/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/04/30/#ubuntu-meeting.txt

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freeflying@schedule Shanghai11:29
UbugtuSchedule for Asia/Shanghai: 26 Apr 04:00: Technical Board | 26 Apr 20:00: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 21:30: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 10:00: Dapper Development Status | 28 Apr 06:00: Kubuntu11:29
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lucasvo@schedule gmt+112:23
lucasvo@schedule GMT+212:23
lucasvoUbugtu is dead?12:24
lucasvo@schedule12:24
Ubugtuschedule Retrieve the date/time of scheduled meetings in a specific timezone12:24
lucasvo@schedule GMT+212:24
lucasvo@schedule UTC+212:25
lucasvo@schedule Berlin12:25
UbugtuSchedule for Europe/Berlin: 25 Apr 22:00: Technical Board | 26 Apr 14:00: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 15:30: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 04:00: Dapper Development Status | 28 Apr 00:00: Kubuntu12:25
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ubuntu_lt@schedule Vilnius12:41
UbugtuSchedule for Europe/Vilnius: 25 Apr 23:00: Technical Board | 26 Apr 15:00: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 16:30: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 05:00: Dapper Development Status | 28 Apr 01:00: Kubuntu12:41
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 25 Apr 20:00 UTC: Technical Board | 26 Apr 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 13:30 UTC: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu
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zulmeeting is half hour isnt it?09:30
mjg59Yup09:32
simirawhich?09:32
zulTB09:32
simiratech09:32
simirawhen's the next cc?09:32
zulnext week i think09:33
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Seveasnot yet set09:36
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Current meeting: Technical Board | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 26 Apr 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 13:30 UTC: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu
ograhmm the agenda is emty again09:55
ogra*empty09:55
janimocandidates09:55
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ograi dont see a valid main candidate09:56
dholbachmdz, mjg59, Keybuk: gloubigoula (Gauvain) asked me to tell you that he'd be 30 minutes late09:56
ograand the universe candidates didnt change much either09:56
dholbachwasabi?09:56
Keybukdholbach: given the agenda, he's likely to miss the meeting09:56
dholbachI'm very sorry that it has to happen. He's a real asset for Universe.09:56
mdzKeybuk: we have sfllaw as well09:57
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Keybukmdz: we do, how?09:57
janimoseconded, gloububoulga is very good09:57
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janimovery helpful in xubuntu land09:58
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Keybukmdz: HE ISN'T ON MY LIST :p09:58
mdzKeybuk: well, he can speak for himself, but I presume he'd like to be able to upload09:58
Keybuksfllaw: add yourself to the list <g>09:58
mdzsfllaw: https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-core-dev09:59
sfllawSo many lists to add myself to.09:59
ogramembership ? 09:59
sfllawI didn't even know I was on the Core Development Team until five seconds ago.09:59
sfllawTa da!09:59
ogra(will that be sorted afterwards ?)09:59
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mdzsfllaw: you aren't yet10:00
sfllawWell there we go.10:00
mdzsfllaw: the basic process for gaining upload privileges in Ubuntu is to apply for membership in the appropriate team and turn up at a meeting (like this one) to be considered10:01
Keybukrandom thought, why doesn't irc.ubuntu.com point to freenode?10:01
mdzsfllaw: typically you bring along an existing member who has worked with you and can speak on your behalf10:01
ogramdz, couldnt we just make employees automatically members ? 10:01
ogra(i think its worth a policy change)10:01
ograi mean signed contract yadda yadda ...10:02
mdzogra: that strikes me as inappropriate, and if I'm not mistaken, sabdfl has explicitly spoken against it10:02
KeybukLet's Get It Started!10:02
ograok10:02
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mdzsfllaw: presumably jbailey would advocate you; is he available by any chance?10:02
sfllawI'm under the impression that he's "being a booth babe".10:03
sfllawBut let me look.10:03
sfllawHe doesn't seem to be online.10:03
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sfllawI'm afraid that I can't say whether jbailey would absolutely vouch for me.10:03
sfllawBut I'm presuming he would.10:03
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mdzI'll try his mobile10:04
dholbachI can try to say some bits: I was in touch with sfllaw around 2 years ago, when I used wvstreams for a project - at that time I was impressed on how fast he reacted, analyzed the problem I had and got the fix either into Debian or fixed it directly upstream. That's what I can say about his Debian / packaging skills.10:05
dholbachsfllaw: for how long have you been a Debian maintainer now?10:05
mdzjbailey was just walking onto an airplane, he won't be able to make it10:06
ogradholbach, thats already 2 years ago ? woah10:06
Keybukmdz: if it crashes, we're blaming you10:06
=== ogra remembers dholbach's praises for wvstreams upstream bck then
ogra*back10:06
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dholbachKeybuk: don't make that kind of jokes shortly before release :)10:07
sivangwas ubuntu existing then? :)10:07
=== sivang lost track of time already.
