[12:03] yeah, what mako said - I don't imagine it'll be a problem once we have a good account of what you've done, it's just a matter of laying that out for us [12:03] anandaputra: cool.. email with me beforehand if you're unclear [12:04] lmanul: alright [12:04] lmanul: you're up [12:04] :) [12:05] lmanul: no need to repost [12:05] lmanul: but give us MORE [12:05] ok.. thanks mako.. [12:05] I first started using Linux back in 1999 with a "Yellow dog" distro onto my iMac. Since then, I've been using Debian quite a lot, until I found out about Ubuntu in spring 2005, simply fell in love with it, and decided to let it replace Debian on my 3 boxes (incl a server). Ubuntu had reached the point where I could really advise my non-computer-aware friends to switch to Linux. [12:05] I then began to really contribute when I participated in Google's "Summer of Code 2005", and I had so much fun hacking Ubuntu and GNOME with the help of seb128 that I never stopped :) So here I am, wanting to really be part of the community, and keep on hacking (especially on UI issues) to make Ubuntu even easier to use and even nicer to look at ! [12:05] Wiki page ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ManuCornet ) and launchpad ( https://launchpad.net/people/manu-cornet ) but they mostly link to http://www.manucornet.net/ubuntu/ where I described what I've been doing for Ubuntu. [12:05] A few recommandations : [12:05] http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/lmanul_ubuntu [12:05] And I think vuntz /queried Kamion a little while ago to give some recommandation about me as well [12:06] cool [12:06] i know you [12:06] do we really need recommendations ? [12:06] And huh, dholbach doesn't seem to be here :) [12:06] lmanul, brought us the new logout dialog [12:06] I think you have enough without him :p [12:06] summer of code wow! [12:06] ;-) [12:06] that speaks for itself :) [12:06] umm, nuff said? [12:06] 18:28 Manu has been helping enthusiastically in the past few months: he's implemented features, giving feedback, etc., and (this is most important) he has contributed to the "love" atmosphere of the [12:06] desktop team. And he's French. So I support his application :-) [12:07] lol [12:07] oh, and dont forget the add to panel dialog ... [12:07] :-) [12:07] "lmanul is a great contibutor for the desktop teams for some months now. He started with a bounty for the Google summer of code, working on the "add to panel" dialog for gnome-panel we ship at the moment and some change for gnome-menus/admin. He's responsive since on the bugs on the code he wrote, helps on bug triage, worked on a separator applet for gnome-applets (which is shipped upstream now), did the patch for the new gnome-session dialo [12:07] g and the icons for it, and is active on IRC and on the desktop list. I recommend it for ubuntu membership [12:07] " [12:07] is being french an asset or a liability? [12:07] that's what I wrote, better and the URI :p [12:07] it depends on if you're trying to sign a contract i guess ;) [12:08] lol [12:08] according to elmo, it's very complicating and somehow involves the marquis de sade [12:08] mako, you could always pretend to be a french speaking brazilian :) [12:08] beeing french make easier for you to read #ubuntu-desktop sometime :) [12:08] haha [12:08] seb128: i imagine :) [12:08] :p [12:09] I'm impressed by all the desktop contributions and I'm particularly pleased to see people continuing to work on Ubuntu after the Summer of Code [12:09] Kamion: amen :) [12:09] lmanul: thrilled to have your contributions to date [12:09] and looking forward to the future [12:09] lots of good stuff === mako is happy with membership [12:09] me too if it wasn't clear [12:09] ack too === ogra waits for lmanul's gdm rewrite in dapper+1 [12:09] lmanul: welcome :) [12:10] Thanks a lot guys ! [12:10] welcome lmanul [12:10] ogra, I'll do my best :-p [12:10] lamont: congrats :) [12:10] welcome lmanul [12:10] *g* [12:10] ups [12:10] lmanul: congrats :) [12:10] lool [12:10] Thanks everyone [12:10] Congratulations lmanul [12:11] mako: May I be the next [12:11] freeflying_: you are next [12:11] I live in China PRC , my name is Hou ZhengPeng , a member of ubuntu-cn locoteam .I've worked on package for kubuntu , do my best for BetterCJKsupport and do some test about CJK also I have translated some docs about ubntu into chinese . My future plan focus on following two : 1 