[12:03] KaiL: you mean kde-guidance? [12:03] ah, yes [12:03] KaiL: displayconfig in kde-guidance [12:04] Pygi: not yet, it needs to pass NEW and compile first :) [12:04] somebody should port that to GNOME ;) [12:04] Riddell: ah ;P === mdke_ [n=matt@ubuntu/member/mdke] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:05] infinity: so you volunteer for doing some uploads for me if needed? ;) === GmanAFK is now known as Gman === infinity scratches his head at the syck FTBFS on amd64 and dives into CVS. [12:06] Pygi: Forward me patches.. adconrad@ubuntu.com [12:07] infinity: as soon as they are done :) [12:07] and thanks ^_^ [12:09] Kamion: Any idea where Mithrandir left off with Flight-6 testing? === sistpoty [n=sistpoty@ubuntu/member/sistpoty] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:11] I'll be back in a sec === mario_ [n=mario@83-131-254-145.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:14] back [12:14] the kernel only supports 16bit FB? [12:14] KaiL: you in a mood for another round of bugs against n-m? ;) [12:15] Riddell, you want network-manager-kde? [12:15] the "it's missing" bug? [12:15] KaiL: 4-bit, you mean (via vga16fb, which is 16 colours, not 16-bit)? [12:15] Riddell: he uploaded it ;) [12:15] KaiL: hm, number of that bug? lemme close it... [12:15] Pygi, 37190 [12:15] bug 27190 [12:15] Malone bug 27190 in linux-source-2.6.15 "general protection fault" [Normal,Needs info] http://launchpad.net/bugs/27190 [12:16] aaaaghr [12:16] bug 37190 [12:16] Malone bug 37190 in network-manager "network-manager-kde missing" [Wishlist,Confirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/37190 [12:16] infinity, as color depth for the splash [12:16] will do now...next todo: let's go, and confirm/reject/whatever to nm bugs [12:16] KaiL: Yes, that's 4-bit. [12:16] vga=773 (1024, 256 colors) seams to fail [12:16] KaiL: And intentional, since vga16fb is the only framebuffer guaranteed to be sane. [12:16] 791 (1024, 16bit) works [12:17] infinity: happen to know why sbcl didn't get scheduled for building on ppc yet? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/sbcl/1:0.9.8.0-1ubuntu3 === sabdfl [n=mark@ubuntu/member/pdpc.silver.sabdfl] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [12:17] KaiL: Oh, if you're using vesafb, I'm not sure.. I use vesafb at 16 and 32 bit, and have never had issues. I may have to look into using it at 8-bit (like you're trying to do). [12:18] well, that's what the installer writes into the settings, if I select 1024 and 16bit at startup, afair ;) [12:21] sistpoty: It keeps getting given-back, due to my overly-clever regexes finding an "Illegal Instruction" in the log. [12:21] sistpoty: I may need to tweak that. [12:21] hmm, 0x341 is what? 1024, 32bit? [12:21] infinity: ah, k :)... not sure if this will even compile on ppc, but I thought it might be worth a try [12:22] KaiL: Err, what? The installer doesn't do any vesafb setup. === j^ [n=j@e178009005.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:24] on the CD menu you can select a screen resolution with F4. This one get's used for X and for into /boot/grub/menu.lst as vga=-Line [12:24] Oh, ick. Not sure that's sane... [12:25] That's just begging for a bunch of people to complain to us later that hibernate/suspend don't work properly, because people are using vesafb instead of vga16fb... [12:26] that could explain some things here ;) [12:26] are those codes computer/gfx card specific? [12:26] Amaranth, nop [12:26] ooh [12:26] you learn something new every day :) [12:26] infinity, vga16fb is always 4bit, 640x480, as the name says? [12:26] KaiL: 4-bit, 640x400 [12:27] or that [12:27] KaiL: Boot with no vga= at all, and you get vga16fb (assuming you have usplash installed) [12:27] vga= something is a good way to break suspend :/ [12:28] now I understand, why we had so much fails on the last test round === besonen_ [n=besonen_@dsl-db.pacinfo.