/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/02/12/#ubuntu-devel.txt

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nictukumvo, hi. In the NetworkWideUpdates spec you mentioned sources.d. That isn't implemented yet, is it?12:21
mvonictuku: it is available in dappers apt12:22
nictukuhmm.12:22
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mvonictuku: it has to end with .list though12:23
mvonictuku: the files you drop in there12:23
nictukugood12:23
nictukuI'm working in a new prototype in python for nwu12:24
nictukuusing most of that specs idea, but with SSL'ed SOAP 12:24
mvonictuku: nice! the initial implementation was pretty hacky :/ (the one that was never released)12:25
nictukuand a simple asymmetric cryptographic keys structure for authenticating.12:25
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mdzjdub: who manages the fridge calendar feed?12:39
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jdubMez: pong01:03
jdubmdz: fridge-devel (jorge, robitaille, me)01:03
mdzjdub: can you add the stuff on DapperReleaseSchedule?01:06
mdzat least feature freeze, beta, rc and final01:06
mdzthe rest are probably not of general interest01:06
jdubhrm, i thought all of those were already there...!01:10
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Mezjdub: can you re-add me to planet please?01:17
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mjg59Kinnison: Which one?01:18
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glickexcuse mem what version of cvs do you all use?01:28
Burgworkglick, http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?keywords=cvs&searchon=names&subword=1&version=all&release=all01:30
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Mezanyone seen jbailey lately?01:38
jdubMez: he's on UK time atm01:40
Mezjdub: darn he's broken libc601:41
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azeemMez: bug number?01:43
glickfor some reason my friend cant checkout sources without getting a read lock error01:45
Burgworkglick, please file a bug01:45
Kamionplease don't file a bug about that, check with the server administrator first01:46
Kamionit's not uncommon for read locks to end up left lying around by accident01:47
glickKamion, i am the server admin01:47
Kamionso check yourself :)01:47
Kamioneither that or your friend doesn't have write permission to the repository01:47
Mezazeem: one sec01:48
glickcan i do this...LockDir=${CVSROOT}/CVSROOT/Lockfiles01:48
glickin the cvs config file?01:48
Kamionno idea, sorry01:48
Mezazeem: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/+bug/3054601:48
Ubugtumalone bug 30546 in kdebase "kickers clock applet is screwed" [Normal,Fix released]  01:48
Kamionask a CVS support channel or mailing list01:48
floamis dapper going to get gimp 2.4?01:49
azeemMez: jbailey commented on that bug01:53
Mezazeem: yeah i didnt notice01:54
azeemand it seems this is fixed?01:54
MezI dunno am testing01:56
azeemwell, "Jeff broke libc" made it sound a bit more theatrical than it was01:57
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calcmjg59: any idea as to when hal is going to be fixed to start up properly?02:08
mjg59calc: Mm?02:08
calcsaw a new upload happened today and it didn't fix the issue02:08
calcit hangs on start up02:08
mjg59calc: Not here, it doesn;t02:08
calcif needed i can try to track down when it started happening, if i can find old debs02:09
mjg59Have you filed a bug? (I'm afraid I only uploaded to add some support I needed for laptop hotkeys, I didn't touch anything else)02:09
calcthere is a bug open about it on malone and in debian bts02:09
calci didn't file it though02:09
calcah ok02:09
calc23:51 < calc> and one of them "hald-addon-acpi" is stuck in read()02:09
calc23:52 < calc> and the acpi one seems to be the last one started02:09
calc23:53 < calc> so probably is the one actually hanging02:09
calc23:55 < calc> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=35129602:09
calc23:55 < calc> that looks like it might be the bug02:09
calc23:55 < calc> but hal-device-manager can't attach to it02:10
calc00:04 < calc> malone #30254 seems like the same thing i am seeing also02:10
Ubugtumalone bug 30254 in hal "Hal freezes on startup..." [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/3025402:10
calcthats what i noticed when looking at it last night02:10
glickdo i have to delte lock files?02:10
calcnow after todays update i see two instances of hald-addon-keyboard running as well02:10
calci'm running on amd64, not sure if that makes a difference02:11
calcoh damn it finally completed02:11
calcit took like 5min to start02:12
mjg59Heh. Probably not my bug, then02:12
mjg59I modified hald-addon-acpi, but not in any way that would affect that (and my patch isn't in Debian)02:12
calchowever hald doesn't show to be running anymore either02:12
calchal-device-manager doesn't run anymore either, but thats probably due to it seeing hald isn't running02:13
mjg59hal-device-manager hasn't worked since dbus 0.6002:13
calcoh ok02:13
calcthe debian bug report sounds like it is exactly like mine, including the part where it sits there for a long time and then dies02:14
=== calc bbl, work
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sistpotyhi folks02:34
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jdubhrm03:45
jdubso03:45
jdubthe new build logs are... not brilliantly helpful03:45
jdubare the old build logs still updated?03:45
crimsundoesn't look like it03:48
jdub:(03:48
crimsun(judging from http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/g/gnome-panel/ )03:48
jsgotangcoyo!03:49
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mjg59jdub: File a bug!03:50
mjg59(ahem)03:50
jdub:-)03:51
irvinjust checking... the latest kernel in dapper is 2.6.15-14 or 2.6.15-15?03:56
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mjg59-1503:56
irvinhmm... i didn't get the update03:58
mjg59May not have built yet03:58
irvini'll probably fetch it later... thanks mjg5903:59
infinitymjg59: BTW, I left the laptops at the office, since I had no other convenient way to get them back to you.04:03
mjg59infinity: Ok - I'll grab them at some stage04:03
mjg59Not urgent04:04
mjg59infinity: Hope they were useful (and you've broken initramfs-tools)04:04
infinitymjg59: By "broken", are you referring to the typo in the new feature?04:04
infinitymjg59: And yes, they were both quite useful.04:04
infinitymjg59: Though the tiny one is a serious pain in the butt to work with.04:04
mjg59infinity: I'm referring to it wanting to rewrite the conffile and destroy RESUME=04:06
mjg59infinity: Excellent. Do express my apologies to Zofia for failing to actually meet her (I do try to see all my fangirls at some stage)04:06
infinityOh, that was going to happen anyway if the conffile ever got updated.  But I'm going to fix it.04:06
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tulgahi all. I cannot install GIF library in dapper 2. howto install it?04:19
tulgaI installed libungif4, libungif4-dev. but not found lungif04:20
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infinitytulga: Tried -lgif?04:25
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psusiMithrandir, ping05:34
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lsd25hi, i know this might be the wrong place, but i was directed here by the folk in #ubuntu .. the administrative programs like network-admin and shares-admin seems to stop and hang on the following: connect(13, {sa_family=AF_INET, sin_port=htons(16001), sin_addr=inet_addr("127.0.0.1")}, 1606:00
lsd25 .. any idea why?06:00
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fabbionemorning06:03
desrtlsd25; i'd guess it's because your loopback interface hasn't been brought up properly06:04
desrtlsd25; there was a problem with this a while back in dapper due to the network interfaces state file not being properly erased on reboot06:05
lsd25desrt, aha! that might be it, the thing is ubuntu refuses to start my networking on boot, even tho i enabled it in network -admin06:05
lsd25thanks alot that as it, no i only need to figure out why networking aint getting started06:06
desrtlsd25; i'll be less help to you for that.  bed time for me.06:06
desrtgood luck06:06
lsd25thanks alot man :)06:06
Mithrandirpsusi: pong?06:08
psusiMithrandir, hey... was just wondering if anything has moved with the e2fsprogs header issue...06:10
Mithrandirpsusi: I haven't gotten any more response from upstream06:10
Mithrandirpsusi: I'll prod him and see what comes out of it.06:11
psusicool06:11
psusinow if only I could open this password protected mount rainier specifiction pdf06:11
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Chipzzlsd25: check if your interfaces are still named correctly06:55
ChipzzI have my eth0 and eth1 swapped since a couple of days06:55
Chipzzhmm wait no that would be unrelated ;)06:56
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lsd25Chipzz, desrt already poin ted me to check lo .. which was it.. and then i found out why it didnt start on boot ..the interfaces file was fucked up07:06
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freeflyingMithrandir: I've configured the /etc/environment to use zh_CN , but after remaster the live cd , it still use en_US as default language07:41
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Mithrandirfreeflying: you need to change the bootloader, since it's passed in from there08:50
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pittiGood morning, Ladies, Gentlemen, Aliens, Artificial Intelligences, etc. pp.!09:15
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poningruso would it be possible to have #dapper created so that bugs can be discussed in there?09:49
seb128there is a #ubuntu-bugs which should be fine for that09:50
seb128any need to create a new chan?09:50
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poningruthere is like no one there when I want to discuss something in #ubuntu-bugs09:52
poningru#dapper just seems more attractive09:52
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poningruas in more people would want to hang out in #dapper than in #ubuntu-bugs09:52
siretartponingru: developers are more likley to be in #ubuntu-bugs09:52
seb128the name of the chan doesn't matter09:54
seb128people are not likely to hang to a new chan because it's named #dapper09:54
poningruwould it be ok if I came in here to discuss those bugs if no one in #ubuntu-bugs answers?09:54
seb128no09:54
poningru:(09:54
seb128discuss bugs on #ubuntu or by bug tracker09:54
seb128read the topic09:54
poningruseriously? #ubuntu?09:54
poningrufine09:55
poningruthanks for the info09:55
seb128this chan is just not a bug tracker one09:55
Kamion"build it and they will come" does not work for IRC channels09:55
seb128hey Kamion, do you feel better today?09:56
Kamionat least not if you want "they" to include knowledgeable people rather than just more people with problems09:56
Kamionyeah, somewhat, thanks09:56
Kamionwill attempt to work at least some of the day09:56
seb128cool09:56
poningruwell I guess I will just file it all at malone, I just wanted a place to make sure my bug isnt showing up only for myself09:57
seb128even if the bug is showing only for yourself that may still be a bug and should be fixed09:58
seb128if you have desktop issues you can mention them on #ubuntu-desktop09:58
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pittielmo: please sync libpng (Ubuntu override ok) and remove libpng3 from the archive10:07
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pittiMithrandir: any idea why we only have ppc live images in daily-current? (yesterday, too)10:15
Mithrandirpitti: I'm not sure what the status of the new world order with soyuz is concerning live images, so no, not really.10:15
ograKinnison, ping ... do you also process the NEW queue until Kamion had a training for it ? the new linux-image-2.6.15-15 packages seem stuck there ...10:17
pittiogra: ... and we finally want sound back on ppc :-P10:18
ograexactly :)10:18
ograand i'm to lazy to compile the source myself :P10:18
Kinnisonogra: I have the ability but not the social responsiblity10:19
=== Kinnison points out that until the CC meeting today, I'm not even an ubuntu member
Kinnisonand I may not qualify then10:19
ograprocessing them would give you a huge amount of social bonus for that i think *G*10:19
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MithrandirKinnison: do you happen to know if we're building live cds inside soyuz yet, or if the old procedure still holds?10:20
KinnisonMithrandir: CD building is untouched10:22
KinnisonMithrandir: whether or not the buildds are doing it, I don't know10:22
KinnisonMithrandir: best to ask adam or lamont10:22
Kinnisonogra: Umm, maybe, but I'd also get a huge "see your job? not any more you don't" unbonus for fucking with the archive without the authority to do so10:22
ograso who has this authority then ? 10:24
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jdubogra: darth vader.10:24
ograhaha10:24
Kinnisonogra: elmo, mdz or kamion10:24
ograhey jdub 10:24
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jduband he wouldn't piss about with 'job unbonus' crapola either!10:24
ograheh10:25
Treenaksjdub: 'I find your lack of faith.. disturbing' 10:25
Kinnisonjdub: the force is strong in you, young waugh10:25
jdubone flick of the wrist, with a little bit of force sauce, and *blammo*, instant powerpc sound action10:25
sivangmorning Kinnison !10:26
MithrandirKinnison: 'k10:27
TreenaksNow all I need is -restricted-modules for 15-1510:27
KinnisonMithrandir: but elmo is awake, so you can ask him10:27
KamionKinnison: alternatively, feel free to instruct me on how to process NEW :-)10:28
Mithrandirelmo: can you tell me what the current state of how live (and I presume, regular install) cds are built?10:28
Mithrandirpossibly s/elmo/Kamion/ too?10:28
KamionMithrandir: AFAIK all that needs to happen for live CDs is that they get s/jackass/drescher/ somewhere, or similar10:29
