[12:09] ogra: I found the problem [12:09] ogra: there is a wrapper script. I just isn't installed into the deb [12:10] gah [12:10] my mistake then [12:11] ogra: but there needs to be some symlinks (it expects everything in /usr/lib/squeak/ and we install in /usr/share/squeak/) [12:11] just change the script ? i dont think its upstream ... [12:12] my packages were based on some guadalinex sourcepackages ... [12:13] apparently the script is pretty popular [12:15] but why should we add unecessary symlinks ? [12:15] change the location of the target then ? [12:16] i.e. lets just install to /usr/lib ... [12:16] just a sec, I think the script is created by ./configure so I'm not entirely sure how to switch it [12:16] ogra: we could do that too === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #edubuntu [12:17] if there is no policy violation through installing to /usr/lib ... (which i doubt) ... [12:29] ogra: initsqueak is created by ./configure so I think it would be better to symlink or change install targets [12:31] lets change targets then [12:32] there is no danger that we clash with debian any day before apple is broke [12:32] lol [12:33] and i think the upstream code didnt change since ages, did it ? [12:33] I don't think so [12:33] but now I got #squeak arguing about inisqueak so... [12:34] heh [12:34] see inisqueak is ok from CLI [12:34] but as far as putting something in the menu, it isn't so good [12:35] somebody over there has a little zenity script but I'm not sure if that is a great solution either [12:35] it needs to check if the user has a writable image ... if so, it should start the vm ... if not, it should create a default image ... [12:35] doesnt it do that ? [12:35] why should zenity be needed ? [12:36] it copies the default image to `pwd` if one isn't found [12:36] i dont see any need for user interaction ... [12:36] what would `pwd` be for a menu item? [12:36] and i dont see why we shouldnt be able to run it from a .desktop file [12:37] cd ~ && inisqueak ? [12:37] yeah, that was just what was suggested in #squeak [12:37] but i think you can make it a lot more elegant ... [12:37] is a .desktop file installed? [12:38] I didn't see one offhand [12:38] iirc there is an option in the xdg spec for the working dir [12:38] it should at least be in the source [12:39] ok, so here is what I'll do. I'll fix the targets to put .changes .image and .sources in /usr/lib/squeak and then make sure a .desktop is installed that runs inisqueak [12:43] ogra: I think Path might work in the .desktop [12:46] I think I can also get rid of /etc/alternatives stuff in squeak-image since alternatives are essentially handles by inisqueak === caravena [n=caravena@200.72.20.130] has joined #edubuntu === ogra_ [n=ogra@p5089D827.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #edubuntu === arkan0x [n=arkan0x@pc-220-72-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === bimberi [n=bimberi@pdpc/supporter/active/bimberi] has joined #edubuntu === iGotNoTime [n=joshua@cpe-65-189-240-199.woh.res.rr.com] has joined #edubuntu [01:29] ogra are you here? [01:30] I just was at this page: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuWiki and at the bottom it says.... [01:30] Edubuntu 5.10 ogra is the lead person [01:31] I feel so bad about asking for so much help from someone sooooo far ahead of what I could ever do with Linux, just wanted to say I appreciate the help you gave me and the time [01:31] thats been an old spec [01:31] just a thank you :) [01:31] i should just lead the development on it ... [01:31] :) [01:32] actually i didnt know that page still exists :) [01:32] yeah it was the main :D [01:32] it was the frontpage when we started and had a separate wiki [01:34] oh, its still linked as the frontpage from the website :) i didnt know that [01:35] honored you are :D [01:37] I have a suggestion... It took me forever to find how to add a "start-up program", maybe that could be in it's own menu dialogue rather than under sessions? [01:38] Unless you are looking to avoid the Windows feel :P [01:38] just a suggestion from a guy with XP