[12:03] <buxy> and for which debian has no official policy yet
[12:03] <buxy> and which causes serious problems since they are trying to provide the same kind of information than Debian packages (dependency resolution between python modules) except that it doesn't match well with the packaging
[12:04] <azeem> ugh
[12:05] <buxy> but I don't know any technical detail, that's just what I observed from the discussions
[12:05] <buxy> and it's really sad that we have no official policy yet because lots of cool stuff are using eggs nowadays (including Turbogears)
[12:08] <sivang> Spec, azeem : what's an egg?
[12:10] <azeem> sivang: I asked that as well
[12:12] <Spec> it's a new python packaging thing
[12:12] <Spec> looks like a zip file to me
[12:13] <Spec> so, umm, what should I do about packaging an egg? just throw the egg in site-packages? :p
[12:13] <Spec> or should i stick to the older convention of just having a folder of the module name in the site-packages
[12:50] <Kyral> Riddell, if I package a bunch of those Service Menu scripts for Konqueror from KDE-Apps, where would I install hem to? (They normally go in ~/.kde/apps/somehing...)
[02:00] <LaserJock> hmm, kinda quiet today
[02:05] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:05] <LaserJock> hiya bddebian
[02:06] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[02:12] <LaserJock> argghhh, darwinports and fink remind me how much I love Ubuntu
[02:13] <Lathiat> hehe
[02:15] <LaserJock> espectially on a x86 mac :(
[02:16] <Kyral> Gah finding a Tablet hat Linux will behave on is gonna be a PITA
[02:16] <bddebian> Heh
[02:16] <Kyral> Well, most of the sites tthat I visit say the only thing NOT working is screen rotation
[02:18] <Kyral> *shrugs and goes to watch TV*
[02:27] <azeem> bddebian: HAPPY BIRTHDAY
[02:27] <bddebian> ssshhh
[02:27] <LaserJock> it's his birthday!!!!
[02:27] <crimsun> omg it's bddebianIsGod's birthday
[02:29] <LaserJock> darn, I can't imagine a IRC version of "Happy Birthday" working very well ;-)
[02:30] <bddebian> hehe
[03:58] <Hobbsee|CInstall> what's a build/install log?
[03:59] <bddebian> ?
[03:59] <Hobbsee|CInstall> bddebian: mentioned in https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html
[04:00] <bddebian> Hmm, I assume they mean debuild/dpkg-buildpackage > build.log 2>&1?
[04:03] <Hobbsee|CInstall> hmmm
[04:06] <Hobbsee|CInstall> LaserJock: hey.  if there's a new upstream version of a program, can i upload it with a debdiff between the old and new versions, or do i need to upload the full thing, including .orig.gz?
[04:13] <Hobbsee|CInstall> bddebian: ah, i think i found it :)
[04:13] <crimsun> 'night all.
[04:15] <LaserJock> Hobbsee|CInstall: if the .orig.tar.gz changes (i.e. new upstream version) you need to upload all of it via debuild -S -sa
[04:16] <Hobbsee|CInstall> LaserJock: yep, gotcha, thanks :)  Had a mental blank, and couldnt remember
[04:24] <LaserJock> hmm, can you change the email the @ubuntu.com email address forwards in LP?
[04:24] <LaserJock> by changing the preferred email address
[04:25] <bddebian> Dunno, mine has never worked :-(
[04:26] <LaserJock> hmm, I'm trying to change MLs over the gmail but I haven't seen anything yet :(
[04:27] <minghua> I changed once and it worked
[04:30] <LaserJock> k, well as long as it is possible
[04:30] <LaserJock> I might have to just wait
[04:32] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: you sure you want to do checkinstall?
[04:32] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: to kill all the whining in #kubuntu, and #ubuntu+1, yes
[04:32] <Hobbsee> i know it's a dirty hack
[04:34] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: don't worry I've even used it before (but don't tell ajmitch ;-) )
[04:35] <Hobbsee> hehe
[04:38] <LaserJock> hi natroll
[04:38] <natroll> howdy LAser
[04:38] <natroll> LaSeR
[04:38] <natroll> anything new?  is the delay official yet?
[04:39] <LaserJock> yep
[04:39] <natroll> 6 weeks?
[04:40] <LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/DaperReleaseSchedule/Skewed
[04:40] <LaserJock> I think
[04:40] <natroll> danke
[04:40] <LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/DaperReleaseSchedule/Slewed
[04:41] <natroll> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseSchedule/Slewed
[04:41] <natroll> yeah
[04:41] <natroll> and dapper has 2 p's
[04:41] <LaserJock> doh, that's what I get for URL-by-memory
[04:42] <natroll> argh, dapper still keeps on notifying me that the battery is charged
[04:42] <natroll> argh...i sound like a pirate ;D
[04:43] <Hobbsee> hehe
[04:43] <Kyral> PIRATE!? *Pulls a missile Launcher*
[04:43] <natroll> Hobbsee, I don't envy your situation tbh
[04:43] <Kyral> ....too much Metroid
[04:44] <Hobbsee> this lasts around 10 mins, then dies
[04:44] <natroll> one of the new dual core ones with issues?
[04:44] <natroll> or reeeeeeeelly old?
[04:44] <Hobbsee> no, toshiba a10 satellite - 2 years old
[04:44] <natroll> i see
[04:45] <natroll> btw, tbh = to be honest
[04:46] <LaserJock> and btw = by the way ;-)
[04:47] <natroll> and LaserJock = Lazy animals sew elephant....ok, nevermind
[04:50] <LaserJock> hmm, well I know what laser is ;-)
[04:50] <Hobbsee> natroll: yes, i knew :P
[04:52] <LaserJock> laser = Light Amplification by Spontaneous Emission of Radiation
[04:52] <LaserJock> now that is a cool acronym
[04:53] <natroll> i don't think i've ever heard that one
[04:53] <natroll> well....maybe....
[04:53] <LaserJock> I had it on a cumulative exam ;-)
[04:54] <natroll> so what do laser and jock have to do with one another?
[04:54] <ajmitch> LaserJock: how could you?
[04:54] <LaserJock> natroll: I work with lasers all day. In my field they call us Laser Jocks
[04:54] <natroll> i see
[04:54] <LaserJock> ajmitch: I plead ignorance
[04:55] <ajmitch> 16:34 < LaserJock> Hobbsee: don't worry I've even used it before (but don't tell ajmitch ;-) )
[04:55] <natroll> blackop
[04:55] <ajmitch> I saw that at the top of my screen
[04:55] <ajmitch> and I was appalled
[04:55] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[04:55] <LaserJock> darn, stupid highlighting
[04:55] <ajmitch> and Hobbsee..
[04:55] <LaserJock> can't get away with anything
[04:55] <ajmitch> whatever will we do with her?
[04:56] <Hobbsee> yes ajmitch?   hehe
[04:56] <LaserJock> ban her to rpm land?
[04:56] <ajmitch> nah
[04:56] <ajmitch> just make her fix gnome bugs
[04:56] <minghua> moral of the story: if you said something and don't want a certain person know, don't mention his nick :-)
[04:56] <Hobbsee> ewww!!!!!!
[04:56] <natroll> ;)
[04:56] <LaserJock> maybe she should be forced to do the Ebuntu packages ;-)
[04:57] <Hobbsee> no!!!!
[04:57] <Hobbsee> i'm already having to wrestle with my windows wireless connection....surely that's enough
[04:57] <ajmitch> we wouldn't be that cruel
[04:57] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: want to give it to me?  the pc, that is
[04:58] <ajmitch> sorry
[04:58] <natroll> i have too many pcs
[04:59] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: if you want, you can look at my package and upload it :D
[05:00] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: actually - i think i've already gotten my punishment - i have gnome on my system, at the moment
[05:01] <Hobbsee> that's where you backup the /home partition, isnt it?
[05:01] <minghua> hey, gnome is not that bad!  (altough the orange progress bar from the new theme can definitly improve)
[05:01] <natroll> lol, the orange looks like some wicked-aweful baby poop or something
[05:02] <Hobbsee> then again, i'm hearing about how bad kubuntu's is, which i havent updated to yet
[05:02] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: it's quite strong, I always set my desktop to a nice light blue
[05:02] <natroll> it's radioactive baby-poop
[05:03] <minghua> Ewww
[05:03] <natroll> forget human, it should be "radioactive baby-poop"
[05:04] <natroll> so is kubuntu's theme similar in color scheme to gnome's?