KinnisonKamion: I'm currently trying to work a couple of other things out, then I'd be glad to10:29
KamionMithrandir: install CD building is unchanged; it was just disabled over the weekend, but I've re-enabled it now10:29
MithrandirKamion: which means infinity or lamont, I presume.  Given that I just have trigger access and can't fiddle with stuff on the buildd.10:30
KamionMithrandir: right10:30
jdubKinnison: i imagine you've already had questions about build logs - would it be possible to spit them out into a directory like the old ones for a while?10:30
Kinnisonno10:30
KinnisonWell, not easily10:30
jdubwill similar browsing and searching exist on launchpad (soon)?10:31
KinnisonI expect so10:31
jdubcool10:31
carlosmvo: hi, around?10:31
mvocarlos: yes10:31
Kinnisonthe right thing to do is to file bugs on /products/soyuz for any view you're missing10:31
mvocarlos: long time not seen, how are you?10:31
=== jdub knows it's a rough migration, doesn't push too many buttons :)
carlosmvo: Fine, thanks. And you?10:32
mvocarlos: fine, I survided london and the dead-flu, now I'm good again :)10:32
carlos:-D10:32
Treenaksmvo: The New & Improved mvo?10:32
Kinnisonjdub: honestly the most useful thing you can do is file bugs for whatever functionality you'd like.10:32
jdubok10:32
Kinnisonjdub: that way we have a target to work toward10:32
carlosmvo: Do you remember that problem I told you about update-notifier?10:33
carlosmvo: I'm having it again now10:33
carlosmvo: https://chinstrap.ubuntu.com/~dsilvers/paste/fileSugA3G.html10:33
carlosthat's the last lines of the strace output10:33
jdubBenC: ping10:34
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jduboh man, this "to execute a command as root" thing is so backwards10:36
pittijdub: we'll fix the description to be more readable and add a manpage10:37
jdubpitti: can't we do it with su?10:37
pittijdub: we don't want to10:37
jdubbut this is entirely backwards10:37
pittibackwards?10:38
jdubas a random terminal user, i really don't care about root10:38
pittijdub: but it's only displayed for admins10:38
jduband putting up banner ads about running stuff as root is pretty crazy10:38
jdubthing is, it's advertising something that flat out doesn't matter *until* you want to do it10:39
jdubin which case one of two things happens:10:39
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jduba) you know enough to try su, which should fail and explain what to do10:39
jdubb) you have no idea what to do, so you read the documentation that says to use sudo10:39
jdubc) you have no idea what to do, but some random website or book says to use su, go directly to (a)10:40
Mithrandirjdub: a) 1) people think about using su, but realise they haven't provided a root password and wonder how to proceed10:40
pittifor a) the message helps to point these folks to sudo10:40
jdubMithrandir: then they either try it or go to (b)10:40
pittiand the message and manpage directly helps (b)10:41
Mithrandirjdub: yes, they do, and then they whine about it too.10:41
jdubMithrandir: with a useful message from su, that would be reduced, but ultimately, we're not going to reduce the number of whiners by putting banner ads in our software :)10:41
jdubthis is like all those stupid startup configuration wizards10:41
jdubEXCUSE ME WHILE WE INTERRUPT THIS PROGRAM FOR A MESSAGE FROM OUR SPONSORS10:42
jdub"try sudo to run shit as root!"10:42
jdub"thanks mum!"10:42
Mithrandirjdub: yes, I agree with you that it's a silly thing to have, which is why I argued against it.10:42
jdubWE NOW RETURN TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAM10:42
jdub$ _10:42
jdubso we're doing crazy stuff like this in dapper, which we have to live with for 5 years? eek.10:43
jsgotangcoeek10:43
jsgotangcopoor grandma10:44
jdubBenC: http://pastebin.com/54298410:44
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ograjdub, afaik the sudo message was a sbdfl request ... convince him ;)10:49
Treenaksogra: 'baby jesus might cry'10:49
jdubthe other thing is, i'm being told on every terminal invocation10:50
Treenaksjdub: until you sudo once10:50
jdubi thought it was supposed to stop after the first sudo10:50
=== Treenaks just removed it from /etc/bash.bashrc
jdubi get it every time10:51
jduband i have mad sudo skillz10:51
jdubi can even recover from typing 'sudp'10:52
jdubwhich i do quite regularly10:52
Treenaksjdub: alias sudp=sudo ;)10:52
=== jdub waves kung-fu slicey hands around
hungerHmmm... which deb do I need to write a bugreport against when I have user-processes hang around after the user logged out?10:54
Treenakshunger: the hanging process10:54
seb128depending10:54
Treenaks'the one & is in'10:55
hungerTreenaks: What if there are several different ones?10:55
MithrandirKamion: do we have anything like dapper_probs with the new world order?10:59
Kinnisonbritney is not currently in the cronjob10:59
freeflyingMithrandir: after remaster kubuntu's dapper livecd , kdm need be restarted manually, and then it can log into kdm 10:59
MithrandirKinnison: could it be?  Not having it is making my work a fair bit harder.11:00
KinnisonMithrandir: I think elmo said kamion would need to get it ready11:00
KinnisonMithrandir: but kamion was ill yesterday11:00
KamionKinnison: can I run it on drescher, or should it be elsewhere?11:01
KinnisonKamion: that I'm not sure about11:01
KinnisonKamion: if it can run elsewhere then I guess it should11:01
KinnisonKamion: if it needs to run on drescher you'll need to check with elmo11:01
Kamionthere is no other host with a mirror that's updated anywhere near as regularly11:02
Kamionrookery is IIRC every six hours11:02
Kamionelmo: can I run britney on drescher please?11:02
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:Kinnison] : Ubuntu Development (not support, even with dapper) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Flight CD 3 released | If your initramfs is broken in any way, please save a copy for infinity | LP Upgrade 1030UTC today. est 1h downtime. Uploads queued
=== j^_ is now known as j^
=== Kinnison thought screen had corrupted then
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ogrameh11:10
ograinputattach is also stuck in NEW ... i cant work with a non installable ltsp-client package ... :(11:11
dokowho does care about package removals from universe?11:11
ogradoko, elmo ... mail him the request11:12
ogra(and avoiding the word morgue in the mail helps a lot ;) )11:12
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Kamionogra: inputattach will be processed right after this publisher run and LP downtime11:15
KamionI would have done it already but the publisher run kicked in11:16
Kinnisonthis LP upgrade includes a librarian disk array firmware upgrade so it's going to be longer than usual11:16
Kinnisonhence the 1h window11:16
Kinnisonit's just unfortunate it happened today11:17
ograKamion, thanks a lot 11:17
freeflyingMithrandir: may you give any advice on that 11:17
seb128is "lo" usually considered as a requirement on a well configured system?11:17
Mithrandirseb128: yes11:17
ograi wonder if we shouldnt postpone feature freeze a week until the LP dust has settled 11:17
Mithrandirfreeflying: uh, unsure.  Ask Riddell?11:18
seb128ie: what would you do with bugs like "app doesn't work when lo is not configured"?11:18
seb128close them as notabug? :)11:18
Mithrandirseb128: why does he not have lo configured?11:18
seb128dunno, ask sladen, he did open a bug on totem about that11:19
KinnisonKamion: I did an install off the dapper 2006-02-03 CD last night11:19
KinnisonKamion: I had a couple of comments but I'm not sure if you'll have fixed them yet11:19
Mithrandirseb128: I'd just close it with something along the lines of "please up your lo interface, then"11:19
KinnisonKamion: do you want them here, in a mail to you, or filed as bugs?11:19
seb128k, let's close the bug, we have enough real ones without bothering for people who don't want to configure a lo11:19
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hungerNo lo was common a while back with all those networking changes going on... I thought that was fixed?11:20
KamionKinnison: quick summary?11:20
seb128Mithrandir: right, will do that, thank you :)11:20
hungerseb128: When was that bug filed?11:20
Mithrandirhunger: sure, but then the bug is "lo is not configured" rather than "$foo doesn't work when lo is not configured"11:20
KinnisonKamion: downloading file XXX of YYY (TTT remaining)11:20
KinnisonKamion: TTT never left 0s11:20
MithrandirKinnison: aptitude bug11:20
KinnisonKamion: when installing the packages, it still used the CD11:20
seb128hunger: the lo one? today11:20
hungerMithrandir: Well, you know how people report bugs:-)11:20
Kamionogra: I don't think that would fit into the rest of the schedule without delaying dapper, sorry11:21
KamionKinnison: downloading should be retrieving, known bug11:21
hungerseb128: Oh, then I'd go for notabug;-)11:21
KinnisonKamion: and "font installation is unutterably slow, can we stub fc-cache like we did for scrollkeeper?"11:21
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KamionKinnison: oh, yeah, just need to test that one11:21
Kamionok, don't need bugs for any of those11:21
KinnisonKamion: and "When loading the kernel, green text appeared at the top of my screen"11:21
Kamionthat one I know about but don't currently know how to fix; it's reasonably frequently reported11:21
ograKaloz, yes, sadly ... but its delaying work quite a bit ... would have been nice to have that planned in the beginning ...11:22
KinnisonKamion: the rest are after the first reboot11:22
KinnisonKamion: so I'll file bugs for 'em11:22
Kamionogra: I don't think it's a significant enough delay to justify shifting freezes around.11:22
MithrandirKamion: can you promote python2.4-soappy?  It appears it's needed by python-soappy which in turn is needed by u-d.11:22
MithrandirKamion: (python-soappy is already in main and from the same source package, so no inclusion report should be needed)11:22
KamionMithrandir: will do after the LP downtime, when Kinnison's promised to teach me how to change overrides :)11:23
MithrandirKamion: great, thanks.11:23
KamionKinnison: the green text requires grotty x86 assembly hacking in syslinux11:23
KinnisonKamion: yum11:23
Kinnisonbuild sequencer suspended, incoming queue process suspended, cron.daily suspended11:30
Kinnisonuploads should be queued11:30
Kinnisonwe'll make this as quick as we can guys11:30
=== ogra gets coffe
ograe11:30
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ograpitti, did we have any securityhttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2006-February/066622.html update which could cause this ? 11:51
ogragrepf11:51
ograhttps://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2006-February/066622.html11:51
pittiogra: not really, sounds like iz gamin bug11:52
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pittiogra: killall gam-server ?11:52
pittihey Keybuk 11:52
ograpitti, thats breezy 11:52
pittiI know11:52
Keybukheyhey11:52
ograpitti, i have no idea why this should appear there11:52
pittibut the last security updates didn't touch gnome11:53
ograpitti, thats what i thought11:53
ograKeybuk, i recently had to look at bootmisc.sh, it has a line like:11:54
ograrm -f /tmp/.clean /var/run/.clean /var/lock/.clean11:54
ograisnt that obsolete ? 11:54
KinnisonKeybuk: my shiny new dapper install hangs at "detecting and activating hardware"11:55
KinnisonKeybuk: on warm boots11:55
KeybukKinnison: boot without quiet and splash and see what the last dmesg line is11:56
KinnisonKeybuk: Will do11:57
Keybukogra: yeah, but I didn't worry about that one because it's harmless11:57
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pittithe rescue mode should also do some verboseness11:57
KinnisonKeybuk: also, when shutting down, it sits for ages and ages at sending TERM signal11:57
Keybukogra: the actual /var/run and /var/lock cleaning code is gone though11:57
ograKeybuk, just noticed it 11:57
KinnisonKeybuk: I was too tired to debug last night11:57
KinnisonKeybuk: I fixed a bug in gnome-power-preferences and went to bed11:57
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radonePleas could anyone help me with sourcelist configuration?11:59
radoneI have dependency problem : libgtkmm2.0-dev: Depends: libgtk2.0-dev but it is not going to be installed11:59
radonemy source list is here: http://cpp.sourceforge.net/?show=1231211:59
ograradone, please ask in #ubuntu, this is not a support channel11:59
ogra(see topic)11:59
radoneogra: ok, thanks11:59
ograKinnison, which bug in gnome-power-preferences did you fix ? i have no bug reports ...12:00
ogra(yet)12:00
ogra:)12:00
Kinnisonogra: bug 30718 :-)12:00
=== Keybuk kicks Ubugtu
KinnisonKeybuk: erm, it can't talk to the db12:01
Kinnisonproduction rollout in progress12:01
Keybukoh12:01
ograheh12:01
Kinnisonpoor ubugtu12:01
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KinnisonUnfortunately the database update is taking longer than we'd hoped, we may not hit our 1h estimate, sorry about this12:19
Robot101to the pub! :)12:19
KinnisonRobot101: I wish12:19
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KinnisonBringing up the ftpmaster functions, please wait12:29
KeybukSPIN UP PONIES FIVE THROUGH TWELVE!12:30
=== Treenaks takes Keybuks drugs away
=== Robot101 takes Keybuk's drugs
KeybukHah!  Take that "hardware detection takes ages on my machine" people!12:32
Keybukmuahahahaha12:32
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Keybuknever again will we get a complaint that Ubuntu takes too long to "detect hardware"12:32
Robot101Keybuk: you removed hardware support?! :)12:32
TreenaksRobot101: he changed the message ;)12:32
Kinnisonincoming queue processor enabled12:32
Robot101"Rotating badgers"12:33
Keybukif only usplash could do animation12:33
Keybukimagine what the breezy april fools joke could've been12:33
jpatricklol12:33
KinnisonUbuntu days reenabled for XX:0012:34
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:Kinnison] : Ubuntu Development (not support, even with dapper) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Flight CD 3 released | If your initramfs is broken in any way, please save a copy for infinity | LP Upgrade was today, please report bugs if you see 'em
