=== _TomB [n=ownthebo@ACD557AD.ipt.aol.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === shackan [n=shackan@host161-82.pool8257.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jouston [n=jouston@59-105-136-199.adsl.static.seed.net.tw] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Huahua [n=hua_@222.50.183.225] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ProN00b [n=dot@pD9E3AD49.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:31] will the behaviour of the eject cd button on the drive change with the next release ? === TomB| [n=ownthebo@ACD557AD.ipt.aol.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cassidy_ [n=cassidy@89.113-201-80.adsl.skynet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:41] ProN00b, the eject button on the cd drive should always have the same behaviour, regardless of release, because it is intended for one purpose only [12:41] *_* === infinito [n=infinito@VPNPOOL01-0149.UNI-MUENSTER.DE] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:42] (to eject the cd) [12:42] I'd be really concerned if my eject button suddenly started muting volume, or shutting down, or something [12:42] hmm, lemme try this again [12:43] but it was a common problem in dapper that it did Not eject the cd [12:44] ProN00b: intended behavior [12:44] HiddenWolf, why ? [12:45] why should a eject button not eject a cd ? [12:45] what wicked logic is behind this [12:45] ProN00b: I'm not the expert, but as far as I know it's not always possible to correctly catch the right hardware signal due to wacky hardware, and safely unmount/eject the disk [12:46] I'd rather have to manually unmount it than starting to eject mounted disks [12:46] then catch the signal, and try to unmount [12:46] if unpossible display error [12:46] Anyway, pitti should know === HiddenWolf afk === zenrox [n=zenrox@71.115.198.118] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:50] ProN00b, if something doesn't work, search the bugtracker, and if it isn't known already, file a bug. It's clearly not intended behaviour for the eject button to fail to eject [12:51] ok === mat [n=mat@igoan/mat] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:52] another thing i have to flame about: why don't you include updated release versions of programms (ff1.5 usw... (ff might be a bad example because of libs)) ? (you could at least put them into universe or multiverse) [01:04] Kamion: about? === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-130-84-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Arrogance [n=aks@ottawa-hs-209-217-96-69.d-ip.magma.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:05] hmm, why totem ? === human_blip [n=mike@220.157.65.181] has joined #ubuntu-devel === didymo [n=ashley@CPE-61-9-197-223.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Aegir [n=richard@d58-105-36-34.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #ubuntu-devel === lakin [n=lakin@S01060013101832ce.cg.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sfeehan [n=sfeehan@pool-71-254-4-163.burl.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Aegir_ [n=richard@d58-105-36-34.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === _lemsx1_ [n=lemsx1@p86-65.acedsl.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:52] Damnit, where do .mime files go again on install? === Arrogance [n=aks@ottawa-hs-209-217-96-69.d-ip.magma.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Cimmerian [n=crom@ti200710a080-12879.bb.online.no] has joined #ubuntu-devel === LeeJunFan [n=junfan@adsl-69-210-207-5.dsl.klmzmi.ameritech.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === slomo_ [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:09] Heya slomo_ === Surak [n=Surak@201009094070.user.veloxzone.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mgalvin [n=mgalvin@ubuntu/member/mgalvin] has joined #ubuntu-devel === _lemsx1_ [n=lemsx1@p86-65.acedsl.com] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [03:36] is disk really the right group for raw1394? === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-130-84-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Surak [n=Surak@201009094070.user.veloxzone.com.br] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === shaya [n=spotter@bzq-88-154-3-248.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-130-84-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === shackan_ [n=shackan@host182-137.pool876.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.30] has joined #ubuntu-devel === human_blip [n=mike@220.157.65.181] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ealden [n=ealden@203.76.211.143] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ogra_ibook [n=ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mhz [n=mhz_chil@moinmoin/fan/mhz] has joined #ubuntu-devel === shackan__ [n=shackan@host11-46.pool8261.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Aegir [n=richard@d58-105-36-34.