[12:06] <Tm_T> aah, nice tytpo
[12:06] <Tm_T> typo
[12:06] <Tm_T> \sh: check it now
[12:06] <Tm_T> "tit" ... =)
[12:07] <\sh> hehe :)
[12:08] <Tm_T> bhuoh
[12:11] <Tm_T> I really should sleep, so good night you all
[12:12] <Tm_T> \sh: and all good to you pal, stay strong ;) ->
[12:12] <\sh> Tm_T: you too :) good night :)
[12:13] <marseillai> does kdevelop allready permit to develop qt4 apps ?
[12:19] <superstoned> marseillai: it won't stop you, but it won't help you at all, either :D
[12:19] <superstoned> guess they would love some help to get cmake and the other qt4/kde4 stuff supported...
[12:20] <marseillai> superstoned: i'm learning with qt tutorial qt 3.3! but i would like learn qt4 too
[12:20] <superstoned> well, i
[12:20] <superstoned> (sorry)
[12:21] <superstoned> i don't know much about it, but i remember vaguely a qt4 tutorial exists somewhere...
[12:21] <superstoned> at least some examples.
[12:21] <\sh> qt4 is not so different from qt3 :) well..some classes are different...and some macros , but that's all..c++ should be learned in any way :)
[12:21] <superstoned> maybe check the kde developer mailinglists' archives?
[12:21] <superstoned> \sh indeed
[12:22] <marseillai> \sh: allready know base c++ .... but with windows and visual c++!
[12:22] <marseillai> programmation under linux is so diffrent
[12:22] <\sh> no it's not, it's a lot easier then mfc :)
[12:22] <marseillai> no! it's different! not more difficult! not easier.
[12:23] <\sh> but c++ is all the same.....sometimes it's scary :
[12:23] <marseillai> \sh: mfc are really horrible but with visual c++ it's really easy
[12:23] <\sh> well, mfc was at the time when I was coding on windows the hell...win32 plain C was a lot easier :)
[12:24] <\sh> that was ... 1992/1993?
[12:24] <marseillai> \sh: you know qt ?
[12:25] <\sh> yes as much as I have to know to code the second irc client before konversation came up :)
[12:25] <marseillai> oki
[12:25] <marseillai> maybe you ca explain me something
[12:25] <\sh> http://sf.net/projects/kmyirc
[12:26] <marseillai> in this example : http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/tutorial1-03.html I don't understand why the quit button is as large as the windows but not as tall as the windows! 
[12:26] <marseillai> i can't explain this
[12:26] <\sh> because it's inside a vertial box layout
[12:27] <\sh> QVBox
[12:27] <\sh> it's resized to 200x and 120y
[12:27] <\sh> so it's not as high as the window 
[12:28] <marseillai> oki
[12:29] <marseillai> i didn't notice the VERTICAL box
[12:29] <marseillai> thanks
[12:31] <\sh> np
[12:39] <Tm_T> apachelogger: son
[12:40] <\sh> lol
[12:40] <apachelogger> omg
[12:40] <apachelogger> mom, you really should go to bed
[12:40] <Tm_T> I should
[12:40] <apachelogger> you have to cook tomorrow
[12:40] <apachelogger> eerrrr
[12:40] <apachelogger> today
[12:40] <apachelogger> gramps is also coming ....
[12:40] <apachelogger> you know what that mean :S
[12:40] <\sh> i'm working again :) what a wonderful feeling
[12:40] <\sh> on ubuntu :)
[12:41] <Tm_T> :)
[12:41] <Tm_T> bah, "make -k"
[12:41] <Tm_T> sleep ->
[04:55] <\sh> anybody up for ideas for kio_apt?
[04:55] <\sh> who wants to fck^H^H^Hfix the code? :)
[10:17] <Riddell> \sh: there's an UVFe in progress for a new version
[10:19] <MrFaber> hi all
[10:19] <Riddell> hi MrFaber 
[10:19] <MrFaber> I heard in dapper channel that gnome has native wpa support with wpasupplicant through gui. Is anything planned for KDE?
[10:19] <MrFaber> hi Riddell 
[10:20] <\sh> Riddell: kio_apt? well, I saw the patch....that's ugly at all...the page is created just like old perl cgi scripts with CGI;
[10:25] <\sh> Riddell: btw..happy easter :)
[10:27] <MrFaber> So no wpa is planned? Should I ask maintainer of kwifimanager? I don't think that the gnome network configuration program can be used with KDE.
[10:29] <\sh> what about knet?
[10:29] <MrFaber> knet?
