[01:32] <jsgotangco> cheers
[02:54] <Velmont> I wonder, -- where did that nested new login-thing go?
[02:55] <Velmont> I want to log on to another computer via XDMCP, - but I want it nested in a window, not a new window for it.
[02:57] <lucasvo> Velmont: edubuntu doesn't use X forwarding...
[02:58] <lucasvo> ehm I mean XDMCP forwarding
[02:58] <Velmont> Thats not what I want.
[02:58] <Velmont> I want an client in a window, just like VNC
[02:59] <lucasvo> use Xnest
[03:00] <lucasvo> but I don't know how it works
[03:00] <Velmont> Before (well, i asked in the wrong chan :P) hoary had a menuoption for it... That is gone in Breezy.
[03:00] <lucasvo> yup
[03:01] <lucasvo> I don't know where one can find it :D
[03:01] <Velmont> matchbox-nest - graphical wrapper around xnest
[03:02] <Velmont> I can use that. - Looks right :] 
[04:10] <Lord_Athur> hi
[04:12] <mhz> Lord_Athur: hi there
[04:12] <Lord_Athur> hi mhz 
[04:12] <Lord_Athur> :D
[04:58] <mhz> neurogeek: feliz navidad!
[04:58] <neurogeek> mhz, feliz navidad para ti
[04:58] <neurogeek> mhz, how is it going??
[04:58] <Lord_Athur> mhz,  q te trajo el viejito?
[05:01] <Lord_Athur> what did san nicolas give you?
[05:01] <Lord_Athur> :D
[05:03] <mhz> Lord_Athur: just a t-shirt :)
[05:04] <mhz> neurogeek: it's ging well but my to-do list it getting too big
[05:04] <mhz> and my pocket too little :d
[05:04] <mhz> Yagisan: hey!!!
[05:04] <mhz> how's familiy?
[05:04] <Lord_Athur> the most important thing at chritmas (o como se escriba) is to be at home and with the family.
[05:04] <mhz> neurogeek: how are you and 'the boss'?
[05:05] <Yagisan> mhz: they are happy. lost interest in their gifts after about 20 seconds
[05:06] <neurogeek> mhz, everything good.. just yesterday returning from a trip to my in-laws.. 
[05:06] <neurogeek> mhz, im on vacations, so, i should be working on the moinmoin stuff
[05:09] <mhz> neurogeek: oh, cool
[05:09] <mhz> Yagisan: that happens :D
[05:34] <Yagisan> night all
[06:39] <Lord_Athur> mhz, 
[06:40] <Lord_Athur> are here?
[07:01] <mhz> re
[07:42] <newmember> I have installed this edu version, but there seems to be alot missing, I have setup ltsp many times and that was easier and there was more documentation, maybe this distro is not quite ready
[07:43] <mhz> newmember: welcome. Edubuntu is young, indeed but very good. LTSP we use is not LTSP standard, it is improved, actually, and LTSP 4.2 will adopt our changes. did you read InstallNotes before installing?
[07:44] <ogra_ibook> did you read the install notes wikipage ?
[07:44] <mhz> Many people have noticed they did wrong not reading tjhose notes, esp. if you are used to LTSP standard
[07:44] <newmember> hi everyone
[07:44] <neurogeek> ogra_ibook, hello.. how is your ibook going??
[07:44] <newmember> top of the season to you
[07:44] <ogra_ibook> the ltsp version we use is th eone ltsp.org is just adopting and will use as version 4.2
[07:45] <newmember> I read what I could see, I installed the the sercver version
[07:45] <mhz> .oO(oh, ogra did not read my answers ;)
[07:45] <ogra_ibook> neurogeek, very nice, including the airport extreme wlan :)
[07:46] <ogra_ibook> newmember, so you just hit enter on the cd prompt, right ? 
