[12:12] <LaserJock> mdke: well, it is really easy to *do* it but I'm not  sure if there are any items that might cause problems
[12:12] <LaserJock> mdke: it should be no problem
[12:13] <mdke> LaserJock, would you take a look? the packaging has all gone a little bit funky today after Ian did his homepage hacks
[12:14] <LaserJock> mdke: what happened?
[12:14] <mdke> he did some crazy hacking to make the translated homepages work with ubuntu-docs, kubuntu-docs, xubuntu-docs and so on
[12:16] <LaserJock> mdke: so now you just want to get to compat 5 so you can put in comments?
[12:17] <mdke> well, i need to include all the translations in debian/install and there are going to be lots of stuff
[12:17] <LaserJock> yikes, that is a lot
[12:18] <mdke> yeah, my commit message got caught in the mailing list filter ;)
[12:18] <mdke> s/message/messages
[12:20] <LaserJock> ok, I checked the changelog of debhelper and it says version 5 should work 99.999% without needing modifications ;-)
[12:20] <mdke> that sounds positive
[12:20] <mdke> you think we should ask Ian if his changes will be affected?
[12:21] <LaserJock> let me check his changes real quick, I seriously doubt it would affect anything
[12:23] <mdke> trappist, ping
[12:25] <mdke> LaserJock, your advice on something. It occurred to me that we've save space in the packages if we move desktopguide/C/sample to desktopguide/sample and amend the links. That way, the sample stuff doesn't get shipped with each language for the UDG, KDG and SG. Thoughts?
[12:26] <LaserJock> hmm, let me think about that
[12:27] <LaserJock> mdke: unless you want the comments in the samples translated (I don't think we do) I would move them
[12:28] <LaserJock> mdke: trying to make common elements common is a worthy goal, I think
[12:29] <mdke> yeah, we don't translate those files
[12:29] <mdke> ok, I'm doing it
[12:29] <LaserJock> mdke: I don't think anything Ian did would be changed by changing the compat version, he didn't make an debhelper calls even
[12:30] <LaserJock> mdke: any in Debian 5 is recommended
[12:30] <mdke> LaserJock, cool, shall we do it?
[12:31] <LaserJock> yes :-)
[12:31] <LaserJock> just don't kick me out if I'm wrong
[12:32] <LaserJock> mdke: I can do the conversion if you want to add the comments etc.
[12:33] <mdke> LaserJock, ok. Can you build a quick test package before committing, just in case?
[12:34] <LaserJock> sure, sort quick ;-)
[12:34] <mdke> rock
[12:34] <LaserJock> sorta quick ,I mean
[12:45] <LaserJock> heh, I'm trying to get home so I can install Beta
[12:46] <mdke> LaserJock, don't worry about doing the compat thing now then, it's not mega urgent
[12:46] <LaserJock> heh, but it's fun ;-)
[12:46] <mdke> :)
[12:47] <LaserJock> it's not every day I get to work on a Main package
[12:50] <LaserJock> mdke: hmmm, my package didn't build, but I dont' think it is from my changes
[12:51] <mdke> error?
[12:51] <crimsun> woo, fixed #34831!
[12:51] <LaserJock> cp: cannot stat `./ubuntu/browser-startpage/index-lt.html': No such file or directory
[12:51] <mdke> LaserJock, ok, i'll fix thanks
[12:51] <LaserJock> what no ubugtu in here? :-)
[12:51] <crimsun> d'oh, ECHANNEL
[12:52] <LaserJock> mdke: so are you having to commit Ian's changes?
[12:52] <mdke> LaserJock, I think I did so. Listen, are you sure you're up to date? that file is present for me
[12:53] <LaserJock> mdke: oh, maybe not if you committ recently. I should have checked that first, doh
[12:54] <LaserJock> I've got too many machines and checkouts
[01:00] <robotgeek> mdke: pong
[01:01] <mdke> robotgeek, np, was about moving sample/ up a directory to avoid duplicating it for translations. I've gone ahead and done it, hope you approve
[01:01] <robotgeek> mdke: no problem, will it break links that i have to take care of, or do we handle that later
[01:02] <mdke> I fixed the links, but it may cause some problems with the annoying kubuntu-docs system
[01:02] <mdke> i'll talk to riddell
[01:03] <mdke> robotgeek, lemme upload then, hang on
[01:03] <mdke> done
[01:04] <robotgeek> mdke: okay, hopefully i'll be done with the xrefs today
[01:06] <LaserJock> mdke: did you do something with ubuntu/desktopguide/C/db/*
[01:06] <mdke> yes, I removed it from debian/install and took it out of the builds
[01:07] <mdke> that might only be in my very last commit
[01:08] <enrico> mdke: hi
[01:09] <mdke> enrico, ciao. some of my commit mails got caught in the ETOOBIG mailman filter. How big are they? not sure if it's worth approving them or not
[01:10] <mdke> mm?
