[12:08] <theCore> where I can report a broken package?
[12:09] <LaserJock> theCore: Malone
[12:09] <ajmitch_> http://launchpad/net/distros/ubuntu/+filebug
[12:09] <ajmitch_> launchpad.net, that is
[12:10] <theCore> thanks, ajmitch_
[12:11] <Erlang> hell, I've got a problem login-in to the REVU page, am I at the right place?
[12:11] <crimsun> what sort of problem?
[12:12] <Erlang> Wrong password.
[12:12] <crimsun> did you attempt to recover your password?
[12:13] <ajmitch_> ugh, people who set bugs as major which just aren't
[12:13] <Erlang> Yes, and it seem to have worked.  Do I need to wait for my first package to appear?  On the wiki it is written I need to use the email address mentionned in my changelog.
[12:13] <tseng> ugh, people who file bugs "beagle uses too much memory"
[12:13] <tseng> over and over
[12:14] <ajmitch_> Erlang: yes, you need to wait
[12:14] <Erlang> oh okay.
[12:14] <Erlang> Shouldn't be very long then.
[12:15] <ajmitch_> as long as you uploaded a source package :)
[12:15] <Erlang> I did, just a few minutes ago (< 5)
[12:15] <ajmitch_> Erlang: what did you upload?
[12:16] <Erlang> Code::Blocks
[12:16] <LaserJock> it uploaded I think
[12:16] <LaserJock> I got an email
[12:16] <Erlang> yeah I see it :D
[12:17] <ajmitch_> ok
[12:17] <hub> ajmitch_: aren't we in freeze?
[12:17] <ajmitch_> hub: yes
[12:19] <Erlang> ah, login-in there was kind of a bitch but it finally worked.
[12:20] <LaserJock> Erlang: did you upload the previous codeblock packages?
[12:21] <Erlang> No.  I didn't know there was a previous codeblocks package.
[12:21] <LaserJock> yes, there was already one there
[12:22] <Erlang> under what package name?
[12:22] <LaserJock> codeblocks
[12:23] <Erlang> I've found it.
[12:23] <ajmitch_> oh great
[12:24] <ajmitch_> so we have 2 people wanting to do the same package again?
[12:24] <Erlang> seems like it.
[12:24] <crimsun> excellent, force them to cooperate! :D
[12:24] <ajmitch_> cooperate or die?
[12:24] <crimsun> that's the spirit!
[12:25] <bmonty> netmeizter (sp?) is the packager of the other codeblocks package
[12:25] <ajmitch_> tseng: I think you should do a mass-reject on beagle bugs
[12:26] <LaserJock> can we get netsmeister's back? Erlang, you should take a look at his package I think.
[12:26] <Erlang> at least the guy did not rip-off my package.
[12:27] <ajmitch_> rip off?
[12:27] <Erlang> copy or anything.  it has been in the wild for a bit
[12:28] <ajmitch_> why would it be a problem if he'd based his packaging on yours?
[12:28] <ajmitch_> it is free software after all
[12:28] <Erlang> good point -_-
[12:28] <bmonty> LaserJock: over the weekend he was on frequently, I think he said he was German
[12:29] <LaserJock> bmonty: yeah, I know him pretty well
[12:30] <bmonty> good, I'll be quiet now :)
[12:30] <Erlang> shouldn't there be a search tool in REVU?
[12:30] <ajmitch_> yeah, it's firefox find-as-you-type :)
[12:30] <LaserJock> "find" in a browser works too ;-)
[12:31] <crimsun> hah, we think alike
[12:31] <ajmitch_> the current REVU was thrown together as a hack, and has served us well
[12:31] <ajmitch_> but it has its flaws & we're redoing it
[12:31] <Erlang> hrm, searching "codeblocks" only finds my package.
[12:32] <ajmitch_> yes
[12:32] <Erlang> oh damn... yes I see
[12:32] <ajmitch_> but if you look at your upload you'll see a history of previous uploads
[12:32] <Erlang> yes yes
[12:32] <Erlang> I guess the other guy will hate me :D
[12:32] <ajmitch_> I see you filed the ITP in debian
[12:32] <Erlang> yes.
[12:33] <ajmitch_> and you've had these packages around for awhile - did you get any interest from sponsors in debian?
[12:35] <Erlang> None.  Packaging C::B prior 1.0rc2 was hell since they used a custom build script.  So I stopped working on it for a while.
[12:35] <Erlang> In short, I did not fight very hard to grasp interest.
[12:36] <ajmitch_> ok
[12:36] <ajmitch_> but you think it's ready to be included in debian now?
[12:37] <Erlang> Well, I see my package still has some flaws, but it is much easier to fix problems now that it is autotooled.  The software itself is has stable as most young software included in Debian.
[12:43] <hub> ajmitch_: is kerry being packaged?
[12:43] <Erlang> I'll warn netzmeister, and ask him about his plans for Debian.  I'll be more than happy to leave this package to somebody else.  I don't really use C::B anyway,.
[12:43] <LaserJock> hub: Kyral was going to do it I believe
[12:43] <LaserJock> hub: but I don't know where he is with that
[12:43] <hub> LaserJock: ok. just wondering
[12:44] <LaserJock> hub: I don't know if he has even started it though, he was going to do it over Spring Break I think
[12:45] <ajmitch_> hub: don't ask me such things :)
[12:46] <hub> ajmitch_: ah sorry. since you do Mono, I thought...
[12:46] <hub> even if it is purely Qt.
[12:58] <tseng> ajmitch_: i agree
[12:59] <tseng> ajmitch_: i did one a week ago, and they all came back as dupes
[01:00] <Toadstool> hi MOTUs o/
[01:01] <LaserJock> hi Toadstool
[01:03] <Toadstool> i'm trying to do my best to find bugs i can handle on launchpad but i often feel like i'm useless :/
[01:03] <Erlang> welcome to the club :D
[01:04] <Toadstool> :)
[01:09] <Erlang> Toadstool: There is plenty of software to package for Ubuntu you know...
[01:10] <Toadstool> yeah but now that Feature Freeze is past for dapper i prefer packaging for debian and then wait for sync ^^
[01:10] <Erlang> that is good too...
[01:12] <Toadstool> my wide-dhcpv6 package is in ubuntu NEW since 2006-02-15...
[01:13] <Toadstool> the latest version was uploaded in sid yesterday :)
[01:13] <Erlang> I've been trying to upload an updated erlang to Debian for a while now... I've stumbled on all sorts of problems.
[01:14] <LaserJock> hi Xoritor
[01:14] <Xoritor> hello LaserJock
[01:14] <Xoritor> how are you tonight?
[01:14] <LaserJock> oh, alright. Still at work.
[01:14] <Xoritor> oh ick
[01:14] <Xoritor> hehe
[01:15] <LaserJock> well, I get most of my Ubuntu work done at work so...
[01:15] <Xoritor> heh
[01:15] <Xoritor> yea me too... work has been kinda slow so... i have been able to work on my stuff for now
[01:15] <Xoritor> :-D
[01:15] <Xoritor> made some massive strides lately
[01:16] <Xoritor> what are you working on?
[01:16] <LaserJock> the Ubuntu Packaging Guide
[01:16] <Xoritor> kick butt
[01:16] <Xoritor> is that acceptable language?
[01:16] <Xoritor> some people are easily offended in irc
[01:16] <Xoritor> heh
[01:16] <LaserJock> I would think so
[01:16] <Xoritor> never know
[01:17] <Toadstool> someone working on a real CDBS guide around here ? 'cause i've never been able to find a correct doc about it...
[01:17] <Amaranth> info cdbs
[01:17] <Xoritor> im working on a real "buzz guide" right now ;-)
[01:17] <Xoritor> hehe
[01:18] <Xoritor> maybe i should hang out in #ubuntu-offtopic ;-)
[01:18] <Xoritor> hah
[01:18] <Toadstool> Amaranth: yeah i've read it but it's far from a i'm-a-packaging-newb guide ^^
[01:18] <LaserJock> Toadstool: I don't think we will have much time to address CDBS much for the Dapper packaging guide, but hopefully dapper+1
[01:18] <Xoritor> Toadstool, im a .deb packaging n00b
[01:18] <azeem> Toadstool: did you see https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml ?
