[06:45] <ulinskie> why is my wiki on ubuntu saying password din not match if I change the theme in user preferences
[10:59] <JaneW> hello
[10:59] <ogra> yello
[11:00] <Riddell> hi
[11:00] <ajmitch> hi
[11:00] <pitti> moin
[11:00] <Kamion> hi
[11:00] <dholbach> HELLO
[11:00] <JaneW> jbailey sends appologies as does mjg59
[11:00] <JaneW> BenC: ping
[11:03] <dholbach> JaneW: you should do a CALL in the room. :-)
[11:03] <Simira> JaneW: are they sick also now?
[11:03] <JaneW> you means SPEAK?
[11:03] <Mithrandir> dudes&dudettes
[11:03] <ogra> dudettes ? 
[11:04] <dholbach> duderettes
[11:04] <mdz> good morning
[11:04] <JaneW> we are missing BenC still
[11:04] <ogra> dholbach, sounds like a gay dancegroup :)
[11:04] <mdz> should we do this in the usual way, or by more physical means?
[11:04] <dholbach> ogra: haha :)
[11:04] <JaneW> I had no appologies from him
[11:04] <JaneW> jbailey sends appologies as does mjg59
[11:04] <Mithrandir> ogra: JaneW and Simira at least are clearly not dudes, but dudettes.
[11:04] <ajmitch> mdz: it'd be nice to see the updates if possible
[11:05] <dholbach> fabbione: woohoo! :)
[11:05] <JaneW> mdz: the community asked for an on-line meeting as usual
[11:05] <mdz> ajmitch: the report would still go out as usual, of course
[11:05] <JaneW> true
[11:05] <JaneW> mdz: but then I'd have to do ALL the typing ;)
[11:05] <Mithrandir> haha
[11:05] <ogra> dont we copy and paste all from prepared docs anyway ... ?
[11:05] <mdz> JaneW: presumably everyone has prepared their reports as usual, and could paste them in addition to talking
[11:05] <JaneW> ok
[11:06] <mdz> but we can do it here also
[11:06] <ogra> lets just do the copy/paste thing here and discuss in RL
[11:06] <mdz> mjg59 is apparently planning to drop by this afternoon
[11:07] <mdz> no word from BenC?
[11:08] <mdz> ok, starting from the bottom then
[11:08] <mdz> Riddell?
[11:08] <JaneW> BenC: is prolly asleep
[11:08] <Riddell> done:  kpdf ported to poppler with pitti did not succeed with kword, investigate kdm for debconf preseed issue (couldn't find a problem, neither could kamion, needs further investigation), various kubuntu.org website updates
[11:09] <Riddell> kubuntu-roadmap-dapper: kde 3.5.1 all released, only 1 problem reported now fixed, (working with backport Mez to get it backported), move amarok/kaffeine to xine
[11:09] <Riddell> langpacks-desktopfiles: investigated for KDE, looks possible if careful to avoid kconfig/klocale loop
[11:09] <Riddell> kubuntu-express: reading kamion's code
[11:09] <Riddell> todo: more kubuntu-express, get network-manager working so I can investigate getting knetworkmanager working
[11:09] <mdz> JaneW: your reminder went out with enough advance notice
[11:09] <mdz> to set an alarm clock
[11:09] <JaneW> mdz: yes about 18 hours before...
[11:10] <mdz> Riddell,pitti: is kword still pending, or is it not worth the effort?
[11:10] <JaneW> Riddell: 3 of your specs are red as they haven't been approved yet...
[11:10] <pitti> mdz: it's an awful lot of work, since it still uses xpdf 2
[11:11] <Riddell> mdz: it's not worth the effort, we need to decide if we want to ship the pdf importer or not
[11:11] <pitti> mdz: which has completely different classes, etc
[11:11] <mdz> (note that the approver doesn't get any asynchronous notification of these, so if a spec needs review, the assignee needs to tell them)
[11:11] <Riddell> JaneW: kubuntu-express I think is pending review by Kamion 
[11:11] <JaneW> Kamion: can you check it please? ^
[11:11] <mdz> ok
[11:11] <Kamion> ok, will eyeball after the meeting
[11:11] <mdz> thanks, Riddell
[11:12] <mdz> is sivang in attendance?
[11:12] <Riddell> JaneW: simplify-kde isn't on my list but should be
[11:12] <JaneW> sivan is not here: he has not made further progress but is still hoping to complete in time for dapper
[11:12] <JaneW> he'll let us know in the next 2 weeks is it is going to need to be deferred
[11:12] <JaneW> Riddell: ok, I'll check that
[11:13] <mdz> seb128: next?
[11:13] <seb128> this week: new GNOME
[11:13] <seb128> next week: dapper-desktop-plan, bug catchup, gstreamer0.8 out of the desktop (gstreamer 0.10 rocks!)
[11:13] <mdz> seb128: how does video-playback look?
[11:13] <Riddell> seb128: can evolution-plugins use gstreamer 0.10?
[11:14] <mdz> since xine is now split, we have that option if gstreamer 0.10 doesn't solve the issues, right?