ograsivang, dholbach and i met in #ubuntu at that time10:07
ograso it existed, yes10:08
dholbachor maybe it was even longer ago10:08
sivangogra: ah, so we already met each other probably 10:08
mdzsfllaw: have you wandered off?10:09
sfllawmdz: Nope.10:09
sfllawdholbach: I've been looking...10:10
dholbachah... ok :-)10:10
mdzsfllaw: it's probably best if we wait until the next meeting for this, when you have some time to prepare10:10
sfllawFair enough.10:10
mdzdholbach: heard from gloubigoula?10:11
sfllawdholbach: January 2000 was when I started.10:11
dholbachmdz: yeah, as I said: he'll be 30m late, so ~20m he should be here10:11
mdzis there any other business?10:11
dholbachthe only other applicant (that really meant it) was afaik wasabi10:11
ogralifeless isnt around by chance ? 10:11
mjg59Daf is around if we want to do his motu?10:11
wasabiI was an applicabt?10:12
wasabiapplicant? I was wondering why you were yelling at me.10:12
dholbachwasabi: for ubuntu-dev?10:12
wasabiAlready in.10:12
dholbachwasabi: I tried to highlight on all your nicks :-)10:12
dholbachwasabi: Oh sorry, I must have missed that. I just rememberd you signed up with the team.10:12
wasabiYeah, I was "missed" in the LP migration somehow, and was too busy to notice.10:12
mdzwasabi: who took care of that for you?10:13
wasabikeybuk10:13
ogradaf sounds like a good start ...10:13
mdzogra: daf isn't here10:13
mjg59mdz: Shall I grab daf?10:13
mjg59(He's physically here)10:13
mdzthis is possibly the most chaotic tech board meeting yet ;-)10:13
mdzmjg59: his choice10:13
ograheh10:13
mjg5930 seconds10:14
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mjg59There we go10:14
wasabiHmm. I think I was in ubuntu-core-dev, too.10:14
wasabiBut I haven't had to work on my packages in main in a long while.10:14
ograhey daf10:14
=== daf waves
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dholbachhello daf!10:15
Keybukwasabi: only found your ubuntu-dev meeting10:15
wasabik. No biggy.10:15
wasabiI'm done with Java stuff anyways.10:15
mdzwasabi,Keybuk: the archive keyring was authoritative at the time10:16
mdzand that's what I worked from when migrating to LP10:16
mdzdaf: welcome10:16
mdzdaf: care to tell us a bit about your involvement with ubuntu and plans for future involvement?10:17
=== sivang hugs daf
dafmostly been involved with Rosetta stuff10:17
dafoccasional patches10:17
=== mvo waves to daf
dafmy impetus for upload privileges is to be able to upload stuff to Ubuntu at the same time as I upload to Debian10:18
mdzdaf: you're a Debian developer as well, yes?10:18
dafaye10:18
mdzdaf: which packages do you maintain there?10:18
dafer10:18
dafhttp://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=Dafydd+Harries&comaint=yes10:19
dafvarious things10:19
dafplus I've recently joined the GNOME team10:19
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mdzdaf: have you done any Ubuntu uploads through an existing developer?10:21
dafno, don't think so10:21
dholbachdaf: didn't I uploaded a patch and new gnome-gpg or something?10:21
dholbachdaf: or you worked on it and I synced it?10:21
dafthat was a sync10:22
dholbachOk.10:22
raphinkhi there10:22
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raphinkhi Gloubi|AFK10:23
raphinkand hi Riddell :)10:23
Gloubi|AFKhi10:23
dholbachthen we investigated a bit in the gossip package10:23
raphinktb is @ 22UTC right ?10:23
mdzraphink: it's at 20UTC as always, and it's in progress right now10:23
raphinkouch sorry mdz :(10:23
=== raphink keeps quiet
dafdholbach: indeed10:23
mdzdholbach: care to comment on your experience working with daf?10:23
dholbachmdz: he was very easy to work with, we discussed some gossip bugs and had a look on a new gnome-gpg version and he was always easy to work with.10:24
dholbachHe answered quickly and things were done in no time. I was happy. :-)10:25
mdzKeybuk: any questions?10:25
Keybukmdz: no questions10:26
mdzok10:26
mdzvotes10:26
mjg59+1 on the basis that I can hit him in person if he does anything wrong10:26
ograheh10:27
Keybuk+1 from me10:27
dholbachhahaha10:27
mdz+1 from me based on Debian experience and dholbach's advocacy10:27
mdzdaf: done and done10:27
mdzdaf: welcome10:27
=== dholbach congratulates daf!