[01:20] <Toadstool> azeem: ah no
[01:20] <Toadstool> looks good
[01:21] <Xoritor> i am not
[01:22] <Toadstool> ajmitch_: yeah you may be right
[01:23] <Xoritor> im waiting on that till i know whats going on a bit more
[01:23] <LaserJock> ajmitch_: I agree, but it at least nice to know what it is I think
[01:24] <Toadstool> on the other hand i've made my first package with cdbs but i've read a great part of /usr/share/cdbs/1 files and dh_* manpages
[01:24] <Amaranth> ajmitch_: they can start with cdbs and slowly learn the rest as they need it
[01:25] <ajmitch_> Amaranth: cdbs can often require knowing some arcane make stuff to arbitrarily put in - debhelper is far better documented & has more examples
[01:26] <Toadstool> yep
[01:26] <ajmitch_> really, cdbs can just hide too much when you're trying to get something working
[01:26] <Toadstool> it depends on what kind of package you're making
[01:27] <ajmitch_> sure, but making a package with cdbs is still 'paste a few lines in here & hope it works'
[01:27] <Toadstool> :)
[01:28] <ajmitch_> I'm not saying cdbs is bad, I've made a package in ~5 min & uploaded into ubuntu 10min later & it worked fine :)
[01:28] <Ubugtu> ubuntu bug 10 in gnutls7 "Ports open but not response from dovecot daemon (hppa)" [Normal,Resolved: notwarty]  http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10
[01:28] <ajmitch_> thanks Ubugtu
[01:28] <Seveas> haha
[01:29] <ajmitch_> Seveas: overzealous regex?
[01:29] <Seveas> how am I ever going to exclude that?
[01:30] <Seveas> it has to ban Ubuntu <int that does not look like a version number>
[01:30] <ajmitch_> who knows, I'll let you figure it out ;)
[01:30] <Seveas> s/ban/matcg/
[01:30] <Seveas> I won't
[01:30] <Seveas> I just let it be this way
[01:30] <ajmitch_> lazy
[01:30] <LaserJock> why would it pick up "10min" though
[01:30] <ajmitch_> because it'll match ubuntu<whitespace><digits>
[01:31] <Seveas> a little more trickery
[01:32] <Toadstool> maybe you should change Ubugtu behaviour and make him show bugs info only when there's something like !bug xxx, 'cause it may be annoying when speaking about a bug and ubugtu shouts at you :)
[01:32] <Seveas> ehrm
[01:32] <Amaranth> Toadstool: no way, i like it
[01:32] <Seveas> the whole REASON for ubugtu to be hear is to shout when you talk about bugs
[01:32] <Toadstool> wow, i should really go to bed my english is getting worse and worse
[01:33] <Seveas> here*
[01:33] <Amaranth> Toadstool: you start discussing a bug and Ubugtu lets everyone know the basics
[01:33] <Toadstool> hum, ok :)
[01:33] <ajmitch_> eg bug 34075 is a little silly
[01:33] <Ubugtu> malone bug 34075 in f-spot "Impossible to launch apps/login on disk full, no feedback" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34075
[01:33] <Amaranth> and gives them an easy link to follow
[01:34] <Amaranth> why is that filed against f-spot?
[01:34] <Toadstool> lol
[01:34] <Seveas> he also respnds to urls like http://launchpad.net/bugs/34075
[01:34] <Ubugtu> malone bug 34075 in f-spot "Impossible to launch apps/login on disk full, no feedback" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
[01:34] <Seveas> and will leave out the url in his response
[01:34] <Amaranth> gnome bug 200000
[01:34] <ajmitch_> Amaranth: because he used f-spot to fill up his disk..
[01:34] <Seveas> because it's already there
[01:34] <Amaranth> hmm
[01:34] <Amaranth> gnome bug 195357
[01:34] <Toadstool> /ignore sometimes Ubugtu
[01:34] <Toadstool> ;)
[01:34] <Amaranth> bleh
[01:35] <ajmitch_> Amaranth: ie, it shouldn't be filed against f-spot at all, since he also filed ubuntu 34073
[01:35] <Seveas> Amaranth, nonexisting bugs?
[01:35] <Amaranth> Seveas: probably
[01:35] <Amaranth> gnome bug 213745
[01:35] <Ubugtu> gnome bug 213745 in Mailer "Unmatched vfolder does not update correctly." [Enhancement,Resolved: duplicate]  http://bugs.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=213745
[01:35] <ajmitch_> Seveas: it hates me, it said 34073 was not found
[01:35] <ajmitch_> malone 34073
[01:35] <Ubugtu> malone bug 34073 in f-spot "F-Spot crashes with large number of pictures" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34073
[01:35] <ajmitch_> hm
[01:35] <ajmitch_> does ubuntu # point to bugzilla still?
[01:35] <Amaranth> mozilla bug 217548
[01:36] <Seveas> ajmitch_, yes
[01:36] <Amaranth> no love for the fox, eh?
[01:36] <Seveas> Amaranth, easy to add
[01:36] <Seveas> @bugtracker list
[01:36] <Ubugtu> debian, freedesktop, gnome, gnome2, malone, ubuntu, and ximian
[01:36] <Toadstool> what would be great with Ubugtu is a little "line" timer which prevents him to flood the chan with the same bug info every two lines, no ?
[01:36] <Amaranth> ximian?
[01:36] <Seveas> @bugtracker add mozilla bugzilla https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/ Mozilla
[01:36] <Seveas> @bugtracker list
[01:37] <Ubugtu> debian, freedesktop, gnome, gnome2, malone, mozilla, ubuntu, and ximian
[01:37] <Amaranth> mozilla bug 217548
[01:37] <ajmitch_> why gnome & gnome2?
[01:37] <Ubugtu> mozilla bug 217548 in Preferences "Junk mail controls - adaptive filters check box" [Major,Resolved: duplicate]  https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=217548
[01:37] <Seveas> @mozilla bug 217548
[01:37] <Amaranth> w00tage
[01:37] <Seveas> ajmitch_, bugs. and bugzilla.
[01:37] <Amaranth> Ubugtu > me
[01:37] <ajmitch_> ok..
[01:37] <Seveas> to grab urls correctly
[01:56] <ToadZzZztool> gn8 motus
[01:57] <crimsun> hmm, slick new sound juicer icon
[02:20] <LaserJock> oh, hi minghua . I didn't see you come in.
[02:21] <minghua> hi LaserJock :-)
[02:28] <LaserJock> hi Kyral
[02:28] <Kyral> hey
[02:34] <Xoritor> ok so i have a library that has plugins for the diff databases it can use
[02:34] <Xoritor> ie... mysql, postgresql, sqlite3
[02:35] <Xoritor> should i build the library with all 3 or make a package for each?
[02:35] <Xoritor> i am thinking a package for each
[02:35] <Xoritor> like snort does
[02:35] <Xoritor> snort, snort-mysql, snort-pgsql
[02:35] <LaserJock> seems logical
[02:36] <Xoritor> so i would have libpreludedb-mysql, libpreludedb-pgsql, and libpreludedb-sqlite3
[02:36] <Xoritor> err... maybe just  libpreludedb-sqlite
[02:37] <Xoritor> more "future compatable"
[02:39] <Xoritor> the other option is to build it against all of them then make a conditional depends so as long as one of them is installed its ok
[02:40] <Spec> is there documentation on what the best practices for packaging a python project are?
[02:40] <LaserJock> Spec: I would look at the Python Policy for Debian
[02:40] <LaserJock> Spec: you can find it at www.debian.org/devel/
[02:41] <Spec> thank you
[02:41] <LaserJock> np
[02:41] <Spec> also, how do i file a bug on launchpad?
[02:41] <Spec> err, about launchpad*
[02:43] <LaserJock> https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bugs is what you want, I think
[02:43] <LaserJock> because Launchpad is a product ;-)
[02:44] <Spec> i think launchpad needs to be more intuitive :p
[02:45] <LaserJock> most people think so, but it is is still a work in progress
[02:46] <Erlang> is being subscribed to universe-bugs a practical solution to get involed with Ubuntu, or would I get flooded by the volume of the list?
