[04:29] <Burglaptop> salut Madpilot
[04:29] <Madpilot> hi Burglaptop
[04:31] <Madpilot> Burgwork: the http://gcompris.net/ website does work in Opera, at least here
[04:32] <Burglaptop> Madpilot: hmm
[04:32] <Burglaptop> you tested all of it?
[04:34] <Madpilot> not all, but I've followed most of the links on the lefthand menu
[04:34] <Burglaptop> ok
[04:34] <Burglaptop> I will report that
[04:34] <Madpilot> this is the latest Opera, 8.52 - I just updated a day or so ago
[04:38] <Madpilot> "we will bikeshed all day" - what does "bikeshed" mean in this context, Burglaptop?
[04:39] <Burglaptop> talk about useless things and never get anywhere
[04:39] <Madpilot> heh, OK. Why "to bikeshed"?
[04:40] <jsgotangco> gcompris?
[04:41] <Burglaptop> http://bikeshed.com/
[04:43] <Madpilot> "Some people have commented that the amount of noise generated by a change is inversely proportional to the complexity of the change."
[04:43] <Madpilot> and what an awful, awful background colour! :P
[04:52] <Burglaptop> ok, grumble
[04:53] <jsgotangco> what's this talk of Guide XML
[04:53] <Burglaptop> no idea, more random tangents and bikeshedding
[04:53] <Burglaptop> did you see my plea?
[04:54] <jsgotangco> reading now
[04:54] <jsgotangco> guide xml doesn't suit us at the moment since we use yelp anyway
[04:55] <jsgotangco> talk of infrastructure doesn't go anywhere
[04:55] <Burglaptop> I also think docbook is suboptimal, but talking about changing right now is foolish
[04:59] <jsgotangco> i just ignore it lately
[05:03] <Burglaptop> jsgotangco: do you have any thoughts on the whole wiki split thing?
[05:03] <jsgotangco> honestly, none at the moment, i was busy with g-a-i, u-m and now with edubuntu
[05:06] <Burglaptop> what are you doing with g-a-i and u-m?
[05:07] <jsgotangco> just a some string updates and the doco
[05:12] <Burglaptop> \ah
[05:15] <Burglaptop> cool, usplash down just landed
[05:22] <jsgotangco> tuxmath crack me up jeez
[05:25] <jsgotangco> wonder why tuxtype is only fullscreen
[05:28] <Burglaptop> gcompris only does 800x600
[05:30] <jsgotangco> Burglaptop: i sometimes wonder how fixated people are with regards to tagging their work as official/unofficial
[05:32] <Burglaptop> I understand some of it
[05:33] <Madpilot> jsgotangco: it's either "it's better to be official" or "It's cooler to be unofficial", it seems like...
[07:12] <robotgeek> jsgotangco: ping, cheap one liner again 
[07:12] <jsgotangco> :D
[07:13] <Burglaptop> as long it isn't one nighter...
[07:13] <robotgeek> i was worried about why my document was not validating, lol
[07:13] <robotgeek> i know a bit  more about docbook, lol
[07:18] <Burglaptop> interesting little bit I read a while back
[07:18] <Burglaptop> 80% think they understand the tone of what they read, while actually only 50% understood the tone
[07:18] <robotgeek> i think it was on slashdot
[07:19] <Madpilot> ...and on slashdot, it instantly degenerated into the sort of discussion where *nobody* got the tone... :P
[07:20] <robotgeek> yeah, if you have made that comment on slashdot, you probably would have been modded +5 funny
[07:22] <Burglaptop> wow, the web is so much more pleasant without flash
[07:23] <robotgeek> being on linux ppc does have it's advantages :)
[07:24] <robotgeek> Madpilot: nice link "bikeshed"
[07:26] <robotgeek> anyways, back to work. i need to bring DG to a reviewable state, lol
[07:47] <Burglaptop> where are xubuntu-docs being developed?