[05:04] <LaserJock> hmm, well reminds me of branding calves in Montana
[05:04] <Hobbsee> i havent updated yet
[05:04] <Hobbsee> can i copy the deb files from /var/cache/apt/archives/ and paste them into my new install?
[05:04] <Hobbsee> or do i need more files?
[05:05] <minghua> Hobbsee: you can use old .debs, just bind mount your /var/cache/apt/archives would be simplest
[05:05] <minghua> although a local mirror is probably a better idea for long-term
[05:06] <Hobbsee> ok, cool
[05:06] <Hobbsee> i only want to do it once
[05:07] <natroll> been 24 hours since i started this debmirror
[05:07] <natroll> and only 88 percent
[05:07] <ajmitch> natroll: why did you grab the whole lot?
[05:07] <natroll> ajmitch, this is just uni, multi, main, restricted with sourc for i386
[05:08] <ajmitch> yeah, why? :)
[05:08] <minghua> you call that "just"? :-)
[05:08] <natroll> yeah, working on messing with customizing the installer and i'm not sure what it will be downloading from the mirror
[05:09] <natroll> and then i have some stuff to mess with in uni and multi post-install with a local mirror
[05:09] <Hobbsee_> did i miss anything?
[05:09] <natroll> ?
[05:09] <Hobbsee> natroll: as in, did anyone say anything to me, that i didtn reply to?
[05:09] <natroll> Hobbsee, no
[05:10] <Hobbsee> ah ok, cool :)
[05:10] <natroll> no worries, gotcha covered
[05:24] <Hobbsee> all right...now i can refresh and see what the new theme looks like...
[05:27] <natroll> how do they look?
[05:27] <natroll> does it*
[05:28] <natroll> yay, 90% now
[05:28] <natroll> i'm gonna watch a movie
[05:33] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: any idea what this is fixed by?  /usr/bin/checkinstall: line 74: ck_gettext: command not found
[05:36] <LaserJock> gettext perhaps?
[05:36] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: dont listen hehe, or give me the solution...
[05:36] <Hobbsee> gettext is installed...
[05:38] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: gettext and gettext-kde are already installed - i'm not seeing much else of relevance
[05:38] <minghua> Hobbsee: ck_gettext doesn't exist in any debian binary package, try grepping your checkinstall source
[05:39] <minghua> especially that "ck_" looks suspiciously like checkinstall's own namespace...
[05:39] <LaserJock> minghua: good point
[05:40] <Hobbsee> hehe @ minghua
[05:43] <LaserJock> and then send all checkinstall bug reports to /dev/null ;-)
[05:43] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:43] <Kyral> Night MOTUish people
[05:44] <LaserJock> cya Kyral
[05:44] <Kyral> oh
[05:45] <Hobbsee> who said anything about *me* using it???
[05:45] <Kyral> you did
[05:46] <Hobbsee> well...
[05:47] <Hobbsee> Kyral: more trying to stop the people whining about how checkinstall doesnt work...but it's kinda useful, occasoinally
[05:48] <Kyral> whateva, I'm going to sleep
[05:48] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:48] <Hobbsee> night Kyral
[05:52] <minghua> bye Kyral
[05:52] <bddebian> Gnight Kyral
[06:15] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: oh my goodness - who the heck created that abomination?????
[06:17] <Hobbsee> now i see why people were complaining
[06:18] <ajmitch> good :)
[06:18] <ajmitch> it was quite intentional..
[06:18] <robotgeek> Hobbsee: now fix it :)
[06:18] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:24] <bddebian> Gnight folks
[06:41] <ajmitch> excellent
[06:42] <ajmitch> the box works
[07:18] <Hobbsee> i hate to say this, but i kinda like the new gnome stuff, with the orange
[07:19] <natroll> i like that the whole thing just feels vibrant
[07:20] <Hobbsee> maybe i wont reformat my machine, to get rid of the gnome-ness of it...
[07:21] <minghua> I generally like the new theme as well
[07:21] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:21] <Hobbsee> open office, the icons all go clear, unless you mouse over them
[07:22] <natroll> the bright-orange is ugly in a way though
[07:22] <natroll> i feel like it's a hooters theme
[07:24] <Hobbsee> yeah, in a way...
[07:24] <Hobbsee> but it does kinda fit
[07:25] <natroll> hooters?
[07:49] <YokoZar> I have two packages that need to be removed from the repository, post-haste.
[07:49] <YokoZar> wine-doc and xwine
[08:34] <dholbach> good morning
[08:36] <Hobbsee> hi dholbach
[08:38] <dholbach> hey Hobbsee
[08:54] <Tm_T> hi kids
[09:40] <Tm_T> moin
[09:40] <tepsipakki> Hi! As dapper is now getting six week more testing and localisation time, is it possible to add openoffice.org-soikko (+libsoikko) which is a hyphenation addon for OO.o. The problem with libsoikko is that it isn't open source, but freely distributable (http://users.tkk.fi/~pry/soikko/license.txt)
[09:41] <tepsipakki> it has been packaged for debian and ubuntu for a long time already, and the hyphenation quality is excellent
[09:41] <Tm_T> +1 for having that
[09:42] <Tm_T> (not that I need, but many will)
[09:42] <Tm_T> and does
[09:42] <minghua> tepsipakki: are both of them in multiverse now?
[09:42] <Tm_T> minghua: problem is that they are not yet
[09:42] <tepsipakki> minghua: neither :/
[09:43] <Tm_T> but we should have them
[09:43] <tepsipakki> yeah, the freeze is long gone
[09:43] <tepsipakki> currently users need to find a suitable package from here http://www.lemi.fi/oo2-soikko/
[09:43] <minghua> well, I suppose the first step is to get a package ready, test them on dapper
[09:43] <minghua> oh good.  any body tested it?
[09:43] <tepsipakki> yes
[09:44] <Tm_T> minghua: I know many active users of soikko
[09:44] <tepsipakki> oh let me test first.. we have it for sarge+OO.o2 backport
[09:44] <Tm_T> tepsipakki: you see? ;)
[09:44] <minghua> tepsipakki, Tm_T: I don't really know the policy for new packages, but please contact people in #ubuntu-l10n about localization issues
[09:44] <tepsipakki> yes, we have 200+ sarge workstations and soikko is installed on all of them
[09:45] <minghua> tepsipakki: no, I mean test it on dapper
[09:45] <tepsipakki> sure
[09:45] <tepsipakki> my workstation is dapper ;)
[09:45] <Tm_T> what? there's other than dapper?
[09:46] <tepsipakki> the sarge version is for gcc3.3, but dapper needs the gcc3.4-version, so that's why it isn't on our local mirror...
[09:46] <minghua> tepsipakki: this soikko software is written in c++?
[09:47] <tepsipakki> minghua: I'm not sure, maybe so if it specifies gcc-version
[09:47] <tepsipakki> http://dtw.silverentertainment.fi/oo2-soikko/
[09:47] <tepsipakki> that's the place for packages, hold on
[09:48] <minghua> tepsipakki: feel free to write a mail to ubuntu-motu mailing list and state the situations
[09:48] <minghua> but binary only stuff are always tricky, so make sure you've done enought investigation first
[09:48] <tepsipakki> minghua: great, I'll do that!
[09:49] <minghua> Hmm, is that webpage finnish?
[09:49] <tepsipakki> yes, sorry about that :)
[09:50] <tepsipakki> there was a problem with OO.o on dapper that resulted soikko failing to install, but it was fixed a week ago, I think
[09:51] <tepsipakki> the bug was in OO.o-packages
[09:51] <minghua> just remember to give more details in English when you write the mail :-)
[09:51] <tepsipakki> yeah ;)
[09:51] <Tm_T> haha
[10:06] <Hobbsee> argh!
[10:06] <Hobbsee> how are you doing StevenK?
[10:06] <dholbach> It seems you guys are having fun :)
[10:06] <Hobbsee> heh...guys...yes...right
[10:06] <Hobbsee> :P
[10:06] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Much better now that I'm home.
[10:07] <Hobbsee> :)
[10:07] <StevenK> Late night shopping after work is sometimes a little hard to bear.
