=== jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:05] let's just talk about sprints *after* docstring freeze :) [12:08] jsgotangco, for dapper+1? [12:09] basically yeah [12:10] dapper +1 is more workable for me. I might actually be able to get time off and will be able to apply myself more to actual docs, given that I would be finished the book [12:12] ooh kde updates [12:12] goodie [12:15] bah, kde [12:16] shaddup [12:17] lol [12:17] :) [12:17] have you moved already? [12:17] thank jsgotangco, you made me feel better [12:17] yep [12:17] with net? [12:17] going in on the 14th [12:18] ahh nice === jsgotangco arrived way too early at work [12:19] what is your timezone again? [12:19] +8 [12:19] it s only 7:20am [12:20] ah [12:21] I was awake at 7am. Then I went back to sleep for another 2 hours [12:21] i wish i could do that [12:21] ive been doing 2 jobs lately [12:22] i slept around 1am a few hours ago and woke at at 6 [12:22] :/ === ompaul just got back from lug business - we will own the world and everybody will run our software one day, sorry, let me rewrite that, we will own the world and everybody will share our software one day :-) === lambert [n=todd@c-24-125-47-253.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:32] jsgotangco: there is a HTML bultin option for users to use html instead of wikisyntax but it is 'off' for security reasons. However, if enabled, the parser works like this: html parser {{{ #!html bla bla bla ginger bla }}} [12:32] hmmm [12:32] this is if for a gui editor? [12:33] id? [12:33] sorry. if? [12:33] if? === mhz wonders how useful could this be for -dco purposes and moin fans [12:34] you said: this is if for a gui editor? [12:34] ahh i think i get you now [12:34] bah bad english at 7:30am [12:34] -dco = -doc [12:34] hehehe === n17 [n=kelvin@209-162-205-24.dq1mn.easystreet.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:44] hello [12:44] hi [12:44] I have an awkward question [12:46] i've been struggling to compile a ndiswrapper for days for a wireless device [12:46] n17: have you tried #ubuntu? [12:46] n17: or wiki.ubuntu.com ? [12:46] they aren't paying any attention to me [12:46] and that wasn't all that helpful [12:47] wiki i mean [12:47] did you do a search for ndiswrapper on wiki.ubuntu.com [12:47] yes [12:48] the drivers they listed....aren't compatible [12:48] i could look again [12:49] n17: did you look at http://ndiswrapper.sourceforge.net/mediawiki/index.php/List [12:49] no. [12:49] i'll check that out -hold on sec.... [01:00] could we just start with a DocTeam irc sprint? Get everybody together for a day to work on docs? or is that already planned? [01:00] LaserJock, sure we tried before though [01:00] when? === jsgotangco personally doesn't want to talk about sprints now [01:00] pre-breezy [01:00] sorry [01:00] I just thought that maybe we had more people now [01:01] well, i found libusb-0.1.11, but it's missing the files i need to install into the ndiswrapper [01:01] sorry to interrupt [01:01] this is totally frustrating [01:01] n17: have you tried the ubuntu forums? [01:02] yeah. a couple of times. None of those methods work very well [01:03] I mean, i haven't posted a question....maybe I should post a question about this? [01:08] n17: you might, the thing is that I (we) are not in a very good position to be giving support. #ubuntu is the support channel but if you haven't been able to get an answer there maybe a forum post could do the trick [01:10] yeah. I've been able to make some headway using the forums, i'm just in this weird unworkable spot and i don't know what to do [01:10] i don't even know if i could explain it.... [01:12] i'll try #ubuntu again and if i get passed over i'll just try to figure it out myself [01:13] thank you for, at the least, trying to help me [01:13] maybe i'll be back [01:16] n17: good luck, sorry I'm not much help. I really don't know anything about ndiswrapper [01:17] LJ mind if I look over the Package Guide and write some things? [01:17] I need to earn SVN access soon [01:18] n17: you still here? [01:18] Kyral: yeah, go for it. Send patches either directly to me or to the -doc list [01:20] Kyral: do you have a svn checkout of the repo? [01:20] LaserJock: nope [01:20] Kyral: get one ;-) [01:20] I'm actually trying to clear my HD of junk lol [01:20] well this isn't junk :-) [01:20] Someone write a script to search and destroy all the emacs backup files on system! [01:21] Whats the command anyway [01:21] I'm not well acquanted with SVN [01:22] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Repository [01:25] I should see if my FSF email works [01:27] Checkout in progress [01:27] you joined the FSF? [01:27] sweet, I just got irrsi installed on the iMac [01:28] jsgotangco: yah [01:28] as an Associate Member [01:29] why? [01:30] Burgwork, I have done what I am going to do tonight [01:30] Burgwork, I'll be back for another hour in about 10 hours [01:31] ompaul, cool, just tell me when you are done === LaserJock [n=LaserJoc@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has left #ubuntu-doc [] === LaserJock [n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:32] Kyral, is that lifetime? [01:32] jsgotangco: as long as you pay your dues [01:32] Kyral: how much? [01:32] but they are tax-detuctable in the US [01:32] yer pound of flesh [01:32] what do you get? [01:32] yanno [01:32] I'll just link you [01:33] https://www.fsf.org/associate/index_html [01:33] Inspire three other people to join the FSF as associate members, and receive a personalized greeting recorded by Richard Stallman or Eben Moglen for your answering machine, voicemail or home page. [01:34] That scares me lol [01:34] "Jerome, I am your father: [01:34] " [01:34] "your phone service uses non-free software" [01:34] scary [01:34] lol [01:35] But %20 off FSF goods :D [01:35] the goods were made from nonfree systems [01:35] heh [01:35] FSF: All your software are copyright us [01:36] oh you get to have a book cool [01:36] yup [01:36] Bootable Membership Card [01:36] petermcv@member.fsf.org works [01:37] hmm $10 isn't so bad [01:37] Burgwork, as I said I am away from the weekend (it being 00:33) here, I have an hour I can do before midday here, I will ping you when I can give no more to it [01:37] $5 for me [01:37] night [01:37] Student :D [01:37] ahhh student [01:38] yeah, I sure will miss those student discounts [01:38] But in the US its tax-deductable [01:38] well, -$10 [01:38] so I thought [01:39] "Right now I'm paying $5/month for Cedega, which really hasn't given me any more good stuff" [01:39] heh [01:39] So I cancelled my Cedega updates and joined the FSF [01:39] FSF is better imo [01:40] and the idea of a bootable business card really amuses me [01:40] this is nice, at least i can flash my bootable membership card to RMS when he arrives here [01:40] huh [01:40] Where do you live? [01:40] Manila [01:40] he's going there? [01:40] RMS is coming over in August for a conference [01:40] Stallman [01:40] Yah I know who RMS is [01:40] Jeez do you think I'm an idiot? [01:41] :) [01:41] bear with me its only 9am :) [01:41] The Faculty Advisor for COSI tried to get him to speak at Commencement [01:42] hmm, I wonder what FSF thinks of the US university systems? [01:42] he has a long list of requirements before accepting the invitation [01:42] lol I heard [01:42] Believe me I agree with most of them [01:42] "AC is desirable but not less than 74F" [01:42] or something like that [01:42] lol [01:42] "No Pets but cats are ok as long as they're friendly" [01:43] He would HATE Potsdam [01:43] RMS, the rockstar [01:43] Potsdam, NY that is [01:43] jsgotangco, we should find the right up and put it ont he smoking gun [01:43] s/right/write [01:43] his needs? [01:43] wants is more like it ;-) [01:44] those crazy things he wants [01:44] i have his email [01:44] we ogranized this event [01:44] good thing the campus that we're going to hold this has its own hotel [01:46] Okay Shower [01:47] Hmm [01:47] kyral@ubuntu.com points to my college mail [01:47] better make my FSF mail point to my GMail [01:48] brb [01:48] moving to a new cucible [01:49] Kyral: is GMail better than other email services? [01:50] like Yahoo for example [01:52] LaserJock, I would say yes [01:55] oh my gosh, you can buy a GNU custom distro for $5,000 from FSF [01:55] LaserJock, linky? [01:55] https://agia.fsf.org/order/ [01:56] All the GNU software custom compiled for your computing platform [01:56] and one copy of all printed manuals. [01:57] isn't that distros ship for free? [01:57] but you get a printed man page ;-) [01:58] I could get the man pages printed for less [01:59] I think it is just a way for people to contribute and feel all special [02:00] plus you get a poster of the GPL preamble [02:01] I guess so [02:01] and 10 tee-shirts [02:02] lol, makes me want to drop 5k [02:03] I think the Ubuntu foundation would be a better place to drop 5k, honestly [02:04] I think so to but I'm a bit biased that way [02:05] nah, we aren't biased at all ;) [02:10] Honestly, my worst fear is turning into