[12:02] <dholbach> you have to set up a local mail server
[12:03] <Kyral> yah like Sendmail?
[12:03] <Kyral> or MSMTP
[12:03] <LaserJock> dholbach: cya
[12:03] <LaserJock> Kyral: he's trying to go to bed ;-)
[12:03] <dholbach> yeah, like exim, postfix, etc
[12:03] <Kyral> sorry dholbach :P
[12:04] <dholbach> don't worry :)
[12:04] <Kyral> cat dholbach >> /dev/bed :P
[12:04] <dholbach> yup
[12:04] <dholbach> I'm off
[12:05] <LaserJock> Kyral: maybe you should have thrown a | shower in there just in case ;-)
[12:05] <Kyral> lol
[12:05] <plugwash> afaict the sendmail command can send any e-mail, not sure exactly how you use it though
[12:05] <plugwash> i think you may have to feed it a smtp command sequence or something like that
[12:06] <Kyral> well, once I get it once, I can script it and bang
[12:09] <phanatic> g'night, guys
[01:11] <LaserJock> anybody got a ppc I could borrow for a test? I need to to see if xcircuit starts up on ppc.
[01:15] <LaserJock> hi seth
[01:16] <seth> LaserJock, yo
[01:16] <LaserJock> seth: how's it going?
[01:16] <seth> it's finals week
[01:16] <seth> yay for finals :/
[01:16] <LaserJock> heh
[01:16] <seth> but it does mean that I'm almost done
[01:16] <LaserJock> I'm glad I'm done with those
[01:16] <seth> but then, 2 weeks after finals, our company is launching its new product
[01:17] <seth> so things are going to be intense for the next month
[01:17] <seth> at least
[01:19] <persia> Is UTF8 the standard encoding yet?  Is it safe to convert things found in KOI8-R during build?
[01:19] <LaserJock> persia: I'm not exactly sure. UTF8 is standard for Ubuntu but there  are apps that still have issues with it
[01:21] <persia> LaserJock: Are the problems on a per-app basis, or are there a significant number of users likely to be using a non-UFT8 locale?  I'm especially interested in the status for RU, as I'm tracking down an encoding complaint in audacity.
[01:24] <LaserJock> persia: seems on a per-app basis
[01:25] <persia> LaserJock: Thanks.  Barring testing issues, I'll look at an iconv call in the rules file.
[01:41] <crimsun> persia: if apps aren't Unicode-aware by now, they need to be fixed
[01:43] <persia> crimsun: audacity is unicode aware, it just has KOI8-R encoding for ru.po, and the results under ru_RU.UTF8 are very ugly.
[01:44] <crimsun> ick.
[01:49] <persia> Is anyone familiar with bind_textdomain_codeset()?  I'd like to find a proper usage example before creating my patch (iconv in the rules file didn't really work right).
[01:54] <bddebian> Heya gang
[01:55] <crimsun> hi bddebian
[01:56] <bddebian> Howdy crimsun
[01:56] <LaserJock> hi bddebian
[01:56] <bddebian> Hello LaserJock
[01:57] <ajmitch> hello bddebian
[01:58] <ajmitch> our king returns!
[01:58] <crimsun> hmm, interesting new volume icon
[01:58] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[01:58] <bddebian> Your king.. pfft
[01:59] <ajmitch> of course
[01:59] <bddebian> phooey
[01:59] <LaserJock> all hail bug king bddebian !! ;-)
[02:00] <bddebian> STOP IT :-)
[02:00] <bddebian> I'm useless lately :'-(
[02:00] <crimsun> cool, BddebianIsAKing now?
[02:01] <ajmitch> slow thing
[02:03] <lifeless> bddebian: upload xclip
[02:03] <Laser_away> alas, group meeting awaits
[02:04] <bddebian> lifeless: ?
[02:05] <lifeless> bddebian: theres a bug on xcllip
[02:05] <lifeless> xclip
[02:05] <lifeless> where you claim you prepped a fix, but wanted to test it, its marked needsinfo,
[02:05] <bddebian> Hmm
[02:06] <lifeless> but xclip is currently fucked in dapper because its in /usr/X11R6/bin
[02:08] <bddebian> I'm afraid it will break on other archs though
[02:09] <bddebian> Maybe I should just hack rules to cp them to usr/lib
[02:09] <ajmitch> such as?
[02:09] <bddebian> ajmitch: ppc
[02:09] <bddebian> amd64
[02:10] <persia> bddebian: I can test amd64.  Which bug number?
[02:10] <bddebian> persia: It's a local fix.  I had the package stop using xmkmf
[02:10] <bddebian> I'm probably better off cping or mving the files after the fact
[02:11] <lifeless> bddebian: put the debdiff in the bug
[02:11] <lifeless> bddebian: then persia can test
[02:11] <bddebian> Oh, that's gonna break the build though
[02:11] <persia> bddebian: Ah, you too were caught by 28707!
[02:12] <bddebian> persia: There are several packages b0rked because of that :-)
[02:13] <persia> bddebian: Too bad we didn't expect the delay in February or March: this would be solved by now :(
[02:13] <bddebian> Yeah
[02:15] <bddebian> Hmm, anyone know much about -e with make?
[02:16] <lifeless> it changes the precedence of FOO=BAR
[02:16] <lifeless> with make by default:
[02:16] <lifeless> FOO=BAR make
[02:16] <lifeless> will only set FOO=BAR in the Makefile rules if there is no FOO= line, or if its using the special syntax (?:= IIRC)
[02:17] <lifeless> make FOO=BAR will set FOO=BAR in the makefile always
[02:17] <bddebian> So I can't override?
[02:17] <bddebian> Ahh
[02:17] <lifeless> FOO=BAR make -e
[02:17] <lifeless> behaves like make FOO=BAR
[02:18] <persia> Audacity depends on wxwindows for gettext translation, and contains .po files with various encodings (UTF8, ISO-8859-1, KOI8-R, etc).  wxwindows doesn't apply bind_textdomain_codeset() to automatically convert to a given locale.  As a result, audacity renders .  In which package should this be fixed?
[02:20] <crimsun> more than likely wxwidgets
[02:20] <crimsun> which well, has historically had ... issues with encodings.
[02:21] <persia> crimsun: wxwidgets?  I don't have that package for -2.4.  I'll prepare a patch for wxwindows, and make sure it works with audacity.  Thanks.
[02:22] <crimsun> persia: both wxwidgets2.6 and wxwindows2.4 have ... unique encoding handling.
[02:23] <persia> crimsun: unique?  Perhaps I should just convert the po in audacity, and avoid changes that could break someone else's hack?
[02:24] <crimsun> persia: whichever is least likely to touch wxwindows.
[02:25] <bddebian> Hmm, what should LIBEXECDIR be?  Just /usr/lib?
[02:25] <persia> crimsun: OK.  I won't play with wxwindows.  Thanks for the warning.