[10:07] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: yeah, guys! ;)
[10:07] <Hobbsee> hehe
[10:07] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: how about sauna with us guys? ;) ;)
[10:07] <Hobbsee> Tm_T: i'm very used to it, even when i'm in a skirt :P
[10:07] <Tm_T> I use skirt too
[10:08] <Hobbsee> dholbach: now look what you've started!  :P
[10:08] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: damn, oh well, have to try ;(
[10:08] <natroll> or jacuzzis
[10:08] <dholbach> Hobbsee: i didn't suggest doing anything in skirts or saunas :-)
[10:09] <Tm_T> haha
[10:09] <dholbach> . o O { not this time }
[10:09] <Hobbsee> hehe
[10:09] <tepsipakki> ok, I've tested oo.o2-soikko on dapper, and it works a-ok
[10:09] <Tm_T> tepsipakki: yup, I think hapo would be interested about this project ;)
[10:10] <tepsipakki> Tm_T: the author of soikko??
[10:10] <Tm_T> tepsipakki: no, Opera translator and active Kubuntu user
[10:10] <tepsipakki> oh, ruhanen, not ryhnen ;)
[10:10] <Tm_T> if someone says it's not needed...
[10:10] <Tm_T> ;)
[10:11] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: here, have a beer, have twelve (and I'll wait until you're drunk, then we go to sauna ;p)
[10:11] <Tm_T> whooops!
[10:12] <Hobbsee> haha!
[10:12] <Tm_T> damned!
[10:12] <Hobbsee> :D
[10:13] <Hobbsee> hehe
[10:13] <Tm_T> ok, back to staring the roof (strange thing it moves all the time) ->
[10:14] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Geez, and you call yourself a uni student.
[10:15] <Hobbsee> StevenK: hehe sure - but i'm not stupid
[10:22] <ajmitch> evening all
[10:22] <ajmitch> how's it going?
[10:25] <ajmitch> I see Hobbsee is having fun getting harassed.. :)
[10:25] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: ah yes, but it's minor compared to what i get in work most shifts...
[10:25] <highvoltage> hi ajmitch. going well this side, you?
[10:25] <Hobbsee> but true, yes
[10:25] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: really?
[10:25] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: yes, unfortunately
[10:25] <ajmitch> highvoltage: good, got a new box up & running
[10:26] <highvoltage> nice
[10:26] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: we'll try & muzzle those here that are less restrained :)
[10:26] <Hobbsee> oh goody...
[10:27] <ajmitch> heh
[10:27] <ajmitch> hah
[10:28] <Hobbsee> :P
[10:28] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I heard you saying earlier that you liked GNOME?
[10:29] <ajmitch> what happened?
[10:30] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: some alien came and messed with my brain.  i compiled networkmanager and libsomethingorother, to try out knetworkmanager, couldnt get that to compile, so installed the base of gnome (although a lot had been installed already), and today installed the full thing.  i like the orange!  but the lack of a run command is seriously starting to annoy me
[10:31] <ajmitch> soon you'll be joining the GNOME team & loving every minute of it
[10:31] <Hobbsee> hehe
[10:31] <Hobbsee> i did notice some very nice stuff in there
[10:33] <ajmitch> excellent, sound driver works properly in this new motherboard
[10:33] <ajmitch> seems that all the hardware is working nicely
[10:33] <ajmitch> (with the exception of the SATA drives which aren't installed)
[10:35] <Hobbsee> yay!
[10:35] <Hobbsee> hehe
[10:35] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: specs on the machine?
[10:36] <ajmitch> amd64 dual-core 4200+
[10:36] <ajmitch> 4GB RAM
[10:36] <ajmitch> 3x250GB SATA drives
[10:36] <Riddell> Kyral: /usr/share/apps/konqueror/servicemenus/
[10:37] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: just put deskbar-applet on your menu and use alt-f3 to run stuff
[10:37] <Hobbsee> wow
[10:37] <Hobbsee> right
[10:37] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: or map something to gnome-panel-control --run-dialog
[10:37] <Mithrandir> (which is f2 by default, it seems)
[10:37] <Hobbsee> *nods*
[10:37] <ajmitch> alt-f2 should be mapped
[10:38] <Mithrandir> possibly alt-f2
[10:38] <Hobbsee> alt+f2 would not bring up the run dialog, nor would windows+r
[10:38] <Mithrandir> (I don't use metacity, so I don't have the default maps.)
[10:38] <ajmitch> works for me on flight5 live cd, which is a fairly standard setup
[10:38] <Hobbsee> but i'll try that deskbar-applet the next time i boot to gnome
[10:39] <Mithrandir> deskbar-applet is really nice since it'll do stuff like search your bookmarks, etc as well
[10:39] <Hobbsee> katapult equivalent, then?
[10:39] <Mithrandir> never used katapult, but I think so, yes.
[10:40] <Tm_T> ajmitch: what harrass where?
[11:05] <ajmitch> Tm_T: nevermind :)
[11:07] <StevenK> ajmitch: I'm still working on Linda, and I haven't got to my evil plan yet.
[11:09] <Tm_T> ajmitch: it wasn't me!
[11:09] <Tm_T> ;(
[11:16] <StevenK> Whee.
[11:16] <StevenK> I love it when I start inserting Perlisms into my Python
[11:17] <ajmitch> yay, my main dapper install has been resurrected on new hardware
[11:20] <ajmitch> another?
[11:20] <ajmitch> you currently have 1GB?
[11:20] <StevenK> No, only half
[11:21] <highvolt1ge> only 1GB? what kind of motu only has 1GB?
[11:21] <StevenK> Which is far to little for this poor machine.
[11:21] <StevenK> s/to/too
[11:21] <StevenK> I'm using all of my core, and I'm 200Mb into swap.
[11:23] <Tm_T> I have 1G ram but too usual is that I spend all of my 1.5G swap too
[11:23] <Tm_T> you know, system become bit laggy then...
[11:23] <Tm_T> 3G ram would be nice
[11:23] <Tm_T> but still I would need swap =)
[11:23] <StevenK> It's nice when I'm swapping between two things. Move to something else, and it swaps for 10 seconds or so.
[11:25] <sivang> hey guys
[11:27] <sivang> would anyone review my package just as a head start? I want to get more stuff in before it's acutally uploaded, so I won't use REVU for now.
[11:28] <sivang> as I expect the packaging the remains same, would be good to take off packaging mistakes now.
[11:29] <StevenK> ajmitch: I've had a machine at work swap hard, with 2Gb.
[11:29] <StevenK> (Of both RAM and swap)
[11:29] <ajmitch> depends on what you load on it
[11:30] <StevenK> Request Tracker
[11:30] <ajmitch> I'm sure I could get this new box using all its ram with no trouble
[11:30] <ajmitch> sigh, 903MB dist-upgrade
[11:30] <ajmitch> this will take a long time
[11:36] <natroll> anyone know an easy way to learn how to build packages?  particularly ones that have no source code, but are more for distributing files?
[11:37] <sivang> natroll: debhelper, a dirs file, dh_install I guess. but check the man pages for details
[11:37] <natroll> huh?
[11:37] <natroll> i've seen dh_install before
[11:37] <natroll> what's debhelper?
[11:38] <natroll> !debhelper
[11:41] <natroll> hrm, nvm
[11:41] <sivang> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debhelper
[11:42] <sivang> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CDBS
[11:42] <natroll> thanks
[12:17] <tepsipakki> hmm, subscribed to u-m list while ago, but haven't received a confirmation mail yet
[12:36] <natroll> where can i get a copy of the GPL text for use in the licensing section of the package
[12:37] <natroll> ?
[12:38] <Hobbsee> natroll: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Kubuntu#head-f51f0e7a4bff16210e8fcc0a96a7b183129735e4
[12:38] <Hobbsee> that what you mean?
[12:40] <natroll> yeah, thanks
[12:43] <ajmitch> yay, /var got remounted read-only during the dist-upgrade
[12:43] <ajmitch> seems those hardware failures did affect a bit of the filesystem
[12:44] <Lathiat> heh
[12:44] <Lathiat> your old box?