[11:14] <seb128> Riddell: not yet but we don't care about it, we can drop it
[11:14] <Riddell> sorted
[11:14] <seb128> mdz: correct, but gst0.10 looks great
[11:14] <seb128> A/V sink is much better
[11:14] <mdz> it works well for me, but I think we need more feedback
[11:14] <Keybuk> gst plays all known videos of mdz sleeping
[11:14] <mdz> seb128,Kamion: please make sure that it's mentioned in the next Flight announcement with a call for video testing
[11:14] <JaneW> Keybuk: heh
[11:14] <pitti> gst 0.10 works well for me, too
[11:15] <mdz> include a link to a sample video
[11:15] <seb128> and reactivity, switching between files, moving in a file, etc are much better too
[11:15] <mdz> (no, not THAT sample video)
[11:15] <dholbach> :-)
[11:15] <ogra> lol
[11:15] <Kamion> mdz: noted
[11:15] <seb128> mdz: agreed, extra feedback would be nice
[11:15] <dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Media/Testing
[11:15] <Keybuk> Dapper Dance.ogg
[11:15] <Kamion> BenC noted lack of DVD support
[11:15] <mdz> seb128: DVD support is coming, right?
[11:15] <seb128> it's known, plugin needs to be ported
[11:15] <mdz> just lags behind
[11:15] <seb128> its not done yet but they are working on it, should be fine for dapper
[11:16] <mdz> ok
[11:16] <mdz> seb128: thanks
[11:16] <mdz> pitti?
[11:16] <pitti>  * hacked kpdf to use poppler instead of static modified xpdf copy
[11:16] <pitti>  * updated network-manager to work with linux-wlan-ng
[11:16] <pitti>  * cleaned up and updated locales and locale binaries
[11:16] <pitti>  * finished openssl transition for main (only package left is python2.3 on ia64+sparc)
[11:16] <pitti>  * misc: various bug fixes, new gnome-volume-manager, some libdb4.3 transitions
[11:16] <pitti> no progress on specs this week
[11:16] <pitti> next week:
[11:16] <pitti>  * play with gnome-power-manager on powerpc and try to find a reasonable solution for the event handling conflict with pbbuttonsd
[11:16] <pitti>  * finish langpacks-desktopfiles for .server files (together with zyga)
[11:16] <pitti>  * catch up on bug triage
[11:16] <pitti> oh, and a pending PHP security update with Adam
[11:17] <pitti> (some other security updates as well)
[11:17] <fabbione> pitti: python2.3 is FTBFS because of aa missing B-D.. i will dig into that later
[11:17] <pitti> fabbione: yay
[11:17] <mdz> pitti: how many packages are involved for the db4.3 transition?
[11:17] <pitti> it's hopefully going into universe anyway, but still
[11:17] <mdz> we could divide them up and perhaps finish in a short time
[11:17] <pitti> mdz: oo.o is basically the only one
[11:17] <pitti> oh, and openldsp
[11:17] <mdz> oh, good
[11:17] <pitti> ldap, even
[11:17] <mdz> heh
[11:17] <JaneW> pitti: there is interest in the firewall spec again - is it too late for dapper?
[11:18] <mdz> ltsp + ldap = ldsp
[11:18] <pitti> but oo.o seems to be particularly hard
[11:18] <mdz> JaneW: from whom?
[11:18] <pitti> openldap probably uses transactions, so we need to be a bit carful
[11:18] <JaneW> mdz: casten (original google bounty guy and Krishna)
[11:18] <mdz> doko: is there someone we can bounty the libdb/oo.o project to?
[11:18] <pitti> JaneW: I read the mail, but didn't followup yet
[11:19] <pitti> mdz: basically, Carsten never get an answer to his bounty proposal
[11:19] <JaneW> piti: ok let me know when you assess it
[11:19] <pitti> s/get/got/
[11:19] <mdz> JaneW: I don't think there is time to complete it by feature freeze; they are welcome to work on it of course and we can take a decision then
[11:19] <pitti> JaneW: it's not going to be finished for FF
[11:19] <ogra> its pretty late ... less than 3 weeks, but if they are confident to finish it ....
[11:19] <JaneW> mdz: ok thanks
[11:19] <pitti> at least not the complete spec
[11:19] <JaneW> pitti: it was just UI missing AFAIR
[11:19] <pitti> but at least we could have the basic stuff working in dapper
[11:19] <pitti> JaneW: no, it was 'just the implementation' what was missing :(
[11:19] <mdz> pitti: that's my fault; I am down to 56 messages in inbox but that is one of them
[11:19] <ogra> heh
[11:19] <pitti> it didn't work at all after SoC
[11:19] <JaneW> oh :(
[11:20] <pitti> but since Carsten had to do it for uni anyway, I hope that it's better nowadays
[11:20] <ajmitch> pitti: that's a shame, I've seen a few people wanting that (but without the skills to code it)
[11:20] <mdz> pitti: please review the proposal; you can judge whether it is reasonable
[11:20] <pitti> mdz: ok
[11:20] <mdz> we can still fund a bounty for it even if it can't target dapper 
[11:21] <pitti> wrt openldap, I'll look into it if infinity can't do it soon
[11:21] <mdz> we do want it eventually
[11:21] <pitti> yes, agreed
[11:21] <mdz> pitti: s/can't do it soon/doesn't survive/
[11:21] <mdz> pitti: do you have a copy of the firewall proposal or shall I forward it?
