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=== Topic for #ubuntu-artwork: Art Team meeting soon! Please place your vote on an applicable time slot now [https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkTeamMeetings] to make this meeting happen. Merry Christmas everyone! :) | ||
=== Topic (#ubuntu-artwork): set by klepas at Sun Dec 25 15:37:53 2005 | ||
=== #ubuntu-artwork [freenode-info] If you're at a conference, please contact freenode staff to make sure we've made special allowance for many users coming into our network from a single internet address ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp ). Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked, except to network staff, services and participating registered users ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )... Thanks! | ||
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artnay | hello | 02:06 |
---|---|---|
artnay | how are you guys? ready to do some serious wiki work? | 02:07 |
lukacu | hello artnay | 02:08 |
lukacu | not really ... i must study ... :( | 02:10 |
artnay | oh :( | 02:13 |
artnay | mhz pinged me yesterday but I wasn't here | 02:13 |
artnay | and he didn't tell what he was planning | 02:14 |
lukacu | i will check later if there is anything i can do but right now i must learn some meaningless stuff ;) | 02:15 |
klep[a] s | meeting on soon... :) | 02:47 |
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artnay | pong mhz | 03:44 |
mhz | ping artnay | 03:44 |
mhz | ? | 03:44 |
artnay | mhz: yeah, you pinged me yesterday. something about wiki? :) | 03:45 |
mhz | hehe, short term memory only :( | 03:46 |
mhz | sorry | 03:46 |
mhz | :) | 03:46 |
artnay | sorry, I was kind of buzy yesterday and couldn't hang with you guys :( | 03:46 |
mhz | np | 03:46 |
mhz | everyone is busy | 03:47 |
artnay | although I wanted to, but my gf was like "how many hours do you spend with ubuntu every day? more than with me?" :D | 03:47 |
mhz | heheheh | 03:48 |
artnay | and then I was in a situation where I couldn't say anything to defend myself | 03:48 |
mhz | artnay: my wife says even more terrible stuff to me :) | 03:48 |
artnay | and I had to leave :) | 03:48 |
artnay | I've tried to make her to use Ubuntu but no luck yet :( | 03:49 |
mhz | what does she do? | 03:49 |
artnay | nothing special, but she and her family still needs shockwave and some other programs that don't run in WINE | 03:49 |
artnay | but at least she's using fx | 03:50 |
=== klepas loves being in 8 weeks holidays with a free broadband connection and a family of FOSS users | ||
artnay | klepas: piss off now! ;D | 03:50 |
=== mhz congrats klepas and his family! | ||
artnay | 8 weeks... I can't recall when was the last time I had that long vacation | 03:51 |
=== mhz hasnt had any in 4 years | ||
artnay | no, seriously. now relax before you get into college and do some Ubuntu artwork during your holiday :) | 03:52 |
klepas | normally i have 6 over the summer hols | 03:52 |
klepas | but i graduated from high school, so this year only they were nice and slapped on another 2 | 03:52 |
klepas | ;) | 03:52 |
klepas | and yep, i've been doing something productive each and every day so far | 03:52 |
klepas | this is currently turning out to be the best holidays i've ever had | 03:53 |
artnay | I'm doing a new background today | 03:53 |
klepas | :) | 03:53 |
artnay | well at least I'm supposed to do... I have a photo already, so just slam Ubuntu logo and text into it and do some colour replacing | 03:53 |
artnay | shouldn't take long | 03:53 |
klepas | hehe | 03:53 |
klepas | give us a link of the original | 03:54 |
artnay | speaking of backgrounds... what about the default background? maybe it shouldn't be a photo so that it would fit with Usplash/GDM etc. | 03:54 |
artnay | I don't have it, it's on my harddisk | 03:55 |