[12:44] <ajmitch> yeah
[12:44] <ajmitch> well the old drives in the new box
[12:45] <ajmitch> I suspect /usr/local may have a couple of problems also
[12:45] <ajmitch> only about 250GB to check in total
[12:49] <Lathiat> ajmitch: oh you got a new box, cool
[12:50] <Lathiat> ajmitch: i got 2 new 300GB satas yesterday, finally can store some stuff
[12:50] <Lathiat> and im not buying anythign else for 6 months ;p
[12:50] <ajmitch> haha
[12:51] <ajmitch> yeah, my box is sitting on my desk with about 1TB of disks in total
[12:51] <Lathiat> i owe the CC 2.5k and work 1k so, mm yeh :)
[12:51] <Lathiat> ajmitch: you have a TV of disk?
[12:51] <Lathiat> well i also have ~1k to my name
[12:51] <Lathiat> so im only 2.5 down, thats about 6 weeks worth
[12:51] <Lathiat> not oo bad
[12:51] <Lathiat> :)
[12:52] <ajmitch> 5 disks, as I bought 3x250GB SATA
[12:52] <Lathiat> ajmitch: nice
[12:52] <ajmitch> and I had a 120 & 160 from the old box
[12:52] <Lathiat> im goign to get more 300s
[12:52] <Lathiat> once im in the black
[12:52] <Lathiat> plan to fill iut up, so 10 of them
[12:52] <Lathiat> :)
[12:52] <ajmitch> no more for 6 months? ;)
[12:52] <Lathiat> ajmitch: mayeb 2/3 months ;p
[12:52] <Hobbsee> night all...need sleep to be awake for tomorrow's meeting
[12:52] <Lathiat> Hobbsee: cya :)
[12:52] <ajmitch> night Hobbsee :)
[12:52] <Lathiat> i like hoarding things :)
[12:53] <Lathiat> its be 2.3TB
[12:53] <Lathiat> after raid5
[12:53] <ajmitch> yeah
[12:54] <Lathiat> and blazingly fast ;p
[12:57] <Lathiat> yay fsck
[12:57] <Lathiat> ajmitch: so what did you get in the end?
[12:58] <ajmitch> Lathiat: hm?
[12:58] <ajmitch> I got the A8N-E motherboard
[12:58] <ajmitch> 4200+
[12:58] <ajmitch> 4GB RAM
[12:59] <Lathiat> 4GB? heh
[12:59] <Lathiat> 10 pbuilders at once? ;p
[12:59] <ajmitch> why not? :)
[12:59] <Lathiat> you could rebuild all of universe in 6 hour sflat ;p
[12:59] <ajmitch> pbuilder on tmpfs :)
[12:59] <Lathiat> heh
[12:59] <Lathiat> mm
[12:59] <Lathiat> i-ram..:)
[01:28] <natroll> is the first line in a makefile required? (the line CC=/usr/bin/gcc)
[02:08] <sivang> siretart: ping, hi
[02:08] <sivang> siretart: unping
[02:13] <sivang> siretart: actually, ping :)
[02:14] <sivang> (guys) I can't send a singed email to REVU to get upload privs. can someone sponser my package upload to REVU ?
[02:20] <raphink> lol
[02:21] <raphink> sivang: what is your issue ?
[02:21] <raphink> you mean you can't upload ?
[03:09] <sivang> raphink: not at the momnet because I don't have my key accessible atm
[03:09] <sivang> and btw, hi raphink  :)
[03:09] <raphink> hehe hi
[03:10] <raphink> working on a K3b bug now :)
[03:10] <raphink> that is very annoying
[03:10] <raphink> and i've almost got the solution to it :)
[03:10] <sivang> raphink: ohh, that's related to what I've done in my ISOBUilder and CDBurner classes
[03:10] <sivang> raphink: how do you get over the SYS_RAWIO problem in our kenrel?
[03:10] <raphink> what is?
[03:10] <raphink> hmm ...
[03:10] <sivang> (I had to dpkg-reconfigure cdrecord and have it SUID root)
[03:10] <raphink> well I'm talking about the k3bsetup bug
[03:11] <raphink> there are several k3b bugs I guess ;)
[03:11] <sivang> raphink: indeed :)
[03:11] <raphink> mine is the one that shows an empty k3bsetup dialog window
[03:11] <raphink> i've found where it comes from
[03:11] <raphink> trying to find exactly what is required to fix it
[03:11] <sivang> raphink: anyway, I don't want to bother you too much, do you want to take a look at the source pakcage?
[03:11] <raphink> not right now
[03:11] <raphink> I'm busy
[03:12] <sivang> sure thing
[03:32] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:33] <mbreit> hi bddebian
[03:33] <bddebian> Hmphf
[03:36] <Kyral> why is bddebian like a hero here?
[03:36] <bddebian> Kyral: I am NO hero
[03:36] <Kyral> well, popular :P
[03:37] <Kyral> anyway I digress..BREAKFAST!
[03:37] <dholbach> he IS :)
[03:48] <sivang> bddebian: can you interest you a sponsership? :)
[03:48] <sivang> bddebian: I can't upload to revu, so I ndeed someone to upload something for me.
[03:50] <mgalvin> just a heads up, #33847 has a patch to fix the bug if anyone could apply it
[03:56] <bddebian> sivang: Normally I would say no problem but I am so swamped at work right that my time is sporadic.. :-(  Sorry.
[04:09] <Amaranth> interesting
[04:09] <Amaranth> 33847 should be marked as fixed in debian
[04:09] <Amaranth> but it's not
[04:11] <Hadaka> Hello, are there a lot of packages in Ubuntu which aren't in Debian? Do the requirements on packages differ for Debian and Ubuntu?
[04:12] <Amaranth> it's easier to get a package into universe, i guess
[04:13] <Yagisan> Hadaka: Did you know you name means naked in Japanese ? no, there aren't too many packages that are only in Ubuntu
[04:14] <Hadaka> Yagisan: Yes, certainly.
[04:15] <Yagisan> as Amaranth said, it is easier to get a package into Ubuntu. You package it, send it to revu, and if it passes peer review, it gets in
[04:15] <Yagisan> however, it is your baby to look after
[04:15] <Amaranth> not really
[04:15] <Amaranth> once it's in ubuntu anyone can touch it
[04:16] <Amaranth> unlike in debian where you own packages
[04:16] <Yagisan> assuming they know the language
[04:16] <Yagisan> if you are still around after uploading a package it is nice
[04:16] <Amaranth> aye
[04:16] <Yagisan> sorry if my point was badly worded
[04:16] <Amaranth> it's expected that you can be called on to answer questions about the package and/or fix small bugs
[04:17] <Amaranth> not required, but you'll be getting emails :p
[04:18] <Yagisan> so, Hadaka, what did you have in mind ?
[04:19] <Hadaka> Yagisan: well, there's a package that would be nice to get into Ubuntu, but it's not really playing too nicely with everything, so I'm wondering how much cleanup it would require before being admitted
[04:20] <Yagisan> Hadaka: that's what revu is for :) You upload, we offer suggestions, you upload fixed version etc
[04:21] <Hadaka> Yagisan: great! I'll ask more when I get there...
[04:21] <Yagisan> Hadaka: although, this close to a release, revu is a bit slow, it picks up more after a release
[04:24] <Yagisan> mm, the 2.1.1 release of avidemux is sweet :) How long after a sync request does it take to arrive in dapper ?
[05:11] <raphink> yeah :)
[05:16] <natroll-> hey, ummmmm, i need some help with a makefile, anyone got a minute?
[05:19] <jaldhar> natroll-: exactly one minute. 60...59..58... :-)
[05:19] <natroll-> hehe
[05:20] <jaldhar> natroll-: seriously, go ahead
[05:20] <dolson> how does one get an @ubuntu.com email address?
[05:20] <crimsun> dolson: you have one as a member
[05:21] <crimsun> it's set to your primary LP e-mail
[05:21] <dolson> oh. so it's already set up
[05:21] <natroll-> ok, http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/NV1ItR36.html
[05:21] <bddebian> crimsun: It never worked for me :-)
[05:21] <natroll-> i can't discern the error, but i may be messing thins up royally
[05:21] <bddebian> But that's because elmo hates me :-)
[05:21] <crimsun> natroll-: we actually need the Makefile
[05:22] <dolson> my default LP email is dana@ubuntustudio.com
[05:22] <crimsun> bddebian: it's all automated on LP now
[05:22] <jaldhar> crimsun: rules is a makefile
[05:22] <natroll-> workin on it
[05:22] <crimsun> jaldhar: Makefile:2: *** missing separator.  Stop.
[05:22] <siretart> does anyone know whats going on with jabberme.net?