still very fresh in his head :) [01:39] there is an easier way :) [01:39] just save your session ... [01:39] (alt-f2 and type gnome-session-save) [01:40] I am scared how much temp space it would take to do that :) [01:40] it will then start up whats currently running [01:40] none at all [01:40] I never reboot anyway, just a thought for those who do [01:40] that's very cool :) [01:41] it just saves a list of the currently running programs and their open files ... [01:41] and restores the session to match that list [01:41] I do actually save session on my laptop, but I have issues with it so I don't use now [01:41] the fan does not work with edubuntu LOL [01:41] I could cook eggs on it [01:42] whats that for a laptop ? [01:42] Averatec 3200 series [01:42] I think 3250 [01:42] amd64 ? [01:42] no big deal, I just run it for no more than 10 minutes these days because of it :) [01:42] or i386 [01:43] it is AMD but I don't know what chip [01:43] but its clearly a bug ... [01:43] could just be my brand [01:43] I am not blaming edubuntu :) [01:43] unless you have an amd64 and run the i386 version on it [01:43] blame edubuntu ... [01:43] edubuntu is too cute to blame for anything bad :D [01:44] its supposed to work and should be fixed :) [01:44] I had a nightmare experience with CentOS a couple weeks ago [01:44] completely crashed my bios [01:44] had to buy a new motherboard [01:44] how that ? [01:44] I don't know [01:45] I never would have thought a distro could do anything like that [01:45] I always had to flash my bios before [01:45] couldn't re-flash this one because bios is not public yet [01:45] so here it sits [01:45] they said in IRC they have seen it before [01:46] crazy [01:46] anyway I am back to the wiki :) [01:46] have a great night :) [01:55] night :) [01:58] ogra: ok, I actually found a shell script from Lex Spoon that does exactly what we want [01:58] cool [01:58] did you get my last messages before my line dropped ? [01:59] iirc there is an option in the xdg spec for the working dir [01:59] it should at least be in the source [01:59] the .desktop file is in the linex dir in squeak-vm [01:59] yeah, I found the .desktop [01:59] there is also an inisqueak (called just squeak) [01:59] but inisqueak is interactive so it put me in an infinite loop :-) [02:00] sadly its spanish ... [02:00] and my spanish is nonexistent :) [02:00] but this script I found really does the same thing but better, for now [02:00] yep [02:00] the linex one is pretty evil [02:01] ensuredir() [02:01] { [02:01] if [ ! -d "${1}" ] ; then [02:01] if mkdir "${1}" ; then [02:01] echo squeak: Creado ${1} [02:01] if [ -d $GNOME_DESKTOP ] ; then [02:01] cp /usr/share/applications/squeak.desktop $GNOME_DESKTOP/ [02:01] fi [02:01] else [02:01] echo squeak: No se ha podido crear ${1}! [02:01] fi [02:01] fi [02:01] the inisqueak script is good for installing multiple versions because it asks you which .image you want to install [02:01] } [02:01] it copies the .desktop file on your desktop if its not there yet ... [02:02] if you delete it and start suqeak, it will reappear [02:03] ok, so to make squeak working we can install this script to /usr/bin/squeak and have squeak-image [02:04] yep [02:04] ok, I'll have it done shortly [02:19] I have a noob question.... some programs start in usr/bin/ and some start from usr/share/ [02:19] what's the difference? [02:21] For example Gdesklets is in /usr/bin/ yet Asterisk is in /usr/share/ [02:22] oops just double-checking I meant sbin not share :P [02:23] /share are alot of stuf data for the programs, normaly the executable should be in /usr/bin [02:23] sbin if system task, a normal user would need them, sudo or root does use them [02:24] ok [02:24] a normal user would not need them :P [02:24] bad typo :) [02:24] so more like system utilities and such? [02:24] yup [02:25] ok === C-O-L-T [n=icechat5@193.231.163.10] has joined #edubuntu === HedgeMag1 [n=me@c-24-18-107-23.