[12:03] <\sh> minghua: it's synced
[12:04] <minghua> crimsun: and if not, how can I check if it's sitting in NEW or not?
[12:04] <crimsun> minghua: oh, that answers the question then. Nevermind. :)
[12:04] <azeem> aha
[12:04] <azeem>   m4_define([_AM_PYTHON_INTERPRETER_LIST] ,
[12:04] <azeem>             [python python2 python2.3 python2.2 python2.1 python2.0 python1.6 python1.5] )
[12:04] <azeem> that's it, my autoconf was outdated I guess
[12:05] <\sh> minghua: there is something wrong with the package..
[12:05] <azeem> or aclocal, rather
[12:05] <crimsun> \sh: just a ftbfs, debdiff provided. I'm uploading.
[12:06] <\sh> crimsun: it's all the time the same with those packages
[12:06] <crimsun> yep
[12:07] <crimsun> minghua: just as an aside, the override doesn't need to be installed since the font path has changed
[12:09] <minghua> crimsun: you are right, I missed that
[12:10] <minghua> crimsun: I'll remember to patch that if I prepare another upload :-)
[12:12] <crimsun> minghua: done
[12:12] <minghua> crimsun: thank you
[12:12] <dholbach> good night everybody
[12:13] <tseng> bye dholbach
[12:14] <minghua> dholbach: good night
[12:17] <crimsun> night daniel
[12:21] <azeem> lifeless: we need a Build-Depends on swig I think
[12:22] <lifeless> azeem: makes sense
[12:22] <lifeless> pbuilder is nearly bootstrapped
[12:22] <azeem> lifeless: and I think if we have a generic python-opensync package, we also need to Build-Depends on python
[12:22] <azeem> dh_python aborts otherwise
[12:23] <lifeless> meep.
[12:23] <azeem> you can pass it a specific version, but not sure what that means for the generic package
[12:23] <lifeless> does not pythonx.y-dev pull in python ?
[12:23] <azeem> nope
[12:23] <lifeless> nuts
[12:23] <lifeless> ok.
[12:23] <lifeless> lets do 2.4
[12:23] <azeem> ok
[12:29] <azeem> lifeless: drat, we need python in any case
[12:30] <azeem> my $python = 'python';
[12:30] <azeem> my $python_version = `$python -V 2>&1`;
[12:32] <lifeless> azeem: fair enough
[12:32] <lifeless> head debian/control
[12:32] <lifeless> Source: opensync
[12:32] <lifeless> Section: libs
[12:32] <lifeless> Priority: optional
[12:32] <lifeless> Maintainer: Robert Collins <robertc@robertcollins.net>
[12:32] <lifeless> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 4.0.0), libglib2.0-dev, libsqlite3-dev, libxml2-dev, check, python2.4, python2.4-dev, swig
[12:32] <lifeless> Standards-Version: 3.6.2
[12:35] <azeem> lifeless: sorry, I meant we really need the `python' package, not `python2.4'.  The latter is dragged in by python2.4-dev
[12:36] <lifeless> azeem: python2.4 provide python
[12:36] <azeem> ah
[12:36] <lifeless> as a binary I mean
[12:36] <lifeless> via alternatives
[12:37] <ogra> hey loogaroo  :)
[12:37] <azeem> lifeless: I wonder why it didn't build then
[12:37] <loogaroo> hi all :)
[12:39] <lifeless> right, that should be the dbg package fixed
[12:39] <lifeless> silly me, copied the borked sample packages compat rule :[
[12:41] <azeem> lifeless: I just tried again in my unstable chroot, and there's no /usr/bin/python there.  Maybe it's different in breezy/dapper?
[12:41] <lifeless> is python2.4 installed ?
[12:41] <lifeless> check update-alternatives
[12:42] <azeem> lrwxrwxrwx  1 root root 9 Oct 22 14:03 /usr/bin/python -> python2.4*
[12:42] <azeem> this is on breezy, it's not using alternatives
[12:42] <lifeless> oh, ah. I see
[12:42] <azeem> there's no python alternative in the unstable chroot either
[12:42] <lifeless> if its not using alternatives
[12:42] <lifeless> then its because of the (IMO) broken python version handling
[12:42] <minghua> I don't think python uses alternatives for /usr/bin/python
[12:43] <lifeless> when, oh WHEN will debian transition
[12:43] <lifeless> so, guess we have to depend on python literally as you say
[12:43] <azeem> nighthawk~/src/cvs/opensync-debian$ grep alternatives /var/lib/dpkg/info/python2.4.postinst
[12:43] <minghua> on sid it's symlinked to /usr/bin/python2.3
[12:43] <azeem> update-alternatives --remove python /usr/bin/python2.4 || true
[12:43] <lifeless> I wonder if we can pass an appropriate option to configure to still get 2.4
[12:44] <lifeless> (I don't wan to try and support 2.3 bindings
[12:44] <lifeless> (its getting too old these days
[12:44] <lifeless> yay
[12:44] <azeem> hrm
[12:44] <lifeless> we have stripped symbols
[12:44] <lifeless> I do love debhelper.
[12:44] <\sh> lifeless: error message? check makefile.am or something like this for occurances to python2.3
[12:45] <azeem> I think we're fine if we just add the python pseudo package to Build-Depends and nuke python-opensync
[12:45] <azeem> it's really dh_python sillyness that requires the formerI think
[12:45] <lifeless> pushing
[12:45] <lifeless> right, now for the stub python package
[12:50] <lifeless> which is still being stubbon
[12:50] <lifeless> the package dir is made, but is empty :[
[12:53] <azeem> built fine now
[12:55] <azeem> this also fixed the issue with exporting PYTHON
[12:56] <lifeless> sweet
[12:56] <lifeless> can you recommend a good sample package that does a stub python-module ?
[12:57] <lifeless> this is shitting me :[
[12:57] <minghua> I don't understand the efforts put on this BetterCJKSupport thing
[12:57] <azeem> lifeless: I try to stay clear from this python madness, although I maintain two or three python packages/modules myself
[12:57] <azeem> but they are probably totally illegal
[12:58] <lifeless> azeem: ;)
[12:58] <lifeless> azeem: I already maintain stuff in python, its just the stub package bit that I've avoided successfully so far
[12:58] <minghua> how did the spec work?  my understanding is that the developers think what they want to work on for this release, propose a spec, discuss with others, write a draft, get approved, then write the code.  is that correct?
[12:58] <ajmitch> I've touched a few in universe, though
[12:59] <ajmitch> minghua: more or less, yes
[12:59] <ajmitch> but anyone can propose a spec
[12:59] <ogra> minghua, between "write a draft" and "get approved" there are several stages of "request review" and "write a draft" involved
[01:00] <ogra> ;)
[01:00] <minghua> yeah, I can imagine things aren't easy :-)
[01:01] <ajmitch> ogra: and 'remove crack'
[01:01] <ajmitch> but it's oh so much fun
[01:02] <ogra> and there seems some requirement for good japanese input methods in main i was at a fair in germany two weeks ago and had some long discussions with people that are annoyed about having to intall it from unierse
[01:02] <azeem> lifeless: how annoying, the configure script detects python2.3 and won't look further
[01:02] <azeem> so it ran fine, but it can't find tmp/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/_opensync.la later on
[01:03] <\sh> azeem: what doesn configure.in/.ac tells you?
[01:03] <ogra> why the heck has debian still 2.3 ?
[01:03] <lifeless> because doko has not done the transition
[01:03] <ogra> bah
[01:03] <ajmitch> because doko is working on a new python scheme
[01:03] <lifeless> theres presumably good reason for the lockstep immobile policy in debia
[01:03] <lifeless> n
[01:04] <ajmitch> so we won't have lots of pythonx.x-foo packages
[01:04] <lifeless> but it doth not make sense to me at the moment, and I didn't get time to talk with doko about it
[01:04] <lifeless> ajmitch: the best is the enemy of the good
[01:04] <lifeless> ajmitch: we should transition before python 2.6 is released!
[01:04] <ajmitch> lifeless: certainly - it's targetted for dapper though
[01:04] <ogra> lifeless++
[01:04] <ajmitch> at least it's on doko's roadmap :)
[01:04] <minghua> ogra: the problem is always that a lot of people are asking for input methods, but few people are working on it :-(
[01:04] <\sh> which will be more fun
[01:04] <ogra> minghua, exactly ...
[01:05] <ajmitch> minghua: not enough people know about the area
[01:05] <ogra> minghua, icouldnt give any reliable answers myself ...
[01:06] <ajmitch> lifeless: and transitions in debian have to be scheduled with the release managers in a way :)
[01:06] <ogra> ajmitch, there are approximately 1/3 of asian humans running around on this planet, why cant we find some to work on it ?
[01:06] <lifeless> oh eww
[01:06] <lifeless> ajmitch: so we should reduce the number of 'transitions' needed.
[01:06] <ajmitch> lifeless: well they get deferred so that there aren't huge numbers of breakages at once, eg C== & X
[01:06] <ajmitch> c++
[01:06] <minghua> ajmitch: actually many people know, but language is really a problem
[01:06] <ajmitch> ogra: because we have problems getting anyone like that involved in development?
[01:06] <minghua> and IMHO asian people are usually more shy :-)
[01:06] <doko> lifeless: we'll do before the end of this year ;-P
[01:07] <ogra> ajmitch, hmm ...
[01:07] <ajmitch> doko: great! :)
[01:07] <lifeless> doko: dude, you are awake. cool.
[01:07] <ogra> time for a conf in asia then :)
[01:07] <ajmitch> ogra: look at how many europeans are involved in ubuntu development :)
[01:07] <lifeless> doko: I'm having trouble making a stub python-opensync to pull in python2.4-opensync
[01:07] <lifeless> doko: HELP!
[01:07] <minghua> before end of this year - sounds a great promise :-)
[01:07] <ogra> wth the advantage that jdub and lifeless dont have to fly that far :)
[01:08] <tseng> nice to lump 3 continents together
[01:08] <tseng> and your nice little island
[01:08] <ogra> and call it european, lol
[01:08] <ogra> europe is everything except china ?
[01:09] <ogra> :)
[01:09] <minghua> ogra: ha, that sounds exactly the mind set of ancient Chinese :-)
[01:09] <tseng> china was somewhat colonized by europeans
[01:09] <doko> lifeless: please send me an email, I think I had one of the mulled wines was bad ...
[01:09] <lifeless> doko: ok, will do.
[01:09] <lifeless> thanks
[01:10] <ajmitch> tseng: all colonised by europeans :)
[01:10] <lifeless> ogra: haven't you heard of eurasia ?
[01:10] <lifeless> :)
[01:10] <ogra> lol
[01:11] <ogra> hmm, but that would exclude sladen ...
[01:11] <ajmitch> haha
[01:13] <ajmitch> ogra: but seriously, we don't have nearly enough people that can do input methods involved
[01:13] <ogra> yup
[01:13] <ogra> thats true ...
[01:14] <ogra> we certainly need more people from asia involved who actually can work on it
[01:15] <ajmitch> we've got a few users who want it, at least
[01:15] <minghua> ajmitch, ogra: in case you don't know, I am actually an "input method" guy
[01:15] <ajmitch> minghua: I know
[01:15] <ogra> minghua, i suspected that :)
[01:15] <ajmitch> minghua: but we need more people, get recruiting! :)
[01:15] <azeem> lifeless: build doesn't depend on the configure stamp
[01:15] <azeem> so it won't autorconf by itself
[01:16] <minghua> but I can't find any other people willing to work together with me to improve the input method packages in ubuntu
[01:16] <azeem> eh, autoreconf
[01:16] <lifeless> azeem: :)
[01:16] <lifeless> azeem: are you hacking up configure.in ? I am too.
[01:16] <ajmitch> lifeless: why are both make clean & make distclean called?
[01:16] <minghua> ajmitch: actually not a bad idea, I should talk with the ubuntu-jp people to see what they have
[01:16] <lifeless> ajmitch: my bad
[01:16] <ajmitch> does upstream have broken makefiles?
[01:17] <azeem> lifeless: no, I just saw that.  I had to run autoreconf manually when I first tried, and didn't realize it was meant to be called by the package
[01:17] <minghua> but probably not in time for dapper
[01:17] <ogra> lifeless, azeem, time for gobby ?
[01:17] <ajmitch> minghua: I know that ubuntu-kr has really taken off since jsgotangco's talk
[01:17] <minghua> I'm working on ubuntu at free time after all
[01:17] <lifeless> ogra: if it worked maybe :)
[01:17] <ajmitch> minghua: as are most of us :)
[01:17] <ogra> :P
[01:17] <minghua> ajmitch: :-)
[01:18] <ogra> btw, \sh any gobby news from phillip ?
[01:18] <\sh> ogra: bope
[01:18] <\sh> nope even
[01:18] <ajmitch> lifeless: fwiw, I still don't get revno 13 or later when I pull
[01:18] <lifeless> ajmitch: do you have a squid ?
[01:18] <lifeless> ajmitch: or a sucky ISP ?
[01:18] <ogra> \sh, the first one soended like your nose is running ;) fits well :)
[01:18] <minghua> ajmitch: yes, Atie from korea add some quite nice info on the wiki page, and I like his style of filing malone bugs
[01:18] <ajmitch> squid & a sucky ISP
[01:19] <\sh> ogra: hehe :)
[01:19] <lifeless> ajmitch: can you check your access.log ?
[01:19] <ogra> ajmitch, tell them to use willow, its the future ! squid is bloat
[01:20] <azeem> hah, got it
[01:20] <ajmitch> lifeless: sure, and I don't see anything there
[01:20] <azeem> lifeless: if we add PYTHON=/usr/bin/python2.4 both to configure's line and before $(MAKE), it won't use 2.3
[01:21] <azeem> the latter is maybe only needed cause I mucked with configure to remove the python2.3 check there, which didn't work
[01:21] <lifeless> ajmitch: ok, so its bypassing squid :[
[01:21] <lifeless> ajmitch: do you have http_proxy set ?
[01:21] <ajmitch> no, I unset it
[01:21] <lifeless> sweet, my patch works.
[01:21] <ajmitch> heh
[01:22] <azeem> lifeless: cool
[01:29] <ajmitch> lifeless: I set http_proxy, and got a TCP_MISS in access.log
[01:29] <lifeless> ok
[01:29] <ajmitch> but still 0 revisions pulled :)
[01:29] <lifeless> did that help or hinder ?
[01:29] <lifeless> ok.
[01:29] <lifeless> so its your freaking upstream
[01:29] <ajmitch> yeah
[01:29] <lifeless> theres a bug report on this
[01:30] <ajmitch> not the first time I've had this
[01:33] <azeem> lifeless: we also need to Build-Depend on automake, autoconf, if we keep the autoreconf
[01:34] <lifeless> azeem: not just autotools-dev ?
[01:34] <ajmitch> autotools-dev doesn't depend on the others, iirc
[01:34] <azeem> lifeless: no, that just provides config.{guess,sub}
[01:34] <lifeless> theres an autosomethingen
[01:34] <lifeless> that brings in the current
[01:35] <azeem> automaken
[01:35] <ajmitch> automaken?
[01:35] <azeem> I'd rather do automake1.9 and be done
[01:35] <ajmitch> it'd help to keep it sane on the next auto* incompatibility
[01:35] <azeem> I think automaken is even discouraged for Debian packaging, but not sure
[01:35] <lifeless> ok
[01:36] <lifeless> I've pushed the confgigure change to the opensync-debian tree
[01:37] <lifeless> and control updates for those deps
[01:38] <Nafallo> *sigh*
[01:38] <azeem> -build: debian/build-stamp
[01:38] <azeem> +build: configure debian/build-stamp
[01:38] <azeem> I think we need this as well
[01:38] <azeem> in debian/rules
[01:38] <ajmitch> configure-stamp would be good
[01:39] <Nafallo> ajmitch: what to do with php4-interbase? it wants firebird2-dev, which is for good reason probably in p-a-s for amd64.
[01:39] <ajmitch> Nafallo: hm?
