[12:35] <nictuku> hi!  could you guys please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2228 ? Thank you
[01:39] <truz24> As far as development effort is concerned, where is there the most need for help?
[01:45] <robertj> why did quake3 not make it from revu into dapper?
[01:51] <Kyral> hey guys, isn't the REVU server donated by Canonical or something?
[01:52] <ajmitch> Kyral: yes
[01:52] <Kyral> SEJeff: wants to know :P
[01:52] <Kyral> why he asked in #ubuntu+1 instead of here is beyond me :P
[01:52] <truz24> any known problems with compiling the vmware kernel module with 2.6.15-19-386 ?
[01:52] <ajmitch> robertj: I don't know, the last message said 'uploading'
[01:53] <SEJeff> Kyral: I'd rather not bother ppl in here
[01:53] <robertj> ajmitch: I bastardized those packages to Tremulous up :)
[01:53] <bmonty_> can anyone suggest a package that has a good example of a gnome applet written in python?
[01:53] <ajmitch> robertj: explain?
[01:53] <ajmitch> bmonty_: deskbar-applet, iirc
[01:53] <robertj> ajmitch: Tremulous is a stand-alone FPS with 99% CC Share-alike content
[01:53] <ajmitch> robertj: ok
[01:53] <robertj> I've emailed the author of the other 1% begging him to relicence
[01:53] <bddebian> Heya gents
[01:54] <ajmitch> hello bddebian
[01:54] <robertj> ajmitch: quake3 src is gpl + some other DFSG bits
[01:54] <bmonty_> hey bddebian
[01:54] <robertj> quake3 content is totally non-free
[01:54] <robertj> Tremulous began like as a quake3 mod but is now standalone with all new content and a different executable
[01:54] <robertj> and it's quite a game
[01:55] <ajmitch> soon to be fully distributable then?
[01:55] <robertj> dunno about that. The problem is the textures can't be replaced without causing players not to be able to play on "pure" servers who check media assets before connection
[01:55] <robertj> but if he will relicence then we _still_ have to wait for CC 3.0 share-alike to come out of draft stage in ~ 3 months
[01:56] <ajmitch> right
[01:56] <robertj> raelly we could just stick it in multiverse and promote it to universe in dapper+1
[01:56] <robertj> np
[01:56] <robertj> thanks
[01:57] <bddebian> So what to do about patching a package with no patch system in place?
[01:57] <Kyral> yo LJ
[01:57] <LaserJock> hi Kyral
[01:57] <bddebian> Heya LaserJock, Kyral
[01:57] <bmonty_> bddebian: just patch it?
[01:57] <bddebian> bmonty_: That was kind of my thought
[01:58] <LaserJock> Hola bddebian and bmonty_
[01:58] <bmonty_> hey LaserJock
[02:05] <crimsun> bddebian: apply the patches directly.
[02:28] <lifeless> ajmitch: upload pyflakes to debian !
[02:28] <lifeless> (bug 330896)
[02:38] <bddebian> crimsun: OK, thnks
[02:39] <crimsun> bddebian: np
[02:42] <TheMuso> bddebian: Thanks for sponsoring that upload. :)
[02:44] <bddebian> NP
[04:06] <robertj> anyone else want to take a gander at why quake3 never made it to dapper?
[04:06] <robertj> last update in revu was positive in january...
[04:24] <LaserJock> hmm, is it bad for a package to dep on a transitional package?
[04:26] <ajmitch> lifeless: I got the mail about it :)
[04:26] <lifeless> ajmitch: so did I :{
[04:26] <ajmitch> why?
[04:26] <lifeless> dunno
[04:26] <lifeless> bts decided I was cool or something
[04:26] <ajmitch> maybe
[04:26] <lifeless> so coming to the meeting tomorrow night ?
[04:33] <lifeless> ajmitch: actually, its tonight
[04:34] <lifeless> in 6 hours
[04:34] <LaserJock> bddebian already has a fan club. There's even a wiki page ;-)
[04:34] <bddebian> Bah, bullocks
[04:34] <lifeless> bddebian: thank you :)
[04:35] <nictuku> s/also/too/
[04:44] <ajmitch> lifeless: I'll try & be there then if I can
[04:44] <bddebian> Work??
[04:49] <LaserJock> dholbach: hi!
[04:49] <dholbach> hello LaserJock
[04:49] <dholbach> good morning
[04:49] <bddebian> Heya dholbach.  You're alive? :-)
[04:49] <LaserJock> Guten Morgen
[04:49] <lifeless> ajmitch: thanks!
[04:50] <dholbach> good morning guys
[04:50] <lifeless> morning!
[04:50] <Se7h> hi all
[04:50] <dholbach> just said in another channel "when I swore to myself to start working earlier, I didn't know life was going to make fun of me and I couldn't sleep at 3:30 any more" :-)
[04:50] <bddebian> Heh
[04:51] <bddebian> Hello Se7h
[04:51] <Se7h> aloha bddebian
[05:05] <nictuku> anyone available to do some reviewing?
[05:05] <nictuku> it's a dependency for nwu
[05:06] <LaserJock> anybody want to write the Packaging Guide for me?
[05:06] <bddebian> s/doesn't/couldn't/
[05:06] <LaserJock> like I can?
[05:07] <nictuku> I'd like to improve my packaging skills and become a MOTU
[05:08] <lifeless> LaserJock: ?
[05:08] <LaserJock> lifeless: ?
[05:08] <lifeless> what Packaging Guide do you need written ?
[05:08] <LaserJock> lifeless: do you have Dapper gnome in front of you?
[05:09] <lifeless> yes
[05:09] <LaserJock> System->Help->System Documentation
[05:10] <lifeless> nictuku: excellent
[05:10] <lifeless> LaserJock: nice.
[05:11] <freeflying> any motus would give me a review on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2237
[05:13] <LaserJock> lifeless: I'm hoping to finish it in the next couple days and send an email to -motu and -devel asking for review before the doc freeze
[05:14] <lifeless> have you incorporated matt palmers packaging hints ?
[05:15] <LaserJock> some, I think. Do you have a URL? I can't remember
[05:16] <lifeless> http://people.debian.org/~mpalmer/debian-mentors_FAQ.html
[05:16] <LaserJock> I did try to grab some info from http://ftp-master.debian.org/REJECT-FAQ.html ;-)
[05:17] <lifeless> its not square on 'how to package', but there are useful tidbits there
[05:18] <bddebian> nictuku: Checking
[05:18] <lifeless> revu would be more useful with an interdebdiff
[05:18] <nictuku> bddebian, its "pycacic"
[05:19] <bddebian> nictuku: pycacic?
[05:19] <LaserJock> lifeless: yeah, I'll have to glance through it and see if there is anything I don't have. At first glance it looks like I probably have most of it
[05:19] <nictuku> bddebian, provides "python*-sysinfo", to which nwu-agent depends
[05:19] <LaserJock> lifeless: but he does have a good description of native and non-native packages
[05:19] <LaserJock> lifeless: which seems to be an issue for people
[05:22] <bddebian> nictuku: Advocated
[05:23] <nictuku> :-)
[05:25] <LaserJock> nictuku: is this a totally new package (not in Ubuntu before)?
[05:26] <nictuku> LaserJock, yes. It's not supposed to go into dapper
[05:26] <ajmitch> bddebian: that was a very very quick review :)
[05:26] <LaserJock> nictuku: should it go in Dapper?
[05:27] <ajmitch> lifeless: what debdiff do you want on revu?
[05:27] <nictuku> I mean, it would be useless since only nwu-agent depends on it, and nwu-agent is not there yet
[05:27] <lifeless> ajmitch: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2237
[05:27] <LaserJock> nictuku: ok, cool
[05:27] <lifeless> ajmitch: against the last one that hit the archive
[05:27] <nictuku> LaserJock, I don't know how strict FF is in universe
[05:28] <LaserJock> apparently not as strict as I thought
[05:28] <ajmitch> lifeless: doesn't the debdiff option on the page work?
[05:28] <lifeless> ajmitch: what debdiff option ?
[05:29] <nictuku> did I do something wrong? Should I have uploaded it during FF?