[02:47] <dolson> crimsun: rjo updated Ardour today, and he thinks we should put it in too.. he said "Ubuntu might be very interested in ardour 0.99.2 since it fixes the timefx mode which was broken in 0.99*."
[02:48] <crimsun> dolson: please request a UVF exception
[02:49] <dolson> crimsun: I'm doing it. I'm going to find the files and try them to be sure there are no changes needed
[02:49] <dolson> I just wanted you to know I was going to file the request
[02:50] <ajmitch_> Erlang: you'd probably get flooded
[02:53] <Erlang> okay.
[02:54] <Spec> how do you upload a screenshot to launchpad?
[02:56] <LaserJock> Spec: as an attachment?
[02:56] <Spec> i see links for people's screenshots of a rendering bug from library.launchpad.net?
[02:57] <ajmitch_> Spec: 'add attachment' on the right
[02:57] <ajmitch_> probably once you've filed the bug :)
[02:57] <Spec> ah
[02:57] <Spec> let me check
[02:58] <Spec> yay :p
[02:58] <dolson> ooooh, debian even has an alpha build of ardour2
[03:00] <Spec> damn, i think i found a bug in gimp(?) trying to take a screenshot :p
[03:21] <minghua> Erlang: I agree with ajmitch_ (I never read all mails from universe-bugs), subscribing the packages you are interested in is probably a better idea.
[03:22] <minghua> Erlang: subscribing in launchpad, so that you receive all bug reports against said packages
[03:22] <Erlang> okay.
[03:23] <Erlang> I've already subscribed to all Erlang related package.
[03:23] <jaldhar> minghua: why do scim im engines depend on scim itself?  I think that maybe why skim is not working--some kind of conflict
[03:23] <jaldhar> minghua: btw, I am on dapper now
[03:24] <minghua> jaldhar: because scim modules won't work by themselves without scim?
[03:24] <minghua> jaldhar: I have no idea if scim-pinyin can work with skim without scim
[03:24] <minghua> jaldhar: if yes, the dependency should probably be changed to scim | skim
[03:25] <minghua> jaldhar: but I think we still need a dependency there
[03:25] <jaldhar> minghua: scim | skim is what I was thinking but I think I will do more research
[03:27] <minghua> jaldhar: I seriously doubt scim's existense will cause skim to misbehave though (with proper configuration), as not every distro has this scim/libscim separation
[03:28] <minghua> jaldhar: so most likely they have /usr/bin/scim co-installed with /usr/bin/skim for their KDE environment
[03:29] <jaldhar> minghua: the strange thing is if I start scim in a gtk app first, then skim will show im engines
[03:56] <Xoritor> ok i think this may be beyond me
[03:56] <Xoritor> heh
[03:57] <Xoritor> does anyone know of a library that is "split up" into diff "packages"
[03:57] <Xoritor> ie... like snort is split up into snort, snort-mysql, snort-pgsql
[03:57] <jaldhar> xoritor: practically all of them.  What are you trying to do?
[03:58] <Xoritor> jaldhar, im trying to compile libpreludedb and want one "package" for libpreludedb-mysql, one for libpreludedb-pgsql, and one for libprelude-sqlite
[03:59] <Xoritor> each containing only the things they respectively need
[03:59] <Xoritor> i think i just had a brainstorm
[03:59] <jaldhar> Xoritor: it does the standard configure, make, make install correct?
[03:59] <Xoritor> yea
[04:00] <Xoritor> i think i just need to figure out how to tell it to put the mysql stuff in one pgsql stuff in another, and sqlite stuff in a third and have a -common for all the other stuff
[04:01] <jaldhar> Xoritor: have a look at the man page for dh_movefiles
[04:01] <jaldhar> I'm assuming you use debhelper
[04:01] <Xoritor> yep
[04:01] <Xoritor> thx
[04:02] <jaldhar> oops dh_movefiles recommends using dh_install instead
[04:15] <minghua> launchpad is down?
[04:16] <ajmitch_> seems to have some issues
[04:23] <chillywilly> anyone know what this means: [5847210.085000]   CIFS VFS: cifs_mount failed w/return code = -22 ?
[04:24] <chillywilly> could you be more crytpic mr. CIFS file system....
[04:31] <minghua> chillywilly: CIFS is related to samba if I am not mistaken
[04:33] <chillywilly> sure, I asked there too ;)
[04:34] <Lathiat> indeed
[04:34] <Lathiat> samba speaks CIFS
[04:34] <Xoritor> cifs means "common internet filesystem" and its what smb became when M$ tried to make a "standard"
[04:34] <Lathiat> no idea what that error is
[04:34] <chillywilly> I can browse the shares through nautilus and with smbclient just fine
[04:34] <Lathiat> often you try to use a hostname in the mount
[04:34] <Xoritor> of course there is more to it but...
[04:34] <Lathiat> you need to use an IP
[04:35] <Xoritor> or setup dns
[04:35] <chillywilly> yep that's it
[04:35] <chillywilly> bah
[04:36] <chillywilly> I think last time I just had an entry in /etc/hosts
[04:36] <chillywilly> hmm, I dohave an entry there
[04:40] <ajmitch_> don't bother with this 'networking' stuff, it's just a passing fad
[04:40] <chillywilly> haha
[04:40] <chillywilly> ajmitchie
[04:41] <crimsun> wow, this new artwork kicks ass
[04:45] <Amaranth> meh
[04:45] <Amaranth> do you have orange icons too?
[04:45] <Amaranth> they're _way_ too bright
[04:45] <Xoritor> orange.. ick
[04:46] <crimsun> yeah, orange
[04:46] <Amaranth> _WAY_ too bright
[04:46] <Amaranth> like, my eyes are burning bright
[04:48] <minghua> reading the changelog it seems easy enought to change back
[05:07] <dolson> I like the tango icons, personally
[05:08] <dolson> although I am using Human
[05:08] <Mez> siretart, ping
[05:09] <ajmitch_> Mez: at this hour of the morning?
[05:09] <Mez> ajmitch_, oh yeah
[05:09] <Mez> o_O
[05:09] <Mez> lol
[05:09] <Mez> *clicks to switch clock back to UK time*
[05:09] <ajmitch_> siretart keeps fairly normal hours :)
[05:10] <Mez> yeah my clock was on a differnt timezone
[05:10] <Xoritor> what is "normal hours"?
[05:10] <ajmitch_> Xoritor: like being up just before business hours
[05:10] <Xoritor> heh
[05:10] <ajmitch_> and going to bed before dawn
[05:10] <Xoritor> hehehehe
[05:15] <Xoritor> do you have to put the source dir for dh_install?
[05:15] <Xoritor> dh_install --sourcedir=debian/tmp
[05:15] <Xoritor> or is that "default"?
[05:16] <Xoritor> i see my issue
[05:16] <Xoritor> nm
[05:26] <Amaranth> ajmitch_: the orange doesn't bother me, the neon orange does :P
[05:27] <Xoritor> with all this talk of orange i sure am glad there are so many themes out there ;-)
[05:47] <crimsun> I actually like the orange more than the brown
[05:49] <ajmitch_> I like blue rather than orange or brown, actually
[05:49] <ajmitch_> it's one of the first things I change
[05:49] <Xoritor> its probably THE first thing i change
[05:50] <minghua> I think brown is just fine
[05:50] <crimsun> as long as $EDITOR has syntax highlighting, I'm rather indifferent :)
[05:50] <ajmitch_> my personal opinion about the colour notwithstanding, it's whether it's a good default theme
[05:50] <minghua> it took some time to adjust, but now I am quite ok with the human theme
[05:51] <Xoritor> IMHO "time to adjust" means it is not a good theme
[05:51] <minghua> and talking about "first thing I change" and "$EDITOR", the first thing I change is setting $EDITOR to vi
[05:51] <Xoritor> if you have to adjust something is wrong with it
[05:51] <bmonty> I like the human theme, but I change the background
[05:51] <Xoritor> ie... its not "human friendly"
[05:52] <Xoritor> ;-)
[05:52] <ajmitch_> or it's not to your tastes
[05:52] <Xoritor> yea true
[05:52] <Xoritor> everyone has diff tastes
[05:52] <ajmitch_> just because you don't like the default, doesn't mean that it's not 'human-friendly'
[05:52] <bmonty> minghua: same here
[05:53] <Xoritor> but really i dont have anything against the human theme... its just the colors (and i like brown much more than orange) for me
[05:53] <Xoritor> if "human" came in lots of colors so i could choose which one i want... i would use it
[05:54] <Xoritor> but again... thats just me
[05:54] <ajmitch_> which would be technically possible
[05:54] <Xoritor> should be anyways ajmitch_
[05:54] <ajmitch_> if a fully-svg icon set were used
[05:54] <Xoritor> so i have no idea
[05:55] <G0SUB> LaserJock
[05:56] <LaserJock> hi G0SUB
[05:56] <G0SUB> LaserJock where is the current list of packages which MOTU-Science maintains?