[01:39] <lifeless> pushed
[01:39] <Nafallo> working on merges ;-).
[01:39] <azeem> ajmitch: well, configure is a file which isn't there, so it might be alright
[01:39] <ajmitch> Nafallo: I saw that
[01:39] <ajmitch> azeem: that's true
[01:40] <Nafallo> good reason is a HEAP of cast from...
[01:41] <ajmitch> Nafallo: so you think that php4-interbase should not be tried on amd64?
[01:41] <ajmitch> or what are you asking me?
[01:41] <Nafallo> ajmitch: I dunno what the solution should be actually :-)
[01:41] <ajmitch> Nafallo: are you working on an amd64?
[01:41] <azeem> ok, built fine now
[01:41] <Nafallo> yepp
[01:41] <ajmitch> aha
[01:42] <ajmitch> Nafallo: 32-bit chroot then ;)
[01:42] <Nafallo> Package: php4-interbase
[01:42] <Nafallo> Architecture: any
[01:42] <Nafallo> will still FTBFS because of missing build-dep...
[01:43] <ajmitch> missing on amd64
[01:43] <ajmitch> right?
[01:43] <ajmitch> well firebird2-dev is only built on i386
[01:43] <Nafallo> right
[01:44] <Nafallo> so change that any to i386?
[01:44] <Nafallo> or try to get firebird2 to build on amd64? ;-)
[01:45] <ajmitch> Nafallo: it should build
[01:45] <ajmitch> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=147500
[01:46] <ajmitch> last comment there
[01:47] <Nafallo> I'm sure it build, but it still has LOTS of cast-to-pointer errors
[01:47] <\sh> good night :)
[01:48] <Nafallo> but then again. looks like php4-interbase is also only built on i386, so p-a-s probably ;-)
[01:49] <Nafallo> hmm
[01:50] <Nafallo> ajmitch: you don't happen to have an i386 happy to build somewhere? ;-)
[01:50] <lifeless> azeem: http://svn.opensync.org/multisync/tags/multisync-0.90.18 <- matching multisync
[01:52] <azeem> lifeless: those are just command-line tools, right?
[01:52] <ajmitch> Nafallo: I've got an i386 box, sure
[01:52] <lifeless> azeem: not at all, thats the full multisync gui
[01:53] <lifeless> azeem: as well as msynctool
[01:53] <lifeless> which is a command line tool
[01:53] <Nafallo> ajmitch: care to testbuild php4-interbase from debian unstable on it? :-)
[01:53] <azeem> ah
[01:54] <Nafallo> should be fine, but I never upload/request syncs without testing ;-)
[01:54] <lifeless> azeem: so, think the engine is ready for an upload ?
[01:55] <azeem> lifeless: well, we could wait for me packaging the other stuff to actually test it...
[01:55] <azeem> but then, it builds, so ship it!
[01:55] <lifeless> azeem: I've just built msynctool 0.90.18 against the installed opensync-dev package.
[01:55] <lifeless> azeem: :)
[01:55] <azeem> wiit
[01:56] <azeem> eh, woot
[01:56] <ajmitch> Nafallo: 1 sec
[01:56] <ajmitch> dapper pbuilder base went strange again
[01:56] <lifeless> I must go do real work now :[
[01:56] <lifeless> I'll ship this up to NEW now though
[01:56] <ajmitch> good old md5sum  mismatch from apt-proxy
[01:56] <lifeless> where it can linger a year or so
[01:56] <azeem> ok
[01:56] <azeem> I'm going to bed now
[01:56] <lifeless> night
[01:56] <ajmitch> lifeless: great, thanks
[01:57] <azeem> NEW is pretty fast these dasy
[01:57] <azeem> days, even
[01:57] <ajmitch> yeah, it's under 2 weeks for most packages now
[01:57] <ajmitch> often under 1
[01:57] <Nafallo> debians or ubuntus? :-)
[01:57] <ajmitch> debian
[01:57] <lifeless> Nafallo: ubuntus is hours
[01:58] <Nafallo> lifeless: yea, that's what I thought :-)
[01:58] <ajmitch> we can't afford to lose a week of an ubuntu release cycle :)
[01:58] <Nafallo> hehe, very true :-)
[01:58] <lifeless> man the python bindings are weak
[01:58] <lifeless> they should write msynctool in python
[01:58] <lifeless> then they would get good fast.
[02:02] <ajmitch> Nafallo: give me a bit while I bash apt-proxy
[02:02] <Nafallo> ajmitch: sure :-)
[02:03] <lifeless> ajmitch: can we sync things that are in NEW ?
[02:03] <ajmitch> nope
[02:03] <ajmitch> not publically readable
[02:03] <lifeless> ..
[02:03] <ajmitch> the earliest it's syncable is from incoming
[02:06] <minghua> what about from UploadQueue on ftp-master before it enters NEW? :-P
[02:06] <lifeless> ajmitch: yeah, sync it ....
[02:08] <lifeless> NOW
[02:09] <lifeless> quick, before cron kicks in
[02:09] <ajmitch> heh
[02:09] <ajmitch> I wish we could, really
[02:09] <ajmitch> but it's elmo's scripts
[02:09] <ajmitch> you didn't set azeem or myself in Uploaders, did you?
[02:10] <lifeless> not yet, I figure you can patch and publish a branch yourselves :)
[02:10] <ajmitch> yeah, once my ISP doesn't suck as much
[02:13] <ajmitch> minghua: because most of those 1.4 billion don't have access to computers?
[02:14] <minghua> I mean, hell, how many of them have even touched (let alone owned/co-owned) a computer?  50 million?
[02:14] <minghua> ajmitch: exactly
[02:14] <ajmitch> I think the point is not just how many have, but how many more might be able to
[02:14] <ajmitch> more dreams of world domination, etc :)
[02:16] <minghua> yeah, everyone envies the big market of China :-)
[02:16] <ajmitch> there's even a lot of chinese people outside of china, who might want it :)
[02:16] <ajmitch> like my flatmate for the last couple of years, using winxp :)
[02:17] <minghua> ajmitch: actually from what I see, about half of the zh_CN l10n people are abroad
[02:17] <ajmitch> yeah
[02:17] <ajmitch> translation for example, require a decent knowledge of the english strings to translate
[02:18] <ajmitch> I don't know how much english is taught in schools there :)
[02:18] <minghua> ajmitch: that would be awesome :-)  maybe you can show him dapper (I guarantee we'll have a working scim in dapper)
[02:18] <ajmitch> minghua: well he's left now
[02:19] <ajmitch> gone back to china for summer & living elsewhere in dunedin next year
[02:19] <minghua> ajmitch: quite a lot.  the problem, though, is the students forget them quickly once the exam is over :-)
[02:19] <ajmitch> of course :)
[02:20] <crimsun> I probably need to get more involved in that, heh.
[02:21] <minghua> hey crimsun, do you speak chinese fluently?
[02:21] <minghua> I suppose it's not your first language...
[02:21] <crimsun> no, not by any stretch of anyone's imagination.
[02:21] <ajmitch> minghua: you're in the US now, right?
[02:21] <minghua> ajmitch: yes, Ph.D. student
[02:21] <crimsun> I understand it completely if it's spoken _to_ me, but it takes me a while to respond
[02:22] <minghua> crimsun: that's not bad :-)  what about written Chinese?
[02:22] <crimsun> written's a bit better than spoken but not by much
[02:23] <minghua> hey, maybe we should form a MOTUChinese team ;-)
[02:23] <crimsun> hehe
[02:24] <ajmitch> well half the MOTUs could form the #ubuntu-motu-de, I think ;)
[02:25] <minghua> anyway, I believe ubuntu will have better support for chinese than debian in the near future
[02:25] <Nafallo> I would be alone in MOTUSwedish ;-)
[02:25] <Nafallo> minghua: that's good news :-)
[02:25] <ajmitch> minghua: hopefully that support from ubuntu can get into debian
[02:26] <minghua> ajmitch: I hope so too, but pushing things in Debian is hard
[02:27] <minghua> ajmitch: I plan to apply for ubuntu member and MOTU soon, so that working in ubuntu is easy
[02:27] <crimsun> great :)
[02:27] <minghua> I'm still heavily involved in debian stuff, but NM progress is like forever
[02:28] <minghua> that's actually the no. 1 reason ubuntu attracts me (as a developer, anyway), more open developing process
[02:29] <Nafallo> ajmitch: ping php4-interbase? :-)
[02:36] <Nafallo> why don't we have something like this: http://www.buildd.net/cgi/nowbuilding.cgi ?
[02:38] <Nafallo> nm, launchpad will probably have something like that :-)
[02:46] <ajmitch> Nafallo: still got pbuilder breakage, you'll have to ask someone else sorry :(
[02:47] <ajmitch> Nafallo: yes, launchpad already has an interface like that, which we can't see ;)
[02:48] <ajmitch> bye minghua
[02:48] <minghua> see you soon guys
[02:48] <Nafallo> ajmitch: hehe, oki :-)
[02:49] <Nafallo> ajmitch: hmm, I might aswell check the buildlogs sometime tomorrow ;-)
[02:50] <Nafallo> what launchpad does seems very much like what debian calls multibuild :-P
[02:51] <ajmitch> how so?
[02:53] <Nafallo> I have dejavu when I read the draft. it doesn't differ to much from what's in the launchpad specs IMO.
[02:54] <Nafallo> atleast some parts. now it feels more like things we want ;-)
[02:54] <Nafallo> but one step at a time now :-)
[03:13] <minghua> hello MOTUs, I am back
[03:13] <bmonty> hey minghua
[03:15] <ajmitch> hi
[03:15] <minghua> hi bmonty.  what timezone are you in?
[03:16] <bmonty> minghua: central
[03:16] <minghua> bmonty: oh!  I've in central too.  I'm in Houston
[03:17] <bmonty> I'm in Omaha
[03:19] <bmonty> ajmitch: you having problems with riots in NZ also?
[03:22] <StevenK> Sydney is too, which is terrible.
[03:23] <ajmitch> bmonty: no riots here
[03:23] <minghua> ha.  apparently lpbugs.py can't handle a bug not assigned to a package :-)
[03:23] <bmonty> ajmitch: good to hear
[03:23] <ajmitch> StevenK: sydney is terrible? yeah, I'd probably agree :)
[03:26] <lifeless> bmonty: NZ is a lot saner than .au
[03:34] <minghua> hi freeflying
[03:34] <minghua> freeflying: did you get my mail about skim?
[03:34] <freeflying> minghua: hi
[03:34] <freeflying> minghua: y
[03:36] <freeflying> minghua: now ,i'm waiting for skim's uploading to debian from mentor
[03:36] <ajmitch> freeflying: you got a sponsor?
[03:36] <minghua> freeflying: that's good to know, but it may not be in time for dapper though
[03:36] <ajmitch> minghua: why not? :)
[03:37] <ajmitch> debian isn't *that* slow
[03:37] <minghua> we have UVF in the middle of Jan, right?
[03:37] <ajmitch> yes
[03:37] <ajmitch> 5 weeks away
[03:37] <minghua> ajmitch: no, the debian maintainer is not freeflying
[03:37] <ajmitch> right..
[03:37] <minghua> and from my previous experience with William, his response time isn't that great...
[03:40] <minghua> speaking for the speed of debian...  I just noticed that some packages got out of NEW
[03:41] <ajmitch> they take a week or 2 in NEW
[03:58] <StevenK> I had one that was sitting in NEW for 3 weeks.
[03:58] <StevenK> And it was just a little Perl package.
[03:59] <StevenK> What's UVF?
[03:59] <bmonty> upstream version freeze
[03:59] <Amaranth> upstream version freeze
[04:00] <Amaranth> it means no more merge-o-matic
[04:00] <bmonty> well at least I know I can type faster than Amaranth :)
[04:00] <ajmitch> it means less shiny new crack
[04:00] <Amaranth> bmonty: i'm on dialup :P
[04:00] <bmonty> excuses....
[04:00] <ajmitch> NB: we will allow new packages in universe, that don't require new libs, etc, up until feature freeze
[04:00] <Amaranth> mine showed up way before yours here ;)
[04:00] <ajmitch> which is 4 weeks later than UVF
[04:01] <ajmitch> it means that we'll do a lot of reviewing & getting REVU cleared
[04:22] <LaserJock> so what happened to Review Day?
[04:23] <ajmitch> LaserJock: what do you mean?
[04:23] <ajmitch> people tried to review stuff
[04:23] <ajmitch> it's always an ongoing task
[04:23] <LaserJock> It didn't seem like there was much activity that I could see. I wondered if it was canceled
[04:23] <ajmitch> seems like everyone thinks it's a failure
[04:23] <ajmitch> maybe we shouldn't bother
[04:23] <LaserJock> Is there a way to see the stats
[04:24] <LaserJock> ajmitch: no, I think it's good, just hard to see what's going on
[04:24] <tseng> not really, revu keeps a log of comments
[04:24] <minghua> yeah, I saw many useful comments as well
[04:24] <tseng> if you have a better idea, you know what to do :)
[04:25] <LaserJock> I was just thinking that maybe if there was something like what we have for the merge
[04:25] <minghua> raphink is really a nice reviewer from what I see
[04:26] <LaserJock> does anybody know how many got accepted over Review Day?
[04:26] <ajmitch> LaserJock: it will come in time
[04:26] <ajmitch> since revu is being rewritten
[04:27] <ajmitch> the current code is a bit of a mess
[04:27] <ajmitch> and we're trying to keep away from '2.0 syndrome'
[04:27] <LaserJock> I'm not complaining so much as trying to figure things out :-)
[04:27] <lifeless> second system syndrome :)
[04:27] <ajmitch> lifeless: essentially :)
[04:28] <lifeless> ajmitch: thats the name of the syndrome - it alliterates
[04:28] <ajmitch> right
[04:28] <ajmitch> I knew I'd heard it somewhere
[04:30] <ajmitch> LaserJock: maybe we could add your requests to the features list ;)
[04:30] <LaserJock> ajmitch: is there a place to add requests?
[04:31] <minghua> someone is running dapper as daily desktop, and in order to dodge problematic upgrades, he runs dapper in a VM as well, just to test upgrades
[04:31] <ajmitch> LaserJock: not really at the moment
[04:31] <ajmitch> LaserJock: we've got a spec written up from UBZ
[04:31] <LaserJock> minghua: hmm, doesn't seem like that would help with hardware problems
[04:32] <ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU2Spec
[04:32] <minghua> LaserJock: I agree
[04:33] <ajmitch> sigh, more autopackage threads on the forums
[04:34] <LaserJock> ajmitch: is REVU2 written in Python?
[04:36] <ajmitch> LaserJock: sure
[04:36] <minghua> ajmitch: I just can't bare with some of the forum users
[04:37] <ajmitch> minghua: I generally don't bother with them
[04:38] <minghua> I just read a thread about scim, there are five or six people complaining an issue, which I've written in NEWS.Debian.gz, has a debian bug and a malone bug open, yet these guys knows nothing about it and don't bother to check
[04:40] <minghua> and some of these said users claim in the forum "we need to have good, out-of-box scim support in dapper" while doing absolutely nothing AFAICS
[04:46] <ajmitch> minghua: it does get depressing
[04:46] <LaserJock> minghua: there is quite a bit of that in the scientific community as well.
[04:46] <ajmitch> which is why I try & avoid the forums
[04:47] <ajmitch> otherwise I'd never want to work on dapper ;)
[04:48] <LaserJock> but then the forums users start saying "the devs don't care about us". It's a vicous cycle ;-)
[04:48] <minghua> yeah, I try not get affected by those posts as well
[04:49] <minghua> just felt like ranting.  now I feel much better :-)
[04:49] <LaserJock> good
[04:50] <ajmitch> rant away
[04:50] <minghua> LaserJock: my position right now is "let them say whatever they want", it's a free distro after all
[04:50] <minghua> it's not that canonical or ubuntu own anybody anything
[04:51] <minghua> if they are so unsatisfied, they can start their own distro ;-)
[04:51] <LaserJock> yeah, I just worry sometimes when these people's posts are read by hundreds of new users
[04:51] <bmonty> amen!
