[12:04] <seb128> hi
[12:04] <_ion> Hi
[12:04] <seb128> are bug fixes uploads authorized or better to wait for after dapper to upload to dapper-updates rather?
[12:05] <infinity> seb128: Depends on the bug.
[12:06] <seb128> infinity: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/shared-mime-info.debdiff ... pdf incorrectly declared as text format
[12:07] <seb128> infinity: the effect is that text handler are list to right menu by nautilus, but evince is still the default action so it's not a blocker of any sort
[12:07] <seb128> the fix is trivial but I'm fine to upload it to dapper-updates later
[12:08] <infinity> Yeah, I'd have no problems with that going in, but I'd wait for mdz, if I were you.
[12:08] <infinity> Basically, when we start rolling CD images, all uploads will be halted for anything that isn't a CD blocker.
[12:08] <seb128> right
[12:08] <infinity> Until then (and we may have another day until then), some stuff like this should be able to get in still.
[12:08] <seb128> I've just that one ready and I was wondering if I should ping mdz or Kamion about it or just wait for after dapper :)
[12:08] <infinity> Kamion's taking the day off.
[12:09] <infinity> It's a UK bank holiday.
[12:09] <seb128> right
[12:09] <seb128> dunno what you call "day"
[12:09] <infinity> Or, rather, it will be when it's Monday.  Which it isn't yet.
[12:09] <infinity> Stupid me, living in the future.
[12:09] <_ion> ma toukokuun 29. 01:09:29 EEST 2006
[12:09] <seb128> it's 0:10am on sunday evening :p
[12:09] <_ion> Sorry, wrong locale.
[12:09] <_ion> Well, anyway, it's monday here. :-)
[12:09] <infinity> seb128: It's 8:09am for me. :)
[12:10] <seb128> infinity: suck to be you then :p
[12:10] <infinity> seb128: Nah, it means I get to see the final dapper release CDs 7 hours before you!
[12:11] <seb128> I'm so jealous :p
[12:12] <\sh> good to know, that I don't have internet connection while I'm in the hotel
[12:12] <robertj> someone shoudl make a goal of breaking edgy really bad ASAP after it's open :)
[12:12] <robertj> just to set a good pace ;)
[12:13] <infinity> Oh, we will, don't worry.
[12:13] <infinity> No need to try, it'll just happen.
[12:13] <\sh> well, first we have to document some regressions for kubuntu which is really embarrassing
[12:13] <\sh> then we need to fix them and push them through dapper-updates :(
[12:14] <robertj> \sh: theres always something. DVD playback is less than great as well :(
[12:14] <infinity> I suspect dapper-updates will get a lot more use than previous releases, since we want this LTS release to be Just Right.
[12:14] <seb128> pushing GNOME 2.14.2 to dapper-updates first
[12:14] <robertj> infinity: also include the fact that it will be around alot longer ;)
[12:14] <\sh> robertj: functional regressions are so bad...I don't mind for last minute bugs
[12:14] <mdke> infinity: I hope so.
[12:15] <infinity> seb128: We're pushing the new GNOME point releases to -updates too?  Cool.
[12:15] <infinity> robertj: Yes, hence "LTS release" from my above statement.
[12:15] <seb128> infinity: Mark wanted us to do that I think and I agree that's a good idea
[12:15] <mdke> seb128: that is good news, does it fix a lot of bugs?
[12:15] <robertj> I'm glad to hear, although it's kinda disconcerting to have no hard-as-a-rock policy about what goes in updates
[12:15] <seb128> mdke: medium, we backported a lot of good stuff from CVS stable
[12:16] <infinity> seb128: Yeah, sounds fine to me, as long as it doesn't introduce regressions.  The idea that "GNOME point releases never introduce new features, and thus introduce few bugs" seems to be complete crack. :)
[12:16] <seb128> mdke: so we have a good part of the bug fixes we can expect from it
[12:16] <mdke> seb128: ah... oh well, hopefully a few more!
[12:16] <seb128> mdke: right
[12:16] <infinity> robertj: If you want hard-as-a-rock policy, don't use updates at all.  It /is/ optional.
[12:16] <seb128> mdke: I expect fixing stuff like .Trash on removable medias to dapper-updates too
[12:17] <mdke> seb128: heh. That would make you my favourite person
[12:17] <seb128> mdke: I'm just not comfortable touching that code on what will be pressed on the CD yet
[12:17] <seb128> s/yet/now
[12:17] <mdke> sure, perfectly reasonable
[12:18] <mdke> seb128: any luck with the bug where nautilus tries to move stuff instead of copying? does upstream have a fix?
[12:18] <seb128> mdke: dapper-updates too
[12:18] <mdke> well, that would rock
[12:18] <infinity> What's this bug?
[12:18] <seb128> mdke: upstream is not really responsive atm, I've some ideas on how to fix it but I'm not comfortable with the code to push it to dapper
[12:18] <Kamion> seb128: that shared-mime-info change is fine if done now
[12:19] <seb128> infinity: dnd from a ro directory to a rw directory on the same partition try to move
[12:19] <Kamion> (as opposed to tomorrow)
[12:19] <mdke> infinity: if you drag and drop a file which you don't have write permissions for, it tries to move it, rather than copy
[12:19] <infinity> seb128: Ahh, I see. :)
[12:19] <seb128> infinity: like dnd from /usr to your Desktop will give you an error :/
[12:19] <infinity> seb128: Correct behaviour, except for the whole "can't delete ro" part. :)
[12:19] <seb128> right
[12:19] <dholbach> Kamion: can I upload http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/scim.debdiff (new panel icon for it)?
[12:19] <seb128> and I didn't figure it sooner since my box has /usr on a different partition
[12:21] <Kamion> dholbach: looks fine, though obviously I haven't looked at the icons; I'll trust you on that. BTW, "find ... -printf '%P\n'" would simplify your debian/rules change
[12:21] <Kamion> dholbach: er, or not - isn't your debian/rules change just wrong?
[12:22] <dholbach> Kamion: I use it in gnome-power-manager and ekiga already and all of the configure/clean targets work just fine
[12:22] <Kamion> dholbach: I'd have expected just "mv -f $${i%.uue}.old $${i%.uue}" - taking basename of $i doesn't seem to help you
[12:22] <dholbach> um
[12:22] <infinity> dholbach: Is the "close icon doesn't fit in certain close widgets" bug being addressed?
[12:23] <dholbach> infinity: no, I'll need to talk to Mark about that.
[12:23] <Kamion> oh, no, never mind me, I'm reading it wrong
[12:23] <Kamion> confusing, but OK
[12:23] <infinity> dholbach: Shows up in epiphany tabs, gaim tabs, and probably most noticeably, the notification popup windows.
[12:23] <dholbach> Kamion: I'll make a note of your suggestion.
[12:23] <infinity> dholbach: But all over, really.
[12:23] <dholbach> infinity: I know :-(
[12:24] <seb128> dholbach: if the close icon is not fixed I'll be really unhappy
[12:24] <seb128> dholbach: and I'm not that happy with the update-notifier icon change neither :p
[12:24] <mdke> also the stop icon appears to be rather odd
[12:25] <seb128> yeah, I don't like it neither
[12:25] <seb128> too "sharp"
[12:25] <mdke> all the other icons are nice and smooth, this one is just very sharp
[12:25] <mdke> heh
[12:25] <mjg59> The stop icon is like fine-grain crack
[12:25] <mjg59> Cut with salt
[12:25] <seb128> I don't get why artwork guys break icons now
[12:26] <mdke> check out the difference between the Delete and Cancel icons in evolution
[12:26] <infinity> But, while the above icons are crap, the only one that's actually "buggy" is the "close" icon.
[12:26] <seb128> I understand they make change for blurry icons, stuff not ready, etc
[12:26] <mdke> it just hurts
[12:26] <seb128> but changing proper icons like that ...
[12:26] <mjg59> Or the conversation windows in gaim
[12:26] <mjg59> Send file has a nice picture of a disk
[12:26] <mjg59> Warn has a little warning triangle
[12:27] <infinity> mjg59: Yeah, I gave dholbach a screenshot, since he doesn't use gaim.
[12:27] <mjg59> Block is like OH MY GOD IF YOU CLICK THIS BUTTON THE WORLD WILL END
[12:28] <mjg59> It's less bad in Epiphany, but it's pretty bad there
[12:28] <mdke> lol (really)
[12:28] <seb128> Kamion: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/shared-mime-info.debdiff ... any opinion on that for dapper? I'm happy to delay to dapper-updates if you want
[12:28] <Kamion> seb128: 23:18 < Kamion> seb128: that shared-mime-info change is fine if done now
[12:28] <Kamion> seb128: 23:19 < Kamion> (as opposed to tomorrow)
[12:28] <infinity> seb128: He already said "yes, if you upload now"
[12:29] <infinity> Someone remind me to never be stupid enough to transfer a DVD ISO over wireless again.
[12:29] <seb128> Kamion: ah thanks, I skipped it somewhere it in the middle of the discussion with mdke :)
[12:29] <\sh> infinity: lol
[12:30] <mjg59> The close button is actually broken in gaim
[12:30] <mjg59> It's scaled to the point of not having a beval
[12:30] <mdke> has anyone in the dev team eyeballed https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LiveCDCustomizationHowToDapper ? I reckon it will be popular with languages that aren't supported on the desktop cd, so ensuring that it is valid would be really great
[12:30] <infinity> mjg59: Yeah, same close button I was talking about elsewhere.
[12:30] <infinity> mjg59: It's broken in epiphany too.  And in the notification popup windows.  And in gedit... And, and...
[12:30] <infinity> mjg59: Like I said, that's the only icon that's actually "buggy", we can argue till the cows come home about others being "ugly".
[12:31] <_ion> mjg59: Scaled, or cropped?
[12:31] <_ion> http://johan.kiviniemi.name/pictures/icons/
[12:31] <mjg59> Might be cropping
[12:31] <mjg59> Oh, hmm, that's not what I have
[12:31] <mjg59> Has it changed /again/?
[12:32] <_ion> Sorry, i forgot to write "when using the Tangerine icon theme" to that page.
[12:32] <_ion> But the same problem with cropped close icons probably applies to all the themes.
[12:32] <infinity> Tangerine's the default, no?
[12:33] <infinity> And for me, close is a puffy red square, with a white X in it.
[12:33] <_ion> infinity: Human is the default. I'm using Tangerine.
[12:33] <infinity> And it's cropped to heck.
[12:33] <infinity> Ahh.  For some reason, I thought Human used Tangerine icons.
[12:33] <infinity> Maybe it falls back to them or something.
[12:33] <_ion> The ~/.gtkrc-2.0 hack fixes the close buttons, but unfortunately it affects other stuff undesirably.
[12:35] <Kamion> mdke: I eyeballed it *extremely* quickly (I'm about to go to bed); the main deficiency I see is that it doesn't mention /casper/filesystem.manifest-desktop at all, so ubiquity installs from CDs customised that way may not DTRT
[12:36] <Kamion> ubiquity removes (manifest minus manifest-desktop) after copying the live filesystem
[12:37] <mdke> Kamion: that's helpful. I wouldn't know how to fix it, perhaps you (or someone else) could take a closer look and update it after the release?
[12:37] <Kamion> will try to remember, yeah
[12:37] <mdke> Kamion: i'll remember ya
[12:37] <Kamion> TODOed
[12:37] <mdke> :)
[12:40] <RemyLaptop> hi guys, does anyone know if there are plans to give the update manager a time scheduler, so for example I can set it to update my system at 1 am ?
[12:41] <seb128> Kamion: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/gst.debdiff ... ok to upload? The code of the function is http://pastebin.com/743768, the is a double g_free(type) pretty obvious, that fixes a crasher
[12:42] <seb128> s#is#issue is
[12:43] <Kamion> seb128: yep, it's obvious, as you say
[12:43] <Kamion> go ahead
[12:43] <seb128> thank you
[12:43] <seb128> 'night Kamion
[12:44] <dholbach> good night Kamion
[12:44] <mdke> noches
[01:20] <doko> infinity: fglrx works, same problems on amd64 as before
[01:23] <infinity> doko: So, no regression, but no fixes?
[01:23] <infinity> doko: Thanks.
[01:23] <doko> correct
[01:23] <infinity> desrt: If I build a new LRM with some madwifi-ng fixes, can you test for me?
[01:23] <doko> i386 works for me as well, have to wait for the flickering to reappear
[01:23] <desrt> ya.  of course
[01:24] <desrt> infinity; i just tossed those two modules in /etc/modules -- fixed it up
[01:24] <RemyLaptop> hi guys, does anyone know if there are plans to give the update manager a time scheduler, so for example I can set it to update my system at 1 am ?
[01:24] <infinity> desrt: I think I've nailed down all the spots where we accidentally broke the modular nature of madwifi-ng.  I want to test the "right fix". :)
[01:24] <RemyLaptop> or if not, where can I suggest it ?
[01:24] <desrt> infinity; about wpasupplicant -- if madwifi-ng gets auto-loaded by the kernel as per default then why is wpasupplicant still built against the old madwifi?
[01:25] <infinity> desrt: Because madwifi-ng is only the default for a very select few PCI IDs, everything else is using madwifi-old.
[01:25] <desrt> ah.  good call
[01:25] <infinity> desrt: Anyhow, be a dear and stick around for a bit.  I'll hack up something.
[01:26] <desrt> word.
[01:30] <ssam> RemyLaptop, system -> administation -> software preferences
[01:30] <ssam> RemyLaptop, #ubuntu+1 is a better place for support questions
[01:30] <RemyLaptop> ssam - that doesn't allow me to specify what time to do it at...
[01:31] <RemyLaptop> as a feature that I can't find currently implemented I figured the development channels would be where to ask how to get it implemented ;-)
[01:32] <\sh> RemyLaptop: what you need is cron or anacron
[01:32] <\sh> RemyLaptop: but you don't want to have automatic updates anyways...and for automatic updates, update-manager is not the tool you need
[01:33] <ssam> RemyLaptop, i think the options there control /etc/cron.daily/apt, which is run at what ever time the daily stuff runs
[01:34] <\sh> ssam: anacron is running this job as well, and it doesn't matter what time you switch on your computer, anacron is checking which jobs he missed and execute the missed job, but it's only doing an apt-get update and not a doomed apt-get dist-upgrade ,)
[01:35] <infinity> desrt: Which kernel are you using?
[01:37] <\sh> and if mvo is implementing a self scheduler for update-manager like the windows update service on windows xp, i would travel to bochum and take away the wlan router ;)
[01:37] <desrt> infinity; -23
[01:38] <infinity> desrt: I meant which flavour. :)
[01:38] <desrt> 686
[01:38] <infinity> desrt: So I don't have to upload the full set. :)
[01:38] <infinity> desrt: Do you use fglrx or nvidia-glx as well?
[01:38] <desrt> i810
[01:38] <infinity> Okay, cool.  So just LRM and LRM-common should do.
[01:42] <infinity> desrt: http://cerberus.0c3.net/~adconrad/desrt/
[01:42] <infinity> desrt: And be sure to remove your hack from /etc/modules before you reboot and test, or this won't be a very good test. :)
[01:43] <infinity> desrt: I want to know if A) that fixes the problem, and B) if the modules still work. ;)
[01:43] <desrt> ok
[01:43] <desrt> binaries, hm?
[01:44] <infinity> You want the sources too?
[01:44] <infinity> Oh ye of little faith. :)
[01:44] <desrt> my paranoid side is making itself known :)
[01:44] <infinity> I can sign the binaries.
[01:44] <desrt> it's cool
[01:44] <infinity> Given that it's the same GPG key as "the guy who runs the buildds", that should do.
[01:44] <desrt> you already have root on my box anyway :)
[01:45] <desrt> well
[01:45] <desrt> small difference
[01:45] <desrt> you'd might have different moral requirements for uploading a trojan to a random directory on a webserver and to the ubuntu archive
[01:45] <infinity> Not really. :)
[01:46] <infinity> But I can pop 'em on people.
[01:46] <infinity> I just didn't cause I can't be bothered with a 7MB upload.
[01:46] <desrt> btw
[01:46] <desrt> what's the deal with wlanconfig?
[01:46] <desrt> it's built as part of madwifi-ng (which lives in l-r-m) but i don't see how i'm supposed to install it
[01:47] <infinity> Not required for the standard station case, required to set up other stuff, like AP mode and whatnot.
[01:47] <desrt> nod.
[01:47] <desrt> rebooting
[01:47] <infinity> We're not really shipping it or using it, since the madwifi-ng in LRM for dapper is "just to make shit kinda work on some new hardware"
[01:47] <desrt> well
[01:47] <infinity> For edgy, it'll actually get used, since madwifi-ng will be the only madwifi.
[01:47] <desrt> in all fairness it works fairly well
[01:47] <infinity> It works fairly well where it does.  And not where it doesn't. :)
[01:48] <desrt> laptop = SO HOT
[01:48] <desrt> omg
[01:48] <infinity> (BTW, I tossed detached signs next to those binaries, if you're feeling paranoid)
[01:48] <desrt> i've already rebooted :p
[01:48] <infinity> A bit late now that you've rebooted, mind you. :)
[01:48] <desrt> looks like it worked
[01:48] <infinity> \o/
[01:48] <desrt> ya.  it's fine
[01:48] <infinity> Do some testing with the network.
[01:48] <infinity> Does WPA work too?
[01:49] <desrt> network-manager just automatically authenticated me to my home (wpa) network on login
[01:49] <infinity> Cool.  And you definitely removed all traces of those modules from /etc/modules?
[01:49] <desrt> this line was typed from my laptop.
[01:49] <jdub> infinity: does this change allow us to use /sys/.../new_ids ?
[01:49] <desrt> /etc/modules has 1 line -- sbp2
[01:50] <infinity> jdub: You can use sys/.../new_ids to use madwifi-ng with something else, sure.
[01:50] <infinity> jdub: No reason why you couldn't already.
[01:50] <infinity> desrt: Yay.  I am teh win!  Thanks for testing.
[01:50] <desrt> no prob.
[01:50] <mjg59> jdub: It's not clear to me why that would fail, and debugging this stuff is a nightmare
[01:50] <jdub> infinity: with current lrm, it doesn't work (verified with two different pciids)
[01:50] <nictuku> I'm sorry if this is off topic, but my project needs a mailing list. Do you guys know if lists.ubuntu.com is open for that?
[01:51] <infinity> jdub: What's the failure mode?
[01:51] <infinity> jdub: And do you have test kit handy?
[01:51] <jdub> infinity: what is the change you've just made?
[01:51] <jdub> infinity: no sign of ath0 whatsoever, even after mucking with wlanconfig
[01:51] <mjg59> jdub: It makes the driver actually work (but not in the way you were observing)
[01:51] <infinity> jdub: To unbusticate the internal module loader.
[01:51] <infinity> jdub: On, yeah, your problem does indeed sound different.
[01:52] <Burgundavia> nictuku, what is your project?
[01:52] <jdub> so with infinity's package, i would still have to muck with new_ids
[01:52] <infinity> jdub: And it may just be a "tough luck, sucks to be you, try again in edgy" bug.
[01:52] <mjg59> jdub: madwifi-ng is there to support hardware that madwifi doesn't support
[01:53] <desrt> but only if you don't like WPA
[01:53] <jdub> mjg59: yeah, yeah 8)
[01:53] <nictuku> Burgundavia, NWU https://dev.ubuntubrasil.org/trac/nwu/wiki, a ubuntu spec implementation. I tried #ubuntu+2 but no one was there :-)
[01:53] <mjg59> jdub: It's been explicitly altered so that it doesn't get loaded by default on hardware that madwifi supports. If it can still be made to work, bonus. If not, notabug.
[01:53] <desrt> since wpa in dapper with -ng is decidedly broken
[01:53] <infinity> desrt: Win some, lose some.
[01:54] <mjg59> IF ONLY WE HAD THE DRIVER SOURCE
[01:54] <infinity> We knew in January that the madwifi situation was going to suck.  The fact that it only half sucks right now isn't so bad. :)
[01:55] <Burgundavia> nictuku, have you discussed it on ubuntu-server? seems to me to be the logical place
[01:55] <mjg59> desrt: We'd be able to have improved hardware support without jumping to an entirely different codebase, and the world would be better
[01:57] <nictuku> Burgundavia, that would be my next step, I just didn't want to bother the list with such a specific request.
[01:58] <Burgundavia> nictuku, ubuntu-server is a good venue because then you can talk about how to integrate it into edgy
[01:58] <nictuku> Burgundavia, I see. you mean the list, not the channel, right?
[01:58] <Burgundavia> nictuku, either
[02:37] <t0rtois3> The python-cairo bindings don't seem to have libsvg built in and libsvg doesn't seem to be in the dapper repositories at all, anyone know why?
[02:39] <infinity> Do you mean librsvg?
[02:39] <t0rtois3> maybe, this is confusing me.  Both appear to exist
[02:40] <infinity> Though I'm pretty sure libcairo does SVG internally.  It certainly doesn't seem to depend on anything else to do it.
[02:40] <infinity> Wait.  That was the most crackful thing I've said all day.
[02:41] <t0rtois3> When I try to build python-cairo it looks for libsvg.
[02:41] <infinity> Cairo doesn't read SVGs at all, it's just a rendering engine.
[02:41] <t0rtois3> according to http://arstechnica.com/articles/columns/linux/linux-20050822.ars it can read them and then render them
[02:43] <infinity> Hrm, it might read them natively.  If that's the case, you certainly don't need an external library for it.
[02:43] <infinity> Given that GTK apps read SVG stuff all the time, I'm pretty sure our lack of libsvg isn't hurting us. :)
[02:44] <t0rtois3> Maybe there is some new way to go about it using librsvg
[02:49] <infinity> checking for libsvg-cairo >= 0.1.6... <-- That check?
[02:49] <infinity> t0rtois3: Since we obviously don't build with that library in Ubuntu, I'd suggest you take your investigation somewhere other than ubuntu-devel. :)
[02:50] <t0rtois3> ok, thanks for your time
[02:52] <jdub> t0rtois3: you might be using a version of python-cairo that wants cairo > 1.0.4
[02:55] <t0rtois3> jdub: it's both the latest and the one that ships with dapper.  I think the gtk way to do it is to use librsvg but the pygtk bindings havn't yet caught up.
[02:56] <jdub> yeah - cairo in dapper is the latest *stable*
[02:56] <jdub> but not the latest cairo available
[02:56] <jdub> (1.0.4 knows squat about svg)
[02:57] <\sh> ok..time to jump under the shower and get ready for karlsruhe^Wwork
[02:57] <\sh> laters
[02:58] <t0rtois3> jdub:So how do most gtk apps handle svg at the moment?
[02:59] <jdub> t0rtois3: it's automagic, thanks to the rsvg-based GtkPixbuf loader
[02:59] <jdub> t0rtois3: /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.4.0/loaders/svg_loader.so
[03:03] <t0rtois3> really need to go cairo the whole way
[03:03] <t0rtois3> ah ha:http://www.rittau.org/blog/20060414-00
[03:04] <zul> jdub: you are going to be at ols in july arent you?
[03:05] <jdub> doubt it
[03:05] <bddebian> Heya folks
[03:06] <zul> ah ok..
[03:06] <zul> hey bddebian 
[03:07] <bddebian> Heya Chuck
[04:03] <AlinuxOS> hello , someone who can help me in fonts.config issue?
[04:03] <bddebian> AlinuxOS: What's the problem?
[04:04] <AlinuxOS> I've finished testing fonts for future ttf-bpg-georgian-fonts 0.3 vesion.
[04:05] <AlinuxOS> so I need to have personal ~/fonts.config file for user after installing ttf-bpg-georgian-fonts package.
