[06:29] <theCore> is there someone alive here ?
[06:44] <Tm_T> never
[06:45] <theCore> ok then ... 
[06:46] <theCore> the art team doesn't seem strong 
[06:46] <Tm_T> true
[06:47] <Tm_T> we do need more active users
[06:47] <Tm_T> and I need time and money to do some artwork
[06:47] <Tm_T> s/users/workers
[10:26] <Tm_T> hi omeg 
[10:27] <artnay> Tm_T: 
[10:27] <Tm_T> artnay:
[10:28] <artnay> what do you think of wiki?
[10:28] <Tm_T> haven't checked
[10:28] <Tm_T> and can't now
[10:28] <artnay> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork
[10:28] <artnay> you should
[10:29] <Tm_T> I will when I'm home
[10:36] <artnay> where is klepas... the meeting will be held soon and there's no agenda yet :|
[10:36] <artnay> do you guys want to help with that?
[10:45] <Tm_T> cant
[10:45] <Tm_T> I afraid
[10:58] <buggzero> o.0?
[10:58] <Tm_T> exactly
[10:58] <buggzero> this place must be full of live ones
[10:59] <Tm_T> all dead
[10:59] <buggzero> what do you have to do to sign up for this gang
[11:03] <Tm_T> just poke artnay for example
[11:03] <Tm_T> but dont poke too hard, I'd rahter see him alive
[11:03] <buggzero> poke?
[11:03] <Tm_T> too much typos, food ->
[11:03] <buggzero> what about a tap
[11:04] <buggzero> or a prod
[11:13] <artnay> buggzero: hello, what's on your mind?
[11:15] <artnay> really, no comments on new wiki style?
[11:15] <artnay> anyone?
[11:15] <buggzero> well
[11:16] <buggzero> i read the artwork team todo list doohickey
[11:16] <buggzero> i want to sign up?
[11:16] <artnay> sure, go ahead
[11:16] <buggzero> how does one do that
[11:16] <buggzero> im like new to all of this
[11:16] <buggzero> well not everything
[11:16] <buggzero> linux
[11:16] <artnay> AFAIK henrik removed all names from the list
[11:17] <artnay> so so...
[11:17] <artnay> s/removed/moved
[11:17] <artnay> to this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtTeam/Members
[11:17] <artnay> add yourself there and hang on this channel
[11:18] <artnay> feel free to ask any questions
[11:18] <buggzero> how do i add myself?
[11:19] <artnay> first of all, you need to have an account
[11:19] <artnay> I guess there's "signup" in the upper right corner
[11:19] <buggzero> oh... so thats what that things for
[11:19] <artnay> use that account to access launchpad.net and edit wiki pages
[11:20] <buggzero> i figureed you8 were talking about a bank account
[11:20] <artnay> you might want to give me your visa verification code :p
[11:23] <buggzero> 12345
[11:23] <buggzero> okay but how does one actually take on projects and what not
[11:24] <artnay> first thing would be to form a team to do some task
[11:25] <artnay> what were you thinking? which projects interest you?
[11:26] <artnay> read this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtworkTeam/TodoList
[11:27] <artnay> adding (project, *buntu) after your name on contact page will make the start easier for each team
[11:28] <artnay> don't get disappointed because of the current state
[11:28] <artnay> we would need at least 10 active people participating in order to get this process going
[11:29] <artnay> glad you found your way here :)
[11:31] <artnay> AUC to be wiki-based... why am I a bit skeptic of that?
[11:31] <artnay> I think it needs a working rating system, otherwise searching will get complicated when there's lots of contributions
[11:33] <artnay> why am I having a monolog here? let's have a discussion :o
[11:34] <buggzero> sorry theres a xfiles marathon on hd and its the funny one with alex trabeck
[11:35] <artnay> hehe :)
[11:35] <buggzero> ok but where does open submit the product
[11:35] <buggzero> i mean is it self proclaimed?
[11:36] <buggzero> i mean i just want some designs included in the next release i thought that would be pretty bad ass
[11:36] <artnay> so you want actually do something? or would like to get what has been done so far?