[04:52] <ajmitch> there's just such a lack of communication, they don't file bugreports, talk to developers, etc
[04:53] <bmonty> ajmitch: I don't think you can fault users for not filing bug reports....malone isn't the most intuitive to use right now
[04:53] <LaserJock> yeah, there is this expectation that everything should be done on the forums. I was there once, with Gentoo.
[04:53] <minghua> I don't know.  some days ago I read on #debian-devel that he is happy that the users used to rant at #debian are ranting at #ubuntu now
[04:53] <bmonty> forums are the technology of choice right now unfortunately
[04:53] <ajmitch> LaserJock: difference in culture
[04:53] <ajmitch> developers are used to IRC & mail
[04:54] <bmonty> ajmitch: right, but that doesn't mean the users should be IMHO
[04:54] <ajmitch> and the forums are 'official'
[04:54] <ajmitch> so developers should be on there, right?
[04:54] <bmonty> no, but they appear to be
[04:54] <bmonty> I personally can't stand the forums...they are hard to search and slow to load
[04:54] <ajmitch> they are official
[04:55] <bmonty> ok, I thought I read that they weren't
[04:55] <minghua> I would expect that there are at least some forum users with clue can point to/file bugs according to the forum discussions
[04:56] <LaserJock> bmonty: I'm more used to forums so I find the email+IRC thing to be hard sometimes, although I am getting better at it
[04:56] <minghua> I used to do that in Chinese debian forums, now I only act as the "clueful user" for the official chinese mailing list though
[04:57] <ajmitch> LaserJock: I don't quite grasp what is 'hard' about them :)
[04:57] <ajmitch> but that's because I've been used to them for several years, perhaps
[04:57] <LaserJock> well, with the forums it is all in one source
[04:57] <minghua> I started with BBS, so I like that, but I can't stand web forums :-(
[04:57] <bmonty> I liked the post giving Matt Garrett a hard time about his request for info on Dell laptops....a good example of this issue
[04:57] <ajmitch> bmonty: url?
[04:58] <minghua> on the other hand, mailing list with mutt makes me feel at home :-)
[04:58] <ajmitch> minghua: oh yes, mutt is nice ;)
[04:58] <bmonty> http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-December/013690.html
[04:58] <minghua> yeah, one of my officemate recently started trying mutt as well
[04:59] <ajmitch> bmonty: you said the post giving him a hard time?
[04:59] <LaserJock> I see how MLs and IRC is good for developers (I wouldn't be here if I didn't) but the forums are easier for me to find info a lot of times. Of course, that's when the forums are good quality
[04:59] <minghua> actually I seem to be influencing the linux software choice of the whole group
[04:59] <bmonty> oops
[05:00] <ajmitch> the reply?
[05:00] <minghua> everybody in our group uses vi and gnome :-)
[05:00] <bmonty> http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-December/013691.html
[05:00] <ajmitch> yes, someone who wants to flame mjg59
[05:00] <ajmitch> they don't know what they're dealing with :)
[05:01] <bmonty> I think that guy gauranteed that all of the devs for ubuntu will ignore him in the future :)
[05:01] <bmonty> anyway time for me to go to bed...goodnight everyone!
[05:01] <ajmitch> http://www-jcsu.jesus.cam.ac.uk/~mjg59/irritated.txt
[05:01] <ajmitch> mmm, flames
[05:03] <ajmitch> ok, bbl
[05:35] <minghua> it seems like designed for ubuntu :-)
[05:36] <ajmitch> minghua: which override?
[05:36] <LaserJock> maybe they were thinking ahead ;-)
[05:36] <minghua> ajmitch: like in "dpkg-scanpackage repo override"
[05:36] <ajmitch> right
[05:36] <ajmitch> there are so many overrides around, that I can't tell which one you mean :)
[05:37] <lifeless> minghua: because developers are muppets
[05:40] <minghua> lifeless: huh?  are muppets "a group of puppets and costume characters" as explained in wikipedia?
[05:41] <ajmitch> muppets, as in silly people
[06:30] <LaserJock> hi Kyral and tritium
[06:31] <tritium> hi LaserJock
[06:32] <Kyral> hey...
[06:32] <Kyral> *THUD*
[06:32] <LaserJock> Kyral: how's school>
[06:32] <Kyral> 2 finals and over 6 hours of PHP coding today
[06:32] <Kyral> you tell me
[06:34] <LaserJock> Kyral: it will be nice when it's over. At least until it starts again ;-)
[06:34] <Kyral> if I come back
[06:34] <LaserJock> ? why not
[06:34] <tritium> aw, school is fun
[06:35] <Kyral> I think I bombed my Calc2 exam
[06:36] <LaserJock> hmm, I think I did too. Calc2 was one of my nastier classes as an undergrad
[06:36] <tritium> don't worry about it, Kyral
[06:36] <Kyral> Yah...seeing as this is my second chance already? lol
[06:37] <LaserJock> well, I guess you could drop out and start a multibillion dollar software company
[06:38] <LaserJock> but I don't know that I would reccomend that ;-)
[06:38] <Kyral> ....
[06:46] <LaserJock> Kyral: so what will you degree be in?
[06:47] <Kyral> I'm IN CS ;P
[06:47] <Kyral> A CS Major that hates math, go figure
[06:48] <LaserJock> I wouldn't think a lot of CS would require that many math skills
[07:11] <zakame> rainy afternoon :D
[07:25] <zakame> er, pardon me asking, but what does a XXX-given-back.gz in the buildLogs mean?
[07:29] <minghua> John Goerzen's story on planet.debian.org is amazing
[07:42] <zakame> hello tritium ! :D
[07:42] <tritium> hi zakame
[07:42] <tritium> What's up?
[07:48] <zakame> here responding to a DD's mail for gpsd :)
[07:48] <zakame> He was curious as to how we manage our changelogs, and if we close Debian bugs in them ;)
[08:06] <lifeless> ajmitch: do new packages in debian automatically flow down ?
[08:22] <dholbach> good morning motus!
[08:22] <crimsun> 'morning daniel
[08:23] <tritium> Hi Daniel.
[08:23] <zakame> afternoon dholbach! :D
[08:24] <crimsun> 'morning michael, zak
[08:24] <tritium> Hi crimsun.
[08:24] <zakame> crimsun: are you still doing #4082 , I duplicated it with mein bug :(
[08:25] <crimsun> Ubugtu: 4082
[08:25] <dholbach> hey daniel, michael, zak - how are you guys?
[08:25] <crimsun> dholbach: not bad, yourself?
[08:26] <dholbach> cool, i'm just waking up :)
[08:26] <crimsun> zakame: feel free to work on it :)
[08:26] <tritium> Not bad.  You?  We're closing on our new house tomorrow.
[08:26] <zakame> dholbach: I wrote back to a DD for gpsd earlier, he sent me the right patch for getting gpsd build on all archs
[08:26] <dholbach> zakame: nice one :)
[08:26] <dholbach> crimsun: "closing on" :)
[08:26] <zakame> crimsun: cool! thanks :D
[08:27] <zakame> whoa, I got hit by a blackout
[08:27] <zakame> brb
[08:29] <dholbach> tritium: "closing on"?
[08:29] <tritium> dholbach: closing is when you officially sign all the papers, etc. to take legal ownership
[08:30] <dholbach> oh WOW!
[08:30] <tritium> Thanks :)
[08:32] <StevenK> tritium: Congrats. My wife and I did that a few months back.
[08:32] <StevenK> tritium: Now you have the fun of moving house. :-/
[08:32] <tritium> StevenK: thanks.  Yeah, and selling our current one ;)
[08:33] <StevenK> Also fun.
[08:33] <tritium> indeed
[08:33] <StevenK> My wife and I moved from a rented house into own place, so it was doubly good.
[08:33] <tritium> congrats!
[08:33] <StevenK> Thanks. :-)
[08:34] <tritium> :)
[08:35] <StevenK> Damn it, drop to SRM!
[08:35] <StevenK> I command thee!
[08:40] <StevenK> /dev/sda4 has gone too long without being checked, check forced.
[08:40] <StevenK> /dev/sda4: /lost+found not found.  CREATED.
[08:40] <StevenK> Whee.
[08:43] <lifeless> fwiw the problem I had a few days back with the -dbg package was purely one of debhelper compat level
[08:43] <lifeless> StevenK: 'new' ?
[08:46] <StevenK> lifeless: New old Alpha.
[09:03] <kos_tom> hi
[09:03] <kos_tom> just wanted to tell you that I've packaged the latest version of GCompris (7.2) for Breezy. It's available at http://thomas.enix.org/pub/debian/packages/breezy/
[09:08] <siretart> hi
[09:08] <siretart> kos_tom: thanks for your effords
[09:09] <siretart> kos_tom: the thing is, we should rather work on getting the latest version of gcompris into dapper first, then we can try to backport that package into breezy
[09:09] <kos_tom> siretart: ok.
[09:10] <kos_tom> siretart: just FWIW, there's a patch inside my package for GCompris. Without it, the SQLite-related stuff doesn't work.
[09:11] <siretart> kos_tom: are you a gcompris developer or just an interested user?
[09:12] <kos_tom> i'm not a gcompris developer, but I work with the main gcompris developer, so I know him quite well
[09:12] <siretart> ok
[09:13] <kos_tom> in fact, I packaged it for breezy, because a school needed it.
[09:13] <siretart> gcompris is a great and big package, and we definitly want it for edubuntu
[09:13] <siretart> I'm sure ogra will really appreciate it
[09:14] <siretart> I see that you used version number -2
[09:15] <siretart> we have a policy in ubuntu that we use version number -0ubuntu1 for the first new upstream version
[09:15] <siretart> so that a -1 version remains bigger, and we retain the possibility to sync from debian (or another source)
[09:16] <kos_tom> hum, ok I see.
[09:17] <siretart> the next thing, I see that you patch ./configure to fix that sqlite issue
[09:17] <kos_tom> yep
[09:17] <siretart> did you talk to upstream about this?
[09:17] <kos_tom> yep, I did
[09:17] <siretart> I'm not that 'happy' to patch autogenerated files
[09:17] <kos_tom> i'm not neither
[09:18] <siretart> because this are thing which tend to break the next upload
[09:18] <kos_tom> but as ./configure is shipped inside the orig tarball, I don't see any other way.
[09:18] <kos_tom> ./configure are usually shipped because they are tightly coupled with the autoconf version.
[09:18] <siretart> well, upstream could (and even more should) fix this issue in a new release
[09:18] <kos_tom> (I find it really really gory)
[09:18] <kos_tom> upstream will fix it in the new release, sure. But to have a working 7.2, I had to patch.
[09:19] <siretart> and the other possibility (what I'd suggest) would be to regenerate ./configure at build time
[09:19] <siretart> this means build depending on automake/autoconf of course
[09:19] <kos_tom> that's not the usual way of building the packages, AFAIK.
[09:19] <kos_tom> yep, and build depending with the correct versions
[09:20] <siretart> well,
[09:20] <siretart> I see many packages which rerun autofoo at buildtime, and it generally works
[09:21] <kos_tom> ok
[09:21] <siretart> but I also see that many maintainers don't want to rely on this
[09:21] <siretart> so they rerun autofoo and store that diff into a dpatch
[09:21] <siretart> which bloats the diff.gz of course
[09:21] <siretart> so you basically have to choose your poison
[09:22] <StevenK> However, Build-Depending on autofoo and running them at build time cuts the size of the diff to about 1Kb.
[09:22] <siretart> excatly
[09:22] <kos_tom> sure
[09:22] <siretart> hi StevenK! :)
[09:23] <kos_tom> StevenK: ultimately, the upstream developers shouldn't have to release the generated files.
[09:24] <siretart> thats usually not that a big problem. It becomes a real one if the generated ./configure is broken
[09:24] <siretart> as in this case
[09:25] <siretart> then the distributor has to regenerate it with fixed input files. the question here is WHEN to rerun that
[09:26] <siretart> since at ubuntu we do sourceful uploads only, I'd rather tend to regen them on the buildds.
[09:26] <crimsun> automake1.x libtool
[09:27] <siretart> kos_tom: would you mind uploading gcompris with the 2 issues I mentioned fixed to REVU?
[09:27] <crimsun> patch configure.ac, then invoke autoreconf -f -i
[09:28] <siretart> kos_tom: this is easier for us to review your package and eventually upload it to dapper (which is a prequisite to get it into breezy-backports)
[09:29] <kos_tom> siretart: ok, will see. Not tonight, but tomorrow.
[09:29] <siretart> kos_tom: you know how to do that?
[09:29] <kos_tom> I just found https://wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU, which appears to explain the stuff
[09:29] <siretart> excatly
[09:30] <siretart> just tell me your gnupg keyid, I'll add you in a sec
[09:30] <StevenK> tmpfs                267552.0T 16536128.0T    113.6M 100% /
[09:31] <StevenK> Muahahahahaha
[09:31] <kos_tom> siretart: my complete fingerprint is 0BE1 4CF3 CEA4 AC9D CC6E 1624 F653 CB30 98D3 F7A7
[09:32] <siretart> ok, done, you may upload now
[09:32] <kos_tom> ok, but I'm at my work, don't have my development stuff there.
[09:33] <kos_tom> and tonight, I'm organizing something for the local LUG (Ubuntu demonstrations !), so won't have time to upload.
[10:14] <kos_tom> lucas: hi
[10:15] <Tonio_> hi all
[10:15] <zakame> hi all, Tonio_ :D
[10:16] <Tonio_> :)
[10:18] <lucas> hi kos_tom :)
[10:25] <siretart> huhu Tonio_
[10:30] <Tonio_> yop siretart
[12:19] <JohnnyMast> hey slomo
[01:37] <Nafallo> hmm
[01:37] <Nafallo> sistpoty should get in soon?
[01:50] <siretart> muhahaha: http://www.ibiblio.org/propaganda/GDM20E20.html
[01:51] <siretart> Nafallo: I should have his phone number around here somewhere, if you need to contact him
[01:52] <Nafallo> siretart: mostly that linuxdcpp is fixed but malone refuses to add bugs against it via lpbugs.py :-/
[01:52] <siretart> Nafallo: lpbugs.py just creates and signs an email
[01:52] <siretart> Nafallo: did you check if the email arrives at launchpad?
[01:53] <Nafallo> siretart: yes, and it works for everything except linuxdcpp ;-)
[01:53] <Nafallo> I guess launchpad import stuff only when there is a binary :-P
[01:54] <siretart> Nafallo: did you check if the source package is actually registered and known at launchpad?
[01:54] <Nafallo> siretart: nope.
[01:55] <Nafallo> how to search for source?
[01:56] <siretart> lets see, how is the package called again?
[01:58] <Nafallo> linuxdcpp
[02:18] <siretart> Nafallo: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linuxdccp
[02:19] <siretart> thats the problem
[02:19] <siretart> you need to ask someone in launchpad to add that sourcepackage to launchpad
[02:19] <\sh> Nafallo: ping kiko he did it for us hte last time
[02:20] <Nafallo> k, thanx
[02:20] <\sh> ok...going back to bed..cu later in the evening...somehow I have east coast times now
[02:20] <siretart> \sh: how are you? feeling better?
[02:21] <\sh> siretart: I wish I do
[02:21] <siretart> \sh: sleep well, gute besserung!
[02:21] <zakame> evening all :D
[02:21] <\sh> siretart: I just went out to buy some bottles of coke...wasn't good to do it
[02:21] <siretart> hey zakame
[02:21] <\sh> bbl
[02:22] <zakame> gn8 \sh :D
[02:22] <zakame> hi siretart ! :)
[02:22] <Tonio_> re
[02:22] <Tonio_> I'm just packaging metamonitor
[02:23] <Tonio_> few bugs in the sources bug I've been able to patch and it works
[02:23] <Tonio_> anyway, I'm not hapy with the patch I've done, cause I'm sure there is a propper way to do it...
