| allee | Tonio_: solution: bksys 1.5.1 changelog: documentation installation fixes | 12:07 |
|---|---|---|
| Tonio_ | allee: ah ? :) | 12:08 |
| Tonio_ | good news | 12:08 |
| allee | Tonio_: install kde.py and generic.py from bksys-1.5.1/admin/ into bksys, rebuild and the symlinks are gone | 12:08 |
| === allee back to gnudatalanguage | ||
| Tonio_ | the problem is that it requires a big change in the tarball........ | 12:09 |
| allee | Tonio_: | 12:10 |
| allee | $ diff -u ../bksys.as-included/kde.py bksys/ | wc -l | 12:10 |
| allee | 292 | 12:10 |
| hunger | Tonio_: Can you upload kdebase debs? | 12:10 |
| Tonio_ | hunger: nope, only riddell can | 12:10 |
| allee | Tonio_: ~ 300 line diff is not big. Put it into debian/patches/ ;) | 12:10 |
| hunger | Tonio_: Too bad:-( I have a couple of config files I'd like to get included:-) | 12:10 |
| Tonio_ | allee: a cool, can provide a patch then ;) | 12:11 |
| Tonio_ | hunger send riddell patches :) | 12:11 |
| allee | Tonio_: I'll send to you ... | 12:11 |
| Tonio_ | allee: your my master, definitly :) | 12:11 |
| hunger | Tonio_: The files are attached to #33034... config to enable fish and sftp in zeroconf. | 12:11 |
| Tonio_ | allee: okay, thanks, but I can do it myself :) anyway, tonio@ubuntu.com :) | 12:11 |
| hunger | They work nicely for me... | 12:12 |
| Tonio_ | hunger, well, need to ask riddell about that :) | 12:13 |
| hunger | Should kubuntu support other zeroconf stuff as well? | 12:13 |
| hunger | Like telnet...? | 12:13 |
| === hunger is not sure about telnet... it is so unsecure. | ||
| hunger | It is easy enough to add that plus shell and login (which basically are telnet as well). | 12:15 |
| allee | hunger: I vote no. | 12:15 |
| allee | :) | 12:15 |
| hunger | allee: So do I... I have them, but I did not attach them to the bug with the other two. | 12:16 |
| hunger | Tonio_: Did you change kdmrc? | 12:16 |
| === toma is now known as toma_ | ||
| hunger | Tonio_: Would you mind changing the ServerCmd when doing so next time to what gdm uses, too (/usr/bin/X -br -audit 0)? | 12:17 |
| Tonio_ | hunger: isn't that done ? | 12:18 |
| hunger | Tonio_: No, it still uses the only-left-for-compatibility path /usr/X11R6/.... | 12:19 |
| Tonio_ | hunger, okay, I will remember ;) | 12:19 |
| allee | Tonio_: mail sent | 12:20 |
| hunger | Tonio_: and the -audit 0 which stops the server from spamming the console it is started from is missing as well. | 12:20 |
| Tonio_ | allee: thanks :) | 12:20 |
| Tonio_ | hunger okay ;) | 12:20 |
| hunger | Not that that is a problem... but I think it would be nice to be consistent with gdm for purely estetic reasons:-) | 12:20 |
| hunger | Anyone got an idea why klaptopdaemon only suspends my laptop after I log out? | 12:21 |
| Tonio_ | hunger: the problem is that patching kdebase for this........ | 12:22 |
| === hunger needs to use klaptopdaemon to suspend, then unlock the screensaver which klaptopdaemon starts, then log out to sustend. | ||
| hunger | Tonio_: I was asking since kdmrc was just updated here. | 12:22 |
| Tonio_ | hunger, yes, I did the patch, but that requires a cdbs patch only for this, so........ | 12:23 |
| Tonio_ | patching after a freeze is generally to resolve problems | 12:23 |
| Tonio_ | even if esthetic is important, I agree, that can be done for dapper+1, but we certainly have other emergency | 12:24 |
| hunger | Tonio_: So we will not get that into dapper? | 12:24 |
| === hunger sighs. | ||
| hunger | Tonio_: I could file a bugreport for that... isen't solving a bug a reason to get it in? ;-) | 12:25 |
| Tonio_ | I agree that -audit 0 is important :) | 12:25 |
| === poningru [n=poningru@n128-227-48-188.xlate.ufl.edu] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Tonio_ | I will ask riddell about that tomorrow and eventually provide a patch | 12:25 |
| hunger | Tonio_: Not using a path that is deprecated is a reason, too. | 12:25 |
| Riddell | hmm? | 12:25 |
| hunger | Hi Riddell! | 12:25 |
| Tonio_ | hunger, yes, when everything is debugged, that becomes important :) | 12:25 |
| Riddell | good evening | 12:26 |
| Tonio_ | evening Riddell | 12:26 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: would you like a patch to change X patch in kdmrc ? | 12:26 |
| Tonio_ | X path sorry | 12:26 |
| Riddell | what would that be for? | 12:26 |
| hunger | Riddell: kdm still uses the pre-X-reorg path to the server... | 12:27 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: not using a depreciated path.... and eventually adding -audit 0 | 12:27 |
| hunger | Riddell: You never know when that will go away... gdm uses the new one for a while. | 12:27 |
| Riddell | what does -audio 0 do? | 12:29 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: stops the server from spamming the console it is started from | 12:29 |
| hunger | Riddell: stopps the server from writting stuff to stderr. | 12:29 |
| Tonio_ | ubuntu's GDM uses that | 12:29 |
| Riddell | is that bad? | 12:29 |
| hunger | Riddell: gdm uses that, too. I am for adding it mostly to use the same commandline as gdm. | 12:30 |
| Riddell | what happens if you have an error, harder to find out what's the problem | 12:30 |
| hunger | Riddell: It stopps logging of fairly uninteressting xauth stuff that goes to the logfiles anyway. | 12:31 |
| === haggai [n=halls@i-83-67-59-194.freedom2surf.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| === poningru [n=poningru@n128-227-48-188.xlate.ufl.edu] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| hunger | Riddell: While changing kdebase... I came up with some config files to make konqueror handle fish and sftp-ssh zeroconf stuff. Could those get added as well? | 12:34 |
| Riddell | how do you advertise those? | 12:34 |
| hunger | Riddell: See http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?s=756cd79c1eca73da9fb5c70fd2384989&t=137073 | 12:35 |
| hunger | Riddell: Gnome handles them for a while now... always annoyed me that it does not work in KDE:-) | 12:35 |
| raphink | Riddell: I've got a patch for adept | 12:36 |
| raphink | Riddell: but I'd like to ask for a favor, if I may call that so | 12:36 |
| Riddell | gnome does fish? | 12:36 |
| Riddell | raphink: what's that? | 12:37 |
| raphink | Riddell: could you please keep my changelog this time? | 12:37 |
| Riddell | hunger: interesting | 12:37 |
| hunger | Riddell: Dunno about fish, but it does handle sftp-ssh (at least on my friends debian box). | 12:37 |
| Riddell | raphink: hmmmmm | 12:37 |
| raphink | I, for one, love to contribute to Ubuntu, but I dislike very much that my name be removed from my contributions | 12:37 |
| raphink | it doesnt' cost anything to keep the changelog I bring in the debdiff | 12:37 |
| raphink | I do it for all contributors I upload for | 12:38 |
| Riddell | well I make sure the name is in the changelog | 12:38 |
| Riddell | I just get worried when e-mail doesn't go to me since I've no idea if it'll go anywhere | 12:38 |
| raphink | Riddell: I mean keeping the changelog | 12:38 |
| raphink | with my name as releaser of the version | 12:38 |
| hunger | Riddell: So he was able to get to the files via zeroconf while I had to figure out how to configure zeroconf:-( | 12:38 |
| raphink | if I want o apply for core-dev it might help to find packages in main with my name | 12:38 |
| raphink | not only with a mention to my work somewhere in the middle | 12:38 |
| Riddell | grep is your friend :) | 12:39 |
| raphink | Riddell: with soyouz, both the guys in changelog and the one who signed get the email | 12:39 |
| Riddell | hunger: how well have you managed to get libnss-mdns working? | 12:39 |
| Riddell | raphink: ok | 12:39 |
| raphink | Riddell: grep is not TB's friend when they look at your work in Ubuntu | 12:39 |
| hunger | Riddell: Is that needed? | 12:39 |
| raphink | you've got no time to grep all packages | 12:39 |
| raphink | for contribution | 12:39 |
| hunger | Riddell: I just installed avahi-daemon... | 12:39 |
| Riddell | hunger: of course, otherwise you can't connect to any services so foo.local | 12:39 |
| Riddell | s/so/at/ | 12:40 |
| raphink | so I'd like it very much if you could just sign with -k instead of making a new changelog mentionning my name | 12:40 |
| raphink | :) | 12:40 |
| raphink | all the more that sometimes you somehow modify the changelog in a way that doesn't reflect the work that was done, or just forget to mention who did the work | 12:41 |
| raphink | like in kubuntu-default-settings for example, on which I think Tonio has been spending quite a lot of time | 12:41 |
| raphink | and in whose changelog his name doesn't appear once | 12:41 |
| raphink | ;) | 12:42 |
| Riddell | [ Anthony Mercatante ] | 12:42 |
| Riddell | all his changes are marked in the standard fashion | 12:42 |
| Riddell | although he missed a few out himself I think | 12:42 |
| raphink | hmm not in all packages | 12:42 |
| raphink | I remember having seen one that didn't mention him | 12:43 |
| raphink | anyway | 12:43 |
| raphink | my point is rather to keep the modifier's changelog | 12:43 |
| raphink | and just sign it with your key | 12:43 |
| raphink | I'd appreciate that very much :) | 12:43 |
| Riddell | I missed his name out from the last but one kdebase upload it's true, but I put it back in retrospectively | 12:43 |
| raphink | ok :) | 12:44 |
| raphink | well that is not my point really though, and I think you got it | 12:44 |
| raphink | when I get my packages sponsored, I expect the changelog to be kept | 12:44 |
| Riddell | sure, I'll use your upload as an experiment | 12:45 |
| raphink | hehe ok :) | 12:45 |
| raphink | you just have to sign it using | 12:45 |
| raphink | debuild -S -sa -kyourkeyID | 12:45 |
| Tonio_ | hum, my two cents | 12:45 |
| raphink | and that's it :) | 12:45 |
| Riddell | I know | 12:45 |
| Tonio_ | that's not very important to me, as long as it works after building, but I must say I can understant some people feel important to see theiur changelog with their name | 12:45 |
| Riddell | and that's why I always include it :) | 12:46 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hum, I didn't even told you about that, but as everyone, you can sometime forget :) | 12:46 |
| Tonio_ | kubuntu-default-settings (1:6.04-5) dapper; urgency=low | 12:46 |
| Tonio_ | this changelog is a big work I did and my name isn't mentionned | 12:47 |
| Tonio_ | I personnaly don't mind, but another personn could have been hurt I assume | 12:47 |
| Riddell | eek, yes | 12:47 |
| Riddell | your right there, that's wrong of me, sorry about that | 12:48 |
| Riddell | I'll put it in retrospectively | 12:48 |
| Tonio_ | I know all of you know my work, that this is a progress and that's enought for me, for I'm not "everyone" :) | 12:48 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: don't say you are sorry, I DON'T MIND :) | 12:48 |
| Riddell | "Mon, 9 Jan 2006 04:50:25 +0000" it was almost 5 in the morning though :) | 12:48 |
| Tonio_ | otherwise, I would have told you before | 12:48 |
| Riddell | raphink: anyhoo, you had a patch? | 12:51 |
| raphink | Riddell: I'm pbuilding it to test it before giving it to you | 12:51 |
| raphink | :) | 12:51 |
| raphink | I'll give it to you as soon as I'm sure it works :) | 12:51 |
| Tonio_ | guys, can we still ask for uvf exception now ? | 12:52 |
| Riddell | I'm probably about to go to bed soon | 12:52 |
| raphink | ok | 12:52 |
| raphink | then you'll get it tomorrow ;) | 12:52 |
| raphink | doesn't matter | 12:52 |
| raphink | Tonio_: oui | 12:52 |
| Tonio_ | ok merci ;) | 12:53 |
| === robotgeek [n=venkat@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I will try to finish that patch for systemapplet in the next days | 12:53 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: which patch? | 12:53 |
| Tonio_ | and have a look at file associations | 12:54 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: system:/ causing files copied to tmp before opening | 12:54 |
| Riddell | ah, that patch | 12:54 |
| Tonio_ | I have done a working patch, but I miss the real name of .desktop then so that's not good | 12:54 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: k-d-s works perfect, uploading | 12:54 |
| Tonio_ | I will try to grab the code of kde 3.4.2 | 12:54 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: cool :) | 12:54 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: did you try the gtk_qt_engine autoconfig on new profiles ? | 12:55 |
| Tonio_ | I tested outside of the package and that was okay | 12:55 |
| allee | Tonio_: fwiw, toma wrote a little helper app to convert media: and system: url to normal path (should be useful for little .desktop hacks) | 12:57 |
| raphink | Riddell: shall I email you the debdiff ? | 12:58 |
| Riddell | raphink: sure | 12:58 |
| raphink | Riddell: jriddell@ubuntu.com right? | 12:58 |
| Riddell | yes | 12:59 |
| Tonio_ | allee: hum........; in fact the problem isn't to convert urls, it is to patch the applet not to use the url parser :) | 12:59 |
| Tonio_ | or eventually to patch the parser | 12:59 |
| allee | ah | 12:59 |
| Tonio_ | allee: but avoiding the parser causes another issue, cause the same parser is parsing the desktop file "name" | 01:00 |
| Tonio_ | so I have to patch there this time | 01:00 |
| Tonio_ | kde 3.4.2 was perfect in fact, duonnu why they changed this.......... | 01:00 |
| Tonio_ | oula !!!! s/duonnu:dunno :) | 01:00 |
| allee | Tonio_: you mean. Your goal is that the parser check if system: or media: is a local URL and then substitues /usaul/path/to/file? that would be great :) | 01:01 |
| raphink | Riddell: patch sent :) | 01:01 |
| Tonio_ | allee: nope, that's exactly what it actually does | 01:02 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I want to avoir that :) | 01:02 |
| allee | Eh? | 01:02 |
| Tonio_ | to come back to /home/bla instead of system:/home | 01:02 |
| raphink | Riddell: please ignore the mail I forgot one things :( | 01:03 |
| raphink | huhu | 01:03 |
| raphink | Riddell: ok? | 01:03 |
| Tonio_ | allee: browse with system:/home, and open a big file, like an avi movie, a big ogg, or even a big log file with kate for example | 01:03 |
| Tonio_ | allee: it gets copied in tmp before launching, which is a real PAIN | 01:03 |
| allee | Mhmm, looks like we _both_ want /home/bla instead of system:/home. Regardless how I failed to explain it ;) | 01:04 |
| Tonio_ | ho sorry I missunderstood :) | 01:04 |
| Riddell | raphink: ok | 01:04 |
| Tonio_ | allee: end of day, sorry :) | 01:04 |
| raphink | Riddell: forgot the icon for the installer ;) | 01:04 |
| raphink | Riddell: could be nicer with an icon hehe | 01:04 |
| allee | Tonio_: keep on the great work! | 01:05 |
| Tonio_ | allee: yes, that's my wanted, :) I tried to avoid using the parser, and that works, but it creates a problem to parse the .desktop Name entry, so we have to patch the parser directly | 01:05 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: see ubuntu-motu list for new uvf process | 01:05 |
| Tonio_ | allee: the problem is that my knowledge in cpp is about 0 | 01:05 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay ;) | 01:05 |
| Tonio_ | allee: concerning kdissert, you should put your name in the changelog and add it to the wiki page | 01:06 |
| allee | Tonio_: wiki? where? | 01:07 |
| LaserJock | Riddell: is the Ubuntu Packaging Guide included in kubuntu-docs? | 01:07 |
| Tonio_ | allee: you will not become a motu, although you are the best of us, if you act like a ghost :) | 01:07 |
| Tonio_ | allee: don't you have a wiki page ? | 01:07 |
| Riddell | LaserJock: good question, I was going to look that up when you first asked and got distracted | 01:07 |
| === Riddell goes to look | ||
| Tonio_ | allee: you did the patch, all you have to do is creating the changelog and signing it | 01:07 |
| allee | Tonio_: ah, you mean my homepage on wiki. | 01:07 |
| allee | Tonio_: and upload to revu? Send you the debdiff? | 01:08 |
| Tonio_ | allee: yes ;) It is too empty and you spend you time helping us for free.... sign your work and become a motu !!! | 01:08 |
| allee | Tonio_: I have to pass membership first ;) I added already a bit of contents to my wiki home page a week ago ;) | 01:09 |
| Tonio_ | allee: well, the patch is done, so you should really make it yourself ;) It'll take only 20 seconds | 01:09 |
| Tonio_ | allee: even better, with that kind of patches and bug resolving, it'll be easier to become a member | 01:09 |
| Riddell | LaserJock: yes it is | 01:10 |
| allee | Tonio_: Stupid question: I assume there's a malone bug. So I attach the debdiff there and ping someone here to upload? | 01:10 |