[10:30] <\sh> knetmanager is it named imho
[10:31] <\sh> give me a minute...I'm searching the pointer
[10:31] <MrFaber> Knet (formerly Kdsl) is a frontend for pppd which allows you to quickly and easily setup your PC with an Internet Account. Development is progressing, and currently Knet offers DSL support for PPPoE connections, and Dialup.
[10:32] <MrFaber> hm, it doesn't seem to have anyhting to do with wlan?
[10:33] <\sh> nono..there is a tool which can manage all connection types even wlan...
[10:33] <\sh> just talked with amu about it yesterday 
[10:34] <\sh> hmm....he should have somewhere a package...
[10:34] <\sh> have to wait for him
[10:35] <MrFaber> \sh: is it the tools in kanotix which show connection status in systray?
[10:36] <\sh> dunno...never saw it....we just talked about it, and it should handle the connections....don't pin me on the wall now :) amu needs to wake up first...then I'll test :)
[10:37] <MrFaber> thx
[10:37] <MrFaber> If it supports wpa it would be great
[10:37] <\sh> Riddell: another thing, this splash screen thingy with amarok 1.4beta3 is upstream..it doesn't work from plain source, too
[10:39] <\sh> and playing media files from samba shares which are not mounted is not working in any way....neither in 1.4x...collection creation of sound files on a mounted sambe share doesn't work eather
[10:39] <\sh> either
[11:06] <Tonio_> hey
[11:06] <Tonio_> \sh: pleased to see you here again ;)
[11:07] <\sh> yeah me too :)
[11:14] <verwilst> grrr, the session config thing has been hidden so it seems
[11:14] <verwilst> it's sucky that everytime i login, an old session restores
[11:17] <verwilst> i had to start kcontrol to disable it
[11:17] <verwilst> would be nice to have it in the kubuntu system settings thingy ;)
[11:57] <cmvo> verwilst: It is in User Account/Session Manager. Took me a long time to find, the first time I looked for it :-)
[12:00] <verwilst> oh :p
[12:26] <Tonio_> jpatrick: ping ?
[12:28] <jpatrick> Tonio_: pang
[12:29] <Tonio_> jpatrick: just read fathi's mail, and although I don't have problems with the usage of kdelibs4-dev, libqt3-mt should be removed
[12:29] <Tonio_> jpatrick: already uploaded ?
[12:30] <jpatrick> Tonio_: yesterday
[12:31] <Tonio_> jpatrick: you should have wait for approval on revu.........
[12:31] <Tonio_> jpatrick: the patches you've done are not valid for example....
[12:31] <Tonio_> jpatrick: can you rename the package 0ubuntu2 and reupload plz ?
[12:31] <jpatrick> Tonio_: you said do this and you get my yes
[12:32] <Tonio_> jpatrick: doesn't mean you did it correctly
[12:32] <jpatrick> Tonio_: when it gets out of NEW,  I will
[12:32] <Tonio_> the modifications needed to be revued too, for example the kdepotpath patch is not correct
[12:32] <Tonio_> jpatrick: thanks :)
[12:33] <jpatrick> right now I _really_  have to do this work
[12:33] <Tonio_> jpatrick: but this phrase "do this and you get my yes" doesn't mean the required modifications don't need to be revued too, everyone can make an error when modifying stuff
[12:33] <jpatrick> ok
[12:34] <Tonio_> jpatrick: ;)
[12:38] <marseillai> hi everybody
[12:42] <Tonio_> marseillaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii va niker ta mreuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu, sur la caneuuuuucaneuuuuuuuuucaneuuuuuuuuucaneuuuubireuuuuuuuuhhhh !!!!!!!!
[12:42] <Tonio_> marseillai: ca va ma couille ? :)
[12:42] <Tonio_> petit bonjour de fouteux, pour tre gentil ;)
[12:43] <marseillai> trankilou! jsuis plein! mais ce soir jvais me vider
[12:43] <marseillai> donc ca va
[12:43] <marseillai> :D
[12:43] <marseillai> c un avantage avec un nick comme le mien
[12:43] <marseillai> sinon jte dis pas les embrouilles ...;
[12:43] <Tonio_> hehe
[01:05] <kmon> can someone confirm this bug?: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kdenetwork/+bug/30756
[01:05] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30756 in kdenetwork kopete "kopete's history extension makes it slow on quit." [Normal,Unconfirmed]  
[01:13] <Tm_T> kmon: I think it's well known
[01:13] <Tm_T> and more "feature" than "bug"
[01:13] <kmon> Tm_T: ok, thanks
[01:13] <Tm_T> also, what's slow? more than 10 seconds?
