[12:05] <wBryce_> goodnight
[12:40] <LaserJock> ogra_ibook: ping?
[12:51] <tseng> Tonio_: slomo_ i dont have time to read the whole scrollback
[12:51] <tseng> Tonio_: but the autostart file isnt for a beagle front end.. its for the backend
[12:51] <tseng> Tonio_: frontends shouldnt touch it please
[12:51] <slomo_> tseng: that's what he want
[12:51] <slomo_> tseng: kde needs a autostart desktop file in /usr/share/autostart
[12:51] <tseng> well then kde is wrong
[12:51] <slomo_> tseng: they don't use /etc/xdg/autostart yet
[12:51] <Tonio_> tseng: yes, that's what I asked for :)
[12:51] <tseng> should be easy enough to fix
[12:52] <slomo_> tseng: so i just copied it over to the wrong/old location and now they're happy ;)
[12:52] <tseng> make kde look in the standard prefix
[12:52] <tseng> slomo_: eh whatever
[12:52] <tseng> slomo_: thanks.
[12:52] <slomo_> tseng: i guess they don't want to patch kde that hard... and when there's ubuntu-desktop installed on a kubuntu system you get gnome-volume-manager etc started by default... so it's maybe better the way it is now for this release
[12:53] <tseng> I guess
[12:54] <tseng> that is a problem kde will have to fix
[12:54] <tseng> does gnome ignore /usr/share/autostart now?
[12:54] <slomo_> well, nobody forces them to use that standard :) but it would definitely better
[12:54] <slomo_> tseng: yes
[12:54] <tseng> ok.
[12:54] <tseng> good enough then
[12:55] <slomo_> that was the first i verified... i don't want two beagled at the same time :P
[12:55] <tseng> yeah that would be awful
[12:55] <Amaranth> iirc GNOME uses /etc/xdg/autostart and KDE uses /usr/share/autostart
[12:55] <slomo_> well, the second refuses to start... but awful nonetheless :)
[12:55] <tseng> Directory: pool/universe/b/beagle
[12:56] <Amaranth> iirc KDE upstream plans to make all of their daemons OnlyShowIn=KDE and GNOME plans to do the same
[12:56] <Amaranth> so they can share a dir
[12:56] <slomo_> sounds useful :)
[12:56] <tseng> OnlyShowIn=GNOME;
[12:56] <tseng> we already have this
[12:56] <slomo_> tseng: don't ask me why it isn't in main yet ;) evolution-sharp is for some reason...
[12:57] <Amaranth> tseng: do all the KDE ones have OnlyShowIn=KDE;?
[12:57] <tseng> i did a report for it in breezy
[12:57] <tseng> Amaranth: ENOKDE
[12:57] <truz24> report?
[12:57] <Amaranth> tseng: hehe
[12:57] <tseng> main inclusion report
[12:57] <truz24> link?
[12:57] <slomo_> tseng: which was reused now... but no idea why beagle is not in main yet... should be afaik
[12:57] <tseng> ok thanks
[12:57] <tseng> i saw a bit this morning
[12:57] <tseng> but i was in meetings the rest of the day
[12:58] <tseng> dont say that too loud
[12:58] <Amaranth> i wonder what could be dropped to make them fit
[12:58] <tseng> ogra will bite your face off
[12:58] <slomo_> hehe
[12:58] <Amaranth> i think using lzma on the livecd + espresso would make it possible
[01:00] <tseng> not for edubuntu
[01:00] <tseng> but not my problem
[01:00] <tseng> f-spot + deps needs 10mb
[01:00] <tseng> by my count
[01:00] <tseng> that is in debs, not on the livecd
[01:00] <tseng> installed size is left as an exercise for the reader
[01:01] <slomo_> shouldn'T be much larger as the livecd images are compressed afaik
[01:01] <tseng> i guess so
[01:03] <robertj> q. what happens if yall add a gnome vfs place pointing to revu1-incoming?
[01:08] <LaserJock> I don't suppose anybody here knows anything about squeak ?
[03:05] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:05] <LaserJock> hi bddebian
[03:06] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[03:22] <Amaranth> sorry
[03:57] <zakame> hi MOTUs
[03:57] <bddebian> Heya zakame
[03:57] <zakame> hi bddebian! =)
[04:07] <no0tic> hi
[04:07] <no0tic> any ndiswrapper-utils mantainer here?
[04:07] <no0tic> ndiswrapper-utils1.8 is not working on dapper
[04:07] <no0tic> I've opened a bug, but noone answered
[04:34] <Toadstool> good night
[05:02] <psusi> I was wondering, what is the policy on bug fixes in the stable release?  if a package is found to be broken in breezy, can not not be fixed in the breezy repo?  or must it wait for dapper?
[05:12] <LaserJock> most likely wait for Dapper
[05:13] <LaserJock> unless it is security or really important (I think like eat your drive important)
[05:14] <psusi> well, how about not quite eat your drive important, but the package is broken kind of thing?
[05:15] <psusi> like a package that by default is configured to start a server from inetd, so the /etc/init.d startup script fails to launch the daemon, but the package does not depend on inetd either?
[05:16] <LaserJock> I don't think so. If it can be built for breezy from the dapper source (without any changes) iit could be backported
[05:20] <psusi> I don't know or care about any updates in dapper really.. just seems that the original package that was released in breezy should have its depends line fixed so it properly installs inetd
[05:20] <psusi> or has the /etc config file line changed so that it correctly starts in stand alone mode, like the packager apparently intended
[05:21] <psusi> simple fix that makes it un broken, you  know?
[05:21] <psusi> seems like that kind of thing should just be slipped into the stable release
[05:22] <LaserJock> yeah, but there are quite a few of those really. Once you start to open the flood gates, then there really isn't much of a point in having a release I suppose
[05:23] <LaserJock> psusi: but you're welcome to ask somebody more knowledgable then me
[05:24] <LaserJock> I've just always heard that it has to be a eats your drive kind of thing
[05:24] <psusi> well, the point of having a release is to publish known good software... once it is found that a mistake was made and the published version is horribly broken....
[05:25] <psusi> well, thanks for letting me know... just kind of sucks, that's all...
[05:25] <LaserJock> I understand though
[05:25] <LaserJock> I was working on a package for Breezy and finally got it to build
[05:26] <LaserJock> then shortly after Breezy was released I found that it was completely broken
[05:26] <LaserJock> wouldn't run at all
[05:26] <psusi> exactly
[05:26] <psusi> then all these bug reports come in and people complain about it
[05:27] <LaserJock> and I close them as fixed in dapper
[05:27] <psusi> well, if it's a big problem, and the fix is simple enough....
[05:27] <LaserJock> but dapper should have much fewer of those
[05:27] <psusi> if the fix is rather involved, then yea... you can tell them to wait for dapper
[05:27] <psusi> oh?
[05:28] <LaserJock> Dapper is way better IMO
[05:28] <psusi> well, of course ;)
[05:28] <LaserJock> I was doing tons of FTBFS the day before Breezy was released
[05:28] <LaserJock> and unmet deps
[05:28] <psusi> I sure hope the intelimouse regression gets fixed before it is released though
[05:29] <psusi> that's a rather glaring and silly bug that got introduced very early in dapper's development cycle and hasn't been fixed yet
[05:29] <LaserJock> We have been focused on bugs for a while now
[05:29] <psusi> kind of sucks that the X guru quit
[05:29] <TheMuso> meh. How do you guys find all these bugs? I know there is malone, but what search criteria do you use?
[05:30] <psusi> well, I reported the intelimouse bug because I found it ;)
[05:30] <LaserJock> TheMuso: I look for bugs in specific packages (or sets of packages in MOTU Science's case)
[05:31] <psusi> and I'm still waiting for the e2fsprogs kernel header conflict on amd64 to be resolved upstream since they didn't like my fix to allow the defrag package to build on amd64
[05:31] <LaserJock> usually anyway
[05:31] <TheMuso> LaserJock: Well thats easy for you. :)
[05:31] <LaserJock> TheMuso: not really, I've got to look at ~ 400 source packages
[05:31] <psusi> and it looks like dmraid and packetcd are going to have to wait for dapper+1
[05:32] <TheMuso> Dmraid IMO should have been given more priority, as many people use fakeraid out there.
[05:32] <psusi> LOTS of changes filter in every day when I pull... it's awesome to watch
[05:32] <psusi> TheMuso, I agree
[05:33] <psusi> I started pushing for it before breezy was released
[05:33] <psusi> took me two weeks to get ubuntu installed because of that
[05:33] <TheMuso> I remember reading somewhere that it doesn't build against klibc or something.
[05:33] <TheMuso> So you using it atm?
[05:33] <psusi> it was building against klibc... I've patched it in my version not to though, since there's no point
[05:33] <psusi> yes
[05:33] <LaserJock> well, I couldn't care less personally, but that is just me. I don't do as much of that kind of stuff. But if people are using it it would be nice to have
[05:34] <psusi> I tell you what... some people think I'm nuts for getting the hardware fakeraid of 2 10,000 rpm raptors...
[05:34] <TheMuso> So I guess what remains is implementing the proper components for d-i and espresso.
[05:34] <psusi> for them, I just point to my 24 second system boot time ;)
[05:35] <TheMuso> psusi: You may as well use software RAID in Linux natively, unless you need to keep Windows around.
[05:35] <psusi> TheMuso, aye... I wanted to keep windows around... just in case... though I never use it any more
[05:35] <LaserJock> so what is fakeraid?
[05:35] <psusi> also you can't boot directly from a software raid0
[05:35] <psusi> LaserJock, bios assisted software raid, so it behaves like hardware raid
[05:35] <TheMuso> LaserJock: Fakeraid is where the RAID info is stored on the HDs that is created by the BIOS. But it is really software RAID.
[05:36] <TheMuso> psusi: Yeah true
[05:36] <psusi> LaserJock, i.e. in windows you have to install a special driver, you configure the raid volumes in the bios setup utility, and the system boots directly from the raid
[05:36] <LaserJock> so it is a compromise? I've never done any raid before so I'm not exactly sure of all the requirements
[05:36] <psusi> TheMuso, yea, so with linux software raid, you have to set up a plain /boot partition so grub is happy, then put the rest of the system on the raid volume... which is kind of a pain
[05:37] <TheMuso> psusi: Yeah I know what you mean.
[05:37] <TheMuso> I guess if someone was to spend time implementing it for d-i and espresso it may have made it in.
[05:37] <psusi> LaserJock, yea, you could say that... really it's just a method companies came up with to produce ide "raid cards" cheap and make money selling "raid cards"
[05:38] <psusi> TheMuso, yea... I need to spend some more time trying to integrate it into d-i
[05:38] <psusi> it's complicated though...
[05:38] <TheMuso> psusi: What about espresso?
[05:38] <psusi> no clue about that... not even seen it yet
[05:38] <TheMuso> Yeah I can understand. First you need to teach partman about it...
[05:38] <psusi> but actually.... I think nothing even needs done for that...
[05:38] <TheMuso> Right.
[05:38] <psusi> oh wait... espresso still uses partman right?
[05:39] <TheMuso> Spec: You may actually ahve a point there.
[05:39] <psusi> yea... partman needs to understand it
[05:39] <TheMuso> That detection would have to be done by casper.
[05:39] <psusi> other than that, espresso is basically how I manually installed ubuntu in the first place
[05:39] <TheMuso> psusi: Don't know.
[05:39] <TheMuso> But whatever partitioner is used, it would need to know about the dmraid created device nodes.
[05:39] <psusi> boot from the livecd, install the dmraid package, format disks, and debootstrap the system
[05:39] <psusi> aye...
[05:40] <TheMuso> So have you been able to create the necessary initramfs hooks?
