=== ubuntulog [i=ubuntulo@trider-g7.fabbione.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === bachler [i=rakahang@62.101.48.8] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === maswan [i=maswan@130.239.18.157] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === jimmac [n=jimmac@dsl-tn-1-249.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === kafeine [n=kori@87.126.78.83] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === miketech [n=miketech@84.57.226.39] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === ubuntulog [i=ubuntulo@trider-g7.fabbione.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === Topic for #ubuntu-artwork: lots of changes: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/?action=fullsearch&value=artwork&titlesearch=Titles === Topic (#ubuntu-artwork): set by artnay at Mon Jan 30 10:29:22 2006 === bachler [i=rakahang@62.101.48.8] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === maswan [i=maswan@130.239.18.157] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === artnay [i=artnay@hideout.unk.fi] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === jimmac [n=jimmac@dsl-tn-1-249.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === kafeine [n=kori@87.126.78.83] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === miketech [n=miketech@84.57.226.39] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === Tm_T [i=tm_travo@xob.kapsi.fi] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === klepas [n=klepas@203-213-31-142.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [01:43] sunday morning [01:46] ouch === lapo [n=bat@host10-163.pool8259.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [01:58] hi === andreasn [n=andreas@130.237.5.249] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === leonel [n=leonel@201.123.51.116] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [02:11] chance we could pool what people have been working together? [02:11] into a sort of giant collection [02:11] and then mark and whoever else can have a look at what was produced [02:12] hello klepas [02:12] hey andreasn [02:12] how's it going? [02:13] just fine. Working on tangofication of thunderbird for the moment [02:13] cool [02:13] working on a sort of GDM [02:13] cool [02:13] tango-ubuntu-ish? [02:23] yea [02:23] andreasn: i need some tango wallpapers [02:23] SVG [02:23] sure [02:23] i can only find the JPEGs and PNGs [02:24] chance you could point me to some? [02:24] these would go into an official universe tango package [02:24] I see [02:24] wouldn't it be cooler to put ubuntu-branding on these instead? [02:25] I just did the wallpaper for fun [02:25] nah [02:25] this is as a complete tango package for ubuntu [02:25] doesn't have to follow any ubuntu branding [02:26] colour schemas, etc. [02:26] just a complete tango package to go into the repositories [02:26] including metacity, gdm, splash, wallpapers, icon set, etc.. [02:26] what would the target group of that package be? [02:27] anyone who wants to completely tango-ify their desktop [02:27] I see [02:27] mark wants these sort of themed-packages [02:27] i figured one of them ought to be Tango [02:27] yeah [02:28] the ones I want to be aware of tango is developers [02:28] so [02:28] not end-users [02:28] yea, same [02:28] but, well, anyway [02:28] but mark would like these packages [02:28] can work on that later [02:28] I'll see if I can locate the wallpaper [02:29] so, got some SVG splashes or wallpapers? [02:29] cheers mate :) [02:29] it seems the link on art.gnome.org is broken [02:29] there is a tango-splash on kde-look that I made that perhaps is reusable [02:30] I might have the svg around [02:32] http://ramnet.se/~nisse/diverse/temp/tango/tango-desktop-1024.svg [02:32] http://ramnet.se/~nisse/diverse/temp/tango/splash-top.svg [02:33] yes [02:33] thanks mate [02:33] however, I don't want to make the impression that tango is the road to all branding, be sure to point that out to mark [02:33] i was up till 4 am this morning trying to find this [02:33] road to the end of all branding in distros I mean [02:34] yea [02:34] i agree with you guys [02:34] great! [02:34] but sadly we don't have much of a say in this [02:34] I know [02:34] so for now [02:34] a bunch of themed packages [02:34] putting it in extras is a good start [02:34] one of which will make it into mainstream perhaps [02:34] if it is good enough [02:35] will have to be the start [02:35] and i think Tango ought to be that extra package [02:35] and if not, it would make it into universe [02:35] and i'll maintain it [02:35] it would also be nice to customize some of the icons in tango to fit better with the brown desktop background [02:35] orange folders and stuff like that [02:36] as blue goes horribly bad together with brown [02:36] have you got the tango-firefox theme already? [02:36] https://addons.mozilla.org/themes/moreinfo.php?id=1565&application=firefox [02:37] yea [02:37] got it [02:37] great [02:37] nah, don't need to customise the icons [02:37] because the package will include tango wallpapers :) [02:37] everything tango [02:37] ok [02:38] hopefully the tb-theme will be working good soon aswell [02:38] you're working on that now? [02:38] yep [02:39] some of the theming-stuff is rather horrible [02:39] :) [02:39] thanks dude [02:39] hidden in some random file deep-deep-down... :( [02:39] :) [02:41] this GDM ought to be kick ass [02:41] nice [02:42] would you like to have a sample of the tb-theme? [02:42] might help me find some bugs [02:50] yea [02:50] sure [02:51] andreasn: you wouldn't know how to test out gdm themes using xnest? [02:51] I have no idea actually :( [02:52] no worries [02:52] http://ramnet.se/~nisse/diverse/temp/tango/thunderbird.jar [02:52] i'll figure it out [02:58] my version of thunderbird must be outdated [02:59] icons won't work with it [02:59] you need 1.5 to run it [02:59] not in universe [02:59] mh [03:00] might have to get it from source [03:00] how did you get it? [03:01] it is in dapper universe [03:01] I think [03:02] ah, okay [03:02] i was considering upgrading to dapper [03:03] is it stable enough? [03:03] it works ok for me [03:04] but I was mostly upgrading because I needed thunderbird 1.5 [03:04] to theme it and stuff [03:04] and dapper also include f-spot with the new tango icons jakub drew [03:06] nice [03:08] fresher icons for banshee and other stuff aswell [03:08] and a working version of hplip as I'm drawing icons for that app aswell [03:09] so I guess you could say that my reason for upgrading to dapper was icons ;) [03:14] yay [03:14] got gdm testing working [03:14] andreasn: fair reason if you're an artist :) [03:16] heh, yeah [03:22] curse poor SVG gradient support in GDM! [03:23] librsvg? [03:23] is that the package that controls SVG rendering? [03:29] it is in most other gnome apps [03:29] and it must be in gdm aswell, but I'm not sure [04:01] andreasn: this GDM theme is soon done :) [04:09] andreasn: do you know where i can find the SVG to that other dark blue-ish Tango wallpaper with the massive folder in it? [04:27] andreasn: done! [04:31] andreasn: i just need a decent background [04:53] anyone awake? === libervisco [n=libervis@hsiproxy.astra-net.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [09:15] andreasn: ping [10:03] klepas: pong [10:04] klepas: neat === lukacu [n=lukacu@cpe-213-157-253-211.dynamic.amis.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === omeg [n=omega@s55933ad4.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [10:46] andreasn: you've seen it? [10:46] [http://wombat.nuxified.com/tmpfiles/tango-renewed-screenshot.jpg] [10:48] That is very nice. [10:49] I do, however, suggest that the contrast of the Tango! title is changed. [10:49] It's currently white on light grey (except for the shadow). [10:49] omeg: yea [10:49] The small text in that image is also really small. I personally would make it a little larger. [10:49] Maybe that would help the hinting, too. [10:50] good point [10:50] Did you make that, by the way? [10:50] i fear though with the 'tango!' logo that changing it to black will make it stand out way too much [10:50] yea [10:50] artwork sprint after all :) [10:51] before i hit the sacks tonight i want to get another one done [10:51] Well, it's nice. :) And I'm glad that not _everything_ is made to be brown. I mean, sure, brown is Ubuntu's color, but I think that it's usually a little overused. [10:51] this was for the Tango package [10:51] I would