[04:05] <AlinuxOS> http://pastebin.com/743996
[04:05] <mdke> notasupportchannelpleasetry#ubuntu
[04:05] <mdke> gah
[04:06] <jdong> :)
[04:06] <AlinuxOS> mdke, no it's specific question that we should integrate into font pacakge.
[04:06] <jdong> how are you doing lately, mdke?
[04:06] <AlinuxOS> it's not only my problem.
[04:06] <mdke> jdong: fine thanks
[04:07] <mdke> jdong: you ok?
[04:08] <AlinuxOS> bddebian, ttf-bpg-georgian contains BPG_Chveulebrivi.ttf  BPG_Elite.ttf  BPG_Rioni.ttf
[04:08] <AlinuxOS> BPG_Courier.ttf       BPG_Glaho.ttf  fonts.cache-1
[04:08] <jdong> mdke: I'm doing pretty good. A bit nervous about entering college this fall, but other than that fine
[04:08] <bddebian> AlinuxOS: I don't think I can help you there.  Sorry :-(
[04:09] <AlinuxOS> bddebian, ok.
[04:09] <AlinuxOS> thank you ;)
[04:09] <mdke> jdong: good. I'm sure that will be fun
[04:09] <AlinuxOS> ok people
[04:09] <AlinuxOS> I wish you good night! )
[04:11] <jdong> good night, AlinuxOS 
[04:11] <jdong> (and he left)
[04:12] <jdong> btw, congrats on the great RC, everyone
[04:12] <jdong> Dapper looks like it's going to be our most polished release ever
[04:14] <bddebian> Aye
[04:22] <jmg> hi
[04:23] <bddebian> Hello jmg
[04:24] <jmg> hi all
[04:32] <ajmitch> afternoon
[04:32] <bddebian> wb ajmitch :-)
[05:07] <desrt> http://desrt.mcmaster.ca/macbook.xhtml
[05:07] <desrt> yay.
[05:12] <Lathiat> desrt: cool
[05:14] <Lathiat> One interesting note is that the 'IEC958' setting in alsamixer toggles the headphone port between copper and fibre modes. If you turn this setting on you should see a red LED glowing inside the headphone jack.
[05:14] <Lathiat> scary
[05:15] <desrt> ya.  weird.
[05:15] <crimsun> which codec does that machine use?
[05:15] <desrt> ich7
[05:15] <crimsun> stac9220x5?
[05:15] <desrt> so whatver that is
[05:16] <crimsun> (tail -2 /proc/asound/oss/sndstat)
[05:16] <desrt> stac9221
[05:16] <bddebian> crimsun!!
[05:16] <desrt> 0: sigmatel stac9221 a1
[05:17] <desrt> why do i get the feeling that crimsun is going to have me installing alsa-sources rsn?
[05:17] <crimsun> no, not yet :-)
[05:18] <desrt> no fixes yet?
[05:19] <crimsun> well, there has been work for the macminis, and if you were to apply it, you'd have to add your sub{vendor,device} ids
[05:20] <crimsun> (http://hg-mirror.alsa-project.org/alsa-kernel?cmd=changeset;node=14772d35b9a64e07d703c9eaac0d34fca76d87eb;style=gitweb)
[05:20] <desrt> well
[05:20] <desrt> thing is, the driver loads....
[05:21] <desrt> oh
[05:21] <crimsun> yeah, it must be routing at this point
[05:21] <desrt> + { .pci_subvendor = 0x8384,
[05:21] <desrt> + .pci_subdevice = 0x7680,
[05:21] <desrt> + .config = STAC_MACMINI }, /* Apple Mac Mini (early 2006) */ 
[05:21] <desrt> this doesn't look like a normal pci 'supported cards' list
[05:22] <crimsun> don't worry, nothing's really standardised in sound/ :-)
[05:22] <desrt> well
[05:22] <desrt> i'll try that patch and let you know
[05:23] <desrt> i love linux-headers
[05:23] <desrt> it seriously makes my day
[05:31] <desrt> crimsun; my snd_hda_intel is in use.  how to i un-in-use it?
[05:32] <crimsun> desrt: kill whatever's using it (use ``lsof /dev/dsp* /dev/snd/*'' to get the pids)
[05:32] <desrt> oh of course.  mixer applet
[05:33] <desrt> no improvement :(
[05:35] <desrt> what's the story with subvendor and subdevice?
[05:35] <desrt> are these the normal PCI device ids or some weird subdevice inside the soundcard?
[05:35] <crimsun> lspci -nv -> pastebin
[05:36] <crimsun> we should migrate to #ubuntu+1 to avoid cluttering the channel
[05:36] <desrt> k.
[05:51] <desrt> crimsun++
[06:48] <desrt> awesome.  my 'fn' keys are working now
[06:50] <jdub> no need to swear
[06:50] <ispiked> what theming engine does the new human theme use?
[06:51] <jdub> ubuntulooks, a minor branch from clearlooks
[06:51] <crimsun> eslowerthanjdub
[06:51] <ispiked> jdub: is this in gnome's cvs?
[06:51] <jdub> i don't know
[06:51] <jdub> you'd have to ask remenic
[06:51] <ispiked> fedora seems to use the same one.
[06:52] <ispiked> so it can't be all of Ubuntu's tweaking.
[06:52] <Burgundavia> ispiked, I believe FC is still using clearlooks
[06:52] <ispiked> Burgundavia: http://www.sitening.com/blog/2006/05/25/fedora-core-5-review-with-screenshots/
[06:52] <ispiked> Burgundavia: looks like the new Ubuntu theme to me!
[06:53] <crimsun> that looks like clearlooks.
[06:53] <jdub> no, that's just clearlooks
[06:53] <ispiked> I'm using clearlooks right now, and it doesn't look like that.
[06:53] <jdub> there are only minor differences between them - ubuntulooks is based on clearlooks
[06:54] <jdub> because the default clearlooks theme in gnome doesn't turn on all the clearlooks bling
[06:54] <ispiked> the theme shown here looks like what I'm using: http://gnome.org/start/2.14/notes/en/rnusers.html
[06:55] <jdub> yes, that's clearlooks with all the bling turned off
[06:55] <ispiked> what controls the bling?
[06:55] <jdub> settings in the gtkrc
[06:56] <ispiked> hmm...
[06:57] <ispiked> is ubuntlooks more than just a modified gtkrc?
[06:57] <jdub> yes
[06:57] <jdub> it's a modified engine
[07:00] <ispiked> hmm... I wonder how much it differs from clearlooks.
[07:00] <ispiked> enough that they needed to branch it, I guess.
[07:02] <jdub> it has a bunch of different effects, like the shiny buttons
[07:04] <ajmitch> even more shiny bling :)
[07:08] <Burgundavia> ajmitch, don't you love shiny bling?
[07:08] <Burgundavia> who cares if it crashes occasionally
[07:08] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: no, I'm a boring person who uses clearlooks & tango
[07:09] <ajmitch> XGl held my attention for an hour or so at most
[07:09] <ajmitch> too much shiny to get any work done
[07:09] <Burgundavia> haven't even tried it, tbh
[07:13] <ajmitch> that sounds dangerous
[07:13] <desrt> as far as i know, the DSDT is a sort of bytecode that describes what the OS ought to do in certain situations
[07:14] <desrt> for example, if it wants to know how to sleep, it looks up the 'sleep' entry in the DSDT and pokes the ports that it tells it to
[07:14] <ajmitch> yes, it's a scary area
[07:14] <ajmitch> I prefer to leave that to people like mjg59
[07:15] <desrt> i want a 4th :p
[07:15] <Burgundavia> desrt, how come I don't see you in #ubuntu-ca ?
[07:15] <desrt> i'm not a canadian
[07:16] <desrt> :)
[07:20] <Burgundavia> http://transmission.m0k.org/screenshots.php <-- we might want to replace gnome-torrent with this in dapper
[07:20] <jdub> itym edgy
[07:20] <Burgundavia> yes
[07:20] <desrt> itym?
[07:20] <desrt> i think you mean
[07:21] <jdub> the gnome ui needs tidying up
[07:21] <Burgundavia> yes, it does
[07:21] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: why is it special?
[07:21] <Burgundavia> ajmitch, it is SDI
[07:21] <ajmitch> ah
[07:22] <Burgundavia> no hundreds of little windows
[07:22] <Burgundavia> be nice to have one that saved over multiple sessions too
[07:22] <ajmitch> so closer to firefox's download window
[07:22] <Burgundavia> yep
[07:22] <Burgundavia> maybe the long-running thingy that is being done for GNOME might be better
[07:23] <desrt> bittorrent has a weird focus
[07:23] <Burgundavia> desrt, wierd focus?
[07:23] <desrt> focus is the wrong word
[07:23] <jdub> 'weird'
[07:23] <desrt> mental model?
[07:24] <desrt> it's very very different than any other p2p technology
[07:24] <Burgundavia> ah
[07:24] <desrt> wow.  my grammar is suffering.
[07:24] <jdub> ber, this uses 'jam', yet another attempt to replace autofoo
[07:25] <jdub> Burgundavia: would be better to replace the ui for the current one
[07:25] <jdub> why reimplement bittorrent in C?
[07:25] <Burgundavia> there was a plan by someone todo that, but I think it stalled
[07:28] <desrt> having python bittorrent pretty much guarentees your backend code will never fall out of maintainership
[07:29] <Burgundavia> except their v4 license is crap
[07:29] <Treenaks> Burgundavia: there is a re-implementation in C - see 'rtorrent'
[07:29] <Treenaks> Burgundavia: (warningL: ncurses interface hell)
[07:32] <Burgundavia> should the installer have mounted my windows partition>?
[07:34] <desrt>    ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----

[07:34] <desrt>     (reason: 550 Error: ".crt" file attachment types not allowed in MIME)
[07:34] <desrt> this is comical.
[07:34] <Burgundavia> why so?
[07:34] <desrt> wtf?
[07:35] <Treenaks> desrt: You evil terrorist! Encryption is only used by people like you!
[07:37] <desrt> ...
[07:37] <Treenaks> desrt: (assuming that was some x.509 certificate file)
[07:38] <desrt> it is
[07:39] <Treenaks> argh, the wiki changed its From: address
[07:44] <desrt> wow
[07:44] <desrt> according to /proc/cpuinfo my macbook is running at 3.3ghz
[07:44] <desrt> no wonder it gets so hot
[07:44] <desrt> 165% overclocked
[08:06] <Burgundavia> jdub, you seen this? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GnomeBlingManager
[08:09] <pitti> Good morning
[08:10] <jdub> wow, someone bothered to write that in C?
[08:10] <Burgundavia> same guy who wrote the livechatsupport
[08:11] <Burgundavia> he is also the cross posting one
[08:16] <neuralis> C for that? why on earth?
[08:17] <desrt> quite the UI.
[08:18] <neuralis> Burgundavia: well, the guy certainly has enthusiasm. if only it can be channeled a bit..
[08:18] <pitti> mdz: permission to upload http://librarian.launchpad.net/2953556/alsa-utils_1.0.10-1ubuntu14.debdiff ? it is a trivial fix to repair sound on ppc G3 systems
[08:18] <Burgundavia> neuralis, indeed, makes it so much harder
[08:19] <desrt> jdub; why does planet strip style out of blog entries?
[08:21] <jdub> desrt: because style is evil (as it happens, an upcoming version won't)
[08:22] <desrt> hum.
[08:23] <desrt> is there any way to float:right an image that will survive planet?
[08:23] <Burgundavia> desrt, got an idea for a masters yet?
[08:23] <desrt> Burgundavia; oh yes
[08:24] <desrt> Burgundavia; program verification
[08:24] <desrt> Burgundavia; with a decidedly educational spin, if i can swing it
[08:24] <mantas_> hello all
[08:25] <Burgundavia> desrt, program verification?
[08:25] <desrt> Burgundavia; there is this formal language called BESTT (basic extended simple type theory) which can be used to formally state program semantics.  theoretically, we're supposed to be using it for teaching because it's really nice
[08:25] <desrt> unfortunately, we don't have good tool support
[08:26] <desrt> mostly due to the fact that nobody's really heard of BESTT before
[08:26] <mantas_> pitti, hi, are you alive ?
[08:26] <SuperQ> http://www.bevmo.com/productinfo.asp?sku=00000077065 <- so tasty
[08:27] <desrt> that looks like it might be ok
[08:27] <SuperQ> it is
[08:28] <neuralis> desrt: most people i know who did substantial research in formal software verification walked away with the same conclusion; they were bored out of their minds.
[08:28] <neuralis> there are a few notable exceptions, but they're rare.
[08:28] <pitti> mantas_: yes
[08:28] <desrt> neuralis; i'm well aware of the risks
[08:29] <desrt> neuralis; i have something over top of the average grad student who gets bored doing formal verification, though
[08:29] <desrt> so i think i'll do fine :)
[08:29] <neuralis> desrt: all of the people i was talking about were professors ;)
[08:30] <mantas_> pitti, language-packs in dapper are 1 week old - lots of translations are updated since ;)
[08:30] <desrt> yes?
[08:30] <desrt> most professors i know don't have the quality i'm speaking about
[08:30] <pitti> mantas_: I know; maybe we'll update them today; if not, we'll update them post-release
[08:30] <desrt> (the ability to code my ass off)
[08:30] <whiprush> howdy gents.
[08:30] <desrt> pitti; i'm fantastic :)
[08:30] <desrt> pitti; yourself?
[08:31] <whiprush> 3 days!
[08:31] <pitti> desrt: quite breezy, almost dapper :)
[08:31] <desrt> pitti; don't drink any more coffee.  you may start getting edgy.
[08:31] <pitti> desrt: I don't even drink coffee ;)
[08:31] <mantas_> pitti, please, don't update post-release - in Dapper Release Roadmap langpack translation deadtime was on 25 May, but current langpacks are only 22 May :(
[08:31] <desrt> oh.  perfect.
[08:32] <pitti> mantas_: what's wrong with post-release? most langpacks aren't even on the CDs anyway
[08:32] <neuralis> desrt: i think you'll find there's very little new ground to be broken with coding in that field. it's almost wholly theory work that's needed.
[08:33] <mantas_> pitti, but all translations are in DVD
[08:33] <desrt> neuralis; you may be onto something with this idea
[08:33] <pitti> mantas_: hm, true
[08:33] <mantas_> pitti, and DVD images will be not updated after release
[08:33] <desrt> neuralis; but what i am planning is very practical and applied, and it seems (at least right now) that there is room for it
[08:33] <pitti> mantas_: I'll talk with mdz; we were still undecided whether to update them again
[08:33] <mantas_> pitti, and for example in Lithuania there are lots of computers without internet connection
[08:34] <neuralis> desrt: fair enough. what level of a thesis is this? bs/ms/phd?
[08:34] <mantas_> so, they will install/upgrade Ubuntu from DVD
[08:34] <desrt> ms
[08:35] <neuralis> desrt: so that's fine, you'll be able to mostly dodge theory if you want to. 
[08:36] <neuralis> desrt: best of luck.
[08:37] <mantas_> pitti, btw, is there a possibility to update only 1 language langpacks ? Bug #34914 is fixed only on May 26 (most traslations were sent until May 25, but rosetta accepted them only on May 26, because rosetta was busy with importing lots of openoffice translations...)
[08:37] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 34914 in Ubuntu "GNOME 2.13 translation to Lithuanian language uses an artifical term for File translation (Rinkmena), which is incompatible with other free software (including previous versions of GNOME)" [Major,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34914
[08:37] <desrt> neuralis; :)
[08:37] <desrt> i love how everyone has their angle
[08:38] <desrt> everyone thinks that the freeze should break for them because their issue is _important_
[08:38] <mantas_> desrt, you about our bug ?
[08:38] <desrt> mantas_; about everyone :p
[08:38] <LaserJock> what? my issues aren't important? ;-)
[08:42] <mantas_> desrt, it's not our problem, that deadline of language pack translations was anounced on May 25 in Dapper Release Roadmap...
[08:43] <mantas_> I think ubuntu developers should follow they roadmap, at least don't make deadlines earlier, than is annouced
[08:46] <kagou> hi
[08:46] <desrt> mantas_; i'm just kidding around
[08:46] <desrt> and now i am falling into bed
[08:46] <desrt> goodnight everyone.
[08:47] <mantas_> desrt, hehe, goodnight (while in my country is morning ;) )
[08:50] <pitti> desrt: good night!
[08:51] <Mithrandir> uh, why is the "you have been subscribed to this spec" a <p class="error message">?
[08:57] <pitti> mdz: permission to upload http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14826 ? only changes dependencies of postgresql-common, and it's not on the CD
[09:05] <dholbach> good morning
[09:06] <mantas_> morning
[09:12] <carlos> pitti: I should talk with you by phone before the Ubuntu sprint, one of the specs I will work on is on a new infrastructure to deploy translatable resources without using .deb packages
[09:12] <carlos> pitti: I talked with mark about this and he agreed that we should implement it for Edgy's univere
[09:12] <carlos> universe
[09:12] <carlos> and then, move it to edgy+1's main
[09:13] <pitti> carlos: this reminds me of the controversial discussion we had in Mataro, where we had this option as well
[09:13] <pitti> carlos: yeah, let's talk about it post-release
[09:13] <carlos> pitti: yeah, is a bit controversial, but it's the only way to provide universe with language packs...
[09:14] <carlos> pitti: I was thinking on taking what Lliurex is doing atm, let me send you the URLs so you read them before the phone call, ok?
[09:14] <pitti> carlos: can we do that phone call not before Friday?
[09:14] <carlos> pitti: sure, I only need to have it before the sprint so we can focus only in the details 
[09:15] <carlos> pitti: I will be at Paris from Wednesday to Staturday (arriving Tuesday night)
[09:15] <carlos> and I need to work on OO.org, Firefox and language packs for universe
[09:16] <carlos> so I need some discussion done before
[09:25] <crimsun> pitti: insight into the various alsa-lib error spew regarding not being able to find components for "default", etc. (bug #31699, bug #35540, debian #369299 and its dupes) has been posted and attached to bug #43146
[09:25] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 31699 in alsa-utils "Can't use other than default sound card" [Major,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/31699
[09:25] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 35540 in gnome-volume-manager "Using alsamixer/amixer after selecting a non-default sound card (System> Preferences> Sound> Default sound card) results in errors" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/35540
[09:25] <Ubugtu> Debian bug 369299 in libasound2 "Subject: libasound2: pcm.c:2146:(snd_pcm_open_noupdate) Unknown PCM default" [Important,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/369299
[09:25] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 43146 in alsa-lib "gnome-sound-properties generates broken alsa conf" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43146
[09:29] <janimo> Kamion: can the desktop dependencies generated from the seeds contain alternate depends?
[09:32] <dholbach> janimo: there's no support for alternate depends yet.
[09:38] <janimo> dholbach: ok, thanks
[10:21] <Mithrandir> I wonder why openvpn and rsyncing off cdimage seems to be broken.
[10:27] <fabbione> Mithrandir: i think the same issues as before RC
[10:29] <thep> Kamion, i've got a bug report on dapper installer (text) when choosing Thai keyboard map: it shows red screen of error
[10:29] <Mithrandir> fabbione: what was that?  It works if I forcefully route it through my DSL connection instead of the openvpn connection.
[10:29] <fabbione> Mithrandir: cdimage does limit to max 2 connection per ip
[10:30] <fabbione> probably the other did hang and needs to timeout
[10:30] <Mithrandir> fabbione: unless it hangs for (literally) ages, I wouldn't think so.
[10:30] <Mithrandir> I haven't rsynced off this machine for a few days.
[10:30] <fabbione> iirc the timeout is several mintues
[10:31] <Mithrandir> unless it's > 72 hours, it should have timed out
[10:31] <fabbione> eheh i guess so
[11:04] <dholbach> Kamion, mdz: I'd really like to get the patch in bug 46440 in (it will enable documentation (scrollkeeper) for all the locales we have in language packs (there were a lot missing) - what do you think?
[11:04] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46440 in scrollkeeper "There is no Croatian translation of desktopguide" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46440
[11:09] <janimo> mvo: hi, regarding the xubuntu-desktop conflicting with ubuntu-desktop bug
[11:10] <mvo> janimo: what bugnumber?
[11:10] <janimo> do you think it would be ok to make xubuntu-desktop alternately depend on gnome-system-tools
[11:10] <janimo> mvo:  let me check
[11:10] <seb128> janimo: any plan to fix thunar?
[11:10] <janimo> seb128: yes
[11:11] <seb128> when?
[11:11] <janimo> seb128: waiting to see what upstream sais to my comments
[11:11] <janimo> well today
[11:11] <seb128> k, so maybe after dapper if upstream doesn't reply
[11:11] <seb128> you were already saying that saturday
[11:11] <janimo> seb128: I did not say I would fix it Saturday
[11:11] <janimo> just before dapper
[11:11] <seb128> no, you said you wait on upstream
[11:12] <janimo> seb128: since then upstream replied and I replied back
[11:12] <seb128> I'm wondering what you will do if upstream doesn't reply
[11:12] <janimo> read the bugzilla comments
[11:12] <carlos> pitti: would be possible to use tomorrow's language pack as the final one?
[11:12] <janimo> mvo bug 46191
[11:12] <seb128> looks like upstream is on crack
[11:12] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46191 in xubuntu-system-tools "xubuntu-system-tools conflicts with gnome-system-tools" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46191
[11:13] <janimo> seb128: tell upstream that not me
[11:13] <mvo> janimo: right, this one
[11:13] <pitti> carlos: I don't know, that's mdz's decision and depends on the CD testing results; from my side it's no problem at all
[11:13] <carlos> ok
[11:13] <seb128> janimo: I've enough to do atm, I've already explained everything on the launchpad bug
[11:13] <janimo> mvo, the altrenatives as I see it are either hand modify the generated xubuntu-desktop depends 
[11:13] <carlos> pitti: I'm doing a small fix for KDE German translations
[11:14] <carlos> would be good to have that fixed with latest release, but it's ok if we need to wait
[11:14] <carlos> for next release
[11:14] <janimo> mvo, or make xubuntu-system-tools Provide gnome-system-tools. But ther latter could affect mixed installs
[11:14] <janimo> seb128: you actually did not explain, but  I will fix it nonetheless
[11:14] <seb128> janimo: but I'll make clear how much bad willing you are putting to try to get the fixed for dapper
[11:14] <janimo> seb128: you said it was a firefox bug if it happened so you don;t care
[11:14] <janimo> seb128: so I have to check it myself and it takes more time than just saying go fix it
[11:15] <mvo> janimo: hand modify to "xubuntu-s-t | ubuntu-s-t"?
[11:15] <janimo> mvo: yes, what do you think?
[11:15] <seb128> janimo: I'll let the bug for now because you seem to enjoy yourself not fixing it, but don't worry I'll fix it today if you don't
[11:15] <janimo> seb128: give me a break already. I said I would fix it 
[11:16] <seb128> janimo: I don't trust you to do so
[11:16] <janimo> seb128: well what can I do?
[11:16] <seb128> you show real bad willing on that for a week
[11:16] <seb128> janimo: nothing, I'll fix it myself
[11:16] <mvo> janimo: its ugly, but I guess it is better than breaking. we need to sit down together in paris to discuss what to do with the system tools
[11:16] <seb128> don't bother
[11:16] <janimo> mvo: I hope the system tools will be replaced by a pygtk one no by edgy?
[11:16] <seb128> I doubt of that
[11:17] <seb128> it's likely than by edgy the new g-s-t upstream infrastructure will be used
[11:17] <mvo> janimo: we have little time and no that many resources. but it would be good if the system-tools would get some love
[11:17] <seb128> using dbus etc
[11:17] <seb128> mvo: Carlos closed a zillion of bug for some days in fact
[11:17] <mvo> seb128: really? that is good to hear
[11:17] <seb128> mvo: I think he landed to CVS the new g-s-t generation
[11:17] <janimo> mvo, seb128 ok. I thought g-s-t was unmaintained and daniel said the 3 of you were planning a python replacement
[11:18] <dholbach> mdke: um, are you aware of scrollkeeper breakage in ubuntu-docs? /usr/share/ubuntu-docs/common/et/preface.xml?
