Tonio_anyway, it could be nice to have a package for ubuntu, since amarok is so popular.... there is no reason listengnome could not fit lots of people awaitings...12:05
pkernGobby's just messed.12:06
pkernOh well...12:06
slomo_Tonio_: so package it :) i'm not really interested in packaging it12:07
slomo_Tonio_: but i'll take a look at revu now :)12:07
Tonio_slomo_: I have a principle in my life, dedicating my work to kde and kubuntu :)12:08
Tonio_that doesn't use QT ;)12:08
slomo_networkmanager-openvpn doesn't use qt :P12:08
Tonio_but seriously, I'm not used to pakcage gnome apps at all ;) would be easier for an experimented gnome apps packager to do it :)12:08
Tonio_slomo_: true, but that's a component to a qt appliation :)12:09
Tonio_that's what I call "a required exception" :p12:09
pkernAh bah. The Gobby Ubuntu patch is so messed that nobody could read anything out of it.12:09
pkernIs there any Ubuntuian way to get the source of the Debian base revision?12:10
pkernApart from crawling archive.debian.{org,net}12:10
slomo_pkern: ask ogra what he have done to your package :)12:10
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pkernslomo_: I think he changed one single line.12:11
slomo_Tonio_: ok, so when we get a package that uses qt and gtk we work together on it ;P well, with avahi i already have one but anyway...12:11
Tonio_slomo_: hehe ;) I never met a package using both in the same sources12:12
Tonio_slomo_: are there packages like that ?12:12
Tonio_I mean, with the same tarball12:12
pkernTonio_: Avahi builds both Glib and Qt-related stuff12:12
slomo_Tonio_: avahi and dbus for example12:12
Tonio_slomo_: okay ;)12:12
Tonio_but really, my knowledge is really too limited at the moment to even think about working on something like dbus :)12:14
Tonio_slomo_: you should know I'm using linux since less than 2 years, so..... :)12:14
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Tonio_hi cbx3312:18
cbx33hi Tonio_12:18
slomo_Tonio_: well... when i have qt-related avahi questions i'll ask you :)12:18
cbx33howz it all going today12:18
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Tonio_slomo_: I doubt I could help, but I'll enjoy to try :)12:19
cbx33Tonio_, i know the feeling12:20
cbx33i sometimes feel really useless here12:20
cbx33i can't fix many bugs...at the moment12:20
cbx33I'm a good coder, but not in languages that are used in ubuntu much like python and c12:21
Tonio_cbx33: anyway, working on "too hard for us" things is the best way to increase our knowledge12:21
cbx33I'm getting more and more into this.  I love helping out the ubuntu project12:21
cbx33wish there were more bugs I could fix :p12:21
Tonio_and limited knowledge never prevent me from contributing :)12:22
cbx33it would be great to have a short training in bug fixing12:22
cbx33Tonio_, i agree12:22
cbx33I still do everything I can to help out12:22
Tonio_but of course I wasn't doing the same things one year ago than the ones I can work on now :)12:22
cbx33just wish i could do more12:22
cbx33well I've only just started12:22
cbx33like a week ago12:22
Tonio_can sound strange, but I did my first website the day I got internet at home12:23
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Tonio_and I started contributing to ubuntu the day I decided to switch to linux on the desktop, one year ago12:23
cbx33wow excellent12:23
Tonio_one and a half exactly ;)12:24
cbx33heheh nice12:24
cassidy"png is not a good format to add in an source package (its a binary format)."  --> I'm not the only one to find that stupid?12:24
cbx33cassidy, where's the quote from :p12:24
Tonio_cbx33: and beleive, it is really hard to help when you just understand what the difference bewteen gtkl and qt is lol12:24
cassidycbx33: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/rasmol/+bug/3942712:24
UbugtuMalone bug 39427 in rasmol "Package doesn't have an icon" [Normal,Confirmed] 12:24
Tonio_cassidy: I agree with this12:25
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Tonio_I personnaly use an svg file and use an algo to generate pngs during the build12:25
