[03:37] <klepas> moin
[03:57] <mhz> klepas: moin
[07:07] <artnay> hi
[07:45] <klepas> hey artnay 
[07:45] <klepas> updated any other wiki entries?
[09:26] <artnay> not yet
[09:26] <artnay> been busy
[09:35] <klepas> cool
[09:35] <klepas> i'm trying to get a job so i can get a laptop
[09:35] <klepas> :)
[09:45] <artnay> I'm trying to get this balloon idea to work... Replacing K menu with "a balloon" that is based on three elements (Navigation [Applications, Places, System] , Search, Actions)
[09:46] <artnay> would like to get a working one with KDE/CSS styles :>
[09:47] <artnay> I mean, holy crap, Vista's Start menu takes 1/3 of the screen space. what a mess
[09:48] <klepas> yea.
[09:48] <artnay> K Menu is too crowded, too. so getting a plain menu with basic functions and some eye-candy would be really nice ;)
[09:48] <klepas> saw that screenshot you showed me yesterday
[09:48] <klepas> i'm fairly happy with the k menu
[09:48] <artnay> I'm still working on that
[09:48] <klepas> but i suppose it should be customisable
[09:48] <klepas> to be simpler
[09:49] <artnay> didn't have much time yesterday (well, I was able to check my mail) so nothing wasn't done :|
[09:49] <artnay> it should be wider
[09:49] <artnay> it takes the Windows approach
[09:49] <klepas> should be wider!?
[09:49] <artnay> get everything into one menu and make it really high
[09:49] <klepas> heck no
[09:49] <klepas> i like smallness
[09:49] <klepas> :P
[09:50] <artnay> me too, that's why I'd like to K menu to utilize some horizontal space
[09:50] <artnay> add "see"
[09:50] <klepas> no
[09:50] <klepas> ewww
[09:50] <klepas> small
[09:51] <klepas> cut down the menus even more
[09:51] <klepas> into things like "create/edit"
[09:51] <artnay> I have a few hours of spare-time today, tomorrow christmas parties and on the weekend I'm working
[09:51] <klepas> "communicate"
[09:51] <klepas> and so forth
[09:51] <artnay> klepas: that's one possibility although I like GNOME's approach
[09:51] <artnay> but if you want to base that on verbs, why not
[09:52] <artnay> so I'm quite busy at the moment, too bad. we should update the wiki asap
[09:52] <artnay> hey btw, people have been asking about communityartwork
[09:52] <klepas> hehe
[09:52] <klepas> yea, saw that
[09:53] <klepas> but all the info is available in more applicable pages now
[09:53] <klepas> btw
[09:53] <artnay> should we just create the main artwork page?
[09:53] <klepas> GNOME 3 will probably move to use such verbs as well to simplify the menus
[09:53] <klepas> main artwork page?
[09:53] <artnay>  /Artwork
[09:53] <klepas> mmh
[09:53] <klepas> maybe
[09:53] <artnay> the one that contains all the links
[09:54] <artnay> so it would be easier to navigate
[09:54] <klepas> let us fix up the current pages
[09:54] <klepas> because it is less work
[09:54] <klepas> all nice and cut down
[09:54] <artnay> GNOME 3? I saw jimmac's hacks
[09:54] <klepas> jimmac's hacks?
[09:54] <klepas> linky plz :)
[09:54] <artnay> it had a few nice ideas, but I didn't like the "start menu" at all
[09:54] <klepas> brb, got to feed the giant furballs :)
[09:54] <artnay> it wasn't that nice, it took the windows approach
[09:55] <artnay> one menu to master them all
[09:56] <Tm_T> artnay: have you seen KDE4 mockups ?
[09:56] <artnay> Tm_T: official ones?
[09:56] <Tm_T> "official" ones ;)
[09:56] <artnay> they didn't differ that much, only using Qt 4
[09:56] <artnay> so GUI is almost the same, right?
[09:56] <Tm_T> oh, you haven't seen aseigos ideas then
[09:56] <artnay> at kde-looks?
[09:56] <Tm_T> nope
[09:57] <Tm_T> can't remember where I saw, but aseigo has good ideas about it
[09:57] <artnay> show me the... KDE!
[09:57] <artnay> like what?
