[12:30] <Hobbsee> morning all
[12:31] <crimsun> 'lo
[12:31] <Hobbsee> :)
[12:35] <Hobbsee_away> Riddell: ping
[03:13] <Mez> Riddell, ping
[03:15] <LeeJunFan> somehow I managed to lose my ability to have kde clock applet show anything but utc tz.
[03:16] <LeeJunFan> if I go to adjust date and time the right time is there.
[03:17] <Mez> right click, onfigure clock -> timezones
[03:17] <LeeJunFan> Mez: yeah, I know, nothing there.
[03:17] <Mez> nothing ?
[03:17] <LeeJunFan> Show timezones has "Local Timezone" and "Configure Timezones"
[03:17] <LeeJunFan> Configure timezones will only allow me to select UTC.
[03:18] <Mez> hmm?
[03:18] <Mez> what makes it so you cant select anything else?
[03:18] <LeeJunFan> tzconfig is set to Eastern. ntpdate grabs the right timezone, date shows the right time, it's just kde.
[03:18] <LeeJunFan> Mez: that's all that's listed.
[03:18] <Mez> weirdness
[03:20] <LeeJunFan> root@jkd:~# tzselect
[03:20] <LeeJunFan> /usr/bin/tzselect: line 53: /usr/share/zoneinfo/iso3166.tab: No such file or directory
[03:20] <LeeJunFan> perhaps libc6 is foobar.
[03:20] <Mez> try this
[03:20] <Mez> sudo apt-get install --reinstall kicker-applets
[03:21] <LeeJunFan> okay, now I'll log out/in.
[03:21] <Mez> (hit ctrl+alt+backspace)
[03:22] <Mez> or killall -9 kicker && kicker
[03:22] <Mez> any luck?
[03:23] <LeeJunFan> nope.
[03:23] <LeeJunFan> I even wiped out the config file for clock_panelapplet
[03:31] <Mez> do you have any kde-i18n package installed
[03:31] <LeeJunFan> Mez: no, I was just looking at that too.
[03:31] <Mez> reading #kde ?
[03:32] <LeeJunFan> no.
[03:32] <Mez> try adding a new user - logging in as them - and seeing if that works
[03:33] <Hobbsee> LeeJunFan: there's already a bug for this
[03:33] <Mez> Hobbsee, there is?
[03:33] <Hobbsee> \ sh and i filed one last night for it
[03:34] <Hobbsee> Mez: yep, want the link?
[03:34] <Mez> please
[03:34] <Hobbsee> launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/+bug/30546
[03:34] <LeeJunFan> Hobbsee: heh, it just started for me seemingly out of the blue.
[03:34] <LeeJunFan> Hobbsee: owell, thanks. I can stop beating my head against the wall now.
[03:34] <Hobbsee> hehe - i found it last night, and got so confused
[03:35] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:35] <Hobbsee> so i'm so screwed in regards to time - it tells me it's 2.35 am, and i know darn well it isnt, cos the sun is up!!!
[03:36] <LeeJunFan> yeah, 9:36pm here
[03:36] <LeeJunFan> so it shows as a whole different day too.
[03:36] <Hobbsee> hehe of course
[03:49] <Mez> Hobbsee, i dont have access to main
[03:49] <Hobbsee> pity - send a patch to someone who does or something?
[03:49] <Mez> plus - if i did - i wouldnt touch glibc, i dont know what jbailets been doing to it
[03:50] <Mez> jbailey *
[03:50] <LeeJunFan> yeah, that's a bad package to get fubared too bad.
[03:50] <Hobbsee> ah ok
[04:04] <LeeJunFan> Hobbsee: op in kubuntu right? got some moron going nuts there.
[04:05] <LeeJunFan> a couple actually.
[04:05] <LeeJunFan> nalioth got em.
[04:06] <Hobbsee> LeeJunFan: yeah, but i was afk sorry
[04:08] <Hobbsee> moral of the story - hobbsee should never go find lunch!
[04:27] <OddAbe19> i'm going to ask a basic question, but it kinda has to do with development <---pre-warning
[04:27] <OddAbe19> is there a way to show the Home, System and Trash icons on the desktop, like stock KDE in kubuntu?