[11:21] <mdz> you were CCed originally
[11:21] <pitti> mdz: I hace it
[11:21] <mdz> ok
[11:21] <pitti> have, even
[11:22] <mdz> ok, thanks
[11:22] <mdz> ogra?
[11:22] <ogra> * thin-client-memory-usage: initramfs netboot mode implemented
[11:22] <ogra> * thin-client-faster-startup: final spec changes, approved  
[11:22] <ogra> * gnome-screensaver-default-image: no work done this week
[11:22] <ogra> * general: ltsp debugging, traveling, sprint
[11:22] <ogra> * next week:  debconf debugging (to be able to set VideoRam, DefaultDepth and other X values for the memory usage spec), implement ltsp faster startup, ltsp bugfixing, merge the changes in my various ltsp trees. implement peres xauth fix with mdz's changes. care for edubuntu-artwork gdm theme handling.
[11:22] <ogra> sadly cant update my specs... launchpad doesnt like me today
[11:23] <dholbach> ogra: Mithrandir had the same problems.
[11:23] <JaneW> ogra: thin client faster start-up is red, can you push the spec to approved soon?
[11:23] <mdz> ogra: is netboot the default for ltsp-build-client now?
[11:23] <ogra> mdz, yup
[11:23] <mdz> cool
[11:23] <Mithrandir> dholbach: uh, what problems?
[11:23] <ogra> :)
[11:23] <Mithrandir> dholbach: the ekiga stuff?
[11:23] <dholbach> Mithrandir: accessing your specs on launchpad?
[11:23] <ogra> Mithrandir, LP
[11:23] <Mithrandir> oh, yes.
[11:23] <dholbach> :)
[11:23] <mdz> ogra: if the launchpad timeouts are recurring (even after a reload) or something other than a timeout is happening, send me the OOPS codes
[11:23] <Mithrandir> it works if I go to +assignedspecs, though
[11:23] <mdz> I'm not having a problem there
[11:23] <ogra> mdz, will do
[11:24] <mdz> ogra: thanks
[11:24] <mdz> mvo?
[11:24] <ogra> Mithrandir, oh thanks !
[11:24] <mvo> Did:
[11:24] <mvo> - AutomaticUpgrades:
[11:24] <mvo>   - testing
[11:24] <mvo>   - evaluted user feedback
[11:24] <mvo>   - fixed some packages that broke upgrades
[11:24] <mvo>   - send report about current status of the upgrade to ubuntu-devel
[11:24] <mvo>   - started to write a NonInteractive DistUpgrade tester to autotest problems during the dist-upgrade
[11:24] <mvo>   - BIG problem: a single failed pkg makes a upgrade stop halfway through
[11:24] <mvo> - misc stuff [gksu statup notification, HIGification on language-seelctor, update-manager)
[11:24] <mvo> - traveld, sprint, got sick
[11:24] <mvo> Will do:
[11:24] <mvo> - finish the non-interactive dist-upgrade autotester
[11:24] <mvo> - gnome-app-install new-look branch finish and upload
[11:24] <mdz> mvo demoed AutomaticUpgrades here at the sprint earlier this week; it's looking good
[11:25] <mdz> all you lurkers out there should test it
[11:25] <JaneW> mvo: default apt sources? Is it still going to get done?
[11:25] <mvo> and don't forget to send me logs if you test it!
[11:25] <mvo> JaneW: yes, I'm confident in that one
[11:25] <mdz> it's in braindump currently
[11:25] <JaneW> mvo: ok good, approved spec please (or else straight to implemented) ;)
[11:26] <mdz> JaneW: did mjg59 send any update?   we can hassle him in a few hours if not
[11:26] <mdz> mvo: thanks
[11:26] <ogra> JaneW, thin-client-faster startup is not red in my launchpad overview ...
[11:26] <JaneW> mdz: yes
[11:26] <JaneW> mjg59 JaneW: Basically, everything's sorted - libpam-foreground and gnome-power-manager need to be added to desktop
[11:27] <JaneW> ogra: it's read cos it's not yet approved
[11:27] <Kamion> as pitti said gnome-power-manager needs some work on powerpc
[11:27] <ogra> JaneW, it was approved this morning
[11:27] <mjg59> g-p-m should be fine on ppc, hal may need some loving
[11:27] <mdz> seb128,dholbach: do you concur re: g-p-m?
[11:27] <JaneW> ogra: oic, excellent, thanks :)
[11:27] <ogra> JaneW, (and has the right status in LP)
[11:27] <mjg59> And pbbuttons probably needs to go
[11:27] <pitti> mjg59: event handling of pbbuttonsd and g-p-m should conflict, don't they?
[11:27] <JaneW> ogra: I haven;t checked the changes this am yet
[11:27] <mdz> if so, please go ahead and seed
[11:27] <pitti> mjg59: g-p-m depends p-m-i depends pbbuttonsd
[11:28] <mdz> mjg59: still coming by later?