[02:29] <bddebian> OK, it doesn't like that:
[02:29] <bddebian> /usr/bin/make \
[02:29] <bddebian>         INCROOT = /usr/include \
[02:29] <bddebian>         USRLIBDIR = /usr/lib \
[02:29] <bddebian>         SHLIBDIR = /usr/lib \
[02:29] <bddebian>         MANPATH = /usr/man \
[02:29] <bddebian>         PROJECTROOT = /usr \
[02:29] <bddebian>         BINDIR = /usr/bin \
[02:29] <bddebian>         LIBEXECDIR = /usr
[02:29] <bddebian> make: *** empty variable name.  Stop.
[02:30] <bddebian> make: *** [build-stamp]  Error 2
[02:49] <bddebian> SHouldn't the above work?
[02:54] <persia> bddebian: Have you tried it with fewer spaces (FOO=BAR rather than FOO = BAR)?  In some cases, this makes a difference.
[02:57] <bddebian> Hmm no, I will thx
[03:00] <bddebian> persia: That was it, thx
[03:02] <Kyral> yo bddebian
[03:08] <bddebian> Heya Kyral
[03:08] <bddebian> Stupid thing still installs in X11R6 path.. :-(
[03:13] <persia> bddebian: Perhaps you could do something with sed between the call to xmkmf and the call to make?
[03:13] <bddebian> I thought about that but it seems like overkill..
[03:14] <crimsun> sometimes ya gotta do what ya gotta do
[03:14] <persia> bddebian: the problem is that xmkmf makes extremely robust Makefiles, which are difficult to fix otherwise :)  Personally, I fell back on 28707 as the fix.
[03:14] <Kyral> If I disappear for a very long time, ask bddebian where I am....
[03:14] <Kyral> I'll prolly be on HURD Island :P
[03:14] <bddebian> w000t :-)
[03:15] <bddebian> persia: What do you mean fell back on 28707?
[03:16] <persia> bddebian: I mean I gave up on the other bugs until 28707 was fixed.
[03:18] <crimsun> I hate when I discover soft blockers
[03:18] <bddebian> OK, who's the sed expert to replace /X11R6/ with / ? :-)
[03:18] <Kyral> uhhh
[03:18] <Kyral> s/\/X11R6\//\/?
[03:19] <crimsun> s/\/X11R6//  is simpler
[03:19] <persia> bddebian: FOO=mktemp; sed s/X11R6\///g < Makefile > $FOO; mv $FOO Makefile is a quick&dirty way to do it.
[03:19] <Kyral> I think he wants tot replace it with a literal /
[03:19] <Kyral> I dunno
[03:19] <crimsun> Kyral: which is fine, since the trailing / is that literal /
[03:19] <Kyral> my sed-fu is weak
[03:19] <bddebian> Kyral: Stronger than mine :-)
[03:21] <crimsun> guh, time to think about an UVFe for wxwidgets2.6 :(
[03:22] <ajmitch> crimsun: to 2.6.3.x?
[03:22] <crimsun> ajmitch: yes, to Sid's
[03:22] <ajmitch> hopefully it wouldn't break *too* much
[03:22] <bddebian> heh
[03:22] <ajmitch> wx has a history of being nasty with updates
[03:23] <ajmitch> too many apps depending on existing bugs :)
[03:23] <bddebian> hehe
[03:23] <crimsun> yeah, I'll have to test it locally before I decide
[03:23] <crimsun> ->coffee
[03:23] <persia> Could someone please remind me of the command to see exported symbols from a library?
[03:23] <Kyral> objdump?
[03:23] <bddebian> persia: objdump -T
[03:23] <ajmitch> ah, curry... an important part of the diet
[03:23] <Kyral> ajmitch: he said COFFEE
[03:23] <Kyral> not CURRY
[03:24] <ajmitch> Kyral: yes, I saw that
[03:24] <ajmitch> you don't have be yell it
[03:24] <Kyral> ah you were referring to yourself sorry
[03:24] <ajmitch> yes, I was
[03:24] <Kyral> ajmitch: I dunno howto bold in Irssi
[03:24] <persia> Kyral: Thanks.
[03:24] <Kyral> sorry
[03:24] <ajmitch> since I just had some vindaloo for lunch
[03:31] <bddebian> OK persia that doesn't work :-)
[03:34] <persia> bddebian: Which part doesn't work?  Does the Makefile get updated?
[03:34] <bddebian> No, I get unknown option to 's'
[03:34] <zakame> hi all
[03:34] <bddebian> Heya zakame
[03:35] <zakame> heya bdd! :D
[03:35] <persia> bddebian: Playing with the shell, I found echo This is /usr/X11R6/lib | sed 's/X11R6\///g'
[03:35] <zakame> coolness, the SoC got extended
[03:36] <ajmitch> only by less than a day :)
[03:36] <zakame> persia: is that the imakefile bits again? :)
[03:36] <persia> zakame: Yep.  bddebian is bravely attempting to use sed in local rules files to avoid 28707.
[03:36] <ajmitch> zakame: what have you applied for?
[03:37] <zakame> ajmitch: ubuntu, tpf and osdl
[03:37] <zakame> I'm thinking of submitting one for debian too :)
[03:37] <ajmitch> zakame: yes, but to do what projects? :)
[03:38] <zakame> persia: rocking!  I was dreaming over your last statement about the 5-year support... and I think its better tosupport a usable app for 5 rathern than a borked one :/
[03:39] <zakame> ajmitch: sendpage for osdl, nms-cgi for tpf, and smart-bugreporting-tool for ubuntu (currently drafting)
[03:39] <ajmitch> great :)
[03:40] <ajmitch> so hard..
[03:40] <persia> zakame: You may be right, and if bddebian is successful, we'll have a supportable model package (xclip).
[03:40] <zakame> awww
[03:40] <bddebian> Well I'm not so far :'-(
[03:40] <zakame> rock on!
[03:41] <zakame> ajmitch: are you going to do NetworkAuthentication?
[03:42] <ajmitch> zakame: hopefully
[03:42] <persia> I think I'm missing something.  When running torcs, I get: "symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/torcs/modules/graphic/ssggraph.so: undefined symbol: alutLoadWAVFile", but `objdump -T /usr/lib/libalut.so.0.0.0 | alutLoadWAVFile` prints an address.  Can anyone point me in the right direction?
[03:43] <ajmitch> back later :)
[03:43] <bddebian> persia: Is it really looking in /usr/lib/torcs/modules....
[03:43] <bddebian> Oh, nm, I read that wrong
[03:44] <zakame> coolness :D
[03:44] <zakame> brb
[03:50] <bddebian> w000t
[03:50] <bddebian> Ugly as hell but it seems to work
[03:53] <persia> bddebian: How ugly?  I just tried it for kdrill (libalut is frustrating), and it was only four lines of mush (sed 's/\/X11R6//g' < $(CURDIR)/Makefile.xmkmf > $(CURDIR)/Makefile type stuff).
[03:53] <bddebian> I did this:
[03:53] <bddebian>         mv Makefile Makefile.in
[03:53] <bddebian>         cat Makefile.in | sed 's/\/X11R6//g' > Makefile
[03:55] <persia> bddebian: Well then, perhaps 28707 isn't the blocker it was.  The cruft shouldn't break anything once ProjectRoot is adjusted, as it should become a NOP.
