=== theCore [n=alex@Toronto-HSE-ppp3778051.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Kyral [n=Chris@ubuntu/member/kyral] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:26] mdke_, ping [02:26] mdke_, unping [02:28] hmm, I didn't know you could unping [02:30] sure, you'd just RST [02:31] granted, it's not like echo "un"request or anything === robotgeek [n=venkat@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robotgeek [n=robotgee@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:11] mdke_: ping === robotgeek [n=robotgee@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robotgeek [n=robotgee@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robotgeek [i=venkat@ubuntu/member/robotgeek] has joined #ubuntu-doc === LaserJock [n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === bhuvan [n=bhuvan@ubuntu/member/bhuvan] has joined #ubuntu-doc === poningru [n=poningru@n128-227-13-170.xlate.ufl.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robotgeek [i=venkat@digital.celebris.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robitaille [n=daniel@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-doc === LaserJock [n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-doc === ealden [n=ealden@203.76.213.44] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Madpilot [n=brian@S0106000d88b9f3db.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:44] hi all === manicka [n=manicka@ubuntu/member/manicka] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:46] Hi manicka [07:46] Hi Madpilot [07:47] hi :) [07:48] hey all [07:49] The Freeze is Nigh Upon Us! Flee, for we are all doomed! [07:49] ;) [07:51] robotgeek, did you add that wireless section to UDG, or should I? (sort of lost track of commits today...) [07:52] Madpilot: yes, i did commit it [07:52] Madpilot: i was not sure if you wanted it there, so i did not commit intially [07:52] ah, there it is. Looks good. === robotgeek is happy [07:53] otherwise i would have to copy back from you === kyral_ [n=Chris@ubuntu/member/kyral] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:37] robotgeek, pong [08:37] Burgwork, unpong [08:37] hey mdke_ [08:37] hiya [08:38] mdke_: now i don't remeber, and i don't have a log [08:38] heh [08:38] you just came in, said ping, and left [08:38] heh, i'll ping again later [08:39] i'm trying to recover all my mail, i screw my machine up [08:39] word up [08:39] hi mdke_ - I just fixed the menu stuff that I messed up last night [08:39] oh cool, I forgot about that [08:40] bhuvan, hey dude [08:40] hello mdke_ [08:40] Madpilot, the gparted menu entry is now "Gnome Partition Editor" fyi [08:41] mdke_, that leads into my next point: [08:41] bhuvan, what do you think about removing the gnome-app-install section of the server guide? [08:41] one thing we **must** do before freeze - get some Dapper users to sanity-check the menu entries in UDG... [08:41] both me and brian were in dilemma. we are certain it can be removed [08:41] yes indeed [08:42] bhuvan, i agree it should be removed [08:42] mdke_, ok. i'll take care [08:42] it's gnome-specific === bhuvan goes to have lunch [08:43] buon appetito [08:43] Madpilot, I've got a dapper install [08:43] mdke, I'm still running Breezy; I'll have a go w/ a Flight4 livecd this weekend, though === Burgundavia [n=corey@S0106000fb085cc63.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:44] hi Burgundavia [08:45] Madpilot, the menu entries might change late-ish, like gparted did yesterday [08:45] mdke, how late is 'late-ish', and what does that mean WRT our string freeze? [08:46] salut Madpilot [08:47] Madpilot, next thursday is string freeze so they can't change after that [08:47] we have a week after that [08:47] OK, I'll leave the menu entries for now, and we can blitz them next week [08:48] yeah [08:52] we need to take a look at About Ubuntu :/ [08:52] it's still going to be just a web page for Dapper, right? [08:53] an xml file [08:53] I think we can just transpose the changes we've made to the about ubuntu section of the desktop guide and move it across [08:54] Just had a look at Breezy's About Ubuntu... Bug Number One: It doesn't say which version of Ubuntu I'm running [08:55] absolutely [08:55] although that's fixed now [08:56] yeah, just comparing what's in SVN === ompaul [n=ompaul@ubuntu/member/ompaul] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Kamping_Kaiser [n=Kaiser@ppp201-15.lns1.adl4.