| LaserJock | Riddell: ah, great. thanks. I'll commit my copyright changes in a minute. I just needed to know about the packaging guide because it is the only doc that is GPL'd | 01:11 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I don't think there is a malone bug for this.... I didn't hear about it anyway | 01:11 |
| allee | Tonio_: oh? and you did you know about/found this wrong link? | 01:11 |
| Tonio_ | allee: what I would do if I were you is probably create the bug, uploading to revu, and I will ask for UVF maybe | 01:11 |
| Tonio_ | allee: sebas asked me to look at it ;) | 01:12 |
| allee | Tonio_: okay ... | 01:12 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I can't imagin my mentor isn't still a member ;) | 01:12 |
| allee | Tonio_: I don't fit in any imagination ;) | 01:13 |
| Tonio_ | allee: haha | 01:13 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: before going to bed, is there a plan to correct systemsettings major bugs before dapper is out ? | 01:13 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: damn well better be | 01:14 |
| Tonio_ | it would be a shame to release dapper with all bugs breezy's version add.... | 01:14 |
| Riddell | that'll be my focus after espresso is done | 01:14 |
| Tonio_ | If I was a standard user and not aware of the situation, I wouldn't understand I must say | 01:14 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: great ;) | 01:15 |
| Tonio_ | unfortunately I can't help on that point.....;;; | 01:15 |
| Tonio_ | raphink ? | 01:15 |
| raphink | Tonio_: yep? | 01:16 |
| Riddell | raphink: adding translations in adept should be done through KDE SVN | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: http://www.planetemu.net/temp/adept-installer.svgz | 01:16 |
| Riddell | otherwise they're far too hard to maintain | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: http://www.planetemu.net/temp/adept-installer.png | 01:16 |
| raphink | Riddell: ah | 01:16 |
| Riddell | raphink: do you have access to KDE's SVN? | 01:16 |
| raphink | Riddell: well it's just something I added as I changed the position in the menu and the NoDisplay for updater and notifier | 01:16 |
| raphink | it's not the main change | 01:16 |
| Riddell | yep | 01:16 |
| raphink | :) | 01:17 |
| Tonio_ | allee: will you tell me when you have done the job with kdissert ? I will ask for uvf exception | 01:17 |
| Riddell | raphink: files in http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/l10n/fr/messages/playground-sysadmin/ if you want to do them | 01:17 |
| Riddell | they're mostly done anyway | 01:17 |
| allee | Tonio_: k but will take a while: pbuild run missing | 01:18 |
| Tonio_ | ho I forgot to translate the second pot file for systemsettings | 01:18 |
| raphink | Riddell: I don't have an access to kde svn | 01:18 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: any reason they are not on rosetta ? | 01:18 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: rosetta has not imported dapper strings yet | 01:19 |
| Riddell | will do at string freeze | 01:19 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay ;) | 01:19 |
| raphink | :) | 01:19 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: euh........; string freeze ? means nothing will be translated after that ? | 01:19 |
| Tonio_ | or means everything will have to be translated after ? | 01:20 |
| Riddell | raphink: forwarding your patch to mornfall for his comments | 01:21 |
| === Tonio_ is happy to see kate working mono-session again ;) that's way more comfortable | ||
| raphink | Riddell: hmm sure, I'm building again to test the icons | 01:21 |
| LaserJock | hi raphink | 01:21 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: means no strings will change so translation can begin | 01:21 |
| raphink | hi LaserJock | 01:21 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay ;) | 01:21 |
| Riddell | raphink: what are the icons? | 01:22 |
| raphink | Riddell: icons tonio gave me for adept_installer | 01:22 |
| raphink | he said mornfall approved them | 01:22 |
| raphink | http://www.planetemu.net/temp/adept-installer.png | 01:22 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: http://www.planetemu.net/temp/adept-installer.png | 01:22 |
| Tonio_ | arf | 01:22 |
| raphink | hehe | 01:22 |
| raphink | ;) | 01:23 |
| raphink | so I made 16 22 32 & 48 versions of them | 01:23 |
| raphink | to be installed with the package | 01:23 |
| Riddell | ah, groovy | 01:23 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: isn't 64 and 128 required ? | 01:23 |
| raphink | :) | 01:23 |
| raphink | Tonio_: I just provided the sizes that are provided for the other apps in the package | 01:23 |
| Riddell | raphink: if you're playing with adept you could look at adding .desktop file for libxine extra codecs and call it MPsupport | 01:24 |
| raphink | I don't think 64 and 128 can be used for menu entries | 01:24 |
| Riddell | MP3 support | 01:24 |
| === Riddell beds | ||
| raphink | hmm | 01:24 |
| raphink | interesting | 01:24 |
| raphink | where would that be? | 01:24 |
| Tonio_ | ah ;) | 01:25 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: that means we have to create a .desktop file for this entry | 01:25 |
| Tonio_ | adept-installer is using a .desktop file per installable program | 01:25 |
| robotgeek | raphink: is that the package to install for all the nice stuff, instead of gstreamer? | 01:26 |
| raphink | Tonio_: ah, so good idea | 01:26 |
| raphink | robotgeek: yep | 01:26 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: it is the package that add mp3 support to xine | 01:26 |
| raphink | robotgeek: seems Riddell's idea is to have an entry in adept_installer to just select it | 01:26 |
| === robotgeek scrolls and looks for package name | ||
| raphink | that would prevent from using easyubuntu for that | 01:26 |
| robotgeek | raphink: that would be great! | 01:26 |
| === robotgeek is looking for the name, so he can document it in the Desktop Guide | ||
| robotgeek | raphink: i'm not happy about all those scripts either, but no matter what we try, they seem not to go away | 01:28 |
| raphink | Tonio_: I don't see where the desktop files for installer are | 01:28 |
| raphink | robotgeek: they do a job official stuff don't do | 01:28 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: hum........; | 01:28 |
| Tonio_ | let me check | 01:28 |
| raphink | robotgeek: we need to provide the same services with clean solutions | 01:28 |
| Tonio_ | I didn't saw that myselft, but I discussed that with mornfall | 01:28 |
| robotgeek | raphink: +1 | 01:28 |
| raphink | Tonio_: ah | 01:29 |
| raphink | mornfall doesn't seem to be around though | 01:29 |
| robotgeek | raphink: yes, mp3-support. video-support metapackages would be great | 01:29 |
| allee | Tonio_: so should one now add my e-mail into maintainer or add a [Achim Bohnet] ? | 01:30 |
| Tonio_ | allee: well, depends :) | 01:31 |
| Tonio_ | will you maintain it is the future or is it a nmu ? | 01:31 |
| Tonio_ | I assume nmu no ? | 01:31 |
| Tonio_ | so fill the chagelog yourself and that's it ;) | 01:31 |
| allee | better: [Achim Bohnet] then. I never started kdissert | 01:32 |
| allee | + don't know how it looks like ;) | 01:32 |
| Tonio_ | allee: and whose name for the changelog ? | 01:33 |
| allee | Tonio_: uploader? | 01:34 |
| Tonio_ | hum......that's exactly the oposite of what we were talking about with riddell :) | 01:35 |
| allee | Tonio_: well, I will not maintain it in the sense of a debian maintainer, but as a member of Kubuntu Team I fix bugs as time/knowledge permits, even in kdissert ;) | 01:35 |
| Tonio_ | allee: won't you upload it to revu ? | 01:35 |
| Riddell | raphink: in /usr/share/app-install/desktop/ | 01:35 |
| allee | allee: I'll upload to revu. | 01:35 |
| Riddell | robotgeek: libxine-extracodecs | 01:36 |
| raphink | thanks Riddell :) | 01:36 |
| raphink | I was trying to understand it in the installer c++ code ;) | 01:36 |
| raphink | Riddell: where do these desktop files come from? | 01:36 |
| allee | Tonio_: btw. does NMU make sense in the (K)ubuntu context. All MOTUs are the maintainers, aren't they? | 01:36 |
| robotgeek | Riddell: awesome, one package to provide them all | 01:36 |
| Tonio_ | allee: in fact, yes :) you're right | 01:36 |
| Riddell | allee: correct, it doesn't make sense | 01:37 |
| Riddell | raphink: not sure the exact process, mvo makes them somehow for gnome-app-install | 01:37 |
| raphink | allee: NMU can be totally ignored in Ubuntu | 01:37 |
| Riddell | I think it extracts them from uploaded packages on the buildds | 01:37 |
| Riddell | but quite a lot of the icons are missing | 01:37 |
| raphink | Riddell: there's a huge list of desktops in there | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: just to know, didn't you habe the time to look at gwenview patch, or is there a problem with it ? | 01:38 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: didn't I upload? | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: cause I have another (easier) way to make the package building correctly | 01:39 |
| raphink | Riddell: no package installs anything in /usr/share/app-install/desktop/ | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hum........ I don't see it on the repos :) | 01:39 |
| Riddell | Accepted gwenview 1.3.1-0ubuntu3 (source) | 01:39 |
| raphink | Riddell: so it must be generated somehow | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | maybe non build at the moment | 01:39 |
| allee | Tonio_, Riddell: 'k changed to 1.0.5.debian-2build2. Question: add my e-mail to maintainer-field or/and additionaly [My name] | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | allee: if I were you, I wouldn't touch the maintenair in control, just feel the changelog | 01:40 |
| Tonio_ | that's how I do personally | 01:40 |
| Riddell | we tend not to change the maintainer field in ubuntu | 01:40 |
| allee | Tonio_: no,no I only talk about changelog maintainer-field: -- Achim Bohnet <ach@mpe.mpg.de> Mon, 27 Feb 2006 23:41:19 +0100 | 01:41 |
| Tonio_ | ah, sorry | 01:41 |
| Tonio_ | allee: well, personnaly, I had my email in the changelog | 01:41 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: don't you do like that ? | 01:41 |
| raphink | Tonio_: like what? | 01:42 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: read 5 lines upper :) | 01:42 |
| raphink | I prefer to have just an entry in the changelog | 01:43 |
| raphink | I mean a whole one ;) | 01:43 |
| raphink | ok need to work more on the icons in adept | 01:43 |
| raphink | there's something wrong | 01:43 |
| === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.25] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| allee | Tonio_: kdissert: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2072 | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | allee: great ;) | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | will post uvh tomorrow :) | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | bed time :) | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | uvf not uvh | 02:40 |
| allee | Does upload to revu count as 'fix commited' in lauchpad? | 02:48 |
| allee | Tonio_: ^^ | 02:48 |
| Tonio_ | allee: any package where you have a changelog feet has an entry to your launchpad account according to what I know :) | 02:50 |
| allee | Tonio_: yeah, quite confusing ;) | 02:50 |
| allee | Tonio_: question is, now after revu upload https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kdissert/+bug/33105, can I set bug to fix-commited ? | 02:51 |
| Tonio_ | ah ! Iassume yes of course :) | 02:52 |
| === jsgotangco [n=jsg@210.4.38.43] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| raphink | Riddell: you there? | 03:15 |
| === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.25] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| === robotgeek [n=venkat@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
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| Mez | grr | 08:22 |
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| Hobbsee | Riddell: ping! | 08:57 |
| Hobbsee | Riddell: any chance we can move the meeting to be on thurs 16th, 20.00 UTC? I cant make it on wednesdays 20 UTC as i'm driving at that point, then have no internet access. | 08:59 |
| === jpatrick [n=patrick@ubuntu/member/jpatrick] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| viviersf | omw | 10:05 |
| viviersf | Riddell, PING !!!!!!!!! | 10:06 |
| === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.25] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| jpatrick | ok, I think he broke something... | 10:06 |
| viviersf | lol jpatrick | 10:06 |
| === Tonio_ [n=tonio@cac94-5-82-229-219-55.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Tonio_ | hello | 10:10 |
| jpatrick | hey Tonio_ | 10:12 |
| freeflying | Tonio_: http://ubuntu-zh.3322.org/screenshot/kdmsplash.png | 10:13 |
| === tvo [n=tobi@5354EA9B.cable.casema.nl] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Tonio_ | freeflying: yes, we need to had a depandancy on k-d-s | 10:14 |
| Tonio_ | freeflying: install moodin or kubuntu-desktop and it'll be okay | 10:14 |
| freeflying | Tonio_: got it ,thx | 10:14 |
| freeflying | Tonio_: moodin ? | 10:16 |
| Tonio_ | freeflying: yes, a ksplash engine | 10:17 |
| Tonio_ | actually kubuntu-desktop depends on it, but not k-d-s | 10:18 |
| jpatrick | freeflying: ksplash-engine-moodin | 10:18 |
| Tonio_ | yep | 10:18 |
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| raphink | Riddell: hi | 10:44 |
| === mornfall|work [n=mornfall@redhat.usu.cz] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| mornfall|work | Riddell: hi | 10:47 |
| mornfall|work | Riddell: as for the debdiff | 10:47 |
| jpatrick | ^^ hehe | 10:47 |
| mornfall|work | Riddell: disabling adept updater from menu makes it useless for users who do not wish to use notifier | 10:47 |
| mornfall|work | Riddell: doing so for notifier makes it hard to get it back running when you disable it | 10:48 |
| raphink | people who do not want to use the notifier can launch adept manager for updates | 10:48 |
| mornfall|work | (as in, you need to go to commandline to do so -- the UI rule of thumb is that any action should be undoable) | 10:48 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: it's not the same | 10:49 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: talking about adept, I've been searching how I could add libxine-extra-codecs to the menus in installer | 10:49 |
| Tonio_ | hello | 10:49 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: drop a .desktop file to /usr/share/app-install/desktop/ | 10:49 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: I don't get how these desktop files are created | 10:50 |
| mornfall|work | (package is app-install-data) | 10:50 |
| raphink | no package creates them it seems | 10:50 |
| raphink | ah | 10:50 |
| raphink | ok | 10:50 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: not my business... i think they are collected from apps and the X-AppInstall things are added :) | 10:50 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: the *rare* users who don't want to use the notifier generally use apt, and even if not, they know how to modify a .desktop file | 10:50 |
| Tonio_ | that's my feeling | 10:50 |
| robotgeek | raphink: will you ping me when you are done, i will update the K Desktop Guide to reflect the changes? | 10:50 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: dunno, any survey to back that up? | 10:51 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: also, what about the undoability of actions | 10:51 |
| raphink | robotgeek: sure | 10:51 |
| robotgeek | raphink: ty | 10:51 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: you mean ? "undoability of actions" ? | 10:51 |
| jpatrick | lets vote at Kubuntu meeting - no wait to late | 10:51 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: we spend a lot of time helping newbies on IRC | 10:51 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: kill adept notifier and select to not run it next time | 10:51 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: now how you get it back through GUI? | 10:51 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: I can type the command...... | 10:52 |
| Tonio_ | I mean, a notifier isn't done to be disabled | 10:52 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: that's hardly GUI | 10:52 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: asking for confirmation is *not* a substitute for a way back | 10:52 |