[11:18] <carlos> seb128: the one that uses hal's security infrastructure to stop using setuid of gksu programs?
[11:18] <dholbach> mdke: might be worth to fix that in the upload too, what do you think?
[11:18] <carlos> that's good news
[11:18] <seb128> carlos: I'm not sure there is anything like that, the one that uses dbus to communicate between backend and frontend rather
[11:18] <mvo> seb128: i'll talk to him next time I see him online
[11:19] <carlos> seb128: that's the same thing then
[11:19] <janimo> mvo, so if I add the alternate deps manually paralell installs of {x,}ubuntu-desktop should be ok right?
[11:19] <seb128> mvo: good, let me know when you start the discussion then I can join
[11:19] <dholbach> janimo: while we plan it and would love to get that done, seb128 is right - it will require a lot of hard work
[11:19] <mvo> seb128: we could add a python based network backend then, that would certainly be very good .
[11:19] <seb128> carlos: I doubt he make that secure daemon yet
[11:19] <mvo> seb128: I haven't seen him on irc for ages
[11:19] <carlos> seb128: hal did
[11:19] <carlos> seb128: it's not something specific from g-s-t
[11:19] <seb128> carlos: he doesn't use hal, he just uses the dbus bus to communicate
[11:19] <janimo> dholbach: it could be ubuntu specific witohut all the legacy that current backends support
[11:20] <carlos> seb128: hal uses dbus too for that feature, so it's either implemented, or is the first phase to get it done that way
[11:20] <mvo> janimo: yes, it should be. I can do a test-run for it in a bit
[11:20] <seb128> carlos: I think it's rather the first phase to get it done
[11:20] <janimo> mvo, I'll upload with next xubuntu-desktop then
[11:20] <carlos> ok
[11:21] <seb128> carlos: bug right, one step to the right direction ;)
[11:21] <carlos> ;-)
[11:21] <janimo> seb128: any news whether gtk 2.10 will be used by gnome 2.16?
[11:21] <seb128> janimo: I stop talking to you, fix your bugs first
[11:22] <janimo> seb128: man you're mean
[11:22] <seb128> you are trying to make sure Ubuntu will be bugged and I don't like it at all
[11:23] <janimo> seb128: if I try to make sure kubuntu is bugged would you forgive me?
[11:23] <seb128> no
[11:23] <janimo> damn
[11:24] <seb128> I spend like 1 hour to comment on that bug saturday and to explain you what the issue is, but looks like you enjoy making it me spend time for nothing on it and refuse to fix it
[11:24] <seb128> that's noted
[11:25] <dholbach> calm down guys... it's release time and we're all stressed
[11:26] <seb128> dholbach: I've been patient enough to explain him several time what the issue is, to comment with details on the bug when he asked but there is some limit where you can stop being calm then
[11:27] <seb128> dholbach: and I'm calm ;) I just want that bug fixed
[11:28] <dholbach> your language doesn't reflect that :-/
[11:28] <janimo> seb128: FYI I have spent way more than 1 hour on this bug, which I consider a gnome bug BTW
[11:28] <seb128> dholbach: I spend^Wwasted hours on that where I could have fix it in 1 min, to be nice
[11:28] <janimo> if it want to call nautilus call nautilus do not go via an indirection which everyone knows about
[11:28] <seb128> dholbach: but seems it doesn't work to be nice
[11:29] <seb128> janimo: you didn't read anything on what I said saturday or on the bug, you make me waste my time on that
[11:29] <seb128> nothing wants to call nautilus, then open a "x-directory/normal" mimetype
[11:29] <dholbach> can't we have a pragmatic, easy fix which makes xubuntu and ubuntu happy?
[11:29] <janimo> seb128: oh yes. Being nice works all the time. You are just not being nice that's all.
[11:29] <seb128> janimo: not with you since you decided you will not fix it for whatever reason
[11:30] <janimo> seb128: if you look at what users say, they get either thunar or nautilus popped up depending on what they click on. That is inconsistency in gnome IMHO
[11:30] <seb128> janimo: nautilus will always open directories with nautilus, that's normal
[11:30] <janimo> seb128: I assume you saw this coming 6 months ago, so you were not being nice in advance
[11:30] <seb128> janimo: gnome-panel or deskbar uses the x-directory/normal handler
[11:31] <dholbach> please choose an easy, pragmatic fix fow now which makes you both happy - this discussion about who is nice and and who not doesn't lead anywhere in case you didn't notice :-/
[11:31] <seb128> dholbach: I'm not discussing who is nice, I don't care, I just want that bug fixed
[11:31] <janimo> seb128: and you're commentig on the bug that this si not a mimetype it's wrong. It is a mimetype as it is in mime.cache. It is just gnome private. But still a mimetype
[11:31] <seb128> dholbach: and I already explained a zillion of time what the fix is, but he will not listen nor provide a good argument on why he will not
[11:32] <seb128> dholbach: I think that's just "you have been not notice so I'll screw dapper to teach you" game
[11:32] <seb128> which is a pitty
[11:32] <janimo> seb128: I told you I'll fix it already
[11:32] <infinity> janimo: By that argument, application/x-flaming-poo would be a valid mime-type if I registered a handle for it.
[11:32] <seb128> janimo: stop telling it and do fix it
[11:33] <mdz> dholbach: the patch for bug 46440 is rather long and difficult to read
[11:33] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46440 in scrollkeeper "There is no Croatian translation of desktopguide" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46440
[11:33] <seb128> janimo: your mimetype is not listed by /usr/share/mime/* -r
[11:33] <janimo> infinity: sure, why not?
[11:33] <pitti> mdz: good morning
[11:33] <infinity> janimo: The fact that a mime HANDLER is registered as a private interface doesn't make it a valid mime-type for the world to use.
[11:33] <seb128> public types are listed by /usr/share/mime/* -r 
[11:33] <mdz> pitti: postgresql-common dep change is fine
[11:33] <janimo> infinity: otherwise why would apps put it in .desktop files MIME=Type handler?
[11:33] <janimo> and get in the mime.cache?
[11:33] <janimo> infinity: i did not say valid or public or not? But a mimetype
[11:33] <infinity> janimo: (Sure, I agree that nautilus and GNOME probably should have done this differently, rather than overload the MIME system, but it's a bit late to fix that now...)
[11:33] <dholbach> mdz: I agree - I'll make a more appropriate diff (as I renamed one of the patches)
[11:34] <msikma> test
[11:34] <msikma> Great, now I can irc at work.
[11:34] <mdz> pitti: what is the story with final langpacks for release?  I think we said yesterday or today
[11:34] <janimo> infinity: that's why I was trying to make sure changin it does not break default xubuntu install before just commiting the proposed fix
[11:35] <pitti> mdz: well, they get a bit better every day :) carlos said he would like us to use tomorrow's
[11:35] <pitti> mdz: however, that might be a bit too late
[11:35] <carlos> right
[11:35] <janimo> infinity: as opposed to commiting right away to fix a non-ubuntu default corner case which is reached by user conciosuly installoing thunar
[11:36] <carlos> mdz: pitti: Anyone will fit, but as much late we take them, more translations fixed we will get ;-)
[11:36] <mdz> pitti: tomorrow is too late
[11:36] <carlos> ok
[11:36] <mdz> carlos: yes, after 1 June they will be even better ;-)
[11:36] <carlos> right
[11:36] <seb128> janimo: installing thunar seems a non-corner case 
[11:36] <carlos> we should stop them at some point
[11:36] <carlos> I know ;-)
[11:36] <janimo> seb128: in gnome?
[11:36] <mdz> carlos: even the sab agreed to stop today
[11:37] <pitti> mdz: I'm fine with taking any of yesterday's or today's, they are all fine 
[11:37] <seb128> janimo: in Ubuntu, you know, some people install several desktop and switch between them
[11:37] <janimo> seb128: anyway it is not OMG janimo breaks dapper. Users installs thunar that is so not default ubuntu install
[11:37] <carlos> mdz: Is ok for me, don't worry
[11:37] <mdz> pitti: whatever you like, so long as they are uploaded today
[11:37] <dholbach> mdz: I sent an updated patch on bug 46440
[11:37] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46440 in scrollkeeper "There is no Croatian translation of desktopguide" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46440
[11:38] <doko> mdz: any word about the qt-x11-free and ia32-libs-kde uploads?
[11:38] <pitti> mdz: alright, then I'll ask Kinnison or cprov to upload today's (shuold be finished around 1500 UTC)
[11:38] <mdz> doko: I am still working through my scrollback
[11:38] <infinity> pitti: If you're going to do langpack uploads right now, hold off for long enough for me to update the i386 buildd chroot tarball.
[11:38] <seb128> janimo: some people install xfce to have a look, that's a shame it breaks their GNOME desktop directory handler and trivial to fix
[11:38] <mdz> doko: did you check how this affects the CD size?
[11:38] <pitti> infinity: no, not right now, in about 6 hours
[11:38] <janimo> seb128: you know just as well I could tell you to change nautilus do not take over desktop by default. Users can install it and open a folder with it and it take the desktop away
[11:39] <infinity> pitti: (So there's no update/dist-upgrade dance at the beginning of each of the 8 billion langpack builds, slowing things down even further..)
[11:39] <fabbione> doko: ia32-libs is broken on ia64... if you plan to upload that, do you mind to fix the postinst script? the diversion goes bana
[11:39] <fabbione> banana even
[11:39] <janimo> seb128: should I start lamenting that you are undermining xfce and things like that?
[11:39] <infinity> pitti: Ahh, kay.  That gives me time.  I'll be ready when you are. :)
[11:39] <carlos> doko: hi, were you able to generate the OO.org language packs from the .po files I sent you?
[11:39] <janimo> mixed environments are corner cases, and harder to fix well so that noone complains
[11:39] <seb128> janimo: those points have nothing to do, nautilus doesn't take over your xubuntu desktop if you don't run it, and if you run it you have a gconf key and a --no-desktop
[11:39] <dholbach> janimo, seb128: please stop the accusations, please.
[11:39] <infinity> fabbione: Is there a bug for the ia64 breakage?  I haven't tested the ia64 upgrade path (though I just re-tested breezy->dapper on amd64 to confirm THAT was fine)
[11:40] <janimo> dholbach: ok 
[11:40] <fabbione> infinity: no i don't think i did file a bug
[11:40] <seb128> dholbach: stop telling me to stop the accusations, I don't accuse anybody
[11:40] <fabbione> infinity: and i can't test it atm because i have no ia64 turned on at hom
[11:40] <fabbione> home
[11:40] <seb128> dholbach: I just want that bug fixed now
[11:40] <fabbione> tho i could get it online
[11:40] <fabbione> infinity: can you test, or do i need to call my wife to get it on+
[11:40] <fabbione> ?
[11:40] <dholbach> seb128: I understand.
[11:41] <fabbione> infinity: the bug was on fresh install
[11:41] <fabbione> infinity: i am sure you can reprouce it in a chroot
[11:41] <infinity> fabbione: Calling your wife to get it on sounds like fun, but I think I can manage.
[11:41] <infinity> fabbione: I'll go play with debootstrap on an ia64 buildd.
[11:41] <fabbione> infinity: just grab a buildd chroot and install ia32-libs
[11:41] <fabbione> that's all i did to reproduce it at home
[11:41] <infinity> Oh, fun.,
[11:41] <infinity> Okay.
[11:42] <mdz> doko: these changes will fix oo.o-kde on amd64 without touching oo.o itself?
[11:42] <infinity> Of course, I'll probably also have to test the breezy->dapper upgrade path for ia64.
[11:42] <fabbione> infinity: what really scares me to ask my wife is that the ia64 is right next to the server... wrong button and i need to fly back home
[11:42] <infinity> And then make sure I'm not breaking amd64 in the process.
[11:42] <infinity> Whee.
[11:42] <fabbione> infinity: the amd64 part is if/def
[11:42] <mdz> doko: I expect infinity is rather bored with building oo.o by hand at this point
[11:42] <doko> mdz: it's plus 1,5MB on amd64-kubuntu, which is fine according to Riddell, no other images are getting bigger
[11:43] <doko> mdz: if we want to fix OOo-amd64 on ia64, then we need to change OOo-amd64 as well, but that's not needed at this point
[11:44] <infinity> OOo-amd64 isn't tough to change.
[11:44] <infinity> Assuming you don't mean that we need to change OOo-i386 to put it in OOo-amd64. :)
[11:45] <doko> mdz: I'm rather bored by trying to reproduce this failure myself, including setting up new installations on two single cpu machines.
[11:45] <mdz> doko: why do we need different config dirs for this case?
[11:46] <doko> mdz: for this case? we always need a different plugin directory for 32/64 bit plugins
[11:47] <mdz> doko: what I mean is, how is this related to the oo.o-kde problem?
[11:48] <doko> mdz: the kde theme and scim plugins can not be found
[11:49] <mdz> doko: those are in the system-wide dir, yes?
[11:51] <doko> they are in /usr/lib/qt3/plugins and /usr/lib/kde3/plugins, referenced by /etc/qt/qt_plugins_3.3rc; if this file cannot be written, it's written in the user's home dir
[11:51] <doko> fabbione: which version? 1.4ubuntu17 or 1.4ubuntu18 ?
[11:53] <mdz> doko: Riddell seems to have already changed kubuntu-meta to remove it
[11:53] <doko> mdz: it=what?
[11:53] <mdz> doko: oo.o-kde
[11:53] <mdz>    * Removed openoffice.org-kde from desktop-amd64, desktop-ia64,
[11:53] <mdz>      desktop-sparc
[11:53] <ogra> mdz, got my mail about hwdb ?
[11:54] <mdz> ogra: I am not there yet
[11:54] <ogra> ok
[11:54] <doko> mdz: ohh, fun, maybe he could have told me before spending the weekend on it?
[11:55] <infinity> mdz: I think he changed it proactively, but was also working with doko to track down the problem so he could add it back.
[11:56] <infinity> mdz: At least, that seems to match the sequence of events that I watched.
[11:56] <seb128> janimo: for information according to a "grep "gnome-default-handler" * -r" to firefox source directory, firefox doesn't use "gnome-default-handler"
[11:57] <janimo> seb128: already checked that, and it works w/o that
[11:57] <janimo> thats' what I said to uptsream in bugzilla querying what use did he see
[11:57] <janimo> seb128: so yes I have been working on the bug
[11:57] <ogra> janimo, any feedback for the xubuntu ltsp install yet ? 
[11:58] <janimo> ogra, two guys you saw on the list . I assume they'll feedback to the list as well
[11:58] <janimo> by tomorrow as they said
[11:58] <ogra> ok
[11:59] <infinity> Argh, where's cprov when I need him?
[11:59] <Riddell> mdz: I was erring on the side of caution, but I'll put it back if doko's fixes get uploaded
[12:00] <janimo> seb128: sorry for your wasted time and nerves.
[12:02] <seb128> janimo: better to not make me waste efforts trying to explain what the issue is next time, if you decided you don't trust what I say and will wait for upstream anyway
[12:02] <doko> fabbione: what exactly is wrong about ia32-libs? which version is wrong?
[12:02] <mdz> Riddell,doko: let's go with what we have, and consider the better fix for post-release
[12:03] <pitti> mdz: do you have a yay or nay for crimsun's alsa-utils patch to fix ppc g3 sound?
[12:03] <mdz> pitti: I don't know what patch you mean
[12:04] <pitti> mdz: http://librarian.launchpad.net/2953556/alsa-utils_1.0.10-1ubuntu14.debdiff
[12:04] <fabbione> doko: the latest one.. it's a diversion error the preinst or postinst and only on ia64
[12:04] <infinity> fabbione: I'm looking at it right now.
[12:04] <fabbione> infinity: thanks
[12:05] <mdz> ogra: hwdb patch is OK
[12:05] <ogra> mdz, thanks :)
[12:05] <infinity> doko: My last upload only fixed things on amd64, I never tested ia64.  My bad.  I'm looking right now.
[12:05] <ogra> we'll re-rnable it in edgy again
[12:06] <mdz> pitti: fine to upload
[12:06] <fabbione> mdz: we have no patch for that memcpy bug :/
[12:06] <doko> infinity: there was no difference on amd64 and ia64
[12:06] <doko> in breezy
[12:07] <infinity> doko: There's a huge difference in dapper, though. :)
[12:07] <mdz> fabbione: I know, the deadline was yesterday :-/
[12:07] <fabbione> mdz: yeah.. we will need to decide what to do.
[12:07] <fabbione> mdz: specially because it bites on install
[12:07] <mdz> seb128: regarding shared-mime-info, the bug is already marked Fix Released?
[12:08] <Riddell> mdz: a couple of diffs for you to review: this one fixes a problem with gtk-qt-engine http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/tmp/gtk-qt.diff
[12:08] <seb128> mdz: which one?
[12:08] <mdz> seb128: bug 44523
[12:08] <Riddell> mdz: 
[12:08] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 44523 in abiword "abiword (and other text editing apps) should not appear in the Open With menu for PDFs" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/44523
[12:08] <seb128> mdz: yeah, I've uploaded the package yesterday (Kamion approved it)
[12:08] <Riddell> and one to add some missing mimetypes to the kmplayer plugin priority http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/kds.diff
[12:08] <seb128> mdz: is that wrong?
[12:09] <mdz> Riddell: this is not actually used in the default install, yes?
[12:09] <mdz> seb128: oh, I thought you asked me about it this morning
[12:09] <fabbione> infinity: what's the url to monitor buildds?
[12:09] <Riddell> mdz: they are
[12:09] <seb128> mdz: I did?
[12:09] <infinity> fabbione: lp.net/+builds
[12:10] <mdz> seb128: maybe you asked last night and it was in my scrollback
[12:10] <fabbione> infinity: danke
[12:10] <seb128> mdz: probably yep
[12:10] <mdz> Riddell: the gtk-qt thing I mean
[12:10] <fabbione> infinity: is it actually working??
[12:10] <infinity> Isn't that the thing I uploaded yesterday that's in kubuntu-desktop and has the evil "don't use shlibs" hack?
[12:11] <fabbione> infinity: it still reports ooo building on i386 and no ooo build on sparc...
[12:11] <infinity> fabbione: sejong died, hence the sparc build is being rescued...
[12:11] <Riddell> mdz: it's used if you don't have gnome installed
[12:11] <fabbione> infinity: died, how?
[12:11] <Riddell> for users with some gtk programmes but not full gnome
[12:12] <infinity> fabbione: Ask Znarl.  He just informed me that the machine had locked up and needed to be power cycled.  I wasn't awake at the time.
[12:12] <seb128> mdz: is that still ok to upload a crasher fix for gnome-system-tools (a double g_free call, Kamion said it was ok to upload yesterday but I just noticed that the upload got rejected)
[12:12] <fabbione> Znarl: ping?
[12:12] <fabbione> infinity: ok thanks
[12:12] <infinity> But I think there is something goofy going on with the build queue DB as well...
[12:12] <mdz> Riddell: right, but we don't install any of those by default (except perhaps in edubuntu? ogra?)
[12:12] <infinity> Since vernadsky is definitely not building OOo anymore.
[12:12] <infinity> Argh.
[12:12] <Riddell> mdz: kubuntu installs gtk-qt by default
[12:13] <Riddell> and kmplayer plugin
[12:13] <ogra> mdz, nope, i wont touch gtk-qt in edubuntu even if my life depends on it
[12:13] <mdz> Riddell: the patch looks correct but it seems equally valid to fix via dapper-updates
[12:14] <mdz> Riddell: I haven't looked at kmplayer yet
[12:14] <infinity> Oh, the buildqueue database is probably confused about vernadsky/OOo since it actually succeeded for once... After I'd uploaded a manual build.
[12:14] <infinity> mdz: Good news, the bug is fixed1 :)
[12:14] <mdz> infinity: eh?
[12:14] <seb128> gtk-qt does weird stuff, we had bugs about volume sliders acting reversed due to it by example
[12:15] <infinity> mdz: Okay, it's obviously not fixed, since we did nothing to fix it, but the autobuild of OOo on vernadsky actually completed this last time.  Bizarre.
[12:15] <ogra> seb128, we also had bugs about the whole gnome desktop crashing with it installed
[12:16] <mdz> Riddell: "(closing Malone #5346, #16469 and #16469)" ?
[12:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 5346 in kaffeine "Kaffeine crashes konqueror when trying to play embedded movies" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/5346
[12:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 16469 in kdebase "konqueror crashes when accessing streams on spiegel.de" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/16469
[12:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 16469 in kdebase "konqueror crashes when accessing streams on spiegel.de" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/16469
[12:17] <Riddell> mdz: yes, kaffeine plugin is quite unstable, that's why we set it to use kmplayer as default plugin but we missed a few mimetypes that still need it set
[12:17] <Riddell> obviously I'll remove the duplicate :)
[12:17] <mdz> Riddell: so there is no third bug to look at?
[12:17] <seb128> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/gst.debdiff ... ok to upload?
[12:18] <mdz> Riddell: in 5346 and 16469 we are working around kaffeine bugs by switching to kmplayer instead?
[12:18] <Riddell> they are yes
[12:18] <seb128> mdz: the code is http://pastebin.com/743768, the double g_free is previous obvious as you can notice :)
[12:18] <crimsun> mdz: / pitti: thanks! (RE: alsa-utils)
[12:18] <mdz> seb128: was just downloading the source ;-)
[12:19] <mdz> seb128: yes, ok
[12:19] <seb128> mdz: thank you
[12:19] <mdz> Riddell: that seems like a fairly major change to make right now
[12:19] <mdke> dholbach: yes, wasn't aware of that
[12:20] <mdz> Riddell: the bugs seem to say that kaffeine is having problems only with some videos
[12:20] <dholbach> mdke: if you drop that fix in, I'll do the upload asap
[12:20] <mdke> dholbach: I'll do it now
[12:20] <dholbach> mdke: merci beaucoup
[12:20] <Riddell> looks like bug 35786 is the other one
[12:20] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 35786 in kdebase "konqueror with kaffeine-xine plugin crashes on certain sites" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/35786
[12:20] <mdz> switching from one large code base to another so late makes me nervous
[12:20] <Riddell> mdz: we already use kmplayer, this just adds some mimetypes that we missed
[12:21] <fabbione> wouldn't kmplayer plugin require mplayer installed?
[12:21] <Riddell> all the mimetypes have to be listed explicitly
[12:21] <mdz> Riddell: how long ago did we switch for other types?
[12:21] <Riddell> mdz: a couple of months at least
[12:21] <mdz> fabbione: no, it is a separate package
[12:21] <fabbione> ok
[12:21] <mdz> I don't think it is even based on mplayer
[12:22] <fabbione> i hope so
[12:22] <Riddell> fabbione: we're using the xine backend
[12:22] <mdz> looks like it is using xine
[12:22] <fabbione> Riddell: ok
[12:22] <mdz> Riddell: does this change which player is used for any of the example content?
[12:22] <fabbione> mdz: you have about 8 minutes to catch breakfast
[12:23] <mdz> fabbione: not hungry
[12:23] <fabbione> mdz: ok
[12:23] <Riddell> mdz: no, that all gets launched in a full player, this is just for webpages with embedded players
[12:23] <mdz> fabbione: but thanks for the reminder ;-)
[12:23] <mdz> do they really serve breakfast until 12 here?