[05:29] <nictuku> s/shouldn't/
[05:29] <lifeless> ajmitch: there are debdiffs against some random versions whose version I cannot tell
[05:29] <ajmitch> lifeless: in the comments section, there's a debdiff link by each previous upload
[05:29] <lifeless> The following uploads have been uploaded concerning the same Package:
[05:29] <lifeless> Comments for upload of April 02 06:50 (debdiff)
[05:30] <lifeless> what version is that ?
[05:30] <ajmitch> lifeless: debdiff is between what you're currently viewing & the upload you select
[05:30] <lifeless> ajmitch: so what I <want> is between the version currently in dapper, and the version the guy asked for a review on
[05:30] <ajmitch> that is a debdiff from the current upload to the first upload
[05:30] <ajmitch> revu isn't meant to be used for packages currently in dapper
[05:30] <ajmitch> though it often gets used that way
[05:31] <bddebian> So I've noticed :-)
[05:31] <LaserJock> I like debdiffs attached to bug reports better
[05:32] <lifeless> ajmitch: so its good to know that its not meant for that ... but if its the first time I review something I'll want a diff against HEAD
[05:32] <lifeless> ajmitch: which means dapper, and if its new, it will be a full-diff ;)
[05:33] <ajmitch> if it's a new package on REVU, the first upload shouldn't show a debdiff option iirc
[05:34] <lifeless> even if its in dapper ?
[05:34] <ajmitch> we'd have to hack revu to check that a package is in dapper, grab it, and do the checks
[05:35] <lifeless> sure.
[05:35] <lifeless> when we get revu-in-lp we'll have that sort of functionality
[05:35] <ajmitch> sure, and until then there's a revu2 rework that's underway
[05:36] <ajmitch> it'd be a bit easier if it were integrated with lp
[05:37] <ajmitch> and we'd probably be reviewing branches & using bzr by then anyway :)
[05:38] <ajmitch> how's 0.8 going anyway?
[05:38] <lifeless> quite well
[05:38] <lifeless> do you encourage people to use the autodebtest stuff yet ?
[05:38] <ajmitch> not yet
[05:39] <lifeless> the code made my eyes bleed, other than that it looks like a good start
[05:39] <bddebian> heh
[05:39] <LaserJock> lifeless: what does it do?
[05:40] <LaserJock> bzr rocks, btw ;-)
[05:41] <lifeless> LaserJock: it lets you put tests in the debian dir for a package
[05:43] <LaserJock> did Diziet write it?
[05:43] <lifeless> yes
[05:43] <LaserJock> man, he has his hands all over Debian ;-)
[05:45] <LaserJock> I was hoping he would have time to finish the Ubuntu Developer's Reference for Dapper
[05:46] <nictuku> bddebian, did you really advocate that package?
[05:46] <bddebian> Yep
[05:46] <nictuku> pycacic or nwu?
[05:46] <nictuku> it's not showing in the revu
[05:47] <bddebian> Oh, maybe I hit the wrong one.  This was scim-bridge
[05:47] <nictuku> ah ok
[05:47] <nictuku> :-D
[05:47] <bddebian> That's what you posted
[05:47] <bddebian> 2237
[05:48] <nictuku> no, that was lifeless
[05:48] <nictuku> or freeflying, rather
[05:48] <bddebian> Oh, whoops, sorry
[05:49] <nictuku> np
[05:49] <bddebian> tsk, tsk, out of date standards .. ;-P
[05:50] <nictuku> yeah, I don't agree with the newer ones :-P
[05:50] <LaserJock> jeeze, don't these young whipper-snappers run lintian ;-)
[05:51] <nictuku> I did, on debian sarge :-(
[05:52] <LaserJock> odd, sarge isn't outdated at all ;-)
[05:52] <bddebian> nictuku: Does it really need python2.3-dev?
[05:53] <bddebian> LaserJock:
[05:53] <bddebian> Err :-)
[05:56] <nictuku> bddebian, hmm probably not, but many python libraries have the same build-depends, I guess that's for a reason?
[05:56] <LaserJock> hmm, a soon as rewrite the data collection program at work I can move sarge to Dapper on the computer at work:-)
[05:57] <bddebian> Oh God, don't mention Data Collection :-(
[05:57] <LaserJock> bddebian: Right now I have to have a 2.4 kernel :(
[05:57] <bddebian> I'll trade you, ours in Windows :-)
[05:57] <lifeless> 2.3-dev is only needed if you are building the package on debian
[05:57] <LaserJock> but then my boss sort of offered to by LabView
[05:57] <lifeless> cause debian still hasn't migrated
[05:59] <nictuku> lifeless, well that package is for debian too.
[06:00] <nictuku> Isn't it the RightThing to ensure that it compiles on Debian too?
[06:00] <nictuku> I mean, build.
[06:01] <LaserJock> no
[06:01] <LaserJock> not necessarily
[06:01] <LaserJock> Ubuntu's defualt Python version is 2.4
[06:01] <nictuku> hmm shouldn't we send improvements back to Debian?
[06:02] <LaserJock> it's not so much that. They don't want 2.4 as default yet
[06:02] <LaserJock> so their default is 2.3 and ours is 2.4
[06:03] <lifeless> nictuku: sure, and we do
[06:03] <lifeless> nictuku: but its easier on some packages than others
[06:03] <nictuku> I thought it was wrong to contribute a new package for ubuntu and don't worry about debian portability.
[06:03] <nictuku> compatibility, I mean.
[06:04] <LaserJock> nictuku: you can worry about it all you want ;-)
[06:04] <crimsun> it's not wrong, just not necessarily the most efficient
[06:05] <nictuku> crimsun, you mean it's not efficient to keep debian compatibility or the opposite?
[06:06] <LaserJock> nictuku: you can use python-dev as a dep
[06:06] <crimsun> nictuku: I mean it's more efficient to maintain Debian as the primary development point, since versions can simply be synced into Ubuntu.
[06:07] <nictuku> LaserJock, oh that's true
[06:07] <nictuku> well as long as I'm able to build both 2.3 and 2.4 versions using the default python-dev, right?
[06:08] <nictuku> in this package, the same source package creates python-, python2.3 and python2.4, as suggested in the python policy
[06:09] <crimsun> it's really simple. Build-depend on both python2.3-dev and python2.4-dev, and your Ubuntu delta will be the one-line change in debian/control for python-yourpackage that Depends on python2.4-yourpackage
[06:10] <bddebian> Whatever happened with all the apt-get.org crap?
[06:10] <nictuku> crimsun, then I guess it's fine already: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/pycacic-0604022255/pycacic-0.3/debian/control
[06:11] <LaserJock> bddebian: what crap, that is high quality packaging there
[06:12] <bddebian> The packaging wasn't the issue.  It was licensing problems wasn't it?
[06:12] <LaserJock> nictuku: why would python-sysinfo depend on python?
[06:12] <LaserJock> bddebian: really? I never heard about that
[06:14] <crimsun> afaik, it was licensing.
[06:14] <nictuku> LaserJock, seems useless, but then again a common practice in python packages I've seen (eg. python-sqlobject)
[06:15] <nictuku> I'm not saying they are right.
[06:15] <LaserJock> hmm, seems like it will cause more delta (since it should be python2.3 in Debian)
[06:17] <nictuku> it actually depends on python (>= 2.4), python (<< 2.5)
[06:17] <nictuku> or better, python (>= 2.4), python (<< 2.5), python2.4-sysinfo
[06:17] <nictuku> the delta would be changing that to the current default (2.3 in debian)
[06:18] <LaserJock> yeah, and I dont' see why you would need that. the only real dep is python2.4-sysinfo
[06:18] <nictuku> I agree.
[06:19] <nictuku> I'll fix that, but i'm just wondering why those other packages do that... maybe for a reason?
[06:19] <LaserJock> I've got to clean up the python app I maintain in Debian too. I'm still not quite sure to do with it
[06:19] <LaserJock> if there is somebody will file a bug report for sure ;-)
[06:19] <nictuku> hehe
[06:20] <LaserJock> My problem is that my app can use either 2.3 or 2.4 but it places some modules in site-packages so I have to give it a version :/
[06:20] <Se7h> btw LaserJock, a package here wont go into the menu, any ideas?
[06:21] <LaserJock> Se7h: did you run desktop-file-validate on the .desktop file?
[06:21] <Se7h> LaserJock use the latest availble on the system
[06:21] <bddebian> Ack..