[05:22] <siretart> hast anyone tried to contact \sh?
[05:22] <natroll-> http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/ZMIY0I51.html
[05:22] <jaldhar> crimsun: oops just spotted that!
[05:22] <bddebian> crimsun: Well according to LP, I'm an MOTU, etc but not a member :-)
[05:23] <crimsun> bddebian: I believe someone in CC takes care of that, perhaps Kamion? Seveas would know.
[05:23] <jaldhar> natroll-: on line 20, are you sure it is blank, there are no tabs or spaces etc.?
[05:23] <natroll-> my rules file
[05:23] <natroll-> http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/6e30fh76.html
[05:23] <crimsun> siretart: haven't, no
[05:23] <Seveas> bddebian, I remember you becoming a member
[05:24] <natroll-> jaldhar, blank
[05:24] <bddebian> Seveas: Yeah, though I probably don't deserve it lately :-(
[05:24] <Seveas> bddebian, members aren
[05:24] <Seveas> 't deactivated automatically
[05:25] <Seveas> put it on the CC agenda
[05:25] <bddebian> No, it was never activated on LP
[05:25] <crimsun> natroll-: everything under a target needs to be tab-ified
[05:25] <natroll-> wait, do i have to have the files being moved in the makefile inside the debian directory?
[05:26] <crimsun> natroll-: spaces are very different from tabs as Makefile separators
[05:26] <jaldhar> natroll-: not necessary. atleast that might be a different error. fix this one first
[05:26] <crimsun> (your debian/rules is fine; it's a red herring)
[05:27] <natroll-> well, that tab thing fixed that part, but the rest is royally messed up
[05:27] <crimsun> "the rest"?
[05:28] <crimsun> as in line 3 onward?
[05:29] <natroll-> i just noticed i messed something else up too....man i'm tired
[05:29] <natroll-> no, i assume that fakeroot should lead to errors such as 'can't create file' and whatnot, right?
[05:30] <siretart> ok, I've sent him an email
[05:31] <natroll-> wow, what a mess this is
[05:32] <crimsun> fakeroot can't override the actual permissions in the dirs
[05:32] <natroll-> yeah, so it's ok that it fails or not?
[05:32] <crimsun> if permissions are the culprit, then yes
[05:33] <natroll-> I get this too: dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${shlibs:Depends}
[05:33] <crimsun> i.e., you can't use fakeroot in /usr/src and expect it to work if you're not in the src group (and aren't root, etc.)
[05:43] <natroll-> hey guys, cleared up a few more errors and now I get this: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/CGbo4R81.html
[05:44] <natroll-> I don't know why it's badly formed, i didn't even create it myself
[05:44] <natroll-> oh, and by the way thanks for everything so far guys :D
[05:49] <natroll-> so...
[05:50] <crimsun> sorry, discussing stuff in -kernel
[05:51] <natroll-> no problem man, you're the one doing ME a favor, i can DEFINITELY wait
[05:53] <crimsun> not sure why you have the extra description in there
[05:57] <natroll-> i have no idea either....
[05:57] <natroll-> maybe the issue is in my control file?
[05:58] <natroll-> http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/N0JlJq18.html
[05:58] <bddebian> natroll-: Whats the System Administration thing?
[06:00] <crimsun> yeah, that's what I'm referring to by "extra description"
[06:00] <crimsun> it's not a valid section
[06:01] <natroll-> oh
[06:01] <natroll-> what is a valid section then?
[06:01] <crimsun> base, for instance
[06:01] <bddebian> libqt3-i18n_3.3.5-1ubuntu17_all.deb libs optional
[06:01] <bddebian> qt3-doc_3.3.5-1ubuntu17_all.deb doc extra
[06:01] <bddebian> qt3-examples_3.3.5-1ubuntu17_all.deb doc extra
[06:01] <natroll-> crimsun, other ones?
[06:02] <natroll-> oh, i see
[06:02] <crimsun> particularly if you want to turn this into a metapackage, you want to make it a flubuntu-meta or something
[06:02] <bddebian> dholbach: :-)
[06:02] <crimsun> fubuntu-meta, sorry
[06:02] <crimsun> bddebian: we've missed Your Grace, too =)
[06:02] <natroll-> crimsun, this is just a little package for a project i need to have done by this monday, nothing to be permanent by any means
[06:03] <bddebian> crimsun: Bah, you mock me :-)
[06:03] <natroll-> where can i see what sections are valid?
[06:03] <crimsun> bddebian: nah :)
[06:04] <bddebian> natroll-: Maybe the Debian New Maintainers guide?
[06:05] <crimsun> natroll-: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections
[06:05] <natroll-> ha, found it, thanks bddebian, this is actually a pretty good doc on that...wonder why i haven't seen this one before...
[06:06] <crimsun> when in doubt, always check the Policy Manual
[06:06] <natroll-> kk
[06:06] <crimsun> it's our sacred text of sorts
[06:07] <natroll-> nice!  it completed!
[06:07] <bddebian> Congrats
[06:07] <natroll-> my first package
[06:08] <natroll-> i feel all fuzzy inside ;D j/k
[06:08] <Kyral> All Hail The Policy Manual
[06:08] <Kyral> Though I find the New Maintainer's Guide more useful...
[06:09] <natroll-> haha, first package....doesn't work at all....
[06:09] <Kyral> lol
[06:09] <natroll-> ok, i think i know what the problem is though
[06:09] <Kyral> ummm
[06:09] <Kyral> http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/3653/ <-- DROOL!
[06:10] <bddebian> What, no usb key for your gpg key? :-)
[06:10] <Kyral> lol
[06:10] <Kyral> I plan to get one too
[06:10] <Kyral> actually lemme call it up
[06:12] <Kyral> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820233008
[06:14] <Kyral> now tell me that ain't a nice USB Drive
[06:14] <LaserJock> well, as soon as the Packaging Guide to rule them all is done... ;-)
[06:14] <bddebian> hehe
[06:15] <LaserJock> I think I might have a chance of shipping it with Dapper with the 6 week push
[06:15] <Kyral> holy cow...
[06:15] <Kyral> http://www.thinkgeek.com/gadgets/tools/5a09/
[06:19] <jaldhar> LaserJock: that reminds me, that for a long time i've been working on a book about debian packaging.  Even got a publisher interested in the idea.  I should pull my socks up and finish it.
[06:20] <Yagisan> Kyral: It needs a USB stick.
[06:20] <natroll-> see, my package isn't including the files i'm trying to include....grrr...
[06:20] <Kyral> Yagisan, I already have that covered *points to the Newegg Link*
[06:21] <Kyral> Yanno since I actually have a job now.... I can stock up on Uber Geek Tools :D
[06:22] <Yagisan> Kyral: I have a 1GB stick too. Trying to figure out how to fit a bootable live ubuntu dist on it.
[06:22] <LaserJock> jaldhar: yeah, that would be very interesting
[06:22] <Kyral> lol
[06:22] <Kyral> Yagisan, I'd stick with DSL for that kinda thing
[06:22] <Kyral> or use a 4 GB stick....
[06:22] <LaserJock> Kyral: you have a JOB!
[06:23] <Kyral> LaserJock, Yah I'm tutoring someone in my schools Intro To CompSci 1 course
[06:23] <Yagisan> Kyral: well, I did get ubuntu into sub 2GB disks before ..
[06:23] <Kyral> only $7 a hour, but the guy wants to meet like 3 times a week and we usually run like 2 hours...
[06:24] <natroll-> ok ok ok, i get through the whole process of creating the package but apparently all the files i intended to be in the package and distributed by it are not picked up...i must be missing something?
[06:25] <Yagisan> Kyral:  This dump http://www.msy.com.au/Parts/msy.htm is the cheapest place near me. (prices in AUD - staff don't speak english!)
[06:25] <LaserJock> Kyral: tutoring can be pretty good. A guy in my lab gets ~$40/hr tutoring high school chemistry ;-)
[06:26] <Kyral> but if I don't score a research position at school or a co-op with IBM, I'm gonna be makin' pizzas all summer...