[11:36] <buggzero> yeah it all seems in a little disarray
[11:37] <buggzero> what?  I want to design, takle some stuff on the todo list
[11:37] <artnay> which tasks are you interested in?
[11:37] <buggzero> well i come from a print and web backround
[11:38] <buggzero> so i would assume splash screens, and the themes and backrounds
[11:38] <buggzero> loading screens
[11:38] <artnay> background, that would be a necessity
[11:38] <buggzero> also the thing about a new fonts
[11:38] <buggzero> about a new font
[11:38] <artnay> that's a bit more compilated issue
[11:39] <artnay> but still it's really something worth of thinking
[11:39] <buggzero> well all the fonts i have so far are similar
[11:39] <artnay> splash screen is quite good actually, and there has been a few new well done splash screens
[11:39] <artnay> so I doubt that it's pretty well covered already, although you can always improve what has been done or create a new one
[11:40] <artnay> if you ask me, there are a few tasks that we should focus on
[11:40] <artnay> unify Usplash, GDM and desktop (this includes colours and shapes)
[11:40] <buggzero> are you like the leader, high chief?
[11:41] <artnay> not that I know :)
[11:42] <artnay> but I guess I'm one of the most active ones involved in this process
[11:42] <artnay> so those weren't facts, just my opinions
[11:43] <artnay> well not just mine, actually ubuntu devs want to keep the current or at least similiar to current Usplash theme
[11:43] <buggzero> well ill take them as facts
[11:43] <buggzero> okay keep in mind im new to ubuntu so whast the u splash?
[11:43] <artnay> are you running ubuntu? have you booted ubuntu?
[11:43] <buggzero> yeah im running it
[11:44] <buggzero> wait
[11:44] <artnay> ok, so it's the process that starts after grub
[11:44] <buggzero> thats the one with the four flag like squares
[11:44] <artnay> when kernel is loading, there's some brown text that tells you what's happening on your system
[11:44] <buggzero> yeah the loader
[11:45] <artnay> yep, the one that's active before the high colour graphical greeter (login manager)
[11:45] <buggzero> allright so they want a new one?
[11:45] <artnay> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Usplash/Artwork
[11:46] <artnay> actually I think people are quite happy with the current one
[11:46] <artnay> as it is used in gfxboot as well
[11:46] <buggzero> 14 colors!
[11:46] <artnay> I know, framebuffer is the limit here
[11:47] <artnay> it has to be so it works well on the most hardware configurations
[11:47] <buggzero> well i always thought it would be cooler if the logo was the loading progress
[11:47] <artnay> there's alternatives to usplash, but they leave a nice share of computers with error msgs etc.
[11:48] <artnay> so by default ubuntu will use usplash, it can be changed after the installation
[11:48] <buggzero> well so waht if we stick with uspash's code but just changed the img?
[11:48] <artnay> what do you mean by logo being the loading process?
[11:49] <buggzero> instead of a rectangle being filled left to right
[11:49] <buggzero> the logo gets colored in a circular fashion
[11:50] <artnay> then people would focus on ubuntu text, not the logo actually
[11:50] <buggzero> well just thinking of something different
[11:50] <artnay> true, that's more than welcome
[11:50] <artnay> or then we could use icons instead of the progress bar, sort os x way
[11:51] <buggzero> i mean its a loading screen, so someting more entertaining is always interesting
[11:51] <artnay> but I don't see that happening
[11:51] <buggzero> well when gnome loads it shows icons
[11:51] <artnay> I get your point, but it's extremely dangerous to play with the logo in a process like that
[11:51] <artnay> what if something fails? it leaves you with "half ubuntu" :)
[11:52] <artnay> and fallbacks to command line
[11:52] <buggzero> ubuntu OG's will be awestruck across the globe
[11:52] <artnay> OG? :o
[11:52] <buggzero> origninal gangster
[11:53] <artnay> hah ;)
[11:54] <buggzero> i mean i think back to windows 98
[11:54] <buggzero> where we took the orignal loader
[11:54] <artnay> isn't xp still using low colours as well?
