[01:27] <womble> Anyone here going to LCA who feels like braving the slings and arrows of Debian Developers to speak at the Debian miniconf about Debian-related Launchpad issues?  I can make sure nobody asks the nasty "proprietary" question if you'd like.
[01:35] <lifeless> I'm not going to LCA - sorr 
[01:35] <lifeless> y
[01:35] <womble> lifeless: You're *what*?
[01:36] <lifeless> but I'd have been happy to talk about launchpad @ the debian miniconf. I think its going to be useful for debian in the fullness of time.
[01:36] <lifeless> I'm
[01:36] <lifeless> not
[01:36] <lifeless> going
[01:36] <lifeless> to
[01:36] <lifeless> LCA
[01:36] <womble> How come?
[01:36] <lifeless> various things, got a lot on is the primary
[01:37] <womble> At any rate, do you know anyone else who'd be game enough to tell Debian why Launchpad isn't Satan's Own Software?
[01:37] <lifeless> sabdfl will be there
[01:38] <lifeless> but I don't know if he'll be there for the miniconfs.. but he would be the ideal speaker IMO
[01:39] <womble> straight from the horse's mouth, as it were.  Pity he's unavailable.  Surely there's someone from the launchpad team who's going?
[01:40] <lifeless> well I dunno if he is unavailable
[02:01] <mpt> Greetings Launchpadders!
[02:03] <lifeless> moin moin mpt 
[02:03] <desrt> hi guys.  how do i file kernel bugs?
[02:03] <lifeless> carefully ?
[02:03] <desrt> linux, linux-image, etc are not recognised product names
[02:03] <lifeless> jamesh should be able to answer this. jamesh: ^ ?
[02:09] <mpt> There was special handling done for the kernel components, I remember that much
[02:10] <mpt> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+search?text=linux
[02:11] <mpt> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+search?text=kernel
[05:32] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: [r=lifeless]  Add cronscripts/supermirror-rewritemap.py, which generates files for use with Apache's RewriteMap, as specified in SupermirrorFilesystemHierarchy. (r2999: Andrew Bennetts)
[07:33] <Burgundavia> mpt_, btw, love the search urls. They are human parseable ;)
[08:06] <BjornT> good morning
[08:07] <jamesh> hi BjornT 
[08:07] <BjornT> did the bugzilla migration happen last week?
[08:07] <jamesh> yep
[08:08] <jamesh> so new bugs are now getting numbers like 28xxx
[08:08] <BjornT> cool. how did it go? any major problems?
[08:08] <jamesh> rather than 6xxx
[08:08] <jamesh> it went quite smoothly
[08:09] <jamesh> we've now got almost 5 times as many bugs logged
[08:09] <jamesh> will be interesting to see if it shows up any problems
[08:09] <desrt> uh.. like the fact that i get 3 emails every time i change anything about a bug? :)
[08:10] <jamesh> desrt: what sort of changes?
[08:10] <desrt> any changes
[08:10] <BjornT> yeah, it's a quite a lot of new bugs. good to hear that it went ok.
[08:10] <desrt> i get the normal one
[08:10] <desrt> plus a mailing list bounce from ubuntu-bugs
[08:10] <jamesh> we need to fix that
[08:10] <desrt> plus the appropriate more specific list (like kernel-bugs, desktop-bugs, etc)
[08:11] <jamesh> I got the admins to add a mailman spam filter rule to try and auto-approve such messages, but I guess it isn't working correctly
[08:11] <desrt> well
[08:11] <desrt> it's the standard "you're trying to post to a members-only list.  please wait for moderator approval." message
[08:11] <jamesh> yeah
[08:13] <jamesh> desrt: about your question earlier: bugs are filed against source packages
[08:13] <desrt> jamesh; ya.  i figured it out :)
[08:13] <jamesh> desrt: there is no "linux" or "linux-image" source package -- only binary packages with those names
[08:13] <desrt> grep ^Source: in the package description
[08:14] <jamesh> "apt-cache show linux-image | grep ^Source:" can give you the source package name
[08:14] <desrt> :)
[08:14] <jamesh> we do need to make it easier to file bugs if you only know the binary package name though.
[08:15] <desrt> well
[08:15] <BjornT> hmm, that was being worked on a while a go, i wonder what happened with it
[08:15] <desrt> launchpad is actually anti-helpful in this respect
[08:15] <desrt> "The distribution package you found this bug in, which was installed via apt-get, rpm, emerge or similar."
[08:15] <jamesh> desrt: right.  And the bug is in the distribution source package :)
[08:16] <BjornT> jamesh: do you know how mailman decides where to send the mailing list bounce? (i.e. which email headers does it look at)
[08:16] <jamesh> desrt: you observed the symptoms of the bug in the binary package :)
[08:16] <desrt> jamesh; in any case, perhaps the wording of that blurb should be changed
[08:16] <jamesh> BjornT: apparently it is the To: header -- ignoring Sender or Bounces-To :(
[08:16] <jamesh> people were discussing it on friday
[08:16] <desrt> jamesh; a little hint there would help a lot of medium-skilled people like me find their way
[08:17] <jamesh> BjornT: we have the launchpad-bugs mailing list set up to accept LP emails, so it should be possible to fix the other lists
[08:17] <BjornT> oh, ok. that sucks :( but i guess that should be considered a bug in mailman, and not in launchpad.
[08:18] <jamesh> of course, by "To:", I mean "From:"
[08:19] <jamesh> desrt: sure.  I said right off that we need to improve this.
[08:20] <desrt> launchpad should have this feature where it forces everyone to use it
[08:20] <desrt> like, some projects are allowed to have their own bugtrackers... like gnome and mozilla... but everyone else pretty much has to use launchpad
[08:35] <mpt__> Burgundavia, what do you mean?
[08:35] <jamesh> desrt: I filed an RT request with the admins to get the moderation email issue sorted
[08:36] <desrt> do they even read those mails?
[08:36] <jamesh> yes
[08:36] <desrt> that must have been like beginning of december
[08:37] <Burgundavia> mpt, the text=blah, instead of the google style urls
[08:37] <jamesh> but that one just affects you
[08:37] <jamesh> this one pisses off lots of people
[08:37] <desrt> fair.
[08:38] <Burgundavia> jamesh, are there plans afoot to fix reportbug in Ubuntu to actually be useful?
[08:38] <jamesh> desrt: to be fair, the admins are probably waiting for the a proper solution for the @ubuntu.com email address synch problem
[08:39] <desrt> synch problem?
[08:39] <jamesh> desrt: the script basically created an MTA alias file mapping $LPUSERNAME@ubuntu.com to the user's preferred email address
[08:40] <jamesh> desrt: some people, after getting their @ubuntu.com address, decided that they'd like to use it as their preferred email address
[08:40] <desrt> oh my.
[08:40] <jamesh> after the aliases get synchronised again, they got a mail loop
[08:42] <jamesh> Burgundavia: no idea.  There was some plans to add some bug reporting stuff to launchpad-integration
[08:43] <jamesh> Burgundavia: this would be to auto-fill the bug entry form with some of the data reportbug provides
[08:43] <Burgundavia> jamesh, yes, but bugreport currently sends bugs for universe to ubuntu-users, which gets caught by the spam filters and I have been filing them by hand
[08:43] <Burgundavia> so we should either 1)remove bugreport 2)fix lp to accept bug reports from bugreport
[08:44] <jamesh> Burgundavia: we aren't going to accept new bug reports by email that are not PGP signed
[08:44] <Burgundavia> jamesh, then we need to remove bugreport from ubuntu
[08:45] <desrt> jamesh; are you going to also require that their key is in the web of trust? :p
[08:45] <desrt> (spammers could make pgp keys too, you know)
[08:45] <jamesh> desrt: no.  We just require that they associate the key with their account
[08:46] <jamesh> desrt: spammers can sign up for Bugzilla accounts too ...
[08:46] <desrt> jamesh; or get their keys signed....
[08:47] <Burgundavia> jamesh, bugreport has a very specific format that can be parsed easily
[08:48] <jamesh> desrt: you can use a key with no signatures if you want.  You just need to register it with your Launchpad account
[08:48] <jamesh> Burgundavia: /me is not an old debian guy :)
[08:48] <mpt> Burgundavia, I'd like to shorten them though
[08:48] <Burgundavia> jamesh, I thought you were. Ah, let me forward you a reportbug email. They are exactly like this everytime and can be trusted
[08:48] <Burgundavia> mpt, at least they are readable
[08:48] <jamesh> Burgundavia: I know what the email looks like
[08:49] <Burgundavia> jamesh, then why not accept them? No spam is ever going to look like that
[08:50] <jamesh> Burgundavia: there are only two conditions under which Launchpad will send email to a particular email address at the moment
[08:50] <jamesh> Burgundavia: (a) if it is an email address verification mail, or (b) if it is set as your preferred address in Launchpad
[08:50] <Burgundavia> jamesh, this is not about sending email, it is about reporting bugs
[08:51] <jamesh> Burgundavia: if we accept bugs from random people, we haven't verified that we can send them email.