[01:11] <mdke> on the phone, in person?
[01:11] <robotgeek> on the phone, we might be going to the Trenton COmputing Festival tommorow
[01:11] <mdke> ah, cool
[01:13] <mdke> LaserJock, oh crap. It's not building, i need to change the makefile a sec
[01:13] <LaserJock> heh
[01:14] <LaserJock> mdke: I was just about to tell you that ;-)
[01:16] <mdke> LaserJock, ok, works now. Sorry!
[01:18] <enrico> mdke: I'll have a look (provided I still have the password)
[01:18] <LaserJock> mdke: thank goodness for bash history ;-)
[01:19] <mdke> enrico, thanks
[01:19] <robotgeek> mdke: i am not updating the translations, as nothing would have changed, except line numbers?
[01:20] <mdke> robotgeek, no, don't update any translations. We'll redo them all later and they will fall into line with the English
[01:20] <LaserJock> robotgeek: awww, I'm sure the translators would appreciate the karma ;-)
[01:20] <robotgeek> mdke: cool, i'll just go ahead and commit then
[01:20] <mdke> thanks
[01:21] <enrico> mdke: are you sure?
[01:21] <enrico> mdke: I don't see your mail queued in ubuntu-doc-commits
[01:21] <enrico> (unless someone else moderated them in before I logged in)
[01:22] <mdke> enrico, ah. I am not sure because I just assumed they'd be there. Maybe they were auto-discarded. What's the policy on very large emails?
[01:22] <mdke> robotgeek, rock, thanks
[01:22] <enrico> mdke: no limit, it seems
[01:22] <robotgeek> mdke: also checked aboutkubuntu and release notes, no xreflabels tehre
[01:22] <LaserJock> mdke: ok, the package built. is there any way to test it?
[01:22] <enrico> "Maximum length in kilobytes (KB) of a message body. Use 0 for no limit. ": 0
[01:23] <enrico> (for ubuntu-doc-commits)
[01:24] <mdke> enrico, *shrug*. I did two massive commits uploads translations and the mails didn't come through. See the gap between r2922 and r2925 at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc-commits/2006-April/thread.html
[01:24] <mdke> no big deal though
[01:24] <mdke> you probably want to go to sleep ;)
[01:27] <LaserJock> mdke: is there anything in particular I should test?
[01:28] <mdke> LaserJock, yelp, /usr/share/ubuntu-docs/html in a browser, and /usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/home/ in a browser
[01:28] <mdke> LaserJock, see that?
[01:28] <LaserJock> yep
[01:28] <mdke> just give em the once over
[01:28] <LaserJock> the doc team rocks!
[01:29] <mdke> yeah, we do
[01:29] <LaserJock> pumping out documentation at the speed of the internet ;-)
[01:30] <enrico> mdke: maybe they've been filtered out somewhere else
[01:30] <enrico> mdke: in the worse possible case, they're still being dispatched and there'll be a huge mail bombing coming :)
[01:31] <mdke> enrico, could be. no worries!
[01:31] <mdke> enrico, grazie come sempre della disponibilita' :D
[01:32] <enrico> mdke: di nulla
[01:32] <enrico> faccio quello che posso (che solitamente non  abbastanza :-/ )
[01:33] <LaserJock> mdke: heh, everything looks ok. I even saw the starterpage in French ;-)
[01:33] <mdke> LaserJock, cool
[01:33] <mdke> enrico, you'd be happy with the team, it is really rocking nowadays
[01:34] <LaserJock> mdke: I'll  commit the changes I made to get to compat 5
[01:34] <mdke> thanks, I'm gonna do a changelog entry I think to explain what the hell has been going
[01:34] <mdke> (on)
[01:34] <enrico> actually
[01:34] <mdke> enrico, where do you live nowadays?
[01:35] <LaserJock> mdke: heh, yeah. so just mention you moved to debhelper 5 to get comments or whatever
[01:35] <enrico> it's a great time for the docteam to be rocking: dapper's a big thing, and the extra time for polishing is the greatest moment for a rocking docteam to really show off
[01:35] <enrico> mdke: at the moment, in Manchester.  Monday I'll go back to Italy
[01:35] <enrico> mdke: now that I think of it, you're in the uk?
[01:35] <mdke> yes, Londra
[01:36] <enrico> mdke: ok, a bit far away
[01:36] <mdke> yeah :)
[01:36] <mdke> LaserJock, will do
[01:36] <enrico> (considering train prices, it's further away than Sidney)
[01:36] <mdke> haha
[01:36] <enrico> 'night everyone!