[11:28] <slomo> mjg59: pbbuttonsd is still needed for brightness setting etc
[11:28] <JaneW> hi jbailey 
[11:28] <pitti> slomo: no, gnome-settings-daaemon does that for ages
[11:28] <mjg59> mdz: Yeah
[11:28] <ogra> mdz, i'll care for the seeding ...
[11:28] <seb128> mdz: I didn't really played with g-p-m, maybe dholbach?
[11:28] <mjg59> pitti: Well, that can be fixed
[11:28] <mdz> mjg59: ok, see you later then
[11:28] <mjg59> slomo: No it's not - hal can do that
[11:28] <pitti> we already had to cripple pbbuttonsd a lot 
[11:28] <seb128> s/played/play
[11:28] <dholbach> mdz: a bit and it looked good from what i saw.
[11:28] <mdz> ok
[11:28] <mdz> let's go ahead then
[11:28] <pitti> mjg59: so g-p-m doesn't use pmi?
[11:28] <mdz> libpam-foreground also
[11:28] <ogra> pitti, it does ...
[11:29] <mdz> mjg59: thanks
[11:29] <mdz> Mithrandir?
[11:29] <mjg59> pitti: It does, but that only needs pbbuttons to make one ioctl
[11:29] <mjg59> Anyway, we'll talk abou this later
[11:29] <ogra> pitti, (hal does in fact)
[11:29] <pitti> yes
[11:30] <Mithrandir> openoffice-amd64: no progress
[11:30] <Mithrandir> live-cd-performance: no further progress
[11:30] <Mithrandir> simplified-livecd: support for putting the live image on USB stick/hard drive added, support for persistency in a loopback (ext2/ext3/whatever) filesystem on vfat added, keymapper stuff Not Yet There, now autoconfigures all found network devices
[11:30] <Mithrandir> misc: distro sprint death plague struck, been having useful discussions with Colin about espresso and how I can help once I get my specs out of the way.  Apache sprint was very productive even though we ended up with a decision to not put 2.2 in dapper due to external modules not being ready.
[11:30] <Mithrandir> probe-for-root-filesystem: started on it today, will hopefully be completed today as well.
[11:30] <Mithrandir> blocked on: access to popcon.ubuntu.com
[11:30] <Mithrandir> (the blocked on is not for a spec, but for getting popcon going again)
[11:30] <mdz> Mithrandir: is there anything from the original simplified-livecd spec which isn't complete yet, or can it be marked implemented?
[11:30] <Mithrandir> we don't handle keyboard maps yet
[11:31] <mdz> Mithrandir: is popcon a sysadmin request? if so, please send the RT ticket number by email
[11:31] <Mithrandir> yes, it is.
[11:31] <Kamion> (gfxboot passes the keymap - casper just needs to do something with that)
[11:31] <mdz> ok, good
[11:31] <Mithrandir> I think it's waiting for admins to set up a replacement for the current machine
[11:32] <mdz> Mithrandir: can we use probe-for-root-filesystem for casper-on-USB as well as install-on-USB?
[11:33] <Mithrandir> casper-on-usb is already there, and no, it's a bit different.  probe-for-root-filesystem seems to just need grub-installer changes, not changes in the installed system.
[11:33] <Mithrandir> Scott has already fixed udev to DTRT when you pass root=/dev/disk/by-uuid/${...}
[11:33] <mdz> Keybuk,Mithrandir: still planning to have a readahead chat while you're here?
[11:34] <mdz> Mithrandir: casper-on-usb just searches around for something with a filesystem image on it, then?
[11:34] <Kamion> Mithrandir: yaboot-installer too?
[11:34] <Kamion> though that might be hairier
[11:34] <Keybuk> mdz: yeah, will still have that chat
[11:34] <Mithrandir> Kamion: that too, but I can't test that in anything resembling a useful way.
[11:34] <Kamion> open firmware being the weird-shit that it is
[11:34] <fabbione> i suggest to skip ppc for this feature
[11:35] <Mithrandir> mdz: with a fairly restricted set of "something", yes.  It doesn't try to look in ext2/ext3 partitions, for instance.
[11:35] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: the caveat is that it doesn't work if you need ide-generic (because it doesn't know to load it)
[11:35] <Kamion> if anyone here has a firewire drive, actually, that might be useful
[11:35] <Mithrandir> Kamion: I have an ieee1394 dvd-rw in Oslo
[11:35] <Mithrandir> so, probably not useful.
[11:35] <Kamion> not so much
[11:35] <mdz> Keybuk: can we arrange for that to be loaded in this case?