promote the using of ubuntu in chinese ,2 establish kubuuntu-zh website for chinese 3 continue BetterCJKSupport spec [12:11] My wiki page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Freeflying [12:12] freeflying_ has been doing great at telling me what to do to get CKJ support in kubuntu better [12:12] freeflying_: i'd personally like to work with you on some of your input method work :) [12:12] mako, minghua is applying for membership today too :) [12:13] I read freeflying_'s (and other ubuntu-cn people's) work on ubuntu.org.cn [12:13] seems we finally have some people to solve input methds [12:13] ogra: yes [12:13] they've done very well documentation work there, helping new users in the forums [12:13] he's also packaged various CKJ fonts and skim input for kubuntu, so I'm all for his membership === ogra thinks it smells like a MOTUInput team :) [12:13] are the ubuntu-tw , ubuntu-cn and ubuntu-hk teams all collaborating on doc stuff? [12:13] the wikipage seems to imply that [12:14] I also think freeflying_'s English skill is important for communication between Chinese users and the whole community [12:14] mako: y , we are working on that [12:14] wow, that's great :) [12:14] <\sh> on freeflying and minghua are doing a great job in teaching motus and main devs how to use input methods...they helped a lot to find some issues in qt3 and the immodule patch :) [12:14] debian had some pretty famous political problems in this regard [12:14] minghua: I guess we'll get to you in a moment, but are you in broad agreement with freeflying_ on the direction we need to take on input methods? [12:14] I also appreciate his BetterCJKSupport proposal, which attracted quite some people === mako nods to minghua [12:15] i think this is one of the major areas that ubuntu needs to focus energy in the next year or two [12:15] Kamion: that depends on what he want to do with input method packages [12:15] minghua: i'd like to have them connected to language packs [12:16] I've not talked with freeflying_ much on input method issue, and I don't really know his plan [12:16] and have necessary configuration happen automagically [12:16] mako: we can get to it when it's my turn :-) [12:16] cool [12:16] freeflying_: how long have you been involved? [12:16] ogra: how long have you seen freeflying_'s contributions? [12:17] because the wikpage shows great work but seems a little thin IMHO [12:17] mako: 5/2005 [12:17] he's been around for a good while [12:17] the magic month === mako nods [12:17] mako, i'm not deep into KDE stuff, but since quite some time [12:17] freeflying_: I am interested in mako's question about cn, tw, hk's collaboration as well [12:17] minghua: we may talk about that sonner after [12:17] and is on #kubuntu-devel daily [12:17] *some* amount of collaboration is going to be necessary in that we all work together at a common place [12:17] s/sonner/sooner [12:17] but if we can have more direct collaboration on obviously related problems, that's *awesome* [12:18] mako++ [12:18] mako: the BetterCJKSupport proposal work is done by all CJK people [12:18] great [12:18] ok.. [12:18] lets get back to freeflying_'s application [12:18] since it's been over 2 hours now [12:18] yes...please... [12:18] but on the documentation side what I've seen is completed separated work [12:18] Kyral....hungry.... [12:19] Riddell, ogra: would you be ok with membership or prefer to wait a meeting or two === ogra goes with Riddell, he can judge the KDE side better [12:19] mako: he's been around long enough and has consistenly been helping with CJK, I'm all in support of his membership [12:20] alright.. === \sh agrees with riddell [12:20] and tests dapper frequently for CJK and other issues [12:20] freeflying_: are you involved in an loco team? [12:20] mako: sure ubuntu-cn [12:21] nice webpage :) [12:21] mako: thx [12:22] I'm fine with freeflying_ for membership based on testimonials [12:22] me too [12:22] freeflying_: i'm happy to have you on board [12:22] alright [12:23] freeflying_: welcome! [12:23] congratulations freeflying_ [12:23] last up to bat [12:23] mako: thx [12:23] my turn? [12:23] thx all [12:23] <\sh> freeflying_: welcome on board :) [12:23] welcome freeflying_ :-D [12:23] congrats freeflying_ [12:23] Okay. My name is Ming Hua. wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MingHua launchpad profile: https://launchpad.net/people/minghua [12:23] \sh licio