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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 26 Apr 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 13:30 UTC: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 04 May 02:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team
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freeflying-ibook@schedule Shanghai01:10
UbugtuSchedule for Asia/Shanghai: 26 Apr 20:00: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 21:30: Xubuntu | 28 Apr 04:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 28 Apr 06:00: Kubuntu | 03 May 20:00: Edubuntu | 04 May 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team01:10
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freeflying@schedule Shanghai11:48
UbugtuSchedule for Asia/Shanghai: 26 Apr 20:00: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 21:30: Xubuntu | 28 Apr 04:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 28 Apr 06:00: Kubuntu | 03 May 20:00: Edubuntu | 04 May 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team11:48
cbx33@schedule London12:11
UbugtuSchedule for Europe/London: 26 Apr 13:00: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 14:30: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 21:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 23:00: Kubuntu | 03 May 13:00: Edubuntu | 04 May 03:00: Ubuntu Development Team12:11
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Current meeting: Edubuntu | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 26 Apr 13:30 UTC: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 04 May 02:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team
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jelknerIs the meeting over?01:54
ograjelkner, which TZ are you in ? 01:56
ogra@schedule EST01:56
UbugtuSchedule for EST: Current meeting: Edubuntu | 26 Apr 08:30: Xubuntu | 27 Apr 15:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 17:00: Kubuntu | 03 May 07:00: Edubuntu | 03 May 21:00: Ubuntu Development Team01:56
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JaneW3 mins01:58
JaneWok let hit it02:01
JaneWhi everyone02:02
blugtuhi jane02:02
jelknerhi jane02:02
JaneW5 weeks to Dapper release02:02
jelknerclass starts for me in 15 minutes02:02
sivanghey JaneW 02:02
JaneWhi sivang 02:02
JaneWedubuntu is in pretty good shape02:02
=== highvoltage can't wait
highvoltageedubuntu is great!02:03
jelkneredubuntu is fantastic!02:03
=== ogra just created https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuMeetingAgenda
JaneWthanks to ogra for that02:03
jelknerthanks, ogra!02:03
cbx33edubuntu rawks :D02:03
JaneWthanks ogra02:03
cbx33thank you ogra 02:03
ograstop now, i'm blushing :)02:03
jelkneri have a quick question...02:03
JaneWwe have it on the top of https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuMeetingRecords too02:03
=== cbx33 imagines ogra's handsome face blushing :p
jelknerogra: can you please tell me again how to chroot when you dist-upgrade to dapper?02:04
ograJaneW, we need a dynamic agenda02:04
JaneWogra: agreed02:04
jelkneror rather rebuilt the ltsp-chroot02:04
cbx33I think it is becomming increasingly necessary02:04
ograjelkner, can we do that outside of the meeting ? 02:04
highvoltagejelkner: that's a question for #edubuntu :)02:04
JaneWesp with the edbuntu membership02:04
ograso from the tech side :02:05
=== highvoltage is interested to hear more about that
ogranot miuch to say, i'm merely busy with ubuntu bugs 02:05
ograwe decided to have an update for the beta CD, so beta2 might be released tomorrow02:05
JaneWogra: there a load of them though like 10k or such like...02:05
ogra(i'm testing isos as i speak)02:05
cbx33nice, 02:05
cbx33I know ther are loads of bugs, I'm trying to help out where I can02:06
ograJaneW, yes, but that also includes whishlist and trivial bugs02:06
cbx33but not so many specific edubuntu bugs02:06
ograthe serious amount is way lower (but still to high)02:06
JaneWogra: oic, does it look like serious bugs are manageable?02:06
JaneWeven with the new bug guy?02:06
ograbut we have simon now to care for our QA02:06
ograhe will kick our butts if we dont get them solved in time ;)02:07
sivanghey highvoltage :)02:07
JaneWok, and I meant QA guy not bug guy02:07
cbx33oh dear02:07
highvoltageogra: do we have a list of the most critical bugs in edubuntu?02:07
highvoltagehi sivang 02:07
JaneWalthough it's much of a muchness ;)02:07
ograhe will also assign edubuntu specific bugs to the new edubuntu bugsquad in launchpad instead of assigning them to me personally02:07
JaneWhighvoltage: I think that should read most critical bugs for edubuntu?02:07
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ograso if you want to help bug triaging, subscribe to it 02:08
JaneWsince we don't seem to have many IN edubuntu - right ogra?02:08
JaneWogra: that's a good idea02:08
highvoltageJaneW: right02:08
JaneWogra: will anyone else help with those yet, or is that for future expansion?02:08
ograJaneW, there isnt even a single bug assigned to that team yet02:09
highvoltageblugtu and i wanted to get testing more formalised, we've been meaning to talk to ogra about that for the longest time02:09
ograand the overall count of edubuntu bugs is ~10002:09
highvoltagebut schedule clashes have made that difficult02:09
sivanghighvoltage: there a rough ubuntu test plans on the wiki, I reckon you could derive upon them and add the additional edubuntu / ltsp bits.02:09
highvoltagetesting and bug hunting / fixing probably goes hand in hand02:09