have a look at finding a solution to that Tango! logo for you, but you probably made it in GIMP, right? [10:51] because the other GDM wasn't to my liking [10:51] no [10:51] Photoshop? [10:52] everything you see in the screenshot is either XML or SVG [10:52] Inkscape [10:52] everything [10:52] Ah, then I could open it in Illustrator, maybe... [10:52] which dramatically reduces the total package size [10:52] If you want me to, that is. [10:52] yea, sure [10:52] one moment [10:52] i'll upload it [10:52] Cool :) [10:53] i wanted this to be entirely SVG also so that people won't have to worry about having this or that of a good size for their monitors [10:53] I'm encoding video at the moment. Illustrator sure is taking a long time to start... [10:54] Yeah, good call. I wonder when X's interface will be fully in Vector. [10:54] Vista and Mac OS X 10.5 are going to be entirely in vector, right? Can't have X stay behind :P [10:54] even highlighting from the dulled icons to the full colour ones as mouseover is vector :) [10:54] Vista is i think [10:55] though whether it will be as complete as their predecessor icon sets... is another question [10:55] klepas: how much stuff will this package include [10:55] I still sometimes see Win95 icons in XP. [10:55] no point releasing a Windows Vista icon set that is scalable when there are so many other gif ones [10:55] omeg: yea, precisely [10:55] will it also ship tangofied icons to apps like kopete and konqueror? [10:55] andreasn: a full list will include: [10:55] ... [10:56] yes [10:56] i hope [10:56] it will take a while [10:56] What do you think about the icons that showed up on the mailing list? [10:56] which is why it will be a package in universe at the minimum [10:56] pretty good [10:56] The ones that Mark presented? I think that it's too bad that apparently _everything_ needs to have a color brown in it, or else it's "not Ubuntu enough". [10:57] andreasn: full list (hoep I'm not missing anything, and this is for Ubuntu, so GNOME for now): GDM, Metacity, GTK (if one is made and acceptable), splash screen, the icon set, wallpapers and app icons [10:57] omeg: ah well [10:57] klepas: and ff and tb [10:57] ah, yes [10:57] and Gaim emotes [10:57] I liked the Gnome v2 icons. I guess that I'll be able to revert the Ubuntu 6.04 icons to Gnome v2 pretty easily, though. [10:58] and for the Kubuntu one, will have kopete emotes [10:58] actually [10:58] i had a look at the gaim emotes todayu [10:58] there were some errors in the package [10:58] though i cannot remember who did them [10:58] I think the icons mark presented is nice, needs to follow the tango guidelines a bit better though to blend in with stuff upstream [10:59] yep [10:59] There's one thing that I don't like about the Tango set. [10:59] and would do better if it were given to the community as accessable SVGs [10:59] And it's the folder icon. Which is too bad, since it's the single most important icon. [10:59] omeg: the color? [10:59] omeg: change it [10:59] I've been working on making a replacement but I doubt they'll ever accept it. [10:59] or propose another [10:59] :) [10:59] Yeah, I'm working on it :) [10:59] hehe [10:59] omeg: can I see? [10:59] i don't like the home icon [11:00] I've been making it at work, so I'm not sure if I have it here. But I want to change what I have around anyway. Let me see if I have it. [11:00] omeg: http://wombat.nuxified.com/tmpfiles/tango-renewed-gdm.tar.gz [11:01] Ah yeah, I have it. Making a PNG... [11:01] chance someone would be able to provide some temporary websapce? [11:01] to just upload all the art done this weekend? [11:01] just temp [11:01] klepas: sure [11:01] less than 8 MB [11:01] i would presume [11:01] but bandwidth... not sure [11:01] depends on how popular it gets [11:02] andreasn: that would be kick ass [11:02] http://www.whahay.net/pubaccess/__folder_wip.png [11:02] Right now, the problem is that it's made for a high size. It kind of falls very flat when seen in that size, especially due to the very narrow lines. [11:03] doesn't follow Tango guidelines much though [11:03] It needs much more clear and big lines to adhere to Tango specifications. [11:03] so somewhat inconsistent [11:03] Yeah. To be honest, I didn't make