dafthank you10:27
dholbachExcellent news! :-)10:27
raphink:)10:27
ograwelcome daf10:27
mdzGloubiboulga: I believe you're next?10:27
=== Gloubiboulga is Gauvain Pocentek
Riddelldaf: well done10:27
mjg59Gloubiboulga: So, what do you want to do in Ubuntu?10:28
GloubiboulgaI guess I'm the next one mdke 10:28
Gloubiboulgamjg59, my work has been centered on Xubuntu for a month10:28
=== mdke passes it onto mdz
janimos/work/great work/10:28
GloubiboulgaI'd like to keep working on this, even if Xfce is in main now:)10:29
mdzjanimo: have you been uploading his packages?10:29
janimomdz, yes10:29
janimoall his xfce work10:29
mdzjanimo: and reviewing them before upload, presumably. ;-)  what is your assessment of his work?10:29
janimomdz, very nice work.10:30
janimothorough10:30
mdzGloubiboulga: presumably you will continue to work through janimo for Xubuntu packages for now; is there any other area where you would like to work as a MOTU?10:31
=== raphink has reviewed Gloubiboulga's work on REVU since he began contributing and is also very happy with the quality of his work
Gloubiboulgamdz, not really a particular aera10:31
janimomdz, there are still some bits left in ubinverse for xubuntu10:31
janimohe has some new uploads from xfce upstream in the queu10:31
janimoe10:31
GloubiboulgaI'm really interesting in helping new packagers10:32
GloubiboulgaI've comment some packages on REVU, it's an important part of the MOTU work imo10:32
Gloubiboulga*commented10:32
ograyes, thats true ... 10:32
raphinkyes, I have advocated comments on REVU for Gloubiboulga as he sent them to me10:33
ograGloubiboulga is very helpful to people in -motu10:33
raphinkmost of good interest10:33
raphinkGloubiboulga: have you gotten in touch with laserjock to help with packaging guide?10:33
dholbachYeah, I personally liked how he steppd up in ubuntu-bugs as well, took care of patches for issues in universe-bugs, etc10:33
dholbachI'm pleased with his work there10:33
mdzok10:33
Gloubiboulgaraphink, nop, I read his guide, discussed a few thing with him, that's it10:33
mdzKeybuk,mjg59: any questions for Gloubiboulga?10:34
Keybuknope, no questions from me10:34
mjg59Gloubiboulga: What are your aims for xfce?10:35
Gloubiboulgamjg59, Xfce itself is fine, but Xubuntu can provide a much more usable desktop10:35
GloubiboulgaIt's easily installable, comes on an iso10:36
Gloubiboulgaeverything is done to have a clean, stable distro using this desktop10:36
mdzGloubiboulga: is there anything in particular that you feel is missing which you would like to work on adding?10:37
janimoGloubiboulga has been in touch with xfce panel plugin writers, about them being in time for dapper10:37
Gloubiboulgamdz, yes, some tools are missing, like keyboard, printer manament10:37
lucasvoimho notebook support in xubuntu is poor10:37
Gloubiboulgamanagment*10:37
Gloubiboulgalucasvo, true10:38
janimolucasvo: true. the only thing there is susp/hib form logout menu10:38
lucasvojanimo: exactly10:38
lucasvono battery status etc.10:38
janimolucasvo: there's a battrey plugin in main since yesterday10:38
mdzGloubiboulga: are there good solutions for keyboard and printer functionality which exist but are not in Xubuntu yet?10:38
Gloubiboulgamdz, Xfce only cannot satisfy a desktop user imo10:38
janimowas in universe10:38
lucasvojanimo: ah, ok10:38
janimoGloubiboulga actually works on the xkb plugin now, but for some reason not mentioningit10:39
Gloubiboulgamdz, you can't easily set up different keuboard layouts for exemple10:39
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Gloubiboulgamdz, janimo just told it, I'm working on the xkb plugin to solve this10:40