| Tonio_ | I don't think any gnome user will disable it on ubuntu | 10:52 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: if you see it this way, there should be tons of entries in the Kmenu for all the stuff that cdan be in the systray | 10:52 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: can you name a single one you can't get back after killing? | 10:53 |
| raphink | Tonio_: ++ | 10:53 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: really, for 0.5% people that will want to play with it and not simply "let it do it's job", it sounds crazzy to make the K menu a mess for the 99.5% other people...... | 10:53 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: they are not usually launched directly from the menu | 10:53 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: 0.5%, where is that number from? | 10:54 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: from the fact that ubuntu isn't gentoo | 10:54 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: now our idea is also that it could be nice to have installer or adept as a kcontrol module in systemsettings, and I think the notifier could be activated through systemsettings too | 10:54 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: right, so implement something to be able to get it back not from menu | 10:54 |
| Tonio_ | it is not designed to be configured file by file.... | 10:54 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: that's a nice idea, patches? | 10:54 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: that's useless made up number then | 10:55 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: it could be 10% and you would never be able to tell | 10:55 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: this is a wish, I don't think you'd blame me for the small amount of work I do in Ubuntu though | 10:55 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: well forget the number, that is stupid from me, okay | 10:55 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: the fact is that "normal" people, standard users, call it like you want, are certainly more thatn 50% | 10:56 |
| mornfall|work | i don't work on ubuntu at all | 10:56 |
| Tonio_ | those people generally don't touch the settings too much | 10:56 |
| Tonio_ | and will certainly not disable the update notifier | 10:56 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: again, that's not an argument | 10:56 |
| Tonio_ | even if closed by error, it'll come back after a reboot, so...... | 10:56 |
| mornfall|work | and it won't come back if you tell it not to | 10:56 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: the argument is that when you disable something, you are supposed to know how to come back...... | 10:56 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: that's not what i hear from openusability | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | I don't say adept is to be done like that be default | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | but we think that's the way it should feet in ubuntu | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | in kubuntu to be exact | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | and that is about the same that what ubuntu does | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | and most people seems to appreciate ubuntu, so that shouldn't be a bad thing | 10:57 |
| mornfall|work | well, you remove functionality -- if you are willing to take over malone of adept and forward bugs upstream (since you diverge from upstream in kubuntu), i'm all for it | 10:58 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: there are much bigger issues of usability in Kubuntu, this is just very very minor | 10:58 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: when I disable the menus in an app and can't get them back unless I type ctrl+M, this is a big issue | 10:58 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: we clarify the desktop, which is completly different | 10:58 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: want a solution ? | 10:58 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: letting users lose a notifier that can be launched from a terminal... well | 10:58 |
| Tonio_ | make adept-notifier a kde service | 10:58 |
| mornfall|work | no | 10:59 |
| Tonio_ | that way it could be stopped and restarted without any desktop entry | 10:59 |
| mornfall|work | sorry | 10:59 |
| Tonio_ | that's the way knemo doesn for example | 10:59 |
| mornfall|work | that's not acceptable | 10:59 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: why ? | 10:59 |
| mornfall|work | well, not if you mean kded module | 10:59 |
| mornfall|work | if there's a way to go about it without kded that could work | 10:59 |
| mornfall|work | but it's clearly a post 2.0 material (we are deep in feature freeze, recall?) | 10:59 |
| mornfall|work | the fact is, i am the current kubuntu maintainer of adept -- if someone wants to take over, i'll be happy about it | 11:01 |
| mornfall|work | with this goes malone and divergence from upstream | 11:01 |
| jpatrick | I can't | 11:01 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: you mean of the package ? | 11:01 |
| mornfall|work | yes | 11:01 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: adept is in main, you need a core-dev to maintain it | 11:02 |
| mornfall|work | i will be more than happy to give up on the pleasure of using malone | 11:02 |
| raphink | I'd be happy to maintain it | 11:02 |
| jpatrick | I'm not core-dev but I could get Riddell to upload | 11:02 |
| raphink | if I were one | 11:02 |
| mornfall|work | Riddell is sponsoring for me now | 11:02 |
| === Tonio_ doesn't understand why something supposed to be a daemon on a kde DM system canot be a kded service........ what are those kded services usefull for then ? | ||
| raphink | Tonio_: +1 | 11:03 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: see, adept notifier needs to do ultra-expensive (for a kded module) processing and making kded run threaded is not an option | 11:03 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: ah ok, then I understand | 11:03 |
| Tonio_ | just sure of one thing, if it was me, adept-notifier would be unstopable via a click | 11:03 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: if you like kded to freeze every now and then, feel free | 11:03 |
| Tonio_ | it is not the purpose of a desktop oriented distro to give 2000 options used from the newbie to the absolute nerd | 11:04 |
| mornfall|work | also, kded *should not* crash -- ever | 11:04 |
| mornfall|work | and i am not overly confident in libapt-pkg not crashing the program | 11:04 |
| Tonio_ | actually, when I see the system menu with "adept manager, adept updater, adept notifier, adept installer" | 11:04 |
| raphink | I'd be fine with 4 adept entries in the kmenu in debian or gentoo | 11:04 |
| raphink | but not in kubuntu | 11:05 |
| raphink | I intend to install kubuntu for my mom, sister or grandmother | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | me feeling is "when my mother will read this, will she event understand what could be the difference there ???" | 11:05 |
| raphink | and I don't want them to try to figure out why 4 entries have the same name | 11:05 |
| raphink | when they can hardly figure out what it's used for with one name | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: ++ | 11:05 |
| mornfall|work | both of you | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | the personns who want to play with advanced settings are able to launched the notifier from the shell | 11:06 |
| raphink | I'm already getting mad when I have to help my mom with the comp ;) | 11:06 |
| mornfall|work | you know, there's this XDG menu standard to allow specifically this *without* patching every single .desktop file out there | 11:06 |
| Tonio_ | as all of them generally spend their time in a console, like most of us | 11:06 |
| raphink | Ubuntu is Linux for _human beings_ | 11:06 |
| raphink | not Linux for nerds | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | I wouldn't say the same if I was discussing of the gentoo desktop of course | 11:07 |
| raphink | indeed | 11:07 |
| raphink | or even Debian | 11:07 |
| raphink | or Slack | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | yep | 11:07 |
| === mornfall|work notes he up to now thought he was considered a human being | ||
| raphink | or whatever intended for people who know what they do | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | but ubuntu is in the category of mandriva or suse on that point | 11:07 |
| mornfall|work | i would hope you could do better than those two | 11:08 |
| Tonio_ | we really hope | 11:08 |
| raphink | hope so too | 11:08 |
| Tonio_ | but it is not is adding so many functionnalities that users will get lost | 11:08 |
| Tonio_ | I know that in theory everyone is able to use it's desktop | 11:08 |
| mornfall|work | no, definitely not, anything made you think i would go that direction? | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | but in real life, 2 buttons instead of makes it so complicated for certain people, you cannot imagin | 11:09 |
| raphink | but I don't think we'll do better for noobs by having 4 adept entries in the menu. This is what Mandriva does, and it's horrible imo | 11:09 |
| mornfall|work | reality check, nearly all advanced functionality is semi-hidden in adept | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | managing applications doesn't require 4 applications | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | because that's it | 11:09 |
| raphink | my mom gets crazy with more than 2 options in a GUI | 11:09 |
| mornfall|work | it's not like i tried to push every single feature to the first sight | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | 4 entries in the K menu means 4 applications | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: why not adding an option to the standard "adept manager" | 11:09 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: the feature is still there | 11:09 |
| raphink | notifier's feature is to run as a daemon in the systray | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | that would let you launch or stop the notifier | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | that's okay :) | 11:10 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: you know, a default desktop should not include adept manager at all | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: ?? | 11:10 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: no irony | 11:10 |
| mornfall|work | Tonio_: manager is *not* for the group of users you are talking about | 11:10 |
| mornfall|work | which is apparently your target group | 11:10 |
| mornfall|work | it has nothing to offer them | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: .......... | 11:11 |
| mornfall|work | you want notifier in systray (possibly with quit removed) | 11:11 |
| Tonio_ | not necessary to go with the extreme | 11:11 |
| mornfall|work | and installer in menu | 11:11 |
| mornfall|work | that's all | 11:11 |
| raphink | ok I'm tired of word games and turning around the problem. i'm gonna poll users on #kubuntu see what they think | 11:11 |
| mornfall|work | poll in irc channel? | 11:11 |
| robotgeek | it would make my job easier too. less applications to document | 11:11 |
| mornfall|work | how representative will that be of actual users? | 11:11 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: yeah you know you ask a question and you note the answers | 11:11 |
| jpatrick | robotgeek: heh | 11:11 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: I'm not a statistics company. I don't mind whether this is representative or not. | 11:12 |
| mornfall|work | see, i'm dead serious here | 11:12 |
| mornfall|work | there's nothing raphink's mom could use adept manager for | 11:12 |
| raphink | sure mornfall|work | 11:12 |
| mornfall|work | specifically nothing she wouldn't be able to do with the 2 wizards | 11:12 |
| raphink | adept manager should be available in the Kmenu for more advanced users | 11:13 |
| raphink | but it's the only one that should be there imo | 11:13 |
| mornfall|work | what happens to installer then | 11:13 |
| raphink | it's moved to Qt;KDE;Core; together with SystemSettings so far | 11:13 |
| raphink | so it's available very easily | 11:13 |
| mornfall|work | aha | 11:13 |
| raphink | and it's labelled "Add/Remove Programs (Adept Installer)" | 11:14 |
| raphink | so it's easy to understand and use | 11:14 |
| === robotgeek would love it if the 3 adept entries magically shrinked to one! | ||
| raphink | Riddell agreed on this | 11:14 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: ideally, we'd like to have installer _inside_ systemsettings, as a kcontrol module | 11:14 |
| jpatrick | have a submenu? | 11:14 |
| mornfall|work | raphink: systemsettings, isn't that python? | 11:14 |
| mornfall|work | or it can use c++ kcontrol modules | 11:15 |
| Tonio_ | yes, having it as a kcontrol module would be the best | 11:15 |
| mornfall|work | nothing stops you | 11:15 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: it can use c++ kcontrol modules | 11:15 |
| mornfall|work | but you are fairly late in the game | 11:15 |
| Tonio_ | mornfall|work: a systemsettings module is simply a kcontrol one | 11:15 |
| mornfall|work | note that there won't be any major adept release for dapper+1 | 11:15 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: there's no late, my goal is not only Dapper, it's Kubuntu in a whole. If it's not for Dapper, it'll be in 6 months | 11:15 |
| === mornfall|work is moving on, and adept 3 has prelimnary 12 month schedule | ||
| mornfall|work | which will be extended as needed | 11:16 |
| raphink | :) | 11:16 |
| mornfall|work | of course there's room for 2.x | 11:16 |
| mornfall|work | but i won't be able to invest much time in that | 11:17 |
| freeflying | any way ,we'd have a workable adept | 11:17 |
| raphink | mornfall|work: I'd love to tell you that I could help you dev it, unfortunately I don't know c++, I want to develop REVU and I've got work in (K)Ubuntu | 11:17 |
| mornfall|work | i don't count on any external help with adept | 11:18 |
| mornfall|work | it's hopeless | 11:18 |
| mornfall|work | adept coding that is | 11:18 |
| raphink | why? | 11:18 |
| mornfall|work | would you? how many patches can you count in adept codebase that are not mine? | 11:19 |
| mornfall|work | i have started with this long time ago | 11:19 |
| mornfall|work | i had some people come and go, but they would never stick around for long | 11:19 |
| mornfall|work | it was called kapture back then and it was somewhat stupid | 11:20 |
| raphink | I've looked at the code myself yesterday | 11:20 |
| mornfall|work | i had no idea how to make a semi-decent GUI | 11:20 |
| raphink | I have seen no specification and no comment | 11:20 |
| raphink | so I very fast gave up | 11:20 |
| raphink | when I want people to understand my code and help with it, I try to put some comments in it so they don't spend 2 days understanding it, that helps :) | 11:21 |
| mornfall|work | unfortunately, from experience, there's no use in commenting code -- it does not help | 11:21 |
| raphink | now I'm also not a c++ dev so it's hard for me to understand it for that reason ;) | 11:21 |
| raphink | hmm | 11:21 |
| mornfall|work | you start commenting code | 11:21 |
| mornfall|work | fine | 11:21 |
| mornfall|work | then you notice that noone is helping | 11:22 |
| mornfall|work | you try to maintain comments with somewhat reduced motivation | 11:22 |
| mornfall|work | then you give up | 11:22 |
| mornfall|work | then you start deleting comments that are hopelessly out of date and confuse you | 11:22 |
| raphink | well I put comments for myself, too ;) | 11:22 |
| mornfall|work | that type of comments is there | 11:22 |
| raphink | and remove the ones that are obsolete when they get to be | 11:22 |
| mornfall|work | whenever i write something particularly heavy i put a comment :) | 11:23 |
| mornfall|work | i also try to comment libapt-front since i'm not alone working on it | 11:23 |
| mornfall|work | (we are 2, enrico zini is helping out) | 11:23 |
| raphink | cool :) | 11:24 |
| Tonio_ | the problem mornfall|work is that most people are used toplay with synaptic for ages now, even with a kde DM | 11:26 |
| mornfall|work | no that's not the problem | 11:26 |
| Tonio_ | it'll take time for people to have "adept" as a reflex, but then I don't see any reason nobody would like to contribute, as it happens with most apps | 11:26 |
| mornfall|work | by that time it'll be far too late | 11:27 |
| mornfall|work | synaptic is stagnating too, since mvo does not have time | 11:27 |