sivangjdub: is this your work? :) http://people.ubuntu.com/~jdub/random/3ubuntu.jpg12:35
jbaileyKeybuk: Usplash could do animation.  I'll flicker because of lack of double buffering, but it's no worse than I had on my TRS-80 ;)12:35
Kinnisontrash80!12:35
jbaileyKinnison: Yeah.  I phear what my father must've paid for that collection of machinery when I was little. =)12:36
=== Kinnison grins
Kamionpitti: could you please review inputattach for main inclusion? thanks12:37
pittiyep12:37
Keybukdidn't we go through that bit already? :p12:38
KeybukI remember bribing you and shortcutting it in <g>12:38
KamionI noticed that joystick was in universe, so I don't get to use the "basically already in main" exception12:39
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KeybukI need to find a package I can use Tom Lehrer quotes and lyrics in the changelog of12:41
=== Keybuk looks at emacs
Keybuk:p12:41
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TreenaksKeybuk: Send the marines.12:41
Keybuk We'll all go together, when we go12:42
Kinnison Three billion hunks of well done steak12:42
Kinnison I got it from Alice...12:45
KinnisonKeybuk: or, to follow on from your last maths related one...  But you can't take seven from three...12:46
mjr You can get anything you want, at Alice's restaurant (excepting Alice)12:46
KinnisonBTW, the +builds UI should be fixed a bit now12:46
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KinnisonKeybuk: in fact, the new math song is full of usable lines12:48
Kinnison"'cos addition is commutative, right?'"12:48
Treenaks'The textbook that I got this problem out of wants you do do it in base 8'12:49
lamont-awayMithrandir: what needs love on the livecd front?12:50
Keybukhttps://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/udev12:51
KeybukKinnison: ^ still displays the wrong versions12:51
Mithrandirlamont-away: s/jackass/drescher/ in livecd.sh, AIUI12:51
KinnisonKeybuk: yeah, s'a non-shallow bug afaict12:51
KinnisonKeybuk: bug cprov12:51
jdubsivang: found object12:51
lamont-awayMithrandir: ah, ok.  I'll fix that once I'm awake12:52
Kamionlamont-away: (s/jackass/drescher/ is kind of a spiritual rendering of the substitution, I'm sure a few other things need changed ... worst case make it use archive.u.c)12:52
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Mithrandirlamont-away: thanks.  And what Kamion says12:52
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Keybukhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/4688670.stm12:53
Keybuk^ fantastic12:53
jpatrickwow, that's odd..12:54
DizietWoohoo, Debian ff maintainer seems to be accepting most of my patches.12:55
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slomomjg59: ping? i have two patches for the dbus-mono bindings... do you want to take a look at it or can i upload it?01:07
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mjg59slomo: I'm so not the right person :)01:10
mjg59Check with pitti and then upload?01:10
sladenKeybuk: it could do animation01:10
sladenKeybuk: what did you have in mind?01:10
slomomjg59: well, you was the last one who touched dbus :) but ok, i'll ask pitti01:10
Keybuksladen: dancing badgers, naturally01:10
slomopitti: ping? ;)01:10
ogramjg59, did you chnage something else in your last g-p-m upload ? i have a missing icon in the preferences recently01:11
pittilistening...01:11
mjg59ogra: Hrm. Don't think so.01:11
ogramjg59, (apart from the changelog entries i mean indeed)01:11
ograok, i'll have a deeper look then01:11
seb128icons broken are probably gnome-icon-theme bog01:11
slomopitti: this is the debdiff: http://slomosnail.de/~slomo/temp/dbus_0.60-2ubuntu11.debdiff01:11
seb128there changed half of the world01:11
slomopitti: it fixes two rather big bugs in the bindings... and doesn't touch anything else01:12
seb128s/there/they01:12
pittislomo: ok, I'll upload that01:13
slomopitti: thanks :) (well, i could upload it too but when you want to do it...)01:13
pittislomo: oh, then go ahead01:14
ograseb128, hmm, i just noted it with all different themes ...01:14
pittislomo: I thought you were searching for a main uploader01:14
seb128ogra: they probably all inherit from the gnome theme and don't ship any variant for that icon01:14
ograyup01:14
slomopitti: no... only for a "go ahead" :) i don't want to touch something as important as dbus without asking before01:14
ograguess so01:14
Keybukogra: this isn't the first missing icon you've had though01:15
Keybukyou had missing nm icons last week, no?01:15
ograyup01:15
seb128that was due to a cache issue01:15
ograbut that was fixed by deleting a cache file 01:15
seb128something/somebody did generate a GTK icon cache on his box01:16
Treenaksseb128: gnome doesn't remember that I want nm-applet to start, is that a result of the new logout/switchuser stuff?01:16
seb128how would it be supposed to remember? save it to your session01:16
seb128ie: run gnome-session-save01:16
Treenaksseb128: why doesn't it do that for me?01:17
seb128it never did01:17
seb128because it doesn't assume you want to register all the stuff which are open to your session01:17
seb128you have to store your session when you want to do so01:17
Treenaksseb128: That's OK, but stuff like network-manager and gnome-power-manager are quite essential imho01:17
seb128that's why they put a desktop to /usr/share/autostart01:18
Treenaksseb128: then why don't they start?01:18
seb128which will be started automatically by gnome-session for every user when I've figured why it doesn't work atm01:18
ograg-p-m doesnt yet .... iirc01:18
Treenaksah01:18
seb128because you didn't send a patch and I'm too busy to fix the universe in a day?01:18
ogra(put a .desktop in place)01:18
seb128it does actually01:18
Treenaksseb128: I'm just asking.. sorry.. how was I supposed to know about gnome-session-save?01:19
hungergnome-power-manager does not run when gdm is on as I understand it.01:19
ograhunger, ??01:19
ograyou mean if youre not logged in ... ?01:19
hungerogra: Right.01:20
ograthats true01:20
hungerogra: It should do aggressive power saving then in my oppinion.01:20
seb128Treenaks: no problem. Right there is an usuability issue with session saving atm, that's already been pointed but nobody went with a constructive suggestion01:20
hungerogra: It won't be bothering anyone then;-)01:20
seb128Treenaks: if you have suggestions on how to change that you are welcome01:20
seb128Treenaks: note I don't want to fix the universe, but the session autostart is on my list, I just did come to it yet :)01:21
Treenaksseb128: sure, if I get a brilliant idea I'll send it to you :)01:21
ograhunger, its fine as it is currently ... at least its the best we have ... future versions or apps we might use might also work when nobody is logged in...01:21
=== hunger shrugs. I am not using gdm anyway.
ograhunger, i know desrt is aiming to prepare something alternative ...01:22
seb128Treenaks: note too that my initial comment is that session never remembered stuff for you if you didn't say it to do so01:22
seb128Treenaks: it just used to have a box to the session dialog for that01:23
Treenaksseb128: yeah01:23
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Keybukooh, emblems are now recursive!01:27
Keybuklook ma, I was good today in the scouts! :p01:27
ogralol01:27
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StevenKHeh01:27
=== Keybuk wonders what the little horsey means
TreenaksKeybuk: No pony for you.01:28
StevenKHeh. I don't remember asking to be a member of motureviewers, but here I am being one.01:29
KeybukStevenK: probably because you're a member of a team that are all members01:30
jdubKeybuk: you now have a little planet, too :-)01:34
TreenaksPlanet Keybuk?01:34
KeybukI saw that01:34
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jbaileyseb128: Around?01:36
seb128jbailey: yep01:36
=== Diziet gets confused and resorts to drawing a railway diagram.
jbaileyseb128: How's life on the timezone front?01:37
jbaileyseb128: Are all the issues you had sorted out with the 2.3.10 locales?01:37
seb128jbailey: great now, everything works fine now01:37
jbaileyRiddell: Actually, for you too, are you still having TZ issues?01:37
seb128yep01:37
Riddelljbailey: I never did (having not run a dist-upgrade or anything)01:38
Riddelljbailey: but everyone who complained has now had it fixed by updating to latest locales01:38
jbaileyRiddell: Lovely, thanks.01:38
jbaileySorry about forgetting to upload that last fix. =)01:38
jbaileyI have a launchpad bug open that counts on me not uploading glibc, so I'll look at moving all the timezone love to locales properly tomorrow.01:39
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DizietOh, FFS, this strange spew from the ff build system is due to the make multiline incompatibility.01:49
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DizietAARGH.  How do I get this shit-for-brains new make to pass a multi-line string to a command without any spurious \'s in it ?01:55
elmoDiziet: there was a thread about it on d-d@l.d.o that might help01:55
Treenaks\l\i\k\e\ \t\h\i\s\ \o\f\ \c\o\u\r\s\e\!01:55
Dizietelmo: Do you happen to have a ref or shall I google ?01:57
elmohttp://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/12/msg00988.html01:57
DizietTa.01:57
mjg59elmo: Can you sync hotkey-setup from Debian? (Do syncs still work the same way?)01:58
DizietEeeeeech.01:58
elmomjg59: yes, and in a bit01:58
mjg59elmo: Thanks01:58
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=== Diziet resorts to: set -e; s=' script \ as \ previously '; n="$$(printf "%s" "$$s" | sed -e 's/\\$$//')"; \ perl -e "$$n"
DizietAt least that way we won't get a rejected patch every time they change the middle of the script.02:01
=== ogra hugs Kamion for the NEW stuff
KeybukI'm going to write an MTA02:11
Keybukit's Unique Selling Point will be that it never delivers anything02:11
ograhuh ? 02:11
Keybukand I shall call it DHL02:11
ogralol02:12
zakamehaha02:12
desrtKeybuk; have it deliver a mail back to the sender stating merely "everything is ok."02:12
ograbut break the contens before :)02:12
ogra*contents02:12
desrtright.  you can't include the original contents in this reply02:13
Keybuk"we put it on the van this morning" ... that's nice, NOW WHERE THE FUCK IS THE VAN?  "oh, the driver finished for the day, it's gone back to the depot"02:13
desrtotherwise you might be able to trick DHL into delivering for you02:13
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Kamionelmo: so how do I change overrides in soyuz (e.g. move a package to a different component)? Kinnison pointed me at change-override.py, but it tries to talk to dogfood and Kinnison said it looked unfinished ...02:22
slomoKamion: while you're at it... can you move libxine1c2 to multiverse? it's source package and the other binary package created by this one is already in multiverse02:25
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Kamionslomo: no, I can't02:27
Kamionslomo: not without knowing how to change overrides :P02:27
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slomoKamion: oh sure... sorry... but can you do it when someone told you how? :)02:28
desrtgrr02:29
desrtslomo; 02:29
desrtKeybuk; 02:29
desrt"its", not "it's"02:29
Keybukdesrt: doesn't matter where you put punctuation, as long as it's there ;)02:30
stratusheh02:30
desrt"it's" is appropriate in this case.02:30
StevenKDamn, why didn't Keybuk mark my English papers when I was in high school. :-P02:30
Keybukit's was appropriate there too, "it has"02:31
desrt08:12 <Keybuk> it's Unique Selling Point will be that it never delivers anything02:31
Keybukoh, bah02:31
stratusit's expired02:31
desrti let it slide.... i'm usually good for one... but once slomo did it too i snapped :)02:32
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=== Keybuk forces desrt to the floor and tickles him to death
=== desrt does not negotiate with terrorists
stratusdesrt: you should review intltoolized strings.02:32
stratusheh02:32
StevenKWhat's to negotiate? Keybuk didn't talk to you about it, he just forced you to the floor, and then to your death.02:33
desrtstratus; far more productive to make the authors of said strings acutely aware of their poor spelling :)02:33
Keybukdesrt: spelling things right would involve thinking before I type02:34
desrtisn't it noon there?02:34
stratusdesrt: sure, but i was just pointing out that you would be helpful in that camp too.02:34
desrtstratus; i can't pay attention to anything like that for more than about 12 seconds :(02:35
stratusdesrt: but i'm sure that you still have the raw power to blame upstream about their poor strings, go ahead. :-)02:36
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desrtstratus; i often do do that :)02:36
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stratusdesrt: for more than 12 seconds? sounds great.02:37
desrtstratus; while using my computer, if i see something that needs fixing02:37
stratusdesrt: good anyway.02:38
desrtwe need a grammar police :)02:39
stratusi think english itself lacks one, so...02:39
=== Keybuk eyes the "UNIX time" and "Internet Time" features of the gnome panel clock
KeybukWHY ARE THOSE STILL THERE?02:39
HrdwrBoBdesrt: you rand?02:39
desrtrang?02:39
HrdwrBoBer rang02:39
HrdwrBoByes02:39
desrtKeybuk; ya.  seriously.  wtf.02:39
desrtKeybuk; they didn't even ask me to add "desrt time"02:40
desrtKeybuk; (00:00 to FF:FF GMT)02:40
TreenaksKeybuk: 'Internet Time' is the @200 stuff right?02:40
stratusdesrt time or desert time?02:40
KeybukTreenaks: right02:40
TreenaksKeybuk: I know people who actively use that02:40
HrdwrBoBTreenaks: that nobody ever used or understood02:40
Keybukstratus: or dessert time?02:40
HrdwrBoBTreenaks: all five of them will have to move on02:40
TreenaksHrdwrBoB: and UNIX time is useful sometimes02:40
KeybukTreenaks: not on the panel, it isn't!02:40
desrtdesrt time, definitely.02:40