[01:14] <kmon> yes
[01:14] <Tm_T> wow
[01:14] <Tm_T> well, that's new to me
[01:14] <Tm_T> I know it takes 4 or 5, but over ten...
[01:14] <kmon> Now that I'm using an amd64 machine it has improved, but on my other 386 machine was a pain
[01:15] <Tm_T> ugh
[01:15] <Tm_T> that history plugin is slow
[01:16] <Tm_T> imho it should be replaced with plain text logging or something
[01:18] <kmon> something faster :)
[01:18] <Tm_T> well, plain text is fast
[01:20] <kmon> I think it's not using very optimized XML handling code....
[01:20] <kameron> hey guys/gals.
[01:20] <kameron> Riddell, aye
[01:20] <kmon> but I could be wrong :)
[01:24] <verwilst> yeah same here!
[01:24] <verwilst> closing kopete takes ages
[01:24] <jpatrick> not here
[01:25] <kmon> jpatrick: do you have the loggin plugin enabled?
[01:25] <jpatrick> yep
[01:25] <kmon> then you are lucky
[01:26] <jpatrick> that's me
[01:28] <verwilst> or just have very few friends ;)
[01:28] <verwilst> :d
[01:28] <verwilst> an empty contact list should be a bonus with this problem ;)
[01:31] <Tm_T> kmon: well, not only that, but there's litesql database or something
[01:31] <Tm_T> don't ask why
[01:31] <kmon> yes
[01:32] <kmon> like amarok uses for storing data
[01:34] <Tm_T> kmon: yeah, I understand it in amaroK case, but in Kopete... bah
[02:41] <kmon> anyone here has LVM and a grub splash image?
[02:47] <Tonio_> how many UVFe approvals are required to upload a package ?
[02:47] <Tonio_> I assumed 3 but I'm not sure
[02:47] <jpatrick> Tonio_: three
[02:47] <Tonio_> jpatrick: hum........ I need to ping guys then :)
[02:47] <Tonio_> jpatrick: just posted an annouce on kubuntu-devel ml for the next meeting
[02:47] <jpatrick> kmon: I think there's a guy on #kubuntu-es with a problem with that problem
[02:48] <kmon> jpatrick: I've found the problem :)
[02:48] <jpatrick> Tonio_: cool
[02:48] <kmon> jpatrick: no... I haven't :(
[02:48] <jpatrick> Tonio_: it's midnight for midnight for me (+0200)
[02:49] <Tonio_> jpatrick: +100 I assume no ? aren't you in spain ?
[02:49] <jpatrick> yes
[02:49] <Tonio_> so it is 23 pm
[02:49] <jpatrick> but it's +0200 now
[02:50] <Tonio_> should be midnight for german people though......
[02:50] <Tonio_> jpatrick: hum summer time ? ;)
[02:50] <Tonio_> \sh: ping ?
[02:50] <jpatrick> yes
[02:51] <\sh> Tonio_: pong
[02:51] <Tonio_> \sh: is that 22 utc time too late for german people ?
[02:52] <Tonio_> \sh: I was asked to defer the meeting to help asians people like hobbsee or freeflying to be there
[02:52] <\sh> 22 utc is 24:00 in germany :)
[02:52] <Hobbsee> +1 Tonio_ 
[02:52] <\sh> right now in germany it's +2 :)
[02:53] <Hobbsee> earliest i can do at all (and make it to the meeting), is 2100 UTC
[02:53] <Hobbsee> 22utc is great
[02:53] <Tonio_> \sh: is midnight too late
[02:53] <Tonio_> ?
[02:53] <jpatrick> for you it is
[02:53] <Hobbsee> i think.  while i'm on holidays, anyway.  as long as it's not your wednesday :P
[02:53] <\sh> depends who you ask :)
[02:54] <Hobbsee> heh
[02:54] <Tonio_> \sh: I think about germans actually since they are many and very active ;)
[02:54] <\sh> hehe :)
[02:54] <\sh> need to reboot
[02:54] <jpatrick> new kernel time...
[02:56] <jpatrick> damnit
[03:09] <jpatrick> Ok, beagle fix => rejected
[03:10] <jpatrick> kerry will just have to dep on half of gnome
[03:17] <marseillai> beagled make my system crash! it uses too many memory during indexation.... and when i let my computer alone beagle takes more and more memory and make my computer crash! even ctrl+alt+f1 don't work and i've to reboot! so apt-get remove beagle .
[03:18] <jpatrick> ha
[04:20] <Riddell> jpatrick: you pinged me?