Tonio_that's the best way to do12:25
cassidywhy? it doesn't change anything12:25
Tonio_cassidy: it changes ONE thing12:25
Tonio_a source is supposed to "modifyable"12:26
cbx33Tonio_, I agree12:26
Tonio_and sorry, but a png isn't modifyable the same way an svg is...12:26
Tonio_I don't like debian folders with non docbook files for man12:26
cassidyif the file IS a png file. It's stupid to convert it into xpm to make it png during the build12:26
Tonio_like direct .1 files........ they are unmodifyable12:26
Tonio_cassidy: in that case yes12:27
pkernTonio_: Eh. If they are the source file? roff files are modifyable.12:27
Tonio_if the provided file is a png in the tarball, I don't mind12:27
Tonio_but I've seen people adding pngs to the debian folder12:27
Tonio_I don't like that12:27
cassidyand there are tons of package with png in their source12:27
pkernTonio_: Things in the debian/ folder are supposed to be diffable against the tarball.12:27
Tonio_cassidy: yes, but reguarding the packaging, I prefer to add svg stuff than png one12:27
Tonio_if upstream adds png in the tarball, there is no reason to change that12:28
Tonio_of course :)12:28
Tonio_although I would prefer to have svg files inside :)12:28
slomo_Tonio_: there exist people that write roff by hand instead of writing docbook ;)12:28
cassidyTonio_: ok, thanks for explanation :)12:28
pkernslomo_: Count me on your list. ;)12:28
slomo_and if there is only a png use the png uuencoded in the diff12:28
Tonio_slomo_: there are people that can generate a binary using 1 and 0 ;)12:28
Tonio_there are genius (almost crazy) ;)12:29
slomo_and send it upstream12:29
slomo_Tonio_: there are weird people out there, yes ;)12:29
Tonio_cassidy: look at the source package for wlassistant for example12:29
pkernTonio_: What do you say about People writing LaTeX?12:29
pkernTonio_: Not that roff is that different, in principle.12:29
slomo_pkern: like me? ;)12:30
Tonio_cassidy: instead of adding pngs to the debian folder, I'm using an svg file and generate svgs during the build12:30
pkernTonio_: Which needs such a builder as a build-dep.12:30
Tonio_pkern: I don't know latex enough to talk about that :)12:30
slomo_Tonio_: and what happens when you don't have a svg but only a svg? :P12:30
Tonio_slomo_: I'm doing the svg ;)12:30
pkernI don't consider writing SGML as so superior.12:30
Tonio_as I did with adept for example :)12:30
Tonio_svg is nicer since you don't have size limitations with it12:31
slomo_Tonio_: well, i am not talented enough to create nice icons :P but i would do them as svg too12:31
Tonio_so in order to build clean icons, I think svg as a base is the nicer choice12:31
slomo_Tonio_: but when i add an icon i get it from someone else (upstream most of the time) and when it's png i can't do anything about it12:31
pkernTonio_: In order to use a desktop to use only free software is the nicer choice.12:32
Tonio_slomo_: no need to be talented :) consider adept is my first svg job;)12:32
pkernTonio_: Sometimes you get binary files and you can't help it.12:32
Tonio_it took me about 12 hours to do it since my skills were about zero :)12:32
cassidyTonio_: ok ok. We can do that from xpm file too ?12:32
pkernTonio_: Just as like sometimes one needs to use proprietary software.12:32
Tonio_pkern: that can happen of course12:32
slomo_pkern: yes? when for example? :)12:32
Tonio_I do use proprietary software when there are no alternatives12:32
pkernslomo_: I have yet to see nice math software.12:32
Tonio_like java.... I can avoid using it for my work, and have no pb with this12:33
pkernslomo_: Maple and Mathematica come to mind.12:33
slomo_pkern: ok, accepted... i thought you meant for the icon stuff... i use mathematica myself12:33
Tonio_I just think a source work has to be full source based12:33
pkernslomo_: In general.12:33
Tonio_and png isn't ;)12:33
pkernslomo_: It was just an analogy.12:33
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Tonio_cassidy: xpm files don't give a good result with big icons, so I generally hate it....12:34
Tonio_svg is way nicer, although it is a bit bigger, I admit12:34