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:11] now to figure out how to make gmail will keep the from address as venkatvc@ubuntu.com [09:12] robotgeek, use an email client! [09:12] mdke: how do i setup the smtp? [09:13] you use your isp's smtp? [09:13] or your own, if you have one [09:13] i use gmail's smtp [09:14] ok [09:14] I'm sure that works in a mail client, right? [09:16] yeah, i was seeing if i could make gmail rewrite the from header when i send it from kmail [09:17] that seems possible only in the webinterface [09:17] get kmail to write the from header [09:17] robotgeek, you can set it in gmail too [09:18] bhuvan: i did set it up in gmail, venkatvc at ubuntu.com is the default [09:18] robotgeek, ok. so, whats your problem ? [09:19] bhuvan: i am actually sending from venkatraghavan at gmail.com using gmail's smtp, i want to find out if there is a method by which i can use gmail's smtp to make it look as it it is from venkatvc at ubuntu.com [09:19] it may not be worth spending too much time on :) [09:20] mdke, suggestion for About Ubuntu - move the "Components" section up so it's second, then Get Help and finally Participate [09:20] anyways, back to work on kdg === Burgundavia writes the GNOME 2.14 press release [09:20] robotgeek, gmail->Settings->Accounts doesn't help ? [09:21] bhuvan: not if you are not using the gmail interface [09:21] ok [09:22] bhuvan: plus it does put in gmail as the sender, so there's no point :) [09:22] robotgeek: frankly, i dont understand your problem :) [09:23] bhuvan: heh [09:23] nvm, it's a waste of time, really [09:23] robotgeek: all emails i sent as 'bhuvan@ubuntu.com' are sent from gmail web interface [09:23] robotgeek: fine, no problem. leave it [09:23] bhuvan: exactly, the same thing doesn't happen if i use kmail, even if @ubuntu.com address is default [09:34] language help needed: Each release will be supported for 18 months after it's [09:34] release date." [09:35] vs Each release is supported for at least 18 months. [09:35] Kamping_Kaiser: ^^ [09:35] "is supported" is simpler & has less verbiage [09:36] agreed [09:36] i'm going over some suggestions from the kubuntuforums [09:36] I always vote (and try to edit) in the direction of less verbiage :P [09:36] http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/index.php?topic=3946.msg15149#msg15149 [09:38] Madpilot: some suggestions there could go into UDG too === manicka [n=manicka@ubuntu/member/manicka] has joined #ubuntu-doc === kgoetz [n=kgoetz@ppp201-15.lns1.adl4.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:54] robotgeek, thanks, I'll look into that tomorrow [09:54] Madpilot: cool, very minor for you. a one liner [10:00] night all [10:00] night bhuvan [10:00] Burgundavia: err === ompaul_ [n=ompaul@213-202-150-70.bas503.dsl.esat.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@195-23-238-135.nr.ip.pt] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:57] mdke: ping [10:58] i saw your planet.ubuntu.com post, and comments are welcome as bugs? === highvolt1ge [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:42] robotgeek_zzz, sure, however you prefer === highvoltage [n=Jono@ubuntu/member/highvoltage] has left #ubuntu-doc [] === manicka [n=manicka@ubuntu/member/manicka] has joined #ubuntu-doc === bustacap [n=bustacap@ubuntu/member/bustacap] has joined #ubuntu-doc === lloydinho [n=andreas@130.225.236.208] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jjesse [n=jjesse@mail.ftpb.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mgalvin [n=mgalvin@ubuntu/member/mgalvin] has joined #ubuntu-doc === lakin [n=lakin@dsl-hill-66-18-228-60-cgy.nucleus.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === glatzor [n=sebi@ppp-82-135-64-134.mnet-online.de] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-doc === lakin [n=lakin@dsl-hill-66-18-228-60-cgy.nucleus.