Stallman [02:11] why? in what way? [02:11] old, slightly crazy but somewhat respected? [02:11] Hyper eccientric? [02:11] Obi-Wan Kenobi without the awesomeness and Force? [02:11] Kyral: lol, the only think you lack is age so I say you run a pretty good risk ;-) [02:12] .... [02:13] I'd rather end up like Linus [02:13] btw, have you seen the vrms package? [02:13] the what? [02:13] and LJ, GMail pwns you [02:13] vrms (Virtual Richard M. Stallman) [02:13] .... [02:13] The vrms program will analyze the set of currently-installed packages on a Debian GNU/Linux system, and report all of the packages from the non-free tree which are currently installed. [02:14] I have to try this... [02:15] ....it picked up the linux-k7 package [02:15] madwifi modules...rar...the NVidia Driver...and Scilab [02:15] I swear Scilab was under GPL [02:16] I don't think so [02:16] I thought it was under non-free in debian [02:16] ...and it added itself as a monthly cronjob.... [02:16] just to keep all FSF members on the straight and narrow :-) [02:16] ...STFU [02:17] all and all about 19 packages [02:18] not bad [02:19] just cut it to 15 [02:19] 0.8% of 1983 packages installed [02:19] I wonder what would happen on my iMac :p [02:19] though I can lose like 6 more because of all the LRM packs [02:22] Funny [02:22] it didn't pick up w32codecs === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:22] Kyral, likely it looked in debian copyright [02:22] Kyral: great, it must be GPL'd then ;-) [02:22] lol [02:23] more likely w32codecs is badly constructed as a package [02:23] hmm [02:24] when I install Debian on my laptop I'll aim for 0 Non-Free [02:25] http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8409 [02:25] Oh Acroread isn't GPL? [02:25] I think I have Envince anyway [02:25] yeah [02:25] Yah I do [02:25] Bye Bye Acroread [02:26] I wish I could do that, evince just isn't there for me yet [02:26] me too [02:26] it couldn't do the forms we have at work === jsgotangco decides to change his icons to yasis [02:26] yeah, I have to do a lot of forms and I have to copy and paste out of .pdfs a lot [02:26] I'm using Tango [02:27] it doesnt jive much with brown [02:27] Oh I have the blue version [02:27] + I don't like the Brown [02:27] I can't remember. I haven't seen my desktop for a couple days :( [02:27] I like white and greys [02:32] Kyral: me too, here's a screenshot http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8411 [02:34] Bleh I try NOT to emulate Aqua :P [02:34] well, I don't have much of a choice === Madpilot [n=bburger@S0106000d88b9f3db.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:55] please dont add noise to the list :/ [02:56] jsgotangco, that directed at me? [02:56] salut Madpilot [02:56] hi Burgwork - no net at home yet? [02:57] Madpilot, 14th [02:57] we have 272 people subscribed to -doc and every one of them receive that small exchange [02:57] jsgotangco, sorry [02:59] well, some of us just snickered :P === Burgwork grumbles about xscreensaver and two computers [03:00] my workmate has turned on the pretty opengl rendered screensavers, which cause my mouse to go jumpy [03:03] anyway, have to go eat. Night all [03:03] night [03:03] later [03:05] i just answered some interview questions for fosdem [03:05] thought you guys might be interested in one of my answers [03:05] > 3. What, in Ubuntu, ashamed you the most ? [03:06] Ooh, tough question, but a good one to think about... From my point of view, [03:06] I'm disappointed that our less "developer focused" teams haven't had enough [03:06] of a helping hand to be as effective as they could be. It's a tough problem [03:06] in every code-oriented FOSS project, but I think it's an area where we could [03:06] improve quite a lot in Ubuntu. [03:06] [03:06] something i think about quite regularly :-) [03:06] so if you guys ever have suggestions for things i can help with, let me know [03:08] awwwww [03:11] hmm [03:11] There is already an Install guide in the SVN Checkout... === bshumate [n=bshumate@ubuntu/member/bshumate] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:14] So when Ubuntu Express comes out do I just expand on the current one or write a completely new one? [03:47] jdub: i agree with you [03:47] I have thought about this too from time to time [03:47] and I usually get to similar conclusions [03:48] m a r k e t i n g === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:49] Usually, a FLOSS project is to focused on 'coding issues' [03:50] and 'end-users' feel very 'aside' of the project, like