gets loaded and it's already lost" | 01:17 |
| infinity | I'm not sure we actually have a race AFTER libata starts scannind for devices. We might. That would be scary. | 01:17 |
| Keybuk | that shouldn't happen ... if tg3 is loaded first, then udevplug will still be blocking while ata_piix gets loaded | 01:18 |
| Keybuk | or, in theory, both get loaded at the same time, and udevplug waits for them both to complete | 01:18 |
| Keybuk | are you heading for bed soon, or are you still going to be up for a couple of hours? | 01:18 |
| === fabbione feels the pain of qemu | ||
| infinity | I'm going to go watch a movie and slack for a couple of hours, then I'll be back at my computer. | 01:19 |
| Keybuk | ok, grab me when you're up for some hot debugging action | 01:19 |
| Keybuk | want to poke around and see what is actually happening with your controller | 01:19 |
| infinity | Yeah, it's kinda hard to tell for sure what order events occur in, since I can't type four thousand words per minute. | 01:20 |
| infinity | If you can script something to watch WTF is really going on behind the scenes... | 01:20 |
| makx | Keybuk: while splitting udev out, you removed probably unintentionaly the initramfs.conf resume variable support. | 01:20 |
| infinity | (Of course, given the delicate race conditions at play, adding any more CPU usage may just make them go away) | 01:20 |
| infinity | Note that I actually booted successfully once, while all the other times were miserable failures. | 01:21 |
| Keybuk | I can give you an "a;b;c" thing to run in the shell, without "quiet" so we can see which is running when | 01:21 |
| Keybuk | where shell ~= initramfs | 01:21 |
| infinity | That irritated me more than anything else... The debug boot that worked. | 01:21 |
| Keybuk | makx: that block was duplicated elsewhere | 01:21 |
| infinity | My girlfriend backed away slowly as I was cursing at my laptop for booting correctly when it bloody well wasn't supposed to. | 01:22 |
| makx | Keybuk: oh indeed, hadn't seen that while going throught the diff. | 01:23 |
| jbailey | infinity: Ah good. Keep this one. | 01:23 |
| jbailey | She understands that programmers are most dangerous in the presence of XPASS. | 01:23 |
| Kamion | infinity: how goes the m-f-l-a stuff? if it's part-done I could take over | 01:24 |
| infinity | Kamion : Smashingly, if I could figure out where the heck the rtlclassic theme comes from.. | 01:24 |
| Kamion | you already know more than me, then :) | 01:27 |
| infinity | Maybe it's not required anymore... | 01:29 |
| === infinity tests this theory. | ||
| infinity | Oh, hot diggity. We don't need rtlclassic anymore. | 01:36 |
| infinity | firefox does right-to-left natively. | 01:36 |
| infinity | Man, right-to-left menus really hurt my brain. | 01:38 |
| infinity | On second thought, this package may be too confusing for a man who's supposedly not working right now. | 01:43 |
| Kamion | it's a flight 2 blocker, so if you can't do it feel free to send it to me (with instructions on how to build the .orig.tar.gz if that's quicker than uploading it) | 01:44 |
| infinity | Well, the orig is the problem, really. | 01:45 |
| infinity | Upstream renamed a mess of locales, and I'm trying to decide if I fudge it and just rename them back, or if I do it correctly, and have the packages conflict with the old ones, etc... | 01:45 |
| infinity | But the Right Way looks very... Odd. It's not a sane source package. :) | 01:46 |
| infinity | Alright, you want me to fix it in 2 hours, or you want to find another sucker? | 01:47 |
| Kamion | two hours is fine | 01:48 |
| Kamion | you've got it in your brain already :) | 01:49 |
| Kamion | (if you don't mind too much) | 01:49 |
| infinity | Yeah, it's floating around up there. | 01:49 |
| infinity | I think I'll just hack it up to be buildable and installable enough to make flight-2 happy for you, then make pitti deal with the fallout. :) | 01:49 |
| Kamion | yeah | 01:49 |
| infinity | Off to watch a movie first, then back to bending my brain at firefox. | 01:50 |
| infinity | At least the lack of rtl theme dependencies is good news. | 01:50 |
| infinity | An he_IL is a confusing locale to use a computer in. | 01:50 |
| infinity | Worse than jp_JP, and I didn't think that was possible. | 01:51 |
| fabbione | Kamion: in yaboot-installer/rescue.d/80... | 01:58 |