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:31] infinity, should I create a bug (or 2)? [12:31] ..and which package is that then? ;) [12:31] Not positive about how we should deal with it yet (which means I'm not sure where the bug should be filed) [12:32] KaiL: I'll discuss it with Kamion and we'll come up with something we agree is sane. [12:32] KaiL: can you please go on an "exploring mission"? ;) [12:32] Pygi, ? [12:32] We need to find out if wpasupplicant is needed for proper working on N-M [12:32] and if it is needed for regular WEP [12:33] It is, the way things are done right now. [12:33] if you can find somebody, who can at least use WEP :) [12:33] infinity: oh, joy :-/ [12:34] we'll see how it is handled in 0.6.2 ... but I guess it will be the same [12:34] KaiL: bah ;) [12:34] I'd like to test, if it works without wpasupplicant, but I'd be happy, if it would work WITH here :) [12:34] btw. I could try 0.6.2 [12:35] that ubuntu1-Package from yesterday still the lastest? [12:35] KaiL: hm ? [12:35] of nm-0.6.2 [12:35] KaiL: please wait with testing 0.6.2 [12:35] hm, ok ;) [12:35] Pygi: The current way it's set up, NOTHING works without wpasupplicant, not even unencrypted wireless. [12:35] we'll release patches & things soon, so it should be in repos... [12:36] infinity: yes, I am aware of that... [12:36] infinity: that is NO GOOD [12:36] :P [12:36] Pygi: I see no technical reason why this couldn't be resolved. [12:36] infinity: it can be resolved ... [12:37] that means more patches,and I think this one doesn't exist, so we have to write it if we want it... [12:37] Yup. [12:37] I'm all for helping on that front, just not today. [12:37] bug 37223 - that seams to be some VERY VERY annoying bug of gnome-vfs, I also know (and hate) [12:37] Malone bug 37223 in network-manager "NetworkManager is trying to access my LAN's Samba share." [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/37223 [12:37] (Flight releases take precedence over NM hacking) [12:38] here in addition with an also rather common "I'd like to connect to everything"-bug ;) [12:38] infinity, flight6 on 2006-04-20, or? [12:38] infinity: agreed ... so, will you be able to help me there once we release flight? [12:40] KaiL: Or 2006-03-30... === Arrogance [n=aks@ottawa-hs-209-217-79-82.d-ip.magma.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:40] Pygi: No promises, but I will help look into it. [12:40] that would be cool - but only with that ATI-fix :p [12:40] k, thanks [12:40] Pygi: It bugs me, cause I really don't want to pull in wpasupplicant as an unconditional dependency. [12:41] infinity: agreed [12:41] RSYNC, YOU FESTERING HEAP OF POO, GO FASTER. [12:41] it would be really great if we could pull that patch [12:42] And I am still unable to see reason why is wpasupplicant needed for anything but WPA [12:42] Pygi: Likely because it was simpler to implement it that way, with only one codepath followed for all wireless networks. [12:42] Riddell: for kubuntu? Unsure, you haven't given me any feedback.. You most likely want new live images, though. [12:42] infinity: o joy, let's all start following "the simple path" and I don't want to see where we will end... [12:43] Pygi: It makes sense, in a way, but it's also an unneeded dependency on a known-sketchy product. [12:43] Mithrandir: well what's the status for ubuntu? === Harti [n=Harti@dslb-082-083-232-021.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:43] infinity: ah [12:44] Riddell: amd64 install cd were having problems booting, something I think we worked out, but since my test machine is downtown, I can't get to it to test. [12:44] perhaps I could hack in a static IP support into NM as patch as well, and post it to their list, if it wouldn't take too much time for me [12:44] Pygi: If wpasupplicant were more robust, I probably wouldn't have a problem with them unconditionally using it as a backend for all wireless. [12:44] infinity: agreed [12:44] Mithrandir: so tomorrow then? [12:45] When rsync and I have done battling, the amd64 install CD will get tested. [12:45] Riddell: yeah [12:46] Mithrandir: ok, thanks [12:49] eigher I need a new power supply for my Test-PC or I need a bigger audio system (and new neighbours...) ;) === LeeJunFan [n=junfan@adsl-69-210-207-5.dsl.klmzmi.ameritech.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:53] talk to you later people === susus_ [n=sz@p5089F0BD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ogra [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Harti [n=Harti@dslb-082-083-232-021.