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Mez [n=Mez@ubuntu/member/mez] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mdke_ [n=matt@ubuntu/member/mdke] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:58] hey guys [04:58] hi [05:05] morning jsgotangco [05:05] hey! [06:17] sometimes we have American spellings and sometimes British. Should I change behaviour to behavior, or vice versa? [06:18] (just an example) [06:18] we should international, IMHO [06:18] so use behaviour, not behavior [06:18] aight === trappist whips out his perl foo [06:19] you might want to raise it on the list first [06:19] good call [06:21] done [06:21] I'll leave it alone until there's some kind of consensus === LaserJock [n=laserjoc@ubuntu/member/laserjock] has joined #ubuntu-doc === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@195-23-238-249.nr.ip.pt] has joined #ubuntu-doc === ompaul [n=ompaul@ubuntu/member/ompaul] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:58] arghh!!! [06:59] why are we experimenting with theme AFTER UI freeze???? === Burgwork hulk smashes his table [07:00] poor Burwork [07:00] that's gotta hurt [07:52] hi all, DapperFlight5 is just about all set (i just need to add an OOo screenshot), if anyone has time to review it and be a grammer nazi that would be great, it will be moved to the main site (www.ubuntu.com) soon so it needs to be ready as flight 5 will be released probably today, thanks in advance [07:57] mgalvin: what are you trying to say here on DapperFlight5:The new Ubuntulooks theme engine which is based on the very popular Clearlooks theme engine brings [07:58] it doesn't read correctly to me for some reason [07:58] just that the ubuntulook theme is not totally new, its based on cleatlooks [07:58] and that the ubuntu improvements include... [07:59] hmm maybe i didn't read it right, but it just seeems wrong for some wierd reason? [07:59] jjesse: there is probably to many ideas in that single sentence [08:00] i will reword it [08:05] jjesse: how does that sound? [08:06] trappist: i'm guilt of writing in both === zenrox [n=zenrox@71.115.198.118] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:10] mgalvin: what exactly needs to be work-nazi'ed? [08:10] trappist: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperFlight5 [08:11] on it [08:11] thanks [08:15] i just added the screenshot numbers so you know [08:16] Burgwork, because the theme itself was added after ui freeze :( [08:16] mdke_, indeed. I am not happy [08:16] well that's Ubuntu [08:16] it happens every cycle [08:16] this is exactly what I spoke about at UBZ [08:16] looks like I will be rasing it in Germany [08:16] yes [08:16] again... [08:16] not to mention that the new theme sucks balls [08:17] hmm, mdke maybe start using kde. come over to the blue side? [08:17] I feel like sending an email to -devel "How not to shit on your documentation team" [08:17] Burgwork: the next developer meeting is in Germany? [08:17] but that probably wouldn't be useful [08:17] LaserJock, yep [08:18] Burgwork, it's not so much shitting on us, because it doesn't really affect our work [08:18] it's just very bad practice to introduce massive changes at the end of the cycle [08:18] when this means that the changes get no community feedback [08:18] and are difficult to fix === theCore [n=alex@Toronto-HSE-ppp3778417.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:20] hmm, the themes are very easy to switch between, and i think the idea of pushing flight 5 out today is to get that feedback (1 day after the theme was added) [08:22] yeah, but I think the feedback is already pretty negative, I don't think it will take Flight 5 to figure out it sucks ;-) [08:22] mgalvin, ui freeze was nearly 48 hours ago. it's not easy to get feedback [08:22] given that nothing can now be changed [08:22] Whats the new theme? [08:22] 4 months ago would have worked [08:23] well, they will probably change it in the next few days, I would guess [08:23] I can only hope so, the theme is too broken to respect the ui freeze [08:23] Kyral: see it