| mornfall|work | there's very little outside activity pushing it forward | 11:27 |
| mornfall|work | if i were to place a bet, i'd say adept dies when i leave it | 11:28 |
| mornfall|work | (dies as in stops evolving) | 11:28 |
| mornfall|work | bbiab | 11:29 |
| raphink | you don't know about that mornfall|work, this is open source | 11:30 |
| raphink | ;) | 11:30 |
| raphink | you'd say NeXT was dead at a given time, yet Apple used it | 11:30 |
| mornfall|work | NeXT was not open source | 11:30 |
| raphink | Knmap was dead a year ago | 11:30 |
| raphink | and it was taken again into life and improved | 11:30 |
| raphink | only one guy is necessary to bring a project back to life whenever it's come to die | 11:31 |
| === nlindblad [n=nlindbla@user179.217-10-120.netatonce.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| mornfall|work | possibly yes... in practice, it's rare | 11:31 |
| mornfall|work | (still bbiab) | 11:32 |
| raphink | in practice there aren't so many open-source devs | 11:32 |
| raphink | Riddell: are you there? | 11:32 |
| === jpatrick pulls out his ebook on KDE-devel, just in case | ||
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| mornfall|work | right, so if you bet, you better bet on something that's likely | 11:36 |
| Riddell | raphink: hi | 11:36 |
| raphink | :) | 11:36 |
| raphink | Riddell: did you see my package on REVU? | 11:36 |
| nlindblad | hello | 11:36 |
| Riddell | raphink: which? | 11:37 |
| raphink | http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2074 | 11:37 |
| freeflying | Riddell: hi | 11:38 |
| mornfall|work | freeflying: hi, btw, adept still breaks on your machines? | 11:38 |
| freeflying | mornfall|work: ya, I can not it under my desktop and ibook | 11:39 |
| mornfall|work | ultra-weird | 11:39 |
| jpatrick | tiber's dying or what? | 11:39 |
| raphink | Riddell: the patch on the desktop files is the same, I just added the icons for installer | 11:40 |
| robotgeek | is it intentional that knode doesn't have a entry in the K-Menu? is it meant to be accessed as a Kontact Module? | 11:40 |
| raphink | Riddell: so I couldnt' send you the patch with the icons ;) | 11:40 |
| jpatrick | robotgeek: yes | 11:40 |
| robotgeek | jpatrick: thanks, will document accordingly | 11:40 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hi ! Send you gwenview 0ubuntu4 yesterday, there was a problem with the package uploaded, due to dsc file | 11:40 |
| Riddell | robotgeek: yes | 11:40 |
| Riddell | raphink: ok | 11:41 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: what was the problem? | 11:41 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: .po files ignored, because the patches are not applied | 11:41 |
| Tonio_ | I removed the .dsc and rebuild the source package, and it works like a charm | 11:42 |
| nlindblad | any idea if there'll be a working driver for those VIA grahpic cards found in laptops | 11:42 |
| Tonio_ | but because it was already uploaded, I had to increment the version | 11:42 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: huh? built that gwenview and it was working | 11:42 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: it builds, but patches are ignored | 11:42 |
| Tonio_ | look at the deb ;) no .moc files in it | 11:43 |
| Tonio_ | delete the dsc, rebuild the source package, pbuild again, and you'll see the deb is completly different | 11:43 |
| freeflying | Riddell: how to add depend on skim to scim's engine in main ? ask the maintainer for that ? | 11:43 |
| Tonio_ | there was an warning regarding to the patches.......;;; don't remember | 11:43 |
| Tonio_ | raphink: can you confirm that your gwenview is still in english ? (and that I'm not completly crazzy ^^) | 11:44 |
| raphink | Tonio_: confirmed | 11:45 |
| raphink | it's still in english here | 11:45 |
| Tonio_ | but the patch works nicelly with the source package I sent you Riddell, tested on 3 machines | 11:45 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: you just have to sign and upload :) | 11:46 |
| raphink | same for ept Riddell ;) | 12:03 |
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| robotgeek | hmm, i can't find a Kmenu entry for kfocus | 12:17 |
| Riddell | robotgeek: it ends up in Lost and Found | 12:20 |
| Riddell | /usr/share/applnk/Applications/kfocus.desktop | 12:20 |
| robotgeek | hmm,okay. I'm wondering if I should document that? | 12:20 |
| Riddell | report a bug would be the correct thing | 12:21 |
| robotgeek | okay, cool. will do | 12:22 |
| Riddell | sebas: we're keynote speakers! http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS9673237573.html | 12:24 |
| robotgeek | Riddell: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kfocus/+bug/33138 | 12:25 |
| freeflying | Riddell: how to add depend on skim to scim's engine in main ? ask the maintainer for that ? | 12:25 |
| Riddell | freeflying: but scim doesn't depend on skim | 12:26 |
| freeflying | Riddell: I mean the engine of scim ,such as scim-pinyin , scim-chewing ,etc. | 12:27 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: did you confirm with gwenview ? | 12:28 |
| jpatrick | robotgeek: I'm on it | 12:30 |
| Riddell | freeflying: but they don't depend on skim either | 12:30 |
| robotgeek | thanks jpatrick | 12:31 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: I don't understand the problem, it applied for me | 12:31 |
| freeflying | Riddell: because I don't want user to install scim in kubuntu , and these engine can work with skim and libscim , so needn't install scim in kubuntu | 12:32 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: well, the package built on the server doesn't have any moc file in it | 12:33 |
| Tonio_ | so I grabbed the source package and tried to pbuild it, and I saw the patches were not applied... | 12:33 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: don't know for you, but on the build server, the problem happened.... | 12:33 |
| Tonio_ | so maybe reuploading the rebuilt source package I sent you will correct the issue... | 12:34 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: all I know is that the actuall deb file doesn't have .moc files... | 12:34 |
| Tonio_ | .mo files sorry | 12:35 |
| Riddell | freeflying: ah, so at the moment they depend on scim, but really they should depend on scim | skim | 12:35 |
| freeflying | Riddell: ya | 12:35 |
| Riddell | freeflying: just send me patches that change the depends to "scim | skim" I think is best | 12:36 |
| Riddell | or upload them to revu | 12:36 |
| raphink | Riddell: I confirm that gwenview is not translated in french in the new version | 12:37 |
| raphink | if that helps ;) | 12:37 |
| Riddell | well no, it needs to wait on a langpack update | 12:38 |
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| jpatrick | hey JRe | 12:38 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: why does a .deb need .moc files? | 12:38 |
| Tonio_ | .mo file, I didn the correction, sorry :) | 12:38 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I'm building to show tou the log | 12:38 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: I have this in my build log from last night.. | 12:39 |
| Riddell | Trying patch debian/patches/kubuntu_01_fix_po_directory.diff at level 0...1...success. | 12:39 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: confirmed | 12:39 |
| Tonio_ | I have that too | 12:39 |
| Tonio_ | the problem is that I didn't have that yesterday......... | 12:39 |
| Tonio_ | amazing....... | 12:39 |
| Tonio_ | anyway there is a problem, because if I apt-get source gwenview && sudo pbuilder build *.dsc | 12:40 |
| Tonio_ | I then get the languages | 12:40 |
| Tonio_ | maybe there was a little issue yesterday on the build machine | 12:40 |
| Tonio_ | I show the build log to raphink yesterday, it was complagning the patches couldn't be applyed for some reason.......; | 12:41 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: can you compare the local built deb and the server one ? | 12:41 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: debdiff /var/cache/pbuilder/result/gwenview_1.3.1-0ubuntu3-i386.deb /var/cache/apt/archive/gwenview_1.3.1-0ubuntu3-i386.deb | 12:44 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: http://pastebin.com/576453 | 12:44 |
| Tonio_ | here is the diff result......... there was a problem though | 12:44 |
| Riddell | http://librarian.launchpad.net/1597448/buildlog_ubuntu-dapper-i386.gwenview_1.3.1-0ubuntu3_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz looks fine | 12:45 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: what are you diffing? | 12:45 |
| Tonio_ | the apt downloaded file and the same package locally build with pbuilder | 12:45 |
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| Tonio_ | only .mo files is the difference | 12:45 |
| Riddell | that's a good thing | 12:46 |
| Tonio_ | the actuall debile on repos doesn't have .mo files, though I don't understand why | 12:46 |
| Riddell | it means they .mo files have been extracted and are waiting to be put into langpacks | 12:46 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: so they don't fit in packages directly ? ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh | 12:46 |
| Tonio_ | and they don't go in debs finally | 12:47 |
| Riddell | no, they get sucked out of the debs after build | 12:47 |
| jpatrick | can someone pastebin their /usr/share/applnk/Applications/kfocus.desktop ? | 12:47 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay, sorry for bugging you with this anywa, just I didn't knew that process | 12:47 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hum........ why are all other applications in french then ? ;) | 12:47 |
| Riddell | http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/576463 | 12:48 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: universe apps keep their .mo files, main apps will have .mo files in language-pack-kde-base | 12:48 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay, taking notes of that :) | 12:48 |
| Tonio_ | of course I couldn't understood without that information ;) | 12:48 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: write it on a wiki page somewhere so others will know | 12:49 |
| jpatrick | Riddell: where is the Lost & Found then? | 12:49 |
| Tonio_ | what is amazing is the output I had yesterday, I will show you toonight, just at the same moment I had a problem with the patch applyance | 12:49 |
| Riddell | maybe even the packaging guide actually | 12:49 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: in the k-menu | 12:49 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: yes, I will probably toonight, I'm not available this afternoon | 12:49 |
| jpatrick | I see "Categories=Qt;KDE;Utility;" | 12:50 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: it's because it's in the obsolete /usr/share/applnk/Applications/ no /usr/share/applications/kde | 12:51 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: explaining the XDG menu system is another area that might need added to the packaging guide | 12:52 |
| jpatrick | mv debian/tmp/usr/share/applnk/Applications/ debiam/tmp/usr/share/applications/kde | 12:52 |
| jpatrick | Riddell: that is on my TODO | 12:52 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: we should look at including libdirfilterplugin on the file manager view | 01:02 |
| Riddell | and change the google search plugin back to html only | 01:02 |
| Tonio_ | what does that libdir does ? | 01:03 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I already searched for google | 01:03 |
| Tonio_ | in fact I wanted to use google on kubutu-web profile and locate for the filemanagement one | 01:03 |
| Tonio_ | but that doesn't look possible........... | 01:04 |
| Riddell | it lets you filter the current directory for whatever you search | 01:05 |
| Riddell | it's in Configure Toolbars -> toolbar: Filter Toolbar | 01:06 |
| Riddell | Filter Field | 01:06 |
| raphink | Riddell: may I remind you about ept ? :) (just so you don't forget) | 01:07 |
| Riddell | certainly can, although I'll probably put changes upstream rather than uploading patches | 01:10 |
| Riddell | since upstream is not really upstream | 01:10 |
| sebas | Riddell: Mewhahahahaha, fucking morons :-) | 01:15 |
| raphink | hmm ok | 01:16 |
| raphink | Riddell: well I could change things directly in the package | 01:16 |
| raphink | I made patches because I was not sure what upstream was | 01:16 |
| raphink | this is a Debian package, with a strange ubuntu verseion | 01:16 |
| raphink | mornfall claims to not work in Ubuntu yet adept is an ubuntu specific stuff | 01:16 |
| raphink | so it's not clear | 01:16 |
| raphink | what is upstream, what is not | 01:16 |
| raphink | and where | 01:16 |
| raphink | which is why I made patches | 01:16 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: shoudn't we look at removing the google toolbar from the filemanagement profile ? | 01:18 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: yes but only if we decide to replace it with the dirfilter one | 01:18 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: That's exactly what I was thinking about ;) | 01:18 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay, let's go with this, I will send you a k-d-s toonight with this + file associations set correctly probably | 01:19 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: cool | 01:20 |
| Riddell | removing the google search bar need code though, need to poke tvo to do that | 01:20 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: we will make dapper the best kde desktop of all distros ! I promiss ! | 01:21 |
| Riddell | :) | 01:21 |
| raphink | Riddell: what do you want me to do ? fix in the package directly or keep the patches, or send the patches upstream or what? | 01:21 |
| Riddell | raphink: I'm putting the changes into KDE's SVN | 01:22 |
| raphink | Riddell: ok :) | 01:22 |
| Riddell | raphink: did you do ther MP3 .desktop file? | 01:23 |
| raphink | Riddell: shall we keep the patches in the meanwhile? since we can't resynchronize with SVN cause it's UVF | 01:23 |
| raphink | Riddell: not yet, and it's not done in adept package, it's in app-install-data | 01:23 |
| Riddell | raphink: we can sync with SVN since adept is not, as you say, upstream | 01:23 |
| raphink | Riddell: so I have to work on app-install-data package to do that | 01:23 |
| raphink | Riddell: hmmm ic | 01:23 |
| Riddell | raphink: app-install-data is automatically generated | 01:24 |
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| Riddell | also we don't want that MP3 one in gnome-app-install since they use gstreamer | 01:24 |
| Riddell | so adept is the best place for it | 01:24 |
| jpatrick | oh brilliant "mv: cannot move `debian/tmp/usr/share/applnk/Applications/kfocus.desktop' to `debiam/tmp/usr/share/applications/kde': No such file or directory" | 01:24 |
| raphink | Riddell: the package is automatically generated ?? | 01:24 |
| Riddell | raphink: I believe so | 01:24 |
| Riddell | raphink: same as language-packs are | 01:24 |
| raphink | hmm | 01:24 |
| raphink | so you think the adept package should add the desktop itself ? | 01:24 |
| Riddell | yes | 01:25 |
| raphink | :s | 01:25 |
| raphink | I'm not at ease with that | 01:25 |
| Riddell | why? | 01:25 |
| raphink | that means we begin to have different sources for these desktop | 01:25 |
| raphink | and it might be harder to maintain this stuff later | 01:25 |
| raphink | although well dpkg -S /usr/share/app-install will tell it comes from adept | 01:25 |
| Riddell | I don't see why | 01:25 |
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| Riddell | jpatrick: if it only makes 1 package it probably uses debian/kfocus no debian/tmp | 01:26 |
| Hobbsee | Riddell: did you get my message from earlier? | 01:26 |
| Riddell | Hobbsee: no | 01:27 |
| raphink | Riddell: I guess I just have to make a .desktop in Multimedia for that | 01:27 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: who his tvo ? need to ask him for a patch so that the search bar doesn't show on kubuntu filemanagement profile | 01:27 |
| jpatrick | everything else is going to tmp/ | 01:27 |
| Hobbsee | [Tue Feb 28 2006] [18:59:33] <Hobbsee> Riddell: any chance we can move the meeting to be on thurs 16th, 20.00 UTC? I cant make it on wednesdays 20 UTC as i'm driving at that point, then have no internet access. | 01:27 |
| Tonio_ | if my understandaing is correct | 01:27 |
| Riddell | raphink: and play with Makefile.am to get it installed to the right place | 01:27 |
| jpatrick | Hobbsee: I think Riddell's busy then | 01:28 |