this for Tango. I made it for a CMS that a programmer is creating at work. But I've been meaning to use this as base for a Tango icon. [11:04] ah cool [11:04] omeg: did you get the tarball? [11:04] omeg: the biggest reason we don't want to change the folder in the base-set right now is that there are too many places we need to change it in [11:04] i didn't check whether it uploaded rihgt [11:04] andreasn: and a lot of other people use it already [11:04] such as subTango [11:04] I got it, klepas. [11:04] :) [11:04] omeg: like folder-new, home-folder, folder-remote etc. in all three sizes [11:05] That would be less than a day's work if you have a new folder base. [11:05] somewhat of a problem though for the modules on the net that have begun to use Tango [11:06] http://gnomedev.com/ [11:06] like Daniel's and my phpbb theme [11:06] I don't think that's a valid reason to not substitute one icon for a better one. [11:06] Afterall, nobody's ever said that Tango is done yet. [11:07] true [11:07] suppose we're just reluctant to change [11:07] I don't think Illustrator can open this, klepas. :( [11:07] the SVGs? [11:07] It can open them, but it doesn't support some SVG things. [11:07] omeg: well, if you want to fix it in all icons in all sizes, feel free to send it to the tango-artists list [11:07] Such as transparency in gradients. [11:08] I think I'll do that when I have some more spare time. It seems interesting enough to try. [11:08] omeg: what do you feel is better in this icon than the one currently in tango? [11:08] I need to stop spending so much time on pixel art: http://www.whahay.net/pubaccess/__atree.gif [11:08] omeg: at work on a windows box, eh? :) [11:09] lol [11:10] andreasn: I don't think my icon is better than the one in Tango yet. Tango's icon is actually pretty good, but the background's dark grey doesn't appeal to me, nor does the frontside part of the folder. It's down too low in both the closed and open states, I'd say. [11:10] Actually, I'm at home right now. I dual boot Windows and Ubuntu (but do a lot of work on Mac OS 9.2.2), and at work I use Mac OS X 10.4. I don't use Ubuntu for art stuff since I've always used Adobe products, and I don't like the open source alternatives enough to switch to them. [11:12] I'm not an experienced icon maker, though. I might not ever be pleased with my folder icon alternative, so I wouldn't expect too much of me just yet. :P [11:13] omeg: well, it's worth a try [11:13] By the way, do you guys know of a good place where I can download open source Mac OS 9.2.2 software? Seems that the OS9 scene is completely and wholly dead :) [11:14] The latest browser to run on it is an outdated Mozilla. [11:14] Well, except iCab, which is actively making OS9 ports, but nobody cares about iCab. [11:14] omeg: haven't heard of any free software for os9, most stuff seems to be shareware [11:15] Yeah, that's correct. I wonder why. [11:15] old platform? [11:16] omeg: anyway, about the folders...right now we focus on getting apps tangofied and the base-set to be complete [11:16] I guess that when OS9 was still being used actively, open source development hadn't taken off that largely yet. I don't really know when it did, to be honest. [11:16] and that is why the thread on the tango-artists-list about colors on folders never got anywhere, hope it don't give the impression that we don't listen to peoples feedback [11:17] Ah, you're a Tango dev? I should say that Tango's stuff is pretty amazing. :) I only have small problems with some of the icons, but nothing serious. It seriously is great work. [11:18] I guess that Ubuntu will also use Tango in the future. I hope that it will, anyway. [11:18] yeah, I've been involved with the project since about the launch of it [11:20] yeah, or a theme following the tango-guidelines [11:21] as I don't want to see a mishmash of styles on my desktop [11:21] and it creates a feeling of unprofessionalism [11:21] Yeah, that's one of the worst things that can happen. [11:21] What do you think about the Vista icons? [11:21] i can't wait until a prime distro uses tango as default [11:22] omeg: their visual metaphors aren't well thought over [11:22] I personally am still hoping that Vista's icon set is just some beta