[06:31] <crimsun> you should intern @xerox if not @ibm
[06:31] <crimsun> xerox hires scores from clarkson
[06:31] <Kyral> As does IBM lol
[06:32] <crimsun> yeah, location and all
[06:32] <Kyral> They come to the COSI and ITL meetings before the career fair lol
[06:32] <bddebian> intern @SCO
[06:32] <LaserJock> yeah, good idea
[06:32] <crimsun> intern @bddebian
[06:32] <Kyral> so trying to look "good" on Career Fair day kinda doesn't work
[06:32] <Kyral> I mean they saw me hyped up on caffine lol
[06:32] <bddebian> heh
[06:33] <Kyral> but before I get any fine geek tools
[06:33] <Kyral> I need to affect repairs on my production box
[06:33] <Kyral> namely replacing my dead DVD Burner
[06:34] <LaserJock> hmm, before I can repair my production box I need to fix the house :(
[06:34] <Kyral> lol
[06:35] <LaserJock> actually the landscaping mostly. Nevada desert isn't very conducive to lush landscaping ;-)
[06:36] <Kyral> You know you are a geek when bathroom reading material includes O'Reilly's "DNS and BIND"
[06:37] <bddebian> heh
[06:39] <LaserJock> mine is presently The Python Cookbook
[06:40] <crimsun> mine's Dwell
[06:40] <dholbach> haha
[06:42] <LaserJock> hmm, well my email seems to be all messed up :(
[06:42] <natroll-> i think i'm about to quit on this horrible package
[06:43] <dolson> oh no.. I lost my references :(
[06:44] <natroll-> *sigh*
[06:46] <LaserJock> dolson: ?
[06:46] <dolson> LaserJock: you want to be a reference? :D
[06:51] <LaserJock> dolson: for what? a job?
[06:51] <dolson> yeah. I guess when I typed in the wrong hdparm command and I lost everything, my references went with it. :P
[06:52] <LaserJock> umm, bummer
[06:52] <dolson> lol, yeah
[06:53] <LaserJock> sure, I can be your reference. "dolson never works. He just hangs out in #ubuntu-motu and makes Ubuntu packages. Don't hire him because then he can work for us more. Mwuahahaha" good enough?
[06:53] <bddebian> heh
[06:53] <dolson> but they'll let me run Ubuntu on my desktop if they hire me :)
[06:54] <dolson> they told me I could run any OS I want, except Windows
[06:54] <Tm_T> =)
[06:54] <JohnnyMast> keep that up
[06:54] <Tm_T> dolson: pick Zeta then
[06:55] <dolson> is that the Be continuation thingy?
[06:55] <Tm_T> yup
[06:55] <Tm_T> or just get licence and give it to me ;)
[06:59] <natroll-> could anyone help me with the packaging issue i'm having, I create this package and it completes, and I install the package, but the files distributed by the makefile aren't installed after that: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/sboCYW50.html
[07:00] <natroll-> for reference, one of the files is /root/.pyflagrc
[07:00] <natroll-> that's what the ls at the end is about
[07:00] <bddebian> natroll-: Where is /root/.local/ come from?
[07:00] <bddebian> s/is/did/
[07:02] <natroll-> bddebian, i should post you my makefile
[07:03] <natroll-> http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/ohSNCo67.html
[07:04] <bddebian> natroll-: Can you post your rules file?
[07:04] <natroll-> does the makefile need each file to be included as a target in order to be included in the package?
[07:05] <natroll-> http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/kpDWA184.html
[07:06] <bddebian> natroll-: You don't need to run configure?
[07:07] <natroll-> no, there is not compilation to speak of
[07:07] <natroll-> at least, am i understanding this right?
[07:08] <bddebian> How did you create the Makefile?  By hand?
[07:08] <natroll-> no, dh_make
[07:08] <natroll-> and i trimmed it down to size
[07:08] <natroll-> oh, wait
[07:08] <natroll-> yeah
[07:09] <natroll-> the makefile was by hand
[07:09] <natroll-> heh, srry
[07:09] <bddebian> Well I could be wrong but I don't think you want /root/.local/ in there
[07:10] <natroll-> why not?
[07:10] <bddebian> Is that really where you want it installed?
[07:10] <natroll-> yep
[07:11] <natroll-> this is a computer forensics machine that will exclusively be using root, no regular user to speak of
[07:11] <natroll-> it won't be on the network after the install
[07:14] <natroll-> bddebian, if you want to know the file structure: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/EnIPXZ77.html
[07:14] <natroll-> err, directory
[07:16] <natroll-> i know, it's annoying, sorry
[07:17] <bddebian> natroll-: It's not that, I'm just not that good with packaging from scratch :-(
[07:18] <natroll-> yeah, it seems more straightforward with actual source
[07:18] <natroll-> bddebian, but i do appreciate the effort :)
[07:21] <natroll-> maybe i should just tar up the whole directory and ask a pro to take a look
[07:22] <natroll-> LaserJock!!! I totally need your help like massively bad i'll love ya forever and stuff
[07:23] <natroll-> *crickets chirp*
[07:23] <natroll-> ;D
[07:23] <LaserJock> lol, I'm reading the backlog. I'm not sure if I can help much
[07:24] <natroll-> well, if you don't want to you can say so :)
[07:25] <LaserJock> grrr, I can't figure out why my @ubuntu.com is acting weird
[07:27] <LaserJock> natroll-: dpkg -c *.deb is much easier to use to figure out what is getting installed where
[07:27] <natroll-> LaserJock, oooh, nice, i'll try it
[07:28] <jaldhar> or debc from the devscripts package
[07:28] <natroll-> ok, so it totally doesn't even use my files for some reason....
[07:28] <LaserJock> jaldhar: do you have anything like a rough draft of your packaging book?
[07:28] <natroll-> how do you get it to include the files in the package and distribute them to the proper directory upon installation?
[07:29] <LaserJock> natroll-: ok, lets take this  one step at a time
[07:29] <natroll-> lol, mmkay
[07:29] <LaserJock> wanna take this to #ubuntu-motu-school?
[07:29] <natroll-> well, if you want my source: http://www.yourfilelink.com/get.php?fid=50437
[07:29] <natroll-> sure, might be good
[07:29] <natroll-> .join #ubuntu-motu-school
[07:29] <natroll-> err
[07:29] <jaldhar> LaserJock: lots and lots of text.  But its really not coherent.  My style is to just write whatever I think and fix it up after.
[07:34] <LaserJock> jaldhar: I might call upon you to review the Ubuntu Packaging Guide if that's ok with you ;-)
[07:35] <jaldhar> natroll-: the thing is you need to have the results go into debian/<packagename> (assuming you are using debhelper level 4) in order to go into the package
[07:35] <jaldhar> LaserJock: sure
[07:36] <natroll-> wait, how do i make the results go into debian/packagename?
[07:36] <jaldhar> natroll- so I would add a variable PREFIX or some such and append that to the beginning of every instance of /root/.local
[07:37] <jaldhar> PREFIX=$(CURDIR)/debian/foo
[07:37] <jaldhar> $(PREFIX)/root/.local
[07:38] <LaserJock> jaldhar: he is using DESTDIR in debian/rules but he has no DESTIDIR or PREFIX in his Makefile
[07:38] <natroll-> argh?
[07:38] <jaldhar> call it DESTDIR then not PREFIX
[07:38] <natroll-> kk
[07:39] <natroll-> and where should I set it in the makefile, under install?
[07:39] <jaldhar> natroll-, yeah.  It looks like your clean target is not really relevant
[07:40] <natroll-> jaldhar, well, will it assume the removal of those files otherwise?
[07:40] <jaldhar> natroll-: to clarify, you set the variable at the top of the Makefile.  You do the $(DESTDIR)/root/.local thing in the install target
[07:40] <natroll-> and destdir is / though, right?
[07:40] <jaldhar> natroll-: the template clean target in debian/rules will take care of it.
[07:41] <natroll-> ok
[07:41] <LaserJock> not when you are making the packages
[07:41] <natroll-> oh, so it's the current directory
[07:41] <jaldhar> natroll-: no DESTDIR (it's case sensitive) would be $(CURDIR)/debian/<packagename>
[07:41] <LaserJock> $(DESTDIR) is set to $(CURDIR)/debian/<packagename>
[07:42] <jaldhar> that's good
[07:42] <natroll-> so set that above the install target..mmkay
[07:42] <LaserJock> natroll-: you just need to adjust your Makefile to use $(DESTDIR)
[07:43] <natroll-> ok, so don't add it to the top of the makefile but adjust that
[07:43] <jaldhar> natroll-: well you really ought to set in the Makefile too for those who don't override it on the command line
[07:44] <LaserJock> natroll-: give me a sec and I'll paste what I mean ;-)
[07:44] <natroll-> jaldhar, ok
[07:44] <natroll-> LaserJock, i'm eagerly awaiting :)
[07:44] <jaldhar> natroll-: O'reilly has a good book on make.  Buy two copies, read one, and whack whoever wrote that Makefile with the other.