[05:40] <psusi> and most partitioners get pissy because the dmraid created volumes don't support the BLKRRPART ioctl
[05:40] <TheMuso> Right.
[05:40] <psusi> yes... I created the initramfs hooks and have added them to my version of the dmraid package, which is up on revu
[05:41] <TheMuso> Ah ok.
[05:41] <psusi> I've had a bug filed on gparted not liking the dmraid drive since breezy rc... it looks like it might soon support it
[05:42] <TheMuso> Have other distros implemented dmraid yet?
[05:42] <psusi> not sure... but I think redhat is leading the charge
[05:42] <psusi> dmraid is made by them
[05:42] <TheMuso> Yeah I know.
[05:43] <psusi> based on the mailing list posts that I skim, it looks like they are still in the early stages of support
[05:43] <psusi> but it isn't a do it yourself thing either
[05:43] <LaserJock> hmm, well you guys lost me :-)
[05:44] <psusi> LaserJock, if you want to read up on it a bit check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FakeRaidHowto
[05:44] <psusi> TheMuso, may as well wish scsi was cheaper
[05:44] <TheMuso> Yeah true.
[05:44] <psusi> besides, fakeraid is just as good
[05:44] <TheMuso> Or even the IDE RAID sollutions.
[05:44] <psusi> they are cheap... most motherboards these days have it built in
[05:45] <TheMuso> I mean hardware IDE raid.
[05:45] <psusi> at least the bargain basment $50 ones
[05:45] <psusi> err... at least NOT the bargain basement ones
[05:45] <LaserJock> hmm, I've just got a single 120GB 7200 RPM IDE drive
[05:46] <TheMuso> psusi: Never thought you could do fakeraid 5.
[05:46] <psusi> LaserJock, I've been a big proponent of fast disks for years... got 2 10,000 rpm 36 gig raptors now... last system had two u160 scsi 18 gig 15,000 rpm cheetahs... before that it was dual 9 gig 10,000 rpm cheetahs
[05:46] <psusi> TheMuso, I think I read that some of them can
[05:47] <psusi> TheMuso, mine can't, I know that... only has 2 ports
[05:47] <psusi> dual drives and dual cpus... makes for a very nice system
[05:48] <LaserJock> psusi: I've never really thought about hard drive speed before but I suppose it could really be a bottleneck
[05:48] <psusi> LaserJock, aye... most people don't think about it
[05:48] <psusi> but it is just as important as a fast cpu or graphics card
[05:48] <psusi> or ram
[05:49] <psusi> once you have a gig of ram, the next priority is hard disk
[05:49] <TheMuso> Damn right.
[05:50] <TheMuso> And have managed to do so for all systems I have here.
[05:50] <psusi> that's a must... and also why I'm so happy to have sata now
[05:50] <psusi> no more master/slave BS
[05:50] <psusi> and sata even supports NCQ... it's almost as smart as scsi was 10 years ago ;)
[05:51] <TheMuso> Here in Australia, Sata drives are still more expensive than IDE. I am not going SATA till they are cheaper than IDE.
[05:52] <psusi> really?
[05:53] <TheMuso> Yeah.
[05:53] <psusi> I decided to go for sata instead of scsi on this computer when I built it... hrm... wow... two years ago now?
[05:53] <psusi> because it was so cheap
[05:53] <psusi> 10,000 rpm sata wd raptor drives are an absolute steal
[05:54] <psusi> high performance at a very low price
[05:54] <TheMuso> I am sure you have other data drives as well?
[05:54] <TheMuso> Or are they the only ones?
[05:55] <psusi> the 74 gig version is now on newegg.com for $125 after rebate...
[05:55] <psusi> nope... just those two
[05:55] <psusi> two 36 gig drives in a stripe
[05:55] <TheMuso> Right.
[05:56] <psusi> that still feelds strange to say I have 72 gigs of storage.... wasn't that long ago that I thought I was the shiznit because I was the first guy on the block with a MASSIVE 1 GB drive... heh
[05:57] <psusi> wow... the 36 gig raptors are only $100 on newegg
[05:57] <psusi> makes me wish I had another port...
[05:58] <TheMuso> hahaha
[05:58] <psusi> SPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED! ;)
[06:00] <psusi> 30,905 messages.... since Jan 1
[06:02] <TheMuso> hahaha
[06:02] <TheMuso> psusi: Thats a good howto.
[06:02] <TheMuso> But I no longer need RAID of any sort or Windows so it no longer concerns me.
[06:03] <psusi> TheMuso, thanks
[06:04] <psusi> I've had probably a dozen different people email me about using it
[06:04] <psusi> so it seems there IS demand for it
[06:04] <TheMuso> I am sure there is.
[06:04] <psusi> now I just need to get the spec approved for dapper+1 ;)
[06:04] <TheMuso> And many who say stuff it, I will re-install windows and set things up on different drives.
[06:05] <TheMuso> What is the link to the spec?
[06:05] <psusi> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FakeRaidSpec
[06:05] <TheMuso> Thanks.
[06:07] <psusi> I cant wait for lvm to support raid1 and raid5 rather than having to use lvm on top of md
[06:07] <TheMuso> And I guess with the CPUs being as powerful as they are today, raid work is probably not much to be done in software.
[06:08] <psusi> exactly... the only one that actually involves any work at all is raid5, and computing xor is not much work
[06:08] <psusi> well, raid6 actually is a good deal of work
[06:09] <TheMuso> I need to read up about RAID 5 again.
[06:09] <psusi> but if you need raid6 you can afford to get that 30 drive 4U rack mount hardware raid system ;)
[06:09] <TheMuso> RAID 0/1 is what most people need anyway.
[06:09] <psusi> aye...
[06:09] <psusi> power users and soho servers just need raid 0/1
[06:09] <TheMuso> ...and a good backup plan
[06:09] <psusi> aye
[06:10] <psusi> so what do you think about the spec?
[06:10] <TheMuso> I think it is good. There is really nothing else to say about it.
[06:11] <psusi> sweet
[06:13] <psusi> so... what should I do to try and get the specs approved for dapper+1?  bring it up in the dev meeting once dapper is finalized?
[06:13] <TheMuso> I dunno.
[06:14] <crimsun> yeah, you'll want to do that
[06:14] <psusi> ok... lets see... was there a wiki page to add topics to like for the CC?
[06:15] <psusi> that reminds me... I really need to propose myself to become a member...
[06:15] <psusi> great googly moogly!
[06:15] <psusi> malone says I have 18,417 karma!
[06:16] <psusi> is that enough to be reincarnated as buda? ;)
[06:17] <crimsun> not really. I think sh at some point had over 150k
[06:17] <LaserJock> check out seb128's too
[06:18] <psusi> wowsers
[06:20] <VoX> why on earth would my nic have gone from eth0 to eth2, when there is only one nic installed in the box?
[06:20] <VoX> er
[06:20] <VoX> wrong #
[06:23] <lakin> seb128 at one point had half a million karma, it's back down to something a bit more reasonable now I assume?
[06:23] <psusi> jesus...
[06:23] <psusi> or should I say Buddah?
[06:23] <crimsun> probably. I mean I had something ridiculous last week, and it made no sense.
[06:24] <crimsun> although I dare say seb deserved his half mil more than I did my inflated amt ;)
[06:24] <lakin> Well they increased the amounts certain things were worth, which shot everyone up really high, and then implemented some sort of time-based reduction, so karma is worth more, if it's more recent.
[06:24] <lakin> yeah, he does.
[06:27] <lakin> crimsun, i umm meant, he deserves his high amount, I meant nothing with regards to your amount. :)
[06:27] <crimsun> lakin: no offense read in your statement :)
[06:27] <crimsun> 'lo ajmitch
[06:28] <ajmitch> hi
[06:31] <LaserJock> hi ajmitch
[06:32] <Se7h> aloha
[06:38] <ajmitch> hi Hobbsee
[06:38] <Hobbsee> hey ajmitch :)
[06:38] <ajmitch> how's it going?
[06:39] <Hobbsee> good, i've found that chem textbooks make very good pillows, in the uni library...
[06:41] <ajmitch> heh
[06:41] <ajmitch> not enough sleep last night? :)
[06:42] <psusi> surely ben collins has a few signatures on his gpg key?  I retrieved it with gpg --recieve-key, but when I --edit-key it and issue a check command, it shows only the self sig
[06:42] <psusi> is there something more I have to do in order to see who all has signed it?
[06:43] <TheMuso> psusi: gpg --list-sigs
[06:44] <psusi> TheMuso, same thing... only signature listed for his key is his own
[06:44] <TheMuso> What is his key ID?
[06:44] <psusi> 60e80b5b
[06:45] <psusi> at least, that's what malone says
[06:45] <TheMuso> Right.
[06:45] <psusi> btw... why the heck is the key id only list the first 32 bits?
[06:46] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: welcome back :)
[06:46] <Hobbsee> hehe thanks :)
[06:46] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: at least it was chem textbooks ;-)
[06:46] <Hobbsee> and my arm, yes...
[06:46] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you need to find a better pillow
[06:46] <Hobbsee> funnily enough, my arm was a bit sore after that!
[06:46] <ajmitch> heh
[06:46] <ajmitch> you didn't sleep enough last night/
[06:46] <ajmitch> ?
[06:46] <Hobbsee> hmm...true
[06:46] <Hobbsee> havent been for the last couple of weeks
[06:47] <Hobbsee> going to bed at 2am, you know :P
[06:47] <ajmitch> who would do such a thing?
[06:47] <Kyral> Hacking?
[06:47] <ajmitch> shocking..
[06:47] <Kyral> I apologize for being hyper in advance :P
[06:47] <TheMuso> I see what you mkean.
[06:48] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:49] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: easy, i dont get tired before then, for the moment at least, and then end up exhausted when i have to get up the next morning
[06:49] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: yeah, that's a bit of a problem, especially when you need to get to classes in the morning
[06:49] <Hobbsee> yeah...
[06:50] <Hobbsee> woot!
[06:50] <ajmitch> but I went to bed early, only about 1:30
[06:50] <ajmitch> ouch
[06:50] <Kyral> lol
[06:50] <Kyral> this is why I live on Campus :D
[06:51] <Hobbsee> ah yes, now *there's* a good idea!
[06:51] <Kyral> what is?
[06:51] <StevenK> Blah, I didn't manage to get to uni by 9am either.
[06:52] <Hobbsee> living on campus
[06:52] <ajmitch> StevenK: funny that
[06:52] <Hobbsee> mind you, i've found that taking the laptop into uni, then leaving at 8 or 9 pm works pretty well, in avoiding peak hour
[06:52] <StevenK> I came close today - 9:20 or so
[06:52] <Kyral> I am always at Uni lol
[06:52] <ajmitch> joy new upstream release for 3 of my debian packages
[06:56] <Hobbsee> hehe @ ajmitch - get going!
[06:56] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I've got a bit of other work to do first :)
[06:56] <Hobbsee> bah...stupid assignmetns...you can do mine too, if you like...
[06:57] <Kyral> and mine!
[06:57] <ajmitch> not just assignments, also some coding work
[06:57] <Hobbsee> are yours better than mine?
[06:57] <ajmitch> Kyral: no thanks
[06:57] <Kyral> mine?
[06:57] <Hobbsee> ah well, one of my assignments is coding...
[06:57] <Hobbsee> yes
[06:57] <Kyral> "Operating System Simulator"
[06:57] <ajmitch> at least I could probably understand Hobbsee's assignments :)
[06:57] <Kyral> which are?
[06:57] <Hobbsee> ajmitch
[06:58] <Hobbsee> true!
[06:58] <whiprush> hi aj, everyone.
[06:58] <Hobbsee> darn enter key...
[06:58] <Hobbsee> hi whiprush
[06:58] <ajmitch> hey whiprush
[06:58] <ajmitch> what's up?