[08:52] <Burgundavia> jamesh, but at least the bug is not lying on the abortion clinic floor when in fact people thought they had birthed a kid
[08:52] <jamesh> Burgundavia: so even if I create a new LP person when processing this email, you won't be able to get answers from the reporter unless they sign up and verify their email
[08:52] <Burgundavia> jamesh, this is a bug in LP, IMHO
[08:52] <jamesh> that we only send people email if they've agreed to receive it from us?
[08:53] <mdke> jamesh, you must see the problem though
[08:53] <jamesh> mdke: yes.
[08:53] <mdke> putting aside what is at fault
[08:53] <mdke> there must be a solution
[08:54] <Burgundavia> jamesh, in pratice, has a bug tracker ever been used for spamming?
[08:54] <Burgundavia> in other words, are we talkinga bout something that is a theory only?
[08:56] <jamesh> Burgundavia: I'm telling you about how email is currently handled by LP.  To accept these bugs, we'd need to reevaluate these constraints.
[08:56] <carlos> morning
[08:56] <Burgundavia> jamesh, ok. Where is the best venue for this discussion?
[08:57] <jamesh> Burgundavia: so I can't just say "sure, we'll accept these emails and create Malone bugs from them" without discussion.
[08:57] <jamesh> Burgundavia: probably a bug report + a spec
[08:57] <sivang> morning launchpadders :)
[08:57] <Burgundavia> jamesh, I think we also need to make a decision for dapper on this
[08:57] <ddaa> Hey, did any of you guys tried to use by bzrk branch lately?
[08:58] <sivang> ddaa: you mean, view branches graphically by Scott's program?
[08:58] <jamesh> Burgundavia: sure.  Say so in the bug report, and it will be evaluated.
[08:58] <Burgundavia> jamesh, ok, will do
[08:58] <ddaa> sivang: I mean by my heavily modified (improved?) branch of scott's week-end hack
[08:59] <sivang> ddaa: I haven't , where can I download it?
[08:59] <ddaa> This week-end, I added some caching that should make it usable with launchpad-sized histories.
[08:59] <ddaa> bzr get http://ddaa.net/bazaar/bzrk
[09:00] <ddaa> For launchpad, you'll _need_ to use e.g. "--limit 70"
[09:01] <sivang> ddaa: ah, otherwise it will hang? :)
[09:01] <jamesh> ddaa: is that to limit the width of the tree view?
[09:01] <sivang> ddaa: I'll use it for the home-user-backup branches of mine, the LP ones are safely stored on my home box, I'm at work now :-(
[09:01] <ddaa> jamesh: that limits display to the 70 first items, which in turns limits the width of the tree
[09:02] <jamesh> when I last tried it, bzrk windows were wider than my desktop (2560 pixels)
[09:02] <ddaa> I think the next thing I'll do is allowing ignoring the ancestry of selected revisions interactively. But that would be quite involved.
[09:02] <Burgundavia> jamesh, https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/28665
[09:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 28665: "Bugs from reportbug need to addressed" Fix req. for: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: Unconfirmed
[09:03] <mpt> Burgundavia, yes, bugzilla.mozilla.org has been used for spamming at least once
[09:03] <Burgundavia> mpt, ok
[09:04] <sivang> ddaa: I didn't know you also hack on Scott's weekend hack bzrk :)
[09:04] <Burgundavia> mpt, how bad was it, what was the vector and does reportbug present a similar vector?
[09:04] <ddaa> sivang: you might also be interested in http://ddaa.net/blog/python/lsprof-calltree :)
[09:07] <mpt> Burgundavia, one bug report, and I don't know what you mean by vector or what reportbug is
[09:08] <Burgundavia> mpt, reportbug is a commandline tool that debian developed to report bugs to debbugs. It was hacked in Ubuntu to send its reports to the ubunt-users mailing list
[09:08] <Burgundavia> mpt, vector is what part of the program they (ab)used
[09:08] <sivang> ddaa: nice, visualize performance profiling, this is also something you hacked on?
[09:08] <mpt> Bugzilla has only a Web interface
[09:08] <mpt> Burgundavia, Launchpad has already been used for link spamming
[09:08] <Burgundavia> mpt, ah?
[09:09] <ddaa> sivang: I did not hack on KCachegrind, just on the output filter for lsprof to produce calltree data.
[09:09] <Burgundavia> mpt, whereabouts?
[09:09] <ddaa> Hotshot is a useless piece of crack IMHO. lsprof gives me much more meaningful data.
[09:10] <sivang> ddaa: could you explain what's in the process of lsprof --> calltree data? 
[09:11] <ddaa> look at the patch :)
[09:11] <mpt> Burgundavia, https://launchpad.net/projects/fatalnetwork and https://launchpad.net/malone/bugtrackers/fn-bugs
[09:11] <ddaa> pretty easy, given up-to-date documentation. Sadly the KCachegrind doc is not.
[09:12] <Burgundavia> mpt, hmm, marginal
[09:14] <mpt> It would take me months to find the b.m.o spamming
[09:14] <mpt> I think it was in Spanish
[09:14] <Burgundavia> mpt, never mind
[09:14] <Burgundavia> mpt, I was more interested int he fact that it happened
[09:29] <jamesh> Burgundavia: and debbugs receives a lot of spam too ...
[09:29] <Burgundavia> jamesh, I am sure it does
[09:30] <jamesh> I think we imported a small amount of it into LP which had previously been imported into bugzilla
[09:30] <Burgundavia> jamesh, what does debbugs do about spam?
[09:30] <jamesh> although it is unreadable now due to charset conversion
[09:30] <jamesh> Burgundavia: try to delete it after the fact
[09:30] <Burgundavia> ugh
[09:30] <Burgundavia> I think we can safely say we are not going to permit random stuff
[09:31] <Burgundavia> but I think allowing certain formats is good, such as from reportbugs
[09:31] <jamesh> Burgundavia: see the link at the bottom of e.g. http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=336076
[09:31] <Ubugtu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Debian bugtracker: need more than 1 value to unpack
[09:31] <jamesh> Burgundavia: they also run a special spam checker that zaps any identical message sent to more than a certain number of email addresses
[09:32] <lifeless> jamesh: yeah, across multiple transmissions, not cc or bcc lists
[09:32] <jamesh> since the spammers often harvest lots of NNNN@bugs.debian.org addresses, they often send the same thing to multiple bugs
[09:32] <jamesh> lifeless: yeah
[09:32] <ddaa> lifeless: meeting in 38 mins!
[09:32] <ddaa> lifeless: I mean 28 mins
[09:32] <lifeless> ddaa: meeting in 28 minuts!
[09:33] <ddaa> lifeless: any agenda item you'd like to have?
[09:33] <lifeless> ddaa: nothing specific from me. next week I will have stuff, for planning the next set of work
[09:33] <lifeless> but this week I'm not prepped
[09:34] <ddaa> okay
[09:34] <ddaa> jblack: you are welcome to attend the meeting
[09:35] <Burgundavia> jamesh, night
[10:00] <lifeless> ddaa: where is the meeting happening ?
[10:01] <ddaa> #canonical-meeting, usually
[10:01] <lifeless> well
[10:09] <sivang> ddaa: reviewers meeting?
[10:09] <ddaa> no, bzr integration meeting
[10:10] <sivang> http://www.parm.net/web2.0/
[10:29] <Kinnison> Morning
[10:31] <sivang> Kinnison: Good morning Daniel
[10:32] <Kinnison> hi sivan. how was your weekend?
[10:39] <sivang> Kinnison: pretty good, hacked some more on HUB, went reading through some of the bits in launchpad/utilities, and for desert had a futurama marathon :)
[10:39] <sivang> Kinnison: what about you?
[10:40] <Kinnison> birthday party of a friend, showed two people around the house (dunno if either will want to buy), finished libgfshare and announced it, hacked about 20% of my way to GFShareFS
[10:40] <Kinnison> Oh, and watched a couple of films
[10:40] <Kinnison> So productive and relaxing -- all good
[10:42] <sivang> Kinnison: really, I wish I could be as productive as you on the weekend. I'm glad to hear the libgfshare is done, pretty amazing stuff :)
[10:43] <sivang> Kinnison: I showed my gf Bill Bailey's site, he has the BBC rave there as the only free quick clip, I think I need to get his DVD or something, iz a keeper :)
[10:44] <sivang> Kinnison: she liked it :)
[10:44] <Kinnison> sivang: *g*
[10:45] <Kinnison> sivang: I acquired another Bill Bailey DVD with two more shows on it
[10:46] <sivang> we should schedule a bill bailey marathon when I visit you in England :)
[10:46] <sivang> Kinnison: where did you announce libgfshare ?