blugtuyeah ,we need to create a first structure for the testing team02:09
highvoltagesivang: noted02:10
JaneWsivang: yes, but I think we have a very basic test plan...02:10
=== JaneW looks
ograhighvoltage, blugtu, cbx33 helped a lot with testing the beta isos ... he can give some hints ;)02:10
ograJaneW, we only have a copied version of the ubuntu testplan02:10
cbx33anything I can do guys02:10
sivanghighvoltage: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing02:10
ogra90% of that stuff doesnt need testing in edubuntu02:10
ograwe need to test other bits ...02:11
cbx33I'm often testing on non-compliant hardware or older hardware02:11
JaneWogra: right ok we should get that customised then02:11
ograsince if the things work in ubuntu and we didnt modify anything, they *must* work in edubuntu as well02:11
JaneWcbx33: would you like to do that?02:11
ograin any case we rather need our owm testplans worked out ...02:11
cbx33I'll give it a shot02:11
cbx33indeed as you stated ogra most of the ubutnu stuff is tested else where02:12
JaneWogra: did you respond to the mail about our CD cover copy? is that signed off now>02:12
blugtusivang: if you want to take a look to edubuntu testing team wiki , here it is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuTestingTeam02:12
ograsince it makes most sense to test the edubuntu specifics beyond the ubuntu install we test anyway02:12
JaneWcbx33: excellent, thanks02:12
cbx33totally agree02:12
cbx33infact most of what I have been testing is non-ubu stuff anyway02:12
JaneWwe actaully need to go through the whole edubuntu wiki and do a springclean and update02:12
cbx33because that's what I'm eventually oing to use it for02:12
cbx33JaneW: agreeed02:12
ograwe should do that around release or shortly before02:13
JaneWto make sure the info is valid, current and well presented02:13
cbx33make sure we get it all done in time02:13
sivangogra: agreed, however if someone edubuntu tests those bits, he can feed bugreports upstream to ubutnu as well :) (regardless of his edubuntu specific bits) Bt I agree this may be out of scope for edu ;-)02:13
ogra(what doesnt mean we shouldnt start already indeed ;) )02:13
sivangblugtu: looking02:13
cbx33ogra: :p02:13
blugtusivang:   ;)02:13
JaneWyes, and if you find any of my typos please correct them!02:13
ograsivang, yes, but i'm not intrested in reports about that, since we'll solve them in ubuntu anyway 02:13
JaneWwe had one of my typos mentioned in a review last time :/02:13
cbx33JaneW: oh dear02:14
sivangogra: sure :)02:14
cbx33they're so unforgiving 02:14
ograif your thin client bootsplash is wrong, thats something that intrests me, if openoffice is broken, i'm sure it will get solved in ubuntu anyway02:14
=== cbx33 bites his tongue
ograok, so apart from that and still missing artwork/doc stuff edubuntu is fine02:15
JaneWogra: you feeling onfident we are on track and have enough testing so far that we won't have major surprises in the next 5 weeks?02:15
cbx33it makes perfect sense that way seeing as there are many more people to fix ubu spefiic bugs02:15
ograi have another topic, not tech related02:15
ograJaneW, yep02:15
JaneWok the tech side is good, well done again!02:15
JaneWogra: you havent seen my whip for a while now :)02:16
ograi was approached independently by several people asking if we could rotate the meeting time 02:16
JaneWogra: next?02:16
cbx33I can see why ogra 02:16
cbx33I'm lucky my boss actually wants me to attend these meetings02:16
JaneWI am not commiting to another 4am meeting :(02:16
JaneWok who is this time really BAD for?02:17
blugtufor me its ok02:17
cbx33ogra: will the introduction of the CC ease this issue?02:17
blugtubut wednesday its not a good day02:17
cbx33having more people available to chair the meeting?02:17
ograwe said as long as nobody complains we want to stick to that time, but now with edubuntu membership and with community demand, i guess we should have at least two times to jump between02:17
highvoltageJaneW: i would like a meeting that takes place out of office hours, so that i can attend it 100%02:17
JaneWwe have other meetings on Tues and Thurs02:17
highvoltageJaneW: just as a question of preference02:17
JaneWperhaps if we have 2 diff times which alternate each week, then at worst ppl attend every second meeting?02:18
ograthats my plan02:18
cbx33sounds good02:18
highvoltagebtw, http://distrowatch.com/index.php?dataspan=102:18
JaneWare we sticking to wednesday?02:18
highvoltageedubuntu #24 for last 7 days :)02:18
ograso move the current one a bit earlier and have an alternate time for the evening02:19
highvoltageJaneW: seems so02:19
JaneWwhen Dapper releases we are going to storm the charts :))02:19
ograhighvoltage, that will drop to nowhere with the new artwork :P02:19
JaneWok 10:00 UTC or earlier?02:19
JaneWogra: :((((02:19
JaneWyes we need to discuss that02:19
ogra10:00 UTC sounds fine 02:19
cbx33earlier I'd like02:19
cbx33ah ok :p02:20
JaneWcbx33: what TZ are you?02:20
JaneWoh UK02:20
blugtufor me its not good02:20
blugtu10 utc02:20
ograwhat about 18:00 UTC for the other, is that to late for you JaneW ?02:20
JaneWyou get up early?02:20
blugtuso early02:20
cbx33but it's ok02:20
highvoltageogra: we'll make lots of noise about that, I promise. that's bound to peak some interest in edubuntu though ;)02:20
ograhighvoltage, hopefully02:20
blugtuogra: 18 utc is perfect02:20
cbx33that'd be great02:20
JaneWogra: too late for work day, and too early for night meeting I have to spend 5-8pm (my time with family and kids - sorry)02:21
cbx33make it 2202:21
