[12:04] because when I was called that [12:04] I became horridly confused [12:05] what is Automatix ? it look like the main problem [12:05] theCore, nononono [12:05] no [12:05] that business is a symptom [12:05] it isnt [12:05] Automatix and its issues [12:05] are a sympton of a much older problem [12:06] which one ? [12:06] the one that started the whole [12:06] Jdodson, Azz, Panickedthumb, Datawolf mess [12:06] months back [12:06] that is the origination of the problem [12:07] really, the problem is a more general one IMHO [12:07] again [12:07] its a matter of who controls what, and who doesnt [12:07] again .. [12:07] Automatix and its developer [12:07] and HOW they control it [12:07] chose to make statements [12:07] those statements were reacted to [12:07] posts were deleted [12:07] so it's basically a disagreement between people who don't want any moderation and those that want some [12:07] and threads were cencsored [12:08] correct LJ [12:08] on one side you have UG and the other staff that feel that moderation is nessecary, while some mods and admins have moderated unessecarily [12:08] on the other side you have azz and everyone behind him that state no moderation should ever occur [12:08] in any capacity [12:08] there has to be a happy medium [12:09] do you need more experience moderators perhaps? [12:09] I dont nessecarily condone the actions of my fellow staff [12:09] in many instances [12:09] Ive been one for 8 years [12:10] thats why I rare edit something unless its blatantly spam , ugly and sick or illegal [12:10] for me, the important thing is to leave a message when something is edited, and explain why [12:10] that way, no question of secrecy can arise, even by accident [12:10] I wont argue mdke , and in a staff discussion DEMANDED IT [12:10] people will not always be happy, but that's life [12:10] but you said that some mods and admins moderated unessecarily, is that because they were just inexperienced or because they had a personal problem with the posts? [12:10] of certain mods that would just mod and not state a reason [12:11] I suspect personal problems LJ [12:11] Kingbahamut, yeah it's important to give a reason [12:11] how big is the Azz gang ? [12:11] or some other involvement [12:11] how big? [12:11] without being utterly accusatory [12:11] or [12:11] gang is such an ugly word :) [12:11] conclusive [12:11] I would say the group that azz and others associate [12:11] is sizeably large [12:12] can you give me a number ? [12:12] I will say however its been nice to be called the better level headed of the bunch of the staff [12:12] but thats for another disucssion [12:12] theCore: best guess.....50? [12:13] thats a shot in the dark though [12:13] it's not that much ... [12:13] well, its been good to talk to you Kingbahamut about this. I think I have been getting a lot of info from the other side of the arguement [12:13] I like to stay balanced [12:13] I only have one request [12:13] you make it that way, your good with me [12:14] Direct Question = DIrect answer [12:14] right [12:14] hehe [12:14] The only bad question, the only bad request, is the one you dont ask me [12:14] I may not bend over backwards for yer [12:14] but Ill try mah best [12:15] cool [12:15] rob1, i hate your email client/server soooooo much! [12:15] i'm gonna kill it! [12:16] I honestly don't do much on the forums anymore because of the lack of moderation, but maybe I will give it a shot again === mgalvin [n=mgalvin@cpe-69-205-38-37.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:22] bah === mdke is struggling with postfix [12:23] mdke: need a bigger hammer? [12:23] yeah [12:23] that's what my dad always said [12:23] why the hell doesn't it know what I want it to do automatically?? [12:23] stupid POS [12:30] Burgwork, pong times 3, 3 strikes and you're out [12:34] i though of a way ubuntu could work: http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/5529 === mdke 's mind boggles [12:35] theCore: what do the arrow's represent? === theCore [n=theCore@Toronto-HSE-ppp3715463.