[02:25] <Tonio_> is patching a Makefile.in a good way to do, or is there a clean way to regenerate another one valid (using automake or something) ?
[02:27] <siretart> Tonio_: is that a handcrafted Makefile.in (package using autoconf only) or is it created (e.g. by automake)?
[02:28] <Tonio_> the package is using autoconf to generate Makefiles
[02:28] <Tonio_> but all Makefiles.in have been gnrated with a very old version of automake
[02:28] <Tonio_> automake 1.6.3
[02:29] <Tonio_> siretart: I'm sure using a more recent version would give a cleaner Makefile.in
[02:29] <siretart> hm. it really depends on the package.
[02:29] <zakame> Tonio_: hm, I was faced with the same prob before (with gpsd), where a missing $(LIBM) in the Makefile.in made build-fails in non-i386 :(
[02:29] <siretart> Tonio_: then this might be the best approach to fix the package
[02:29] <Tonio_> in fact the hack I've done works, but the method isn't clean to me.....
[02:30] <Tonio_> siretart: so what to do ?
[02:30] <Tonio_> patching like I've done and tell upstream to use a more recent version ?
[02:30] <Tonio_> or make usage of automake via the rules file ?
[02:32] <Tonio_> zakame: and how did you proceed ?
[02:32] <siretart> Tonio_: I'd do both
[02:32] <zakame> Tonio_: what exactly is the change made to your Makefile.in?
[02:32] <Tonio_> zakame: here is an example
[02:33] <Tonio_> in the way it uses MOC :
[02:33] <Tonio_> configurebase.h: $(srcdir)/configurebase.ui
[02:33] <Tonio_> 	$(UIC) -o configurebase.h $(srcdir)/configurebase.ui
[02:33] <Tonio_> configurebase.moc: configurebase.h
[02:33] <Tonio_> 	$(MOC) configurebase.h -o configurebase.moc
[02:33] <Tonio_> that doesn't work, while it is supposed to...
[02:33] <Tonio_> but the result is configurebase.h file missing
[02:34] <Tonio_> so I changed "$(MOC) configurebase.h -o configurebase.moc" to "$(MOC) $(srcdir)/configurebase.h -o configurebase.moc"
[02:34] <Tonio_> as you can see, that's not a very clean way to proceed, but that works :)
[02:35] <zakame> hm, indeed... :(
[02:35] <Tonio_> best way would be to regenerate all makefiles.in within rules, but that sound like a kind of mess to perform :)
[02:36] <zakame> in my case with gpsd, all I really needed to do was to force LDFLAGS="$(LDFLAGS) -lm" in debian/rules ;)
[02:36] <Tonio_> yes, but my problem isn't a path problem
[02:36] <zakame> short of a 156K dpatch :(
[02:36] <Tonio_> the fact is that I don't understand why the original code doesn't work...
[02:37] <zakame> when it should, gaah :(
[02:37] <Tonio_> and the strange thing is that it seems to read the makefile from the end to the begining
[02:37] <Tonio_> is that normal ?
[02:38] <Tonio_>  I mean, several .h files are performed, but errors are ordered from the last .h file to the first....
[02:39] <Tonio_> dunno if that's normal.....
[02:45] <zakame> dholbach: whoa, open MOTU! you rock! :D
[02:45] <jsgotangco> open Motu?
[02:46] <dholbach> zakame: i'm glad you like it
[02:46] <zakame> jsgotangco: jedi-padawan relations ;)
[02:46] <jsgotangco> ohhh
[02:46] <zakame> dholbach: yeah, as I'm having such a session right now at #u-ph :D
[02:47] <jsgotangco> zakame, you know very well i'm very much on the dark side
[02:47] <jsgotangco> *heavy breathing*
[02:47] <zakame> jsgotangco: so, that's sith->?what? relationship :D
[02:48] <jsgotangco> a sith lord -> sith apprentice relationship
[02:50] <zakame> oh right :))
[02:50] <dholbach> you want me to hack on the kernel or what?
[02:55] <Gloubiboulga> hello
[02:55] <zakame> hi Gloubiboulga
[02:58] <Gloubiboulga> I've just seen dholbach's message on the ubuntu-motu list
[02:58] <Gloubiboulga> I think it's a really good idea :)
[02:59] <dholbach> could you all please follow up on the list on this?
[02:59] <dholbach> like that we can plan it better
[03:01] <Gloubiboulga> dholbach, yes
[03:01] <zakame> sure dholbach :D
[03:24] <zakame> crimsun: hm, seems mftrace was already uploaded and built, despite PendingUpload, could I close the bug(s) then? :)
[03:26] <zakame> hi slomo :D
[03:26] <slomo> hi zakame :)
[03:27] <jdong__> I'm investigating a build failure under Hoary with mplayer...
[03:27] <jdong__> I think we're missing a build-dep
[03:27] <jdong__> (not that I expect it to work with a build dep ;) )
[03:28] <jdong__> stepping thru the build again to check
[03:29] <slomo> jdong_: with the hoary package or the dapper one?
[03:29] <jdong__> sorry, too early in the morning :D
[03:29] <jdong__> I meant Dapper -> Breezy
[03:30] <jdong__> I believe it wasa a link error with an unknown lib
[03:30] <jdong__> around 20 min into the build on an A64
[03:30] <slomo> jdong_: that would be at the first linking... hmm, upload me the buildlog somewhere, maybe i can give you a hint ;)
[03:30] <jdong__> slomo: I'm rebuilding it to get the error again at the moment :)
[03:31] <jdong__> and where am I logged in twice???
[03:31] <jdong__> grr
[03:31] <jdong__> brb
[03:31] <jdong_> stupid screen :)
[03:32] <jdong_> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lmp4v2
[03:32] <jdong_> libmp4v2-dev, I guess?
[03:34] <slomo> yes
[03:34] <slomo> libfaac-dev missed a depend on libmp4v2-dev in breezy
[03:35] <jdong_> would it be an acceptable idea to add a libmp4v2-dev dep from mplayer?
[03:35] <Mithrandir> do you mean build-depend?
[03:35] <zakame> ain't that in multiverse?
[03:35] <jdong_> add libmp4v2-dev as a build-dep on mplayer in Dapper
[03:36] <ogra> zakame, as well as mplayer is ...
[03:36] <slomo> jdong_: yes, i can do it with the next mplayer upload... but this will be earliest at the weekend. currently there's a small issue with ffmpeg in mplayer that i need to fix
[03:36] <jdong_> slomo: ok, that's fine
[03:37] <zakame> ogra: oh, right, moving on... :)
[03:37] <ogra> :)
[03:41] <Yagisan> slomo - I tried to backport mplayer this weekend (with the fixed dep), and it FTBFS on amd64, would that be the ffmpeg issue you mention ?
[03:42] <Kyral> Morning
[03:43] <zakame> heya Kyral
[03:43] <siretart> small issue with ffmpeg?!
[03:44] <siretart> I'd rather say it is a mess! :)
[03:45] <Yagisan> siretart: It's not possible to standardise on a ffmpeg and ffmpeg-dev package is it ?
[03:45] <siretart> Yagisan: no
[03:46] <siretart> Yagisan: ffmpeg upstream is way to unstable, and changes both API and ABI too frequently :(
[03:46] <Yagisan> siretart: Words can't express how much that annoys me as a user
[03:46] <siretart> Yagisan: jo
[03:47] <jdong_> p7zip, -O2 CFLAGS bring slightly better performance (5% increase)...
[03:47] <jdong_> any reason we don't use it?
[03:47] <Yagisan> siretart: ?
[03:47] <siretart> Yagisan: I agree with you
[03:48] <siretart> jdong_: sounds reasonable. I'd suggest filing a malone bug about this. perhaps you can attach a patch, too
[03:48] <jdong_> ok
[03:49] <Yagisan> siretart: ok, google couldn't translate jo. It's frustrating when you are encoding/decoding and different apps don't work together, because ffmpeg changed :(
[03:49] <ogra> jdong_, the simple fact that e have to rebuild the world, that it requires a lot of testing and that we divert even more from debian with it i guess
[03:49] <jdong_> siretart: nvm, google revealed SFX issues on some archs with -O2
[03:50] <jdong_> idn if the archs are relevant to us though
[03:50] <Amaranth> SFX?
[03:50] <Amaranth> we have lots of arches
[03:50] <jdong_> self extracting 7zips
[03:50] <jdong_> Amaranth: Cygwin?
[03:50] <ogra> in any case it would be far to intrusive for dapper ...
[03:50] <Amaranth> oh, only windows does those, i thought
[03:50] <jdong_> Amaranth: yeah, cygwin is a POSIX-like supported arch with p7zip
[03:51] <jdong_> there's been a LOT of 7z hype over @ the forums recently
[03:51] <Amaranth> yeah
[03:51] <ogra> jdong_, thst something to look at for dapper+1 at earliest date ...
[03:51] <slomo> Yagisan: no... do you have a buildlog? the issue with ffmpeg in mplayer is a decoding problem with h264 (completly distorted picture)
[03:51] <Amaranth> if the language packs are compressed with LZMA compression we can fit more on the CD
[03:52] <jdong_> ogra: I understand :)
[03:52] <ogra> we simply couldnt bear any undiscovered bugs in the packaging system for a 5year support release
[03:52] <Yagisan> slomo: no, but I can chuck it into the breezy pbuilder again for you
[03:52] <jdong_> ogra: just that a lot of people want to use 7z more for their personal purposes
[03:52] <Yagisan> slomo: I can't do dapper, as I'm waiting for a mirror sync
[03:52] <slomo> Yagisan: maybe the libmp4v2 problem? but please do it :)
[03:53] <Yagisan> slomo: I'll dcc it to you when done
[03:53] <ogra> jdong_, thats fine, if its free, make a package ... a good MOTU task ;)
[03:53] <Yagisan> jdong_: isn't 7z mainly used for warez ?
[03:53] <ogra> it could even see some more widespread testing if there would be a package in universe
[03:54] <jdong_> Yagisan: umm, it's a very powerful compression format
[03:54] <jdong_> ogra: it's already in universe; p7zip
[03:54] <jdong_> ogra: dfsg approved Freeness :)
[03:54] <ogra> oh, didnt know that
[03:55] <jdong_> ogra: main downside is RAM usage and slowness
[03:55] <jdong_> ogra: to achieve its 20% improvement over bzip2 on larger archives, it at times takes 100MB+ to compress/decompress
[03:55] <Amaranth> 7z is just a wrapper format
[03:55] <jdong_> LZMA compression
[03:55] <Amaranth> the thing everyone is excited about is LZMA compression
[03:55] <Amaranth> yeah
[03:56] <Amaranth> i thought that had patent issues
[03:56] <Hieronymus> Amaranth: haven't they expired?
[03:56] <Amaranth> everyone says 7z when they mean LZMA because it's the most popular implementation
[03:56] <Yagisan> jdong_: I don't doubt it powerful, but I thought I knew where I saw .7z packages before.
[03:57] <Yagisan> slomo: when did mplayer 2:0.99+1.0pre7try2+cvs20051205-0ubuntu7 get uploaded ?
[03:57] <slomo> Yagisan: some time ago ;) maybe 2 weeks ago
[03:57] <jdong_> the patents expired; p7zip is pure GPL right now
[03:58] <jdong_> the lzma SDK is LGPL or more free
[03:58] <jdong_> (I believe the p7zip author has supernatural licensing rights to the SDK?)
[03:58] <Yagisan> slomo: hmm, wasn't there on sunday/monday when my build failed. I'll download and see if I can reproduce the error
[04:02] <jdong_> is \sh around?
[04:03] <jdong_> I plan on bringing back my beta testing repository (breezy-backports-staging) for Backports beta testers...
[04:03] <jdong_> with the usual "100% beta breaks your system" warnings and such
[04:03] <jdong_> there are several Backports enthusiasts that have expressed interest in helping me beta test
[04:04] <jdong_> just would like to know if anyone'd object to that
[04:04] <jdong_> packages will be built in clean chroots, according to Backports policies and all
[04:04] <jdong_> no source changes, etc
[04:07] <Yagisan> jdong_: you don't use pbuilder for backports ?
[04:12] <slomo> Yagisan: thanks
[04:12] <Yagisan> slomo: your welcome
[04:12] <jdong_> Yagisan: for Backports purposes, I still find it faster (for me) to use a chroot instead
[04:12] <jdong_> Yagisan: I keep my chroots very clean, with vmwares for testing
[04:13] <slomo> jdong_: why? apt-get source foo && pbuilder build foo.dsc ;)
[04:13] <Yagisan> jdong_: I scripted up my pbuilder scripts, that's how I caught the mplayer build-dep missing error
[04:13] <jdong_> jdong_: ubp-build.py has experimental version sed support now :)
[04:13] <jdong_> I use pbuilder at times
[04:14] <slomo> Yagisan: no idea about this failure... it's not logical imho ;) we link to libmpcdec but it doesn't find the symbols in libmpdec...
[04:15] <Yagisan> slomo: excellent, I'll try in a dapper pbuilder, when I stop getting md5sum errors from the mirrors
[04:15] <Yagisan> slomo: See if I get the same illogical error :)
[04:17] <jdong_> yay for dead cats
[04:18] <\sh> beta testing backports repository>
[04:18] <\sh> ?
[04:18] <\sh> guys i'm sleeping and it pinged here
[04:19] <jdong_> \sh: sorry to disturb you... I'm bringing back breezy-backports-staging on mirrormax for Backports beta testers
[04:20] <jdong_> they know well not to disturb devs about problems resulting from using it
[04:20] <jdong_> wondering if you're ok with it
[04:20] <\sh> jdong_: how are you managing this with user and passwort authentication
[04:20] <jdong_> \sh: I've not planned to use authentication...
[04:20] <jdong_> \sh: I don't think average users would be stumbling on staging left and right :)
[04:20] <\sh> so how are you managing it, that those people are not spamming the whole world with "damn, I broke my ubuntu with backports again"?
[04:21] <jdong_> tell them not to?
[04:21] <\sh> jdong_: it failed the first time..do you think you will succeed the second time?
[04:21] <jdong_> \sh: the first time, we had a "stable" Backports repo on there for general use
[04:22] <jdong_> that isn't happening this time
[04:22] <jdong_> this time, it's a BETA TESTING repo ONLY, and it's clearly going to be labeled as such
[04:23] <jdong_> In addition, I will not be signing the repository, adding another CLEAR WARNING before any of these packages are installed
[04:23] <Yagisan> jdong_: Uh, you do know on the forums, there was a guide about how to disable the non-signed message
[04:24] <jdong_> Yagisan: yes, and it was critized enough for it
[04:24] <\sh> jdong_: well..I'm not ok with it...but do whatever you like...if the support requests are increasing because of this beta staging backports area...well I think we will have the same discussion again as last time..which I don't want...and others either
[04:25] <jdong_> \sh: I don't think that'll happen this time
[04:25] <\sh> jdong_: you don't know the users :)
[04:25] <jdong_> but if any support requests like that ever pop up, contact me
[04:25] <Yagisan> jdong_: Just wanted to point out that techincal solutions don't always work on social problems
[04:25] <jdong_> Yagisan: yeah, I experienced that before with moving repository URL's
[04:26] <\sh> anyways going back to sleep...
[04:26] <\sh> laters
[04:26] <siretart> \sh: sleep well
[04:27] <jdong_> see ya
[04:27] <Yagisan> jdong_: Honestly, I think a a backports beta is better as a "closed" beta, without the general users accessing it
[04:27] <siretart> jdong_: I'm not sure if it is worth the efford
[04:28] <siretart> jdong_: I think how to create a breezy pbuilder is quite well documented on the wiki. and the sources are available in our archive
[04:28] <Yagisan> jdong_: personally, I backport what I need with pbuilder
[04:28] <siretart> jdong_: what I've been thinking todo was to write a small wrapper script, which fetches the source package from dapper and builds it with the local breezy pbuilder, so that building the packages would be a oneliner, even for backporting beta testers
[04:29] <jdong_> siretart: there were about 2-3 packages that staging testers caught problems with
[04:29] <jdong_> one caught bug is worth the effort for me
[04:29] <jdong_> and more testers = better coverage
[04:30] <jdong_> and if I have 10 beta testers, having them all do pbuilder packages themselves doesn't make much sense to me
[04:30] <siretart> jdong_: err, what kind of problems?