HrdwrBoBTreenaks: anyone who needs unix time knows how to get it02:40
stratusKeybuk: yes, btw who cares about UNIX time? It's over.02:40
TreenaksKeybuk: I don't want to be forced to run the KDE clock applet...02:41
stratus:-)02:41
KeybukTreenaks: "date"02:41
desrthahahah02:41
TreenaksKeybuk: that requires an extra terminal02:41
desrtunix time is what i thought it was02:41
desrtwhat a useless option02:41
HrdwrBoBTreenaks: oh nos, if you need unix time02:41
HrdwrBoByou have plenty of terminals alreadt02:41
Keybukif we have either of those, I want to be able to see the date in Discordian!02:41
desrtKeybuk; please don't say anything to upstream about those two options02:42
desrtKeybuk; i want to do something fun :)02:42
stratusdesrt: bcc me and share the fun stuff.02:43
desrtstratus; send me an email with your gnome bugzilla email address02:44
=== desrt gotta run
stratusdesrt: heh02:44
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ograpitti, ping02:56
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pittiogra: pong02:56
ograpitti, do you have sound now ? 02:56
ogracant get it working here02:56
pittioh, new kernel in the archive now?02:57
ograyup02:57
=== pitti tries
ogra/dev/sndstat looks fine, the devices in /dev/snd as well02:57
freeflyingogra: pitti : hi, I've noticed that you've talked about scim in #ubuntu-meeting, so how about that maininclusion 02:58
pittifreeflying: yes, good idea; can you quickly drive me through the first steps with scim? I don't know anything about input methods02:58
pitti(in /msg)02:58
ografreeflying, its on the anastacia list for main inclusion... but that was before the switch to launchpad, no idea if or when it will enter main 02:58
ografreeflying, i'm not having any clue about scim myself, i just see the enormous demad and occasinally get questions from users about it02:59
=== pitti aptitude install skim
freeflyingogra: pitti : will you read something here www.scim-im.org03:00
pittiscim even03:01
freeflyingpitti: I'm remastering livecd, and make skim work with it defaultly, so if you'd like , you may have a try about skim03:01
pittiI installed scim now (above was just a typo)03:02
pittido I need skim as well?03:02
freeflyingpitti: in gnome you need not03:02
freeflyingpitti: skim is just a kde fronted for scim03:03
pittiok03:03
pittiso I installed scim, and in gedit I now have the scim input method03:03
freeflyingpitti: and also you'd install some IMEngine like scim-tables-zh or others03:03
pittibut I continue to type latin characters03:03
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pittiwhoops03:04
pittiI pressed ctrl+spave03:04
pittiand now I can type chinese :)03:04
freeflyingexport XMODIFIERS=@im=SCIM03:04
freeflyingexport GTK_IM_MODULE=scim03:04
freeflyingexport QT_IM_MODULE=scim03:04
freeflying#export QT_IM_SWITCHER=scim03:04
freeflying#scim -d03:04
freeflying#export XMODIFIERS=@im=fcitx03:04
freeflying#export GTK_IM_MODULE=fcitx03:04
freeflying#export QT_IM_MODULE=fcitx03:04
freeflying#fcitx-cairo03:04
pitti03:04
pittiwell, maybe not chinese, but something like that :)03:05
jpatrickhehe03:05
jpatrick:)03:05
freeflyingpitti: great ,thses are some Japnese at all ,:)03:05
pittiah, my keyboard selector turned into something different03:05
pittiwith a huuuge choice of alphabets, nice03:05
freeflyingpitti: y, and there many other IMEngines in scim-tables03:06
spaceytoo bad there is no k8 kernel on 32bit03:06
pittiwhoops, gedit crashed03:06
pittifreeflying: is scim known to cause many crashes?03:06
freeflyingpitti: it used be , but now quite few03:07
seb128pitti: backtrace?03:07
pitti!03:08
seb128pitti: oh, scim one?03:08
pitti(I hope that's not a curse of any kind :) )03:08
freeflyingpitti: these are chinese 03:09
seb128how does scim work? I tried installing it some time ago but ctrl-space was not doing anything03:09
pittiyes, I know03:09
pittiseb128: right-click, select input method scim03:09
seb128ah, k03:09
pittiand then ctrl+space changes03:09
=== seb128 tries again
mdkesiretart, any luck with the ubuntu-docs upload?03:09
pittiand I can select the mapping in the keyboard applet03:09
freeflyingpitti: if you use qt/kde program , install scim-qtimm, and it will works too03:10
pittifreeflying: ok, nice, so it seems that scim works out of the box03:10
pittiand it's not terribly big either03:11
freeflyingpitti: y03:11
pittiogra, BenC: still no ppc sound with 15 kernel03:11
pittiit can open the device now, though03:11
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ograpitti, yes, same here 03:12
ograpitti, i also noted that the alsa initscript is gone ... it used to make it work for me if i ran it with force-resume 03:12
freeflyingpitti: still no sound on ppc with 15 kernel?03:12
pittifreeflying: ok, I'll review the packages now03:12
pittifreeflying: exactly03:13
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freeflyingpitti: I prepare to show kubuntu on ppc to Mark at 2/1503:13
seb128pitti: I've no scim method on a GtkTextView widget menu03:13
=== freeflying hope that will be fixed
seb128(ie: gedit text area)03:13
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pitti_bah, go my ISP03:15
freeflyingseb128: you'd add these export XMODIFIERS=@im=SCIM,export GTK_IM_MODULE=scim03:15
pittifreeflying: why and where do you need all those scary exports?03:16
freeflyingpitti: I put these in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/03:17
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freeflyingpitti: you may configure these with im-switch03:17
seb128freeflying: doesn't work neither03:17
pittifreeflying: why do we need im-switch?03:19
seb128pitti: do you need to run "scim" somewhere to get the context menu method?03:19
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pittiseb128: yes, I selected 'Scim input method'03:20
freeflyingpitti: im-swithc ican configure these for each language such as Ja, Ko and others03:20
seb128pitti: I've no such menu item ... do you use the current dapper package?03:20
freeflyingseb128: you'd run scim -d first03:20
seb128as previous time I tried, no way to get the scim method listed or the control panel03:20
seb128scim is running03:20
pittiseb128: yes03:21
seb128without the -d03:21
seb128I use -d now but no change03:21
pittiseb128: I just did aptitude install scim, and then it was just there03:21
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freeflyingseb128: if you'd like , u may use my livecd for test skim/scim   http://ubuntu-zh.3322.org/ISO/kubuntu-zh-live-i386.iso03:22
pittiseb128: oh, btw, I only seem to get it in newly started apps03:23
pittiseb128: i. e. I started gedit, and it's there03:23
jsgotangcodownloading...03:23
pittiseb128: it's not automatically updated to existing apps like my terminals03:23
jsgotangcougghhh 10kb/sec03:23
freeflyingjsgotangco: it's just a 4M VDSL,03:24
pittifreeflying: hm, no; I get it in gedit, but not in gnome-terminal03:24
pittieven after restarting03:25
seb128pitti: I restart gedit several times03:25
seb128I'll strace it to see03:25
pittifreeflying: DCC doesn't work well here, please pastebin or email03:26
freeflyingpitti: put the file I sending in /etc/X11/Xsession.d and make it can be excute03:26
seb128pitti: "grep -i scim /etc/gtk-2.0/gtk.immodules" ?03:26
pitti"/usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.4.0/immodules/im-scim.so"03:26
pitti"scim" "SCIM Input Method" "scim" "/usr/share/locale" ""03:27
seb128k03:27
seb128I've no such entry03:27
seb128scim package is bugged somewhere03:27
=== seb128 runs /usr/bin/gtk-query-immodules-2.0
seb128lsd25: /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.4.0/immodules/im-scim.so: No such file or directory03:27
seb128s/lsd25/ls (xchat...)03:28
seb128pitti: dlocate /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.4.0/immodules/im-scim.so ?03:28
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freeflyingpitti: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/817403:28
jbaileydoko: Seen the emails with Sujet: Request for clarification on the 128bit long double requirments  ?03:29
Treenaks'Sujet'? :)03:29
jbaileyTreenaks: "subject" in fr_CA03:29
pittiseb128: scim-gtk2-immodule03:30
Treenaksjbailey: ah :) 'shady figure' in Dutch :)03:30
pittifreeflying: that script sets scim as default input method?03:30
seb128ahhhh03:30
jbaileyTreenaks: But I tend to assume that all of the distro team is passingly fluent in just about every western european language, and a smattering of eastern european ones for common prompts. =)03:30
seb128that's what I was missing the previous time too03:30
seb128pitti: thank you03:30
freeflyingpitti: y 03:30
pittiseb128: you didn't install recommends: or something?03:30
jbaileypitti: ping re: timezone stuff when you have a moment.03:31
pittijbailey: moderately busy, but just fire away03:31
Riddelljbailey: fr_CA is not a western european language03:31
seb128pitti: no, I use apt and don't install Recommends since I don't want those usually03:31
jbaileyRiddell: I've been advocating that Canada join the EU for some time.03:31
jbaileyRiddell: I want a european passport, DAMMIT.03:31
jbailey=)03:31
jbaileypitti: It looks like the sensible thing for me to do is migrate all of the timezone questions in glibc to locales.  I think that will solve the last of the questions I have about it.  Any objection?03:32
dokojbailey: yes, ABI breakage discovered for all versions after 3.303:33
jbaileydoko: It looks like glibc will support the old and new ABIs/.03:33
pittijbailey: in principle not, but what do we need questions for? i. e. which particular question do you mean?03:33
jbaileypitti: Establishing the default timezone.03:33
pittijbailey: ah, just a normal prio debconf question?03:34
jbaileyKamion: This is probably interesting to you as well, since I think the installer might set this.03:34
freeflyingpitti: or you can install im-switch and " im-switch -s scim " , it will establish a simbolic link in ~/.input.d03:34
jbaileypitti: Well, the nice part is that I think this means it can actually become a debconf question.03:34
freeflyingpitti: then scim will start with X03:34
jbaileyRight now it's a shell script.03:34
pittijbailey: ah, right, I recently got that question in a terminal03:34
jbaileypitti: Yeah, that happened because it detected that you had chosen a timezone that didn't exist.03:35
jbailey(since the timezones were no longer in the libc6 package)03:35
pittierm, had I?03:35
pittiah, I see03:35
jbaileySo I think the Right Thing is to put the question in the package that actually contains the timezones.03:35
pittiI agree03:35
jbaileySince it's not an essential package, I think it means that I can debconfify it and everything.03:35
jbaileylocales, that is.03:36
dokojbailey: right, dapper's as well?03:38
Kamionjbailey: as long as it continues to support the non-debconf interfaces to setting the timezone (/etc/timezone and /etc/localtime), that's fine03:38
jbaileydoko: Dapper won't grow the new ABI.  It's all glibc 2.403:40
jbaileyunless I've seriously misunderstoof.03:40
jbaileyKamion: Sure.  Debconf Is Not a Registry. =)03:40
Kamionsomebody remind me, what do I have to do to make Rosetta pick up a new .pot file in my package?03:41
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TreenaksKamion: draw a circle on the ground, put some candles on it, wave a dead chicken03:41
RiddellKamion: it should do it automatically (or rather the rosetta people will notice it and assign it somewhere sensible)03:41
Riddellbut dapper isn't being imported into rosetta yet03:41
KamionRiddell: automatically if the .pot file appears somewhere in the source package, or if it appears somewhere in the binary package?03:43
Kamionthis is a weird case and does not correspond neatly to stuff in /usr/share/locale?03:43
Kamions,\?,/,03:43
freeflyingpitti ,seb128 : how about scim now ?03:43
RiddellKamion: if it appears in the compiled sources03:43
KamionRiddell: YM the binary package, or the built source tree?03:44
seb128freeflying: after installing the input method it seemed to work, what was the discussion about?03:44
RiddellKamion: built source tree03:44
Kamionhm, ok, scary magic03:44
RiddellI think, pitti will know the details03:44
freeflyingseb128: We want this can be installed defaultly , at least for our CJK users03:45
Riddellseb128: I think freeflying is asking if it's passed main inclusion review yet03:46
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seb128ah, that's a question for pitti03:47
seb128I was just interested to get it working because we get bugs about it sometime and I didn't manage to reproduce them before03:47
hungerpitti: Just assigned #30730 over to you... It would be nice if you could use that for fetchmail's init script (it is just a couple of lines shuffled around to make /etc/default/fetchmail more useful).03:50
hungerpitti: Thanks:-)03:50
siretartmdke: not yet, cprov wanted to contact me about some kind of additional required workflow. I didn't really get it03:59
pittifreeflying: yes, I'm reviewing it now, don't panic :)04:00
pittiKamion: the pot file needs to be somewhere in the built source tree, not in the debs04:00
freeflyingpitti: just waiting   :)04:01
pittiKamion: preferably in the same directory where the po files are, but as long as there is only one po/ directory and pot file, it does't really matter04:01
pittiKamion: pkgstriptranslations just does sth like find -name *.pot -o *.po | tar up04:02
Kamionpitti: ok, perfect - thanks04:02
pittihunger: yes, I agree04:02
jbaileyseb128: Are you handling evo-exchange bugs now, or should those go to Adam?04:06
seb128jbailey: I don't have any exchange setup, so my "handling" on them is limited to forward what looks like a bug upstream04:07
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pittifreeflying: what's scim-dev for? it's an empty package04:19
pittifreeflying: ah, nevermind04:19
freeflyingpitti:  meta package to provide development libraries and documentations for SCIM platform.04:20
pittifreeflying: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionReportScimimswitch doesn't exist04:21