[08:18] <Tm_T> Riddell: known issue? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/i8051
[08:41] <seth> Tm_T, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/+bug/30546
[08:41] <seth> known issue in libc6 :)
[08:42] <Tm_T> aah!
[08:42] <Tm_T> seth <3
[08:42] <seth> haha
[08:42] <Tm_T> I didn't know what bug that is
[08:42] <seth> I just found it a few minutes ago
[08:42] <seth> it also messes up your clock and sets it to UTC
[08:43] <Tm_T> seth: well, that's how I noticed it
[08:43] <seth> yep
[08:43] <seth> I like how when you hover over the clock
[08:43] <seth> it's the same time EVERYWHERE :P
[08:43] <Tm_T> aye! =)
[08:44] <Tm_T> funny, that's why the text "so global that doesn't care local times"
[08:46] <seth> that's a related issue that may help them though, I would post it on the bug :)
[08:46] <seth> your screenshot that is
[08:46] <Tm_T> yu
[08:47] <Tm_T> thanks
[08:47] <Tm_T> do that, I get more breakfast ->
[08:48] <seth> haha
[08:48] <seth> done :)
[09:03] <Tm_T> hum, maybe I should register to that
[10:29] <Tonio_> Riddell: ping ?
[01:04] <Riddell> Tonio_: hi
[01:05] <Riddell> hi Hobbsee
[01:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: just working on the settings, fyi
[01:35] <hunger> Riddell: Are you around?
[01:35] <hunger> Riddell: Any idea how to stop the gnome-desktop files in /usr/share/autostart from starting in KDE?
[01:37] <Riddell> hunger: no idea, how did they get there?
[01:37] <Riddell> hmm, OnlyShowIn=GNOME;
[01:37] <Riddell> maybe we need to make KDE respect that
[01:37] <hunger> Riddell: gnome-volume-manager and gnome-power-manager install them there now that gnome-session seams to support /usr/share/autostart.
[01:38] <Riddell> that must be new
[01:38] <hunger> Riddell: It is.
[01:38] <hunger> Riddell: Gnome seams to have stolen the idea from kde... 
[01:38] <Riddell> I wonder if that means KDE stuff autostarts in gnome
[01:39] <hunger> Riddell: It does not. I tested.
[01:39] <Tonio_> Riddell: concerning the dpi, I set it to 100, are you fine with the value ?
[01:39] <hunger> Riddell: the desktop-file spec does not cover autostart at all... no wonder there is some chaos:-)
[01:40] <hunger> Riddell: someone on freedesktop.org wrote it does not matter since /usr/share/autostart contains only DE-independent stuff, with the DE checking in /usr/share/DE/autostart for its own things.
[01:41] <hunger> Riddell: But that was the "best" information I found on the topic.
[01:42] <hunger> No idea whether kde checks there... ubuntu has no such dirs. I guess it was just some interpretation from some random guy anyway.
[01:43] <Riddell> sounds like it
[01:49] <hunger> Riddell: This annoyed me so much I even tried to switch over to gnome completly:-)
[01:49] <hunger> Riddell: Unfortunately gnome is way to lame to be fun.
[01:50] <hunger> Then I tried updating to kde 4... but ran out of diskspace when grabbing the sources.
[01:50] <hunger> So now I am back to the normal kde3.5.1 ubuntu debs:-)
[02:38] <Mez> Riddell:ping
[02:45] <mornfall> *yawn*
[02:46] <Tm_T> uargh!
[02:46] <Tm_T> oh f*ck
[02:46] <Tm_T> just spent 3hfor nothing
[02:52] <Hobbsee> night all
[02:53] <Hobbsee> Riddell: expect breezy debs in the morning, i'll upload to the same place as the dapper ones
[03:03] <Riddell> Mez: hi
[03:05] <mornfall> 'lo
[03:05] <Riddell> morning
[03:06] <Mez> Riddell: arts needs to depend on base-files to be backported - as it tries to check lsb-release - but that doesnt exist without base-files
[03:07] <Riddell> ah yes
[03:07] <Riddell> I was waiting on soyuz to open before uploading anything
[03:08] <Mez> It's open ;)
[03:08] <Riddell> yep, will do now
[03:08] <Mez> np ;)
[03:08] <Mez> dpnt forget anything else that tries to needs to aswell
[03:09] <Riddell> I take it akode works now?
