[12:03] <Kamion> vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 FTBFS
[12:03] <mdz> whee
[12:03] <Kamion> I think I'd prefer to leave that one to mvo though - don't know how the interaction with the vmware packaging bods works
[12:03] <Kamion> seems to be at least a missing Build-Depends: bzip2
[12:03] <mdz> pitti: why did the langpacks take a substantial amount of time to build?
[12:03] <mdz> Kamion: when do you come down to London; tomorrow?
[12:04] <jono> hey
[12:04] <pitti> mdz: because it's just two buildds that can build them ATM
[12:04] <holycow> hey guys
[12:04] <pitti> mdz: for the package itself, it takes some time to msgfmt all the PO files
[12:04] <jono> hey
[12:04] <holycow> any ubuntu / canonical people here?
[12:04] <mdz> pitti: oh, I thought that was done in advance
[12:04] <jono> holycow: usually quite a few
[12:04] <mdke> holycow: define people
[12:04] <holycow> would anyone know of any surveys detailing user satisfaction levels with linux/computers?
[12:05] <holycow> lol :) sorry that was a leading to my question ... should of been a single line.
[12:05] <pitti> mdz: for the sake of having real source packages I don't
[12:05] <mdz> holycow: no, no ubuntu people here; they all hang out on #gnome
[12:05] <ogra> mdz, huh ? 
[12:05] <jono> :P
[12:05] <holycow> mdz, eh, good point actually heh
[12:05] <mgalvin> dholbach: that new artwork package works for me (was the legacy human stuff based on those packages I made or fresh artwork team work? (just wondering))
[12:05] <Kamion> mdz: yes, tomorrow morning; I expect to get there around 11am
[12:06] <mdz> Kamion: ok
[12:06] <Kamion> mdz: showing up at the office, right?
[12:06] <Kamion> (it's much cheaper to get a train after 9am)
[12:06] <mdz> Kamion: if I only feel as close to death as I do now, then I'll be there.  if I'm worse, I may need to work from the hotel
[12:06] <Kamion> I see. yay plague
[12:06] <ogra> :/
[12:06] <Kamion> well, I hope to see you tomorrow then
[12:13] <HiddenWolf> Is there any way that I can unsubscribe from a bug in malone?
[12:14] <LaserJock> HiddenWolf: i think you can if you go to the bug report
[12:14] <mdz> the 'unsubscribe' button, or via email
[12:14] <HiddenWolf> hm, i overlooked it then.
[12:14] <LaserJock> you can't unsubscribe teams though, yet. AFAIK
[12:14] <mdz> HiddenWolf: if you have further questions about it, please use #launchpad
[12:14] <mdz> LaserJock: only by mail
[12:14] <zyga> zyga -> bed
[12:14] <zyga> night guys
[12:15] <zyga> thanks for ubuntu :)
[12:16] <mdz> (bug #30532)
[12:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30532 in malone "Unable to unsubscribe a team from a bug" [Critical,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30532
[12:17] <dholbach> mgalvin: I can't really tell - the ubuntu-art guys provided me with it
[12:18] <dholbach> mgalvin: but thanks for your work on it
[12:20] <mgalvin> dholbach: ok, no worries, was just curious since it seemd to pop up after my post ;), if it was based on mine then i am just glad to help :)
[12:26] <dholbach> if you're all happy with it, I'll upload now. mdz, sabdfl: any other changes you want me to do now or other considerations?
[12:27] <seb128_> dholbach: I think that the close button change should be dropped for dapper but that's probably not a decision up to you ...
[12:48] <mdke> dholbach: maybe worth pinging henrik or something if the distributor logo is going to change: screenshot here needs redoing: http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop
[12:48] <mdke> ah, 2 screenshots
[12:56] <dholbach> urg, what a nice timing, holba.ch is offline
[12:58] <Burgwork> mdke, /desktop looks good
[12:58] <mdke> Burgwork: yeah, it does indeed :)
[12:59] <mdke> Burgwork: do you do the screenshots? maybe you can redo those
[12:59] <Burgwork> no, henrik did them
[12:59] <mdke> ah, k
[01:00] <mdke> well, he can redo em :)
[01:02] <Burgwork> hmm, joel makes a good point about the logo on -desktop
[01:03] <mdke> i didn't see that
[01:03] <Burgwork> the mailing list. the distributor logo looks like a button
[01:04] <sabdfl> https://chinstrap.warthogs.hbd.com/~mark/ulogo.png
[01:05] <mdke> Burgwork: wait til you see the new one
[01:05] <sabdfl> erk
[01:05] <mdke> you're gonna hurl
[01:05] <sabdfl> not sure how many people can see that
[01:05] <sabdfl> mdke, that the one you are referring to?
[01:05] <Burgwork> sabdf1, ah, us non-canonical people cannot see that
[01:05] <ogra> Burgwork, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-artwork/+bug/47260/+index
[01:05] <sabdfl> i'm totally open to contributions
[01:05] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47260 in ubuntu-artwork "Distributor icon is ugly" [Normal,Confirmed]  
[01:05] <Keybuk> sabdf1: only staff, copy it to rookery
[01:05] <mdke> sabdfl: I can't see it. I'm referring to the one which is a 1/3 slice and looks like it has been failed to be resized appropriately
[01:06] <sabdfl> the new one is 1/3 slice but properly done
[01:06] <sabdfl> i've asked the artist to have a final stab with the full logo
[01:06] <sabdfl> but - it always looks too fiddly
[01:06] <mdke> sabdfl: but the website and all Ubuntu marketing has a whole circle as the logo... the one before the button was perfectly acceptable, IMO
[01:06] <sabdfl> contributions welcome, in the next 8 hours :-)
[01:06] <sabdfl> it was rather ugly, as an icon
[01:07] <sabdfl> this is clearly part of the logo
[01:07] <mdke> i know that last minute crack artwork is traditional, but it seems to me that it's getting changed just for the sake of it now
[01:07] <Seveas> I loved it, was the best so fat
[01:07] <Seveas> so far*
[01:07] <Riddell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~jriddell/ulogo.png
[01:07] <Burgwork> ugh, that is worse
[01:08] <ogra> looks broken ...
[01:08] <Seveas> much worse
[01:08] <ogra> at least that will be what people will think
[01:08] <Burgwork> I am left wondering where the logo went and whether of not I should resize my screen
[01:08] <mdke> can we have at least "This is not the final artwork" written over it?
[01:09] <ogra> *flat
[01:09] <Burgwork> ogra, I agree with you
[01:10] <Keybuk> ogra: you can never have enough bling
[01:10] <mjg59> sabdfl: Breezy shipped with a full logo rather than a gnome one, right? Is there a strong feeling that any of the changes offer significant improvements over that?
[01:10] <Riddell> mdke: yay!
[01:10] <ogra> Keybuk, so why dont we switch to Xgl quickly befor the CD building starts :P
[01:10] <Burgwork> Riddell, might have me switching next. Then the world would trulyl end
[01:11] <Seveas> ogra, Ublingtu 
[01:11] <Keybuk> ogra: because I'm in the same hotel as mdz and he could break into my room and cut my balls off
[01:11] <mdke> lol
[01:11] <ogra> lol
[01:11] <Seveas> haha
[01:11] <Burgwork> Keybuk, would make less enjoyable, no?
[01:11] <mdke> it's worth the sacrifice
[01:12] <Burgwork> sabdfl, another concern I have is with copyright dilution. We should be careful to not hackup our logo too much
[01:12] <Burgwork> s/copyright/trademark/
[01:12] <sabdfl> that's true
[01:13] <Burgwork> therefor, a plain simple Ubuntu logo works well
[01:13] <sabdfl> but the point is still that our logo is unfortunately a bit delicate, and 24x24 (really 22x22) is not great for that
[01:13] <sabdfl> it did NOT work well, i'm afraid
[01:13] <Burgwork> it also isn't ugly and won't get you jumped at the next dev conference :)
[01:13] <mdke> the one before the button was already an improvement over the breezy one, definitely
[01:13] <ogra> we have even 16x16 in synaptic
[01:13] <sabdfl> it always looked a bit cheap and nasty
[01:13] <Seveas> sabdfl, what do you think is wronw with the one before the button?
[01:13] <sabdfl> Seveas: the shadowing looked wrong
[01:14] <Seveas> the one with shadowing was the one before that
[01:14] <sladen> sabdfl: what happened to the really nice shiny logo (the one you had on your laptop during LinuxTag, which I remember commenting on)
[01:14] <mjg59> I tended to agree that the sadowing looked slightly funny, but several people seemed to comment on it positively
[01:14] <sladen> sabdfl: which could be further improved by dropping the shadow from near the bottom
[01:15] <mjg59> (Which I can't say I understand, but, well)
[01:15] <sabdfl> look, art gods, draw me the fricken' icon and send it to me for a decision
[01:15] <sabdfl> i only picks them from what i sees
[01:15] <sabdfl> if yous knows what i means
[01:15] <sabdfl>  </goftather mode>
[01:15] <sabdfl> erk
[01:15] <sabdfl> so much for me as a mafia don
[01:15] <ogra> heh
[01:15] <Seveas> Don Marco
[01:18] <Riddell> mdz: in a mood for one last guidance fix?  http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/tmp/guidance.diff
[01:20] <Burgwork> Riddell, how well does guidance seperate the qt bits from the underlying bits (ie, how easy would it be to tack a gtk frontend on it?)
[01:21] <sabdfl> night all
[01:27] <dholbach> i uploaded the package to http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach now
[01:27] <dholbach> so if somebody wants to test it some more, that'd be great
[01:28] <dholbach> i'm off to bed now
[01:28] <dholbach> have a nice evening
[01:29] <Riddell> Burgwork: it doesn't separate at all
[01:29] <Burgwork> Riddell, hmm
[01:29] <Riddell> Burgwork: although regardless they're probably much easier to port between frontends than gnome-system-tools :)
[01:30] <Burgwork> hmm, indeed, plus in a nicer language
[01:30] <Burgwork> that KDE and GNOME do not provide good config tools is a major shame
[01:30] <Burgwork> that they don't work together on a common freedesktop.org set is even more nuts
[01:31] <mjg59> sabdf1: Ha. I ended up getting a passport from a different country in order to avoid visa waiver hassles
[01:31] <mgalvin> hmm, vmware-player in multiverse, nice
[01:31] <Riddell> Burgwork: you're right in principle but abstracting for both distributions and frontends is never going to end up with nice code
[01:31] <Burgwork> Riddell, no, you are right there
[01:32] <Riddell> Burgwork: but what config tools do you think are missing?
[01:33] <Burgwork> X,but also just thinking of the mess of the rh, suse, etc. shipping their own code
[01:34] <sladen> win 194
[01:35] <Burgwork> sladen, ?
[01:35] <sladen> Burgwork: missing a /
[01:35] <Burgwork> sladen, ah. What does that command do?
[01:38] <Seveas> switch to window 194
[01:38] <Seveas> sladen is insane
[01:38] <Burgwork> Seveas, are you saying he has 194 windows open?
[01:38] <Seveas> 194 or more
[01:38] <mjg59> Burgwork: The X configuration pain is going to go away very soon
[01:39] <Burgwork> mjg59, with better hotplugging on the X end?
[01:39] <mjg59> Given that, right now, there's no standardised options namespace, a decent X config tool has to special-case every single driver
[01:39] <mjg59> With magical dbus hurrah
[01:39] <Burgwork> I like magic fairy dust
[01:40] <mjg59> For great justice
[01:40] <Seveas> X going dbus?
[01:40] <Seveas> funky
[01:40] <mjg59> And run-time configuration excellence
[01:40] <Keybuk> *sigh*
[01:41] <mjg59> RH are doing a lot of work on this right now
[01:41] <Keybuk> dbus ... it's like IPC, only crappier
[01:41] <Seveas> (c)Keybuk Advertisement Agency
[01:41] <Robot101> where did the crappier bit come from?
[01:42] <sladen> Keybuk: oh, but it's *simpler* than IPC.  "The _only_ requirement is an XML parser"...
[01:42] <mjg59> X already has enough mad parsers that another doesn't matter?
[01:42] <Keybuk> sladen: yes, this is the point I snort into my drink and cry "the world has gone MAD!"
[01:43] <Seveas> I'm waiting for someone to create dbus over tcp to get upnp-like hell 
[01:43] <sladen> Seveas: it exists.
[01:43] <Keybuk> oh, I'm sure one day all web page accesses will be over dbus to a PornManager service
[01:43] <Seveas> sladen, *shiver*
[01:43] <Robot101> XML parsers? eh?
[01:43] <sladen> Seveas: echo <listen>tcp:host=localhost,port=12434</listen> | sudo tee -a /etc/dbus-1/system.conf
[01:44] <Seveas> sladen, no fun on localhost only
[01:44] <Keybuk> Robot101: XML Configuration files are *the* in thing this season
[01:44] <Seveas> open to the world by default 
[01:44] <Keybuk> it's what all the good desktop environments are wearing
[01:44] <sladen> except that you can't do that, you need to *parse* XML config file, then *insert* it into the right place
[01:45] <sladen> Seveas: well change 'localhost' for 1.2.3.4 ...
[01:45] <Seveas> wouldn't 0.0.0.0 work? I have a dynamic IP 
[01:46] <Seveas> weird idea, managing your server via dbus-over-tcp/ipsec
[01:50] <desrt> hmm
[01:50] <desrt> macbook starts having random lockups
[01:50] <Keybuk> tsk
[01:50] <Keybuk> don't buy shint
[01:50] <Keybuk> uh, shiny
[01:50] <desrt> i wonder if they're heat releated
[01:51] <Robot101> Keybuk: shint was closer to the desired word? :)
[01:51] <desrt> it's obviously disk-related
[01:51] <desrt> like the disc controller dies
[01:51] <desrt> and if an app tries to touch disk it locks in D-state forever
[01:52] <Keybuk> Robot101: allegedly so
[01:52] <Keybuk> desrt: I like the PowerBooks, where they put the CD drive right under where most people's right wrist rests
[01:52] <Keybuk> so after time, you crush the CD drive and it no longer wokrs
[01:56] <robertj> Keybuk: I paid extra $150 for the black macbook, why isn't it working! It's not shiny!