freeflyingpitti: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionReportim-switch?highlight=%28switch%2904:23
pittifreeflying: ah, 'mind the dash' :)04:23
pittifreeflying: thanks, I'll correct it on the MainInclusionQueue page04:23
pittifreeflying: so what we should do is to make e. g. scim-anthy a dependency of language-support-ja, right?04:25
pittifreeflying: and maybe put scim itself in desktop04:25
pittifreeflying: so that we can avoid installing all input methods on all computers04:25
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freeflyingpitti: make IMEgine a dependency of language-support04:26
Keybukgot to pop into town to get vga/dvi converter, then will be building this pc04:26
pittifreeflying: hm, we don't even need to put scim in desktop, since e. g. scim-anthy depends on it already04:27
freeflyingpitti: y04:27
freeflyingpitti: just use dependency04:27
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jono_hi all04:28
jono_is beagle planned for dapper?04:28
pittifreeflying: where and how do we bring in im-switch?04:28
Treenaksjono_: I think it's still too crackful for that :(04:28
jono_Treenaks, thats what I thought04:28
freeflyingpitti: actually scim shall have a dependency on im-switch04:28
jono_but inotify is in right, so I just need to install the beagle package?04:29
Keybukinotify is in, enabled and used04:29
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freeflyingpitti: another problem: how can skim be installed 04:29
jono_Keybuk, good stuff :)04:29
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pittifreeflying: I don't have im-switch installed, and it works nevertheless04:29
pittifreeflying: hm, good question, we don't have separate gnome/kde support packages04:30
freeflyingpitti: the others use im-switch to configure scim 04:30
freeflyingpitti: im-switch make the configure more easily04:31
pittifreeflying: ok, I don't object against adding a dependency to scim04:31
pittiskim has it already04:31
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freeflyingpitti: I've added it to skim , but minghua will not add it to scim04:32
pittiwhy not?04:32
freeflyingpitti: in fact there are request for add it to scim about 1 year ago04:32
freeflyingpitti: I don't know 04:32
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pittifreeflying: debian bug 314744 ?04:33
pittisilly Ubugtu, speak after me: D-E-B-I-A-N04:33
freeflyingpitti: and in kubuntu, user needn't install scim , just libscim8 for skim04:34
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pittifreeflying: hm, so shouldn't e. g. scim-anthy depend on scim | skim, instead of just scim?04:34
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freeflyingpitti: it's hard to solve all these 04:35
=== pitti waves to jdthood
pittifreeflying: why? just changing dependencies is trivial? or does scim-anthy need more work to work with skim?04:36
freeflyingpitti: scim-anthy is just a IMengine of scim, but skim can wok\rk just need libscim804:37
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freeflyingactually, I just install libscim8 scim-anthy and skim, they will work 04:37
freeflyingand dependency of anthy on scim is meaningless04:38
=== jdthood semaphores back to pitti
pittifreeflying: ok, whatever, but something needs to be fixed04:39
freeflyings/libscim8/libscim8c2a04:39
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pittifreeflying: anyway, we shold probably just put scim into ubuntu-desktop, and skim into kubuntu-desktop and depend on the language specific input method packages in langauge-support-lang04:39
pittifreeflying: that libscim dependency is generated automatically04:40
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jdubhttp://en.opensuse.org/Xgl04:40
pittijdub: I saw the videos yesterday, craaack :)04:40
freeflyingpitti: best choice  now 04:41
jono_we need that kind of high quality, fresh, brazilian crack in Dapper04:41
ograpitti, another boring wobbly windows demo ?04:42
pittiogra: yes, with a performance requirement our open source drivers will never ever provide04:42
ograheh04:42
pittifreeflying: ok, chewing's dependencies are fine, could you please quickfix anthy?04:43
HiddenWolfpitti: isn't novell planning to ship it in NDL?04:43
pittidunno04:43
Yagisanpitti, so my beloved radeon 7200 can't run it nooo!!! ;)04:44
jono_ogra, they are shipping it in NLD04:44
ograHiddenWolf, in 3 years if its basically usable probably 04:44
KamionRiddell: kubuntu-dapper seeds seem to have been locked for some time?04:44
ograjono_, thats crazy04:44
Kamionbzr: WARNING: Unable to update the working tree of: sftp://chinstrap//home/warthogs/archives/seeds.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/seeds/dapper/04:44
HiddenWolfogra: damn. :/04:44
Kamionbzr: ERROR: bzrlib.errors.LockError: File '.bzr/branch-lock' already locked04:44
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jono_ogra, it is a touch04:44
ograHiddenWolf, no i have no clue to be honest ... but i wouldnt consider it ready for common usage04:45
Riddell-rw-rw-r--  1 pitti warthogs 0 Feb  7 15:33 .bzr/branch-lock04:45
freeflyingpitti: you mean the maininclusion of scim-anthy?04:45
RiddellKamion: pitti was the last to touch kubuntu seeds04:46
pittifreeflying: well, first that, and to make sense in general :)04:46
Kamion-rw-rw-r--    1 jriddell warthogs      0 Dec  8 03:35 branch-lock.write-lock04:46
Kamiondunno if that's significant04:46
Kamionpitti: ?04:46
HiddenWolfogra: I'd be nice to look into to at least test it. People like candy, and graphically dapper isn't too different from warty. :/04:46
pittiyes, the write-lock is what matters04:46
pittiKamion: but it's group writable, so that shouldn't stop you?04:46
ograHiddenWolf, i like stability ... 04:46
KamionI've certainly committed to kubuntu/seeds/dapper since Dec 804:46
Riddellme too04:46
Kamionpitti: I could probably break the lock by hand but I dislike doing that04:47
HiddenWolfogra: *chuckle* There is that.04:47
pittiKamion: I had this several times so far, I just rm'ed the .write-lock to make it work again04:47
ograHiddenWolf, and compatibility ...04:47
pittiKamion: that's what they told me in #bzr at least04:47
Kamionok, if neither of you are committing to it then I'll do that04:47
Kamions/committing/pushing/04:47
RiddellI'm not, go ahead04:47
pittime neither04:47
freeflyingpitti: shall change the dependency in scim-anthy package and upload it now04:48
Kamionok, thanks04:48
pittiKamion: hmm, Feb is still surprising, though; the last time I merged the seeds was last friday or so04:48
pitti(Feb 7 even)04:48
ograHiddenWolf, i.e. since i care for ltsp i rather care about S3 Virge than about Nvidia 25000XS turboboost afterburner cards ;)04:48
pittiKamion: so I assume that timestamp was from your attempt04:49
Kamionpitti: perhaps my bzr touched the branch-lock in the process of discovering that there was a held write lock04:49
lfittllamont-away: ping04:49
HiddenWolfogra: Hm, yeah, I agree.04:50
Yagisanogra: I miss the fact that my s3 virge has been unaccelerated since Xfree86 3..x04:50
mdkesiretart, ok good luck with that. Let me know when it is sorted out!04:50
pittifreeflying: thanks04:51
jono_is there a central hardware database for ubuntu ?04:51
pittifreeflying: maybe you want to add the im-switch dependency to scim?04:52
pittifreeflying: I don't know whether this makes sense, so I just defer that to your judgement :)04:52
freeflyingpitti: but the maintainer won't like to do so 04:52
pittifreeflying: in Debian you mean? I don't see a particular ubuntu maintainer04:53
Riddelljono_: no but ogra keeps an eye on what everyone is using at http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/04:53
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lamont-awaylfittl: si?04:53
jono_Riddell, ahhh cool04:54
lfittllamont-away: svnmailer successfully built 12 hours ago, but it is still not in the archive04:54
lamont-awayneato.04:54
ograjono_, you have a short mind :P04:54
lamont-awayKinnison: ^^04:55
jono_ogra, I remember we discussed this in the past :)04:55
pittifreeflying: oh, wait04:55
ograjono_, we talked about it a year ago ;)04:55
freeflyingpitti: what ?04:55
jono_ogra, I didnt realise this site was up and running04:55
pittifreeflying: no need to deviate from debian just for that dependency04:55
jono_ogra, last time we talked you were working on the client :)04:55
jono_ogra, good work :)04:55
pittifreeflying: we'll just add im-switch to ubuntu-desktop04:55
ograjono_, it is but still lacking basic functionallity ...04:55
jono_ogra, so can a user use the site to search for hardware support?04:55
ogranope, not yet04:56
pittifreeflying: so, merely fixing anthy is enouhg04:56
ograbut a developer can use the hwdb ID and download the dataset to get the info out of it ...04:56
freeflyingpitti: ok ,I'll upload to REVU04:56
ograsearchability is still the biggest lack04:56
jono_ogra, is the plan to make it searchable by users?04:56
pittifreeflying: will it be uploaded to ubuntu after that soon?04:57
pittifreeflying: if not, just pastebin me the debdiff, I'll upload it04:57
ograjono_, yup04:57
ograjono_, but that requires some time on my side i didnt have yet ...04:57
freeflyingpitti: It'll need some reviews 04:57
jono_ogra, ahhh ok04:57
pittifreeflying: I'm happy to review it :)04:57
ograjono_, currently edubuntu and ltsp draw all my attention04:58
freeflyingpitti: just some minutes04:58
pittiyes, no hurry :)04:58
Kamionlfittl: it's in NEW04:58
Kamionlfittl: all new packages require manual attention before entering the archive04:58
lfittlKamion: Binary NEW isn't processed automatically?04:59
Kamionlfittl: hell no04:59
lfittlKamion: oh, k, thanks04:59
lfittlKamion: Who processes the binary NEW queue?05:00
Kamionlfittl: elmo, mdz, and I05:00
pittifreeflying: same issue with scim-tables, it depends on scim05:02
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DizietCan anyone tell me what a StartupWMClass is ?05:13
Diziet(In a .desktop file.)05:13
Robot101Diziet: it's startup notification stuff05:20
Robot101Diziet: https://listman.redhat.com/archives/xdg-list/2003-July/msg00024.html05:20
KamionBenC: are you dealing with l-r-m and linux-meta?05:22
Kamion(I NEW-processed linux-source-2.6.15 earlier today)05:22
=== jdub wonders where some of his uploads went... libcmml, liboggz, libannodex...
ograjdub, NEW stuff ? 05:26
jdubnup05:26
jdublibapache2-mod-annodex was NEW05:26
ograyes, i saw the mail to utnubu05:26
Kamionjdub: versions?05:27
jdubSource: libcmml05:27
jdubVersion: 0.9.1-0ubuntu105:27
jdubSource: liboggz05:28
jdubVersion: 0.9.3-0ubuntu105:28
jdubSource: libannodex05:28
jdubVersion: 0.7.3-0ubuntu105:28
ograi dont see any upload from you on -changes05:28
jdubnor i05:28
ograwhen did you uplaod them ? 05:29
jdubi got a NEW mail back for mod_annodex05:29
jdubearlier today05:29
ograhmm, likely Kinnison can answer this ...05:29
ograor #launchpad05:30
Kamion02:50:05 WARNING Exception during processing made it out of the main loop.05:30
Kamion -> http://librarian.launchpad.net/1558945/vwS18nhX3kEkOC0oP39LLZBVffo.txt ('libcmml_0.9.1.orig.tar.gz')05:30
Kamionsodomy non sapiens05:30
KamionI suspect you forgot to use -sa05:30
jdubhrm05:31
Kamionif that's true and soyuz didn't mail you to tell you, file a bug05:31
pittiKamion: inputattach looks fine, btw05:31
pittiKamion: I just wonder why it's not built...05:31
jdubKamion: hrm, on launchpad?05:31
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ograhmm, LP bug ? it should reject it properly05:32
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Kamionjdub: launchpad-upload-and-queue05:32
Kamionpitti: has built, I new-processed it earlier today05:32
pittiah, I see05:32
Kamionand rookery has it05:33
jdubKamion: https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad-upload-and-queue/+bug/3074105:34
Ubugtumalone bug 30741 in launchpad-upload-and-queue "No error mail about missing .orig uploads" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  05:34
Kamionjdub: oh, where did that attachment come from?05:35
jdubsorry, which?05:35
Kamionhttp://librarian.launchpad.net/1558945/vwS18nhX3kEkOC0oP39LLZBVffo.txt, mentioned in that bug05:36
jdubyou pasted it above05:36
Kamionso I did :-)05:36
ograheh05:36
Kamionhadn't noticed there was a traceback in there05:37
ograjdub, looks like you can poke cprov directly in #launchpad :)05:37
DizietRobot101: Ah, thanks.05:37
pittimjg59: arrgh - I started g-p-m and it shut down my system05:39
=== Kinnison returns from the bank, sorry for the delay
Kinnisonlamont-away: ?05:41
ograhmm, yes, something is wrong ... i just updated it and the preferences crash 05:41
Kinnisonogra: ?05:41
pittiand now it immediately shuts down again while loading the gnome desktop05:41
mjg59pitti: Suggests that it failed to read your battery status and thought it was 005:41
mjg59Presumably hal boog05:42
pittimjg59: I just took out the battery, yes05:42
mjg59Ah05:42
mjg59In that case it's g-p-m being stupid05:42
mdzjdub: please unsubscribe khirano@gmail.com from ubuntu-bugs05:42
mdzjdub: it's bouncing, and the uncaught bounces are forwarded by mailman to me05:42
ograKinnison, see jdub ...05:42
pittimjg59: it even displayed me the power chord icon, so it knew that I was on power adapter05:42
mjg59pitti: Ha. Right, easy enough to fix then05:43
jdubmdz: ok05:43
pittimjg59: I'm going to continue to work on the new pmi now; I want to add script calling support05:43
mjg59pitti: Sure05:43
mjg59pitti: Ideally most of the scripts in acpi-support would move into pmi05:43
jdubmdz: done05:44
mdzjdub: thanks05:44
mjg59pitti: At least, the prepare and resume ones05:44
ogramjg59, while your at it.... see bug 3071805:44
pittimjg59: So I presume we'll need to move the /etc/power/ scripts from pbbuttonsd to pmi05:44
Ubugtumalone bug 30718 in gnome-power-manager "gnome-power-preferences crashes on toshiba a100" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/3071805:44
pittimjg59: but that will become a transition hell :-/05:44
mjg59pitti: Well, better to merge them with the ones from acpi-support05:44
mjg59Yes05:44
ogranot sure if thats the issue i see as well here05:44