[03:09] <Mez> hopefully though-  hte script fu will work and we'll be able to backport it eventually
[03:09] <Riddell> arts 1.5.1-0ubuntu1 does build-dep on lsb-release, base-files
[03:10] <Mez> o_O
[03:10] <Mez> so it does
[03:11] <Mez> then why wasnt it working
[03:11] <mornfall> it's broken? :-)
[03:13] <Mez> if i managed to get rid of my menu list in konq - hoe do i get it back?
[03:14] <Riddell> menu list?
[03:14] <Mez> yeah, like fiel etc
[03:14] <Mez> file *
[03:14] <Mez> gah
[03:14] <Mez> waht was that
[03:14] <Mez> ?
[03:18] <Tm_T> it was... me!
[03:18] <Tm_T> ] ;=
[03:31] <Mez> so, any hints on how to get it back
[03:32] <Tm_T> only over my dead body!
[03:33] <Tm_T> ok, more coffee ->
[03:36] <Riddell> Mez: you have no menu bar in konqueror?
[03:36] <Mez> nope
[03:36] <Mez> sorted 
[03:36] <Riddell> control-M
[04:17] <hunger> seb128: You claim #30506 is a kde bug... are you sure?
[04:18] <hunger> seb128: That is the one about g-v-m desktop files being run by kde.
[04:19] <hunger> seb128: As I understand the desktop file spec the autostart usage is totally undefined... should ubuntu really rely on that kind of behaviour?
[04:39] <Riddell> hunger: kde should respect OnlyShowIn=Gnome
[04:40] <Riddell> so it's a kde issue
[04:40] <Riddell> I believe gnome doesn't work at all for autostart files, so they have their own issues :)
[04:58] <Tm_T> seth: ok, new locales installing, but I doubt it fixes anything
[05:01] <Tm_T> Riddell: talking about kicker clock only utc -bug, what I should test?
[05:01] <Tm_T> ...works \o/
[05:01] <Tm_T> interesting
[05:03] <Riddell> yeah, install locales 2.3.10 
[05:03] <Riddell> Tm_T: is that what fixed it?
[05:04] <Tm_T> seems so, I restarted twice earlier today
[05:05] <Tm_T> Riddell: btw: http://www.kolumbus.fi/lliehu/sekalaista-tavaraa/kuva1.png <- I got similar
[05:06] <Tm_T> maybe I should change my kubuntu-devel list address to gmail
[05:07] <Tm_T> another thing: https://launchpad.net/people/jussi-kekkonen <- why pointing to jussikekkonen2 in wiki, why 2
[05:08] <Tm_T> hmm, I can edit it myself, right?
[05:08] <Tm_T> and I also need caffeine =)
[05:18] <Riddell> Tm_T: hmm, why is it going to kubuntu-devel?
[05:18] <Riddell> Tm_T: the launchpad to wikipage importer is ofter wrong, you can change it
[05:19] <Tm_T> Riddell: no I can't: "The Ubuntu WikiName JussiKekkonen is already registered by Jussi Kekkonen."
[05:19] <Tm_T> well, that's me
[05:19] <Tm_T> no idea when I registered it though =)
[05:20] <Tm_T> hmm, I'm registered twice in launchpad
[05:20] <Tm_T> that explains
[05:20] <Tm_T> but why when, I don't remember been registering at all
[05:22] <Riddell> buzilla import creates accounts I think
[05:22] <Tm_T> that explains
[05:23] <Tm_T> have to remove that another one
[05:23] <Tm_T> interesting that it doesn't send me any notification about that
[05:26] <Tm_T> hmm, is there any way to remove launchpad account?
[05:29] <Riddell> you can merge them
[05:30] <Tm_T> hmm
[05:31] <Tm_T> how?
[05:39] <Riddell> no idea I'm afraid, should be an option somewhere
[05:40] <seth> Tm_T, https://launchpad.net/people/+requestmerge
[05:41] <Tm_T> tack
[05:44] <Tm_T> seth: thank you much, I think I get this solved now :p
[05:44] <seth> np
[05:46] <Tm_T> today I mean
[05:59] <Tm_T> seth|away: change it!