Tonio_but what is 2 kB disk usage nowadays ?12:35
pkernTonio_: Consider the 100 USD laptop12:35
pkernTonio_: Not that they need colourful icons12:35
Tonio_pkern: I don't consider them since this project will never work....12:36
slomo_Tonio_: but about java... i have yet to see a reason why i should install one of the commercial jre/jdk... for everything i need classpath/gij is good enough12:36
pkernTonio_: It won't?12:36
Tonio_pkern: I don't consider giving "pseudo" computers to poor people is a solution...12:36
Tonio_pkern: I hope it will, but I don't think it will12:36
pkernTonio_: What's so pseudo about them?12:36
pkernTonio_: You share this attitude with Gates. ;)12:37
Tonio_pkern: the ability to perform simple tasks the same way that we can do it from 10 years12:37
pkernTonio_: Which are?12:37
Tonio_pkern: and ? bill gates is certainly wrong on many points, but I think considering his experience is helping africa for example12:37
pkernTonio_: Heck, I even use a P2-350 myself for video streaming. And they have a 500 MHz.12:37
Tonio_he should have good reasons to beleive that can't work12:37
Tonio_and yes, I share this opinion on that point :)12:38
Tonio_I don't have any problems with this12:38
Tonio_pkern: they have 500 mhz, but no hdd, and no battery12:38
Tonio_what can you do with it ?12:38
hubTonio_: Bill Gates opinion on this matter is purely FUD12:38
Tonio_no multimedia, no cpu usage or it might shutdown in 5 minutes........12:38
hubTonio_: because he has been turned down12:39
Tonio_honnestly, those 100 USD pcs are a shame12:39
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pkernTonio_: half a gig of hdd is not enough?12:39
Tonio_hub: it may, I didn't say "I agree with his arguments", I just share the same opinion, but with MY understanding and MY arguments12:39
Tonio_pkern: exactly12:39
hubTonio_: the OLPC is about education12:40
hubeducation for everybody12:40
hubeducation is a right that some countries do not offer, unles you have money. (/me points at a few G8 countries)12:40
pkernTonio_: 1:10 physical work to battery energy isn't too bad, either.12:40
Tonio_pkern: I think is can be possible to provide really better stuff for 100 USD12:41
pkernhub: Well does G8 include Russia?12:41
Tonio_can you imagin the number of computers companies trash every year ?12:41
pkernTonio_: Oh. I guess the UN really wants to hear how. Seriously.12:41
hubTonio_: go ahead, submit your design?12:41
Tonio_PIII 1.2 gigs with 256 megs of ram12:41
pkernTonio_: They aren't better...?12:41
pkernTonio_: There are projects collecting those, yes.12:42
hubTonio_: you also forget that that thse computer needs a 220V AC plug12:42
pkernTonio_: How do they get the power for them in Africa? And where are the trashed monitors?12:42
Tonio_pkern: in my opinion, it would be better to recycle those computers that can perfectly do the job12:42
hubTonio_: the one you threw away12:42
pkernTonio_: Mind you... You don't have power everywhere in Africa.12:42
pkernTonio_: Heck, you don't even have water everywhere.12:42
hubTonio_: and how do they use it? how do they bring it home?12:42
pkernAnd solar power is expensive.12:42
pkernhub: At school there's another set ;)12:43
Tonio_pkern: people that don't have power need lots of things before informatics.........12:43
Tonio_like power ;)12:43
pkernTonio_: Perhaps... education?12:43
Tonio_like water network12:43
pkernTonio_: They shouldn't learn informatics.12:43
hubTonio_: *education*12:43
Tonio_pkern: and ? education doesn't obviously require a computer12:43
pkernTonio_: But get a general education.12:43
Tonio_don't forget the world didn't start in 199012:43
hubTonio_: you are spoiled, you live in a country were you all have electricity and free post secondary education12:43
Tonio_yes, they need education12:43
pkernTonio_: Education without the internet is hard nowadays. How are they expected to participate in the world.12:43
Tonio_pkern: I don't agree12:44
hubpkern: not even12:44
slomo_Tonio_: about the nm plugin... why do you reload the dbus configuration in postinst?12:44
Tonio_education without internet is perfectly possible.......12:44