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #edubuntu === HedgeMage [i=me@freenode/staff/HedgeMage] has joined #edubuntu === P3L|C4N0 [n=gcamposm@201.230.101.223] has joined #edubuntu === HedgeMage [i=me@freenode/staff/HedgeMage] has joined #edubuntu === arkan0x [n=arkan0x@pc-220-72-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === bimberi [n=bimberi@pdpc/supporter/active/bimberi] has joined #edubuntu === arkan0x [n=arkan0x@pc-220-72-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #edubuntu === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #edubuntu === sankarshan [n=sankarsh@220.227.211.249] has joined #edubuntu === jinty [n=jinty@135.Red-80-37-34.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #edubuntu === bimberi_ [n=bimberi@pdpc/supporter/active/bimberi] has joined #edubuntu === ulinskie [n=yolynne@202.57.88.34] has joined #edubuntu [08:13] Anyone know the TFTP default root directory in edubuntu? === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage] by ChanServ === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #edubuntu === spacey [n=herman@ubuntu/member/spacey] has joined #edubuntu === JaneW [n=JaneW@dsl-146-178-247.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #edubuntu [09:48] Here's a feature we DON'T need for Edubuntu http://www.boreme.com/boreme/funny-2002/paperclip-p1.php [09:48] http://www.nongnu.org/pyscitrivia/howto.html [09:48] hmm, looks nifty [09:49] too bad it needs pygame === vandenoever [n=jos@146.107.217.112] has joined #edubuntu [09:53] hello, yesterday i posted a msg to the mailing list [09:53] it's awaiting moderation [09:53] does that usually take long? [09:54] JaneW: it might be smart to register edubuntu.com [09:54] oh, wait, nev mind [09:57] ogra: you awake? === jane_ [n=JaneW@dsl-146-178-247.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #edubuntu === jamey2 [n=jamey@82-37-128-102.cable.ubr01.telf.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #edubuntu [10:01] my college is interested in setting up an edubuntu/ubuntu network, can someone please advise me on a few things? [10:01] jamey2: shoot. I might be able to answer [10:02] thanks [10:02] ok, well our first worry is how the servers will work... how do multiple servers work together, and what sort of spec will we need? === spacey [n=herman@ubuntu/member/spacey] has joined #edubuntu [10:03] jamey2: there are a number of ways, but I understand quite well. I am not the expert on this [10:03] i've been reading on the wikis, it seems they recommend a base of 256 mb + about 50 mb per client [10:03] but then other sites recommend varying amounts of RAM per client [10:03] what do you think? [10:04] edubunt is a little bit heavier than some other ltsp, from what I understand [10:04] ah ok, i see [10:04] I think our recommendation is 128 per client [10:04] woah [10:04] let me just find [10:05] right... that means 256 + (128 * 250)... 32256 mb [10:05] ok [10:06] ok, Edubuntu documentation is a mess [10:06] yeah it's a bit disorganized [10:06] jamey2: anyway, what other questions did you have? [10:06] how do the servers work together? [10:07] i've searched a while but can't find much on multiple servers under ltsp/*ubuntu [10:08] I believe it is possible, but to be honest, I am not certain how, nor can I point you at a doc === sankarshan [n=sankarsh@220.227.211.249] has joined #edubuntu [10:08] ok thanks anyway [10:09] i do have another question: how do you find edubuntu for education in general? [10:09] good and getting better [10:10] great [10:10] the current stable release is first release, with a few kinks [10:10] brill [10:10] s/is/is a [10:10] our next stable release is on July 1st [10:10] this next release will be supported for 3 years [10:11] Burgundavia, we're not clear about that yet for edubuntu . [10:11] ogra: oh? [10:11] since we say server distros are supported 5 years [10:11] ah [10:11] and edubuntu defaults to a server install [10:11] ogra, do you have in idea about multiple server configs? [10:11] but its not a classic server [10:12] no [10:12] effectively, that would mean supporting gnome for 5 years [10:12] jamey2, you maen clustering like openmosix etc ? [10:12] um, not exactly [10:12] i've read on a few pages that you can simply have multiple