[01:37] <mdke> notte
[01:37] <mdke> thanks
[01:38] <LaserJock> mdke: bombs away
[01:39] <mdke> LaserJock, yay, thanks
[01:40] <LaserJock> mdke: and with that I think I'll head home.
[01:41] <LaserJock> I'll probably be on a bit latter if you need anything more
[01:41] <LaserJock> but you probably need to go to bed or something
[01:42] <mdke> i ought to
[01:42] <mdke> thanks for your help!
[01:42] <LaserJock> np
[03:33] <Madpilot> evening all
[03:34] <mdke> evening Madpilot 
[03:34] <Madpilot> greetings from Xubuntu ;)
[03:34] <mdke> cool
[03:34] <Madpilot> I'm trying out the Dapper Beta LiveCD
[03:34] <mdke> ultra cool
[03:35] <Madpilot> it's nice, feels (on ten minutes use) very much like "Gnome Lite"
[03:35] <mdke> i need to try it out
[03:35] <mdke> do you know how to use sed?
[03:35] <Madpilot> nope
[03:36] <mdke> Madpilot, betterwikidocs has been approved by Mark
[03:36] <Madpilot> yes, you mentioned that last night - good to hear
[03:36] <mdke> oh, wasn't sure whether you were around
[03:36] <Madpilot> any idea of a timeline?
[03:37] <mdke> not yet
[03:37] <Madpilot> hopefully in time for Dapper+1, anyway
[03:38] <mdke> or even Dapper+0
[04:05] <mdke> rock
[04:08] <LaserJock> yeah, I saw that the packaging guide is completely transltated into swedish
[04:08] <mdke> pretty cool huh
[04:09] <LaserJock> totally
[04:10] <rob> mdke, did you hear back from Jane about Lulu?
[04:10] <mdke> rob, no, I'll chase her at some stage
[04:10] <rob> cool, sounds good
[04:10] <mdke> might have got lost in her filters
[04:18] <rob> the WikiLicensing spec has some good points, Mediawiki makes it really clear what licenses the work is submitted under (part of the initial configuration is choosing one), perhaps something modeled of that (an icon depicting the license used with a short blurb)?
[04:23] <mdke> that should be covered in the spec
[04:29] <arekmenner> So...
[04:29] <arekmenner> How 'bout that DocBook, eh?
[04:29] <mdke> it's good isn't it?
[04:29] <arekmenner> Wouldn't know, just now learning.
[04:29] <arekmenner> Figured I'd give you fellows another hand.
[04:30] <mdke> arekmenner, welcome aboard
[04:30] <Madpilot> arekmenner: cool
[04:30] <mdke> have you seen our various wiki pages?
[04:30] <arekmenner> Yeah, I'm thumbing through them at the moment.
[04:30] <LaserJock> cool
[04:31] <mdke> arekmenner, what are you interested in helping with, do you know?
[04:31] <arekmenner> Hahah, not at the moment.
[04:32] <arekmenner> I'm just getting to be a better programmer, so I figured I'd do something while I'm getting to the point when I could help ubuntu.
[04:32] <Madpilot> mdke: is the Xubuntu Desktop Guide on the web anywhere?
[04:32] <arekmenner> Thus, I decided DocTeam might be a good place to simmer.
[04:32] <mdke> Madpilot, don't think so
[04:33] <arekmenner> Ooh, xubuntu.
[04:33] <mdke> arekmenner, which flavour of Ubuntu do you use?
[04:33] <arekmenner> At the moment, xubuntu.
[04:33] <LaserJock> arekmenner: what languages do you know?
[04:33] <arekmenner> LaserJock: Python, C++/C, and PHP
[04:33] <LaserJock> cool
[04:33] <arekmenner> I'm not terribly fluent in any of them, really.
[04:33] <arekmenner> Which is what I'm working on.
[04:33] <LaserJock> heh, I'm just trying to learn Python
[04:33] <arekmenner> Like I said, though, I felt like doing something.
[04:33] <arekmenner> Oh, it's great.
[04:33] <arekmenner> So simple, and it makes so much sense.
[04:34] <Madpilot> that's three more languages than I know - programming is not one of my strengths ;)
[04:34] <arekmenner> ^-^
[04:34] <LaserJock> if I get a handle on it and Fortran my programming will probably be all for me
[04:34] <arekmenner> So, let's see...
[04:34] <arekmenner> I'm running xubuntu on a laptop
[04:34] <LaserJock> umm, that last part didn't make much sense :/
[04:34] <arekmenner> I'm on the same robotics team as jdong.
[04:34] <arekmenner> That's where I got into it.
[04:34] <arekmenner> He's a crazy fellow.
[04:34] <arekmenner> I'm going to get my desktop dual booting pretty soon.
[04:35] <arekmenner> Just as soon as I figure out how to resize my hard drive.