[12:23] <Riddell> full player is still kaffeine
[12:23] <fabbione> mdz: eheh no problem
[12:23] <highvoltage> mdz: where is 'here'? :)
[12:24] <fabbione> mdz: 11:30 only on weekends and holidays.. otherwise 11
[12:24] <mdz> highvoltage: the K+K Hotel George, or as I like to call it "home"
[12:24] <highvoltage> ah, kk george, accordign to your IP :)
[12:24] <infinity> fabbione: You sure do know your breakfast schedules. :)
[12:24] <fabbione> infinity: you bet :)
[12:24] <mdz> Riddell: can you check when that change was made please?
[12:24] <pitti> mdz: it's a slow migration to become an European citizen, accept it :)
[12:24] <fabbione> infinity: but just because i am a very slow starter in the morning
[12:25] <fabbione> infinity: so i need to plan it properly
[12:25] <Riddell> mdz:   * Added profilerc to define video player priority between kaffeine
[12:25] <Riddell>     and kmplayer
[12:25] <Riddell>  -- Anthony Mercatante <tonio@ubuntu.com>  Mon, 27 Mar 2006 00:30:30 +0000
[12:25] <dholbach> mdz: ok to upload  http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/gnome-power-manager.debdiff ?
[12:26] <infinity> mdz: Tell me that you care so little about freetds (library for accessing Sybase and MSSQL servers) that I can push in a last-minute patch to fix date format handling...
[12:26] <mdz> infinity: isn't that in universe?
[12:26] <mdz> oh god it isn't
[12:27] <infinity> mdz: No, it's always been in main.
[12:27] <mdz> infinity: what build-deps on it?
[12:27] <infinity> mdz: php5, at least.
[12:27] <jdub> that
[12:27] <pitti> mdz: and libgda2
[12:27] <jdub> that's quite important for some php users
[12:27] <mdz> jdub: yes, php5 is quite important for some php users
[12:28] <mdke> dholbach: where do you see the error?
[12:28] <mdz> infinity: do you have a diff?
[12:28] <infinity> mdz: As history goes, vorlon long ago added a patch to do on-the-fly locale handling in ffreetds.  Which was great, but it also mangled date formats according to locale, which broke any number of expectations from using the library to, y'know, get dates from a SQL server.
[12:28] <infinity> mdz: He just fed me a patch to fix that.
[12:28] <infinity> mdz: Yeah, let me find the right browser window with the URL sitting in it.
[12:29] <infinity> mdz: http://minbar.dodds.net/~vorlon/freetds-0.63-fixmylocale.diff
[12:29] <mdke> dholbach: oh, i see it. scrollkeeper doesn't give me that error, odd
[12:29] <infinity> mdz: (Obviously, that's the patch provided by vorlon, I can debdiff the Ubuntu source instead, but it'll come out pretty much identical.  We're in near version lockstep)
[12:29] <janimo> jdub: hi, do you know if gtk 2.10 is going to be ready for gnome 2.16?
[12:29] <dholbach> mdke: sudo scrollkeeper-rebuilddb
[12:29] <jdub> janimo: that's the goal
[12:29] <seb128> janimo: it'll probably
[12:30] <mdz> infinity: woo, this has been in debian for a whole 5 days? :-P
[12:30] <mdke> dholbach: odd, I don't see it, there seems to be an error in one of my scrollkeeper libs (failed to load external entity "/var/lib/scrollkeeper/(null)/scrollkeeper_cl.xml"), anyway, i've uploaded the fix, you are good to go
[12:30] <dholbach> mdke: rock on
[12:30] <rzr> hi
[12:31] <mdz> infinity: looks non-trivial; any rationale for pushing it now rather than -updates?
[12:32] <infinity> mdz: Yeah, I was going to hold off, but the rationale for pushing it now is so people don't end up with two different sets of SQL date results when using dapper or dapper-updates.
[12:32] <infinity> mdz: Seems tacky to me to change that sort of thing post-release.
[12:32] <infinity> mdz: But this is the "correct" way, matches upstream, and matches copious numbers of 3rd party applications that expect date formats to be in a certain Sybasish format.
[12:33] <mdz> infinity: I understand the nl_langinfo bit, but what's with the other changes?
[12:34] <infinity> The other half of the patch is to stop stomping on the user's chosen locale (the other mistake of vorlon's original patch)
[12:35] <pitti> Kamion, mdz: the current live CDs have spare space again; is there anything that will make them bigger again? can I fill them with langpacks again?
[12:35] <infinity> vorlon's original patch just took your environment and ran with it.  This properly checks the preferred local in /etc/freetds/locales.conf (as the library docs upstream claim it should), then falls back to environment if you have no preference.
[12:36] <doko> mdz: would you consider to make the qt change in ia32-libs only, and delaying the qt-x11-free change until after the release? at least it fixes a crash for kubuntu-amd64 and makes scim work at all. of course we would need to make sure, that the qt-x11-free binary in ia32-libs-kde is built in a trusted environment (which could just be manual build on a buildd environment)
[12:36] <mdz> pitti: how much space?
[12:36] <pitti> mdz: about 20 MB on i386/ppc, 15 on amd64
[12:36] <mdz> doko: what's the change? do you have a diff prepared?
[12:37] <pitti> (that will still leave some 5 MB breathing room)
[12:37] <infinity> doko: I can do the "fake" QT build if required.
[12:37] <mdz> pitti: ok, so long as we have a buffer for, e.g., random icon updates later today
[12:37] <pitti> mdz: I'll wait for Kamion's answer, too, to be sure (the last time I filled the CDs I wasn't aware of the pending ship-live addition)
[12:37] <infinity> pitti: Spare space is suspsicious.   What fell off? :)
[12:38] <infinity> (I'm pretty sure that spare space is actually spare, fwiw)
[12:38] <pitti> infinity: that's what I wonder, too, and why I like to get Colin's opinion
[12:38] <infinity> We had reserved it for example-content and the book and such, and those are all in now and smaller than expected.
[12:40] <doko> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/ooo-amd64/
[12:40] <mdz> pitti: Kamion is off today (UK bank holiday)
[12:40] <doko> it's the qt change as posted, plus installation of the qt config files in /etc/qt3-32 in ia32-libs-kde
[12:40] <dholbach> mdke: Could you look at my /query, thanks?
[12:43] <infinity> pitti: Cheese rolling down the hill day!
[12:43] <fabbione> sejong still idling
[12:43] <infinity> Yeah.. And? :)
[12:44] <fabbione> infinity: Oo.o. kthxbye :)
[12:44] <infinity> Yeah, I'm fixing.
[12:44] <fabbione> lovely
[12:44] <infinity> The DB got itself wedged in a special way.
[12:44] <infinity> Hence my earlier "where's cprov when I need him?" comment.
[12:44] <fabbione> i didn't notice the comment
[12:44] <fabbione> sorry
[12:45] <Mithrandir> pitti: what's happening with translations done this weekend per jordi's request?  Friend's asking and hasn't seen new langpacks yet.
[12:47] <mvo> mdz: is bug 45656 something for now? or rather for dapper-updates?
[12:47] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45656 in notification-daemon "Notification bubble shows sometimes wide, sometimes narrow" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45656
[12:48] <mantas_> pitti, hehe, it seems I'm not alone - people are waiting for new langpacks... have you talked with mdz about regenerating language packs to match officially announced dapper translation deadline - 25th of May?
[12:48] <mdz> mvo: what kinds of notifications are affected?
[12:49] <mdz> mantas_: see the earlier discussion on this channel
[12:49] <mdz> Mithrandir: ^^
[12:49] <pitti> infinity, mdz: I phoned Colin, he's okay with it
[12:49] <mvo> mdz: stuff from the notification-daemon (update-notifier, disk-full notification, rhythmbox)
[12:49] <pitti> Mithrandir, mantas_: it's decided, we'll update the langpacks this evening
[12:49] <Mithrandir> pitti: cool, thanks.
[12:50] <mantas_> pitti, hehe, now you are hero in Lithuania ;)
[12:50] <mdz> mvo: it seems entirely cosmetic from the examples in the bug
[12:50] <mvo> mdz: it is, yes
[12:50] <mdz> somewhere in Lithuania, work is quietly beginning on a statue shaped like pitti
[12:50] <mdz> mvo: -updates then
[12:51] <mvo> mdz: ok, targetet it for it, thanks
[12:54] <impaque> hello, can you tell me with which CFLAGS is the majority of packages on kubuntu built with? i searched the net but couldn't find an answer. i'm not a gentoo ricer, i'm just curious. ;)
[12:55] <mantas_> mdz, yea, we already have the Frank Zappa statue, so, I think with pitti statue would be less work ;)
[12:55] <mdz> mvo: please add to DRR
[12:56] <mdz> doko: how do these ia32-libs-kde changes affect the size of the package?
[12:58] <Chipzz> impaque: should be in the buildlogs (you can find these on launchpad.net)
[12:59] <doko> mdz: it's a plus of 1,5MB for ia32-libs-kde, which is unproblematic according to Riddell; didn't check myself.
[12:59] <Riddell> plenty free space on kubuntu amd64 today
[01:00] <mvo> mdz: done
[01:00] <impaque> Chipzz: thanks
[01:03] <infinity> fabbione: Okay, fixing build DB... If you run into cprov today, tell him he owes me a beer and a hooker for the pain I just went through.
[01:03] <fabbione> infinity: ahahahah ok
[01:04] <crimsun> mdz: Is http://librarian.launchpad.net/2969615/alsa-lib_1.0.10-2ubuntu5.debdiff acceptable for dapper? It fixes the root of the problem for a host of issues that pitti has had to work around.
[01:06] <Kamion> thep: I'll need /var/log/syslog from the installer
[01:06] <pitti> crimsun: it looks sane of course, but can we be 100% sure that it does not have any unintended side effects?
[01:07] <crimsun> pitti: no location changes, but instead of using the buildd's directory, it uses /usr/share/alsa/, which is what we really want
[01:07] <infinity> fabbione: Other than the dpkg status file, just how wide is the impact of this sparc memcpy bug?
[01:07] <mdz> doko: ia32-libs-kde OK
[01:08] <pitti> crimsun: right; I mean that this changes the behaviour of alsa in a way we don't want to
[01:08] <fabbione> infinity: that seems to be the most evident breakage... there might be more hidden somewhere..
[01:08] <infinity> fabbione: You do realise that the buildds have been running dapper kernels since sparc lit up in the DC.  I'm wondering just how broken the world may be because of it.
[01:08] <mdz> crimsun: the only change is to configure with --datadir?
[01:08] <fabbione> infinity: it affects only CPU < Sparc III
[01:08] <fabbione> infinity: that's not the DC case
[01:08] <thep> Kamion, OK. I didn't find the bug myself. I'll ask it from the reporter.
[01:08] <infinity> fabbione: Oh, phew.
[01:09] <crimsun> pitti: it doesn't change anything beyond saying "look in /usr/share/alsa and not where the buildd built". There are no other changes. All the Debian bugs closed verify that.
[01:09] <thep> Kamion, actully, I've asked him to file a bug.
[01:09] <fabbione> infinity: if the breakage was wider, i would have push the big fat red alert button a few days back
[01:09] <crimsun> mdz: yes, that is the sole change
[01:09] <infinity> fabbione: Good to know; thanks.
[01:09] <fabbione> infinity: no problem
[01:09] <pitti> crimsun: right, that's what I understood. What I meant is: it will certainly change behaviour; will it conflict with the asoundconf workarounds we did?
[01:10] <pitti> crimsun: (don't get me wrong, I'd love to see that fix, but I want to make sure we don't break anything)
[01:10] <crimsun> pitti: it will not conflict with any of the workarounds; I've tested locally to see that. It actually covers the last case we didn't, which is bug #43146.
[01:10] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 43146 in alsa-lib "gnome-sound-properties generates broken alsa conf" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43146
[01:11] <mdz> crimsun: what effect does it have?
[01:11] <pitti> crimsun: great
[01:11] <mdz> crimsun: it seems likely to introduce a lot of hardware-specific behavioral changes
[01:12] <sivang> re all
[01:12] <mdz> if all of the stuff in /usr/share/alsa is currently being ignored
[01:13] <crimsun> mdz: David Ramsden's post in http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=369302 explains the current issue
[01:13] <Ubugtu> Debian bug 369302 in libasound2 "Subject: ALSA lib control.c:816:(snd_ctl_open_noupdate) Invalid CTL default" [Important,Open]  
[01:13] <mdz> doko: regarding bug 41592, that request hasn't been processed yet; isn't the existing version in the archive correct?
[01:13] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 41592 in vnc4 "UVF Exception: vnc4 (now sync request)" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41592
[01:13] <pitti> crimsun: ah, this explains a lot; I might also fix the Logitech headset breakage I encountered :)
[01:13] <Kamion> pitti: FWIW, if you're looking at filling up derivatives too, I don't know offhand how much of ship-live they each have
[01:14] <pitti> Kamion: I'll ask ogra and Riddell before touching them
[01:14] <doko> mdz: bddebian did overwrite the version built using xorg using the version build with xfree86
[01:14] <ogra> Kamion, i didnt add anything to ship-live beyond your initial packagelist
[01:14] <doko> repackaging the xorg based version.
[01:14] <mdz> doko: already?
[01:15] <Kamion> ogra: I added build-essential/fakeroot/linux-headers later, after my initial commit
[01:15] <dholbach> mdz: if you find some tiny bit of time, can you look at  http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/gnome-power-manager.debdiff  and the updated patch on bug 46440 or do you want me to mail them to you?
[01:15] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46440 in scrollkeeper "There is no Croatian translation of desktopguide" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46440
[01:15] <mdz> doko: I thought he was proposing to overwrite our version via a sync, but we had not done it yet
[01:15] <ogra> Kamion, which i didnt merge
[01:16] <mdz> dholbach: g-p-m OK
[01:16] <dholbach> mdz: merci
[01:16] <ogra> dholbach, hal dep added ? 
[01:16] <mdz> ogra: that seems perfectly logical
[01:16] <dholbach> ogra: kinnison asked me to
[01:16] <doko> mdz: no, meant to overwrite the version, which was in the archive before the conversion to xorg (overwriting the debian version with a very old version of xfree86)
[01:16] <seb128> ogra: there was a bug about it
[01:16] <mdz> I don't think it works without hal
[01:16] <ogra> dholbach, mdz, just wanted to make sure its not forgotten
[01:16] <ogra> seb128, yep
[01:16] <dholbach> ogra: ah right, yes - added it
[01:17] <ogra> mdz, it had no hal dep
[01:17] <ogra> mdz, as seb128 said
[01:17] <mdz> ogra: the patch that dholbach just referred to added one
[01:17] <dholbach> seb128, ogra: does anybody of you know the bug number? i couldn't find it
[01:17] <seb128> ogra: the update add the Depends now ...
[01:17] <mdz> it sounded like you were questioning whether that was correct
[01:17] <seb128> dholbach: sec
[01:18] <ogra> mdz, nope, just wanted to make sure its in (havent seen the patch)
[01:18] <doko> infinity: qt-x11-free_3.3.6-1ubuntu5* at http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/ooo-amd64/
[01:18] <mdz> ogra: grumblegrumble
[01:20] <mdz> dholbach: what is po/fake.po?
[01:20] <dholbach> mdz: the build needs a something.po file to generate a template for that language code
[01:20] <dholbach> mdz: so I added an empty one, so it's happy.
[01:20] <mdz> dholbach: it's not empty though; it's huge :-)
[01:21] <dholbach> mdz: it has msgstr "" - that's what I call "empty" :)
[01:22] <mdz> dholbach: seems simpler to just create .po files, rather than making these symlinks
[01:22] <mdz> dholbach: any reason not to do it that way?
[01:22] <dholbach> mdz: that would have made the diff even bigger :)
[01:22] <dholbach> think of it as my way of trying to please you :-)
[01:22] <mdz> dholbach: yes, but with no code changes it's obviously correct :-)
[01:22] <seb128> dholbach: bug ##45536
[01:23] <seb128> dholbach: bug #45536
[01:23] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45536 in gnome-power-manager "Shutdown, but logoff" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45536
[01:23] <dholbach> seb128: you rock - thanks
[01:23] <seb128> np
[01:25] <dholbach> mdz: do you want me to replace all the particular translations and simplify debian/rules or just go with it?
[01:26] <mdz> dholbach: simplifying makes mdz happy
[01:26] <dholbach> mdz: Ok, that's all I want.
[01:27] <seb128> lunch time, bbl
[01:27] <mdz> dholbach: that patch, minus the debian/rules change and fake.po, and plus the various .po files, is OK to upload
[01:27] <tepsipakki> is it possible to disable the hibernation option from logout-prompt?
[01:28] <dholbach> mdz: rock on
[01:28] <Kamion> mvo: er. so. have we signed the distribution agreement with VMware for these player packages?
[01:28] <Kamion> mvo: if so, that information should be in debian/copyright
[01:28] <mdz> tepsipakki: /etc/default/acpi-support, and please ask in #ubuntu next time
[01:29] <mvo> Kamion: mdy is the person responsible for this, I was at a conference call with them and they said it was ok. but mdy will know for certain, I will mail him
[01:30] <Kamion> mvo: are VMware aware that an arbitrary number of Ubuntu mirrors will probably mirror this if we stick it in multiverse? (i.e. it won't be just us distributing it, legally speaking)
[01:31] <Kamion> I don't want our mirrors to get into trouble or to have to apply complicated rsync restrictions
[01:31] <mvo> Kamion: we talked about this and they where aware and ok with this. but I have nothing written, just the info from the conference-call
[01:32] <mvo> Kamion: I'm happy to wait for mdy on this, I totally understand your position
[01:32] <tepsipakki> mdz: ok, thanks...
[01:33] <Kamion> I understand we need to move quickly if we want to get this into dapper
[01:35] <mvo> Kamion: I send him a mail and will text him and ask (politely) to look into his mail (if I can find his mobile number)
[01:38] <Kamion> ta
[01:39] <thep> Kamion, I got the syslog. It said:
[01:39] <thep> May 27 02:14:59 debconf: Setting debconf/language to th_TH:th
[01:39] <thep> May 27 02:14:59 kbd-chooser[2972] : INFO: kbd_chooser: setting keymap th-tis
[01:39] <thep> May 27 02:14:59 kbd-chooser-apply[2978] : ERROR **: :unknown charset tis-620 - ignoring charset request
[01:39] <Kamion> thep: in a bug report on kbd-chooser, please - I'm not actually working today (contrary to appearances)
[01:39] <Kamion> unfortunately it is unlikely that we'll be able to fix that for dapper now, I'm afraid
[01:40] <Kamion> because it would require a debian-installer rebuild
[01:40] <thep> Kamion, even though it fails to install correctly?
[01:41] <Riddell> mdz: did you make a decision on those gtk-qt and kmplayer mimetype patches?
[01:41] <thep> Kamion, regarding the bug report, yes, I'll ask him to file the bug, for sure.
[01:42] <Riddell> pitti: what's going into ship-live?
[01:44] <Kamion> thep: I realise it's a serious problem, but it will take some time to fix and it's just been discovered too late
[01:52] <infinity> doko: While I'm looking at it anyway, should ia32-libs be freshened?  The packages haven't been updated since March 30..
[01:52] <doko> infinity: will do it
[01:53] <infinity> doko: Kay, if you're going to do it, should I leave the "fix ia64 without breaking amd64" thing to you too, or do you want me to do that? :)
[01:53] <infinity> doko: I suspect that just wrapping the second half of preinst in an if(amd64) guard should do the trick.  More or less.
[01:53] <infinity> doko: Completely untested, of course. :)
[01:54] <pitti> Riddell: nothing from my side :) from your's?
[01:54] <doko> infinity: I'm currently installing a fresh breezy chroot, and want to upgrade to dapper; unfortunately that's a 1Mbit line ...
[01:54] <infinity> doko: I haven't done an upgrade test yet, but just deboostrapping dapper and installing ia32-libs exposes the first bug (which I introduced when fixing amd64, my fault)
[01:55] <infinity> doko: But fixing that might still mean upgrades are broken, yeah.  I can test in the DC.  Plenty of bandwidth to spare.
[01:55] <doko> infinity: testing in the DC is definitely easier
[01:56] <infinity> Even easier with all these chroot tarballs lying around, so I don't have to debootstrap. :)
[01:56] <thep_> Kamion, OK. I respect all maintainer's decisions.
[01:56] <infinity> Oh, except I don't have one for breezy-updates... Weird.
[01:59] <Riddell> pitti: ok, you were talking with Kamion about filling up derivatives though
[02:00] <pitti> Riddell: I could add 10 MB to the amd64 kubuntu one if you want me to; the other ones are full/oversized anyway
[02:00] <Riddell> pitti: with what?
[02:01] <pitti> Riddell: language packs
[02:01] <carlos> pitti: could you remind me which package contains the patch that adds gettext support to .desktop files ?
[02:01] <carlos> for GNOME
[02:01] <pitti> crimsun: has there been an agreement with mdz about the alsa-utils fix? (my gut says dapper-updates material)
[02:01] <Riddell> pitti: I was waiting for doko's ia32 package before filling up amd64
[02:02] <pitti> carlos: glib2.0 and gnome-desktop
[02:02] <carlos> pitti: ok, thanks
[02:02] <pitti> Riddell: right, I'll leave it alone for now
[02:02] <pitti> ogra: ping
[02:02] <ogra> pitti, pong
[02:03] <doko> Riddell: infinity is currently preparing the qt-x11-free build by hand
[02:03] <pitti> ogra: edubuntu-live has plenty of space left, too; anything planned for it?
[02:03] <carlos> pitti: I got an email saying that the icons in the gnome panel were missing translations
[02:03] <ogra> pitti, langpacks ? 
[02:03] <pitti> ogra: :)
[02:04] <ogra> i have currently only de,fr,es,en
[02:05] <pitti> ogra: do you want to care for filling or shall I?
[02:05] <ogra> pitti, go ahead if you dont break it and have nothing else to do
[02:05] <ogra> else i'll care
[02:05] <Riddell> carlos: I'm told the koffice translations in rosetta are from koffice 1.4, the koffice package doesn't seem to be generating a .pot file, can i give you one to upload?
[02:05] <pitti> ogra: I have always stuff to do, but I'm fine with doing it; I just want to make sure to not get into your way if you want to add stuff 
[02:05] <carlos> Riddell: sure
[02:06] <carlos> Riddell: anyway, the problem there is also that the 1.5 translations are in universe
[02:06] <carlos> and I need to do a manual upload, do you remember?
[02:06] <carlos> Riddell: I answered the bug report
[02:06] <carlos> already
[02:06] <Riddell> carlos: yep, can you do that too?
[02:06] <carlos> sure
[02:06] <carlos> Riddell: what about k3b?
[02:06] <ogra> pitti, only thing i have left with edubuntu is fiddling with the cursor theme, i wont change anything but edubuntu-artwork
[02:06] <carlos> should I do another upload for that one?
[02:07] <pitti> ogra: is a spare space of 5 MB fine for you?
[02:07] <ogra> yep, absolutely
[02:07] <ogra> thats a big buffer ;)
[02:07] <Riddell> carlos: I'm not sure what's currently in k3b but it wants to be k3b-i18n 0.12.10
[02:08] <carlos> Riddell: well, my question is more 'did you upload a new release of k3b' recently?
[02:08] <carlos> that's less than 2 months ago
[02:10] <Riddell> carlos: oh, k3b and k3b-i18n are out of sync
[02:10] <Riddell> k3b is 0.12.14 from Mar 15th
[02:11] <infinity> dholbach: When do I get to whine about the Ubuntu panel logo changing to something completely hideous?
[02:12] <carlos> Riddell: do you need to upload a new version?
[02:12] <infinity> dholbach: The other one (which is still used for alacarte) looked much better.
[02:12] <carlos> Riddell: if it's too late, you could provide me the tarball with translations and will do the upload into Rosetta by hand
[02:12] <carlos> Riddell: I need to do it anyway by hand....