[07:46] <ogra_ibook> that sets up all stuff automatically
[07:46] <newmember> hmmm
[07:46] <newmember> I  typed server
[07:46] <ogra_ibook> newmember, see the wikipage mentioned in the topic and the release notes
[07:46] <neurogeek> ogra_ibook, good, im thinking to get one myself.. soon i hope..
[07:47] <newmember> crap
[07:47] <ogra_ibook> 'Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes'
[07:47] <newmember> let me try that again
[07:47] <newmember> I was ready something differnt than I was thinking
[07:47] <newmember> I was thining server=good idea
[07:47] <mhz> newmember: it happens :)
[07:47] <ogra_ibook> you only need to edit the /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf file post install any restart dhcpd and you are set
[07:48] <newmember> I santa was good to everyone
[07:48] <mhz> newmember: you can install edubuntu on top of your current 'server' install but I'd suggest you try reinstalling based on InstallNotes
[07:48] <newmember> I have it in a vmware season so it will only take a few min
[07:48] <ogra_ibook> newmember, i'm arguing with our CD guys about this since some time, i want it renamed to "minimal" for the next release... its a bit confusing
[07:49] <newmember> shouldnt agrue, discuss loudly
[07:50] <newmember> I still remember installing MS-SQL once the menu actually said "install without opening the manual"
[07:51] <ogra_ibook> heh, yes, thats one of my main targets ;) but we had to adopt this "server" thingie from ubuntu ...
[07:53] <ogra_ibook> the dapper CD already has a graphical selection menu instead of a prompt ... its far more obvious ... (but sadly still carries the word "server" in it)
[07:57] <ogra_ibook> ywhats wrong with the gfxboot menu ? 
[07:59] <mhz> ogra_ibook: nothing wrong. It's just I remember devel telling me I have to download InstallCD if my machines cannot boo into GUI
[07:59] <mhz> boot
[08:00] <ogra_ibook> thats totally different
[08:00] <mhz> which means, that for chile, all shipped CD's will be Live-Install CD
[08:00] <ogra_ibook> nope
[08:00] <mhz> and old boxes will need to donwload manually
[08:00] <mhz> nope?
[08:00] <ogra_ibook> the debian-installer used always the framebuffer
[08:01] <ogra_ibook> there is only a menu and a picture added
[08:01] <ogra_ibook> s/menu/graphical menu/
[08:02] <mhz> like Morphix?
[08:02] <ogra_ibook> the edubuntu liveCD would give you the workstation only install anyway ....
[08:02] <ogra_ibook> we wont make shippables from it ... if we press CDs, it will be install CDs
[08:03] <mhz> ogra_ibook: let me get this right...
[08:03] <ogra_ibook> not like morphix...
[08:03] <ogra_ibook> if we are able to get pressed CDs, be sure it wont be liveCDs ... 
[08:03] <mhz> Ubuntu CD's to be shipped will be LiveCd (you can install ONLY from X ?)
[08:03] <ogra_ibook> yes
[08:03] <mhz> that's my complaint
[08:03] <ogra_ibook> see which channel you are in here ;)
[08:04] <mhz> hehehe
[08:04] <ogra_ibook> i'm not talking about ubuntu 
[08:04] <mhz> i know 
[08:04] <mhz> sorry
[08:04] <mhz> I was mixing my complaint
[08:04] <ogra_ibook> ubuntu will only ship liveCDs, thats right
[08:04] <newmember> i was just reading about differnt distros for school in linuxformat.co.uk    why so many distros? why not work on one really  good one?
[08:05] <ogra_ibook> thats what we do here 
[08:05] <mhz> ogra_ibook: and Edubuntu will ship Install CD (which let's you install whatever)
[08:05] <mhz> newmember: ooops, many answers to that
[08:06] <ogra_ibook> mhz, yes, since the liveCD wouldnt give us the default install and i doubt mark wants to pay for more than one variant
[08:06] <mhz> newmember: what is good for you may not be good for everybody.