[04:35] <arekmenner> It's a 250 GB on an old box.
[04:35] <crimsun> don't worry, I'm capable of parsing far less intelligible sentences, lj ;)
[04:35] <arekmenner> So it only sees 130 of the gigs ;_;
[04:35] <crimsun> that's a bios limitation, arekmenner 
[04:35] <Madpilot> arekmenner: I just helped a friend put a 250Gb in an old box, AFAIK it sees the entire thing (in Ubuntu, anyway)
[04:36] <mdke> arekmenner, nice, you might wanna help out on the xubuntu guide, which is being worked on kinda at the last minute
[04:36] <crimsun> either the bios needs to be updated, or you need to install a newer controller card with a newer firmware
[04:36] <arekmenner> crimsun: I'm hoping it isn't the latter.
[04:36] <rob> what version of xfce4 is xubuntu running?
[04:36] <arekmenner> This is the last computer part I'll get in a while.
[04:36] <crimsun> rob: 4.4beta1
[04:37] <Madpilot> version 4.3.90.1 in Dapper Beta, apparently
[04:37] <arekmenner> I'm running dapper beta.
[04:37] <arekmenner> Any good way for me to figure that out?
[04:37] <arekmenner> My laptop's just over here.
[04:37] <crimsun> 4.3.90.1 is 4.4 beta 1
[04:37] <rob> ooh, when did that come out, I'm running 4.3.80.1 :)
[04:37] <arekmenner> Playing Fooly Cooly at the moment... why is that still on...
[04:37] <Madpilot> arekmenner: in Xubuntu? Applications menu -> About XFCE
[04:37] <crimsun> rob: last week
[04:38] <arekmenner> Xfce Desktop Environment version 4.3.90.1 (Xfce 4.3 UNSTABLE)
[04:38] <arekmenner> So I hear xubuntu just released a LiveCD.
[04:38] <rob> Xfce 4.3.90.1 here
[04:39] <rob> hmm
[04:39] <arekmenner> Very exciting. It might just be the new DSL ^-^
[04:39] <crimsun> it's a bit "fatter" than dsl
[04:39] <arekmenner> (nods)
[04:39] <crimsun> (to be expected, since it includes more)
[04:39] <arekmenner> But DSL's been getting bigger, too.
[04:39] <rob> hmm..
[04:40] <arekmenner> Anybody know of any good graphical IRC clients for Xfce?
[04:40] <arekmenner> (I know this isn't the place to put stuff like this in the future, but I'm just quickly doing something)
[04:41] <crimsun> good is of course an individual preference
[04:41] <arekmenner> Hahah
[04:41] <Madpilot> it's got gaim by default, but you asked for a good IRC client... IMO gaim doesn't qualify...
[04:41] <arekmenner> I'd have to agree.
[04:41] <arekmenner> Irssi is good, but I'm in 3 channels here.
[04:41] <Madpilot> it does work, at least...
[04:41] <arekmenner> And I'd like to keep tabs on 'em.
[04:42] <mdke> arekmenner, can't you can keep tabs on them with irssi?
[04:42] <mdke> oh, not audibly
[04:42] <arekmenner> Well, that's not really the problem.
[04:42] <rob> arekmenner, I just use Xchat, gtk and all
[04:43] <rob> heavily modified xchat though :)
[04:43] <mdke> i like irssi
[04:43] <arekmenner> Oh, silly me, forgot to dhclient
[04:43] <arekmenner> Hm...
[04:43] <arekmenner> Sudo's really giving me some troubles.
[04:43] <crimsun> well-- I've found no client beside irssi that can actually handle all the networks and channels I'm in
[04:44] <crimsun> it's not uncommon for me to join upwards of 60
[04:44] <mdke> LaserJock, oy
[04:44] <crimsun> managing miniscule tabs in xchat*, konversation, et al, is just impossible
[04:44] <arekmenner> Oh my...
[04:44] <arekmenner> This isn't good.
[04:44] <rob> crimsun, tried treeview in xchat? I get lost in irssi after I join 50+ channels
[04:45] <crimsun> rob: yeah, but I don't prefer it
[04:45] <arekmenner> Er...
[04:45] <arekmenner> Again with the stupid tech questions..
[04:45] <arekmenner> Sudo doesn't like me anymore.
[04:45] <arekmenner> Wait...
[04:45] <mdke> arekmenner, you'll get better support in #ubuntu
[04:45] <arekmenner> Lemme check to make sure I'm a sudoer.
[04:45] <rob> I do have a whole virtual desktop dedicated to xchat windows though
[04:45] <arekmenner> mdke: I'm aware, I'm just thinking out lout. Sorry ^-^
[04:46] <Madpilot> arekmenner: if you're logged in as the first user - the one created during install - then you should have sudo rights
[04:46] <mdke> LaserJock, unping actually.