| fabbione | db_input critical yaboot-installer/ybinerr | 01:58 |
| fabbione | shouldn't that one be || true ? | 01:58 |
| Kamion | cdebconf always displays error templates so it doesn't really matter | 01:59 |
| fabbione | ok | 02:00 |
| infinity | Kamion : You know, the quicker fix would just be to temporarily upload a lanpack-en that doesn't depend on the firefox locale... | 02:00 |
| Kamion | infinity: yeah, but ugh | 02:00 |
| Kamion | I'd rather not regress if we don't have to | 02:01 |
| Keybuk | infinity: can you, for my sanity, confirm that you're having those sata issues on 2.6.15-7 ... and not -6 ? | 02:13 |
| infinity | Keybuk : I saw it a total of once on -6, but it may have been unrelated. I get it every boot on -7 | 02:15 |
| infinity | (Well, every boot but that one where it worked..) | 02:15 |
| Keybuk | right | 02:20 |
| Keybuk | of course, we're looking at entirely the wrong subsystem :p | 02:20 |
| Keybuk | real IDE drivers seem to not led modprobe complete until they've taken ownership of the drives they wanted | 02:22 |
| infinity | What do you mean by "real IDE"? | 02:22 |
| Keybuk | SUBSYSTEM=="ide" | 02:22 |
| infinity | Anything not libata? | 02:22 |
| Keybuk | as apposed to IDE-in-drag | 02:22 |
| Keybuk | as you've got a double-whammy-wait | 02:23 |
| Keybuk | you have to wait for the IDE subsystem to find the devices, then the SCSI subsystem to take them and export them | 02:23 |
| infinity | As I said, though, I THINK ide-generic is loading before libata even kicks in, but it's hard to tell. | 02:23 |
| Keybuk | yeah | 02:24 |
| infinity | Anyhow, movie, or I'll never get back to be Kamion's bitch, and he'll hate me forever. | 02:24 |
| Keybuk | after your movie, we'll have an initramfs play session | 02:24 |
| === ..[topic/#ubuntu-boot:Keybuk] : known: oss drivers loaded, no network plugging, alsa rules not reloaded, mtab not updated, /dev/pts not mounted, ide-generic beats sata drivers || fixed: notify-reboot, vio_type segfault, no modules loaded, hal/pcmcia rules not reloaded, nfs root fails, sata root fails, pnp devices not loaded, init stop/start, grepmap bitching, fb drivers loaded, installer "devfs" rules | ||
| Keybuk | (diff: scsi-devfs/installer fixed -- new known: ide-generic beats sata) | 03:06 |
| === HiddenWolf [n=HiddenWo@136.37.dynamic.phpg.net] has joined #ubuntu-boot | ||
| === jbailey_ [n=jbailey@modemcable139.249-203-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #ubuntu-boot | ||
| Keybuk | hmm, ok | 04:54 |
| Keybuk | infinity: anyway, is your laptop free to do a little debugging | 05:00 |
| infinity | It can be made free. | 05:13 |
| infinity | Let me fire up the auxiliary laptop for IRC, and stop all the crap I'm doing on this one. | 05:14 |
| Keybuk | the modprobe in initramfs is the same as the real one, right? | 05:17 |
| Keybuk | it's not some Kamion busybox special? | 05:17 |
| jbailey | It should be, yes. | 05:19 |
| jbailey | The modprobe in busybox had issues on ppc64 so I ditched it. =) | 05:19 |
| infinity | Okay, IRC is on the laptop of doom. | 05:25 |
| infinity | Keybuk : Give me 5 mins for a smoke, then you have me for about 30 mins (more, if we're really getting somewhere interesting) before I pass out. :) | 05:25 |
| infinity | Keybuk : I'm all yours. Hurt me. | 05:31 |
| Keybuk | ok, so reboot it WITHOUT "quiet" or "splash" and with "break=premount" | 05:32 |
| Keybuk | and scripts/init-premount/thermal if your laptop dies, like mine does :p | 05:32 |
| infinity | Hrm,I've only done this a dozen times today... | 05:33 |
| Keybuk | then UDEV_LOG=info udevd --daemon | 05:33 |
| Keybuk | this should mean you get the dmesg output and udevd log messages | 05:33 |
| Keybuk | so you can get a good idea of when things actually happen, relative to each other | 05:34 |
| Keybuk | then do: | 05:34 |
| Keybuk | udevplug -Bpci -Iclass=0x0[12] *; echo WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO | 05:34 |
| Keybuk | or something | 05:34 |
| Keybuk | so in the middle of that log output, there'll be a great big scream, so you can get a rough idea of what finishes first | 05:34 |
| infinity | Hrm. I get my scream at the end. | 05:35 |
| infinity | This wasn't what I was expecting. | 05:36 |
| infinity | You? | 05:36 |
| Keybuk | nope, me neither | 05:36 |
| Keybuk | ok | 05:36 |
| Keybuk | so that's kinda interesting | 05:36 |