[05:59] <seth|away> hahaha
[05:59] <seth|away> but I'm going to sleep
[05:59] <Tm_T> oh no
[05:59] <Tm_T> still...
[06:00] <Tm_T> I won't marry you if you use awaynick
[06:01] <Riddell> Mez: you joined Kubuntu Beasties?
[06:01] <Mez> I dont see why not
[06:01] <Mez> the bugs get assigned to it dont they
[06:01] <Mez> and I just saw it as kubuntu-devel
[06:02] <Tm_T> Kubuntu beasties?
[06:02] <Riddell> Mez: I don't actually know what that group is
[06:02] <Riddell> if I made it, it was a long time ago
[06:02] <Tm_T> :p
[06:03] <Mez> lol
[06:03] <Mez> you're admin of it
[06:03] <Mez> It's kubuntu-devel
[06:03] <Mez> lol
[06:03] <Mez> like ubuntu-devel
[06:03] <Mez> nor do i know
[06:03] <Riddell> if it gets bugs assigned to it the e-mail should change to kubuntu-bugs@lists
[06:04] <Mez> I dunno - who set up the group
[06:06] <Riddell> we weren't sure
[06:07] <Riddell> Beasties sound like the sort of thing I'd put in, but I have no memory of making it
[06:07] <seth|away> yeah, what happened to just Kubuntu Team
[06:07] <seth|away> now every time I reply to a bug that is owned by the beasties, I get a bounce from the kubuntu-bugs list
[06:07] <seth|away> which is annoying
[06:12] <Riddell> hmm, I'll have to look at that
[07:12] <jjesse> Riddell: question on the help files, if I click on "Kubuntu Quick Guide" in the main screen of Konq, it can't find the help file (dapper flight3, just finished updating everything)
[07:14] <Riddell> jjesse: confirmed
[07:15] <Riddell>  none of them work
[07:15] <Riddell> oh well, one more docs thing to fix
[07:30] <OddAbe19> i'm going to ask a basic question, but it kinda has to do with development <---pre-warning
[07:30] <OddAbe19> is there a way to show the Home, System and Trash icons on the desktop, like stock KDE in kubuntu?
[07:31] <Riddell> reply question, why would you want to?  they're already on the panel :)
[07:31] <OddAbe19> because it's easier to access for me
[07:31] <OddAbe19> is there a way or not
[07:33] <Riddell> try sudo cp /usr/share/applications/kde/Home.desktop ~/Desktop
[07:34] <Riddell> err, no sudo there
[07:35] <Riddell> hmm, doesn't work
[07:36] <Riddell> I'll need to change kdebase to install them somewhere else.  or maybe install them hidden
[07:40] <Tm_T> hm
[07:40] <Tm_T> I also hate broken spacebar
[09:03] <Sime> sebas: ping
[09:04] <sebas> Sime: pong
[09:04] <Sime> hi, i'm back from vacation.
[09:04] <sebas> How was it?
[09:04] <sebas> Didn't break a leg and stuff? 
[09:05] <sebas> Ade was skiing for only two hours and had to stay in bed for a week :-)
[09:05] <Sime> it was rather warm and sunny.
[09:05] <sebas> Hm, skiing, right? :D
[09:05] <Sime> I got sunburnt everyday.
[09:05] <Sime> snowboard.
[09:05] <sebas> Aye, tried that to, but it seems I'm not made for that kind of endeavour.
[09:05] <Sime> i'm a bit sore in places though, but nothing serious. :-)
[09:06] <sebas> Heh, I don't wanna know the details.
[09:06] <sebas> I've been exploring LDAP in userconfig, already got some code in there
[09:06] <Sime> well, you have to fall over a lot in snowboarding,
[09:06] <Sime> and it hurts when the snow is icy.
[09:06] <Sime> yes, I saw that LDAP stuff.
[09:07] <sebas> I've been doing rollerskating for a couple of years, so I can imagine.
[09:07] <Sime> what is the motivation for the LDAP stuff?
[09:07] <sebas> I need a little more knowledge of LDAP and specific schemes that are used.
[09:07] <Sime> inline skating??
[09:07] <sebas> Mostly that it has been buggering me to see how easy it is to implement it 
[09:07] <sebas> yeah
[09:07] <Sime> for codeyard? or?