[03:56] <bddebian> Aye
[04:03] <bddebian> Hmm, do I need to add sed as a build-dep now?
[04:04] <crimsun> no, it's in base and is present already.
[04:04] <persia> bddebian: Does Ubuntu have Essential?  If not, yes.  If so, then only if sed is not essential.
[04:04] <bddebian> OK, thx guys
[04:04] <crimsun> Essential: yes
[04:04] <crimsun> Priority: required
[04:04] <crimsun> Section: base
[04:06] <zakame> back
[04:07] <zakame> woohoo! seems we can break the imake ice after all :)
[04:07] <crimsun> heh. I did that sed cruft with wxwidgets2.6 a while ago ;)
[04:13] <zakame> persia: what are the changes to debian/dirs and *.menu , from the patch? they're not documented in debian/changelog
[04:16] <persia> zakame: It's part of "Removed statis references to X11R6 from the debian directory".  Hold on a minute: I made a mistake with the last patch - a new one should be forthcoming.
[04:18] <zakame> ah yes... /me am used to listing individual changed files in the log
[04:19] <persia> zakame: There were so many!  I can edit if you like.
[04:20] <zakame> no, it ok now, that's just mypreference anyhow :) rocking work :D
[04:20] <persia> zakame: Thanks.  You'll upload, or should I list it on my wishlist page?
[04:24] <zakame> persia: ok :)
[04:24] <persia> zakame: Thanks.
[04:48] <Yagisan> Is getting an ICE in gcc a good enough excuse to get a import gcc-4.1 ?
[04:49] <ajmitch> usually not
[04:49] <ajmitch> you'd have to convince doko, and then mdz, I suspect
[04:49] <crimsun> Yagisan: it doesn't build with gcc-4.0?
[04:51] <Yagisan> ajmitch crimsun I was using the nifty new -ftree-vectorize and it gave an ICE on valid code with 4.0 and a working file with 4.1
[04:52] <Yagisan> anyway I should get make to delivering my ads. Catch you later tonight
[04:52] <Yagisan> s/make/back
[04:54] <zakame> awww
[06:23] <imbrandon> stupid question , why does php5 depend on apache2* ( it can also be used as command line only like python etc )
[06:50] <Hobbsee> hi everyone ;)
[06:52] <Mithrandir> ehlo, Hobbsee
[06:52] <bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
[06:52] <Hobbsee> hi bddebian
[06:52] <bddebian> Gnight Hobbsee :-)
[06:52] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:52] <bddebian> Gnight everyone
[06:52] <Hobbsee> afternoon bddebian
[06:54] <Hobbsee> argh!
[06:54] <StevenK> What computer lecture?
[06:54] <Hobbsee> which...would be finishing in...5 mins, i guess :D
[06:54] <Hobbsee> StevenK: the one i'm not at.
[06:54] <StevenK> What subject?
[06:54] <Hobbsee> computing
[06:54] <Hobbsee> c++ programming
[06:55] <StevenK> Ah. I passed that unit 4 years ago.
[06:55] <Hobbsee> actually, better still...you can do my evil maths assignment!
[06:55] <StevenK> Hobbsee: It's been a while since I've sunk my teeth into maths, I'm happy to help.
[06:55] <Hobbsee> heh
[06:55] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: is it evil or is it just maths?
[06:56] <StevenK> Spending 15 minutes using Performance Monitor on Windows XP does not make a hard prac.
[06:56] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: it's calculus.
[06:56] <StevenK> Therefore, evil maths.
[06:56] <Hobbsee> exactly
[06:56] <Hobbsee> well, there are some matrix proofs in there...
[06:57] <StevenK> Yummy, matrixes.
[06:57] <Hobbsee> hehe
[06:59] <Mithrandir> cruuunchy matrices.
[07:00] <StevenK> With butter inna bun
[07:02] <Hobbsee> hehe!
[07:02] <Hobbsee> StevenK: http://rutherglen.ics.mq.edu.au/math132s106/m132-a3.pdf
[07:03] <Hobbsee> StevenK: i'm up to 1f, have done question 2, and have no clue about the lovely question three :P
[07:13] <ajmitch> afternoon
[07:17] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :)
[07:41] <crimsun> excellent, just python version changes for Sid's wxwidgets2.6
[09:10] <\sh> moins
[09:11] <crimsun> moin \sh
[09:28] <dholbach> good morning motu world!
[09:33] <Hobbsee> hi dholbach :)
[09:33] <dholbach> hey Hobbsee - how are YOU?
[09:34] <Hobbsee> dholbach: i'm avoiding my maths assignment, and fighting a bit with my wireless card, with this new kernel :)  And yourself?
[09:34] <dholbach> Hobbsee: just started working and we have beautiful weather over here
[09:34] <Hobbsee> :)
[09:34] <dholbach> Hobbsee: is the maths assignment sooo bad?
[09:34] <Hobbsee> dholbach: yes.  i'ts calculus, among other things.
[09:35] <dholbach> you should find some guys in here who can help you :)
[09:35] <dholbach> hey slomo_
[09:35] <Hobbsee> heh
[09:35] <slomo_> hi dholbach :)
[09:36] <dholbach> slomo_: you seem to be trying to stay awake for 22h a day?
[09:37] <slomo_> dholbach: not really... i slept ~6 hours last night... like almost every night
[09:37] <slomo_> dholbach: why? :)
[09:37] <dholbach> slomo_: then you were up real early :)
[09:38] <siretart> hey motus!
[09:40] <dholbach> hey siretart
[09:42] <slomo_> hi siretart
[09:43] <crimsun> hey folks
[10:08] <Hobbsee> i'm off for a while - see you later...
[10:08] <Mithrandir> enjoy your passout.
[10:08] <Hobbsee> heh
[11:21] <Toadstool> hi everybody
[11:48] <Riddell> siretart: what does it take to get my UVFe approved?
[11:48] <\sh> oh wow...I love ssh X11 Forwarding and Cygnus software
[11:49] <siretart> Riddell: it was set to 'confirmed', so it is approved
[11:49] <siretart> Riddell: I assume you talk about qt-4.1.2, right?
[11:52] <Riddell> yes
[11:52] <Riddell> ok, cool, how do I request the sync then?
[12:00] <siretart> Riddell: thats documented on DeveloperRessources wiki. You just need to subscribe 'ubuntu-archive', and say exactly what version from which origin you want to sync from and confirm that you have checked that all ubuntu changes can be dropped
[12:06] <Whoopie> Hi
[12:08] <Whoopie> siretart: with regard to bug #43385 (acroread): couldn't we just mention that we switched to marillat's repo and rebuilt it for dapper? It's not a new version upload, it's a bugfix. See #41787.
[12:09] <Mithrandir> uh, we're shipping acroread?
[12:09] <Mithrandir> has the license been fixed to allow redistribution?
[12:10] <Whoopie> Mithrandir: it's in multiverse.
[12:10] <Mithrandir> yes, and?