[02:12] <carlos> seb128: I have a test request for you, do you have time now?
[02:12] <Riddell> carlos: please import these by hand http://surfnet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/k3b/k3b-i18n-0.12.14.tar.bz2
[02:13] <Mithrandir> why is there only a russian "about ubuntu" in example-content?
[02:13] <Riddell> carlos: and these .pots for koffice http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/tmp/koffice-po.tar.gz
[02:13] <Riddell> carlos: and all the .pos from koffice-i18n-xx
[02:13] <carlos> Riddell: ok. Take into account that those will take one month to appear in Dapper (with next language pack update)
[02:13] <carlos> Riddell: ok
[02:17] <seb128> carlos: pong
[02:18] <carlos> seb128: do you have the Evolution launcher on your panel?
[02:18] <seb128> carlos: yeah, and the description is not translated and I don't know why
[02:18] <carlos> so it's a know bug
[02:18] <carlos> ok
[02:18] <seb128> yep
[02:19] <seb128> but I've no idea of what is causing the issue
[02:19] <carlos> I got complains about Rosetta / language packs not working
[02:19] <seb128> I'm sorry about it :/
[02:19] <carlos> dude, don't worry ;-)
[02:19] <seb128> :)
[02:19] <pitti> carlos: will anything drastically change in today's langpacks? like 3 MB of new translations due to some fixes or so?
[02:19] <carlos> just noting you the bug, because the translation is part of the .desktop files and thus, language packs are not involved...
[02:20] <Riddell> language packs take precedence over .desktop translations in ubuntu 
[02:20] <Riddell> as I remember
[02:20] <seb128> yep, they do
[02:21] <carlos> pitti: well, today's snapshot uses yesterday translations, I'm not sure how many extra translations would we get
[02:21] <pitti> carlos: you spoke about German KDE fixes?
[02:21] <carlos> pitti: tomorrow's langpacks (with today data) will get koffice translations, k3b translations and fix some other German KDE translations to stop the fork we had
[02:21] <pitti> carlos: we have to take today's
[02:22] <carlos> go ahed
[02:22] <carlos> ahead
[02:22] <carlos> I think we already agreed on that...
[02:22] <pitti> ok, -updates will get the rest
[02:22] <Riddell> can't we make a new snapshot in a couple of hours with those KDE changes?
[02:22] <carlos> Riddell: not really, OO.org is being imported atm
[02:22] <carlos> and thus will block those translations to be imported
[02:23] <carlos> and we still use a mirror so we would need to update the mirror to generate a new snapshot
[02:23] <infinity> Whatever you do, don't blame me.
[02:23] <carlos> infinity: I'm not blaming you ;-)
[02:23] <carlos> Riddell: it's a bit difficult to get all things in place in time for today
[02:23] <doko> carlos: we should add a flag, when we want to import translations, and when not.
[02:23] <infinity> carlos: Well, I am the one who's uploaded OOo like twelve times in the last week and stuffed up rosetta every time. :)
[02:24] <carlos> doko: we will talk about it next month
[02:24] <Riddell> carlos: ok, I'll just keep saying nice things to stop a riot on kde-i18n :)
[02:24] <carlos> doko: I guess you already know I will be in Paris (from Wednesday to Friday)
[02:24] <doko> carlos: didn't know. fine!
[02:24] <Riddell> carlos: at the conference?
[02:24] <carlos> Riddell: Rosetta will get the fixed strings today or tomorrow
[02:25] <carlos> Riddell: so translators will work with upstream translations in place
[02:25] <carlos> it's just dapper which will have some differences from upstream until next update
[02:25] <carlos> Riddell: yes
[02:27] <pitti> ogra: which are your most prefered languages? do you have a list?
[02:27] <ogra> not really
[02:28] <ogra> we have many users in brazil and chile
[02:28] <ogra> and in asia, but dont ask be for langs there
[02:28] <ogra> s/be7me/
[02:28] <pitti> ogra: pt is #6 on the top 11 anyway, so it'll make it on all CDs
[02:28] <Riddell> hmm, no mdz around to review patches
[02:29] <ogra> pitti, not on the edubuntu install CD :/
[02:29] <ogra> Riddell, after lunch :)
[02:29] <pitti> ogra: right, the install CDs are almost full, I only change the live CD now
[02:29] <ogra> yep
[02:29] <carlos> seb128: I think I found the problem
[02:29] <ogra> the install CD is full to the edge
[02:29] <carlos> seb128: do you have time?
[02:33] <carlos> seb128: Hmm, I need to have lunch now, but I will try to send a bug report with all information when I'm back
[02:35] <pitti> EdgyEft: nice nick :)
[02:35] <AlinuxOS> pitti, hello ;)
[02:35] <pitti> hi AlinuxOS 
[02:36] <ogra> pitti, thats Seveas' release specific logbot :) 
[02:37] <sivang> what does EdgyEft does? :)
[02:38] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39482 in nautilus "nautilus tries to move when dragging and dropping from read-only folders, instead of copying" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/39482
[02:38] <Mithrandir> dholbach: I'm wondering if I've found a bug in oo-about-these-files.odt.  Spell checking seems broken.
[02:39] <seb128> carlos: pong
[02:39] <seb128> carlos: sorry I just finished lunch break, I'm back to work now :)
[02:39] <seb128> carlos: where is the pb?
[02:40] <sivang> man, nautlilus takes time to build, not like evo, but long enough :p
[02:41] <sivang> seb128: basically, loggin in and out is enough for use a new installed nautilus right?
[02:41] <seb128> not true, nautilus is pretty fast to build
[02:41] <seb128> running "make" is enough to try that bug
[02:41] <seb128> and gnome-session-remove nautilus then src/nautilus
[02:41] <sivang> k, thanks
[02:46] <dholbach> Mithrandir: spell checking used to work fine in that file for me
[02:47] <Mithrandir> dholbach: doesn't for me, i386 dvd oem-config install.
[02:48] <dholbach> Mithrandir: missing *spell-<locale>?
[02:48] <dholbach> Mithrandir: and it works for other files?
[02:48] <Mithrandir> dholbach: works fine in a blank document.
[02:49] <infinity> doko: Argh.  Okay, the ia32-libs fix is easy.  I just need to move one line 4 lines up in the preinst.
[02:49] <infinity> doko: Want me to freshen it while I'm at it and just upload?
[02:51] <dholbach> Mithrandir: you opened it in a location where you can write on?
[02:52] <infinity> doko: Right, I'll just do it. ;)
[02:54] <Mithrandir> dholbach: yes.
[02:55] <tseng> hi Mithrandir dholbach 
[02:55] <Mithrandir> hiya tseng 
[02:55] <doko> infinity: I don't have any more changes for ia32-libs
[02:55] <dholbach> Mithrandir: hum, that works for me. (not if I open from /usr/share/example-content, but copied over to ~ it works fine)
[02:55] <infinity> doko: Alright, then I'll just do the ia64 fix and the refresh.
[02:56] <infinity> doko: Same trick as OOo-amd64, I assume?  (BUILD=0 fetch-and-build)?
[02:57] <pitti> seb128: what was the outcome of the poppler/tetex-bin unpatch/rebuild discussion?
[02:57] <seb128> pitti: none
[02:57] <doko> infinity: yes
[02:57] <infinity> doko: Rock.  Will do, then.
[02:57] <Mithrandir> dholbach: completely clean install?
[02:57] <infinity> doko: And I'll get that QT build for you in a bit too.
[02:58] <dholbach> Mithrandir: I tested it on all the installs I did.
[02:58] <pitti> bah, ENOMDZ
[02:58] <pitti> seb128: I'd love to at least do a no-change upload of tetex-bin to rebuild against the current poppler
[02:58] <infinity> pitti: He's lunching.  What do you need?
[02:59] <pitti> infinity: see above, to fix bug 42075
[02:59] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 42075 in tetex-base "includegraphics fails" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/42075
[02:59] <seb128> pitti: I asked that to mdz, but he didn't reply
[02:59] <infinity> pitti: You don't need approval to do those poppler uploads.  No source changes, and the bug obviously needs to be fixed.
[02:59] <infinity> seb128: ^^^
[02:59] <infinity> Get those rdeps rebuilt, like, yesterday.
[02:59] <pitti> infinity: poppler is fine, we need a rebuild of the rdepends (only tetex-bin is left AFAIUI)
[02:59] <infinity> PLEASE.
[02:59] <seb128> ok, so just do a tetex-bin "rebuild with new poppler" one
[02:59] <infinity> pitti: Yes, I meant "poppler-related"
[03:00] <jsgotangco> hi guys
[03:01] <seb128> hey jsgotangco
[03:01] <Mithrandir> dholbach: hmm.
[03:05] <ogra> pitti, wow, are you sure that will fit .... looks like a very long list of langs to me
[03:05] <jsgotangco> yeah
[03:06] <pitti> ogra: unless my script lied, it should
[03:10] <_ion> Go, USA! http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2089-2200170_1,00.html
[03:10] <infinity> pitti: "changed api"?
[03:11] <infinity> pitti: Surely, you meant "abi"...
[03:11] <pitti> infinity: erm, yes, sorry
[03:11] <infinity> pitti: Anyhow, are we positive that's the only upload required?
[03:11] <pitti> infinity: I'll check the other ones in a minute
[03:11] <infinity> pitti: Thanks, dude.
[03:12] <mvo_> pitti: have you seen my last comment for bug #46338 ?
[03:12] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46338 in update-manager "language-support-en not installed any more" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46338
[03:12] <jsgotangco> _ion: topic
[03:13] <sivang> does anybody know posible return values for gnome_vfs_uri_get_scheme() ? gnome reference seems a bit out of date..
[03:13] <sivang> (one value is 'file', I wonder if there is a 'directory' one as well)
[03:13] <pitti> infinity: confirmed
[03:14] <_ion> jsgotangco: Oh, sorry, wrong channel.
[03:16] <ogra> hrm, ia32-libs is really broken here ...
[03:18] <ogra> is anybody working on bug #46285 ? (doko, infinity or Mithrandir perhaps ?)
[03:18] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46285 in ia32-libs "pre-installation of the package is trying overwrite '/usr/bin/ldd' with  `/usr/bin/ldd.amd64'" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46285
[03:19] <ogra> it breaks upgrades here completely
[03:19] <pitti> mvo_: oh, I see
[03:19] <infinity> ogra: It breaks on upgrade from dapper->dapper, you mean?  It works fine on breezy->dapper.
[03:19] <pitti> mvo_: I can do that change, no problem
[03:19] <infinity> ogra: But I think I can fix your broken dapper->dapper case at the same time, so no worries.
[03:19] <pitti> mvo_: hm, that's certainly an issue for other language-support-* as well?
[03:19] <ogra> infinity, yes, dapper (about 4 weeks outdated) -> dapper
[03:20] <mvo_> pitti: yes, I'm pretty sure it is
[03:20] <mvo_> pitti: if it is trivial to fix that would be good, if not, well 
[03:20] <pitti> mvo_: sure, I can fix it
[03:20] <mvo_> then we need  a different strategy
[03:20] <pitti> mvo_: it just doesn't look very nice
[03:20] <mvo_> pitti: the guy from the heise forum mailed me
[03:21] <pitti> and I don't understand why it's removed in the first place
[03:21] <infinity> ogra: /msg me the output of "dpkg -S /usr/bin/ldd" from that box.
[03:21] <infinity> ogra: If you haven't already fixed it, that is.
[03:21] <ogra> gah
[03:21] <siretart> ogra: the problem is that there shouldn't be the /usr/bin/ldd diversion. remove it by hand and upgrades work again
[03:21] <mvo_> pitti: but it is *very* mysterious, apprently the tool just vanishes, no excpetion, nothing
[03:21] <ogra> infinity, 5 seconds to late
[03:21] <infinity> Oh well, I think I know what it was anyway.
[03:21] <ogra> siretart, yes, i know
[03:21] <infinity> I'll fix it and test the fix in a bit.
[03:21] <siretart> ogra: it is very unclear for me where this diversion come from
[03:21] <pitti> mvo_: hm, that would mean the upgrade removes u-desktop, too?
[03:21] <infinity> siretart: It came from an old broken version.
[03:22] <siretart> ah,ok
[03:22] <infinity> siretart: Easy enough to solve, I just need to know where all the failure cases are. :)
[03:22] <mvo_> pitti: no, it always tries to ensure that u-d is installed (even when the dist-upgrade wants to remove it)
[03:22] <siretart> ah, great
[03:23] <tseng> ogra: it is.
[03:23] <ogra> argh
[03:23] <tseng> switch to a real theme
[03:23] <ogra> thats horrible
[03:23] <tseng> and it goes away
[03:24] <pitti> mvo_: hm, but u-m can't be installed without l-s-en...
[03:24] <ogra> tseng, well, i usually use edubuntu anyway, where we use a more beautiful distributor logo ;)
[03:24] <tseng> :)
[03:24] <ogra> just testing a ubuntu dapper upgrade
[03:25] <tseng> other icon themes use the old distributor logo
[03:25] <ogra> tseng, yep its in hicolor
[03:26] <mvo_> pitti: language-support-en is not a dependency on my system of ubuntu-desktop (or am I missing something?) (only ubuntu-live)
[03:26] <ogra> but i wonder who decided to make it *that* ugly ... even the 3d version was better
[03:26] <mdz> Riddell: I asked you to confirm when the kmplayer change was made originally, and I don't remember seeing your reply
[03:27] <pitti> mvo_: oh, oops, right
[03:27] <mdz> Riddell: I'm OK with the change if kmplayer is very well tested in this context
[03:27] <carlos> seb128: hi
[03:27] <carlos> seb128: around?
[03:27] <seb128> wb carlos
[03:27] <seb128> yep
[03:27] <carlos> so
[03:27] <mdz> Riddell: gtk-qt is fine
[03:27] <Riddell> mdz:   * Added profilerc to define video player priority between kaffeine
[03:27] <Riddell>     and kmplayer
[03:27] <Riddell>  -- Anthony Mercatante <tonio@ubuntu.com>  Mon, 27 Mar 2006 00:30:30 +0000
[03:28] <carlos> seb128: I saw that gaim has the same problem
[03:28] <carlos> seb128: and got the .po file from launchpad
[03:28] <carlos> and gaim's .po file lacks the .desktop msgid
[03:28] <Riddell> mdz: kmplayer is well tested
[03:28] <mdz> Riddell: both OK then
[03:28] <Riddell> mdz: one last patch, adding more translations to the .desktop files in kubuntu-docs http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/tmp/kubuntu-docs.diff
[03:29] <carlos> seb128: I wonder if the code that searchs the translation using gettext is falling back to the .desktop content if it gets the empty string....
[03:29] <seb128> carlos: no it doesn't
[03:29] <carlos> that's the problem then...
[03:29] <seb128> carlos: the issue is that the Name= is to the template but not the description then?
[03:30] <carlos> seb128: I'm going to check evolution now
[03:30] <seb128> carlos: could you fix the evolution template to list that string or do I need a package upload for that?
[03:30] <carlos> seb128: but gaim lacks all
[03:30] <seb128> carlos: I just checked
[03:30] <seb128> Name= is listed
[03:30] <seb128> but the Comments= is not
[03:30] <carlos> how's that possible?
[03:30] <carlos> seb128: send me a fixed .pot file and I will upload it by hand
[03:31] <seb128> carlos: the .desktop is a custom one, we use the same name as the official one but a different description
[03:31] <mdz> Riddell: fine
[03:31] <seb128> carlos: ok, doing that now
[03:31] <mdz> pretty soon though we are going to need to stop uploading
[03:31] <carlos> seb128: oh, I see
[03:31] <Riddell> thanks mdz, that should be the last uploads from me
[03:31] <carlos> seb128: anyway, the .pot regeneration should fix that
[03:32] <carlos> that's the idea of regenerate all .pot files...
[03:32] <mdz> *** if anyone has an approved upload which hasn't been uploaded yet, speak up
[03:32] <mdz> (apart from Riddell)
[03:32] <seb128> carlos: the .pot is generated, debian/evolution-mail.desktop is just not listed by po/POTFILES.in in that case
[03:33] <infinity> mdz: I need to upload ia32-libs one more time to fix another upgrade/diversion bug, and to refresh the stale debs in the source package.
[03:33] <infinity> mdz: I think that's the last thing on my list.
[03:34] <carlos> seb128: that's a bug then... could you fix it for edgy?
[03:34] <Riddell> infinity, doko: what's the status of ia32-libs-kde and qt?
[03:34] <infinity> Riddell: The hacked QT is building on a buildd right now.
[03:34] <seb128> carlos: I'll fix it to dapper-updates too yep
[03:34] <carlos> seb128: I guess gaim has the same problem too, right?
[03:34] <mdz> Riddell: you have kubuntu items on DapperReleaseRadar still; are those done now?
[03:34] <seb128> carlos: I didn't look at it yet but that's likely, I'll fix it too
[03:35] <carlos> seb128: about the code that looks for gettext translations
[03:35] <carlos> seb128: is the spec stating that we are not going to fallback to the ones inside the .desktop files?
[03:35] <mdz> dholbach: have you been able to reach mark regarding the icons?
[03:36] <Riddell> mdz: yes, I'll edit
[03:36] <Riddell> (yes, they are)
[03:36] <seb128> carlos: we do fallback, but I think that's the same call asking for Name and Description of the .desktop
[03:36] <seb128> carlos: we fallback if Name is not translated, but I don't think the case one was translated by gettext and not the other get considered
[03:36] <seb128> carlos: that's sort of a corner case
[03:37] <seb128> carlos: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/evolution-2.6.pot
[03:37] <seb128> carlos: could you upload it to rosetta now?
[03:37] <carlos> seb128: gaim is not getting name nor description translations for Spanish (and I guess any other language as we lack those strings)
[03:38] <carlos> seb128: but the .desktop file has the translations and I get them in English
[03:38] <seb128> carlos: because the Name translation is found to the .mo
[03:38] <seb128> carlos: and I don't think the code consider the case were Name and Description come from different code path
[03:39] <carlos> seb128: yes, I'm going to upload it, but until OO.org is done, it will not appear...
[03:39] <RicardoPerez> hi
[03:39] <seb128> carlos: if the .mo has no Name,Description it uses the .desktop
[03:39] <seb128> carlos: we are in the corner case where Name should come from gettext and Description from the .desktop
[03:39] <carlos> seb128: no, gaim doesn't have the Name inside the .mo file
[03:39] <carlos> seb128: that's evolution
[03:40] <mdz> pitti: status of final langpacks?
[03:40] <pitti> mdz: currently importing on rookery
[03:40] <pitti> ETA 1 hour, plus some time for testing
[03:41] <infinity> doko: chinstrap:~/adconrad/qt-hacked/
[03:41] <doko> infinity: thanks
[03:44] <carlos> doko: did you see my question about OO.org language packs ?
[03:44] <jdub> sabdfl: regarding bug #46801, this icon was never intended for us as a button unto itself - in fact, it's often rendered inside a small button, so it looks bizaare.
[03:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46801 in gedit "Bad close icon" [Unknown,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46801
[03:44] <jdub> s/us/use/
[03:44] <doko> carlos: when?
[03:45] <carlos> doko: two or three hours ago
[03:45] <carlos> doko: anyway, I can ask again ;-) Were you able to use the Rosetta's .po files I sent you ?
[03:47] <mdz> jdub: yes, that icon is terrible
[03:47] <pitti> mdz: wrt bug 46338, ok if I update l-support-* to have the alternative ... | openoffice.org2-l10n-XX dependency?
[03:47] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46338 in update-manager "language-support-en not installed any more" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46338
[03:48] <pitti> mdz: it's a hack, but a safe one, and we probably won't be able to fix the actual bug now (according to mvo)
[03:48] <mdz> pitti: yes
[03:48] <ogra> jdub, no comments on the distributor icon ? 
[03:48] <doko> carlos: sorry, don't see any mail from you; nor did I get .po files
[03:49] <carlos> hmmm
[03:50] <carlos> that's bad...
[03:50] <carlos> doko: do we have time to do an upload before release?
[03:50] <mdz> pitti: did you talk to Colin about getting final ubiquity translations from rosetta?
[03:51] <pitti> mdz: no, what would be my job for that?
[03:51] <mdz> pitti: only that you happened to speak to him earlier
[03:51] <pitti> mdz: he already pulls translations from rosetta regularly AFAICS
[03:51] <mdz> pitti: yes, but we need one more
[03:51] <doko> carlos: sure; these are translations only. so if mdz agrees ... where can I find the translations?
[03:51] <mdz> or at least it would be nice
[03:51] <mdz> jordi did ask for installer translations on friday
[03:52] <pitti> mdz: oh, I see; he told me that he is preparing an upload anyway
[03:52] <jdub> ogra: there's a bug already filed about that one. i'm tip-toeing over this minefield. :-)
[03:52] <pitti> mdz: I'm currently testing the fix for bug 47073, maybe Kamion wants to include it
[03:52] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47073 in ubiquity "does not offer to use physical drive when LVM partitions are present" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47073
[03:52] <pitti> mdz: I'll speak to him
[03:52] <ogra> jdub, did anybody notice that "about ubuntu" and "about gnome" both have different versions of the distributor logo in the menu entries ?
[03:53] <seb128> ogra: ubuntu has an ubuntu logo, GNOME a GNOME logo
[03:53] <ogra> jdub, hicolor has the flat variant replacing the icon for the gnome entry, human has the new one showing up in about ubuntu
[03:53] <ogra> seb128, not here on my freshly upgraded system
[03:53] <doko> carlos: are translations from packages, where the potfiles are desktop files, not imported to rosetta?
[03:53] <Who_> dholbach: Mark suggested one of the art team pop in to talk about theme packaging...
[03:53] <seb128> ogra: you have a GNOME foot for Ubuntu?
[03:54] <ogra> seb128, nope i have a flat ubuntu logo for gnome and a "buttonized" one for about ubuntu
[03:54] <carlos> doko: if the .desktop files are not using .pot templates to do translations, no we don't import them
[03:54] <jdub> weird
[03:54] <carlos> doko: ooo-build is using .pot/.po files
[03:54] <carlos> but you asked me to block those 
[03:54] <ogra> i think thats caused by having the flat one in hicolor
[03:54] <carlos> are we using them now?
[03:54] <seb128> ogra: what theme do you use?
[03:55] <ogra> seb128, human (it wasnt changed during upgrade)
[03:55] <seb128> ogra: gnome uses gnome-logo-icon-transparent, that's weird to have an Ubuntu logo for that one
[03:55] <z_diver> Who_: Hi, are you going to stick around and see if you can locate Daniel?
[03:55] <ogra> seb128, yep
[03:55] <ogra> thats why i mention it here
[03:55] <seb128> ogra: what version of ubuntu-artwork do you have?
[03:55] <seb128> ogra: I don't have that on my box, nor on my laptop when I did installations on it
[03:55] <carlos> doko: I think the problem is that I sent the tarball by email... I need to regenerate the tarball with the .po files
[03:56] <mdz> I get the GNOME foot for GNOME, and the horrible buttonlike Ubuntu logo for Ubuntu
[03:56] <carlos> doko: let me prepare it and I will send you the URL
[03:56] <ogra> seb128, 27
[03:56] <Who_> z_diver: yea, for half an hour
[03:56] <seb128> mdz: same for me
[03:56] <carlos> doko: will Esperanto and Kurdish work? those are new languages
[03:56] <jdub> i switched to tango, so i get a normal ubuntu logo ;)
[03:56] <doko> carlos: maybe emails for some size are not accepted in the data center? elmo?