[04:31] <jdong_> siretart: regressions in program functionality
[04:31] <jdong_> siretart: sometimes obscure interactions with other Universe packages
[04:31] <siretart> jdong_: err, and how do you circumvent them?
[04:32] <jdong_> siretart: I'd know about them and not let the packages into the stable repository?
[04:32] <jdong_> rather than figuring it out the hard and painful way where ordinary users would get affected
[04:32] <Yagisan> jdong_: that's the nature of backporting from an unstable and changing development repository
[04:32] <jdong_> Yagisan: but that's no excuse not to try to avoid it
[04:33] <Yagisan> jdong_: no, that is why the backporter needs to test what they backport
[04:33] <siretart> jdong_: I was thinking about a wrapper skript 'ub-backport-build <sourcepackage>', which would fetch the source from dapper and builds it in the local pbuilder
[04:33] <siretart> jdong_: if you are interested, we could put that script into dapper and backport it officially
[04:34] <jdong_> siretart: that'd be very cool
[04:34] <siretart> jdong_: that way it would be most easy for backport testers to fetch and build the packages themselves
[04:34] <jdong_> Yagisan: these are packages that I test but missed the bugs
[04:34] <jdong_> Yagisan: I spend A LOT OF TIME testing
[04:34] <Yagisan> siretart: I have some scripts that may be able to be modifed for that purpose
[04:35] <siretart> Yagisan: that would be cool. are they publically available?
[04:35] <Yagisan> siretart: not yet, but I can send them to you
[04:36] <siretart> Yagisan: just send it to ubuntu-backports@lists.ubuntu.com (and perhaps CC: ubuntu-motu@)
[04:36] <siretart> so that jdong can see that it as well ;)
[04:36] <jdong_> thanks guys, that'll be sweet :)
[04:36] <Yagisan> siretart: I'm not on that list, it won't get through
[04:37] <Yagisan> I'll need to subscribe today
[04:37] <jdong_> I appreciate your help
[04:37] <Yagisan> I'll post it when I get up, but it works for backports, and non-backports
[04:37] <Yagisan> depends on a working pbuilder though
[04:38] <jdong_> Yagisan: that's the thing... you need to automate that, too
[04:38] <siretart> Yagisan: perhaps we could provide a working pbuilder example config
[04:38] <jdong_> it needs to ship being able to backport out-of-the-APT
[04:39] <siretart> it really isn't that hard to create a pbuilder
[04:39] <siretart> jdong_: no, it just needs a custom apt config, not depending on the system apt
[04:39] <jdong_> siretart: but it's a deterrent to beta testers
[04:39] <siretart> jdong_: I've done this for several small projects, its no problem
[04:40] <Yagisan> OK, after work today, I'll fix up the script, turn it into a package, and sent it to both lists, and revu, and stick it in my repo
[04:42] <jdong_> thanks
[04:43] <Yagisan> jdong_: no worries, it would be nice to have a package that isn't rejected because of licensing :)
[04:43] <lucas> I just uploaded a new version of motutools to REVU. if somebody has some time to review it : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1160
[04:48] <Yagisan> Goodnight all (3am here)
[04:48] <siretart> lucas: advocated
[04:48] <siretart> gn8 Yagisan
[04:48] <zakame> gn8 Yagisan :D
[04:49] <Yagisan> btw slomo, mplayer built fine in the dapper pbuilder on amd64
[04:49] <Yagisan> night
[04:50] <lucas> siretart: thanks :-)
[04:53] <zakame> wow we're just 102 packages unassigned for merge :)
[04:55] <jsgotangco> time for the UTOM team to change that
[04:55] <jsgotangco> :D
[04:57] <JohnnyMast> guys i found a theme song for MOTU
[04:58] <JohnnyMast> http://www.rosiello.net/downloads/13 - Princes of the Universe.ogg
[04:58] <JohnnyMast> it rocks !
[04:58] <zakame> JohnnyMast: I've that playing NOW :D
[04:58] <JohnnyMast> its would fit
[04:59] <JohnnyMast> fit ubuntu MOTU like a successfull package on pbuilder
[04:59] <jsgotangco> good night
[04:59] <lucas> zakame: 102 packages unassigned for merge doesn't mean we are lagging behind debian for only 102 packages
[04:59] <lucas> a lot of merges are waiting for reviews & uploads
[05:01] <zakame> lucas: yeah; still, that's 102 packages unassigned ;)
[05:01] <JohnnyMast> only 102
[05:01] <JohnnyMast> i have seen a lot more
[05:01] <JohnnyMast> guys i have a strange pbuilder error
[05:02] <zakame> we have 165 accepted, and 488 done
[05:03] <lucas> http://ox.blop.info/bazaar/versionslist.html <= comparison of debian sid vs ubuntu dapper pkg versions
[05:03] <zakame> lucas: so we're more or less half-done for merging :) I'm looking forward for what's next after that ;)
[05:05] <zakame> rocking!
[05:06] <zakame> good night all :D
[05:06] <JohnnyMast> guys
[05:07] <JohnnyMast> could you all look into this ?
[05:07] <JohnnyMast> http://pastebin.com/463819
[05:07] <zakame> sure
[05:07] <JohnnyMast>  have python-glade2 in my deps
[05:08] <zakame> have you checked your ./configure call?
[05:08] <JohnnyMast> with python ?
[05:08] <JohnnyMast> there is none
[05:08] <zakame> in debian/rules?
[05:09] <zakame> can you paste that as well?
[05:09] <JohnnyMast> my rule file ? sure but i blame control
[05:09] <JohnnyMast> or pbuilder
[05:09] <JohnnyMast> since it also cant read my dapper cd
[05:09] <zakame> wah
[05:10] <JohnnyMast> http://pastebin.com/463827
[05:10] <JohnnyMast> thats the rule file
[05:10] <JohnnyMast> *rules
[05:11] <zakame> gah, cdbs ...
[05:11] <JohnnyMast> yep
[05:12] <zakame> i see why you blame the control file then ;)
[05:12] <JohnnyMast> you want to see it ?
[05:13] <zakame> go :D
[05:13] <JohnnyMast> ok
[05:14] <JohnnyMast> http://pastebin.com/463830
[05:15] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: You don't have permission to access /downloads/13 - Princes of the Universe.ogg on this server.
[05:15] <zakame> huh? why the B-D _and_ B-D-I on the same python-glade2 pkg?
[05:15] <zakame> lucas: I'm looking at your ruby merges ;)
[05:17] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus let me check
[05:17] <zakame> JohnnyMast: also, 'tis seems you didn't explicitly set which python version to use
[05:17] <JohnnyMast> lol i C
[05:17] <zakame> it should prolly be python2.4-dev
[05:17] <JohnnyMast> well it doesnt depend on a version
[05:17] <JohnnyMast> i checked already
[05:19] <zakame> hm but the binary will be, even if its arch: all
[05:19] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus fixed
[05:19] <JohnnyMast> it only depends on >=2.2
[05:19] <zakame> anyhow I'll look at this tomorrow, 'tis 12:19 am here in .ph and rainy even :(
[05:20] <JohnnyMast> well thats all debian/debian a like os`es there days
[05:20] <zakame> good night :D
[05:24] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus you you like it
[05:24] <JohnnyMast> ??
[05:26] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: no
[05:26] <JohnnyMast> i do :) its ideal for motu
[05:29] <siretart> slomo: I think I have managed to build a transcode-1.0.2 with the ffmpeg we currently have in dapper. It seems to build on amd64, will try it on x86, too
[05:29] <siretart> and yes, it is linked statically to our lovely ffmpeg
[05:31] <slomo> siretart: and again 1 GB big? ;)
[05:31] <siretart> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 15097674 Dez 14 17:31 result/transcode_1.0.2-0.0ubuntu1_amd64.deb
[05:31] <siretart> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   291360 Dez 14 17:31 result/transcode-doc_1.0.2-0.0ubuntu1_all.deb
[05:32] <siretart> slomo: 15mb.
[05:32] <slomo> and 40 mb uncompressed... same as before
[05:32] <slomo> ok...
[05:32] <siretart> slomo: better than not having transcode at all
[05:32] <JohnnyMast> could you start a build on revu for me ? i think my own pbuilder is broken and i need somethng to check
[05:32] <slomo> siretart: yes
[05:33] <JohnnyMast> that was asked to siretart
[05:33] <siretart> slomo: to change this, we would have to make ffmpeg provide dynamic libs. perhaps we could make ffmpeg provide a dynamic 'libavcodec-ubuntu.so', and hope that we won't change ffmpeg in dapper again
[05:33] <siretart> JohnnyMast: which package?
[05:34] <JohnnyMast> hold on im uploading it now then ile pass you the revu link
[05:34] <siretart> ok
[05:35] <JohnnyMast> its a strange thing 1) pbuilder cant read my dapper cd 2) it wasnt a build one heck of a lot of packages
[05:36] <JohnnyMast> siretart here it  is http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1161
[05:36] <slomo> siretart: or ship libavcodec-transcode.so with transcode
[05:42] <siretart> slomo: this would mean code duplication
[05:43] <siretart> slomo: I don't want to ship the source to ffmpeg in transcodes diff.gz
[05:44] <slomo> ok
[05:44] <siretart> slomo: lets rather declare the one ffmpeg we currently have as the semi-official and link dynamically to that
[05:44] <siretart> slomo: but if we do that, we should wait until after UVF, so that we avoid unecessary rebuilds
[05:45] <JohnnyMast> siretart did you start the build ?
[05:47] <JohnnyMast> thanks
[05:47] <JohnnyMast> siretart on my pbuilder it says python-glade2 is missing
[05:48] <siretart> JohnnyMast: done
[05:48] <siretart> JohnnyMast: seems to ftbfs, but because of different reason
[05:48] <JohnnyMast> whats ftbfs ?
[05:49] <Amaranth> fail to build from source
[05:50] <JohnnyMast> i dont see it failing
[05:50] <siretart> JohnnyMast: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/ttb-0512141135/ttb_0.9.4-0ubuntu1.buildlog
[05:51] <JohnnyMast> yes thats what i get
[05:51] <siretart> for some reason, your package does not seem to detect the system python-glade2 package
[05:51] <JohnnyMast> and the missing package is in the controle file
[05:51] <JohnnyMast> as depend
[05:52] <JohnnyMast> siretart do you have any idea`s about it ?
[05:53] <siretart> JohnnyMast: no, sorry
[05:54] <JohnnyMast> siretart this was exactly why i tought that my builder was broken because the package is in the deps and also installed
[05:54] <Gloubiboulga> sudo apt-get install flex
[05:54] <Gloubiboulga> sorry
[05:54] <Gloubiboulga> :/
[05:56] <siretart> JohnnyMast: no, your pbuilder seems to be fine
[05:56] <JohnnyMast> yeah
[05:56] <JohnnyMast> maybe its my debian/ dir somewhere
[06:05] <siretart> slomo: ok, it built on amd64 and on x86
[06:05] <siretart> slomo: I think I'll upload it to the archive, ok?
[06:05] <slomo> fine with me :)
[06:08] <siretart> uploading now
[06:09] <siretart> ok im off for today
[06:09] <siretart> cu folks!
[06:39] <seth_k> Can I get another advocater for http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1070 kmobiletools? Riddell has reviewed and advocated :)
[06:41] <Riddell> seth_k: "another reviewer" best not to presume too much :)
[06:42] <seth_k> haha well said ;)
[07:04] <cyberix> slomo: What is/was the problem with gnunet-gtk?
[07:05] <cyberix> slomo: It still doesn't work in sid?
[07:25] <dholbach> can somebody proof-read/enhance/fix/add-bling-factor to http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/Draft?
[07:25] <dholbach> we really need it to fix up universe bugs
[07:25] <dholbach> and the desktop team and the kubuntu team as well :)
[07:27] <slomo> cyberix: no idea, i didn't have any luck to talk with elmo about it... but don't worry, i don't forget it :)
[07:36] <dholbach> anyone?
[07:37] <LaserJock> hi dholbach
[07:37] <dholbach> Riddell just added a kubuntu paragraph, does anybody care enough to write a motu/universe one?
[07:37] <dholbach> or shall we leave it out?
[07:38] <LaserJock> dholbach: looks, cool
[07:39] <LaserJock> although I will be on the road on the 21st
[07:39] <dholbach> a lot of people will, i guess
[07:39] <dholbach> but we should have those bug days regularly
[07:40] <dholbach> that's, why i decided to drive it anyways
[07:40] <LaserJock> btw, I just read your Open MOTU Day email, do you have an idea of when that would be?
[07:41] <dholbach> i think we should start planning it... adding ideas around it, so we can really make it big
[07:41] <dholbach> that's why i didn't ask for a date yet :)
[07:41] <dholbach> surely next year
[07:41] <LaserJock> I think it is a great idea, anything I can do?
[07:42] <dholbach> suggest random cool stuff on the mailing list
[07:42] <dholbach> :)
[07:42] <LaserJock> maybe I can get a rough draft of the Ubuntu Packaging Guide done by then
[07:42] <dholbach> sounds cool
[07:42] <dholbach> that'd be something we could refer people to
[07:45] <JohnnyMast> dholbach im writing a reply mail to urs
[07:46] <dholbach> urs?
[07:48] <JohnnyMast> you on the mailing list
[07:48] <dholbach> ah cool
[07:48] <JohnnyMast> it has been send
[07:48] <dholbach> but just to me ;)
[07:49] <JohnnyMast> :|
[07:49] <JohnnyMast> let me forward it to the mailing
[07:49] <LaserJock> JohnnyMast: have you worked on w.u.c/Merging lately?
[07:50] <JohnnyMast> no only revu and bug fixes
[07:50] <JohnnyMast> the others where fixed for me
[07:50] <JohnnyMast> but are still asigned
[07:50] <LaserJock> k, I guess I should finish that up
[07:51] <JohnnyMast> so LaserJock whats the story ? are you motu already ?
[07:51] <LaserJock> no
[07:51] <JohnnyMast> getting there ?
[07:51] <LaserJock> only a wannabe ;-)
[07:51] <LaserJock> not sure
[07:51] <JohnnyMast> but ur wise and old
[07:52] <LaserJock> I just became an Ubuntu member at the last CC Meeting
[07:52] <LaserJock> JohnnyMast: well, thanks but I don't know if I have the technological knowledge to be a MOTU yet
[07:52] <LaserJock> there is still a lot for me to learn
[07:52] <LaserJock> I just try to help where I can
[07:52] <JohnnyMast> well LaserJock keep it up !
[07:53] <LaserJock> I'll try, thanks for the encouragement
[07:53] <JohnnyMast> :)
[07:53] <JohnnyMast> btw did you do anything on the mergin text ?
[07:53] <LaserJock> not since the 7th
[07:54] <JohnnyMast> ok
[07:54] <JohnnyMast> dholbach, what did you think of my idea ?
[07:54] <LaserJock> I better finish up my xcdroast tutorial, it is kinda bad to leave it hanging there
[07:54] <JohnnyMast> yes well i liked it with the attachments
[07:55] <JohnnyMast> *ike
[07:55] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: in general it's a good idea to have people willing to take care of motu wannabes, it's just a question of how to organize that
[07:55] <JohnnyMast> *like
[07:55] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: i think the motu open day, the motu school and the mailing list are a good start
[07:55] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: what do you think?
[07:56] <JohnnyMast> but you could put the (example MOTOpersonal ppl life in ubuntu-school
[07:56] <JohnnyMast> so then ppl have a root to join from
[07:56] <JohnnyMast> that fixes the organisation
[07:56] <JohnnyMast> the teachers are in school :)
[07:57] <JohnnyMast> so that the school room doesnt have only idlers
[07:57] <JohnnyMast> it will be more active with once in a while an extra lecture
[07:57] <dholbach> you could work on the idea a bit and present in tomorrow's motu meeting
[07:57] <JohnnyMast> is that here ?