Gloubiboulgaediting xorg.conf is not an easy for most users :)10:41
Gloubiboulgaesay thing even10:41
mdzok10:41
mdzKeybuk,mjg59: votes?10:41
Keybuk+1 from me, good to get more xfce work10:42
mdz+1 for Gloubiboulga based on several MOTU recommendations and good work demonstrated with janimo10:42
mdzdid we lose mjg59?10:43
mdzGloubiboulga: at any rate you have a majority, congratulations and welcome10:43
janimoGloubiboulga: congrats :)10:43
dholbachcongratulations Gloubiboulga! welcome to the team!10:43
Gloubiboulgathanks :)10:43
ogracongrats Gloubiboulga 10:43
raphinkwelcome Gloubiboulga :)10:43
raphinka fait plaisir de t'avoir comme dev :)10:44
mdzI believe that's the end of the agenda?10:44
Gloubiboulgamerci raphink ;)10:44
ograyep10:44
Gloubiboulgajanimo, dholbach, ogra thanks a lot :)10:44
dholbachthanks everybody10:44
mdkemdz, i have a quick question, if you have time. I've written it already so it should be fast.10:44
dholbachGloubiboulga: anytime - you deserved the praise10:44
mdzmdke: shoot10:44
mdkeI've vaguely followed the meeting since I joined the channel, is it correct that ubuntu membership is no longer required for becoming a developer (some of the candidates considered are not members, and some of the core-dev team don't appear to be either)? If so, I think we should update the website: it gives a slightly misleading account of the community governance process. Or alternatively, the ubuntu-members LP group may be incomplete.10:44
ogramdke, its still required10:45
mdkeso the latter?10:45
mdzmdke: they're somewhat disconnected at the moment; people generally go through the processes separately10:45
mjg59Whoops, sorry about that10:45
mdzindeed, they're handled by different groups10:45
mdkemdz, does it matter which goes first?10:45
mjg59But I agree10:45
mdzmdke: for my part, I don't mind which goes first, but they should happen close together10:46
mdzfolks who are in ubuntu-dev but not members should go through the membership process10:46
mdkeok, the website is definitely misleading then10:46
raphinkindeed10:47
mdzwhat we wanted to avoid was folks having to wait 3 weeks or more, and attend adjacent meetings, to go through the process10:47
mdzthis is probably something to be discussed at CC next week10:47
mdkeok fine10:47
mdzlogically, it would make sense for membership to be a prerequisite, but we've been somewhat flexible for practical reasons10:47
mdzmdke: would you put it on the CC agenda?  I'll try to be there to discuss10:47
mdkemdz, be happy to.10:48
mdkeit's two problems I suppose10:48
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lifelessKeybuk: am I too late?10:48
mdzlifeless: well hello, we were just about to close up10:48
KeybukI think we can just squeeze him in10:49
lifelessthank you10:49
mdzlifeless: care to introduce yourself?10:49
lifelessHi, I'm lifeless10:49
sivanghe has a french dictionary named after him :)10:49
lifelessI'm here hoping to get upload rights to universe as a MOTU10:49
ograyay10:50
ogralifeless, 10:50
lifelessindeed, the Robert-Collins dictionary10:50
ograoften missed here10:50
lifelesshttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/RobertCollins describes most of the Ubuntu focused things I get up to10:50
mdzlifeless: you maintain a few packages in Debian as well, yes?10:51
mdzah, it's on your wiki page10:51
lifelessyup, bicyclerepair, fl-cow, opensync, testresources10:51
mdzlifeless: who sponsors the bzr uploads to ubuntu? jbailey?10:52
Mithrandirlifeless: I don't think Ubuntu runs well on S/360s.  I don't know about S/390s, though..10:52
mdzlifeless: do you do most of the packaging work for the uploads which go directly to ubuntu?10:52
lifelessmdz: yes. bzr is currently packaged by jbailey himself10:52