[07:53] <LaserJock> Burglaptop: no clue. Are there xubuntu docs? other than xfce docs
[07:54] <jsgotangco> none that i know
[07:54] <jsgotangco> rob spearheaded one but he disappeared
[08:44] <mdke> Burgwork, upstream
[08:44] <mdke> i heard that a few people were interested in doing some for ubuntu, but never heard anything concrete
[08:52] <mdke> bloody hell @ mailing list
[08:54] <jsgotangco> what about?
[08:55] <mdke> the changes to infrastructure etc
[08:55] <jsgotangco> yeah
[08:55] <jsgotangco> there is a strange fixation to such
[08:58] <jsgotangco> mdke: i've already commited the last batch of updates for g-a-i it's already merged in the bzr of mvo, i'll clean up that part after freeze
[08:58] <jsgotangco> u-m on its way
[08:58] <Madpilot> u-m?
[08:58] <jsgotangco> update manager
[08:58] <Madpilot> ah
[08:59] <mdke> jsgotangco, oh cool, nice work
[08:59] <mdke> hiya Madpilot 
[09:00] <jsgotangco> mdke: as for the png we have on svn, i was thinking of optimizing them using pngcrush or something similar
[09:00] <jsgotangco> it'll reduce the size by at least 50%
[09:00] <Madpilot> hi mdke
[09:00] <LaserJock> mdke: which ML was the "bloody hell" about? I'm losing track :(
[09:02] <mdke> jsgotangco, for all of them?
[09:02] <mdke> jsgotangco, if it works well... sounds good
[09:02] <mdke> LaserJock, ours
[09:02] <LaserJock> mdke: really? I thought it was pretty tame. I'll have to read some more ;-)
[09:03] <jsgotangco> mdke: yeah after distro release i guess or have those working on screenshots optimzize it themselves :)
[09:03] <mdke> ok
[09:05] <LaserJock> jsgotangco: that is a good idea, the repo is pretty large and I think a lot of size is due to images.
[09:06] <jsgotangco> yeah
[09:07] <jsgotangco> i learned about pngcrush when i saw a bug report on synaptic
[09:07] <jsgotangco> regarding the manual
[09:08] <mdke> can you just crush all the files in one go?
[09:09] <jsgotangco> i haven't tried it but i'm sure its possible
[09:09] <jsgotangco> if only it works in dapper now
[09:09] <HrdwrBoB> er
[09:10] <jsgotangco> it seemed to have been broken after a libpng update
[09:10] <HrdwrBoB> find -name \*.png -exec pngcrush '{}' \;
[09:11] <jsgotangco> there ya go regex love
[09:12] <HrdwrBoB> well, not really
[09:17] <mdke> -> work
[10:03] <mdke> Madpilot, feel free to mark sections complete as you check them for typos
[10:04] <Madpilot> will do - I moved a few status tags just now, but ignored most of them
[10:05] <mdke> and you can do a patch for the whole dg directory, rather than individual files, if you like
[10:05] <Madpilot> with the same "svn diff", or does the syntax change when you're diff'ing entire directories?
[10:06] <mdke> same
[10:06] <Madpilot> thanks - I'll keep that in mind
[10:07] <mdke> ok applied
[10:07] <mdke> i made one tiny change so svn up
[10:07] <Madpilot> will do, but I'm not doing any more editing tonight
[10:07] <mdke> cool, thanks for those
[10:07] <Madpilot> np
[10:09] <Madpilot> bhuvan: I can do basic proofreading for serverguide if you like
[10:09] <mdke> bhuvan, we'll get there, don't worry
[10:09] <mdke> the DG needed some major love tho
[10:10] <bhuvan> Madpilot: you provide your love to dg. we'll get your help, if need be in the end
[10:17] <Madpilot> OK, I lied, one last diff off to the list
[10:19] <mdke> ooh printers
[10:19] <mdke> what do you envisage going in that section? specific printer hardware?