[05:56] <Xoritor> night everyone
[05:56] <crimsun> dayam, over 800 lines of diff for _one_ hda codec
[05:57] <ajmitch_> yeah, it's a fair bit of code that got changed
[05:57] <crimsun> and that isn't even the largest one
[05:57] <crimsun> realtek isn't going to be twice that
[05:57] <crimsun> s/n't//
[05:58] <G0SUB> LaserJock ?
[05:59] <LaserJock> G0SUB: sure, tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/all_list.html
[06:00] <G0SUB> LaserJock are all apps in the science category included?
[06:00] <LaserJock> G0SUB: some of them are in Main though, and I need to weed those out
[06:00] <LaserJock> science, math and tex
[06:00] <G0SUB> LaserJock okay ... I have found some in graphics ... where do i list those?
[06:01] <LaserJock> G0SUB: if you just start compiling a list that aren't in the science, matha, or tex sections that would be the easiest
[06:02] <G0SUB> LaserJock I am doing that itself
[06:03] <LaserJock> G0SUB: so what is your question?
[06:03] <G0SUB> LaserJock where do I write those down? in a wiki?
[06:05] <LaserJock> you can make your own list if you want, or we could do a wiki.
[06:05] <LaserJock> maybe a wiki would be the best, then we can get others to help ;-)
[06:05] <G0SUB> okay
[06:07] <G0SUB> LaserJock https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Science/NewPackages
[06:09] <LaserJock> I was thinking more /MOTU/Teams/Science/MiscPackages but whatever
[06:09] <G0SUB> okay, I haven't created the page yet
[06:10] <LaserJock> G0SUB: have you seen w.u.c/UbuntuScientists before?
[06:10] <G0SUB> yes
[06:11] <LaserJock> I think it might be good for use to run through that list after we are done and mark wich apps are in Ubuntu
[06:13] <G0SUB> LaserJock for the time-being, I am using packages.ubuntu.com to search ...
[06:13] <LaserJock> yeah, or synaptic might be helpful also
[06:14] <G0SUB> yes ...
[06:14] <G0SUB> LaserJock we don't have SodiPodi in the Vector Drawing tools list
[06:17] <LaserJock> G0SUB: so maybe we can fill in both the /UbuntuScienctists and /MiscPackages pages together
[06:18] <G0SUB> hmm ... let me do the MiscPackages first ... then we'll classify and put them in UbuntuScientists
[06:18] <LaserJock> exactly
[06:19] <G0SUB> LaserJock btw, I don't think all apps in UbuntuScientists are owned by MOTUScience ... for example Inkscape
[06:21] <LaserJock> G0SUB: sure
[06:22] <LaserJock> G0SUB: and there are lots of apps that aren't in Ubuntu at all
[06:22] <G0SUB> LaserJock so do we take them over? is Inkscape a scientific package?
[06:23] <minghua> inkscape is in graphics section
[06:23] <minghua> and I wouldn't call inkscape a scientific app
[06:23] <G0SUB> hmm ... that's what I think too
[06:23] <minghua> it's probably closer to gimp than to gnuplot
[06:28] <LaserJock> yeah, UbuntuScientists is for apps that scientists might use, especially for people coming from windows
[06:28] <LaserJock> not necessarily scientific apps
[06:29] <LaserJock> but a real lack with that wiki page is that it doesn't correlate with what we have, i.e. package names and which apps are in Ubuntu
[06:31] <G0SUB> LaserJock do we consider different modellers as scientifc apps?
[06:32] <LaserJock> what kind of modellers? what would be an example
[06:33] <G0SUB> some OpenGL modellers ... lightlab
[06:33] <G0SUB> or even blender?
[06:33] <LaserJock> no, but stuff like molecular modellers would be
[06:34] <G0SUB> ok
[06:34] <LaserJock> I mean we already have ~450 source packages, we don't want to cast the net too wide (if we haven't already) :0
[06:34] <G0SUB> LaserJock heh ... and what about scientific python stuff?
[06:35] <LaserJock> yeah, I think that should go in
[06:35] <G0SUB> good
[06:35] <LaserJock> but then I'm partial because I use it ;-)
[06:36] <G0SUB> hehe
[06:39] <G0SUB> LaserJock https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Science/MiscPackages
[06:40] <LaserJock> so you added blender?
[06:40] <LaserJock> doh, spoke to soon
[06:40] <G0SUB> hehe
[06:45] <LaserJock> hmm, metapackages
[06:46] <G0SUB> yeah ...
[06:47] <LaserJock> G0SUB: what is your TZ again?
[06:47] <G0SUB> LaserJock +0530 (IST)
[06:48] <G0SUB> LaserJock it's almost 4 in your place now ...
[06:48] <LaserJock> G0SUB: other way I think. almost 2200
[06:49] <G0SUB> heh, yeah ... it's 12:00 IST here, not GMT
[06:50] <LaserJock> G0SUB: ok, I'm going to go to bed. I'll work on the list in the morning, when you should be asleep or something
[06:50] <G0SUB> LaserJock heh, fine :)
[06:50] <G0SUB> see you
[06:50] <LaserJock> cya
[06:51] <G0SUB> minghua are you busy?
[06:51] <minghua> G0SUB: sort of
[06:51] <G0SUB> minghua okay, later then ... nothing urgent here
[06:52] <minghua> G0SUB: you can always send me a mail if you want something from me
[06:52] <minghua> LaserJock: welcome back :-)
[06:52] <LaserJock> G0SUB: sorry, just thought of something
[06:52] <LaserJock> G0SUB: are you checking source packages?
[06:52] <G0SUB> LaserJock yeah, ask
[06:53] <G0SUB> LaserJock not yet
[06:53] <G0SUB> no actually
[06:53] <LaserJock> G0SUB: we are going to ultimately be interested in source packages
[06:53] <G0SUB> LaserJock okay ... i will take note of that
[06:54] <LaserJock> actually, it might be easier to do the binary packages
[06:54] <LaserJock> and then use one of lucas's scripts to convert the list of binary packages into source packages
[06:54] <G0SUB> well, let's just mark the packages now ... later we can can do this
[06:54] <LaserJock> yes, so just disregard what I said ;-)
[06:55] <G0SUB> LaserJock haha :)
[06:55] <LaserJock> hi minghua btw
[06:55] <G0SUB> minghua sure ... but I just wanted to discuss something related to Debian with you
[06:56] <minghua> G0SUB: hmm, why with me particularly?  is it related to scim?
[06:56] <G0SUB> minghua well, no ... but debian in general ... and you because i know you and also since you are a DD
[06:57] <ajmitch_> minghua: maybe you're getting a reputation as a someone knowledgeable about debian ;)
[06:57] <minghua> G0SUB: no, I am not a DD :-)
[06:57] <G0SUB> ajmitch_ :)
[06:57] <G0SUB> minghua doesn't matter
[06:58] <G0SUB> ajmitch_ hehe
[06:58] <minghua> G0SUB: if it's nothing private, feel free to talk here, I think I will have time to answer in half a hour
[06:59] <G0SUB> minghua just ping me when you are free ... I would like to talk in Private
[06:59] <ajmitch_> hey Yagisan
[06:59] <ajmitch_> how are you?