hubTonio_: you can ask your questions on #olpc12:44
pkernhub: If one thinks that they should solve their problems on their own, given sufficient education, is it.12:44
Tonio_I didn't saw a computer at schol before I was 20, and that didn't prevent myself to learn mathematics, history etc......12:44
hubTonio_: but you had books, didn't you?12:45
cassidyTonio_: How can i generate a xpm from a svg ? It seems rsvg-convert doesn't do that12:45
hubcassidy: from any PNG12:45
Tonio_slomo_: I only did that since the package I used as a based did it, and I assumed there was a good reason to do it ;)12:45
hubcassidy: ImageMagick can do that12:45
Tonio_slomo_: I didn't investigate more than this :)12:45
Tonio_cassidy: I never use xpm12:45
cassidyTonio_: it's for Debian menu12:45
Tonio_cassidy: but there are ways to generate png files from an svg ;)12:46
Tonio_look at wlassistant for the complete mecanisme12:46
slomo_Tonio_: hmm... ok, it doesn't hurt so let's leave it ;)12:46
Tonio_cassidy: hum....... I assume you can do svg -> png -> xpm12:46
cassidyso i do png -> svg. I put the svg in the package and during the build : svg -> png -> xpm 0_o12:46
Tonio_but I don't know if direct conversion is possible12:46
Tonio_cassidy: png -> svg will give a very bad renderring12:47
Tonio_so if you don't have a "real" svg, better uuencoding the png file maybe :)12:47
pkerncassidy: Only if you trace the png somehow. Plain embedding isn't fun.12:47
hubTonio_: if I had to stick to what I learned with my teachers, I wouldn't even be here12:47
hubTonio_: that problem is that you are focused on technology12:47
tritiumpng -> svg would indeed be a suboptimal choice12:48
cassidythat you, you want svg everywhere ;)12:48
Tonio_hub: I am not12:48
Tonio_hub: I consider that to learn, except informatic things, books are the best way12:48
Tonio_and honnestly, I would prefer to ear, there are plans to get power to all africa, than giving them computers that can fit with the power missing issue......12:49
tritiumTonio_: and good educators!12:49
Tonio_I don't say that's right, and we will know if I'm wrong in a few years12:49
Tonio_tritium: yes, that abvious :)12:49
tritiumcertainly, though, I agree with you, Tonio_12:50
Tonio_I hope I'm wrong, but I'm sik of earing they have "pseudo medecine" for their health, "pseudo water full of virus", now pseudo computers looking like toys.......12:51
Tonio_it is not the good way to help them in MY opinion12:52
slomo_pkern: thanks for the sda bug :)12:52
Tonio_but as I'm not there to help, I think I may shut up on that point12:52
pkernslomo_: :p12:52
pkernslomo_: I don't know if it makes sense, though.12:52
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pkernslomo_: Considering the Gobby Howl issue.12:53
slomo_pkern: it does :) what is the license of the icons etc?12:53
pkernslomo_: GPL12:53
pkernslomo_: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Gobby-logo.png12:54
slomo_could you add this url to the bugreport?12:54
pkernslomo_: Thomas Glatt <tom(at)0x539.de> is its creator.12:54
pkernWell, I could, yes.12:55
pkernslomo_: I just added the content, done.12:56
pkernslomo_: I took the SVG version from the repo anyway and scaled it. ;)12:56
slomo_pkern: ok :) if you could port gobby to avahi everything would be perfect then :)12:58
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pkernslomo_: Well, I would also need to backport it to 0.3.x for it to be "perfect". |:12:59
pkernslomo_: I doubt it would be stable enough to enter Dapper as a change.12:59
pkernslomo_: So I'll target Avahi support for Dapper+1 with 0.4.x ;)12:59
hubTonio_: you see computer like computer, not like a tool12:59
Tonio_hub: that's the oposite01:00
Tonio_I see computer like a replacement01:00
Tonio_without computer, I do in another way01:00
Tonio_that's due to the fact I didn't grew with computers01:00
Tonio_I started informatics from scratch at the age of 2101:01
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Tonio_I don't have the feeling a computer is necessary in people's life01:01
Tonio_and moreover when they don't have light, water, schools and education01:01