highvoltage18:00 utc is great for me too (but for the same reason it's bad for janew :/ )02:21
ograisnt 18:00 UTC 8pm for you ?02:21
cbx33listen forget me...I can work around it02:21
JaneW20:00 UTC works for me02:21
cbx3320:00 is great for me02:21
blugtuogra: yes02:21
highvoltageyeah, i think we can discuss this some other time in #edubuntu.02:21
highvoltagewednesdays 12:00 is working Ok.02:21
cbx33yes brilliantly02:22
JaneWogra: I can't really commit before 19:0002:22
ograUTC ?02:22
freeflying20:00 UTC is too early for asian02:22
JaneWok let's debate this on the mailing list of #edubuntu then?02:22
cbx33make it the late one then02:22
blugtuJaneW: OK02:22
ograbut it seems we have a tendency for 10:00 UTC and 20:00 UTC, right ? 02:23
JaneWI am UTC +202:23
JaneWogra: yes that would work for me02:23
ograyep, as i am02:23
blugtu20 utc is good02:23
JaneWon a wednesday?02:23
ograok, lets take these for the proposal and see what feedback we get02:23
ogralets keep the day02:23
JaneWogra: er that will suck on the day we have the 4am the next morning, but we'll cope :)02:23
ograi usually dont sleep before the 4am meeting, so i'm fine 02:24
ograthe question is if you can sort it02:24
cbx33oh dear ogra 02:24
JaneWlet's try that02:24
JaneWso what time next week?02:24
sivangblugtu: according to what ogra said, why do yo have there a section about "Installation" ? this is already getting tested part of ubuntu no?02:24
ograJaneW, next week == first meeting in the month 02:25
cbx33sivang: no02:25
JaneWogra: yes02:25
cbx33ther eare extra bits in the edubuntu installation02:25
sivangcbx33: ah I see, ltsp related?02:25
ograwe should take care for a third ECC member today as well02:25
JaneWogra: anything else?02:25
ograyes, see above02:25
blugtusivang: yep but we will see for details during a testing meeting02:26
JaneWtake care?02:26
ogravote, elect02:26
JaneWwe'll discuss the ECC election next week no?02:26
ograor do we want to sort that on the first ECC ?02:26
ograRiddell, edubuntu CC02:26
freeflyingRiddell: we'd have KCC :)02:26
ograRiddell, like the KCC ;)02:26
JaneWogra: do we need to discuss the process or what?02:26
ograJaneW, i guess we need to *define* a process first 02:27
JaneWogra: ahh02:27
JaneWogra: mailing list discussion?02:27
cbx33self nomination, seconded, vote, elect ?02:27
JaneWor here and now?02:27
JaneWcbx33: yep sounds good02:27
ograsounds very good02:27
blugtui quote cbx3302:27
JaneWogar: think we must follow CC processes as far as possible02:27
JaneWogar! lol02:28
ograJaneW, not for the ECC itself02:28
ograbut for the member approval02:28
JaneWogra: yes that's what I meant02:28
sivangogra: special TB/CC per each derivative? :)02:29
=== ogra adds a membership candidates section to the new agenda page
JaneWok the new WEB SITE, highvoltage any news on that?02:29
JaneWogra: thanks02:29
highvoltageJaneW: been talking to Znarl in PM... he's on it02:30
JaneWhighvoltage: excellent, got an ETA yet?02:30
highvoltageJaneW: i'll ask him quickly02:30
JaneWhighvoltage: we can let it slip in unnoticed02:30
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highvoltageJaneW: what do you mean?02:31
highvoltageoh, right02:31
cbx33hehe :p02:31
highvoltageJaneW: i've been in contact with znarl over the weekend and monday, yesterday, and today, so it's unlikely to just slip by unnoticed.02:32
JaneWcan=can't sorry02:32
JaneWhighvoltage: cool ok thanks02:32
JaneWcan't wait02:32
highvoltagepips1 and i will still make lots of changes to it in the future02:32
JaneWwe are still waiting for final dapper artwork02:32
ograif you want to apply for membership, please add yourself at the bottom of https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuMeetingAgenda02:32
=== highvoltage needs to run, wil try to pop in again before end of meeting
cbx33cya highvoltage 02:33
JaneWI think it's being kept largely under wraps till closer to the release02:33
JaneWbye highvoltage 02:33
cbx33JaneW: any news on the artwork theme yet?02:33
blugtucya highvoltage02:33
JaneWbut it looks like our default theme is going to be the chalkboard one02:33
JaneWwhich is dark green02:33
ograwhich i strongly oppose02:33
=== JaneW too for the record
highvoltageJaneW: i haven't seen it yet, but if ogra's unhappy with it, then so am i!02:34
=== cbx33 again
JaneWwe are still free to provide nice alternatives for the 'Young' theme02:34
ograyes, i didnt recieve any wallpaper yet02:34
cbx33JaneW: but not the default?02:34
JaneWcbx33: right02:34
ograbut changing to chalkboard will mean to redo *all* themes02:34
ograelse the colors bite02:34
cbx33it is a real shame that this is being forced upon us02:35
JaneWI don't HATE the chalkboard one, but I definitely don't love it, and I don;t think it does anything to help build our brand02:35
cbx33any chance of a petition?02:35
JaneWwe can try that yes02:35
cbx33or an appeal02:35
ogracbx33, JaneW and i did what we could 02:35
cbx33I understand02:35
cbx33Wish I could jump on the band wagon too02:35
JaneWogra and I are powerless alone, but if we have community support that may carry more weight02:35
ograso its up to the community i guess02:35
ograwhich we are not allowed to show the theme 02:36
JaneWogra: are we def not allowed to show it?02:36
JaneWI am not clear about that...02:36
cbx33what is the issue here?02:36
ograno idea, but its not much different from https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDapperTheme/JonathanCarter/chalk02:37
JaneWogra: hehe clever02:37
ograits a little brighter and has more chalk leftovers on it ... 02:37