| Hobbsee | if you dont want to move it, that's fine - i just wont be able to make the meeting | 01:28 |
| Riddell | Hobbsee: so long as it doesn't clash with any other meeting that should be fine | 01:28 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: I am? | 01:28 |
| jpatrick | you said you'll be busy for two weeks or something | 01:28 |
| Riddell | /in/ two weeks, i.e. busy all next week | 01:28 |
| jpatrick | d'oh | 01:28 |
| raphink | Riddell: ok | 01:30 |
| raphink | I'll do that later :) | 01:30 |
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| Riddell | Tonio_: tvo did the changes to the google search bar to make it always be on, even on file management mode | 01:30 |
| Hobbsee | hmm...9 second lag... did i miss anything when my connection dropped out? | 01:31 |
| jpatrick | nope | 01:31 |
| Hobbsee | ok, so the meeting didnt get changed? fair enough | 01:32 |
| Hobbsee | stupid classes starting at 9am | 01:32 |
| jpatrick | just checking the calendar | 01:32 |
| Hobbsee | ok | 01:32 |
| Hobbsee | tues night would be ok, or whatever - just not wed nights... | 01:33 |
| Hobbsee | and i didnt know my timetable until recently lol | 01:33 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay, so he might know how to go back ;) | 01:35 |
| Tonio_ | making a note on this | 01:35 |
| jpatrick | Hobbsee: 20th is aokay | 01:36 |
| jpatrick | no 16th | 01:36 |
| Hobbsee | yep, cool | 01:37 |
| jpatrick | who do I poke to change it? | 01:37 |
| Hobbsee | so that's my friday, yep | 01:37 |
| Hobbsee | not sure | 01:37 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: finally, I think we have to make a decision concerning tabs :) | 01:38 |
| Hobbsee | hehe | 01:38 |
| Hobbsee | sure? | 01:38 |
| Tonio_ | I don't mind on the top or bottom, but I really think konversation, kopete and konsole have to have to tabs at the same place | 01:38 |
| Tonio_ | for homegeity reasons | 01:39 |
| === nlindblad [n=nlindbla@user179.217-10-120.netatonce.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Tonio_ | Riddell: most people think on the bottom is best because it is were the focus is.... I think that's a good argument :) | 01:39 |
| Tonio_ | I'm ready to add that for toonight k-d-s too | 01:40 |
| === Hobbsee agrees with Tonio_ | ||
| Tonio_ | I don't mind the palce at all, but a desktop has to have a global logic | 01:40 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: also, we should had a dep on kds or moodin | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | lots of people don't have kubuntu-desktop installed because they removed OOo for example, and then the ksplash crashes......... | 01:43 |
| Tonio_ | will do that toonight also :) | 01:43 |
| Riddell | yes, ok | 01:44 |
| Riddell | (to both) | 01:45 |
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| === Hobbsee beds | ||
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay, working ont his right now | 02:01 |
| freeflying | Riddell: ping | 02:07 |
| Riddell | freeflying: hi | 02:07 |
| freeflying | Riddell: I have work on skim . give you patch or upload to REVU ? | 02:08 |
| Riddell | freeflying: revu is good | 02:09 |
| freeflying | Riddell: I've you mail u a patch of scim-chewing , got it ? | 02:09 |
| Riddell | freeflying: oh yes, I'll look at that soon | 02:11 |
| LeeJunFan | dammit launchpad's search function must really suck. Almost every bug I submit eventually get's marked as a duplicate but when I searched it turned up nothing. | 02:17 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: k-d-s is over with all modification we were discussing about.... still need to contact tvo and that might be okay | 02:37 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: what do you think of the dirfilter thing? | 02:37 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I like it | 02:37 |
| Riddell | yeah, me too | 02:38 |
| Tonio_ | it is nice, although I may not use it a lot | 02:38 |
| Tonio_ | but that a cool feature for users | 02:38 |
| Tonio_ | as long as googlebar is removed hehe | 02:38 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: tvo@ubuntu.com works? | 02:38 |
| Riddell | don't think #so | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: something I would like to see is kwallermanager....... | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | there is a problem with it | 02:39 |
| freeflying | X Error: BadMatch (invalid parameter attributes) 8 what dose this happen | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | secure config with password on default wallet is a pain to use | 02:39 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: I agree | 02:39 |
| Tonio_ | and wallet without a password is very comfortable, but not clearly secured........ | 02:39 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: I use the second option, as I'm not working in the Pentagon, but well........ there is certainly something to do with it | 02:40 |
| Riddell | the kwallet wizard is too scary, it should be simplified | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | even the way to config it is not clear, and might be very detailled in the kubuntu doc | 02:40 |
| Riddell | 1) don't use kwallet 2) no password 3) password | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | well, my idea is to use a default wallet preconfigured | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | without any password | 02:40 |
| Tonio_ | and chmoded to 600 | 02:41 |
| Riddell | actually 4) use user password would be best | 02:41 |
| Tonio_ | quite secured for a desktop and comfortable | 02:41 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: that requires coding :) | 02:41 |
| Riddell | yes, that's the trouble | 02:41 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: that means everytime you start kopete, you have to type your password | 02:41 |
| Riddell | but if we can preconfigure it without a password I think that's fine | 02:41 |
| Tonio_ | that's not very nice to use | 02:41 |
| freeflying | Riddell: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2077 | 02:42 |
| Tonio_ | so maybe, default wallet without password for comfort, and then documentation on the way to get that more secured in the kubuntu documentation | 02:42 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: are you okay ? | 02:42 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: good for me | 02:43 |
| Tonio_ | anyway the wallet is like gtk_qt_engine, needs copied in the profile, so let's hack startkde once again........ | 02:43 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay, let's go | 02:43 |
| Riddell | freeflying: what's changed? | 02:43 |
| robotgeek | i use kwallet, and i asked it to "allow always". IIRC, i only have to enter my password once? | 02:43 |
| Riddell | robotgeek: whenever konqueror starts | 02:43 |
| freeflying | Riddell: make the skim.pc have a right includedir | 02:43 |
| Riddell | freeflying: ok, will do in a bit | 02:44 |
| freeflying | Riddell: then we can build some scim's engine with skim support | 02:45 |
| Riddell | freeflying: they don't at the moment? | 02:46 |
| freeflying | Riddell: ya ,because of them wrong includedir in skim.pc , i've comunicated this with upstream author | 02:47 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: as soon as the wallet is opened by even a trusted application, you habe to type the password....... | 02:47 |
| freeflying | Riddell: he has not any clue on that , so I'd patch skim.pc.in | 02:47 |
| Tonio_ | that's the reason most people put a blank password on it | 02:47 |
| Tonio_ | best would be wallet with password and no password required for trusted applications, but this is not managed actually........... | 02:48 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: hmm, i think the only apps which use my wallet are kmail/kopete | 02:48 |
| Tonio_ | konq too, for web passwords | 02:49 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: and i alredy have typed my kwallet once, kopete doesn't ask for password when launched | 02:49 |
| Tonio_ | and kmail/kopete/konqueror are certainly the most used kde appliations so that needs to be configured in a comfortable way for the user | 02:49 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: nothing forbids to add a password in postconfig | 02:50 |
| Tonio_ | but I think no password by default is what feets the mass attempts | 02:50 |
| Tonio_ | I can be wrong on that, but that's the global feeling I have while reading board or ngs | 02:50 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: no, not that. i fail to see why kwallet is a problem (is it when a blank password is set?) | 02:50 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: no, the opposite | 02:51 |
| Tonio_ | having a password on the default wallet makes it a pain to use | 02:51 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: really, cause kopete launched without asking me a password | 02:51 |
| === robotgeek wonders what weird setting he has | ||
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: certainly a wallet without password:) | 02:52 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: no, i have a password | 02:52 |
| robotgeek | albeit, same as my user password | 02:52 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: once the wallet is opened, you are not prompted for a password anymore | 02:52 |
| Tonio_ | just while it gets opened first time in the application | 02:53 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: yup, so what is a pain? | 02:53 |
| Tonio_ | typing a password on each session | 02:53 |
| Tonio_ | that's not comfortable to me | 02:53 |
| robotgeek | hmm, i rarely logout, so i enter a kwallet password _once_ a login | 02:54 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: i used to use OS X before, so i am used to it :) | 02:54 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: we're talking of average users......... | 02:54 |
| Tonio_ | most people shutdown their computers 2 or 3 times a day | 02:55 |
| Tonio_ | you have to think about "what would like my mother" | 02:55 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: hmm, i never thought of that before :) | 02:55 |
| Tonio_ | I don't care about geeks, they can change the config if they want :) | 02:55 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: even if my nick says i am a geek, i am not a big one :) | 02:56 |
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| Tonio_ | robotgeek: the simple fact that your rarely disconnects makes you an extraterrestrial compared to the "normal" user :) | 02:57 |
| ubijtsa2 | shutdown several times a day? | 02:57 |
| ubijtsa2 | what on earth for? | 02:57 |
| Tonio_ | ubijtsa2: they go on the net, then leave, then come back 2 hours later etc........ | 02:58 |
| ubijtsa2 | if you want to save power, you hibernate or suspend to RAM... | 02:58 |
| Tonio_ | I don't say that's good | 02:58 |
| Tonio_ | I'm saying this is the way people are using their computer | 02:58 |
| freeflying | Riddell: have u reviewed skim | 02:58 |
| ubijtsa2 | Tonio_: for the hardware, it is extraordinarly bad to repeatedly start and shutdown | 02:58 |
| Tonio_ | ubijtsa2: PLEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASE, we're talking of your mother, mine, or so, do you think she even has an idea of what is hybernate or suspend to ram ???????????? | 02:59 |
| ubijtsa2 | Tonio_: I hear you about the users though.. :) | 02:59 |
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| Tonio_ | ubijtsa2: I'm not stupid, I know that, but I know most people don't care | 02:59 |
| ubijtsa2 | Tonio_: uhm, once I explained to my parents about suspend, they were quite happy to use it | 02:59 |
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| Tonio_ | ubijtsa2: most people don't have a son having good knowledge to explain that | 03:00 |
| ubijtsa2 | still bad for the hardware, but starts faster | 03:00 |
| Tonio_ | imagin that you are about the 1% users that know what is a computer and how it works | 03:00 |
| === jpatrick is stupid sometimes | ||
| Tonio_ | there is not more than 1% | 03:00 |
| ubijtsa2 | Tonio_: that may be the case, so it's our job to educate people | 03:00 |
| Tonio_ | ubijtsa2: that's what linux users are saying for 10 years, and what is the result ???? | 03:01 |
| Tonio_ | 1% of linux users in the world, mostly geeks or neards | 03:01 |
| Tonio_ | nerds | 03:01 |
| Tonio_ | My thinking actually is that people don't want to learn, that's sad, but that's it | 03:01 |
| Tonio_ | so we have to do with it | 03:01 |
| ubijtsa2 | Tonio_: well, windoze now has hibernate and suspend2ram and people use it.. | 03:01 |
| Tonio_ | ubijtsa2: very few people are using it, I can tell you | 03:02 |
| ubijtsa2 | hmm.. perhaps the people I know are not representative | 03:02 |
| Tonio_ | I discovered in my compagny NOT ANY user was using this on their laptop........ 100 personns.... | 03:02 |
| Tonio_ | my friends are not representative too | 03:03 |
| Tonio_ | but my "clients" at work are........ and that's terrific | 03:03 |
| ubijtsa2 | or I just chose my friends well ;) | 03:03 |
| Tonio_ | I lost the idea of educated people long time ago | 03:03 |
| Tonio_ | if that was the solution, linux would be used by at least 30% of people | 03:03 |
| Tonio_ | that's not the case | 03:03 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: +1 | 03:04 |
| Tonio_ | and will probably never be, unless we change our thinking that "everyone can learn this" | 03:04 |
| ubijtsa2 | yeah... perhaps the shutdown option should be better hidden.. | 03:04 |
| Tonio_ | they "can", but they "don't want'" | 03:04 |
| ubijtsa2 | give users the option of suspend or restart | 03:04 |
| Tonio_ | they want things to work alone, without the need to understand | 03:04 |
| robotgeek | ubijtsa2: linux is user-friendly, it's very selective about who it makes friends with :) | 03:04 |
| ubijtsa2 | don't give them the option of shutdown without plenty of scary warnings | 03:05 |
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| ubijtsa2 | robotgeek: it makes friends with people that are worth having as friends :) | 03:05 |
| === ubijtsa2 gets upset when he has to shut his box down for any reason.. | ||
| jpatrick | you don't have to shut down | 03:07 |
| ubijtsa2 | jpatrick: check the scroll-back :) that's my argument as well | 03:08 |
| jpatrick | ;) | 03:08 |
| ubijtsa2 | jpatrick: I suggest that 'shutdown' gets hidden. only give 'suspend' or 'restart' to users | 03:08 |
| jpatrick | I've never used suspend | 03:09 |
| ubijtsa2 | maybe allow hibernate for when you need to change hardware | 03:09 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: ping ? | 03:21 |
| === hunger [n=tobias@p54A63C8F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Riddell | Tonio_: hmm? | 03:21 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: during first boot on profile, is .kde create before of after startkde is launched ? | 03:22 |
| Tonio_ | this is to know if I need to mkdir -p or not :) | 03:22 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: probably after | 03:22 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: okay.... in the doubt, I will maybe make the mkdir -p "in case of" | 03:23 |
| Tonio_ | that might not create any problem anyway | 03:23 |
| jpatrick | anyone know a Fathi Boudra ? | 03:24 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: is ArmeBosse | 03:25 |
| jpatrick | he stole my ksplash-engine-moodin | 03:25 |
| Riddell | on #ubuntu-motu | 03:25 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: how so? | 03:25 |
| jpatrick | Riddell: http://mentors.debian.net/ | 03:25 |
| jpatrick | 10th on list | 03:25 |
| Riddell | that's a good thing then, getting it into debian | 03:25 |
| jpatrick | which is what _I_ had in mind just now | 03:26 |
| jpatrick | I hope my changelogs there | 03:27 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: just sending you a new patch for startkde and k-d-s with the modifications we discussed | 03:44 |
| Tonio_ | needs testing of course, but according to my tests, it works | 03:44 |
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| Tonio_ | need to find out the email address of that tvo ;) | 03:56 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: tobivollebregt@gmail.com--katapult/katapult--tvo--0.3--base-0 <- is it this guy ? | 03:59 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: yes | 03:59 |
| Tonio_ | okay | 03:59 |
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| === Topic for #kubuntu-devel: Flight 4 out || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KubuntuDapperGoals || http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kubuntu || Join: http://www.last.fm/group/Kubuntu+Developers/ || Kubuntu meeting on #ubuntu-meeting on Wed, 15th March - 20:00 UTC -- https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kubuntu/Meetings -- be there! | ||