[06:58] <whiprush> not much
[06:58] <Kyral> hi whiprus
[06:58] <Kyral> .....
[06:58] <whiprush> ajmitch: thanks for accepting that bug. :D
[06:58] <ajmitch> whiprush: bad news on the f-spot-import & g-v-m bug
[06:58] <whiprush> oh no!
[06:58] <ajmitch> whiprush: I checked with seb & pitti & it can't be added into gconf as an option
[06:58] <ajmitch> the ui lied to us
[06:59] <Hobbsee> Kyral: there's such a thing as a soft beer?
[06:59] <whiprush> heh
[06:59] <Kyral> I meant like a real beer
[06:59] <Kyral> not American Beer :P
[06:59] <Hobbsee> oh.
[06:59] <whiprush> there's always hope for just making it the default in dapper+1
[06:59] <ajmitch> yeah
[06:59] <Kyral> bear?
[06:59] <Hobbsee> er, or beer!
[06:59] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Or beer, either?
[06:59] <Kyral> lol
[06:59] <whiprush> anyone heard from \sh yet?
[06:59] <Kyral> I haven't been around
[07:00] <Hobbsee> whiprush: i havent in ages
[07:00] <Hobbsee> ack!
[07:00] <StevenK> Aiee
[07:00] <Kyral> MOTU Bear Hug!
[07:00] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[07:01] <Hobbsee> air's overrated StevenK...
[07:01] <SEJeff> :)
[07:01] <ajmitch> SEJeff: I'd agree
[07:01] <StevenK> Hobbsee: And a nasty habit to boot?
[07:01] <Kyral> I haven't taken it yet....
[07:02] <Kyral> thanks for reminding me :D
[07:02] <Hobbsee> LOL!
[07:02] <Hobbsee> StevenK: exactly.
[07:02] <Hobbsee> so's eating.
[07:03] <SEJeff> ajmitch: what ever happened to the motu-school, did that kind of die?
[07:03] <Hobbsee> Kyral: why, what were you going to say?
[07:03] <Kyral> nothing....
[07:03] <StevenK> Kyral: It's a trap!
[07:03] <ajmitch> SEJeff: it required people to want to teach, things to teach, and people to listen
[07:03] <Kyral> StevenK: no shit
[07:03] <StevenK> Damn, too slow.
[07:03] <Kyral> I've watched enough anime to know what would happen if I answered :P
[07:04] <Kyral> Something would have come out of Hammerspace and smacked me HARD
[07:04] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:04] <SEJeff> ajmitch: yeah that is a pretty thankless job I guess. I'm going give a go at packaging leaftag this week or next if I can
[07:04] <Hobbsee> whiprush: last signed in on  Last Seen: 4 weeks 5 days (20h 59m 56s) ago (\sh_away seen 4 weeks 5 days (20h 59m 56s) ago)
[07:05] <whiprush> yikes
[07:05] <Kyral> Hobbsee: Ever see Love Hina?
[07:05] <Hobbsee> Kyral: nope
[07:05] <Kyral> heeh its good
[07:05] <Kyral> a little on the harem side, but still funny
[07:06] <Hobbsee> ugh, harems
[07:07] <Kyral> Its not that bad...
[07:07] <Kyral> though I think I like School Rumble better
[07:09] <Hobbsee> mmm ok :P
[07:09] <Kyral> huh?
[07:09] <Hobbsee> to the "it's not that bad"
[07:09] <Hobbsee> was reading about NM
[07:10] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: how's the kubuntu bugfixing going? :)
[07:10] <Kyral> oh, Full Metal Panic?! Fumoffu is good (along with Full Metal Panic and Full Metal Panic! The Second Raid)
[07:10] <Kyral> NM?
[07:10] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: dunno yet, not sure if there's that much focus on it right now - seems like there's a fair bit on network-manager-kde, and maybe kpowersave
[07:11] <Hobbsee> Kyral: network manager.
[07:11] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: so what have you been working on?
[07:11] <Kyral> Kerry got accepted
[07:11] <Hobbsee> me personally?  some testing, including of kde 3.5.2, and being at uni, with all the insane assignments, and catching u
[07:11] <Hobbsee> p
[07:13] <ajmitch> kids these days..
[07:13] <Kyral> hey I'm 20 years old
[07:14] <ajmitch> and?
[07:14] <Kyral> Don't call me a kid unless you are prepared to be called "Old Man" :P
[07:14] <poningru> stupid kids
[07:14] <Kyral> HEY!
[07:14] <Hobbsee> stupid poningru :P
[07:14] <Kyral> meh.....
[07:15] <Hobbsee> 17
[07:15] <Kyral> and already in college?
[07:15] <Hobbsee> Kyral: yes.  i was the youngest in the grade thru school
[07:15] <Kyral> wait....Euro?
[07:16] <ajmitch> hah
[07:17] <Kyral> Sorry....a 17 year old in college is kinda odd in the US, thats why I ask
[07:17] <ajmitch> Kyral: not that unusual here
[07:17] <Kyral> oh jeez poningru don't say that
[07:17] <Kyral> ajmitch: Ah Aussie
[07:17] <poningru> how old are ya?
[07:17] <LaserJock> Kyral: I started college at 16 ;-)
[07:17] <poningru> oh 20
[07:17] <Kyral> Yah!
[07:17] <Kyral> So don't feel old!
[07:17] <Kyral> I'm one year behind you!
[07:17] <poningru> uni in US != uni in Euro
[07:17] <Kyral> poningru: I know this
[07:18] <Kyral> which is why I asked
[07:18] <poningru> imagine your junior year and your senior in hs as a uni
[07:18] <Kyral> poningru: I know, my college has a program like that
[07:18] <Kyral> Though I'm not "used" to 20
[07:18] <Hobbsee> Kyral: australia.
[07:19] <poningru> hehe
[07:19] <Se7h> 'back to school' heh?
[07:19] <Kyral> I sometimes I have to remind myself that I am 20 and not 16 :P
[07:19] <LaserJock> lol, I have to remind myself that I'm 24 and not 35
[07:19] <Kyral> You said 17
[07:19] <poningru> a what?
[07:19] <Se7h> LaserJock lmao
[07:19] <poningru> LaserJock: hahahahaha
[07:19] <Hobbsee> Kyral: i am 17, i keep forgetting, and answering 18
[07:19] <Kyral> Hobbsee: PUIRJURY :P
[07:19] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:20] <Hobbsee> i had to for work - was told "you must sign this"
[07:20] <Hobbsee> so i did...and ignored the one about the age limit
[07:20] <Kyral> Yah, well, its called "working papers"
[07:20] <Kyral> in the US ;P
[07:20] <Kyral> anyway, back to Inuyasha...I need to relax before bed
[07:20] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:20] <ajmitch> heh
[07:20] <poningru> INYUASHA
[07:20] <Kyral> I'll be working for 10 hours streight tomorrow
[07:20] <poningru> kogome
[07:20] <Kyral> SIT BOY!
[07:20] <Hobbsee> ugh
[07:20] <poningru> I hate that show
[07:21] <Kyral> kik
[07:21] <LaserJock> Kyral: this *is* relaxing before bed
[07:21] <Se7h> you people should got and rest, you all look tired
[07:21] <Kyral> lol
[07:21] <poningru> hehe you are lucky with that schedule
[07:21] <Kyral> Excel Saga
[07:21] <Kyral> YEA!
[07:21] <poningru> I have 2 meetings to go to
[07:21] <crimsun> oh I'm definitely tired, but there are so friggin many alsa-* bugs on malone...
[07:21] <poningru> and then an exam
[07:21] <Erlang> Inuyasha?
[07:21] <poningru> then a tutoring job
[07:21] <Kyral> Anime
[07:21] <Kyral> Excel Saga is MOST EXCELLENT
[07:21] <poningru> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inuyasha
[07:21] <poningru> it sucks
[07:21] <Erlang> oh, I know nothing of that.
[07:22] <Se7h> crimsun i would help if i didnt have work at 14h and its 6.21am here
[07:22] <Hobbsee> crimsun: easy solution - ditch alsa?  :P
[07:22] <Kyral> Yah well, I started watching it and I tend to finish things
[07:22] <Se7h> off to bed
[07:22] <Se7h> cya all
[07:22] <Kyral> Suzuka is good....
[07:22] <Kyral> Ai Yori Aoshi is good
[07:22] <crimsun> Hobbsee: hehe
[07:22] <LaserJock> ajmitch: +1
[07:22] <Kyral> Trigun....
[07:22] <Erlang> I prefer Other Things.
[07:22] <Kyral> FMP
[07:23] <Kyral> Azumanga Daioh
[07:23] <ajmitch> Kyral: I think we've established that you like anime..
[07:23] <Kyral> ehehehe
[07:23] <Kyral> No kiddin
[07:23] <Kyral> I have over 190 GB of anime
[07:24] <StevenK> steven@liquified:~% du -sh /media/media/tv
[07:24] <StevenK> 257G    /media/media/tv
[07:24] <LaserJock> Oh My Gosh!
[07:24] <poningru> holy shit
[07:24] <LaserJock> I've got 2GB of music and that is it
[07:25] <Kyral> 186G	/home/kyral/anime
[07:25] <Kyral> hmm
[07:25] <Kyral> 333G	/home/kyral/anime
[07:25] <Kyral> hehe
[07:25] <LaserJock> I wouldn't have enough room for pbuilders and chroots if I did that
[07:26] <crimsun> I um, have lots of failed build logs.
[07:26] <ajmitch> sigh, diskspace comparisons..
[07:27] <Kyral> oh god...
[07:27] <Kyral> One Piece takes up 52 GB?!
[07:28] <Erlang> what's more manly, uptime or diskspace comparisons?
[07:28] <Kyral> or Server!
[07:28] <Kyral> azuredreams.us/munin
[07:28] <ajmitch> Erlang: bug fixing
[07:28] <crimsun> launchpad karma, definitely
[07:28] <ajmitch> crimsun: nah
[07:28] <Erlang> ha ;D nice one
[07:29] <LaserJock> how bout how many times we've broken Universe?
[07:29] <ajmitch> crimsun: we know you've been doing a lot of bug work lately :)
[07:29] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:29] <crimsun> ajmitch: bahah
[07:29] <ajmitch> LaserJock: fixing universe would be preferable thanks :)
[07:30] <LaserJock> ajmitch: oh, yeah... that's what I meant ;-)
[07:30] <Hobbsee> it needs someone to bork it, to fix it though :P
[07:30] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: it's well borked
[07:30] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:31] <Hobbsee> oh crud!!!!
[07:31] <Kyral> lol
[07:31] <Kyral> I am SO glad I don't drive :D
[07:31] <ajmitch> I've got $60 in my wallet here if you need it? :)
[07:31] <Hobbsee> oh thanks :)
[07:31] <Kyral> ajmitch: you live near her?
[07:31] <ajmitch> Kyral: about 3 hour flight
[07:32] <Kyral> That ain't what I call near....
[07:32] <Hobbsee> unfortunately, i went shopping a few days ago...and i havent been paid again yet
[07:32] <Hobbsee> anyway, back soon
[07:32] <Kyral> I mean by your definition I live "near" my uncle in Cali
[07:32] <poningru> Hobbsee: why are you not in #ubuntu-women
[07:33] <Hobbsee> poningru: good question.  guess i already connect into enough as it is
[07:33] <ajmitch> poningru: because -motu is much more fun?