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["-] [01:00] Mithrandir: is main free again yet? [01:01] Kinnison: no. [01:01] Kinnison: tomorrow, sometime. [01:03] Kinnison: sorry. :-/ [01:04] Mithrandir: s'okay [01:04] Mithrandir: how's f6 going? === jdong [n=jdong@ubuntu/member/jdong] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:04] If it's not gonna be opened any time soon I may go shopping before the meeting [01:05] Kinnison: please go shopping. It'll be tomorrow, as in, in about 12-16 hours. [01:05] Mithrandir: fair enough :-) === Kinnison goes for caffeine and chocolate === mgalvin [n=mgalvin@ubuntu/member/mgalvin] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:08] Kinnison: you're planning to stay awake until the status meeting? :) [01:08] sivang: if I go to bed I'll never get up in time [01:08] Kinnison: heh :) [01:09] Kinnison: How are you btw? === mvo envies Kinnison for having shops open in the middle of the night [01:09] mvo: Feh, we only have the second largest supermarket in the UK [01:09] mvo: oh, and four or five smaller branches [01:09] within 30 minutes of here :-) [01:09] Kinnison: is UK a sort of "non resting" place? [01:09] Kinnison: shops close at 8 in germany [01:09] that is, shops open 24/7 [01:09] mvo: yeah that sucks [01:10] sivang: some shops are open 24/7 [01:10] mvo: that's like in .IL [01:10] and I would love to get some caffeine and chocolate === Harti [n=Harti@dslb-082-083-232-021.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mvo waves to sivang === sivang waves back to mvo :-) [01:10] sivang: will you stay up to talk about HUB? === mvo goes and makes a tea instead [01:11] mvo: I think I shall have a pot of green tea upon my return [01:11] mmm tea [01:11] mvo: I might, I actually worked today both on something with martin, and in the backgorund on HUB [01:11] mvo: I turned up to be more productive then when I concentrate on one of them ..I guess I'm having a good muse day [01:13] mvo: I happen to like those status meeting very much, feels good to know exactly where we stand in real time :) [01:14] Kinnison: green tea is on my agenda as well :) === sivang has only fruit, but is too lzy to go prepare tea [01:14] sivang: I'm not too happy about the one at 4am though :) [01:14] (fruit tea, lipton's brand) === Harti [n=Harti@dslb-082-083-232-021.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["-carpe] === mvo considers to prepare matcha. that shall keep me awake === poningru [n=poningru@n128-227-55-122.xlate.ufl.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:17] mvo: I can understand you, I have work tomorrow so I can symphatize greatly :) [01:17] sivang: after the 4am meeting I'm jetlaged the next day [01:17] feels like a trip through serveral timezones [01:18] mvo: I tend to just not sleep after the wonky-hour meetings. [01:18] mvo: Or, stay up for a few days before, then sleep for a day after. Or whatever. :) [01:18] mvo: Of course, I'm not all that sane, nor rational, so I'm not sure if my advice should be followed. [01:19] infinity: I find it hard to keep productive without any sleep [01:19] I tend to not concentrate that well then [01:19] mvo: See, I'm most productive at the tail end of a really (really) long stretch. [01:19] woah [01:19] maybe I never stretched far enough :) ? [01:20] mvo: I'm like you on this :) [01:20] mvo: Well, when I'm wide awake and alert, my mind's on 1000 things at once, and I sort of multitask all over... As I get further on in the day, I get more focussed on individual tasks, until the evening is spent banging my head on ONE FRIGGIN' THING UNTIL IT WORKS OR ELSE. Those last two hours always produce the best solutions. [01:20] Again, I'm aware that I'm neither sane, nor rational. [01:21] heh :) stop pointing that out all the time. we know ;) [01:21] Yes, Sven. === mvo kicks infinity [01:21] "sven" [01:21] infinity: it worked the other way around for me, I couldn't really solve a couple of bus in my code until I started working on another thing in the backgorund. weird [01:21] he isn't even german (or is he?) [01:21] infinity: Sven ? [01:21] as in, Luther ? [01:21] mvo: Frerman. [01:22] IIRC he is on the seb128 side of germany ;) [01:22] infinity: Hey, I do that too. [01:22] mvo: French, with a German name. I assume a border case, like seb. :) [01:22] sivang: sort of a insider joke [01:22] My best