[01:58] <desrt> i have to say
[01:58] <desrt> i'm fairly disappointed in apple wrt the macbook
[01:58] <desrt> they didn't try very hard
[01:58] <desrt> it runs bloody hot and it's _big_
[01:58] <Burgwork> desrt, they don't have to. Apple fanatics would buy polished shit if Jobs said it was good for thek
[01:58] <Burgwork> s/thek/them
[01:59] <desrt> i'd gladly take a cut in speed if it meant that my laptop ran at a sane temperature, was stable, and had a longer battery life
[02:01] <Burgwork> desrt, but they sold these things as 4x faster, not 4x as much battery life (something I would pay for)
[02:01] <mdke> you do tend to get what you buy
[02:01] <desrt> how about removing the bloody cdrom drive?
[02:01] <mjg59> Probably the last conference season for my trusty X40
[02:02] <desrt> apple has some pretty dumb ideas
[02:02] <desrt> mjg59; my coworker was less than helpful today....
[02:03] <mjg59> desrt: Mm?
[02:03] <desrt> mjg59; about the backlight control stuff
[02:03] <mjg59> Ah
[02:04] <crimsun> mjg59: worn out from use?
[02:04] <desrt> fwiw, backlight control _and_ sleep are supported in windows
[02:04] <desrt> the trackpad is not
[02:04] <mjg59> crimsun: Getting a touch knackered
[02:04] <mjg59> It's been around the world a couple of times now
[02:44] <bddebian> Howdy folks
[02:59] <Seveas> gah
[03:00] <Seveas> pkill -HUP gnome-panel kills xchat
[03:00] <Seveas> stupid tray plugin
[03:00] <Seveas> but anyway, I sent don marco a distributor-logo proposal :) 
[03:04] <Seveas> http://www.ubuntulinux.nl/~dennis/logo/
[03:07] <desrt> that's not the ubuntu menu icon anymore :(
[03:08] <Seveas> it never was
[03:08] <Seveas> I just created it
[03:27] <ajmitch> afternoon
[04:31] <FliesLikeABrick> the graphics in the log-out window (the nice big colorful ones) are all GPL, right?
[06:00] <KaiL_> nice, that universe imports EVERYTHING from debian, but was it planned, to import it's kernel-images? ;)
[06:01] <jdub> wow, some dude is recommending a UI that would let you enable DMA for a limited period of time
[06:02] <tseng> jdub: is he recommending snorting crack cut with ajax?
[06:03] <ajmitch> jdub: is that sounder thread still not dead?
[06:03] <KaiL_> jdub, what should be the use of such an UI?
[06:08] <jdub> punching users in the face, i guess... ;)
[06:13] <bddebian> heh
[06:14] <StevenK> Enable DMA for a limited time. Hrm, a big dial that has two points - "Slow I/O" and "Fast I/O" ?
[06:19] <lifeless> StevenK: what about a spring
[06:19] <lifeless> StevenK: you need to keep pushing it in to get fast io
[06:19] <Mithrandir> can I have it in blue?
[06:27] <bgertzfield> Does anyone know where I can see the Ubuntu buildd logs?
[06:27] <KaiL_> lifeless, LOL
[06:27] <bgertzfield> evidently Kamion mentioned the vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 package had a FTBFS on the build machines
[06:30] <bgertzfield> ah, found https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+builds
[06:30] <bgertzfield> very nice
[06:30] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/200099 gives you a link to the log
[06:30] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: yep! just found it
[06:30] <bgertzfield> /bin/sh: bzip2: command not found
[06:30] <Mithrandir> that's not the kernel stuff, though
[06:30] <bgertzfield> curses
[06:31] <Mithrandir> build-depend on bzip2, then.  Should be trivial. :-)
[06:31] <bgertzfield> https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/200093 is the buildd log
[06:31] <bgertzfield> I had no idea bzip2 wasn't essential (tar is...)
[06:31] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: how can I go about getting a new package to you folks asap?
[06:31] <bgertzfield> mvo is handling the uploads, but he's asleep
[06:32] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: do you want to give us a new package yourself or should I just add the build-dep?
[06:32] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: I'd be perfectly happy if you just added the build-dep to vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 (in a -4 revision)
[06:32] <bgertzfield> but I'm happy to do it too
[06:33] <Mithrandir> less hassle for me to do it myself, since I then don't have to comb the package for other things too.
[06:33] <bgertzfield> I'd really appreciate that!
[06:36] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: you'll be pleased to see there are amd64 packages for this :)
[06:36] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: uploaded
[06:36] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: incredible! thank you
[06:36] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: nice. :-)
[06:36] <Mithrandir> np
[06:37] <Mithrandir> I didn't do a full test build, but I think it'll build just fine.  I'll keep an eye on it.
[06:37] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: I'll email mvo, Kamion, and yourself
[06:37] <Mithrandir> cheers
[06:37] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: I'm sure it'll be good.  The whole build succeeded except the bzip2 (groan) :)
[06:37] <Mithrandir> yeah, builds are picky that way.
[06:37] <Mithrandir> (also pbuilder testing good.)
[06:37] <Mithrandir> now I have to get some breakfast.
[06:37] <bgertzfield> pbuilder is a buildd simulator of sorts?
[06:38] <bgertzfield> thanks again. I'll use pbuilder next time
[06:41] <Mithrandir> pbuilder builds in a chroot and only installs the build-deps + Essential: yes, Priority: required and build-essential
[06:41] <bgertzfield> got it. makes sense
[06:41] <tseng> hi Mithrandir 
[06:42] <bgertzfield> will use it next time; last time I did a lot of Debian packages (che@debian.org :) was before that existed
[06:42] <Mithrandir> yeah, Junichi wrote it just a few years back, iirc.
[06:42] <Mithrandir> hiya yse
[06:42] <Mithrandir> uh
[06:42] <Mithrandir> hiya tseng 
[06:42] <tseng> good one
[06:42] <bgertzfield> yeah
[06:42] <Mithrandir> so much for misaligned fingers and tab-completion
[06:43] <bgertzfield> hm
[06:43] <bgertzfield> wait a sec, why is vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 trying to build on sparc?
[06:44] <ajmitch> morning Mithrandir 
[06:44] <bgertzfield> oh, it was trying to build the architecture-independent package (the kernel source) -- it also failed for the missing bzip2 dependency
[06:44] <bgertzfield> never mind. :)
[06:44] <bgertzfield> I'm pretty sure that's okay
[06:44] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: it's supposed to be masked off.  Anyway, you don't support sparc, so no need to fix that before release.
[06:45] <bgertzfield> the architecture-dependent binary packages are masked off correctly
[06:46] <bgertzfield> it was just trying to build the m-i source .deb
[06:46] <Mithrandir> no, since that's, iirc, done in Packages-arch-Specific which is a file handled by the buildd people.
[06:46] <bgertzfield> oh!
[06:46] <bgertzfield> I see
[06:46] <Mithrandir> infinity: ^^ correct me if I'm wrong
[06:46] <bgertzfield> yeah, I was wondering who handled that
[06:47] <bgertzfield> anyway, I truly appreciate how flexible all the Ubuntu folks have been
[06:48] <Mithrandir> np
[06:48] <Mithrandir> :-)
[06:48] <bgertzfield> I'll be furiously hitting my web browser's "reload" button on the buildd log ;)
[06:49] <Mithrandir> it needs to be published first, which is a process that starts at about :02 and ends ~20 minutes later before it'll start building
[06:49] <Mithrandir> so I'd recommend getting yourself a cup of coffee, tea or similar first.
[06:49] <bgertzfield> I see. good timing for us then
[06:49] <bgertzfield> I will go for "similar". :D
[06:54] <Mithrandir> I'm off for a bit, see you later.
[07:37] <pitti> Good morning
[07:38] <bgertzfield> howdy
[07:42] <glatzor> ping mdz
[07:54] <bgertzfield> Woo hoo!!
[07:54] <bgertzfield> i386 build of vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 2.6.15.10-4 in ubuntu dapper
[07:54] <bgertzfield> Requested 2006-05-30 05:40:02 UTC in pocket RELEASE
[07:54] <bgertzfield> Built 2006-05-30 05:45:03 UTC by vernadsky (i386) in two minutes
[07:54] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: Thanks so much.
[08:18] <bgertzfield> OK, off to bed.
[08:45] <highvoltage> Seveas: i like the monthly update iso idea too
[08:52] <mvo> Kamion, mdz: I would like to upload a new app-install-commercial-data (small package, only data file changes). is this still ok?
[08:53] <pitti> infinity: ping
[08:56] <infinity> pitti: Good morning.
[08:56] <pitti> infinity: it seems that yesterday's uploads (langpacks, other pkgs, whatever) used up the 5 MB margin and filled the CDs up to the rim; the ppc one is 702 MB, but there is no oversized tag - which is wrong, the missing tag or the size?
[08:56] <pitti> infinity: good morning
[08:59] <infinity> Mithrandir: Thanks for taking care of the vmware-player-kernel FTFBS.  You're a champion.
[08:59] <Mithrandir> infinity: np
[08:59] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: yay. :-)
[09:00] <infinity> pitti: You'd have to ask Kamion, who's got the exact size memorised because he's a freak, but 702MB is probably not quite oversized yet.
[09:01] <pitti> infinity: but in theory, the .OVERSIZED tag should be correct?
[09:02] <pitti> (and its absence)
[09:02] <dholbach> hello pitti - hello everybody
[09:02] <dholbach> heya mvo
[09:03] <infinity> pitti: That's a fine theory, yes.  I'll not commit to that, since I don't know the debian-cd internals as well as Kamion or Sledge. :)
[09:10] <Kamion> Mithrandir: you hacked vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15's debian/control instead of debian/control.in
[09:10] <Kamion> (although it built anyway)
[09:11] <Mithrandir> Kamion: autogenerated control.ins are teh suck.  (I didn't even see the control.in)
[09:11] <Mithrandir> s/in//
[09:12] <Kamion> pitti: max size is 736051200 (see http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/bzr/cdimage/mainline/bin/publish-daily - I let my scripts memorise things for me)
[09:13] <Kamion> pitti: but for install CDs, you need to search for "CD 2 will only" in the build log too, to make sure debian-cd didn't try to overflow to a second CD
[09:13] <pitti> Kamion: so 702 MB would actually be okay?
[09:13] <pitti> Kamion: right, I know, the install CDs are fine
[09:13] <Kamion> yes, the current powerpc live CD is about 400K inside the limit
[09:14] <pitti> Kamion: ok; I can still upload a new -meta to fix the ia64 overflow
[09:14] <Kamion> mvo: what's the app-install-commercial-data change?
[09:15] <Kamion> pitti: erk, it's late for that, but ok
[09:15] <mvo> Kamion: it add a vendor with a 3rd party repository (omnis webstudio)
[09:15] <mvo> Kamion: only data files, 9kb package
[09:15] <Kamion> mvo: that sounds like it can be done in -updates
[09:15] <pitti> Kamion: since we have to roll new CDs anyway... (but I don't have to, was just a proposal)
[09:16] <infinity> Kamion: New artwork's still being done anyway, so as long as the new app-install-data and ubuntu-meta beat the artwork in, no harm done.
[09:16] <Kamion> pitti: if it's before the next cron.daily ...
[09:16] <Kamion> infinity: oh, point
[09:16] <Kamion> mvo: ok, do it quickly
[09:16] <pitti> Kamion: alright
[09:16] <mvo> Kamion: it is ready now,  will upload now
[09:16] <mvo> Kamion: thanks
[09:25] <crimsun> Kamion: are uploads to universe still acceptable for issues like "segfaults on start but trivial patch fixes it", or is that more -updates material?
[09:26] <dholbach> crimsun: that kind of stuff is ok
[09:27] <crimsun> dholbach: ok, just wanted to check before I uploaded, thanks
[09:27] <dholbach> thank you
[09:29] <infinity> Can anyone who's awake quickly install http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/ubuntu-artwork_28_all.deb then log out and log back in and let me know if it's buggy in any way?
[09:29] <infinity> There's a certain sense of urgency on this one. :)
[09:33] <Burgundavia> infinity, menus appear fine. I see you changed a few logos :)
[09:34] <infinity> I did no such thing, this is more sabdfl and dholbach work. :)
[09:34] <infinity> But it's also the final ubuntu-artwork package, if it seems to work.
[09:34] <pitti> infinity: yay for the old distributor logo
[09:34] <Mithrandir> infinity: seems to work for me.
[09:34] <infinity> Anyhow, looks good on my end, except for the "tab close" bug that I think we're resigned to not having fixed before we release.
[09:35] <mvo> infinity: the tab close button in gedit?
[09:35] <infinity> Oh, yay, the "stop" icon isn't flat anymore, either!
[09:35] <infinity> mvo: gedit, gaim, epiphany, notification bubbles, etc.
[09:35] <mvo> yes, that looks ... not nice
[09:35] <Burgundavia> infinity, I see no visual flaws with menus, logout, and any apps that use gnome icons
[09:38] <infinity> Anyone else?
[09:39] <infinity> Okay, I'll wait for more success stories and/or bug reports until 08:00 UTC, then I'll upload to make cron.daily.
[09:40] <pitti> infinity: I can't see any obvious breakage
[09:40] <G0SUB> pitti: hello!
[09:40] <pitti> hello G0SUB 
[09:41] <G0SUB> pitti: I guess you are my mentor for SoC?
[09:41] <pitti> G0SUB: indeed I am :) I'll send you an official introduction mail today
[09:41] <G0SUB> pitti: that's great
[09:42] <G0SUB> pitti: I will start working on the design from today ... will put up my ideas on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OfflineUpdateSpec/DesignDiscussion
[09:42] <pitti> G0SUB: sounds good! thanks
[09:43] <G0SUB> infinity: why did the logout option disappear from System menu?
[09:43] <G0SUB> pitti: ok
[09:43] <pitti> G0SUB: !
[09:43] <pitti> G0SUB: it's still here for me; the only thing that vanished a while ago is the Lock Screen item
[09:44] <G0SUB> pitti: I don't see either
[09:44] <triceratops> infinity: are you aware of bug #47371 (fglrx API ERROR). I'm asking because I'm not sure if it's worth filling a bug report against restricted modules itself..
[09:44] <G0SUB> pitti: my dist-upgrade is a couple of days old though, may be it came back
[09:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47371 in Ubuntu "Can't start openoffice or blender after update to dapper" [Major,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47371
[09:44] <infinity> G0SUB: It turned into "Quit..."... Do you not have that?
[09:45] <infinity> pitti: How's that -meta upload going?