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Aegir [n=richard@d58-105-36-34.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-130-84-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Arr0gance [n=aks@ottawa-hs-209-217-84-245.d-ip.magma.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zakame [n=zak@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Arr0gance [n=aks@ottawa-hs-209-217-84-245.d-ip.magma.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel [06:01] lol i go to the impi linux website and ubuntu is classified as economy class === j_ack [n=nico@p508D82E6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === psquared89 [n=pat@ppp-70-227-65-129.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jdong wonders when updated l-r-m and l-i packages will show up on mirrors :) [06:22] whenever k NEWs them. I wouldn't hold my breath -- probably Monday. Let 'im have the weekend at least. [06:23] thanks, crimsun === psquared89 [n=pat@ppp-70-227-65-129.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Konversation] [06:42] mmm. the new artwork changes are nice === bpuccio [n=brian@ool-457a9c38.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zyga [n=zyga@ubuntu/member/zyga] has joined #ubuntu-devel === robitaille [n=daniel@ubuntu/member/robitaille] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stratus [n=stratus@201-25-32-172.paemt705.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel === hunger [n=tobias@p54A62BE1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Aegir [n=richard@d58-105-36-34.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel === j^ [n=j@e178004089.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === stub [n=stub@ppp-58.8.4.140.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #ubuntu-devel === kagou [n=kagou@84.7.25.66] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:01] hi === j^ [n=j@e178004089.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gloubiboulga [n=gauvain@ubuntu/member/gloubiboulga] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Lure [n=lure@clj46-234.dial-up.arnes.si] has joined #ubuntu-devel === TomB| [n=ownthebo@ACD557AD.ipt.aol.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === highvoltage [n=Jono@mtngprs7.mtn.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.30] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:16] morning all === smurf [n=smurf@debian/developer/smurf] has joined #ubuntu-devel === doko__ [n=doko@dslb-088-073-096-020.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === shackan_ [n=shackan@host6-141.pool876.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel === dsas [n=dean@host81-158-83-28.range81-158.btcentralplus.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === freeflying [n=freeflyi@61.190.65.30] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:19] hi all === Hirion [n=hirion@draugr.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh [n=shermann@ubuntu/member/backslash-sh] has joined #ubuntu-devel === blixtra [n=chris@i577B0020.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Loevborg [n=loevborg@d2-117.dip.axsp.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jamesh [n=james@203-166-236-175.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:29] anyone seen heno on IRC recently? === zakame [n=zakame@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:30] nope [10:31] hi all [10:31] <\sh> moins [10:32] \sh, nice to see you back again [10:32] hello \sh ! [10:32] hi [10:32] <\sh> jsgotangco: thx :) === Fjodor [n=sune@0x55510b65.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sivang wonders if ubuntu-artwork is the right place to ask an icon for a program that will probably be in main for dapper+1 [10:39] see, I want it to be co-herent with the rest of the artwork === _TomB [n=ownthebo@ACD8FE51.ipt.aol.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ozamosi- [n=nozamosi@h145n12c1o1049.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jsgotangco [n=jsg@ubuntu/member/jsgotangco] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ozamosi- is now known as ozamosi [11:34] anybody knows the difference between 'dip' and 'dialout' groups? [11:34] I'm looking at malone #40802 [11:34] Malone bug 40802 in gnome-system-tools "in users-admin user privileges there are 3 modem entries" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/40802 [11:35] sivang: dialout get modem access, dip can run ppp when they dialin IIRC. (dial-in-ip) IIRC. [11:36] okay, so this needs clarification then [11:36] what do you think about the audio entry?: [11:36] "audio" => _("Use serial devices such as Modems and Palm Pilots."), [11:36] this seems to be as a glitch ;-) [11:36] wow, that seems confusing [11:36] yes [11:36] loudly confusing === Keybuk [n=scott@syndicate.netsplit.