[07:33] <Hobbsee> hehe
[07:33] <Hobbsee> that too
[07:33] <Kyral> yah! We aren't allowed in there :P
[07:33] <Hobbsee> feels weird having a "women" channel - i've worked more with the guys, all my life
[07:33] <Kyral> its like some IPTables thing
[07:33] <poningru> Kyral: yes you are
[07:33] <poningru> hehe
[07:33] <Kyral> poningru: it was a joke :P
[07:34] <poningru> yeah figured that out about two seconds after I wrote that
[07:34] <Kyral> if ( user.gender == male ) { return 1; } :P
[07:34] <Hobbsee> 27.80 - woot!  think i'll be able to refer to pay for petrol
[07:34] <Kyral> Again this is why I don't drive....
[07:34] <Hobbsee> Kyral: else {break}
[07:34] <ajmitch> excellent :)
[07:35] <Hobbsee> hehe :)
[07:35] <Kyral> Hobbsee: no
[07:35] <Hobbsee> back in a bit
[07:35] <Kyral> else { return 0; } :P
[07:35] <Hobbsee> Kyral: well, seeing as "blow up" isnt exactly standard c++ :P
[07:35] <Hobbsee_away> now stop delaying me hehe!
[07:36] <Kyral> void blow_up ( user user ) { delete *user; }
[07:36] <Hobbsee_away> now that's getting more complex than i understand hehe
[07:36] <Hobbsee_away> i sorta do...oh well
[07:37] <ajmitch> Hobbsee_away: stop getting distracted, go get petrol :)
[07:38] <Kyral> ajmitch: you HAVE, I remember meeting you at UBZ :P
[07:38] <ajmitch> that was ages ago
[07:39] <Kyral> yes, but more than I have
[07:39] <Kyral> and Canada doesn't count when its a half-hour drive
[07:40] <LaserJock> Kyral: I haven't even been to Canada and I lived probably only 4-6 hrs away
[07:41] <Kyral> LaserJock: its literally my backyard
[07:41] <Kyral> Montreal is like 2 hours away
[07:41] <Kyral> I wanna go to Euro
[07:42] <LaserJock> All I've ever done is go to Mexio (kinda going upstream)
[07:42] <TheMuso> Has anything been released about the next dev summit at all?
[07:42] <Kyral> Dev Summit?
[07:42] <TheMuso> The next conference for Ubuntu.
[07:42] <Kyral> ah
[07:43] <Kyral> I don't think so
[07:43] <ajmitch> nothing yet
[07:43] <TheMuso> Right.
[07:43] <Kyral> sabdfl just did that Asia Tour right?
[07:43] <ajmitch> yes, he did
[07:43] <Kyral> yah let him "rest" a bit :P
[07:44] <LaserJock> they should just do it in London
[07:44] <ajmitch> LaserJock: again?
[07:44] <Kyral> or Germany....
[07:44] <ajmitch> it's been in the UK twice already
[07:44] <LaserJock> ajmitch: ah, I didn't know that
[07:44] <Kyral> I have family in Germany :P
[07:44] <LaserJock> ajmitch: shoulda figured
[07:44] <Kyral> I don't care where it is
[07:44] <Kyral> I'll find a way to go :D
[07:45] <ajmitch> Kyral: & you'll be busy writing up specs & planning the distro?
[07:45] <Kyral> nope
[07:45] <Kyral> I'll just be listening
[07:45] <Kyral> I mean I know nothing....
[07:45] <LaserJock> I doubt I'll make it
[07:45] <Kyral> but I figure if I listen I'll learn a lot :D
[07:45] <LaserJock> hi tritium and minghua
[07:46] <ajmitch> you must be rich if you'll fly around the world to listen to people argue :)
[07:46] <Kyral> right "old man"? :P
[07:46] <tritium> Hi LaserJock :)
[07:46] <Kyral> ajmitch: I only said the Dev Summit
[07:46] <minghua> hi LaserJock, ajmitch, Kyral and tritium :-)
[07:46] <ajmitch> hey tritium
[07:46] <Kyral> Like I said if its in Germany I'm good
[07:46] <ajmitch> Kyral: yes, which is a week or so of BoFs & spec-writing
[07:46] <Kyral> I have family there
[07:47] <Kyral> Though I have always wanted to visit Italy *Is half Italian*
[07:47] <ajmitch> assuming that it's in the same area of germany as your family :)
[07:50] <LaserJock> hmm, can you make rules/filters easily with mutt?
[07:50] <TheMuso> LaserJock: What do you want to do?
[07:51] <LaserJock> I just want to move email to different folders as they come in based on To: or CC:
[07:51] <ajmitch> LaserJock: I'd use procmail
[07:51] <minghua> use procmail then
[07:51] <TheMuso> procmail
[07:51] <LaserJock> hmm, seems like a concensus
[07:52] <LaserJock> I've been using pine or thunderbird but I'm trying to explore all my options
[07:52] <TheMuso> Mailman lists are easy to filter as they have a List-Id. Thats what I use for filtering ubuntu lists and other lists using mailman.
[07:52] <VoX> i use evol
[07:52] <VoX> works like a charm
[07:53] <LaserJock> VoX: yeah, well I managed to screw over my IMAP in about 2 mins with evo. That is the last time I tried it :(
[07:53] <VoX> pfft
[07:53] <whiprush> LaserJock: here's a tbird-like muttrc: http://trunks.whiprush.org/~jorge/.muttrc
[07:54] <whiprush> it took me like 2 weeks to come up with that
[07:54] <whiprush> it's pretty sweet though
[07:54] <TheMuso> Mutt's powerful key commands and customizability are irrisistable.
[07:54] <LaserJock> also I use OSX, Windows, and linux so I'm trying to be figure out how be able to access from different machines
[07:54] <TheMuso> And depending on what box I am in, depends on what address the email appears from.
[07:55] <LaserJock> whiprush: cool, thanks
[07:55] <TheMuso> LaserJock: If you want an idea of how I have done mine, I'd be happy to show you
[07:56] <LaserJock> TheMuso: sure, the more the merrier (or confused, we'll see)
[07:57] <TheMuso> LaserJock: Give me a sec.
[07:57] <LaserJock> minghua: I agree but what the heck. I did the same thing for .vimrc
[07:58] <siretart> morning
[07:59] <TheMuso> LaserJock: http://www.themuso.com/muttrc.txt -- It isn't commented sorry.
[08:00] <LaserJock> TheMuso: thanks
[08:04] <Kyral> How ironic
[08:04] <Kyral> I was about to (literally) climb into bed
[08:04] <ajmitch> welcome back Hobbsee
[08:04] <ajmitch> Kyral: so do so?
[08:05] <TheMuso> ooo nice.
[08:05] <Kyral> yah
[08:05] <Kyral> 'cept the ceiling is like 8 feet high :P
[08:06] <Kyral> anyway goodnight people
[08:06] <Hobbsee> night Kyral
[08:07] <Hobbsee> Kyral: i get that feeling as well - about me annoying everyone :P
[08:08] <Kyral> whee we have something n common ;P
[08:09] <ajmitch> Kyral: only sometimes annoyed :)
[08:10] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I doubt you'd annoy too many people
[08:21] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: ah right
[08:22] <Hobbsee> i'll take your word for it :)
[08:23] <ajmitch> partly because you're away most of the day at work or uni ;)
[08:28] <ajmitch> hey zakame
[08:28] <Hobbsee> hi zakame
[08:28] <zakame> hello ajmitch Hobbsee ! :D
[08:28] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: hehe!  so i cant disrupt the chat there?
[08:29] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: hehe, nah, you haven't been disruptive
[08:30] <Hobbsee> right
[08:30] <ajmitch> though you probably haven't fixed enough bugs yet...
[08:30] <Hobbsee> i know
[08:31] <Hobbsee> that's the trouble, not knowing much C++ yet...
[08:31] <ajmitch> there's always a few thousand other universe bugs to fix
[08:31] <Hobbsee> true
[08:31] <ajmitch> many of them not needing any coding knowledge
[08:31] <ajmitch> we're mere weeks away from release, and we want universe to shine
[08:31] <Hobbsee> true
[08:31] <Hobbsee> anything in particular that you recommend?
[08:32] <ajmitch> bug day on friday, doing general triage, or doing lots of simple packaging fixes
[08:32] <ajmitch> it's easy enough to find 10 packages that are 'low-hanging fruit'
[08:32] <ajmitch> like rebuilds for unmet deps, python2.3->2.4 problems, .desktop files
[08:33] <zakame> or x-swatting :)
[08:33] <ajmitch> that too :)
[08:33] <ajmitch> there's a few hundred bugs assigned to MOTU to get rid of
[08:33] <Gloubiboulga> morning
[08:33] <ajmitch> hello Gloubiboulga
[08:34] <Gloubiboulga> hey ajmitch
[08:34] <tritium> Hi Hobbsee :)
[08:34] <Hobbsee> hey tritium
[08:34] <Hobbsee> looks like i'm being sent to work :D
[08:34] <ajmitch> lucky you!
[08:34] <ajmitch> good thing you got petrol then
[08:34] <zakame> heya Gloubiboulga
[08:34] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: ubuntu work, silly!
[08:35] <Gloubiboulga> hi zakame :)
[08:35] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: haha, sorry, I thought you meant you got a phone call & had to work ;)
[08:35] <Hobbsee> ah....nope...greatful i dont have to go there either - the night manager is angry at me
[08:35] <ajmitch> what for?
[08:35] <tritium> Where do you work, Hobbsee?
[08:36] <Hobbsee> tritium: at a supermarket
[08:36] <tritium> ah
[08:36] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: a, cos i was late, cos my car broke down, but, the bigger one - cos i whinged about him taking the manager, and leaving me as the sole employee in the store, apart from a new girl, who had to go home.  and it went busy, and the customers got angry.  so i complained to head head manager about it on the phone.
[08:37] <ajmitch> ooh
[08:38] <ajmitch> so he's rightly getting the blame & not liking it :)
[08:38] <Hobbsee> (complaining about the rostering, which also, in effect, blamed him)
[08:38] <Hobbsee> yes.  lol
[08:39] <Hobbsee> so he was there on sunday, throwing crap at me for stuff that i'd prefer to forget (sleezy guy asking me very...ah...interesting questions...ick.), etc
[08:39] <Hobbsee> hehe
[08:39] <ajmitch> you seem to get hit on a lot?
[08:39] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: how do i search for wrong deps on packages - any specific way?
[08:39] <Hobbsee> yes, it seems so.  most unfortunate.
[08:39] <crimsun> hmm, I never seem to have _that_ problem. =)
[08:40] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: apt-cache -i unmet shows those packages currently uninstallable due to broken depends
[08:40] <ajmitch> crimsun: funny, I'm the same
[08:40] <Hobbsee> ah!
[08:40] <Hobbsee> crimsun: hehe, lucky
[08:40] <Hobbsee> ooh man, fun!
[08:40] <Hobbsee> and a UVF exception thingo for each of them?
[08:41] <siretart> Hobbsee: http://tiber.tauware.de/~siretart/unmet/dapper-unmet.txt is updated daily
[08:41] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: usually it doesn't need it
[08:41] <ajmitch> sometimes a rebuild will work
[08:41] <ajmitch> other times it requires some more work
[08:41] <ajmitch> ah, or that list :)
[08:41] <Hobbsee> but if i have to change it, then i need to file a UVF exception?
[08:42] <ajmitch> Package zope-zshell version 1.60-2 has an unmet dep:
[08:42] <ajmitch>  Depends: zope (>= 2.6.1-7)
[08:42] <ajmitch> now that's old
[08:43] <ajmitch> siretart: I'll be requesting a UVF exception for zope-zwiki soon - upstream has filed bugs about it :)
[08:43] <ajmitch> right, zope-zshell is a straight (non-UVF) sync from debian
[08:44] <TheMuso> c
[08:44] <TheMuso> damn...
[08:44] <TheMuso> ajmitch: If a rebuild is necessary, what has to be done?