Tonio_hub: I don't mean computer is a gadget, but certainly not a priority in people's life01:02
slomo_Tonio_: you have my vote for nm-openvpn now... :) is the vpnc one at the same state?01:03
Tonio_hub: and not having a computer at home didn't prevent myself from getting my mathematics diploma...01:03
Tonio_slomo_: yep, exactly yhe same, except I couldn't test it :)01:03
Tonio_hub: and at university I was the only one not using their computers, since I simply didn't feel the ned of it... so plz don't tell me "you don't see computers like tools"01:04
Tonio_that's exactly the oposite of my real feeling :)01:04
pkernIs vpnc Cisco-VPN-compatible?01:05
hubTonio_: btw, #olpc is probably more appropriate01:05
pkernIf so, I can test it.01:05
tritiumpkern: sure is01:05
tritiumit works quite well01:05
Tonio_hub: sure ;) but it is too late here in france to debate this :)01:05
Tonio_hub: ping me another day, I would take pleasure debating this :)01:05
pkerntritium: Last time I tried it didn't, but that experience is about a year old.01:05
hubTonio_: I won't ping you for that01:06
pkernSo time to try it again.01:06
hubTonio_: I don't care01:06
tritiumpkern: same for me.  It worked well for me about a year ago.01:06
slomo_pkern: it worked for me one year ago without problems ;)01:06
hubpkern: you are gobby developer as I understand>01:06
pkernslomo_: Perhaps it depends on the other side.01:06
slomo_Tonio_: but before uploading the plugins you really should coordinate with debian about package names etc :P01:06
Tonio_slomo_: I promiss to do it ;)01:07
pkernhub: Yes, one of two.01:07
Tonio_slomo_: we did that for the knetworkmanager stuff, there is no reason we don't do it for the vpn modules :)01:07
slomo_Tonio_: ok :) thanks01:08
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hubpkern: 'cause AbiWord people (not me) are working on a collaborative writing as well01:11
pkernhub: I know.01:11
pkernhub: Too many people work on such a solution./01:12
pkernhub: I can't help that everybody reinvents the wheel.01:12
hubpkern: and they do not seem to be willing to try to share01:12
pkernhub: We'll build Gobby-over-Jabber support in the next weeks.01:12
hubbut rather "hack something that work"01:12
pkernhub: Yep.01:12
pkernhub: We created a library for use in other programs when no Free Software solution was available.01:13
pkernhub: Probably MateEdit, the KDE client, will move to obby, but that's it.01:13
pkernOr rather KDE collaborative editor01:13
pkernhub: I'm a little bit disappointed |:01:14
hubpkern: me too01:14
slomo_pkern: btw, regarding avahi... you could write to the mailinglist... it's more likely to get an answer there01:15
pkernslomo_: I'm not so glad about the attitude of some Avahi devs anyway. I'll start another try later this day.01:16
slomo_pkern: what attitude?01:17
pkernslomo_: Regarding the howl compatibility layers they built. First they build it, then they threaten everyone who uses it and implement really silly warnings which confuse more than do help.01:17
slomo_pkern: heh... that's the only aspect i don't like as well but i don't care enough... people should just port to avahi, it's not too hard anyway01:19
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slomo_pkern: and the message was meant to be annoying :P01:20
pkernslomo_: It's just that the two APIs are quite similar, Avahi provides more hooks, yes. But that's it.01:20
pkernslomo_: It did confuse me. I expected my software to be buggy.01:20
pkernslomo_: But then it spits warnings about *intended* behaviour.01:20
pkernslomo_: I'm ok with the startup message, I mean others.01:20
pkernslomo_: IMHO that's not ok.01:21
slomo_pkern: and the avahi api is much more structured, powerful and easier to use imho... and avahi is free in contrast to howl/mdnsresponder01:21
pkernslomo_: Howl's free. mDNSresponder is not.01:22
pkernslomo_: Howl runs on Windows, Avahi does not.01:22
slomo_pkern: not dfsg-free... and avahi should be easy to port to windows... it only has to be done by someone who knows windows :P01:23