[11:35] <mvo> Kamion: I have one
[11:35] <Keybuk> mdz: then it'd break your laptop
[11:35] <Kamion> mvo: cool, will talk later
[11:36] <mdz> Keybuk: I don't use root=/dev/disk/by-uuid/foo on my laptop
[11:36] <Keybuk> right, but you wouldn't be able to use it either
[11:36] <Keybuk> including whatever Tollef was doing
[11:36] <mdz> the plan so far is only to use this method if root is on a removable device
[11:36] <Keybuk> removable devices are always SCSI
[11:36] <Keybuk> (in Linuxworld)
[11:37] <fabbione> Keybuk: nope 
[11:37] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: udevinfo can give you the path, though
[11:37] <Keybuk> fabbione: the IDE subsystem has no concept of of "removable"
[11:37] <fabbione> Keybuk: you don't use IDE at all there
[11:37] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: chcken and egg
[11:37] <Keybuk> in practice this shouldn't be a problem
[11:38] <Keybuk> if we only use /dev/disk/by-*/* for "removable" devices, then we only care about the SCSI subsystem
[11:38] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: how so?  I'm thinking of doing it in the installer, where you'd see the drive or not.  If you don't see it in the installer, you lose.
[11:38] <Keybuk> and that will all work fine
[11:38] <mdz> Mithrandir: oo.o-amd64 seems a lost cause at this point, no?
[11:38] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: let's discuss the problem with clarity in a bit
[11:39] <Mithrandir> mdz: I guess so.. the current solution works, while it's not pretty.
[11:39] <mdz> let's officially defer it, then
[11:39] <Mithrandir> 'k
[11:39] <mdz> dapper+1 material
[11:39] <mdz> thanks, Mithrandir
[11:39] <mdz> Keybuk?
[11:39] <Keybuk> streamlined-boot: remaining changes are to the cleanup scripts and improving readahead; no new breakages expected
[11:39] <Keybuk> network-magic: testing of n-m underway, when it works, it's great.  going to modify it to work better for us, and then decide whether it's ship-able or desktop-able.  resolv.conf bug fixed in ifupdown, still to write iftab helper for udev but it's high on todo now.
[11:40] <doko> Mithrandir: how do the -experimental OOo2 packages work?
[11:40] <mdz> Keybuk: should probably get streamlined-boot reviewed and approved, considering it's nearly implemented
[11:40] <Kamion> Keybuk: oh, we should sit down and sort out netcfg udev rule generation so that interface names don't change between the installer and the target system
[11:40] <fabbione> or between reboots. kthxbye
[11:40] <mdz> Keybuk: maybe sit down with Kamion and go over the changes you've made vs. the spec
[11:40] <mdz> Kamion: I believe that's just waiting for Keybuk to implement iftab support in udev
[11:40] <JaneW> Keybuk: streamlined boot, is the spec going to be approved? - or straight to implemnted?
[11:41] <Kamion> mdz: that works too, I guess
[11:41] <mdz> the installer can continue to write iftab
[11:41] <Keybuk> mdz, JaneW: yeah, I should probably ...errr... write that spec ;)
[11:41] <mdz> it involves quite a few different changes and would benefit from some peer review
[11:41] <JaneW> Keybuk: thanks, that would be good ;) 
[11:42] <mdz> Keybuk: thanks
[11:42] <mdz> Kamion?
[11:42] <Kamion> cd-bootloader: Added an accessibility menu for UbuntuExpress/Accessibility.
[11:42] <Kamion> ubuntu-express: Uploaded an initial working-for-me version; and have spent a fair bit of the distro sprint polishing away some of the really egregious bugs. Made cdebconf and debconf coinstallable and added preliminary support for using cdebconf here; initial testing suggests it doesn't provide really noticeable speed benefits, but it may help avoid some compatibility bugs. Started bringing Tollef up to speed on wher
[11:42] <Kamion> e things are. Added first cut at a to-do list on the wiki (UbuntuExpress/ToDo) so that Tollef and Jonathan can dive in.
[11:43] <Kamion> misc: Some system-config-kickstart maintenance (I'm working on getting this stuff into Debian so we don't necessarily have to worry about maintaining it ourselves so much).
[11:43] <Kamion> next-week: Shake up the Espresso component API to allow for running debconffiltered processes asynchronously, which will let me massively improve UI responsiveness in the first few steps. Start on the missing UI steps (language, keymap, location/timezone). Thinking about killing archive-copier by default since it's not all that necessary any more.
[11:43] <JaneW> I have jbailey's update...
[11:43] <mdz> Kamion: is there implementation work to be done for the localized help in cd-bootloader, or just translations?
[11:44] <Kamion> mdz: implementation, basically just file-shuffling
[11:44] <jbailey> JaneW: Please, thanks.
[11:44] <mdz> Kamion: ready for  a live espresso demo after the meeting?
[11:44] <jbailey> (I wrote it in the email to you and don't have it handy. *g*)
[11:45] <Mithrandir> mdz: I'm hogging his machine for grub-installer foo, so preferably not. :-)
[11:45] <Kamion> mdz: sure, will need a bit of prep time though since Tollef's stolen the test box for other things
[11:45] <Mithrandir> or at least not right away.
[11:45] <mdz> definitely today though
[11:45] <Kamion> certainly
[11:45] <iwj> kamion: You can use this test box here ...