[08:45] <ajmitch> TheMuso: if a rebuild is all that's needed, then just upload the rebuilt package with x.y.z-1 changed to x.y.z-1build1, for example
[08:45] <TheMuso> cheers.
[08:47] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: I'm sure you'll find plenty to do ;)
[08:47] <Hobbsee> hehe i'm seeing that...
[08:47] <crimsun> nice, wpasupp->main
[08:48] <ajmitch> good
[08:48] <Hobbsee> updating my pbuilder now - something's screwing up with it
[08:48] <ajmitch> and then you can go for MOTU - until then if you need to put a patch up, add it as an attachment on malone & assign the bug task to motureviewers
[08:49] <TheMuso> If a build-dep needs to be changed, is there a quick way of installing all other build-deps even though one in the archive is broken?
[08:49] <ajmitch> TheMuso: cut & paste from what it complains about? :)
[08:50] <ajmitch> eg gl-117 is sitting on my disk, is FTBFS in the archive due to bad x build-deps
[08:51] <ajmitch> I just tried building & grabbed the deps it says it needed
[08:51] <TheMuso> ajmitch: No, if the package has a broken build-dep in the archive, and I fix it in my local copy, how do I get all the new build-deps installed for the package including my fixed dep, without manually entering them into an install line?
[08:51] <ajmitch> & changed the others to suit what's in dapper
[08:51] <ajmitch> TheMuso: in pbuilder?
[08:52] <ajmitch> the easy way is to get the broken build-dep fixed in the archive, if that's what you mean
[08:52] <TheMuso> No. I know pbuilder fetches everything
[08:52] <TheMuso> never mind.
[08:53] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: stupid question, i know, but the build deps need to be installed on my machine, if i'm building with a pbuilder?
[08:53] <tritium> Nope, Hobbsee
[08:53] <zakame> pbuilder login?
[08:53] <tritium> Just inside the pbuilder chroot
[08:53] <Hobbsee> tritium: then why do i get this?  http://pastebin.com/626468
[08:54] <crimsun> ah, good old pdebuild
[08:54] <ajmitch> because you're using pdebuild
[08:54] <Hobbsee> and i'm supposed to be using?
[08:54] <zakame> Hobbsee: nope, unless your pbuilder's in a chroot (but even that's optional)
[08:55] <ajmitch> which does a build-dep check before it's in the chroot, usually because it needs things for the clean target
[08:55] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: I was just wondering the same thing till I remembered pdebuild. :)
[08:55] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you will not have much luck with zope stuff, btw :)
[08:55] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: ah ok, and you can still specify your key and all that automatically?
[08:55] <Hobbsee> oh, why not?
[08:56] <ajmitch> because the zope packages require special care & loving attention
[08:56] <ajmitch> and a rebuild will not fix them
[08:56] <ajmitch> which is why I tend to get dumped with all the zope stuff in universe ;)
[08:56] <Hobbsee> what do they need, or do i not want to know? i'm curious now
[08:56] <ajmitch> you really don't want to know
[08:56] <crimsun> ajmitch really just LOVES the pain.
[08:56] <Hobbsee> heh right
[08:57] <zakame> Hobbsee: pdebuild --use-pbuilder-internal
[08:57] <ajmitch> forking main source packages to build python2.3-* binaries for universe
[08:57] <ajmitch> *eeevil*
[08:57] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[08:57] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: once I get the forked nastiness in, the zope stuff should Just Work
[08:57] <Hobbsee> okay :)
[08:57] <ajmitch> except for a few that need updated
[08:59] <zakame> heya ivoks
[08:59] <ivoks> hey
[09:00] <ajmitch> some people just don't look before filing bugs, I guess
[09:00] <ivoks> anyone with atheros wifi card? :)
[09:00] <ajmitch> or malone doesn't show them where to look
[09:00] <Hobbsee> seeing as the search is usually borked, i can understand that
[09:00] <ivoks> malone has very confusing search :/
[09:00] <tritium> ajmitch: malone is confusing
[09:01] <ajmitch> ivoks: and broken at the moment
[09:01] <ajmitch> it is rather frustrating to use
[09:01] <ajmitch> ivoks: I used to have an atheros card :)
[09:01] <Hobbsee> know anything about ewb?  it doenst seem to exist in breezy or dapper
[09:01] <ivoks> ajmitch: heh... that doesn't help :)
[09:01] <Hobbsee> doesnt seem to have ever existed, but is listed as a dep in some of the packages
[09:02] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: nope, I looked at it briefly, I think those others were pulled in from some random crackful place
[09:02] <ivoks> i think some bugs are fixed in wifi-radar, so would try to test that on atheros cards...
[09:02] <ajmitch> ivoks: it was in my laptop bag in montreal ;)
[09:03] <ivoks> and your bag never returned from montreal? :)
[09:03] <ajmitch> correct
[09:03] <ajmitch> it disappeared while I was at the hotel
[09:03] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: looks very cracked and random - one of the other deps doesnt exist either
[09:04] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: lots of the ewb stuff is broken
[09:04] <ivoks> :/
[09:04] <Hobbsee> so i'm seeing.  broken as in, fixable, or broken as in, avoid unless you have very great protection and programming skills?
[09:05] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: or broken as in take a flamethrower to the lot & cut the rest up for scrap
[09:05] <Hobbsee> hehe right
[09:06] <ivoks> i hate when i have to write documentation for program i never used :/
[09:07] <Hobbsee> ooh, these look like some that i can fix!
[09:07] <ajmitch> which ones?
[09:07] <Hobbsee> xlibs ones
[09:07] <ajmitch> ah right
[09:07] <TheMuso> Whats the easiest way to change the sources.list file in a pbuilder base.tgz?
[09:07] <TheMuso> Other than opening it an tarring it back up again
[09:07] <TheMuso> Or is that the only way?
[09:08] <ajmitch> pbuilder login --save-after-login
[09:08] <TheMuso> ah ok.
[09:09] <ajmitch> stupid mistake in debian/rules
[09:09] <ajmitch> someone should kick me now :)
[09:09] <ivoks> ajmitch: don't be so hard on your self
[09:10] <ajmitch> ivoks: oh no, I deserve it
[09:10] <ivoks> ok, tell us what was that mistake
[09:12] <ajmitch> missing $(CURDIR)/debian/f-spot
[09:12] <ajmitch> bad, stupid mistake
[09:12] <ajmitch> doing mv /usr/libexec/gnome-screensaver/f-spot.screensaver /usr/share/gnome-screensaver/
[09:12] <ajmitch> not healthy in debian/rules :)
[09:12] <ivoks> :)
[09:13] <ivoks> i did that once, too
[09:13] <zakame> ajmitch: awww *patpat*
[09:13] <TheMuso> ouch
[09:13] <ivoks> so, either we are all idiots or is common mistake :)
[09:13] <ajmitch> ivoks: I should know better ;)
[09:14] <ivoks> f-spot screensaver?
[09:14] <ajmitch> yes
[09:14] <ivoks> in wich process we lost KISS philosophy? :)
[09:14] <ajmitch> use photo collection for gnome screensaver
[09:19] <Hobbsee> ack, this is confusing!
[09:19] <ajmitch> ok, 1 of 3 f-spot tasks down before upload
[09:20] <Hobbsee> ajmitch
[09:20] <ajmitch> Hobbsee
[09:20] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: i hate to be a pain, but why do i get this?  http://pastebin.com/626499
[09:21] <Hobbsee> where am i supposed to find the file that it's asking for?
[09:21] <Hobbsee> darn enter key is getting in the way again :P
[09:21] <Hobbsee> seeing as it doesnt seem to be anywhere in the debian folder, or in the subdir up from that
[09:21] <ajmitch> because the directory or file is missing, and it looks like one that should have been installed by make install or whatever the realplayer build system uses?
[09:22] <ajmitch> hard to fix proprietary junk like that
[09:22] <Hobbsee> so where abouts *should* it be if the package was workign correctly?  source dir, right?
[09:22] <ajmitch> depends, sometimes it's created at build time
[09:23] <Hobbsee> right
[09:26] <ajmitch>  bzr branch http://192.168.2.20/debuild/mono/f-spot-0.1.11/debian
[09:26] <ajmitch> just branch packaging off the laptop onto my main box
[09:26] <ivoks> ahm...
[09:26] <ivoks> hylafax-server needs fixing :/
[09:26] <ivoks> i can do that...
[09:27] <ivoks> it needs 'sleep 2' beetween stop and start in restart function of init script
[09:28] <ajmitch> pbuilder tarball needs updated again
[09:28] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: such as?
[09:28] <Hobbsee> nonlock
[09:29] <ajmitch> was it ever in ubuntu?
[09:29] <Hobbsee> http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?searchon=names&version=all&exact=1&keywords=nonlock
[09:29] <Hobbsee> oh yes, warty, hoary, breezy, but no dapper.
[09:29] <ajmitch> removed from debian
[09:30] <Erlang> I was gonna say that...
[09:30] <Hobbsee> ah.
[09:30] <Erlang> only stable still carries it.
[09:30] <ajmitch> ------------------ Reason -------------------
[09:30] <ajmitch> RoQA; unused, old, upstream dead, alternatives available
[09:30] <ajmitch> from the debian removals list
[09:30] <Hobbsee> fair enough
[09:30] <Hobbsee> http://packages.debian.org/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?keywords=nonlock&searchon=names&subword=1&version=all&release=all
[09:31] <Erlang> Hobbsee: It's from kfreebsd.
[09:31] <Hobbsee> shows it, which i thought was odd - but not from source
[09:33] <ivoks> when did upstream die? :)
[09:35] <ajmitch> ok, f-spot builds just a *little* faster on this box of mine :)
[09:35] <Hobbsee> got no idea
[09:35] <ajmitch> last upload to debian was 2001
[09:35] <ajmitch> of nonlock
[09:36] <ajmitch> sigh, 30 seconds instead of > 5 minutes
[09:39] <Gloubiboulga> is ubuntu really concerned with bugs like malone 36881
[09:39] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 36881 in tango-icon-theme "Does not install properly" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36881
[09:39] <Gloubiboulga> ?
[09:39] <ajmitch> why would ubuntu not be concerned? :)
[09:39] <ajmitch> ah I see, installed from source, broke his system, etc
[09:39] <Gloubiboulga> yep
[09:41] <ajmitch> heh
[09:43] <TheMuso> argh. I can't work out why sear doesn't find its damn libs. Probably because one or two of them have had a major version change. :S
[09:43] <TheMuso> Even though build-deps are now satisfied.
[09:44] <siretart> Gloubiboulga: I updated bug 36881 now
[09:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 36881 in tango-icon-theme "Don't get confused about empty /usr/local/share/icons/Tango" [Minor,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36881
[09:45] <Gloubiboulga> siretart, thanks
[10:00] <TheMuso> Some advice here guys.
[10:00] <TheMuso> The package sear doesn't like updated build-deps to suit ubuntu, and the sid version has a new upstream release as well as updated build-deps. The problem is, the build-deps are also newer than what is in Ubuntu. So where do I go from here?
[10:01] <ajmitch> and what are the build deps that are broken?
[10:03] <ajmitch> since looking at the changelog, if we grabbed the new sear from sid, we'd have to update other libraries
[10:03] <ajmitch> hello Seveas
[10:03] <Seveas> hi
[10:03] <TheMuso> libatlas-cpp-0.5c2, libcal3d10c2, liberis-1.2c2 (>= 1.2.0), libmercator-0.2-1c2 (>= 0.2.1), libsage-0.1 I think.
[10:03] <TheMuso> ajmitch: I am well aware of that.
[10:08] <siretart> iirc the dependencies are only used by sear
[10:08] <siretart> if thats right, I wouldn't mind updating them as well
[10:11] <TheMuso> Checking the various reverse-depends for those libs seems to confirm that. The worldforge server is the only other package set that depends on those libs.