[09:45] <G0SUB> infinity: I can see that, but logout in that menu would need fewer keystrokes for me
[09:45] <pitti> infinity: uploaded some minutes ago
[09:45] <G0SUB> infinity: may be it's better for many people. it's fine
[09:46] <G0SUB> btw, the update notifier icon looks out of the place ... it's not at all Tango-ish
[09:46] <infinity> triceratops: Curious.  It works here, with lrm-686 and the latest fglrx.
[09:46] <jdub> hrm, who was it that updated wine yesterday?
[09:46] <jdub> 17:42 < tigert> hmm
[09:46] <jdub> 17:42 < tigert> wine stopped working on my dapper
[09:46] <jdub> 17:42 < tigert> interesting
[09:46] <jdub> 
[09:47] <infinity> triceratops: Maybe someone just needs to reboot after having installed the latest LRM to get the kernel and X driver to match?
[09:47] <infinity> G0SUB: Yeah, I'm not too happy with the update-notifier icons either, but at least they're not buggy/broken, so we can ship with them.
[09:48] <infinity> G0SUB: Now's not the time to whine about bad art, just bitch loudly about anything that's actually BROKEN. :)
[09:48] <G0SUB> infinity: yes, I agree. it's solid, so it's fine
[09:49] <jdub> sladen: PING
[09:50] <jdub> 17:50 < tigert> $ wine GNC400WT.EXE
[09:50] <jdub> 17:50 < tigert> err:ntdll:RtlpWaitForCriticalSection section 0x7fced940 "syslevel.c: Win16Mutex" wait timed out in thread 0009, blocked by 000a, retrying (60 sec)
[09:50] <jdub> worked before yesterday's update
[09:50] <jdub> http://librarian.launchpad.net/2974258/wine_0.9.9-0ubuntu2_i386.changes
[09:51] <jdub> 17:50 < tigert> picasa also stopped working
[09:51] <jdub> (picasa ships its own, so... hrm...)
[09:52] <crimsun> infinity: 28 looks fine to me, no regressions from 27
[09:52] <infinity> Okay, new (and hopefully final) ubuntu-artwork uploaded.
[09:56] <jdub> heh
[09:57] <jdub> dholbach: "- updated." -> stikes fear into the heart of u-a lovers. ;-)
[09:59] <infinity> And now we begin with this whole business of releasing an OS....
[10:00] <triceratops> infinity: Back again... fglrx error apears after reboot.
[10:01] <infinity> triceratops: Bizarre, but not something I can do anything about before release, unfortunately.
[10:01] <infinity> triceratops: Even more bizarre that I'm running identical packages to at least one person commenting in the log, and don't see the bug.
[10:02] <mvo> wb dholbach
[10:02] <triceratops> infinity: linux-restricted-modules-2.6.15-23-k7 ?
[10:02] <infinity> triceratops: You never had the ATI packages installed at any point, did you?  That could lead to breakage due to files going missing, etc.
[10:02] <dholbach> thanks mvo
[10:02] <infinity> triceratops: No, I'm using -686, but so was one of the followup comments.
[10:02] <infinity> dholbach: -artwork uploaded, for better or worse.  This is it.
[10:02] <triceratops> This is on a dapper machine and fglrx works till the last upgrade..
[10:03] <infinity> triceratops: I get that.  There's also nothing I can do about it right now.
[10:03] <infinity> triceratops: I'll follow up to the bug post-release, and we'll see if there's anything I can fix in dapper-updates, but for now, this is it.
[10:04] <infinity> triceratops: Note that, like I said, it does work for me, and a large number of other who tested it for me, so I suspect some sort of curious local breakage.
[10:06] <triceratops> infinity: I don't think it is a local brakage due to the fact thatz it is a test machine I installed last sunday from the latest dayl build iso and only did tthe last upgrade
[10:07] <triceratops> infinity: anything I can do to give you more input to trace this?
[10:08] <infinity> triceratops: Probably, but it'll have to wait until June 1.  Seriously.  Changes to dapper are closed.
[10:11] <infinity> triceratops: What model card do you have in that machine?
[10:11] <triceratops> infinity: Ok, I'll be back on thursday. BTW which timezone is yours? :-))
[10:11] <infinity> triceratops: There are reports of breakage on older (r200, aka 9200 and friends) cards.  It's an upstream bug.
[10:12] <triceratops> infinity: R200 514D, Radeon 9100
[10:12] <infinity> triceratops: Of course, the new driver fixed problems on some newer cards, so it's a catch-22.  Can't make everyone happy. :/
[10:13] <triceratops> infinity: Grumble, damned proprietary sh...
[10:14] <triceratops> infinity: nevertheless, thanks a lot. bye
[10:26] <sivang> re all
[10:27] <pitti> hi sivang 
[10:27] <pitti> hey seb128 
[10:28] <seb128> Hey pitti
[10:31] <infinity> pitti: Should openoffice-l10n have a source-level seed in supported, so the binaries don't show up in anastacia?
[10:31] <infinity> pitti: http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/anastacia.txt
[10:33] <infinity> CD images will start building in ~60 mins, after a build-and-publisher cycle.
[10:33] <\sh> moins
[10:33] <infinity> (And I should be back by then)
[10:33] <pitti> infinity: actually, they should be dependencies of language-support-*
[10:33] <seb128> did we get stock close and distributors icons fixed?
[10:33] <pitti> infinity: however, these packagages seem to have appeared just recently
[10:33] <infinity> seb128: Distributor, yes, the "tab close" thing is deferred to -updates. :/
[10:34] <infinity> pitti: Well, -l10n was FTBFS until just over a week ago.
[10:34] <pitti> infinity: if you are fine with that, I'll upload new l-support-* packages for them (they aren't on CDs)
[10:34] <seb128> infinity: "deferred"? why don't reverting?
[10:34] <infinity> seb128: Ask the sab, dude.  Not me.
[10:34] <seb128> that's a mistake we are doing ...
[10:34] <infinity> pitti: Yes, please do.
[10:34] <seb128> all those liveCD will look ugly :/
[10:35] <infinity> Keybuk: Here's your big chance to drive the manual-queue on pitti's language-support uploads. :)
[10:35] <Kinnison> pitti: do you need me to do a mass upload of langpacks?
[10:36] <infinity> Kinnison: No, no.  langpacks are finalised.  He's just fixing some metapackages.
[10:36] <Keybuk> infinity: gee, thanks
[10:36] <Kinnison> infinity: oh righty
[10:36] <sladen> jdub: pong
[10:36] <infinity> Keybuk: If nothing else is in incoming (which should be the case), you can just cheat and run lp_queue's disabled cronjob by hand, instead of doing the move/process/move thing.
[10:37] <pitti> Kinnison, infinity: I don't mind uploading the l-support-* packagages directly; it's not that many, and the changelog might be useful to someone
[10:37] <mdz> pitti: more language-support updates?
[10:38] <sladen> jdub: oh joy.  ta.
[10:38] <pitti> mdz: infinity just pointed me to the number of new help and l10n packages which appeared some days ago (sorry, I wasn't aware of them)
[10:38] <pitti> mdz: however, they aren't on CDs, so should be uncritical
[10:40] <Mithrandir> aiee, mixing of english and norwegian text in "about ubuntu". That looks _really_ bad.
[10:40] <mdz> ogra: have you verified the fix for bug #46426 in a recent CD build?
[10:40] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46426 in ltsp "Xubuntu install CD install ltsp" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46426
[10:41] <sladen> can somebody do  grep -c wine /etc/mailcap   It appears that  dh_installmime  didn't run 'update-mime' on postrm
[10:42] <sladen> (at least on this laptop)
[10:43] <jdub> sladen: don't worry, that wasn't it
[10:43] <jdub> sladen: talk to tigert on #gnome-hackers to make sure
[10:44] <mvo> hello Riddell, are you around? I was wondering if the dr-konqui has a external program that you can run "wrap around" a normal application and catch SIGSEGV (gnome has gnome_segv for this)
[10:46] <pitti> Keybuk: I'm ready to upload the updated l-support-* stuff, can I just dput them?
[10:48] <pitti> Keybuk, infinity: uploaded; to packs do not match a valid locale, so we need to see them manually (I'll do that now)
[10:48] <infinity> Okay, back with brainfood.
[10:49] <pitti> erm, s/see/seed/
[10:50] <Keybuk> pitti: yes, you can just dput
[10:51] <Keybuk> of course, _I_ would have uploaded them all at once, rather than individually :p
[10:51] <pitti> Keybuk: ?
[10:52] <pitti> Keybuk: oh, that's just how langpack-o-matic does it right now
[10:52] <Keybuk> ls ... *zoooom* ... ok, so I need less
[10:54] <infinity> yay for 8 rejects...
[10:54] <Keybuk> yeah
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094824-005547/language-support-ar_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094825-005550/language-support-km_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094826-005552/language-support-lo_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094826-005554/language-support-lv_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <pitti> infinity: known bug
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094827-005556/language-support-mk_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094828-005558/language-support-ml_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <pitti> but cosmetical
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094828-005560/language-support-ne_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <infinity> ./rejected/upload-20060530-094830-005564/language-support-sl_6.06+20060413_source.changes
[10:55] <infinity> pitti: ^^^
[10:55] <infinity> Err, what? :)
[10:55] <infinity> Rejected uploads are cosmetic bugs?
[10:56] <pitti> infinity: bug 44186
[10:56] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 44186 in soyuz "language-support-* upload generates rejected mail for old version" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/44186
[10:56] <pitti> infinity: the curent version is accepted, and this ancient one from 0413 keeps being rejected on every new upload
[10:56] <mdz> bizarre
[10:56] <Keybuk> oh wow
[10:56] <infinity> Oh, that's weird.  I didn't even check the timestamp or version.
[10:57] <infinity> Though it was a fresh entry in the upload queue.
[10:57] <Keybuk> he's right, he never uploaded those rejected packages
[10:57] <infinity> That's awesome.
[10:58] <Keybuk> rejects ... "rm -rf *" ... what rejects
[10:59] <sladen> OMG, yet-another-aweful-menu-icon-logo  *sigh*
[10:59] <pitti> infinity: ok, I seeded the remaining two oo.o-l10n-* packagages which do not fit into any l-support-*, so anastacia should be clean again
[10:59] <infinity> pitti: Thanks, you are The Man.
[11:00] <mvo> where would be a good place to ask why python seems to be unable to catch SIGSEGV (with the signal modul) - is there a python channel?
[11:00] <Keybuk> mvo: uh... POSIX?
[11:00] <infinity> mvo: I find that whining at spiv gets all my python questions answered.
[11:00] <mvo> Keybuk: #POSIX ;)
[11:03] <sivang> mvo: gjc and jhdalin might know in #pygtk, they helped me greatly in my subprocess questions in HUB
[11:04] <mvo> Keybuk: can you elaborate please?
[11:05] <Keybuk> mvo: there's conditions on how and when you can catch SEGV isn't there?
[11:05] <Keybuk> I may be confusing SEGV and KILL though
[11:06] <infinity> You may be.
[11:06] <mvo> Keybuk: hm, I guess I need to look into my stevens again, but I was though it was KILL
[11:06] <Kinnison> Keybuk: IIRC you can't catch SEGV from a SEGV
[11:07] <Kinnison> SEGV is very catchable
[11:07] <Treenaks> Kinnison: if the first thing you do in the handler is to reset the handler..
[11:07] <Kinnison> Treenaks: true
[11:08] <mdz> infinity: this publisher run should bring everything into sync, yes?
[11:08] <infinity> Okay, NEW queue is empty, anastacia is empty, and we're on the last publisher run required for CD images...
[11:08] <infinity> mdz: See above. :)
[11:08] <Keybuk> ah, no, you can catch SEGV just don't return from the signal handler
[11:08] <Keybuk> I was confusing SEGV and KILL
[11:14] <infinity> Okay, all CD-related cronjobs are disabled.
[11:16] <infinity> The entire DC is in manual mode, now... 
[11:16] <infinity> (That's right, elmo has to type all downloads, bit by bit, so be patient)
[11:17] <sivang> poor elmo 
[11:17] <sivang> ;-)
[11:17] <Znarl> ...I hope he doesn't delegate this.
[11:17] <infinity> Znarl: You can't type at 1Gb/s?
[11:18] <sivang> lol
[11:18] <Treenaks> infinity: keyboard repeat++
[11:18] <Znarl> infinity : I start to typo at around 800Mb/s
[11:19] <infinity> Znarl: Poor flow control?
[11:20] <\sh> I wonder if we get the possibility to create an ubuntu/kubuntu mirror here in our DC...20GBit/s is the highest bandwidth for one internet service company here in .de
[11:22] <Znarl> \sh : join #ubuntu-mirrors if you need assistance setting it up.
[11:31] <ogra> mdz, i havent verified bug 46426 (got no xubuntu CD here) but janimo can
[11:31] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46426 in ltsp "Xubuntu install CD install ltsp" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46426
[11:32] <janimo> ogra: this was reported fixed for RC
[11:32] <janimo> oh I tested Rc too and it was gone
[11:32] <ogra> good
[11:33] <janimo> ogra: I got no feedback from the xfce /ltsp testers yet
[11:33] <infinity> Let the CD making begin!
[11:34] <fabbione> infinity: did the last publisher run?
[11:34] <ogra> excitement !
[11:34] <fabbione> infinity: are we in manual mode now??
[11:35] <infinity> fabbione: We're manual now.  I'm spinning CDs as we speak.
[11:35] <fabbione> infinity: ok.
[11:35] <jsgotangco> great anticipation, intense moment!
[11:36] <infinity> A (very long) drum roll, please!
[11:37] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: why isn't the date for the current DVD on testing/short updated?
[11:37] <Mithrandir> s/short/current/
[11:38] <infinity> Mithrandir: Can we get the tables completely cleared and update the build number to 20060530.1?
[11:38] <infinity> (At least, I think they'll all have the build number when I'm done)
[11:39] <Mithrandir> infinity: you're doing DVD builds too?
[11:39] <infinity> Okay, not everything will.  Some will be 20060530
[11:39] <infinity> I'll let you know as they roll in. :)
[11:39] <infinity> Mithrandir: Yeah, I'll do DVDs last.
[11:40] <\sh> Singing: It's the final countdown...(Old 80ties Europe song, for those who were not born these days)
[11:40] <infinity> (To make them match the livefses)
[11:40] <Mithrandir> ok, I'll twiddle my thumbs and watch the logs, then
[11:41] <infinity> Oh, cute, soyuz sends the accepted mail to the GPG signer.  Never noticed that before.