[04:21] <Tm_T> Riddell: howdy
[04:21] <jpatrick> Riddell: new moodin upload
[04:21] <jpatrick> if it's possible
[04:21] <jpatrick> http://www.kubuntu-es.org/jpatrick/newmoodin.debdiff
[04:24] <Tm_T> Riddell: we decided to move "support channel" from !kubuntu.fi @ ircnet to #kubuntu-fi @ freenode
[04:29] <Riddell> jpatrick: where i that from?
[04:29] <Riddell> Tm_T: cool, will update
[04:30] <Tm_T> Riddell: also we had crazy idea about small forum, but that's just idea
[04:30] <Tm_T> Riddell: maybe wiser to keep things in ubuntu-fi forum
[04:31] <Riddell> kubuntu.org updated
[04:31] <Tm_T> whoops
[04:32] <Tm_T> Riddell: "Kanava on nimeltn #kubuntu.fi ja verkkona Freenode." would be better
[04:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: hey ;)
[04:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: can you add an event to the fridge ? I don't have acces for this...
[04:33] <Riddell> neither do I
[04:33] <Riddell> e-mail fridge-devel
[04:33] <Tonio_> Riddell: yup, thanks :)
[04:34] <Riddell> Tm_T: done
[04:34] <Tm_T> Riddell: big thanks :)
[04:35] <Tonio_> Riddell: done
[04:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: oups.......... I missed that, there is already a meeting on 27/04...
[04:37] <Tonio_> Riddell: we should deffer it to 28/04...
[04:38] <Tonio_> Riddell: 27/04 at 2 am means in the night from 26 to 27 or 27 to 28 ?
[04:39] <Tm_T> Tonio_: first one
[04:39] <Tonio_> Tm_T: thanks :) both ways are acceptable in france (stupid but that's it)
[04:39] <Tonio_> Tm_T: no pb then
[04:39] <Riddell> 26 to 27
[04:40] <Tm_T> yeah, actual date mentioned ;)
[04:40] <freeflying> Riddell: have added Kubuntu membership application stuff to the coming CC
[04:41] <jpatrick> how do i apply a diff to a dir?
[04:41] <freeflying> jpatrick: debdiff?
[04:42] <jpatrick> i was looking at patch
[04:45] <Riddell> freeflying: cool, what's the date for that?
[04:45] <Riddell> jpatrick: same way as applying it to a file
[04:45] <Riddell> patch -pX < foo.diff
[04:46] <freeflying> Riddell: 2006-04-18 21:00 UTC
[04:50] <Tm_T> Riddell: ah, one more, #kubuntu-fi not #kubuntu.fi
[04:50] <Tm_T> Riddell: then it's correct
[04:51] <Riddell> done
[04:51] <Tm_T> thanks =)
[04:51] <Tm_T> shame on me
[04:53] <jpatrick> Riddell: http://www.kubuntu-es.org/jpatrick/moodin/
[04:54] <marseillai> Riddell: i don't know what is needed to have mp3 support for musicbrainz in amarok and i don't know if it's hard to do this package but i really think it could be add to plf depot ...
[04:57] <Riddell> marseillai: are you involved with plf?
[05:11] <marseillai> Riddell: nop but the plf master agree with my proposal if the package can't be integrate in MOTU
[05:14] <Riddell> marseillai: well it just needs rebuilt with libmad-dev as a build-dep
[05:14] <Riddell> oh, libtunepimp too probably
[05:14] <Riddell> jpatrick: where did you get that patch?
[05:14] <marseillai> if you do the package Mirno will ask to integrate this one in plf repository
[05:14] <marseillai> and many chance to be accept
[05:15] <jpatrick> Riddell: made it myself
[05:17] <Riddell> jpatrick: the icons don't look fuzzy to me
[05:17] <Riddell> except the second last one
[05:17] <jpatrick> that's the one
[05:20] <Riddell> the icon size should be 48 then, no such icon size as 50
[05:21] <jpatrick> too small like that
[05:22] <jpatrick> which is why I choose 50
[05:23] <Riddell> let me try it
[05:24] <Riddell> takes a while to compile when I have 4 koffice compiles going as well
[05:24] <marseillai> Riddell: you can build this packages ?