[11:54] <buggzero> and we made and xwing and a tie figher in combat, and used the lazer blasts as the progress bar
[11:55] <buggzero> yeah its only like 24 colors or something
[11:55] <artnay> have you tried other distros? some use kernel hacks that allow the use of high colour images
[11:55] <buggzero> screw other distros
[11:55] <artnay> hehe :)
[11:55] <buggzero> ubuntu is the first one ive really liked
[11:55] <buggzero> i hate kde
[11:55] <buggzero> plus all the pros i know they use debian
[11:55] <buggzero> so this was the middle ground
[11:55] <artnay> I've been quite happy with ubuntu, although dapper is showing some really unpleaseant changes
[11:55] <buggzero> im just glad to give microsoft the finger
[11:56] <buggzero> well if we control the art maybe we can bring down this tyranny
[11:57] <buggzero> what are they proposing that is so bad?
[11:57] <artnay> for me XP has worked technically quite well (although it has been limiting my use), I'm not using MS products home because of their business practices
[11:58] <buggzero> yeah it seems like its getting more and more invasion of privacy, using linux is the new fashion statment
[11:58] <artnay> umh, mainly their monopoly is what causes headaches to me
[11:59] <buggzero> yeah i mean they have the boardwalk, park place, the railroads
[11:59] <artnay> many things, like not publicizing protocols, patenting fat after a long time, not supporting open standards, doing things MS way or the highway etc etc
[12:00] <buggzero> so whats looking down about dappy
[12:00] <artnay> oh, the negative parts?
[12:00] <buggzero> yeah
[12:01] <artnay> you should try flight 3 so you would know
[12:01] <buggzero> flight 3?
[12:01] <artnay> I know it's a development version, but there's many things that won't most probably be ready before dapper
[12:01] <artnay> look at the gnome-screensaver and gnome-xchat for instance
[12:02] <artnay> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperFlight3
[12:02] <buggzero> someone told me downloading dapper now would break your shit
[12:02] <artnay> try live CD instead
[12:02] <artnay> I was using dapper on my desktop machine before it broke down
[12:03] <artnay> the machine itself, well so did dapper :)
[12:04] <buggzero> what the hell some of their new menus look ugly as hell
[12:04] <artnay> ethernet was lost and my computer kept rebooting every 30 sec or so
[12:04] <artnay> so I didn't have time to fix it
[12:04] <buggzero> gnome-xchat UGH
[12:04] <buggzero> thats a bummer
[12:05] <artnay> and the logout icon in panel
[12:05] <buggzero> well were the damn art group, dont we have a say to pimp slap some of this stuff?
[12:05] <artnay> I think that a button that is used once per session shouldn't be placed in gnome-panel that way
[12:06] <artnay> sure we do
[12:06] <artnay> those changes just happened, we really didn't know anything before it just happened
[12:06] <artnay> so it would be great if we did the artwork job and the coders could focus on, umh, code
[12:08] <artnay> oh yeah, the main priorities... background, icon set, metacity theme
[12:08] <artnay> at least those tasks should be done for dapper
[12:09] <buggzero> well thats good to hear
[12:13] <buggzero> metacity?
[12:13] <artnay> that's the one drawing window decorations, buttons there etc.
[12:14] <artnay> http://www.gnome-look.org/index.php?xsortmode=high&page=0
[12:14] <artnay> there's some metacity themes, pick a suitable one for dapper x)
[12:14] <artnay> I'd go with unity-no-red
[12:16] <buggzero> metacity is the window style?
[12:16] <artnay> yep
[12:17] <buggzero> i like the pixel looks
[12:17] <buggzero> the unity one is decent, i dont see the no red one
[12:18] <buggzero> but i hate the picture backround for terminal
[12:18] <artnay> just image the same decorations without close button being red
[12:19] <artnay> I guess it's not terminal background, terminal is just using fake transparency so it's actually desktop background that is visible
[12:20] <buggzero> i like the rectangular buttons
[12:20] <buggzero> those are sweet
[12:20] <artnay> hey manu :)
[12:20] <lmanul> artnay: hey :)
[12:20] <artnay> so we'll have a meeting on the 2nd
[12:20] <artnay> are you able to attend?