pkernslomo_: The Howl dev wants to port Avahi's mDNSresponder to Howl 2. However I doubt that he'll push that project forward when Avahi builds on Win.01:23
pkernslomo_: Howl's DFSG-free. mDNSresponder is not, and it's included.01:23
pkernslomo_: I don't think it's that easy to port. Otherwise it would be done already.01:24
pkernslomo_: Due to DBUS et al.01:24
slomo_pkern: afaik they are working on a fifo based IPC for 0.7 which should work on windows too... and the other parts are easy to port or need no changes at all01:25
slomo_but better discuss that with mezcalero :P01:25
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pkernI don't understand one thing. They built that howl compatibility layer. But why didn't they just port the applications. Perhaps I could find someone who complets the port using my work. ;)01:27
slomo_the compat layers were meant to be a iterim solution until apps are ported01:28
slomo_and they were done because it would be cool to have itunes etc running with avahi on os x and they could be done ;)01:28
pkernWhy would one want Avahi on OS X.01:30
slomo_for screenshots? ;)01:31
pkernAnd then... Those are not the Howl ones.01:31
slomo_yes, those are the libdns-sd ones01:31
pkernOh yeah... let's get rid of that OS X integration, we want to replace it!01:31
pkernWhat about building a free GUI instead.01:32
pkernLess waste of resources.01:32
slomo_from what i saw the compat layers were only done because they could be done and to produce some screenshots ;)01:32
pkernConsidering that those bindings are under APSL (which is not DFSG-free, I know... but then it's OSX, isn't it)01:32
pkernOh well.01:32
pkernFor nice screenshots I want to see Gobby ported to OSX. But that will never happen.01:33
pkernWhat? Why I want it ported or why it will never happen?01:34
slomo_why it will never happen01:34
pkernIt's Gtk after all.01:34
slomo_there is a os x port of gtk01:34
pkernI know.01:34
pkernNot advanced enough to run seriously. |:01:35
pkernPerhaps it's worth another try to integrate it into DarwinPorts.01:35
slomo_would be a nice SoC project :)01:35
pkernBut then Avahi is more of a high priority.01:35
slomo_to finish it i mean01:35
pkernToo big I suppose.01:35
pkernEspecially because Gtk's menu handling just isn't compatible with OS X's.01:35
slomo_some of the freebsd SoC projects were far bigger01:36
pkernslomo_: Were they taken and completed?01:36
slomo_taken but not completed afaik01:36
pkernslomo_: And do you know how advanced the OS X port already is?01:36
slomo_one was implementing journaling for the fs iirc01:36
pkernslomo_: I don't think they made much of a progress the last months, but I can be wrong.01:36
slomo_no idea... it was done by a imendio guy iirc?01:37
pkernI guess tomorrow is the next round of mentor organisation approvals/denials.01:37
pkernslomo_: Yep.01:37
pkernHm, if strikethrough means completed then the roadmap looks nice.01:38
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KyralAnyone wanna kill time by talking to me and a friend over HAM while we wait for Dapper to download?02:22
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crimsunBddebianIsAGod? Word.02:29
bddebianHeya gang02:29
bddebiancrimsun: I thought you said I was an idiot? :_)02:29
crimsunbddebian: me? I may be an idiot, but I don't recall saying you're one. :)02:30
bddebiancrimsun: You are FAR from an idiot02:33
bddebianYou scolded me for uploading gxine :-)02:33
crimsunyou didn't do anything wrong; I was just hoping to get input from Darren prior to an upload. There's no harm done.02:34
Toadstoolg'night everybody02:56
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bddebianWhat the hell is xclip supposed to do?04:27
bmontyfrom the man page: "annoy the crap out of bddebian"04:28
bddebianYuck, yuck :-)04:28
bmontybddebian: sorry, isn't it supposed to be some kind of ancient clipboard viewer?04:32
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YagisanG'day all.04:33
bddebianYeah and I hacked it to not use the /X11R6/ path but when I execut it, it doesn't do anything.  I don't get any errors but it doesn't do anything either.  Though that might be normal behaviour04:33