[08:06] <mhz> ogra_ibook: that is good. I dont complain about this second point.
[08:07] <mhz> my only complaint remains against the obligation of GUI
[08:07] <mhz> but that is for Ubuntu
[08:08] <ogra_ibook> so how would you solve it ? 
[08:09] <ogra_ibook> only ship half the amount and get angry users because we have to limit the amount for shipit CDs ?
[08:09] <mhz> nononon :D
[08:09] <newmember> I guess I just do not know enough about distros
[08:10] <mhz> make LiveCd include the non-GUI installer for those less fortunate who just dont have enough hardware to run X in Live mode
[08:10] <ogra_ibook> mhz, that doesnt work
[08:10] <mhz> newmember: there's a flavor for each need
[08:10] <ogra_ibook> at least not in 700MB
[08:11] <ogra_ibook> mhz, thats what the DVD offers
[08:11] <mhz> ogra_ibook: i know that's why I complain, it is just not fair. there are many old users with old hardware, esp. those who are going to try ubuntu for 1st time because XP wont run
[08:11] <mhz> but want to see it working and testing it
[08:12] <mhz> ogra_ibook: a DVD is not for them either
[08:12] <mhz> otherwise, probalby they would use XP
[08:12] <ogra_ibook> would you expect them to do a sever install and install stuff on top ? 
[08:12] <ogra_ibook> and configure everything manually? 
[08:13] <ogra_ibook> on a 400Mhz PIII with 256Mb ubuntu runs very nicely
[08:13] <mhz> ogra_ibook: nope, I would expect them to go to one of our UbuntuFests, get excited with linux, run home with the exact same CD they saw running Live on someoneelses hardware and press install
[08:14] <mhz> it's a sicological thing
[08:14] <mhz> they will use same CD they saw running
[08:14] <mhz> not a bit diff.
[08:15] <ogra_ibook> hmm, then i dont get your point 
[08:15] <mhz> ogra_ibook: current people I have seen with 400 MHz to 600 MHz have no more than 128 MB (tops, usually 96)
[08:15] <mhz> those PC install very good using install CD
[08:16] <mhz> Today, I can give them the CD's I got from shipping
[08:16] <ogra_ibook> and where is the difference to a liveCd being used for install there ? 
[08:16] <mhz> and they'll install and keep a nice CD case
[08:16] <mhz> with beatigul picture and logo
[08:16] <ogra_ibook> that wont change 
[08:16] <ogra_ibook> you just get one CD that does both instead of two
[08:17] <mhz> ogra_ibook: AFAIK, the LiveCD, the one many users will ask for shipping, will only install from X running.
[08:17] <mhz> not from booting
[08:17] <ogra_ibook> and ? 
[08:17] <ogra_ibook> the system thats running is 100% identical 
[08:18] <ogra_ibook> i miss to see the probelm
[08:19] <mhz> ogra_ibook:  those old 400 - 600 MHz with 96 MB ram  people wont be able to install via the CD we, LoCo teams, Lug's etc get
[08:19] <mhz> (LiveCD)
[08:19] <ogra_ibook> huh ??
[08:19] <ogra_ibook> why shouldnt they
[08:19] <mhz> because LiveCD will not run X
[08:19] <ogra_ibook> errm, why shouldnt it ? 
[08:20] <mhz> IIRC, 128 MB is needed to run X correctly and smoothly in Live mode
[08:20] <ogra_ibook> and belive me, 96Mb isnt eniugh at all for a standard ubuntu
[08:20] <mhz> have you ever run any GUI installer on less than 128 MB?