[10:47] <sivang> (btw, funny it looks like "lib gf share" as in sharing your gf. kind'o reminds me liboobs of g-s-t)
[10:48] <Kinnison> Umm, I announced it on my blog
[10:49] <sivang> labas SteveA 
[10:49] <sivang> Kinnison: funny, http://www.londonremade.com/html_newsletters/newsletter_august_04.html
[10:50] <Kinnison> what's funny about it?
[10:51] <SteveA> lifeless: ping
[10:52] <lifeless> pong
[10:53] <sivang> Kinnison: I searched for you on google, and thought you were appointed as what noted there :)
[10:53] <sivang> (was sure google will pull out your site as the first hit)
[10:53] <mantiena-baltix> kiko-afk, hi, still not online ?
[10:53] <Kinnison> Well certainly putting: daniel silverstone blog :should work
[10:56] <sivang> Kinnison: probably
[10:56] <daf> mpt: yo
[10:59] <mpt> daf, yi
[10:59] <sivang> hey daf 
[11:01] <daf> hi Sivan
[11:02] <daf> mpt: I think you have a mail from me from last week that you haven't answered yet
[11:02] <mpt> one about headings, and one about bug pages
[11:04] <daf> ok, two :)
[11:04] <mpt> both of which really belong in Malone ;-)
[11:04] <daf> um
[11:05] <daf> the first one has a list which are related to potential bugs
[11:05] <daf> I didn't think the second one described a bug at all
[11:06] <mpt> well, the part about the Search button being in the wrong tab order is
[11:07] <daf> oh, ok
[11:07] <daf> as I said, I wasn't sure whether that was by design or not
[11:07] <daf> you're indicating that it's not, so I'll file a bug
[11:07] <daf> hi silbs 
[11:08] <silbs> hi daf!  just passing through...
[11:10] <Kinnison> silbs: I've made sure to save you some cake for the soyuz sprint
[11:13] <daf> good morning niemeyer 
[11:13] <niemeyer> daf!
[11:14] <niemeyer> daf: Morning!
[11:14] <niemeyer> daf: How was your trip back home?
[11:14] <daf> fine, thanks
[11:14] <daf> I tracked my route home :)
[11:19] <Kinnison> daf: If I'd known you were due in London on Sunday I'd have taken you home the moment you first dozed off. You should have said :-)
[11:20] <daf> actually, I got to sleep by 11
[11:21] <Kinnison> okay
[11:23] <niemeyer> daf: Oh, cool! I imagine you already know everything about the unit by now.. :)
[11:25] <daf> perhaps not quite :)
[11:25] <daf> I did manage to figure out how to use gpsbabel to download some caches
[11:25] <daf> I'll go hunting later
[11:55] <sabdfl> Kinnison: morning, did you get my voicemail friday?
[11:55] <Kinnison> sabdfl: yo, good morning
[11:56] <Kinnison> sabdfl: Yeah, I got it saturday morning
[11:56] <Kinnison> sabdfl: Sorry, 'net connection was screwwy all Friday and I was trying to get the ISP to sort it
[11:56] <Kinnison> sabdfl: I'm currently going through all the branches and working out what's left to do
[11:56] <sabdfl> Kinnison: thanks
[11:57] <sabdfl> i'm headed to asia this evening, could you arrange a time with cvd to talk SteveA and I through the status today, please?
[11:57] <Kinnison> sabdfl: and, to answer your first question from the v-mail -- yes, the holiday was good, but I need a break to recover from it :-P :-)
[11:57] <Kinnison> I'll talk with cvd and organise that for this afternoon
[11:58] <sabdfl> thanks muchly
[12:00] <sivang> Kinnison: vcations always require a break to recover from :)
[12:00] <Kinnison> sivang: aye :-)
[12:00] <Kinnison> hmm, speaking of that break, I need to organise a dental appt.
[12:03] <sivang> Kinnison: nice to see you include hebrew in your Xmas greetings blog post :)
[12:03] <Kinnison> sivang: :-)
[12:08] <matsubara> good morning!
[12:09] <daf> yo matsubara
[12:10] <SteveA> Kinnison, sabdfl: okay, noted.  I can take a break from the meetings here sometime this afternoon.
[12:12] <matsubara> hmm, rf-built still not up to date?
[12:15] <Kinnison> SteveA: what time period will you be able to liberate a chunk in?
[12:16] <Kinnison> SteveA: in particular, think you can spare ca. 30m at 4pm ?
[12:16] <Kinnison> SteveA: UTC
[12:19] <daf> Kinnison: have you seen bug 5227?
[12:20] <daf> Kinnison: changing the status would be good
[12:20] <daf> Ubugtu: where are you when I need you?
[12:21] <sivang> lol
[12:21] <Kinnison> daf: I've updated it to confirmed/minor/assigned-to-dsilvers
[12:21] <Kinnison> daf: it's a private bug
[12:22] <daf> thanks!
[12:29] <dholbach> hello.
[12:29] <dholbach> Could somebody tell me, where I can find ubuntu bug 19668 in Launchpad?
[12:29] <Ubugtu> Ubuntu bug 19668: "sgid problem" Product: Ubuntu, Component: gnome-games, Severity: normal, Assigned to: daniel.holbach@ubuntu.com, Status: PENDINGUPLOAD http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=19668
[12:30] <daf> dholbach: go to the link Ubugtu just posted
[12:30] <dholbach> ok
[12:30] <daf> dholbach: click on "View this bug in Launchpad"
[12:31] <dholbach> ok
[12:31] <dholbach> And then?
[12:31] <Kinnison> dhol: or do what I did and change your ubug mozilla keyword from http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=%s to http://launchpad.net/malone/bugtrackers/ubuntu-bugzilla/%s
[12:32] <daf> ok, if this bug was related to just one LP bug, then you'd get taken straight to it
[12:32] <daf> but it's related to two
[12:32] <daf> looks like it might be a dup
[12:32] <daf> at any rate, either of the two bugs listed will be the one you want
[12:32] <daf> s/either of/one of/
[12:32] <dholbach> I'd want the 19668 one :(
[12:32] <seb128> could somebody do something about that moderation mail flood? people keep complaining about that all over the place
[12:32] <Kinnison> dholbach: take the later numbered one then?
[12:33] <daf> indeed, the dup is marked
[12:33] <daf> jamesh: maybe the redirection code should be smarter about dup bugs
[12:34] <seb128> dholbach: seems that there is no 19668
[12:34] <daf> dholbach: Bugzilla had a duplicate for 19668, which also got imported
[12:34] <seb128> a query on "sgid" with all the status possible return no such bug on launchpad
[12:34] <daf> dholbach: I think #4648 is the imported 19668
[12:34] <daf> oh, wait
[12:34] <dholbach> daf: it isnt - look at the bugzilla bug - it's very long.
[12:35] <seb128> so either it didn't get imported
[12:35] <seb128> or query on a topic doesn't work
[12:36] <daf> hmm
[12:36] <daf> this is weird
[12:38] <daf> it looks to me too as though the bug wasn't imported
[12:38] <daf> I think jamesh is your man for fixing the problem
[12:39] <daf> looks like he may have gone to bed already
[12:39] <daf> so I'm going to suggest that you send him an email
[12:39] <seb128> there is no hurry anyway
[12:39] <daf> ok
[12:39] <daf> I'm suspecting that it may be something to do with the fact that the bug was opened the day before the import
[12:40] <daf> er, ignore that
[12:44] <SteveA> Kinnison: check with cvd for mark's schedule.  I can be available whenever that is.
[12:44] <Kinnison> SteveA: 4pm then
[12:45] <Kinnison> SteveA: I'll confirm that with cvd
[01:00] <Kinnison> Do we not update the launchpad (built) tree on chinstrap any more?
[01:01] <daf> I believe lifeless claimed that it should be working again now
[01:01] <daf> salgado!
[01:01] <salgado> daf, yo!
[01:02] <daf> you were missed
[01:02] <daf> have a good break?
[01:02] <salgado> really?
[01:02] <salgado> had a very good one
[01:02] <Kinnison> good to hear
[01:03] <daf> salgado: yes, I kept looking at bugs and thinking "if only I could ask salgado about this"
[01:03] <cprov> Kinnison: it's bronken since last wednesday, I think
[01:03] <Kinnison> cprov: aah
[01:04] <cprov> daf: I've been doing great on bug triage, congrats, I really appreciate that !
[01:04] <salgado> hey Kinnison. have you had a good break too?
[01:04] <Kinnison> it was a good holiday. I need a break to recover from it
[01:05] <daf> doesn't sound very restful to me
[01:05] <salgado> daf, I can see some bugmail from you on my inbox. I promise to answer then today
[01:05] <salgado> daf, if there's anything other than that, just ask
[01:05] <daf> salgado: woo, thanks!
[01:05] <daf> salgado: good to have you back :)
[01:06] <salgado> nice to hear that. :)
[01:08] <sivang> Boa vinda para trs salgado  :)
[01:08] <daf> BjornT: a thought just popped into my head: bug keyword subscriptions -- e.g. "subscribe me to Launchpad bugs that have the 'poll' keyword"
[01:09] <salgado> silbs, hi sivang! thanks
[01:09] <salgado> sivang, ^
[01:10] <daf> bom dia kiki
[01:11] <sivang> salgado: :)
[01:14] <kiko> hey hey hey
[01:14] <kiko> if it ain't the great salgado
[01:14] <kiko> lifeless, -built is still fucked. what's up with that?