[12:10] <Mithrandir> if it's not redistributable, we can't redistribute it
[12:16] <siretart> Mithrandir: we've been shipping acroread (the binary package) since warty
[12:16] <siretart> Mithrandir: I was told that sabdfl himself decided to ship it, but I havn't heared that someone investigated the matter deeper. but I may be wrong
[12:19] <Mithrandir> siretart: the license doesn't appear to give rights to redistribute it.
[12:20] <siretart> Mithrandir: right
[12:21] <Whoopie> Mithrandir: and what about 2.2.1 in the EULA?
[12:22] <Mithrandir> Whoopie: that talks about installed copies.
[12:22] <Mithrandir> and it talks about internal use, and it doesn't allow usage over anything but NFS.
[12:23] <Mithrandir> there, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/acroread/+bug/43780
[12:23] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 43780 in acroread "Redistribution not allowed" [Critical,Unconfirmed] 
[12:25] <Whoopie> why is it in marillat's repo? If Adobe was concerned about it, wouldn't they have done anything against it?
[12:25] <StevenK> Whoopie: They may not.
[12:25] <StevenK> Whoopie: It's up to Adobe to chase it. They may choose not to.
[12:26] <Mithrandir> that doesn't mean you can redistribute.
[12:26] <siretart> Whoopie: marillat has a lot of stuff with highly doubtful licences. so this argument doesn't really count
[12:26] <StevenK> So, surely we punt the (useless) acroread out of the archive, and close all its bugs.
[12:26] <StevenK> Mithrandir: Well, you can. You just shouldn't.
[12:26] <StevenK> I don't think marillat even reads licenses.
[12:28] <Whoopie> ok, that's bad. I hoped to find a solution to upgrade it, not to ban it from the archive.
[12:29] <Mithrandir> StevenK: can as in "is allowed to".  You can jump off bridges, but I'd advise you not to.
[12:29] <Whoopie> But I understand your concerns.
[12:33] <Whoopie> another question: we're shopping kismet, but our version doesn't support the newer wireless cards (e.g. ipw3945). Would it be possible to sync with debian and ship a version which supports all our supported cards?
[12:35] <Lathiat> whast the current debain version?
[12:38] <StevenK>     kismet | 2005.08.R1-1.2 |        dapper | source, amd64, i386
[12:38] <StevenK>     kismet | 2006.04.R1-1 |           sid | source, amd64, i386
[12:40] <StevenK> We are releasing in less than a month. A new upstream version is very unlikely.
[12:40] <StevenK>     kismet | 2005.08.R1-1.2 |        dapper | source, amd64, i386
[12:40] <StevenK>     kismet | 2006.04.R1-1 |           sid | source, amd64, i386
[12:40] <StevenK> Crap, sorry.
[12:41] <StevenK> Who knew the 4th button on my mouse pasted.
[12:41] <Mithrandir> it does?  Weird.
[12:42] <StevenK> I have a Microsoft IntelliMouse.
[12:42] <StevenK> The wierd glowy one that happens to have 7 buttons.
[12:42] <StevenK> The button on the left hand side seems to paste as well as pressing the whell.
[12:43] <StevenK> Er. Wheel
[12:43] <Mithrandir> I have a logitech mx518 or something which has 8 or so, but apart from the wheel, it doesn't paste.
[12:47] <StevenK> Whoopie: If you'd like to try and get kismet sync'd, you're welcome to test it to death and see if there are no regressions.
[12:48] <StevenK> And then beg a MOTU to ask for UVF exception, and then a sync.
[12:51] <StevenK> Mithrandir: It appears (from my reading of the Adobe website), that we can distribute acroread if we fill out the Adobe Reader Distribution Agreement.
[12:51] <Mithrandir> StevenK: ok.  I guess Somebody might want to do that.
[12:51] <Mithrandir> StevenK: care to add that info to the bug?
[12:54] <StevenK> Mithrandir: Done.
[12:54] <Mithrandir> thanks
[12:54] <Whoopie> StevenK: I rebuilt it under dapper. And it works here. But I can't say that there are no regressions.
[12:57] <phanatic> hi people
[12:57] <sivang> hey phanatic
[12:57] <sivang> phanatic: what's up?
[12:58] <phanatic> hey sivang, got answer from JaneW, she updated the UDS page :)
[01:01] <\sh> hmmm..is there a wiki page for the Ubuntu conference in Paris?
[01:02] <waldo> anyone around?
[01:02] <\sh> somehow yes :)
[01:02] <waldo> i was sent here to get some help on a strange error I'm getting in (386) Ubuntu Dapper when using gnome-nettool -- namely that it crashes with a glibc error
[01:03] <waldo> I was told to report the error here....
[01:03] <waldo> by someone in ubuntu+1
[01:03] <waldo> I just did a ton of updates today (hadn't used the machine in weeks) so.. anyway here goes
[01:05] <waldo> So I type "gnome-nettool" and I get the following:  "*** glibc detected *** free(): invalid pointer:  0x08123500 *** Aborted"
[01:05] <waldo> what's this all about?
[01:05] <sivang> waldo: you have some sort of memory corruption
[01:05] <sivang> waldo: trying to free a non existant pointer
[01:05] <sivang> (or so)
[01:05] <waldo> memory corruption?
[01:06] <waldo> this happens consistently after reboots, etc.
[01:06] <sivang> waldo: well, free is trying to release memory at the pointed location by 0x0812350
[01:06] <sivang> waldo: but apparently there is nothing to be free there according to it's tables.
[01:06] <waldo> I saw something somewhere about problems w/mismatching glibc when I googled this error....
[01:06] <sivang> (it uses tables IIRC to track allocated addres ranges)
[01:06] <phanatic> \sh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitParis
[01:07] <waldo> sivang well, what could be causing this?
[01:07] <sivang> phanatic: you did? wow
[01:07] <waldo> this is drake+all current updates
[01:07] <phanatic> sivang: was too impatient :)
[01:08] <waldo> am I the only  one getting this error?
[01:08] <sivang> phanatic: congrets
[01:08] <sivang> phanatic: I'll probably have to track the conf from home, or come by myself :)
[01:09] <phanatic> sivang: it will be decided tonigh/tomorrow
[01:09] <waldo> it only crashes when I use the UI.  If I run nettool from the commandline only it doesn't dump
[01:09] <phanatic> so nobody got answer yet
[01:09] <phanatic> i just got the answer for the "when do we get results?" question :)
[01:10] <Yagisan> hmm. Why do I have "unattended-upgrades" installed ?
[01:10] <sivang> phanatic: ah :)
[01:10] <sivang> phanatic: so there's still hope ;-)
[01:10] <sivang> phanatic: what do you mean 'who do we get restuls?" quesiton ?
[01:11] <phanatic> sivang: i asked JaneW to tell me when the sponsorships will be decided
[01:11] <sivang> phanatic: ah!
[01:12] <phanatic> sivang: she answered and updated the wiki page, so everybody knows the answer :)
[01:12] <Yagisan> my amusing though for today. gcc-4.1 FTBFS in pbuilder due to it dieing in the initial patching, yet apparently it builds in Debians buildds
[01:13] <waldo> gnome-nettool runs for everyone else fine?
[01:16] <StevenK> Yagisan: Whee.
[01:17] <StevenK> sivang: If it happens consistenly with the same program only, then it probably isn't memory corruption.