[07:58] <dholbach> #ubuntu-meeting
[07:58] <dholbach> should be on fridge.ubuntu.com/event
[07:58] <JohnnyMast> what time ?
[07:58] <JohnnyMast> its some where in my email inbox
[07:58] <JohnnyMast> ile work out an document
[07:59] <JohnnyMast> or better ile create a presentation in dia
[08:00] <eruin> \s I think you need new blogging software ;p
[08:00] <JohnnyMast> im working on edge
[08:00] <JohnnyMast> to wrap it in deb
[08:00] <JohnnyMast> well not yet im waiting for an upstream stable
[08:01] <JohnnyMast> dholbach feeel like doing a revieuw ?
[08:02] <dholbach> tell me the url and i'll look at it later
[08:02] <JohnnyMast> ok
[08:02] <JohnnyMast> hold on to something
[08:03] <JohnnyMast> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1162
[08:03] <dholbach> cool, have it in the browser
[08:03] <dholbach> will poke at it later
[08:03] <JohnnyMast> thanks
[08:04] <JohnnyMast> whats the motu school channel name again ?
[08:04] <dholbach> anybody wants to add something to http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/Draft, something universe-wise?
[08:05] <LaserJock> JohnnyMast: #ubuntu-motu-school ?
[08:05] <JohnnyMast> thumbs up @ LaserJock thanks thats what ineeded
[08:05] <LaserJock> dholbach: maybe we should say something about how many universe bugs there are
[08:07] <ajmitch> morning all
[08:07] <dholbach> yeah, something about the motu team, having fun on the bug day as well
[08:07] <dholbach> something about our bug page on the wiki, whatever :)
[08:08] <ajmitch> what's new?
[08:09] <dholbach> UbuntuBugDay/Draft!
[08:09] <dholbach> owohoo
[08:13] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: You might want to indent the license info in debian/copyright with two spaces, so that it's clear where it begins and ends
[08:14] <JohnnyMast> what line do you mean ?
[08:14] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: in debian/copyright
[08:14] <Hieronymus> I mean the license
[08:14] <Hieronymus> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2003/12/msg00007.html
[08:15] <JohnnyMast> oh on line 2
[08:15] <JohnnyMast> \..\
[08:15] <JohnnyMast> |..|
[08:16] <Hieronymus> ?
[08:16] <Hieronymus> no
[08:16] <Treenaks> the | things indicate 'quoted text'
[08:16] <Treenaks> JohnnyMast: have a look around in /usr/share/doc/*/copyright for examples
[08:16] <Treenaks> JohnnyMast: then read this.
[08:16] <Treenaks> JohnnyMast: then be enlightened
[08:17] <dholbach> /usr/share/debhelper/dh_make/licenses/gpl
[08:17] <dholbach> is a nice template
[08:17] <Treenaks> dholbach: that too :)
[08:17] <dholbach> guys, just use dh_make :)
[08:17] <Treenaks> dholbach: dholbach_make
[08:17] <dholbach> dh_make -b -c gpl
[08:18] <dholbach> cd bla*; rm *.ex *.EX dirs docs README.Debian
[08:18] <dholbach> and you can start working :)
[08:18] <slomo> or better create your own template for "standard" packages which just needs to be copied around ;)
[08:19] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: and replace "Read /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL"
[08:19] <JohnnyMast> ok
[08:19] <JohnnyMast> yes i noticed how they use that linein the template
[08:19] <Hieronymus> make it something on Debian systems
[08:20] <JohnnyMast> ??
[08:21] <Hieronymus> On Debian systems, ....
[08:21] <ajmitch> dholbach: when do you think you'll have this 'open day'?
[08:22] <dholbach> next year
[08:22] <ajmitch> ok
[08:22] <dholbach> we need to plan it, have cool ideas for it
[08:22] <dholbach> make it big
[08:22] <slomo> ajmitch: make in debian seems to be repaired :)
[08:22] <dholbach> invite everybody to the party :)
[08:23] <ajmitch> slomo: yes, I saw manoj had fixed it
[08:23] <ajmitch> dholbach: make sure it doesn't clash with anything else ;)
[08:23] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: Can you please use Homepage in the description in debian/control instead of HOMEPAGE?
[08:24] <ajmitch> jan 23rd-28th are out
[08:24] <ajmitch> I'll be fanboying jdub & sabdfl
[08:24] <ajmitch> (LCA)
[08:24] <slomo> ajmitch: ok, fine :)
[08:24] <JohnnyMast> i learned the home page from dholbach with kiwi
[08:24] <JohnnyMast> but okey good advise
[08:25] <ajmitch> like  Homepage: http://www.async.com.br/projects/kiwi/ ?
[08:25] <Hieronymus> ajmitch: yeah. Or are you supposed to shout about homepages?
[08:25] <ajmitch> no, I wouldn't SHOUT
[08:25] <dholbach> about good ones ;)
[08:25] <ajmitch> I don't even have homepage urls in my descriptions
[08:26] <JohnnyMast> http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/kiwi-0512011200/kiwi-1.9.2/debian/control
[08:26] <JohnnyMast> but i see now what i did wrong
[08:26] <dholbach> i think it's fancy to have it
[08:28] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: and you seem to have changed the LICENSE file of the original, but these don't get copied anyway, and it might be illegal/not legally safe to change it
[08:29] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus that was because of a litnian warning
[08:29] <JohnnyMast> but i will change that back + fix the control file and copyright file
[08:30] <JohnnyMast> after i finish my MOTU openday article that im gonna post as ref for the meeting tomorrow
[08:30] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: you'd do better to contact upstream about that if lintian gave an error
[08:31] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus the whole open source world should be notified about it
[08:32] <JohnnyMast> because did you know the address of the foundation changed ?
[08:33] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: no
[08:33] <JohnnyMast> thats what i mean
[08:34] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: but changing it in the LICENSE file is pointless and probably illegal
[08:38] <JohnnyMast> well Hieronymus dont wurry m going to change it back
[08:38] <JohnnyMast> mind enuming the points of atention ?
[08:39] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: ehm, repeat that?
[08:39] <JohnnyMast> the litle points you talked about
[08:39] <ajmitch> morning Kyral
[08:39] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: okay. 1: don't change LICENSE, as it's pointless and probably illegal
[08:40] <Hieronymus> 2: in debian/control, change HOMEPAGE to Homepage
[08:40] <Hieronymus> 3: fix debian/copyright
[08:40] <Kyral> ajmitch: Actually I just got done coding too much PHP ;p;
[08:41] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus thanks for that
[08:41] <Kyral> Oh anyone know whats on the MOTUSchool docket for this weekend?
[08:42] <JohnnyMast> im writing about MOTU school now
[08:42] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: oh, and is PKG-INFO actually going to be installed? (I'm not really sure what it is/does)
[08:42] <dholbach> i added a quick line to the bug day announce :-/
[08:42] <Kyral> I mean what the lesson is
[08:42] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus nope its not going to be installed
[08:42] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: then don't change it, as that's pointless
[08:43] <JohnnyMast> its part of the source package
[08:43] <LaserJock> dholbach: good
[08:43] <JohnnyMast> its an info file
[08:43] <JohnnyMast> it cant display wrong info
[08:43] <Kyral> Host 'NebulaPeace', running Linux 2.6.15-6-386 - Cpu0: Intel 2193 MHz; Up: 1:42; Users: 2; Load: 0.06; Free: [Mem: 25/243 Mio]  [Swap: 714/714 Mio]  [/: 22758/27465 Mio] ; Vpenis: 26 cm;
[08:43] <Kyral> Hostname: NebulaPeace - OS: Linux 2.6.15-6-386/i686 - CPU: Intel(R) Celeron(R) (2193.155 MHz) - Processes: 43 - Uptime: 1h 42m - Load Average: 0.06 - Memory Usage: 69.20MB/242.70MB (28.51%) - Disk Usage: 3.23GB/26.94GB (12.00%)
[08:43] <Kyral> oops wrong chan
[08:43] <Kyral> soryr guys
[08:44] <Kyral> I meant to fire it into the Forums channel
[08:45] <raphink> Riddell: I modified kubuntu-grub-splashimages
[08:46] <Riddell> raphink: how so?
[08:46] <raphink> the Architecture stuff
[08:47] <raphink> I used the grub entry in control
[08:47] <raphink> I mean the Architecure field from the grub package
[08:47] <Riddell> raphink: yeah, I approved it :)
[08:47] <Riddell> raphink: although actually I need to reboot to make sure it really works
[08:47] <raphink> Riddell: I get lintian warning doing so though
[08:47] <Riddell> bah, nobody listens to lintian
[08:47] <raphink> oki
[08:47] <raphink> ;)
[08:47] <slomo> raphink: which warning?
[08:48] <raphink> several people tested it already ;)
[08:48] <Kyral> hmm, which dir does debian/postinst work in while its being run?
[08:48] <raphink> slomo: architectures unknown
[08:48] <raphink> slomo: because in grub there's darwin-, hurd-, etc. archs
[08:48] <raphink> so I kept them
[08:48] <slomo> raphink: oh ok... ignore it then :)
[08:48] <Riddell> I was a bit surprised to see openbsd in there
[08:48] <raphink> no reason why my package shouldn't work on darwin-i386 or hurd-i386
[08:49] <raphink> I did slomo :)
[08:49] <slomo> but what about architecture all?
[08:49] <raphink> Riddell: well there's a debian openbsd I believe... even kfreebsd
[08:49] <raphink> I've seen a guy use Debian Kfreebsd as his main distro
[08:49] <raphink> slomo: no, PPC don't use grub
[08:49] <raphink> it's only i386 and amd
[08:50] <slomo> raphink: so it's not installable because there is no grub for ppc... problem solved ;)
[08:50] <raphink> s/amd/amd64/
[08:50] <raphink> slomo: Riddell thought I shouldn't use all
[08:50] <raphink> I guess because the machine would generate a package for ppc
[08:50] <raphink> so the package would be there as _all
[08:50] <raphink> but not installable
[08:50] <raphink> there would be a dead dependency
[08:50] <raphink> and I think he wants to avoid that ;)
[08:51] <slomo> ok, accepted :)
[08:51] <raphink> ooh nice party hat jdong :)
[08:51] <jdong> while blindly ignoring the financial side of the situation :)
[08:51] <jdong> just got my acceptance letter from MIT
[08:52] <raphink> oh great :)
[08:52] <Kyral> lol
[08:52] <slomo> congrats jdong :)
[08:52] <Kyral> nice knowing you JDong
[08:52] <\sh> jdong: are you assembling the 100$ laptops for mako?
[08:52] <jdong> \sh: that'd be cool to do :)
[08:52] <jdong> still have not made up my mind yet where I want to go....
[08:52] <raphink> yep :)
[08:52] <Kyral> Free laptops for the Ubuntu members :D
[08:52] <jdong> LOL
[08:52] <jdong> that'd be nice
[08:53] <raphink> that'd be really cool :)
[08:53] <raphink> yeah :)
[08:53] <jdong> now, need to find money.....
[08:53] <\sh> jdong: quanter is doing that :)
[08:53] <raphink> free $100 laptops with ubuntu on them :)
[08:53] <slomo> i don't need a second one... better give me a mac mini ;)
[08:53] <raphink> LOOOOL
[08:53] <raphink> slomo: if you have a laptop you don't use, think of me ... :s
[08:54] <Kyral> I could use a laptop for test things
[08:54] <Kyral> I mean another one lol
[08:54] <Kyral> I'm using a 3 year old Inspirion 1100 right now as a glorified PDA :D
[08:55] <raphink> hehe
[08:55] <Kyral> which is what I am on right now actually
[08:56] <Kyral> armed with my Ethernet cable, Wifi-Detector, and a bunch of extendable cables, I will never have use a Windows Machine AGAIN! Mwahahaha!
[08:56] <jdong> lol
[08:56] <LaserJock> so a PDA with IRC
[08:56] <Kyral> and a 30 GB HD...
[08:56] <Kyral> 2.2 Ghz Celly
[08:56] <jdong> hey, I'd love a PDA with IRC...... free.....
[08:57] <jdong> if Bram Cohen ever figures out how to torrent hardware... I think I'll waive my rights to a jury trial to use his software :)
[08:57] <Kyral> It doesn't outperform my desktop by any stretch, but with Flux on it, it moves :D
[08:57] <Kyral> except in boot time
[08:57] <Kyral> this puppy boots in 14 seconds flat
[08:58] <jdong> Kyral: I remember my ultra-moded Gentoo
[08:58] <raphink> Riddell: I'm using cdbs for knmap. SHouldn't it generate the .pot file automatically?
[08:58] <jdong> good times....
[08:59] <Kyral> jdong: I just used sysv-init-perl (or something like that) and ripped out all the bootservices I didn't need
[08:59] <JohnnyMast> MOTU day proposal !! www.rosiello.net/ubuntu/
[08:59] <jdong> Kyral: I just had an overglorified initrd setup :)
[09:00] <Kyral> lol
[09:00] <raphink> Riddell: you there?
[09:00] <Kyral> but you have to admit, dropping it down from 35 secs to 14 is damn nice :D
[09:01] <jdong> Kyral: yeah, especially on a laptop
[09:01] <Kyral> my desktop actually takes longer...
[09:01] <jdong> I still find Hoary more suitable for getting speed on low-ends
[09:01] <Kyral> but then again its checking a lot more
[09:01] <raphink> JohnnyMast: by teachers, you mean lecturers or mentors ?
[09:01] <Kyral> Dapper + Fluxbox
[09:01] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: could we have that on the wiki?
[09:01] <jdong> Kyral: LOL
[09:01] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: reviewed your package
[09:02] <JohnnyMast> dholbach lecture ppl like what ajmich did
[09:02] <Kyral> Fluxbox I love :D
[09:02] <JohnnyMast> and just mentor like teachers
[09:02] <Kyral> I dumped XFCE in favor for it on my Desktop
[09:03] <JohnnyMast> dholbach what do you think ?
[09:03] <Riddell> raphink: hi
[09:03] <Riddell> raphink: yes, but you need the patch
[09:03] <raphink> Riddell: hmm hi ... we've been talking a few minutes ago ...
[09:03] <LaserJock> Kyral: dapper+openbox would be better >:)
[09:03] <raphink> Riddell: why do I need the patch?
[09:03] <Riddell> raphink: sorry, my computer spontaniously rebooted :)
[09:04] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: the problem is, that we need people who do it
[09:04] <raphink> oooh I need to patch cdbs ?
[09:04] <Riddell> raphink: to set $kdepotpath correctly in admin/cvs.sh
[09:04] <Riddell> raphink: no, patch admin/cvs.sh
[09:04] <raphink> hmm
[09:04] <JohnnyMast> dholbach create a new team
[09:04] <raphink> hmm ok
[09:04] <raphink> so I just add the patch to patches/ in debian/ and that should do it, no?
[09:04] <JohnnyMast> i would like to help but im not @ubuntu.com
[09:04] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: the people are the problem, not the team :)
[09:04] <JohnnyMast> no its not
[09:05] <JohnnyMast> at least not to beginners
[09:05] <JohnnyMast> because laser could drive those crazy with what he knows
[09:05] <JohnnyMast> also raphink is a good hand
[09:05] <dholbach> we should discuss it and we'd see, what the team says
[09:05] <JohnnyMast> Kyral as well
[09:06] <JohnnyMast> yes its just basic talk not about "how to review" because thats for the MOTU`s there selfs
[09:07] <JohnnyMast> could you put it in the topic of the meeting channel ? im not sure if im abled to be there during the meeting
[09:08] <Kyral> hmmmwhat?