here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperFlight5 [08:24] mgalvin: DapperFlight5 is all fixed up === Kyral has been thinking about doing a clean reinstall when Dapper is released... [08:25] I plan to do that [08:25] trappist: thanks! [08:26] Somethin' is screwy with my GTK apps [08:26] or rather GNOME [08:26] I thought you went to the dark side :) [08:26] Why would I use Windows? [08:26] no, KDE [08:26] .. === Kyral sighs === robotgeek smacKs LaserJock [08:27] lol [08:27] mdke: true, of course the earlier the better === mgalvin thinks ubuntulooks looks like a holloween theme :-/ [08:28] mgalvin: actually your screenshots look better than my yelp [08:31] mgalvin: looks fine now [08:33] jjesse: thanks === Kyral [n=Chris@ubuntu/member/kyral] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:44] bleh. kontact issues holding up my british/american spelling patch. [08:48] mdke: ping. i now remember why i pinged you yesterday [08:50] mdke: basically, the padding left=0 mkaes it very close to the screen edge [08:50] trappist: ^^ [08:51] of course, this is better than unclickable links :) [08:54] robotgeek, he fixed that, iirc [08:54] yeah I said padding-left=1em; [08:54] mdke: the unclicable links, yes. but now it is too close to the screen edge? [08:54] where it originally said padding=1em; which was breaking clickability [08:55] http://doc.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/desktopguide-web/C/ch02.html for example [08:56] hmm [08:56] is it a problem on my screen, or is "Linux Basics" at the bottom too close to the screen [08:56] oh yeah === mdke has no ideas at present [08:57] just to let you know that i remembered why i pinged you yesterday [08:57] cool, thanks [08:59] that Linux Basics is position: absolute; left: 0px; [08:59] trappist: css guru :) [09:00] it looks pretty deliberate [09:00] kmail has decided I don't get to send emails. /me resorts to mutt to send this patch. [09:01] trappist: better thank deleteing your .kde [09:01] that would suck. [09:01] trappist: i redownloaded all my mail, and setup new filters yesterday [09:02] i need to move to mutt+procmail+fetchmail solution, but i like kmail too much [09:03] I was a kmail guy back in the day, then went to mutt for a coupla years, but I came back [09:03] sent the patch, anyway [09:04] I like mutt a lot, but it was really just part of a misguided goal to go console for practically everything [09:04] to prove I was a real man or something [09:04] thanks for the patch trappist [09:04] ignore the xfce docs from now on though :) [09:04] can do [09:05] and don't change pot files [09:05] is xubuntu doing docs elsewhere? [09:05] Burgwork, not that I know of [09:06] trappist, and, a patch per document if possible too, so each contact person can check & apply [09:07] at first I just said for file in $(find . -type f ! -whole-name '*/.svn/*'); do perl -pi -e 's/([Bb] )ehaviour/$1ehavior/g' "$file"; done but the results of that sucked. [09:07] mdke: can do that too [09:07] trappist, thanks. Would you remail the patch with those things in mind? I'm just mailing the list now [09:08] sigh. ok, back to mutt :) [09:08] sorry === kyral_ [n=Chris@ubuntu/member/kyral] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:13] mdke, sweet, pdf! [09:14] we should be able to munge a good release notes out of the excellent Flight stuff mgalvin has beendoing [09:17] ok I think I sent it again [09:22] cool. I seem to have somehow fixed kmail. [09:26] Burgwork, the pdfs are pretty rubbish at the moment sadly === sdquinn [n=squinn@69.203.205.68.cfl.