[04:46] <mdke> night all
[04:46] <rob> Right click on nick -> Kline :)
[04:46] <arekmenner> Madpilot: I just realized I'm not, we had an rsync party earlier, and everything's funky.
[04:46] <Madpilot> rob the bots were that bad?
[04:47] <rob> sometimes yes
[04:47] <Madpilot> night mdke
[04:47] <rob> my whois puts the ips/hosts in their own window too for easy access when klining ;)
[04:50] <arekmenner> So what all does the Doc Team document?
[04:51] <Madpilot> arekmenner: lots of things - have a look on the righthand side of doc.ubuntu.com for some of our stuff
[04:57] <LaserJock> mdke: ping, unping, jeeze ;p
[05:00] <mdke> LaserJock, ping
[05:00] <LaserJock> heh, pong
[05:01] <mdke> just ribbin ya. If you have a loose end, do you fancy doing some more ubuntu-docs stuff?
[05:01] <LaserJock> shoot
[05:02] <mdke> LaserJock, we need to add the translations to debian/install
[05:02] <mdke> I've done desktopguide and about-ubuntu
[05:02] <mdke> I'll just upload that
[05:03] <LaserJock> so do you want me to do other docs?
[05:04] <mdke> do you fancy doing the PG? maybe even the SG if you are enjoying it?
[05:04] <mdke> it's not fun
[05:04] <mdke> (uploaded)
[05:04] <LaserJock> k, I'll see what I can do. TZ tag team, we are good ;-)
[05:04] <arekmenner> back in a flash
[05:05] <mdke> LaserJock, I've organised the file a bug with comments and white spaces, it should be pretty clear what's up
[05:05] <mdke> btw, aren't there other files that should be in the package from the PG?
[05:06] <arekmenner> Er...
[05:06] <arekmenner> This is a little overwhelming.
[05:06] <LaserJock> mdke: like what?
[05:07] <Madpilot> arekmenner: what is?
[05:07] <arekmenner> I'm on two irc channels, and irssi is just overlapping them.
[05:07] <mdke> LaserJock, files/ and images/
[05:08] <arekmenner> Any tips on that?
[05:08] <Madpilot> arekmenner: awful as Gaim is, at least it's got a GUI with tabs for channels in IRC...
[05:08] <arekmenner> Hahah
[05:08] <arekmenner> Agreed.
[05:08] <LaserJock> mdke: yeah, files/ is used, images/ is not but it only has 1 image
[05:08] <mdke> not used?
[05:08] <mdke> kill!
[05:08] <LaserJock> sure
[05:09] <Madpilot> back later, all
[05:09] <mdke> and we need to install files/
[05:09] <LaserJock> mdke: so files/ is not included?
[05:09] <mdke> LaserJock, no, i don't see it in debian/install
[05:09] <mdke> and the link is broken
[05:10] <LaserJock> mdke: :(
[05:10] <arekmenner> Ah.
[05:10] <arekmenner> At least I have windows now.
[05:10] <LaserJock> mdke: I'll fix it then
[05:11] <mdke> LaserJock, it's a one liner though, no biggie
[05:11] <arekmenner> Rather, tabs.
[05:12] <LaserJock> mdke: ok, I'll try to get as far as I can, you can go to bed ;-)
[05:12] <mdke> okay, thanks
[05:12] <LaserJock> np
[05:15] <arekmenner> Ah.
[05:15] <arekmenner> Home sweet XChat.
[05:21] <arekmenner> So do we have a place on launchpad for error reports?
[05:21] <arekmenner> For documentation, that is.
[05:22] <arekmenner> Welcome back.
[06:57] <Burgundavia> ah, glorious free wireless
[06:58] <Madpilot> Burgundavia, in Seattle?
[06:58] <Burgundavia> yep
[06:58] <Madpilot> good boat trip down?
[06:58] <Burgundavia> pretty smooth
[06:58] <Burgundavia> got a window seat
[06:58] <Madpilot> nice
[06:59] <Madpilot> got any time in Seattle tomorrow before you fly out?
[07:00] <Burgundavia> nope, I fly out at 640
[07:00] <Madpilot> 0640? Erk. Hope you can get a wakeup call from the desk. Or several. :)
[07:01] <Burgundavia> I do on the way back
[07:29] <LaserJock> umm, yikes. Is there any espresso (or ubiquity) documentation?
[07:30] <LaserJock> I'm struggling with the partioning
[07:31] <Madpilot> worse than the old text installer's partitioning? (which wasn't bad, actually)
[07:32] <Burgundavia> the partitioner in ubiquity sucks
[07:33] <Madpilot> what is ubiquity?