bddebianHeya Yagisan04:33
Yagisanbddebian: what's up ?04:34
bddebianNada man, you?04:34
bmontybddebian: I played with some of X apps awhile ago and came to two conclusions:04:34
=== Yagisan has been making a nuisance of himself with avidemux
bmonty1. the X build system is fuckin wierd04:34
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bmonty2. These apps are not very useful anymore04:34
bddebianbmonty: xmkmf is broken currently yes :-)04:35
bddebianWell not broken but still using the X11R6 path04:35
Yagisanslomo__: around ?04:36
bmontybddebian: yeah, I think any app that is still broken in that way is probably not very useful04:36
bmontybddebian: maybe a morgue candiate?04:36
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bddebianWell someone must use it, there is a bug filed on it ;-P04:36
bddebianHeya tritium04:36
tritiumhi bddebian04:37
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sivangslomo__: I changed what you asked with respect to the package, now what's left is the s/binary-arch/binary-indep/09:22
sivangslomo__: but I want to understand fully what I'm doing before going on with the change, should I just change it such that binay-indep will be the main target that calls everything underneath it?09:22
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=== enyc puzzled why ubuntu 6.06 still has Mailman 2.1.5 -- same as the last 3 releases at-current in-fact [!!]
Hobbseeenyc: what's the latest version of it?09:47
enycHobbsee: 2.1.8 upstream, 2.1.7+2.1.8rc1 in unstable/testing09:49
Hobbseeah ok09:49
Hobbseeenyc: it's too late for dapper...but dapper+1 it should get updated09:50
Hobbseeesp if you remind someone about it09:50
enycits not much changes.. mostly just mailman security updates internally...09:50
enycHobbsee: I noticed similar abuot 'freedoom' and a bugfix was done, and this was then UVF-exception updated (but its not a arch-specific (compiled) or dependancy-headache package)09:51
Hobbseeoh ok.  if it were only bugfixes, then it could probably go in - but if there were new features as well, and if the current package functions...particularly this late in feature freeze...09:52
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MithrandirHobbsee: I think we could request an UVF exception for mailman, its development is slow and stable enough for that.  It'd make pitti's job easier, if nothing else.09:55
HobbseeMithrandir: ah ok09:55
=== Hobbsee hadnt heard of mailman before, so was treating it as any other out-of-date package
Mithrandirit's in main, though, so it'd have to be post-beta.09:56
Hobbseeand when's the beta?09:56
Mithrandiras in, dapper beta.09:56
Hobbseeright, yep09:56
Hobbseeyes, of course - unlikely that it's anything else :P09:56
Mithrandirhiya ajmitch09:57
Hobbseehey ajmitch09:57
ajmitchhow's it going?09:58
Hobbseegood, some woman decided to crash into me today..10:01
Hobbseetried to reverse up a one way street - right into me.10:01
ajmitchvery clever of her10:01
Hobbseevery, yes10:03
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=== Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
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slomo__sivang: ping?11:03
ivokswhat do you think, is it better to include SPF support in spamassassin or not?11:04
sivangslomo__: pong, did you see my backog msg?11:05
sivangslomo__: about the s/binary-arch/binary-indep/11:05
Toadstoolgood morning everybody11:06
slomo__hi Toadstool11:06
Toadstoolhi slomo__11:06
slomo__sivang: yes... what do you want to know? :)11:06
sivangslomo__: Well, I want to know how to change the order of stuff :) and not break the current which builds and works11:07
sivangslomo__: I mean, is it just plain s/binary-arch/binary-indep/ ?11:08
slomo__sivang: just try to understand the makefile :) there's a build, binary-arch, binary-indep and clean rule... the binary-arch rule should be empty, the binary-indep rule should include everything needed to build that thing, the build rule should call everything that is needed to build (arch and indep) and the clean rule should clean up everything11:09