[09:07] <sebas> For skolelinux
[09:08] <Sime> ok, thought so.
[09:08] <sebas> In CodeYard, we don't use LDAP.
[09:08] <sebas> Good idea though, I could hack on guidance during working hours :>
[09:08] <sebas> Ah :)
[09:09] <sebas> In Nijmegen?
[09:09] <Sime> Oz.
[09:09] <Sime> in the 90s. :)
[09:09] <sebas> There's a pool and a miniramp near de Goffert, I'm thinking of trying again.
[09:09] <sebas> Yeah, inline skating is sooooo 90ties ;-)
[09:09] <Sime> I've got a good pair of skates here in Nijmegen.
[09:10] <sebas> I should really do a little sports, but I guess my gear needs an upgrade, and without knowing that I'll use it a lot, I
[09:10] <sebas> d rather not put hundreds of EUR in new gear.
[09:10] <sebas> Besides, I don't see really cool skates in the shops anymore.
[09:10] <Sime> BTW, do you know how Guidance compares to the usability report?
[09:10] <Sime> what is missing / not implemented?
[09:10] <sebas> About half of it.
[09:11] <Sime> coz. the kubuntu feature freeze is real soon.
[09:11] <Sime> feb 23.
[09:11] <sebas> The bigger UI changes in userconfig are missing mainly, but I'd rather concentrate on stability / things that don't break until Dapper is out
[09:11] <sebas> Revamping the UI might cost some time to get stable, and I'm unsure as to how much time I have exactly.
[09:11] <Sime> good, concentrate on the smaller stuff. I think the big UI changes for userconfig need more thought first.
[09:12] <sebas> Yeah.
[09:12] <Sime> I think it might be a good idea to i18n() the strings.
[09:12] <sebas> I was thinking about the group membership issues again (and again), I think we should map the groups to more abstract things.
[09:12] <sebas> such as 
[09:12] <sebas> [ ]  May gain admin privileges
[09:12] <sebas> [ ]  May use the digicam
[09:12] <sebas> (That'd be the groups admin and camera in Kubuntu)
[09:13] <sebas> I'd like to hear Jan's opinion on that approach though.
[09:13] <sebas> displayconfig is in Dapper btw, but it's in the system administration section of kcontrol, dunno why.
[09:14] <sebas> Hm, yeah, translation.
[09:14] <sebas> Should be mostly straightforward.
[09:14] <sebas> Does feature freeze also mean string freeze?
[09:14] <Sime> setup.py should be able to handle outputing the .po files.
[09:14] <Sime> string freeze. dunno.
[09:15] <sebas> Hm, ok.
[09:15] <sebas> It's probably too much work to translate all of guidance short term anyway. 
[09:15] <Sime> but we need to get a feature complete release out in the next week or two. (should be doable)
[09:16] <Sime> the only other real new feature is automatically detecting gfx HW changes at boot time...
[09:16] <sebas> Which works quite well on the hardware I have, btw.
[09:16] <sebas> :-)
[09:16] <Sime> and I don't know if Riddell is gaim enough to use it in dapper.
[09:17] <Sime> I'll be using it either way. ;-)
[09:17] <Sime> it is pretty simple and better than leaving a broken system for the user.
[09:17] <Sime> right now if you swap cards then the machine is 'broken'.
[09:18] <sebas> Hm, yeah. I think it should go in aswell.
[09:18] <sebas> Would give us quite some testing coverage :>
[09:18] <sebas> Wait, users, not beta testers :D
[09:18] <sebas> We could blog that it *should* work and ask people to try...
[09:19] <sebas> So we get some bugfixes in before Dapper is out.
[09:21] <Sime> yes, we will have enough stuff to test and fix before the finally dapper release.
[09:21] <Sime> (I just discovered that I need to improve handling for cards with limited video ram...)
[09:22] <Sime> I've got a machine here with 1 AGP card + 2 PCI cards.
[09:22] <Sime> so I'm busy debugging that. ;-)
[09:22] <Sime> you can also specify which card/screen is the primary and which is the secondary screen.
[09:23] <Riddell> sebas: feature freeze != string freeze
[09:23] <Sime> Riddell: thanks,
[09:23] <Riddell> Sime: game enough to use which?
