=== Lord_Athur [n=alejandr@pc-170-38-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === dsaa [n=dsaa@210.5.89.41] has joined #edubuntu [12:42] neurogeek: holas [12:42] neurogeek: you are testing hurd?? === Lord_Athur [n=alejandr@pc-170-38-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === Flosoft [i=admin@213.219.158.123] has joined #edubuntu === mhz is now known as mhz_dinner === jsgotangco [n=jsg@210.4.59.120] has joined #edubuntu === yuzonic [n=yuzonic@dslb-084-059-060-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #edubuntu === yuzonic [n=yuzonic@dslb-084-059-060-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #edubuntu [] === Lord_Athur [n=alejandr@pc-170-38-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has left #edubuntu ["Abandonando"] === pitux [n=pitux@252-240-90.adsl.terra.cl] has joined #edubuntu === crimsun [i=crimsun@pdpc/supporter/silver/crimsun] has joined #edubuntu === arkan0x [n=arkan0x@pc-71-87-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === dsaa [n=dsaa@210.213.93.191] has joined #edubuntu === arkan0x [n=arkan0x@pc-71-87-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === ulinskie [n=yolynne@202.57.88.34] has joined #edubuntu === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #edubuntu [03:15] hi ogra [03:15] Hello people === irvin [n=irvin@ubuntu/member/irvin] has joined #edubuntu === P3L|C4N0 [n=gcamposm@201.230.49.155] has joined #edubuntu === dinda [n=dinda@cpe-68-201-202-100.houston.res.rr.com] has joined #edubuntu === dinda [n=dinda@cpe-68-201-202-100.houston.res.rr.com] has left #edubuntu [] [03:59] re === mhz_dinner is now known as mhz === MotherLUG [n=karin@29.124.233.220.exetel.com.au] has joined #edubuntu [04:03] Hello All :D [04:04] I had a look at the edubuntu live CD this morning and I was wondering is there a particular place and way where I can log bugs I have found? [04:18] MotherLUG: yup [04:18] http://launchpad.net [04:18] I just got there [04:18] and was searching [04:20] mhz, Is there anywhere in particular that I need to go at launchpad? [04:20] sorry if I'm a PITA, this is all new to me [04:20] and I mostly don't want to stuff up [04:25] MotherLUG: i'll check [04:26] https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+filebug === neurogeek [n=neurogee@201.211.160.18] has joined #edubuntu [04:26] MotherLUG: that url [04:26] neurogeek: hi [04:27] mhz, hello!! [04:27] neurogeek: nice to see ya [04:49] mhz, Thankyou for your help [04:49] MotherLUG: your welcome. Thx for submitting bugs [04:50] that is one KEY contribution to improve development quality [04:58] mhz, I was trying to modify my theme in the ubuntu wiki, but it is not functioning, then everytime I do it, my computer hangs [04:58] ulinskie: ooo [04:59] that's weired [04:59] ulinskie: you do it from userPreferences? [05:01] mhz, yes I did it from UserPreferences [05:01] mhz, I tried doing it for at elast 6 times === mhz is gonna try it, too === irvin [n=irvin@ubuntu/member/irvin] has joined #edubuntu [05:08] ulinskie: what theme are you selecting? === arkan0x [n=arkan0x@201.215.87.71] has joined #edubuntu === ulinskie [n=yolynne@202.57.88.34] has joined #edubuntu [05:22] hello mhz sorry my computer hanged up on me, [05:22] mhz, were u able to answer my query? [05:23] ulinskie: what theme are you selecting? [05:24] try now [05:24] edubuntu === ulinskie is away: visit wahoy.com, zamboanga's free online classified ads === sankarshan [n=sankarsh@202.149.56.110] has joined #edubuntu === Godfather85 [i=my@80.73.72.214] has joined #edubuntu [07:46] hi from Russia! [07:47] that differenses: Ubuntu & EdUbuntu? === TOZTWO [i=TOZTWO@dialup-4.253.31.154.Dial1.Dallas1.Level3.net] has joined #edubuntu === signifer123 [n=michael@pool-141-157-88-80.balt.east.verizon.net] has joined #edubuntu === Godfather85 [i=my@80.73.72.214] has left #edubuntu [] === signifer123 [n=michael@pool-141-157-88-80.balt.east.verizon.net] has joined #edubuntu === irvin [n=irvin@ubuntu/member/irvin] has joined #edubuntu === dsaa [n=dsaa@210.1.86.116] has joined #edubuntu === jsgotangco [n=jsg@125.212.126.120] has joined #edubuntu === littlepaul [n=littlepa@p5084C7FA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #edubuntu === ulinskie [n=yolynne@202.57.88.34] has joined #edubuntu [10:49] hello can anybody help me regarding the changing the theme in the wiki thru UserPreferences, mine always says password does not match even if it is already correct === Niko [n=lewmnik@84.249.170.105] has joined #edubuntu === irvin [n=irvin@ubuntu/member/irvin] has joined #edubuntu === juliux [n=juliux@ubuntu/member/juliux] has joined #edubuntu [11:15] ulinskie, it doesn't happen to my account [11:16] jsgotangco, what theme r u using? [11:16] edubuntu [11:17] hmm.. do u have the power to reset my password? [11:17] nope [11:17] I have used in for loggin in [11:18] but it does not work when I modify my user preferences [11:18] that'sweird [11:18] wiki password is based on your LP account === C-O-L-T [n=hunika@193.231.163.10] has joined #edubuntu === knario [n=knario@200.72.81.5] has joined #edubuntu [11:21] wait I'll try again in another machine [11:27] jsgotangco, still not working [11:28] jsgotangco, I have already reset my password [11:28] hmm..this is strange [11:28] dunno [11:28] try asking #launchpad [11:28] ok thanks === bart11 [n=bart11@210.213.197.129] has joined #edubuntu [11:43] jsgotangco, its a bug [11:45] :) [11:58] ogra: u there? === signifer123 [n=michael@pool-141-157-88-80.balt.east.verizon.net] has joined #edubuntu === MotherLUG [n=karin@29.124.233.220.exetel.com.au] has left #edubuntu ["Leaving"] [01:20] Flosoft, yes, i am now :) === TOZhick [i=TOZTWO@dialup-4.226.135.90.Dial1.Dallas1.Level3.net] has joined #edubuntu [01:29] ah ... check the ltsp channel ogra [01:29] yes, i saw that ... === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #edubuntu [01:30] what exactly do you mean ? [01:30] you want a windown desktop and do an rdp connection to a linux server ? [01:30] cheers [01:30] yes [01:30] as VNC doesn't start a new Session it is not the thing I need [01:30] hmm, never played with that ... but it should be possible ... linux speaks rdp ... [01:31] hmm [01:31] i've done reverse though [01:31] vnc *can* start a new session ... try xvnc on gdm ... [01:31] linux desktop -> windows server [01:31] (rdp) [01:31] well I need: XP Home >>> Kubuntu Breezy [01:32] then connect to this via vnc and log in through the exported gdm ... that should work [01:32] (or kdm even) [01:32] hmmm how do I set this up? [01:32] because it should also adapt the resolution etc. [01:33] xvnc has the option to connect to the running X server ... just make KDM start and attach xvnc to it ... [01:33] (its really just a theory, but i guess it can work) [01:33] is that XDMCP? [01:33] nope, thats vnc then [01:33] xdmcp means you run kdm on the client and connect through X network transport [01:34] so that is impossible for windows? [01:34] oh good udev update [01:34] xdmcp ? [01:34] yes [01:35] i think there are commercial X servers like hummingbird that enable you to do that ... [01:35] but its pretty expansive [01:35] *expensive [01:35] crap [01:35] >$500 a seat [01:36] the vnc solution would be a compromise ... [01:36] jeezz [01:36] but would indeed be slower ... [01:36] damn ... [01:36] freenx could probably help here, i never tried it since we cant include it yet [01:37] but freenx isn't yet in Breezy or dapper? [01:37] thats what i wrote ... [01:38] :( [01:38] it ships its own crippled version of X libs ... we cant support that ... [01:38] there are efforts going on to make it work with the Xlib from the distro, but thats not done yet ... nomachine doesnt want to take out the proprietary parts ... [01:40] and how do I setup an Image Server? So that Clients in the network boot an Linux image from the Server? [01:41] thats done by default in edubuntu ... [01:41] I use Kubuntu :S [01:41] you need a dhcp server that answers to PXE requests first ... [01:42] the setup of the dhcp server points the client to a tftp server (mostly the same machine) [01:42] the tftp server provides a boot image to the client which then gets booted ... [01:43] the bootimage mounts / via naf from an nfs server (as well mostly the same machine) [01:43] s/naf/nfs/ [01:43] (what am i typing ... tsk) [01:43] hmm [01:44] doesn't that need netboot.gz? [01:44] the essential bit is the dhcp server [01:44] hmmm ... well I use my router as dhcp :S [01:44] which has all the info for the client ... (where the tftp server is, where to mount nfs from etc) [01:45] hrmmm [01:45] this one? [01:45] http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/dapper/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/ [01:45] ? [01:45] jsgotangco, thats a installer image ... [01:45] (for the installer that is) [01:46] ltsp-server-standalone has all you need ... [01:46] but you need the same backend right? (dhcpd, tftpd) [01:46] yup [01:46] i guess the dhcpd has a directive what to boot i guess [01:48] nope, it only points the client to the tftpserver ... [01:49] and the tftpd has the image? [01:49] yup ... [01:50] a PXE image that points to the kernel and initramfs ... [01:50] (which are also serverd by the tftpserver) [01:50] hmm [01:50] can i ask something [01:50] what's the difference between initrd.gz and initramfs? [01:50] nope, youre not allowed :P [01:51] initrd only hold the modules dir ... initramfs is a minimal system that contains scripts, binarys and the modules ... way more flexible ... [01:52] but initramfs is bigger right? [01:52] yup [01:52] a bit [01:52] the cd installer still uses initrd.gz [01:52] nope [01:52] huh? [01:52] its initramfs as well ... [01:53] okay our installation manual is way outdated... [01:53] look in your /boot dir [01:53] (not surprising) [01:53] initramfs images are called initrd.img ... [01:53] yeah [01:53] (historically based i think) [01:53] its 6.2MB [01:54] the kernel is 1.3 but i guess that is compressed [01:54] a netboot image only needs to be 3MB though === Rondom [n=Rondom@mrbg-3e3422b8.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #edubuntu [01:54] hmm interesting [01:54] but the installer initramfs is somewhat special ... [01:55] it has some extra parts (dont ask which, thats kamion land) [01:55] recent ltsp initramfs netboot images shouldnt be greater than 4MB ... [01:55] (else i've failed ;) ) [01:55] hmm i'm getting it better now [01:56] before i thought it was voodoo [01:56] the netboot initramfs only needs the network drivers, until recently it shipped everything ... [01:56] ahhh [01:57] but what about the vga module or whatever graphics it needs? [01:57] thats in the kernel ... [01:57] vga16 i think [01:58] ahh [01:59] this is quite interesting... [02:01] ahh need to reboot :/ [02:01] brb === dsaa [n=dsaa@210.1.83.88] has joined #edubuntu === ealden [n=ealden@203.76.213.90] has joined #edubuntu === irvin [n=irvin@ubuntu/member/irvin] has joined #edubuntu === jsgotangco [n=jsg@125.212.126.120] has joined #edubuntu === Yagisan [n=jamie@60-240-87-1-nsw-pppoe.tpgi.com.au] has joined #edubuntu [02:23] G'day All [02:25] hi === Yagisan wonders why a customer would spend more then $20 on mobile calls to me to dispute a $20 charge on an invoice [02:25] hey jsgotangco what's up [02:27] so odd - when the first thing I said was - I'll correct it. [02:27] haha [02:27] even sent a free service voucher to them [02:27] yet still not happy. Can't please everyone it seems [02:30] so hows your weekend jsgotangco [02:30] ? [02:35] Is it just me, or is evolution + spamassassin unable to block spam sent as images ? [02:36] oh i just declined a speaking stint at a local university because they wanted to stage a debate with people from MS [02:36] good thing the MS folks declined too [02:40] Yagisan, you have german customers ? thats sounds way to german to play in .au :) === signifer123 [n=michael@pool-141-157-88-80.balt.east.verizon.net] has joined #edubuntu [02:42] ogra: no German customers yet. Would you like to be the first ? :) [02:42] heh, phear me if i sue you for a 20 cent difference in a bill :P [02:42] ogra: BTW why too german ? [02:43] because i saw people doing that ^^^ ... [02:43] and its very typical for us :( [02:44] germans are doctrinarires [02:44] (at least the majority) [02:45] ogra: They complained about the cost of a weekend call out. IE it cost me $20 to get there and