[09:09] <JohnnyMast> Kyral to be a teacher
[09:09] <JohnnyMast> Kyral http://www.rosiello.net/ubuntu/
[09:15] <ajmitch> the 'lessons' need more interaction
[09:15] <raphink> yes
[09:15] <raphink> I was thinking of using a graphical support
[09:16] <raphink> such as slides on a website
[09:16] <raphink> the lecturer could control what slide is being viewed as he talks
[09:16] <raphink> just as when you give a conference
[09:16] <raphink> and then I think the way questions are asked was not very friendly
[09:17] <JohnnyMast> remote desktop controle to the "big ubuntu vnc" server
[09:17] <raphink> I reckon it's not easy to deal with questions on a chat lecture
[09:17] <ajmitch> we do what we can
[09:17] <raphink> sure ajmitch, just reporting comments :)
[09:17] <raphink> don't take it personaly
[09:26] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus, ping
[09:28] <raphink> Riddell: configure is one of the files that need to be removed in debian/rules ... but if I run debuild -S -sa and then try to build the .dsc, configure is not there anymore ... so I can't build
[09:29] <raphink> Riddell: I added the rm -f in the clean:: rule though :s
[09:29] <ajmitch> raphink: why would configure need to be removed?
[09:29] <raphink> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1076
[09:29] <ajmitch> if you need to get it back, re-run autoconf before calling ./configure again
[09:29] <raphink> see the comment from the 22nd of november
[09:30] <ajmitch> which means build-depends, evil hacks, etc
[09:30] <raphink> yes
[09:30] <ajmitch> ugh, massive diff :)
[09:30] <Nafallo> Unpacking gnokii (from .../gnokii_0.6.8-0.2_amd64.deb) ...
[09:30] <Nafallo> /var/lib/dpkg/tmp.ci/preinst: line 6: /usr/sbin/addgroup: No such file or directory
[09:30] <Nafallo> wtf? :-P
[09:30] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: pong!
[09:30] <raphink> ajmitch: this package depends on automake anyway anyway
[09:31] <JohnnyMast> Hieronymus i uploaded a new version
[09:31] <ajmitch> raphink: yes, but you never call automake or autoconf
[09:31] <ajmitch> unless kde.mk does so
[09:31] <raphink> so I shall use the autoconf.mk
[09:31] <raphink> ?
[09:31] <LaserJock> could I get somebody to look at some dbg output at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/5761 real quick?
[09:31] <ajmitch> raphink: maybe. I haven't used it so I don't know :)
[09:31] <JohnnyMast> looking
[09:32] <raphink> let's see
[09:32] <raphink> I'll try something else
[09:32] <raphink> having it depend on automake1.9 instead of 1.6 since this is thel ast version
[09:32] <raphink> isn't there a package for automake that would always depend on the last version?
[09:32] <slomo> always the last version is evil
[09:33] <slomo> depend on and use a version you know which works
[09:33] <ajmitch> slomo++
[09:33] <slomo> and the autotools cdbs class can do the rebuilding of the stuff for you... but i can't remember the options currently ;)
[09:33] <raphink> slomo: I was told 1.9 works fine
[09:33] <slomo> try it and when it works fine use it :)
[09:34] <ajmitch> LaserJock: talk to dholbach about yelp
[09:34] <raphink> well it seems using automake1.9 solves the pb though
[09:35] <LaserJock> dholbach: ping?
[09:35] <raphink> ooh stupid me
[09:35] <raphink> lol
[09:35] <ajmitch> hopefully dholbach isn't asleep yet :)
[09:35] <ajmitch> raphink: ?
[09:35] <raphink> nm
[09:35] <raphink> hehe
[09:35] <slomo> rajasun: DEB_AUTO_UPDATE_X where X = AUTOCONF, AUTOMAKE, LIBTOOL, ACLOCAL
[09:35] <raphink> ajmitch: nm
[09:35] <ajmitch> please enlighten the rest of us
[09:35] <slomo> raphink: set the ones you need to true
[09:37] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: what's the massive ttb script doing in the .diff.gz? And you haven't fixed anything, have you, or am I looking at the wrong version?
[09:37] <JohnnyMast> i think ur looking @ the wrong one
[09:37] <ajmitch> anything that is built when compiling the package or just building it, shouldn't need to be in the diff
[09:38] <Hieronymus> JohnnyMast: link?
[09:38] <JohnnyMast> ok
[09:38] <JohnnyMast> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1164
[09:38] <ajmitch> still a 32k diff
[09:39] <Hieronymus> http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/ttb-0512141530/ttb_0.9.4-1ubuntu1.diff.gz
[09:39] <Hieronymus> the whole ttb program is in the diff I think
[09:39] <ajmitch>  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1164
[09:39] <ajmitch> sigh
[09:39] <ajmitch> --- ttb-0.9.4.orig/build/scripts-2.4/ttb
[09:39] <ajmitch> +++ ttb-0.9.4/build/scripts-2.4/ttb
[09:39] <Hieronymus> +++ ttb-0.9.4/build/scripts-2.4/ttb
[09:39] <JohnnyMast> yes its the main pytion script
[09:39] <ajmitch> you aren't removing build/ in clean?
[09:39] <JohnnyMast> now how did it het there
[09:39] <ajmitch> JohnnyMast: you forgot to remove it
[09:39] <JohnnyMast> *sike*
[09:39] <JohnnyMast> oops
[09:40] <ajmitch> the clean target is quite empty
[09:40] <JohnnyMast> added
[09:43] <JohnnyMast> dholbach , ping
[09:43] <dholbach> ajmitch, LaserJock, JohnnyMast: on the phone
[09:44] <JohnnyMast> alright
[09:44] <JohnnyMast> ajmitch i found the MOTU theme song
[09:45] <JohnnyMast> ajmitch http://www.rosiello.net/downloads/13%20-%20Princes%20of%20the%20Universe.ogg
[09:46] <ajmitch> that's nice
[09:46] <JohnnyMast> well some one listen see if we all agree
[09:46] <raphink> slomo: where shall I set these flags ?
[09:47] <raphink> in the beginning right?
[09:47] <ajmitch> dholbach: archived another upload of yours on revu :)
[09:47] <slomo> raphink: yes
[09:47] <raphink> DEB_AUTO_UPDATE_AUTOCONF = true
[09:47] <raphink> doesn't work
[09:48] <LaserJock> JohnnyMast: cool, I do like the intro
[09:48] <JohnnyMast> me 2
[09:48] <raphink> maybe it's automake
[09:48] <JohnnyMast> we are the princes of the univerce:)
[09:48] <ajmitch> sounds worrying
[09:48] <raphink> oh no
[09:48] <raphink> DEB_AUTO_UPDATE_AUTOCONF = true
[09:48] <raphink> oop
[09:49] <raphink> DEB_AUTO_UPDATE_AUTOMAKE = 1.6
[09:49] <raphink> I think
[09:49] <slomo> raphink: oh, yes... sorry :) but you probably need automake, autoconf, aclocal
[09:51] <raphink> slomo: I use DEB_AUTO_UPDATE_AUTOCONF
[09:51] <JohnnyMast> LaserJock there is also a ghotic like part ... i like that part
[09:51] <raphink> and it says : missing separator
[09:52] <slomo> raphink: use google or look at the makefile :) i can't remember how to use it, i only saw it once in another package and don't use it myself somewhere
[09:52] <raphink> ok
[09:54] <ajmitch> hm
[09:54] <ajmitch> I think we need to email people who have packages on REVU
[09:54] <ajmitch> I don't know if comments that people add are emailed out automatically, are they?
[09:55] <slomo> no
[09:55] <ajmitch> so there are people who uploaded back in october or earlier, who have had recent comments
[10:00] <minghua> I was actually thinking that we need a list like debian-mentors
[10:00] <ajmitch> minghua: possibly
[10:01] <minghua> and if REVU are only used for new ubuntu packages from now on, it won't hurt to send such RFS requests to said list
[10:01] <minghua> and if ubunut-motu list is not busy, it can be used for this purpose
[10:02] <ajmitch> we have the motureviewers list
[10:04] <ajmitch> oh dear, launchpad UI had changed again
[10:04] <ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/people/motureviewers
[10:04] <JohnnyMast> pygtk == python-gtk2  right ?
[10:05] <minghua> JohnnyMast: yes, if pygtk > 2.0 :-)
[10:05] <JohnnyMast> ok thanks
[10:05] <dholbach> ajmitch: thanks
[10:05] <dholbach> LaserJock: yelp?
[10:05] <dholbach> JohnnyMast: nice :)
[10:06] <JohnnyMast> yeah you liked it ? cool
[10:07] <ajmitch> JohnnyMast: why is malone 4811 still pending upload?
[10:07] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #4811: phpmyadmin.prerm: line 12: db_get: command not found In: phpmyadmin (Ubuntu), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: MOTU Reviewers Team, Status: PendingUpload https://launchpad.net/bugs/4811
[10:07] <JohnnyMast> good question
[10:08] <JohnnyMast> yeah :( i did my best on it
[10:08] <ajmitch> it just required some knowledge of an evil system called yada
[10:08] <ajmitch> rather than relying on the workaround that people suggested
[10:09] <ajmitch> yada is really *evil*
[10:09] <JohnnyMast> i was thinking of repack it
[10:09] <ajmitch> do *not* do that
[10:10] <ajmitch> there's no way we'd approve that upload, no matter how broken yada is ;)
[10:10] <LaserJock> dholbach: yelp crashes for me dbg output at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/5761
[10:10] <dholbach> LaserJock: which version is it?
[10:11] <LaserJock> dholbach: of yelp, the latest in dapper
[10:11] <LaserJock> dholbach: but it doesn't do it in a dapper chroot
[10:11] <dholbach> anything strange in the terminal output?
[10:11] <LaserJock> dholbach: I tried creating another user and it does the same thing
[10:11] <LaserJock> dholbach: no
[10:12] <LaserJock> dholbach: I just get a dialog box that says the yelp has quit unexpectedly
[10:12] <dholbach> you just started it?
[10:13] <LaserJock> dholbach: yes, anything I do with yelp is the same
[10:13] <dholbach> could you try to follow the steps on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash and send the backtrace?
[10:13] <Tonio_> hi again
[10:13] <ajmitch> JohnnyMast: another thing, use -Xubuntu1 rather than -XUubuntu1 in debdiffs :)
[10:13] <LaserJock> dholbach: yeah
[10:13] <dholbach> cool
[10:14] <Tonio_> anyone know the process to get in a translation group in launchpa ?
[10:14] <Tonio_> simply email the group's responsible ?
[10:14] <JohnnyMast> ajmitch Ubuntu was in phpmyadmin?
[10:14] <ajmitch> JohnnyMast: mgp, malone 3197
[10:14] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #3197: AbiWord grammar checker does not get installed In: abiword (Ubuntu), Severity: Wishlist, Assigned to: Ubuntu GNOME Team, Status: New https://launchpad.net/bugs/3197
[10:14] <ajmitch> hm
[10:14] <ajmitch> 3297
[10:14] <ajmitch> you also had wron bug number in changelog :)
[10:15] <ajmitch> malone 3297
[10:15] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #3297: mgp puts binaries in /usr/X11R6/bin, which is not in the default $PATH In: mgp (Ubuntu), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: MOTU Reviewers Team, Status: PendingUpload https://launchpad.net/bugs/3297
[10:15] <raphink> doesn't work :(
[10:16] <ajmitch> JohnnyMast: also, /usr/X11/bin doesn't even seem to exist on my box
[10:17] <JohnnyMast> at the time i was on that bug, i worked on breezy wich had that dir(if i remember correctly)
[10:17] <ajmitch> and you know now that we do all fixes for dapper )
[10:18] <ajmitch> :)
[10:18] <JohnnyMast> yeah hehe
[10:24] <LaserJock> dholbach: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/5765
[10:25] <dholbach> LaserJock: gecko_prefs_set_string() - nothing funny, if you start yelp from the terminal?
[10:25] <ajmitch> Kyral: comments on easychem on REVU
[10:26] <LaserJock> dholbach: what do you mean? I get nothing if I start from terminal, just error dialog
[10:26] <dholbach> nothing in the terminal?
[10:26] <LaserJock> no
[10:26] <dholbach> hrm
[10:27] <dholbach> but it seems to be the same issue as Nafallo had
[10:27] <dholbach> you might get this output:
[10:27] <LaserJock> dholbach: seems weird to me that it works fine in my chroot
[10:27] <dholbach> Nafallo nafallo@darkelf:~ $ strace yelp 2&> tmp/yelp
[10:27] <dholbach> Nafallo nafallo@darkelf:~ $ grep nspr tmp/yelp
[10:27] <dholbach> Nafallo open("/usr/lib/libnspr4.so", O_RDONLY)  = 3
[10:27] <dholbach> no, that's accurate
[10:28] <dholbach> must be /usr/lib/libnspr4.so vs /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/bla/something/libnspr4.so
[10:28] <ajmitch> yay
[10:28] <Kyral> ajmitch: what should I do about that? Get rid of debian/copyright?
[10:28] <ajmitch> more nastiness
[10:28] <ajmitch> Kyral: crazy idea
[10:28] <LaserJock> dholbach: "open("/usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/libnspr4.so", O_RDONLY) = 3" is what I get
[10:28] <dholbach> in the chroot?
[10:29] <LaserJock> no
[10:29] <ajmitch> Kyral: upstream should learn how to properly apply the GPL to their source ;)
[10:29] <Kyral> how is that my problem? ;P
[10:29] <dholbach> LaserJock: you could have different outputs in both cases
[10:29] <LaserJock> dholbach: I get nothing in the chroot
[10:29] <ajmitch> Kyral: debian/copyright should reflect what the source has
[10:29] <Kyral> ajmitch: Ah...so I should..?
[10:30] <ajmitch> ie, the source doesn't state (or any later version)
[10:30] <dholbach> oh hm wlel
[10:30] <dholbach> that's weird also
[10:30] <dholbach> LaserJock: could you file a bug on yelp with that information?
[10:30] <ajmitch> Kyral: I'm just trying to minimise the chances of elmo rejecting based on license issues
[10:30] <dholbach> the trace and the version and everything?
[10:30] <Kyral> ajmitch: ah...
[10:30] <LaserJock> dholbach: sure, I just wanted to know if it was just me ;-)
[10:30] <dholbach> LaserJock: you rock
[10:30] <dholbach> thank you
[10:30] <ajmitch> Kyral: I'd like to see it in, really :)
[10:31] <Kyral> ...but it says GPL in the COPYing...
[10:32] <ajmitch> Kyral: yes, and the COPYING file says how to apply it
[10:32] <ajmitch> Kyral: upstream is meant to state if they want to use GPL 2 or later
[10:32] <ajmitch> most people don't actually read the GPL :)
[10:33] <Kyral> ah....so in copyright I should state GPL2?
[10:33] <ajmitch> in copyright you might need to have the text that upstream uses
[10:33] <ajmitch> referring to /usr/share...
[10:33] <Kyral> cat COPYING >> debian/copyright
[10:34] <ajmitch> and you'll get smacked down
[10:34] <Kyral> lol
[10:34] <Kyral> Good to know
[10:34] <ajmitch> see http://ftp-master.debian.org/REJECT-FAQ.html
[10:34] <ajmitch> Common license : Do not include a license that is in /usr/share/common-licenses into your debian/copyright. That's a waste of space.
[10:35] <ajmitch> there are a number of good tips in there
[10:35] <ajmitch> which wiki page should link to this? :)
[10:36] <Kyral> Yah no kiddin
[10:37] <ajmitch> at minimum, remove the 'or later version' from debian/copyright
[10:37] <LaserJock> ajmitch: I'm going to bookmark that for the Packaging Guide ;-)
[10:37] <ajmitch> that will probably make it ok for upload
[10:37] <Kyral> ah
[10:37] <ajmitch> LaserJock: great
[10:37] <Kyral> I wonder if I should wait until my @ubuntu.com goes live
[10:38] <Kyral> LJ yours work yet?
[10:38] <LaserJock> don't know, I doubt it
[10:39] <LaserJock> do you have to put something in URL when reporting a bug on bugzilla?