[06:21] <bddebian> Err validate
[06:21] <nictuku> LaserJock, for nwu I send the files to site-python..
[06:22] <LaserJock> nictuku: are they compiled by a postinst script?
[06:22] <Se7h> bddebian same here
[06:22] <Se7h> its the first time this happen
[06:23] <Se7h> LaserJock isn't menu / .desktop file enough?
[06:24] <LaserJock> no
[06:24] <nictuku> LaserJock, I use a minimal cdbs debian/rules, then move them using .install
[06:24] <nictuku> seems to work: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2236
[06:24] <LaserJock> nictuku: hmm, you might check the installed deb
[06:24] <nictuku> (please don't mind reviewing 2236)
[06:25] <nictuku> LaserJock, check if they have compiled files, you mean?
[06:25] <LaserJock> nictuku: yeah, I found with my packages that posints scripts were added in /var/lib/dpkg/info
[06:25] <LaserJock> nictuku: that compiled the .py files
[06:26] <LaserJock> dh_python does it
[06:26] <nictuku> I don't get what the problem is
[06:27] <LaserJock> if it does that then it will compile with the default Python version, which means they shouldn't go in site-python
[06:27] <LaserJock> because the files are version specific, or at least that is my worry/understanding
[06:28] <nictuku> I don't see any problem there, as long as you don't get a deb package you build in ubuntu and take it to sarge.
[06:28] <nictuku> and vice-versa.
[06:28] <LaserJock> well, what if you run the app with different versions of python
[06:29] <LaserJock> if you run the app with 2.4 but it was byte compiled with 2.3 that might be a problem, no?
[06:29] <nictuku> my files are in site-python but only .py, not .pyc
[06:29] <LaserJock> but you don't know that
[06:29] <LaserJock> they are compiled after isntall
[06:29] <nictuku> well dpkg -c tells me that
[06:30] <LaserJock> it won't show in dpkg -c
[06:30] <nictuku> really?
[06:30] <nictuku> oh
[06:30] <nictuku> postinst
[06:30] <LaserJock> yeah
[06:30] <nictuku> ding
[06:30] <LaserJock> I just installed the .deb in looked int /var/lib/dpkg/info/
[06:30] <LaserJock> and found it there
[06:31] <nictuku> that's why the python policy say that a "all versions" package is not supported.
[06:31] <LaserJock> perhaps, although you could not use dh_python and get rid of the postinst I suppose
[06:31] <LaserJock> but I'm not sure if I want to do that
[06:32] <nictuku> you could just prevent dh_python fromdoing that
[06:32] <nictuku> but I'm not sure either
[06:33] <LaserJock> actually dh_python -n looks good
[06:34] <LaserJock> although I assume that the idea is that you sacrifice speed when you do that
[06:34] <ajmitch> hi Hobbsee
[06:35] <LaserJock> hi Hobbsee
[06:35] <Hobbsee> hey ajmitch and LaserJock!
[06:35] <Hobbsee> the maths test didnt  kill me!
[06:35] <ajmitch> great!
[06:35] <LaserJock> yeah!
[06:35] <Hobbsee> you've gotta start wondering when you cant understand question 1, part a....
[06:35] <LaserJock> I never really enjoyed math, especially 2nd semester Calc :(
[06:36] <Hobbsee> eek
[06:36] <crimsun> it's all blarg until you hit number theory, then at least it's fascinatingly dizzy and worth falling asleep over
[06:36] <ajmitch> hehe
[06:36] <Hobbsee> so i'll have lots of fun in the future, hey?
[06:36] <LaserJock> I enjoyed 1 semester adn 3rd sememster but 2nd just kicked my butt
[06:36] <ajmitch> loads
[06:37] <ajmitch> hey robitaille
[06:37] <LaserJock> and now I come to find that 2nd semester had everything I need for my career :/
[06:37] <ajmitch> yeah..
[06:37] <Hobbsee> number theory...wonder which bit that is....
[06:37] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: oh good, so i can try to skip all possible  maths units, and otherwise ingore them?
[06:38] <LaserJock> umm, no :-)
[06:38] <Hobbsee> :( whyever not?
[06:38] <Hobbsee> i wonder which bit number theory is...
[06:38] <LaserJock> because you don't know what you will be doing years from now
[06:38] <Hobbsee> true
[06:38] <LaserJock> and calculus is very universal
[06:39] <Hobbsee> ajmitch
[06:39] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: yay!
[06:39] <Hobbsee> as long as you dont go with bigpond, or equivalent
[06:39] <Hobbsee> after seeing their performance yesterday...
[06:39] <ajmitch> heh
[06:40] <ajmitch> actually I was just told that it's already been changed
[06:40] <ajmitch> & that I just need to reconnect the DSL
[06:40] <Hobbsee> ah ok
[06:41] <bddebian> Well time for this old fart to go to bed.  Gnight gents
[06:41] <LaserJock> cya bddebian
[06:41] <bddebian> And ladies
[06:41] <Hobbsee> night bddebian
[06:41] <LaserJock> yeah, don't be sexist
[06:41] <LaserJock> ;-)
[06:41] <bddebian> Heh
[06:41] <Hobbsee> actually, i lie - i dont usually wear skirts
[06:42] <ajmitch__> ok
[06:42] <LaserJock> I don't either :p
[06:42] <ajmitch__>  modem_run[9740] : ADSL line is up (4288 kbit/s down | 608 kbit/s up)
[06:42] <ajmitch__> much better
[06:42] <ajmitch__> LaserJock: that's good to hear ;)
[06:43] <Hobbsee> ajmitch__: so why do you have a tail?
[06:43] <ajmitch__> Hobbsee: because I just reconnected?
[06:43] <robitaille> hi ajmitch__
[06:43] <Hobbsee> :)
[06:44] <ajmitch> that's ok :)
[06:45] <ajmitch> very disappointing :)
[06:46] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:46] <Hobbsee> poor ajmitch_
[06:46] <ajmitch> I know
[06:46] <LaserJock> I don't feel bad for him, he got faster internet out of the deal
[06:47] <ajmitch> :P
[06:47] <ajmitch> now I can upload packages 4x faster
[06:47] <LaserJock> nice
[06:47] <Hobbsee> yay!
[06:47] <ajmitch> it's got a 20GB cap though
[06:47] <Hobbsee> debdiff's are way better :D
[06:48] <LaserJock> my DSL is fairly slow but considering I was on dialup before I'm pretty happy
[06:48] <ajmitch> start of last year I was on 128/128kbps
[06:48] <Se7h> LaserJock lol
[06:48] <ajmitch> so 3.5/512 is a good improvement from that
[06:48] <LaserJock> but my uni line is sweat
[06:49] <ajmitch> TheMuso: it's strange that I can actually get faster DSL in NZ than that - though we don't have adsl2+ here yet
[06:49] <ajmitch> another Hobbsee_
[06:49] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Yeah. And if I'm right, if Telstra do release ADSL 2, it won't be fastr than what is available on cable.
[06:49] <LaserJock> hmm, did Hobbsee get a faster line too?
[06:49] <Hobbsee_> hehe yeah
[06:50] <TheMuso> SO will have to go with an ISP with own DSLAM.
[06:50] <ajmitch> TheMuso: impossible here :)
[06:50] <ajmitch> we have no unbundling
[06:50] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: no, i moved my laptop, and the wired pulled itself out.  but the wireless actually felt like connecting, which is good.
[06:50] <TheMuso> ajmitch: That must suck.
[06:50] <ajmitch> just a bit
[06:51] <TheMuso> How long after binaries are built shoul they hit the archive?
[06:51] <ajmitch> within 30-60min
[06:51] <Se7h> where u from btw?
[06:51] <ajmitch> who?
[06:52] <Se7h> all of ya
[06:52] <TheMuso> Se7h: Sydney, Australia.
[06:52] <ajmitch> NZ
[06:52] <ajmitch> too many people from sydney here :)
[06:52] <Se7h> TheMuso a just made a call to there a few minutes ago
[06:52] <TheMuso> heh
[06:53] <Se7h> really ?
[06:53] <Se7h> all from aus ?
[06:53] <Se7h> jeje
[06:53] <trappist> I can't make a bug a duplicate because the bug itself has duplicates - how do I find *those* bugs to make them duplicates of what seems to be the best bug report?