[10:11] <ajmitch> so I can stop slacking & get onto my other bugs
[10:16] <TheMuso> So where does this stand in terms of UVF etc?
[10:20] <siretart> TheMuso: worldforge is closely related to sear. I wouldn't be surprised it this would have to go 'in sync'
[10:20] <Lathiat> sear needs to be synced
[10:20] <Lathiat> it deps on old libs
[10:20] <Lathiat> and wont compile with the new ones
[10:20] <Lathiat> its universe and nothign depends on it i dont see it a problem to sync it
[10:20] <TheMuso> Righto.
[10:21] <siretart> could someone please write a detailed report, which needs to be updated along with sear, and which packages are affected exactly by this update?
[10:21] <Lathiat> the other packages have already been updated
[10:21] <Lathiat> which is why it doesnt compile now
[10:21] <Lathiat> just new sear shoudl do the trick
[10:21] <Lathiat> or did when i looked at it a couple weeks ago
[10:21] <siretart> I think we should be very clear what we are actually about to update and what potentially could get broken because of that
[10:21] <TheMuso> Lathiat: There is one package that also needs updating from debian.
[10:22] <TheMuso> liberis-1.3 needs updating as well.
[10:22] <TheMuso> I think
[10:23] <Lathiat> ah ok
[10:24] <zakame> ajmitch: rock on
[10:25] <ajmitch> zakame: ?
[10:26] <zakame> ajmitch: your zope-* coming from motumergers
[10:26] <ajmitch> haha
[10:27] <ajmitch> yeah, I looked at my subscribed bugs list & decided to cleanup all those I did way back then
[10:30] <zakame> yeah waay back =)
[10:35] <ajmitch> hey dholbach
[10:35] <dholbach> hey ajmitch
[10:36] <ajmitch> dholbach: do you usually just use upstream's NEWS file for debian/changelog?
[10:36] <dholbach> mostly, yes
[10:36] <ajmitch> right
[10:37] <ajmitch> a few too many acronyms like bgo, b.x.c :)
[10:38] <dholbach> yeah, i usually drop those
[10:39] <zakame> hello dholbach :)
[10:39] <dholbach> hi zakame
[10:40] <ajmitch> bugs are evil!
[10:40] <TheMuso> Hey dholbach.
[10:40] <dholbach> ajmitch: hehe
[10:40] <dholbach> hi TheMuso
[10:41] <Gloubiboulga> dholbach, hi, is there a log of yesterday's meeting somewhere ?
[10:41] <dholbach> i'm going to write the minutes but there are logs yes
[10:41] <ajmitch> yep
[10:41] <dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~bbione
[10:41] <sivang> morning all
[10:41] <dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione
[10:41] <Gloubiboulga> thanks :)
[10:41] <ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/BugSquadTeam_2006-03-27
[10:45] <lucas> hey all
[10:46] <ajmitch> hi lucas
[10:47] <zakame> heya lucas
[11:08] <lucas> dholbach: hi
[11:08] <ajmitch> malone hates me
[11:08] <dholbach> hi lucas
[11:09] <lucas> I'm looking at mldonkey. there's a new version in debian (2.7.3). you patched 2.7.1-2ubuntu1.
[11:09] <lucas> I don't understand the rationale behind the "/var/run/mldonkey" => "/var/run" change
[11:09] <lucas> could you explain when you have time ?
[11:18] <siretart> lucas: sure
[11:19] <siretart> lucas: /var/run is nowadays on tmpfs, that means that /var/run/mldonkey needs to be created in the init script, since it will get deleted every reboot
[11:19] <lucas> mmh, and on debian, it isn't on tmpfs ?
[11:19] <siretart> lucas: I tried to merge the new version, but I failed because of obscure syntax errors in the generated mldonkey configuration files
[11:20] <siretart> lucas: no, this is a new development in ubuntu. but there are people in debian advocating this as well. currently, this isn't in debian yet
[11:20] <lucas> ok
[11:20] <lucas> thank you
[11:26] <raphink> hehe
[11:28] <Tm_T> meh
[11:28] <Tm_T> raphink: is it bad idea to check kopete package things from kdenetwork package?
[11:28] <Tm_T> like manpages and such
[11:29] <siretart> lucas: I can show you my mldonkey_2.7.3-2ubuntu1 merge, but I couldn't install it because of that configuration file errors
[11:29] <raphink> Tm_T: I don't get what you mean
[11:29] <siretart> lucas: if you could fix this, that would safe me a lot of headaches, and make many many ubuntu users loving mldonkey happy ;)
[11:30] <Tm_T> raphink: http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/625341
[11:30] <Tm_T> raphink: first raw package has nice lintian output
[11:30] <lucas> siretart: I'm really not a ocaml expert :-)
[11:30] <lucas> siretart: you could ask sylvain le gall (debian maintainer)
[11:30] <lucas> he is usually quite friendly
[11:30] <raphink> Tm_T: sure you cna get the manpages from the kdenetwork package
[11:31] <raphink> you can ignore the library stuff
[11:31] <Tm_T> raphink: aye
[11:31] <siretart> lucas: does he irc?
[11:31] <lucas> I don't think so
[11:31] <raphink> Tm_T: fix this though :
[11:31] <raphink> W: kopete: extended-description-line-too-long
[11:31] <Tm_T> raphink: oh, have to
[11:32] <Tm_T> raphink: also I think I doublecheck dependency part in control file
[11:32] <siretart> lucas: I filed debian bug #354701 about this. no answer up to now
[11:32] <Ubugtu> Debian bug 354701 in mldonkey "Subject: Please support /var/run and /var/lock on tmpfs" [Normal,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/354701
[11:32] <Tm_T> raphink: otherwise seems fine?
[11:33] <raphink> Tm_T: well the libraries errors can be safely ignored
[11:33] <raphink> so it's ok
[11:33] <Tm_T> thanks
[11:36] <Tm_T> raphink: who knows about kubuntu's current kopete default settings?
[11:36] <Tm_T> there's one "secret setting" I like to bring up
[11:36] <Tm_T> easter egg <3
[11:36] <raphink> Tonio_ knows about most default settings in Daper
[11:36] <raphink> what is that Tm_T?
[11:36] <Tm_T> ok, I'll bother him, thanks sir
[11:37] <Tm_T> raphink: about Kopete chat window tabs, "always show tabs"
[11:37] <Tm_T> so show tab bar even there's just one tab open
[11:37] <Tm_T> there's no gui settings for it, yet
[11:37] <raphink> indeed
[11:38] <Tm_T> I prolly do one to myself
[11:38] <raphink> we have it for konqui, konsole and others
[11:38] <raphink> we should have it for kopete too
[11:38] <Tm_T> I think so too
[11:38] <raphink> how do you set that?
[11:38] <Tm_T> one line to kopeterc
[11:38] <Tm_T> in group "ChatWindowSettings"
[11:39] <raphink> let me see
[11:39] <Tm_T> AlwaysShowTabs=true
[11:39] <Tm_T> and restart kopete, you'll see the difference
[11:39] <raphink> wait a min
[11:39] <Tm_T> I can now use kopete without status bar and thus making it more simple and yet efficient
[11:40] <raphink> that'll be very fast to set in k-d-s
[11:41] <Tm_T> yeah
[11:41] <raphink> I'll try and fix speedcrunch default style etoo
[11:41] <Tm_T> maybe discussion to next kubuntu-meeting?
[11:41] <raphink> no need imo
[11:41] <Tm_T> ok
[11:41] <Tm_T> just pushing it in then ;)
[11:41] <raphink> we want apps to be logical
[11:41] <Tm_T> true
[11:41] <Tm_T> I'll contact to tonio about this baby, thanks
[11:41] <raphink> we moved move tabs to the bottom to have it logical
[11:42] <raphink> Tm_T: I'll do it don't worry
[11:42] <Tm_T> gah!
[11:42] <raphink> well I'll call him to confirm ;)
[11:42] <raphink> but I'm pretty sure he'll be ok with it
[11:42] <Tm_T> and just when I thought I have something fun =)
[11:42] <Tm_T> yeah
[11:43] <Tm_T> now some fresh air in snowy spring weather ->
[11:43] <raphink> I'll have to deal with k-d-s in 4 days anyway
[11:50] <siretart> lucas: strange. now the merge seems to work for me
[11:51] <siretart> lucas: would you like to test the package fo rme?
[12:09] <lucas> siretart: I'm not using it
[12:10] <kelmo_lap> hi siretart
[12:10] <siretart> ok. I sent a patch for review to sylvain. lets see if he answers at all
[12:10] <siretart> hi kelmo_lap!
[12:11] <kelmo_lap> siretart, i have thought about the dhclient issue, that it does not wait for a result before the next ifupdown hook is executed
[12:11] <siretart> kelmo_lap: I'm not sure if you already noticed, in order to unbreak the mess in dapper, I've ported the packaging of our experimental branch to trunk/ and uploaded that to dapper
[12:11] <kelmo_lap> when using an action script
[12:11] <kelmo_lap> no, have not noticed, but thatnks for the heads up
[12:12] <siretart> kelmo_lap: keybuk seems to be on holiday until tomorrow, and I wanted to have wpasupplicant ready for main asap
[12:12] <kelmo_lap> siretart, i would like to add a timeout when using an action script, and have the action script keep a "state" file, that contains its connection status
[12:13] <kelmo_lap> so the loop waits for a connection status, then moves on, or it times out
[12:13] <kelmo_lap> that way the next ifupdown hooks would have expected behaviour
[12:13] <siretart> kelmo_lap: whats the problem in marking the interface as 'dhcp' instead of 'manual'?
[12:14] <kelmo_lap> i really really believe that is not correct
[12:14] <kelmo_lap> look at the dhclient.pid created by ifupdown
[12:14] <kelmo_lap> the action script will get confused, or never even start on connection events
[12:14] <kelmo_lap> just like you observed
[12:15] <kelmo_lap> but this is just cream on the cake, something to think about
[12:24] <zakame> hi all
[12:27] <kelmo_lap> siretart, funny looking changelog for the dapper upload ; )
[12:28] <kelmo_lap> siretart, but i hope it works out, looks good to me
[12:29] <zakame> ooh what mail?
[12:30] <ogra> zakame, the one from this morning ...
[12:30] <zakame> oh
[12:30] <ogra> not a recent one :)
[12:34] <kelmo_lap> siretart, ah, there is a typo in the preinst script
[12:35] <kelmo_lap> it needs fixing
[12:36] <kelmo_lap> you cheated by just making it $1, so it does not affect trunk
[12:48] <beezly> I packaged up music-applet (spotted it after it was mentioned on Planet GNOME) - is there anything more I can do with it?
[12:48] <beezly> it's at www.cs1ajb.staff.shef.ac.uk/ubuntu
[12:48] <beezly> (only built for amd64 at the moment)
[12:49] <Toadstool> hi here
[12:49] <beezly> hi To
[12:49] <beezly> argh
[12:49] <beezly> Toadstool :)
[12:49] <Toadstool> :)
[12:49] <beezly> my IRC laziness is getting worse - I keep trying to TAB english :)
[01:17] <siretart> kelmo_lap: I think i fixed that typo in both branches, I did notice $CONFFILE vs. $CONFILE afterwards :/
[01:17] <siretart> ogra: thanks. I think a mail like this was needed badly. I hope I didn't violate the CoC to bad
[01:18] <kelmo_lap> siretart, yep, its no real problem at all, i was alarmed and spoke before investigating
[01:18] <ogra> siretart, not at all
[01:18] <ogra> :)
[01:19] <siretart> :)
[01:19] <ogra> i think Seveas should drink a cup of jasmin tea before each mail he sends to this thread ;)
[01:20] <siretart> ogra: btw, he does in fact use apt-key add to add keys to the keyring, but in a quite crackful way
[01:20] <ogra> yes, i saw your mail after i sent mine ...