[07:00] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: haven't seen ytou round for awhile - what's your opinion of apparmour? ;)
[07:01] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: me - up shit creek without a paddle. apparmour looks similar to grsecs RBAC, but i haven't had time to compare the two. I've been waiting for gcc 4.1 to hit debian :)
[07:01] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: why are you up the creek?
[07:03] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: caring for my wife after the hospital fuckup is becoming very stressful, I can't devote enough time to generating an income as well, and my NEIS funding was cancelled as a result
[07:04] <ajmitch_> ouch :(
[07:04] <ajmitch_> that's got to be hard
[07:06] <Yagisan> it is. I get to spend this weekend refactoring my finances, and trying to work out how to balance both family and work. The hospital stuff up was bad enough that my wife needs help to do almost everything
[07:08] <Yagisan> hmm, that skaller guy is accusing ubuntu of gpl violations in debian-mentors.
[07:10] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: sure, he's also insinuating the same of debian
[07:10] <ajmitch_> idiocy knows no bounds
[07:11] <Yagisan> it must be hard to read when your head is stuck so far up your arse you can't see.
[07:12] <Yagisan> G'day Hobbsee
[07:12] <Hobbsee> hey Yagisan
[07:12] <ajmitch_> what happened with the hospital?
[07:12] <ajmitch_> hello Hobbsee
[07:13] <Hobbsee> hey ajmitch_
[07:13] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: I dumped CSU about a week ago, and they sent me an email last nigh stating I was "at risk of exclusion"
[07:13] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[07:13] <Hobbsee> odd that!
[07:14] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: when my wife gave birth, the hospital fucked up on the episectomy, and creaded a 4th degree tear
[07:14] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: you should see my reply
[07:14] <Hobbsee> hehe - pastebin it?
[07:14] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: it's pdf
[07:14] <Hobbsee> ah ok
[07:15] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: in effect they tore the barrier between her vagina and rectum so bad a train wreck looks cleaner
[07:15] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: they then *discharged* her with no treatment
[07:16] <ajmitch_> that's criminal
[07:17] <G0SUB> Yagisan who? where?
[07:17] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: oh, they claim they did everything right.
[07:17] <minghua> G0SUB: I am back
[07:17] <G0SUB> minghua :)
[07:17] <crimsun> there's a(n in)famous book about similar things in the USA by Naomi Wolf called _Misconceptions_
[07:17] <minghua> and hello Yagisan
[07:17] <ajmitch_> right? they call that right?
[07:18] <crimsun> it pretty much documents problems with the birth procedure in USA hospitals
[07:18] <Yagisan> G0SUB: my wife is the pooor victum. The perp is Westmead hospital, westmeand, nsw, australia
[07:18] <G0SUB> Yagisan in which country did this happen?
[07:18] <G0SUB> holy crap!
[07:18] <Yagisan> s/westmeand/westmead
[07:18] <G0SUB> Yagisan is she alright now?
[07:18] <Yagisan> we had a specalist quote 6+ months before she is healed
[07:19] <ajmitch_> it's the sort of thing that makes you very angry
[07:19] <minghua> Yagisan: really sorry to hear about that happened to your wife
[07:20] <Yagisan> yes it does.
[07:20] <G0SUB> Yagisan can you please tell me how such a thing happened to her?
[07:20] <Yagisan> thanks for your sympathy guys/girls.
[07:20] <Yagisan> G0SUB: I think we had a medical student as the midwife
[07:20] <G0SUB> these things may happen in remote places in India
[07:21] <G0SUB> Yagisan so she was pregnant?
[07:21] <crimsun> G0SUB: it actually occurs consistently in the USA, too.
[07:21] <Yagisan> as every other doctor and midwife we have spoken to said "WTF ?? that's not right"
[07:21] <Yagisan> G0SUB: it was while she gave birth
[07:21] <G0SUB> Yagisan how's the child?
[07:22] <Yagisan> he's fine
[07:22] <G0SUB> good
[07:22] <Yagisan> mum however is not. Neither physically or emotionally
[07:22] <G0SUB> I pray that she gets well soon ...
[07:22] <Yagisan> thanks
[07:22] <crimsun> best wishes for you all
[07:25] <Yagisan> crimsun: thanks for the book. I'll see if I can find a copy
[07:26] <Kyral> Night MOTU
[07:28] <Hobbsee> night Kyral
[07:31] <Yagisan> Night Kyral
[07:32] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: pastebined the reply to CSU, but it failed to word wrap. http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/9948
[07:33] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: ok
[07:34] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: at least you should get a laugh out of it
[07:34] <Hobbsee> hehe oh i am
[07:35] <Hobbsee> and i copied the text, and pasted it into kate - reads fine :D
[07:35] <Hobbsee> haha nice
[07:35] <Hobbsee> csu is charles sturt uni, isnt it?
[07:36] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: yes it is
[07:37] <ajmitch_> Hobbsee: what uni are you at ?
[07:37] <Hobbsee> ajmitch_: macquarie
[07:38] <Hobbsee> ah crap!
[07:38] <Hobbsee> ouch.
[07:38] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: my email isn't that funny ;)
[07:38] <ajmitch_> Hobbsee: ouch :)
[07:39] <Hobbsee> no, that was leaning down to try and pick stuff up off the ground :P
[07:39] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: it's a masterpiece
[07:39] <Hobbsee> then overbalancing and going splat!
[07:39] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: a few spelling mistakes blemish it, but overall it's good
[07:39] <ajmitch_> Hobbsee: that was silly
[07:39] <Hobbsee> it was!
[07:40] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: it was 4am, and I was furious. I also had to use their web based system, not my beloved evolution with spellcheck
[07:40] <ajmitch_> how nasty
[07:41] <ajmitch_> Hobbsee: so when will you be ready to go for MOTU? :)
[07:41] <Hobbsee> hehe got no idea
[07:42] <ajmitch_> got more packages underway?
[07:42] <Hobbsee> looking forward dapper+1 open development though
[07:42] <ajmitch_> or just doing kde maintenance for now?
[07:42] <Hobbsee> not at the moment
[07:42] <Hobbsee> something like that
[07:42] <ajmitch_> good, we need bugfixers
[07:42] <Hobbsee> doesnt mean that i can fix a lot yet though...
[07:43] <ajmitch_> you'll learn
[07:44] <Yagisan> lets see, that gets Hobbsee, StevenK doing work. I can sit there and gasbag while my kids run around. Who else ?
[07:45] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:45] <ajmitch_> jdub, lifeless
[07:45] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: no, that would leave you to go and work at my work :P
[07:45] <ajmitch_> plenty of others in sydney :)
[07:45] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: your work ?
[07:45] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: supermarket
[07:45] <ajmitch_> ah
[07:45] <ajmitch_> lucky you
[07:46] <Hobbsee> in fact, you might enjoy it, seeing as i doubt they'd try hitting on you...
[07:46] <ajmitch_> next planned trip isn't till 2008 though :)
[07:46] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: Coles or Woolies ? (and where ?)
[07:46] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: bilo
[07:46] <Yagisan> Hobbsee: so basically coles ;)
[07:46] <Hobbsee> something like that
[07:47] <Hobbsee> hehe yeah
[07:47] <Hobbsee> that'd be fun
[07:49] <ajmitch_> I'll just tell my parent I'm off to australia, yet again
[07:49] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: so when do you move here ;)
[07:50] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: maybe next year, though I'll probably move to melbourne :)
[07:51] <Hobbsee> haha
[07:51] <Hobbsee> yes, brisbane and high temperatures, yeah
[07:52] <Hobbsee> which reminds me, i was planning to go out tonight, and see a friend of mine who has a pool
[07:57] <crimsun> wow, um patch_analog.c has 1642 lod
[07:57] <crimsun> I think benc just might frown
[07:58] <ajmitch_> that's unfortunate
[07:58] <crimsun> this one set is going to be massive
[07:59] <ajmitch_> what are most of the changes?