[03:56] <ogra> mdke, seb128, but i just noticed there are some packages missing, due to the ia32 upgrade bug apparently let me run another dist-upgrade
[03:56] <seb128> $ dpkg -L ubuntu-artwork | grep transparent
[03:56] <seb128> $
[03:56] <mantas_> pitti, sorry for disturbing, but it would be nice to know how many hours are left until you will start generating of new langpacks ?
[03:56] <carlos> doko: well, those are huge
[03:56] <dholbach> Who_: theme packaging as in moving stuff into the appropriate directories?
[03:57] <z_diver> Who_: OK, well I'm going to be taking off.  I'll check back when I can.  Feel free to email me if you guys want me to test anythign.
[03:57] <carlos> doko: so it was my fault
[03:57] <ogra> s/ia32/ia32-libs
[03:57] <seb128> ogra: no gnome-logo-icon-transparent shipped by ubuntu-artwork
[03:57] <doko> carlos: kurdish is already in
[03:57] <carlos> doko: I should not send emails bigger than 2-5 MB
[03:57] <doko> 
[03:57] <carlos> doko: ok
[03:57] <pitti> mantas_: they are already building on people.ubuntu.com; I'll broadcast a call for testing when they are done
[03:57] <seb128> mantas_: I think they are being generated already
[03:57] <ogra> seb128, wait, let me pull the missing packages ... 
[03:57] <doko> carlos: could you just put the tarball at some place?
[03:57] <Who_> dholbach: I think mark just wanted one of us around to be quizzed in case you were unsure about anything
[03:58] <mantas_> Hehe, Lithuanian XFCE translation isn't complete, so, I told to XFCE translators, that they have few hours ... ;)
[03:58] <ogra> if NM gets my network up again :(
[03:58] <dholbach> Who_: no, the clue about all the stuff in one directory helped - thanks. I'll fix with next upload.
[03:58] <z_diver> dholbach: Do you know what caused the flat dirctories.?
[03:58] <jdub> dholbach: might be good to change their default background layout to zoom
[03:58] <dholbach> z_diver: yes
[03:58] <seb128> mantas_: translations are never wasted anyway, you will get language-pack update to dapper-updates too
[03:58] <dholbach> jdub: i'll do that
[03:59] <ogra> grmbl... no NM for me anymore *cry*
[03:59] <carlos> doko: yes, that's what I'm going to do
[03:59] <mantas_> seb128, I know, but DVD iso images aren't regenerated, so, people, who don't have internet connection will use translations, which were at release time
[03:59] <carlos> doko: I'm getting new uploads to use latest information
[03:59] <seb128> mantas_: that is right too
[03:59] <carlos> s/information/translations/
[04:00] <Who_> dholbach: well if you have any questions I'll be around - did you get the LegacyHuman package?
[04:00] <z_diver> dholbach: good.  I'll be available to test a little later today.  Thanks for everything.
[04:00] <dholbach> Who_: no didn't get the package - hope it's not big - everybody has grey hair about cd size already
[04:00] <dholbach> z_diver: cool
[04:01] <Riddell> ogra: why no NM?
[04:01] <ogra> Riddell, dunno, doesnt work after my last upgrade
[04:01] <Who_> it's 6k :)
[04:02] <Who_> dholbach: should be in your inbox now (6k)
[04:02] <ogra> dholbach, you'll get used to the grey hair, belive me :)
[04:02] <dholbach> Who_: thanks
[04:03] <dholbach> ogra: yeah, in twenty years, but not now :)
[04:03] <ogra> dholbach, haha, wanna care for edubuntu CDs for 2 weeks ? then you are prepared for the "in twenty years" case ;)
[04:05] <dholbach> ogra: no, trust me...
[04:05] <pkern> Is there any documentation how to activate suspend on a powerpc machine on Dapper?
[04:05] <pkern> I did not find any, and all the ways that state to activate it are silent about the fact that this is "not for powerpc"(tm).
[04:05] <ogra> pkern, works here out of the box (G4 ibook)
[04:05] <pitti> pkern: argh, it seems that a recent gnome-power-manager broke that; in earlier versions it just worked
[04:05] <pkern> ogra: I just made a clean install and it did not work. G4 ibook too.
[04:05] <Who_> dholbach: that 6k size is only if the gtk2-engines-clearlooks package is on the CD already - which I assume it is...
[04:05] <pitti> ogra: not here any more
[04:06] <ogra> oh
[04:06] <dholbach> Who_: urg
[04:06] <pitti> ogra: it worked with my old ~, but not with a fresh user
[04:06] <ogra> i'm not up to date on my ibook, sorry
[04:06] <tseng> dholbach: btw
[04:06] <dholbach> Who_: doesn't that conflict with ubuntulooks - I think so
[04:06] <tseng> dholbach: most of the new themes in ubuntu-art are broken for me
[04:06] <Who_> dholbach: I have them both installed here - themes work fine
[04:06] <tseng> dholbach: like they are missing an engine
[04:07] <tseng> dholbach: they show up as the default ugly win9x theme
[04:07] <dholbach> tseng: I know
[04:07] <dholbach> tseng: next upload
[04:07] <tseng> dholbach: ok, hugs
[04:07] <pkern> pitti: Will it be fixed in dapper-release? ;)
[04:07] <dholbach> Who_: so that means having a new dependency there
[04:07] <doko> mvo: java ping
[04:07] <dholbach> Who_: i'm not so fond of that :-/
[04:07] <pitti> pkern: I doubt; dapper-updates maybe; can you please look for/file a bug?
[04:07] <pkern> pitti: Will do.
[04:07] <mvo> doko: tee pong
[04:07] <Who_> dholbach: I guess it does - but I'm new to this stuff :)
[04:09] <Who_> dholbach: all the themes no using ubuntulooks need a dependency...Currently it looks to me like we only depend on ubuntulooks
[04:09] <dholbach> Who_: seems that ubuntu-desktop depends on it already
[04:09] <Kamion> mdz: the patch I was talking about is in a comment on bug 47073
[04:09] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47073 in ubiquity "does not offer to use physical drive when LVM partitions are present" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47073
[04:09] <dholbach> Who_: arg - which other ones do we need?
[04:09] <Kamion> pitti: any luck on testing that?
[04:10] <Who_> dholbach:OK, I'm just checking
[04:10] <doko> I'm looking at various reports claiming that sun-java5-bin cannot be installed using espresso and apt-get; didn't check espresso, but apt-get works for me, even for a new installation. See bug 46096, bug 47273
[04:10] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46096 in sun-java5 "Apt will not install j2re1.4 on an espresso install" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46096
[04:10] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47273 in sun-java5 "Installation of sun-java5-jre fails on clean system" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47273
[04:10] <pitti> Kamion: I'm right on it; the lvm alternate install succeeded, now I want to start ubiquity
[04:10] <Kamion> doko: it breaks in noninteractive mode
[04:10] <pitti> Kamion: however, clicking on the icon suddenly doesn't work for me *boggle*
[04:10] <mdz> pitti: I just called Kamion about that; he's fixing
[04:10] <mdz> it's a syntax error in /usr/bin/ubiquity
[04:11] <z_diver> dholbach: I noticed nuoveXT icon set didn't get in there today.
[04:11] <Kamion> doko: it's really a bug in the live filesystem generation, that debconf/frontend gets left as noninteractive; I believe Adam fixed that last night
[04:11] <pitti> mdz: ah, I see; I fix it manually
[04:11] <dholbach> z_diver: let's take this to ubuntu-art
[04:11] <doko> Kamion: sure, so should I just print an error message to stderr, when noninteractive is selected?
[04:11] <Kamion> doko: yes
[04:11] <Kamion> doko: but don't manually look for noninteractive
[04:11] <Kamion> doko: print an error message if db_input returns non-zero
[04:11] <doko> ok, thanks
[04:12] <Kamion> I think I commented as such on one of the sun-java5 bugs
[04:12] <dholbach> z_diver: could you join?
[04:12] <z_diver> dholbach: sure, is it on FreeNode?
[04:12] <Kamion> (because somebody assigned it to debconf)
[04:12] <dholbach> z_diver: yes
[04:12] <Who_> dholbach: Fray needs gtk2-engines-pixbuf (which I couldn't see in ubuntu-desktop). IndustrialXT needs nothing not already there (Industrial Engine is in Ubuntu-desktop) and the othere need Ubuntulooks or Smooth - which is included in Ubuntu-Desktop)
[04:12] <z_diver> dholbach: not finding it.
[04:13] <dholbach> z_diver: /j #ubuntu-art
[04:13] <pitti> mvo: ok, I fixed all the l-support-* for OO.o[2] 
[04:13] <dholbach> Who_: let's take it to #ubuntu-art
[04:13] <mdz> pitti: what did you and seb128 decide about poppler?
[04:13] <Who_> dholbach: That would be Gray that needs pixbuf
[04:13] <pitti> mdz: I just rebuilt tetex-bin, which should fix the issue
[04:13] <seb128> mdz: we rebuilt tetex-bin
[04:13] <pitti> mdz: all other packages have been built against the current poppler (I checked)
[04:13] <pitti> mdz: IMHO safer than reverting the patch now
[04:13] <pitti> and rebuilding 4 other packages
[04:14] <mdz> ok
[04:14] <seb128> mdz: upstream took the patch and infinity asked to the Debian maintainer to apply the same, so be stay binary compatible with Debian (and upstream will probably change their soname with next version)
[04:14] <Riddell> mdke: kubuntu-docs uploaded with translated .desktops, thanks
[04:14] <pkern> pitti: But I guess you don't have any hint how to get g-p-m to notice the possibility of sleeping?
[04:14] <pkern> pitti: The bug report is filed.
[04:14] <pitti> pkern: Kinnison should know, but he's not online
[04:14] <pitti> pkern: thanks
[04:15] <mvo> pitti: \o/
[04:15] <Kamion> ubiquity syntax error fixed in bzr
[04:16] <seb128> pkern: what do you mean by "notice"?
[04:16] <seb128> pkern: force it to show you the option?
[04:16] <pkern> seb128: Well... in a way, yes. On !powerpc it checks acpi-support, which I don't have.
[04:17] <pkern> seb128: But I do not even get suspend on lid close, just screen locking. (Which is bad because the PMU will force a suspend after a certain amount of time.)
[04:17] <seb128> pkern: ok, I know there is a /apps/gnome-power-manager/can_suspend gconf-key, but dunno if that's from any use for you
[04:17] <pitti> bah, since when do we have psychedelic colorful buttons again on ppc? *grr*
[04:17] <seb128> probably not
[04:17] <seb128> pitti: I just marked like 10 duplicates of the bug
[04:17] <pkern> seb128: can_hiberate is toggled, but not shown in the dialog o_O
[04:17] <seb128> pitti: you use ati driver right?
[04:17] <pitti> seb128: right
[04:17] <pitti> seb128: still remember the issue I had in London? that was fixed ages ago, and now it's back
[04:18] <seb128> pkern: so g-p-m probably thinks that's not possible, dunno then
[04:18] <seb128> pitti: weird it was fixed
[04:18] <pkern> seb128: Well, suspend is shown in the menu now, thanks.
[04:18] <pkern> seb128: Got to try it now ;)
[04:18] <pitti> seb128: didn't have a problem for months, and now it reappeared some days ago
[04:18] <seb128> pitti: it's a common cairo/xrender issue on ati it looks like, we keep getting duplicates and we didn't fix anything for it afaik
[04:18] <mvo> doko: I was not able to reproduce this either, it works for me from apt and gnome-app-install
[04:19] <seb128> pitti: the best you can do is probably to use a non-cairo based theme (ie: anything but Human)
[04:19] <pkern> seb128: Well, a bubble says "Your computer failed to suspend", but it worked just fine.
[04:19] <pkern> seb128: Network, display and input devices all work well. So thanks a lot. (:
[04:20] <seb128> np
[04:22] <ogra> seb128, mdz, now fully upgraded: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/shot1.png
[04:22] <sivang> seb128: I have a patch for malone #39482 , do you think it can be uploaded if some folks give it testing on some off-archive debs?
[04:22] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39482 in nautilus "nautilus tries to move when dragging and dropping from read-only folders, instead of copying" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/39482
[04:23] <pitti> Kamion: yay, the 'use whole disk' selector works fine with your patch, and installation is running now
[04:23] <seb128> sivang: to dapper-updates probably
[04:23] <pitti> Kamion: I'll report to the bug when the installation actually finished
[04:23] <ogra> and NM still doesnt work (it did before the upgrade)
[04:23] <seb128> sivang: where is the patch?
[04:24] <sivang> seb128: do you prefer to see debdiff attached to the bug report , as I can also prepare source pkgs
[04:24] <Kamion> pitti: great, thanks
[04:24] <Kamion> mdz: ok to upload that partman-auto patch, then?
[04:24] <seb128> ogra: cd /usr/share/icons && find . -name "*gnome-logo-icon-transparent*" ?
[04:24] <seb128> sivang: the diff to start with
[04:24] <pitti> Kamion: hm, now it failed with 'Erzeugen eines Dateisystems fehlgeschlagen' (creation of fs failed)
[04:25] <Kamion> pitti: gar. logs?
[04:25] <pitti> Kamion: while creating /dev/hda3 fs for /
[04:25] <sivang> seb128: k, I will attached it to the bug report for your convinience :-)
[04:25] <Kamion> pitti: may still need ''vgchange -a n
[04:25] <Kamion> er
[04:25] <Kamion> 'vgchange -a n'
[04:25] <seb128> sivang: good
[04:25] <mdz> Kamion: has it been tested?
[04:25] <Kamion> pitti: but let's have the logs and I'll check
[04:25] <pitti> Kamion: /var/log/partman.log?
[04:25] <Kamion> pitti: /var/log/partman and /var/log/installer/syslog please
[04:25] <ogra> seb128, its in human, gartoon, and the a11y themes
[04:25] <mdz> Kamion: it doesn't fall under my preferred "obviously correct without context" criterion
[04:26] <seb128> ogra: I blame gartoon then
[04:26] <mdz> Kamion: can you explain the fix to me?
[04:26] <Kamion> mdz: see conversation with pitti, I'll wait until we've checked out his current problem
[04:26] <seb128> ogra: open the gartoon one?
[04:26] <Kamion> mdz: certainly
[04:26] <ogra> seb128, how should that influence anything, i dont use gartoon anywhere
[04:26] <jsgotangco> woo language upload
[04:26] <Kamion> mdz: if there is only one disk available, partman-auto skips the disk selector so that you don't get a dialog with only one sensible option
[04:27] <Kamion> mdz: we exclude /dev/mapper/*-* from the disk selector, because it doesn't make sense to offer logical volumes there (you can't partition them)
[04:27] <ogra> seb128, thats the gartoon gnome foot (a blue comic one)
[04:27] <pitti> Kamion: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/
[04:27] <seb128> ogra: is one of those matching the icon you see for the menu item?
[04:27] <ogra> seb128, and Human/48x48 shows the one from the menu
[04:28] <Kamion> mdz: the script responsible for the disk selector was erroneously picking the first option from the list of devices available in the event that only one disk is available, without excluding /dev/mapper/*-*
[04:28] <ogra> seb128, nope, gartoon isnt in any of my menus
[04:28] <Kamion> mdz: so, if only one (actual) disk is available and there are also LVM volumes around, it might well pick a logical volume instead of the first real disk
[04:28] <seb128> ogra: Human ships an gnome-logo-icon-transparent.png for you?
[04:28] <Kamion> the only real disk, that is
[04:28] <ogra> seb128, just dpkg -S ing here
[04:29] <carlos> pitti: we got 8000 new translations since yesterday language pack
[04:29] <pitti> Kamion: I can do another one with verbose logging
[04:29] <Kamion> the fix just keeps track of the first real disk and chooses that in the event that only one real disk is available
[04:29] <pitti> carlos: wow
[04:29] <mdz> Kamion: ok, makes sense
[04:29] <ogra> seb128, hmm, nope, i wonder wher that comes from then ... 
[04:29] <seb128> ogra: ok, it would have been weird
[04:29] <ogra> no idea wher that comes from :/
[04:29] <mjg59> mdz: gnome-power-manager needs to unconditionally enable suspend for PPC
[04:30] <Kamion> pitti: strange, I can't find any actual error in there; yes please, verbose logging would be great
[04:30] <mdz> mjg59: hey what to who now?
[04:30] <pitti> mjg59: that must be a gconf issue, right? because it worked with my old /home directory, but not with a fresh user
[04:30] <mjg59> pitti: Indeed
[04:30] <ogra> seb128, sorry for the chaos ...
[04:30] <seb128> ogra: np, but is that a new install from the current CD ?
[04:30] <ogra> nope, my upgraded hoary
[04:31] <seb128> ogra: ie: is that likely to be something on the CD that created it?
[04:31] <mjg59> mdz: Whether or not suspend is available is controlled via a gconf key, which always ought to be true for PPC (but currently isn't)
[04:31] <seb128> ah, ok
[04:31] <carlos> pitti: and 24331 since Friday
[04:31] <ogra> hoary->breezy->dapper
[04:31] <mjg59> mdz: Can I show you a patch in an hour or so?
[04:31] <seb128> ogra: you probably played some time ago to change the panel logo
[04:31] <ogra> seb128, must have been long ago since i dont remember it at all
[04:31] <seb128> ogra: that icon used to be the panel emblem for hoary
[04:31] <sivang> seb128: patch attached to bug report, now I have a train to catch, /me runs
[04:31] <ogra> but well, its the only explanation:)
[04:31] <seb128> later sivang
[04:31] <seb128> ogra: right
[04:32] <sivang> laters folks
[04:32] <carlos> doko: hmm I think the impress' .pot and .po files are not being generated
[04:33] <infinity> mdz: Ready to wrap your mind around some HideousHacks(tm)?
[04:33] <ogra> btw, will we get a saner distributor logo or will we have to live with the "stolen from osX aqua" one ?
[04:33] <infinity> mdz: HideousHacks, AKA "Why most people should never use diversions, cause fixing misuse sucks"
[04:33] <ogra> this buttonish border looks scary :)
[04:34] <pitti> ogra++
[04:34] <seb128> ogra: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-artwork/+bug/47260
[04:34] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47260 in ubuntu-artwork "Distributor icon is ugly" [Normal,Confirmed]  
[04:34] <seb128> comment on it
[04:34] <ogra> hehe
[04:34] <ogra> will do :)
[04:34] <pitti> the doc team already complained about breaking screenshots all over
[04:34] <ogra> i neither didnt like the one before, but that looked a lot better
[04:35] <mdz> infinity: the only reasonable fix for diversions bugs is to remove the use of diversions entirely
[04:35] <infinity> mdz: Heh.
[04:35] <infinity> mdz: Seeing this debdiff will likely solidify that opinion for you.
[04:36] <pvanhoof> eeeeeeeeek. what is that border around the ubuntu logo
[04:36] <infinity> mdz: http://cerberus.0c3.net/~adconrad/ia32-libs.diff
[04:36] <infinity> seb128: Commented.
[04:36] <jsgotangco> pvanhoof: amen
[04:37] <mdz> why does it seem like all reporters of Kubuntu ubiquity bugs flag them as security-related for no apparent reason?
[04:37] <infinity> mdz: The ia64 bit in preinst comes froms somewhere along the way, the diversion being randomly renamed from ldd.amd64 to ldd.ia32-libs, so now there's a mix of both in the wild.
[04:38] <fabbione> mdz: because they are special?
[04:38] <fabbione> the bugs i mean .. of course..
[04:38] <infinity> mdz: The postinst ugliness comes from past failed attempts at removing diversions, so some machines ended up with a parentless /usr/bin/ldd for no sane reason.
[04:38] <pitti> Kamion: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/ *.verbose
[04:38] <infinity> mdz: It's all very scary.
[04:38] <infinity> mdz: But appears to be correct, and was tested on amd64 and ia64, breezy and dapper chroots.
[04:38] <pitti> Kamion: exactly the same error after restarting ubiquity with verbosity (although the partition table was already updated in the first run)
[04:40] <hunger> What are my chances to see suspend working in dapper as well as it did in breezy?
[04:40] <infinity> hunger: If it's not currently, then "about nil".
[04:40] <doko> Kamion: in the installer: did the console mode (frame buffer / vga) did change in dapper (compared to breezy)?
[04:40] <infinity> hunger: We're going to close the gates for uploads completely very shortly.
[04:41] <hunger> infinity: I feared that:-(
[04:41] <Kamion> doko: it's 640x400 now
[04:41] <Kamion> (vga16fb change in kernel)
[04:41] <hunger> infinity: Well, I guess I'll have to install breezy again then:-(
[04:42] <Kamion> pitti: oh, can you get /var/log/syslog too? I think the actual error may have landed there
[04:42] <Kamion> I need to consolidate that post-dapper, the current situation is a mess
[04:42] <fabbione> Kamion: can you confirm we don't have LAMP on dvd? (powerpc)
[04:42] <infinity> doko: We changed the framebuffer to work a bit better for 5% of people, which made it worse for 1%... Are you in the 1% that got shafted?
[04:42] <Kamion> fabbione: correct
[04:43] <fabbione> Kamion: ok thanks.
[04:43] <Kamion> fabbione: given a bit more time, it would be fixable, but ...
[04:43] <Kamion> (ENOTIME)
[04:43] <pitti> Kamion: indeed -- 'could not stat /dev/hda3 -- no such file or directory'; I'll send you the full log
[04:43] <Kamion> pitti: whoa, oddness
[04:43] <doko> infinity: no, see bug 47283
[04:43] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47283 in bash "Strange Resolution in Shell" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47283
[04:43] <fabbione> Kamion: i think we can live without.. thanks
[04:44] <pitti> Kamion: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/var_log_syslog
[04:44] <pitti> Kamion: Indeed I have /dev/hda[124] , but not 3
[04:44] <infinity> doko: 80x25 is "strange" now? :)
[04:44] <Kamion> pitti: 403
[04:44] <pitti> Kamion: it seems udev needs to be poked after recreating partitions or so?
[04:44] <Kamion> we do poke udev though, I think ...
[04:44] <pitti> Kamion: sorry, fixed
[04:44] <Kamion> do you have /bin/update-dev?
[04:45] <pitti> yes, I have
[04:45] <infinity> doko: I guess he got used to the non-standard 80x30 that the 640x480 console gave him.  He also needs to adjust his monitor to show the whole image, which might help.
[04:45] <infinity> doko: Very much a Rejected bug waiting to happen. :)
[04:46] <doko> infinity: already done :)
[04:46] <infinity> mdz: Comments on the ia32-libs scariness, or do you just want me to upload it without you looking, so you don't have to vomit?
[04:47] <fabbione> infinity: he is busy atm...
[04:47] <infinity> fabbione: Ahh.
[04:47] <infinity> Are you his new scecretary? :)
[04:47] <infinity> secretary, too.
[04:47] <fabbione> infinity: no,  but i can 
[04:47] <fabbione> infinity: no,  but i can watch him moving around the office
[04:49] <Kamion> pitti: I must say, I can't say I understand this
[04:49] <carlos> mdz: Hi, When will be open edgy in launchpad?
[04:49] <infinity> Did I promise anyone anything today that I haven't yet done (other than ia32-libs)?  I'm starting to lose track of my own body parts.
[04:50] <Kamion> pitti: particularly given that that partition allegedly exists on boot, according to the syslog
[04:50] <fabbione> infinity: to fill up my bank account?
[04:50] <Kamion> so I blame, er, well, no idea
[04:50] <infinity> carlos: When soyuz is ready for us.
[04:50] <pitti> Kamion: fdisk -l /dev/hda3 also prints it
[04:50] <pitti> Kamion: I just called /bin/update-dev manually, doesn't help
[04:51] <carlos> infinity: so you need some code changes first?
[04:51] <infinity> carlos: No, we just need to get the distribution created, make sure it works, etc.
[04:51] <Kamion> pitti: what's in /sys/block/hda?
[04:51] <carlos> so that means this week or next one...