[11:41] <infinity> Guess I've never sponsored someone else's upload since the switch.
[11:41] <infinity> Or I just don't pay attention.
[11:41] <sivang> \sh: one of my favorites
[11:42] <sivang> shock, een
[11:42] <sivang> even, even
[11:42] <Mithrandir> sivang: electric eel?
[11:43] <sivang> Mithrandir: thanks
[11:43] <Mithrandir> at least I think they can.  Maybe others can too
[11:44] <\sh> you know guys, I'm totally on crack...I'm compiling an ubuntu kernel on a sles9 box, and packaging all the crack into an rpm, for having a good working and running kernel...I'm mentally ill somehow
[11:44] <infinity> \sh: Why compile it again?  Just tear apart the binary package and re-pack it as an RPM.
[11:44] <infinity> \sh: Then you'll know it's identical.
[11:45] <G0SUB> infinity: the latest ubuntu-artwork rocks big time ... it's awesome
[11:45] <infinity> (Reminds me of the scary "identical deb and rpm" method of calling debian/rules from the .spec file..)
[11:45] <sivang> ohh
[11:45] <sivang> that sounds like horror
[11:46] <infinity> Works pretty weell, actually, just it LOOKS just plain wrong.
[11:46] <sivang> I bet it feels wrong as well
[11:46] <sivang> (when doing it)
[11:46] <Gloubiboulga> ogra, janimo, highvoltage has tested a daily xubuntu build (alternate install) iirc, and asked for ltsp installation... which fails
[11:47] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: oh sad :(
[11:47] <janimo> how does it fail?
[11:47] <janimo> highvoltage: ping ^
[11:47] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, unable to configure the chroot I think
[11:50] <Gloubiboulga> janimo, bug #47278
[11:50] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47278 in ltsp "Xubuntu chroot building fails on daily install" [Major,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47278
[11:50] <janimo> Gloubiboulga: thanks
[11:51] <\sh> infinity: because I packaged my first kernel rpm package...just for the fun of it..time is money ;)
[11:57] <dholbach> Gloubiboulga, janimo: you guys didn't rebuild the tang* packages and didn't do the icon-naming-utils patch - i fear it might be too late soon
[11:57] <janimo> dholbach: it's ok
[11:57] <dholbach> Gloubiboulga, janimo: but I daresay you have more pressing matters
[11:57] <pitti> infinity: you know that u-artwork on at least the latest (30.1) altearnate CD is still at 27?
[11:58] <infinity> pitti: Don't say that.
[11:58] <pitti> Hi Kamion 
[11:58] <Keybuk> Kamion: hi!
[11:58] <janimo> dholbach: any matter in particular or just release pressure in general?
[11:58] <pitti> infinity: jigdo didn't download *any* new package compared to 30, I verified the md5sum, and the file list
[11:58] <dholbach> janimo: no, I just thought you're busy with more important stuff :)
[11:58] <pitti> infinity: same for ppc
[11:58] <janimo> dholbach: yup
[11:58] <infinity> /pool/main/u/ubuntu-artwork/ubuntu-artwork_27_all.deb
[11:58] <infinity> Argh.
[11:59] <\sh> hmm...to enabled selinux via kernel parameter, I need to feed the kernel append line the "selinux=1" parameter?
[11:59] <pitti> ubuntu-artwork |         27 | http://archive.ubuntu.com dapper/main Packages
[11:59] <pitti> ubuntu-artwork |         28 | http://archive.ubuntu.com dapper/main Sources
[11:59] <infinity> Kamion: Is lithium not doing the pre-build mirror run properly?
[11:59] <pitti> infinity: ^ seems it wasn't yet published?
[11:59] <ajmitch> \sh: correct, and then watch everything still not work :)
[11:59] <infinity> pitti: It was published a good 10 minutes before I kicked off the build.
[12:00] <Keybuk> ubuntu-artwork |         28 |        dapper | source, all
[12:00] <Keybuk> infinity: sure? :p
[12:00] <infinity> Keybuk: Yes, positive.
[12:01] <infinity> Keybuk: It was published around half an hour ago, the 30.1 build was started 5 or 10 minutes after that.
[12:01] <Keybuk> it's not in the published archive
[12:01] <infinity> Err, of course it is.
[12:01] <infinity> source, all
[12:01] <infinity> It's an arch:all package.
[12:02] <Kamion> infinity: only reason it would skip the mirror run is if there was another build in progress (or it thought there was)
[12:02] <infinity> Oh, feh.  The publisher crashed.
[12:02] <Keybuk> ahh
[12:02] <infinity> Danm it all to...
[12:02] <Keybuk> yeah, it's sitting the pool
[12:03] <infinity> I only looked in the pool during the publisher run, I didn't actually check the publisher's logs to make sure it, y'know, did its job.
[12:03] <infinity> Feh.
[12:04] <\sh> ajmitch: ok
[12:04] <ajmitch> \sh: init won't load the policy, and you need newer userspace tools/libs to work with the newer reference policy
[12:05] <infinity> Okay, that's messed up.
[12:05] <infinity> The log doesn't show it crashing.  It shows the deb being added, and apt-ftparchive running...
[12:05] <infinity> And then we don't get it published.
[12:06] <infinity> But nothing from that run actually got in.. -meta didn't either.
[12:06] <ogra> whee, there is CC meeting this evening ? 
[12:07] <infinity> Double-U Tee Eff.
[12:07] <Kamion> ogra: in theory ...
[12:07] <ogra> yeah, but thats an optimistc theory :)
[12:09] <Kamion> infinity: sounds like the mirrors are screwed; Packages on drescher is correct
[12:09] <Kamion> Znarl: help
[12:09] <Kamion> ubuntu-artwork |         28 |        dapper | source, all
[12:09] <infinity> Kamion: But lithium mirrors from drescher, no?
[12:11] <Kamion> nope, from syncproxy
[12:11] <infinity> Ahh, kay.
[12:11] <infinity> I use ftpmaster.internal for the livefs builds...
[12:11] <Kamion> see cdimage/etc/anonftpsync
[12:11] <infinity> And they look correct, so I don't have to re-do them.  Phew.
[12:12] <Kamion> switching to ftpmaster.internal would mean I'd have to sort out ports exclusion and crap
[12:12] <infinity> So, when the mirror issue is sorted, we can just do ISOs.
[12:12] <infinity> Kamion: Or just have one mirror on drescher, instead of the main and ports mirror?
[12:13] <infinity> Kamion: What's the harm in having a unified mirror?
[12:13] <infinity> Kamion: It's not like hppa debs are going to jump onto an i386 CD...
[12:14] <infinity> Err, so/on drescher/on lithium/
[12:14] <Kamion> right, but let's not change it over *now* ...
[12:14] <infinity> That sentence makes way more sense without that thinko.
[12:14] <infinity> Kamion: No, no.  Not now.  Just saying "sometime".. :)
[12:14] <Kamion> ftpmaster.internal seems to require auth for rsync
[12:14] <Kamion> guess it needs configuration to allow lithium
[12:14] <infinity> Kamion: Easily fixed, though.
[12:15] <infinity> Znarl: Daaaa-aaaad!  Our toy is brooo-oooken!
[12:15] <\sh> ajmitch: well, it was booting without any problems right now...lets see what our security guy is doing
[12:18] <Kamion> infinity: you did fix that debconf/frontend issue with livecd-rootfs, didn't you?
[12:19] <infinity> Kamion: Yes, though untested.
[12:19] <Kamion> ok
[12:19] <infinity> Kamion: Should be fixed on current dailies (and the build we're about to do), if you want to make a note to check that in your testing.
[12:20] <infinity> Kamion: Do you want to drive lithium for alternate build when you're sure the mirroring situation is sorted?
[12:20] <infinity> Kamion: I'll keep babysitting the world of live/desktop.
[12:21] <infinity> s/build/builds/
[12:23] <Kamion> infinity: sure
[12:23] <Kamion> pitti: libextractor is funny
[12:23] <Kamion>      - no longer using xpdf code: Christian wrote a PDF extractor himself, so we
[12:23] <Kamion>        do not longer import security problems from xpdf.
[12:23] <Kamion> OUR ONE WON'T HAVE ANY SECURITY PROBLEMS
[12:24] <infinity> To be fair, it's hard to have as many security problems as xpdf has had.
[12:25] <infinity> 20 monkeys, 5 typewriters, and a case of scotch could produce safer code.
[12:25] <ajmitch> \sh: oh it'll boot fine, just without having a policy
[12:28] <\sh> ajmitch: we are creating a policy by ourself ;)
[12:28] <Kamion> dholbach: did you ever check out kleansweep for bug 40126?
[12:28] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 40126 in Ubuntu "Dapper AptGetOrg import." [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/40126
[12:28] <ajmitch> \sh: that's great, but with what tools?
[12:29] <dholbach> Kamion: not yet - looking now
[12:30] <dholbach> Kamion: let's drop that one
[12:30] <dholbach> Kamion: thanks for your work and for reminding me
[12:31] <\sh> setools, if this is not working I'm compiling new versions somehow...let's see what we find out :)
[12:32] <ajmitch> \sh: you'll have to, and you'll probably end up having to get new libs, including ones that live in the initramfs, recompiling init, etc :)
[12:32] <ajmitch> \sh: hence why it didn't make feature freeze
[12:34] <Kamion> dholbach: ok, can I close the bug out then?
[12:34] <dholbach> Kamion: yeah
[12:34] <sladen> mjg59: which package is /sbin/pccardctl in?  It's unconditionally called from acpi-support but it's not installed (this machine, or the bug reporter's)
[12:34] <infinity> (base)adconrad@cthulhu:~/x/xorg-7.0.0$ dpkg -S /sbin/pccardctl
[12:34] <infinity> pcmciautils: /sbin/pccardctl
[12:38] <mdz> janimo: thanks for confirming, DRR updated
[12:40] <janimo> highvoltage: ping
[12:41] <highvoltage> janimo: pong
[12:41] <janimo> highvoltage: hi, I just saw the ltsp but today
[12:41] <janimo> as I was not subscribed
[12:41] <janimo> was there anything else in /var/log/installer?
[12:42] <highvoltage> janimo: no, there wasn't
[12:42] <highvoltage> janimo: ogra told me to include it if it exists, but it didn't
[12:42] <janimo> I don;t think I can debug this having never installed a ltsp server
[12:42] <janimo> or anything ltsp for that matter
[12:42] <highvoltage> janimo: i can rsync again, and test if it happens again today
[12:43] <janimo> highvoltage: nothing changed since yesterday AFAIK
[12:43] <highvoltage> janimo: ogra had an idea what it was about, apperently the same problem came up in edubuntu
[12:43] <janimo> was the computer connected to the net?
[12:43] <janimo> just in case some packages were missing froom the CD
[12:43] <highvoltage> no, it wasn't
[12:43] <highvoltage> hmmm.. perhaps that was the case.
[12:43] <highvoltage> ogra: ping
[12:44] <janimo> Kamion: do you know if for the packages you added manually (as opposed to in the seeds) for the ltsp xfce menu, the deps are also included?
[12:44] <janimo> if not that may be the case. Since I found out recently that ldm depends on gnome libs, so if they are not installed the whole thing might fail
[12:45] <highvoltage> hmmm.. i think you should ping ogra as soon as he's available. i think he could provide some insight there. in the meantime, i'll so an installation again, and check the output on the other tty's, i was too much in a rush to think about checking that yesterday
[12:46] <\sh> ajmitch: you just agreed to help me with selinux...thx ;)
[12:46] <ogra> janimo, the only intresting bit to debug the client builder itself is /var/log/instakller/messages, indeed /var/log/installer/syslog might have additional info but thats from the installer, not the client-builter itself...
[12:47] <janimo> highvoltage: thanks
[12:47] <ogra> highvoltage, i'm available since some hours :)+
[12:48] <highvoltage> ogra: okay :)
[12:48] <Kamion> infinity: FYI, I think we might have to respin for bug 46961 anyway
[12:48] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46961 in ubiquity "Gparted should return "1 Cancel" when its operation fails" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46961
[12:48] <Kamion> janimo: they're in the ship seed, so germinate will take care of that
[12:48] <highvoltage> ogra: can you remember what you suspected the xubuntu ltsp problem to be? janimo needs some more information.
[12:48] <Kamion> janimo: (aren't they?)
[12:49] <ogra> highvoltage, i have no clue at all without any log
[12:49] <janimo> Kamion: ok, yeah they are, I moved them around for a while and forgot if they stayed in ship. thanks
[12:49] <highvoltage> ogra: you said something about you bet it's the same problem we had in... (and i can't remember anything after that)
[12:49] <janimo> highvoltage: irclogs ;)
[12:50] <ogra> highvoltage, which i also get no logs for :P
[12:50] <infinity> Kamion: Damn.
[12:50] <ogra> highvoltage, expert install
[12:50] <ajmitch> \sh: lucky me
[12:51] <janimo> infinity: can you let through xubuntu-default-settings (stuck in the queue). It's ok if not too, it's just last moment icon and text color changes
[12:52] <infinity> janimo: Will do.
[12:52] <janimo> infinity: thanks
[12:52] <infinity> janimo: You're lucky Kamion's bug is worth halting for. :)
[12:52] <janimo> :)
[12:53] <Kamion> ogra: /var/log/messages is obsolete in dapper, FYI - if you're using it, please switch to /var/log/syslog (preferably using log-output)
[12:54] <infinity> Kamion: How long will it take to get a fix tested for that bug?
[12:54] <Kamion> (obsolete in the installer, to clarify)
[12:54] <Kamion> infinity: ... a while; no ETA yet :(
[12:54] <infinity> Kamion: Fair enough.
[12:55] <Kamion> we have a vmware clone here on which I can more or less reproduce it
[12:55] <infinity> Kamion: Isolated where the fix needs to be, or do you need more eyes?
[12:55] <Keybuk> Listing ubuntu/dapper (NEW) 0/0
[12:55] <Keybuk> ... c0r
[12:55] <Keybuk> Columns: number-out-of-date, number-newer-than-source, arch
[12:55] <Keybuk>        0    0 amd64
[12:55] <Keybuk>        0    0 i386
[12:55] <Keybuk>        0    0 powerpc
[12:55] <Keybuk> cute
[12:55] <infinity> Keybuk: Yeah, fancy isn't it.
[12:55] <fabbione> Keybuk: sparc?