blugtui have to go Bye all see you later in #edubuntu02:37
JaneWand some smudging...02:37
cbx33bye Bluekuja 02:38
ograciao Bluekuja 02:38
blugtulol ciao oliver02:38
cbx33ogra: it just seems very old fashioned02:38
JaneWso like I said before if you have anything better SEND it to us02:38
cbx33what about swapping it for an interactive whiteboard :p02:38
JaneWwe can;t complain unless we have alternatives02:38
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cbx33I can do what I can02:38
cbx33my wife is a website designer, I can get her to give it a shot if you want02:39
cbx33she's pretty good with that kind of thing02:39
JaneWcbx33: yes please!02:39
ograwe wanted to stay with the current bright and colorful theme, but were told by our coo that it isnt recognized as edubuntu branding yet02:39
cbx33oh it will be02:39
cbx33if it's the last thing I do :p02:39
ogra(which we both disagree about)02:39
cbx33It;s a gear theme02:39
JaneWcbx33: see this http://art.ubuntu.com/backgrounds/edubuntu/02:40
cbx33and brands it well02:40
cbx33JaneW: do you have any tips/guidence on what we like/don;t like02:40
cbx33a design brief I suppose I could pass on to her02:40
JaneWwe like edubuntu girl but were hoping for more diversity, since that was an issue last time, so were looking at something like02:40
ograthe goal was to appear more grown up than in last release02:41
JaneWperhaps a bit subtler though02:41
cbx33I see what you mean02:41
cbx33it's nice, but it looses the brainding i feel02:41
ograwe wanted a more neutral wallpaper, but still bright and friendly02:41
cbx33ogra: totally agree with you there02:41
JaneWogra: for the default yes, but we still want a fun and naive young option02:41
cbx33i think quite a clean background with a definite theme would be nice02:42
JaneWedubuntu girls with her new diverse friends?02:42
ograyes, the young one can look like edubuntu girl or the children of edubuntu02:42
cbx33I'll get her started tonight, she'll do her best I know it02:42
JaneWogra use this http://art.ubuntu.com/images/backgrounds/abstract.jpg02:43
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ograJaneW, we had that already :) 02:44
ograwas the very first wallpaper i packaged :)02:44
JaneWyes but it wasn't released02:44
cbx33any more thoughts on artwork?02:44
JaneWand we replaced it with the fun young one02:44
ograit was pre mustard :)02:44
cbx33pre-mustard hahaha02:44
JaneWcbx33: ogra lves mustard02:45
=== cbx33 loves ketchup
ograi dont even eat mustard :)02:45
ograbut i like the color :)02:45
=== cbx33 pictures handsome ogra in his mustard coloured shirt
cbx33and mustard coloured leather pants :p02:46
ogranah ...02:46
cbx33maybe we culd use a picture of hip hop ogra in his mustard attire for the background02:47
ograthey are black i wouldnt wear colored leather02:47
Mithrandirwe could just color rotate the image and they'd be mustard.02:47
cbx33right, next?02:47
ograMithrandir, heh ... "different kinds of mustard" :)02:48
JaneWok the dreaded cookbook02:49
JaneWlooks like there had been some action this week02:49
ograis anyone of the cookbook team here ? 02:49
ograspacey and pygi are missing02:49
cbx33I think I'm a n00bie member02:50
ograHedgeMage is working hard on it it seems02:51
ograshe asked for screenshots last night02:51
ograbut she can only attend the evening meetings02:51
JaneWok, we'll carry that discussion over02:52
JaneWbut there's deifinately action on it now02:52
ograan i guess she'd also go for membership02:52
JaneWok anything else to discuss?02:52
ogra(i hope we'll get actually some candidates for next meeting)02:53
cbx33for the meeting?02:53
=== cbx33 is a candidate :p
ograyay !02:53
ograok, then i'd say meeting adjourned :)02:54
ograthanks all02:54
cbx33hang on02:54
cbx33I just wanted to mention02:54
cbx33I've started a team02:54
cbx33to try to provide some support material for schools02:55
ograyou should announce it on the mailing list 02:55
ograwith a little description and advertisement :)02:55
cbx33I will do later, wated to get some opinions on it first :p02:55
ograits a great idea :)02:56
JaneWcbx33: excellent idea!02:56
JaneWI am sure jelkner will be interested02:56
JaneWplease post on the m/l...02:56
JaneWshould help to get things ging again02:56
cbx33well that's all I had to say I think02:56
cbx33apart from02:56
ograhighvoltage will be intrested as well :)02:57
JaneWso long02:57
cbx33if anyone has any general dogsbody things that need doing02:57
JaneWand thanks for all the quiche02:57
JaneWcbx33: I'll keep that in mind :)02:57
cbx33I'm ya man :p02:57
JaneWwrite specs for SoC!02:57
cbx33I'll get the missus working tonight02:57
sfllawogra: I won't kick you.  Violence solves nothing.02:57
sfllawogra: Guilt however, I use like a surgeon.02:57
ograsfllaw, you wont move my fat ass without kicking ;)02:58
JaneWsfllaw: he likes a good whipping02:58
Mithrandiryeah, it's just enjoyment for him.02:58
JaneWpref with some alcohol02:58
JaneWand a smoke02:58
ograbut to be honest, the edubuntu bugcount is marginal 02:58
MithrandirJaneW: in the wounds?02:58
JaneWMithrandir: yeah02:58
sfllawJaneW: Lady, I like your style!02:59
ograsfllaw, you wont have to kick much :) i think edubuntu has around 10 open bugs 02:59
ograok, can we close ? 02:59
JaneWyes adjourned02:59
JaneWearly for once :))02:59
JaneWback to #edubuntu03:00
cbx33back to #edubuntu03:00
ograexactly 60mins03:00
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Current meeting: Xubuntu | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 04 May 02:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team