[07:45] <natroll-> oh wow
[07:45] <natroll-> i just understood what's going on
[07:45] <natroll-> so the Makefile when executed makes a mock filesystem under debian/packagename that will be 'merged' with the system's filesystem when the package is installed
[07:46] <natroll-> well, sortof
[07:46] <jaldhar> close enough
[07:47] <natroll-> ok, clean target removed and $(DESTDIR) added to all the paths in the install target
[07:47] <natroll-> prepended rather
[07:47] <jaldhar> now try it. It should work
[07:48] <natroll-> erg, i need to tweak it a bit, it assumes some directories that aren't in the mock filesystem but are present in the real one
[07:50] <LaserJock> natroll-: what abot the firefox .desktop going to ~/ ?
[07:50] <natroll-> yeah, fixed that
[07:50] <natroll-> was from my mangled one from even earlier than this, i overlooked it
[07:50] <jaldhar> natroll-: in this case you should fix it in the Makefile but you can also use dh_installdirs or dh_install
[07:50] <natroll-> jaldhar, ummmmm, huh?
[07:50] <natroll-> jaldhar, let me read about that and i'll get back to ya
[07:51] <LaserJock> natroll-: the interesting thing is you really don't need the Makefile since debian/rules is a Makefile
[07:51] <LaserJock> natroll-: you can do everything you are doing in debian/rules
[07:52] <natroll-> oh ya?
[07:52] <natroll-> ugh, i feel like a blind man feeling around for a lightswitch
[07:52] <natroll-> not that the lightswitch will help
[07:52] <natroll-> cuz i'm blind
[07:52] <LaserJock> it's alright, packaging is like that at first ;-)
[07:52] <natroll-> errr, i'm really dumb when tired, nevermind me
[07:53] <jaldhar> LaserJock: that's true.  Sometimes with small programs of my own I do everything in debian/rules.  But this way after fixing the Makefile, he can contribute it back upstream
[07:53] <LaserJock> jaldhar: but I don't think there is an upstream in this case
[07:54] <LaserJock> natroll-: you are trying to make a fubuntu-desktop package right? a metapackage
[07:54] <natroll-> nopers
[07:54] <natroll-> probably a bad name
[07:54] <LaserJock> hmm, ok so is there an upstream?
[07:55] <natroll-> it's just for a post-install addition to the gnome menu
[07:55] <natroll-> but i can't figure out another good way to do it
[07:55] <natroll-> well, another good way that requires no user-interaction (the students != gurus)
[07:56] <natroll-> LaserJock, what precisely does upstream mean?  I hear it all the time
[07:56] <LaserJock> natroll-: upstream is the authors of the software we package
[07:56] <LaserJock> natroll-: sometimes it is also used for Debian since we get our packages from them
[07:57] <LaserJock> natroll-: if you imagine software as a river flowing from the author to the user we are downstream from the author
[08:00] <LaserJock> natroll-: anyway it might be helpful to have a Makefile so that others can use the same source if you think it will be used outside of Ubuntu
[08:03] <natroll-> phone, srry
[08:03] <natroll-> ok, i see, no, this one isn't for upstream but I'd like to get a few forensics packages together for that purpose
[08:03] <natroll-> so i might be tormenting you later ;)
[08:04] <natroll-> i see
[08:05] <natroll-> LaserJock, ok, cool
[08:05] <natroll-> make ran ok now, lets give the package a shot
[08:06] <natroll-> YAY!
[08:06] <natroll-> wow, that seriously rocks, thank you guys sooooooooo much
[08:07] <LaserJock> natroll-: does dpkg -c look better?
[08:07] <natroll-> looks fantastic :)
[08:07] <LaserJock> natroll-: ok, when you feel ready you should upload your package to REVU so we can really take a look at it ;-)
[08:08] <natroll-> well, when i do a REAL package I will
[08:08] <natroll-> in fact, i think i'll take a break and bet pyflag packaged
[08:08] <natroll-> just for fun
[08:13] <natroll-> dh_make -e "Nathan Sutton <nathan.sutton@gmail.com>"
[08:13] <natroll-> err, wrong terminal
[08:13] <LaserJock> lol
[08:13] <Tripke> is someone using wifi on ubuntu ( device level one WPC0300 )
[08:15] <natroll-> is there a command to get the information in the control file for a package without having to dpkg -e?
[08:17] <jaldhar> natroll-: debc. it's in the devscripts package.
[08:18] <natroll-> thanks
[08:21] <natroll-> jaldhar, how does the ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends} work?  do i need to do anything specifically to use these macros?
[08:21] <LaserJock> no
[08:22] <natroll-> cool, so don't even worry about dependencies then?  that's pretty cool
[08:22] <LaserJock> I wouldn't say that exactly
[08:26] <jaldhar> natroll-: no. library packages, insert values into those macros as needed
[08:28] <natroll-> hrm, do you think it'd be ok to borrow the software's description from their website?
[08:35] <LaserJock> natroll-: I think that is generally consider "fair use"
[08:39] <natroll-> LaserJock, are the debhelper commands listed under 'binary-arch: build install
[08:39] <natroll-> ' in the rules file typically properly configured automatically?
[08:40] <natroll-> i mean are the appropriate ones commented and uncommented automatically?
[08:41] <Gloubiboulga> not really natroll
[08:41] <natroll-> ahh, so i better tear through it a bit
[08:41] <LaserJock> depends
[08:41] <LaserJock> it is good to look at each man page
[08:56] <bddebian> tseng: ping?
[08:56] <tseng>  bddebian pong?
[08:56] <bddebian> tseng: Got a few minutes?
[08:57] <tseng> ok
[08:57] <bddebian> Mind if I query you?
[08:57] <tseng> ok.
[09:05] <Hobbsee> hey everyone!
[09:06] <natroll-> if something is under the GPL, who is said to hold the copyright?
[09:07] <LaserJock> natroll-: the author
[09:07] <LaserJock> hi Hobbsee
[09:07] <LaserJock> natroll-: I was going to ask you about that before, but I wanted to get the big problems out of the way first ;-)
[09:09] <natroll-> LaserJock, okie dokie
[09:12] <natroll-> LaserJock, interesting, this is at the end of his license, is this even legal? http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/nBYpTH99.html
[09:13] <natroll-> oh man, there's a bunch of different copyright holders for this one bit of software, it's in pieces
[09:15] <TMM> can someone please jog my memory on where that 'how do I make packages' page? I am missing some basic stuff here :) that debhelper alternative for instance
[09:15] <TMM> cbds or something
[09:16] <TMM> and the patch system
[09:17] <natroll-> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Kubuntu?action=show&redirect=KubuntuPackagingGuide
[09:17] <natroll-> http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/
[09:17] <natroll-> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/index.html
[09:17] <natroll-> that should keep ya busy :)
[09:17] <LaserJock> TMM: what you want is cdbs
[09:17] <TMM> Lathiat: that was it! :) I loved cdbs :P
[09:17] <TMM> LaserJock: ...
[09:18] <LaserJock> TMM: and wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPackagingGuide/Resources has a link to the Duckcorp guide to cdbs
[09:20] <TMM> thanks
[09:26] <TMM> is the best way to start out, in fact, dh_make?
[09:26] <TMM> or is doing all the files from scratch better?
[09:27] <LaserJock> TMM: depends. dh_make will get you up and running pretty fast. Just make sure you know what it is doing ;-)
[09:28] <TMM> ah, just remove all the crap
[09:28] <TMM> now there's the whole issue of the whole kernel module thing...
[09:28] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: :)
[09:37] <natroll-> does anyone know what python package provides the directory /usr/include/python/?
[09:37] <natroll-> or how to find out?
[09:38] <LaserJock> probably a python-dev type package
[09:38] <LaserJock> you might try dpkg -S
[09:38] <natroll-> kk
[09:41] <natroll-> yeah, python2.4-dev
[09:46] <natroll-> yay, pyflag FINALLY has it's build-deps satisfied, that was a lot i think
[09:46] <sivang> hey all
[09:46] <natroll-> and it breaks :(
[09:46] <sivang> siretart: ping
[09:47] <sivang> siretart: to upload a packagte to REVU I just send a singed message to it, and then it will allow me to dput ?