[12:55] <Keybuk> fabbione: ENOBRITNEY
[12:55] <infinity> Keybuk: dapper_probs.html is finally clean too.
[12:56] <fabbione> Keybuk: whops
[12:56] <infinity> fabbione: http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/testing-ports/dapper_outdate.txt
[12:56] <Kamion> infinity: more or less, but feel free to look - problem is in gparted, note how Apply_Operation_To_Disk is void
[12:56] <infinity> fabbione: The only outdates in ports are a really longstanding guile FTBFS, and the gdb FTBFS tha tI ran out of time to help DaveM debug.
[12:56] <infinity> fabbione: otherwise, all good.
[12:57] <fabbione> hmm
[12:57] <fabbione> there are some OO.o bits that can't be installed anylonger on sparc
[12:57] <fabbione> W T #!?
[12:58] <highvoltage> people who run on sparc uses OO.o?
[12:58] <fabbione> highvoltage: when it's faster than amd64? yes
[12:58] <ogra> highvoltage, yes, the ltsp users :P
[01:01] <infinity> openoffice.org | 2.0.2-2ubuntu12 |        dapper | source, i386, powerpc
[01:01] <infinity> WTF?
[01:01] <infinity> fabbione: That's the source of the problem...
[01:01] <infinity> Oh.  It landed in universe for sparc.  Hah.
[01:01] <infinity> Fixing.
[01:01] <fabbione> ah thanks
[01:01] <infinity> We really need a tool to find stuff like that.
[01:01] <fabbione> that should set the counter for sparc to 0
[01:01] <Kamion> fabbione: ok, sparc should move from testing-ports output to testing at the next run
[01:02] <fabbione> Kamion: thanks dude
[01:02] <highvoltage> janimo, ogra: i got it
[01:02] <ogra> you got it ? 
[01:02] <ogra> tell us
[01:02] <highvoltage> E: Package esound has no installation candidate
[01:02] <ogra> aha
[01:02] <highvoltage> ogra: the error ^^^
[01:02] <ogra> janimo, you dont ship esd ?
[01:06] <janimo> ogra, not sure.if it is pulled by the ltsp partes yes, if not no
[01:06] <infinity> Kamion: Do we have any sane way to find override disparities between arches, or just wait for them to cause bugs?
[01:06] <ogra> its not a dependency, ltsp-build-client uses it
[01:07] <janimo> ogra, ah so do I need to explicitely seed it?
[01:07] <janimo> highvoltage: thanks for the catch :)
[01:07] <ogra> janimo, yup
[01:08] <janimo> ogra: any other such hidden deps :) ?
[01:08] <janimo> I got the 4 or 3 packages with ltsp in their names + ldm so far, and now esound
[01:08] <janimo> anything else?
[01:10] <Kamion> infinity: I tried to write a script to do that at one point, but I think picking lint out of my navel suddenly became terribly exciting or something
[01:10] <ogra> janimo, grep EARLY_PACKAGES ltsp-build-client
[01:10] <infinity> Kamion: Well, you do have lovely lint.
[01:10] <janimo> ogra, so libesd and esound-common were in the cd, only esound was missing
[01:10] <janimo> ogra: where do I grep? where is that dir?
[01:10] <janimo> on the iso?
[01:10] <ogra> janimo, just esound should be fine, it was a dependency once, but debian revolted
[01:11] <ogra> so i had to take it out and rely on the seeds, i wasnt aware you dont have esound at all, sorry for that
[01:11] <ogra> its a script from ltsp-server (in /usr/bin/)
[01:12] <janimo> ogra, np. So now I have quite some gnome libs + esd on the CD (ship only though). Seems to fit even on the ppc
[01:12] <janimo> or maybe I just did not look at the build logs :)
[01:12] <ogra> yes, that shouldnt be too much
[01:13] <janimo> ok, should be mirrored in <15min then take effect in the next CD build. hope this is the only missing bit
[01:13] <janimo> highvoltage: will you be able to test today's new image later?
[01:13] <ogra> janimo, EARLY_PACKAGES="x-window-system-core ltsp-client discover1 laptop-detect xresprobe esound inputattach usplash ldm"
[01:13] <janimo> whenever it is built?
[01:14] <ogra> i guess the rest is available in your seeds
[01:14] <janimo> ogra, huh usplash? thats ubuntu usplash
[01:14] <ogra> yep
[01:14] <ogra> but you have that ;)
[01:14] <ogra> (its the binary)
[01:15] <janimo> ogra, ok, phew
[01:15] <janimo> I thought it was the artwork itself only
[01:20] <jono> hey
[01:20] <Treenaks> hm
[01:20] <Treenaks> freenode is weird:
[01:20] <Fujitsu> Hi, jono.
[01:21] <Treenaks> 13:20 <        jono> hey
[01:21] <Treenaks> 13:20 -!- jono (Jono Bacon) has joined
[01:21] <jono> Treenaks: odd
[01:21] <ogra> Treenaks, youre lagging
[01:21] <jono> hey Fujitsu
[01:21] <Treenaks> ogra: likely
[01:21] <jono> biab
[01:22] <mdz> infinity: are we building new livefses?
[01:23] <Keybuk> jono: hey dude
[01:24] <fabbione> janimo: ping?
[01:24] <Kamion> mdz: please eyeball http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/tmp/gparted-safe-apply-operations.diff
[01:25] <infinity> mdz: We will have to once Colin gets that gparted fix in.
[01:25] <infinity> Kamion: Four Oh Four.
[01:25] <Kinnison> Kamion: what infinity said
[01:25] <janimo> fabbione: pong
[01:25] <Kamion> it's there now
[01:25] <fabbione> janimo: hey
[01:26] <infinity> janimo: ?
[01:26] <fabbione> janimo: ??
[01:26] <Keybuk> infinity: did you reenable publisher?
[01:26] <janimo> infinity: no just being pinged by fabbione I assumed it was a sparc thing :)
[01:26] <fabbione> janimo: nah..
[01:26] <Kinnison> Kamion: a very rapid eyeballing says "looks okay to me"
[01:26] <infinity> Keybuk: I'm publishing manually right now.
[01:27] <Keybuk> ah
[01:27] <fabbione> i would have lart you for that.... no ping ;)
[01:29] <infinity> Kamion: I assume somehwhere outside of the context of the second hunk, apply is set to true?
[01:29] <infinity> Err, third hunk.  Whatever.  The last one.
[01:30] <infinity> Reading diffs of diffs makes hunk numbering confusing.
[01:30] <Keybuk> infinity: yeah, at the top of the block
[01:30] <infinity> Okay, cool.  Then it looks sane to me.
[01:33] <infinity> Kamion: Will that prototype change require rebuilding anything else, or is this purely a private API anyway?
[01:34] <Kamion> infinity: no, just internal to gparted
[01:34] <Kamion> it's not quite working - it now fails to corrupt your disk but never tears down the progress bar
[01:34] <zul> heylo
[01:35] <sladen> can somebody with amd64 run  apt-cache search libgl*-dev
[01:35] <infinity> Kamion: Well, failing to eat disks is progress.....
[01:36] <infinity> sladen: Why would you epxect the output to be any different on amd64?
[01:36] <ogra> sladen: libgl1-mesa-dev and libgl1-mesa-swrast-dev#
[01:36] <ogra> (and mesademos)
[01:37] <pitti> Kamion: yes, I'm not sure with which version we would be better off, I just routinely file sync bugs for stuff that's fixed in Debian
[01:38] <sladen> ogra: no libglu..-dev ?
[01:39] <sladen> infinity: because I have a bug report saying they are
[01:39] <rpedro> hello
[01:39] <infinity> sladen: apt-cache appears to glob in a special way, so libglu1-mesa-dev doesn't come back in that search.
[01:39] <infinity> sladen: It's there, though.
[01:39] <infinity> sladen: (If you search for it directly)
[01:40] <ivoks> pitti: it seems that cups1.2 has some issues with older cupses
[01:40] <infinity> sladen: What's the bug report?
[01:40] <ivoks> pitti: we should consider cups1.2.1 for -updates asap :/
[01:40] <infinity> sladen: If amd64 was missing any libgl*dev stuff, half the archive would be FTBFS.
[01:40] <pitti> ivoks: yeah, it seems we still have quite a number of printing bugs
[01:40] <pitti> ivoks: will that help?
[01:40] <rpedro> can I get a backtrace from nautilus when it crashes and the 'restart app|inform developers| etc.' dialogue appears?
[01:41] <pitti> ivoks: also, this libgnomeprintui bug about not reading ~/.cups/lpoptions really sucks
[01:41] <ivoks> pitti: changelog of 1.2.1 says that those issues are fixed
[01:41] <ivoks> pitti: i will try
[01:41] <ivoks> pitti: yeah :(
[01:41] <pitti> ivoks: I already backported some fixes from svn head a while ago, but I don't remember reading about compatibility fixes
[01:41] <ivoks> pitti: but, atm cups 1.2 doesn't work with OSX (at least some versions of it) :/
[01:42] <infinity> sladen: If you're referring to bug #29435, you really should read the comments.
[01:42] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 29435 in mesa "Missing GL/gl.h" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/29435
[01:42] <ivoks> pitti: i spent 5 hours yeasterday making those two to work... finally i reverted to breezy
[01:42] <seb128> rpedro: click on "inform upstream", the detail text has the backtrace
[01:42] <seb128> rpedro: install nautilus-dbg before (and maybe libgnomevfs2-0-dbg too)
[01:43] <infinity> sladen: And the guy who "couldn't get the latest version" was just suffering from an out-of-date mirror, and an inability to type "apt-get update"
[01:43] <rpedro> seb128: ok, going to try that
[01:43] <ivoks> pitti: "The scheduler no longer uses chunking in responses to clients - this caused problems with older versions of CUPS like 1.1.17 (PR #6143)"
[01:44] <pitti> ivoks: I see
[01:44] <infinity> sladen: Oh, I see.  You're looking at #47338 ... That's also complete 100% user error.
[01:44] <sladen> infinity: bug #47338 but it's most like the same thing
[01:44] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47338 in mesa "libglu-dev and libgl-dev broken on amd64" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47338
[01:44] <ivoks> pitti: that would explain some bugs that were reported
[01:45] <Kamion> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/tmp/gparted-safe-apply-operations.diff updated, can you rebuild?
[01:46] <infinity> Kamion: Looks the same to me...
[01:47] <infinity> Of course, I wasn't smart enough to save the old one, so I can't diff.
[01:47] <Kamion> reload
[01:48] <Kamion> changes to apply_operations_thread to make it run off the end of the progress bar properly
[01:48] <Kamion> yay distro team pair-programming for a change
[01:49] <highvoltage> janimo: i will try my best. i'm extremely pressed on time, but i'll rsync and test as soon as i have a gap
[01:49] <seb128> Kamion: "manual partitioning on ubiquity let with no bootable partition" would be a gparted bug, right?
[01:49] <seb128> there is https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gparted/+bug/41012 on the topic too
[01:49] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 41012 in gparted "No (obvious) way to set a boot flag" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  
[01:50] <seb128> (still my laptop refusing to boot when there is no bootable partition ...)
[01:51] <Kinnison> back in a bit
[01:52] <Kamion> seb128: guess so
[02:00] <Kamion> winn0r
[02:04] <Kamion> uploaded, but I think I missed cron.daily
[02:04] <mdz> janimo: it's time to stop uploading
[02:04] <Kamion> ooh, manual mode
[02:06] <Keybuk> "Day 1 in the Big Release House ... Colin is in the diary room"
[02:07] <fabbione> Keybuk: lol
[02:07] <Kamion> publisher running, I'm off for lunch
[02:08] <highvoltage> Keybuk: lol
[02:09] <infinity> Kamion: You sorted the manual queue mojo alright?
[02:15] <mdz> infinity: yep
[02:15] <infinity> fabbione: sparc looks okay on dapper_probs now.  Thanks for the heads-up.
[02:15] <mdz> infinity: will you kick off livefs and CD builds when it finishes?
[02:15] <infinity> mdz: Yup, yup.
[02:15] <fabbione> infinity: thank, no problem
[02:21] <sladen> what does gnome-volume-manager have to do with sound-cards (!?)
[02:22] <ogra> it has the word "volumme" in its name ? 
[02:22] <ogra> -m
[02:23] <pitti> sladen: only that it restores the default sound card if you pull out the current default card (like an USB headset)
[02:24] <janimo> mdz, yeah I've stopped, this one got in the queue shortly after it got closed, and asked inf to unstuck it only after a couple hours
[02:24] <Kamion> infinity: yeah, I did
[02:29] <ogra> dapper-dvd-i386.iso
[02:29] <ogra>   3367493632 100%    2.60MB/s    0:20:34  (1, 100.0% of 1)
[02:29] <ogra> nice :)
[02:32] <doko> carlos: OOo translation ping ... it looks like  the current build finally will succeed. about 3.000.000 message strings, 50.000 warnings from translate-toolkit, 1500 errors (ignored) during the OOo import run; but too late for dapper; nobody had the chance to look at the translations (maybe except kurdish)
[02:32] <carlos> doko: and Esperanto?
[02:32] <carlos> doko: could you at least upload Esperanto and Kurdish?
[02:33] <Kamion> upload? as in to dapper?
[02:33] <Kamion> no
[02:33] <carlos> Kamion: l10n files
[02:33] <Kamion> yes, but do you mean upload to the dapper archive?
[02:33] <carlos> yes
[02:34] <Kamion> uploads are for absolutely critical showstopper fixes only
[02:34] <Keybuk> sladen: gnome-volume-manager has ended up being the generic "do shit on hal events" process
[02:34] <highvoltage> janimo: if i start the rsync now, will it include that esound fix? or should i hold on a bit?
[02:34] <janimo> highvoltage: only if there's a CD built in the past half hour
[02:34] <janimo> highvoltage: not yet
[02:34] <carlos> doko, Kamion: Is there any way to do those uploads as part of language packs updates (once per month) ?
[02:35] <carlos> doko: or the lack of an initial Kurdish or Esperanto packages would prevent that?
[02:35] <highvoltage> janimo: ok
[02:35] <janimo> highvoltage: probably later today, when 30.1 CD's appear
[02:35] <Kamion> if not, it could be a candidate for dapper-updates
[02:35] <doko> carlos: the build takes 14h, so if something goes wrong, double the time. I couldn't do faster, working most of the night as well
[02:35] <highvoltage> janimo: ok, i'm leaving for a birthday party i'll be killed for if i don't go in about 3 hours, so please let me know when it's there, if you happen to notice it :)
[02:35] <carlos> doko: dude, don't worry, I know we were a bit late already...