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:41] LaserJock, they mean "X elect Y" [01:42] (sorry again, for that sudden deconnection" [01:44] theCore: so what would the moderators moderate? Everyting Ubuntu? [01:45] LaserJock, the communities [01:45] makes sense [01:46] LaserJock, they would ensure a quality control on the wiki, doc, and forums [01:47] LaserJock, what do you think? [01:47] cool, I don't know if that will ever happen, but it would be good [01:48] LaserJock, i'm please to heard that :) [01:50] LaserJock, so, do you want to continue working on the guide ? [01:50] yeah, I just have other things to do too [02:01] mdke, sorry I was out === warren__ [n=warren@auproxy1.proxy.lucent.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:20] I think Ubuntu should be run by a giant turtle [02:26] mpt, wtf!!! [02:58] nice, my project on sourceforge has been approved :D [03:29] theCore: what project ist that? [03:29] the Linux Gluing Project [03:31] tlgp.sf.net << there is nothing here for now [03:31] but i will fill this space with docs [03:35] so how is it going to be distributed? [03:36] in a tarball [03:37] to put in a personal server [03:38] but for now the whole site is too big [03:40] right now the whole thing is 190MB === Kingbahamut [n=bahamut@c-24-98-229-28.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:41] 190MB? [03:41] yep [03:43] it a full collection of doc, howto, dicto, guides [03:43] thats pretty sizeable [03:43] for just text documents [03:44] just the HOWTO dir is 90MB === Kingbahamut glares. [03:44] referenced to what? [03:44] linux [03:44] core linux [03:44] or distro depedent? [03:45] core linux, with a little tendence to ubuntu [03:45] Such a thing would save me some time , I still write documentation with that Slackware slant in my head [03:46] probably why I prefer CLI so much [03:46] CLI? [03:46] Command Line Interface [03:46] Kingbahamut: yeah, I came from Gentoo so I want to compile everything [03:46] my first linux experience was [03:46] a ok [03:46] a Floppy Slackware isntall , pre 95 [03:46] lol, my second [03:46] wow [03:47] I still have that box too [03:47] i love old distro [03:47] amidst my junk [03:47] somehow I never got into Slack. I don't think I even installed it once [03:47] every year or so [03:47] I do a floppy slack install [03:47] just to refersh my memory [03:48] but my primary computer experience, the initial one at least [03:48] was in 1986 on a SunOS machine [03:49] back then Sun was based loosely on BSD code, rather than the System V that Solaris took [03:49] i wasn't even born at this time :P [03:49] Though even then, to now [03:49] Solaris has changed alot [03:50] LaserJock: Gentoo Geek? [03:50] Kingbahamut: yeah, for over 2 years I think [03:50] I tried [03:50] sadly [03:50] I could never quite get the hang of it [03:50] dont laugh [03:50] I looked for a binary equivilent and ended up at Ubuntu [03:50] I even tried [03:50] *shudders* [03:50] VidaLinux [03:50] Kingbahamut: it is different [03:51] one of my 20 test boxes is still a VidaLinux machine [03:52] there is one distro that is still on my heart , Linux From Scratch [03:52] LFS isnt is just a book? [03:52] yea [03:52] ive run (even if for only a few days) probably anywhere from 30 to 40 [03:52] of the Top 100 on Distrowatch [03:52] just to see [03:53] of those, Id have to say OneBase was the worst [03:53] with ArkLinux being a close 2nd [03:53] Kingbahamut: what do like best? Ubuntu and Slack? [03:53] Ubuntu by far [03:53] yay [03:53] I wouldnt spend so much time on the forums [03:53] and the Doc Facility [03:53] slackware is obsolete [03:54] if I didnt like it [03:54] in my considered opinion [03:54] BoB, not obslete [03:54] it's a relic of a time gone by [03:54] just unpopular [03:54] it's unpopular for a reason [03:54] You have to give Volkerdink credit though [03:54] I used slackware in 1996 [03:54] look, absolutely [03:54] slackware is too tough to maintain [03:54] for him keeping on [03:54] but slackware's time has been and gone [03:54] as long as he has [03:54] Kingbahamut: yeah, it is amazing for one man [03:55] specially with his illness last year [03:55] was supposed to See him on Linux Lunacy [03:55] last year but didnt [03:57] that was a blast ride, if GC offers it again, Id recommend it [04:03] i decapitated docs :( [04:03] my docs* [04:03] decapitated? [04:04] yea, striped 120MB out of my docs [04:05] theCore: where do you get these docs? [04:05] many places [04:05] what about licenses? [04:05] but most come from tldp.org [04:05] all GPL [04:06] that awesome 'rm -rf ' command [04:06] convenient [04:06] yes [04:07] hmmm [04:07] careful with that [04:07] thats a very unweildy lightsaber with a mind of its own command [04:07] lol [04:08] 'sudo rm -rf /' <-- my personal favourite [04:09] geeze [04:09] dont tell an enduser that [04:09] lol [04:09] or if you do [04:09] make sure hes in irc [04:09] and tell him if he does do it [04:09] it will fix his problem [04:09] a total system decapitation [04:09] and he will still remain in the channel [04:10] lol [04:10] ie "Quick Everyone Im being hacked how do I stop it!?!?!?!" [04:10] "Hurry, open up an xterm window and type sudo rm / -fr" [04:11] really ? [04:11] used to tell them in the old irc days to unplug the modem cable [04:11] and that would stop the attack [04:11] i gonna try that right now [04:11] lol [04:11] I am of course [04:11] kidding [04:11] lol [04:12] there should be a bit [04:12] written into the kernel [04:12] that stops you from doing that [04:12] kind of like if you issue that command you get a [04:12] EVERYTHING WILL BE DETELED IF YOU DO THIS, ARE YOU SURE? [04:13] it wouldn't be tough to implement ... [04:13] one can dream [04:13] cant one? [04:13] maybe [04:13] record you hold for installing linux on the same system in one day? [04:14] hum, 3, i think ? [04:14] ill be quiet then [04:14] why ? [04:14] learning to recompile the kernel [04:14] cause KP [04:14] like [04:14] 8 times [04:15] KP ? [04:15] Kernel Panic [04:15] lol [04:15] was not a pretty sight that day [04:15] for sure [04:15] compling a kernel is not tough [04:16] I guess I couldnt wrap my head around it that day [04:16] or something, who knows [04:16] was a Data Recovery Specialist back then [04:16] my office laughed at me for weeks [04:17] you REINSTALLED [04:17] because you broke the kernel?> [04:17] lol [04:17] go on [04:17] laugh [04:17] its ok [04:17] I can take it [04:17] that was a long time ago too === theCore laugh out loud [04:18] I only get one person laughing for that [04:18] sigh [04:18] im losing my touch === theCore laugh out loud for 3 peoples [04:20] To err human, to forgive divine I suppose [04:20] well [04:20] I just thought maybe after the first... SIX TIMES [04:21] you might have learnt something :) [04:21] well [04:21] as I go back on that experience [04:21] I was doing like 4 recoveries [04:21] 2 of which were for JPL [04:22] and I remember just angry enough to bust a keyboard or two while I was doin it all [04:32] there should be a #ubuntu-politic chanel [04:34] theCore: man, I don't know [04:34] politic channel/ [04:34] LaserJock, why not ? [04:34] that alone scares me [04:34] lol [04:34] it would be fun [04:35] no [04:35] I just dont think so [04:35] theCore: I just can't imagine it would be anything but a giant troll [04:35] lol [04:35] The forums argument over the last few days [04:35] you want an entire channel of that stuff? [04:36] phew, that could get well [04:36] rough [04:37] it would probably help to evacuate the pressure [04:37] hmmm [04:37] that gives a strange analogy to me [04:37] which one? [04:37] Lets go and put 5 megatons of Dynamite under a building , because the intense pressure of that building is so great [04:37] that it has to come down right [04:38] but when you detonate that stuff [04:38] more than the building is going to come down [04:38] lol, you are probably right about this one :P [04:39] I dunno [04:39] just call it like I see [04:39] it [04:39] it would be fun, though [04:39] someone tell me im an idiot if its not that way [04:43] *silence* [04:46] i'm up: tlgp.sf.net [04:55] theCore: so you collect all the docs and put them at in one place? [04:55] LaserJock, yep [04:55] theCore: do you have to do anything? [04:56] LaserJock, i will try to glue them together [04:56] hmmm [04:56] LaserJock, but not now [04:56] I hear crazy glue does wonders [04:56] just dont get it on your hands [04:56] theCore: what do you mean by glue? === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-252-84-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:57] LaserJock, remove redundencies, use the same style for all page, stuff like that ... [04:58] ok [04:58] what do you think? [04:59] interesting, pretty ambitious [04:59] I am checking out some stuff right now, I need to learn bash scripting ;-) [04:59] that seems very portable theCore [05:00] portable ? [05:00] movable from where it is [05:00] to somewhere else [05:01] ah