| === Topic (#kubuntu-devel): set by jpatrick at Wed Feb 22 22:29:15 2006 | ||
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| === OculusAquilae [n=bastian@p548D32F6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Tonio_ | Riddell: something that makes me crazzy sometimes with a default kubutu : | 05:28 |
| Tonio_ | why on earth haven't we kcalc ???????? ^_^ | 05:29 |
| === hunger agrees with Tonio_! | ||
| Riddell | why should we? | 05:29 |
| Tonio_ | we have computers we can make billions of operations, and we cannot make 456*7.2 | 05:29 |
| Riddell | speedcrunch | 05:29 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: a calc is typically the kind of tools you don't use very often, but that is always required one day :) | 05:30 |
| Tonio_ | spedcrunch can make operations ? | 05:30 |
| hunger | Riddell: Because speedcrunch can't do base conversions. | 05:30 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: to be honnest, when I launched speedcrunch the first time, I asked myself "is THAT supposed to be able to calculate ?" :) | 05:31 |
| Tonio_ | why not simply replacing speedcrunch by kcalc ? | 05:32 |
| Tonio_ | kcalc is simple, eye candy, can do the same and isn't very heavy :) | 05:32 |
| Riddell | kcalc is unusable compared to speedcrunch | 05:32 |
| Tonio_ | hum | 05:32 |
| jpatrick | we're thinking of the average user | 05:32 |
| Riddell | however the new version of speedcrunch does have a keypad for those who insist on making it unusable | 05:32 |
| sebas | Riddell: for bla in list: ? | 05:33 |
| hunger | Riddell: Maybe... but at least kcalc does have base conversion:-) | 05:33 |
| Riddell | the trouble is that that new version uses qt4 and we won't have qt 4 in dapper main | 05:33 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I'm just thinking of my grandma ;) | 05:33 |
| sebas | Dunno, I don't use qptrlists, since python's native lists are pointers anyway. | 05:33 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I must say I don't see a big difference | 05:34 |
| Tonio_ | you can use the numpad with both | 05:34 |
| Tonio_ | well, that was just a suggestion anyway :) | 05:35 |
| Tonio_ | another one Riddell, now that keep is in main, couldn't we think about replacing konserve by keep ? | 05:35 |
| Tonio_ | keep is more advanced, and developped especially for kubuntu ;) | 05:35 |
| jpatrick | by our friend JRe | 05:36 |
| Riddell | sebas: magically that worked this time, I'm sure it didn't last time :) | 05:37 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: yes, konserve will be demoted | 05:37 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: cool ;) | 05:37 |
| jpatrick | Riddell: do you think we might be able to use Kerry? | 05:44 |
| Tonio_ | Mez: ping ? | 05:50 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: go ahead and package it | 05:51 |
| jpatrick | Riddell: tried but it fails on build 'configure' script | 05:51 |
| jpatrick | building* | 05:52 |
| jpatrick | I did 'autoconf' | 05:53 |
| Riddell | what's the error? | 05:53 |
| jpatrick | http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/576885 | 05:54 |
| jpatrick | or is it made another way? | 05:55 |
| Riddell | no idea at all | 05:57 |
| jpatrick | I'll take a configure script from another kapp | 05:58 |
| jpatrick | oh yes, it works | 06:02 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: has a decision been taken between beagle and kat ? | 06:06 |
| jpatrick | Tonio_: which is where Kerry comes in | 06:06 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: this is why I asked | 06:07 |
| Tonio_ | ;) | 06:07 |
| Tonio_ | a few weeks ago, discussions where more over kat than beagle | 06:07 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: neither | 06:07 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hehe, that clear :) | 06:07 |
| Tonio_ | locater is your friend :) | 06:07 |
| Tonio_ | enough to me at least | 06:08 |
| jpatrick | I'm going to poke upstream about bad tarballs | 06:08 |
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| jpatrick | this thing's got more holes than Swiss cheese | 06:08 |
| Riddell | hello faked | 06:08 |
| faked | hi all! | 06:09 |
| faked | what is the (k)ubuntu-way to build kernel-modules (fglrx, nvidia...)? module-assistant does not work correctly to me | 06:12 |
| faked | in dapper | 06:12 |
| jpatrick | must be something horribly wrong http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/576904 | 06:16 |
| Riddell | faked: that's a user question, #kubuntu or #ubuntu (I also know nothing about building properietry linux modules) | 06:18 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: I really like that metabar theme for kubuntu | 06:19 |
| Tonio_ | http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=34127 | 06:19 |
| Tonio_ | much better than the actual one | 06:19 |
| Tonio_ | may I include it ? | 06:20 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick, faked any opinion ? | 06:20 |
| faked | Tonio_: looks good | 06:21 |
| jpatrick | Tonio_: that's the one I use | 06:21 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: there is no comparison possible with the actual one.... | 06:21 |
| Tonio_ | I may work a bit on themes etc toonight | 06:22 |
| Tonio_ | ;) | 06:22 |
| jpatrick | :) | 06:22 |
| === incinerator [n=incinera@82-41-24-164.cable.ubr04.edin.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| JRe | Tonio_: this theme is great :) | 06:24 |
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| Tonio_ | JRe: that's my feeling too, so unless Riddell doesn't appreciate, I might replace the actual one | 06:25 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: sure | 06:26 |
| Riddell | incinerator: going to edlug on thursday? | 06:26 |
| incinerator | Ridell: yes | 06:28 |
| incinerator | Riddell: yes | 06:29 |
| jpatrick | now this is more like it: http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/576921 | 06:29 |
| Riddell | incinerator: have I seen you there before? | 06:30 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: what about porting this theme to amarok ? | 06:31 |
| Tonio_ | the actual kubuntu amarok theme is not very, very nice | 06:31 |
| Tonio_ | I don't understand why people who are contributing on kde-look do not ask us for integration........ | 06:39 |
| Tonio_ | we need those contributions ;) | 06:39 |
| jpatrick | I'm no artist | 06:40 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: that wasn't an asking for contribution, juste your opinion ;) | 06:41 |
| Tonio_ | I will do it | 06:41 |
| jpatrick | how about: http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=33020 | 06:43 |
| apokryphos | eek, no; too OS X ee | 06:44 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: nice, but way too different from the reste of the distro | 06:44 |
| Tonio_ | I personally like coherence on the desktop | 06:45 |
| Tonio_ | then I'm changing everything ^^ | 06:45 |
| === apokryphos likes http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=30658 | ||
| Tonio_ | apokryphos: same problem to me ;) | 06:46 |
| === jjesse is now known as jjesse_lunch | ||
| Tonio_ | what I appreciate in the metabar style is that it takes the basis of the wallpaper and kdm theme | 06:46 |
| Tonio_ | the amarok on the same way, and we will have something very "logic" in its theme | 06:46 |
| apokryphos | sounds good | 06:47 |
| jjesse_lunch | umm the ad that is on the top of that page is blocked by company filter as "adult material" | 06:47 |
| jpatrick | lol | 06:47 |
| apokryphos | hah | 06:48 |
| Tonio_ | jjesse_lunch: on kde-apps ? | 06:48 |
| Tonio_ | s/apps/look | 06:49 |
| jjesse_lunch | Tonio_: on this link:http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=30658 | 06:56 |
| Tonio_ | jjesse_lunch: astonishing ;) | 06:57 |
| jjesse_lunch | what is the add? | 06:57 |
| Tonio_ | jjesse_lunch: dunno, I use adblock + konq + pierceve filters :) | 06:58 |
| Tonio_ | never see any add while surfing | 06:58 |
| jjesse_lunch | grin, just installed the filter so we are trying it out | 06:58 |
| Tonio_ | great news, we will (finally) get an official tarball to package openwengo ;) | 06:59 |
| Tonio_ | nice | 06:59 |
| jpatrick | bit late | 06:59 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: indeed, but well, it will possible to package it for dapper+1 and provide a backport | 06:59 |
| Tonio_ | openwengo is really a great, great application for those who, like me, can't stand skype | 07:00 |
| jpatrick | and the same with Kerry | 07:00 |
| jpatrick | assuming it builds | 07:00 |
| === Tonio_ HATES skype | ||
| Tonio_ | I prefer windows........ can you imagin........ | 07:01 |
| jpatrick | you do? | 07:01 |
| Tonio_ | windows to skype ? definitly | 07:02 |
| Tonio_ | skype is actually killing the standard SIP in the professionnal voip world, like autocoms etc...... | 07:02 |
| Tonio_ | replacing it by a crappy proprietary protocol | 07:02 |
| Tonio_ | the way it works is a SHAME | 07:02 |
| Tonio_ | they do mesh-networking | 07:02 |
| Tonio_ | which is really an horrible way to proceed | 07:03 |
| Tonio_ | to unsure good quality, skype is generally launched using strong priority over all other process (al list on windows) | 07:03 |
| Tonio_ | this application is a shame, really...... | 07:03 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: and I assume it contains crappy backdoors in some way.... | 07:04 |
| jpatrick | possibly | 07:04 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: never forget that the guys who are doing have are the responsible for kazaa....... | 07:04 |
| jpatrick | Kazaa sucks | 07:04 |
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| Tonio_ | kazaa and skype is the same devel team, and the same network technology.......; | 07:05 |
| Tonio_ | sucks | 07:05 |
| jpatrick | yep | 07:06 |
| kmon | hi | 07:06 |
| jpatrick | hola kmon | 07:06 |
| Tonio_ | but because people really seems to like what smells, skype is an incredible success while openwengo had problems to get known........ | 07:06 |
| kmon | hola jpatrick | 07:06 |
| Tonio_ | hi kmon | 07:07 |
| kmon | hi Tonio_ | 07:07 |
| kmon | anyone here has tried playing with turbogears in dapper? | 07:07 |
| kmon | I'm having a strange problem and I don't know if it's a bug in turbogears or kubuntu dapper.... | 07:08 |
| Tonio_ | what is that turbogears ? | 07:08 |
| kmon | it's a rapid web development plataform for python | 07:09 |
| kmon | ala rails | 07:09 |
| jpatrick | isn't that Ruby? | 07:09 |
| kmon | nope | 07:09 |
| === jpatrick disliked Ruby abit | ||
| kmon | turbogears is python | 07:09 |
| === jpatrick out(supper) | ||
| kmon | how can I test if a file is utf8? | 07:12 |
| Tonio_ | ...........; we need to find a way to hide those default konq profiles | 07:15 |
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| nlindblad | evening | 07:36 |
| jpatrick | good evening nlindblad | 07:36 |
| nlindblad | jpatrick: how's it going? | 07:37 |
| jpatrick | fine | 07:37 |
| nlindblad | jpatrick: gone to school this week? | 07:37 |
| jpatrick | no | 07:37 |
| jpatrick | maybe in two days time | 07:37 |
| nlindblad | how long since you did? | 07:37 |
| jpatrick | one month | 07:38 |
| nlindblad | you've missed alot then | 07:39 |
| jpatrick | not entirely | 07:39 |
| jpatrick | I asked my friends what work they had and did it | 07:39 |
| nlindblad | good | 07:45 |
| === jjesse_lunch is now known as jjesse | ||
| jpatrick | how did your patch come along? | 07:46 |
| kmon | I have a problem with kate. I'm editing a xml file and copying and pasting code appears to messed up the encoding of the file. How can I see if that's true? | 07:47 |
| nlindblad | well, the community reviewed it and I got a few ideas from some of the commentaries | 07:47 |
| jpatrick | cool | 07:49 |
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| Tonio_ | re | 08:39 |
| Tm_T | Tonio_: kmenu can be simple: http://www.tm-travolta.net/pics/temp/kmenu-1.png | 08:46 |
| Tm_T | I like | 08:46 |
| Riddell | Tm_T: multiple layers are not simple | 08:47 |
| Tm_T | Riddell: true | 08:47 |
| Tm_T | but I find that simpler than "default" | 08:47 |
| Tonio_ | hum, not bad indeed, but I think I prefer the actual one | 08:48 |
| Tm_T | :) | 08:48 |
| Lure | I also think that more than two levels is too much | 08:48 |
| Tm_T | yup, that is for people who don't really use kmenu | 08:48 |
| Tm_T | like me | 08:48 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: did you upload latest k-d-s ? if not please don't, I have new modifications to apply ;) | 08:48 |
| jpatrick | ha | 08:49 |
| Tm_T | in that rare occasion that I do use, I don't need everything there (but debian menu is good) | 08:49 |
| Tonio_ | I personally use quite exclusively katapult | 08:49 |
| Tm_T | I use normal run dialog + terminals | 08:49 |
| jpatrick | me too | 08:49 |
| Tm_T | katapult is too... I feel it's limited | 08:50 |
| Tonio_ | the only problem with katapult is the delay to have new applications in | 08:50 |
| Tonio_ | apart from that, it is as simple as a launcher can be, and powerfull | 08:50 |
| Lure | Tonio_, jpatrick: I still do not understand how to fix kubunto moodin image to match my LCD | 08:50 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: kdm theme or ksplash image ? | 08:50 |
| jpatrick | anyone know where i can find katapult's svn/bzr? | 08:50 |
| Lure | is this supposed to be done by k-d-s | 08:50 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: no, not looked at it yet | 08:51 |
| Lure | ksplash | 08:51 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: I think it's in KDE now, ask Mez | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: good :) keep the kdebase patch, but forget the k-d-s package, I will build a new one toonight | 08:51 |
| jpatrick | ah, yes I remember now | 08:51 |
| jpatrick | playground | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: wxga screen ? | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | 16/9 ? | 08:51 |
| Lure | 1920x1200 | 08:51 |
| jpatrick | bug | 08:51 |
| jpatrick | big* | 08:51 |
| Lure | I get 1280x1024 | 08:51 |
| Mez | jpatrick, http://baz.thekatapult.org.uk/dev/ | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | what is the ratio ? | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | ah.............; | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | indeed | 08:51 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: isn't it stretched ? | 08:52 |
| Lure | Yep - I tried to change Theme.rc, but does not seem to have effect | 08:52 |
| Tonio_ | on my laptop for example, I have 1280*800, and the image is stretched to fit the screen correctly | 08:52 |
| jpatrick | Mez: cheers | 08:52 |
| Lure | OK, I thought that Background-1920x1200.jpg should be used | 08:53 |
| Tonio_ | doesn't that work for you ? | 08:53 |
| Lure | (it is there) | 08:53 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: I'm gonna look at the package, but what is exactly your problem ? | 08:53 |
| Tonio_ | cause you didn't described it, and didn't answer my questions........ | 08:54 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: I wanna help and correct the issue but I need informations | 08:54 |
| Lure | I thought that moodin would use non-streched image if available and not strech it | 08:54 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: okay | 08:55 |
| Lure | See /usr/share/apps/ksplash/Themes/kubuntu | 08:55 |
| Tonio_ | hum........; supposedly, this is how it should work in my dreams | 08:55 |
| Lure | there is Background-*.jpg for differe resolution | 08:55 |
| Tonio_ | so in fact it stretches the 1280 1024 image and ignores the 1900*1200 one correct ? | 08:55 |
| Lure | I thought that Theme.rc influences that, but it does not help here | 08:56 |
| Lure | Yes. | 08:56 |
| jpatrick | why can't we just use an svg background | 08:56 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: are you using a tool like 855resolution to set your resolution ? | 08:56 |
| Lure | I tried to manually change Background and BaseResolution settings, but it did not help | 08:56 |
| Riddell | moodin does weird things to the background sizes | 08:56 |
| Tonio_ | I in fact have the same problem than you but I assumed it was due to this...... | 08:56 |
| Lure | jpatrick: that would be nice, but not sure if moodin is able to display svg | 08:57 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: yes, but there are several backgrounds, I need to investigate why it doesn't use the one depending the resolution | 08:57 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: it does, but it shrinks it | 08:57 |