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:40] hmm, I wish pitti was here so I could have asked him about 'audio' group [11:40] Keybuk: Heya Scott, maybe you could shed some light, is that exactly what audio group is about? : [11:40] "audio" => _("Use serial devices such as Modems and Palm Pilots."), [11:40] (taken fro users-conf in s-t-b) [11:41] lifeless: so dip is actually for being able to run ppp over a serial interface or so? [11:42] that was memory, I suggest goodle tc [11:42] tc->etc [11:43] hmm google suggests you do need to be in audio to access some modems === ssam [n=ssam@80-41-76-144.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:45] sivang: I think audio is largely a hang-over from Debian [11:46] Keybuk: what happened to "Being able to play audio" ;-) [11:46] I was just checking that [11:46] indeed, audio is the group that can write to audio devices on the system [11:46] Keybuk: I'm trying to help malone #40802 [11:47] Malone bug 40802 in gnome-system-tools "in users-admin user privileges there are 3 modem entries" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/40802 [11:47] audio should be "Use audo devices" === HiddenWolf [n=HiddenWo@136.158.dynamic.phpg.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:48] the other two "modem" devices -- one is describing actual modems, ie. pci and isdn modems [11:48] Keybuk: okay, I need to find the patch that changed that, since this used to be like this once, and remove it, it's a start against confusing :) [11:48] one is just describing serial ports in general [11:48] yes [11:48] obviously we can put actual modems in the modem group, but a serial device can be many things [11:48] indeed. a serial connection between a laptop and a black VT box os so [11:48] *or [11:49] Keybuk: gotta run for a while, be back in 30 minutes. === nmsa [n=alcatel@86.125.56.74] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === raphink [n=raphink@ubuntu/member/raphink] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sivang -> back [12:02] Woo hoo! Convention Report = 800+ CDs distributed, ubuntu talk totally packed. World Domination, on schedule. [12:03] pfftt that's nothing when the LTS system gets in place [12:03] (Laser Targetting System) [12:03] word. [12:04] whiprush: i'm happy to know you're still awake at this time :) [12:04] Keybuk: dude I totally owe you some info on that one bug report, I feel shitty for it being so crappy in the first place. [12:06] whiprush: heh, yeah :) [12:06] Keybuk: so, as basw-passwd docs say: [12:06] dialout = Full and direct access to serial ports. Members of this group can reconfigure the modem, dial anywhere, etc. [12:06] I think I'll make a patch now :) [12:07] <\sh> I think /usr/sbin/dip was something like a dial in helper program for pppd...something like expect or chat [12:08] so dudes I'm on day three at this linux convention here at home, you guys wouldn't /believe/ the excitement around dapper. [12:09] This guy from Google, chris dibona, is like, fanboi #1. [12:09] whiprush: excellent [12:09] whiprush: and you're whipping up the hype too? [12:09] my talk was packed. [12:09] it's just unreal man. [12:09] dibona was there? [12:09] yeah. [12:10] whiprush: fun! [12:10] ajmitch: he was with dibona dude, talk about celebrity status === jsgotangco is nort worthy of whiprush [12:10] jsgotangco: almost as much of a celebrity speaker as you? [12:10] Dude so he's like "You guys won't believe how awesome ubuntu is. Stop what you're doing, get the CD." [12:10] naw i'm already past my prime [12:10] <\sh> I wonder who this dibona guy is? [12:10] he heads up google's open source office [12:10] hi \sh! [12:11] \sh: he used to be one of the original slashdot editors [12:11] he was previously with VA and so on [12:11] <\sh> oh this dibona guy :) yeah I remember :) [12:11] whiprush: so when's the ohio linux thingy? === shackan_ [n=shackan@host104-86.pool8261.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:12] jdub: I talked to them today, in october, I have the contacts, I mentioned "the plan". [12:12] they will email you soon. [12:12] whiprush: sweet [12:12] "the plan" ? is jdub living in airports for a month again? [12:12] jdub: looks like aseigo is a go too, it should be sweet. [12:12] "the plan" [12:12] whiprush: are there public dates in october? [12:14] jdub: The dates just got finalized, I will email them to you as soon as the guy wakes up, I think I drank him under the table. [12:14] <\sh> aseigo could be the man to push kubuntu as no. 1 kde distro in europe [12:14] \sh: probably better to get a european [12:14] jdub: there will be a python track this year too. You have no excuse. :D [12:14] whiprush: rock, thanks :) [12:14] heh [12:15] wou;d there be a shaving auction event too? [12:15] <\sh> jdub: well, he's sponsored by the trolls, he is a good spokesman for kde...ok, another choice would be mr. ettrich, but he signed already a crontract with the trolls :) [12:16] jdub: dude, I can't begin to explain how pumped up people are for dapper. [12:16] I've been flooded for three