[10:20] <Madpilot> at a minimum, a pointer to whereever Dapper keeps it's Printer config thing - it's System-Admin-Printers in Breezy
[10:21] <Madpilot> links to the wiki's printer stuff, maybe to linuxprinting.org
[10:21] <mdke> is this a common task though?
[10:22] <Madpilot> printers are more common than handhelds, and we've got a section on handhelds & Ubuntu
[10:22] <mdke> i mean, should it be in common-tasks.xml
[10:23] <Madpilot> maybe - right now most of the hardware stuff is in config-system.xml, though
[10:24] <mdke> sure, so if that is going to be hardware directed, it's definitely in the right place
[10:24] <mdke> if it's just a guide to printing, i dunno
[10:27] <Madpilot> anyway, I need to get some sleep - email the list about the printer thing, perhaps?
[10:27] <mdke> okay!
[10:27] <Madpilot> talk to you later
[10:27] <mdke> night
[02:53] <jsgotangco> mdke: new documentation wiki???
[02:54] <mdke> sorry?
[02:57] <jsgotangco> new wiki gets merged with help?
[02:58] <mdke> just miss out the word "new"
[02:58] <jsgotangco> wiki gets to be under help.ubuntu.com?
[02:59] <mdke> yes...
[02:59] <mdke> we've been talking about that for 6 months or so
[03:01] <jsgotangco> ah i'm so zoned out of all this infrastructure talk im not having fun anymore
[03:02] <mdke> me neither
[03:02] <mdke> let's just make some good docs
[03:02] <jsgotangco> that's what i'm doing
[03:04] <mdke> i didn't mean to suggest you weren't :)
[03:04] <mdke> i know you are
[03:04] <jsgotangco> :D
[04:28] <jsgotangco> hmm
[04:28] <jsgotangco> nm killed my network
[04:28] <jsgotangco> lol
[05:26] <LaserJock> mdke: Kamion mdke: it's the d-i installation manual
[05:26] <LaserJock> mdke: I looked it up myself
[05:27] <LaserJock> it is the documentation for the debian installer
[05:28] <LaserJock> so I don't think it is of any use to Ubuntu
[05:29] <LaserJock> hmm, guess I was wrong :(
[05:34] <LaserJock> mdke: I think Kamion has a good point. We perhaps should collect some of the Debian docs (at least links) and put them somewhere on help.u.c
[05:37] <jsgotangco> its basically d-i with some string changes
[05:37] <jsgotangco> but its no different to the breezy manual
[05:37] <jsgotangco> the request is reasonable though
[05:38] <LaserJock> I think we should make a place on doc.ubuntu.com where we just set up catagorized links to the debian docs.
[05:38] <jsgotangco> mdke: so are we going to put this?
[05:38] <jsgotangco> its pretty trivial imo
[05:38] <jsgotangco> but horribly out of place in our current setup
[05:39] <jsgotangco> doh
[05:39] <jsgotangco> i'll just reply to this email
[05:40] <LaserJock> jsgotangco: I think he'll be back, he was having connection problems
[06:01] <LaserJock> jsgotangco: I just sent a RE: to your RE: ;-) hope it makes sense
[06:01] <jsgotangco> heh its 1am nothing makes sense to me now
[06:01] <LaserJock> lol
[06:02] <LaserJock> well it's only 0900 here so I have no excuse
[06:12] <LaserJock> now I feel dumb. :(
[07:06] <theCore> hello LaserJock 
[07:06] <LaserJock> hi theCore 
[07:06] <theCore> I'm so lucky, or actually unlucky
[07:07] <theCore> I had hard drive failure, this week
[07:07] <theCore> I lost many files, but none from PackagingGuide
[07:08] <LaserJock> yikes
[07:08] <LaserJock> another one?
[07:08] <theCore> ya, this one is due to aggressive shutdown technics
[07:11] <LaserJock> jeeze, you need to be more careful about your hard drives ;-)
[07:13] <theCore> do you remember my little stupid brother ? (the one spamed #ubuntu and -offtopic). Now, because I lock my screen every time I quit my computer. He decide to shutdown to computer by removing the power cord. 