ogra :thx [12:24] I am a Chinese coming from mainland China. Currently I am a Ph.D. student on materials science, in Rice University, Houston, USA. [12:24] My main contribution so far has been: 1. testing and reporting bugs; 2. helping MOTUs with transitions and merges; 3. taking care of the SCIM related packages (I am the Debian maintainer of some of them). [12:24] My future plan would be: 1. maintaining and improving SCIM related packages, as input methods seem to be a popular request from users and Ubuntu seems to be lacking people that work on this; 2. help MOTU science team, especially on collaborating with Debian. [12:24] minghua's been around for a long time - I remember your name from a conversation about translations late in the hoary cycle I think [12:24] I would also like to mention that I am heavily involved in the i18n/l10n work in Debian, which I think Ubuntu will also benefit from. [12:24] I was surprised that he wasn't a Member [12:24] or was it warty, one of those [12:24] Kamion: yes, that's probably my first Ubuntu bug :-) [12:25] mako: back to the input method issue you mentioned: I would love to see input method support integrated into lang-pack too [12:25] <\sh> minghua is quite active in the MOTU area and also one of hell bug squasher [12:25] but I am not really a programmer, so I definitely need help on that [12:26] elmo just synced his scim package from debian :) [12:26] however as I've indicated on my wiki page, input method support is my first priority in both Debian and Ubunut [12:26] minghua has contributed much oto scim [12:26] minghua: we're gonna do it [12:26] as with freeflying_ I'm happy to have more people who actually know about input methods, and particularly getting the Debian scim maintainer on-board is clearly the right thing to do [12:26] minghua: if we can get people from 4 other languages represented.. we can do this === mako nods to Kamion [12:26] and I would definitely pursue automatical IM support in dapper+1 if we don't have enough time for dapper [12:26] minghua: we'll do it [12:27] and I approve of the detailed wiki page :) [12:27] okay I'm off. I support minghua :P [12:27] so minghua++ as far as I'm concerned [12:27] thanks Kyral :-) [12:27] minghua: i don't think we have time to test it honestly for dapper.. because the changes are pretty invasive [12:27] bye Kyral [12:27] minghua: we should *start* planning for dapper+1 [12:27] minghua is helping me (and MOTU Science in general) with his knowledge of Debian and desire for collaboration [12:27] ack from me too [12:27] minghua: we should meet up sometime this week to strategize [12:27] mako: yes that's my concern too, especially dapper will be supported for 3 years [12:27] minghua: awesome :) [12:28] mako: and scim upstream now essetianlly don't support old release branches :-( [12:28] can I ask what " automatical IM support" is going to be? [12:28] mako: that would be wonderful (having some help from others) [12:29] I believe I've approved everyone from this meeting in Launchpad; let me know if I've missed anyone [12:29] Kamion: you rock [12:29] awesome [12:29] so i think that's it [12:29] earobinson: my vision is that you choose CJK (chinese, japanese, korean) as the language in install, input method (hopefully scim :-) packages will be automatically installed, and when you boot into you new gnome/kde desktop, you can use IM immediately [12:29] i approve of minghua, if that wasn't clear === ogra applauds minghua [12:29] yep, any other business before we close? [12:29] minghua: YES [12:29] <\sh> minghua: congrats :) [12:29] minghua: BROTHER [12:29] that still requries a lot of work, though [12:30] please say no, my wife would like to actually see me tonight :) [12:30] thanks, mako, [12:30] minghua: this has been my #1 goal for ubuntu since almost day one :) [12:30] ok ok ok [12:30] thanks d ogra [12:30] i think that means the MEETING IS OVER [12:30] Kamion: quickly run away :) [12:30] thanks everyone who was here at weird times [12:30] thanks for the CC members too [12:30] Kamion, only 30min and its early morning already, hurry up :) [12:31] lets do it like 10 hours earlier next time [12:31] for such a long meeting [12:31] fascinating - thanks folks! [12:31] next meeting at UTC12 [12:31] two weeks from today [12:31] ? [12:31] sounds sane [12:31] works for me [12:31] cool [12:31] minghua: would you mind have a talk about scim with me when you have time [12:32] me too [12:32] freeflying_: I have time right now [12:32] if it's not too early for you ;-) === earobinson111 [n=earobins@HSE-Toronto-ppp315854.