[09:23] <Sime> Riddell: what is the policy about language support in kubuntu?
[09:24] <Riddell> Sime: i18n should be supported
[09:24] <Riddell> through gettext
[09:24] <Sime> Riddell: detecting changes in the machine's gfx hw and then automatically running dpkg-reconfigure 'xserver-xorg
[09:24] <Sime> Riddell: which languages?
[09:25] <Riddell> Sime: oh that, how much can go wrong :)
[09:25] <Riddell> Sime: English is the only requirement, if it produces .po files then they will go into rosetta and people can translate them there
[09:26] <Sime> Riddell: as I was saying, if it works, it is better than the current situation.
[09:26] <Riddell> yep
[09:27] <Riddell> so will we get a guidance release before February 23rd?
[09:27] <Sime> not quite win/win, more win/breakeven. :-)
[09:27] <Sime> feb 23 => yes,
[09:27] <Riddell> before :)
[09:27] <Sime> hopefully a bit early that the 23rd.
[09:27] <Riddell> feature freeze is start of 23rd UTC
[09:27] <Riddell> so anytime on 22nd is perfect :)
[09:27] <Sime> earlier
[09:28] <Sime> about two weeks then..
[09:28] <Riddell> wonderful
[09:45] <Sime> sebas: have you set up displayconfig-hwprobe.py to run at boot time?
[09:47] <sebas> Sime: Not that I know.
[09:48] <sebas> Do we want that?
[09:48] <Sime> have you just played with it a bit?
[09:48] <sebas> (Loading python at boot time is something distropeople would not like)
[09:48] <sebas> No, I wasn't aware of its existance.
[09:49] <Sime> oh, check out displayconfig-hwprobe.py then.
[09:51] <Sime> it is rather small and fast. It just checks hw changes at boottime.
[09:51] <Sime> well that is the idea.
[10:20] <Mez> Riddell: ping
[10:20] <Riddell> Mez: hi
[10:21] <Mez> Riddell: arts has built and installed fine backported - starting on kdelibs
[10:21] <Riddell> Mez: rocking
[10:22] <Tonio_> Riddell: concerning the kde settings, do you think it is a good idea to enable the double click by default ?
[10:22] <Mez> riddell: if everything goes fine I should be able to request it for backports later today
[10:22] <Riddell> Mez: people have been requesting konversation too
[10:22] <Tonio_> I personnaly don't know anyone that uses simpleclick
[10:22] <Riddell> Tonio_: no, too big a change from kde defaults
[10:22] <Mez> Riddell, has konv been uploaded?
[10:22] <Mez> (0.19)
[10:22] <Riddell> Mez: yes
[10:23] <Mez> Riddell, might be better to sync from debian ?
[10:23] <Mez> when it's in debian
[10:23] <Riddell> why?
[10:23] <Mez> well - there was a lil bug in my package
[10:23] <Mez> not so much a bug - but meh
[10:23] <Riddell> that won't help the backport though
[10:23] <Mez> it had gmo files it didnt need
[10:24] <Mez> It'll have to be done after any lde update so it builds right
[10:24] <Mez> hmm
[10:24] <hunger> Is there anything I can do to help fix this gnome-desktop file issue in current dapper?
[10:24] <Mez> I'm gonna have to request everything kde to be backported again
[10:25] <Riddell> hunger: sure, program the fix
[10:25] <Riddell> lde?
[10:25] <hunger> Riddell: That is the one thing I hoped not to hear;-)
[10:26] <hunger> Riddell: Can you at least point me into a general direction?
[10:26] <Riddell> hunger: ksmserver possibly
[10:27] <hunger> It should be in kdebase... or kdelibs?
[10:27] <hunger> Riddell: Thanks.
[10:28] <Riddell> kdebase
[10:28] <hunger> Riddell: Found it, thanks!
[10:29] <Mez> Riddell: I'm assuming that if kdelibs and kdebase go fine - I shouldnt have a problem with the other stuff
[10:31] <Riddell> Mez: that's the hope yes
[10:32] <Mez> bhest to check anyways
[10:33] <Riddell> yes, definatly
[10:33] <Riddell> my hope is that 3.5.2 will be easy :)
[10:33] <Mez> lol
[10:39] <Tm_T> =)
[10:40] <hunger> Riddell: KDE does ignore the OnlyShowIn, etc. or so it seams at a first glance in kdelibs.