[12:20] <buggzero> feb 2nd?
[12:20] <artnay> 23 UTC
[12:21] <artnay> henrik just changed the whole layout of artwork wiki
[12:21] <lmanul> Hmm, yeah sure
[12:21] <artnay> as time is running out, we need to discuss the main priorites and form teams to do separate tasks
[12:21] <lmanul> I probably won't stay for ages (that's pretty late in my time zone), but I'll come, no problem
[12:21] <artnay> yep, it's 01 AM here then :o
[12:22] <lmanul> I'm not sure I'll get some time to contribute a lot though...
[12:22] <artnay> I suggest that we'd focus on background, icon set and metacity theme
[12:22] <artnay> everythis else is (needed) extra
[12:22] <buggzero> well i got nothing but time
[12:22] <lmanul> But I'll be glad to attend the meeting, listen, and give my opinion if needed
[12:22] <lmanul> buggzero: now that's rare :)
[12:23] <buggzero> well WHICH IS NOT TO SAY THAT IM A LOOSER
[12:23] <buggzero> im just... generally free
[12:23] <buggzero> for the time being
[12:23] <lmanul> buggzero: I'm definitely not saying that
[12:23] <artnay> buggzero: in case you didn't know, manu is responsible for the new logout dialog https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperFlight3#head-8d8b3cb6bca3949852d30fbd7acc89ed3dfc846e
[12:23] <lmanul> buggzero: I would be glad to have nothing but time ! :)
[12:24] <artnay> time and a working computer *sigh*
[12:24] <lmanul> New logout dialog, new panel "add to" dialog, new separator for the panel, etc.
[12:24] <artnay> mhz, hey mate
[12:24] <lmanul> I'm making everything anew :-p
[12:24] <artnay> lmanul: yep, but what interests us are the new icons
[12:24] <artnay> oh, comments on those
[12:25] <buggzero> wait wait the one with the icons or the one that says ABOUT gnome
[12:25] <artnay> the door scheme you're using in logout icon... don't you think green is a bit too friendly for that kind of action? :o
[12:25] <mhz> hay artnay 
[12:25] <artnay> I'd suggest to stay in a red colour, just as it is at the moment
[12:26] <artnay> maybe making it more up-to-date, just an idea
[12:26] <artnay> I was thinking something like this: http://f.unk.fi/~artnay/logout.png
[12:26] <artnay> but it should use ubuntu palette
[12:27] <artnay> mhz: so wiki got renewed, what do you think of change?
[12:27] <buggzero> allright i have to get out of here for now
[12:27] <buggzero> artnay: a pleasure talking with you
[12:27] <artnay> buggzero: you too.
[12:27] <buggzero> you'll see more of me around
[12:28] <artnay> excellent. take care!
[12:28] <artnay> mhz: the wiki structure completely ignores different *buntu flavours
[12:28] <mhz> lol
[12:29] <artnay> and I'm really not into AUC being wiki-based... I think wiki isn't suitable for that kind of work
[12:29] <mhz> yup, i guess i agree with you
[12:29] <artnay> it lacks important functions and it might get complicated to navigate
[12:29] <mhz> artnay: what 'renewed' wiki?
[12:29] <artnay> ^ topic
[12:30] <artnay>  /Artwork
[12:30] <artnay> now it's missing edubuntu and xubuntu completely
[12:32] <artnay> well they can be found, but they should be provided on the first sight
[12:32] <artnay> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork lacks vital information, I think
[12:33] <artnay> I haven't replied to ML because I wanted to discuss of it here on IRC first
[12:34] <artnay> lmanul: are you now mostly coding? can community expect new icons from you? :)
[12:35] <artnay> mhz: oh yeah, we have to prepare before the meeting!