[02:35] <Kamion> I'm afraid 14h builds are totally unacceptable at this point
[02:36] <Kamion> carlos: ^--
[02:36] <Kamion> we hope to have the final images rolled long before that, and to be testing
[02:36] <doko> carlos: sure, that should be possible, but we should have the packages up for testing before
[02:36] <carlos> Kamion: indeed
[02:36] <carlos> doko: we are doing daily language packs  atm
[02:37] <janimo> carlos: did the langpacks go in yesterday? I did only see lang support packages on the list
[02:37] <infinity> janimo: langpacks are uploaded silently to prevent flooding dapper-changes.
[02:37] <carlos> doko: If I provide you with a fixed URL were you could fetch the .po files, would you be able to setup oo.org weekly lang packs?
[02:37] <infinity> janimo: They all went in yesterday or the day before.
[02:37] <janimo> infinity: thanks
[02:37] <infinity> janimo: The language-support stuff today was just some bugfixes.
[02:37] <highvoltage> the times displayed on cdimage.ubuntu.com, are they UTC?
[02:37] <Kamion> language-support are *supposed* to be silent in general but may not have been in this case
[02:37] <carlos> janimo: yes, they landed yesterday
[02:38] <Kamion> highvoltage: London IIRC (+1)
[02:38] <highvoltage> Kamion: thanks
[02:38] <Kamion> infinity: the buildd sequencer is running normally automatically, right?
[02:39] <infinity> Yes, but I just stopped it to run the queue builder.
[02:39] <doko> carlos: in theory, yes. in practice: no. there are currently strings in rosetta which prevent OOo building at all. have to fix these first in the imported files and in rosetta
[02:39] <Kamion> aha
[02:39] <carlos> doko: could you send me a report about that after dapper release, when you are not so busy to see what I could do to improve that?
[02:40] <doko> carlos: sure, let' chat about it on #irc next week
[02:40] <carlos> doko: ok, thanks
[02:40] <doko> carlos: but (hint, hint), import/export GSI files yourself ...
[02:40] <carlos> doko: that's one of the things we should talk next month
[02:41] <carlos> doko: I want to evaluate the possibility to import/export GSI files directly from Rosetta
[02:42] <doko> carlos: and elmo will start to cry, when the diff get's bigger than the .orig.tar.gz. so an option to only export new or changed translations would be very nice
[02:43] <carlos> doko: please, prepare a list of things/suggestions you have about this and let's talk about it before the sprint
[02:43] <doko> carlos: I'll update the spec
[02:43] <carlos> doko: cool, thanks
[02:45] <infinity> Kamion: Okay, building.  I'll publish as soon as all the binaries are in.
[02:48] <kagou> hi
[02:50] <doko> mvo: ping
[02:51] <mvo> doko: pong
[02:51] <Keybuk> doko: you realise that a diff from 2.0 to 1.1 is roughly the same size as the current one
[02:51] <Keybuk> WAIT A MINUTE!
[02:51] <Keybuk> doko may have stumbled on a fantastic way to give Mark what he wants ;P
[02:52] <doko> Keybuk: ?
[02:52] <highvoltage> doko: i think Keybuk passed out of excitement :)
[02:52] <Keybuk> doko: if you replaced the current openoffice diff with one that simply reverted the package back to the 1.1 packages ... it would be the same size! :)
[02:53] <doko> mvo: bug 47328
[02:53] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47328 in update-manager "Consistent multiverse in synaptic and gnome-app-install" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47328
[02:53] <infinity> Kamion: Publishing.
[02:54] <mvo> doko: hm, it is mostly a usability issue
[02:54] <doko> mvo: tmarble did email you, could you reply?
[02:58] <mvo> doko: not yet
[03:08] <lemsx1> good morning all
[03:10] <ciga> hi
[03:11] <OculusAquilae> infinity: ping
[03:12] <sfllaw> Mithrandir: Mostly because I didn't know how frequent our daily builds are.  They, suspiciously, do not seem to happen once per day.
[03:13] <infinity> OculusAquilae: ?
[03:14] <infinity> sfllaw: When everything's in full auto, the dailies are (at least) daily.
[03:14] <infinity> sfllaw: Which was certainly the case for the last few days.
[03:14] <ogra> sfllaw, during release/milestone preparation we tend to build them more often
[03:14] <OculusAquilae> infinity: I wanted to ask what to do because of Launchpad-Group kubuntu-de. Its owner isn't active anymore.
[03:15] <OculusAquilae> infinity: and we have no active admins
[03:16] <sfllaw> ogra: I suppose the testing matrix is pretty full right now.
[03:16] <sfllaw> So we can afford to start over.
[03:16] <Riddell> nice to see outside recognition of infinity's move to launchpad
[03:16] <ogra> sfllaw, yep
[03:16] <ogra> sfllaw, and the isos changed a lot since RC
[03:16] <infinity> Riddell: Don't make me hurt you.
[03:16] <sfllaw> ogra: OK.
[03:16] <ogra> (edubuntu results are all for RC for example)
[03:17] <infinity> OculusAquilae: Hrm, only two team members.  Not much of a "team".
[03:17] <infinity> OculusAquilae: Anyhow, if you're looking to usurp the team by getting one of the active members promoted to team Admin, I suspect you should ask someone who's not me.
[03:17] <OculusAquilae> infinity: We can't add more members because the team is restricted
[03:18] <infinity> OculusAquilae: I'm only an LP admin for hilarious reasons best not discussed, I don't actually flex that power.
[03:18] <Keybuk> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/releasecon.jpg
[03:18] <ogra> OculusAquilae, #launchpad
[03:18] <OculusAquilae> infinity: Who has that power then?
[03:19] <infinity> OculusAquilae: I have the power, I just don't use it. :)  Try kiko, SteveA, stub, or lifeless on #launchpad.  All better choices than I for LP admin.
[03:20] <OculusAquilae> infinity: ok thanks
[03:20] <infinity> Okay, firing off livefs builds nowish...
[03:26] <mdz> iwj: ping
[03:29] <ogra> Keybuk, one-man-con ? 
[03:29] <ciga> does anyone have '[fglrx]  API ERROR: could not register entrypoint for *' error message when starting glxinfo in the latest dapper?
[03:29] <ogra> where is the rest ? 
[03:30] <infinity> ciga: Not the time or place to be discussing it, but yes, in fixing some newer cards, ATI broke DRI on some r200 cards.  There's a bug on launchpad already.
[03:37] <ciga> infinity: thank you.
[03:37] <bddebian> Heya folks
[03:41] <iwj> mdz: Hi.
[03:42] <iwj> Just writing a mail about this themes thing.
[03:44] <iwj> mdz: Seen your mail of 10 mins ago, willdo.
[03:44] <mdz> iwj: thanks
[03:46] <iwj> You say `per Mark'.  Do you mean (a) Mark has told you this some place I didn't see it or (b) Mark has told you this in a mail that I am supposed to have a copy of ?  Because if (b) there is something wrong with mail from Mark to me.
[03:46] <mdz> iwj: (a)
[03:47] <iwj> Oh, good, thanks.
[03:47] <Kamion> (over-the-cube-discussion)++. Er.
[03:47] <Kamion> :-)
[03:48] <Kamion> Riddell: isn't bug 47194 just a duplicate of bug 45437? or do you think qtparted has crashed and not told stderr?
[03:48] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47194 in ubiquity "Dapper RC:Installer crashed at partitionning step" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47194
[03:48] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45437 in ubiquity "crash in installer @ partition screen" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45437
[03:49] <Kamion> Riddell: oh, no, it's in a different place that doesn't have a None check - ignore me please
[03:50] <Riddell> yeah, I think they're different
[03:55] <mdz> infinity: livefs builds finished?
[03:55] <Kamion> Riddell: I don't believe your close of bug 46331, though :)
[03:55] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46331 in ubiquity "Cache issue with kde frontend" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46331
[03:55] <Kamion> especially because it's a known issue ...
[03:56] <infinity> mdz: They're thinking really hard about finishing.
[03:56] <infinity> Kamion: Mirroring issues okay enough to do alternate builds yet?
[03:56] <infinity> Kamion: I'll let you verify that, and you can do alternates in parallel with my desktop builds.
[03:56] <Kamion> Riddell: oh, wait, did you not stop qtparted from creating filesystems in installer mode?
[03:57] <Kamion> infinity: yeah, it's fine - starting builds now
[03:57] <infinity> Kamion: I'll do DVDs after the desktop run, I guess, since I'm watching for livefs goodness anyway.
[03:58] <Riddell> maybe I'm misunderstanding what he's saying, he's saying partman doesn't pick up new patitions made by qtparted?
[03:58] <infinity> Kamion: Rebuilding all the -alternate- images, I assume, so we're starting from a known archive state?
[03:58] <Kamion> infinity: yes
[03:58] <infinity> Kamion: Rock.
[03:58] <Kamion> Riddell: ok, in the gtk frontend, we stop gparted from creating filesystems, and let partman do all of that work
[03:59] <Kamion> Riddell: this has the advantage that filesystem creation flags are automatically consistent with those used by d-i
[03:59] <infinity> And there comes the ubuntu livefs.
[03:59] <Kamion> Riddell: but it has the downside that if you go back to gparted it doesn't remember the partition types
[03:59] <Kamion> but apparently you don't do this for qtparted
[03:59] <Kamion> I didn't realise that until now
[04:00] <Riddell> yes, qtparted will still make the filesystems
[04:00] <Kamion> that's a bit of a shame for consistency
[04:00] <Riddell> although if you just click Back it'll forget all about what you've done, it only makes them on clicking Next
[04:01] <Kamion> in edgy I hope to fix this by just writing a partitioning UI from scratch on top of partman
[04:01] <Kamion> the approach of using an external partition editor was expedient for dapper, but it just has way too many reliability problems
[04:01] <Riddell> yes
[04:04] <BenC> so for this round of testing we should do the same tests we were assigned last time on the chart?
[04:04] <infinity> BenC: And more!
[04:04] <infinity> BenC: Test till you drop.  This is "it", after all.
[04:05] <ogra> yeah 1
[04:05] <ogra> !
[04:05] <bddebian> heh
[04:05] <fabbione> BenC: we will need to swap some sparc tests,  because i have no cd here
[04:05] <ogra> BenC, add the night as well ;)
[04:06] <BenC> fabbione: Ok, I can do cd install on my U2, and boot the installer (but not actually install) on my e3k
[04:06] <BenC> that is, if it can boot from a CDR
[04:06] <BenC> some of these old sun cdrom's are not burnable media aware
[04:06] <fabbione> yeah i remember that
[04:07] <Kamion> sfllaw: I'm in the London office now, so powerpc netboot testing plus the random crap lying around here is about all I can do
[04:08] <Keybuk> likewise
[04:08] <Keybuk> the London office seems well covered for PowerPC testing
[04:08] <Keybuk> !PowerPC should be assigned to others
[04:09] <sfllaw> Thanks guys.
[04:09] <BenC> Keybuk: can you do powerpc-server too?
[04:10] <Keybuk> BenC: define "server"
[04:10] <fabbione> BenC: yes we can
[04:10] <fabbione> we can also do amd64
[04:10] <infinity> Keybuk: The ubuntu-server CD. :)
[04:10] <sladen> infinity: when are the i386 images likely to be ready.  I'd like to grab them before I leave this nice fast JANET connection
[04:10] <BenC> the server install from the alternate cd including LAMP
[04:10] <Keybuk> I can install the ubuntu-server CD on a PowerBook :p
[04:10] <fabbione> BenC: yeps
[04:10] <BenC> server cd I mean
[04:10] <_ion> LAPR > LAMP
 :-)
[04:10] <bddebian> heh
[04:10] <Keybuk> LAPDANCE > *
[04:10] <Robot101> LAMP = Linux, Apache, Many scripting languages, PostgreSQL
[04:10] <infinity> sladen: ubuntu-desktop is ready now.
[04:11] <Keybuk> fabbione: START UP RSYNC PONIES 1 THRU 3
[04:11] <Treenaks> Keybuk: LAPDANCE!?
[04:11] <fabbione> Keybuk: fired up
[04:12] <pitti> rsync and jigdo pulling at full speed
[04:12] <Chipzz> Robot101: Linux/Apache/Mysql/PHP actually
[04:13] <infinity> Chipzz: I'm sure he's aware of that.
[04:13] <Robot101> Chipzz: uh, yes. it's an anti-mysql joke... :P
[04:14] <Chipzz> I find more things wrong with postgres than with mysql actually :)
[04:14] <pitti> Chipzz: GRRR
[04:15] <infinity> Chipzz: Can we avoid this holy war here?
[04:15] <infinity> Chipzz: It'll just end in pitti and I mudwrestling in the channel, which won't help the release one bit.
[04:15] <sfllaw> Keybuk: I do not want to know about your lapdancing pony fetish.  ;)
[04:15] <Chipzz> yea maybe for the better ;)
[04:17] <Kamion> oh yeah, Ubuntu alternate built
[04:17] <bddebian> Lapdancing ponies?
[04:17] <infinity> Kamion: If I don't tell you in Paris that I cut the livefs build time in half, tie me to a chair until I do so.
[04:17] <infinity> Kamion: I swear it gets slower every day.
[04:17] <maswan> the prancing pony release?
[04:18] <bddebian> hehe
[04:20] <Kamion> infinity: I'll bring my handcuffs and skipping rope
[04:20] <HiddenWolf> Kamion: have fun with customs. ;)
[04:20] <infinity> Kamion: I knew we should have been roommates...
[04:20] <sfllaw> Oh my!
[04:21] <Kamping_Kaiser> mmm. good quit message that one...
[04:30] <dholbach> sfllaw: going to wipe or replace the Testing/Current table?
[04:31] <sfllaw> dholbach: Didn't I already do that?
[04:31] <infinity> Make sure to note the correct datestamp for ALL the images we're testing.  They're not all going to be the same.
[04:31] <dholbach> sfllaw: then some people were quite fast in updating the sheet :)
[04:31] <infinity> (20060530, 20060530.1, 20060530.2...)
[04:36] <infinity> kubuntu-desktop CDs are built.
[04:37] <Riddell> and I was just testing the existing ones
[04:37] <Riddell> ok, thanks
[04:37] <Keybuk> infinity: which are built, and of which vers
[04:37] <infinity> Keybuk: -desktop-, AKA -live- ...