[08:21] <mhz> Gnome will let you run Xchat and Firefox in standard ubuntu
[08:21] <mhz> with 96 MB
[08:21] <mhz> maybe Evolution and Xchat (no firefox there)
[08:22] <ogra_ibook> never
[08:22] <mhz> so, once they try that, they may get convinced to buy more ram or give Linux a try on a more powerful PC
[08:22] <ogra_ibook> it will start and then start swapping ... you wont have any fun with a 96MB system 
[08:23] <ogra_ibook> gnome alone needs 128 to run smoothly ... add 50 or more for firefox if you want to use more than one win/tab
[08:24] <ogra_ibook> the recommendation for a default ubuntu is 256MB .... look at the wiki, its there somewhere
[08:24] <mhz> ogra_ibook: hehehe, yeah, i know
[08:24] <ogra_ibook> sure you *could* install in 96Mb but that would start swapping immediately
[08:24] <mhz> I have read such specs.
[08:25] <mhz> I have run Gnome (slowly, yes) on 96 MB and run Xchat
[08:25] <ogra_ibook> people will drop it in favor of something smaller very soon, because they get to annoyed by the slowness
[08:25] <mhz> oooh, thats nothing yes
[08:25] <mhz> hence my interest on WindowMaker
[08:25] <mhz> once they try it... it flies!
[08:25] <ogra_ibook> i really wouldnt recommend it to anyone
[08:25] <mhz> :)
[08:26] <mhz> xfce is till too heavy to get fun in a 96 MB box
[08:26] <ogra_ibook> you said a default install is fine and that wimply isnt the case, so a liveCD used as installer is perfect here, since it makes sure you match the minimal requirements
[08:27] <ogra_ibook> s/wimply/simply
[08:27] <newmember> Can I use, this for a thin client?  http://www.vfxweb.com/index.php?productid=8150
[08:28] <mhz> ogra_ibook: it's not that I recommend it to anyone all the time but if users see they want to have latest apps. that let them generate PDF (abiword), get a PIM + mail client (evolution), they do end up understanding that if no more money to buy RAM, then WMaker or fluxbox is an option
[08:28] <ogra_ibook> newmember, not yet ... multiarch support will come with dapper in april
[08:29] <newmember> thanks
[08:29] <mhz> ogra_ibook: hmm, I hadn't seen it like that.. (about LiveCD and minimal req. to get you happy tester)
[08:29] <newmember> would havew been nice for the kids room
[08:29] <ogra_ibook> currently you can only use i386 clients on i386 servers or amd64 clients (who would do that?) on amd64 servers
[08:30] <ogra_ibook> in cureent dapper (development release) you already can use i386 clients on amd64 servers, i'm working on ppc support ...
[08:33] <mhz> ogra_ibook: thx for making me see other points
[10:08] <Lord_Athur> hi
[10:56] <droop> hello all
[10:56] <droop> my menubar just disappeared, how do I bring it back?
[10:58] <lucasvo> droop: what windowmanager are you using?
[10:58] <droop> gnome, this was a fresh install
[10:59] <droop> i was half an hour into changing the settings
[11:00] <lucasvo> droop: the whole panel or only the dropdown menu
[11:00] <lucasvo> ?
[11:00] <droop> both the top and bottom panels
[11:01] <droop> I was transforming the bottom panel to an OSX-like dock and had just unchecked the Expand setting in the preferences
[11:01] <lucasvo> hm, you have to choose another theme. probably
[11:02] <lucasvo> open a shell and run gnome-theme-manager
[11:02] <droop> i like the default theme, I just want the few popular apps to be avalaible at the bottom panel like the OSX dock
[11:03] <droop> I moved the Window Switcher to the top panel
[11:03] <lucasvo> droop: why not?
[11:05] <ogra_ibook> droop, so the top panel disappeared as well ? 
[11:06] <droop> why not what?
[11:06] <droop> yes
[11:06] <ogra_ibook> look if any panel is running with ps ax|grep "gnome-panel "
[11:06] <droop> i'm staring at a blank desktop
[11:06] <ogra_ibook> (in a terminal ...)
[11:06] <droop> is there a key combination to open a shell?