[01:15] <sivang> daf: a nice one
[01:15] <salgado> hey kiko, how's it going?
[01:15] <daf> sivang: how did you get on with Postgres?
[01:16] <kiko> it's going okay
[01:17] <sivang> daf: stub told me that script (utilities/launchpad-database-setup) is rarely used, so it's not going to be a best use of time, so I'm going to add the required entries to postgres by hand and continue from there.
[01:17] <daf> er
[01:17] <sivang> *best use of time to work/fix it/not-urgent etc..
[01:17] <daf> I thought he said that converting it to Python would not be a good use of time
[01:18] <sivang> hmm, then maybe I am wrong :-)
[01:18] <daf> since the fix is done already, I thinkwe should apply iy
[01:18] <daf> for future members of the Launchpad team
[01:18] <daf> do you know if the fix works?
[01:18] <sivang> oh - I just recalled (please excuse my out-of-sync, I'm doing 2 more things in parallel) the fix seems not to be the onyl thing we need to do,
[01:19] <sivang> it's still failing, but on later stage.
[01:19] <daf> ok
[01:19] <daf> what's the failure?
[01:19] <sivang> for some reason, even when executed "sudo -u postgres ..." gives the same error with patch cannot rename it's temp chunk back to the original file..
[01:20] <daf> ok, then leave it, I guess
[01:21] <sivang> I will be home around 16:45-17:00 UTC , and will try make it work once again, if you're still here I will ping you with the erros.
[01:22] <daf> ok
[01:27] <daf> seb128: cool, you're fixing my GNOME bugs now that we're using Malone :)
[01:27] <seb128> daf: which ones? I was using malone for some time already before switching
[01:27] <daf> ah, ok
[01:28] <daf> it just seemed that way
[01:28] <seb128> I'm rather trying to catch up with bug log for a week or so :p
[01:38] <Kamion> jamesh: reading scrollback, FYI, spam sent to debbugs has never once managed to open a new bug, to my knowledge
[01:38] <Kamion> (which extends over the last five or six years)
[01:39] <Kamion> jamesh: the spam problem in debbugs is entirely about existing bugs, not new bugs, so is largely irrelevant to the reportbug issue
[01:40] <Kamion> reportbug *can* send followups to existing bugs, but that's more of a niche use case that I don't think we have to care about particularly urgently
[01:41] <daf> Kamion: https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/28665
[01:41] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 28665: "Bugs from reportbug need to addressed" Fix req. for: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: Confirmed
[01:41] <Kamion> daf: yes, I know, I'm just responding to something jamesh said earlier
[01:41] <daf> Kamion: ok, just making sure you knew
[01:47] <kiko> hey BjornT 
[01:49] <BjornT> hi kiko 
[01:49] <kiko> how's it going man?
[01:53] <BjornT> well, just had a little sleep since i wasn't feeling too good. i feel much better now, though. anyway, just finished catching up with email and other stuff, so i will start to get some work done now.
[01:57] <salgado> stu1, around?
[01:59] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: [trivial]  Add forgotten test for bug 3289: Can't edit gstreamer-midi bounty. (r3000: kiko)
[01:59] <kiko> r3000 r us
[01:59] <daf> 3k revisions
[01:59] <kiko> I cheated though
[02:00] <bradb> lifeless: When will we be able to access the most recent version of rocketfuel again?
[02:00] <kiko> bradb, the devel tree is working
[02:00] <kiko> the built one is not
[02:01] <stu1> salgado: Yo
[02:01] <bradb> kiko: I see up to only 2976 in the devel tree.
[02:01] <bradb> kiko: i.e., when doing bradb@chinstrap /home/warthogs/archives/rocketfuel/launchpad/devel $ bzr log | less
[02:03] <salgado> hi stub. are the shipit reports scheduled as a cronjob now? if so, what's the day/time they're scheduled to run?
[02:04] <stub> salgado: shipit reports are scheduled to run weekly at 0:00 UTC Monday.
[02:04] <daf> bradb: bzr revno
[02:04] <stub> salgado: Although todays ran a few hours late because I did it manually
[02:04] <bradb> daf: 
[02:04] <bradb> bradb@chinstrap /home/warthogs/archives/rocketfuel/launchpad/devel $ bzr revno
[02:04] <bradb> 2976
[02:05] <daf> bradb: yes, I was just pointing out that "bzr revno" is an easier way to get it than "bzr log"
[02:05] <salgado> stub, okay. did anything went wrong so that you had to run then manually?
[02:05] <bradb> daf: ah, ok, thanks
[02:05] <stub> I'll see if I can do a push from balleny to chinstrap to up the revno. I doubt I can do anything about the auto pushing, but I may be able to do it manually
[02:06] <stub> salgado: cut & paste error in the crontab
[02:06] <daf> stub: good idea
[02:09] <stub> Nope... looks like manual won't work without me doing stuff I'm not too sure about
[02:09] <stub> I guess I can rsync the branch to a different chinstrap location...
[02:12] <Mirv> see error OOPS-16A614 - cannot open editproposedmembers or the links that are e-mailed when someone is trying to join the team
[02:13] <kiko> Mirv, I /think/ that is fixed, but I may be wrong
[02:13] <kiko> salgado, can you check up on Mirv's report?
[02:13] <Mirv> just got that, and still getting at eg. https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-l10n-fi/+members/+editproposedmembers
[02:14] <kiko> Mirv, it might just not have been rolled out
[02:14] <stub> bradb: You can pull changes from /tmp/lpdevel
[02:15] <bradb> stub: Thanks.
[02:16] <kiko> thanks stub 
[02:16] <kiko> man, lifeless, can you fix rocketfuel and KEEP IT FIXED
[02:16] <kiko> K THX BYE
[02:16] <Mirv> salgado/kiko: any ETA on the rollout if it's so?
[02:16] <bradb> what kiko said :)
[02:16] <kiko> that's stub's department
[02:17] <stub> Rollout is in about 14 hours
[02:18] <Mirv> stub: ok, thanks
[02:18] <stub> Probably rev 2992, which was HEAD as of Friday some time.
[02:18] <stub> So if it was fixed before friday, it will go out
[02:18] <Mirv> while I'm at it, it doesn't seem that anyone approved/declined ever gets e-mails about that, so the text field asking for reason for acceptance/decline will seemingly go to /dev/null.
[02:22] <kiko> that's also salgado's
[02:22] <salgado> I think there's a bug open for that already. checking now
[02:26] <kiko> salgado, Mirv the bug originally mentioned (about the broken URLs) was fixed by daf in revno 2985.
[02:27] <kiko> bug 6372, daf
[02:27] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 6372: "approving members broken" Fix req. for: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Dafydd Harries, Status: Fix Committed http://launchpad.net/bugs/6372
[02:27] <daf> hmm?
[02:27] <kiko> was who fixed the bug. ;)
[02:27] <daf> oh, right
[02:28] <daf> I think it landed round about Thursday
[02:28] <kiko> right
[02:29] <kiko> BjornT, how busy are you this week?
[02:29] <kiko> and bradb we should talk a bit with SteveA about keywords
[02:29] <kiko> there's been "developments"
[02:30] <bradb> kiko: Sure.
[02:33] <kiko> stub, so you're cutting up revno 2992?
[02:33] <kiko> I'll only report up to there then
[02:33] <kiko> that way the rollout and the report match up
[02:34] <BjornT> kiko: i'm sure i have things to do to keep me busy all week, but not much is really urgent. why? do you want me to do something else?
[02:34] <stub> kiko: Yup
[03:00] <kiko> BjornT, well, we need to put some work into externalsystem.py to improve malone-bugzilla syncing, which might be an invitation to implement some improvements to bug watches
[03:00] <kiko> is that the sort of work you'd find interesting?
[03:02] <kiko> carlos, before you go, this is the week for pomsgsetview and bug 1681 right?
[03:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 1681: "Viewing a translation page fails in unix2newlines" Fix req. for: rosetta (upstream), Severity: Major, Assigned to: Carlos Perell Marn, Status: In Progress http://launchpad.net/bugs/1681
[03:02] <BjornT> kiko: sure, it sounds interesting. what are the major problems at the moment?
[03:03] <carlos> kiko, an I hope more things, pomsgsetpage is mostly done
[03:03] <kiko> BjornT, well, I know of two problems: a) watch status and bugtask status should be linked b) we hit bugzilla.gnome.org N times when updating the status for N bugtasks
[03:03] <carlos> kiko, mainly, I want to work on language packs and poimport fixes
[03:03] <kiko> carlos, okay, cool
[03:04] <kiko> BjornT, can you find out if there a specification on improving bug watches?