thing. [11:22] novell linux desktop 10 will probably [11:22] Because I find them appaling. [11:22] *appalling [11:22] and some people in the fedora project wants to use tango for fedora core 6 [11:22] Especially the new Internet Explorer icon. It's just totally wrongfully designed. [11:23] would be nice to see distros stop wasting effort to produce a branding icon set [11:23] In fact, their entire glass interface is nonsense. [11:23] But I guess that's just Windows. [11:23] It's not like they haven't been messing up their interface more and more ever since Windows 95's release. [11:24] the thing about the vista interface is that there are probably going to be a buch of winxp-icons in there left [11:25] and probably some win9x-icons aswell [11:25] and it will take a while before isv's are starting to migrate to the vista-style [11:27] klepas: do you have all my tangofied app icons? [11:27] haven't sent too many of them upstream yet :( [11:29] foresight linux ships with tango by default aswell, btw [11:31] andreasn: none of them [11:31] I think I have a tar.gz around here somewhere [11:31] just making branding sets the way they are traditionally done is senseless [11:31] that would be awesome [11:31] :) [11:37] klepas: http://ramnet.se/~nisse/diverse/temp/ubuntu-tango-set/ [11:38] just tell me if something is missing [11:38] I have already sent the inkscape icon to their mailing-list, but I'm not sure if it's in or not [11:38] but pitivi use the new tango-icon in cvs [11:39] i'll have a look at in a sec [11:43] they're awesome [11:43] Those icons are hot. [11:43] i'll consider adding to that when time permits [11:43] so that we keep some sort of version number for it [11:44] can we call it version 0.1 === klepas edits the tarball as tango-apps-0.1.tar.gz [11:44] http://ramnet.se/~nisse/andreasportfolio/icons.html [11:44] check if any of them are missing that is in this page [11:47] the kontact icon [11:48] and the xchat-gnome icon [11:49] no, I mean the other way around [11:49] I can't use the xchat-gnome icon in my portfolio, lapo did that one [11:49] ah, okies [11:49] :P [11:50] the puzzle icon [11:50] that red dot one [11:50] and the Aaa one [11:50] oh, and the mailbox one [11:51] ok, the puzzle icon is in ff, the mailbox in tb, the A in tango-art-libre [11:51] and the filter is supposed to go into tango-art-libre aswell [11:51] so it's all good? [11:51] probably === miketech [n=miketech@dslb-084-057-240-028.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === andi [n=andi@chello213047173210.2.14.tuwien.teleweb.at] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [12:07] anyone know where i would find the gnome-terminal colour settings [12:07] as in the file for it [12:11] well, i would search it in ~/.gnome2 but so far i was not successful finding it ;) [12:12] yea, looked there also [12:12] :( [12:13] ~/.gconf/apps/gnome-terminal/profiles [12:13] maybe you dont need to directly edit files there but just write some gconf-directives [12:15] thanks mate [12:18] yay [12:18] :) [12:19] andreasn: ping [12:20] pong [12:20] wondering [12:21] actually [12:21] private [12:31] you're welcome, i'm happy i could be of help :) === irvin [n=irvin@ubuntu/member/irvin] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [12:36] ha, finally remembered the nick i registered with ;) [12:54] in case anyone asks [12:55] i'll mail about the happenings and results of the artwork weekend tomorrow [12:55] late here and college tomorrow [12:55] ok, have a good sleep then pascal [12:55] cheerio === klepas [n=klepas@203-213-31-142.static.tpgi.com.au] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] === AndyFitz [n=andy@cust1772.qld01.dataco.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === AndyFitz [n=andy@cust1772.qld01.dataco.com.au] has left #ubuntu-artwork [] === heno [n=henrik@henrik.gotadsl.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === glatzor [n=sebi@ppp-82-135-75-114.mnet-online.de] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === lapo [n=bat@host10-163.pool8259.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [03:08] hi === _who_ [i=jonny@88-105-100-116.