yes, [05:01] I guess adaptable is a better way to put i t [05:03] Kingbahamut, i'm working on a new design: http://tlgp.sourceforge.net/newdesign === bhuvan [n=bhuvan@ubuntu/member/bhuvan] has joined #ubuntu-doc [05:10] any comments on this page ? http://tlgp.sourceforge.net/best-comp/ [05:12] theCore: why do you want that? [05:12] LaserJock, dunno .. [05:12] n/m then [05:13] that is what I would like to get, except less case and more hard drive [05:13] theCore: I just wondered why it was at your tlgp site? [05:15] i dunno, it was one my ideas of website, so i decide to put a small page in the misc. area [05:15] interesting === Burgundavia [n=corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-252-84-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robitaille [n=robitail@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-252-84-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [05:53] mdke, yes as do I. its lookout express (on windows NT), we aren't upgrading to windows xp until next year === Lewix [n=x@130.160.153.125] has joined #ubuntu-doc [05:53] hi [05:53] I have a laptop , toshiba M40/M45 serie and I've downloaded the iso dvd of ubuntu. when I boot and type enter there's things that loads up then my screen goes black. as well with the dvd screen as with the install. I tried linux vga=771 with the live dvd because i want to be sure that it works before installing and I all seem to work till I got a erro message about xserver [05:58] Lewix: this isn't really a help channel - please try the main #ubuntu channel [05:58] ive tried it for 3days [05:59] nobody anwser they just ignore me [05:59] Lewix: it might not be that they are ignoring you, just that they don't know [05:59] maybe [06:00] I may be the only one with this problem [06:00] didn't find a solution on the net [06:00] Lewix, did you tried the forums ? [06:00] of course [06:00] I find some ppl with the same problem but no solutions [06:01] Lewix, did you tried the CD version of ubuntu [06:01] yep the same [06:01] then I 'downlaoded the dvd version [06:02] Lewix, i think i know what is it [06:02] really? [06:03] Lewix, can you boot the console, at least ? [06:03] maybe [06:03] hmm ? I'm a newbie [06:04] they say something like you didn't set up the xserver [06:04] when I' put the live cd and type linux vga=771 [06:04] but can you login in the "command prompt" [06:04] otherwise if I just type enter it loads up files and then the screen turn black [06:05] command prompt? do you mean the boot screen ? [06:06] Lewix: but you have tried just hitting enter? no vga= [06:08] Lewix, let a couple of minutes so I can find a solution [06:08] Lewix, what is your graphic card? [06:09] ati [06:09] X600 ? [06:10] intel celeron M processor 380, 1.6ghz 512ddram 80gb [06:10] hmm dunno let me check [06:10] ati radeon express 200m serie [06:11] LaserJock: both [06:13] Lewix, you will probalbly need to make a custom kernel ... [06:13] custom kernel, I'm really a newbie [06:14] Lewix, i trying to found an easier path for you [06:14] thanks a lot [06:15] is it the m40 or m50 model ? [06:17] It's written like that: satellite toshiba M40/M45 series in a manual [06:17] how can I know exactly the model [06:17] turn the machine over and look at the labels underneath? [06:18] k [06:18] it should be written somewhere under the laptop [06:18] thanks [06:19] toshiba M45- S169 system unit [06:19] good [06:20] what is the current operating system on it ? [06:20] windows [06:20] du you have the install cd? [06:21] do* [06:21] dvd [06:21] you have it? [06:21] inside there is a live version [06:21] and the installer [06:21] no, i'm talking about windows [06:21] yep normally [06:22] i found on the web, that there is a problem with the LiveCD but not with the install cd === jsgotangco [n=jerome@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:23] so, if i where you i would make a backup of you windows files, and try to install ubuntu [06:23] s/you/your/ [06:24] with linux vga=771? hmm the fact is I wanted to resize my hd first with the live cd [06:25] ewh, bad idea [06:25] ohh [06:25] why ? [06:25] resizing partition is an arcane art [06:25] with qparted [06:25] arcane art / [06:25] ? [06:27] the best thing would be to start with a fresh winXP install [06:28] on a partition smaller than the hard drive [06:28] then install ubuntu [06:30]