[06:54] <Se7h> two of the countries i might go live to
[06:54] <ajmitch> Se7h: I said I'm from NZ, not australia
[06:54] <ajmitch> never ever confuse the two ;)
[06:54] <Se7h> ajmitch  i read it ;)
[06:54] <Hobbsee> sydney here, too
[06:54] <trappist> anyone?
[06:54] <robitaille> trappist:  you have to change all these other duplicates to be duplicate of the bug you want to keep open
[06:54] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: your bigpond connection go haywire last night as well?
[06:54] <LaserJock> what I though NZ was a state of AU
[06:54] <trappist> robitaille: I know, my question is how to identify those bugs
[06:54] <TheMuso> ajmitch: re binaries and being built, bdebian uploaded a debdiff for a package I fixed a few days ago, and while all arches have reported a successful build, I haven't seen the packages in the archive yet.
[06:54] <Se7h> LaserJock lmao
[06:54] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: it is, we send all of our criminals there.
[06:54] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: I am with Westnet on ADSL.
[06:55] <ajmitch> TheMuso: what package?
[06:55] <Hobbsee> TheMuso: oh ok, i thought you mentioned telstra earlier
[06:55] <Se7h> u'r were talking bout dsl connections
[06:55] <Se7h> i have 4Mb and think it sucks
[06:55] <TheMuso> ajmitch: silc-toolkit
[06:55] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: Yeah, because I still rely on them for ADSL itself.
[06:56] <Hobbsee> *nods*
[06:56] <trappist> robitaille: any idea?
[06:56] <TheMuso> IMO WestNet are 100% rock solid.
[06:56] <robitaille> trappist:  the duplicates should be in the ledft-hand side column of that report.
[06:56] <LaserJock> Se7h: I have no idea what I get but I think it is ~1 Mb
[06:56] <robitaille> which bug number you are looking at?
[06:57] <trappist> robitaille: gotcha, thanks. this is bug 32915
[06:57] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 32915 in kde-guidance "Display applet does not start" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32915
[06:57] <ajmitch> TheMuso: strange
[06:57] <Se7h> LaserJock didn't i read 512Kb ?
[06:57] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Agreed.
[06:58] <TheMuso> ajmitch: But, the sources are in the archive.
[06:58] <LaserJock> Se7h: eh?
[06:58] <Se7h> LaserJock forget it...i'm just pissed cus i dont have higher than 10Mb
[06:58] <Se7h> :p
[06:59] <TheMuso> Se7h: Many of us in Australia don't either, at least most on ADSL don't.
[06:59] <TheMuso> I could get cable here, but DSL is better value for money.
[06:59] <robitaille> trappist:  so if you go to 37275, you can see all the duplicate on the left.
[06:59] <LaserJock> Se7h: well, at my uni I have a nice connection. Sometimes I can download an .iso in 1.5 min.
[07:00] <Se7h> LaserJock thats 1Gb
[07:00] <Se7h> very nice :9
[07:00] <robitaille> trappist:  so 32915 has already been dealt with by beeing marked as duplicate of 37275
[07:00] <Se7h> :>
[07:00] <Se7h> well mates, its 6am here, i'm off to bed, cya all
[07:00] <Hobbsee> is that with a download accelerator, or not?
[07:01] <Hobbsee> or a torrent?
[07:01] <LaserJock> cya Se7h
[07:01] <TheMuso> lol
[07:01] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: no just an .iso
[07:01] <trappist> robitaille: yeah, I just did that
[07:02] <LaserJock> if I find a good uni close by University of Southern California has a fast mirror I think
[07:03] <LaserJock> Kyral has got the best hookup, his uni mirrors Ubuntu so he doesn't have to go outside the local network
[07:04] <Hobbsee> hehe nice
[07:04] <Hobbsee> if the flight cds get on bigpond, i can just grab them from the ISP, rather than having to search for another mirror somewhere
[07:05] <Hobbsee> that ends up being pretty fast - with an accelerator
[07:09] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: do you use adept at all?
[07:09] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: very occasionally
[07:09] <tritium> Hello, all
[07:09] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: could you check something for me real quick?
[07:09] <LaserJock> hi tritium
[07:10] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: what is it?
[07:10] <ajmitch> hey tritium
[07:10] <tritium> Hi LaserJock, ajmitch
[07:10] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: if you search for acl2 I would like to know if the description line is complete
[07:10] <LaserJock> Hobbsee: or if it is truncated and ends with a P
[07:11] <Hobbsee> it shows up to main ...
[07:12] <LaserJock> in synaptic it has "... main binaP"
[07:12] <ajmitch> acl2 - A Computational Logic for Applicative Common Lisp: main binary
[07:12] <ajmitch> from the commandline
[07:12] <robitaille> LaserJock:  I have seen the same in another package recently... there is a bug report; for the life of me I can't remember which one right now.
[07:13] <LaserJock> robitaille: yeah, they guy said he filed like 3 dozen bug reports about it
[07:14] <robitaille> https://launchpad.net/people/tjaustinbardo/+reportedbugs
[07:14] <robitaille> yep...quite a few reported bugs about that problem
[07:15] <tritium> holy Thilo Six, batman
[07:15] <LaserJock> robitaille: I told him to report just 1 bug against synaptic but I think we could Reject the other ones
[07:15] <robitaille> and it seems he has looked only at the "a"s
[07:16] <robitaille> the bug report I saw was 2-3 weeks ago, so it must from someone else
[07:16] <ajmitch> oh goody, he filed yet another f-spot bug
[07:17] <LaserJock> robitaille: so I think I stopped him before he got to the 'b's ;-)
[07:18] <trappist> I wonder if that's how I should file my complaints about the menu locations of certain apps, or their lack of menu entries in kde
[07:18] <trappist> it would be a few dozen bugs at least, if I filed per-package
[07:19] <LaserJock> trappist: if they lack .desktop files you can file bugs about that, I've got about 40 of those to upload still :/
[07:19] <trappist> LaserJock: then I guess you've got that process down - could you add Eterm to your list if you haven't already?
[07:20] <trappist> that's my personal #1 concern
[07:21] <trappist> that and two other eterm gripes that aren't getting a lot of attention
[07:21] <trappist> I've fixed one of em, but they don't let me upload :)  and nobody's looking at the patch.
[07:22] <ajmitch> probably because the bug isn't assigned to be reviewed & it's floating around with the ~10K other bugs?
[07:23] <trappist> I didn't figure I was supposed to assign bugs.  what should I do with a bug like that?
[07:24] <robitaille> ajmitch:  only 9371 bugs tonight....there was some serious bug triage over the weekend by some senior Ubuntu developers :)
[07:24] <ajmitch> bugs with patches should be assigned to motureviewers
[07:24] <ajmitch> (universe bugs, that is)
[07:24] <ajmitch> robitaille: great, I noticed that there were no more bugs assigned to debzilla :)
[07:24] <trappist> cool, eterm is universe
[07:25] <ajmitch> it makes them a little easier to search for
[07:25] <LaserJock_away> 'night folks
[07:25] <ajmitch> night
[07:26] <trappist> done
[07:27] <ajmitch> wb Hobbsee
[07:27] <trappist> ajmitch: what if it wasn't a universe package?
[07:27] <Hobbsee> oops...
[07:27] <Hobbsee> ctrl + esc isnt the same as ctrl + alt + backspace!
[07:27] <trappist> ajmitch: or if it didn't have a patch
[07:27] <ajmitch> trappist: then you don't assign it
[07:27] <ajmitch> Hobbsee: you did a silly thing?
[07:28] <trappist> ajmitch: is there an appropriate way to get a bug some visibility if it doesn't happen to be a universe package with an attached patch?
[07:28] <Hobbsee> i wanted xkill!  not restart x, hehe!
[07:28] <TheMuso> Hobbsee: lol
[07:28] <ajmitch> trappist: there's not really an appropriate way without nagging & annoying developers, usually :)
[07:29] <trappist> bleh.  I assume this is why so many bugs languish for so long on malone
[07:29] <Hobbsee> yeah, they slip thru as unassigned
[07:29] <ajmitch> trappist: and if everyone clamours for their favourite bug,the situation will be the same except much much noisier
[07:30] <trappist> ajmitch: good point.
[07:30] <Hobbsee> what, like checkinstall?  :P
[07:30] <trappist> well, thanks ajmitch.  off to bed with me.