[05:24] <jpatrick> ok
[05:27] <Riddell> marseillai: no, I don't have the time
[05:27] <marseillai> oki
[05:27] <Riddell> jpatrick: 48 is good for me, looks exactly the same as 50 and I'm pretty sure it is the same since it'll load the closet icons size it has
[05:28] <jpatrick> ok
[05:29] <Riddell> jpatrick: I'd also try to avoid making packaging changes during features freeze, it can only introduce bugs
[05:29] <Riddell> and moodin is in debian now so we'll just sync with them post dapper
[05:30] <jpatrick> ok
[05:30] <Riddell> anyhoo, uploaded, thanks
[05:30] <jpatrick> thank you, I'll close the bug
[05:34] <kwwii> evening
[05:34] <Riddell> good afternoon kwwii 
[05:34] <kwwii> Riddell: I am going to finish the splash stuff tonight and send it to you
[05:35] <Riddell> groovy
[05:35] <kwwii> Riddell: Mark said he wanted me to put the text "BETA" on the pre-release screens
[05:35] <Riddell> I'm out tonight so can't guarantee I'll take care of it
[05:35] <Riddell> that's a good idea
[05:35] <kwwii> well, as long as it is in the beta on tuesday I am happy
[05:35] <kwwii> :-)
[05:35] <kwwii> I'll finish the Ubuntu splash too
[05:36] <kwwii> so, they both need to be done by tomorrow night at the latest, I guess
[05:36] <kwwii> I would really like someone to test them before me submit them for the beta
[05:36] <kwwii> and the grub screen is not soooo easy to test :-)
[05:37] <kwwii> s/me/we
[05:38] <kwwii> I have made grub screens for 7 years, with the maintainer of the gfxboot package at suse and I have never heard of using a pic that size, so I am a bit worried :-)
[06:09] <kwwii> great now gimp dies all the time
[06:14] <verwilst> oh? will there be a colorful grub finally? :)
[06:15] <kwwii> verwilst: not sure...I will make a pic, anyway :-)
[06:16] <verwilst> ;)
[06:16] <verwilst> would be cool
[06:16] <verwilst> it looks too 80's right now ;)
[06:17] <kwwii> actually it was the size of the isolinux screen (welcome splash thingy) that I was wondering about :-)
[06:17] <kwwii> I was mistaken
[06:17] <verwilst> gentoo does a great job wrt all this
[06:17] <verwilst> framebuffer stuffs and all
[06:17] <kwwii> why screen does 639x320?
[06:18] <verwilst> even with the new splashscreens and init stuffs, it still looks too big :$
[06:18] <kwwii> hehe, gentoo uses the bootsplash beyond grub :-)
[06:18] <verwilst> yeah i know
[06:18] <verwilst> but those 2 are both part of the "boot experience" ;)
[06:18] <kwwii> I am coauthor of the bootsplash ;-)
[06:18] <verwilst> kwwii: so ubuntu will get bootsplash too?
[06:18] <kwwii> hehe
[06:19] <verwilst> i've got no clue why ubuntu started from scratch with that :$
[06:19] <kwwii> believe me, I am staying out of that stuff...I get too emotional about it
[06:19] <kwwii> !
[06:19] <kwwii> well, having a splash completely in user space is a great idea
[06:19] <verwilst> why's that?
[06:19] <kwwii> well, if you do not have enough kernel hackers...
[06:20] <kwwii> but debian bootsplash stuff exists too
[06:20] <kwwii> so, to be honest, I have no idea
[06:20] <kwwii> the bootsplash can do about 100 times more than the usplash
[06:20] <kwwii> but, hey, it is not my decision :-)
[06:20] <kwwii> so I am simply making the pics as best as I can
[06:21] <verwilst> myeah, i've always thought it was stupid hehe
[06:21] <verwilst> reinventing the wheel for the 9234234234 time :p
[06:21] <kwwii> but prescaling a 14 color pic from 640x480 to 640x400 and hoping that it will look as good as it did before is kinda naive
[06:21] <verwilst> ;)
[06:45] <kwwii> so how does one install the header files for kdebase?
[07:06] <\sh> apt-get install kdebase-dev
[07:12] <kwwii> so there is no kdebase-devel
[07:12] <kwwii> can anyone tell me how to install the header files for kdebase?
[07:12] <kwwii> maybe a stupid question, but still
[07:12] <kwwii> :-)
[07:12] <\sh> i told you
[07:12] <\sh> apt-get install kdebase-dev
[07:12] <kwwii> erm, guess I missed it
[07:12] <kwwii> hehe
[07:12] <kwwii> thanks
[07:13] <kwwii> I was rebooting and missed it, thanks again
[07:13] <kwwii> well, the problem is bigger than that, already had 'em installed
[07:13] <kwwii> shit
[07:23] <\sh> what's wrong?
[07:25] <kwwii> kbloggerbutton.cpp:34:29: error: konq_operations.h: No such file or directory
[07:25] <kwwii> kbloggerbutton.cpp:35:28: error: konq_popupmenu.h: No such file or directory
[07:25] <\sh> did you install apt-file?