[04:37] <Keybuk> 20060530.1  ubuntu-desktop
[04:38] <Keybuk> 20060530.2  ubuntu-alternate
[04:38] <Kamion> Kubuntu alternates built too
[04:38] <Keybuk> 20060530.2  kubuntu-alternate
[04:38] <Keybuk> ( I don't see updated kubuntu-desktop yet )
[04:38] <dholbach> I remove all the comments from Testing/Currents - is that ok? sfllaw?
[04:38] <infinity> kubuntu-desktop should be 20060530.1
[04:39] <infinity> I think the mirrors are thinking really hard about syncing it.
[04:39] <Keybuk> 20060530.2  edubuntu-alternate
[04:39] <Riddell> dholbach: can you update the kubuntu cd numbers while your there
[04:39] <pitti> dholbach: we should test everything with the current CDs, so that should be fine
[04:39] <ogra> Kamion, thanks !
[04:39] <Keybuk> ( No edubuntu-desktop yet )
[04:39] <infinity> Keybuk: edubuntu-desktop and xubuntu-desktop still pending.
[04:39] <ogra> live please :)
[04:39] <Kamion> um? edubuntu-alternate still seems to be running
[04:39] <infinity> Keybuk: And DVDs will come after all the desktop builds.
[04:40] <Kamion> oh, never mind, my ssh session died
[04:40] <ogra> edu install is there already
[04:40] <Kamion> yeah
[04:40] <sfllaw> dholbach: Comments?
[04:41] <sfllaw> Like which bugs failed?
[04:41] <dholbach> sfllaw: PASS/FAIL etc
[04:41] <sfllaw> Uhm, nothing says PASS/FAIL on this page right now.
[04:41] <dholbach> it does
[04:41] <dholbach> in the various tables
[04:42] <sfllaw> Some of them say 20060525-fail.
[04:42] <sfllaw> But that's correct.
[04:42] <sfllaw> Is that what you mean?
[04:42] <dholbach> yeah
[04:42] <infinity> Kamion: Building xubuntu-alt too?
[04:42] <dholbach> I thought we'd clean it up completely
[04:42] <dholbach> no?
[04:42] <sfllaw> dholbach: It's good to keep track of the fact that things _used_ to fail.
[04:42] <dholbach> oh well, ok
[04:43] <infinity> s/wats/waits/
[04:43] <dholbach> then I just updated the cd numbers
[04:43] <Kamion> xubuntu alternate done
[04:43] <Kamion> doing ports as well while I'm here
[04:43] <highvoltage> yay!
[04:44] <highvoltage> http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/daily/current/ is empty though :/
[04:44] <Kamion> s/cdimages/cdimage/ dude
[04:44] <Kamion> it may still be mirroring though
[04:46] <highvoltage> Kamion: thanks dude
[04:47] <Kamion> (the 'cdimages' alias normally works, but we've had problems with apache config not knowing about that in the past, so it's best to use the official name)
[04:48] <infinity> Kamion: ubuntu-server and ubuntu-server-ports while you're at it too, SVP... I'll be stuffed up for a while on Live and DVD, I'm sure.
[04:49] <Kamion> yeah, realised I should have done that before starting on the other ports
[04:49] <Kamion> they're in my queue
[04:50] <dholbach> iwj: there's a new ubuntu-artwork - I'll upload the firefox-themes-ubuntu again.
[04:51] <iwj> Thanks.
[04:51] <infinity> dholbach: Did you just say "new ubuntu-artwork"...?
[04:51] <iwj> Or I can do it.  I mean, I just did one.
[04:51] <dholbach> infinity: the one from 6h ago
[04:51] <infinity> Oh, thank god.
[04:51] <infinity> I was about to jump through my screen and strangle you.
[04:51] <dholbach> infinity: ok, go ahead then :-)
[04:51] <dholbach> infinity: oops
[04:51] <iwj> Oh, if it was 6h ago, then I've already uploaded f-t-u since then.
[04:51] <dholbach> iwj: ok, go ahead then :-)
[04:52] <iwj> Quality stable stuff, this theme-builder package.
[04:53] <infinity> iwj: Were you going to ask someone to process that upload at some point? :)
[04:54] <iwj> infinity: Err, they need processing manually now ?  In that case I should be, yes.
[04:55] <dholbach> infinity: it's for universe
[04:55] <infinity> dholbach: Yes, I shut down the WHOLE QUEUE. :)
[04:55] <dholbach> infinity: I see :)
[04:55] <infinity> iwj: I'll process it right now.
[04:55] <iwj> infinity: Well, yes, err, would someone like to process my upload then please ? 
[04:55] <iwj> Thanks.
[04:56] <iwj> Should there have been an announcement about this on u-d-a ?
[04:56] <Keybuk> dholbach: isn't it for main?
[04:56] <iwj> The most recent thing I have there is mdz's from Friday.
[04:56] <dholbach> Keybuk: I don't think so.
[04:56] <iwj> Keybuk, dholbach: We don't know yet whether it's for main or universe.
[04:56] <dholbach> oh ok
[04:56] <fabbione> iwj: it's the same we did for the past 4 releases
[04:56] <iwj> Currently universe.
[04:56] <Kamion> it's currently in universe but Mark wants it in main
[04:57] <infinity> Kamion: Not in ship, I hope...
[04:57] <Kamion> infinity: "in desktop, in case we happen to be re-rolling CD images for some other reason"
[04:57] <infinity> Gah.
[04:57] <Kamion> or words to that effect
[04:57] <jdub> Keybuk: ha ha
[04:57] <jdub> What does the identity of the maintainer have to do with it? Maybe he
[04:57] <jdub> knows more about the subject than you do, maybe not.
[04:58] <bgertzfield> infinity: Good morning!
[04:58] <jdub> Keybuk: do you know more or less about udev than the maintainer? *MORE* or *LESS*?
[04:58] <Keybuk> jdub: I know equal amounts
[04:58] <Keybuk> and he doesn't know more about the subject than me
[04:58] <jdub> no, only two choices
[04:58] <jdub> MORE or LESS!
[04:58] <Kamion> jdub: "yes"
[04:59] <bgertzfield> infinity: Hey -- mvo just mentioned that the vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 package that gets installed by default is the i386 flavor.  Did I mess up the packaging, or does linux-restricted-modules do the same?
[04:59] <pitti> Kamion: but more or less isn't yet true, 'exactly equal' is missing :)
[04:59] <infinity> bgertzfield: Hrm?  In what sense?
[05:00] <infinity> bgertzfield: In the "apt-get makes stupid decisions" sense, it will resolve the pure virtual dependency by picking the first one in asciibetical order, then pulling in all its deps (ie: a new kernel)
[05:00] <infinity> bgertzfield: Nothing you can do about that.
[05:00] <Kamion> pitti: I see you are not a believer in the axiom of choice ;)
[05:00] <infinity> bgertzfield: Smarter package management frontends will go for the "path of least change", which should lead to getting the modules for your current kernel installed.
[05:00] <bgertzfield> infinity: I see.
[05:00] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK, that's what I figured.  Thanks.
[05:00] <infinity> bgertzfield: (Assuming you only have one flavour installed)
[05:01] <sivang> he
[05:01] <bgertzfield> infinity: so mvo ended up pulling in the i386 kernel as well.
[05:01] <infinity> bgertzfield: There's not really much we can do to improve this, so we cope and users write HOWTOs when it breaks a bit. :)
[05:02] <bgertzfield> hmm
[05:02] <bgertzfield> this is also weird; I don't see the smp kernels in the 2.6.15 i386 kernel modules package list
[05:02] <bgertzfield> let's see what happened
[05:03] <infinity> There are no SMP kernels.
[05:03] <infinity> -686 and -k7 are SMP/UP autoswitching.
[05:03] <bgertzfield> Oh.
[05:03] <bgertzfield> Really!
[05:03] <bgertzfield> ubuntu++
[05:04] <Keybuk> pitti: mmm, infinite sets
[05:04] <bgertzfield> I had no idea.
[05:04] <bgertzfield> infinity: thanks
[05:04] <pitti> Keybuk: I said 'countable', not 'finite' :)
[05:04] <dholbach> hum, doesn't the powerpc alternate cd have a memcheck?
[05:04] <Keybuk> if you have an infinite number of hotel rooms, and each one is occupied, can you find room for infinity, should he be kicked out of home?
[05:04] <Kamion> no
[05:04] <Kamion> memtest => x86 assembly
[05:04] <jdub> pitti: perhaps the the inter-relationships between scott's knowledges of udev are in indeterminite states
[05:05] <dholbach> :-/
[05:05] <Kamion> in fact it's called "memtest86+", which is a clue :)
[05:05] <Keybuk> jdub: shut up.
[05:05] <dholbach> right, now you say it...
[05:05] <Keybuk> love Keybuk
[05:05] <Keybuk> kthxbye
[05:05] <Keybuk> ;)
[05:05] <Keybuk> xx
[05:05] <dholbach> so I need to find out which bit of memory is broken myself :)
[05:05] <pitti> Keybuk: sure, we just kick out Mr. Hilbert from his room 
[05:05] <jdub> hostile today, Keybuk 
[05:05] <Keybuk> pitti: without kicking anyone out
[05:06] <pitti> Keybuk: ok, gently ask him :)
[05:08] <mvo> bgertzfield: exactly this happens, it installs a i386 kernel image and the i386 modules. the next problem is that vmware-player wants to start /etc/init.d/vmware-player in its post-inst. this causes the postinst to fail because the scripts fails (no modules loaded because there are no modules for the -k7 flvaour)
[05:08] <pitti> Keybuk: it works with infinitely many buses each containing infinitely many Adams, but will it work with 2^oo-1? :)
[05:09] <Keybuk> pitti: how long will it take infinity to process an infinite number of buildds building an infinite number of openoffices that have reached an infinite size?
[05:10] <bgertzfield> mvo: right. according to infinity, there's not a lot we can do about that :( apt chooses the wrong package
[05:10] <pitti> Keybuk: let's conquer some more universes to get the power and matter to try it out
[05:10] <bgertzfield> mvo: that's the problem with virtual package dependencies and apt; it doesn't know it should pick the package that depends on a package already installed
[05:11] <doko> Keybuk: the size of openoffice.org-l10n is limited by the number of translations ;-P
[05:11] <Keybuk> doko: so it's all pitti's fault?
[05:11] <doko> Keybuk: blame carlos and jordi ;)
[05:12] <Kamion> ubuntu/kubuntu ports alternate done; ubuntu-server building
[05:12] <carlos> :-P
[05:14] <jsgotangco> lol
[05:14] <jsgotangco> start an lp team? heh
[05:14] <AlinuxOS> Hi great pitti, I've got this error today: Failed to fetch http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/daily/./Packages.gz  404 Not Found
[05:15] <pitti> AlinuxOS: known, I'll move them to langpacks/daily/dapper-updates
[05:15] <mvo> bgertzfield: right. we could hack around it by depending on all vmware-player-kernel-module packages from the player and remove the dependency in the modules to the image. ugly and won't cover custom kernel builds
[05:15] <pitti> AlinuxOS: today's build has failed because Rosetta didn't give me a tarball (hey carlos!)
[05:15] <doko> JaneW: helpcontent2    source\text\simpress\main0106.xhp       0       help    tit                             0       af      Gereedskap^M\n<E2><80><94> Jane Weideman^M\nGereedskap^M\n<E2><80><94> Jane Weideman^M\nNutsgoed                                20060529 21:41:49
[05:16] <doko> that's in an OOo translation ...
[05:16] <carlos> pitti: I did
[05:16] <bgertzfield> mvo: yes, very ugly
[05:16] <carlos> pitti: do you remember the -updates change?
[05:16] <pitti> dholbach: oh, didn't you want to clear the test matrix?
[05:16] <pitti> carlos: yes, I did
[05:16] <AlinuxOS> :)
[05:16] <AlinuxOS> carlos, :D
[05:17] <carlos> oh, fuck, I named it -update
[05:17] <AlinuxOS> 100000000 people are waching you :)
[05:17] <carlos> pitti: http://mawson.ubuntu.com/~carlos/rosetta-dapper-update.tar.gz
[05:17] <dholbach> pitti: sfllaw wants to keep the old data
[05:17] <AlinuxOS> entire nation deppends on you :)
[05:17] <carlos> AlinuxOS: ;-)
[05:17] <pitti> carlos: ah; I tried '-updates'
[05:17] <AlinuxOS> carlos, god bless you :) pitti and ubuntu-devel team :D
[05:17] <carlos> pitti: it's 'updates'
[05:17] <AlinuxOS> hehe
[05:17] <carlos> my fault
[05:17] <carlos> pitti: let me fix it
[05:17] <JaneW> doko: huh? :)
[05:17] <AlinuxOS> http://ka.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%83%9A%E1%83%98%E1%83%9C%E1%83%A3%E1%83%A5%E1%83%A1%E1%83%98%E1%83%A1_%E1%83%93%E1%83%98%E1%83%A1%E1%83%A2%E1%83%A0%E1%83%98%E1%83%91%E1%83%A3%E1%83%A2%E1%83%98%E1%83%95%E1%83%94%E1%83%91%E1%83%98#Ubuntu_Linux
[05:17] <AlinuxOS> ;)
[05:18] <AlinuxOS> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ka/7/72/01_georgian_ubuntu_dapper.png
[05:18] <AlinuxOS> how is sexy georgian Ubuntu Dapper :)
[05:18] <AlinuxOS> loolz
[05:18] <pitti> carlos: oh, I was just about to fix it; so, -updates or -update?
[05:18] <carlos> pitti: -updates
[05:18] <carlos> pitti: it's renamed
[05:18] <carlos> and the script is fixed
[05:19] <Kamion> AlinuxOS: ok, we appreciate your work, but we are trying to do a release here, so please if you ever find yourself typing "loolz" consider that it's noise here
[05:19] <doko> carlos: ooo/rosetta-ooo-help-simpress/af.po
[05:19] <mgalvin> Riddell: ping?
[05:19] <doko> #: helpcontent2/source/text/simpress/main0106.xhp#tit.help.text
[05:19] <doko> msgid "Tools"
[05:19] <doko> msgstr ""
[05:19] <doko> "Gereedskap^M\n"
[05:19] <doko> " Jane Weideman^M\n"
[05:19] <doko> "Gereedskap^M\n"
[05:19] <doko> " Jane Weideman^M\n"
[05:19] <doko> "Nutsgoed"
[05:19] <pitti> carlos, AlinuxOS: ok, cranking up build of dapper-updates packages
[05:19] <AlinuxOS> Kamion, oops, sorry :) You've right!