[07:33] <Burgundavia> however, it is good for the standard use case
[07:33] <Burgundavia> espresso is not ubiquity
[07:33] <Burgundavia> s/not/now
[07:33] <Madpilot> ah
[07:33] <Madpilot> missed that
[07:34] <Madpilot> if you needed /boot, /, ~ & swap, how's ubiquity for setups like that?
[07:35] <Burgundavia> slightly counter intuitive
[07:35] <Burgundavia> hmm, my install went very badly
[07:36] <Madpilot> huh. I got very used to doing that setup with the Breezy installer - I think we did five installs on Clive's machine before the final one ;)
[07:36] <Burgundavia> there are lots of little bugs that I think are a symtom of that
[07:37] <LaserJock> I was going to tring to do LVM and there are no options
[07:38] <Burgundavia> yes, ubiquity handles the basic cases well, but hte more advanced cases badly
[07:38] <Burgundavia> as wehreas the text installer handles all soso
[07:39] <LaserJock> well, :(
[07:39] <LaserJock> I don't want to download the install .iso , I'll just make due
[07:41] <froggypinkle> hello
[07:41] <gaz00> hi
[07:41] <froggypinkle> do you think you could help me with my printer issue
[07:42] <Burgundavia> froggypinkle: please try #ubuntu
[07:42] <Burgundavia> this is not a help channel, this channel for chatting about documentation
[07:42] <froggypinkle> I have nobody talks back there
[07:42] <Burgundavia> have you tried the forums?
[07:43] <Madpilot> froggypinkle, just ask your question in #ubuntu, someone will probably answer
[07:43] <froggypinkle> yep and aparently its just supposed to work 
[07:50] <Burgundavia> froggypinkle: I would file a bug then
[07:51] <Burgundavia> froggypinkle: we are sorry, but we cannot help you here
[07:57] <Madpilot> gah - what's the URL for the list of Ubuntu mailing lists?
[07:57] <Burgundavia> lists.ubuntu.com
[07:57] <Madpilot> thanks, just found it :P
[07:57] <gaz00> http://www.ubuntu.com/community/lists
[07:58] <gaz00> Oooh..lists.ubuntu.com is even better
[07:58] <Burgundavia>  /community likely needs to be updated
[07:58] <gaz00> why isn't that linked off ubuntu.com?
[07:58] <gaz00> ;)
[07:58] <Burgundavia> because the website needs an overhaul
[07:59] <Madpilot> Burgundavia, something for you to do during your flight tomorrow!
[07:59] <Burgundavia> heh
[07:59] <Burgundavia> I intend to sleep
[07:59] <gaz00> multi-task.
[08:00] <Madpilot> after drinking all night? ;) (you are legal in Yankeeland now, right?)
[08:00] <LaserJock> grrrr, ubiquity partitioning is making me not so happy
[08:02] <Burgundavia> anyway, night 
[08:02] <Burgundavia> I might not have internet tomorrow, being in a town of 5k in OK
[08:23] <LaserJock> mdke: unfortunately I wasn't able to work on ubuntu-docs. I was trying to revive my Ubuntu box but espresso is not behaving well, I will look at it tomorrow if you don't get to it first
[10:02] <Madpilot> hi jsgotangco 
[10:02] <jsgotangco> hi Madpilot long time no chat
[10:02] <Madpilot> yeah. how've you been?
[10:02] <jsgotangco> pretty busy in real life  but still active in ubuntu on other fields
[10:03] <Madpilot> cool. I've been playing with Dapper Beta LiveCDs - finally tried out Xubuntu
[10:03] <jsgotangco> oh do you like it?
[10:03] <jsgotangco> i've used the first xubuntu iso from flight6
[10:04] <jsgotangco> i expected a smaller install though
[10:04] <robitaille> Xubuntu reminds me so much of my old window manager I had in unix in the mid-90s :)
[10:04] <Madpilot> I do, actually. "gnome lite"
[10:04] <jsgotangco> did the beta retain the spinning mouse?:
[10:05] <Madpilot> in the splashscreen? yes
[10:05] <jsgotangco> heh that was wicked
[10:05] <Madpilot> I think the other versions need animated splashscreens too! :)
[10:06] <jsgotangco> im very happy with the result of the beta
[10:06] <jsgotangco> it is very stable
[10:06] <Madpilot> seems like it - I was just running the LiveCD for a couple of hours
[10:06] <Madpilot> swearing at Gaim in between trying everything in the menus at least once
[10:07] <jsgotangco> irssi love dude
[10:07] <jsgotangco> if there is no client
[10:07] <jsgotangco> hehe
[10:07] <gobbe> in fact, xfce's old versions were quite 1:1 copy of cde
[10:07] <gobbe> cde's desktop
[10:07] <jsgotangco> yeah cde
[10:07] <Madpilot> jsgotangco, bah. If X exists, I'm going to use it ;)
[10:08] <Madpilot> cue my oft-repeated "Removing XChat-Gnome from Dapper is a huge mistake" line...