klepas | ah, that's right, using xp, huh? | 03:55 |
artnay | yeah, I'm still at work | 03:55 |
=== klepas looks lovingly at his suse machine :) | ||
klepas | lol | 03:55 |
mhz | hehehe | 03:57 |
artnay | mhz: so, the wiki structure? you haven't commented what I proposed | 03:57 |
artnay | about the last changes and the overall layout of /Artwork | 03:58 |
mhz | I have only read it, true. I haven't commented it | 03:58 |
mhz | My feeling is subpages are too dangerous to play with | 03:58 |
mhz | unless | 03:58 |
klepas | oh, by the way, i think we will have quite an attendance | 03:59 |
artnay | so what would you suggest? | 03:59 |
klepas | for the meeting | 03:59 |
klepas | should have a fair few extra people joining us :) | 03:59 |
artnay | klepas: that's good, thanks for spreading the information :) | 03:59 |
mhz | we have nly one level of sbpages and they keep the CamelCase syntax | 03:59 |
mhz | if no CamelCase is kept, then autolinking will brake | 03:59 |
artnay | umh, I didn't quite understand. :o so we have only one subcategory on /Artwork, right? | 04:00 |
klepas | artnay: i estimate... about 5-10 extra people | 04:01 |
artnay | like clicking a link will bring a new page with text etc., no links at the moment | 04:01 |
mhz | artnay: I'll explain | 04:01 |
mhz | Wikis rely on one big power they have: Autolinking. Autolinking means that whwnerver I am writing and I place MauricioHernandez (that's camel case) when I save the page, that CamelCase will direct users to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MauricioHernandez | 04:02 |
mhz | right? | 04:02 |
artnay | it is | 04:03 |
klepas | mhz: ohh, i saw today | 04:04 |
klepas | mhz: congrats on becoming a member :) | 04:04 |
mhz | s, continuing with explanation | 04:04 |
mhz | klepas: ? | 04:04 |
klepas | community council | 04:05 |
klepas | dunno when it last held their meetings | 04:05 |
klepas | but i think i remember seeing your name somewhere | 04:05 |
mhz | if when writing I place MauricioHernandez/Artwork instead of MauricioHernandez/TheArtwork, | 04:05 |
klepas | under "accepted new members" | 04:05 |
klepas | or something | 04:05 |
mhz | the first will not create any link. The second will. | 04:06 |
mhz | klepas: oh, yes! I am very happy, thx | 04:06 |
artnay | klepas: it was some time ago, I read a log where they welcomed mhz and discussed about automatix licensing etc. | 04:06 |
klepas | nice | 04:06 |
klepas | mhz: nervous during the meeting? | 04:06 |
artnay | mhz: now is there a reason why only the 2nd example would creat a link? | 04:07 |
mhz | klepas: yup, very much but on the other hand, after 6 months contributing... | 04:08 |
mhz | :) | 04:08 |
artnay | now if there was /Artwork which would link to /*buntuArtwork and links to projects on this page, would it be too difficult? | 04:08 |
mhz | artnay: yes, Wiki syntax is CamelCase to create a link | 04:08 |
mhz | unless, you use [[CamelCase/Camel] ] | 04:08 |
mhz | which is longer and less probable users will remember that when editing | 04:09 |
mhz | the nice feature about CamelCase is that you just write | 04:09 |
artnay | but I see no other way to handle this artwork/wiki issue. all artwork projects should be accessible by using only one page (/Artwork). /Artwork should cover all neccessary information BUT it shouldn't contain anything that wouldn't be accessible from UbuntuArtwork, KubuntuArtwork etc. | 04:11 |
artnay | so people could bookmark their favourite distro's artwork project and they wouldn't be forced to use /Artwork | 04:11 |
mhz | artnay: to make things crystal-clear... could you make a txt doc or other format where you graphically show what you have in mind? | 04:13 |
mhz | maybe i am missing one of yur points | 04:13 |
artnay | and there hasn't been any other propositions (which isn't good) | 04:13 |