code gets written between 10pm and 4am [01:22] ah :) [01:22] after that i'm usually too wiped out to type coherent things [01:22] Amaranth, so you live at the wrong continent ;) [01:22] life [01:23] KaiL: Doesn't matter where I am, the times listed only work because I normally go to bed at midnight. [01:23] When I was sleeping during the day it was 4am-8am or so [01:27] infinity: do you have any experience with ATI V3200 on a T43p ? :-) === jkakar [n=jkakar@204.174.36.228] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:28] sivang: Nope. I avoided the 'p' series specifically because of that card. :) [01:28] infinity: is it known to be squashing your brain to dust to make it work with Xorg? [01:29] infinity: I'm going to buy a T43 , and since I want 14" with 1400x1050 as you so rightfully recommended, they can offer my only p's. with that card :) [01:29] infinity: the one I had over UBZ was returend due to an exccesive amount of dead pixels [01:29] sivang: what about waiting for a t60? [01:30] mvo: That's even worse, we don't support any of the video in any T60, at all. [01:30] Not even with fglrx. [01:30] ATi V3200? Never heared of that.. FireGL? [01:30] infinity: isn't there a model with intel graphics? or am I confusing things? [01:30] sivang: fglrx will drive the V3200 fine, the free driver SHOULD (it's an RV380, which we have some support for), but I won't guarantee it. [01:31] mvo: There's one or two models of T60 with Intel graphics, but they're a lot lower down on the spiffy scale (ie: they come with slower CPUs, 1024x768 displays, etc) [01:31] mvo: If you want a T60 with a 1400x1050 or 1600x1200 display, you get ATI video. [01:31] mvo: I could wait, but then the price range I suppose will be much higher then what I'm offered currently from within .IL, including TAX and intl. warranty... [01:31] *grumpf* we don't do even 2d ? a shame [01:32] thought about an FSC Lifebook S? That's available with 1440x1050 and intel graphics ;) === mvo kicks .... someone ... probably ati for this [01:32] hehe [01:32] mvo: We don't support anything in the Radeon X1xxx range yet (and neither fores fglrx), so you get stuck with vesa. Woo. [01:32] s/fores/does/ === mvo is in kicking mode today === infinity considers new fingers. [01:32] infinity, not even fglrx supports them? [01:32] KaiL: Nope. [01:33] KaiL: Not really sure WHY, but I know they don't. ATI's Linux customers aren't very happy with them. [01:33] ...I love ATi.... [01:33] (everybody saw the ironie-tags?) [01:34] I would be much happier if Thinkpads shipped with nVidia stuff, but I get what I get, and I like the rest of the machine too much to go shopping for another based on the video. [01:34] mvo: plus, the T43p's all come with 7200RPM sata hd, 1GB ram , 1.86GHz proc, 128MB video ram, seems like a decent nice machine, and with a 9cell 5hr batt, it weight 2.62Kg only. [01:35] sivang: sounds pretty nice. I wonder how much the duo core helps in real life (for the t60) [01:35] mvo: I'll let you know when I get one. :) [01:35] infinity: do you recall that my batt was drained quikly then in regular models? it appears it wasn't new. The dealer really tried to rip me off, thanks god I mananged to get a full refund. [01:35] infinity: what model do you plan to get :) ? === mvo considers a x60, looks so *sweet* [01:35] infinity: so with a brand new batt should have no impact on uptime [01:35] sivang: I'm shocked. [01:36] infinity: yes, things like that happen..was shocked myself. [01:36] mvo: x60 is also with duo core ? [01:36] http://vilpublic.fujitsu-siemens.com/vil/pc/vil/datenblaetter/mobile/en/ds_lifebook_s7020.pdf ;) [01:36] yes [01:36] mvo: Basically the same as what I have now (1400x1050 display, 2GHz CPU, 2GB RAM), but with a dual core CPU and a 7200RPM disk (cause I'm sick of slow disk) [01:36] mvo: (that is like two procs in one?) [01:36] ..or S7110, if you need 2 CPUs [01:36] KaiL: you have one of them? the specs looks nice [01:37] infinity: is this the big 15" machine that you wanted to switch HDs with ? [01:37] mvo, a friend has a 15" version (E7010) [01:37] sivang: Yeah, I think I'll downgrade from 15in to 14in when I go T60... [01:37] sivang: The 15in is nice (and very wonderful for movie watching), but a tad bulky for my tastes. [01:37] infinity: but you just said you will be stuck with vesa :-) [01:38] KaiL: what is the overal quality of it? especially the keyboard? [01:38] infinity: yes, after seeing lots of people with 15" I decided I Wanted something powerful and mobile. [01:38] sivang: Sure, and I'll be forced to help implement proper support for my laptop. :) [01:38] infinity: ah, I see :-) the unbeaten path [01:38] mvo, very good, but FSC seams to have some "monday production problem" sometimes === sivang goes searches for X60 [01:38] infinity: the t60 with 14" was the alternative that I'm considering. a bit bigger/heavier than the x60 though [01:38] mvo: Nothing beats IBM keyboards. Period. If that's your purchasing criteria (it's certainly one of mine), you're owned by IBM for life. [01:38] so out of 10 laptops, 9 work very good and the 10th is full of bugs [01:39] infinity: I thought so. every keyboard I tried so far lost against my x30 [01:39] ...this is totally random, not related to any series [01:39] heh [01:39] interessting [01:39] mvo: Tosihba comes a distant second, but IBM still wins hands-down for most hardcore hackers. [01:40] both x60/t60 is not really availble here yet :/ === aquarius [n=aquarius@82-47-92-64.cable.ubr04.dudl.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:40] mvo: And you'll be happy to know that (according to many people online, I haven't yet been able to test one myself :/), the X60 and T60 still have lovely keyboards. [01:40] his book only has an issue with the mouse (something, several FSCs seams to have): you need to "awaken" the touchpad to get detected as synaptics [01:40] mvo: (Though the jerks have added a Windows key, so the Ctrl key is a bit smaller) [01:40] mvo: But the feel is still the same. [01:40] infinity: *groumpf* [01:40] mvo: I think here as well, but I'll have to check. I suddenly feel suicidal wanting to hack X code to help support more cards :-) [01:40] KaiL: hm, no track-point? [01:41] Seveas, wx 2.6.3 released [01:41] that one is also hit by this bug :/ [01:41] sivang: that sounds like famous last words ;) [01:41] hehe [01:41] if you awaken the touchpad while booting, everything is ok [01:41] mvo: really, it sounds like a religious experience :-) [01:41] else you only have a standard PS/2 touchpad [01:41] strange: on a 99% identical Lifebook C, this doesn't happen [01:42] infinity: is this whole not-support-ati stuff a PCIe issue? or is the chipset so different? [01:42] s/chipset/graphicchip/ [01:43] X850 PCIe works, so... [01:43] 'k === LeeJunFan [n=junfan@adsl-69-210-207-5.dsl.klmzmi.ameritech.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:43] looks like ATi stopped to care about Linux :/ [01:44] as creative did - or is there a solution for X-Fi arround? [01:45] nope, T/X 60's haven't arrive here yet. [01:46] some are available here, but hardly with the specs I want (i.g. x60s with smalest battery is available, but not with a decent one) [01:47] the cheap versions are always easy to get ;) [01:47] heh :) yeah! [01:47] to be exact, biggest CPU, everything else cheapest [01:47] mvo: why not sticking to T43p ? :) [01:47] mvo: I wonder who really needs dual core processing on a laptop :) [01:48] sivang: I'm facinated by the idea to have a dual-core processor in my notebook. it's so *cute* [01:48] lol [01:48] mvo: not to metnion what that does to your batt life :) [01:48] sivang: don't be rational on such a issue! [01:48] hehehe! === sivang hugs mvo [01:48] you're so right, [01:48] btw. having an SMP live CD would be cool ;) [01:48] sivang: think about it, to processors to drain your battery ... [01:48] but since this things are SO expansive in .IL [01:48] I can only dream about it probably :-) [01:48] KaiL: yes, this gets more and more important [01:49] mvo: well, the only thought if having an SMP kernel on my laptop working as expected , is rather arosing [01:49] ;-) [01:49] KaiL: the kernel automatically switches to SMP if detected [01:49] Kamion, the one on the live CD? [01:50] oh, it might only be the -686 and -k7 ones [01:50] Kamion: that was the change from benc a while ago (some weeks)? [01:50] yes - and the live CD is 386 [01:50] there's no special "live CD kernel", but the live CD does use the -386 kernel [01:50] mvo: yeah [01:50] and the -386 is still needed for AMD