[11:06] <ogra_ibook> to get a terminal hit alt-f2
[11:07] <ogra_ibook> and type gnome-terminal in the prompr
[11:07] <ogra_ibook> *prompt
[11:07] <mhz> ogra_ibook: is the 'ogra' nick also working for you?
[11:08] <ogra_ibook> partially, the laptop with it is locked and stands some meters away
[11:08] <droop> ogra_ibook: do you mean ctrl+alt+F2?
[11:08] <ogra_ibook> but i hear the beep from xchat 
[11:08] <ogra_ibook> droop, err, yes, indeed
[11:11] <mhz> ogra: so it's ok I use 'tab' instead of 'tab + _ibook' ?
[11:11] <droop> i can't get a shell in the graphical desktop but "gnome-panel" is running
[11:12] <ogra_ibook> mhz, sure
[11:13] <mhz> thx, made my life easier
[11:13] <mhz> ;)
[11:14] <ogra_ibook> droop, hmm, do you see any small grey rectangle in any of the corners ?
[11:15] <droop> nope, I rebooted and the bottom panel would try to load the icons and then disappear, try to load the icons again and then disappear
[11:16] <ogra_ibook> hmm, any error messages ? 
[11:16] <tclong> hola!
[11:16] <droop> none
[11:16] <mhz> tclong: hola
[11:16] <droop> at least none that pop up
[11:17] <ogra_ibook> i thought if you use collapse but have the expand buttons disabled, you might see a very small rectangle to click on
[11:18] <ogra_ibook> droop, what happens if you move your mouse to the bottom edge of your display ? 
[11:19] <ogra_ibook> somewhere in the middle
[11:21] <droop> nothing, I just created a launcher for gnome-panel and then ran it
[11:21] <ogra_ibook> is it back again ? 
[11:21] <droop> both panels would show up, the bottom panel would start to load the icons, and then both would disappear
[11:21] <tclong> ogra: are you aware of any issues with edubuntu and acx111 wifi cards?
[11:22] <ogra_ibook> and dont come back if you muve the mouse near the bottom ? 
[11:22] <ogra_ibook> *move
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> tclong, we include the madwifi drivers, they should support acx111
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> tclong, what issues do you have ? 
[11:23] <lucasvo> is it a known bug that the downloads window of firefox isn't displayed correctly?
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> in dapper ? 
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> its displayed corretly :) 
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> its just empty
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> ;)
[11:23] <ogra_ibook> yes, thats known
[11:24] <lucasvo> ogra_ibook: good
[11:24] <droop> ogra it's not that they would collapse, both panels would try to load three or four times and then disappear
[11:24] <lucasvo> ogra_ibook: I hope it will be fixed :D
[11:24] <ogra_ibook> lucasvo, no, we plan to release in this state :P
[11:24] <ogra_ibook> droop, no error message at all ? #
[11:24] <ogra_ibook> thats weird
[11:24] <tclong> ogra: just having difficulties bringing the wificonnection up, so I started working throught the tutuorial at http://www.houseofcraig.net/acx100_howto.php
[11:25] <droop> ogra_ibook: no error messages, how can I kill the gnome-panel process?
[11:25] <ogra_ibook> killall gnome-panel in a console
[11:27] <ogra_ibook> tclong, modprobe acx_pci or modprobe acx_usb didnt help ?
[11:28] <ogra_ibook> both are included in edubuntu... lots of firmware as well
[11:28] <tclong> I'm going to give it a try later this week when I get a chance to work on it again.
[11:28] <droop> ogra_ibook: do I have to do it within gnome or can it do it after switching to the text mode console?
[11:29] <ogra_ibook> as long as you didnt compile stuff from source or did fiddle with stuff like this howto describes, they should just work
[11:29] <ogra_ibook> droop, should work from textmode ... if not, just use sudo :)
[11:31] <ogra_ibook> hey \sh 
[11:31] <tclong> ogra: too late. I may have to reinstall, which shouldnt be a problem.