artnay | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkTodoProposal should cover it | 04:14 |
artnay | when I click /UbuntuArtwork link on /Artwork, it would bring me a list of all projects related to Ubuntu artwork (like /ArtworkTodoList is now) | 04:14 |
artnay | but the problem is that all *buntus want to have their own style, so every /*buntuArtwork page should cover the subjects (unified structure, that's what I'm talking about) | 04:15 |
mhz | ohhh | 04:16 |
mhz | we can fix that 'free-creating-page-style by proposing users to use CategoryArtwork at the end of each single page | 04:16 |
mhz | this way, when we visit the page CategoryArtwork, this will list automatically all pages including that link (CategoryArtwork) | 04:17 |
artnay | yes, therefore we should create a working structure that would be used in all projects | 04:17 |
artnay | at the moment there are lots of artwork related sites that aren't listed in proper places, don't have "Artwork" in a title etc. | 04:18 |
mhz | yes, but my fear is how we 'convince' people | 04:18 |
artnay | so it's quite hard to track this pages | 04:18 |
mhz | indeed | 04:18 |
artnay | s/this/these | 04:18 |
artnay | convince people of what? | 04:19 |
mhz | ok, let me get this streight | 04:19 |
mhz | artnay: you propose https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkTeams ? | 04:19 |
mhz | artnay: you propose https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkWork | 04:20 |
mhz | or a different approach? | 04:20 |
artnay | what's /ArtworkWork? | 04:20 |
artnay | ArtworkTodoProposal is currently a temporariry page to access some artwork related pages | 04:21 |
artnay | and /ArtworkTeams is for what? | 04:21 |
artnay | now how should I guess that https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuArtwork will cover Kubuntu's logo? | 04:23 |
artnay | it should be something like /Artowork -> /KubuntuArtwork -> KubuntuArtworkResources or something similiar | 04:23 |
artnay | I don't really know | 04:23 |
artnay | it would be more logical at least for me | 04:24 |
artnay | and /UbuntuArtwork shouldn't be about logos and palettes etc. | 04:24 |
mhz | so, if we have https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuArtwork page how many SubPages do you consider from it? | 04:25 |
artnay | it should cover links to all Ubuntu artwork related pages | 04:25 |
artnay | that would be the main page | 04:25 |
artnay | it would have links to other pages, TOC in the bottom of the page | 04:25 |
artnay | like, umh, Projects (a similiar list to /ArtworkTodoList) and maybe something else | 04:26 |
artnay | every *buntuArtwork projects covers different projects, the approach to artwork differs etc. | 04:28 |
artnay | some cleanup would be needed in /Artwork and with my grammar :) | 04:29 |
mhz | heheh | 04:29 |
mhz | we'll need many people to understand the pros and cons of such organizing wiki pages :( | 04:30 |
mhz | that is also difficult | 04:30 |
=== mhz needs to think big deal on this | ||
artnay | it surely is. but nobody has proposed a better approach | 04:30 |
mhz | artnay: i like and share your concern very much | 04:31 |
artnay | wiki is our main project at the moment. we can't actually think that people will contribute if they don't have a clue what to do | 04:31 |
mhz | yup | 04:32 |
artnay | we could propose that every *buntu will create a /*buntuArtwork page that would contain similiar topics as mentioned in ArtworkTodoList | 04:35 |
klepas | gnite | 04:35 |
artnay | bye klepas | 04:35 |
klepas | :) | 04:35 |
=== mhz_idle bbs | ||
klepas | see you in 7 hours and 25 minutes | 04:36 |
klepas | 24 minutes | 04:36 |
klepas | :) | 04:36 |
artnay | ok | 04:36 |
klepas | ;) | 04:36 |
artnay | I will most probably not be here then | 04:36 |
artnay | but try to create something out of wiki :o | 04:37 |
mhz_idle | artnay: stiil there? | 05:19 |