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Gloubiboulgahi !03:36
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freeflyingGloubiboulga: hi, congrats03:37
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Gloubiboulgahi freeflying, thanks !03:37
janimohi all03:38
janimocongrats to Gauvain!03:38
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Gloubiboulgathanks janimo !03:38
GloubiboulgaJust did my first upload03:38
=== janimo looks
freeflyingGloubiboulga: nice :)03:39
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Gloubiboulgajanimo, sorry, not a Xubuntu one ;)03:39
janimoyeah, but there is time for those too )03:39
Gloubiboulgayes :)03:40
freeflyingjanimo: dose the space of xubuntu enough now?03:40
janimofreeflying: enough for what?03:40
janimowe have a lot of free space still03:40
freeflyingjanimo: some scim's module 03:40
janimofor language support?03:40
janimojust say which packages03:40
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freeflyingscim-pinyin scin-anthy scim-hangul scim-chewing03:41
janimoyou can post to the list if you wish with the packages and a brief description of why it's needed if not obvious03:41
janimook, are these on ubuntu/kubuntu already?03:41
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freeflyingno , due to the space issue03:41
janimois it ok if they go to ship and not installed by default?03:42
nomedhi all03:42
janimoI'd like to keep desktop default install small if possible03:42
janimohi nomed03:42
Gloubiboulgahi here nomed 03:42
freeflyingjanimo: if these can be installed defaultly ,CJK users can use it directly03:42
freeflyingjanimo:  great!03:44
janimofreeflying: so right now by default CJK users cannot type in native language on ubuntu/kubuntu becaus ethese ar enot on the CD?03:44
janimoI see there are two chinese one korean and one japanese right? the four packages you mentioned03:44
freeflyingjanimo: ya, guys need download the language support packages03:44
janimofreeflying: oh, so what is the improvement in dapper regarding asian languages?03:45
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janimoworking just not fitting on CD? did they not even work ok so far?03:45
freeflyingjanimo: guys needn't configure anymore03:45
janimooh, you needed to tweak X/fontconfig and such?03:45
freeflyingif they choose download language suppot package , everything is okey03:45
freeflyingjanimo: needn't 03:46
janimobesides these which are input methods, is there anything missing right now from xubuntu default?03:46
freeflyingthe are in desktop seeds03:46
janimook I'll add these 4 packages to xubuntu-desktop, seems to be 4Mb total03:47
freeflyingjanimo: if you have enough space , include language-pack-gnome-CJK would be better  :)03:47
janimofreeflying: there's no other reason for them not being on the ubuntu CD right?03:48
janimolike quality issues ?03:48
freeflyingjanimo: no others03:48
janimoI guess not if they're in main03:48
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janimofreeflying: language-pack gnome ?03:48
janimothat's mostly for gnome apps right?03:48
janimogranted abiword is in there too and gaim03:48
freeflyingjanimo: then what for xfce4's i18n ?03:49
janimofreeflying: those are small enough (a few 100Kb per language) that are put directly in the base langpacks03:49
janimono more than 300K/lang03:49
freeflyingjanimo: then language-support-CJk03:50
janimoso if CHK have translated xfce they're in :)03:50
janimofreeflying: sure03:50
janimotill now I did not put in anything besides what's in ubuntu03:50
janimoto keep the CD easily downloadable03:50
freeflyingjanimo: with these , CJK user needn't download exrta package 03:50
janimobut I'll add many langpacks03:50
freeflyingthat's great03:50
janimothe top 10 languages' lang support seem to total 120-130 Mb 03:50
janimothat fits I think even with OOo on the CD03:51
freeflyingjanimo: CJK is in top 10?03:51
janimowell mandarin sure is :)03:51
janimotop 1 I think :)03:51
janimobut yes I fon;t recall the ubutu classification03:51
janimolet me check03:51
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freeflyingjanimo: xubuntu has abiword ,why include OOo03:52
janimofreeflying: OOo is not installed just on the CD. since it fits03:52
janimoI got the impression from a bengali translator that, besides OOo no free office is usable in indian langauges03:53
janimois that not the same for CJK?03:53
freeflyingjanimo: as to me , xubuntu shall use light program like goffice instead of OOo03:53
janimofreeflying: I agree that it's lighter and that's the default03:54
janimobut does abiword support CJK/indic languages?03:54
freeflyingjanimo: not too well03:54
janimoso what do chinese users who prefer not to write in English do? :)03:54
janimothey need OOo I guess03:55
freeflyingabiword can write in CJK03:55
freeflyingbut not so fine as OOo dose03:55
janimomost popular languages according to ubuntu classification: zh es bn hi ar xh pt ru ja de fr03:55
janimoso chinese support will be on CD definitely03:55
freeflyingnice :)03:55
janimook what do we have on our agenda today?03:56
janimonot on the wiki of course since that's empty :)03:56
nomedhttp://xoomer.virgilio.it/bat/xubuntu/xfce-setting-show.png <--03:57
Gloubiboulganothing for me...03:57
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janimonomed :)03:57
nomedjanimo: we'll need an xubuntu-icons-theme within artwork03:57
nomedfor sure03:57
janimowhat theme does tha tuse?03:57
nomedthere will be really few but needed anyway03:58
janimoare those new icons made for xubuntu?03:58