[07:47] <ajmitch> wb Hobbsee :)
[07:47] <Hobbsee> ty
[07:47] <ajmitch> keep on hitting the wrong keys?
[07:49] <ajmitch> dholbach: I've got a UVF exception to make, but it's going to be a rather large diff.. how likely are you to approve it? :)
[07:49] <ajmitch> (upstream requested the exception)
[07:53] <Hobbsee> ajmitch
[07:54] <Hobbsee> ajmitch: nah, that was just my net connection going awol.
[07:56] <ajmitch> ah, the usual
[07:56] <ajmitch> fairly impressive upgrade, isn't it?
[07:57] <TheMuso> Oh yeah.
[09:05] <dous> if someone files a bug that is related to a package that isn't in ubuntu, is it perfectly okay for me to mark it wontfix?
[09:07] <lifeless> dous: where did they file it ?
[09:08] <dous> lifeless: malone
[09:09] <lifeless> what source package did they file it on ?
[09:09] <dous> lifeless: see 4195 it was filed on eclipse, but the details say that it conflicts with azureus
[09:10] <lifeless> hmm, how did they figure that out/
[09:10] <lifeless> ?
[09:11] <robitaille> and it was using a deb file from Debian...as per the wiki instructions
[09:12] <dous> yes. so it's okay if I mark it wontfix?
[09:12] <dous> since the software involved is unsupported
[09:13] <robitaille> personally I would reject it on the basis the package didn't come from the ubuntu repos.  We don't support everything written in the wiki :)
[09:14] <dous> okay then.. thanks :)
[09:53] <zakame> hi all
[10:04] <Toadstool> hi all
[10:05] <zakame> heya Toadstool
[10:26] <viviersf> sigh
[10:26] <viviersf> i hate broken packages
[10:26] <viviersf> :(
[10:28] <zakame> awww
[10:57] <lifeless> come one come all
[10:57] <ajmitch> everyone join the lifeless cheer squad
[10:59] <ajmitch> hopefully the CC members show
[10:59] <ajmitch> hi Seveas
[10:59] <TheMuso> ajmitch: Whats the big occasion?
[10:59] <nictuku> TheMuso, CC meeting
[11:00] <Seveas> hi
[11:00] <TheMuso> Oh ok.
[11:00] <ajmitch> TheMuso: just another CC meeting
[11:04] <ajmitch> lifeless: maybe in another 2 weeks? :)
[11:05] <lifeless> ajmitch: meh. This one was at a good time ;)
[11:05] <lifeless> do they often just awol ?
[11:05] <ajmitch> not usually
[11:13] <zakame> question: what would be the new version of resolvconf if I touch it to fix malone 33362
[11:13] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 33362 in resolvconf "Runtime directory does not exist during /etc/rcS1.d/08loopback setup" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33362
[11:13] <lifeless> win 25
[11:33] <allee> exists a policy for dapper to not ship python2.3 modules for dapper, only phython2.4? (python-numarray, doko dropped 2.3 in -2)
[11:33] <lifeless> yes, we dont have python2.3 in dapper IIRC
[11:33] <ajmitch> we do, but in universe
[11:34] <ajmitch> since some packages (zope 2.8 being the prime culprit) still need it
[11:34] <lifeless> oh right
[11:34] <lifeless> I forgot about the black beast from hell
[11:34] <ajmitch> zope & plone are still popular :)
[11:36] <allee> ajmitch: if 2.3 will only be in universe what happens with py modules in main?
[11:36] <ajmitch> there are no python 2.3 modules in main any more
[11:37] <ajmitch> in main
[11:37] <ajmitch> allee: what do you need python 2.3 for?
[11:38] <allee> a science software astrowise (analyzing data from a teleskop soon mounted in chile)
[11:38] <StevenK> ... but does that mean python2.3-numarray still exists in universe?
[11:38] <ajmitch> StevenK: nope
[11:39] <ajmitch> StevenK: the only way to get it into universe is to upload a new source package (evil, I know)
[11:39] <ajmitch> but that's what I have to upload to get zope working again :)
[11:39] <allee> ajmitch.  So that a problem.  When a 2.3 module in universe depends on a module in main. BANG  (see https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/matplotlib/+bug/37625/)
[11:39] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 37625 in matplotlib python2.3-matplotlib "python2.3-matplotlib has unavailable dependencies" [Major,Confirmed] 
[11:39] <ajmitch> that's fallout from the recent changes
[11:39] <StevenK> ajmitch: Same thing as main/non-free in Debian.
[11:40] <ajmitch> I'll have to talk to doko & see what we can do to fix those
[11:40] <ajmitch> allee: can your software work with python2.4 instead?
[11:41] <allee> ajmitch: From INSTALL: 1) Install python 2.3.5 (currently < 2.4)
[11:41] <ajmitch> wonderful
[11:41] <allee> yeah.
[11:42] <allee> But to be fair it's a huge package (lot's of c binding too).  I don't know what has changed in 2.3 -> 2.4.  Maybe upgrade would be not trival.
[12:12] <ajmitch> lifeless: congrats
[12:13] <ajmitch> easiest one I've seen for awhile :)
[12:13] <lifeless> possibly I should not have been nervous.. heh.
[12:14] <ajmitch> and I think your packaging skills should hold up well for the TB meeting, being a DD
[12:15] <lifeless> oh right, theres more :0
[12:15] <ajmitch> yeah
[12:15] <ajmitch> where they grill you on whether you'll break the archive
[12:15] <lifeless> heh.
[12:16] <ajmitch> looks like bug 2397 can be closed :)
[12:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 2397 in pornview "Pornview segfaults at startup" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2397
[12:17] <lifeless> done
[12:17] <lifeless> bug 2397
[12:17] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 2397 in pornview "Pornview segfaults at startup" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2397
[12:17] <ajmitch> great
[12:19] <lifeless> ajmitch: so wheres the doco on the next step ?
[12:20] <lifeless> found it
[12:20] <lifeless> MaintainerCandidates
[12:21] <lifeless> so, just add to the team, ... done
[12:23] <ajmitch> yeah
[12:23] <ajmitch> turn up at TB meeting
[12:23] <ajmitch> plead your case
[12:27] <lifeless> ajmitch: haha: YYYY-mm-dd at HHMMUTC
[12:27] <lifeless> ajmitch: next meeting date
[12:28] <ajmitch> nice
[12:30] <lifeless> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoardAgenda
[01:08] <jacob-wardell> hi
[01:09] <jacob-wardell> hello...
[01:09] <jacob-wardell> ?
[01:09] <nomed> hi all
[01:09] <jacob-wardell> morning
[01:09] <jacob-wardell> how are you?
[01:22] <doko> how are obsolete files handled on the REVU web site?
[01:23] <ajmitch> we remove them if needed - the revu page shows current & archived packages
[01:23] <ajmitch> if an old version is there, it generally gets archived
[01:26] <doko> ajmitch: please could you remove the pydev / eclipse-pydev packages?
[01:29] <ajmitch> remove altogether, or just archive?
[02:32] <zakame> hi all
[02:34] <kelmo> hi siretart , you about?