artnay | mhz_idle: I just came home. what's up? | 05:33 |
mhz_idle | I will think of a 'tree' of logic Pages for artwork related stuff and general to all atwork teams | 05:34 |
mhz_idle | then will compare it to yours and we can set a proposal to use subpages in the less cases as possible | 05:34 |
mhz_idle | is that right for you? | 05:34 |
artnay | mhz_idle: that's what I've been asking, comments and suggestions :) | 05:35 |
artnay | thanks mhz | 05:35 |
artnay | maybe I should do my own | 05:36 |
artnay | but guests are coming soon... so I have to do some cleaning before that | 05:36 |
mhz_idle | hehehe, mee too | 05:37 |
mhz_idle | I am cooking now | 05:37 |
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artnay | http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-art/2005-December/000558.html | 07:42 |
artnay | what do you think? | 07:42 |
artnay | AUC would be the primary place to submit ubuntu artwork, also *projectname*DiscussionArtwork could be used as well to attach files | 07:43 |
artnay | *projectname*Artwork would be sort of status page, dependencies, links to resources and guides that are related to this project etc. | 07:44 |
artnay | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkTodo | 08:11 |
artnay | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkTodoProposal | 08:11 |
artnay | :o | 08:11 |
artnay | can we get some Artwork grepping on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RecentChanges ? | 08:15 |
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mhz | artnay: ping | 09:10 |
mhz | lukacu: ping | 09:10 |
artnay | hey mhz | 09:10 |
lukacu | hello | 09:10 |
artnay | /ArtworkTodoProposal updated | 09:10 |
mhz | artnay: hey, good to see ya here so late, i guess | 09:10 |
mhz | artnay: please see http://wiki.edubuntu.org/MauricioHernandez | 09:11 |
artnay | you too | 09:11 |
mhz | at the bottom om it, 'navegation macro' | 09:11 |
mhz | will help your ideas so subpages get listed 'automatically'? | 09:11 |
lukacu | mhz: you can write macros in moinmoin ? | 09:19 |
mhz | yup | 09:20 |
mhz | Moin is 100% python | 09:20 |
lukacu | nice ... now, if only i knew python ;) | 09:20 |
mhz | hehehe | 09:21 |
mhz | me too? | 09:21 |
mhz | ! | 09:22 |
lukacu | well i have every intention to learn it but there is just no time | 09:23 |
mhz | indeed | 09:23 |
mhz | I will start reading about making themes for XFCE before python and XML | 09:24 |
lukacu | yeah ... priorities. i have my queue too | 09:25 |
mhz | mine is endless | 09:27 |
lukacu | :) | 09:27 |
artnay | hey mhz | 09:36 |
artnay | did you read this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork | 09:37 |
artnay | layout changed and now it sort of has a structure | 09:37 |
mhz | artnay: please see http://wiki.edubuntu.org/MauricioHernandez | 09:38 |
mhz | will help your ideas so subpages get listed 'automatically'? | 09:38 |
artnay | mhz: so could we grep -i Artwork https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RecentChanges | 09:38 |
mhz | hehehehe | 09:38 |
artnay | as "news" ? | 09:38 |
artnay | well you get the idea :) | 09:38 |
mhz | People can just subscribe to any page they like and will get mail notifications plus a nice DIFF inside the mail body | 09:39 |
artnay | yeah, that's true | 09:39 |
mhz | so, if people susbcribe to /Artwork | 09:39 |
artnay | but there lots of people who haven't signed up | 09:39 |
mhz | yup | 09:39 |
mhz | could /Artwork become UbuntuArtwork instead? | 09:40 |
artnay | oh noes, I've lost verbs :| | 09:40 |
artnay | mhz: why? | 09:40 |
artnay | /UbuntuArtwork should cover Ubuntu-related projects | 09:40 |
mhz | hmmmm | 09:40 |
mhz | could we make standard ArtWork instead of plain Artwrok ? | 09:41 |
mhz | and then keep CamelCase l;inking | 09:41 |
artnay | what do you mean? | 09:42 |