[09:49] <TMM> owww... crappy simplepatchsys...
[09:49] <TMM> it tries it at -p0 - 2 , and the patch fails at all levels, while doing it manually works just fine (r)
[09:51] <sivang> LaserJock: what was the email address to send a signed email to? does the email need to contains anything special  so it will let me upload to REVU?
[09:52] <natroll-> so...what do you do when building a package and it breaks during make?  Learn C?
[09:53] <TMM> natroll- that helps, but, start by looking if it works without using the dpkg-buildpackage first (don't install)
[09:54] <natroll-> TMM, ok
[09:55] <LaserJock> sivang: keyring@tiber.tauware.de I think
[09:55] <LaserJock> sivang: wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU has it
[09:56] <natroll-> TMM, well, it doesn't make, but I can see what the issue is, it's missing the flag '--tag=CC'
[09:56] <natroll-> not that I know how to fix that
[09:56] <LaserJock> sivang: then one of the admins will email you back when they have added you to the keyring
[10:01] <natroll-> haha, i actually fixed it
[10:03] <minghua> Automatrix on slashdot?!
[10:04] <TMM> does anyone know anything about simplepatchsys?
[10:05] <LaserJock> minghua: hmmm
[10:07] <natroll-> so should I report upstream about the change i had to make to build the package, or not?
[10:08] <LaserJock> natroll-: probably depends on your relationship with upstream and how specific the changes are to Ubuntu
[10:09] <bddebian> Have any of you tried debmirror?
[10:09] <natroll-> LaserJock, well, it refused to make both with dpkg-buildpackage and with just make unless I added a flag in a Makefile.in (--tag=CC)
[10:09] <natroll-> LaserJock, is that too specific, it sounds rather generic
[10:09] <natroll-> bddebian, I actually just used it the other day
[10:10] <bddebian> natroll-: How'd you get it to work?
[10:10] <bddebian> I did this:  sudo debmirror -a i386 -s main -h mirrors.kernel.org -d dapper -r /ubuntu --progress -e http --ignore-release-gpg /archive/
[10:10] <minghua> natroll-: I think the question goes down to: if you just run ./configure && make && make install, does it work?
[10:10] <natroll-> minghua, ahhh, i'd have to try that
[10:11] <minghua> natroll-: if no, then bug upstream; if yes, then fix your debian/rules :-)
[10:12] <LaserJock> minghua: I wonder if slashdot has done anything with EasyUbuntu?
[10:12] <natroll-> bddebian, I used this as reference for debmirror: http://cargol.net/~ramon/ubuntu-dvd-en
[10:12] <natroll-> bddebian, but I used it for breezy...but i was in dapper
[10:13] <TMM> what should the patches in simple-patchsys be relative to? they work if the patch command is executed from the root of the source dir, is that what it expects?
[10:14] <ajmitch> morning
[10:14] <LaserJock> hi ajmitch
[10:14] <natroll-> morning ajmitch
[10:14] <ajmitch> 1079 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 84 not upgraded.
[10:14] <ajmitch> sigh :)
[10:14] <crimsun> ajmitch: alsa fixes merged into benC's git
[10:14] <minghua> LaserJock: no idea.  and I don't have enough stamina to fight against automatrix
[10:14] <ajmitch> crimsun: excellent, thankyou very much! :)
[10:15] <minghua> morning ajmitch
[10:15] <crimsun> ajmitch: thanks for bringing it to my attention :)
[10:16] <bddebian> Awesome, thanks natroll-
[10:16] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[10:16] <natroll-> bddebian, np
[10:16] <LaserJock> netzmeister: nabend!
[10:17] <TMM> would it be better to ask in ubuntu-devel?
[10:17] <bddebian> netzmeister: I got my Proliant up and running! :-)
[10:21] <natroll-> must....sleep.....
[10:21] <minghua> TMM: won't hurt, I suppose
[10:22] <ajmitch> bddebian: I got my new box up & running :)
[10:22] <netzmeister> hi LaserJock..
[10:22] <netzmeister> bddebian:  ohh fine..
[10:22] <bddebian> ajmitch: Coolio :-)
[10:22] <netzmeister> bddebian:  you told me yesterday?! apic and lapic
[10:23] <bddebian> netzmeister: Yeah but it died on boot after that.  I had to update my initramfs with cpqarray :-)
[10:25] <ajmitch> bddebian: so now you can get back to fixing universe bugs even faster
[10:25] <ajmitch> oh no
[10:25] <ajmitch> automatix on slashdot
[10:26] <LaserJock> yeah, minghua brought that up :(
[10:26] <bddebian> ajmitch: I can't do anything :-(
[10:28] <ajmitch> bddebian: why not?
[10:28] <ajmitch> you have the skills
[10:29] <ajmitch> you're a MOTU, you have the power
[10:30] <bddebian> MOTU yes, skillz no :-(
[10:30] <ajmitch> bah, stop complaining about lack of skills & just get to work :)
[10:30] <JohnnyMast> ur so friendly ajmitch
[10:30] <JohnnyMast> :p
[10:32] <JohnnyMast> hows the motu school btw?
[10:32] <Hobbsee> hehe of course he is.  just try poking him with a big stick, and he gets even more friendly.
[10:32] <JohnnyMast> i know ilike i didnt try :p
[10:34] <JohnnyMast> bddebian we trust in you dont wurry
[10:34] <JohnnyMast> just have fun on the job thats all that counts
[10:46] <LaserJock> dholbach: ping?
[10:46] <dholbach> LaserJock: pong
[10:47] <LaserJock> dholbach: I've been working on Malone 29105
[10:47] <Ubugtu> malone bug 29105 in ubuntu-doc "Docteam .debs lack docbase reigstration" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/29105
[10:48] <dholbach> nice
[10:48] <LaserJock> dholbach: I've got it all figured out. There is only one sticky point
[10:49] <LaserJock> dholbach: the doc base viewers can't access the docs in /usr/share/ubuntu-docs/
[10:49] <LaserJock> dholbach: they need to be in /usr/share/doc/
[10:49] <dholbach> sorry, I never worked much with doc-base stuff before
[10:49] <dholbach> I suggest you ask in #ubuntu-devel - I'm quite busy atm. :-/
[10:50] <LaserJock> dholbach: so is it ok to create a symlink from /usr/share/ubuntu-docs/html /usr/share/doc/ubuntu-docs/html ?
[10:50] <LaserJock> dholbach: oh, np. I just need your approval on the symlinks
[10:50] <dholbach> yeah
[10:50] <dholbach> sure
[10:50] <dholbach> it's the doc-team's package
[10:50] <dholbach> it doesn't need my approval :)
[10:50] <LaserJock> dholbach: well, but it is also a Main package
[10:51] <dholbach> that's fine
[10:51] <LaserJock> k, thanks.
[10:54] <Kyral> Stupid question, but what is the Xubuntu channel?
[10:55] <LaserJock> Kyral: the channel for xubuntu I would think
[11:57] <Kyral> Umm, whats ttthe procedure for when Upstream already has made Debian Packages (nott in Debian)
[11:58] <tseng> you ask them to kindly remove debian/ from their tarballs
[11:58] <tseng> and surrender ownership
[11:58] <tseng> or, join motu :)
[11:58] <Kyral> the guy has a source repo :P
[11:59] <tseng> is it native or diff.gz?
[11:59] <Kyral> basically I have been asked by someone in the Forums to package this
[11:59] <Kyral> http://www.kadu.net/wiki/index.php/English:Download:Ubuntu
[11:59] <tseng> if he is doing everything right
[11:59] <tseng> it is worth asking him to work with ubuntu directly with a sponsor
[11:59] <Kyral> yah I'll have to look it over
[11:59] <tseng> if its bad, you should get him to fix it before finding a sponsor
[11:59] <Kyral> Sponsor == ?
[12:00] <tseng> someone who can upload for ubuntu
[12:00] <tseng> and wants to help him out
[12:00] <Kyral> ah so not me lol
[12:00] <LaserJock> Kyral: you'll just have to work hard and fix that
[12:01] <Kyral> yah yah