[04:51] <infinity> carlos: Other than the fact that we'll all be exhausted, I suspect that a couple of hours between cprov and I will be all that it takes to make it go.
[04:51] <carlos> hmm, I'm being late then to get translations in place too
[04:51] <pitti> Kamion: hda[124] , no 3
[04:52] <Kamion> pitti: then your kernel is interestingly confused
[04:52] <pitti> Kamion: vgchange -a n doesn't help either
[04:52] <carlos> infinity: please, tell me if you agree on a date for it
[04:52] <infinity> carlos: "Any time after June 1" :)
[04:52] <carlos> ;-)
[04:52] <carlos> ok
[04:52] <infinity> carlos: Some of the devs will be itching to upload ASAP, so the faster we can get going on the infrastructure side, the better.
[04:53] <pitti> Kamion: ok, let's debug that at a later point then? it seems unrelated to the partman patch I tried
[04:53] <Kamion> pitti: I think so, yeah
[04:53] <carlos> infinity: yeah, I will try to get it in place in time, if I'm late... I will execute it by hand and put it in place for edgy + 1
[04:54] <Kamion> I've uploaded the partman-auto patch
[04:54] <pitti> unless you need anything further
[04:54] <Kamion> pitti: nope, thanks
[04:55] <pitti> Kamion: I file a bug with what we have, as a reminder
[04:55] <Kamion> thep: there's way too much hardcoded in kbd-chooser, sigh - I didn't realise that the *.syms.h files were copied in there too
[04:55] <Kamion> not fixable before dapper, but fixable after
[04:55] <Kamion> pitti: thanks
[04:56] <mdz> infinity: can you upload an ia32-libs with only the new packages so that we can consider this more substantial change separately?
[04:56] <mdz> carlos: some time after dapper is released
[04:56] <infinity> mdz: Yeah.
[04:57] <mdz> infinity: what is the bug it is fixing?
[04:57] <mdz> is there a report open?
[04:57] <ogra> mdz, amd64 dapper->dapper upgrades fail completely on ia32-libs
[04:57] <thep> Kamion, OK. Will wait till post-dapper.
[04:57] <Kamion> sorry it wasn't spotted earlier, again
[04:57] <infinity> mdz: Some reported, some not.  Upgrades from several intermediate dapper versions are broken on amd64.  Upgrades from breezy to dapper are broken on ia64, fresh installs on ia64 are currently broken.
[04:58] <Kamion> thep: ubiquity *might* manage to work (possibly by accident), not sure
[04:58] <infinity> mdz: The failure cases are explained above in my ramblings to you to explain the changes.
[04:58] <thep> Kamion, you mean another installer?
[04:58] <Kamion> thep: the desktop CD installer
[04:58] <Kamion> it does use kbd-chooser under the hood though, so my guess is that it will also fail
[04:59] <mdz> infinity: why does breezy->dapper break on ia64 but not amd64?
[04:59] <mdz> I must admit, I am not very sympathetic toward ia64 at this juncture
[04:59] <thep> Kamion, it's another installer than espresso?
[04:59] <infinity> mdz: Because ia64 still ships a divers, amd64 doesn't, and somewhere along the way, someone decided to rename that divers from ldd.amd64 to ldd.ia32-libs.
[04:59] <mdz> doko: what do you mean by this?
[05:00] <mdz>    * Build using qt-x11-free_3.3.6-1ubuntu5, entering the archive in
[05:00] <mdz>      dapper-updates.
[05:00] <infinity> mdz: So, we can either break all dapper->dapper upgrades by forcing it to be ldd.amd64, or break breezy->dapper by forcing it to be ldd.ia32-libs, or employ the hack I added in that preinst to normalise it.
[05:00] <Kamion> thep: espresso is called ubiquity now
[05:00] <thep> Kamion, i see
[05:00] <doko> mdz: the qt-x11-free_3.3.6-1ubuntu5 is not yet in the archive, but built by hand on a clean environment. 
[05:01] <infinity> mdz: Anyhow, the ia64 code is all if-guarded anyway, so it's a "for-free" change while fixing the amd64 stuff and updating the binaries.
[05:01] <mdz> doko: the one that I said should wait until after release?
[05:01] <doko> we did agree to upload the qt-x11-free_3.3.6-1ubuntu5 to dapper-updates, didn't we?
[05:01] <doko> correct
[05:01] <mdz> doko: dapper-updates, NOT dapper
[05:01] <pitti> argh
[05:01] <Kamion> right, 1600, time to download translations
[05:01] <ogra> wasnt that fixed ?`
[05:01] <ogra> Keybuk poked on it a lot
[05:01] <doko> mdz: I'm confused; you did OK ia32-libs-kde
[05:02] <pitti> ogra: ISTR reading a pbbuttonsd changelog entry, but it's still started on ppc/live
[05:02] <ogra> bah
[05:02] <mdz> doko: please revert
[05:03] <mdz> doko: if this is what you meant, I misunderstood you
[05:05] <doko> mdz: well, yes, that was a misunderstanding. 
[05:05] <pitti> carlos: now that we have all domains that the buildd tarballs have, can we be sure to have all PO files as well?
[05:05] <pitti> carlos: i. e. can I drop the tarball merging?
[05:06] <Kamion> hmm, I have several ubiquity bugs which I think are due to people not reformatting the root file system
[05:06] <carlos> pitti: I think so, yes, the only ones that we would be missing are the ones that failed
[05:06] <carlos> pitti: and we have that list already
[05:06] <infinity> pitti: Drop tarball merging?  Does that mean I can stop publishing them and remove apache from the buildds? *excited look*
[05:06] <Kamion> I think I'll worry about those after dapper, unless anyone radically objects ...
[05:06] <doko> mdz: do we really need to revert that? it's a local change only affecting kubuntu on amd64, tested by Riddell and me. The rationale of this was having one less abort for OOo
[05:06] <pitti> carlos: 'the ones that failed' -> is that yes or no?
[05:07] <carlos> pitti: I have those entries available from launchpad.net/rosetta/imports
[05:07] <carlos> pitti: so I guess the answer is 'yes'
[05:07] <pitti> carlos: failed because they are broken, or because importing them doesn't work?
[05:07] <carlos> pitti: most of them, because the files are broken
[05:07] <pitti> carlos: in the former case, shipping them in the langpacks doesn't make sense anyway
[05:08] <carlos> pitti: I guess a couple are due rosetta bugs, and from time to time, I review them
[05:08] <carlos> pitti: don't worry, I will reduce that list to zero so any missing translation will appear in next language pack
[05:10] <pitti> carlos: great
[05:10] <Kamion> is Rosetta still stalled doing the OOo import?
[05:11] <infinity> mdz: I can do a much smaller patch that doesn't worry about upgrade breakage at all, but at least makes ia64 installable from scratch (that's just an if guard around one statement, instead of the gobs of scary in the previous diff)
[05:11] <Kamion> it seems to be taking longer than usual to do a couple of translation exports
[05:11] <infinity> mdz: While I'd prefer to sort all the upgrade bugs, I can see the argument for just leaving it saying "oh well, good enough for most users"
[05:12] <carlos> Kamion: 320 .po files to go
[05:12] <seb128> carlos: did you update the evolution template? do you know when the change will be applied?
[05:12] <Kamion> carlos: any rough ETA?
[05:12] <carlos> Kamion: oh, the export thing is unrelated
[05:12] <mdz> doko: I said that the change should go to dapper-updates, not that it should go in dapper for kubuntu/amd64
[05:12] <mdz> infinity: this smells like dapper-updates to me
[05:12] <carlos> Kamion: I'm doing full exports of OO.org to generate language packs, but should be much faster as I got already most of them
[05:13] <carlos> Kamion: you should get your request in 10 - 15 minutes, don't think it would take much more
[05:13] <carlos> but the imports don't block the exports
[05:14] <carlos> so those are unrelated
[05:16] <Kamion> carlos: ok, thanks
[05:16] <Kamion> ah yes, there's one of them now
[05:16] <seb128> carlos: and about my question? :)
[05:17] <doko> mdz: my understanding was, that the qt-x11-free upload should go to dapper-updates and the ia32-libs-kde upload to dapper; therefore the followup discussion with infinity how to provide the qt-x11-free packages included in ia32-libs-kde. I think we would be better with working qt widgets and scim on kubuntu-amd64, but preparing the upload now.
[05:18] <infinity> mdz: Here's what I'm talking about.  If I ignore all the possible upgrade snafus addressed by the scary patch (and leave those for -updates), this will at least make the ia32-libs on the ia64 ISO installable.
[05:18] <infinity> mdz: http://cerberus.0c3.net/~adconrad/ia32-libs.diff2
[05:18] <mdz> doko: you showed me a diff
[05:18] <mdz> http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/ooo-amd64/ia32-libs-kde.diff
[05:18] <carlos> seb128: the evolution template is blocked by OOO imports
[05:18] <mdz> doko: but that is not what you uploaded
[05:19] <pitti> mantas_, seb128, Riddell, carlos: new daily language packs ready for testing. Please upgrade to them and report any issues you might find (final candidates)
[05:19] <carlos> seb128: I don't think it will be imported until tomorrow
[05:19] <seb128> pitti: ok, will do
[05:19] <seb128> carlos: ok, then dapper will have that bug, no big deal that's a detail
[05:19] <danimo> crimsun: ping?
[05:19] <carlos> seb128: well, dapper will have it anyway, final language packs are already done
[05:20] <carlos> seb128: even before you gave me the fixed .pot file
[05:20] <seb128> carlos: right
[05:22] <mdz> infinity: ok, you have a deal
[05:22] <infinity> mdz: Danke.  I'll pester you for the other change on June 2nd. :P
[05:22] <mdz> doko: this doesn't affect the CDs and we can look at it after release; it's not a trivial change by any means
[05:22] <infinity> (Or I'll forget about it and won't care in a month)
[05:22] <mdz> infinity: perhaps both of the ia64 users will remind you
[05:23] <infinity> mdz: well, it affects OOo working properly on the kubuntu/amd64 livecd.  That's about it.
[05:23] <danimo> crimsun: unping
[05:23] <infinity> mdz: I suspect that after we made a lot of noise about Ubuntu and KDE, saving face with livecds that work well might be worth it.
[05:23] <mdz> infinity: no, it just means it doesn't get the KDE file dialog
[05:23] <mdz> right?
[05:23] <infinity> mdz: Note that the change is localised to ia32-libs-kde, which is broken anyway.
[05:24] <infinity> mdz: Riddell would have to confirm that.  I'd understood it as "the dialogs are completely broken", but I've not actually looked.
[05:24] <mdz> infinity: the KDE dialog is broken; Riddell unseeded oo.o-kde to work around that.  it works.
[05:25] <mdz> and we're not going to revert that change in favor of this one
[05:25] <infinity> Ahh, well.  If it works perfectly well otherwise, then screw it.
[05:25] <mdz> that would be exchanging a simple and safe fix for a complex and risky one
[05:25] <infinity> But getting this in -updates ASAP for breezy->dapper upgraders would be nice.
[05:25] <infinity> Cause they'll have OOo-kde installed, and it'll break.
[05:26] <mdz> it's already broken
[05:27] <mdz> and apparently has been for some time
[05:27] <infinity> I understood that it worked in breezy.
[05:27] <infinity> Then broke early in dapper.
[05:27] <infinity> So people jumping from breezy to dapper will watch it regress.
[05:28] <infinity> Achwell.  I'd rather go bikeshed about the ugly icon on my panel anyway.
[05:28] <infinity> It's not the end of the world if this gets fixed post-release, it's just unfortunate that the livecd will lack the shininess of a pseudo-integrated OOo.
[05:29] <pitti> rebooting to test final langpacks
[05:33] <pitti> carlos: any idea why you don't export the 'libc' domain from glibc any more?
[05:35] <carlos> pitti: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/glibc/+pots/libc is setup to appear in language packs
[05:36] <doko> mdz: I'm reverting it. it's not true, that I did upload something else. I adjusted the changelog after our discussion to be more verbose. See http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/ooo-amd64/ia32-libs-5-6.diff for reference
[05:36] <pitti> Riddell, seb128: apart from dropping libc domain (compared to yesterday), new langpacks look good to me
[05:36] <carlos> pitti: the only thing I can guess is that we got no .po files for that translatio domain....
[05:37] <pitti> carlos: the libc tarball has plenty
[05:37] <carlos> for libc ?
[05:37] <Kamion> gar, why are people translating pt and pt_PT separately] 
[05:38] <Kamion> or es and es_ES
[05:38] <carlos> Kamion: which domains?
[05:38] <carlos> we are 'killing' those translations
[05:38] <jdub> Kamion: where are the dvd images hosted?
[05:38] <mdz> doko: thank you
[05:38] <doko> mdz: is it ok to freshen the packages from the archive for the ia32-libs-kde upload?
[05:38] <Kamion> carlos: ubiquity/+pots/ubiquity
[05:38] <pitti> carlos: yes, glibc tarball has lots of po files; unfortunately it doesn't build mo files any more, so the buildd tarball doesn't have them
[05:38] <Kamion> jdub: cdimage.u.c/releases/dapper/blah
[05:38] <jdub> oh,ok
[05:38] <Kamion> or cdimage.u.c/dvd/ for dailies
[05:39] <mdz> Kamion: are installer translations going to make this cron.daily?
[05:39] <Kamion> jdub: I don't think I published DVD images for the RC
[05:39] <Kamion> mdz: er, maybe, if I stop being asked questions ;)
[05:39] <Kamion> probably not though, it takes a while
[05:39] <carlos> pitti: I will do a manual import of those .po files
[05:39] <infinity> I can just turn off the publisher crontab and we can start by-handing it...
[05:39] <pitti> carlos: right, let's ship them in -updates
[05:40] <carlos> Kamion: I did some changes to prevent even more that situation
[05:53] <infinity> Okay, I think that's my last upload for dapper-release.
[05:53] <infinity> Who knows how many I'll be making for -updates, but whatever.  :)
[05:53] <bgertzfield> infinity: Go have a drink. ;)
[05:54] <infinity> bgertzfield: Well, no, now I get to drive the FTP and CD build machinery.
[05:54] <infinity> After June 1st, THEN I can drink.
[05:54] <infinity> Copious amounts, if I have my way.
[05:54] <Kamion> I heartily wish that merging installer translations was quicker
[05:55] <carlos> doko: I did a single .tar.gz export this time
[05:55] <bgertzfield> infinity: Yes.  Yes you will.
[05:55] <carlos> doko: http://people.ubuntu.com/~carlos/ooo-dapper-2006-05-29.tar.gz
[05:56] <mvo> bgertzfield: hello! did you got my mail?
[05:56] <bgertzfield> mvo: Yeah!  I just got the email.  Thanks again. :)
[05:57] <doko> carlos, mdz: these OOo translations are still targeted for dapper?
[05:57] <Kamion> mdz: no, no way I'll make this cron.daily, sorry
[05:57] <carlos> doko: It lacks ooo-impress because for some reason, you didn't provide it or it wasn't imported into Rosetta (not sure why)
[05:58] <carlos> mdz: those are to generate ooo.org language packs that have their own packages outside pitti's language packs
[06:16] <mdz> Kamion: urgh, I would have uploaded a 1.0.10a fixing the typo if I had known
[06:16] <mdz> it would be nice to have working desktop CDs this close to release
[06:19] <thep> Kamion, Gotta go to bed. Thanks for handling the bug.
[06:20] <Kamion> mdz: sorry, I'll have it for this cron.daily
[06:20] <Kamion> working as fast as I can
[06:22] <seb128> pitti: language packs look good to me
[06:23] <infinity> Kamion: I can stop the soyuz machinery for you if you're not going to make it.
[06:25] <mathrick> hi, I need some help with Ubuntu's fontconfig, namely, I'm trying to patch is so that FreeSans is considered as the very last candidate (it's too ugly for anything else), and also to make my Japanese fonts look right
[06:26] <Tonio_> hi
[06:26] <mathrick> I thought it'd include /usr/share/language-selector/fontconfig/$LANGUAGE, but apparently, that's not the case
[06:26] <Kamion> infinity: I'll make this one, just not the previous one
[06:26] <mathrick> the result is that Japanese-specific overrides for embedded bitmaps and similar don't work
[06:26] <infinity> Kamion: Alright.
[06:27] <mathrick> actually, I believe embedded bitmaps should be simply disabled per-script, no matter the current locale, but that's another step, right now I want to see why it does't work the way I expect it to
[06:27] <mathrick> hey Burgwork 
[06:28] <ogra> mathrick, please ask support questions in #ubuntu we're preparing the release here
[06:29] <mathrick> ogra: this is not a support question, this is me trying to fix problems with language-selector
[06:29] <mathrick> ogra: the desired end result is a patch
[06:32] <mantas_> pitti, where I can find new language packs ?
[06:33] <infinity> mathrick: Even if a patch is produced, it won't make dapper at this point, so this may not be the ideal time to discuss it.
[06:34] <Burgwork> hey mathrick 
[06:35] <pitti> mantas_: deb http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/daily/ ./
[06:35] <mathrick> infinity: okay, but that's nevertheless something that needs addressing, I got the first part figured out, now I need someone to tell me if /usr/share/language-selector/fontconfig/$LANGUAGE is supposed to be read by fontconfig
[06:36] <mathrick> so that I know if I should move to #ubuntu and try to debug my install
[06:56] <Kamion> infinity: could you hold soyuz after all please? hit a small snag
[06:56] <infinity> Kamion: On it.
[06:56] <Kamion> should only take an extra ten minutes
[07:04] <infinity> I'm timing you.
[07:05] <fabbione> infinity: me?
[07:05] <Kamion> you're timing my ISP's upload bandwidth now
[07:05] <Kamion> no me
[07:05] <fabbione> :)
[07:06] <Coyctecm> what's default font in open office, open office don't respect .fonts.conf ?
[07:08] <mdke> Riddell: rock!! thanks a lot
[07:10] <Kamion> infinity: Good to go now.
[07:10] <Kamion>    39659 | S- | ubiquity             | 1.0.11               | 30 seconds
[07:10] <Kamion>          | * ubiquity/1.0.11 Component: main Section: admin
[07:10] <infinity> Woo.
[07:11] <infinity> Publishing.
[07:11] <Kamion> the snag was that I broke the encoding of partman-auto's Croatian translation by accident during the merge
[07:11] <infinity> That was a lot of language packages that just scrolled across my screen...
[07:12] <crimsun> pitti: I've received no word (at least in awaylog). -updates is fine. Thanks.
[07:12] <pitti> crimsun: yes, let's do it for -updates then, should be easier to undo if it should really break something
[07:15] <pouet> I have done a libpam_mount patch, but the author doesn't seem to react on source forge. I want to know if it's possible to have them included in ubuntu patches ?
[07:15] <pouet> or if there is some place to submit them.
[07:16] <pouet> maybe launchpad ?
[07:16] <pitti> pouet: please submit it as a bug report
[07:16] <pitti> pouet: it's nothing for dapper, we are in ice cold freeze
[07:16] <pouet> pitti: yes, but I will swich to edgy eft soon after it's released
[07:17] <pouet> pitti: I have read the repository will open mid jun
[07:17] <pitti> pouet: yes, it will
[07:18] <jdub> ice cold freeze! *dink* ... that's the sound of another dapper-changes mail hitting the ice... ;-)
[07:19] <pitti> jdub: Scrud managed to get out, too :)
[07:19] <pitti> (the furry cute animal from Ice Age)
[07:21] <pouet> I am impatient to have upgrades
[07:22] <pouet> I hope edgy eft will not be too much broken ^^
[07:22] <ogra> i hope it will
[07:22] <jdub> pitti: ha ha
[07:22] <ogra> at least in the beginning
[07:22] <infinity> I'm planning on breaking it spectacularly.
[07:22] <jdub> i hope edgy is a buckling tower of pain and horror to start with
[07:22] <ogra> brokeness in the beginning of a cycle means more new features ;)
[07:22] <ogra> yay
[07:22] <jono> hey jdub
[07:23] <jdub> morning jono
[07:30] <zyga> hello
[07:30] <zyga> I'm sorry for dissapearing yesterday but my laptop is no longer operational
[07:31] <bgertzfield> hey zyga
[07:31] <bgertzfield> sorry to hear that :(
[07:31] <bgertzfield> I hope I didn't trash it!
[07:31] <zyga> no
[07:31] <bgertzfield> phew
[07:31] <pitti> zyga: iz GTK bug?
[07:31] <zyga> I turned it off because the fan was malfunctioning
[07:31] <zyga> pitti: hum?
[07:31] <bgertzfield> I see
[07:32] <zyga> bgertzfield: it is not damaged but I need to get some hardware to re-assemble it
[07:32] <pitti> zyga: nevermind, seb128 will kick me soon enough
[07:32] <mvo> zyga: oh, that are bad news :/
[07:33] <zyga> phone
[07:34] <sivang> re all
[07:36] <zyga> back
[07:36] <zyga> hi sivang
[07:36] <zyga> pitti: gtk display bug on ati drivers?
[07:36] <sivang> hey zyga , how is it going?
[07:36] <pitti> zyga: yes, that one sucks
[07:36] <zyga> anyway I need to get some CPU heat paste and re-assemble the thing carefully
[07:36] <zyga> pitti: yes it's very annoying
[07:36] <zyga> pitti: but hibernation works ! :)
[07:37] <zyga> sivang: I trashed my laptop
[07:37] <sivang> zyga: oh god, how did you do that?
[07:37] <zyga> (or, it died and I trashed it trying to repair)
[07:37] <zyga> fan got stuck
[07:37] <zyga> I disassembled it 
[07:37] <zyga> I'll drop a pic because it's pretty picture :D
[07:37] <zyga> so much stuff in that laptop is useless IMHO :)
[07:38] <zyga> pitti: how is a bug like that generated?
[07:38] <pitti> zyga: out of sheer malice; frankly, I don't know
[07:38] <zyga> pitti: it's rather ackward, like some color mask gone wrong
[07:44] <zyga> too bad it's this close to release
[07:46] <sivang> pitti: I managed to fix something from the Radar :-) malone #39482 , but I forgot to drop the debug g_warnings in the debdiff I attached to the bug :-/
[07:46] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39482 in nautilus "nautilus tries to move when dragging and dropping from read-only folders, instead of copying" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/39482
[07:47] <pygi> sivang, hey
[07:47] <sivang> pygi: hey dude
[07:47] <pygi> you have a sec or working on bugs?
[07:47] <sivang> pygi: 'sup?
[07:48] <pygi> fixing Diva bugs (not that you know what that is, but still :P)
[07:48] <sivang> pygi: I just need to fix a debdiff, so I can chat while doing that
[07:48] <sivang> pygi: Diva, I think you showed me it's interface sometime ago?
[07:48] <pygi> sivang, indeed :P
[07:49] <pygi> sivang, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HomeUserBackupNg
[07:49] <pygi> some nice ideas from me :)
[07:53] <sivang> pygi: k, cool thanks
[07:53] <sivang> pygi: I had some discussins with mpt the other day,
[07:53] <sivang> and I'm keen to change a bit our plans :)
[07:53] <pygi> sivang, who is mpt? :-/
[07:53] <pygi> and how do you want to change plans?
[07:53] <sivang> mpt is Ubuntu's in house UI specialist and designer
[07:53] <sivang> ;-)
[07:54] <Treenaks> sivang: GUIru?
[07:54] <pygi> o joy, and I guess changing plans means in UI ?
[07:56] <sivang> pygi: not entirely :)
[07:56] <pygi> sivang, ergh, what then? 
[07:56] <pygi> Don't say you wanna change the scope to "World best backup application" ? :)
[07:56] <sivang> but changing plans is more of to postpone the "super uber complete disaster recovery system" and first concentrate on making it rock solid , with all the bindings in place,
[07:57] <sivang> and so get it and tell many users it's safe to use.