janimocan they be part of tango itself?03:58
nomednot all of them but some03:58
janimowhat is the reason for not?03:58
nomedthe xubuntu specific ones no03:58
nomedjust generic icons03:58
janimothere is a sound icon in tango already and does not look like that (whistle)03:59
nomedbut i have still to talk to dobay about this03:59
janimowhat is the situation in current mcs-manager?03:59
nomeddobey even03:59
janimowhere does it fallback to?03:59
ogradid you guys see that you are at place 4 on distrowatch ?03:59
janimoyes, but more techinaclly? :)03:59
freeflyingjanimo: dose xubntu has a network-con tool 03:59
nomedi'll write a mail to xfce-devel03:59
ogra(for the 7 day stats)03:59
janimoogra, yeah somewhat under our expectations ;)03:59
Gloubiboulgaogra, yep :)03:59
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Current meeting: Xubuntu | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 04 May 02:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu
ograjanimo, well, its hard to beat ubuntu :)04:00
janimonomed, writing to xfce devel would be really great04:00
janimoogra, ;)04:00
nomedjanimo: tecnically xfce-mcs-setting is the devil04:00
janimobut really I think xubuntu is overhyped :)04:00
=== janimo talks like a gentoo zealot
nomedit can use icons that don't exist04:01
ograjanimo, it has buntu in its name, thats ebnough for a hype :)04:01
janimonomed, if upstrem could fix that code to use saner icon names which can be found in tango/icon-spec we'd be further ahead04:01
janimoI'd prefer that instead of changing tango to some other theme at this point04:01
janimoand possibly incur other breakage04:01
janimoor even have poeple not like it04:02
janimoogra, and an X. Never underestimate the power of the letter X in marketing04:02
nomedjanimo: you do not need to change tango04:02
janimomost of the reason why XMl is popular IMHO04:02
janimonomed, so tango will be the fallbak?04:02
nomedthey need to fix that issue04:02
janimolook in xubuntu first then fallback to tango?04:03
nomedjanimo: back to the beginning :)04:03
janimoif so does that not mean less performance?04:03
nomedxubuntu icons theme in xubuntu-artwork :)04:03
nomedfallback --> tango04:03
nomedanyway the dialog icons issue is still there04:03
nomedas those icons are hardcoded04:03
janimonomed, ok please write to xfce-devel about this04:04
nomedthe only solution at the moment is to patch source 04:04
janimoI suppose they'd like to fix that too04:04
janimoas they seem to use tango04:04
nomedme too04:04
janimoindeed the mcs manager is out of sync with the rest if I think about it04:04
nomedi'll continue a thread that  got 43 answers :)04:04
janimook :)04:04
nomedit was at a good point :)04:04
janimothey seemed positive generally right?04:04
nomedabsolutely yes04:04
janimoI am looking at desktop icons in the meantime04:05
janimolaunchers and removable media04:05
janimonomed, ok thanks.let's see what they say and then go on.04:05
nomedi would see even hd .. not removable ..04:05
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janimonomed, I mean behaviour04:06
janimothey do not automatically show up and things like that04:06
nomeduhhh ..04:06
janimoin the meantime talk to dobey if it's possible to get some of these into tango itslef04:06
nomedjanimo: i'm sure there is a bug on that code04:06
janimomakes our job easier long term04:06
janimonomed, yes there is04:06
nomedjanimo: yes it's possible04:06
janimobut brian/benny don't havetoo much time to debug04:06
nomedi have already the legacy xml file04:06
janimoespecially sine it seems to work for them04:07
nomedao it may depend on dbus04:07
nomedahh and tango upstreamer will include that patch as soon as i send it to him04:08
nomedi'm just waiting a steady state :)04:08
janimogreat :)04:08
janimothan daniel will upload it to ubuntu and we're better 04:08
nomedi think then some artist should play with xubuntu images 04:09
nomedthey need to be all fixed04:09
janimowhich images?04:10
janimocurrent artwork?04:10
nomedwallpaper, usplash, logo and so on04:10
janimohmm do you not like jmak's work?04:10
nomedthey 're done but they've even small issues04:10
janimohe is the single artist so far who actively participated04:11
janimosince the beginning04:11
nomedjanimo: the usplash could be strongly improved04:11
janimonomed I agree but usplash looks ugly because of small res no?04:11
nomednot really04:11
janimoalthough ubuntu usplash is nicer 04:11
nomedit's while the artist convert the image to an idexed one04:11
nomedit's possible to get a really better resolution04:12
nomedi've seen images on 16c that were the same as the original one04:12
janimowe may need to tell jmak how to actually test the usplash so he sees the result himself04:12
nomedthat depends on how the artist can use gimp inkscape and such apps04:12
=== luzi_away is now known as luzi
luzithe problem with usplash is not resolution, it's the 16 colors!04:13
nomedluzi yes04:13
nomedbut ex04:13
nomedthe usplash i checked had a color map with a lot of red and pink04:13
nomedand i don't see red or pink in xubuntu usplash04:13
nomedthat means the palette could be optimized04:14
nomedand consequentely the image resolution04:14
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nomedif you have 16 c ..04:14
nomedbut you use just 4 c from that palette ...04:14
janimonomed, please talk to jozsef or luzi about this and see if you can sort it out04:15
janimoand when you're all satisfied I'll upload :)04:15
nomedjanimo: i wrote a mail 04:15
nomedbut i need they contact me or just replay :)04:16