K6 and for systems which dislike SMP kernels [01:51] the problem with using e.g. -686 on the live CD is that, AIUI, you de-optimise for AMD [01:51] huh? I always thought, the optimisations for Athlon and P4 are very similar at the end? [01:51] KaiL: not particularly the latter, since it *is* a UP kernel - it just knows how to rewrite itself dynamically to become an SMP kernel if it needs to [01:51] KaiL: earlier AMDs anyway === aquarius [n=aquarius@82-47-92-64.cable.ubr04.dudl.blueyonder.co.uk] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Ex-Chat"] [01:52] the -686 requires an i686, or? [01:52] Kamion: technically, it rewrites itself to remove some of the pessmiastions that SMP locking introduces on a UP machine [01:52] Kamion: and more than just de-optimizing for AMD, you drop support for < 686 :P [01:52] elmo: right [01:52] elmo: right, but I'm not actually bothered about the live CD on real Pentiums; I *am* bothered about it on Via C3 [01:53] elmo, which is more or less the same - the only really still alive 586 is AMD K6-2 and K6 III [01:53] *shrug* until binary-i386 becomes something other than i386, I think it'd be a mistake to change the kernel on the live CD [01:53] mvo: PCIe isn't an issue, my T43 is a PCIe X300. It's just that the newer chips are completely different, and the free driver needs to play catchup. Why ATI doesn't support them in fglrx (when they obviously do in their Windows drivers) is a mystery. [01:54] elmo: does it do that in memory or by removing parts of its image on disk before and relaods? [01:54] sivang: in memory [01:54] whooha [01:54] infinity, who builds the graphics chips for the xbox360? [01:55] elmo: I'm not advocating that - I think -386 is the right choice [01:55] KaiL: ATI, I believe. [01:56] there isn't enough space for a second (686) kernel on the live CD, or? [01:56] KaiL: nope [01:56] KaiL: and furthermore it'd need a different initrd too (different modules) [01:57] and the interaction with the live installer would be hairy in the extreme [01:57] and this SMP hack on the -386 is not possible? [01:57] KaiL: no idea === sivang wonders about programs that rewrite themselves, using all but kernel functions. [01:57] not to mention, that we would "win" dual-pentiums with that too [01:58] I really don't care about dual Pentiums [01:58] I doubt hardware like that will perform usefully with the live CD anyway [01:58] I guess, not even with an installed xubuntu ;) [01:59] KaiL: -386 is kept UP-only intentionally, since some old sketchy ISA-only drivers will completely refuse to compile/work with an SMP kernel. [01:59] hmm [01:59] what op is the Via C3 missing to be a real 686? [02:00] Amaranth: cmov AIUI [02:00] Amaranth: None, but it's missing "cmov" to behave like everyone else's 686. [02:00] ah, that's right [02:00] (cmov isn't part of the 686 base spec, it just happens to be there on everything but the C3) [02:00] next idea: create some "-586-smp", which gets the default kernel and create some "-386" real crappy hardware? [02:00] +for [02:01] there is a spec? i thought back then it was just "do what intel does" [02:01] aren't 586 optimisations hideously bad on 686? [02:01] KaiL: We don't want more kernel images. Really. We don't. [02:01] and yeah. what infinity said - not happening, sorry [02:01] I don't know, if we need to use the "compatible with >10 years old trash"-kernel as default.. [02:01] Kamion: Some can be pretty bad, yes. 486 on 686 is saner. [02:01] KaiL: you can get practically new 486 hardware, depending on what you're doing - mdz runs some [02:01] Kamion, at least that kernel would work everywhere and support SMP [02:02] Kamion, but you don't want to run ubuntu on that ;) === infinity bought new AMD 486s not that long ago. [02:02] KaiL: why not? perfectly good on a server [02:03] yeah, a 486 with good network cards would make a good router [02:03] The AMD 5x86 (which is a 486 with a really stupid name) keep getting die shrinks and keeps getting manufactured. It's a really, really low power i386 solution for embedded and "tiny server" use that works well. [02:03] anyway, if you're going to call things names, at least get it right [02:03] the Pentium II was released in 1997 [02:04] so I guess, the only possible solution is to wipe out all arguments against SMP kernels... [02:04] infinity, the X5 is still build? cool! [02:04] how big is the latest version? 