[03:06] <BjornT> kiko: ok, i'll take a look at it later, have to eat now. i think there is a spec or two, but i don't know how the status of them.
[03:07] <kiko> BjornT, let's talk then after you eat, I'm interested 
[03:14] <kiko> salgado, what's your plan for this week beyond reviewing cprov's code?
[03:14] <kiko> what's left of mirror management?
[03:16] <salgado> kiko, I don't have a plan yet. matsubara said he has some branches for me to review, though
[03:16] <kiko> he does
[03:17] <salgado> kiko, for mirror management, we need to write the scripts that are going to check the mirrors. I guess it's mainly this what's missing
[03:17] <kiko> maybe that's something you could do together with the reviews this week?
[03:19] <salgado> if the reviews don't take up too much time I might be able to finish it. anyway, I guess I can at least start this week
[03:19] <kiko> that'd be good.
[03:24] <Nafallo> kiko: is there any way we can remove _the product_ gajim?
[03:24] <kiko> Nafallo, I can hide it, but it have undesireable effects. why remove it?
[03:25] <Nafallo> upstream says it confuses users to have both gajim and ubuntu/gajim
[03:25] <Nafallo> so request by nkour
[03:25] <kiko> is it just a translation problem?
[03:26] <kiko> if so, I understand what he's complaining about and I might have a fix in my tree that jordi and I worked on
[03:28] <Nafallo> let's see what he says. I've copy-pasted this to him.
[03:29] <Nafallo> [15.29.05]  nkour: not only transl
[03:29] <Nafallo> [15.29.08]  nkour: it's also bugs etc
[03:29] <Nafallo> [15.29.19]  nkour: tell him to hide it or delete it for good from outside ubu
[03:29] <kiko> hmmm.
[03:29] <Nafallo> so he want's it hidden/deleted it seems.
[03:29] <kiko> well, I think the problem is more that we don't communicate well the difference between products and distro packages.
[03:29] <kiko> and I am loathe to hide this package for that reason
[03:30] <kiko> the only legal reason to hide a product would be if it was garbage or didn't exist.
[03:31] <stub> where is the launchpad meta patchage?
[03:31] <stub> erm... package
[03:37] <kiko> in dapper?
[03:38] <kiko> stub, and breezy
[03:38] <kiko> it's called launchpad-dependencies
[03:40] <bradb> seb128: Hi. Might you have some time to provide feedback to my "Use Cases for Package Bug Reports" email at some point today?
[03:40] <seb128> bradb: hey, what would that been about?
[03:41] <bradb> seb128: The report showing all bugs filed on things for which you are a bug contact.
[03:41] <bradb> (You, and possibly/probably teams to which you belong.)
[03:41] <seb128> those are basically the stuff I'm responsive for
[03:42] <seb128> what should I say on the topic? :)
[03:42] <Nafallo> kiko: I asked nkour to join and fix his issues for himself instead :-)
[03:42] <nkour> kiko, you're the same pygtk guy?
[03:42] <nkour> the FAQ guy?
[03:43] <nkour> AKA "hi" :D
[03:43] <bradb> seb128: I had some questions: How do you expect to use this report? What information do you want to see? Should it aggregate all package bugs, or breakdown per package?
[03:43] <nkour> Nafallo, and \sh can verify that they get reports that are ubu-specific (They patch with some patches for LP) in normal gajim that should not have been in LP from day one
[03:44] <jamesh> seb128: bugzilla bug 19668 did not get imported because dholbach added a watch on it to LP bug 4648, and we were using the watches to associate b.u.c bugs with LP bugs
[03:44] <nkour> kiko, so please only leave it as ubu and not as both as it's super confusing to even us
[03:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 19668: "[dapper]  please add pwcx webcam decompressor" Fix req. for: Ubuntu, Severity: Wishlist, Assigned to: Adam Conrad, Status: Unconfirmed http://launchpad.net/bugs/19668
[03:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 4648: "games (Ubuntu) - some games are not working" Fix req. for: gnome-games (Ubuntu), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Ubuntu GNOME Team, Status: Fix Released http://launchpad.net/bugs/4648
[03:44] <\sh> nkour: what?
[03:44] <dholbach> jamesh: so i'll never close that bug :)
[03:44] <seb128> jamesh: I though it would be imported as a dup or something
[03:45] <seb128> bradb: k, I'm quite busy on other stuff atm, I'll ping you back later on that if that's ok?
[03:45] <jamesh> seb128: no.
[03:45] <bradb> seb128: Sure, whatever suits you suits me.
[03:45] <jamesh> seb128: the dupes listed in Launchpad are actually imported versions of the dupes of bugzilla bug
[03:46] <seb128> I see
[03:47] <\sh> nkour: about what bugs are you talking?
[03:47] <Alinux> ciao ciao :)
[03:50] <kiko> nkour, sorry, was inside mutt
[03:51] <kiko> Goblin?
[03:52] <nkour> hi \sh 
[03:54] <nkour> \sh, do you remember the gpg_agent = True patch you ahd? that should be in yours. it's eaiser to have *one* place in LP than two. especially since we (upstread devs) don't use LP for what it offers
[03:54] <nkour> kiko, please remove so only one gajim in LP exists ;)
[03:55] <kiko> nkour, do you understand why there are two?
[03:55] <\sh> nkour: well, yes, but I think it's a matter of communication. The problem is, that LP is different from any other bugtracker. It has products, which is normally the real upstream, and the distro specific product. 
[03:55] <kiko> the ubuntu package is not the same as the upstream product
[03:55] <kiko> upstream does tarball releases and maintains an rcs somewhere
[03:56] <kiko> the package is a packaged version or snapshot of upstream
[03:56] <kiko> there can be bugs in both parts of the process
[03:56] <kiko> and translations differ between them as well
[03:56] <kiko> which is why they are different in launchpad
[03:56] <kiko> that difference isn't entirely clear from the UI however
[03:56] <\sh> nkour: and there is no way we can solve the problems of not understanding this. It's something we have to address towards our users.
[03:56] <nkour> kiko, so as upstream I cannot remove my own product from the upstream place?
[03:57] <kiko> nkour, I can reassign it to someone else if you like.
[03:57] <nkour> kiko, we use TRAC to do our job. you use LP to do yours. shouldn't be that hard. I do not like someone else to maintain sth that looks like official dev place of Gajim, but still I do not like that I do this
[03:58] <nkour> what I ask is: have it in UBU and have a LP place for it and that's it
[03:58] <kiko> nkour, the product and the package are different.
[03:58] <nkour> but I think I'm repeating myself from day one
[03:58] <nkour> kiko, ok rm product. leave pkg
[03:58] <kiko> for bugs in particular, you can use bugwatches to link your trac watches with tasks
[03:59] <nkour> a. it's doesn't seem obvius and I don't have the time to do that; b. even if it was one click I'm not forced to do that right?
[03:59] <\sh> nkour: could you do me a favour, and add to the product description a sentence like: If you want to report bugs towards non-packaged version of gajim, please go to http://... if you have a bug report for the ubuntu version of gajim, please go to https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gajim
[03:59] <nkour> \sh, could kiko does all us a favor (users, devs, you guys) and rm it so it's clear what is Ubu and what is not?
[04:00] <nkour> do*
[04:00] <\sh> nkour: i'm not familiar with the internal structure of launchpad, but I don't think this is somehow possible, as I understand the layout, there is no distro package without an upstream product.
[04:00] <kiko> nkour, even if I do remove it, nothing prevents someone else from coming in and registering it. that's not the right fix.
[04:00] <\sh> kiko: correct me if i'm wrong
[04:01] <kiko> the link between them is not mandatory
[04:01] <nkour> kiko, ok so I will make the product desc (which is the only thing I can modify and is somehow visible) sure to say it's abandoned page
[04:01] <nkour> this is brutal but same is how LP works in my eyes
[04:02] <nkour> or reassign to \sh and let him update as he wants
[04:02] <kiko> either is acceptable, I guess.
[04:02] <nkour> I won't bother anymore even asking stuff. it's been really many months ;)
[04:02] <nkour> kiko, please assign to \sh and Nafallo 
[04:02] <kiko> it would help if we worked on making the distinction more useful, perhaps
[04:02] <nkour> the page is aftearll as is alreayda abadoned as it refeers to 0.8
[04:03] <kiko> sure.
[04:03] <nkour> kiko, thanks.
[04:03] <kiko> \sh, are you okay with owning the upstream page?
[04:03] <nkour> kiko, to my eyes and to some devs. LP how it works now (and the last months) is like a prison you're forced to go
[04:03] <\sh> kiko: use MOTUIM team as owner for the upstream page :)
[04:03] <nkour> and you will always have the stamp on ur body
[04:03] <nkour> this for sure is not a nice feelig :)
[04:07] <kiko> wake up pqm
[04:19] <ohoel> could anyone enlighten me as to how rosetta translations interact with upstream gnome?
[04:21] <bradb> jamesh: Double-checking: the script was run to Cc the Ubuntu devs to all Ubuntu bugs, right?