| Riddell | or something | 08:57 |
| Lure | Tonio_: what is 855resolution? | 08:57 |
| Riddell | that's why I made the 1024 one 1200 wide | 08:57 |
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| Tonio_ | Riddell: well there is a 1280*800 and it isn't used | 08:58 |
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| Tonio_ | instead I have the 1024*768 stretched | 08:58 |
| Tonio_ | hum... need to investigate right now | 08:58 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: I'm quite certain it uses Background.jpg by default for everyone | 08:59 |
| Riddell | I have a 1024 monitor and it displays the 1024 image but it needs to be 1200 wide to display correctly | 09:00 |
| Riddell | also it caches in ~/.kde/share/apps/ksplash/cache/ | 09:00 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: hu ? wow strange | 09:00 |
| Riddell | which confused me for a while | 09:00 |
| Lure | Tonio_: yes, that is specified in Theme.rc, but it may be also hardcoded somewhere | 09:00 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: possibly yes, I'm investigating ;) | 09:00 |
| jpatrick | TB about to start | 09:01 |
| Lure | I will try tpo remove cache and see if it is recreated | 09:01 |
| Tonio_ | moodin bug maybe ? | 09:02 |
| jpatrick | file it - and I'll poke upstream | 09:02 |
| Riddell | yes, but I couldn't see anything wrong in the code | 09:03 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: need to be sure first ;) | 09:03 |
| jpatrick | Tonio_: that's my job :) | 09:03 |
| Tonio_ | 2.Rename your resolution specific background(i.e Background-1600x1200.jpg) to Background.jpg | 09:04 |
| Tonio_ | argh............. | 09:04 |
| Tonio_ | it has to be done manually | 09:04 |
| Lure | interesting - when a removed cache and change Theme.rc to 1920x1200 I got strange result | 09:04 |
| Tonio_ | so by default, the only one used will be Background.jpg, that's it | 09:04 |
| Tonio_ | damn........ | 09:04 |
| Lure | image is still stretched, but I would say to 4000x2000 or so.... | 09:04 |
| Lure | Dialog is far left (almost out of screen) | 09:05 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: anyway, the problem is that it isn't able to dynamically select the good image according to what I see | 09:05 |
| jpatrick | Mez: it isn't getting any files... | 09:05 |
| Lure | Yes, my question was if we could do fix this in k-d-s or similar | 09:06 |
| Lure | similar as we fix font/DPI sizes | 09:06 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: did you read ReadMe.txt ? | 09:06 |
| Lure | (if at all possible, of course ;-)) | 09:06 |
| Tonio_ | there are instructions for >1280 users | 09:06 |
| Lure | Yes, tried that, no effect (Add just seem to unpackage tar to dir) | 09:07 |
| jpatrick | "an integer is required" | 09:07 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: well, via a postinst script maybe........ | 09:07 |
| jpatrick | I could do that | 09:07 |
| Tonio_ | but that will create another issue during the initial installation, because X isn't started then...... | 09:07 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: it should be possible to create a postinst script that will read xorg config and set the goof parameters no ? | 09:09 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: err, huh? | 09:09 |
| Tonio_ | as long as xorg is installed before k-d-s | 09:09 |
| Tonio_ | the problem is that the splash requires manual config actually | 09:09 |
| Tonio_ | so how to make it automatic ? that's the question :) | 09:10 |
| Riddell | goof parameters? | 09:10 |
| Tonio_ | goof ? means ? | 09:10 |
| jpatrick | Tonio_: sounds tricky | 09:10 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: that's what I'm asking you | 09:10 |
| Tonio_ | good parameters, sorry | 09:10 |
| jpatrick | SVG background if possible | 09:11 |
| Riddell | jpatrick: it's not (without coding it) | 09:11 |
| === jpatrick opens src | ||
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: svg background will cause the same problem in fact | 09:12 |
| Tonio_ | the only solution I see is a postconfig | 09:12 |
| Lure | interesting is that moodin is aware of resultion as cache dir is named 1920x1200 | 09:14 |
| Lure | ;-) | 09:14 |
| LaserJock | Riddell: ping? ubuntu-meeting | 09:16 |
| Riddell | quite forgot | 09:17 |
| Tonio_ | same for me ;) | 09:17 |
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| Lure | Background.jpg in cache is actualy none of the ones on source dir | 09:17 |
| Lure | it is 2850x1406 | 09:18 |
| Lure | And this some kind of matches what I get | 09:18 |
| Tonio_ | hum.......... | 09:18 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: once again, did you read the readme ???????? | 09:18 |
| Tonio_ | ***Users of 1900x1200, 1600x1200 & 1440x900. | 09:18 |
| Tonio_ | 3.In Theme.rc change 'BaseResolution =' to your monitors resolution. (This will prevent auto-scaling of background and fonts) | 09:19 |
| Lure | Yes - I have renamed Background.jpg and change BaseResolution | 09:19 |
| Tonio_ | did you do this ? | 09:19 |
| Tonio_ | ok.......... | 09:19 |
| Tonio_ | sounds bad | 09:19 |
| Lure | I just do not do repackage and Add again, as this only unpackage | 09:19 |
| === toma_ is now known as toma | ||
| Lure | I just change in-place | 09:20 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: so the background is supposedly the good onen base resolution is set | 09:20 |
| Lure | It seems to have some effect (if I remove cache first), but not the expected one... :-( | 09:20 |
| Tonio_ | can you remove the cache entries and have a look at it ? | 09:20 |
| Lure | I do rm -rf for whole Modin/kubuntu cache each try | 09:21 |
| Lure | I will retry repackage + re-add just to be sure (I did that 2 days ago with no effect) | 09:22 |
| === toma is now known as toma_ | ||
| Tonio_ | lure okay | 09:23 |
| Riddell | well done LaserJock | 09:26 |
| LaserJock | thanks, I was really nervous | 09:27 |
| Tonio_ | LaserJock: ;) | 09:29 |
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| Lure | Tonio_: no change - difference is that Added theme is installed in /.kde/share/apps/ksplash/Themes | 09:34 |
| Lure | and not on global /usr/share/apps/ksplash/Themes | 09:35 |
| Tonio_ | that's normal :) | 09:35 |
| Tonio_ | but you still experience the same bug ? | 09:35 |
| Lure | yes | 09:36 |
| Tonio_ | http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=29426 | 09:36 |
| Lure | maybe it is an issue of overwrite (re-add), however | 09:36 |
| Tonio_ | look at the comments........ you are not the only one unfortunatelly | 09:36 |
| jpatrick | upstream bug | 09:38 |
| Tonio_ | well I can see a solution : stop using moodin and provide a standard but adapted from this theme splash | 09:38 |
| Lure | true... | 09:38 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: more than that | 09:38 |
| Tonio_ | all moodin themes refer to a specific resolution | 09:38 |
| Tonio_ | the engine works like that | 09:38 |
| Tonio_ | so it cannot be used by default because we don't have an idea of the screen resol | 09:39 |
| Riddell | _Sime: is editing DPI in the next displayconfig? | 09:39 |
| jpatrick | Tonio_: we spent ages getting it in - can't pull out now | 09:39 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I looked about everywhere, I think we will not find any solution, because moodin themes generally require configuration reguarding to the resolution | 09:40 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: I understand, but it is not adapted to a default usage, what could we do ? | 09:40 |
| Tonio_ | there is no emergency, we can search a bit | 09:40 |
| Lure | I think it is not end of world if we leave it as is until upstream fix | 09:41 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: look on kde-look, you'll see all moodin themes have those settings : | 09:41 |
| Lure | It is just not standard kubuntu polish ;- | 09:41 |
| jpatrick | I know | 09:41 |
| Lure | ;= | 09:41 |
| Tonio_ | baseresolution | 09:41 |
| Tonio_ | means that you have to set parameters depending your resolution | 09:42 |
| Tonio_ | okay, there is a bug on big resolutions, and that could be resolved by patching moodin | 09:42 |
| Tonio_ | but what about stretched images ? | 09:42 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: how evil | 09:43 |
| Tonio_ | I don't see an easy way to autoconfig this, except a very dirty kind of hack in startkde that would copy the theme in your profile and autoset resolutions | 09:43 |
| Riddell | it can't be hard to find the screen width in the code though | 09:44 |
| Riddell | I wonder why it reads it from the file | 09:44 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I will investigate, but I'm quite certain we will have to come back to the old engine and adapt the theme (which can we done quite easilly) | 09:44 |
| Lure | Tonio_: I am also concerned that it is not just image problem | 09:44 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: don't know | 09:44 |
| jpatrick | without the pretty icons and effect | 09:44 |
| Lure | there are many other numbers (icon positions) that would potentially also need to change | 09:45 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I agree that moodin should be able to detect the resol, and select the good image | 09:45 |
| Lure | see Theme.rc | 09:45 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: true | 09:45 |
| Tonio_ | there are lots of comments on that point too | 09:45 |
| Tonio_ | in fact in it's actual state, moodin requires a full manuall config for themes........ | 09:45 |
| Tonio_ | so unless there is in a few days a new version with lots of improvements on that point, we may not be able to use it....... unless we find a dev to patch all moodin source ;) | 09:46 |
| Lure | I would personally prefer simplier splash if it always looks good - I like the polish | 09:46 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: well the standard engine doesn't require background | 09:46 |
| Tonio_ | so there are no pbs on that point | 09:47 |
| Tonio_ | we loose effects, but that will work on ANY machine | 09:47 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: I understand how it can affect you, but can we reasonnably release kubuntu with such a problem ? | 09:47 |
| Lure | BTW - which one is used in Breezy? | 09:48 |
| Tonio_ | best would maybe be to keep moodin in main, poke upstream for improvements, and think about dapper+1 :) | 09:48 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: the engine ? | 09:48 |
| jpatrick | Riddell: cache.cpp, scaler.cpp, thememoodin.cpp... | 09:49 |
| Lure | engine and name - I do not recall how it looks like (I am more on Dapper these days -;-) | 09:49 |
| Tonio_ | lure wait | 09:49 |
| jpatrick | Lure: there was no engine | 09:49 |
| Tonio_ | http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=29410 | 09:50 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: yes there is one, but the default | 09:50 |
| Lure | jpatrick: but it was still set in Desktop->Splash Screen? | 09:50 |
| Tonio_ | no effects, but absolutly no resolution dependancy, that's it's advantage........ | 09:50 |
| Lure | Tonio_: that was it! | 09:50 |
| Tonio_ | Engine = Default | 09:51 |
| Tonio_ | that's it........ | 09:51 |
| Tonio_ | limited, but this engine doesn't depend on coords and resol | 09:51 |
| Lure | "Default" splash is KDE 3.5 default on my system | 09:52 |
| Tonio_ | well, I will not touch anything for the moment and will investigate | 09:52 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: you too ? | 09:52 |
| jpatrick | what? | 09:53 |
| Tonio_ | we take a few days to investigate and then decide | 09:53 |
| Lure | Do you want I open a bug? | 09:53 |
| Tonio_ | but more than the bug, it is the dependance to the resolution parameters that are making me unsure at the moment....... | 09:54 |
| jpatrick | yes, something I poke upstrean at | 09:54 |
| Tonio_ | changing this is not a very easy trick | 09:54 |
| Tonio_ | because it means that you release has many background as there are resolutions......... | 09:54 |
| Tonio_ | the default engine uses the kde wallpaper directly, which makie a hudge difference | 09:54 |
| Lure | Tonio_: I would agree - probably lot's of effort for small improvement | 09:54 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: well, the adapted theme wouldn't be that different, but effects missing | 09:55 |
| Tonio_ | we have to reasonnable I think....... | 09:55 |
| Tonio_ | but I'll wait a bit in case we find a "magic solution" | 09:55 |
| Tonio_ | at the moment I have others themes to manage :) | 09:56 |
| Tonio_ | buttons can potentially be placed where they shouldn't too, it is a very common problem apparently | 09:56 |
| Tonio_ | everything is depending the resolution, even little images cause they have coords...... | 09:57 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: may you ask to upstream is there is a way to avoid the resolution ? | 09:58 |
| jpatrick | sure | 09:58 |
| Tonio_ | ideal would be no background in fact | 09:58 |
| Tonio_ | can moodin work without background | 09:58 |
| jpatrick | No | 09:58 |
| Tonio_ | or with background and another big image on it, to prevent from stretching | 09:59 |
| jpatrick | it's in the code | 09:59 |
| Tonio_ | stretching the background isn't a problem | 09:59 |
| Tonio_ | stretching the white square on the middle of the screen is one | 09:59 |
| Tonio_ | can that be another image ? | 09:59 |
| robotgeek | some gradient maybe? | 09:59 |
| jpatrick | if (bgImage.isEmpty()) | 10:00 |
| jpatrick | { | 10:00 |
| jpatrick | KMessageBox::error(this, i18n("No background. Try to put a Background.jpg in theme folder")); | 10:00 |
| jpatrick | } | 10:00 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: in fact background can be stretched, taht not a big issue | 10:01 |
| Tonio_ | the problem is that all themes I have seen have only background + little images | 10:01 |
| Tonio_ | can the white square be another image ? | 10:01 |
| Tonio_ | detached from the background ? | 10:01 |
| jpatrick | white_square == Background.jgp ? | 10:02 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: no | 10:02 |
| Tonio_ | ho you mean actually ? | 10:02 |
| Tonio_ | yes, actually, all the graphic part is background.jpg | 10:02 |
| Tonio_ | only little images (printer etc.....) are detached | 10:03 |
| Tonio_ | the problem is that stretching the background means stretching the square | 10:03 |
| Tonio_ | and getting potential problem with printer not at the good place etc........ | 10:03 |
| Tonio_ | all moodin themes I have seen only have a background and that's all....... | 10:04 |
| jpatrick | if (bgImage.isEmpty()) { return 0; } | 10:05 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: okay, but how do you display the white square ? | 10:08 |
| Tonio_ | I don't see any parameter for another image | 10:08 |
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| Tonio_ | and how do we manage the little image position without coords | 10:09 |
| Tonio_ | hum......... sounds complicated to manage, really | 10:09 |
| Lure | Tonio_: whitesquare is part of Background.jpg. | 10:09 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: yes, I know, that's the problem | 10:09 |
| Tonio_ | stretching the bg=stretching the square | 10:10 |
| Tonio_ | unless we provide 50 backgrounds and a hack to autoselect the good one depending the resolution | 10:10 |
| Lure | more than I think, it looks like streching may be a workaround for icon placement | 10:10 |
| Tonio_ | dirty method, the square should be independant from the background | 10:10 |
| Lure | Icons are for sure on right location on my streched background image | 10:11 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: yes, logic, cause the placement is depending coords | 10:11 |
| Tonio_ | but there are several problems if you look on the kde-look page | 10:11 |
| Tonio_ | people had to change the coords for the images to feet nicely | 10:11 |
| Tonio_ | I should have looked at this before integrating it......... my fault | 10:14 |
| Tonio_ | grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, I can't integrate the metabar theme too........... | 10:18 |
| Tonio_ | bad day | 10:18 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: I won't add that too...... | 10:18 |
| Tonio_ | tables are fixed width, so depending the font config or the langage, there might be text outside the table...... | 10:19 |
| _Sime | can people here tell me if "sudo xresprobe dummy" outputs reasonable resolutions that match thier hardware? | 10:23 |