[12:35] <artnay> mhz: want to help with that one?
[12:35] <mhz> well, artnay, maybe adding "you may find artwork related to Edubuntu, Kubuntu and Xubuntu" at Offcial Artwork section could do the job
[12:36] <artnay> why is it official?
[12:36] <mhz> i dont know
[12:36] <artnay> I mean, they're using different backgrounds, icon sets etc.
[12:36] <mhz> you should ask Henrik about it
[12:36] <artnay> take edubuntu for an example
[12:36] <artnay> I guess text official refers to logos
[12:36] <artnay> but it should cover a lot more than that
[12:37] <mhz> yup
[12:37] <artnay> and somehow we should also link to ubuntu marketing as they have web banners etc.
[12:37] <mhz> absolutely right
[12:37] <artnay> so to me the wiki change seems to be a bit rushed... no offense.
[12:37] <artnay> we did some work but we never got it finished as there were no comments or people helping with that
[12:38] <mhz> then, Henrik is the person you probably need to talk to as he made the changes
[12:38] <mhz> artnay: when that happens, and you feel you need to move on, just move on and the "rest will follow"
[12:38] <artnay> 13:39 [freenode]  (*) There is no such nick hno73
[12:38] <artnay> :(
[12:39] <mhz> artnay: yo have his email?
[12:39] <mhz> need it?
[12:39] <artnay> mhz: sure
[12:39] <artnay> I have it
[12:39] <artnay> but, umh, maybe that should be discussed on ML
[12:39] <artnay> as he doesn't seem to be on IRC
[12:39] <mhz> henrik@ubuntu.com
[12:39] <mhz> oh, you got it
[12:39] <artnay> it would be great if he had time to be here
[12:40] <artnay> but let's hope he'll be present in the meeting
[12:40] <mhz> ML is good but tell people "we need to get this to discussion before thursday"
[12:40] <artnay> because that's something artwork team was really lacking, input from canonical
[12:40] <mhz> if discussion never arises, then just move on and talk to Henrik
[12:40] <mhz> ;)
[12:41] <lmanul> artnay: about the logout icon color, the main idea of the dialog is to make each icon's color different from the others (logout=green, shutdown=red, suspend=orange, hibernate=blue, restart=purple)
[12:41] <artnay> lmanul: sure, but the shapes will give the idea as well
[12:41] <mhz> artnay: even at edubuntu I have same issues regarding artwork. We still have no clue what the "hired designers" will/are doing
[12:41] <artnay> mhz: there are no hired designers, I discussed with a few canonicals
[12:42] <lmanul> artnay : right, shapes + color is more powerful IMHO than shapes or colors alone
[12:42] <mhz> so, I thought I would have some guidelines regarding GTK tweaking and Wallpapers stuff, and icons, but in the end it seems that I will have to move on based on my own ideas ;0
[12:43] <artnay> lmanul: have you tested how that green door blends to gnome-panel?
[12:43] <artnay> it must be used there as well IMHO
[12:44] <artnay> lmanul: you had a chat with tango devs concerning the icons, right?
[12:44] <lmanul> artnay: yes
[12:44] <lmanul> The icons are mainly tango style
[12:44] <artnay> what about sleep and hibernate icons? I think there should be a small change between those
[12:45] <lmanul> yeah, it would be great
[12:45] <artnay> not just the colour
[12:45] <lmanul> But finding a good concept is not easy
[12:45] <lmanul> The "Zzz" idea doesn't quite work
[12:45] <artnay> I know :)
[12:45] <artnay> no it doesn't
[12:45] <lmanul> hehe :)
[12:45] <artnay> neither does a door with recycle icon etc.
[12:46] <lmanul> a door with recycle icon ?
[12:59] <artnay> lmanul: you, sort of restart icon (two arrows reflecting the door)
[01:00] <artnay> it was just an idea I had, but since you came up with those icons, I thought they were pretty decent and we could work on those
[01:00] <artnay> you... yeah I meant to say