[11:45] <mdz> preferably before lunch, while we're all focused together
[11:45] <Kamion> iwj: ok, thanks
[11:45] <mdz> or directly after lunch
[11:45] <mdz> Kamion: thanks
[11:45] <JaneW> jbailey : * ToolchainRoadmapNg: Led a group discussion at the Distro Sprint with
[11:45] <JaneW> doko - See http://people.ubuntu.com/~jbailey/thinclient.txtfor initial
[11:45] <JaneW> brainstorm. For those interested in participating, please see
[11:45] <JaneW> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/20060131_dropping-pre-i686_jbailey-doko.oggand post comments to ubuntu-devel and put [small]  in the subject.
[11:46] <JaneW> jbailey: * ToolchainRoadmap: Providing timezones directly from upstream tzdata
[11:46] <JaneW> going well. Targetting to upload tomorrow (Friday 02 Feb). 
[11:46] <JaneW> * LocalesThatDontSuck: Update from Belocs locales coordinated with
[11:46] <JaneW> pitti. This will move localedef out of glibc and into a separate binary
[11:46] <JaneW> package.
[11:46] <JaneW> General: Distro sprint this week. Avoided the plague (/me knocks wood).
[11:46] <JaneW> Spent time talking with Martin about Main Inclusion and support. 
[11:46] <mdz> jbailey: what remains on ToolchainRoadmap, for your part?
[11:46] <mdz> same question for belocs
[11:47] <pitti> belocs is basically done now
[11:47] <pitti> with this morning's uploads
[11:47] <jbailey> mdz: Just these last tweaks to make updating timezones not suck across 5 years.  Other than that it's just the usual set of bugs.
[11:47] <mdz> pitti: ok, if so, please mark as implemented
[11:47] <doko> mdz: ToolchainRoadmap+1: need to think how we go on with a breezy/dapper test build
[11:48] <pitti> jbailey: belocs had a separate spec?
[11:48] <jbailey> mdz: ToolchainRoadmap+1 is behind because of the lack of test build.  I think it was due in December, but depended on Soyuz.
[11:48] <jbailey> pitti: LocalesThatDontSuck is the wiki page.  Lemme look up what we called it in Launchpad.
[11:48] <mdz> doko,jbailey: I see no reason why a dapper-autotest couldn't be done right away, in terms of infrastructure
[11:48] <mdz> (using katie and wanna-build)
[11:49] <jbailey> mdz: How do we coordinate that?
[11:49] <mdz> same as the last few times, via lamont/infinity/elmo
[11:49] <mdz> soyuz won't have a snazzy autotest capability for a while; it'd have to be done more or less by hand there as well
[11:49] <pitti> jbailey: don't worry, this one is implemented for ages
[11:49] <mdz> so no point in waiting for that
[11:49] <doko> mdz: let's discuss this in person, it didn't work well last time
[11:49] <jbailey> Cool, hopefully next week (subject to infinity jetlag and elmo time)
[11:50] <mdz> doko: hmm, ok
[11:50] <mdz> jbailey: thanks
[11:50] <mdz> iwj?
[11:50] <jbailey> pitti: Right.  It's even called "Belocs-locales" =)
[11:50] <iwj> AutomatedTesting:  Announcement to go out RSN; found a few bugs which I want to get out first.
[11:50] <iwj> Firefox: Some bugfixes (including turning offesddsp) uploaded early this week.  pygnome coredump will hopefully be fixed RSN.  Anyone else have a firefox problem they want to demo for me ?
[11:50] <iwj> DefaultApplicationsFirefox: no change since last report.
[11:50] <iwj> DeveloperDocumentation: Not started, not blocked.
[11:50] <iwj> Death plague: I'm more or less recovered but I still feel very thickheaded today.
[11:50] <Keybuk> *ahem* ... X bug
[11:50] <iwj> Bugs backlog: awful.
[11:50] <jbailey> pitti: I'll look over the spec later to make sure that it reflects what we actually implemented.
[11:50] <iwj> Email backlog: none.
[11:51] <mdz> iwj: pygnome coredump?
[11:51] <seb128> is that the gtkmozembed crasher?
[11:51] <iwj> mdz: There's a bug which makes pymozgnombed or whatever it's called crash.
[11:51] <iwj> Yes.
[11:51] <mdz> ah
[11:52] <seb128> nice to get that one fixed
[11:52] <Kamion> yeah, I ripped gtkmozembed out of espresso to avoid that :)
[11:52] <Kamion> (that code path sucked anyway ...)
[11:52] <mdz> firefox (sans flash) has been behaving pretty well for me
[11:52] <mvo> I use gtkhtml2 in gnome-app-installright now
[11:52] <mvo> but ...
[11:52] <iwj> mdz: Good.
[11:52] <doko> iwj: there are Firefox problems on amd64
[11:52] <Mithrandir> doko: oh, what?
[11:52] <iwj> doko: Still ?
[11:52] <ogra> not herre
[11:52] <ogra> -r
[11:52] <iwj> Where then ? :-)
[11:53] <doko> iwj, Mithrandir: still the same as reported in launchpad, looking up the number ...
[11:53] <dholbach> Is there any upstream bug about pygtkmozembed?
[11:54] <iwj> dholbach: Not that I know of but I haven't had a thorough look.