5x5mm? ; [02:04] ) [02:05] Pretty tiny. [02:06] KaiL: the kernels are now dual SMP and UP and patch themselves on bootup [02:06] sladen: Yes, except for the -386 kernel. We've been over this. :) [02:07] sladen, the kernels, you can install manually, yes... [02:07] that'd be like 0.2in [02:07] but as you might remember, it's not the kernel installed as default ;) [02:07] and not the one on the live-CD === lakin [n=lakin@dsl-hill-66-18-228-60-cgy.nucleus.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:09] quite frankly I think there are worse performance issues on the live CD === sladen thanks units: 129mm^2 [02:09] like, er, the way you're running everything off a CD === infinity stops fapping his gums on IRC and goes to hack while he waits for rsync. [02:09] s/fapping/flapping/ [02:11] Kamion: yeah, i don't think a different kernel is going to help much on the live cd :) === ealden [n=ealden@203.76.211.214] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:18] infinity, fapping is a decidedly different activity...;D === Kinnison returns with a large pot of jasmine tea and declares most things to be 'right with the world' [02:26] mvo: tea? [02:26] lovely ATi, don't even have a support-forum for Linux [02:26] Kinnison: yes please [02:27] but really, thet don#t have the time for X1k, they need to fix such important thinks like crashes with >=22 mode lines in the config file ;) === whiprush [n=jorge@64.62.190.212] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:29] Kinnison: hehe [02:29] Kinnison: "right with the world" ? :-) [02:30] sivang: english expression meaning "all okay" [02:36] Kinnison: I know, it just sounds funny :) [02:38] :-) [02:39] sivang: sup on some jasmine tea and you'll understand [02:41] Kinnison: :-) === sivang only has mineral water here. [02:45] tsk [02:45] next time we're going to meet, remind me to bring you jasmine tea [02:47] Kinnison: I will! :-) let's hope it will happen sooner then later [02:47] :-) [02:51] Kinnison: oh , and that artificially colored lipton "fruit" tea [02:51] eww [02:51] nasty === mvo runs away from sivang === seth [n=seth@ubuntu/member/seth] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sivang tries to catch mvo with a lassso === marcin [n=user@194.114.146.58] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:59] Could someone on dapper do me a favor and do a quick apt-get update && apt-cache show xwine ? [02:59] I need to know if that package is still in the repos [03:00] It appears to be [03:00] drat [03:01] ok I'm filing a bug against the package saying "package still exists" ;) [03:01] YokoZar: please don't do that [03:01] YokoZar: if you want something removed, ask me, and give a reason [03:02] Kamion: It's been on morguecandidates for like 4 months now ;) [03:02] Here let me link you [03:02] yeah, 'cos anyone actually *looks* there [03:02] no, don't link me [03:02] I'm in a really inconvenient environment right now === Aegir [n=richard@129.96.148.153] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:02] ln -o a.out crts.o kamion.o crt1.o [03:02] hint: ftpmasters don't actually look at MorgueCandidates, you need to make actual removal requests [03:03] ok === jcole [n=jcole@palrel1.hp.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:03] But those tend to get ignored too :-) [03:03] I was told the way to do that WAS to put it in morgue ;) [03:03] dudes [03:03] bddebian: I promise that they won't if you ask me [03:03] YokoZar: I'm afraid you were told wrong, sorry [03:03] or at least out-of-date [03:04] i just got the task to slim down dapper for a small net install [03:04] Anyway, thanks, and I'll ask you now: packages xwine and wine-doc are super-ancient and incompatible with current wine packages [03:04] MorgueCandidates seems useful as a way to collect information before making a removal request [03:04] Kamion: No worries, I was just being a smart-alec, sorry [03:04] bddebian: (I'm also not aware of ever having got a removal request from you) [03:05] there very existence is also confusing some users (I've seen a few forum posts by newbies asking about xwine) === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:05]