[01:18] <sivang> StevenK: hmm, right, in any event I cannot reproduce it here
[01:18] <waldo> can anyone reproduce my crash of gnome-nettool (from terminal) or System->Adminstration->Network Tools ?
[01:19] <RandolphCarter> waldo: nope, could you paste any output on the terminal somewhere?
[01:19] <waldo> So I type "gnome-nettool" and I get the following:  "*** glibc detected *** free(): invalid pointer:  0x08123500 *** Aborted"
[01:19] <waldo> that's the output.  It only does this when it tries to go to the screen.
[01:20] <waldo> I mean, if I do a command line only function like --ping=localhost it doesn't crash until it tries drawing the window...
[01:20] <waldo> then it eats it
[01:20] <RandolphCarter> mmm, malloc :) sorry, but without gdb'ing, I can't help
[01:21] <waldo> okay just ran gdb and it says this
[01:21] <Mithrandir> waldo: which architecture?
[01:21] <waldo> 386
[01:21] <waldo> very old computer
[01:21] <waldo> umm...
[01:21] <Mithrandir> I can't reproduce it either..
[01:21] <waldo> actually I don't know if this is helpful
[01:21] <waldo> it's the same error, then Program received signal SIGABRT, Aborted
[01:22] <waldo> [switching to thread -121965600 (LWP 4995)]   0xffffe410 in __kernel_vsyscall ()
[01:22] <waldo> do i need to do like a traceroute or something?
[01:22] <waldo> i'm not good at this gdb thing... :)
[01:23] <waldo> hmm.
[01:23] <waldo> well, i'm gonna go to bed.  And hopefully this magically fixes itself.
[01:24] <waldo> fwiw the error seems to be in __kernel_vsyscall and before that in raise() from /lib/tls/i686/cmov/libc.so.6  -- I don't know why there's 686 anything since this is an old 386 but whatever.
[01:25] <waldo> night
[01:25] <RandolphCarter> night - if you get the time, run 'ltrace gnome-nettool 2> call.log' and upload call.log somewhere
[01:25] <waldo> hmm one sec
[01:26] <waldo> i'll do that quickly..
[01:26] <RandolphCarter> cheers
[01:26] <waldo> okay I have the log.. where to send it?
[01:26] <waldo> hmm.
[01:27] <RandolphCarter> try: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/ if it's a reasonable size
[01:28] <waldo> k give me 20 seconds
[01:31] <waldo> okay done
[01:31] <waldo> sorry for the blank lines at the top ,it was to help me find the top of the log and I forgot to cut it off
[01:32] <waldo> does that help you at all?
[01:32] <waldo> there?
[01:32] <waldo> sorry again... :blah:
[01:32] <waldo> I'm turning off the linux box...
[01:33] <RandolphCarter> thanks, I'll have a look, we might be able to tell where it's failing at least
[01:34] <waldo> it seems to draw out the window and the widgets and stuff .  Then takes a dump
[01:34] <waldo> fwiw this is a laptop I'm setting up for a friend.  Circa 1998..
[02:20] <zul> heylo
[02:25] <crimsun> four core-dev candidates today? Neat.
[02:25] <crimsun> g'luck zakame & zul
[02:26] <Lathiat> nice
[02:27] <zul> thanks
[02:46] <ajmitch> hi
[02:46] <Yagisan> evening ajmitch
[02:47] <ajmitch> how's it going?
[02:48] <Yagisan> ajmitch heath getting better, money getting worse.
[02:48] <Yagisan> + typing getting worse
[02:48] <ajmitch> ah :(
[02:48] <ajmitch> still trying to get customers?
[02:48] <Yagisan> ajmitch: been making up and distributing flyers this week
[02:49] <Yagisan> ajmitch: is that an offer ;)
[02:49] <ajmitch> sadly no :)
[02:53] <Yagisan> ajmitch. I'm trying to relax by testing out -ftree-vectorize and seeing how much speed up I can get, and is it measurable enough to be worth it
[02:53] <ajmitch> interesting
[02:53] <ajmitch> any results so far?
[02:54] <Yagisan> ajmitch: yes. some code actually did get faster, others had no change, and some valid code caused an ICE :)
[02:54] <Yagisan> ajmitch: but without -msse etc it doesn't work
[02:55] <Yagisan> ajmitch: so not suitable for base i386, but amd64 might be able to use it. no idea about powerpc
[02:56] <ajmitch> evening Hobbsee
[02:56] <Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :)
[02:57] <Yagisan> ajmitch: to be honest, if I could utilise -fprofile-generate and -fprofile-use in the .deb build scripts, I'd expect a bigger boost, but I'm not sure the buildds would like that.
[03:10] <Hobbsee> hi StevenK and Yagisan
[03:11] <Hobbsee> :P
[03:11] <StevenK> Ooof
[03:13] <bddebian> Heya gang
[03:14] <Hobbsee> hi bddebian
[03:14] <bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
[03:18] <phanatic> hey bddebian
[03:21] <Hobbsee> heh
[03:21] <Mithrandir> Yagisan: yet another one. :-P
[03:21] <Mithrandir> Yagisan: post it on teh intarweb
[03:21] <Hobbsee> hehe
[03:21] <Hobbsee> LOL!
[03:21] <Hobbsee> thanks Mithrandir :)
[03:22] <Hobbsee> bad Yagisan!  you shouldnt make me laugh so hard whne the parents are asleep!
[03:22] <StevenK> Yagisan: My hair is darker. :-P
[03:22] <Yagisan> and that folks is the total extent of my artistic ability
[03:22] <StevenK> Hahaha
[03:22] <Mithrandir> Yagisan: nice. :-)
[03:23] <StevenK> Yagisan: Your artistic ability seems to be better than mine,
[03:23] <StevenK> s/\,/./
[03:23] <Yagisan> StevenK: well, I've spent 3 days trying to draw artwork for my ads. I'd hope it would be better then that
[03:23] <StevenK> Hah
[03:23] <bddebian> Hi phanatic, Mithrandir, Yagisan, StevenK :-)
[03:24] <Yagisan> G'day bddebian
[03:24] <StevenK> Yagisan: Oh, speaking of, Sean wanted to see your CV.
[03:24] <Yagisan> StevenK: oh ?
[03:24] <Mithrandir> hiya bddebian
[03:25] <StevenK> Yagisan: Just to see and have it on file. I think.
[03:25] <Yagisan> StevenK: Will have done up tomorrow then.
[03:27] <StevenK> Yagisan: Aye
[03:47] <crimsun> bddebian: what do you mean by "libglib2.0-data packages"?
[03:48] <tuxmaniac> Hello world!
[03:48] <bddebian> crimsun: http://www.w00tlinux.com/bb/sutra227407.html
[03:49] <crimsun> bddebian: $ COLUMNS=120 dpkg -l libglib2.0-data |grep ^ii
[03:49] <crimsun> ii  libglib2.0-data          2.10.2-1ubuntu1          Common files for GLib library
[03:49] <\sh> siretart: any news from fai kernel on ubuntu? :) looks like I need it somehow faster then expected :)
[03:50] <bddebian> crimsun: Weird it doesn't show up for me
[03:50] <Whoopie> Hi, how can I do a snapshot of the gksu window? I doesn't look nice here.