[11:54] <mdz> ok
[11:54] <mdz> infinity is bedridden
[11:54] <mdz> thanks iwj
[11:54] <mdz> fabbione? 
[11:54] <fabbione> sec
[11:54] <fabbione> vim died
[11:55] <ajmitch> this plague sounds serious
[11:55] <fabbione> * server-candy: done last cleanup for system-integrity-check still blocked on admins to prepare the server.
[11:55] <fabbione> * ubuntu-cluster: no progress.
[11:55] <fabbione> * boot-from-usb: implemented.
[11:55] <fabbione> * last week: Apache2.2 sprint, distro sprint. Details have gone into Jane's reports.
[11:55] <fabbione> * this week: distro sprint: server candy work and a lot of small things: fix a few FTBFS, fixed a kernel regression in .12 for a scsi driver that made the system unbootable (needs porting to dapper). Created ubuntu-x-swat team for X server maintainance (suicide is less painful). Started looking at X... no really..
[11:55] <fabbione> * next week: world peace.
[11:55] <JaneW> mdz: I'll get an update from infinity if he emerges
[11:55] <ogra> uh, he switched to gentoo ?
[11:55] <ajmitch> ogra: bad pun 
[11:55] <ogra> :)
[11:55] <mdz> fabbione: is server-candy blocked, or not?  you say it's blocked, but that you will work on it this week
[11:56] <fabbione> mdz: i cannot upload to the archive is the admins do not provide the server.
[11:56] <fabbione> mdz: i can still do code cleanup and test locally
[11:56] <fabbione> but clearly it would be nice that if i can actually get a wide spreaded test
[11:56] <fabbione> RT#723
[11:58] <mdz> sysadmin has some high priority things coming in right now due to soyuz and sparc, but I'll see what can be done
[11:58] <mdz> meanwhile, X bugs need your sweet loving
[11:58] <fabbione> mdz: yes i know about that. tho 723 is from UBZ or so
[11:59] <mdz> fabbione: yes, but we need to deal with the present :-)
[11:59] <fabbione> mdz: yeah i know.. please reassing them to the SWAT team
[11:59] <mdz> fabbione: thanks for updates
[11:59] <mdz> doko?
[11:59] <doko> [status] 
[11:59] <doko> - no changes from last week, besides
[11:59] <doko> - openoffice.org: don't stick with 2.0.1, but start working
[11:59] <doko>   on upgrades to current milestones leading to 2.0.2.
[11:59] <doko> [this week] 
[11:59] <doko> - distrosprint
[11:59] <doko> - fixing sparc specific bugs
[11:59] <doko> - practical virus testing (should be fixed now)
[11:59] <doko> [still to do for this week] 
[11:59] <doko> - ISDN testing, together with mvo
[11:59] <mdz> doko: openoffice-gnome?
[12:00] <doko> mdz: the martink bounty? 
[12:00] <mdz> doko: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OpenOfficeGnome
[12:00] <mdz> marked approved, high priority in LP
[12:01] <mdz> doko: regarding martink, if he completed the work to your satisfaction, please send me mail to that effect so that we can close out the bounty
[12:01] <JaneW> doko: java-roadmap spec still needs to be approved...
[12:02] <mdz> I'm the approver on that one, didn't realize it was pending
[12:02] <mdz> er
[12:02] <JaneW> tsk tsk, we really need that auto-mailer functionality...
[12:02] <mdz> the link from LP to the spec is broken
[12:02] <mdz> there is no JavaRoadmap in the wiki, hence nothing to approve
[12:02] <doko> mdz: the "my defaults" are underspecified, a suggestion from a user. font hinting was low priority, there's a workaround using environment variables, but not gnome integration
[12:03] <JaneW> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDownUnder/BOFs/JavaRoadmap ?
[12:03] <doko> JaneW, mdz: java-roadmap is low priority, as descriobed, will work on an openoffice.org2 specific solution as it's done for eclipse
[12:04] <JaneW> and LP spec https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/java-roadmap
[12:04] <mdz> doko: regarding openoffice-gnome, is there work that can be done or no?
[12:04] <mdz> if so, it's high priority, otherwise, must be deferred
[12:05] <mdz> JaneW: that wiki page looks like the old JavaRoadmap spec from UDU
[12:05] <JaneW> mdz: agreed...
[12:05] <doko> mdz: the hinting can be done, will update next week. will talk to seb128 for the copy/paste integration, "my defaults" should not be done
[12:06] <mdz> doko: is there a new JavaRoadmap spec?
[12:06] <doko> mdz: update for "only OOo"?
[12:07] <mdz> doko: hmm?
[12:08] <mdz> doko,mvo: how are you planning to do ISDN testing here?  do we have ISDN service available?
[12:08] <doko> mdz: do you mean https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NativeJavaGcjPackages ?