nomedluzi if you're fine with it we can talk a bit at #xubuntu later04:16
nomedluzi there is a small issue on the official xubuntu logo 04:17
nomedhave u seen it ..04:17
luziwhat issue?04:17
nomedtake a look on the left part of that circle :)04:18
nomedmaybe it's me ... 04:18
mjg59It looks like the "head" is offset from the "body"04:18
luziok, i see it now!04:19
luzii'll fix it.04:19
nomedthen i was thinking that as xfdesktop supports color background04:19
janimoanything else?04:19
nomedthe wallpaper could just be a trasparent layer ..04:19
nomedluzi what do u think ?04:20
nomed(as the smoke one )04:20
janimoGloubiboulga: any plans regarding xfce uploads this week?04:20
nomedif i' not wrong04:20
janimoxfburn. thunar plugins?04:20
nomedjanimo: there is a new version of verve panel plugin04:21
janimonomed, I know04:21
sladennomed: you get 14 colours, which is good enough for a gradient (hence the kubuntu one is shades of blue and the ubuntu one is shades of brown/gold)04:21
nomedbut checking it i do not see any reason to upload it04:21
Gloubiboulgajanimo, xfburn is still broken, and I have no answer on Xfce bugzilla04:21
janimoI kind of expect upstream to aply the xfrun dbus patch already so verve makes more sense04:21
janimoGloubiboulga: did you file abug on xfburn?04:21
nomedahh ok04:21
Gloubiboulgajanimo, yes04:21
janimoin what way is broken? I used it to burn some isos this week04:21
janimobetter than graveman which crashes04:21
Gloubiboulgajanimo, if it's build from SVN it's ok, buit if I use make dist or make distcheck it FTBFS04:22
janimoGloubiboulga: oh I remember. autotools madness04:22
nomedsladen: i agree04:22
GloubiboulgaI'll try to have a look at this04:22
highvoltageogra: are you saying that my old theme looks shitty?04:22
Gloubiboulgajanimo, screenshooter and media-tag plugins are ready04:23
ograhighvoltage i'd never say that !04:23
highvoltagesorry, please ignore tha!!!04:23
nomedthe xubuntu png should just use better the color map 04:23
janimoGloubiboulga: does screenshooter work?04:23
Gloubiboulgajanimo, yep, but there's an icon issue04:24
janimoI ddi not check the last release if they improved on what i ported04:24
janimognome-screenshot is used no?04:24
janimothat is in most icon themes04:24
Gloubiboulgajanimo, not in the Xfce one04:24
GloubiboulgaI had to install the gnome icons package to see the plugin in the panel04:25
nomedGloubiboulga: there is gnome-screenshoter in Rdent04:25
Gloubiboulganomed, hm... I didn't see it04:25
janimoI see s stock-screenshot04:25
nomedfind /usr/share/icons/Rodent/ | grep shoot04:25
nomedapplets-screenshooter.png sorry04:26
nomedGloubiboulga: anyway we can add the icon you need i guess04:26
nomedwith the name that 's on the desktop file04:26
janimohmm I explicitely changed that tpo gnome-screenshot back then04:26
janimoI wonder why04:26
janimowe shoulduse whatever name is in tango for screenshot04:27
janimothat is: nothing04:27
nomedjanimo: we can even use the name that is desktop file and add it to xubuntu icons theme04:27
luzinomed: the logo issue is fixed.04:27
nomedso you do not need to add any patch04:28
nomedluzi thanks :)04:28
luzinomed: oops, i just saw that the bar is not right yet...04:28
GloubiboulgaI'll check again04:29
Gloubiboulganomed, right, seen it :)04:29
janimoGloubiboulga: when they're ready put them online04:31
janimoso I can look at them, and then you can upload :)04:31
Gloubiboulgajanimo, ok04:31
Gloubiboulgajanimo, do you want a package for the thunar archive plugin too ?04:34
janimoalthough we need to think where it would fit better04:34
janimosingle package which depends on fle roller for now?04:34
janimoI guess since it does not work yet with xarchiver it cannot be part of thunar or xarchiver04:35
GloubiboulgaI don't see what else we could do for the moment04:35
janimowe could sync xarchive from debian as it has cmd line ooptoins and try that04:35
janimoanyway if xarchiver is bugged it'd be good to have that as a fallback in universe04:35
janimoI'll file a sync requets (should have done it along with xarchiver)04:36
janimoarrrgh. two projects trying to make two similar gtk only archivers and none of them being done yet :(04:36
janimoso lets' at least have the thunar plugin in and test it with file roller04:36
janimoat least that works\04:37
nomedjanimo: the xarchiver devel contacted me few h ago04:37
janimonomed, one good news and a bad news? or soemthing like that ;) ?04:37
nomedi was next to convince him to release something in the mean time ..04:38
janimobut then he said no ?04:38
nomedand he suddenly changed his mind 04:38
janimowell there are a few lessons learned for dapper+1 anyway04:38
nomedanyway ... exactly04:38
janimonot just the xarchiver one but some oethers too04:38
janimo'do not trust upstream'04:38
janimoactually one lesson :)04:38
nomedhe was upset becouse of xarchiver is not in xubuntu yet04:39
nomedeheh yep04:39
janimohe was upset?04:39
janimowell xarchiver is in ubuntu when it's in main04:39
janimowhich may be tdoay or next week depending on when colin has time to put it in04:39
janimobut him being upset?04:39
janimohow about making the thing work first? :)04:40
janimois that the original dev (colossus) or the new one (stefan)?04:40
janimoI assume colossus. 04:40
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janimoif so he should just release with a stable gui and cmd line options04:40
janimothen wonder about how to optimize for archibves with 250K  files in them which only exist in benchmarks04:41
nomedjanimo: colossus04:41
janimois he not the main dev now?04:41