[07:57] <sivang> we only have like 4 months before edgy, and I am not sure we would be able to complete everything in time if we try to do everything at one hit,
[07:57] <sivang> we already have lots of work in doing better device detection, and making it respond in real time to plug events like hal does,
[07:58] <sivang> in accordance with that we need to make sure all error are trapped and are accounted for in an appropriate way
[07:58] <pygi> sivang, we won't have complete recovery disaster system ready for edgy ofcourse
[07:58] <sivang> plus adding support to for remaining size probes for different devices etc..
[07:58] <pygi> sivang, I added a lot more things we have to work on for system like that, so it's sure we wouldnt be able to finish it in time
[07:59] <sivang> we have enough work to do together with the notifcation infrastrucutre without making it super uber disaster recovery system
[07:59] <pygi> sivang, please look at that page I gave you , and add part (Edgy - Scope )
[07:59] <sivang> pygi: cool, I will ldo that
[07:59] <sivang> I'm just happy you're not disappointed by it
[07:59] <pygi> also, please comment the things I wrote down :)
[07:59] <sivang> You seemed very eager and I would hate to break you enthusiasm :-)
[07:59] <sivang> pygi: will do, but first I Need to fix the debdiff I sent to seb128 so he won't get angry at me :)
[07:59] <pygi> sivang, bah, I haven't even planned to have all that ready for edgy :)
[08:00] <HiddenWolf> sivang: you've got some home user backup love planned? :)
[08:00] <zyga> I'm pulling pictures of my mess
[08:00] <pygi> All we need is get general infrastructure on which we can build on
[08:00] <zyga> I should be ashamed of myself :)
[08:00] <pygi> HiddenWolf, a lot love :)
[08:00] <sivang> HiddenWolf: lots and lots of love
[08:00] <sivang> HiddenWolf: I already have a team behind me :)
[08:00] <HiddenWolf> SoC?
[08:00] <pygi> HiddenWolf, nop, no SoC :)
[08:00] <pygi> sivang, o joy, team is 3 people :)
[08:01] <HiddenWolf> btw, is there a list of accepted _buntu projects?
[08:01] <pygi> HiddenWolf, yup
[08:03] <HiddenWolf> ah
[08:03] <pygi> sivang, that team on LP ... are we going to hold there all people interested in HUB, or just devs?
[08:04] <pygi> sivang, btw. we are
[08:04] <pygi> argh. :P
[08:10] <pygi> will be back in sec
[08:12] <pygi> sivang, back, hopefully you got the last pm
[08:13] <pygi> dinner, brb
[08:18] <sivang> back now
[08:20] <sivang> pygi: after you do the doc I could write the neccessary bindings myself even I guess :)
[08:23] <Mithrandir> sladen: why do you think 43780 has a lower severity because it's not in main?
[08:23] <sivang> pygi: what did you mean in 
[08:23] <sivang> GnomeVFS
[08:23] <sivang> 1)Take advantage of GnomeVFS in "boot" mode
[08:23] <sivang> 2)Port GnomeVFS pre-boot so we could take advantage of it (?!) 
[08:23] <sivang> ?
[08:23] <sivang> How is it related to the preboot/post-boot ?
[08:24] <_ion> 0) Rewrite GnomeVFS to be a thin wrapper to something like fuse.
[08:24] <_ion> The same applies to KDE VFS.
[08:25] <sivang> to have it available in boostrap environments?
[08:27] <pygi> sivang, sorry, afk, I'll be here later :(
[08:28] <sivang> pygi: no problem :-)
[08:31] <sivang> hmm, applying debdiff is with plain patch right?
[08:31] <sivang> after all, it's just a patch :-)
[08:33] <zyga> done
[08:33] <zyga> I've got all the messy pictures :)
[08:38] <sivang> hmm, how I tell patch to create a file that's listed on the patch if it's not laready there?
[08:39] <sivang> zyga: any idea?
[08:39] <zyga> hmm
[08:39] <Mithrandir> sivang: run diff with -N; patch does so automatically
[08:39] <zyga> right
[08:39] <zyga> -N diff's new files
[08:39] <chantra> hi there
[08:39] <zyga> -Naur - new, treat all like text, universal, recursive
[08:39] <zyga> the universal differ
[08:40] <chantra> I would like to cross compile package from a i386 to amd64
[08:40] <chantra> it seems that amd64 arch doesn't exist in the kernel
[08:40] <chantra> should i use ia64 ?
[08:40] <zyga> chantra: ?
[08:40] <zyga> chantra: ia64 is not amd64
[08:40] <chantra> :(
[08:40] <zyga> chantra: the kernel fully supports x86_64 aka amd64
[08:40] <zyga> but you want a cross compile first
[08:41] <zyga> s/compile/compiler/
[08:41] <chantra> okie dokie :)
[08:41] <chantra> yep, I'm on my way to tpkg-make :)
[08:42] <chantra> giving a try :)
[08:42] <sivang> Mithrandir: I already did a debdiff, should patch then automaticaly handle stuff?
[08:43] <Mithrandir> sivang: yeah
[08:43] <zyga> sivang: unless it's binary then yes
[08:43] <sivang> Mithrandir: I want to change only inside the debdiff already, instead of re-introducing the changes into a fresh source
[08:43] <sivang> Mithrandir: and then apply and test the changes
[08:43] <sivang> zyga: it
[08:43] <sivang> zyga: not a binary pkg
[08:43] <Mithrandir> just edit the debdiff, then
[08:43] <sivang> zyga: only souce
[08:44] <sivang> Mithrandir: ok, I've done that, tries to patch -p1 < ... and it gave a warning about the non exisitng debian/patches/.. file, and did not create it there
[08:44] <sivang> patching file debian/changelog
[08:44] <sivang> patching file debian/patches/94_readonly_dnd_fix.patch
[08:44] <sivang> patch: **** unexpected end of file in patch
[08:45] <chantra> zyga: while tpkg-make Hmph - dunno the x86_64-linux arch
[08:45] <sivang> 94_readonly_dnd_fix.patch - this is the new file that did not exist before
[08:45] <chantra> while tpkg-make x86_64-linux it tells me:
[08:45] <chantra> Hmph - dunno the x86_64-linux arch
[08:45] <_ion> sivang: Perhaps rediff(1) would help.
[08:45] <zyga> chantra: I don't know tpkg-make, sorry
[08:46] <chantra> arf :s
[08:47] <sivang> _ion: right, thank you!
[08:49] <chantra> zyga: cheers :)
[08:49] <zyga> chantra: good luck
[08:50] <sivang> Mithrandir: I just needed to fix the offest indicators :)
[08:50] <Mithrandir> sivang: use a real editor which does so for you.
[08:52] <sivang> Mithrandir: care to tell me which is it? :)
[08:52] <sivang> nonetheless, patching failes... I guess I might do it manually afterall
[08:52] <Mithrandir> sivang: emacs does, at least.
[08:53] <sivang> okay, I'll try with emacs , maybe it will do better the offset adjustment
[08:59] <sivang> well, it appears rediff gets confused over debdiffs
[08:59] <chantra> zyga: have you ever cross compile .deb package?
[09:00] <sivang> given debdiffs are diffs over diffs
[09:00] <highvoltage> wow. that's deap, man.
[09:01] <zyga> chantra: no but i cross compile stuff dauly
[09:01] <zyga> daily
[09:02] <chantra> well I want to create .deb package, therefore it would be handy to be able to use dpkg utils :)
[09:03] <zyga> I don't know how to cross compile debs really
[09:03] <Kamion> last I checked, dpkg-cross was the answer
[09:03] <zyga> we use properiarity system at work
[09:03] <chantra> Kamion: yep, but I need to set up the environment first
[09:04] <chantra> and it seems amd64 and x86_64 are not supported by tpkg-make
[09:04] <chantra>  wonder if ia64 will do the trick
[09:04] <zyga> chantra: no
 should be one of alpha-linux, arm-linux, hppa-linux, i*86-linux,
[09:04] <chantra> ia32-linux, ia64-linux, m68k-linux, mipsel-linux, mips-linux, ppc-linux,
[09:04] <chantra> powerpc-linux, sparc-linux, s390-linux or similar.
[09:04] <zyga> that's 100% different arch
[09:04] <zyga> different CPU and instruction set
[09:05] <chantra> arf, the pasted bit is from tpkg doc
[09:05] <chantra> to you see anything near to amd64?
[09:05] <zyga> no
[09:05] <chantra> :(
[09:05] <chantra> :p
[09:06] <sivang> highvoltage: deep? :)
[09:06] <Kamion> I'm sure you could just search for any of those architectures and hack amd64 into the list ...
[09:07] <highvoltage> sivang: i'm in the mood for joking :)
[09:07] <sivang> highvoltage: well, you first need to let rediff work out your debian/patches level patch
[09:07] <sivang> highvoltage: then , create a new debdiff
[09:07] <sivang> as rediff on a debdiff seems not that useful :)
[09:08] <highvoltage> :)
[09:10] <sivang> ah, finally
[09:10] <sivang> clean debdiff attached
[09:10] <sivang> now just wait for the Seveas 
[09:10] <sivang> oops
[09:10] <Seveas> ?
[09:10] <sivang> , for the seb128 
[09:10] <Seveas> heh
[09:10] <sivang> :)
[09:10] <Seveas> yeah, the seb128 is much more useful than the seveas 
[09:10] <sivang> hehe
[09:11] <sivang> Well, only when you need him to break stuff on your behalf in mina :p
[09:11] <sivang> or mine as well
[09:14] <sivang> my battery is almost done with all this nautilus building
[09:14] <sivang> laters all
[09:14] <zyga> bye sivang 
[09:18] <highvoltage> bye sivang 
[09:29] <pygi> sivang, back :)
[09:29] <pygi> sivang, so you wanna get rid of everyone once you have the doc? :P
[09:30] <mdke> dholbach: something has destroyed the help system...
[09:30] <dholbach> mdke: destroyed as in how?
[09:30] <pygi> sivang, about GnomeVFS...I was thinking that we could transfer backup images to nfs, ftp, bla, bla and all that provided by GnomeVFS)
[09:31] <mdke> dholbach: yelp is empty except for about ubuntu (gnome docs, ubuntu docs are gone)
[09:31] <mdke> dholbach: something scrollkeeper related?
[09:31] <dholbach> I can't confirm that
[09:31] <mdke> ah
[09:31] <dholbach> and I have the newest scrollkeeper version and everything installed
[09:31] <mdke> dholbach: i see it, and so do two more in -doc
[09:31] <dholbach> urg
[09:31] <dholbach> which locales are that?
[09:32] <mdke> en_GB
[09:32] <dholbach> all of you?
[09:33] <mdke> dholbach: yes I think so. The other two aren't around now
[09:34] <mdke> dholbach: DonS the yelp guy who runs Ubuntu confirms it too
[09:34] <dholbach> mdke: same locale?
[09:35] <mdke> dholbach: he's English so I guess so
[09:36] <olemke> dholbach, mdke: same yelp issue here with en_US.UTF-8
[09:36] <mdke> dholbach: italian works ok
[09:38] <mdke> bbiab
[09:38] <dholbach> I'm trying something
[09:38] <dholbach> i'll get back to you in a bit
[09:43] <dholbach> olemke, mdke: can you try to install the .deb files from  http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/scrollkeeper/ and try again?
[09:44] <olemke> dholbach, sure
[09:45] <olemke> dholbach, those are for amd64? i'm on 386 :-(
[09:45] <dholbach> urg, sorry
[09:45] <dholbach> just a min
[09:45] <olemke> dholbach, no problem
[09:46] <dholbach> didn't think about it :)
[09:51] <dholbach> can you check again? reload the page?
[09:51] <olemke> dholbach, better :-)
[09:58] <dholbach> olemke: please tell me if that works for you
[09:58] <olemke> dholbach, unfortunately still the same. LANGUAGE=en_GB or en_US only shows about ubuntu
[09:58] <olemke> de_DE and it_IT works fine
[09:59] <olemke> or do i have to do anything else after installing the packages (like re-login)?
[10:00] <dholbach> no, not at all
[10:00] <olemke> thought so
[10:01] <dholbach> which version of ubuntu-docs is that?
[10:01] <olemke> 6.06.1
[10:02] <pitti> ouch
[10:02] <pitti> seb128: what was that for?
 zyga: iz GTK bug?
[10:03] <pitti> seb128: oh, that one; SCNR :)
[10:03] <seb128> pitti: I was away for some sport and diner, I'm catching up :p
[10:03] <zyga> seb128: hi
[10:03] <dholbach> olemke: what happens, if you run yelp from the terminal?
[10:03] <seb128> hey zyga
[10:03] <dholbach> olemke: can you paste the output in a query?
[10:04] <zyga> I really don't know, could be an X bug too
[10:04] <zyga> but I didn't manage to run anything, my laptop is dead
[10:04] <zyga> :/
[10:04] <olemke> dholbach, no output on terminal
[10:04] <olemke> dholbach, what query?
[10:06] <dholbach> olemke: ok, nevermind
[10:06] <dholbach> olemke: i'm at a loss of words
[10:07] <olemke> dholbach, ah got it now. :-) only output is that beagled is not running when searching for something, but i guess that's normal
[10:07] <dholbach> yeah, I suppose so
[10:08] <dholbach> olemke: i did a scrollkeeper update this morning, but I just added languages to it, no changes wrt to en_*
[10:09] <olemke> dholbach, I'll have a look in my apt cache, probably the old scrollkeeper is still there
[10:09] <seb128> I've the yelp issue on my box
[10:10] <dholbach> seb128: what happens there?
[10:10] <dholbach> seb128: which version of ubuntu-docs and scrollkeeper?
[10:10] <seb128> dholbach: do you want me to debug?
[10:10] <seb128> current
[10:10] <seb128> scrollkeeper_0.3.14-11ubuntu5_i386.deb
[10:10] <dholbach> ok, that's the old one
[10:10] <dholbach> the one I didn't patch
[10:10] <dholbach> ah no
[10:10] <seb128> ii  ubuntu-docs    6.06.1         The Ubuntu Documentation Project
[10:10] <dholbach> that's the one I patched already - sorry
[10:12] <olemke> dholbach, i'm downgrading to 0.3.14-11ubuntu4 and see if that fixes it
[10:13] <dholbach> olemke: thanks a lot
[10:13] <olemke> dholbach, yes, that one works!
[10:13] <dholbach> urg
[10:13] <seb128> dholbach: downgrading to 0.3.14-11ubuntu4 works
[10:13] <dholbach> URG
[10:13] <seb128> dholbach: do you want me to debug that?
[10:13] <olemke> *lol*
[10:13] <dholbach> I have no idea what could have cause that
[10:13] <seb128> dholbach: cf query
[10:13] <olemke> i'll leave the debugging to seb128 :-)
[10:38] <seb128> dholbach, mdke, olemke: I've a fix ready to upload
[10:39] <seb128> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/scrollkeeper.debdiff ok to upload?
[10:39] <dholbach> seb128: thanks a lot.
[10:39] <seb128> mdz: the scrollkeeper update from this morning dropped the C locale by mistake, that fixes it
[10:39] <seb128> np
[10:39] <mdke> kewl, thanks seb
[10:40] <seb128> np
[10:40] <olemke> seb128, great
[10:44] <ciga> hi
[11:02] <mirak> hi
[11:02] <mirak> I am a bit tired by the nvidia driver from restricted modules that breaks after some upgrades. how is that possible ? isn't the restricted package bound to the appropriate kernel ?
[11:11] <mirak> Error: API mismatch: the NVIDIA kernel module has the version 1.0-8756, but this X module has the version 1.0-8762.  Please make sure that the kernel module and all NVIDIA driver components have the same version.
[11:11] <mirak> sorry
[11:11] <mirak> mistake
[11:12] <mdz> seb128: argh
[11:12] <mdz> seb128: yes, ok to upload
[11:13] <mdz> dholbach: how goes it?
[11:13] <pitti> mdz: the two i386 buildds are still crunching through the langpacks :( (with all the other buildds idling around)
[11:14] <dholbach> mdz: all seems to be good - i'm fixing up the community themes atm
[11:14] <seb128> mdz: done
[11:14] <dholbach> if somebody wants to test: http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/ubuntu-artwork_28_all.deb
[11:14] <mdz> pitti: I have resigned myself to the fact that we will not have working CDs until tomorrow
[11:15] <dholbach> I'd be happy if somebody would look and check for obvious breakage
[11:15] <mdz> dholbach: what's wrong with the community themes?
[11:15] <seb128> is that going to be the dapper artwork?
[11:15] <dholbach> mdz: referred to non existing icon themes (or stuff that had to be packaged) and I had a bug in the Makefiles
[11:15] <mdke> dholbach: what sort of tests do you need?
[11:15] <dholbach> i'm working on it high speed
[11:15] <dholbach> mdke: install and check for missing icons or stuff that looks queer
[11:16] <mdke> dholbach: ok :)
[11:17] <mdke> heh
[11:17] <seb128> good idea
[11:19] <zul> heylo
[11:19] <seb128> dholbach: graphics, game, sound and video still look blury
[11:20] <dholbach> seb128: we didn't get those in 48x48
[11:20] <mdke> dholbach: is the menu logo supposed to be only about a third of the circle?
[11:20] <dholbach> mdke: yes
[11:20] <mdke> geez
[11:20] <pitti> dholbach: cool, this becomes active at instant :)
[11:20] <pitti> dholbach: yay for better close icons
[11:20] <nomed> dholbach, gtkrc files shouldn't go in 
[11:21] <nomed> gtk-2.0/gtkrc ?
[11:21] <nomed> or not anymore ?
[11:21] <seb128> pitti: that still looks ugly on close button
[11:21] <pitti> seb128: but better than before IMHO
[11:21] <seb128> pitti: no
[11:21] <seb128> pitti: exactly the same for me 
[11:21] <pitti> dholbach: System -> About Ubuntu still has this buttonish look, is that correct?
[11:21] <seb128> pitti: open the theme selector by example
[11:21] <seb128> pitti: restart your panel
[11:21] <mdke> I can't get over the 1/3 menu icon... ughhh
[11:22] <dholbach> pitti: kill the panel
[11:22] <seb128> pitti: that's a coded entry, it's not updated dynamically
[11:22] <seb128> hum, no, it comes from a .desktop
[11:22] <seb128> but not updated dynamically ... :)
[11:22] <pitti> seb128: right, big icons stay the same here
[11:23] <seb128> notify bubble looks weird
[11:23] <seb128> tool small icon on them
[11:23] <mdke> close icons in gaim chat window still don't look like close icons
[11:23] <seb128> we should really get that one delayed to after dapper
[11:23] <seb128> still looks weird to gaim and gedit
[11:24] <seb128> it's just better for epiphany
[11:24] <mdke> yeah, confirm gedit too
[11:29] <zyga> pitti: is there any way to help you with building langpacks?
[11:29] <zyga> distdpkg-deb or something :)
[11:29] <pitti> zyga: buy a third i386 buildd and quickly put it into the DC :)
[11:29] <zyga> DC?
[11:29] <pitti> data center
[11:30] <zyga> I can do the former
[11:30] <zyga> how fast do you use?
[11:38] <zyga> pitti: bah, you were not serious
[11:38] <pitti> zyga: oh, of course not
[11:38] <zyga> I was :D
[11:39] <zyga> langpack building is easy to parallelize
[11:39] <mdke> zyga: you are considering getting a new server into the datacenter in the next 24 hours or so?
[11:39] <mdke> impressive
[11:39] <zyga> mdke: I didn't say 24 hours but I could donate stuff I don't need
[11:39] <pitti> zyga: right, but due to our current buildd machinery, they will only be built on i386 buildds
[11:40] <mdke> zyga: that's kinda nice, but I think the langpacks are getting built now, and dapper is about to come out
[11:40] <mdke> so pitti could only have been joking
[11:40] <pitti> https://launchpad.net/+builds
[11:40] <zyga> it'd be uber cool if we could somehow build langpacks for all languages daily
[11:41] <robertj> Are those duck foot-prints on the new close icon for gedit & friends ;)
[11:41] <pitti> zyga: already happening :)
[11:41] <zyga> pitti: for *all* languages!?!
[11:41] <zyga> :D
[11:41] <pitti> zyga: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2006-May/000537.html
[11:41] <pitti> zyga: yes, I changed it to build the complete set every day
[11:41] <zyga> pitti:I read that mail
[11:42] <zyga> nice, how long does it take to build the whole set?
[11:42] <mdke> zyga: this one too? https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2006-May/000567.html
[11:42] <zyga> mdke: no, I've got 40 unread emails pending :/
[11:42] <zyga> I'll go thru them tomorrow
[11:43] <zyga> pitti: interesting host names ;] 
[11:44] <seb128> the new distributor logo looks weird :/
[11:44] <mdke> seb128: s/weird/terrible
[11:45] <seb128> not that bad
[11:45] <seb128> but I think I preferred the one with the border
[11:45] <seb128> and that was already something :p
[11:45] <zyga> is the ubuntu artwork on display somewhere?
[11:45] <mdke> well, I think it should be consistent with the website and all other Ubuntu marketing and have the whole circle
[11:45] <seb128> agreed
[11:46] <dholbach> I'm fixing a last bug now, then I'll upload the package, so adventurous testers can have another look while I do a quick walk to get the dog out and fetch some candy somewhere - I need it badly now.
[11:47] <dholbach> and after that I can do the upload 'for real'
[11:47] <ogra> so does that mean we have an ETA for CD buiilds ? 
[11:47] <zyga> dholbach: do you work at home?
[11:47] <dholbach> zyga: yes
[11:47] <ogra> "last bug" sounds promising
[11:47] <ogra> err last upload indeed
[11:47] <dholbach> ogra: yeah, installed the community ubuntu-art themes to the wrong directory
[11:48] <mdke> ogra: don't worry... still another 10,000 or so to go
[11:48] <ogra> ouch, but well, things donw in a hurry ....
[11:48] <ogra> mdke, i hope you mean bugs
[11:48] <mdke> lol
[11:48] <ogra> i wouldnt want 10000 iso tests
[11:48] <HiddenWolf> mdke: nearer 11k by now.
[11:51] <zyga> hello sabdfl :)
[11:52] <dholbach> ok, can you please test http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/ubuntu-artwork_28_all.deb - I'm going for a 10-15 minutes walk now
[11:52] <mirak> I am sure there is a problem with nvidia driver and kernel upgrade
[11:55] <pitti> yay, langpacks have all built now
[11:55] <LaserJock> \o/
[11:56] <zyga> pitti: do you know if you can sucessfuly install dapper on a ppc alongside with latest osx?
[11:56] <pitti> zyga: sure, that should work fine (does for me)
[11:56] <zyga> pitti: what partition type did you use?
[11:57] <zyga> I'm sorry to bother you with this it's just that I tried this several times and got no understanding of what's ultimatly wrong
[11:57] <pitti> zyga: no special one, just what the installer creates
[11:57] <zyga> (neither system sees the drive as partitioned after the other got installed)
[11:58] <zyga> hmm, I choose hfs+ with journaling, case sensitive
[11:59] <mdke> dholbach: gaim close button in chat window still bad, gedit seems a bit better, although still a bit small i think. Otherwise seems ok (apart from the distributor logo atrocity)
[11:59] <mdz> " No pending builds for The Dapper Drake."
[12:00] <ogra> YAY !!!
[12:00] <LaserJock> mdz: time to open The Edgy Eft? ;-)
[12:00] <ogra> ssshhh
[12:00] <zul> ssh...dont mention the war
[12:01] <mdz> LaserJock: that just means the last batch of stuff has all built
[12:01] <mdz> s/last/most recent/
[12:01] <mdz> we aren't finished yet