[04:21] <jamesh> bradb: yes.  I also ran a similar script for all Launchpad project bugs
[04:22] <jamesh> so ubuntu-bugs is subscribed to all public Ubuntu bugs, and "launchpad" is subscribed to all launchpad bugs
[04:22] <bradb> Great, thanks. I'll update MaloneRunsUbuntuTaskList re: Ubuntu bugs.
[04:23] <jamesh> ubuntu-bugs is set as the distro contact, so it is getting subscribed to new bugs too
[04:24] <bradb> cool
[05:09] <bradb> daf: To change the upstream target of a bug, you can change the product on the +editstatus page. You needn't reject-and-reopen.
[05:12] <bradb> Oh, I can see that you did that in later bug reports. I was noticing reject-and-reopens initially.
[05:27] <jordi> kiko: yes, the distro/product confusion keeps coming every week no matter how well we try to explain
[05:27] <jordi> they just find it too confusing
[05:29] <seb128> I find it confusing too
[05:29] <jordi> I have a hard time justifying it myself.
[05:32] <bradb> I've watched reporting a bug on product vs. source package confuse many a Malone newbie.
[05:32] <sivang> distro is just a special kind of product , and big part of launchpad revlovles around it, that it deserves it's own object path I guess
[05:36] <seb128> what I hate is to have to go on 3 different pages to close and upstream bug, mark the distro one as patch commited and comment
[05:38] <desrt> + it's weird getting like 4 emails every time someone modifies a bug in a way that they could have done all-at-once with bugzilla
[05:41] <bradb> seb128: I'm at war with pqm to try and land the status changes + comment widget patch.
[05:41] <seb128> would be nice :)
[05:41] <bradb> It's currently #3 in the queue: http://pqm.ubuntu.com/, though I would be somewhat surprised if it got processed before my day finished.
[05:44] <bradb> This patch also fixes major layout issues on the +editstatus page
[05:59] <kiko> bradb, I think pqm is jammed
[06:00] <bradb> kiko: Sadly, I don't /think/ it is. I've seen it take longer than this to mirror. I hope I'm wrong.
[06:00] <kiko> no
[06:00] <kiko> it's jammed
[06:05] <einheit_> Kinnison: ping
[06:05] <Kinnison> einheit_: pong
[06:05] <bradb> kiko: How do you tell that the mirroring is jammed?
[06:05] <kiko> not the mirrorring
[06:05] <kiko> the actual processing of the queue
[06:06] <bradb> Well, the branch in #1 has already landed.
[06:06] <bradb> Then it sits in #1 while it mirrors.
[06:07] <bradb> I've seen this mirroring take an entire workday.
[06:07] <kiko> I told elmo to kick pqm
[06:07] <kiko> lifeless can mirror when he fixes the problem
[06:07] <kiko> why doesn't he rsync mirror?
[06:07] <bradb> no idea
[06:17] <kiko> BjornT, how was lunch?
[06:17] <kiko> or dinner as it may be
[06:20] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: [trivial]  Add forgotten test for bug 3289: Can't edit gstreamer-midi bounty. (r3001)
[06:27] <Sero> do you know how long should I wait for approval my ship request (2000 CDs) ?
[06:28] <Sero> should somebody contact with me?
[06:28] <carlos> Sero, With that amount of CDs, yes, I think someone will contact you
[06:29] <Sero> so... I'm waiting :)
[06:40] <hyperactivecrond> is there a site admin around who could un-delete my wiki accounts
[06:43] <hyperactivecrond> please?
[06:44] <carlos> hyperactivecrond, undelete?
[06:44] <hyperactivecrond> carlos: yes
[06:45] <carlos> hyperactivecrond, you have a form at https://launchpad.net/people/carlos/+editwikinames (change carlos with your account name)
[06:45] <carlos> hyperactivecrond, where you can add them
[06:45] <hyperactivecrond> ok....
[06:46] <carlos> but it's the same form where you remove them
[06:46] <hyperactivecrond> ah
[06:46] <hyperactivecrond> how does one remove them?
[06:46] <carlos> you have a 'Remove' flag on the right
[06:47] <carlos> I think you cannot remove the ubuntu's one
[06:48] <hyperactivecrond> ... alright
[06:48] <hyperactivecrond> i can't login to the wiki though
[06:50] <carlos> hyperactivecrond, what are you using as login?
[06:51] <carlos> hyperactivecrond, your login is your launchpad login not the wikiname
[06:51] <hyperactivecrond> as login? to the wiki?
[06:51] <carlos> yes
[06:51] <hyperactivecrond> ccmolik@sbcglobal.net
[06:51] <carlos> yeah, that should work
[06:51] <carlos> salgado, ^^^^ Could you help here?
[06:53] <hyperactivecrond> it says 'wrong password;
[06:53] <hyperactivecrond> sorry wrong password  *
[06:55] <kiko> ddaa?
[06:55] <kiko> question for you in bug 5573
[06:55] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 5573: "Cannot use sftp URLs for branches" Fix req. for: launchpad (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Diogo Matsubara, Status: In Progress http://launchpad.net/bugs/5573
[06:55] <kiko> or jblack/lifeless
[06:55] <matsubara> kiko: ddaa already answered that. 
[06:56] <kiko> the bug wasn't updated, then, matsubara 
[06:57] <matsubara> kiko: btw, it's already fixed and reviewed. Just waiting a answer from stub.
[06:57] <kiko> cool
[06:58] <matsubara> kiko: I need to know if he can change a DB constraint for that field. Currently it's using urlparse which doesn't accepts sftp.
[07:03] <carlos> hyperactivecrond, You need to wait for salgado or spiv. I think they are the experts on that part of launchpad
[07:03] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: [trivial]  Production config updates - librarian has moved (r3002: Stuart Bishop)
[07:03] <hyperactivecrond> ok.
[07:03] <salgado> hyperactivecrond, if you try that same email/password pair on https://launchpad.net/+login it works?
[07:03] <hyperactivecrond> yes salgado 
[07:04] <kiko> hyperactivecrond, did you ever select the option "Disable my account forever" in the wiki?
[07:04] <hyperactivecrond> ... yes...
[07:04] <kiko> well, then :)
[07:04] <kiko> okay, let me see what I can do.
[07:05] <hyperactivecrond> thx so much kiko
[07:05] <hyperactivecrond> i knew tht was the prob..
[07:21] <kiko> hyperactivecrond, what's your launchpad username?
[07:22] <hyperactivecrond> kiko: ChristopherCmolik
[07:22] <carlos> kiko, shouldn't we disable that option from the wikis that are integrated with launchpad?
[07:22] <ddaa> matsubara: Absolutely, you need to write another validator for the DB constraint.
[07:22] <kiko> carlos, see my email to launchpad
[07:22] <BjornT> kiko: lunch was good. do you want to discuss bug watches?
[07:22] <carlos> kiko, oh, ok ;-)
[07:22] <kiko> BjornT, sure, if you like
[07:23] <ddaa> matsubara: and propagate that to a new Vocabulary or whatever is used for form validation.
[07:23] <kiko> ddaa, there's no automagic way of doing that nowadays..
[07:23] <ddaa> kiko: I did not expect that to be automagic.
[07:23] <ddaa> On the contrary, I expect it to be a (relatively) large amount of boring coding.
[07:27] <SteveA> Kinnison: ping
[07:28] <BjornT> kiko: ok. i found only one spec, BugWatchTaskLinkage, which is only half finished, and somehow marked implemented, even though i'm quite sure that it isn't. i think i'll create a new spec to describe what i want to do.
[07:28] <kiko> BjornT, that sounds like a good step.
[07:28] <kiko> don't be overambitious
[07:29] <carlos> see you later
[07:29] <Kinnison> ciau
[07:35] <BjornT> kiko: don't worry, it will be a small spec. the first step i want to do is to make the bug task read only (apart from the bug watch) if it has a bug watch, and have status and so on pulled from the remote bug.
[07:36] <BjornT> kiko: does that sound like a good start?
[07:36] <kiko> like an excellent start!
[07:39] <BjornT> kiko: cool. i'll send you an email tomorrow describing a bit more what plans i have, i feel that i'm too tired to discuss it atm in detail.
[07:39] <kiko> thanks
[07:48] <elmo> jamesh: do you think it'd be possible to add something to the activity log for all the bugs imported from bugzilla?
[08:03] <dilys> Merge to devel/launchpad: [r=jamesh]  Implement BugStatusChangesAsComments, Phase One, (r3003: Brad Bollenbach)
[08:03] <kiko> rock and roll bradb 
[08:10] <bradb> That one's for you, seb128 
[08:22] <seb128> bradb: rock !
[08:22] <seb128> bradb: status/comment change is on prod so?
[08:24] <kiko> seb128, next week only.
[08:48] <cyberix> Just notified that gnunet and gnunet-gtk dapper packages are available in launchpad.
[08:48] <cyberix> All functions related are just gray.