| _Sime | I'm doing some work on guidance/displayconfig. | 10:23 |
| robotgeek | _Sime: +1 | 10:24 |
| Riddell | wow, what did that just do? | 10:25 |
| Lure | _Sime: not for me - just empty fields (id:, res:, freq:) and disptype:lcd/lvds | 10:25 |
| Riddell | >sudo xresprobe dummy | 10:25 |
| Riddell | Password: | 10:25 |
| Riddell | id: | 10:25 |
| Riddell | res: | 10:25 |
| Riddell | freq: | 10:25 |
| Riddell | disptype: lcd/lvds | 10:25 |
| Lure | It also switches to text screen temporary - very strange | 10:25 |
| robotgeek | _Sime: however, i remember running dpkg-reconfiure pretty recently | 10:25 |
| _Sime | Lure: that is wierd. | 10:25 |
| _Sime | have you guys got laptops or ??? | 10:25 |
| Lure | I am using fglrx driver | 10:25 |
| Riddell | _Sime: yes | 10:25 |
| Lure | Yep: HP Compaq nw8240 | 10:26 |
| Riddell | _Sime: all blank fields on my desktop machine | 10:26 |
| _Sime | what is the native resolution? | 10:26 |
| robotgeek | http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/577310 | 10:26 |
| Lure | 1920x1200 | 10:26 |
| _Sime | some laptops have weird ass resolutions these days. | 10:26 |
| robotgeek | _Sime: mine is a laptop, but connected to external display | 10:26 |
| _Sime | robotgeek: 1280x1024 is your laptop screen? | 10:27 |
| Lure | _Sime: high-res display is really cool | 10:27 |
| robotgeek | _Sime: no, it is connected to an external monitor | 10:28 |
| robotgeek | the laptop screen is "disabled" | 10:28 |
| _Sime | robotgeek: what is your laptop's normal / panel res? | 10:28 |
| robotgeek | _Sime: lemme hunt :) | 10:29 |
| robotgeek | _Sime: looks like 1024 x 768 | 10:30 |
| Lure | _Sime: why do you not use xdpyinfo and dimensions for getting resolution? | 10:30 |
| _Sime | Lure: xdpyinfo tells you the current res, not the native res of the monitor. | 10:31 |
| Lure | true | 10:31 |
| _Sime | there is a bug report on launchpad, and someone says that they have a native res of 1280x1040(!) | 10:31 |
| allee | Riddel, Tonio_, raphink, jpatrick et al: Please have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AchimBohnet and let me know anything wrong/missing or if there should be more. If it's okay/enough I dare to apply for membership at next CC in a week. | 10:32 |
| Lure | _Sime: fglrx is able to autodetect display resolution: http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/577321 | 10:33 |
| Riddell | allee: looks good | 10:35 |
| Lure | _Sime: BTW - do you need more info for bug 32915 (Display applet _getGfxCard error) | 10:35 |
| Tonio_ | allee: nice ;) | 10:35 |
| Riddell | allee: I'll definatly support you | 10:35 |
| Tonio_ | allee: same ;) | 10:36 |
| allee | Riddell, Tonio_ : thx for checking. Will you be around next CC? | 10:36 |
| === allee add this name ... | ||
| Tonio_ | allee: sure ! | 10:36 |
| Lure | allee: I would support you, but not member (you made me understand DPI) ;-) | 10:36 |
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| jpatrick | allee: looks good and sorry I can't go (damn school) | 10:37 |
| allee | Lure: this makes me proud | 10:37 |
| _Sime | Lure: I've fixed a lot of bugs lately. Just give in another test once the update is out (later this week). then we'll have another look. | 10:37 |
| robotgeek | jpatrick: you can always leave testimonials :) | 10:37 |
| jpatrick | I'm doing that | 10:38 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I have to ask for uvh exception, will do toonight | 10:38 |
| Lure | _Sime: will do - thanks | 10:38 |
| allee | jpatrick: np. I hope 'damn' work will _require_ my attention during meeting :( | 10:38 |
| jpatrick | if I could you have my support | 10:40 |
| Riddell | allee: I'll be in london with sabdfl, so I should think so | 10:42 |
| jpatrick | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AchimBohnetTestimonials ? | 10:42 |
| robotgeek | subpage would be better, IMO | 10:43 |
| jpatrick | /Testimonials | 10:43 |
| robotgeek | +1 | 10:43 |
| allee | jpatrick: search wiki work testimonials find Testimonials/*. Checking their contents | 10:44 |
| jpatrick | something about MP3s... | 10:45 |
| allee | jpatrick: not Testimonials is not a good place: Testimonials are people saying they really really like Ubuntu and it has changed their life! | 10:45 |
| jpatrick | I can't find any | 10:47 |
| allee | looks like 'subpage' like robotgeek is best | 10:49 |
| jpatrick | now what to write.... | 10:52 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: I would like to patch kdebase in order not to install all those generic profiles | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | "kubuntu web" and "kubuntu file manager" are probably enought | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | cause actually you get a big list of profiles to choose by default when loading or saving one | 10:57 |
| Tonio_ | is that okay for you ? | 10:58 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: I would worry that people who use them would miss them | 10:59 |
| Tonio_ | hum......indeed... the problem is that the big majority isn't | 11:00 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: why not splitting in another package ? | 11:00 |
| Tonio_ | konqueror-default-profiles | 11:00 |
| Tonio_ | ? | 11:00 |
| Tonio_ | I got a few complains about that | 11:01 |
| Tonio_ | people asking "why are there kubuntu profiles diplucating generic ones | 11:01 |
| Tonio_ | duplicating | 11:01 |
| Tonio_ | people who want them can find the package, and we can document this in the kubuntu documentation, no ? | 11:02 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: i can document konqueror --profiles if you need it | 11:03 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: well the package is that if accepted, we first need the modify kdebase package ;) | 11:03 |
| jpatrick | allee: who should I ask to get kmplayer in Debian? | 11:04 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: i already have Settings -> Load View Profile? | 11:04 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: I'm talking about not having those profiles installed by default in fact, but sepe | 11:04 |
| Tonio_ | aseparate in another package | 11:04 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: it's pretty hidden away even now, why bother? | 11:05 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: hum...... because I'm a stupid perfectionnist ;) | 11:05 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: :) | 11:06 |
| allee | jpatrick: If your commit/maintain kmplayers/debian dir in alioth pkg-kde/kde-extra repo. We can ask Mark Purcell. If not ... | 11:06 |
| robotgeek | just keep me in the loop, i will document it Tonio_ | 11:06 |
| jpatrick | allee: how do I go about that..... | 11:06 |
| allee | debian-mentor will the right address. You can try #debian-qt-kde too, but they are pretty busy ... | 11:06 |
| Lure | I agree with Tonio_: simplicity is better and having more here is just questionable | 11:07 |
| jpatrick | I'm registered at debian-mentor | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: what embarrased me is that there is no way to remove them once for all...... | 11:07 |
| allee | jpatrick: well, upload to debian, mean commitment to manage it: handling/fixing bugs in debian BTS, uploadin new version | 11:07 |
| Tonio_ | I personnaly use many profiles, like ftp etc... and it is a pain having them with those 6 default...... | 11:07 |
| jpatrick | allee: I know | 11:08 |
| Tonio_ | allee, jpatrick, any opinion ? | 11:08 |
| robotgeek | i use only one, so +1 Tonio_ | 11:08 |
| jpatrick | Tonio_: remove them? install rm -f profiles/* | 11:08 |
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| Tonio_ | jpatrick: and update kde and have them back ;) | 11:08 |
| Lure | Tonio_: maybe you should package your personal profiles for others to use... ;-) | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: the problem is that those defaut one will still set in the profiles list | 11:09 |
| Tonio_ | and I haven't been able to find a way to hide them | 11:09 |
| robotgeek | Tonio_: werent they hidden in breezy? | 11:09 |
| Lure | true - you cannot delete them... | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | robotgeek: they are | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | I mean, "kde developpers", is that of any use ? | 11:10 |
| robotgeek | why can't we have it the way it was in breezy? | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | of "simple browser" and "tabbed browser", what for when you have "kubuntu web" | 11:10 |
| Tonio_ | there is no reason to have them, really | 11:10 |
| jpatrick | mv default.profile .default.profile ? | 11:11 |
| danimo | who is in charge for thg+ | 11:11 |
| Tonio_ | jpatrick: I know how to remove them | 11:11 |
| danimo | who is in charge for the display config stuff | 11:11 |
| danimo | (python, called from system settings) | 11:11 |
| Tonio_ | I'm searching a way to have them removed eventually by default | 11:11 |
| jpatrick | _Sime: ? | 11:11 |
| Lure | danimo: _Sime? | 11:11 |
| jpatrick | sebas: ^^ | 11:12 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: what about profiles in a separate package + doc ? | 11:12 |
| Tonio_ | 3 web profiles in the list are simply stupid, really | 11:12 |
| danimo | _Sime: ping? | 11:13 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: why? | 11:13 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: well, if we try to have a logic and optimised desktop, I don't see the need of three web profiles who duplicates themselves...... | 11:14 |
| Tonio_ | "kde developpment"..... who will use that ? | 11:14 |
| Tonio_ | I mean, splitting is very easy to do, so why not ? ^^ | 11:15 |
| Lure | I think these profiles are abused for KDE specific bookmarks here... | 11:15 |
| jpatrick | allee: can I register at alioth? | 11:15 |
| Tonio_ | each time I want to load a profile I have to search in the list because of those unusefull ones | 11:15 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I know you are using profiles too, so what is your feeling ? | 11:16 |
| allee | Tonio_: simple browser and tabbed browing are not needed. MC profile. I don't know. _When_ it supports same shortcut as mc, it maybe useful. 'kde development' can go to kdelibs-dev or dropped | 11:16 |
| Riddell | Tonio_: I don't see the need for konqueror profiles at all :) | 11:16 |
| Riddell | but people demand them | 11:16 |
| robotgeek | Riddell: i've answered questions for people who read Konqueror's handbook asking for the "mc" profile | 11:16 |
| Tonio_ | Riddell: they demand the functionnality, yes | 11:17 |
| Tonio_ | that's why I insisted to have it back | 11:17 |
| Tonio_ | but I'm not sure they are using the default one | 11:17 |
| Tonio_ | generally, they do personnal with sets of pages loaded by default | 11:17 |
| === robotgeek deletes the "KDE Development" profile | ||
| Tonio_ | allee: so your opinion is that on the default desktop, perhaps not having them would be cleaner ? | 11:18 |
| robotgeek | err, tried to | 11:18 |
| Lure | Tonio_: can we move them from global to user (in order to be able to remove manually) | 11:20 |
| Tonio_ | Lure: nope | 11:20 |
| Lure | :-( | 11:21 |
| Tonio_ | they are installed in /usr/shre by default and the ones sitting in your profile are copies of those ones | 11:21 |
| Tonio_ | there is no way to hide them as far as I know, so that's why to me, the bast solution would be a separate package :) | 11:21 |
| Tonio_ | for the "rare" people wanting them | 11:21 |
| allee | Tonio_: I doubt that they are useful. | 11:24 |
| allee | Tonio_: so removing simple browser and tabbed browing is no loss | 11:25 |
| Tonio_ | allee: true, and according to me kde developpers, don't need a profile ;) | 11:25 |
| Tonio_ | maybe mc can be of any use | 11:26 |
| Tonio_ | but globally, they will certainly disturb users more than be of any help......... | 11:26 |
| allee | Tonio_: well, KDE development can be a nice start. but for new developers -> kdelibs-dev? But it should be more visible for new developers. So with kdelibs-dev installed, maybe on about: page. | 11:28 |
| Tonio_ | hum, why not indeed...... | 11:28 |
| Tonio_ | allee: anyway, if I was a developper wanted to contribute to kde, I would go kde.org :) | 11:28 |
| === freeflying-ibook [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.25] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| allee | Hmm, maybe a 'helping Kubuntu' profile on homepage would be better ;) Link to kubuntu homepage, kubuntu wiki, lauchpad bug search, forum(?) ... | 11:29 |
| Tonio_ | allee: why not :) | 11:30 |
| robotgeek | allee: that would probably also help the OEM's | 11:30 |
| robotgeek | they can create their own profile :) | 11:30 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I may just ask to the next meeting | 11:31 |
| Tonio_ | event if not possible, juste to get the global feeling | 11:31 |
| Lure | allee: why not put this to default home page (About Kubuntu) - it will also work with Firefox | 11:32 |
| Lure | file:///usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/home/index.html | 11:32 |
| allee | Tonio_: ah, that the defaults, never saw it, yet. Hmm, IMHO this page should point to usefull Kubuntu resources, not explain kubuntu (should be move to 'more about kubuntu' page ;) | 11:34 |
| danimo | Riddell: can you add a fix to displayconfig? | 11:35 |
| danimo | Riddell: not sure if it's correct, but otherwise it won't come up here | 11:36 |
| Tonio_ | alle good point | 11:36 |
| Riddell | danimo: sure | 11:38 |
| Riddell | _Sime: ^^ | 11:38 |
| === _danimo [n=danimo@p5088642A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Riddell | 22:38 < Riddell> danimo: sure | 11:39 |
| _danimo | Riddell: cool, in site-packages, go to displayconfigabstraction.py (or their respective source) | 11:40 |
| _danimo | Riddell: in like 262, text can appearantly be null, hence the correct line is | 11:41 |
| _danimo | if pic_device.text and .... | 11:41 |
| _danimo | pci_device even | 11:41 |
| allee | Tonio_: hmmm, about homepage. I usually google, or go to a page and fire a search. If this is not uncommon, so maybe a homepage with just ... | 11:42 |
| Tonio_ | allee: well I don't know I must say.... | 11:43 |
| Tonio_ | no opinion on that point | 11:44 |
| allee | google web: with search field, next a way to search kubuntu wiki, and at top or buttom, a row of links to homepage, wiki, forum, report/search bugs, ... | 11:44 |
| allee | afair firefox has only google on it's homepage. An additional bit more kubuntu specific search feature + links seem nevertheless okay :) | 11:45 |
| Tonio_ | allee: interesting ;) | 11:45 |
| Tonio_ | keep that for the meeting ;) | 11:45 |
| _Sime | _danimo: send me an email (simon@simonzone.com). I'm going to bed now. :) | 11:46 |
| _danimo | _Sime: ok | 11:46 |
| allee | Tonio_: This is just what _I_ would find a useful homepage. maybe other can imagine their favorite homepage too ... | 11:46 |
| freeflying-ibook | morning all | 11:46 |
| Tonio_ | allee: anyway, I like the idea ;) | 11:47 |
| Riddell | danimo: committed to svn | 11:47 |
| Tonio_ | freeflying-ibook: good evening ;) | 11:47 |
| freeflying-ibook | Riddell: is skim ok ? | 11:48 |
| allee | Tonio_: as a meeting topic we would need some more input. So people have time to think about it. | 11:48 |
| Tonio_ | allee: true | 11:48 |
| Riddell | freeflying-ibook: just looking at it now | 11:48 |
| Tonio_ | spleeping time ;) | 11:49 |
| Tonio_ | nite all | 11:49 |
| allee | nite Tonio_ | 11:50 |
| freeflying-ibook | night Tonio_ | 11:50 |
| Tonio_ | allee: I missed the uvf exception, sorry !!!!!!!!!! | 11:50 |
| Lure | Tonio_: bye - I will also go now | 11:50 |
| Tonio_ | allee: will do tomorrow morning | 11:50 |
| allee | nite Lure | 11:50 |
| allee | Tonio_: :) | 11:50 |
| === amu_ [n=amu@kubuntu.de] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| Riddell | freeflying-ibook: doesn't skim need im-switch? | 11:59 |
| freeflying-ibook | Riddell: pitti add im-switch to language-pack-zh/ko/ja | 12:00 |
| _danimo | _Sime: done | 12:00 |
| === _danimo is now known as danimo | ||
| Riddell | freeflying-ibook: but why would you want to have skim without im-switch? | 12:01 |
| === robotgeek [n=robotgee@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #kubuntu-devel | ||
| freeflying-ibook | Riddell:skim will be installed defaulty ,and some language package depend on im-switch , so I think it needn't depend on it | 12:02 |
| Riddell | freeflying-ibook: why does 10_correct_includedir_in_skim-pc.dpatch start with "10"? | 12:04 |
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