ltsp/edubuntu servers which spread the load [10:12] just a bootserver and an appserver then ? [10:12] ah yeah [10:13] well i thought one would be the file server, the rest app servers or something? [10:13] we use simple ssh tunnels to forward the display, so every machine with a ssh server and some kind of desktop installed can be a server [10:14] you could then also split out the booting to a separate server (which likely makes no sense) [10:14] and add a nfs server with home dirs [10:14] i see [10:16] in principle you can split ltsp into one server per task if you really want that [10:17] for real clustering you should talk to neuralis, he experimented a lot with openssi [10:17] he's usually in #ltsp [10:17] i'm talking to him now :) [10:17] oh, i see [10:17] heh [10:18] sorry for sounding so naive, but what i meant is... [10:18] wasnt in that tab today yet :) [10:18] ogra: have we ever considered pygame? [10:18] Burgundavia, dont we ship it in the ubuntu default install already ? [10:18] we have a large college with 250 machines spread out over a large area but all on the same subnet. we want any student to be able to login from any terminal and get their home dir /apps [10:18] ogra: universe [10:19] ah [10:19] so would a nfs server with the home dirs work, and does edubuntu/ltsp deal with this config? [10:19] most likely nobody stepped up to support it for main yet ... [10:19] sorry for all the questions [10:19] ogra: it would mean pulling more of sdl in [10:19] not out of the box, you'll need some tweaking [10:20] Burgundavia, yep ... i doubt pitti would be happy [10:20] but it shouldnt be to hard to achieve that [10:20] jamey2: no questions means nobody is using edubuntu, so questions are good :) [10:20] (i.e. likely only an entry in the clients fstab) [10:21] since i'm currently the walking documentation for ubuntu ltsp (dont let me get hit by a bus) ... go and ask ;) [10:21] s/go/go on/ [10:22] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PythonEduLab <-- lets make pitti tear his hair out for dapper+1 :) [10:23] the title sounds suspicious like a jelkner thing ... === ogra looks [10:23] it is [10:24] ogra: does nexenta contain all the packages that ubuntu does [10:24] lol [10:24] ? [10:24] highvoltage: mostly [10:24] (hi, btw) [10:24] highvoltage, i'd guess so, yes [10:24] as far as they compile [10:24] Burgundavia: would you be able to do a apt-get install edubuntu-desktop in nexenta? [10:24] highvoltage: don't know if they do the meta packages [10:24] highvoltage, you would if they did :) [10:25] ogra: what do you mean? [10:25] wxwidgets, pygame, sdl, where does the crack stop? [10:25] Burgundavia, ask jelkner :) === jamey2 [n=jamey@82-37-128-102.cable.ubr01.telf.blueyonder.co.uk] has left #edubuntu ["Leaving"] [10:25] Burgundavia: hollywood, baby [10:26] highvoltage, you would be able to install edubuntu on nexenta if they would build it [10:26] ok. [10:26] we'll have our own sparc port soon, then ltsp will work on sparc and we'll have edubuntu on sparc ... [10:26] (dapper+1) [10:28] is sparc going official for dapper+1? [10:29] i think so ... [10:29] but there is nothing final yet === ogra goes to read his mail backlog [10:29] I should be in Germany in July, so we can chat more then [10:33] i'm not sure if *i* am in germany in july ... [10:33] why not? [10:33] we'll pretty sure not have our conference her [10:33] e [10:33] oh [10:33] while silly people are kicking around a silly black and white ball? [10:33] soccer championship starts mid june [10:34] i rather hide from that :) [10:35] it is a real shame that schoolforge is basically dead [10:41] :( [10:42] as is seul/edu [10:42] in fact, I think the most active educational stuff in Linux has been centered around ltsp [10:43] mhz had some educational content ideas as well [10:43] but i didn't read anything about it after he proposed it [10:43] I wish I had more time in the day [10:43] yeah [10:44] or my lifespan would be longer [10:44] or need less sleep :P [10:44] no time !:P === pips1 [n=philipp@68.15.62.81.