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [12:32] elmo: could you install gnome-menus Build-Depends on the breezy amd64 chroot? [12:32] (mark will still be on tour tho, and likely unable to attend) [12:32] seb128: RT it? I'll do it before I go to bed [12:33] sorry got DCed can I ask what " automatical IM support" is going to be? [12:33] elmo: right, doing that now, thank you [12:33] Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 25 Jan 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 26 Jan 20:00 UTC: Dapper Development Status | 27 Jan 22:00 UTC: Documentation Team Meeting | 31 Jan 20:00 UTC: Technical Board | 7 February 12:00 UTC: Community Council === ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:mako] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 25 Jan 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 26 Jan 20:00 UTC: Dapper Development Status | 27 Jan 22:00 UTC: Documentation Team Meeting | 31 Jan 20:00 UTC: Technical Board | 7 February 12:00 UTC: Community Council [12:33] minghua: anyway I'd have my breakfast firstly [12:33] thanks everyone for showing up! [12:33] ok, I'm out. night all, thanks everuone [12:33] g'night [12:33] ciao all [12:33] i have another irc meeting to be in [12:33] for the GPLv3 [12:33] bah [12:33] yay meetings === dihack [n=dihack@202.53.231.30] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] [12:34] mako: goodluck, I love v3 so far. === mako [n=mako@bork.hampshire.edu] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === kassetra [n=kassetra@ubuntu/member/kassetra] has left #ubuntu-meeting [""] === earobinson [n=earobins@HSE-Toronto-ppp315854.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === lmanul [n=manu@dan75-4-82-239-58-38.fbx.proxad.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === ogra_ibook [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === allee [n=ach@allee.exgal.mpe.mpg.de] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Konversation] === mhz [n=mhz_chil@moinmoin/fan/mhz] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === LaserJock [n=LaserJoc@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Ex-Chat"] === mhz [n=mhz_chil@moinmoin/fan/mhz] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === minghua [n=minghua@danube.mems.rice.edu] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === manicka [n=grant@203-158-43-234.dyn.iinet.net.au] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === ogra_ibook [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra_ [n=ogra@p5089D533.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === robotgeek [n=robotgee@62.240.70.121] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === dop182 [i=dop182@200.226.66.212] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === dop182 [i=dop182@200.226.66.212] has left #ubuntu-meeting [] === Ubuntuser_Ba [n=fabio@ubuntu/member/ubuntuser] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [02:29] Seveas: ping === darkmatter [n=darkmatt@206-163-250-96.yktn.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === Ubuntuser_Ba [n=fabio@ubuntu/member/ubuntuser] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Ex-Chat"] === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === anandaputra [n=ananda@222.124.10.195] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === anandaputra [n=ananda@222.124.10.195] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Leaving"] === Ubuntuser_Ba [n=Ubuntuse@ubuntu/member/ubuntuser] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === freeflying_ [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.12] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === earobinson [n=earobins@HSE-Toronto-ppp315548.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === siretart [i=siretart@ubuntu/member/siretart] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === cyphase [n=cyphase@adsl-69-110-151-164.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === earobinson [n=earobins@HSE-Toronto-ppp315548.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [06:51] I'm currently upgrading my Gateway, I'l be back after ipcop decides to play nice! :-) === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === JaneW [n=JaneW@dsl-146-149-172.