[10:08] <jsgotangco> i have to start updating my laptop page
[10:08] <jsgotangco> you're just not used to having GAIM as a chat client
[10:09] <Madpilot> no, all I do is IRC
[10:09] <jsgotangco> xchat-gnome is more confusing as an IRC client at first glance compared to GAIM
[10:10] <crimsun> gaim is just horrid, though
[10:10] <robitaille> jsgotangco:  personally I hated gaim irc client, and didn't like xchat-gnome.  xchat was fine.  But I prefer irrsi
[10:10] <jsgotangco> yeah funny we have irssi shipped
[10:10] <Madpilot> we should bring back XChat. When it first launches it goes right to #ubuntu by default - neither XChat-gnome nor gaim do that...
[10:10] <jsgotangco> but the channce most users will use it is pretty low
[10:11] <robitaille> I wonder if some higher up people uses it :)
[10:11] <jsgotangco> i use irssi mostly for remote connecting to my box
[10:11] <jsgotangco> s/for/when
[10:11] <Madpilot> robitaille, probably
[10:12] <crimsun> yeah, quarter after 4 AM. Bed time.
[10:12] <Madpilot> later robitaille 
[11:36] <mdke> LaserJoc1_away, np, thanks anyway
[11:37] <mdke> morning everyone
[03:04] <mdke> so I'm wondering if we should stop shipping html
[03:04] <mdke> I'm fairly sure that we won't have space to ship html of the translations as well as xml
[03:04] <mdke> so maybe it's worth giving up html
[03:05] <mdke> no one has ubuntu-docs installed without also having yelp, or very few people
[03:05] <mdke> and the html is on the website
[03:05] <mdke> any thoughts?
[03:06] <highvoltage> the only thing that comes to mind (not that i'm active with -doc), is that some people might want to read some docs off the CD before installing.
[03:07] <highvoltage> that's where html in the cd tree is nice though.
[03:07] <mdke> highvoltage, the live cd?
[03:08] <mdke> the livecd has yelp, and should display the xml ok
[03:08] <highvoltage> oh, right... i was thinking traditional cd.
[03:08] <mdke> hmm
[03:08] <mdke> not sure
[03:08] <highvoltage> yeah, then there seems little reason to keep duplicate docs around, as far as i can tell.
[03:09] <mdke> the main reason for html is that someone running a server might want to read the serverguide
[03:09] <mdke> but then again, ubuntu-docs isn't shipped in the server seed, so.
[03:09] <highvoltage> does that require anything else beside plaintext?
[03:09] <mdke> highvoltage, sorry, I don't understand the question
[03:10] <highvoltage> mdke: what i mean is, does the serverguide really require an html file with images? wouldn't a plain text document be enough?
[03:11] <mdke> highvoltage, well that's true. I don't know how to make plain text documents ;)
[03:11] <highvoltage> mdke: sorry, i might be going a bit off the topic you started from
[03:11] <highvoltage> hehe
[03:11] <mdke> but in any case, I doubt we'd have room to include plain text translations
[03:13] <mdke> what we should do for edgy is to make separate packages for each document, and have some metapackages, I suppose
[03:16] <mdke> maybe we should just include html for the server guide in english, and not other languages *shrug*
[03:20] <highvoltage> is there any sensitivity around the issue?
[03:21] <highvoltage> i suppose most people who would do a server install would have some kind of connectivity, with which they can get it on-line
[03:21] <mdke> yeah
[03:21] <mdke> and they don't have ubuntu-docs installed by default either, and might not think to look for it there
[03:21] <highvoltage> perhaps there should be a documentation tarball/iso that you could download seperate to the CD
[03:22] <mdke> they are more likely to find it on the website than in ubuntu-docs, certainly
[03:22] <highvoltage> yep
[03:22] <mdke> I'll mail the list, I think dropping it is the way forward
[04:32] <arekmenner> So do you fellows usually write the DocBook XML yourselves or use an exporter like MoinMoin wiki or that OpenOffice plugin?
[04:32] <highvoltage> anyone in -doc know where i can get ubuntu.ttf?
[04:33] <arekmenner> It'd probably be somewhere on doc.ubuntu.com
[04:33] <arekmenner> I'll go look for it for you.
[04:33] <arekmenner> Wait, we're talking a font, aren't we...
[04:33] <arekmenner> Silly me.
[04:34] <arekmenner> http://packages.ubuntu.com/dapper/x11/ttf-ubuntu-title
[04:34] <arekmenner> Could that perhaps be what you're looking for?
[04:36] <highvoltage> arekmenner: thanks!