[07:13] <LaserJock> ouch
[07:14] <theCore> yea
[07:14] <theCore> ouch
[07:14] <LaserJock> how old is he?
[07:14] <theCore> 16, I think
[07:15] <LaserJock> hmm, I would probably thoroughly thrash him. 
[07:15] <theCore> I did ;)
[07:16] <LaserJock> Is he going to pay for a new hard drive?
[07:16] <theCore> the hard drive is okay
[07:17] <theCore> actually, it's my inode table that is scraped
[07:17] <LaserJock> ahh, what FS?
[07:17] <theCore> ext2 
[07:17] <theCore> ext3
[07:18] <theCore> I'm trying to find a way to repair it manually, right now
[07:18] <LaserJock> hmm, seems odd. I've had ok luck with ext3 and power outages etc.
[07:20] <theCore> He did that, at least 5 times, this week. I had to left my computer open because I was compiling Seamonkey
[07:20] <LaserJock> ohhh, I would have been soooo upset.
[07:21] <theCore> I will get over it, at least my personals files haven't been too damaged
[07:22] <theCore> I lost one or two trival files
[07:23] <theCore> anyways, now I need to find a way to recover my files from my hd
[07:24] <theCore> I only got one cdrw, and its already used for the LiveCD, 
[07:26] <theCore> I going to make a tarball and upload it to my gmail account 
[07:26] <theCore> viva the 2GB storage
[07:26] <LaserJock> how big will the tarball be?
[07:27] <theCore> 200 MB
[07:27] <theCore> more or least
[07:27] <theCore> less*
[07:28] <theCore> It suck like backup technic, but at least its get to work done
[07:28] <LaserJock> oh, that's not too bad. My ~/ is about 1GB tarballed 
[07:29] <theCore> mine too
[07:29] <theCore> but I stripping, all my "downloadables"
[07:29] <theCore> I'm*
[07:30] <robotgeek> hey theCore LaserJock 
[07:30] <LaserJock> hi robotgeek  
[07:30] <theCore> boujour rebotgeek
[07:31] <robotgeek> salut theCore 
[07:31] <theCore> robotgeek, oh
[07:31] <robotgeek> theCore: i don't know french, but picked this up :)
[07:32] <theCore> yea, I thought so
[07:33] <LaserJock> yeah, I've picked up a little French and German from those crazy MOTUs :-)
[07:33] <theCore> lol
[07:34] <robotgeek> :)
[07:34] <robotgeek> damn, i really need to put this box out of it's "windows" misery. problem is, it's not my box :)
[07:34] <theCore> Cette phrase n'est pas faite pour tre comprise. :)
[07:35] <LaserJock> lol, I had to use babelfish on it ;-)
[07:35] <robotgeek> theCore: google translate of this sucks :)
[07:36] <LaserJock> robotgeek: babelfish.altavista.com is what I usually use.
[07:36] <theCore> I expected that
[07:36] <LaserJock> robotgeek: what did you get?
[07:37] <robotgeek> This sentence is not made to be included/understood :) 
[07:37] <robotgeek> it's probably "meant"
[07:37] <LaserJock> same as babelfish
[07:37] <theCore> ( This sentence isn't meant to be understood )
[07:38] <theCore> I need a latin translator
[07:39] <robotgeek> theCore: that ways you could have "security by obsucrity" :)
[10:18] <robotgeek> learned ones, ping :)
[10:18] <Burgwork> robotgeek, hmm?
[10:20] <robotgeek> Burgwork: hmm, i was wondering what is better a) adept guide as a separate chapter in KDG b) or just link to it
[10:21] <robotgeek> with a) it would resemble the structure of Ubuntu DG
[10:22] <Burgwork> adept should be in a section called "Installation", not "Adept"
[10:22] <Burgwork> along with discussions of apt-get, etc.
[10:23] <robotgeek> true
[10:24] <robotgeek> i'll just put it in there for now, and talk with jjesse later