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Toadstoolstupid question: why does debuild preserve +x right on two scripts when running dh_install whereas my pbuilder doesn't? am I missing something?11:13
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ToadstoolI am a moron, forget about my question...11:42
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kokehi all!12:47
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ajmitchhey koke01:22
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MatrixZReal: http://www.mailingmania.com/pages/ptp.php?refid=matrixz02:08
MatrixZReal: http://www.mailingmania.com/pages/ptp.php?refid=matrixz02:08
MatrixZReal: http://www.mailingmania.com/pages/ptp.php?refid=matrixz02:08
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zakamehi all02:43
Toadstoolhi zakame02:48
zakamehello Toadstool =)02:49
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zakamehi all03:10
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Hobbseehi zakame03:11
zakamehi Hobbsee03:11
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zakamehi ajmitch__03:37
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monziehi all07:05
jpatrickhi monzie07:05
monziehi jpatrick07:05
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bddebianHeya gang07:15
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LaserJockhi bddebian07:21
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KyralIs it just me or are the @ubuntu.com addresses getting spammed like nobodies business?09:16
bddebianI wouldn't know, mine has never worked :'-(09:18
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\shhmm..no...my address never went public :)09:18
\shi receive enough spam for my assassin with @sourcecode.de :)09:18
KyralI use it as my "professional" address09:18
hub\sh: hey09:20
hub\sh: wassup?09:20
Tm_TI don't have one, so no spam problems here ;-P09:20
\shg'evening hub :) still in xandros business? :)09:20
\shheard they have now a one man office in germany :)09:21
\shhehe...and I heard some other rumours..but this is not for the public :)09:22
Tm_T\sh: it wasn't me!09:23
=== Tm_T hides
\shnono...has nothing to do with anybody here :)09:24
Tm_Tand just when I thought I did something big09:24
Tm_Toh well, I also was sleepig ->09:24
Tm_Tsleeping even09:24
\shI finally managed to win the fight against kamions cdbuilding monster scripts :)09:25
Kyrallol, I love the wording of the NetHack license09:33
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wasabiI uploaded something a few days ago and never got an upload nor reject message (upload.ubuntu.com). I have a feeling it was my key. I recently removed the expiration date, because it expired.09:59
wasabiAnyway to check? :)09:59
bddebianwasabi: Reject messages are b0rked last I knew.  Especially unstable -> dapper stuff in changelog10:00
=== bddebian has done a few :_(
wasabiWell... not sure why my uploaded never happened.10:00
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bddebianHeya ajmitch10:24
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bddebianLater folks10:46
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cartel_hey motus11:09
LaserJockhi cartel_11:10
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cbx33evenin all11:16
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:RoXaNuTzA] : Yup :D
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:RoXaNuTzA] : Yup :D Nice channel !:D
RoXaNuTzAhi all11:32
crimsundo NOT do that.11:32
RoXaNuTzAtopic ?11:32
crimsunyes, the topic.11:33
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:RoXaNuTzA] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | We are in feature freeze now. Focus on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges
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LaserJockwhat the heck was that?11:41
crimsunno idea, but I'm in a foul mood this evening, so I apologise in advance if I seem snappy11:42
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chillywillywhat an idiot11:46

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