[02:35] <zakame> heya spacey kelmo Hobbsee
[02:35] <Hobbsee> hey zakame
[02:36] <spacey> hi zakame
[02:36] <kelmo> hi zakame
[02:50] <siretart> kelmo: I'm currently at work, and can't give much attention to irc
[02:51] <siretart> kelmo: I just read your email about the init script, I intended to answer the bugreports from earlier today this evening
[02:51] <kelmo> ok, that is there just as a reminder
[02:51] <siretart> kelmo: my opinion about this is to install the init script in the examples/ dir with an explanation why
[02:51] <kelmo> i await your response ; )
[02:51] <siretart> I'll give you a short version
[02:52] <siretart> I don't think that we should install an init script
[02:52] <siretart> even disabled, because we cannot really provide a good roaming solution which integrates into the rest of the system
[02:53] <siretart> the current package is suitable for OTHER daemons to provide a decent roaming solution
[02:53] <kelmo> enough said, that is fine with me
[02:53] <kelmo> exactly my earlier point
[02:53] <kelmo> i always hated that daemon
[02:54] <siretart> I think the solution joachim proposed (wifiroamd) is the way to go
[02:54] <siretart> kelmo: for the guy who rised that one bug to severity grave
[02:55] <siretart> kelmo: how do you think shipping the init script in the examples dir, provide some documentation, and close the bug
[02:55] <kelmo> 100% comfortable with that
[02:55] <siretart> :)
[02:56] <kelmo> ok, well, we may as well use that script you rewrote
[02:56] <kelmo> that i fixed up a little bit
[02:56] <siretart> sure
[02:56] <kelmo> and make a not in *modes
[02:56] <zakame> Toadstool: ping
[02:56] <Toadstool> zakame: pong
[02:56] <Toadstool> :)
[02:56] <kelmo> that it lives in /examples for those that need it
[02:57] <kelmo> s/not/note
[02:57] <siretart> if you have time and want to include it in our trunk/, just go for it, I won't get to it at least in the next 6 hours. perhaps only tomorrow
[02:57] <kelmo> i have a little bit of time, at the cost of sleep
[02:57] <zakame> Toadstool: rock on for ebtables :)
[02:57] <kelmo> that is cheap i think ; )
[02:58] <kelmo> siretart: have a good day then
[02:58] <siretart> I consider sleep precious *g*
[02:58] <Toadstool> zakame: well that was an easy fix :)
[02:58] <siretart> kelmo: thanks :)
[02:58] <zakame> yeah, too bad it was only until now that it got committed
[02:59] <Toadstool> it would have been in the archive a few days ago if I hadn't forgotten to change unstable to dapper in debian/changelog :/
[03:00] <zakame> hehe, yeah I got that snag too
[03:00] <zakame> anyhow, is yann around?
[03:04] <Toadstool> hum I have to generate a file containing a base64 encoded key in a postinst script and I don't want my package to depend on openssl and use "openssl rand -base64 32", what do you think about something like "dd if=/dev/random bs=32 count=1 | uuencode -m file"?
[03:23] <janimo> crimsun: ping
[03:33] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: ping
[03:33] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, pong
[03:33] <janimo> Hi Gauvain
[03:33] <Gloubiboulga> hi :)
[03:33] <janimo> did you read the gnumeric mail
[03:33] <janimo> on their list?
[03:33] <Gloubiboulga> yep, but it's not really clear to me
[03:33] <janimo> a bit conrradictory answers but in the end I think
[03:34] <janimo> yeah my thoughts as well
[03:34] <janimo> and he followed up in a personal mail which was again unclear
[03:34] <janimo> :(
[03:34] <Gloubiboulga> maybe we could try to meet the devs on irc
[03:35] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: yes, good idea
[03:35] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, I have time now...
[03:35] <janimo> ok, np I try
[03:35] <janimo> ah you _do_
[03:35] <janimo> :)
[03:35] <Gloubiboulga> yep, i *do*
[03:35] <janimo> I am logging in now to gnome.ner
[03:35] <janimo> net
[03:36] <janimo> hmm can I specify the server in a /join command?
[03:36] <Gloubiboulga> it's /server
[03:37] <janimo> ok let's see if it does not log me out from here
[03:38] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, the server is not gimpnet?
[03:38] <janimo> hmm yes, I think so
[03:38] <janimo> althoug I saw ref to gnome.net too
[03:38] <janimo> or org
[03:38] <Gloubiboulga> irc.gimp.org
[03:39] <Gloubiboulga> it works here :)
[03:39] <janimo> gnome.org here :)
[03:44] <kelmo> siretart: i have tested and committed an alternative init script, that will be installed to the examples dir
[03:44] <kelmo> siretart: i just ask that you add documentation/comments where neccessary please
[03:44] <kelmo> siretart: or point out defficiencies to me if too busy
[03:46] <siretart> kelmo: thank you very much. will do that this evening
[03:47] <kelmo> gn8 then
[03:56] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: uh, progress :)
[03:56] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, yep :)
[03:56] <janimo> they know how to scare people :)
[03:56] <Gloubiboulga> :D
[03:56] <janimo> it seems I am very bad at asking clear questions :)
[03:57] <Gloubiboulga> it was clear to me :)
[03:58] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, the guy you pinged is Ray?
[03:58] <janimo> yes
[03:58] <Gloubiboulga> ok
[03:58] <janimo> since those are his initials I think
[03:58] <janimo> JHM Dassen
[03:58] <janimo> am writing a mail now
[04:00] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, could you tell me why several files in /usr/bin in the xffm package are removed?
[04:00] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: haven;t looked at xffm at all
[04:01] <janimo> it is as it comes from debian (4.2.x)
[04:01] <bddebian> Heya gang
[04:01] <Gloubiboulga> hm
[04:01] <janimo> you mean current (broken) dapper package right?
[04:01] <Gloubiboulga> hi bddebian
[04:01] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, yes
[04:01] <bddebian> Hello Gloubiboulga
[04:01] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, I have a working deb here, but not clean yet
[04:01] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: that was always just synced, and epoch bumped but other than that I haver not looked at it
[04:01] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: how is xffm 4.3? have not tried to from svn either
[04:02] <ercin> hii
[04:02] <Gloubiboulga> there's a stable release available and it works fine with our current Xfce
[04:02] <bddebian> Hello ercin
[04:02] <ercin> is there a service like alioth for ubuntu?
[04:04] <janimo> ercin: not really as most ubuntu packages are minor mods of debian ones
[04:05] <janimo> but some groups (X, kernel) use their own repos for the ubuntu specific work
[04:05] <Gloubiboulga> bddebian, thanks for the upload of my hibernate patch :)
[04:05] <bddebian> Gloubiboulga: NP, thanks for the patch :)
[04:06] <Gloubiboulga> it wasn't a hard one
[04:07] <ercin> janimo, we need a mirror for xgl/compiz/mesa packages
[04:07] <janimo> ercin: mirror?
[04:07] <janimo> for developing on those packages you mean?
[04:08] <ercin> janimo, actually quinnstorm need a mirror for her apt repository
[04:08] <ercin> and she is makin some contributions to the code
[04:09] <ercin> some kind of development
[04:09] <janimo> ercin: afaik, most people keep their contribs on their external webspaces
[04:09] <bddebian> Put it on a wiki page?
[04:09] <janimo> but the revu people used to give web space for those not having any
[04:10] <ercin> revu?
[04:10] <ercin> ayaa she have some space but its reallly slowwwww
[04:11] <janimo> ercin: REVU if you wish :)
[04:11] <janimo> http://revu.tauware.de/
[04:11] <ercin> janimo, ok thx
[04:12] <janimo> or ask around if nay motu has good bandwidth and sets up space for other motus
[04:12] <janimo> s/nay/any/
[04:17] <zakame> was there an UVF exception filed for sysstat?
[04:26] <Gloubiboulga> Could anyone have a look at the texmaker package on REVU?
[04:26] <Gloubiboulga> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2059
[04:26] <Gloubiboulga> it's a new upstream release, and UVF has been accepted for it
[04:26] <Gloubiboulga> a long time ago...
[04:28] <bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Riddell says he uploaded in December.  Is this a new version?
[04:29] <Riddell> Gloubiboulga: does it still compile?  there was an issue with texmaker that it didn't compile with qt 4.1
[04:30] <Gloubiboulga> bddebian, Riddell, it's a new version
[04:30] <Gloubiboulga> it builds with qt 4.1
[04:30] <bddebian> Ah
[04:30] <bddebian> Riddell: You wanna do it?
[04:30] <Riddell> nope, busy
[04:30] <Gloubiboulga> It's the main change since the previous version
[04:31] <bddebian>  1.3-0?  Isn't that the same?
[04:32] <Gloubiboulga> we have 1.2.1 in dapper
[04:32] <bddebian> Yeah, I just noticed that, sorry :-)
[04:32] <Gloubiboulga> np :)
[04:37] <jdthood> Newbie alert.  Hi.  I'm quite familiar with Debian.  I'd like to become better acquainted with Ubuntu.  I thought that I might be able to do that by doing MOTU work for a package in maintain in Debian.  Can someone direct me to instructions on what I should do next?
[04:42] <Gloubiboulga> jdthood, we use REVU (http://revu.tauware.de) to manage new packages in universe
[04:42] <Gloubiboulga> you can have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
[04:42] <Gloubiboulga> jdthood, your package is not in ubuntu yet?
[04:43] <jdthood> It's already in ubuntu.