[03:50] <crimsun> bddebian: it's a dependency of ubuntu-desktop, even.
[03:52] <bddebian> Weird
[04:19] <Dulin> Hi
[04:35] <Yagisan> my 2 year old grabbed the washing powder and made a "sand pit" while I was in the dunny
[04:35] <Yagisan> she was completely covered in the stuff
[04:36] <Yagisan> her and dad were not happy about her impromptu shower to wash it off
[04:36] <crimsun> ah, the joys of children
[04:37] <Kyral> morning MOTU people
[04:37] <crimsun> I bet my folks are happy to be empty-nesters
[04:37] <crimsun> morning Kyral
[04:37] <Yagisan> G'day Kyral
[04:37] <Kyral> Morning dholbach
[04:38] <Yagisan> crimsun: she emptied 4kg of the stuff ! from a new box.
[04:38] <Kyral> whats a dunny?
[04:40] <Yagisan> Kyral: toilet
[04:40] <Hobbsee> Yagisan: he's clearly *never* been to australia :P
[04:40] <Kyral> ah
[04:40] <Kyral> Yah I'm a stupid american
[04:41] <Hobbsee> hehe
[04:41] <Kyral> Kyral baka ja nei
[04:41] <Kyral> ( I hope I got the grammer on that right)
[04:43] <Spec> japanese?
[04:43] <Yagisan> Kyral: nope. Kyral baka desu ne. or in hiragana Kyral 
[04:43] <Yagisan> Kyral: what you actually said was
[04:43] <Spec> hiragana is apparantly a language comprised of blackboxes and 'a's with tildes above them...
[04:43] <Yagisan> Kyral: Kyral stupid. See you later
[04:43] <Kyral> lol
[04:43] <Kyral> sorry lol
[04:43] <Yagisan> Spec: missing fonts
[04:43] <Spec> i know :p
[04:44] <Spec> yeah, i was thinking about that
[04:44] <Spec> but then i'd be expected to do work
[04:45] <Kyral> lol
[04:45] <Kyral> If my college offered it I would do it in an instant
[04:45] <Kyral> but they don't
[04:45] <Spec> Mine does - and I'm at a community college
[04:45] <Kyral> I'm at an Engineering college
[04:45] <Kyral> Liberal Arts programs aren't our thing :P
[04:45] <Spec> i'm trying to transfer to one, eventually
[04:46] <Yagisan> I tried formal lessons. didn't work for me
[04:46] <Yagisan> I learn better "interacting" with them :-P
[04:47] <crimsun> Kyral: consider teaching English in Japan
[04:47] <Yagisan> Kyral: avoid Nova then
[04:48] <Yagisan> Kyral: need your bachelors first
[04:48] <Yagisan> though
[04:48] <Kyral> Nova?
[04:48] <Yagisan> Kyral: major english language school
[04:49] <Spec> avoid Nova?
[04:49] <Yagisan> Kyral: basically treats you, like you'd treat a mexican
[04:49] <Yagisan> Spec: as a teacher. NoVa = No Vacation
[04:49] <Spec> ah
[04:49] <Kyral> ...I'd treat a Mexican the same way I'd treat an American
[04:50] <Kyral> if you're an ass to me, I'm an ass to you
[04:50] <Yagisan> Spec: sick for 1 day and you lose your job
[04:50] <Kyral> if you are nice to me, I'm nice to you
[04:50] <Kyral> etc etc etc
[04:50] <Yagisan> Kyral: actually, I'm refferring more to the recent protests I saw on tv
[04:51] <Kyral> ah
[04:51] <Yagisan> Kyral: english as an ambiguous "you"
[04:51] <Yagisan> s/sa/has
[04:52] <Yagisan> Kyral: steryotypical I know, but even US shows portrey it that way
[04:54] <Spec> I feel awkward being American. :-/
[04:54] <Kyral> yah....
[04:54] <Kyral> lol
[04:55] <Kyral> I mean wesa hated no?
[04:55] <Spec> there's a bug in launchpad, I just submitted a comment and it sent two of them, timestamped differently: 10:42:34 and 10:54:25
[04:55] <Spec> well, we're hated for good reasons....
[04:56] <bddebian> BS
[04:56] <Yagisan> Kyral: no. people nice. Government , well, the current one isn't a good one
[04:57] <Kyral> and how!!
[04:57] <Kyral> cat Bush > /dev/null
[04:57] <Kyral> I didn't vote for the arseclown
[04:58] <Kyral> I love what my mom always told me about voting
[04:58] <Yagisan> Kyral: rather like down here. I mean, what were people think oh wait thats right "tax cuts" (sure, first you raise taxes, then at election time you lower it. sheep vote for you.)
[04:58] <Kyral> "You don't vote, you don't get the right to bitch for the next 4 years" :P
[04:58] <Yagisan> Kyral: your system is odd. It's not majority wins, its first to get counted
[04:59] <Kyral> yah yah
[04:59] <Kyral> I wanna move to Canada damn it :P
[04:59] <Kyral> or someplace like Britian
[05:00] <Kyral> I know I swapped the i and a sorry
[05:00] <Kyral> Yagisan: where do you live btw?
[05:00] <Yagisan> Kyral: Australia
[05:01] <Yagisan> Kyral: kind of odd, as well, I'm allways around at these odd hours
[05:01] <Lathiat> Yagisan: what city?
[05:01] <Kyral> Yanno, with all the Ubuntu People down there, maybe I should move down there lol
[05:01] <Yagisan> Lathiat: Sydney
[05:01] <Lathiat> need more people in perth :(
[05:01] <Kyral> Lathiat: izzat an offer? :P
[05:01] <tseng> Lathiat: sydney is more better
[05:01] <Lathiat> yeh but im not in sydney
[05:01] <Lathiat> :(
[05:01] <Kyral> Seriously find me a Computer Science / IT job down there and I'll move lol
[05:02] <Yagisan> Soon as my bachelors is done me -> tokyo same day
[05:02] <Yagisan> anyway bbl
[05:02] <Kyral> As much as I love the culture of Japan
[05:02] <Kyral> I wouldn't move there
[05:02] <Kyral> because I'd make a royal idiot of myself within' a week
[05:03] <persia> Kyral: You'd be doing well then.  Most foreigners feel like an idiot before they leave the airport :)
[05:03] <Kyral> lol
[05:03] <Kyral> What is the word? Stupid American?
[05:04] <Kyral> I know just enough not to be clueless, yet at the same time enough to make dangerous overgeneralizations :P
[05:05] <Kyral> cat /dev/urandom > Hobbsee ?
[05:05] <Hobbsee> hehe
[05:05] <Kyral> Then again I would just find some coders and we would have conversations in C or Bash lol
[05:05] <Hobbsee> i think you mean cat /dev/null > /dev/kyral.brain
[05:05] <Kyral> you CAN'T cat /dev/null!
[05:05] <Hobbsee> oh cant you?
[05:05] <Kyral> no!