not fiting anywhere [03:50] well [03:50] jdub: however, in ubuntu, I know there are many good intentions to revert that [03:51] but we still may not be aiming correctly [03:51] I have even thought about more agressive marketing [03:53] Karma points is one nice idea but it does not consider many contributions, like artwork, wiki, irc, install fests, howtofests (we'll have our first one in April if you read the docs I sent you), conferences, talks, organizing stuff, ML admins, etc [03:53] mhz: what's the difference btwn a howtofest & an installfest? [03:53] jdub: those may not be considered 'tech' point but surely deserve attention and lots of motivation [03:55] Madpilot: well, maybe it is not the best name but it was what I came up with after a shower... HowTo fest: users vote for a couple of topics prior to the event date and on the event we provide tutors who will help th voters learn stepbystep about DB's, python, Admin stuff, etc. It is a step for people who already do installs and have been using linux for a little while [03:56] For example: HowTo install and run Zope? [03:56] How to admin your own Mail server? [03:56] Madpilot: stuff like that [03:56] from lower intermediate level and up [03:56] mhz: cool idea - we've just started doing installfests again at our local LUG - I might mention howtofests as well [03:56] or maybe from upper beginner level [03:57] Madpilot: please do so [03:57] You use same date for two purposes [03:57] the logistic issues may be to have all technology related available [03:57] our installfest last month wound up being a howtofest of sorts after the first two hours anyway :P [03:58] I can't imagine myself tutoring about Moin without people actually running at least a MMDE version [03:58] (except for the Gentoo-installers, who were still compiling X or something... [03:58] lol === mhz still is in love with Gentoo [03:59] Madpilot: yeah, making two kind of fests on same day bring people of different backgrounds to share expriences and help === LaserJock [n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [n=jsg@210.4.38.43] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:00] Madpilot: jdub: i know there are great howto's out there but it will never be the same for a newbie to have a doc or a tutor with him [04:02] jdub: so, yes, it is dissapointing there's much less contribution in non coding areas but that failure -if it is- it's our responsibility because we are not promoting well, we are not using marketing well. Evenelizers can go to a conference or a LoCo team meeting and will certainly encourage people while they are there but that is it. After 2 weeks things go back to neutral. [04:03] jdub: Instances like the the Letter doc-team and another team are doing is a good starting point [04:03] letting people know the status or needs [04:03] But i insist we need to be more agressive [04:04] .oO(maybe 'agressive' is not the right word) [04:04] jdub: ? [04:04] .oO( "I see dead people" ) [04:04] Interrogation [04:05] :D [04:05] lol [04:05] jsgotangco: you couldn't help it, right? [04:06] heh === lambert [n=todd@c-24-125-47-253.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:32] .oO(Maybe I should try to keep my answers lot shorter... 0 1 0 1 0 ) [04:38] I just had a brainwave - the Mepis/Ubuntu deriv. will have to be called "Ubuntu ME" - look how well the name worked for MS... :D [04:41] Ubuntu MEH :P === LaserJock [n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-doc === rob [n=rob@ubuntu/member/rob] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [n=jsg@210.4.38.43] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:26] whoa map cleanup [06:27] hmm? [06:27] UbuntuWorldWide [06:28] no one lives in antartica anymore [06:28] there's still at least one person in the mid-Atlantic, though [06:29] must be his own private island or yacht :D === EricNeon [n=eric@203.148.3.94] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:30] it isn't Bermuda, it's right out in the middle - odd :P [06:30] hi all~ [06:30] hi EricNeon [06:30] lol [06:31] long time no see [06:31] .oO( eye doctor, please!) [06:31] :) === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mpt [n=mpt@222-154-181-62.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mpt [n=mpt@222-154-155-110.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mpt_ [n=mpt@222-154-155-215.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mpt__ [n=mpt@222-154-152-199.