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #edubuntu [10:49] Burgundavia: that's not a silly black and white ball :P [10:49] trying to hit a puck with a stick is much sillier :P [10:50] I was arguing about a silly b/w ball, nothing to do with another silly sport involving a puck [10:51] Burgundavia, schoolforge dead ? [10:51] what makes you think that ? [10:52] ogra: the app list is barely maintained and hideous [10:52] well 3/4 of the world beg to differ on the b/w ball heh [10:52] only because it takes less equipment to play [10:52] Burgundavia, that might be true, but schoolforge itself was at least alive in january [10:52] (i met one of the guys at a conference) [10:53] which conference? [10:53] a thin from the EU [10:53] *thing [10:53] http://www.schoolforge.net/ <-- this schoolforge? [10:53] yes [10:53] guys, we have been asked what text we would like on the edubuntu CD covers...? [10:54] oh, do we ? [10:54] :) [10:54] with a dragon yin yang tatoo [10:54] "this computer will cause your teacher to be happy. Use with caution" [10:54] JaneW: what about updating the text that were on the old covers? [10:54] if anyone is fond of helping to test flight-6, its due for today [10:55] ohhh [10:55] should i grab an image? [10:55] kewl [10:55] yeah, grab it :) === jsgotangco looks for amd64 [10:56] ogra, there is http://www.schoolforge.net/ and http://schoolforge.org.uk/ . The latter is maintained by John Ingleby who we met in London :-) [10:56] shold i get the currend daily? [10:56] pips1: the former is still active, but appears to be US oriented [10:56] pips1, ahh, then i muddled them [10:57] Burgundavia, i meant .co.uk [10:57] org.uk ;-) [10:57] err, yes === ogra sometimes wonders if its not enough to drive on the wrong side of the road and have wrongly sized wrenches ... [10:58] do they also need their own namespace on the internt ? === jsgotangco grabs amd64 daily for edubuntu [10:59] we had this for the CDs before (unofficial) https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCdLabelAndSlip [10:59] well, good night. I need to sleep [11:00] night Burgundavia [11:00] JaneW, we should adjust that a bit, but i think its still fine [11:01] ogra: I think so too [11:02] ogra: think we should list some of the applications and uses? [11:02] night Burgundavia [11:02] probably the more obvious ones [11:03] JaneW, i woldnt ... the app selection slowly starts to differ between the arches due to our space problems [11:04] JaneW: there was another cd slip too, wasn't there? or was that Ubuntu [11:05] JaneW: i remember seeing a nice edubuntu one with a breezy badger on it [11:06] highvoltage: no that was never official or accepted [11:06] it was created by Sebastein Loss [11:07] he put a huge amount of effort in and I was a bit annoyed that none of his stuff was used [11:07] or even acknowledged as far as I know [11:09] i've always liked his stuff. i feel a bit bad that his stuff wan't used either, but as far as i can recall, it was just because no printed cd's were planned? [11:09] JaneW: i loved his design though [11:09] (still do) === vandenoever [n=jos@146.107.217.112] has left #edubuntu ["Konversation] [11:13] ok, i386 live seems good ... [11:13] crickey so i get to test amd64 for edubuntu flight 6 jeez [11:14] yeah [11:14] ok 1 hour to go [11:15] ogra: did you see silb's message for edubuntu artwork links? === bimberi [n=bimberi@pdpc/supporter/active/bimberi] has joined #edubuntu [11:17] ogra: is this the flight 6 cd? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/dapper-install-i386.iso [11:18] im getting the current as well [11:18] well that's the candidate for flight 6 [11:19] highvoltage, yep [11:19] live will likely se a rebuild to get the latest network-manager in [11:58] ogra, the header info still says MEETING: March 15 at 12:00 UTC instead of March 29 12:00 UTC ... also, I just realised that in Europe, we now have +2 hours off-set from UTC, because of daylight saving time... [11:59] feel free to chane :) [11:59] *change [11:59] the topic isnt locked [12:03] JaneW, according to silbs request, we'll likely have another text it seems [12:03] ogra: huh? [12:03] ogra: she sent me