days of people. [12:16] Eft is the future! [12:16] from all walks of life ... it's been /amazing/ [12:17] jdub: blog post will follow on the event of course. [12:17] <\sh> jdub: another idea is, stay a couple of months in the netherlands, get cloned with a bit of kde drugs in your blood, and kubuntu will have jdub2, the fanatic blue guy without pants ;) [12:17] whiprush: lots of people at LWE sydney were pissed that dapper was delayed, and that i didn't have dapper CDs anyway - holy crap [12:17] jdub: oddly enough, when I explained the delay, I got nothing but nods. [12:17] the plan, october etc, all of those linux conferences? [12:17] \sh: the host would reject the transplant [12:18] I think a majority of them are still very happy with breezy. [12:18] yeah [12:18] whiprush: that's pretty normal, breezy is incredibly stable for most people [12:18] "okay, so you're telling me it's going to be better, and that there are good reasons for it... 'sok by me!" [12:18] jdub: until I did the last minute of XGL, then all of a sudden, they're all about edgy. :D [12:18] heh [12:18] heh [12:18] LWE was pretty funny [12:18] i had dapper running with XGL on my 24" lcd === janimo [n=jani@Home03207.cluj.astral.ro] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:19] jdub: oh, sweetness [12:19] and the novell guys (with big fancy stand) only had videos of their XGL demo [12:19] <\sh> jdub: very sad, but then we need someone who is as charismatic as you, and have your skills to hypnotise the masses [12:19] so everyone loved the linux australia stand [12:19] jdub: I did an ubuntu on sunray talk too.... [12:19] whiprush: how did that go? [12:19] GLEE. [12:19] whiprush: what's sunray? [12:19] jdub: is there a linux presence in CeBit in Darling harbour? [12:21] jsgotangco: now that i won't be away, i'll be there ;) [12:21] jsgotangco: there are a bunch of local linux companies as well as LA and OSIA [12:21] who will be there [12:21] ahh [12:21] sivang: a thin client. [12:22] so like, pre-edubuntu thin clients. :D [12:22] jsgotangco: each of the cebit sections is called a 'parc' (numbskulls), and there is a 'linux parc' [12:22] jdub: yeah i was looking through the website a few days ago, i won't be anywhere near that place that time though [12:23] i will most likely be in hanover next year though [12:23] ohh LA is a sponsor [12:23] jsgotangco: 'partner' more like ;) [12:24] <\sh> jsgotangco: so we can meet in hannover next year for an early morning visit to the bavarian cebit hall...to have a "Mass Weissbier and a Weisswurst" ;) [12:25] \sh: i'll take note of that, we're scheduled already for hannover as early sa now [12:26] jdub: I spent about an hour going over pessulus and sabayon, and explaining how we deploy mass desktops with custom profiles. [12:26] did the whole thing live, very cool. === sivang wonders how one can manage a job / RF and attending so many events and conferences :-) [12:26] <\sh> jsgotangco: don't go there during the weekend..weekend is "collectors day"...better to visit the cebit the first 3-4 days.... [12:26] whiprush: rawk! [12:26] whiprush: they must have digged pessulus so much [12:27] jsgotangco: it's incredible, how even among linux people, how things like pessulus are not well known. [12:27] sabayon got people clapping though. [12:27] yeah [12:27] and deskbar? [12:28] Xnested thing, click and drag, make your profile, done and done. [12:28] oh dude, you know I did the deskbar. :D [12:28] DONE. [12:28] so we made the profile, and I deployed a few different ones === Keybuk doesn't "get" the desk bar [12:28] did some "deployment" stuff... [12:29] My last slide was called "Holy Crap!" [12:29] <\sh> whiprush: how do you massdeploy, via fai or kickstart? [12:29] which was showing the profile stuff stuffed into LDAP. [12:29] \sh: kickstart [12:29] <\sh> whiprush: oh well, when I'm finished with my project, let's talk about the "real thing" (tm) named FAI :) [12:29] so you can like, stick all the goodies in LDAP, and deploy the profiles by OU. [12:30] even the windows guys were impressed. === sivang nods to \sh about the coolness of this buzzword ;-) [12:30] \sh: fai is poop [12:30] I have a cute demo I give to Windows users now [12:30] I install dapper onto a laptop [12:30] \sh: I have lots of old RHEL kickstart scripts, so I just reuse those. ::D [12:30] take the hard drive out, then boot it in a completely different laptop [12:31] and watch their open jaws when it doesn't spend the next week playing the "Found new hardware" game [12:31] Keybuk: hehe , they probably don't know what hit them :) [12:31] Keybuk: tickling their abstract funny bone only gets you so far :-) [12:31] or ever ask for the CD :) [12:31] <\sh> jdub: fai is the best thing to install and setup a lot of servers.... [12:31] jdub: the one bummer is that I couldn't get gimmie to work out of cvs for a lightning talk, I really wanted to say "GNOME IS MADE OF PEOPLE!" [12:31] whiprush: ha ha [12:32] jdub: it's an extreme example, but it's not that unusual for even minor hardware changes to annoy Windows users -- it's a cute way to demonstrate Ubuntu deals with hardware changes perfectly [12:32] well, other than X [12:32] \sh: naw, it only seems like it. kickstart + cfengine is much better. (fai is like an abused kickstart plus a lame cfengine-lite, so why not go for the real deal?) [12:32] jdub: people really like the new add/remove programs, and gdebi. [12:33] whiprush: yeah, the new g-a-i is really raising eyebrows [12:33] whiprush: did you get some new ideas for g-a-i? [12:33] jsgotangco: mostly just oohs and aahs. [12:34] most of my problem areas were non ubuntu specific, things like an oddball broadcom and whatnot [12:34] <\sh> jdub: kickstart is just like autoyast :) but with fai I can implement deployment not only of debian based distros but as well rpmdistros like suse or redhat (that's my project right now), and for rolling out configurations, fai is able to use cfengine1/2 ...which is again implemented by default [12:34] Keybuk only that pnp desktop resize with external monitors and projectors is more common than replacing the laptop of a harddisk [12:34] <\sh> jdub: and the main dev is sitting in cologne :) [12:34] can anyone tell me *why* on God's green earth pygtk's gtk.main() wrapper eats exceptions? [12:34] it's so dangerous [12:35] j^: we should team up on daniels and harass him about x automagic stuff [12:39] is the kubuntu live fs being built? today's live CD doesn't contain the new kubuntu-meta [12:39] or maybe a build time of 01:45:27 BST is too late for it === jsgotangco_ [n=jsg@125.212.120.253] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh__ [n=shermann@xdsl-81-173-252-99.netcologne.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:46] jdub first step would be Auto enabling and disabling Xinerama screens. === janimo [n=jani@Home03207.cluj.astral.ro] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [12:52] oh man [12:52] i just had the most awesome idea for dapper release love [12:53] oh aye? === Znarl [n=karl@bb-82-108-14-161.ukonline.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:53] have to make sure it's viable first [12:53] before i blather it [12:56] <\sh> space, the final frontier, these are the adventures of Ubuntu Dapper Drake... === jpatrick [n=patrick@ubuntu/member/jpatrick] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:57] \sh disk space? [12:59] <\sh> s/space/time/ ? [01:01] heh [01:01] \sh: I started reading Einsetien's Relativity book [01:02] \sh: then one he claims is for "people with high scholl knowledge" to understand [01:02] nice so far [01:03] heh [01:05] <\sh> sivang: good to know, that einstein himself was not good in school :) [01:05] hehe [01:06] \sh: but it's true, he actually did physics in his spare time from the patent office in germany I think [01:06] \sh: he used to be a patent accountant or something [01:06] and he did not do so good at school [01:06] (or maybe it was switzeland, can't recall) [01:07] <\sh> swiss :) [01:07] right :) [01:07] <\sh> and he messed up with the university-entrance diploma :) === jpatrick [n=patrick@ubuntu/member/jpatrick] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:08] \sh: heh, he did? did he try to cheat? :-) [01:08] <\sh> no...i just failed an exam :) [01:08] \sh: LOL [01:09] <\sh> so he had to repeat one school term [01:10] <\sh> http://www-groups.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/Biographies/Einstein.html [01:12] \sh: nice, reading now [01:12] good night [01:13] night jsgotangco === Huahua [n=hua_@221.172.48.164] has joined #ubuntu-devel === lbm [n=lbm@x1-6-00-13-10-7a-d1-e4.k233.webspeed.dk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:31] Riddell: I hadn't turned the dailies back on yet. Doing now. === highvoltage [n=Jono@mtngprs7.mtn.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jono [n=jono@88-107-8-94.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:42] infinity: could you start a livefs build running? [01:43] Riddell: Any particular arch you want? [01:44] infinity: all of them would be good [01:44] wanting to test ubiquity [01:45] Riddell: Kay. I'll do amd64/i386/powerpc. [01:45] thanks [01:46] Want me to spin the ISOs when I'm done, or are you all over that? === ploum [n=Ploum@ubuntu/member/ploum] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:47] if it's no hassle to you that would be lovely [01:48] Riddell: I'm working on all those "zapped my partition table" bugs, BTW [01:48] Riddell: there are basically three problems there [01:48] Kamion: Espresso doesn't always seem to cause a /etc/mkinitramfs/conf.d/resume to appear [01:48] Riddell: one is that ubiquity's UI throws an exception at all (and we just have to fix each of those in turn) [01:48] mjg59: s/always/ever/ [01:48] Excellent [01:48] mjg59: I know, just heard about that in my mail this morning, will sort something out [01:49] Heh. No problem [01:49] Riddell: the second is that pygtk doesn't propagate exceptions beyond nested gtk.main() calls; I don't know if you have the same issue with pykde [01:49] Riddell: the third is that partman doesn't generally run with 'set -e' and so doesn't notice the debconffilter going away, and carries on merrily regardless [01:50] Riddell: to address the second, I'm going to add an exception handler to gtkui that puts up an exception dialog, asks people to file a bug, and then exits; you may like to do something similar in kde-ui === phanatic [n=phanatic@ubuntu/member/phanatic] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:51] from ubiquity.frontend.yesnodialogue import YesNoDialogue [01:51] Riddell: ^-- you don't appear to have added that to bzr [01:55] <\sh> Riddell: btw...did you try the KGlobal.locale().insertCatalogue(...) for the translation stuff? [01:57] guys: i have to do my second ubuntu talk in a few hours, can someone summarize the core duo/wifi situation? [01:57] 3945 stuff? [01:57] yeah [01:57] i believe there's an effort to make sure what exists will be in the kernel [01:58] but what exists right now doesn't seem all that hot [01:58] It's in the kernel [01:58] so it might not be elite for dapper [01:58] ok, we're doing a manual three step process here. [01:58] it's the driver, the blob, and some other thing. [01:58] Driver is in the kernel, the rest is in l-r-m [01:58] Driver, firmware, and binary-only daemon. [01:59] Just needs to get through NEW [01:59] I believe === infinity nods. [01:59] metal. [01:59] That's in progress right now. [01:59] Getting test feedback would be good [01:59] I've got no test hardware, and nor does infinity [01:59] mjg59: so I totally added to your mystique. I got a bunch of acpi questions. [01:59] binary-only daemon? I thought intel was quite open wrt their wireless chipsets? === poningru_ [n=poningru@n128-227-50-237.xlate.ufl.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:00] Chipzz: Yeah, the situation is a bit complicated [02:00] and my answer was "Top men are on it, they're very British, and don't go to his blog, unless you want to hear multiple instances of a C word I can't say here." [02:00] whiprush: Go ahead [02:00] lemme guess... patents? :P [02:00] child-molesters? [02:01] Hahaha [02:01] Chipzz: FCC [02:01] Chipzz: Actually, paranoid lawyers [02:01] something like "yeah, and so, the laptop guy is a total alcoholic ..." [02:01] "that's how screwed we are." [02:01] Aw. I had one small glass of vodka yesterday. [02:02] And really quite a lot of beer the night before [02:02] <\sh> that's nothing [02:02] mjg59: vodka-redbull! ;) [02:03] mjg59: anyway, what's different compared to ipw2[12] 00 for the lawyers? [02:04] <\sh> Chipzz: that's pestilent :) [02:04] pestilent? [02:04] Chipzz: the norty stuff is done in software instead of firmware/hardware [02:05] jdub: "win-wifi"? :P :/ [02:05] yes [02:05] crap [02:05] have they learned NOTHING then? === Chipzz sighs :( [02:06] you thought that after the whole win-modem debacle people would know better [02:06] ffs :( [02:06] Riddell: could you add -I.bzrignore to the list of flags you pass to dpkg-source when building packages? I don't think there's much point in including .bzrignore in ubiquity source packages. [02:06] <\sh> Chipzz: the redbull stuff in vodka [02:07] 14:00 < mjg59> Chipzz: Yeah, the situation is a bit complicated [02:08] hrrrm [02:08] nm that [02:08] \sh: msg me please. [02:09] Riddell: also your source tree isn't quite clean - you have debian/ubiquity-guadalinex-doc/ lying around there (which is commented out of debian/control, so debian/rules clean doesn't clean it) [02:12] Chipzz: Having software control the Tx/Rx power seems perfectly reasonable to me. It just also happens to be something the FCC would prefer was obfuscated and not generally available. [02:13] Chipzz: So, Intel releases a binary-only daemon to make the FCC happy and limit their liability, and other people reverse engineer it and provide a free alternative at their own risk (just as people take to wifi firmware with hex editors to make FCC-unfriendly changes currently) [02:13] hrrrm [02:13] could be worse I guess [02:13] Chipzz: In the end, if a free alternative is produced, I doubt the FCC will go after them, but Intel would prefer not to lose FCC licenses or suffer fines. Individuals likely care less. [02:14] infinity: and individuals would also be "less liable"? [02:14] (is that even a word, liable? :P) [02:14] Anyhow, the situation is a bit icky, the binary-only daemon is rather sketchy, but word on the street (from people who own the hardware) is that it works. [02:15] Chipzz: Individuals would be just as liable for pissing off the FCC, but if they do it outside the US, there's nothing they can really do about it. [02:15] infinity: what's the situation for us if people DO reverse engineer it? [02:15] And then the only people breaking the law are