[11:31] <\sh> if u speak about the devil
[11:31] <\sh> greetings from amu
[11:32] <ogra_ibook> tclong, sudo apt-get install --reinastall linux-image-`uname -r` should suffice
[11:32] <droop> it seems like gnome-panel is not running
[11:32] <ogra_ibook> \sh, thanks :) 
[11:32] <ogra_ibook> \sh, frohe weihnachten, war zu faul zu SMSen
[11:32] <tclong> cool, thanks!
[11:33] <\sh> ogra_ibook: thx
[11:33] <droop> is there a key combination to log off? at least I can try failsafe gnome
[11:33] <ogra_ibook> tclong, i'm not sure if you als need the same command for the linux-restricted-modules package
[11:33] <ogra_ibook> *also
[11:33] <\sh> ogra_ibook: let me guess...your christmas present?
[11:33] <ogra_ibook> droop, ctrl-alt-basckspace
[11:34] <droop> oh yeah
[11:34] <ogra_ibook> \sh, yes, from ogra *g*
[11:35] <\sh> ogra_ibook: hehe :) ebay or new?
[11:35] <lucasvo> ogra_ibook: I thoutght santa clause brings the christmas presents... :D
[11:35] <ogra_ibook> new
[11:35] <\sh> kroesus :)
[11:35] <ogra_ibook> lucasvo, i dont trust fat guys with white beards ;)
[11:35] <lucasvo> \sh: it is an i an d not a p
[11:36] <\sh> lucasvo: well...doesn't matter...ogra is a rich man in any way ;)
[11:37] <ogra_ibook> haha
[11:38] <droop> same problem in failsafe gnome, is there a file I can edit to change the panel properties?
[11:38] <droop> I still have access to the filesystem
[11:38] <ogra_ibook> \sh, well, it was the cheapest i could get ...
[11:38] <ogra_ibook> and i already love it for its keyboard ...
[11:38] <ogra_ibook> my blood pressure is waaay lower now ;)
[11:38] <tclong> back later
[11:39] <\sh> ogra_ibook: hehe...I saw them at amus place last time :) I love them too :) But first a new job :) then new toys :)
[11:39] <ogra_ibook> droop, you could delete stuff in ~/.gconf or even ~/.gconf completely
[11:39] <ogra_ibook> \sh, yup
[11:40] <ogra_ibook> but the 12" is worth it ...
[11:40] <\sh> ogra_ibook: that's why I like this little toshiba thing :)
[11:40] <ogra_ibook> 5h battery power and in dapper even airport extreme is properly supported
[11:40] <lucasvo> ogra_ibook: *wow*
[11:40] <lucasvo> airport works?
[11:40] <ogra_ibook> yup
[11:40] <mhz> ogra: will ubuntu always be gnome default ? (just courious about Artwork fans not prefering GNOME over other desktops and how much their opinion will count)
[11:41] <lucasvo> gnome rocks!
[11:41] <\sh> mhz: ubuntu is gnome, kubuntu is kde :)
[11:41] <ogra_ibook> with the bcm43xx module and the apple firmware ... sadly we cant ship the firmware, you need to install it manually
[11:41] <mhz> yes, i know
[11:41] <\sh> mhz: and kedubuntu is not just a dream :)
[11:41] <mhz> hehehe, not at all
[11:41] <lucasvo> ogra_ibook: hm, ok
[11:41] <mhz> \sh: not a dream
[11:41] <ogra_ibook> mhz, ubuntu will stay gnome 
[11:42] <\sh> mhz: I heard rumours....rumours about edubuntu with kde by default ;) ogra heard them too :)
[11:42] <mhz> ogra: so, how much does the artwork team opinion weighs?
[11:42] <ogra_ibook> mhz, did you notice that we adjust our release schedule to match the gnome release schedule ;)
[11:42] <ogra_ibook> \sh, not as long as KDE doesnt make predictable and reliable release schedules
[11:43] <ogra_ibook> mhz, ?