[05:06] <Hobbsee> darn!
[05:06] <Kyral> you can cat /dev/zero, /dev/random, and /dev/urandom
[05:06] <Kyral> but not /dev/null
[05:06] <Hobbsee> ah, i meant the first then.
[05:06] <Kyral> the universal datasink, /dev/null is
[05:07] <Kyral> (and I had to phrase it that way so irssi wouldn't think /dev/null was a command)
[05:07] <Hobbsee> heh
[05:07] <Kyral> I dunno, I tried learning Japanese via WikiBooks, but never had enough time lol
[05:09] <tseng> hard to learn a language from a book
[05:10] <Kyral> yah
[05:12] <Hobbsee> night all...
[05:12] <Kyral> cya Hobbsee
[05:16] <Kyral> Gak I dunno what fontpack I need for that to render hiragana right
[05:16] <Kyral> wait....would rxvt-unicode do it?
[05:21] <Kyral> Hmm now it should work
[05:55] <Yagisan> re
[05:57] <Kyral> re?
[05:57] <Yagisan> Kyral: returned. You didn't notice I left ?
[05:57] <Yagisan> Kyral: if I'm quiet - I'm not here
[05:57] <Kyral> ah
[06:00] <Yagisan> Kyral: Kochi or Mincho fonts should work for you
[06:01] <Kyral> Yagisan: I switched over to rxvt-unicode
[06:04] <Yagisan> Kyral: ok. So,  what is it about Japan/Japanese that you like ?
[06:08] <Kyral> Dunno
[06:08] <Kyral> I'm inherently curious
[06:09] <Kyral> and right now American pop-culture is pissing me off lol
[06:09] <Spec> can you dd if=/dev/null of=/dev/brain bs=1024
[06:10] <Kyral> no
[06:10] <Kyral> you can't cat /dev/null
[06:10] <Spec> it makes a null file
[06:11] <Kyral> you can't cat /dev/null
[06:11] <Spec> dd isn't catting
[06:11] <Kyral> ah
[06:11] <Kyral> sorry lol
[06:13] <Yagisan> Kyral: I'd give you my reasons but this is a G rated channel ;)
[06:13] <Kyral> ....if it begins with H I'm gonna smack you
[06:15] <Yagisan> Kyral: H ? no.
[06:15] <Kyral> lol
[06:15] <Yagisan> Kyral: that stuff is weird.
[06:16] <Kyral> yah
[06:16] <Kyral> I don't watch it
[06:16] <Yagisan> Kyral: can you say "never been on a date"
[06:17] <Kyral> can you say "yes"
[06:17] <Kyral> :P
[06:17] <Kyral> wait was that for you or me?
[06:17] <Yagisan> Kyral: I find spam for it often also arrives at the same time as viagra spam
[06:17] <Yagisan> Kyral: the people that like it
[06:18] <Kyral> ah
[06:18] <Kyral> well, I've never been on a date
[06:18] <Kyral> but thats because I'm a socially-naive Hacker :P
[06:18] <Yagisan> Kyral: my secret to catching a chick. hide the pc
[06:19] <zul> Yagisan: hehe...that didnt work for me
[06:19] <Mithrandir> displaying them worked for me.
[06:19] <zul> same here
[06:20] <Kyral> Yagisan: I'm at a school known for Computer Science
[06:20] <Kyral> what is the Think Geek shirt?
[06:20] <Yagisan> Kyral: stalking^W showing an interest in her helps. I know it's hard when you seee the pc
[06:20] <Kyral> "Chicks Dig Unix"
[06:20] <Kyral> what was the ^W?
[06:20] <Kyral> oh there is this girl who has stronger Shell-Fu than I
[06:21] <Kyral> with excellent sed and grep-fu as well
[06:21] <Yagisan> I find it odd being with another "geek". We are to similar for my taste
[06:22] <Kyral> Its comforting
[06:22] <Kyral> to me
[06:22] <Kyral> because I can relax and let my Hackerness out
[06:23] <Yagisan> I like differences. I can be myself without the need to compete with her
[06:23] <Kyral> oh its not competition
[06:23] <Kyral> (Keep in mind this girl and I are only friends)
[06:23] <Kyral> She is a Computer Engineering/Software Engineering Major and I'm a Computer Science Major with a minor in IT
[06:25] <Yagisan> Kyral: my wife has an English Linguistics Degree. She officially knows more then I do, and I'm supposed to be the native speaker
[06:25] <Kyral> lol
[06:25] <Kyral> nice
[06:26] <Kyral> well, then again, most foreigners speak better English than 50% of Americans
[06:26] <Yagisan> Kyral: please don't temp me
[06:27] <Yagisan> s/temp/tempt
[06:27] <Kyral> huh?
[06:27] <Yagisan> Kyral: Americans and English. Funny joke ;)
[06:27] <Kyral> Bah stuck up British English bastard :P
[06:27] <Kyral> Though I do admit, I love the accent
[06:28] <Yagisan> Kyral: English is what the Queen speaks ;)
[06:28] <Kyral> Have the ability to make anything sound elegent, I mean a British man could be swearing a blue-streak and it would still sound refined
[06:29] <Yagisan> Kyral: I suppose that would depend where he's from. I can imitate one rather well
[06:29] <Yagisan> Kyral: we have fun teasing them a bit down here. They all seem to want to retire down under
[06:30] <Kyral> now who?
[06:30] <Yagisan> Kyral: Britsh. Are you sure you are a native speaker :-P
[06:30] <Yagisan> bah typos
[06:31] <Kyral> Yagisan: I have trouble following conversations sometimes
[06:31] <Kyral> ADHD, OCD, Aspburgers Syndrome
[06:32] <Yagisan> Kyral: I know the first 2, whats the last one ?
[06:32] <Kyral> Best described as a "Highly-functional Form Of Autism"
[06:33] <Kyral> I translate it as "Socially-Impaired"
[06:33] <Yagisan> Asp Burger - sounds like a exotic delicacy
[06:33] <Kyral> or, in better words, I have a hard time picking up on things like sarcasm, or the other invisible "signals" of social conversation
[06:34] <Yagisan> Kyral: so, your a geek then
[06:34] <Kyral> hehehe
[06:34] <Kyral> and I misspelled it on purpose BTW
[06:34] <Kyral> in pronoucation, its "Assburgers"
[06:35] <Yagisan> Arse Burgers ? =-O no thanks
[06:36] <Kyral> yah
[06:36] <enyc> Hrrm... anybody here having trouble with 'drip' package for dapper ?
[06:36] <Kyral> now you know why I misspelled it
[06:37] <enyc> it wont work -- gtk modules foil to find shared librarieos that are there already and stuff!
[06:38] <enyc> (drip:7159): Gtk-WARNING **: Failed to load module "libatk-bridge.so": libatk-bridge.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory  and stuff --even though libatk-bridge.so is there in /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules
[06:38] <sistpoty> hi folks
[06:38] <sistpoty> ping siretart
[06:39] <enyc> Hello sistpoty , master of the getting-freedoom-updated ;-)
[06:39] <sistpoty> hey enyc ;)
[06:40] <enyc> I cant get drip to work...