artnay | sorry, I'm not good at wikis :| *goes rtfm* | 09:42 |
mhz | artnay: np | 09:43 |
mhz | if we use http/Artwrok instead http/ArtWork | 09:43 |
mhz | the 1st will not be considered link when you edit a page and place that word | 09:43 |
mhz | the 2nd will be a link inemediately | 09:44 |
artnay | so what should be done and how? how's that preventing us? | 09:44 |
artnay | what would you suggest? | 09:47 |
artnay | it would be great to have wiki in a better shape by tomorrow | 09:47 |
artnay | name it ArtWork? | 09:49 |
artnay | that's all? or do you have anything better to offer? :) | 09:49 |
artnay | mhz: and can we get that "grepped" version of RecentChanges? then just add link "Recent changes in Artwork pages" below the news section | 09:51 |
mhz | nope | 09:51 |
artnay | that would help people who haven't signed and just want to see what's happening | 09:51 |
artnay | it would be very useful | 09:51 |
mhz | artnay: i'll ask my friends in #moin | 09:52 |
mhz | but I dont think so | 09:52 |
artnay | well that's strange | 09:52 |
artnay | it's kind of basic operation, don't you think? :o | 09:52 |
mhz | artnay: by standard, I mean, that ArtWork should then be used everywhere in wiki instead of Artwork | 09:52 |
mhz | or viceversa | 09:52 |
mhz | but if we do the latter | 09:52 |
mhz | to make it a link we'll have to write [/Artwork] everytiem | 09:53 |
artnay | understood | 09:53 |
artnay | it's all the same to me, what matters is usability | 09:53 |
mhz | IMHO, usability is ArtWork | 09:54 |
artnay | but we really could have some use for the list of recent changes in *ArtWork* pages | 09:54 |
mhz | unless in english, artwork is just one word | 09:54 |
mhz | In spanish, it is 2 word | 09:55 |
artnay | well Artwork would be used only on one page | 09:55 |
artnay | no... ArtWork :) | 09:55 |
mhz | artnay: it's possible only if we touch Moin code (python) | 09:55 |
mhz | hmm | 09:55 |
mhz | yes, but everytime we edit pages on any content, we'll refer to Artwork or ArtWork... then it'll matter | 09:56 |
artnay | but that's just a minor issue now, I think | 09:56 |
artnay | we need the structure first | 09:56 |
artnay | then build it, at this point we need a decision on that | 09:56 |
artnay | (wheter we use Artwork or ArtWork) | 09:57 |
artnay | how many people will attend tomorrow? do you guys have any idea? | 09:57 |
lukacu | nope ...it will be a complete surprise for me | 09:58 |
artnay | mhz: I didn't know CamelCase is case-sensitive although that's quite obvius */me goes hit his head into a wall :|* | 09:59 |
mhz | artnay: hehehehehe | 10:00 |
mhz | dont be hard on yourself | 10:00 |
mhz | at least, wait until AFTER the meeting | 10:00 |
mhz | we need you there | 10:00 |
mhz | :D | 10:00 |
lukacu | lol | 10:00 |
artnay | I just stared at what you wrote and was like "umh" | 10:01 |
artnay | this is one of those situations when you feel yourself dummy | 10:01 |
artnay | ;) | 10:01 |
artnay | anyways, it wouldn't matter if we think about it | 10:01 |
artnay | umh | 10:01 |
artnay | now what was that... nevermind | 10:01 |
artnay | "as a dummy" and the 2nd one would be... just renew the wiki! :D | 10:03 |
artnay | should we post an announcement to ubuntuforums? | 10:08 |
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mhz | artnay: a post to announce the meeting? | 10:24 |
mhz | sure | 10:24 |
=== mhz never goes to forums though | ||
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klepas | moin moin | 11:46 |
lukacu | moin klepas | 11:46 |
klepas | meeting soon :) | 11:50 |
lukacu | yeah ... a bit more than a day to go :) | 11:53 |
mhz | moin klepas | 11:55 |
=== mhz can't wait to see how many of the 8 votes show up | ||
mhz | :D | 11:55 |
klepas | well there might even be more people that a not in the art team showing | 11:56 |
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