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === lamont [n=lamont@mix.mmjgroup.com] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === artnay_ [n=jirig@shell.evtek.fi] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === robitaille [n=robitail@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === FLeiXiuS [n=fleixius@pcp0010489211pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === juliux [n=juliux@ubuntu/member/juliux] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === freeflying_ [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.12] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fabbione [i=fabbione@gordian.fabbione.net] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Ex-Chat"] === juliux [n=juliux@ubuntu/member/juliux] has left #ubuntu-meeting ["Verlassend"] === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mvo [n=egon@ip181.135.1511I-CUD12K-01.ish.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ealden [n=ealden@219.90.91.5] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === fleixius_ [n=fleixius@pcp0010489211pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === dholbach [n=daniel@p54A66030.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Simira [n=rpGirl@tar.linpro.no] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mvo [n=egon@ip181.135.1511I-CUD12K-01.ish.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mvo [n=egon@ip181.135.1511I-CUD12K-01.ish.de] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === doko [n=doko@dslb-084-059-096-046.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === licio [n=licio@licio.estaminas.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Dullin [n=dullin@dsl-129-160.aei.ca] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Vego [n=vegard@195.159.157.54] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === ogra_ [n=ogra@p5089D011.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === signifer123 [n=michael@pool-141-157-88-80.balt.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === lucasd [n=lucas@ubuntu/member/lucasd] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === kjcole [n=kjcole@dsl092-145-217.wdc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === juliux [n=juliux@ubuntu/member/juliux] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === Vince [n=vincent@85.69.101.91] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:00] Seveas, ping === jelkner [n=jelkner@158.59.195.17] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:00] hello [01:00] good morning! [01:00] hi all [01:00] hi jelkner [01:01] JaneW: hi jane, did you get my email? [01:01] jelkner: you are up first today :) [01:01] cool! [01:01] let's just give it 2 mins [01:01] ok === flint_ [n=flint@69-173-179-231.sbtnvt.adelphia.net] has joined #ubuntu-meeting === mhz [n=mhz_chil@moinmoin/fan/mhz] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:02] hi mhz [01:02] hi juliux [01:02] Q: Who is the target audience for the Edubuntu Cookbook? Hosted by jelkner - 5-10 mins [01:02] good morning edubuntu'ers [01:02] flint_: wanna do minutes? [01:02] Hi all. [01:02] hi kjcole [01:03] hi juliux [01:03] hi mhz [01:03] jelkner, outlines at http://docbox.flint.com/~kjcole/outlines.html [01:03] hi JaneW [01:03] JaneW, we need to talk this offline. is matt around? [01:03] flint_: hi edubuntero [01:03] flint_: I think he is yes [01:04] ok is ogra around? [01:04] yup [01:04] highvoltage: ping [01:04] hi ogra === mhz is MauricioHernandez [01:04] who else do we need? [01:04] i dont have to telly you much this week ... [01:04] mhz: I do know that :) [01:04] heheh, it was for minutes purposes [01:04] ogra: is that good or bad? [01:04] ogra: do we have flight 3 testers? [01:04] good for ubuntu, bad for edubuntu :) [01:05] :(( [01:05] ok lets not get into that yet [01:05] i have done mostly ubuntu UVF work last week [01:05] are we ready to start? [01:05] tell me when [01:05] Mauritzo, I like it ... edubuntero indeed! [01:05] I have promised that jelkner can go first, since he has limited time... [01:05] jelkner: hit it [01:06] Ok, the question we need to resolve is: "Who is the target audience for the cookbook?" [01:06] I would say the peron who sets up the lab [01:06] JaneW: pong, i am just about to go into another meeting though :/ [01:06] the answer to that question will determine which way we go forward [01:06] so either a teacher or beginner