[06:40] <Yagisan> sistpoty: freedoom ?
[06:40] <sistpoty> Yagisan: free wad file for doom ;)
[06:41] <Yagisan> sistpoty: you the maintainer ?
[06:41] <sistpoty> Yagisan: nope... I just got it synced from debian, that's all
[06:41] <Yagisan> sistpoty: I package a doom engine. Currently doesn't work with freedoom
[06:42] <Yagisan> sistpoty: ahh. the wad. is it called freedoom.wad or doom2.wad ?
[06:42] <sistpoty> Yagisan: doom2.wad
[06:43] <Yagisan> sistpoty: that will cause problems with the real doom2.wad
[06:43] <enyc> hrrm freedom is a 'doom 2 compatible replacement' wad iirc
[06:44] <sistpoty> Yagisan: it's meant as a complete replacement, so it shouldn't be installed together with doom2.wad
[06:44] <enyc> p.s. recently PrBoom 2.4.1 has come out -- good everhaul mixing itn changes from many places/projects together...
[06:44] <Yagisan> sistpoty: ah no. it should be able to be installed alongside doom2.wad
[06:45] <enyc> O well I must go
[06:45] <enyc> speak later ;-)
[06:45] <Yagisan> sistpoty: it can replace it, but should not conflict with it. That denies the user choice of what data to use
[06:46] <Gloubiboulga> hi sistpoty :)
[06:46] <sistpoty> hi Gloubiboulga
[06:47] <sistpoty> Yagisan: maybe... but I must admit I'm not very well informed on what current doom engines expect as iwad file (maybe prboom hardcodes doom.wad or doom2.wad)...
[06:47] <sistpoty> Yagisan: but FWIW there is some development about freedoom going on inside debian
[06:49] <sistpoty> Yagisan: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-games/2006/04/msg00067.html
[06:49] <Yagisan> sistpoty: ok. kinda disturbing to see that it's called doom2.wad because an engine does not understand -iwad foo.wad
[06:50] <Yagisan> sistpoty: thanks. I'll subscribe to that list
[06:52] <Yagisan> sistpoty: so, what is your preferred engine ?
[06:53] <sistpoty> Yagisan: haven't played it for some time, but back then I preferred prboom
[06:54] <Yagisan> sistpoty: my preferred is deng.
[06:54] <Yagisan> sistpoty: doesn't yet support boom features, hence no freedoom support yet
[06:55] <sistpoty> Yagisan: didn't try deng yet, only saw some screenshots (that looked quite cool)
[06:56] <Yagisan> sistpoty: I periodically upload it to revu for people to check my packaging
[06:57] <Yagisan> sistpoty: I am resolving potential dfsg issues in the code base atm, but you can always grab it from my private repo
[06:57] <sistpoty> Yagisan: once I got a little bit more time, I'll certainly test it :)
[06:58] <Yagisan> sistpoty: sure. resource packs won't be ready until after the dapper release though
[07:00] <Burgwork> what would it take to get a deb into multiverse at this late time? (ie, something new)
[07:00] <LaserJock> Burgwork: do you have a source package ready to go?
[07:00] <Yagisan> Burgwork: act of god ?
[07:00] <LaserJock> Yagisan: make that mdz ;-)
[07:00] <Yagisan> Burgwork: what is it ?
[07:01] <Yagisan> LaserJock: there is a difference ?
[07:01] <Burgwork> LaserJock, not yet
[07:01] <LaserJock> not so much, although that would make me wonder where elmo is in that scheme
[07:01] <Burgwork> Yagisan, sorry, can't tell you until I have it ready. Something from my company
[07:02] <LaserJock> Burgwork: it might be hard to get a package going and approved in time, but theoretically yes, we have Feature Freeze exceptions
[07:02] <Yagisan> Burgwork: that may make it hard to get it in then
[07:03] <crimsun> it's actually just the same group as motu-uvf
[07:03] <LaserJock> right
[07:03] <Yagisan> Burgwork: every man and his dog here knows what packages I want to get in, but that won't happen any time soon. No harm in saying what it is though.
[07:04] <crimsun> actually I don't know
[07:05] <LaserJock> me neither
[07:08] <Yagisan> anyone know where lists.debian.org hides mbox archives of the lists ?
[08:13] <lucas> if I package rubygems for dapper (new software, can't break anything except itself), will I be allowed to upload it to dapper ?
[08:14] <crimsun> you would need to file a FF exception
[08:14] <crimsun> same basic procedure as a UVF exception
[08:15] <lucas> ok
[08:23] <Amaranth> i thought the consensus was that rubygems was a bad idea
[08:38] <lucas> it is
[08:39] <lucas> but providing a package for it is harmless, and it's still better than having users compile it by hand
[08:39] <lucas> it doesn't mean other packages will depend on it
[08:52] <LaserJock> ack, do the Ubuntu install .isos have build-essential on them?
[08:57] <LaserJock> nvm, I checked the seed
[10:41] <crimsun> 'grats, zul
[10:46] <LaserJock> yeah, way to go zul!
[10:46] <bddebian> Damn, if zul can get in, I should apply.. ;-P
[11:02] <phanatic> hey raphink
[11:03] <raphink> hi phanatic
[11:05] <sivang> hey phanatic
[11:05] <sivang> phanatic: what's up?
[11:06] <phanatic> hey sivang, waiting for the decision :)
[11:06] <phanatic> and fixing tons of dh_iconcache ;)
[11:07] <sivang> phanatic: cool, I fixed some transparency stuff
[11:07] <sivang> but I need sponsers
[11:08] <sivang> http://muse.19inch.net/~sivan/tray_icon/
[11:08] <sivang> anybody in for it?
[11:08] <phanatic> me too... i still don't have upload rights to universe (maybe the time has still not come)
[11:43] <crimsun> 'grats, sivang
[11:43] <Toadstool> yeah, congrats sivang
[11:43] <phanatic> sivang: congrats :)
[11:45] <LaserJock> way to go sivang
[11:46] <dholbach> good night
[11:46] <LaserJock> cya dholbach
[11:47] <phanatic> :D
[11:47] <lucas> I have a question. I have breezy, dapper and sid chroots
[11:47] <lucas> on my laptop
[11:48] <lucas> I'd like to use some sort of caching mechanism to avoid fetching the packages from archive.ubuntu.com or ftp.debian.org all the time
[11:48] <lucas> I've considered apt-cacher, but it doesn't work at all with different distros, because the same binary pkg file name might have different content on ubuntu and debian
[11:48] <ogra> lucas, there were some mails to -motu about unionfs usage for that
[11:49] <ogra> (or was that only about preventing the tarball, i cant really remember)
[11:52] <lucas> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-March/000583.html
[11:52] <lucas> yup it was about avoiding the tarball
[11:52] <ogra> yeah ...
[11:53] <lucas> otoh, I could just set two apt-cachers
[11:54] <LaserJock> but how is that going to help you?
[11:54] <lucas> one apt-cacher for debian files, one for ubuntu files
[11:55] <lucas> this would work
[11:58] <lucas> ... or I could use classic caching using apache2 ...