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robitaille [n=robitail@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robitaille [n=robitail@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:03] wow, docu wiki seems nice [09:08] what? [09:09] Madpilot: http://doc-book.sourceforge.net/homepage/ [09:10] someone posted this to the list, it apparently stroes it as xml internally [09:10] stores, rather [09:11] interesting - we could abandon HTML converting/building entirely... [09:11] dunno what issues we might have with it [09:14] i could test it on my machine later [09:14] the problem would probably be the way we use entities [09:14] is there a time set for the next docteam meeting? [09:14] today? none [09:14] i'll just defer it for next week [09:15] i dont even know if something happened the last meeting === jsgotangco has to check logs this weekend and do cleanup [09:27] nice gui too, but i don't know if we can just "move over" to another format === robitaille [n=daniel@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-doc === enrico_ [n=enrico@debian/developer/enrico] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:11] Madpilot: it's actually a bit painful to install, heh === lloydinho [n=andreas@130.225.236.82] has joined #ubuntu-doc === lloyd [n=andreas@130.225.236.82] has joined #ubuntu-doc === ompaul [n=ompaul@213-202-160-233.bas503.dsl.esat.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@195-23-238-211.nr.ip.pt] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:00] Burgwork, is there a position with regard to historical information on the faq, at this stage moving to warty from debian seems to be a bit of a redundant point === mpt [n=mpt@222-154-152-199.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:09] Burgwork, I am not going to do anything else with the faq before the weekend, however if you want to leave it place I will do something with it on Monday. [12:23] Kyral, i don't think the current install guide will be helpful. You should build on the guidalinex guide, because ubuntu-express is loosely built on the guidalinex install system === mdke struggles to read all the off-topic scrollback === mpt [n=mpt@222-154-152-199.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === roblaptop [n=Robert@ubuntu/member/rob] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-252-84-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jdub [n=jdub@ppp121-112.static.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:59] hey jdub [01:59] you got a few minutes? [02:00] mdke: not right now, my net connection just came back up and i have shit to sort out - sorry 8) === roblaptop looks in [02:00] jdub, no problem, I'll mail you I think [02:00] hi roblaptop [02:01] hi mdke [02:11] jdub, ok email sent: I'd love it if you have a look, it's kinda advocacy related so i'm sure you'll have loads of ideas === jjesse [n=jjesse@mail.ftpb.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:16] mdke: oh, funny [02:16] mdke: that's very timely [02:16] yeah? [02:17] jdub, you think you might have a few moments for that in the next few days or so? [02:17] mdke: i've been doing some spec stuff for the artists we're contracting, and was wondering what was going on with the flash bits, to make sure we could have them *very* sexy, and consistent with the other artwork [02:17] yeah [02:17] well [02:17] hmm [02:17] i'm leaving for europe on monday [02:17] but i have a few days in the office in london [02:18] ooh [02:18] when? [02:18] um [02:18] i can't get to ubuntu [02:18] look at my wiki page [02:18] k [02:18] between oswc and fosdem [02:18] forget the dates ;) [02:19] 18-24 feb [02:19] that will be a bit late for those flash guys, they are keen to start soon [02:19] yeah [02:19] right [02:19] any ideas you can stick on that wiki page would rock tho [02:19] ok [02:19] coolie [02:19] i don't think you gave the page name [02:19] crap [02:20] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GreatFeaturesOfUbuntu?action=show [02:20] ta [02:20] dude [02:20] ta to you === jdub does a brief hulk smash [02:20] great BENEFITS of ubuntu :-) === mdke shrugs :) [02:21] stuff like "it's free" won't work, because it's hard to animate [02:21] i dunno [02:21] it's free isn't a benefit [02:21] that's a feature [02:22] lol [02:22] anyhow [02:22] any ideas gratefully received [02:22] "collect and share your photos" [02:22] ^ benefit === mdke nods [02:22] good one [02:22] f-spot with tags and flickr and shit [02:22] ^ feature [02:22] :-) [02:23] btw while you're here, I did some color modifications on yelp: http://mdke.org/images/yelp [02:23]