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:26] they aren't styled at all [09:26] hi all again [09:26] meeting in 30min correct? [09:27] holy crap [09:27] did you see mark's email? [09:27] saw a bit of it [09:27] on [ubuntu-art] ? [09:27] thank god [09:27] indeed [09:28] great [09:28] trappist, thanks for re-diffing [09:29] np [09:29] who is this mark shuttleworth bozo talking about delaying dapper? [09:29] the guy in charge of ubuntu [09:29] aaaaah [09:29] "I'm writing to propose a six week delay in the release date of Dapper," [09:29] I know, kidding ;) [09:29] i missed that part. :( [09:30] I have mixed feelings about that [09:30] that would be a good thing. I think we would have the same string freeze for docs though, myself [09:30] I lean toward delaying it, but I don't think my vote counts yet [09:31] there's something to be said for the "when it's done" release cycle philosophy, but I don't like the way it works in debian. [09:31] well there is a good argument that dapper is special in the context of the ubuntu cycles [09:32] yeah [09:32] may 6 weeks is a little much [09:32] i wonder how they picked 6 weeks? [09:32] why not just a month [09:33] from browsing lists and hanging out on the various channels I get the feeling we've got a really good pace going and that with a little more time we could put out a significantly better release [10:11] so what would that mean for the docs? [10:12] we'll have to wait an see [10:12] I would say, string freeze stays the same, more time for translation [10:12] hmm [10:12] or moves slightly [10:12] there is a lot of stuff to get translated this time, and the docs are pretty much nearly ready [10:13] except the Packaging Guide [10:13] haha [10:13] is it in bad shape? [10:13] I'm getting pretty concerned [10:13] how come? [10:13] well, one of the problems is I need patches and review from the developer community but they are working hard on developing === mdke nods [10:15] I'm not sure what it is going to look like by string freeze [10:15] well don't worry [10:15] perfection is impossible [10:15] yeah, but sorta complete would be nice [10:16] do what you can, no worries. Shall we call on the devs in a more formal way? [10:16] It also looks like the Ubuntu Developer's Reference that Diziet was going to do is deferred [10:16] mdke: not yet, I think most of the devs that would have an interest know, but I can push a little harder [10:17] some of it is me just setting aside a block of time to work on it [10:17] sure [10:17] my research advisor is pushing me a bit at the moment [10:17] I'll do what I can with the packaging guide, but having never made a .deb it'll probably be all word nazi stuff. [10:18] anyway, it is pretty much my top priority right now so I hope to get some major work done soon [10:18] yay, don't let it stress ya though [10:18] trappist: well, I'll call on your expertise after we have stuff pretty set [10:19] LaserJock: probably a good idea [10:19] anything anybody can tell me about what needs the iron grammar fist will be helpful [10:19] trappist: I wouldn't want to waste your time on something that I'm just going to screw up ;-) [10:19] right :) [10:21] mdke: well I need the stress to get motivated. Unfortunately, university has taught me some bad habits. [10:21] ok, stress out! [10:21] mdke: but I have been totally committed to this doc and I hate to have it not be in Dapper [10:23] LaserJock: maybe we'll all luck out and get another six weeks [10:23] you can do it :) [10:23] mdke: will the packaging guide be translated? how would that work? [10:24] LaserJock, if it's done in time, sure. It will get translated in rosetta [10:25] I don't know anything about translations so sorry for the stupid questions. Where will the translations go? Are they a part of the ubuntu-docs package? [10:26] yes [10:26] questions are fine :) [10:28] I think translations become part of the language packs [10:29] so the translations for all the packages for a given language that is translated are put in the lang pack. Those must be huge. [10:30] Burgwork, no, they are in ubuntu-docs [10:30] oh [10:42] Burgwork, http://doc.ubuntu.com/test [10:42] we need to sort out proper styling for the admonitions, most importantly of all [10:42] I might try and steal some of brent's stuff for GNOME [10:43] then add some brown or something [10:43] -> bed [10:43] mdke, not bad, at least they work [10:43] yeah [10:44] night mdke [10:44] night === lakin [n=lakin@dsl-hill-66-18-228-60-cgy.nucleus.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:46] good night mdke === rob [n=Robert@ubuntu/member/rob] has joined #ubuntu-doc === manicka [n=manicka@ubuntu/member/manicka] has joined #ubuntu-doc