[07:25] <\sh> apt-get install apt-file (from universe)
[07:25] <\sh> then sudo apt-file update
[07:25] <\sh> and then you can search e.g. apt-file search konq_operations.h
[07:26] <\sh> and it should give you the bin package where this file hides :)
[07:26] <kwwii> cool :-)
[07:26] <kwwii> thanks for the help!
[07:27] <marseillai> \sh: is it you who told me about a new kde-irc-client?
[07:28] <kwwii> yairc
[07:28] <kwwii> ? lol
[07:28] <kwwii> oops, I forgot the K
[07:28] <Tonio_> kwwii: hehe ;)
[07:28] <\sh> you mean because of your question about "if I know qt?"
[07:28] <marseillai> yes
[07:29] <marseillai> \sh: i ask you this because i would like look what is about this client ... takes informations!
[07:29] <marseillai> :)
[07:30] <\sh> marseillai: you can take over the projekt..I think it's from 2000 or so...dunno long ago :) It's only there for learning purposes...bad qt code ;)
[07:31] <marseillai> ah! oki!
[07:32] <\sh> nowadays if i want to code something for kde, I do it with python and pyqt/pykde...it's oop, quite the same syntax, no big pointer jumping and actually the same speed ;)
[08:56] <kwwii> if anyone wants to test the splash stuff, I can give you the latest pics
[08:56] <kwwii> usplash, syslinux, etc.
[08:56] <Lure> kwwii: hi - you have new packages or just images?
[08:57] <kwwii> Lure: just images, I know *nothing* about the usplash
[08:57] <kwwii> Lure: but these are prescaled for 640x400, so we definitely need to test them
[08:57] <kwwii> I sent them to Riddell as well :-)
[08:57] <Lure> kwwii: ok, I can try to re-package the stuff for test...
[08:57] <kwwii> of course
[08:58] <kwwii> should I bounce the mail to you?
[08:58] <Lure> yes please - lure.net AT gmail.com
[08:58] <kwwii> okidoki
[08:59] <kwwii> done
[08:59] <kwwii> the colormap should fit perfectly with the usplash already, so it should be more an issue of image quality
[09:00] <kwwii> of course, if your text messages end up orange, let me know :-))
[09:01] <Lure> ;-)
[09:03] <Tonio_> next meeting 's been added to the fridge
[09:04] <Tonio_> Lure: hey !!! fine ?
[09:04] <Lure> Tonio_: yes, back from two day vacation 
[09:04] <Tonio_> was it nice ? :)
[09:05] <Lure> yes - just too much food ;-)
[09:05] <Tonio_> hehe ;)
[09:05] <Tonio_> Lure: I discussed with keybuck about the vpn modules of network-manager
[09:05] <Tonio_> Lure: I must say I quite don't understand the problem
[09:05] <Tonio_> Lure: he talked about a problem with dns pushing
[09:06] <Tonio_> Lure: but as far as I know this is a limitation of openvpn on linux, not to the vpn modules........
[09:06] <Lure> Tonio_: I think the problem is that n-m by default comes with DNS server
[09:06] <Tonio_> Lure: does it ?
[09:06] <Lure> and ubunto of course do not want to ship DNS server (with open ports) on desktop
[09:06] <Lure> this was cut out of out n-m, but may be required by VPN modules
[09:06] <Tonio_> Lure: no port 53 opened on my machine
[09:07] <Tonio_> do you talk about the vpn modules ?
[09:07] <Tonio_> Lure: the vpn modules work on my machine
[09:07] <Tonio_> without any port 53 opened
[09:07] <Lure> Tonio_: no, core n-m, but part of Ubuntu patch for n-m is cutting out local DNS and replacing it with resolv.conf mgmt
[09:07] <Lure> Tonio_: it may be the issues just with particular version of modules (openvpn, pptp....)
[09:07] <Tonio_> Lure: but that doesn't prevent the vpon modules from working
[09:08] <Tonio_> that's what I don't understant
[09:08] <Lure> or that VPN works with our backend and Keybuk just do not know...
[09:08] <Tonio_> hum......
[09:08] <Tonio_> Lure: he is supposed to now but I didn't get any response to my latest messages
[09:09] <Lure> Tonio_: what if we just package VPN modules and publish on test repo - if we show that they work, we can get them in universe easily
[09:09] <Tonio_> Lure: I can confirm it works with our backend, I used it only one hour ago
[09:09] <Tonio_> Lure: that's my goal
[09:09] <Lure> you have packages already?