mjg59ogra: kinnison was looking into that05:44
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ogramjg59, he already fixed it05:45
ogramjg59, but has no upload rights :)05:45
Kinnisonjdub: ?05:46
mjg59ogra: Ok05:46
lamont-awayKinnison: any idea on the status of svnmailer?  apparently "built several hours ago"05:46
Kinnisonlamont-away: svnmailer?05:46
=== Kinnison can look, one sec
lfittllamont-away: Kamion said that it was in binary NEW, everything is ok then05:46
lamont-awayah05:47
lamont-awayKinnison: is there any way that I can check yet? or is that still pending...05:47
Kinnisonlamont-away: still pending05:47
Kinnisonlamont-away: need web-ui visualisation of the distrorelease queues05:47
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lamont-awayok05:48
jdubKinnison: hrm?05:49
Kinnisonjdub: ogra said you wanted me#05:49
ograjdub, Kinnison is our point of contact for launcpad weirdness with uploads/buildds05:49
jdubKinnison: i fixed my shit and filed a tangentially related bug.05:50
Kinnisonjdub: okay05:50
Kinnison:-)05:50
=== Kinnison was at the bank
Kinnisonthe joys of mortgages05:50
ograBenC, hmm, my bcm43xx got worse with -15 lots of DUP's in pings to my AP and a pretty unstable behavior ...05:51
pittimjg59: hmm, reading the scrips, we don't actually need to move them from pbbuttonsd - the ones that are active by default don't do anythign for suspend/resume05:52
pittimjg59: and keeping the other ones in sync with upstream is a bit painful05:52
mjg59pitti: Ok05:52
ograi dont have any probs if i just disable pbbuttonsd over here ...05:53
pittimjg59: so I'll just add /etc/apm script calling for now, does that sound sane to you?05:53
pittiogra: no, pmi with some perlish ioctl's works just fine05:53
mjg59pitti: Ok05:53
ograpitti, yup :)05:53
pittimjg59: maybe g-p-m should conflict to pbbuttonsd in the future then?05:54
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ograpitti, dont tell that to Keybuk 05:54
pitti?05:54
KinnisonBenC: I was having fun last night with a yealink usb handset. know much about them?05:54
pittito Kamion you mean?05:54
mjg59pitti: Sure05:55
ograpitti, Conflicts may only be used for file conflicts in packages ...05:55
pittiogra: huh? since when?05:55
ograpitti, thats what i was told  ...05:55
ograpitti, ask Keybuk 05:55
mjg59Debian policy doesn't say that05:56
ograi had this discussion during the last xscreensaver-> gnome-screensaver switch05:56
pittithat sounds pretty weird, how else should two alternative packages that do the same thing declare a conflict to each tother?05:56
pittiKeybuk: ???05:56
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sistpotypitti: see malone #2233505:57
Ubugtumalone bug 22335 in ubuntu-meta ubuntu-desktop "gnome-screensaver conflicts with ubuntu-desktop" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2233505:57
pittiah05:57
pittiwell, that's something entirely different05:57
sistpotypitti: there is a lengthy comment in there ;)05:57
ograpitti, see Keybuks comment at the end05:58
seb128pitti: the discussion was about screensaver, and having both installed is not an issue, you may want to use one with KDE and the other with GNOME on the same box05:58
ograsistpoty, thanks, i didnt remember the bug#05:58
sistpotyogra: me neither, but goole is my friend ;)05:58
seb128pitti: so they should not conflict for nothing05:58
AmaranthReplaces is supposed to Do The Right Thing now, isn't it?05:58
pittiseb128: but here they will05:58
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seb128Replaces is when you replace a file from an another package05:58
pittiseb128: installing g-p-m and pbbuttonsd at the same time will break the same way as installing pmud and pbbuttonsd05:59
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pittiwhich is why pbbuttonsd Conflicts: pmud05:59
pittiand that makes much sense05:59
ograAmaranth, all these fields are only referring to files inside the packages ... according to Keybuk 05:59
seb128pitti: yeah, I was not speaking about current case :)05:59
pittiof course introducing a virtual package and C/F/P: to it would be cleaner05:59
Amaranthogra: Until we have something better to do what we need, I guess we'll have to keep abusing them then, eh? :)06:00
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ograAmaranth, sure, you dont meet Keybuk in person to feel the baseball bat :)06:00
Amaranthogra: we're on different continents ;)06:01
seb128Amaranth: abusing Replaces for what?06:01
ograus others who do, might consider themselves ;)06:01
Amaranthseb128: abusing Replaces/Conflicts to do transitions06:01
ograseb128, for package foo replaces package bar ...06:01
seb128if you want to transition you have to use Provides too06:01
ograAmaranth, honestly, i tend to trust Keybuks knowledge06:01
Amaranthseb128: well, yeah06:02
Amaranthbut those are all supposed to do different things, we're using them wrong06:02
mjg59Ok, fixed g-p-m06:02
Amaranthoh well :D06:02
seb128speak for you06:02
Simirawho is in charge of time-admin?06:02
ogramjg59, thanks :D06:02
seb128Simira: upstream? :)06:02
ograSimira, dholbach 06:02
ogra*g*06:02
seb128Simira: dholbach/mvo/me06:02
Simiraseb128: preferrably. I'm stuck in a wrong timezone06:03
seb128Simira: dholbach|mvo|me rather :)06:03
ograSimira, thats locales/glibc ... was fixed by jbailey iirc06:03
seb128Simira: how "stuck"? what version of the locales package do you have?06:03
ogratry an upgrade 06:03
Simiraogra: there are none06:03
ograhmm06:04
Simiraseb128: time-admin doesn't work, and the last update changed my time zone, for some reason06:04
Simirato utc06:04
pittimjg59: ok, so after Scott's lengthy rant^Wexplanation, it seems to me that g-p-m Conflicts:/Replaces: pbbuttonsd shoudl actually be fine?06:04
mjg59Sure06:04
seb128Simira: what version of the locales package do you have?06:04
pittiso I don't understand the excitement 06:04
pittiintroducing virtual packages for all pairs of semantically conflicting packages is certainly not what we want06:05
ograpitti, i understand that its not fine, unless you have two conflicting files ..06:05
pitti(s/pairs/sets/)06:05
mjg59ogra: This isn't true06:05
seb128pitti: the discussion was that xscreensaver/gnome-screensaver which don't require any sort of Conflicts technically06:05
Simiraseb128: 2.3.1006:06
pittiogra: according to scott, using Conflicts: *alone* is a problem, and I perfectly understand that06:06
seb128Simira: hum, that should work fine with that one :/06:06
ogramjg59, this is what he told me in /query as well as the aforementioned bug06:06
mjg59xscreensaver/gnome-screensaver shouldn't conflict because there is no conflict of function06:06
mjg59g-p-m/pbbuttons probably should, because there is a conflict of function06:06
seb128ogra: that was not quite the same situation06:06
seb128your conflict had no reason to be06:07
Simiraseb128: it worked when Tollef watched, for some reason06:07
pittiright now pbbuttonsd and g-p-m fight with each other, and I get really strange effects06:07
Simiraseb128: but I didn't have locales installed, though06:07
Simirauntil now06:07
seb128pitti: I think everybody out of ogra agree you should use C/R for it :)06:07
seb128Simira: that was your issue so06:07
ograseb128, i tend to agree, but still there are no conflicting files in the packages and i dont know about functional conflicts06:08
Simiraseb128: probably. Thanks anyway06:08
pittiogra: I do :)06:08
seb128Simira: complain to jbailey when he's around than an upgrade let you without locales installed :)06:08
pittiogra: in fact, it function-conflicts with gnome-settings-daemon, too, but we didn't make that explicit so far since we needed the other bits of pbbuttonsd06:08
pittimjg59: it seems that in the near future we need to extent pmi's interface to cover power source changes06:10
pittimjg59: /etc/apm scripts support that at least06:10
ograpitti, i'm just very careful since i had to learn it the painful way and its still how i understood Keybuk 06:10
ograpitti, up to you if you want to interpret it differently06:10
Kinnisonmjg59: thanks for that upload to g-p-m06:11
ograpitti, but i think the part about virtual package names in the bug might apply 06:11
Amarantherr, don't xscreensaver and gnome-screensaver both try to lock the screen?06:12
Amaranthi guess gnome-session would have to start both of them for that to be a problem though06:12
ograAmaranth, yes06:12
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seb128Amaranth: only one is started06:13
ograand gnome-screensaver had a Replaces as well back then 06:13
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ograeven if the bug only states the conflicts06:13
seb128could you move that to #random-discussion-place? :)06:13
Amaranthso until we get the redesigned gnome-session... :)06:14
seb128?06:14
seb128what are you talking about06:14
seb128gnome-session starts gnome-screensaver first and fallback on xscreensaver if it's not installed06:14
seb128what do you want to redesign?06:15
Amaranthseb128: i thought gnome-session was being completely redone for 2.1606:15
Amaranthusing .desktop files in /usr/share/autostart or something to decide what to start in the session06:15
seb128that change is already in current dapper version ...06:16
seb128and that's a new feature, nothing has been redesigned06:16
Amarantherr, so shouldn't packages handle whether or not they're added to the session?06:16
seb128they do06:16
Amaranthand not the gnome-session package06:17
Amaranthok...06:17
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Amaranth*sigh*06:17
seb128g-p-m, n-m, g-v-m install a .desktop to /usr/share/autostart06:17
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Amaranthi should just stop coming to these channels until the end of march when i'm actually using ubuntu again06:17
seb128I just have to debug why the feature doesn't work atm, that might be a distro patch breaking it06:18
Amaranthoh, that reminds me, alacarte and pyxdg will get no love from me until dapper+106:18
seb128no big change :)06:18
Amaranthheh06:18
seb128they have not changed for months now :)06:18
Amarantha couple of bugs still though06:18
Amaranthiirc one of the bugs has been fixed in pyxdg cvs for about 6 months06:19
seb128do you have a cvsdiff or something?06:19
seb128maybe we should patch the package06:19
Amaranthi don't even have access to cvs06:19
Amaranththe program, i mean :P06:19
Amaranthand it was a series of cvs commit's, i'll have to piece together which ones actually fixed it06:20
seb128http://cvs.freedesktop.org06:20
Amaranthsomeone else said they wanted to take over pyxdg maintainership, i wish i could remember who06:20
seb128in case you have access to some kind of internet browser06:21
Amaranthseb128: yeah, lanius committed it weird06:21
Amaranthseb128: it's a couple of different commits, i think because he got it wrong and didn't test before committing06:21
seb128what file has the change?06:22
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AmaranthMenu.py06:22
Amaranthhttp://cvs.freedesktop.org/pyxdg/pyxdg/xdg/Menu.py?r1=1.142&r2=1.14306:22
Amaranththere's a start06:22
Amaranthbut the diff is on top of all the other unicode fix attempts06:22
zygahello06:23
zygaAmaranth: hi06:23
=== Amaranth points at zyga
Amaranthgood luck :P06:23
zygawhat's up?06:23
zygawhat unicode fix attempts?06:23
Amaranthit'd be nice if pyxdg in dapper could get the utf-8 fixes and tryexec support from cvs06:23
lfittlBenC: ping06:23
Amaranthif someone has non-utf8 data in their .desktop file, pyxdg will die trying to read it06:24
Amaranthcvs has a fix06:24
zygaAmaranth: are those fixes in cvs?06:24
zygak06:24
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zygaI'll look at them today06:24
Amaranthactually, i think it only fixes non-utf8 filenames06:24
zygais there a bug number?06:24
Keybukpitti: C/R is fine, I'd also recommend one of the packages was dropped from the archive06:24
Keybukbecause otherwise we get bitten when we change our minds before release06:24
Keybuklike we *ALWAYS* do06:24
Amaranthbug 2569906:24
Ubugtumalone bug 25699 in pyxdg "smeg won't start at all!" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2569906:24
zygaAmaranth: thanks06:25
Amaranthand 2996106:25
ograKeybuk, so i misunderstood it ? 06:25
Keybukogra: conflicts or replaces on their own are bad unless you mean what they mean06:25
Keybuktogether they *can* do what you want06:26
Keybukbut only if you're never, ever, going to change your miund06:26
Keybuke.g. udev conflicts and replaces hotplug06:26
pittiKeybuk: well, we don't want to drop pbbuttonsd from the archives06:26
Keybukpitti: then you don't want C/R06:26
pittiKeybuk: I'd like to push it out of desktop06:26
Keybukpitti: you instead want to make mvo's magic upgrade tool uninstall it06:26
Keybukdesktop or main?06:26
pittiKeybuk: desktop primarily06:26
pittiit's still good for xfce etc.06:26
pittiand we can uncripple pbbuttonsd again06:26
KamionI think we also need to make the consequences of having them simultaneously installed much less bad06:26
pittiif we use g-p-m06:27
Kamionbecause not everyone will be using mvo's magic upgrade tool06:27
Keybukthe problem is that we're bound to change our minds and not ship g-p-m06:27
pittiand if we don't use g-p-m, then the c/r won't hurt06:27
Kamionfor example each could refuse to start if the other's running06:27
Keybukwe've done this every damned release so far06:27
Keybukkamion++06:27
Kamionthat would be much safer and simpler IMO06:27
Amaranthmaybe g-p-m could stop the pbbuttonsd daemon when it starts?06:27
Kamionand wouldn't cause massive package manager pain06:27
pittiAmaranth: no06:27
pittiAmaranth: g-p-m runs in the user's session, pbbuttonsd is a system daemon06:28
Amaranthhrm06:28
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Amaranthpbbuttonsd could see if g-p-m was installed?06:28
pittiKamion: but if we make g-p-m not doing anythign at all if pbbuttonsd is running, then we can as well not install it at all06:28
pittiAmaranth: no, because not everyone uses gnome06:29
pittiAmaranth: you do want pbbuttonsd for !gnome06:29