mdzlifeless: are you a Debian developer, or does someone sponsor your uploads there?10:53
lifelessmdz: I'm a DD, though still a relatively new one10:53
sivanglifeless: what about i5/OS ? ;-)10:54
mdz(I asked because your Maintainer fields don't have a debian.org address)10:54
lifelessI tend to get someone to eyeball my uploads if I'm working in a new area of packaging I'm not familiar with10:54
lifelessmdz: ah.10:54
Keybukmdz: that's not so unusual?  When I was a DD, I never used my debian.org address10:54
mdzKeybuk: not everyone does, but when they don't, it isn't immediately obvious whether they're a DD or not10:55
lifelessthis is true. I guess I think of myself as 'me' and as being a DD as one facet.10:55
mdzand I'm far too lazy to go beyond apt-cache show to confirm ;-)10:56
lifelessits the same with canonical work, I usually use my home address except in rare circumstances10:56
Keybuklifeless: so, what makes you want to join the MOTU?10:56
Keybukwhat about Ubuntu interests and excites you10:56
Keybukand what would you like to change and make better?10:56
lifelessso10:57
lifelessI want to join MOTU to be able to complete the loop when I'm helping out in #ubuntu-motu10:57
lifelessfor instance, azeem and I want to make the mobile syncing stuff in ubuntu really rock for dapper +110:58
lifelesswhich is why we are working on all the opensync, discussing issues with upstream10:58
lifelessand so on.10:58
mdzlifeless: what are the issues there? I'm interested10:58
lifelessmdz: multisync is essentially abandoned upstream, and the 'new' codebase 'opensync' is very unstable10:59
mdzI want to be able to sync contacts between my phone and evolution, in particular10:59
mdzdoes opensync have that sort of use case as a target?11:00
lifelesswe've hit a number of issues in packaging - the test suite is location fragile11:00
lifelessoh yes, thats exactly what opensync is about, multisync 0.8x may well do it already11:00
mdzcool, maybe I'll find time to play with it one of these days11:01
Keybukwould opensync also let me sync the evolution address book on my laptop with that on my desktop?11:01
lifelessbut the multisync 0.8 ui is (at best) crackful - the 0.9 ui based on opensync should be much much better once it all comes together11:01
mjg59Keybuk: Yes11:01
lifelessKeybuk: yes11:01
lifelessKeybuk: syncml + evo on the desktop, evo + syncml on the laptop11:01
mjg59Synchronisation is something we've really been missing out on11:01
mdzany further questions?11:02
mdzvotes11:02
lifelessanswering what about ubuntu interests and excites me is rather hard - I find *everything* fascinating and interesting--- its just a matter of triaging down to the things I have time to actually look at11:03
mjg59+1 based on past record and intention to work on important stuff11:03
mdz+1 based on Debian history, sanity of existing packages, etc.11:03
Keybuk+111:03
Keybukeven though he's at least partly responsible for Arch11:03
Keybuk:)11:03
mdzlifeless: congrats11:04
lifelessI'm also 'at least partly responsible' for the solution!11:04
lifelessmdz: thank you11:04
lifelessthank you mjg59 and Keybuk too11:04
mdzany other business before workrave strangles me?11:04
mdkemdz, I've added the agenda item for the CC11:05
mdzmdke: thanks11:05
ograyay lifeless 11:05
ografinally :)11:05
mdznot hearing any other business, adjourned11:05
mdzthanks all11:05
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ograthanks mdz 11:05
raphinkcongrats lifeless11:05
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Tonio_seems I'm a bit late this time ^^11:07
raphinkhuhu11:07
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