a mail asking for CD civer text, which I replied to [12:03] JaneW, see her last mail [12:04] ogra: now she wants install instructions [12:04] and min specs [12:04] yes [12:04] the'll fill the cover already [12:04] ogra: can you respond [12:04] to make sure it's correct [12:04] yep [12:04] thanks [12:04] be consise! [12:05] waiting for your reply to hit my inbox ... [12:05] meh, install CDs need a rebuild too [12:06] ogra: I'll fwd [12:06] the first mail didn;t have you CCed [12:06] ah, k [12:06] then it gets hard to check :) [12:10] JaneW, dont we also offer commercial support as well ? [12:11] ogra: er, I donlt know, not officially yet afaik [12:11] but I am sure we would/could if there was demand [12:12] we have a special http://www.ubuntu.com/support/supportoptions/paidsupport talks about "Cluster and Thin Client Support" [12:12] *special offer [12:15] oic === Rondom [n=Rondom@84.245.164.11] has joined #edubuntu === jinty [n=jinty@135.Red-80-37-34.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #edubuntu === jsgotangco burning amd64 build atm [12:23] jsgotangco, the kbd-chooser changes were forgotten ... you might have probs installing with a non english keyboard [12:23] (there is a CD rebuild pending) [12:23] its ok i'll test it on an en_us keyboard [12:23] the only non-us keyboard i have here are my 2 laptops [12:23] and live is missing the latest artwork ... [12:24] oh not that much of an issue then [12:24] thanks to a rebuild of the complete KDE world ... [12:24] except the kbd [12:24] weee === Bluekujaa [n=jioker@host6-232.pool8714.interbusiness.it] has joined #edubuntu [01:45] jonathan? [01:48] **Reminder** Edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 12 mins [01:49] yeah i remember it :) [01:49] i will arrive 5 minutes later [01:49] ;) === Bluekujaa [n=jioker@host6-232.pool8714.interbusiness.it] has left #edubuntu [] [01:55] i'm here i'm here i'm here! [01:55] geez, traffic is dense, and i'm in time for the meeting :) [01:56] arent you using gprs anyway ? [01:56] you could do it from a traffic jam :) === kjcole [n=kjcole@ubuntu/member/kjcole] has joined #edubuntu [01:57] ogra: i've used IRC on gprs from my laptop while driving before, it won't be the first :) [01:57] (although right now i'm at work with nice, free bandwidth) [01:57] heh === Yagisan [n=jamie@60-240-205-203.tpgi.com.au] has joined #edubuntu === Rondom_ [n=Rondom@87.193.20.242] has joined #edubuntu === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #edubuntu === mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage] by ChanServ === Pygi [n=mario@83-131-242-196.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #edubuntu === jinty [n=jinty@135.Red-80-37-34.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #edubuntu === trondm_gone is now known as trondm === bobulator [n=bob@host-87-75-129-152.bulldogdsl.com] has joined #edubuntu [03:04] afternoon, it's all gone a bit wrong. i did a fresh flight 5 install, and im getting 'Error 17: CAnnot mount selected partition' any ideas? === pips1 arrives back from #ubuntu-meeting [03:06] bobulator, looks like a BIOS issue, set the acess mode for your disk to LBA [03:08] ogra, hmm do you know what section thats in? i cant see it... brb [03:08] no idea ... anywhere in the HD settings of the BIOS [03:10] k [03:13] ogra, ah got it, LBA mode is on. just checking... i put GRUB on the main partition of the system drive (its not asked me that question before, incidentally). and it also says it cant read the filesystem type [03:14] err, you need to put GRUB into the MBR, unless you already have a bootloader === highvoltage thinks this is quite cool: http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/371 [03:15] wheres the MBR? [03:15] its jsut odd its not asked me where to put it before... === Seveas [n=seveas@ubuntu/member/seveas] has joined #edubuntu [03:19] where should i be installing grub then if not on the main partition? [03:19] bobulator: MBR is your master boot record [03:19] it's located at the beginning of the disk, it's where your bios looks for information about your bootloader [03:20]