[10:51] <Mez> Riddell, you're a pain..
[10:52] <Mez> have you seen how many things i have to re-backport
[10:52] <Mez> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy-backports/kde/
[10:58] <Riddell> hunger: hmm, I get gnome-power-manager started, maybe it's in my session
[11:02] <Mez> Riddell: will everything need to be rebuilt against the new kdelibs? or should it be fine?
[11:02] <Mez> because - are we going to have to like - backport all KDE apps?
[11:08] <Riddell> Mez: no, it's all binary compatible
[11:08] <Mez> oh 
[11:08] <Mez> then i shouldnt need to re-backort stuff
[11:08] <Riddell> no
[11:08] <Riddell> otherwise I'd have to rebuild the whole archive each time there was a new kdelibs
[11:09] <Mez> true
[11:09] <hunger> Riddell: Is it OK to change the API of kdelibs to fix the gnome-autostart issue or should I better not do that?
[11:09] <hunger> I'd add a function... that shouldn't cause havok, should it?
[11:13] <hunger> libarts1-dev has unmet dependencies.
[11:13] <hunger> kdelibs depends on it... what now?
[11:15] <Riddell> hunger: adding a function might break ABI I'm not sure
[11:15] <Riddell> or maybe that's only virtual functions
[11:15] <hunger> Riddell: adding shouldn't break ABI IIRC...
[11:15] <Riddell> you'd need to check the ABI compatibility stuff on developer.kde.org
[11:15] <Riddell> adding something does, I remember it having no logic at all
[11:15] <hunger> Riddell: I need to check whether it works at all:-)
[11:15] <Riddell> (unless you know about compiler formats presumably)
[11:16] <hunger> Riddell: What about libarts1-dev?
[11:17] <Mez> Riddell, grr - I'm gona have to redo that now
[11:18] <hunger> Any idea how I can install that?
[11:19] <Riddell> hunger: it's in main
[11:19] <Riddell> Mez: what? why?
[11:19] <hunger> Riddell: It is not installable.
[11:19] <Riddell> hunger: why not?
[11:20] <Mez> Riddell, because it syncs from dapper 
[11:20] <Mez> if you're changing arts - I need to check the new version backportds
[11:20] <hunger> Riddell: unmet dependencies: libarts1-dev: Depends: libarts1c2a (= 1.5.1-0ubuntu1) but 4:3.5.1-0ubuntu1
[11:20] <Riddell> Mez: I'm not changing arts
[11:20] <hunger> Riddell: Depends: libartsc0-dev (= 1.5.1-0ubuntu1) but it is not going to be installed
[11:20] <Mez> thought you were ?
[11:21] <Riddell> Mez: no, what made you think that?
[11:21] <Riddell> hunger: that's broken, I think arts 4:3.5.1 was a mistake I made when first asking for testers of something
[11:22] <Mez> you were talking about it - an changing it now ?
[11:22] <hunger> Riddell: So what can I do to make apt install the beast?
[11:23] <Riddell> Mez: it was the lsb/base-files issue, but arts already build-deps on them
[11:24] <Riddell> hunger: what does apt-cache policy libartsc1c2a say?
[11:25] <hunger> W: Unable to locate package libartsc1c2a
[11:28] <Riddell> apt-cache policy libarts1c2a 
[11:29] <hunger> Installed: 4:3.5.1-0ubuntu1
[11:29] <hunger> Candidate: 4:3.5.1-0ubuntu1
[11:29] <Mez> ibarts1c2a:
[11:29] <Mez>   Installed: 1.5.1-0ubuntu1
[11:29] <Mez>   Candidate: 1.5.1-0ubuntu1
[11:29] <Mez>   Version table:
[11:29] <Mez>  *** 1.5.1-0ubuntu1 0
[11:29] <Mez>         500 http://archive.ubuntu.com dapper/main Packages
[11:29] <Mez>         100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
[11:30] <hunger>   Version table:
[11:30] <hunger>  *** 4:3.5.1-0ubuntu1 0
[11:30] <hunger>         100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
[11:30] <hunger>      1.5.1-0ubuntu1 0
[11:30] <hunger>         500 http://archive.ubuntu.com dapper/main Packages
[11:30] <Riddell> hunger: I'm afraid I think you need to remove arts and then reinstall everything
[11:31] <Mez> Riddell:it seems to be doing some post-processing
[11:31] <Riddell> Mez: what does?