techie [01:06] highvoltage: ok, can we have a web update next week? [01:06] JaneW: yep [01:07] JaneW: that was my orignial assumption [01:07] highvoltage: can you respond to question above? [01:07] "Who is the target audience for the cookbook?" [01:07] Morning Johnathan... [01:07] I don;t think it's the kids necessarily, although they may read it too [01:07] ogra? [01:07] Keep in mind there are direct implications to how we work depending on what we are aiming at. [01:07] JaneW, ? [01:08] and we don't want to aim at "everyone" [01:08] hi flihnt [01:08] ogra: looking for an opinion on "Who is the target audience for the cookbook?" [01:08] makes the book not that usable by anyone [01:08] yes, i wonder why :) [01:08] JaneW: i think the answer to that is, from a technical pov, it should be doable by teachers without any help [01:08] the book is about how to set up a lab ,right? [01:08] but organisations who would like to replicate should be able to use it [01:08] the atrget should be the admin who sets up the lab in first line [01:08] got to run, i'm being called! [01:08] highvoltage: so you agree with my 'either a teacher or beginner techie' [01:08] bye [01:09] highvoltage, I promise by next meeting I ill learn how to spell... [01:09] but the content should make it possible to use the cookbook in a class as well to explain ltsp and edubuntu [01:09] jelkner/ kjcole : think that's possible?^ [01:09] ogra: what do you mean by "use the cookbook in a class"? [01:09] JaneW: How to set up and use (as in ok, now I've got a lab... how do I use it to teach... Moodle, etc)... maybe. [01:09] I don't know in which class one is supposed to learn something about edubuntu [01:10] jelkner: he is saying it can also be used to teach 'what is linux' 'what is FOSS' [01:10] jelkner, as teaching material .. [01:10] hmm.. [01:10] JaneW, nope, not in this wide range [01:10] only what is ltsp, what is edubuntu [01:10] jelkner: got a URL for the cookbook so we can see what's in it now? [01:10] there are enough good docs explaining FOSS out there :) [01:11] I think there should be a general part and a part with a step by step explanation(something like: do this: sudo do this: rm -rf / do this ....) [01:11] there can never be enough! ;-) [01:12] so at the beginning of every chapter for e.g. Installation of Network hardware, there should be a theoretical part explaining TCP/IP, netmask and that kind of stuff [01:12] Can I take a few minutes to explain what prompted this discussion? [01:12] we need the url, so ppl like lucasvo can see it [01:12] licio, pong [01:12] jelkner: YES please do [01:13] OK, we started with the TuxLab Cookbook [01:13] we need a "server" for bzr, so people can checkout and merge [01:13] which is very much like the book most of you are describing [01:13] ogra: you got a server for us? ;) [01:13] lucasd, got one. docboc.flint.com [01:13] jelkner: yes, cos that's what we have seen ;) [01:13] corrction docbox.flint.com [01:13] Ou original plan was to keep to that text as much a possible [01:13] and to modify for Edubuntu [01:14] JaneW, if i can store the hwdb on your home PC you can have some space on my server :P [01:14] jelkner: right, and has that changed? [01:14] If we pursue this path, we will need help from ogra and others who actually built the system, to make sure we get it right [01:14] sure we'll need some technical reviewing [01:15] jelkner, i'm a bit overloaded until after the sprint (feature freeze) after this i'll have some more time to care for docs etc ... [01:15] in Kevin's discussion with ogra, he seemed to suggest that we won't need alot of the detail we were asking him for [01:16] ogra, ollie, do not lie to the nice tech writer, you are a programmer. Documentation is your sworn enemy :^) [01:16] and we didn't want to be a pain and keep bothering him, but while we can right, we don't know the details [01:16] also there is the question of others wanting to participate more [01:16] jelkner: right and is it very different to the current text? [01:17] that got us thinking about a very different kind of cookbook [01:17] lucasvo: in an edubutu training class [01:17] i just led a new user through ltsp installation last night, i could advise him with two lines to get it working ... there are not much details you need to know ... [01:17] one aimed not at technical folks, but at end users [01:17] jsgotangco and mhz have become fairly involved