Kamionpitti: then make pbbuttonsd not start up if g-p-m is installed?06:29
pittiso that should be sorted out in the *-desktop metapackages06:29
Kamionthat would work on the next reboot06:29
pittiKamion: well, *that* seems hackish to me06:29
Kamionand is no worse than Conflicts06:29
Amaranthpitti: ok then, doesn't gdm run as root? :)06:29
Kamionand a hell of a lot less painful for package managers to resolve06:30
pittiKamion: what's so bad about having two alternative solutions for a common problem and declarign a C/R about it? maybe I'm blind, but I still don't understand the fuss about it06:30
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pittithe final u-desktop should depend on whichever solution we eventually want, and the c/r would make sure that the transition works either way06:30
Kamionpitti: because when we change our mind and want to switch back to pbbuttonsd, package management tools will start claiming that the sky is falling06:31
KeybukKamion: not for the first time, I wish for a testing/*_probs history06:31
pittiKamion: how did we solve the notification-daemon -> notify-daemon and back case?06:31
pittimvo: ^ ?06:31
Kamionpitti: notify-daemon has gone from the archive, which is sufficient for upgrade tools to work it out, AIUI06:32
pittihm, so if I have notify-daemon installed, then the dpkg behavior when upgrading to notification-daemon depends on whether or not some mirror has a file? that seems weird to me06:33
pittiin any case, I'm opposed to make them both work together, but I would actually like to uncripple pbbuttonsd06:34
pittiright now it's half-useless with gnome, and half-useless without gnome06:34
Kamionpitti: it's not dpkg behaviour, it's apt behaviour, and apt knows about whether packages are available ...06:34
pittiI see06:35
Keybukpitti: apt behaviour06:35
Keybukpitti: "I have foo installed, which C/R bar, which is a dependency of meta which I also have installed"06:36
KeybukMOMMY HELP!!!!!!06:36
KamionAIUI unavailable packages are scored down, although I might be making that up06:36
TreenaksI want XGL for DAPPER!#06:36
Keybukthe only way to fix the problem is to violate the user's package choices06:36
Treenaks:P06:36
ograTreenaks, pfft06:36
KeybukKamion: installed=100, available=50006:36
Treenaksogra: or at least dapper+1 :)06:36
ograTreenaks, pfft+106:37
Treenaksogra: how about a pony then?06:37
pittiKeybuk: ok, so the only other sane thing I can see is to make g-p-m not start if pbbuttonsd is running06:37
ograTreenaks, youre a MOTU, just package it for universe ;)06:37
KamionKeybuk: where's that done?06:37
pittii. e. breezy->dapper upgrades will continue to use pbbuttonsd, and fresh installs will have g-p-m06:37
Treenaksogra: actually.. xserver-xgl is packaged06:37
KeybukKamion: inside apt somewhere06:37
Treenaksogra: but universe can't really be a default, can it :)06:37
ograpitti, just make mvo's tool sort it ...06:37
KamionI think the numbers must have changed then06:38
Keybukand 100 is the magic apt barrier for something06:38
KeybukKamion: not recently, it's been 100/500 for as long as I can remember06:38
pittiogra: that can happen independently then06:38
ograTreenaks, i doubt it will be ready enough to be a default before dapper+306:38
Keybuk(it's certainly 100/500 on my woody box)06:38
Kamion500 doesn't match anything relevant here06:38
Treenaksogra: isn't Novell pimping it for NLD10 ?06:38
Kamionoh, hang on, missed one06:39
Kamionok, maybe that's it in pkgPolicy::InitDefaults, would have to remember how more of apt works to understand it properly06:39
ograTreenaks, are we novell ? 06:39
pittiogra: yay, sound on ppc is back06:39
pittiBenC: thank you! ^06:39
Treenaksogra: Maybe :)06:39
ograpitti, what did you do to get it working ? 06:39
AmaranthTreenaks: NLD10 won't be out until the end of the year06:40
ograit doesnt work here 06:40
TreenaksAmaranth: dapper+1 then :)06:40
KeybukTreenaks: +2 more like06:40
TreenaksAmaranth: won't be out before october :)06:40
KeybukNovell seem to be clinging onto their patches and not releasing them06:40
pittiogra: nothing actually, it just worked now after unmuting06:40
ograhrm06:40
TreenaksKeybuk: yeah, that's bad...06:40
TreenaksKeybuk: They 'open up' a bunch of stuff in one go06:40
pittiogra: in my last boot, everything was unmuted and I still didn't hear anything06:40
AmaranthKeybuk: they're at least making code dumps now06:40
Treenaksthen leave it, and dump a load of patches on it every $long_time06:41
pittiogra: maybe something the alsa scripts did on shutdown/next reboot/when the moon phase advanced06:41
AmaranthKeybuk: if they hang on too tight the code available will go a different direction06:41
ograi tried everything ... i even found where Keybuk has hidden the alsa powermanagement now :P06:41
ograbut no sound for me :(06:41
AmaranthKeybuk: that started happening, they freaked and released the new code06:41
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Treenaksogra: Powerbook/ibook? because I've had sound on my mac mini since the _previous_ kernel upgrade06:41
Keybukogra: alsa power management? :p06:41
Keybukogra: it's in the same place as before06:41
TreenaksKeybuk: 'APM'06:41
ograKeybuk, oh, was the initscript only a link to apm ?06:42
pittiogra: but now I don't get /dev/sda1 for my usb stick any more06:42
Keybukogra: the init script was only called by the apm script.d file06:42
pittippc is doomed *sniff*06:42
ograTreenaks, todays kernel upgrade is supposed to fix it06:42
ograKeybuk, oh, how silly06:42
Keybukpitti: quest has the neat "root fs is sdg" bug06:42
Treenaksogra: I hope it doesn't break it again for me then :)06:42
Keybuklooks like I'm going to have to fix that <g>06:42
Treenaksogra: also, I haven't actually seen that kernel in my upgrade yet06:43
ograok, lets try another reboot06:44
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mullen_Kamion: ping06:54
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=== Mez|Work growls
Mez|WorkI tried a flight 3 install with LVM06:54
Mez|Workand that failed.06:55
KamionMez|Work: hmm?06:55
Mez|Worknow It wont get to the partioner - it freezes.06:55
Kamionif you mean the automatic LVM setup, that's fabbione's baby06:55
Mez|Workany ideas Kamion: seeing as you're the installer guy06:55
Mez|Workah well06:55
Mez|Workit failed06:55
Kamionswitch to alt-f2 and hit 'ps x' to see what it's doing06:55
Mez|Workand now I get stuck just before loading the partiioner06:55
Kamionlast couple of processes, excluding sh and ps x06:55
Mez|Workwill do06:56
Mez|Workgive me a mo to reboot it though and get to that point06:56
Mez|Workwas gonna reformat hard drive with windows 98 :D06:56
Kamion/var/log/partman may also help06:57
Mez|WorkIt's at the "scanning disks" phase it stalls06:57
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Mez|Work It's runing parted_server06:58
Mez|Workas the last process06:58
Kamionthat's not meaningful - any particular /lib/partman/ script?06:58
Mez|Workand init.d/30parted06:58
Kamionoh, is there by any chance more than one parted_server running?06:58
Keybukhmm, the x-chat notification icon has suddenly become FIST SIZED!06:58
Mez|Workonly one running06:59
Kamiontry killing off everything parted_server/partman-related and trying again06:59
Kamionthat sort of thing can sometimes happen if partman dies very hard06:59
Mez|Workit;s doing same thing07:00
Keybukseb128: apparently is all your fault ;)07:00
Mez|Workand this is after about 7 reboors07:00
Mez|Workreboots *07:00
KamionMez|Work: anything interesting in /var/log/partman?07:01
seb128Keybuk: I blame dholbach, he's the icon guy :)07:01
Mez|Workparted_server: OUT: ok07:01
KamionMez|Work: putting it somewhere I can see it is probably easiest, it's not an easy log to read07:01
seb128the xchat-gnome icon is fine07:01
Mez|WorkKamion : I can try and email it to you07:01
Mez|Workwhether that'll work i dunno07:01
Kamionthat's an example of a very uninteresting line in /var/log/partman :-)07:01
Kamione-mail, stick on web, whatever07:02
seb128but right, gnome-icon-theme guys are on crack, we will probably revert to one of the previous version for that GNOME07:02
Mez|Workit's 34 lines long07:02
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Mez|Workwell I';m not sure how to get it from a machine thats installing to the web tbh07:02
Kamionback up to the main menu and select "Save debug logs"07:02
Kamionor switch to alt-f2 and 'anna-install openssh-client-udeb' to get scp, if you prefer07:03
Mez|WorkKamion: for some reason it's unstalled itself - it's now somewhere else07:03
KamionI need the logs before you perturb the situation much more :)07:03
Mez|Workwell I'm not doing anything - just watching the log file :D07:04
Mez|Workoh, and it's behind an annoying proxy07:04
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Mez|WorkKamion: I beleive it fixed itself :D I'll shout back in a mo if not07:05
ograpitti, no sound :(07:05
Mez|WorkI've got the partioner up and running now07:05
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KamionMez|Work: I'd still like the log file if possible07:07
Kamionsomething that takes 7 reboots to fix itself isn't really all that fixed07:07
Treenaksit _is_ a special number (7)07:07
Mez|WorkKamion: It had no HDD activity etc etc ....07:07
Mez|WorkKamion: does it save the logs to anywhere- because I've no idea how to get back out to the menu or if I even want to now :D07:08
Mez|Workactually07:08
Kamion18:03 < Kamion> or switch to alt-f2 and 'anna-install openssh-client-udeb' to get scp, if you prefer07:08
Mez|WorkI can copy the logs to the target 07:08
Kamionno07:08
Kamionit will save them to /var/log/installer/ itself if you actually manage to complete an installation07:08
Mez|Workok07:09
Mez|Workwell - I'll send you them once it's completed07:09
Mez|WorkI'll actually be able to get to some sort of FTP site then :D07:09
Mez|WorkIt's installing the base system anyways :D07:09
Kamionthanks07:09
Kamionobviously I don't know if I'll be able to do anything with them, and we probably won't be able to verify any fix now anyway07:10
Mez|Workcolin.watson@canonical.com ?07:10
Kamioncjwatson@ubuntu.com preferred07:10
Kamionthough the above works07:10
Mez|WorkKamion: if they help - they help :D if they dont - hey - it's only bandwidth (and not mine)07:10
Amaranthfish fries?07:11
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jbaileySimira: What issue are you having?07:27
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ograpitti, Kamion, Keybuk any news aboput inputattach ? i really need ltsp installable soon...07:35
Kamionogra: I'm waiting for elmo to tell me how to change overrides in soyuz07:35
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ograKamion, ah, fine then ...07:35
Kamionbugging pitti and Keybuk won't help you in the least07:35
ograKamion, didnt know on whose table it currently was ...07:36
elmoKamion: what needs done?07:36
Kamionelmo: inputattach -> main07:36
Kamionalso python2.4-soappy -> main, IIRC07:36
Kamionpitti's oked the former and the latter is just a binary from source already in main07:37
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Surakhello07:39
elmoKamion: should be done now, I'll hopefully get the stuff cleaned up and instructions to you and mdz later07:40
ograhmm, intrestingly LP always showed it in main ...07:40
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SurakHi, I have trouble compiling linuxant's hsfmodem for breezy amd64. the error message is: "Unknown Debian architecture x86_64, you must specify GNU system type, too at /usr/bin/dpkg-architecture line 214.07:44
Surakdpkg-buildpackage: unable to determne host architecture07:44
Mez|WorkKamion: logs sent - from mezzle@gmail.com07:48
Mez|WorkSubject: Installer logs07:48
Simirajbailey: on my last update (yesterday), time-admin was updated, but it did not install locales. So time manager sat my time zone to utc, and I wasn't allowed to change it (or any other time issue).07:50
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ograhmm07:52
ograhttp://fridge.ubuntu.com/event07:53
ogralooks quite funny in my firefox07:53
ogra(the tabs spread across the calendar)07:53
jbaileySimira: locales are depended on by ubuntu-minimal.  How did you not have it installed?07:56
jpatrickogra: same here in Konqueror07:56
ograjpatrick, ah, fine, so its the css, not the browser ... calming07:57
Simirajbailey: I don't know. I think it was uninstalled by some update I did07:57
jbaileySimira: Something to watch for in future upgrades, anyway.07:58
Simirajbailey: I probably need a hint on what logs to check07:58
stratusogra: calm down yes07:58
stratusogra: you are always a reload away from the fix07:58
jbaileySimira: All the logs get rotated, so there's no promise that you'd even find it.07:58
jbaileySimira: Given that we know the problem, though, I wouldn't worry about it.07:59
stratusogra: it's happening with a lot of websites.07:59
Simirajbailey: ok, thanks08:00
sistpotyelmo: is it possible to have universe test-rebuilt like it was done for breezy?08:05
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janimoogra, you know anything more about the gdm themese issue than it is on LP?08:06
ograjanimo, seb128 promised to look at it ...08:07
janimothanks08:07
ograare you in a hurry with the artwork ? 08:07
janimonot really just planning08:07
ograartwork deadline is still far out ...08:07
ograwe can already use the alternative etc ... seb128 will pick it up with gdm ...08:07
janimodo you already provide an alternative in edubuntu-art?08:09
janimoto etc/gdm/gdm.conf.deriv I mean08:09
ogranope, not yet 08:10
ograbut we should have that ready before feature freeze (23th)08:11
ograerr08:11
ogra23rd 08:11
janimook thanks08:11
Kamionelmo: great, thanks08:15
Kamionogra: source was in main, binaries weren't08:15
KamionMez|Work: thanks08:15
ograKamion, oh ... yes ..08:16
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ogramjg59, regarding the screen lock complaints on lid close, do you also think we should have a "only lock screen" option in g-p-m preferences ? 08:36
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Bombshell!list08:37