[09:57] <klepas> probably on kde-artists.org
[09:57] <artnay> jimmac's hacks: http://www.flickr.com/photos/gamehack/sets/1506658/
[09:58] <artnay> that Applications menu is terrible
[09:58] <artnay> nothing personal :)
[09:58] <Tm_T> artnay: well, now there's panel, there's desktop, there's menus... he's main idea is that they're not "separate" but works together making things just work better
[09:59] <artnay> notification area / "systray" is based on a few simple colours, I like that
[09:59] <artnay> stolen from OS X and Apple stole it from... ;)
[09:59] <artnay> and Vista is taking the same approach, that wasn't a surprise
[10:00] <artnay> Tm_T: I didn't get you, need some pics :)
[10:01] <Tm_T> artnay: trying to find
[10:01] <Tm_T> and even pics doesnt show the greatness of it
[10:02] <artnay> jimmac's hacks have this hotspot idea
[10:02] <artnay> notice the icons on the upper corners?
[10:02] <klepas> yea
[10:02] <klepas> whoa
[10:02] <klepas> if that is how gnome 3 is going to be...
[10:02] <klepas> then i might change =P
[10:02] <artnay> klepas: you actually like that?
[10:04] <Tm_T> artnay: I think here's something: http://kde-artists.org/main/forum/index.php?board=5.0
[10:04] <klepas> they aren't bad
[10:04] <artnay> I guess KDE 4 has many of those features, like that unified notification area
[10:04] <klepas> and i'm assuming of course i can customise them
[10:05] <artnay> customizing GNOME?
[10:05] <klepas> yea
[10:06] <artnay> they want to provide sane defaults, customizing is 2nd priority (if it's even possible without hacks)
[10:07] <Tm_T> artnay: aye
[10:07] <klepas> that would be good
[10:07] <klepas> i hope kde 4 keeps the same in mind
[10:07] <Tm_T> well, I hacked my Kicker clock =)
[10:08] <artnay> Tm_T: ok, I only see threads containing ideas how things could be done
[10:08] <klepas> because personally having superkaramba and moving this and moving that would be crap
[10:08] <artnay> no pics
[10:08] <klepas> it uses system resources like nothing else and is not good for slower macines
[10:08] <Tm_T> artnay: yu, I don't remember where I saw some really nice pics
[10:08] <klepas> s/macines/machines
[10:08] <Tm_T> klepas: *karamba... never liked it =)
[10:09] <artnay> klepas: some widgets do, but superkaramba by itself?
[10:10] <klepas> not by itself
[10:11] <klepas> but if KDE 4 will be anything like the devs with powerful machines want it to be at default then it is going to suck at first
[10:11] <klepas> it needs to be fast enough to run well
[10:11] <artnay> so maybe optimizing the code of widget would be the place to start
[10:11] <klepas> even on an 800 Mhz machine
[10:12] <artnay> when will KDE 4 be out? more than a year, right?
[10:12] <Tm_T> artnay: atleast a year
[10:13] <artnay> so there's plenty of time before KDE 4 or GNOME 3 will be released
[10:13] <klepas> really?>
[10:13] <klepas> isn't it 6 months release cycle?
[10:13] <klepas> or did they make an exception?
[10:13] <artnay> for minor changes
[10:13] <artnay> there's no schedule for major changes
[10:14] <artnay> although I saw one project which was delayed for like 3 or 4 months
[10:14] <artnay> it had a schedule
[10:14] <artnay> plasma.
[10:15] <klepas> mmh
[10:15] <klepas> strange
[10:15] <klepas> just curious
[10:15] <artnay> First uploads of the API documentation to this website will likely occur in September 2005 given the current roadmap. 
[10:15] <klepas> if you guys open a new tab in konqueror
[10:15] <artnay> so they're behind the schedule
[10:16] <klepas> and then begin typing in a few characters into the url bar
[10:16] <klepas> does it lag a second or two to make the scroll down thing appear?
[10:16] <klepas> because that has begun to annoy me
[10:16] <klepas> =\
[10:17] <artnay> I guess it does, I'm using XP right now :(
[10:17] <klepas> =[
[10:18] <klepas> seen my recent screenshot?
[10:19] <artnay> show us already
[02:27] <artnay> klepas: 
[02:27] <artnay> Tm_T: 
[02:27] <artnay> anyone?
[02:27] <Tm_T> yes yeas
[02:27] <Tm_T> -a
[02:47] <artnay> bachler: 
[02:47] <artnay> miketech: 
[02:47] <artnay> *:
[02:47] <Tm_T> ?
[02:47] <artnay> WIKI!
[02:47] <artnay> lets do it today, shall we?
[02:47] <Tm_T> WIKIWIKI!
[02:47] <artnay> Artwork page?
[02:47] <Tm_T> I won't
[02:47] <Tm_T> ;)
[02:48] <Tm_T> have to fix more that clock of mine ->
[02:48] <artnay> ok, I'll watch a few episodes of Lost then
[08:00] <dholbach> hellas
[08:01] <dholbach> would it be ok, if i would added your mailing list as a QA contact to artwork related bug reports?
[11:32] <dholbach> good night everybody