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [03:23] <_who_> hello everyone [03:25] <_who_> the 'Artwork Weekend' wiki page seems to be blank - does that mean that as yet, little has been decided? [03:29] well, pascale asked to tell everybody that he will mail the outcome tomorrow [03:29] since its late already and he got college tomorrow [03:29] *pascal even [03:34] <_who_> yea, I need to get used to talking accross time zones - it's middayish Sunday here in England... [03:34] <_who_> So essentially, the meeting is over now then? [03:34] and one hour later here in austria (i guess) ;) [03:35] well, i dont know [03:35] apparently i dropped in here the first time today ;) [03:35] <_who_> anyone around who was here when the three theme packages for polishing were discussed? [03:36] <_who_> this is my first outing in any Ubuntu Art meeting, [03:36] http://wombat.nuxified.com/node/151 [03:36] this is a link pascal gave me [03:39] <_who_> yea, I knew Pascall was very pro-tango :P [03:39] <_who_> I think we really ought to do one totally tango theme [03:40] <_who_> I'm just more interested in doing one using NuovEXT and Water Vapour [03:41] well, i might not be the right person to talk with for something like that ;) i'm not a very creative guy you know ;) [03:41] but your plans seem nice [03:42] <_who_> lol, do you know how we submit artwork for consideration for Dapper? [03:43] sorry, i dont - pascal will be here tomorrow from about 6 in the morning (cet, so 5 in the morning in the uk) [03:44] he'll most likely know [03:44] i didnt catch any discussions today either - was here too late it seems [03:50] When you've put together the artwork you need to get it packaged for Universe [03:50] I suggest you contact the MOTU team https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU or #ubuntu-motu [03:51] link up with someone there who can package art team stuff regularly and upload to universe [03:51] agree on a regular place where you can upload a tarball and the packager can grab it === lapo_ [n=bat@host187-195.pool873.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === lapo_ is now known as lapo [04:07] heno: have you considered the dappericons tangoification? [04:08] lapo: well, I think it's a good idea, personally [04:08] but it needs to be taken forward [04:08] I suggest you support the ongoing effort of klepas to put a complete tango package together [04:09] and then push it into universe [04:10] I think following the guidelines WRT perspective is a good idea [04:10] I'm not sure using the tango colours will work at this point though [04:11] your comparison image makes a very good case, lapo [04:11] you should post it on the wiki and the mailing list [04:11] which mark now reads [04:12] and he is the one who is now giving direction to the icon designer [04:12] perhaps you can offer to work with and help that designer directly [04:13] to better follow the tango guidelines [04:14] ok, I'll surellly do it [04:15] great, push the message out there :) [04:15] going through indirect channels (like myself) will only weaken the message [04:15] and slow down communications [04:16] I was looking for mark, but he is not online [04:20] as you can see my english sucks and I fear to be misunderstood, but I'll do my best on the ml [04:22] he is easier to catch on email [04:23] Dont worry about your english; your pictures speak loudly and clearly ;) [04:23] k, thanks for you help [04:24] your === bachler [i=rakahang@62.101.48.8] has joined #ubuntu-artwork === jozmak [n=mak@h66-201-246-249.gtcust.grouptelecom.net] has joined #ubuntu-artwork [04:41] Did anyone get a chance to look at the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperExampleContent stuff? [04:41] Can anyone here make a decent drawing in OOo draw? ;) [05:00] ooo draw is painfull, I did all the illustration for my gf graduation thesis, dunno how much interesting can be a schematic thooth btw :-) [05:02] lapo: that might be ok. ATM we have 0 [05:03] I could draw something myself, but that would be really bad :-/ [05:19] heno: http://xoomer.virgilio.it/bat/heno/ [05:20] btw new ooo misrenders them in a bad way, I did this stuff in 0.98 (...and you can't immagine how painfull it was :-)) [05:20] lapo: heh, yeah. Have you tried making equations ion OOo? That's very painful indeed [05:21]