[11:43] <mhz> ogra: yup, but I need to be clear how much Artwork Team can have influences
[11:43] <\sh> ogra_ibook: it
[11:43] <ogra_ibook> mhz, the artwork team can do whatever they want
[11:43] <\sh> it's not a problem of release schedules....(regarding edubuntu) it's more or less a problem of stable software
[11:44] <ogra_ibook> mhz, we'll have a art company developing the default artwork for all three (ed/k/ubuntu)
[11:44] <ogra_ibook> so the artwork team can develop all stuff they want
[11:44] <\sh> anyways, amu just woke me up...and I wanted to sleep...so I'll sleep :)
[11:44] <mhz> ogra: ohh, so they are not 'official'
[11:44] <mhz> .oO(i thought they were)
[11:44] <ogra_ibook> \sh, regarding ubuntu its a problem of release schedules
[11:44] <\sh> ogra_ibook: yes that's why we have two flavours..:)
[11:45] <ogra_ibook> mhz, they might become official once, but they havent even formed 
[11:45] <ogra_ibook> the artteam is some guys who *want* to do stuff
[11:45] <\sh> ok...guys...cu tomorrow again...with more rocking stuff :)
[11:45] <\sh> good night :) 
[11:45] <droop> ogra_ibook: deleting .gconf didn't remove my changes, anywhere else I should look?
[11:46] <ogra_ibook> but they didnt supply anything yet, nor have they even a structure
[11:46] <ogra_ibook> droop, thats where your changes to the default are saved 
[11:46] <ogra_ibook> thats a bit weird ...
[11:47] <ogra_ibook> since it brings back defaults if you delet it on all gnoe systems i've seen in my life
[11:47] <mhz> ogra: i see you rpoint now
[11:47] <droop> yeah i know, i was pretty much expecting everything to revert back to default once I logged off and logged back in
[11:47] <ogra_ibook> mhz, it would be cool to have community developed artwork by default once, but first we need a working team 
[11:49] <ogra_ibook> mhz, as long as we dont have one, mark will hire a company... and as i understood it should be a comapny in london where he can directly go for discussing stuff etc
[11:50] <mhz> ogra: yup, good idea
[11:51] <ogra_ibook> heh
[11:52] <droop> ogra_ibook: rebooting brought back the default settings, thanks for your help
[11:52] <mhz> hehehe, I remember one of the UserFriendly stips that showed a pizza staying warm over a flat server rack (unit)
[11:53] <ogra_ibook> droop, glad you got it back 
[11:53] <ogra_ibook> mhz, the sad stuff is, that thing tastes as cheap as it was ...
[11:54] <mhz> ogra_ibook: stop chewing before speaking and dont make keyboard greesy
[11:54] <mhz> LOl
[11:55] <mhz> ogra_ibook: I remember when I was single and had no kids, I used to have pizzas (doble cheese) almost 2 to 3 times a week
[11:56] <ogra_ibook> i'm just to lazy to start cooking at midnight, but havent had any warm food today
[11:56] <mhz> oops, pity
[11:57] <droop> ah crap, same thing happened, this time when I added an app launcher for TuxPaint
[11:58] <droop> is there a log file i can look for?
[11:58] <ogra_ibook> there is a debian bug about tuxpaint, might be we inherited it... probably try to create a new launcher and make it start tuxpaint
[11:59] <ogra_ibook> ah
[11:59] <ogra_ibook> bugzilla 16577
[12:00] <ogra_ibook> its fixed in dapper
[12:00] <droop> i wasn't launching TuxPaint, i just added the launcher to the bottom pael
[12:00] <ogra_ibook> the launcher is broken
[12:00] <droop> go you have a link?
[12:00] <droop> i mean *do
[12:00] <ogra_ibook> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=16577
[12:05] <droop> it seems like it's just with TuxPaint, or am i mistaken?