[07:59] <crimsun> full table definitions of codecs
[07:59] <crimsun> there's no way around it, either
[08:00] <crimsun> the initialisation methods have changed so much since 1.0.10rc3 that to get your sound working, these changes are necessary
[08:00] <ajmitch_> no, it's not stuff you can just throw out
[08:01] <Yagisan> bbl - need to do dad stuff(tm)
[08:01] <ajmitch_> did you have to work around the semaphore changes?
[08:01] <ajmitch_> see you later Yagisan
[08:02] <crimsun> no, the semaphore changes can be skipped for the codecs I've processed so far
[08:03] <crimsun> Ingo's changes really are very, very well contained
[08:03] <ajmitch_> good
[08:03] <ajmitch_> why were the changes made?
[08:05] <crimsun> performance, mainly
[08:05] <crimsun> he has made it much simpler and faster
[08:05] <crimsun> http://lwn.net/Articles/165039/ is a pretty good overview
[08:12] <ajmitch_> nice, sounds liek something useful
[08:36] <Yagisan> re
[08:36] <ajmitch_> welcome back
[08:37] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: heh - both child processes are now in the S state :)
[08:37] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: have you noticed ssp is now part of gcc 4.1 :) I'm very much looking forward to that
[08:37] <ajmitch_> yeah, I heard that
[08:38] <G0SUB> vuntz
[08:38] <G0SUB> vuntz ping
[08:39] <vuntz> pong
[08:39] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: I wonder if we can set an autobuilder up to automatically build all apps with ssp enabled
[08:39] <Yagisan> ?
[08:39] <G0SUB> vuntz read your blog ...
[08:39] <ajmitch_> now, or for dapper+1?
[08:39] <G0SUB> vuntz would like to volunteer for pessulus
[08:40] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: dapper+1 , and for testing purposes @ home
[08:40] <ajmitch_> GOSUB: cool, start hacking on it :)
[08:40] <G0SUB> ajmitch_ :)
[08:40] <vuntz> G0SUB: cool
[08:40] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: siretart knows sbuild well, though infinity is the buildd guy
[08:40] <vuntz> G0SUB: can you send me a mail (vuntz at gnome.org)? I'll have to leave for work really soon now
[08:40] <G0SUB> vuntz my C is a bit rusty now, else could have helped with gnome-panel too ...
[08:40] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: I doubt anything would break, but I'd like to gather data on what effects if any it has on i386/amd64
[08:41] <G0SUB> vuntz yeah, I can mail you ...
[08:41] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: and comparative benchmarks would be nice
[08:41] <G0SUB> vuntz more on this later ...
[08:42] <ajmitch_> Yagisan: sure
[08:42] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: in effect, I'd like to have a mountain of documentation, graphs etc with me, so I can effectively redo UDU's proactive security, and get a "yes" this time
[08:42] <ajmitch_> but I think it might be done for dapper+1 anyway :)
[08:43] <ajmitch_> you'd want to talk to doko for gcc & pitti for security
[08:43] <ajmitch_> but they're both keen on having it enabled
[08:43] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: I know pitti was keen, didn't know about doko though
[08:44] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: isn't it odd that infrastructure like wanna-build isn't packaged ?
[08:44] <ajmitch_> not particularly, when you know what debian is like :)
[08:47] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: what suffering from multiple personality disorder ?
[08:47] <ajmitch_> yeah
[08:49] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: you'd think they would package what they need (I'd like it if they did anyway), so they could easily deploy new systems.
[08:50] <ajmitch_> nah
[08:50] <ajmitch_> it's in cvs
[08:50] <ajmitch_> and some of it is packaged
[08:53] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: ubuntu does not use wanna-build anymore does it ?
[08:55] <ajmitch_> not that I know of
[08:57] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: IIRC ubuntu deployed a new system on launchpad. I think it was soyez or something like that. I thought it was a wanna-build replacement
[08:57] <ajmitch_> yes, launchpad replaces most of that functionality
[08:58] <ajmitch_> I'm just not sure exactly how much
[09:01] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: I'm also not very familiar with launchpad. Seems hard to find what I want.
[09:02] <ajmitch_> a twisty maze of passages, all alike
[09:04] <Yagisan> ajmitch_: hmm, that reminds me of nethack. I keep dieing on that, very quickly.
[09:09] <Yagisan> hmm, evil wesnoth. It won't let me level Konrad from Youth to lord after 1 exp.
[09:11] <ajmitch_> how disappointing
[09:13] <Hobbsee> urgh, there's an update on gnupg - and it's after feature freeze
[09:14] <ajmitch_> Hobbsee: so? it's a security update, so it's sort of required
[09:15] <ajmitch_> plenty of things are being updated after feature freeze
[09:15] <Hobbsee> true
[09:16] <Hobbsee> ajmitch_: http://lists.gnupg.org/pipermail/gnupg-announce/2006q1/000216.html - fun
[09:16] <ajmitch_> looks like it's nearly time for me to disappear for the night
[09:16] <ajmitch_> yes, saw it on slashdot
[09:16] <crimsun> cya ajmitch_
[09:16] <ajmitch_> nearly time, I said ;)
[09:16] <crimsun> hehe
[09:16] <ajmitch_> since I'm waiting on someone to give me a lift to the hotel
[09:17] <ajmitch_> & then back to NZ tomorrow morning
[09:17] <Hobbsee> ah ok
[09:17] <ajmitch_> so sad to leave this country behind, really ;)
[09:18] <Hobbsee> hehe
[09:19] <Yagisan> catch you all later. hopefully with good news next time.
[09:20] <crimsun> later Yagisan
[09:20] <ajmitch_> bye Yagisan
[09:20] <Hobbsee> bye Yagisan
[09:24] <crimsun> ...4803 lod for patch_realtek.c
[09:25] <ajmitch_> ouch
[09:26] <crimsun> I'm going to attach urls to ubuntuforums posts as justification
[09:27] <ajmitch_> & my personal recommendation? :)
[09:28] <crimsun> sure. This patch is a lot more important than the weight of the others, because so many of the new laptops use an ALC* codec
[09:28] <ajmitch_> and also desktop motherboards now also
[09:29] <crimsun> Particularly with Dapper needing to be supported for 3 years, it'll be an issue if people can't hear anything
[09:40] <ajmitch_> ok, see you all in a day or so
[09:41] <crimsun> 'evening
[09:43] <Hobbsee_away> bye ajmitch_
[09:44] <crimsun> cya Hobbsee_away
[10:21] <zakame> hi all
[10:31] <Tonio_> hello everyone
[10:37] <zakame> hi Tonio_
[10:38] <Tonio_> hey zakame ;)
[10:41] <Toadstool> hi everybody
[10:45] <Hobbsee> hmmm...this gnupg update definetly doesnt like me.  it's free for anyone else to package...
[10:46] <zakame> hmm what's with gnupg?
[10:48] <Hobbsee> security update
[10:48] <Hobbsee> needs packaging
[10:49] <minghua> zakame: a security release
[10:49] <zakame> ah
[10:50] <zakame> gaah its noticeable, I'm not in the know :(
[10:54] <minghua> but isn't gpg in main?  why Hobbsee is trying to package it?
[10:54] <Hobbsee> minghua: it's a security *update* - therefore, the current package needs upgrading ;)
[10:55] <Hobbsee> not doing it from scratch - but i still got errors, so am leaving it for the moment
[10:56] <minghua> Hobbsee: yeah, I get the meaning of the update ;-)  what I was trying to ask is why are you (if you are indeed) doing a main upload
[10:56] <zakame> true, but still you'll need a core-dev to upload the updated package
[10:57] <Hobbsee> oh, fair enoguh
[10:58] <Hobbsee> figured that i could upgrade it, then someone else could have a look and upload it.   maybe this isnt the case.
[10:58] <zakame> you can, actually :)
[11:00] <minghua> it's not like I receive life critical messages signed by gpg every day
[11:01] <minghua> Hobbsee: Hmm...  find a good hiding place before uploading? :-P
[11:01] <Hobbsee> hehe
[11:02] <Hobbsee> in the basement, in a locked filing cabinet, where the lights had gone (and so had the stairs), with a large friendly sign on it saying "beware of the leppard"?