[09:09] <Tonio_> I don't want them in main
[09:09] <Tonio_> Lure: on revu, they are in
[09:10] <Lure> we can announce them on forums/wiki and get some wider testing
[09:10] <Tonio_> I was just wondering why he didn't care of it at all, since he removed the vpon removal patches
[09:10] <Lure> there is huge demand
[09:10] <Tonio_> Lure: yep, can be done
[09:11] <Tonio_> I think packages may require a bit on cleaning, I will do it
[09:11] <Lure> Tonio_: I think he has lot's of other things on his mind and he probably want to stabalize n-m a bit first
[09:11] <Tonio_> Lure: admit that removing the vpn removal patches without giving any look to the vpn modules is a bit strange....
[09:11] <Tonio_> that confuses me
[09:11] <Lure> there are lot's of bugs openede, but mostly driver dependant
[09:11] <Tonio_> Lure: maybe yes.....
[09:12] <Tonio_> Lure: well, if we want something in, we have to do it by ourself ;)
[09:12] <Lure> but removing removal patches is at least allowing others (like you ;-)) to work on it... ;-)
[09:12] <Tonio_> that's the way kubuntu works !
[09:12] <Tonio_> let's go
[09:12] <Lure> Tonio_: exaclty - it looks like that I will need to enable my VPN account at company to get it tested ;-)
[09:13] <Tonio_> Lure: is it openvpn ?
[09:13] <Tonio_> unfortunatly I can't test the vpnc module
[09:13] <Tonio_> only openvpn
[09:13] <Lure> Tonio_: I am no expert, but we have used some Cisco client to connect on Windows
[09:14] <Lure> but I know that at least one guy is using it from Linux, therefore I need to check how
[09:14] <Lure> (unless Cisco is completely proprietary)
[09:14] <Tonio_> Lure: simply openvpn is ssl based, while most others are ipsec based
[09:14] <\sh> it's not...but then not in highest safe mode of cisco :)
[09:14] <Tonio_> *the vpnc component is supposed to be compatible with ipsec vpn servers
[09:15] <Lure> hi \sh
[09:15] <Tonio_> Lure: sisco is proprietary code, but compatible with the ipsec standard
[09:15] <Tonio_> \sh: stop me if I'm wrong on that point ;)
[09:15] <Lure> \sh: so highest mode uses some strange encryption scheme?
[09:15] <\sh> the default is ipsec...but the best encryption you get from cisco is with cisco prop. addons
[09:16] <Lure> Tonio_: will try to reactive my account on Tue and will see
[09:16] <Tonio_> Lure: would be nice :)
[09:16] <Tonio_> impossible to get rtouted properly
[09:16] <Tonio_> ssl is by easier to fit with
[09:16] <Tonio_> by far
[09:17] <\sh> but this is not a vpn per definition :)
[09:17] <Tonio_> \sh: yes, but well, now most people use a router at home, it is way easier to implement ssl based stuff
[09:17] <\sh> I wonder if those implementation are supporting mpls
[09:18] <Tonio_> unless you may get dozens of routing problems, and be forced to used specific brands compatible with those proprietary stuff
[09:18] <\sh> to be honest, a private person doesn't need a vpn...what can he do? only point to point tunneling...and the companies won't setup extra an ssl based vpn tunnel for that :)
[09:18] <\sh> Tonio_: it's named: mpls :) 
[09:19] <Tonio_> \sh: really, to me vpn connection at home is really usefull
[09:19] <Tonio_> imagin the number of "VIPs" that want network access at home
[09:19] <Tonio_> sisco is a nightmare with this, cause home routers are incompatible most of the time, so you have to use ppp connection
[09:20] <Tonio_> as slow as possible
[09:20] <\sh> Tonio_: yes...but they don't want to have a vpn which is vulnerable because of external libs :)
[09:20] <Tonio_> \sh: they don't even know what a lib is hehe
[09:20] <Tonio_> \sh: concerning mpls, it is usefull for "company 2 company" connection
[09:20] <\sh> Tonio_: see..but the systemadmin in the company knows it :)
[09:20] <Tonio_> I can't imagin myself implementing mpls at home ;)
[09:21] <\sh> Tonio_: it's router to router :) 
[09:21] <Tonio_> \sh: honnestly, most people and specifically sysadmin don't mind security, you should know that ;)
[09:21] <Tonio_> \sh: yes, but the cost make it uncompatible with private usage :)
[09:21] <\sh> the path is in the complete bgp4 cloud :)
[09:22] <Tonio_> mpls is way to expensive for this
[09:22] <\sh> small juniper :)
[09:22] <Tonio_> that's why I talked about "company to company"
[09:22] <Tonio_> to me, honnestly, vpn isn't a security issue
[09:23] <Tonio_> most companies have a complete book about security rules, but let the user decide their password
[09:23] <Tonio_> which result their child name is the password choosen, and simply talking near the coffe machine gives you the full keys......