[01:21] <ajmitch> siretart: your mail was good :)
[01:21] <siretart>         gpg --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net --recv-keys 437D05B5
[01:21] <siretart>         gpg --export --armor 437D05B5 | sudo apt-key add -
[01:21] <ogra> heh
[01:22] <siretart> ajmitch: I hope he replys to this in a reasonable way. but I don't have any expectations
[01:22] <siretart> btw, mc is great for reviewing binary .deb packages. :)
[01:22] <ajmitch> hehe
[01:22] <ajmitch> dpkg-deb is useful also
[01:22] <siretart> even better is this one:
[01:22] <siretart>         wget http://people.ubuntu.com/~jriddell/kubuntu-packages-jriddell-key.gpg
[01:22] <siretart>         sudo apt-key add kubuntu-packages-jriddell-key.gpg
[01:23] <siretart> so, as soon as Riddell relocates his key, automatix will break ;)
[01:23] <ajmitch> do it! do it!
[01:26] <siretart> kelmo_lap: how long do you think we should wait for kyle?
[01:28] <kelmo_lap> siretart, i suggest, that you could send a mail, acknowledging that he is extremely busy, and to not bother him that we would arrange an alternative uploader, say 48 hours after the time that the mail is sent
[01:28] <kelmo_lap> ie, let him know that we can get someone else after some time, if he is too busy
[01:29] <kelmo_lap> no response in a day or two, we go to plan b, he may ask us to find someone else, or he may even just do it
[01:29] <siretart> ok. will do that tomorrow then.
[01:30] <siretart> kelmo_lap: I have this packages tested by my usual sponsor, and he was quite happy with it :)
[01:30] <kelmo_lap> but i don't wanna cut him out, i'm glad just to be able to work on it, and am in no rush at all
[01:30] <siretart> right. of course
[01:30] <kelmo_lap> siretart, thats great!
[01:30] <siretart> he told us before that he was very busy, so no need to harass him
[01:31] <kelmo_lap> yep, but best no create an even more infuratin situation, where we have made alternative arrangements, and he bothers to take time out of his business to make an upload, only to find it was already done . . .
[01:32] <kelmo_lap> infuriating*
[01:33] <siretart> right
[01:34] <kelmo_lap> one of us should really do something about becoming an nm or so . . .
[01:35] <ajmitch> siretart is in the NM queue :)
[01:35] <kelmo_lap> ah, good
[01:35] <kelmo_lap> glad to hear that
[01:36] <kelmo_lap> siretart, you have already taken a snapshot of the experimental branch to make the upload to debian too? (with the preinst typo fixed)
[01:37] <siretart> kelmo_lap: yes, I've silently replaced/repackaged and resigned the upload candidate
[01:37] <beezly> i added an i386 build of music-applet to my repository but I've noticed that the diff.gz is quite large and has a lot of stuff like config.sub in - is that normal? am I doing something wrong?
[01:37] <siretart> yes, I'm currently waiting for FD to assign me an AM
[01:37] <kelmo_lap> siretart, many thanks
[01:37] <beezly> http://www.cs1ajb.staff.shef.ac.uk/ubuntu/
[01:37] <kelmo_lap> we can begin somemore changes in that branch then, without fear they may not be right at all times
[01:38] <siretart> you mean in trunk, yes?
[01:38] <kelmo_lap> is that what you'd like? work only in trunk now?
[01:41] <TheMuso> Can anybody explain why a particular package is not in the ubuntu archive, yet launchpad reports it as being available?
[01:41] <siretart> I'd say yes
[01:41] <siretart> we wanted to focus on docuemtation
[01:42] <TheMuso> bah thats why.
[01:42] <TheMuso> Never mind.
[01:43] <kelmo_lap> siretart, okay, just making sure we are in full understanding of eachother
[01:43] <siretart> beezly: for the config.{sub,guess} issue, please make sure to read and understand /usr/share/doc/autotools-dev/README.Debian
[01:43] <siretart> kelmo_lap: :)
[01:43] <kelmo_lap> i will work in trunk
[01:43] <siretart> okay
[01:44] <kelmo_lap> will have time this weekend to hit it hard
[01:44] <beezly> siretart: thanks
[01:44] <kelmo_lap> until then, i may not be able to work much on it
[01:47] <siretart> kelmo_lap: what is the corrent /e/n/i stanze for the option 'scan_ssid=1'?
[01:47] <kelmo_lap> any native wpa_supplicant option, prefixed with "wpa-"
[01:47] <siretart>   wpa-scan-ssid 1
[01:47] <siretart> ok
[01:48] <kelmo_lap> take a look at the verbosity printouts
[01:48] <kelmo_lap> i wrote every available option there
[01:48] <siretart> yepp. I'm adding an example to READE.Debian for hidden ssids
[01:48] <kelmo_lap> as it would be written in the interfaces file
[01:48] <kelmo_lap> cool
[01:49] <kelmo_lap> i am even thinking of something similar to hostapd
[01:49] <kelmo_lap> ifupdown, rather than the init system
[01:50] <kelmo_lap> the init method is just two restrictive
[01:51] <kelmo_lap> what if you want a two card/ssid access point, both using hostpd concurrently, i don't think that is possible via init script
[01:51] <kelmo_lap> hostapd*
[01:51] <siretart> for hostapd, I could even image to have the user to remove the interface from /e/n/i, and handle all interface handling be seperate scripts/means
[01:52] <siretart> this includes bailing out if the interface IS managed by ifupdown. but this may also be too intrusive
[01:53] <kelmo_lap> hmm, i would want it to be defined in ifupdown, really, thats where the flexibility comes from
[01:55] <kelmo_lap> so currently, i am associated to two access points, spawning two wpa_supplicant daemons, via ifupdown, both ipw2200 and madwifi-ng
[01:55] <siretart> hm. I see.
[01:55] <ajmitch> working without any trouble?
[01:55] <kelmo_lap> associated != have two ip leases
[01:56] <kelmo_lap> only one interface has asked for an ip, at this time
[01:56] <kelmo_lap> but the fact i can use my in built ipw2200, or cradbus madwifi card, without editing stuff for each time, is nice
[01:57] <kelmo_lap> cardbus*
[01:57] <kelmo_lap> where, previously, the interface was defined in /etc/default/wpasupplicant
[01:59] <ajmitch> wb Hobbsee (if you stay) :)
[02:00] <Hobbsee> hey ajmitch
[02:00] <Tm_T> Hobbsee: =)
[02:09] <TheMuso> Aha! Found a package that FTBS with no bug reports! Will file a bug, but is it quicker just to attach a debdiff, or upload to revu?
[02:10] <Yagisan> TheMuso: probably debdiff
[02:10] <TheMuso> Thats what I was thinking.
[02:22] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: what do i do if i've fixed a package, which needed a changed build dep, and there's no listing of the package in malone?
[02:23] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: pretty hard to send a debdiff to a non-existant place...
[02:25] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: what's the package?
[02:25] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: libwarped0-dev
[02:25] <ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/warped/+filebug
[02:25] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Howd you manage to fix hat? I looked at that earlier, and it failed to build for me.
[02:25] <StevenK> Hobbsee: Malone is by source package
[02:26] <TheMuso> Even with deps fixed up.
[02:26] <Hobbsee> ah...
[02:26] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: checking now, butit seems to be building...
[02:26] <Hobbsee> i cancelled in the middle of make, when i remembered not editing the changelog
[02:27] <TheMuso> It took a while for me too. It seems to have problems linking, or it did for me anyway.
[02:27] <TheMuso> If any MOTU has a minute, they might be quickly able to get the fix uploaded for Malone #36994.
[02:28] <TheMuso> I can then move onto silky with an unmet dep, which I started to look at in the first place.
[02:29] <ajmitch> TheMuso: you didn't select patch when attaching the debdiff
[02:29] <ajmitch> launchpad mangled it into an ugly mess
[02:29] <TheMuso> gah!
[02:29] <TheMuso> Will re-upload.
[02:31] <TheMuso> ajmitch: That should be better now.
[02:31] <ajmitch> TheMuso: did you really need to have a debdiff full of config.sub & config.guess mess? :)
[02:31] <TheMuso> ajmitch: That was already in the package diff.
[02:32] <TheMuso> For the source I got from a.u.c.
[02:32] <ajmitch> but your debdiff was against that source package, hence your build added it in
[02:32] <TheMuso> Ok, so what needs to be done to prevent that?
[02:33] <ajmitch> either removing it from the debdiff, or fixing debian/rules :)
[02:33] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: mm...yeah...you're right...
[02:35] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Ok I will try and remove it from the rules file.
[02:35] <TheMuso> not remove, make sure it doesn't get included.
[02:53] <Toadstool> heya, anyone who wants to review and upload the debdiff attached to bug 34409 ? :)
[02:54] <Toadstool> Ubugtu's not here... https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/lprng/+bug/34409
[02:57] <TheMuso> Ok, third times the charm, hopefully. There were Makefile contents in the original diff, I am not sure if they can be changed, but anyway if removal is desired, please let me know. Malone #        test -r /usr/share/misc/config.guess && \
[02:57] <TheMuso>           ln -sf /usr/share/misc/config.guess
[02:57] <TheMuso>         test -r /usr/share/misc/config.sub && \
[02:57] <TheMuso> sorry, wrong copy/paste.
[02:57] <TheMuso> https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/36994
[03:04] <Toadstool> TheMuso: I wonder why there is the config.log and the Makefile in your debdiff when according to the changelog entry you just patched debian/rules
[03:05] <TheMuso> Toadstool: I really don't know. How this package got into Debian in a similar state I don't know.
[03:05] <Toadstool> :)
[03:06] <TheMuso> argh!
[03:06] <TheMuso> Not in original.
[03:06] <TheMuso> Another file I need to remove when cleaning up.
[03:06] <TheMuso> I am not having a good night.
[03:07] <Toadstool> good luck with your modifications ;)
[03:07] <Gloubiboulga> TheMuso, raphink's revu-tools is really usefull to check that kind of issues
[03:07] <TheMuso> Toadstool: I think it will be right. This time I will be going through with a fine tooth come.
[03:07] <TheMuso> Gloubiboulga: Where can I find more info?
[03:08] <Gloubiboulga> the packages are on the repos
[03:08] <Gloubiboulga> and I guess the man pages will help :)
[03:08] <TheMuso> Ok cheers.
[03:08] <TheMuso> DO they have enough depenndancies?
[03:08] <TheMuso> :)
[03:09] <TheMuso> Gloubiboulga: Thanks.
[03:09] <TheMuso> Sorta used to doing it all by hand.
[03:09] <TheMuso> Must be tired, even though I don't feel it. :S
[03:11] <TheMuso> Hey mhz.
[05:53] <Tm_T> raphink: moin
[05:53] <raphink> moinmoin
[05:54] <Tm_T> AGH!
[05:54] <Tm_T> forgot to clean kopete dir before build package...
[05:54] <Tm_T> whoooops
[05:55] <Tm_T> raphink: deockbook file included
[05:55] <Tm_T> doc
[05:55] <raphink> great :)
[05:55] <raphink> good job Tm_T
[05:55] <Tm_T> hmm, my package doesn't get gpg sign
[05:55] <raphink> Tm_T: are you sure of the name and address you've put in the changelog?
[05:56] <Tm_T> yes
[05:56] <raphink> if you need, you can force signing using the -k switch with debuild
[05:56] <Tm_T> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -k<keyid> ?