[11:31] <Mez> no - i mean it's got to the post-processin stage
[11:32] <Riddell> kdelibs?
[11:32] <Mez> yeah
[11:32] <hunger> Riddell: Thanks, that fixes it.
[11:32] <Riddell> that's a good sign :)
[11:32] <Mez> * Post-processing files in kdecore/html
[11:32] <Mez> Riddell: thats why i told you
[11:35] <Mez> Riddell: It just hit the install target
[11:35] <Mez> w00t
[11:36] <hunger> Riddell: When I do dpkg-buildpackage in kdelibs, will that override my patch?
[11:36] <Riddell> Mez: lets just hope it's creating the correct packages
[11:36] <Riddell> hunger: no
[11:36] <Riddell> hunger: use debuild
[11:36] <Riddell> (does the same thing but with extra checks
[11:37] <hunger> Riddell: Well, it does remove my patch... but since I put it into debian/patches it reapplied it right away;-)
[11:45] <Hobbsee> Riddell: ping
[11:45] <Riddell> Hobbsee: hi
[11:46] <hunger> How long does kdelibs need to build approximately?
[11:46] <Hobbsee> :) you are on
[11:46] <Hobbsee> Riddell: i have good news and bad news for you
[11:46] <Mez> hunger, so far an hour and 25 mins
[11:46] <Hobbsee> the good:  dapper debs finished uploading.  The bad: the breezy debs: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8131
[11:47] <Riddell> Hobbsee: export LANG=C
[11:48] <Hobbsee> and that'll fix the error at the end?
[11:48] <Riddell> Hobbsee: sed -i 's/&kmousetool;/KMouseTool/' doc/kword/a11y.docbook 
[11:48] <Riddell> Hobbsee: debuild -nc
[11:49] <Hobbsee> ok, trying that
[11:49] <Hobbsee> argh, i was going to reboot before doing that....
[11:49] <Hobbsee> too late
[11:50] <Hobbsee> maybe i will, and cancel it
[11:50] <Riddell> debuild -nc don't compile everything again, just the install stages
[11:51] <hunger> floam: That might still be in time for etch;-)
[11:52] <hunger> Sorry for that... wrong channel again.
[11:52] <Riddell> sebas: are you able to book another bed at fosdem?
[11:53] <hunger> Riddell: Will you be at fosdem?
[11:53] <Riddell> hunger: should be yes
[11:53] <Riddell> I'm giving a talk
[11:53] <hunger> Riddell: I have not yet checked the list of speakers.
[11:54] <hunger> Riddell: I think I owe you a couple of beers for your work. Maybe I can make it to brussels:-)
[11:55] <Riddell> :)
[11:55] <Riddell> I'm only in the KDE room
[11:55] <sebas> Riddell: There's exactly one bed left.
[11:56] <hunger> Riddell: Well, usually everybody meets up at some bar on friday:-)
[11:56] <Riddell> sebas: ooh, can I book it then?
[11:56] <sebas> Riddell: Yes.
[11:57] <sebas> Could you send me an email with the address, and preferably FOSDEM in the subject line, so I don't loose track?
[12:00] <Mez> FUCK
[12:00] <Mez> I just accidentally deleted the .debs
[12:00] <Mez> I've spent 2 hours building tht
[12:00] <Mez> oh
[12:00] <Mez> actually
[12:01] <Mez> might not have yet
[12:01] <Mez> I dont know if it copied the result out
[12:01] <Riddell> debuild -nc is your friend
[12:01] <Riddell> sebas: will do
[12:01] <Mez> Riddell, cept I'm having to use pbuilds :D remember?
[12:01] <Riddell> oh, yeah
[12:01] <Mez> /bin/sh: --attr=language,section,Language Section: command not found
[12:01] <Mez> o_o
[12:01] <Riddell> ?
[12:02] <sebas> Riddell: Excellent.