[12:08] <mvo> mdz: I have various isdn hardware with me (and a modem)
[12:08] <mdz> doko: I mean https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/java-roadmap
[12:08] <mvo> we may only be able to test everything but the connecting :/
[12:09] <mdz> doko: the summary mentions gcj
[12:09] <doko> mdz: ISDN: it's just getting firmware loaded with udev, for breezy we did use hotplug
[12:09] <mdz> doko: but the hyperlink goes nowhere, and there are some other components to it as well
[12:09] <mdz> doko,vmo: re: ISDN, ok
[12:09] <mdz> s/vmo/mvo/
[12:09] <Kamion> Riddell: I've approved kubuntu-express now with the changes I mentioned. Note the status whiteboard though - I think it would help to design the UI in advance and have a usability person look it over.
[12:09] <doko> mdz: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDownUnder/BOFs/JavaRoadmap
[12:10] <mdz> doko: if that's the real java-roadmap spec, please update the URL in LP
[12:10] <Riddell> Kamion: thanks, will do probably after a demo 
[12:10] <doko> mdz: ok
[12:10] <Kamion> Riddell: (not that my demo will bear much relation to the final UI as yet)
[12:10] <mdz> ok, we're over time already
[12:10] <mdz> dholbach?
[12:11] <dholbach> this week (done): GNOME 2.13.90, random fixes
[12:11] <dholbach> this week (todo): serious bug triage with seb256 (now that he's feeling better again), try to make evolution work with bogofilter
[12:11] <dholbach> next week: visit London, bug triage, apt-get.org reviews
[12:11] <JaneW> and there's no daniels or BenC...
[12:11] <mdz> dholbach: enjoy the holiday next week
[12:12] <mdz> thanks dholbach and doko
[12:12] <dholbach> mdz: thanks a lot
[12:12] <mdz> JaneW: please find out what happened to BenC
[12:13] <JaneW> mdz: I will
[12:13] <Riddell> mdz: mornfall is waiting on a reply to kubuntu-package-manager
[12:13] <mdz> JaneW: daniels I don't expect will be attending these meetings going forward
[12:13] <mdz> Riddell: it's a major piece of work and I've asked for input from mark on it
[12:13] <Riddell> ok
[12:13] <JaneW> nod, do we need any further updates in x? I know it's implemented, but does it need further tracking at all?
[12:13] <mdz> JaneW: only the issues we discussed tuesday
[12:14] <JaneW> we could shift x into someone else's section for that
[12:14] <ogra> JaneW, it will have bugs that need to be fixed before release ...
[12:14] <mdz> if there's anything else to discuss, let's do it in person
[12:14] <mdz> thanks everyone, adjourned
[12:14] <ajmitch> mdz: hm?
[12:14] <fabbione> cuya
[12:15] <JaneW> bye
[12:15] <pitti> bye
[12:15] <ajmitch> ah well
[12:15] <JaneW> ajmitch: handg 10
[12:15] <jsgotangco> heh
[12:15] <JaneW> hang 10 even
[12:15] <mdz> ajmitch: hmm?
[12:15] <ajmitch> sorry, I'd written up an update for selinux
[12:15] <Mithrandir> I think ajmitch wanted to throw in his update
[12:16] <mdz> ajmitch: if you have dapper work in progress, please arrange with JaneW to get it tracked on the status spreadsheet
[12:16] <JaneW> ajmitch: shoot
[12:16] <ajmitch> no matter, I might not have time before feature freeze now
[12:16] <ajmitch> selinux: spec not approved, some implementation details have changed since UBZ due to switch to modular reference policy. Probably not time for a bounty before feature freeze. - building targeted & strict policies off the reference policy project, currently monolithic but switching to modularised policy.
[12:16] <ajmitch>  - some basic tools for managing selinux users & booleans are being done with the python bindings.
[12:16] <ajmitch>  - going to try & coordinate policy packaging with debian, talked with the current policy maintainer at LCA & he's happy to let me maintain refpolicy in debian with his help.
[12:16] <mdz> pitti: you're approver on that spec
[12:16] <ajmitch> timing looks shaky now that I'm off to australia next week
[12:16] <ajmitch> but I'll see what net access I have there
[12:17] <JaneW> ajmitch: your call, want it track or not?
[12:17] <mdz> ajmitch: we can certainly lay the groundwork in dapper, but I don't think it's something we'll want to switch on for this release due to our conservative strategy
[12:17] <ajmitch> JaneW: might as well
[12:17] <pitti> mdz: ok, I'll look at it
[12:17] <ogra> if its not going to be implemented, can we switch off the "cant mount /selinux/" message ? 
[12:17] <JaneW> ajmitch: ok will add it
[12:17] <ajmitch> mdz: understood, I've discussed that briefly with pitti
[12:17] <mdz> ajmitch: I'm interested in hearing about your progress though
[12:17] <mdz> ok
[12:17] <mdz> I need to make a phone call, anything else?
[12:17] <ajmitch> ogra: can do, it's a simple modification to the sysvinit patch
[12:18] <mdz> ajmitch: thanks for the update, we'll see what we can accomplish there
[12:18] <ogra> that'd be nice ... even a >/dev/null would be enough 
[12:18] <ajmitch> ok
[12:35] <sivang> bah, status meeting it was ?
[12:36] <Lathiat> indeed
[12:37] <ajmitch> sivang: yep