[04:43] <jdthood> However, it needs some adaptation.
[04:43] <jdthood> Thanks for the URLs
[04:43] <Gloubiboulga> np
[04:43] <Gloubiboulga> what is your package?
[04:43] <jdthood> resolvconf
[04:44] <zakame> jdthood: whoa, I just touched that today
[04:44] <sladen> -:)
[04:44] <zakame> that's why the nick sounded familiar
[04:45] <jdthood> Maybe you fixed the error message at boot, then.  :)
[04:47] <zakame> yes, that was fixed today, malone 33362
[04:47] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 33362 in resolvconf "Runtime directory does not exist during /etc/rcS1.d/08loopback setup" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33362
[04:48] <jdthood> Cool.  Except that means I have to find some other learning exercise.
[04:49] <bddebian> Ah, 33362 is fixed?
[04:50] <zakame> yup, thanks to sebastian kapfer
[04:50] <bddebian> Sweet
[04:51] <bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Building texmaker now
[04:51] <zakame> still waiting for the actuall install into the archive though
[04:51] <Gloubiboulga> bddebian, ok
[04:52] <jdthood> Bizarre.  There is a discussion going on right now on ubuntu-devel about handling of /etc/resolv.conf.  No mention of resolvconf.  Is there some common knowledge about "resolvconf in ubuntu" that I'm lacking?
[04:52] <sladen> never heard of it
[04:53] <zakame> hmm, even so, I'm not aware of that... I'vebeen using resolvconf now even since sarge, and I haven't found any problems with it (even 33362 doesn'r bite much)
[04:53] <jdthood> E.g., was any decision ever made about whether to integrate network-manager with it?
[04:54] <jdthood> SFAIK it works properly with all network configurers and DNS caches in Debian, but network-manager development has been happening in ubuntu and I don't know where the relevant conversations are going on.
[04:55] <jdthood> I believe that NM doesn't cooperate with resolvconf, but don't really know.
[04:59] <jdthood> Ah, found it.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NetworkMagic
[04:59] <jdthood> "As the resolver will controlled entirely by dhcp3 or static configuration, no need for the resolvconf tool is forseen."
[05:03] <jdthood> That's good news.  A standard DHCP client will be used, and the standard DHCP clients already work properly with resolvconf if it's installed.
[05:09] <bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Uploaded, thanks
[05:09] <Gloubiboulga> bddebian, thanks :)
[05:36] <bddebian> Is this too much detail in a changelog for such a small change to a package?
[05:36] <bddebian> graveman (0.3.12-4-2.1ubuntu2) dapper; urgency=low
[05:36] <bddebian>   * Change Icon=graveman in desktop/graveman.desktop.in
[05:36] <bddebian>   * Copy graveman48.png graveman.png
[05:36] <bddebian>   * Update desktop/Makefile.* to reflect filename change
[05:36] <bddebian>   * Closes Malone: #1849
[05:36] <bddebian>  -- Barry deFreese <bddebian@comcast.net>  Mon,  3 Apr 2006 11:32:31 -0400
[05:38] <zakame> most probably
[05:38] <zakame> but of course, 'tis your call :)
[05:43] <zakame> gn8 all
[05:43] <Gloubiboulga> night zakame
[05:44] <zakame> thanks Gloubiboulga
[05:56] <trappist> is there some utility to write a line like "-- Barry deFreese <bddebian@comcast.net>  Mon,  3 Apr 2006 11:32:31 -0400" in the changelog?  I've been doing it by hand every time, and it kinda sucks
[05:56] <bddebian> trappist: dch -i
[05:56] <trappist> oh cool
[05:57] <bddebian> The -i will automatically increment the version number though, so make sure you check it :-)
[05:57] <trappist> I usually do that too.  I generally only submit debdiffs of pretty small changes, though, and I dunno what SOP is for that
[05:58] <trappist> bddebian: btw I replied to your reply on the list re: changelogs
[06:07] <trappist> if a bug is reported against breezy and it's fixed in dapper, should it be closed?
[06:13] <bddebian> trappist: I think so yes
[06:13] <pef> trappist: and add -D dapper to be sure to have the correct distro set ;)
[06:14] <trappist> pef: thanks, I'll have a look at the man page - never heard of this tool until now
[06:22] <LaserJock> trappist: WRT changelogs, I usually do is this
[06:22] <LaserJock> if I don't have to change anything, I just sign and upload
[06:22] <LaserJock> if I have to change something I do my own changelog entry and add what the person contributed
[06:23] <ogra> it really depends on the change though ...
[06:24] <trappist> is this stuff documented anywhere?  when to do what to the changelog?
[06:24] <LaserJock> no
[06:24] <trappist> LaserJock: aren't you the packaging guide guy? ;)
[06:24] <ogra> i often have one liner pending locally until a upload is justified by more changes for example ...
[06:25] <trappist> ogra: out of curiosity, do you mention that in bug reports?  I often see bugs with fixes attached and no further comments
[06:26] <ogra> trappist, i usually mention the bugnumber in the changelog then ...
[06:27] <trappist> ogra: and the patch contributor's name, right? ;)
[06:27] <ogra> not if it was changed before already and the bug was in progress or fix pending ...
[06:27] <bddebian> trappist: Did the submitter not have a changelog entry?
[06:28] <trappist> bddebian: I'm not referring to a specific case
[06:28] <ogra> its just a cornercase, but happens sometimes with xscreensaver for example, where i collect changes because 90% of them are very small ones
[06:28] <bddebian> Ah, OK
[06:29] <trappist> imho even very small changes should be properly attributed
[06:29] <bddebian> Hmm, maybe I shouldn't have copied graveman48.png to graveman.png?  Now I get unrepresentable changes to source errors on build.. :-(
[06:29] <siretart> has the update-manager tool for upgrading from breezy to dapper already been uploaded to breezy-updates, or shall testers still use http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/backports/update-manager/?
[06:29] <siretart> hey bddebian1
[06:29] <bddebian> Heya siretart
[06:30] <trappist> I am so frickin happy with the new cupsys I'm going to cry
[06:31] <bddebian> Damn I hate not having an Ubuntu box here at work.. :-(
[06:31] <LaserJock> trappist: this is how I usually do attribution https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/dapper-changes/2006-February/006344.html
[06:31] <trappist> I love working in an ubuntu shop :)
[06:32] <trappist> LaserJock: I think that's awesome.  I wish they were all like that.
[06:32] <LaserJock> trappist: honestly, I think most are. We slip sometimes but I think for the most part we try to give credit where credit is due
[06:33] <trappist> LaserJock: yeah in my experience most are.  I got my diaper in a bit of a wad when a patch I was really proud of that took a lot of work had no attribution, and I'm suddenly sensitive to it.
[06:33] <bddebian> trappist: You are Rocco?
[06:34] <trappist> yeah
[06:34] <bddebian> Ahh
[06:34] <trappist> and you're Barry
[06:34] <bddebian> Well python wasn't me ;-P
[06:34] <trappist> I assume
[06:34] <trappist> yeah I know :)
[06:34] <bddebian> Yeah, I'm Barry
[06:34] <LaserJock> the Ubuntu go
[06:34] <LaserJock> d
[06:34] <bddebian> pfft
[06:35] <LaserJock> heah man, you got me started in this whole MOTU thing, I have to say stuff like that ;-)
[06:36] <bddebian> Heh, yeah, sorry for that ;-P
[06:36] <trappist> I'm just starting to get interested in the MOTU thing, now that I realize that so many of my favorite packages are in universe
[06:37] <ogra> bddebian, do it at build time (the copying, not in the source package)
[06:42] <bddebian> ogra: By build time do you mean in the Makefile instead of in debian/rules?
[06:43] <ogra> bddebian, nope i mean a cp in rules
[06:43] <ogra> or mv even
[06:43] <ogra> you can do it as well with a .install file or if you have with .files ...
[06:44] <ogra> there are many ways to achieve it ...
[06:44] <LaserJock> like everything else in packaging ;-)
[06:44] <bddebian> But then the Makefile doesn't match the filename
[06:44] <ogra> but moving the png *in* the orig.tar.gz is surely the worst :)
[06:44] <ogra> copy it in the install target ;)
[06:53] <akulah> how do I upload a package to REVU?