nomedthat's exclty what i told him04:41
nomedhe "is"04:41
janimoit would have been better if he developed alone and released 0.4 in time imho04:42
janimoit looked like it was right on track04:42
nomedi dunno why he forgot he was the devel :)04:43
nomedand the other guy should just help him ...04:43
janimoprobbaly has no time04:45
janimowhich is understandable04:45
janimobut anyweay if someone wants to make our release, he needs to take freeze dates into account04:46
janimoat least a bit04:46
janimoit's ready when it's ready is a nice quote but won't help in our case04:46
nomedjanimo: i guess the devels have some script to add that to emails :)04:47
nomedcould we consider the meeting over ?04:49
luzii was going to ask about the translation of the desktop guide04:49
luzii feel it's not quite ready yet.04:49
janimoyes I thin kit can be over antie now04:50
janimoluzi, ah yes04:50
janimothere are no parts which are ready at all?04:50
janimochapters which are more or less like in ubuntu desktop guide04:51
luzithe 'guided tour' is nearing completion, the other ones not quite yet.04:51
janimowhere I assume translations could be copied too ;)04:51
janimoluzi, ok whenever you're reday04:51
luziwhat is the latest it should be ready?04:51
janimowe don;t have a date since we did not have a strict schedule as ubuntu04:52
janimoso all I can say ASAP :)04:52
luziok :)04:52
janimobut considering that the guide is smaller than ubuntu's04:52
janimoand parts can be taken from there by translators do not stay up at night or something04:52
janimoonly if you like that :)04:52
janimobut whenever you feel some parts are ready ping xubuntu and the doc list so people can start on it04:53
luzii like to work at night, actually :o)04:53
luziok, i'll do that.04:53
janimoI expect the guide can be translated on a new language in 2 days by a person no?04:53
luziyeah, i think so.04:53
janimoso there is time actually04:53
janimobut the sooner it;'s done the sooner users read it and give feedback04:54
janimoshould I upload the guide as is now?04:54
janimowhenever you think there' new upload worthy material ping me04:54
janimoeither mail or the list04:54
luziok, i think we'll wait another week or so.04:55
luzijanimo, what are we going to do about the 'help' buttons in the gui parts of xubuntu-system-tools?04:55
janimoluzi, good question04:55
luziit would be great to have it open the guide in a browser04:56
janimoI though about hiding them04:56
janimowould that be bad?04:56
nomedjanimo: exo-open like ?04:56
janimoif not whip up a smal dialog04:56
nomedif there is html doc i think it could shows up that ..04:56
nomedno ?04:56
janimowe cannot depend on yelp, and the docs  are not plain html04:56
janimoI think it is yelp markup04:56
janimohtml would be nice 04:56
nomedjanimo: that's strange04:57
nomedas all the xfce help stuff is in html04:57
janimofirst I'd like to see xubuntu-system tool sin main though04:57
nomedahh wait04:57
janimogot to find a clean way to make multi builds from the g-s-t package04:57
nomedxubuntu-system-tool is in yelp markup ?04:57
janimowell gnome-system-tools docs are 04:58
janimoend in .xml anyway04:58
nomedjanimo: i guess it could be considered somehow esential04:58
janimo /usr/share/gnome/help/network-admin/es/network-admin.xml04:58
janimothe help?04:58
nomedubiquity suggests that 04:58
nomedno xubuntu-system-tools04:58
janimowell sure it;'s essential04:58
janimobut not because of ubi since it only recommends it04:59
janimobut so that people can config the network interface without the ocmmand line 04:59
janimomostly, there are other nice tools04:59
janimoso if we have them in and no help I am still happy04:59
nomedthat's sure05:00
luzii think we should a) have it open the correct section of the xubuntu desktop guide in a browser b) if not possible , hide buttons05:00
nomedor even hide it if yelp is not installed (b.a ) :)05:01
janimoGloubiboulga: care to answer to the kb layout mail?05:02
janimoby JMak05:02
Gloubiboulgajanimo, ok05:02
janimook , once we have those tools on the CD I'll do a) or b)05:02
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 04 May 02:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 11 May 08:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Seveas] : test
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-meeting:Ubugtu] : Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 27 Apr 20:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 27 Apr 22:00 UTC: Kubuntu | 03 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 04 May 02:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 May 12:00 UTC: Edubuntu | 11 May 08:00 UTC: Ubuntu Development Team
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freeflying-ibook@schedule Shanghai09:17
UbugtuSchedule for Asia/Shanghai: 28 Apr 04:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 28 Apr 06:00: Kubuntu | 03 May 20:00: Edubuntu | 04 May 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 May 20:00: Edubuntu | 11 May 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team09:17
Lure@schedule Ljubljana09:21
UbugtuSchedule for Europe/Ljubljana: 27 Apr 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 28 Apr 00:00: Kubuntu | 03 May 14:00: Edubuntu | 04 May 04:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 10 May 14:00: Edubuntu | 11 May 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team09:21
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raphink-pbookhi there11:00
raphink-pbookRiddell: hello11:01
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