they may be able to help with the tech writing [01:17] but the end users are technical folks in our case [01:17] not true [01:17] i.e. school admins, teachers that care for the server [01:18] at least in our area, most of the "users" aren't technical people at all [01:18] ogra: more technical than 'the general public', but still not sysadmin gods [01:18] i didnt say sysadmin gods ;) [01:18] yes I also think that even 'technical' types my be only familiar with MS stuff [01:18] that should be enough [01:19] the big question is around installation [01:19] the TuxLab book is mostly about setting up a lab [01:19] and *much* less about using it [01:19] The original cookbook went into great detail about the stages of booting ("... then tftp bla-bla-bla...") Who was that intended for? [01:19] Edubuntu is different in two ways: [01:19] 1. It is much easier to setup [01:20] 2. The applications is comes with are much more standard [01:20] jelkner: know what, I am happy for you to create it in the way that you think it;s required, my reason for this is 3 fold. === lucasvo1 [n=lucasvo@63.180.78.83.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #ubuntu-meeting [01:20] 1) Your are doing the work [01:20] 2) You are an educator and are closest to the type of traget audience we are looking at === lucasvo1 hates GNU screen [01:20] 3) We have limited time to get it done and out there [01:21] jelkner 3. No grants, standard equipment, etc. [01:21] 4) This is not the only book, only one of many [01:21] we can always amend it again, if we decide it needs to change for Dapper +1 for whatever reason [01:21] so if it fills some good need and we can get it done, we are ahead [01:21] is there agreement of my sledgehammer non-democratc approach? [01:21] ;) [01:22] JaneW, yes [01:22] JaneW: what is so non-democratic? === JaneW claps [01:22] so the audience is teachers... [01:22] ok, in that case, we have a plan that will involve much less work from the technical folks and much more opportuniy for community participation [01:22] imho, audience = any person in a school taking care of a lab [01:22] I would say the audiense are teachers with a little aim to get to know something about the techniques used in school [01:22] flint_: no the auduence is whoever is going to set the lab up, which is likely educators in a lot of cases [01:22] we are going to have a real cookbook, complete with lots of recipies [01:23] (computing lab) [01:23] ok educator not teacher... [01:23] lucasvo: I guess it wasn't that undemocratic, just manipulative ;) [01:23] kevin and flint have taken a stab at an outline already [01:23] I would say NO education [01:23] why shouldn't one use it at home? [01:23] mhz: agreed [01:23] so if anyone wants to participate, we can invite them to submit a recipie [01:24] jelkner: nice idea [01:24] wiki:EdubuntuRecipies :D [01:24] lucasvol, educator rather than education, [01:24] I would say: any person who is aimed to learn a at least llittlebit about techniques used and has a goal to set up a lab [01:24] flint_: yes exactly [01:24] mhz: great [01:24] jelkner: we can also have community contributed hints and tips and 'favourite recipes' etc ;) [01:24] oooh, that was a thought [01:25] JaneW [01:25] JaneW: yes! === mhz always speaks his mind [01:25] Before we decided to strip down the original, I tossed around an outline idea or three with flint (partially as a practical matter, partially to learn bzr) Those are at: http://docbox.flint.com/~kjcole/outlines.html [01:25] ok, we will have an update in 2 weeks [01:25] can we be early on the agenda for then? [01:25] great, thanks guys :) [01:25] sure [01:25] "Who is the target audience for the cookbook?" [01:25] Two ways this question can be answered. The two ways are... [01:25] 1. "focus Elkner-san" apporoach ..this is a target rich environment. pick one and nail it. [01:25] 2. "big tent many Clowns" develop a framework and fill as fast as possible. [01:25] next week ogra and I are at the distrosprint, and may not make the meeting... [01:26] depends how full our schedule is there... [01:26] i'd like to make it, but leats see [01:26] JaneW: jelkner: and we could even have EdubuntuStudyContent (fr whatever LMS we package) [01:26] if there is going to be NO meeting I'll let you know by the end of Tuesday. [01:26] mhz: yes, but that will take longer [01:27] flint_ Big KITCHEN, many COOKS (spoil the... never mind) [01:27]