[08:49] <cyberix> Do I have to enable them somehow?
[08:49] <kiko> can you give me an example?
[08:49] <cyberix> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+package/gnunet
[08:50] <cyberix> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+package/gnunet-gtk
[08:50] <kiko> You actually need to get to https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/gnunet
[08:50] <kiko> that's harsh
[08:50] <kiko> daf?
[08:51] <SteveA> kiko: i was just talking with elmo
[08:51] <SteveA> elmo was trying to file a bug on libpng in dapper
[08:52] <SteveA> but all the navigation gets you to is to report a bug on libpng in ubuntu
[08:52] <SteveA> the report-a-bug menu link for libpgn in dapper points to report a bug on it in ubuntu
[08:52] <SteveA> bradb: actually, this is one for you
[08:52] <kiko> I think bradb's working on filing bugs for binary packages, btw
[08:53] <cyberix> Ok, but there I get "No Translatable Templates Available" message.
[08:53] <SteveA> this is for a source package
[08:53] <SteveA> elmo: can you post some URLs please?
[08:53] <elmo> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/libpng/+bugs
[08:53] <elmo> clicking on reporting a bug, goes to
[08:53] <elmo> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/libpng/+filebug
[08:54] <bradb> elmo: You can't file a bug on a distro release, only on "the current release", i.e., the generic Ubuntu +filebug page
[08:54] <bradb> The UI doesn't make this very clear though.
[08:54] <SteveA> oh yeah, i remember now
[08:55] <SteveA> i keep forgetting the details of the malone model
[08:57] <bradb> I'll open a bug for this.
[09:03] <bradb> bug 28710
[09:03] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 28710: "Bug filing UI is confusing for release-oriented bug reporters" Fix req. for: malone (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: Unconfirmed http://launchpad.net/bugs/28710
[09:23] <kiko> jblack, have you ever used pyflakes?
[09:32] <lifeless> kiko: I'm looking into it
[09:32] <kiko> thanks lifeless 
[09:32] <lifeless> kiko: *something* is leaving stale locks
[09:32] <kiko> I just thought of you
[09:32] <lifeless> and that is fucking the update script, as you would expect
[09:32] <kiko> note that I told elmo to kill pqm today 
[09:33] <lifeless> why ?
[09:33] <kiko> it hung for hours on one of the committs
[09:34] <lifeless> if it looks like its hung, its doing sftp push.
[09:34] <lifeless> thats probably what caused the stale lock.
[09:34] <kiko> why don't you rsync?
[09:34] <lifeless> please, dont ever kill pqm itself, only kill the test suite processes
[09:34] <kiko> the commits afterwards didn t break
[09:34] <lifeless> yes, they did
[09:34] <lifeless> I have the tracebacks here
[09:35] <kiko> you need to explain that to elmo because I personally don't do anything
[09:35] <lifeless> they committed locally, but didn't push to chinstrap
[09:35] <kiko> just complain 
[09:35] <kiko> but again, why can't you rsync?
[09:35] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, hi
[09:36] <kiko> hey mantiena-baltix 
[09:36] <kiko> what's up?
[09:36] <mantiena-baltix> I still have problems on http://launchpad.net/distros/baltix/+addmilestone - I get an error about permissions :(
[09:37] <mantiena-baltix> you told me 2 days ago, that you fix this problem, but It seems you forgot :(
[09:37] <kiko> mantiena-baltix, I didn't forget, but this change will only be rolled out into production by next week.
[09:37] <kiko> the process for rolling out changes to production involves a one-week staging period.
[09:39] <lifeless> rsync is not safe to concurrently accessed branches
[09:39] <lifeless> rocketfuel is such.
[09:39] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: We can add the milestone for you in the meantime, as admins, until the permission fix lands.
[09:39] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, ok, thanks for explanation
[09:40] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Do you want me to add a milestone for you, or do you prefer to wait until the permission bugfix lands?
[09:41] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, I don't know what info should be filled in milestone page :(
[09:41] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: a name (something that would make sense as part of a URL) and, optionally, a target date
[09:41] <bradb> e.g. "future", "1.0"
[09:42] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, could you make screenshot of add milestone page and put it somewhere at internet, for example at ftp://ftp.akl.lt/incoming ?
[09:42] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, doesn milestone mean release ?
[09:46] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: I uploaded the page to your incoming dir. milestone_page.tiff.
[09:47] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: A milestone needn't correspond to a release, but it probably often would.
[09:55] <kiko> lifeless, how long does an sftp push take?
[09:55] <kiko> 8 hours? wow.
[09:56] <bradb> kiko: See dude, I was serious about the delay. :)
[09:57] <kiko> depressing
[10:01] <lifeless> kiko: thats the longest I've seen
[10:01] <lifeless> kiko: and why we are focused on the versionedfile branch, landing that will make massive differences to performance.
[10:03] <kiko> lifeless, why does it take so long being inside the datacenter?
[10:03] <kiko> the sheer size of the tree?
[10:03] <kiko> network should be fast, right?
[10:03] <lifeless> no, there are bad O algorithms in the current pull logic
[10:03] <kiko> bradb, can you add some extra implementation strategy to https://wiki.launchpad.canonical.com/LaunchpadWhatsNew -- ?
[10:03] <lifeless> and the sftp latency while small is multiplied hugely.
[10:04] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, so, warty is ubuntu distribution milestone or not ?
[10:04] <lifeless> you have seen local merges take some time I'm sure
[10:04] <kiko> bradb, I have no idea where to put the file, how to access it from content code, etc?
[10:04] <kiko> lifeless, they take about 2 minutes per revision
[10:05] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: It could be, yeah.
[10:05] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/. The "Ubuntu Milestones" portlet shows what they're using.
[10:05] <lifeless> so, if you have a branch that has 10 commits on it, thats 20 minutes, and then consider that sftp is (say) 10 times slower than local disk
[10:05] <lifeless> thats 200 minutes - 3 hours
[10:05] <kiko> I see.
[10:05] <kiko> bummer man
[10:05] <bradb> kiko: Looking at LWN now...
[10:05] <kiko> thanks
[10:05] <kiko> bradb, I'll email launchpad about it anyhow
[10:05] <lifeless> kiko: indeed.
[10:06] <kiko> lifeless, would nfs be faster?
[10:06] <lifeless> no
[10:06] <lifeless> we need to fix the root cause
[10:06] <kiko> lifeless, you could rsync and then merge locally
[10:06] <kiko> have you considered that?
[10:06] <kiko> rsync to  tempdir on chinstrap
[10:06] <kiko> merge in to launchpad
[10:06] <kiko> or something similar
[10:07] <lifeless> then we would need to run bzr in ssh on chinstrap
[10:07] <lifeless> thats getting awfully complex
[10:07] <lifeless> compared to just fixing the root cause.
[10:07] <lifeless> and time spent on that is time not spent on the root cause.
[10:07] <kiko> some things need wallclock time to sort out though
[10:08] <lifeless> well, pqm has been keeping up
[10:08] <kiko> I am assuming there are design issues still to iron out in the root cause
[10:08] <lifeless> except when it gets killed and then cannot push to chinstrap
[10:08] <kiko> lifeless, it was already not pushing before
[10:08] <kiko> and it hasn't pushed for the last 5 days
[10:08] <lifeless> kiko: I fixed it.
[10:08] <mantiena-baltix> baltix has some releases already, 0.7x was released about 2 years ago (in this release Morphix live CD and installation technology and Debian package were used), 0.8x was released about 1 year ago (ubuntu 5.04 live CD technology and Debian Sarge packages were used) and 1.0 was released this few months ago and in this version Ubuntu 5.10 startup technology and Ubuntu 5.10 packages as base were used
[10:08] <lifeless> kiko: it has been broken again by something causing a stale lock.
[10:08] <kiko> lifeless, unfortunately, the last revision is still the same since thursday
[10:08] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, so, I wanna document these Baltix releases in launchpad
[10:08] <kiko> so while you may have fixed it indeed
[10:09] <kiko> we are still unable to make any progress
[10:09] <kiko> if you have a mitigation strategy to suggest other than "wait for bzr" I'm all ears
[10:09] <kiko> and I'm okay with wait for bzr, but it looks damn bad on the resum
[10:10] <lifeless> there are no design issues blocking this
[10:10] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: right...
[10:10] <lifeless> there is a branch that is nearly ready to merge
[10:10] <lifeless> and we're all working on that and its pre-reqs like mad.
[10:10] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Like https://launchpad.net/distros/baltix/+addrelease ?
[10:11] <lifeless> anyway its 8am, I haven't had breakfast. so -> me gets caffiene and food now that pqm is running again
[10:12] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, I still don't understand what difference is between milestone and release. It seems ubuntu releases are same like milestones
[10:12] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: milestones are arbitrary
[10:12] <bradb> e.g. "future", "fooconf"
[10:12] <lifeless> kiko: it has 562 revisions to push. Patience will be required.