[11:02] <Hobbsee> dodgy paraphrase - i dont remember the exact quote
[11:04] <zakame> lol
[04:45] <Xoritor> i think i am getting the hang of this
[04:45] <Xoritor> :-D
[04:45] <Xoritor> yay
[05:44] <Xoritor> are the the things in /usr/share/aclocal/ supposed to be in the -dev package of a library?
[05:45] <Xoritor> or a part of the standard package, in this case i made a -common for the *.so files and perl/python bindings
[05:46] <Xoritor> im just not sure if the *.m4 should be part of -common or -dev
[05:46] <Xoritor> to me its a -dev package, but im not 100% sure
[06:25] <freetux> Bonjour  tous, je viens sur les conseils de tonio suite  un commentaire sur mon blog
[06:29] <hugelmopf> hey motus... there is a lastfm player in debian testing and unstable and i was wondering, if we are going to have it for dapper? it is not in the package list on packages.ubuntu.com.
[06:42] <LaserJock> hi MOTU world
[06:43] <JohnnyMast> hi LaserJock
[06:45] <LaserJock> how is it going JohnnyMast ?
[06:48] <JohnnyMast> flex :) i never had time anymore to help out here
[06:48] <JohnnyMast> but things are changing now
[06:50] <LaserJock> JohnnyMast: good :)
[06:50] <JohnnyMast> :D
[07:02] <Xoritor> hi LaserJock
[07:03] <LaserJock> hi Xoritor
[07:05] <G0SUB> LaserJock
[07:05] <Xoritor> ok... to me .m4 files are part of a -dev package... but im not sure... this is an m4 file for aclocal (which i think should be in -dev)
[07:06] <Xoritor> so where do you guys/gals think this should go ./usr/share/aclocal/libpreludedb.m4
[07:06] <Xoritor> in a -dev or in the main .deb
[07:07] <azeem> neither
[07:07] <azeem> hrm
[07:07] <azeem> in the -dev
[07:07] <azeem> if at all
[07:08] <azeem> what does it provide?
[07:08] <Xoritor> i will have to check one sec
[07:08] <azeem> ah right, prelude refuses to use pkg-config, so it doesn't provide a .pc file either, reverting to M4 hacks
[07:08] <Xoritor> dnl Autoconf macros for libpreludedb
[07:09] <Xoritor> so is that a -dev package or not?
[07:09] <azeem> there is a -dev package already, right?
[07:09] <Xoritor> i normally would think so, but you never know with this
[07:09] <LaserJock> G0SUB: hi, I'm working on the list at the moment ;-)
[07:09] <Xoritor> im making one yes, but its not in there
[07:09] <G0SUB> LaserJock great :)
[07:09] <azeem> Xoritor: I'd put it in there, then
[07:09] <Xoritor> azeem, i will have to add it
[07:09] <LaserJock> hi raphink and azeem
[07:10] <azeem> hi LaserJock!"
[07:10] <Xoritor> azeem, very cool thank you
[07:13] <raphink> hi LaserJock
[07:18] <LaserJock> raphink: catch the train ok?
[07:24] <raphink> LaserJock: sure :)
[07:24] <raphink> LaserJock: the train was very late ;)
[07:24] <LaserJock> raphink: did you sleep at all?
[07:25] <raphink> 2 hours or so :)
[07:33] <LaserJock> raphink: I probably had ~9 and I'm still feeling tired :(
[07:33] <raphink> ;)
[07:44] <LaserJock> doko__: had any luck with vnc4?
[07:45] <doko__> LaserJock: no, didn't try any further
[07:48] <LaserJock> doko__: seems a shame, but I had a hard time figuring out what it was doing. Carrying part of the X source with it seems like a problem to me.
[08:03] <phanatic> hi people
[08:04] <Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
[08:04] <phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga
[08:08] <G0SUB> LaserJock any comments on the list?
[08:11] <LaserJock> G0SUB: just finished, take a look
[08:12] <G0SUB> LaserJock great!
[08:14] <LaserJock> one thing I noticed is the Electronics section. I wonder if we should add it
[08:14] <G0SUB> hmm, electronics
[08:14] <G0SUB> I wondered too
[08:15] <LaserJock> I was thinking of adding electronics and weeding out some of Tex to specific packages that are useful for scientists
[08:16] <G0SUB> hmm, possible
[08:18] <LaserJock> I think electronics is closer to science than a lot of the tex stuff
[08:18] <G0SUB> i agree
[08:21] <LaserJock> hi mkrufky
[08:24] <LaserJock> mkrufky: one thing to note is that you need to send a signed email to the REVU admins to get your gpg key in the keyring.
[08:31] <LaserJock> G0SUB: yeah, there are 129 tex source packages. I don't think we need to carry all that.
[08:31] <G0SUB> yes
[08:33] <Xoritor> yay
[08:42] <LaserJock_lunch> I'll be back in a bit, lunch with the wife ;-)
[08:43] <G0SUB> LaserJock_lunch heh :)
[08:58] <sistpoty> hi folks
[08:59] <phanatic> hi sistpoty
[09:00] <netzmeister> hi siretart
[09:00] <netzmeister> ups..
[09:00] <netzmeister> ;-)
[09:01] <netzmeister> hi sistpoty
[09:01] <sistpoty> hi phanatic and netzmeister
[09:01] <sistpoty> motu-meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
[09:04] <Tonio_> hello
[09:04] <phanatic> hi Tonio_
[09:04] <sistpoty> hi Tonio_
[09:05] <sistpoty> Tonio_: motu-meeting in #ubuntu-meeting ;)
[09:05] <Tonio_> oups, I completly forgot
[09:05] <sistpoty> well, we didn't start yet ;)
[09:05] <Tonio_> sistpoty: already started ?
[09:05] <Tonio_> okay :)
[09:06] <Tonio_> sistpoty: everyone instroduced himself ?
[09:06] <sistpoty> no
[09:06] <Tonio_> good
[09:06] <Tonio_> sistpoty: thanks for the reminding ;)
[09:06] <sistpoty> np ;)
[09:13] <mkrufky> LaserJock_lunch: sorry, i was AFK when you wrote me
[09:50] <slomo> oh there was a meeting? damn...
[09:50] <sebest_> hello slomo
[09:50] <slomo> hi sebest_ :)
[09:51] <slomo> sebest_: i wasn't very successfull with the dbus/avahi reconnection... you?
[09:52] <sebest_> neither, i wonder if writing python bindings on top of the c API wouldn't be a better solution
[09:52] <raphink> yes there was ;)
[09:53] <slomo> sebest_: maybe... but it should be possible with using dbus directly too... the question is how? :(
[09:54] <Xoritor> grrrrr
[09:54] <Xoritor> so dh_strip is having fits
[09:54] <Xoritor> dh_strip BFD: debian/samhain/usr/sbin/samhain: warning: Empty loadable segment detected, is this intentional
[09:55] <Xoritor> works great for 64bit stuff... for 32bit stuff i get that ^
[09:55] <sebest_> slomo: yes i should be, but i guess we would need some help from pydbus hackers :)
[09:55] <slomo> sebest_: btw... http://avahi.org/ticket/19
[09:56] <slomo> sebest_: will you care for it in the next days? (sda dbus stuff, not that bug ;) )
[09:58] <sebest_> i looked at the bug
[10:04] <LaserJock> is the meeting over?
[10:04] <tseng> yes
[10:04] <LaserJock> dang, it. My wife called and asked if I wanted to go to lunch. I totally forgot :(
[10:05] <Xoritor> heh
[10:08] <LaserJock> thanks Xoritor but I gotta get lots of work done :)
[10:09] <LaserJock> so what's up with pushing the Dapper release? What would that mean for us?
[10:11] <Xoritor> hehehe
[10:12] <Xoritor> pushing? as in "pushing back" ?