[04:36] <arekmenner> No problem! ^-^
[04:36] <highvoltage> ^_^
[04:39] <arekmenner> So whenever any of you fellows get back, you could just tell me if you usually write DocBook by hand or export.
[04:40] <mdke> arekmenner, we write it by hand, at the moment there are not exporting tools which are good enough to make clean and valid docbook xml for our purposes
[04:41] <arekmenner> That's what I kind of assumed.
[04:43] <mdke> there are some plugins for clever editors and bluefish has some helpful features
[04:43] <mdke> you can't beat gedit though

[04:43] <arekmenner> But that means I'll have to install Cygwin on this box.
[04:43] <arekmenner> (Or get it dual-booting)
[04:43] <arekmenner> Oh well, I can just learn it for now.
[04:43] <mdke> you should generally use the operating system you're writing about :)
[04:44] <arekmenner> ^-^
[04:44] <arekmenner> I'll write on the laptop.
[04:45] <mdke> bbl
[05:08] <LaserJock> morning all
[05:09] <arekmenner> Morning.
[05:09] <arekmenner> How do?
[05:10] <LaserJock> hi arekmenner 
[05:10] <arekmenner> Not a whole lot going on in here.
[05:16] <rebelliousfreedo> hye everyone
[05:16] <arekmenner> Hello.
[05:16] <rebelliousfreedo> i need help
[05:16] <arekmenner> With what?
[05:16] <rebelliousfreedo> ubuntu
[05:16] <arekmenner> Hmm..
[05:16] <rebelliousfreedo> im newbie
[05:17] <arekmenner> That would probably be better suited for the IRC channel #ubuntu
[05:17] <rebelliousfreedo> oo really?
[05:17] <arekmenner> I hate to be so cheery and then ship you off somewhere else.
[05:17] <rebelliousfreedo> hmm
[05:17] <arekmenner> But this is mostly for writing documentation about ubuntu.
[05:17] <arekmenner> #ubuntu is the ubuntu help channel.
[05:17] <rebelliousfreedo> oo ok thanx
[05:17] <LaserJock> yeah, what arekmenner 
[05:17] <arekmenner> All you have to do is type /join #ubuntu
[05:17] <LaserJock> said
[05:17] <arekmenner> And then ask your question there.
[05:18] <arekmenner> Happy hunting!
[05:18] <arekmenner> Aw, he'll do fine.
[05:18] <LaserJock> mdke: is there any documentation for espresso/ubiquity?
[07:04] <mdke> LaserJock_away, yeah, Kamion writes it
[07:49] <trappist> who can edit http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/dapperbeta?  there's a couple of emails on the list about some mistakes
[07:50] <mdke> i'll have a look
[07:51] <trappist> and for future reference I'm usually available for proofreading high-profile publications like this - the doc says it's ours but I never heard about it until it was referred to on the list
[07:52] <mdke> mgalvin takes care of it, he writes them on the wiki then transfers it over
[07:52] <mdke> trappist, let him know, he often asks in here for reviewing, but you may not have been around
[07:58] <mdke> jane seems to like the lulu idea
[07:58] <mdke> good news
[08:02] <trappist> did I get removed from the launchpad group?
[08:02] <trappist> ah, found mgalvin
[08:10] <trappist> aw dangit.  looks like I removed myself from the group accidentally when I tried to leave another group.
[09:06] <LaserJock> mdke: glad to here jane likes the lulu ide
[09:06] <mdke> me too
[09:07] <LaserJock> well espresso has been a bust for me :(
[09:07] <LaserJock> I'm pretty disapointed
[09:07] <LaserJock> the livecd is awesome overall, fastest livecd I've ever seen
[09:08] <LaserJock> but I just can't get the partitioning to work at all and it keeps freezing on me
[09:08] <mdke> hit malone
[09:09] <LaserJock> yeah, I think most of the stuff is already reported
[09:09] <mdke> i would have thought so
[09:09] <LaserJock> but I have *no* linux ATM and I'm going to have download the regular install cd (which will take forever on my DSL)
[09:10] <mdke> yeah, I just went straight for the installer
[09:10] <LaserJock> espresso is great at wiping out all my partitions, it just can't make new ones very well
[09:11] <LaserJock> I even tried partitioning using gparted first and then running espresso
[09:11] <LaserJock> but it still wan't to reformat my partions as a different FS
[09:11] <LaserJock> s/wan't/wants/
[09:11] <mdke> annoying
[09:13] <LaserJock> bbl
[09:14] <mdke> we need to think about how to publish these guides then, paperback/hardback, size etc
[09:16] <LaserJock> yeah
[11:35] <poningru> question about a page on the wiki
[11:35] <poningru> the restricted formats page
[11:35] <poningru> can we put in a section about easyubuntu?
[11:36] <poningru> right at the begining