[06:54] <LaserJock> akulah: dput revu <package>_source.changes
[06:54] <akulah> when I do: dupload packagename.changes it uploads it to ubuntu
[06:54] <akulah> server
[06:56] <akulah> hello!
[06:57] <bddebian> akulah: Why are you using dupload instead of dput?
[07:00] <akulah> sory
[07:01] <bddebian> Don't be sorry, both work, I was just asking
[07:24] <redguy> can anyone tell me what sets my eth0 to 169.254.0.0 network even though I have a eth0 inet static section in my /etc/network/interfaces?
[07:28] <ogra> NM ?
[07:49] <orbital_fox> anyone alive in here?
[07:53] <DrMegahertz> sort of
[07:53] <bddebian> orbital_fox: Define alive :-)
[07:55] <bddebian> ogra: :)
[07:57] <LaserJock> Dapper has killed them all :(
[07:57] <LaserJock> six extra  weeks has done the MOTU in ;-)
[07:59] <ogra> evil duck
[08:01] <Schugy> anyone here who can teach me how to use ./configure e.g. properly, sometimes i have some libs in /usr, /usr/local but when I simply change the prefix pkgconfig-pc-files are searched under the new prefix and not in /usr and /usr/local and so on...
[08:12] <orbital_fox> is this channel ment to be just for developers?
[08:17] <trappist> Schugy: try ./configure --help for that
[08:17] <Schugy> no idea
[08:17] <Schugy> trappist: i haven't found it out in 5 years of --help
[08:17] <TomaszD> ok, got a debug log now
[08:17] <TomaszD> ops
[08:17] <TomaszD> sorry
[08:17] <TomaszD> wrong window
[08:18] <Schugy> damn, i would like to specify a include, lib, bin dir for every single package
[08:20] <Schugy> installing ekiga on wartyis a pain ^
[08:21] <ogra> warty is nearly dead, why would someone want to do that ?
[08:22] <Schugy> well, i would like to use a linux installation for 5-7 years just like others did with win2000, xp blabla....
[08:23] <ogra> then use one thats supported for 5 years :)
[08:23] <ogra> warty will be shut down in
[08:23] <ogra> ~4 weeks
[08:23] <Schugy> the only problem is that new software doesn't work with 5 year old glibc, gtk, gcc, alsa....
[08:23] <ogra> and that you dont get any security uptdates etc ...
[08:24] <Schugy> many projects use bleeding edge libraries
[08:24] <ogra> wartys 18 months are done ...
[08:25] <Schugy> still wonder if it's really bad to have a five year old linux just like win xp
[08:25] <ogra> yes
[08:25] <bddebian> yes
[08:26] <ogra> as long as you care about security it is
[08:26] <Schugy> but maybe there have been 5 years of fixing bugs instead of producing new ones while devoloping new features
[08:26] <ogra> thats why we make upgrading from release to release so easy
[08:27] <ogra> warty wont see any bugfixes, security updates etc anymore
[08:27] <ogra> its dead
[08:27] <LaserJock> orbital_fox: sort of, people wanting to help out, etc. It isn't a support channel though
[08:28] <poningru> orbital_fox: also its meant for people who want to package stuff and seeking help in that regard
[08:28] <Schugy> it always takes several weeks to make a new distro work like the old one
[08:29] <ogra> really ? did you try it with ubuntu ?
[08:29] <Schugy> dvb. bluetooth, avm driver, philips webcam driver, xcdroast, webcam_server, mplayer, kde...
[08:30] <trappist> I used to be an xcdroast guy
[08:31] <trappist> for mplayer, if I just keep my ~/.mplayer/config and remember to install w32codecs I'm good
[08:31] <ogra> as long as you make sure ubuntu-desktop is installed, upgrades should be a no brainer ... note that no .deb will ever touch a user config change, sou your config will be preserverd
[08:35] <Schugy> is mythtv in the universe now? well, there were quite many programs missing in warty :-)
[08:36] <ogra> its in universe since hoary, yes
[08:37] <Schugy> cool
[08:37] <Schugy> and vice c=64 emu?
[08:38] <ogra> was that missing in warty ?
[08:38] <ogra> just look at packages.ubuntu.com :)
[08:39] <Schugy> in breezy...
[08:39] <Schugy> not warty...
[08:39] <Schugy> well, i see there was some progress
[08:40] <bddebian> Hello thierry
[08:41] <Schugy> oops, i've forgotten to select "any"
[08:42] <Schugy> but i have 1.19 instead of 1.14
[08:44] <Schugy> but one essential seems to be still missing!
[08:45] <Schugy> i've compiled the SuSE jstools from source for warty
[08:45] <Schugy> i need jstest and jscal. really
[08:45] <Schugy> and i've posted it in the forums ^^
[08:46] <Schugy> jscalibrator is just for a special joystick-lib
[08:47] <Schugy> or is there anything else i don't know?
[08:56] <thierry> hi bddebian
[09:12] <phanatic> hi people
[09:21] <bddebian> Hello phanatic
[09:21] <phanatic> hey bddebian
[09:21] <dholbach> have a nice evening
[09:21] <LaserJock> going already?
[09:22] <LaserJock> have a good evening dholbach :-)
[09:22] <dholbach> bye LaserJock
[09:22] <dholbach> "already"?
[09:22] <LaserJock> only 12:22pm here
[09:22] <dholbach> i've been here since ~4:00 time :)
[09:22] <dholbach> now it's 21:22 my time
[09:22] <LaserJock> arggh
[09:23] <LaserJock> poor dholbach :/
[09:23] <dholbach> yeah couldn't sleep
[09:23] <dholbach> but i'll have no problems tonight
[09:23] <LaserJock> I should mention that on the "Ubuntu devs are never around" thread on the forums
[09:25] <dholbach> maybe :)
[09:25] <bddebian> Hehe
[09:25] <bddebian> Later dholbach
[10:14] <ajmitch> morning
[10:14] <crimsun> 'morning ajmitch
[10:15] <ajmitch> LaserJock: which forum thread was that again? :)
[10:15] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[10:16] <bddebian> And crimsun
[10:16] <ajmitch> hello bddebian
[10:16] <crimsun> 'lo bddebian
[10:16] <LaserJock> ajmitch: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=153380
[10:16] <bddebian> ajmitch: You don't love me anymore :-)
[10:17] <ajmitch> bddebian: not when you complain like that
[10:17] <bddebian> What am I complaining about now?  You asked me to lookat Bugs assigned to MOTUs and I am doing so :-)
[10:18] <ajmitch> 08:16 < bddebian> ajmitch: You don't love me anymore :-)
[10:18] <ajmitch> LaserJock: oh I could go & explain why the forums just aren't attractive for developers to sit round & help out ;)
[10:20] <LaserJock> ajmitch: well, I tried to make it sound friendly. I was a forums only guy once.
[10:20] <ajmitch> yeah
[10:21] <ajmitch> I try & do stuff on the forums every once in a while
[10:21] <ajmitch> but it's like spitting in the wind most days
[10:21] <ajmitch> & I can do more just as a developer
[10:22] <LaserJock> I can certainly understand that
[10:22] <ajmitch> usually it's just nagging them to file bugs
[10:23] <ajmitch> since they often seem unwilling to do that, preferring to just complain in yet another forum thread
[10:23] <ajmitch> it's a certain class of user that's attracted to the forums :)
[10:23] <bddebian> What are you trying to say? :)
[10:24] <ajmitch> bddebian: that I'm bound by the CoC to not go much further
[10:25] <bddebian> Heh
[10:25] <LaserJock> lol
[10:25] <LaserJock> well, I am interested in the people who are really interested
[10:25] <ajmitch> hm, should I join this NZ loco team, or would it be a waste of my time? ;)
[10:26] <bddebian> ajmitch: You should just fix bugs.. :-)
[10:27] <ajmitch> yeah
[10:29] <LaserJock> maybe we should have a #ubuntu-motu LoCo team ;-)
[10:29] <LaserJock> since I swear it is a location
[10:30] <ajmitch> haha
[10:30] <ajmitch> it fits the crazy part of loco
[10:30] <LaserJock> yeah, since they dont' have crack teams ;-)
[10:30] <ajmitch> such a shame, that
[10:32] <LaserJock> cya ajmitch
[10:33] <bddebian> Later ajmitch
[10:39] <Kyral> oy oy oy