people who use the new free/open code to increase their transmission rates further than the law allows, which is your own risk, no one else's. [02:17] At any rate, the FCC's ability to demand obfuscation of code to change Tx power is sketchy at best. They may feel the urge to test it in court against someone they can make an example of (Intel, Broadcom, etc), but I doubt they'd care to go after Joe Q Hacker. Don't take that as solid legal advice to go do it, though. [02:17] so, either we include a binary only daemon, OR, we do not include a reverse engineered daemon? [02:17] I'll just wait for some enterprising Australian resident (oh wait, I live in .au) to do it. [02:18] Chipzz: Erm, what? No. Either we include the binary daemon, or we include a free/open one when one is made available. [02:18] either way it still sucks [02:18] "14:15 < infinity> And then the only people breaking the law are people who use the new free/open code" [02:18] Chipzz: Distributing it doesn't constitute circumvention any more than distributing a free zip file password cracker. [02:18] wouldn't that be a problem? [02:18] Chipzz: You cut off my sentence. [02:18] Chipzz: "people who use it to increase their Tx rates out of FCC-allowed spec" [02:19] Anyhow, way offtopic, not sure why I'm discussing this here. [02:20] sorry about that, didn't want to misrepresent what you said... guess I just misunderstood [02:20] k will shut-up now ;) === kmon [n=javier@217.Red-80-25-51.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:22] infinity: not to mention the damage of radiation :) [02:22] infinity: when in access outside the limits, that is [02:22] sivang: the animals in tschernobil also survive... so will our children ;) [02:23] Hi. Anyone knows why the linux-image & linux-restricted-modules 2.6.15.21 update isn't available yet? [02:23] Chipzz: not sure how those experiments are conducted ;-) [02:23] kmon: Happening as we speak. [02:23] sivang: experiments? :) [02:23] infinity: Oh. Great :) [02:23] Chipzz: never mind, let's cut the off topic ness :) [02:24] sivang: uhu :) [02:24] infinity: so I heared yo're pulling in support for the new ATIs in the 60's :-) Couldn't you do that before I purchased my T43? [02:25] kmon: when package names change, they go into the new queue for manual approval. [02:25] that is, for the {T|X}60's :-) [02:26] Kamion: Dude, is there a particularly sane reason why cron.daily-live returns instantly and does... Well... Nothing? [02:26] ah , actually not much of a problem, the current fglrx is giving nasty corruption that might still be worthwhile debugging even [02:26] sivang: i think the T43's are nicer than the 60's anyway :) [02:26] highvoltage: that's a first timer, and a cheering hand! Let me know your reasons :) [02:26] (in another channel) [02:27] sivang: well, first of all, the X60's are damn ugly [02:27] sivang: it's also a bit big, i like the idea of having a laptop that's at least mobile [02:27] sivang: and that big screen also drinks battery power like it's Sprite lite. [02:28] highvoltage: they claim to have ground breaking battery life :) [02:28] together with dual core processing, this seems a bit unreal [02:28] mdke: sorry, were you talking to us? [02:28] yeah [02:28] highvoltage: he's right, PMing [02:28] mdke: even though it's sunday? :-) [02:28] O:-) [02:28] Kamion: Oh. Filesystem's full. Feh. [02:29] infinity: /dev/sda3 562456664 533885524 0 100% / [02:29] I'll sort it out [02:29] sivang, it looks to me like the developers are trying to do some work, so yeah, keeping to the topic is important even today === infinity never seems to look there first, until something whines about it. [02:29] (In this cash, baz whined) [02:29] s/cash/case/ [02:33] mdke: noted, agreed, sorry again :) [02:34] FWIW, I don't mind much when people let their hair down a bit on the weekend and go a bit off-topic here. Others may care more, though. :) === glatzor [n=sebi@ppp-88-217-1-52.mnet-online.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:40] infinity: all I can say, that I'm greatful for you giving an off topic advice here once, about getting 1400x1050 on a thinkpad :) [02:44] infinity: little should be happier now [02:44] mjg59, I'm getting a debconf question for the latest acpi-support, is that intended? [02:45] mdke: No [02:45] Especially since it doesn't have any debconf support [02:45] What's the issue? [02:45] Uhm, yeah. No debconf at all... [02:46] mdke: Do you mean a conffile prompt? [02:46] (That would be intentional) [02:46] ah could be [02:46] sorry, I heard once that users shouldn't ever see those questions === j_ack [n=nico@p508D82E6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:46] is that wrong? [02:47] No, users shouldn't ever see them IF no conffiles actually got changed. [02:47] You quite probably chnaged yours. :) [02:47] yes, I did. fine, thanks [02:47] Kamion: Thanks. === lemsto [n=salim@ANantes-154-1-100-154.w86-214.