[09:23] <\sh> this is a spof and the security officer needs to be exterminated :)
[09:24] <\sh> that's why i like single sign on tokens :)
[09:24] <Tonio_> I have never seen in my life a company with a "good" security policy
[09:24] <Tonio_> never
[09:24] <\sh> safeword style
[09:24] <Tonio_> \sh: yes, tokens is a nice way to do
[09:24] <\sh> biometrical things can be done as well
[09:25] <Tonio_> \sh: but that makes the big part of security stronger, that doesn't resolve the others problems....
[09:25] <Tonio_> I always laugh when I hear the passwords used for domain administrator account in companies...
[09:25] <\sh> sure..nobody wants to lose his finger or two fingers :)
[09:25] <Tonio_> \sh: their is a new system
[09:26] <Tonio_> which is based on biometric + heart pulse
[09:26] <Tonio_> then is the finger is cut, no blood going in it, it doesn't work
[09:26] <Tonio_> that's very interesting
[09:26] <Tonio_> \sh: heard about that ?
[09:26] <\sh> nope..any pointers?
[09:27] <Tonio_> \sh: television ;)
[09:27] <Tonio_> \sh: might be found on the web, but not easy to find.....
[09:27] <Tonio_> \sh: it is already used on expensive cars
[09:28] <\sh> hehehe...and after the driver had an accident with this car, he can never drive it again :)
[09:28] <Tonio_> \sh: fancy revuing the vpn modules of n-m for universe uploading once I finish the packages cleaning ?
[09:28] <Tonio_> \sh: assume yes :)
[09:28] <Tonio_> ^^
[09:28] <\sh> I'm not a motu anymore :)
[09:29] <Tonio_> \sh: did you purge your key ??
[09:29] <\sh> no..I removed myself from the dev and core dev team...
[09:32] <Tonio_> \sh: can't you simply ask to be added again ?
[09:32] <Tonio_> due to the situation, I don't see the point that would get reject
[09:32] <\sh> Tonio_: No...I don't want that...actually I will start from scratch :)
[09:33] <\sh> when the time comes
[09:33] <Tonio_> \sh: I can understand
[09:36] <\sh> right now, I'm happy that I can chat here but I don't have the head for doing really serious stuff..I'm playing around with something, but just for the fun
[09:36] <Tonio_> \sh: after darkness, there is light
[09:37] <\sh> that's the plan :) 
[09:37] <Tonio_> it's gonna get better from day to day
[09:54] <mart> there's a stray "Powered by" at the bottom of the kubuntu.org packages....
[09:57] <mart> oh, the png doesn't render in konqueror here... but it does in gwenview. weird.
[10:00] <kwwii> ok...time for bed...the Ubuntu boot pics are done as well
[10:00] <kwwii> at least the first version of them
[10:00] <kwwii> I cannot wait to hear everyone scream about this stuff
[10:03] <kwwii> bye
[10:32] <Tonio_> Lure: packages will be uploaded in 30 minutes
[10:35] <Tonio_> Lure: want me to add them on my repo ?
[10:35] <Lure> Tonio_: you should - then we can ask on forums for testers
[10:35] <Tonio_> Lure: yup :)
[11:06] <Lure> Tonio_: should we package also pptp - see bug 39696
[11:06] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39696 in network-manager "NetworkManager PPTP Support" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/39696
[11:26] <Lure> Tonio_: this may explain VPN problems with Ubuntu n-m - bug 37239
[11:26] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 37239 in network-manager "VPN connection should alter /etc/resolv.conf" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/37239
[11:29] <Tonio_> that's a limit that exists with the openvpn client
[11:30] <Tonio_> this is not due to n-m specificly
[11:30] <Tonio_> the openvpn CLI client has the same issue
[11:30] <Lure> you mean the resolv.conf stuff?
[11:34] <Tonio_> yep
[11:34] <Tonio_> there is the same issue with the standard vpn client
[11:35] <Tonio_> which is used by the module
[11:35] <Tonio_> this is not an n-m issue to me
[11:35] <Tonio_> the issue is due to openvpn, that only manages this with the windows version on the client
[11:35] <Tonio_> s/on/off
[11:36] <Lure> ok
[11:36] <Tonio_> I explained that to keybuck, but didn't receive any answer
[11:36] <Lure> Tonio_: I am going trough n-m bugs jusy now - should I advertise your packages in the ones regarding n-m?
[11:36] <Lure> regarding vpn
[11:38] <Tonio_> Lure: wait a bit that I'm finished with slomo on this :)
[11:39] <Lure> ;-)