| Keybuk | now, can you cat /proc/modules | 05:36 |
| Keybuk | in particular, the ones at the top | 05:36 |
| infinity | sd_mod, ata_piix, ahci, libata, scsi_mod, generic, ide_core | 05:37 |
| Keybuk | right, unless I'm going mad, none of those is a plain-old-IDE driver? | 05:38 |
| Keybuk | now, do you have a /dev/sda* ? | 05:38 |
| infinity | Yeah, I have /dev/sda* | 05:38 |
| Keybuk | what happens if you modprobe ide-generic now? | 05:38 |
| infinity | The good ol' I/O resource not free messages. ie: nothing bad. | 05:39 |
| Keybuk | and you don't end up with /dev/hda ? | 05:39 |
| infinity | This is whaty I epxect from running things in this order. | 05:39 |
| infinity | No /dev/hda, right. | 05:39 |
| Keybuk | right, | 05:39 |
| infinity | I never have BOTH, only one or the other. | 05:39 |
| Keybuk | now, let's try that again (from a fresh reboot), but instead make a two-line shell-script that contains those two lines | 05:39 |
| Keybuk | beware the fact you don't have ^D | 05:39 |
| Keybuk | so echo '#!/bin/sh' > test.sh; echo 'udevplug -Bpci -Iclass=0x0101*' >> test.sh; echo WOOOO >> test.sh | 05:40 |
| infinity | I also have shit for scrollback, which sucks. | 05:40 |
| Keybuk | yeah, is more just whether it's an "at the end, or in the middle" thing | 05:40 |
| Keybuk | (uh, echo echo WOOO, clearly :p) | 05:41 |
| infinity | Alrighty. | 05:42 |
| infinity | Right. Two things of note. | 05:43 |
| infinity | 1) I forgot the UDEV_LOG. :) | 05:43 |
| infinity | 2) The script never returned. | 05:43 |
| infinity | Thanks, busybox. | 05:43 |
| Keybuk | heh | 05:44 |
| infinity | Never did echo either, so I think this is some kinda special going on here. | 05:44 |
| Keybuk | did you forget to run udevd all together? | 05:44 |
| infinity | Oh, right. I ran into that a few hours ago when debugging this. | 05:45 |
| Keybuk | heh | 05:45 |
| Keybuk | udevplug will be sitting there waiting for udevd to start :p | 05:45 |
| infinity | Why does udevplug block indefinitely with no udevd running? :) | 05:45 |
| Keybuk | because that's what it's designed to do | 05:45 |
| Keybuk | not exit until the events you plugged have actually been handlecd | 05:45 |
| Keybuk | if that means waiting for udevd to start, that's what it means <g> | 05:45 |
| Keybuk | it actually exits after about 3 minutes anyway | 05:46 |
| infinity | Seems a bit obtuse. :) | 05:46 |
| Keybuk | *shrug* | 05:46 |
| Keybuk | udevd is always running | 05:46 |
| Keybuk | the alternative would be some evil, unreliable, "check udevd is running" check | 05:46 |
| Kamion | SCORE, got gfxboot to work | 05:47 |
| jbailey | alarm(10); echo "WTF are you doing that udev is taking so long?" | 05:47 |
| Keybuk | jbailey: pretty much, except it's alarm(180) | 05:47 |
| Keybuk | 10s is less time than my sound card driver takes to load <g> | 05:47 |
| Kamion | though judging from the way I just had to adjust nearly every setting on my monitor to make it look decent, it's using a video mode my monitor has never heard of before | 05:48 |
| jbailey | Ugh, really? | 05:48 |
| infinity | Keybuk : Okay, same result when run as a shell script. | 05:48 |
| Keybuk | meh | 05:49 |
| Keybuk | removing the ide-generic call fixes it every time, right? | 05:49 |
| infinity | Yup. | 05:49 |
| Keybuk | fair enough, I'll just assume what's really happening then :( | 05:49 |
| infinity | As does a massive sleep before the ide-generic call (for obviousl reasons) | 05:49 |
| Keybuk | right | 05:50 |
| infinity | Is it possible udevd behaves differently (other than the syslog output) when UDEV_LOG is set to info? | 05:51 |
| infinity | Anyhow, let me try this again, with the modprobe in there. | 05:51 |
| infinity | And see where it happens. | 05:51 |
| Keybuk | yeah, it goes slower | 05:51 |
| Keybuk | mayyybe try without that, and just with dmesg | 05:51 |
| infinity | No dmesg in initramfs. I suppose I should copy it over. | 05:55 |
| infinity | Anyhow, running 'udevplug blah blah' followed by 'modprobe ide-generic' (basically what init-premount/udev does) didn't break with udevd running with info-level logging. | 05:56 |
| infinity | This is a rather fragile race, if it's a race at all. Or we've completely mis-diagnosed it. | 05:57 |
| Keybuk | and what about without info-level logging? | 05:59 |
| Keybuk | so far this _feels_ like a race ... it's of the "hides when you try and debug it" variety | 06:00 |