[10:13] <kiko> I am considering suicide so perhaps it won't matter
[10:13] <lifeless> can I have your mountain bike ?
[10:13] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Some workflows have targets that line-up conveniently with releases.
[10:13] <kiko> lifeless, one of them, sure
[10:13] <lifeless> sweet. suicide away.
[10:14] <lifeless> evolution is making me feel the same way though
[10:14] <lifeless> FUCKING thing just hung again.
[10:15] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Does that make sense?
[10:18] <bradb> kiko: Conflicts seem a definite concern with LWN, even with categories. It seems like a guaranteed conflict between people trying to land.
[10:18] <kiko> bradb, I am suggesting editing it myself, every week, with launchpad report content
[10:20] <bradb> That's an improvement over what I've read. I wonder if we can avoid a text file.
[10:20] <kiko> see my email :)
[10:20] <bradb> ok, /me reads
[10:23] <jordi> ha ha.
[10:23] <jordi> kiko's launchpad-users post is held captive in my jail.
[10:23] <kiko> cool
[10:24] <kiko> I love jail
[10:24] <jordi> I don't. So I EMPTIED it.
[10:24] <LarstiQ> throw those bums out!
[10:25] <kiko> you know
[10:25] <kiko> there used to be a site called jailbabes.com
[10:26] <kiko> http://web.archive.org/web/19981201205154/http://www.jailbabes.com/
[10:27] <kiko> http://web.archive.org/web/19990202055305/www.jailbabes.com/white/aw21770.html
[10:28] <jordi> kiko: woah
[10:28] <jordi> Georgia says:
[10:28] <jordi> I'm out-going, friendly, curious, energetic and fun. I like reading, tennis, books, education and learning anything new. I have high morals and a strong mind and appreciate the same qualities.
[10:28] <kiko> sounds like my kind of jailbabe
[10:29] <kiko> the smoking: yes is a bit of a turnoff
[10:29] <kiko> she's interested in getting to know both boys and girls
[10:29] <kiko> "man could have a damn fine weekend in vegas with this stuff"
[10:29] <jordi> haha
[10:30] <jordi> the web in 1999 was cool :)
[10:31] <kiko> indeed it was
[10:31] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, as I understand difference between milestone and release is, that milestone has list of bugs and features and release has list of packages ;)
[10:31] <jordi> Christine does not smoke. She only drinks.
[10:33] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: That's nearly the way it's modeled in Launchpad, except that you can attach bug reports to releases, to ensure a fix for a specific release, i.e., for backport and security critical fixes.
[10:34] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: In other words, attaching a bug report to a specific release is backward-looking, e.g., security fix or backport fix, and milestones are forward-looking, e.g., we aim to fix these bugs by this date.
[10:35] <kiko> lifeless, will you know of the progress of the push?
[10:35] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, ok, thanks for help. Only one thing I still don't understand is why ubuntu has 2 - ubuntu-6.04 and dapper milestones, which describe one release. What difference is between ubuntu6.04 and dapper milestones ?
[10:36] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: I'm guessing that the ubuntu-* ones were brought in from our Bugzilla data import.
[10:37] <kiko> jordi, bug 6499
[10:37] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 6499: "Import queue oopses when trying to accept an item" Fix req. for: rosetta (upstream), Severity: Normal, Assigned to: Nobody, Status: Unconfirmed http://launchpad.net/bugs/6499
[10:37] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, and what difference between dapper  and ubuntu 6.04 milestones ?
[10:37] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Probably nothing. I doubt adding both was intentional.
[10:38] <bradb> But the UI won't prevent it; it'll let you add milestones as you wish.
[10:41] <mantiena-baltix> ;)
[10:42] <mantiena-baltix> I also have ame problems on http://launchpad.net/distros/baltix/+addrelease like on +milestone - I get an error about permissions :(
[10:42] <mantiena-baltix> s/ame/same
[10:43] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Sorry, right after I pasted that URL I realized it was probably protected with the same permissions.
[10:43] <mantiena-baltix> ;)
[10:44] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: For that, you'll have to wait until the permissions fix gets rolled out. It's a more complicated form.
[10:44] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, I hope this will be fixed with same fix, which is made by kiko 
[10:44] <kiko> I need rocketfuel to update 
[10:45] <bradb> kiko: Hm, actually +addrelease is launchpad.Admin
[10:45] <kiko> right
[10:45] <kiko> addrelease is more complicated 
[10:45] <kiko> thankfully it isn't something you need to use so much
[10:45] <bradb> indeed
[10:46] <kiko> > +        try:
[10:46] <kiko> > +            return  ProductRelease.selectOne(query)
[10:46] <kiko> > +        except SQLObjectNotFound:
[10:46] <kiko> > +            return default
[10:46] <kiko> guys, IIRC selectOne returns None when it doesn't find anything -- and not SQLObjectNotFound.
[10:46] <kiko> gneuman, where did you get that code from?
[10:46] <jordi> kiko: can reproduce, see buglog
[10:47] <kiko> jordi, it may be that the tree isn't updated. we'll find out tomorrow when stub rolls out, can you test again then jordi?
[10:47] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, bradb, SteveA: what name is better to milestones and to releases ? Baltix 0.8 and 0.9 versions are compatible with Debian Sarge (uses Debian Sarge packages as base) and Baltix 1.0, 1.1 and 1.2 are based on Ubuntu 5.10 "breezy"
[10:47] <kiko> those would be 5 releases, mantiena-baltix 
[10:47] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, but 2 milestones, right ?
[10:47] <jordi> kiko: yah
[10:48] <kiko> mantiena-baltix, milestones are just something to organize bugs around
[10:48] <kiko> they are always forward-looking
[10:48] <lifeless> kiko: its does three out of 562
[10:48] <lifeless> kiko: did you ask stub/elmo to kill pqm on thursday ?
[10:49] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, ubuntu distibution milestones are identifical to releases
[10:49] <lifeless> (I'm trying to figure out why a stale lock happened on thursday
[10:49] <kiko> lifeless, can't remember. possibly.
[10:49] <kiko> mantiena-baltix,  I didn't understand that phrase.
[10:50] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, ubuntu distibution has same milestones like releases (milestone names are identifical to release names)
[10:51] <kiko> sure, mantiena-baltix. but a release is always in the past, and a useful milestone is usually in the future.
[10:51] <kiko> you can have milestones that happen between releases, too
[10:52] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, ok, I think I understand ;)
[10:53] <kiko> cool.
[10:54] <kiko> cprov, builds finished on dogfood
[10:54] <cprov> kiko: I know 
[10:54] <kiko> cprov, are you going to rekick those 3 leftovers?
[10:54] <cprov> kiko: not today, have damaged the chroot by trying to mount dev-pts
[10:55] <kiko> really?
[10:55] <kiko> what happened?
[10:56] <mantiena-baltix> but I still don't know what name is better to use for milestones and what for releases. I'm still developing Baltix 0.9.x, which is compatible with Debian Sarge (uses Debian Sarge packages as base) and Baltix 1.x (current version is 1.2beta), which is based on Ubuntu 5.10 "breezy"
[10:56] <cprov> kiko: freak BSCT, will requests dsilvers 
[10:57] <mantiena-baltix> so, maybe I should use "sarge" and "breezy" for milestone names ?
[10:58] <mantiena-baltix> ubuntu uses codenames for release names, but baltix has many releases and not all releases has codenames ;)
[11:06] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: It's your distro. Use whatever you think you can work best with.
[11:07] <bradb> The names should probably be things that will make sense to your users too, and the people that would report Baltix bugs.
[11:09] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, because milestones are for bugs and features I think it would be wise to use same codenames like distributions, on which these Baltix milestones are based
[11:10] <bradb> Your intuition is probably right.
[11:10] <mantiena-baltix> I think it would be easier to users and developers - if milestone name is "breezy" then users will know, that this milestone has probably same bugs like ubuntu (of cource Baltix has less bugs, because it fixes some ubuntu bugs ;)
[11:11] <mantiena-baltix> but question is if 2 or more releases can be made from same milestone ?
[11:20] <jblack> kiko: fyflakes, never heard of it
[11:21] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: You can have as many milestones as you want. There is no forced relationship between your milestones and your releases.
[11:22] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: In between two releases, you might have used four or five different milestones to coordinate development. Launchpad will be more than happy with you working that way.
[11:22] <jblack> kiko: Looks kinda cool. Its like pylint. 
[11:26] <mantiena-baltix> bradb, but if I use vice-versa - 2 milestones and 5 releases ?
[11:27] <bradb> mantiena-baltix: Sure, whatever works for you.
[11:28] <kiko> jblack, yeah, give it a try and use it -- it would have caught many of the errors I saw on launchpad-errors
[11:35] <jblack> kiko: That was a case of forgetting to run the tests. :)
[11:35] <jblack> But thats a great thing to know about
[11:44] <mantiena-baltix> kiko, so, I will have an ability to add milestones and releases after 5 days ?
[11:57] <mpt> Gooooooooooooooooood morning Launchpadders!