back (they *are* almost an hour away from me) and I charged them at cost. Next time, they can pay before I turn up on the weekend === Yagisan wonders - if it is so hard to get someone to come out on weekends - is it because the customers don't want to pay ? [02:47] likely [02:51] hmm - perhaps I should buy a "cluebat" in the sporting goods section to help remind customers that weekends are not free [02:51] :) [02:54] new terms & conditions. If on a weekend/public holiday/after hours and you need Yagisan, first open your wallet. Do you have at least $20 - if so take all of it out and place in an envelope with Yagisan written on it. Now call Yagisan, when he arrives - hand envelope (and contents) to him. Now describe your problem. === C-O-L-T [n=hunika@193.231.163.10] has joined #edubuntu [02:55] marvel at how he now recovers your login/internet/whatever password === zakame [n=zak@210.213.91.183] has joined #edubuntu === Rondom_ [n=Rondom@mrbg-3e3422b4.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #edubuntu === Rondom_ is now known as Rondom === jelkner [n=jelkner@66.92.145.252] has joined #edubuntu [03:28] one of our edubuntu servers has stopped serving clients [03:28] mount: Mounting /dev on /root/dev failded: No such file or directory [03:28] Target filessystem doesn't have /sbin/init [03:29] oh, before that [03:29] mount: Mounting /root/dev on /dev/.static/dev failed: No such file or directory [03:30] anyone here know what this means? [03:34] jelkner: is that on the client or server ? [03:34] the client [03:34] i'm talking to you know from the server [03:34] so that seems to be working ok [03:35] but clients won't boot [03:35] s/know/now ;-) === signifer123 [n=michael@141.157.88.80] has joined #edubuntu [03:37] jelkner: have you tried to reboot the clients ? [03:37] Yagisan: yes, serveral times [03:37] i also restarted the server [03:37] the server comes back up fine [03:38] but the clients are not booting [03:38] this is in a public library [03:38] the librarian called me and told me it has been like this all day (yesterday) [03:38] jelkner, check if the nfs server is running ... [03:39] i suppose that breezy ? [03:39] yes [03:39] *thats [03:39] i tried: [03:39] /etc/init.d/nfs-kernel-server restart [03:40] ps ax|grep nfs [03:40] that should give you some lines [03:40] then check /etc/exports [03:40] ps ax|grep nfs [03:40] oops, wrong terminal ;-) [03:40] additionally make sure there is no other dhcp running anywher [03:40] e [03:41] ps ax|grep nfs [03:41] 9503 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9504 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9505 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9506 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9507 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9508 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9509 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] 9510 ? S 0:00 [nfsd] [03:41] stop pasting please [03:41] ok [03:41] if you need to paste use a pastebot [03:41] s/bot/bin [03:41] what is a pastebot? [03:41] jelkner: pastebin [03:42] pastebin.ubuntulinux.nl for example ... [03:42] so look at /etc/exports [03:42] or http://pastebin.com/ eg [03:42] it should have a line pointing to /opt/ltsp [03:43] yes [03:43] ok [03:44] pastebin.ubuntulinux.nl doesn't seem to be there [03:44] but pastebin.com is [03:44] then check if the client shows the right "rootserver:" ip on boot ... [03:44] should be the server ip... [03:45] jelkner: did anything on the network change at all ? anyone adjust the ebubuntu server, put in a new dhcp server ? [03:45] no [03:45] not that i know of [03:45] i'm not here most of the time [03:45] note that these little internet routers often come with a dhcp server enabled [03:46] but the librarian wouldn't do that [03:46] ahh [03:46] so if someone resetted the router or replaced it, it could be that there is one running [03:46] but the root server seems correct [03:46] Running /scripts/nfs-premount is ok, too, i think [03:47] but then nfs: server 192.168.0.254 not responding, timed out [03:47] so its definately a nfs or a network problem ... [03:47] the ip is correct i suppose [03:47] yes [03:48] this looks very much like #19196, but if you say it doent boot on second attempt it must be something else ... [03:48] *doesnt [03:49] i tried 5 times [03:49] same symptom each time [03:49] in any case servers dont just stop working, someone must have changed something to cause this [03:52] any suggestions on how to diagnose? [03:52] find out what was changed ... [03:53] how? [03:53] ask ... ? [03:53] jelkner: ask [03:54] the librarian doesn't know [03:54] if you didnt, someone else must have changed something ... [03:54] someone has obviously changed something [03:54] people come in all day and use these machines [03:54] kids ? network staff ? [03:54] kids and patrons, it's a library [03:54] is there any *new* equipment ? [03:54] cleaning personal ... [03:54] no [03:54] could be [03:55] but all i have to work with now is me and the machines [03:55] unplugged the router to put the vaccum cleaner in ... after they replugged, the router reset itself ... [03:55] do you think it is the wireless router? [03:55] let me try that [03:55] no idea [03:56] but you need to take the whole into account, not only you and the machines ;) [03:56] often new/replacement routers are dropped in straight from the box with dhcp enabled eg for home users. You don't want that for a library [03:56] does the libary offer wireless access for patrons ? [03:56] not yet [03:57] this whole thing came about because the local friends of the library group (of which i am a member) donated the equipment [03:57] for two edubuntu workstations [03:58] and a linksys rounter with wireless [03:58] I'd check to see if the routers where replaced/rebooted, make sure no new devices are on the network, and that no one has joined multiple networks with some cable [03:58] ok, doing that now... [03:58] causing other dhcp servers to answer the requests === jinty [n=jinty@196.28.44.35] has joined #edubuntu [04:03] ok, i need to break the network connect and reset the router so i can log into it [04:03] thanks all! === JaneW [n=JaneW@dsl-146-139-82.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #edubuntu [04:19] hiya JaneW [04:19] or JaneW 's computer rather [04:48] does it matter what permissions libraries have? === signifer123 [n=michael@pool-141-157-88-80.balt.east.verizon.net] has joined #edubuntu [04:48] soz === AFDSf [n=afgd@60.17.192.31] has joined #edubuntu [04:49] hey [04:49] hello. [04:50] mmm was browsing the edubuntu site, and saw a link for the irc chat. I'm a teacher in china, edubuntu looks really good [04:50] :) [04:51] ^^ [04:51] thing is... [04:52] of all the ubuntu versions (kubuntu, ubuntu + edubuntu) this is the one that was benefit most from having a live cd [04:52] thats why we'll have one with the next release ;) [04:52] that's really good to hear [04:53] cool... [04:53] will it be one cd or like 4 cd's or 1 dvd? [04:53] feel free to test the daily build of the development version http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily-live/ [04:53] every classroom we have computers with crappy win*ows, if I can just go along with a live cd of this..... oh my god HAPPY KIDS! [04:54] ok i'll take a look at it [04:54] yesterdays build should already be pretty usable ... [04:54] that's excellent [04:54] apart from regular breakage due to development [04:55] but even so april release date is only 1 month after term start [04:55] (noetwork interfaces have wrong naming, only english keaboard layout etc...) [04:55] the livecd though is workstation mode not server [04:55] yes, it omits all the server bits [04:56] can i ask why would someone use the edubuntu for a server>? I mean aren't they better off with the ubuntu? [04:56] but gives a good preview of the thin client for whatever its worth :) [04:56] AFDSf, edubuntu is an LTSP server by default [04:56] AFDSf, edubuntu is a server distribution by default [04:56] wow [04:56] yes :) [04:56] a thin client classrom server ... to use your old hardware as terminals ... === jsgotangco have to yet rsync the daily though [04:57] i really hate to be dumb, but i thought it was built for kids - why would they use a server? Also what is a ltsp server? [04:57] jsgotangco, i fixed the lsb issue, but the datacenter is moved around, so the binary doesnt show up yet [04:57] AFDSf, for clasroom labs [04:57] ogra, ahhh so that explains why some services are erratic [04:57] ltsp == linux terminal server project ... [04:58] hi jsgotangco I was here for a bit - just rebooting and blogging etc [04:58] wow JaneW blogs [04:58] taking the kids for a walk, since I have been neglecting them today as I am a bit sick [04:58] nice [04:58] you have one powerful server and a bunch of diskless clients (i.e. resembled old PCs without disks) that work as terminals [04:58] AFDSf: the teacher installs it on a server. The kids all use pcs/thin clients attached to the server [04:59] wow that's really technical [04:59] jsgotangco: just about my life and such, no real work stuff like you guys ;) [04:59] AFDSf, but you can still enjoy edubuntu as a workstation for kids :) [04:59] is it possible to use it, say in my situation. Just take a live cd into class and let them use the apps? === jsgotangco is thinking of an article for freesoftwaremagazine.com [04:59] AFDSf, yes [05:00] hmmm [05:00] the livecd has no server stuff [05:00] AFDSf, it enables schools in poor countries to give every kid a pc workplace at school without spending a lot of money [05:00] can i ask what the advantage with having a server setup is? [05:00] AFDSf: actually its more like - insert cd -> next -> next -> next -> next -> next -> reboot -> edit 1 file. turn on kids computers [05:00] oh... [05:00] and you only have to manage the stuff on the server ... its very low maintenance work [05:00] JaneW, gimme the url if possible :) [05:01] but what does the server actually provide>? [05:01] whoa edubuntu marketing team in full force [05:01] AFDSf: in a nutshell, everything [05:01] imagine the terminals like additional keyboard mice and diaplays connected to a single machine === jsgotangco starts blog stalking [05:01] i can imagine this, but what is the advantage>? [05:02] you can manage and maintain everything in one place [05:02] AFDSf: low cost, low maintaince. If a pc breaks it takes 60 seconds to replace it with another working one [05:02] instead of maintaining say 20 copmputers in a class you only care for one ;) [05:02] yep [05:02] and your old machines come back to life [05:02] (as long as its in a network) [05:02] if you install a new app, you only have to do it once for everyone [05:03] so what is actually installed on the workstations? [05:03] AFDSf: nothing [05:03] you can take their hard disks out [05:03] none [05:03] just a network card [05:03] but surely they need something to tell them to look for a server? [05:03] network boot? [05:03] yes, the network card ... [05:03] yep [05:03] yup [05:03] the network card should be able to boot from a network [05:03] either a network bootable card, boot floppy or boot cd [05:04] I wrote a howto on the edubuntu wiki [05:04] a boot cd can make them look for the server? [05:04] a very good one ;) [05:04] yup [05:04] ah i see [05:04] thanks ogra [05:04] how long does it take for a workstation to load up from the server on a 100mps lan? [05:04] Yagisan, i even often use it in #ltsp for ubuntu users :) [05:05] AFDSf, the 5.10 version takse about 90sec for a standard PC ... the 6.04 will be ~10-50sec [05:05] ogra: nice :) Should have stuck a link in it to my website - try and get a few paying customers, so I can write more good documentation [05:05] yeah [05:05] whoag thats faster than i thoguht it would be for cat5 cable... [05:06] i mean i boot ubuntu on my laptop from the harddrive and it takes maybe a couple of minutes... i'm guessing a flashy edubuntu will take 5 mins [05:06] edubuntu isn't that mcu hbigger than ubuntu === jinty [n=jinty@196.28.45.166] has joined #edubuntu [05:06] that really depends on the hardware [05:06] AFDSf: no, takes about as long as a normal ubuntu boot [05:06] but it's gonna be over lan [05:06] Yagisan, not anymore ;) [05:06] lan is much slower than harddrive [05:06] Yagisan, usong my amd64 laptop as thin client i can boot in <15sec [05:07]