| infinity | I'm booting so I can add dmesg to my initramfs. :) | 06:00 |
| Keybuk | Fly On The Wall Bug | 06:00 |
| Keybuk | changes when you point the debugger at it | 06:00 |
| Keybuk | heh, why? just boot without quiet, then you get dmesg spat all over the console | 06:00 |
| === pitti_xg [n=pitti@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-boot | ||
| Keybuk | "xg" ? | 06:01 |
| Keybuk | what happened to pitti server 2005 ? | 06:01 |
| pitti_xg | Keybuk: I'm trying xchat-gnome :) | 06:01 |
| infinity | Yeah, but no backscroll in said dmesg. | 06:01 |
| infinity | Meh. | 06:01 |
| infinity | Remind me to add that DEBUG flag next week. | 06:02 |
| pitti_xg | heh | 06:02 |
| infinity | I'm taking suggestions on what we want copied in there as of now. :) | 06:02 |
| Keybuk | lsmod, dmesg, udevmonitor, lspci, lsusb | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | syslog? | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | less, vi | 06:03 |
| infinity | nvi, or nano? | 06:03 |
| infinity | Or I could upload ae to universe and impose my own view of the world on you. | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | some kind of stty stuff to make ^C and ^D work | 06:03 |
| infinity | Muahaha. | 06:03 |
| Keybuk | nvi, it's a sysadmin area | 06:03 |
| infinity | Hrm, some echoing would have been smart there. | 06:07 |
| infinity | I broke it successfully, though. | 06:07 |
| === infinity reboots one more time. | ||
| infinity | I hope the echoing doesn't slow it down enough to unbreak it. | 06:08 |
| Keybuk | that would be a bitch -- echo being slower than modprobe <g> | 06:10 |
| Kamion | hey, udevmonitor's only 6K | 06:10 |
| Kamion | would that be useful in the installer? | 06:10 |
| Kamion | I tend to think so ... | 06:10 |
| infinity | Damnit. echo made it work. | 06:11 |
| infinity | That SCREAMS race now. | 06:12 |
| infinity | The only difference between the broken script and working script was an echo statement between the udevplug and the modprobe. | 06:12 |
| Keybuk | Kamion: you can have it in there if you want | 06:13 |
| Keybuk | infinity: yup, almost certainly a race then | 06:14 |
| Keybuk | well, that's nice to know | 06:14 |
| Keybuk | btw, if you omit the udevplug call, do you get the same behaviour ? :p | 06:14 |
| infinity | If I just modprobe ide-generic? | 06:15 |
| Keybuk | yup | 06:15 |
| Keybuk | just to make reallly sure that's the culprit here | 06:15 |
| infinity | Yeah, ide-generic does what one would expect, give me geenric IDE drives. | 06:16 |
| Keybuk | right | 06:17 |
| Keybuk | now what if you do this | 06:17 |
| Keybuk | udevd --daemon | 06:17 |
| Keybuk | modprobe ata_piix | 06:17 |
| Keybuk | modprobe ide-generic | 06:18 |
| infinity | D'oh, I just rebooted. | 06:20 |
| === infinity reboots again. | ||
| infinity | I think 4:20am may be past my bedtime. | 06:20 |
| infinity | modprobe ata_piix ; modprobe ide-generic was so close to racing, it's no funny. | 06:23 |
| infinity | If my shell were faster, maybe it would have broken. | 06:23 |
| infinity | (the ide-generic output in dmesg was interlaced with the ata_piix output, but just late enough that ata_piix seemed to claim the driver first...) | 06:23 |
| infinity | s/driver/drive/ | 06:23 |
| Keybuk | heh, it's meeting time in 8 hours :p | 06:26 |
| Kamion | Keybuk: udevmonitor in udev-udeb> yes please | 06:26 |
| infinity | Okay, rebooting the laptop to normal land and going to try to sleep before the meeting. | 06:27 |
| Keybuk | right, so it definitely is a race then | 06:28 |
| infinity | Certainly smells like one. | 06:32 |
| === Kamion kicks hotplug out of base, at least | ||
| Kamion | (I know you want it removed, but I don't want to be the one pressing that button :-)) | 06:55 |
| Keybuk | why is it still in the archive? | 07:01 |
| Keybuk | elmo: WHY? WHY? WHY? | 07:01 |
| Keybuk | uh, -ENOELMO | 07:01 |
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| Keybuk | Kamion: would you like udevinfo and udevtest in there too? | 07:11 |
| Kamion | Keybuk: udevinfo probably yes, udevtest seems a bit more nebulous given the size | 07:13 |
| Keybuk | right, I don't tend to use udevtest much -- it's often easier just to punt it through udevd again and see what happens :) | 07:14 |
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