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:02] Riddell: You have new ISOs. === j^ [n=j@i577B28BD.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh has to download an actual ubiquity source package.. === zul [n=chuck@ubuntu/member/zul] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:16] heylo === stub [n=stub@ppp-58.8.4.140.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ploum_ [n=Ploum@101-236.242.81.adsl.skynet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === ploum_ [n=Ploum@101-236.242.81.adsl.skynet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === bddebian [n=bdefrees@71.224.172.103] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:39] Howdy [03:40] <\sh> hey bddebian [03:41] Hi \sh! === Surak [n=Surak@201009094070.user.veloxzone.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel [03:57] Kamion, I noticed the name of espresso changed to ubiquity. What happened? [03:57] Surak: make it more Ubuntu-ish [03:58] And give it some more meaning, as well... [03:58] "espresso" was meaningless, if you didn't know the name was derived from "Ubuntu Express" [03:59] But Ubiquity has meaning in itself, as in "we want Ubuntu to be Ubiquitous, and Ubiquity will help make that happen". === infinity still has a fondness in his heart for pitti's "Prestobuntu" suggestion, though. [04:01] hehe [04:01] prestobuntu reminds me of 'prestobarba', the most popular razor blade in brazil [04:01] infinity: I don't suppose you ever got a chance to take a look at ivtools? [04:02] Nope, I've been busy slacking with beta releases and then falling deathly ill. [04:02] Ugh, sorry to hear that === apokryphos [i=[U2FsdGV@server2.polaristar.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Natja [n=lionel@102-44.240.81.adsl.skynet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zul__ [n=chuck@CPE0006258ec6c1-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === zakame [n=zak@ubuntu/member/zakame] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:31] Heya zakame [04:31] hello bddebian! :D === pvanhoof [n=pvanhoof@d54C0E27E.access.telenet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === cassidy [n=cassidy@225-130.240.81.adsl.skynet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jinty [n=jinty@173.Red-83-56-136.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === dborg [n=daniel@e182053050.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:50] Riddell: Also, kdelibs is FTBFS, due to mismatched types in the cups stuff; kdewebdev is FTBFS trying to iterate a for loop over an empty glob. === infinito [n=infinito@VPNPOOL01-0381.UNI-MUENSTER.DE] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:51] Diziet: Your mozilla-firefox-locale-all upload fails to build. === slomo [n=slomo@ubuntu/member/slomo] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:52] Diziet: Your pango1.0 is also FTBS. === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-130-84-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:54] ah, that explains the homepages breaking === wasabi__ [n=wasabi@c-67-172-206-227.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:56] am i right in thinking that kde applications (eg kword) are hidden from the gnome menu? should Bug #40501 be rejected? [04:56] Malone bug 40501 in koffice kword "Kword does not appear in menu" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://launchpad.net/bugs/40501 [04:56] mdke: Were you the one that was helping my dumb ass with anjuta? [04:58] bddebian, no, sorry === Surak [n=Surak@201009094070.user.veloxzone.com.br] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [04:59] NP === chris^ [n=chris@ACB41BE7.ipt.aol.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:04] Diziet: Ahh, nevermind the pango1.0 failure, you should have just used a versioned build-dep on the newer fontconfig. Tsk, tsk. [05:05] mdke: Well, what do you know about mime/xml files? :-) === shackan [n=shackan@host184-141.pool876.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:10] ssam: they are not generally hidden [05:10] Diziet: And mozilla-firefox-locale-all seems much happier with a build-dep on ubuntu-docs. Fix uploaded. You're off the hook. [05:10] Riddell: You get to fix your own this time, though. :) [05:11] infinity: yep, thanks === mhz [n=mhz_chil@pc-130-84-214-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === \sh [n=shermann@ubuntu/member/backslash-sh] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:15] Riddell, so it is a bug that kword does not show in the gnome menu? rather than policy? === chris^ [n=chris@ACB41BE7.ipt.aol.com] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Verlassend"] [05:15] ssam: yes [05:16] Missing/broken .desktop file? [05:18] anybody seen smurf ? [05:19] Heya sivang [05:19] Not in the last 20 years or so.. ;-P === pitti [n=pitti@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Burgundavia [n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:21]