[10:12] <LaserJock> yeah, Mark is talking about pushing the Dapper release by ~ 6 weeks
[10:13] <tseng> hm what for
[10:14] <LaserJock> more polish, testing, and translations it appears
[10:14] <LaserJock> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-art/2006-March/000734.html
[10:21] <dolson> can someone assist me with a UVF exception request?
[10:22] <dolson> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ardour/+bug/34266
[10:22] <Ubugtu> malone bug 34266 in ardour "ardour UVF exception request" [Normal,Needs info] 
[10:23] <LaserJock> dolson: I think the suggestion is to go check out what has changed from the ardour website.
[10:23] <dolson> that is already in the report
[10:24] <dolson> there is no ChangeLog file that I can find in the ardour soure tree, other than the one in debian/
[10:24] <LaserJock> dolson: that is what I mean by going to their website
[10:25] <dolson> I don't follow you.. I'm sorry
[10:25] <tseng>  * matthias still waits for somebody to fix libbonoboui toolbars
[10:25] <tseng> < pbor> heh
[10:25] <tseng> ugh
[10:26] <LaserJock> dolson: go to the ardour website and look for info on what changes were made
[10:26] <dolson> LaserJock: I did that already, and it is in that bug report... I don't understand what I am supposed to do
[10:27] <LaserJock> dolson: ok, well it looks like dholbach and I both read over that too quickly ;-)
[10:27] <dolson> I can paste it into a file and attach it I guess
[10:28] <LaserJock> in some ways that might help, I'm so used to looking in files for that sort of thing
[10:28] <dolson> I can tell :)
[10:30] <Xoritor> ok if i am just adding a config option which number should i bump in this   3ubuntu10
[10:31] <Xoritor> should that be 4ubuntu10 or 3ubuntu11 (i would say the latter)
[10:31] <Xoritor> further right == least amount of change
[10:32] <LaserJock> Xoritor: yeah, the version right before the "ubuntu" is for Debian ;-)
[10:32] <Xoritor> k
[10:34] <Xoritor> thought so
[10:36] <siretart> dolson: did you compile, install and test the new ardour?
[10:36] <dolson> siretart: yeah, no changes need to be made
[10:38] <siretart> if you compile and install packages you want an uvf request, please make a copy of the build- and installlog for attaching that to the report
[10:39] <dolson> can you tell me where those files go? I used pbuilder to build and dpkg to install
[10:41] <sistpoty> dolson: you can use pbuilder --logfile <buildlog> to make a buildlog... for install-tests I'd suggest piuparts
[10:41] <sistpoty> huhu siretart btw ;)
[10:42] <siretart> hey, sistpoty! :)
[10:42] <LaserJock> Guten Abend siretart and sistpoty
[10:42] <sistpoty> hi LaserJock
[10:43] <siretart> but you can also use tools like script(1)
[10:43] <minghua> siretart: yeah, I think requiring pbuilder build log and piuparts test log for UVF exception request is a good idea
[10:44] <LaserJock> is piuparts pretty easy to set up?
[10:44] <tseng> as easy as pbuilder
[10:44] <tseng> you can even use the same targz
[10:44] <siretart> it can use pbuilders base.tar.gz
[10:44] <siretart> yes
[10:45] <LaserJock> ok, cool. I wanted to add it to the Packaging Guide.
[10:48] <dolson> well, it doesn't work for me. that's great
[10:48] <minghua> LaserJock: easy to set up, but require a fast mirror (or a local one) to use efficiently, IMO
[10:49] <LaserJock> minghua: ok, I'll make a note of that. Thanks
[10:50] <minghua> LaserJock: and btw hello, and I missed the motu meeting as well :-(
[10:53] <siretart> oh, there was a motu meeting, sorry for not attending, I was at uni until nearly 2000CET :/
[10:55] <LaserJock> slomo: ping?
[10:55] <slomo> LaserJock: pong
[10:56] <LaserJock> slomo: did you look at my tetex-src UVF exception request or just change the status because of dholbach's comment?
[10:58] <slomo> LaserJock: mostly because of dholbach's comment... but i looked at it as well :) i see no reason why we shouldn't update this... but i see no reason why we have this and should update it as well...
[11:01] <LaserJock> slomo: well, I think it is because tetex-base doesn't ship the actual source
[11:01] <LaserJock> slomo: honestly, I don't know much about the package. I just use it. I'm trying to get some info from Debian
[11:01] <slomo> LaserJock: apt-get source tetex-base would get the source, wouldn't it? is this just like linux-source / linux-image?
[11:02] <LaserJock> slomo: I don't think so
[11:02] <slomo> so the sources of tetex-base contain not the sources? ok... in that case we should update and i think dholbach will have the same oppinion then :)
[11:04] <minghua> LaserJock: give me the bug number of this tetex-src UVF exception?  I want to subscribe to it
[11:04] <LaserJock> slomo: I'm not positive, but I think that is the case. I looked at a few of the tetex "packages" and the files in the source package of tetex-base != the files in tetex-src
[11:04] <LaserJock> minghua: 34242
[11:05] <minghua> thanks
[11:06] <LaserJock_away> another meeting :(
[11:06] <slomo> LaserJock_away: ok, interesting... add this to the bug please :)
[11:10] <siretart> dolson: re seq24: isn't there an upstream changelog?
[11:10] <siretart> dolson: did you really test the new upstream version?
[11:11] <dolson> siretart: there is a changelog, although it hasn't changed in a long time.. the diff gives no output
[11:11] <dolson> I made a song with it, so I think it's good
[11:12] <dolson> the ardour buildlog is still being created, I'll attach it when this is complete
[11:12] <siretart> hm. I'm undecided about seq24
[11:16] <dolson> that's understandable
[11:16] <dolson> just go ahead and reject it. I'm probably one of 10 people that use it anyhow
[11:17] <dolson> I can't even get to the upstream site to get the list of changes. it's been down for two days
[11:18] <dolson> I can't even spell buildlog
[11:19] <siretart> dolson: I have to decide which of the 2 version is more stable for dapper: the new one and the old one
[11:20] <siretart> dolson: the decision woul be easier when I knew what actually was changed.
[11:21] <siretart> dolson: if you (and perhaps others) would say that they tested the new version, and it is more stable than the old one, and they don't expect bigger problems, and that the update is necessary and a good idea and so on, I'll happily agree
[11:21] <siretart> same btw for the other 2 members of the uvf team
[11:21] <dolson> I understand. I'm trying to find a google cache
[11:23] <dolson> well, the only thing I can say is that I had some lockups with the old one that the interface didn't respond. now, whether that was to do with my kernel or the app itself, I don't know, I was messing with different patches and things
[11:23] <dolson> other than that, I haven't had any issues with any version of seq24
[11:26] <siretart> dolson: if you hadn't bad issues with the old version, how about leaving the old one dapper, and putting a newer on in dapper-backports?
[11:27] <dolson> siretart: that's fine with me. I don't know how to get stuff into backports, but I asked jdong on the forums to see if my guys (from ubuntustudio) can cooperate with him to get updated audio apps... it's a big complaint I hear almost daily from people on IRC, MSN, AIM, etc
[11:29] <siretart> dolson: well, if the problem was that the applications would be always outdated, then some add-on repository could help, but..
[11:30] <dolson> I don't agree with a 3rd party repo. that's why I'm here
[11:30] <siretart> dolson: my impression is that many audio application are simply not mature enough. so whats actually needed is more upstream work (upstreams are usually happy for any help they are offered)
[11:30] <dolson> there's a difference between bleeding edge and "released almost a year ago"
[11:31] <siretart> I agree that there is no need for another 3rd party repo
[11:31] <siretart> so whats the point?
[11:32] <dolson> what's the point of what?
[11:34] <siretart> never mind
[11:38] <dolson> Linux audio apps have come a long way... they're improving all the time. I'm not a programmer, or I would help out upstream. Just because they aren't at the exact same level as commercial apps for other OSes doesn't mean that we should simply ignore them
[11:39] <siretart> the same applies not only to audio related applications but to every free software
[11:39] <dolson> I agree. and other people are concerned with other software, and not audio. I am concerned with audio, and not others