[10:43] <raphink> slomo: I've set the flags... debuild fails with http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/464331
[10:43] <raphink> then if I try to run automake manually, I get http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/464332
[10:44] <raphink> indeed aclocal is missing, although I've set it
[10:44] <slomo> looks like a too old automake...
[10:44] <slomo> use 1.9 as you said before
[10:45] <slomo> for automake and aclocal... for autoconf 2.59
[10:45] <raphink> hmm ok I'll try
[10:45] <ajmitch> ah, jdong
[10:45] <Kyral> JDong
[10:45] <jdong> hey
[10:45] <minghua> hi jdong, I have a question for you
[10:45] <jdong> sure
[10:46] <LaserJock> dholbach: bugzilla 21015
[10:46] <minghua> jdong: what is the policy for breezy-backports with modified source now?
[10:46] <dholbach> LaserJock: thanks
[10:46] <jdong> minghua: currently no mod sources
[10:46] <raphink> I can't set the version for autoconf but I have 2.59 on my comp slomo
[10:46] <raphink> slomo: as of automake/aclocal, I get the same error with 1.9
[10:46] <minghua> jdong: due to the libstdc++ allocator transition, scim can't be backported from dapper as is
[10:46] <jdong> minghua: yes, I've heard that one
[10:47] <jdong> minghua: I've been toying with this idea: http://ubuntubackports.org/wiki/index.php/SourceChanges
[10:47] <minghua> jdong: that means no scim backports, but I'm okay with that
[10:47] <jdong> minghua: correct; currently it'd mean no backport
[10:47] <minghua> jdong: just to know the status, and I'll spread the words
[10:47] <jdong> minghua: likewise with some other packages with these disappointingly small changes necessary.... :)
[10:48] <jdong> minghua: perhaps teach them how to (responsibly) build a backport of it themselves? ;)
[10:48] <slomo> raphink: *sigh* ugly autotools... what happens when you run autoreconf by hand?
[10:48] <raphink> slomo: seems it works if I run `make -f Makefile.cvs' manually then automake && autoconf
[10:48] <minghua> jdong: both ubuntu-ja and ubuntu-zh has their own backported repos, so I'll probably collaborate with one of them
[10:49] <jdong> minghua: cool, sounds very appropriate
[10:49] <slomo> raphink: what das Makefile.cvs do?
[10:49] <raphink> no idea
[10:49] <slomo> look at it ;)
[10:49] <minghua> jdong: as currently the backporting required modifying source package (c2a back to c2), it's probably not for ordinary user :-)
[10:49] <raphink> hmmm
[10:49] <raphink> sure
[10:50] <jdong> minghua: :-/, depends on the definition of 'ordinary user' ;)
[10:50] <slomo> raphink: btw, aclocal should be called first iirc... then autoconf, then automake
[10:50] <minghua> jdong: okay thanks for your time, I'll update the thread on backport forum
[10:50] <raphink> I tried that slomo, but it doesnt change anything, it's just setting variables, not calling subs
[10:50] <jdong> against my better judgement, I shall backport xfsprogs on my system :)
[10:50] <jdong> minghua: np, thanks for checking with me
[10:51] <raphink> slomo: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/464341
[10:51] <slomo> raphink: ah... kde magic? wonderfull... better ask someone with kde knowledge then ;) whatever this stuff in admin does
[10:51] <raphink> slomo: so it runs admin/Makefile.common
[10:52] <slomo> raphink: yes, what does it do?
[10:52] <raphink> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/464343
[10:54] <raphink> so it calls cvs.sh
[10:54] <raphink> to build the files
[10:54] <ajmitch> oh nasty kde build systems
[10:54] <Kyral> lol
[10:54] <raphink> http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/464345
[10:55] <raphink> that's what is says when building
[10:55] <Kyral> ajmitch: I fixed the copyright file. should show up in REVU soon
[10:55] <raphink> running
[10:55] <ajmitch> Kyral: cool
[10:55] <ajmitch> hey siretart
[10:55] <ajmitch> ah, that was just netsplit join, hopefully he is actually around
[10:56] <slomo> raphink: actually no idea... autotools themself are annoying enough sometimes but the kde buildsystem is even worse... look in the kde cdbs class if there's some variable to set for regeneration of everything you need...
[10:56] <raphink> slomo: do you think I could call that in the prebuild, instead of using the _UPDATE_ flgas ?
[10:56] <Kyral> Why can't people just use Makefiles?
[10:56] <slomo> raphink: sure
[10:57] <raphink> I'll do that then
[10:57] <raphink> it's faster
[10:57] <slomo> Kyral: because autotools are more confortable if you use them sane ;)
[10:57] <slomo> raphink: but be carefull with the versions
[10:57] <Kyral> slomo: or Autotools ;P
[10:57] <raphink> sure
[10:57] <Kyral> slomo: I meant instead of these insane things like Scons and xmkpf or whatever it is
[10:57] <seth_k|lappy> slomo, you looked at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1070 once before, do you think you could have time to do it once more sometime?
[10:58] <Kyral> Yah it hit REVU
[10:58] <slomo> seth_k|lappy: sure... i'll add it to my todo list... but i can't promise anything until the weekend ;)
[10:58] <Kyral> now I need slomo to advocate again ;P
[10:59] <seth_k|lappy> slomo, no problems... just whenever you get a chance :D
[10:59] <slomo> Kyral: url please
[10:59] <raphink> seems to work
[10:59] <Kyral> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1166
[11:00] <slomo> Kyral: while you're at it... consider using dpatch or improve your patchsystem ;)
[11:00] <ajmitch> hehe
[11:00] <Kyral> I don't know any other way
[11:00] <ajmitch> so learn, or be creative
[11:00] <Kyral> What the hell do you think I was doing during the lesson on Patching?
[11:01] <ajmitch> I mean improving on what \sh taught
[11:01] <slomo> Kyral: np, it works... but it's really a bit fragile ;) consider looking at a package which uses dpatch... hmm, ajmitch, name one :)
[11:01] <ajmitch> don't ask me :P
[11:02] <seth_k|lappy> ajmitch, I swear swear swear noteedit is sane this time; care to peek? https://launchpad.net/bugs/5577
[11:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug #5577: noteedit: merge new debian version In: noteedit (Ubuntu), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: MOTU Merge Team, Status: PendingUpload https://launchpad.net/bugs/5577
[11:02] <seth_k|lappy> slomo, when should one use cdbs vs. dpatch? or is it a preference thing
[11:03] <ajmitch> seth_k|lappy: you can use dpatch with cdbs
[11:03] <ajmitch> since cdbs doesn't specify a patch system
[11:03] <slomo> Kyral: ah, i have one... mono uses dpatch ;)
[11:03] <ajmitch> seth_k|lappy: asking me to review a kde package?
[11:03] <slomo> cdbs even has a nice include for using dpatch
[11:03] <ajmitch> \sh is really a better person to ask if he's around
[11:03] <seth_k|lappy> alrighty
[11:03] <minghua> I use dpatch exclusively
[11:04] <ajmitch> slomo: you'd reject a package just because it *doesn't* use dpatch?
[11:04] <Kyral> My first priortity is that a package installs sanely
[11:04] <Kyral> and works as advertised
[11:04] <Kyral> once thats done I can clean up the debian dir
[11:04] <slomo> ajmitch: nope... that was a suggestion, no must :)
[11:05] <minghua> hey ajmitch, dpatch is not _that_ bad...
[11:05] <seth_k|lappy> wait, if cdbs doesn't specify a patch system, what manner of voodoo is cdbs-edit-patch? I use that normally, but I worked on a package last week that used dpatch and then I used dpatch-edit-patch, so I assumed cdbs had its own patch system.
[11:05] <Kyral> in Linux voodoo usually has something to do with Bash Scripting and sed
[11:06] <ajmitch> seth_k|lappy: cdbs includes an example, called simple-patchsys
[11:06] <ajmitch> it also has support for quilt & dpatch
[11:06] <slomo> ajmitch: in fact i already advocated it before ;)
[11:06] <ajmitch> slomo: I know
[11:07] <sivang> simple-patchsys doesn't require you have a 00list of patches,
[11:07] <sivang> but rather on dictionary sorting of patches filenames to form order in application? ( ajmitch ?)
[11:07] <sivang> s/on/an/
[11:07] <ajmitch> sivang: I think so
[11:07] <slomo> but dpatch allows more customization... it's even possible to run 00list through a preprocessor before using it etc ;)
[11:07] <JohnnyMast> ajmitch in my revu am i allowed to code an own setup.py ?
[11:08] <ajmitch> JohnnyMast: depends on how crackful it is
[11:08] <sivang> slomo: right, so you get many gnome stuff using this (as I've seen)
[11:08] <minghua> so in simple-patchsys is there any way to have a patch but not applied (for backport purpose, for example)?
[11:08] <\sh> seth_k|lappy: cdbs works with simple patch sys..which means normal diffs...it adjusted dpatch-edit-patch to cdbs-edit-patch
[11:08] <ajmitch> minghua: nope, it's only a simple system
[11:08] <Kyral> I've done it again
[11:08] <minghua> ajmitch: sure, fair enough.  but I think I'll stick to dpatch for now :-)
[11:08] <\sh> but as we could see the last time..if someone is breaking cdbs ... nothing compiled anymore
[11:09] <Kyral> I've sparked a discussion on patch systems
[11:09] <seth_k|lappy> true
[11:09] <ajmitch> Kyral: easychem has a few build warnings
[11:09] <ajmitch> http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/easychem-0512011625/easychem_0.6-0ubuntu1.buildlog
[11:09] <Kyral> ajmitch: it does?
[11:09] <sivang> I thought setup.py is actualyl the "debhelper" of dist-utils, that you take a template and "override" the methods to run your own customization code, if to follow OOP
[11:09] <\sh> the rule but says...don't use a patch system at all, when there is no one...do your changes in the diff.gz
[11:09] <ajmitch> \sh: we're talking about a new package here
[11:10] <sivang> \sh: so that means manually diffing, and including all changes into the diff.gz , that will be applied by the debian/rules on build?
[11:10] <Kyral> I see newline warnings....
[11:10] <ajmitch> one with a patch systme learnt from the motu school :)
[11:10] <\sh> well...then I prefere diff and patch and debhelper :) so I know what i'm doing :)
[11:10] <ajmitch> Kyral: library.c:1: warning: ISO C forbids an empty source file
[11:10] <ajmitch> as well as string length warnings
[11:10] <sivang> ajmitch: he did? :-)
[11:11] <Kyral> so you want me to go fix them?
[11:11] <sivang> can I ask here autotools and gnu general project question guys? ;-)
[11:12] <sivang> slomo: btw, packages the follow that approch seem scary :)
[11:12] <sivang> slomo: (00list.in , install.in etc...)
[11:12] <slomo> sivang: sure... but i can't promise that i know the answer ;)
[11:13] <sivang> slomo: you know notify-send ?
[11:13] <sivang> slomo: (thank alot btw)
[11:13] <slomo> sivang: i know what it does... but that's it ;)
[11:14] <raphink> slomo: running `make -f Makefile.cvs' in pre-build:: works fine :)
[11:14] <dholbach> good night everybody
[11:14] <raphink> night dholbach :)
[11:14] <ajmitch> bye dholbach :)
[11:14] <slomo> gn8 dholbach :)
[11:14] <dholbach> night guys :)
[11:14] <sivang> night dholbach
[11:15] <LaserJock> good night dholbach
[11:15] <Kyral> noight dholbach
[11:15] <dholbach> :)
[11:16] <sivang> slomo: don't worry about it. a small CLI wrapper that uses libnotify
[11:17] <slomo> sivang: that's exactly what i know about it :P
[11:17] <sivang> slomo: all there is, but do you know if it supports some kind of callbacks? (I wasn't abel to find those by reading it man page)
[11:18] <slomo> sivang: callbacks for a CLI program? hm, i doubt it... (why don't you use the library itself?)
[11:18] <\sh> going again......I don't make it...watching harry potter
[11:18] <sivang> \sh: still feeling bad?
[11:18] <\sh> it's getting worse
[11:18] <\sh> 39.8 degree
[11:18] <sivang> \sh: oh man, I hope you get better soon
[11:18] <sivang> \sh: you need compresses
[11:19] <sivang> \sh: (cold ones)
[11:19] <\sh> not now....when it's going over 40..I had this before...:0
[11:19] <ajmitch> some 'medicinal' brandy?
[11:19] <sivang> yes, I think its in place
[11:19] <sivang> advil or so
[11:20] <sivang> slomo: ok, so I decided that I am going to use the library directly :)
[11:20] <Kyral> Again I get Jeff's voice in my head going "We do NOT have a drinking problem in this project!"
[11:20] <slomo> sivang: what are you doing btw? :)
[11:20] <sivang> slomo: exactly for those reasons, how do I start a C project that will have all the necesary foo, for using libnotify to produce 3-4 small binaries ? :-)
[11:21] <sivang> Kyral: were you in Montreal?
[11:21] <Kyral> sivang: bingo :D
[11:21] <Kyral> Only for the Love Day
[11:22] <sivang> Kyral: oh man, I didn't meet you nor knew who you are, and we talked quite some bits over IRC :)
[11:22] <Kyral> sivang: I know lol
[11:22] <sivang> slomo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HomeUserBackup
[11:22] <slomo> sivang: you mean the autotools magic required for that? well, as it's C you can probably take one of the millions of tutorials out there :)
[11:22] <Kyral> I met Mitch and dholbach and \sh...
[11:23] <sivang> Kyral: well, I'm not nearly as half handsome and charming as they are so I guess you didn't loose too much - but it would have been nice to meet :)
[11:23] <Kyral> sivang: indeed
[11:23] <Kyral> I cannot wait for the next conference
[11:23] <ajmitch> Mitch? who is Mitch? :P
[11:23] <Kyral> Wait...I hope I can arrange transportation lol
[11:23] <sivang> slomo: right. I though there was a quicker way like "you know what, this is a package I worked on - take it's auto-foo as a template and just reaplce yours" :-)
[11:24] <Kyral> ..damn tabcomplete dictionary
[11:24] <sivang> what is bonkers?
[11:24] <Kyral> I meant "bonk"
[11:24] <Kyral> tab complete took it though
[11:25] <sivang> slomo: anyway, will look for a tutorial :)
[11:25] <slomo> sivang: i have some started but never finished projects on my hdd... but today i would do many things different ;) but look for example at... hmm... thoggen and evince autotools stuff looked nice and clean iirc
[11:26] <sivang> slomo: how do you know what directives to use in configure.in ? AFAIK they change constantly :-/
[11:26] <sivang> and most intros appear old and out dated..
[11:27] <slomo> sivang: hmmm, if you don't have any idea look at millions of examples and extract what you need from them =)
[11:27] <sivang> slomo: right, I know - I'll use update-notifier :)
[11:28] <slomo> sivang: isn't it written in python?
[11:28] <sivang> slomo: nope, at least not according to what mvo told me. libnotify hasn't still seen a decent python binding lib
[11:28] <slomo> oh, yes... seems to be C :)
[11:29] <slomo> then it's a good example probably
[11:29] <sivang> slomo: I hope.thanks!
[11:29] <raphink> Riddell: all changes done
[11:30] <slomo> sivang: but when you have some more specified questions feel free to ask me :)
[11:30] <sivang> slomo: sure, thanks alot :)
[11:31] <slomo> np :)
[11:31] <slomo> good night everybody
[11:32] <raphink> nigth slomo
[11:32] <sivang> night slomo
[11:32] <raphink> thanks for your patience and advice
[11:54] <tseng> woo flight 2!
[11:55] <eruin> hey lads, do any of you know whether package md5sums are checked after download, before install?
[11:56] <ajmitch> I believe they are
[11:57] <eruin> that's good enough for me :)
[11:58] <eruin> I'm on a very fast, but very unstable connection
[11:59] <ajmitch> the Packages.gz has an md5sum per package
[11:59] <ajmitch> and Release is GPG_signed, with an md5sum of each Packages, Source, etc
[12:00] <ajmitch> bbl