jpatrickBombshell: huh?08:38
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davedi've got a stumper involving breezy amd64, pam, and vmware gsx..08:58
davedFeb  7 14:48:34 virtual01 vmware-authd[14351] : PAM unable to dlopen(/lib/security/pam_unix.so)08:58
davedthat file most certainly exists (the next line in the log after that is No such file or directory)08:58
davedso i'm wondering if there is a /lib /lib64 /lib32 issue going on here trying to load the pam modules08:58
davedldd of the binary shows    libpam.so.0 => /lib32/libpam.so.0 (0x55573000)08:59
davedi can't find any package that would introduce pam modules into /lib32/security09:00
daved#ubuntu sent me here, so i apologize if this isn't the proper place to get support09:01
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elmodoes anyone know if it's possible to override dpkg's sense of architecture when building a source package?10:01
tsengelmo: the man page shows a --force-architecture10:02
elmothat's for installing10:02
ograonly through changing the control file afaik...10:03
jbaileyelmo: It looks like dpkg-buildpackage has a -a option.10:04
ograto be used with the -d option10:05
elmoright, but this source is building a mixture of architectures10:05
elmonot to worry, I just wandered if anyone knew off hand, if not, I'll mess around and figure something out10:05
jbaileyI probably played with something like this early on with Hurd stuff, but haven't looked at it in forever.10:06
Keybukok then mr computer, why won't you boot?10:09
elmomvo: grr, breezy broke --print-uris as non-root, is that known/fixed in dapper?10:11
Keybukoh, I see why you won't boot10:11
Keybukbecause you're all wet inside!!10:11
mvoelmo: what is broken? apt-get --print-uris install ? update?10:12
elmomvo: install10:13
elmomvo: specifically, I'm running 'apt-get -qqq -y --print-uris --reinstall install libc6 libncurses5'10:13
elmowhich works with hoary, breaks on breezy10:13
mvo$ apt-get -qqq -y --print-uris --reinstall install libc6 libncurses5 -o Debug::NoLocking=true10:14
mvo'http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/n/ncurses/libncurses5_5.5-1ubuntu3_i386.deb' libncurses5_5.5-1ubuntu3_i386.deb 291404 5e1677c5d6f5995855a4a2cfb9e272c010:14
mvothat is dapper, I'm checking breezy now10:14
elmoah, ok, the intuitively named Debug::NoLocking works for breezy too10:15
mvoelmo: oh, so the problem is that it tries to lock in breezy?10:15
elmomvo: yes10:15
mvoelmo: let me check that10:16
mvoelmo: sorry for the inconvenience I hope using NoLocking=true helps for now10:16
elmomvo: that's fine, thanks :)10:16
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pygihello, anyone that can kick people in #ubuntu?10:19
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elmomvo: apt-get -o Debug::NoLocking=true --print-uris --reinstall install libc6 libncurses5 libstdc++2.10-glibc2.210:20
elmomvo: any idea why that wouldn't print a URI for the last pkg?10:20
elmooh, it's cached10:21
elmoso much hate10:21
mvo:/10:22
pygiah, well :) will be better :P10:22
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elmomvo: 'tis ok, -o Dir::Cache=/die/screaming/apt/die works ;-)10:23
elmowell once I create /d/s/a/d/archives/partial/ anyway10:23
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Skenvoydead easy question: how do i specify a file pointer as an argument to a function in C10:25
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spaceyany  idea how i can find out why Xorg takes 50% cpu after reboot10:26
slomo_spacey: update-notifier maybe?10:26
mvoSkenvoy: sorry, this is not a support channel for programming, please try somewhere else10:26
Skenvoy<_<10:26
slomo_spacey: it was doing such weird things for me lately10:26
pygimvo: join ##c10:26
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Skenvoypeople familiar with C blatantly hang out here :P10:26
pygiskenvoy: lol :))10:26
pygisorry mvo, wrong person :)10:26
Skenvoyk, will try :P10:27
mvogood luck :)10:27
Skenvoyta10:27
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=== pygi feels lost in so many channels :)
spaceyslomo_ update notifier takes like 20% cpu10:27
slomo_spacey: try killall update-notifier10:28
slomo_spacey: i bet your cpu usage of Xorg is gone then :)10:28
spaceyyup10:28
spaceyjust did10:28
spaceyslomo know of a filed bug regarding the problem?10:30
mjg59ogra: Yeah, I've been thinking that10:30
spaceyanyway i can't find it10:30
slomo_nope... mvo do you know about this problem already?10:30
spaceyguess i'll file one10:30
ogramjg59, i'll add a patch for it during the week then :)10:31
mvoslomo_, spacey: known problem, working on a fix10:32
spaceymvo: so no need to file bug?10:32
mvospacey: no, thanks10:32
spaceyok10:33
mjg59ogra: Cool10:35
=== ogra fears he loses all his C skills over ltsp scripting ...
ograneed to do smoe C stuff inbetween :)10:36
neuralisogra: after a year of python, my c went down the drain ;)10:37
Simiraisn't ekiga in Debian? I have a friend that can't find it10:37
pittiogra: C is indeed something more people should forget about :/10:37
ograneuralis, i usually try to change between C python and scripting ...10:38
neuralispitti: hear hear.10:38
ograpitti, was that meant as a secret hint ?10:38
ogra:)10:38
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pittiogra: no, just a general attitude after having better alternatives (for most tasks anyway) for decades10:38
ograyup :)10:38
ograyay, my ibook has an f-spot :)10:39
ograthanks slomo_ , works fine 10:39
seb128Simira: maybe it's in NEW, or maybe they have not uploaded it yet10:39
pittiogra: I'm *so* glad that it's not a gnome app starting with 'g'10:39
neuralispitti :-D10:40
ograhehe10:40
Simira:D10:40
pygi:P10:40
seb128we should get f-spot on the default desktop10:40
neuralispitti: actually, there's a (win32) application called g-spot that extracts codec information from video files, afaik10:40
neuralisseb128: f-spot, tomboy, and beagle, hopefully10:42
seb128no no no10:42
tsengneuralis: not really dude10:42
seb128beagle is not ready for that10:42
tsengpass the pipe10:42
ograonly f-spot10:42
tsengbeagle can be dapper+1 imo10:42
neuralisoh, you meant for dapper? 10:42
seb128yep10:42
pygistill too unstable and unreliable10:42
tsengseb128: did you figure out how to get mono onto the cd10:43
neuralisi was talking post-dapper. 10:43
tsengwell then yes10:43
tsengtomboy less than the others10:43
seb128tseng: no, I was waiting on you or slomo to do some estimation on how much CD place is required for that10:43
tsengits nice, but im not sure it warrants a mono process in the default install10:43
tseng(all the time)10:43
neuralistseng: that's probably true.10:43
seb128tseng: did you do the wiki page for beagle/main?10:44
seb128I still want to build nautilus with libbeagle10:44
tsengseb128: hm no10:44
tsengit needs gmime2.1 and beagle -> main yet10:44
seb128before feature freeze would be nice :p10:44
neuralisthen again, tomboy's one of the shiny things that non-linux people love to play with when i show it to them.10:44
tsengi just did a report to UVF update beagle10:44
ograneuralis, while youre here ... do you have any clue how openssi solved the cross access to /dev over the different nodes ? 10:44
tsengto make everything work again10:44
seb128first step :)10:45
seb128do you know if somebody did one for f-spot?10:45
neuralisogra: /dev is a cdsl, if i remember correctly10:45
tsengseb128: ajmitch_ is supposed to10:45
seb128having the new version would be nice10:45
seb128cool10:45
ajmitch_seb128: I will, I've got 0.1.8 ready to upload to debian10:45
tsengseb128: if he doesnt i will do it and kick him around a bit10:45
seb128ajmitch_: thank you10:45
seb128tseng: thank you too :)10:45
slomo_seb128: i'll take a look at how much space would be used tomorrow... but before we put that stuff on cd we need to fix mono on ppc... otherwise the ppc cds will fail to be created :/10:45
ajmitch_seb128: the major change to go into main will be changing to sqlite 310:46
ajmitch_which will of course break everyone's install10:46
tsengseb128: ugh10:46
tsenger10:46
tsengslomo_: ugh10:46
seb128ajmitch_: not cool10:46
seb128slomo_: yeah, better to fix that10:46
tsengseb128: dude we are pretty stuck on the mono ppc stuff10:46
tsengseb128: because.. no one outside canonical has ppc-smp10:46
ajmitch_seb128: I know, but I don't know if there's an easy way to fix that apaer from shipping a migration script10:46
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ajmitch_seb128: a python script to dump & reload the db shouldn't be hard, it just needs written10:47
ograneuralis, i was wondering if that could be the solution for local device acces in ltsp ...10:48
slomo_ajmitch_: you could hack the f-spot shell script to do the conversion if an old database is found10:48
ajmitch_slomo_: I could, but that requires that the sqlite 2 & 3 command line utils be installed10:48
neuralisogra: probably not without serious kernel hacks10:48
ograneuralis, since i think the *real* solution is to have a secured access to the clients /dev from the server ... 10:48
ograyes, i was suspecting that 10:49
ajmitch_which won't happen for most f-spot users (they'll only have the lib)10:49
slomo_ajmitch_: oh yes... i didn't think about that10:49
tsenglike i said once before10:49
tsengif someone already has f-spot installed they have universe enabled10:49
ajmitch_slomo_: it's painful either way10:49
tsengand have sqlite210:49
tsengif they are installing fresh, they have no db10:50
neuralisogra: if it were possible, it'd probably be the most elegant solution, but it's impractical10:50
slomo_seb128: at least the people who have enough knowledge to fix it don't have access to a smp ppc... do you know someone who could give shell access to one?10:50
ajmitch_tseng: yes, which doesn't help if it's automatic, since f-spot never depended on the util, just the lib10:50
tsengblargh10:50
ograneuralis, our kernel already has ocfs support builtin ... probably something is possible on top of this 10:50
tsengim off10:51
tsengcya10:51
ajmitch_bye10:51
neuralisogra: hmm10:51
sistpotycya tseng10:51
neuralisogra: i'd be pretty careful about going that route10:51
slomo_bye tseng 10:51
ograneuralis, sill plenty of time until dapper+1 ...10:51
seb128slomo_: nop :/10:51
neuralisslomo_: i can probably get you a ppc smp shell10:52
ajmitch_neuralis: that would be great, this problem has been unfixable for awhile10:52
slomo_neuralis: that would be perfect :) it wouldn't be for me but for one of the mono devs10:52
neuralisdo you require ubuntu on it, or is osx fine? (i'm unfamiliar with the problem you're trying to solve)10:53
neuralisogra: sure, but how are you going to secure ocfs? and it would still require non-trivial kernel hacking, i think10:54
slomo_neuralis: ubuntu... or some other linux distribution... the problem doesn't show up on os x from what we know10:54
ograneuralis, i havent looked at it at all yet ... its only a weird idea ...10:54
neuralisslomo_: hm. that i might not be able to do. i'll send out some e-mails and let you guys know if i come up with anything.10:55
slomo_neuralis: thanks :)10:57
neuralisslomo_: sure. sent to a few people at mit genetics, i seem to recall they have a bunch of smp ppcs on hand.10:58
slomo_neuralis: ah... and we need a 32 bit userland on them... no idea if it shows up in a pure 64bit environment10:59
neuralisslomo_: i asked if they have one that i can just borrow, so if they do, i can put whatever you need on it11:00
Keybukyup11:01
Keybukdefinitely know why this pc doesn't work11:01
slomo_neuralis: great :)11:01
Keybukdiagnosis: the coolant isn't supposed to leak all over the motherboard and cards11:01
ograKeybuk, awww ... watercooled ? 11:01
elmois there some way to feed stuff to a serial console, short of expect + minicom ?11:02
Keybukogra: yes, quite literally it seems11:02
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ograouch11:02
Keybuk*shrug* it can go back :)11:02
Keybukand then I can wait another few weeks for a new one <g>11:02
ograif it still works with all the liquid on it ? 11:03
Keybukit doesn't work11:04
Keybukwell, that's not true11:04
Keybukit worked for nearly three second11:04
Keybukthen it stopped working11:04
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slomo_neuralis: when you get an answer can you write me a mail? :) slomo@ubuntu.com11:05
neuralisslomo_: sure. i'm not too hopeful (it's a lot easier to get an osx shell than to borrow lab hardware), but it's worth a try.11:06
slomo_neuralis: do you need to tell them a reason or can you just ask for hardware there? :)11:10
ograKeybuk, i rather meant if it will work again if dried ...11:10
Keybukogra: no idea, it still leaks11:11
Keybukso it'd get itself wet again pretty quickly11:11
KeybukI'm going to suggest they just build another one, rather than trying to give me components that have already had a wash ;)11:11
Keybukamusingly it's leaking directly onto the main bus11:12
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ograheh11:13
=== Keybuk makes it leak some more, so they can't pull a fast one
neuralisKeybuk: evil :)11:14
Keybuklol, I know I would11:15
KeybukI'd just replace the bit of leaky pipe and mop up the spillage11:15
Keybuk"if it boots, ship it back"11:15
ograheh11:17
Keybukoops11:17
Keybukso that made it drench the graphics cards and switched itself off11:18
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ed1tdo i wanna grant "stopThread" in jre installation?11:45
tiredbonesI'm getting a seg fault while upgrading to breezy from hoary. The module is python2.4-minimal, how do I work around this/11:46
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LadyNikongreetings11:47
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LadyNikonI am having the same issue as this :https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/vpnc/+bug/2972711:50
Ubugtumalone bug 29727 in vpnc "vpnc: missing script vpnc-connect" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  11:50
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