[05:56] <zakame> enough triaging for the night, gn8 all! :D
[05:56] <Tm_T> zakame: night :)
[05:57] <raphink> gtg
[05:57] <zakame> thanks Tm_T
[05:57] <Tm_T> np
[06:00] <Tm_T> heh, cleaning more package and signing it
[06:18] <Kyral> Whoops
[06:18] <Kyral> I think I turned a bunch of people in #ubuntu into HURD freaks....
[06:19] <bddebian> w000t
[06:19] <bddebian> Good job Kyral :-)
[06:19] <Kyral> lol
[06:19] <Kyral> they are all talking about getting Ubuntu working on it
[06:20] <azeem> uhm, they start flowing in
[06:20] <bddebian> Err UbuntGNU :-)
[06:20] <Kyral> azeem: huh?
[06:20] <azeem> to #hurd I mean
[06:20] <Kyral> is that bad?
[06:20] <azeem> no, I just noticed :)
[06:20] <Kyral> I mean a fresh infusion of blood into the project would be nice right?
[06:20] <Kyral> Even if they are complete newbies
[06:21] <bddebian> Kyral: If they are developers yes :-)
[06:21] <azeem> yeah, Barry can train them
[06:21] <bddebian> heh
[06:21] <Kyral> who?
[06:21] <bddebian> <-- Barry
[06:21] <Kyral> ah
[06:21] <bddebian> pfft
[06:21] <Kyral> joking :P
[06:22] <Kyral> oy, one of them is gonna try for it NOW
[06:23] <bddebian> Kyral: ?
 going to go now an try to get an ubuntu HURD box going :D
[06:24] <Kyral> I just mentioned it
[06:24] <Kyral> that it was different
[06:24] <azeem> heh
[06:24] <Kyral> ehhe
[06:24] <Kyral> oh well, its what got me into Linux
[06:24] <Kyral> it wa different
[06:24] <Kyral> I didn't know shit about it
[06:24] <Kyral> but it was different and I was curious :P
[06:24] <bddebian> That's OK, I've been playing with it for years and I still don't know shit about it ;-P
[06:25] <Kyral> frankly thats the best way
[06:25] <Kyral> bddebian: do you run HURD as production?
[06:25] <bddebian> Heh, no
[06:26] <Kyral> Dual Boot?
[06:26] <bddebian> But I do have 5 Hurd boxen :-)
[06:26] <Kyral> Qemu Image?
[06:26] <Kyral> ah
[06:26] <Kyral> port Xen to HURD lol
[06:26] <bddebian> pfft
[06:26] <Kyral> what?
[06:27] <bddebian> piss on Xen :-)
[06:27] <Kyral> why
[06:28] <bddebian> Because I don't know anything about it. :-)
[06:28] <Kyral> lol
[06:28] <Kyral> more the reason to learn about it :P
[06:29] <Kyral> Its a really amazing technology
[06:29] <Kyral> look at azuredreams.us/munin
[06:29] <Kyral> (my monitoring panel for my domain)
[06:29] <Kyral> You will notice 3 machines there right?
[06:30] <Kyral> and if you examine the graphs for them
[06:30] <Kyral> they appear to be 3 machines
[06:30] <Kyral> howver
[06:30] <bddebian> Yep
[06:30] <Kyral> what if I told you
[06:31] <Kyral> that they are all on one physical machine?
[06:31] <Kyral> the "true" OS is xen.azuredreams.us
[06:31] <truz24> from bash, how can i delete files based on created or modified date?
[06:31] <Kyral> mail and www are Debian XenGuests
[06:31] <truz24> under a certain directory, i want to delete all files created in 2005
[06:32] <Kyral> the power of paravirtualization :D
[06:33] <bddebian> Kyral: Cool
[06:44] <bddebian> Kyral: You did tell "them" that there is no Ubuntu Hurd?
[06:44] <Kyral> bddebian: yah....
[06:44] <bddebian> :-)
[06:44] <Kyral> I mean I told them it hasn't been done....
[06:44] <Kyral> maybe I shouldn't have said "it could be fun to try"
[06:45] <Kyral> I mean my philosopy is (with Linux) that if you don't know if it will work, try it
[07:34] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock
[07:36] <LaserJock> hi bddebian
[08:22] <LaserJock> hi trappist
[08:23] <trappist> I'm messing with a package where dpkg-buildpackage makes a .udeb.  how do I make a real package out of that so I can test my changes?
[08:23] <trappist> heya LaserJock
[08:25] <Tm_T> moin
[08:29] <Tm_T> raphink: what's next?
[08:29] <LaserJock> trappist: I really don't know anything about .udebs :/
[08:29] <Yagisan> morning motu's, anyone recommend a nice graphical svn client ?
[08:30] <highvoltage> esvn is highly recommended
[08:30] <tseng> apt-cache says: rapidsvn - A GUI client for subversion
[08:30] <LaserJock> Yagisan: I only use graphical in Windows
[08:32] <Yagisan> I just tried svn-workbench, but it, well dies on checkout
[08:33] <Yagisan> thanks guys :)
[08:36] <Yagisan> my poor system. tv capture, gcc compile, and a 2GB rsync went off at the same time.
[08:45] <uglew> is it unadviceable that i upgrade from kde 3.5.0 to kde 3.5.2?
[08:45] <uglew> *dvise
[08:45] <hub> I think they expect feedback :-)
[08:45] <hub> so if you run dapper, it can not be worth than some upgrades during the development cycle
[08:46] <hub> (I reinstalled my desktop twice...)
[08:47] <uglew> hub: is it terribly unstable?
[08:47] <uglew> hub: no, forgot to mention it: breezy
[08:47] <uglew> IN BREEZY, is it unadviceable that i upgrade from kde 3.5.0 to kde 3.5.2?
[08:48] <Yagisan> uglew: well, for starters, it not in breezy is it
[08:49] <uglew> Yagisan: "An update to the popular KDE desktop, version 3.5.2, is now available for Kubuntu (Breezy Badger and Dapper Drake) (...)" -- taken from DistroWatch.
[08:49] <Yagisan> uglew: my breezy box only has kde 3.4.3
[08:50] <uglew> Yagisan: my breezy is 3.5.0 anyway
[08:50] <Yagisan> uglew: doesn't look supported to me. and I updated 15 minutes ago
[08:50] <uglew> Yagisan: 3.5.2?
[08:50] <hub> uglew: I haven't tried it, but I'd guess it is quite stable. it is for Dapper users
[08:50] <Yagisan> uglew: only offical repos in your sources.list ?
[08:50] <uglew> Yagisan: something like that, why?
[08:51] <hub> uglew: http://www.raphink.info/testing-kde-352-in-dapper
[08:51] <hub> uglew: dapper
[08:51] <uglew> hub: i need info for breezy
[08:52] <hub> uglew: I think you can try to s/dapper/breezy/ in the information given
[08:52] <hub> I don't run breezy, so I haven't even tried
[08:52] <uglew> thank you
[08:54] <Yagisan> uglew: that is not an official release. It appears to be a kubuntu.org release. http://kubuntu.org/announcements/kde-352.php
[08:54] <Yagisan> uglew: so it may well eat your system. Good news is, it won't be our fault.
[08:54] <uglew> Yagisan: what is the difference between kubuntu.org and official??
[08:55] <hub> Yagisan: on the other hand, it is made by the official maintainer that want feedback before requesting a UVF
[08:55] <Yagisan> uglew: they rebuilt the dapper packages for you to use in breezy
[08:55] <hub> again it might eat children :-)
[08:56] <Yagisan> hub: yeah, but people like uglew that are worried they may break their system should stick to breezy for important systems
[08:56] <Yagisan> like I do with my work computer
[08:56] <uglew> is it absolutely trivial to backport some apps from dapper to breezy? is it almost as trivial as.. recompiling?
[08:56] <Yagisan> uglew: some yes, others no
[08:56] <crimsun> slomo_: thanks for the quod libet merge
[08:57] <slomo_> crimsun: np :)
[08:57] <uglew> Yagisan: of the 16 000 packages, what percentage would you think is as trivial as recompiling? say, 90%?
[08:58] <Yagisan> uglew: it is a case by case evaluation. Really. I have my own backports, and some of them were a pain in the arse
[08:58] <Yagisan> uglew: it gets ugly when package a, need b > y, and package c needs b < y
[08:59] <uglew> Yagisan: i know, that's why i was asking for statistics. that was not a question of principle.
[08:59] <uglew> Yagisan: i understand
[09:01] <Yagisan> uglew: it's hard to give you exact numbers. of my private backports, about 40% were just a recompile, 20% dependency change, 30% not-in-ubuntu-or-debian-yet and 10% better-be-worth-it
[09:01] <Yagisan> uglew: and several of them broke other breezy apps
[09:01] <uglew> Yagisan: i see. thanks a lot.
[09:02] <Yagisan> uglew: the new kde should be ok, but *you* are a tester by upgrading to it.
[09:03] <uglew> Yagisan: my using 3.5.0 doesn't make me a tester anyway? or is this an official release?
[09:03] <Yagisan> uglew: you are already a tester with that. As I said, 3.4.3 here
[09:04] <Kyral> hey guys
[09:04] <hub> uglew: it may not be trivial because of dependencies
[09:04] <hub> something like KDE is probably not trivial
[09:04] <uglew> right
[09:04] <Yagisan> definitely not
[09:08] <Yagisan> uglew: people that have already upgraded should be in #kubuntu
[09:09] <Tm_T> hmm
[09:09] <Yagisan> what's up Tm_T ?
[09:10] <Tm_T> I have no idea what I should do with this new Kopete package :p
[09:14] <Tm_T> oh well, maybe Riddell tells as soon as he share his attention;)
[09:14] <Riddell> hmm?
[09:14] <Tm_T> Riddell: yeah, what I do with kopete package now
[09:15] <Tm_T> should be polished enough
[09:15] <Tm_T> http://www.tm-travolta.net/kde/kopete/0.12/
[09:15] <Tm_T> all there
[09:15] <Tm_T> including current output of "lintian -i package.deb"
[09:16] <Riddell> Tm_T: I could put them on kubuntu.org, but I don't really have time immediately
[09:16] <Tm_T> Riddell: np, hit me if you need anything related :)
[09:18] <Tm_T> now I feel I have done enough for one day. good night and thanks all of you :)
[09:26] <Kyral> hllo
[09:46] <LaserJock> hmm, do you have to have a "build" rule in debian/rules if you aren't building anything?
[09:47] <ogra> i think there is something in the policy
[09:48] <ogra> but it works without in ubuntu ... i think its because the debian buildds fail if its not there or something ...
[09:48] <LaserJock> At a minimum, required targets are the ones called by dpkg-buildpackage, namely, clean, binary, binary-arch, binary-indep, and build
[09:52] <Kyral> ust put a touch or something in there
[09:53] <Kyral> hey LJ, do me a favor
[09:53] <Kyral> I wanna test a Irssi script, but do to so I need to detach this screen
[09:54] <LaserJock> ok
[09:54] <Kyral> I'm gonna reattach in like 7 mins
[09:54] <Kyral> the script should pick itt up and change my status to away during then
[09:54] <LaserJock> k
[09:54] <Kyral> when I come back tell me if it did?
[09:54] <Kyral> ty :D
[09:59] <LaserJock> Kyral: arggh, I have to go to a meeting
[09:59] <LaserJock> Kyral: you are away now
[10:09] <Kyral> hehe cool it worked
[10:26] <TheMuso> Hey all.
[10:44] <segfault> can anyone review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2217 ? it's just an updated version of an already uploaded package.
[11:38] <chillywilly> where is pstopdf or ps2pdf?
[11:38] <ajmitch__> gs-common: /usr/bin/ps2pdf
[11:39] <Se7h> hi all
[11:39] <chillywilly> thanks ajmitch__
[11:40] <chillywilly> weird...maybe I was shelled into a different box.