[05:20] <carlos> doko: that's a bad copy and paste
[05:20] <AlinuxOS> sorry all, pitti carlos Kamion all :)
[05:20] <carlos> doko: that is hidden by a bug in Rosetta...
[05:20] <doko> carlos: and the ^M's are all nasty ...
[05:20] <AlinuxOS> Kamion, that was my emotion..you know it's very difficult to show emotions in IRC
[05:20] <carlos> doko: copy and paste
[05:20] <AlinuxOS> so don't be angry :)
[05:21] <doko> carlos: that breaks the OOo build
[05:21] <JaneW> carlos: sorry
[05:22] <carlos> doko: I will try to get that bug fixed and 'migrate' that data (will set it as Needs review) before we prepare final .debs
[05:22] <doko> carlos: ^M's in general?
[05:23] <carlos> doko: no, that's a side effect
[05:23] <carlos> doko: and thus should also be deactivated
[05:23] <seb128> pitti: is dapper-updates already open?
[05:23] <doko> carlos: that's not the only place with ^M's, so if you can replace them with \r where appropriate
[05:23] <infinity> seb128: No.
[05:23] <pitti> seb128: no, just for my daily langpacks on people
[05:23] <Kamion> \r doesn't belong in msgstrs either
[05:24] <pitti> AlinuxOS: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/daily/dapper-updates/
[05:24] <pitti> carlos: wow, that works *really* fast now
[05:24] <seb128> infinity: I know now is not time to speak about that, but will it be open on friday? ;)
[05:24] <doko> Kamion: they do in GSI format, and as long as we have to convert to po format, we have to keep them
[05:24] <AlinuxOS> pitti, so I substiute that in my sources.list.
[05:25] <seb128> infinity: I'm not that in an hurry but GNOME 2.14.2 will be out tomorrow, and if I can update before my VAC, the Paris summit and the GUADEC that would be could :p
[05:25] <infinity> seb128: No idea, TBH.
[05:25] <AlinuxOS> pitti, ok, done. works great here. Thank You!
[05:26] <carlos> Kamion: there are some msgstrs that need the \r char (if the msgid has it)
[05:26] <infinity> seb128: I can prep some things to make it easier, but we'll see.
[05:26] <seb128> infinity: k, we will see than on friday then ;)
[05:26] <seb128> s/than/that
[05:26] <infinity> seb128: You can always prepare all the uploads and trust dholbach to upload them. :)
[05:26] <Kamion> carlos: gettext tools spam my screen massively for everything I download from Rosetta that has \r
[05:26] <seb128> infinity: right :p
[05:26] <Riddell> mgalvin: hi
[05:26] <bgertzfield> mvo: hm.  I just ran synaptic to see how the installation goes
[05:26] <bgertzfield> mvo: you're right, it's quite nasty
[05:27] <bgertzfield> mvo: synaptic really doesn't let the user know "by the way, there are other things to make this work!"
[05:27] <carlos> Kamion: hmm, I did a fix to prevent that char to appear in our database unless the msgid has it
[05:27] <carlos> Kamion: was it recent?
[05:27] <Kamion> carlos: downloaded on Monday
[05:27] <mgalvin> Riddell: hi, we were just talking with JaneW about the newsletter stuff and mdz suggested consolidating them...
[05:27] <Kamion> I have no idea how old the strings were
[05:27] <carlos> Kamion: debian-installer ?
[05:27] <Kamion> carlos: yes
[05:27] <Kamion> can't remember what language
[05:28] <JaneW> mgalvin: I just mailed the xubuntu guys too
[05:28] <Kamion> ru possibly - there were several
[05:28] <carlos> Kamion: ok, I will try to debug it
[05:28] <mgalvin> Riddell: jsgotangco and myself are going to work on it to
[05:28] <mgalvin> JaneW: great! thanks :)
[05:28] <mvo> bgertzfield: yes :/
[05:28] <Riddell> mgalvin: ok
[05:28] <mgalvin> Riddell: so we started https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-newsletter
[05:31] <infinity> Oh, holy crap, Ubuntu DVDs finished.
[05:31] <mgalvin> Riddell: just wanted to make sure you were aware of what was discussed and the plan that is to make one larger newsletter with deriv specific sections
[05:31] <jsgotangco> mgalvin: this could be one team that the LP calendar can be used heh
[05:31] <_ion> Cool, distributor-logo.png in ubuntu-artwork has been fixed. 
[05:32] <ogra> Kamion, any trace of edubuntu liveCD builds yet ? or am i to impatient ?
[05:33] <mgalvin> jsgotangco: indeed
[05:35] <Keybuk> Riddell: everything in K->Help is duplicated
[05:35] <Keybuk> Welcome to KDE
[05:35] <Keybuk> Welcome to KDE
[05:35] <Keybuk> KDE Users' Manuals
[05:35] <Keybuk> KDE Users' Manuals
[05:35] <Keybuk> etc.
[05:36] <Riddell> Keybuk: hmm, works on my install, I'll need to wait for these desktop CDs to rsync before I can confirm for a fresh user
[05:36] <ogra> Keybuk, do you have kubuntu-docs installed twice ?  :P
[05:36] <Keybuk> Riddell: this was the 30 kubuntu-desktop, rather than 30.n
[05:37] <infinity> ogra: edubuntu livecd is happening right now, sorry.  It got backed up in the queue. :)
[05:37] <ogra> ok, thanks :)
[05:37] <ogra> i just saw the others were done already :)
[05:37] <infinity> If anyone's doing Ubuntu DVDs, those are now current.
[05:38] <infinity> (Which was what backlogged ogra's CDs.. Oops)
[05:38] <ogra> heh
[05:38] <ogra> i'll do eubuntu DVDs once they exist
[05:38] <ogra> *edubuntu indeed
[05:40] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK, mvo and I have a possible solution for the vmware-player kernel modules dependency
[05:40] <infinity> bgertzfield: Colour me curious.
[05:40] <bgertzfield> infinity: Our problem is that the linux kernel images depend on the correct flavour of linux-restricted-modules
[05:41] <bgertzfield> we don't have that luxury here; the linux images can't possibly depend on something from multiverse
[05:41] <infinity> bgertzfield: Right...
[05:41] <infinity> bgertzfield: You can't force the upgrade at all in any sane fashion.
[05:41] <mjg59> Do we implement enhances: yet?
[05:41] <infinity> mjg59: Hahahahaha!
[05:41] <bgertzfield> infinity: so instead, what if we make linux-player Depend: on a new set of virtual packages: vmware-player-kernel-modules-386|vmware-player-kernel-modules-custom, vmware-player-kernel-modules-686|vmware-player-kernel-modules-custom, ... etc.
[05:41] <infinity> mjg59: (That's a "no")
[05:42] <infinity> bgertzfield: That can perhaps help with the auto-upgrading magic, but it won't help with the "wrong flavour" problem.
[05:42] <bgertzfield> then we make vmware-player-kernel-modules-386 Provided: by vmware-player-kernel-modules-2.6-16-386, and change the Depends: to a Recommends
[05:42] <bgertzfield> infinity: It will, because users will have to install *all* kernel modules
[05:42] <infinity> bgertzfield: Oh, I see what you've done, yes.
[05:42] <bgertzfield> infinity: our problem is we have a user-space component (vmware-player) whose postinst will fail if its kernel modules are not present
[05:43] <mvo> infinity: its not as bad as it sounds, the package is pretty small
[05:43] <infinity> bgertzfield: Given the tiny size of the packages, I guess that hack won't hurt too much.
[05:43] <bgertzfield> infinity: Excellent.
[05:43] <bgertzfield> mvo: I had a second idea
[05:43] <infinity> bgertzfield: But if you want to ship them all anyway, why have seperate packages at all?
[05:43] <bgertzfield> mvo: we can do this "correctly" for both i386 and amd64 with substitution variables
[05:43] <bgertzfield> infinity: hm.
[05:43] <bgertzfield> infinity: yeah, that's an even better question
[05:43] <infinity> bgertzfield: Just make vmware-player-kernel-modules-2.6.15 contain all the kernel modules and be done with it.
[05:44] <bgertzfield> infinity: I didn't think of that. :)
[05:44] <bgertzfield> mvo: what do you think?
[05:44] <mvo> sounds ok to me
[05:44] <infinity> bgertzfield: (Well, that would probably still be a metapackage, depending on vmpkm-2.6.15-23, to make the ABI thing work)
[05:44] <bgertzfield> ok. that will handle the architecture issue as well
[05:44] <bgertzfield> infinity: sure.
[05:44] <bgertzfield> infinity: hm, the ABI thing?
[05:44] <infinity> So, just encode the ABI number in the package name, but not the flavour, and ship all flavours in one.  Easy enough.
[05:44] <bgertzfield> ah, kernel ABI
[05:45] <bgertzfield> you mean a metapackage Provided: by vmpkm-2.6.15-23. got it
[05:45] <bgertzfield> ok!
[05:45] <bgertzfield> mvo: you want to tackle this? or should I
[05:45] <infinity> Someone show me the final code for this one before it gets uploaded, just in case there were some, uhh, miscommunications. :)
[05:46] <mvo> bgertzfield: if you have the time to do it I would appreciate, I'm doing the final testing for dapper (image) right now
[05:46] <bgertzfield> infinity: sure.
[05:46] <bgertzfield> mvo: ok
[05:47] <bgertzfield> I'll also fix Mithrandir's little mistake :)
[05:47] <infinity> The control.in thing? :)
[05:47] <bgertzfield> yep.
[05:48] <pitti> I go offline for a bit to test CDs on my workstation
[05:49] <bgertzfield> hm.  I just realized I also failed to make a proper source package for vmware-player 1.0.1
[05:49] <bgertzfield> if I change from a "debian native" (1.0.1-3.tar.gz) to a proper .orig.tar.gz in a revision, will that work?
[05:49] <infinity> bgertzfield: Yes, you can swap between releases.
[05:49] <infinity> bgertzfield: Please do.
[05:49] <bgertzfield> ok. fixing that too.
[05:50] <bgertzfield> good thing I am upstream. :)
[05:53] <siretart> 
[05:55] <dholbach> Kamion: which information do you need if the "auto resize" option is not shown (desktop install) - or is there a bug about it already?
[05:56] <bgertzfield> infinity: hm. It actually looks like I don't have to make any other changes in vmware-player 1.0.1 to make this work. Is it worth uploading now just to go from .tar.gz -> .orig.tar.gz?
[05:56] <infinity> dholbach: It's only shown in certain circumstances.
[05:56] <bgertzfield> or should I save that for when I need to make an actual change?
[05:56] <infinity> bgertzfield: yeah, do the upload to fix the naive thing anyway, please.
[05:56] <dholbach> infinity: oh? i thought it was shown if the disk was covered with partitions completely?
[05:56] <bgertzfield> infinity: will do
[05:56] <infinity> bgertzfield: I have to manually drive the archive to get the other change in, so just do both.
[05:57] <bgertzfield> ok. thanks so much
[05:57] <ogra> infinity, seems edubuntu live is ready, so if lithium has some spare cycles i'd appreciate a DVD
[05:57] <Kamion> dholbach: there are more conditions than that
[05:57] <Kamion> dholbach: given /var/log/partman, I can tell you why it wasn't displayed
[05:57] <infinity> ogra: kubuntu DVDs and edubuntu DVDs are next on my list.
[05:57] <ogra> cool, thanks :)
[05:57] <dholbach> Kamion: if this is intended, I'm happy with that.
[05:57] <Kamion> ubuntu-server done, BTW
[05:57] <jsgotangco> yay
[05:57] <Kamion> dholbach: feel free to stick the partman log somewhere and I can check quickly
[05:57] <bgertzfield> Kamion: awesome.
[05:57] <infinity> All desktop images (ubuntu, kubuntu, edubuntu, xubuntu) are done, FWIW.
[05:59] <dholbach> Kamion: http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/partman
[06:02] <bgertzfield> infinity: so, this new mega-package for the kernel modules should probably neither Depend: upon nor Suggest: the linux-image flavors, I assume
[06:02] <seb128> Kamion: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gparted/+bug/47520 
[06:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47520 in gparted "gparted should makes sure there is a bootable partition" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  
[06:03] <seb128> Kamion: that's sort of an installer issue too since it let the system not bootable, if you want to subscribe to it ...
[06:03] <elmo> mdke: ping?
[06:04] <bgertzfield> hm.  I guess I can make it a Recommends (didn't mean Suggests) with alternatives
[06:04] <Kamion> seb128: unfortunately it's painful UI changes and ubiquity changes to fix, I'm sorry, I heard you the first time too but I don't think we can fix it for dapper
[06:04] <Kamion> yes, it's an installer issue, obviously
[06:04] <infinity> bgertzfield: Recommends with alternatives, I guess.  Depends is more correct, but will lead to the previous apt confusion, I guess.
[06:05] <seb128> Kamion: no problem, that's not like the issue was new, I pinged with a similar issue previous cycle too
[06:05] <seb128> Kamion: that's just to have the bug listed somewhere
[06:06] <bgertzfield> infinity: Right.  Since I want to do this correct for all architectures, can I use Recommends: linux-image-@@ABIVER@@-386 [i386]  | linux-image-@@ABIVER@@-amd64-generic [amd64]  ?
[06:06] <bgertzfield> etc.
[06:06] <seb128> (I was not pinged about the issue again, just pointing the bug I just filled about it in case you want to subscribe to it)
[06:06] <bgertzfield> or should I use a substitution variable?
[06:06] <Kamion> seb128: done
[06:06] <seb128> thank you
[06:06] <infinity> bgertzfield: No, write it per-arch.
[06:06] <bgertzfield> infinity: via a substitution variable, right?
[06:07] <infinity> bgertzfield: Right.  Substvars to the rescue.
[06:07] <bgertzfield> oh, I suppose I could have two mega-packages with different names as well
[06:07] <bgertzfield> but I don't see how that's super helpful
[06:07] <bgertzfield> substvars it is.
[06:07] <infinity> bgertzfield: No, one megapackage is saner anyway.  Just use substvars to get the right Recommends on each arch.
[06:07] <bgertzfield> OK.
[06:07] <bgertzfield> easy enough
[06:07] <Kamion> dholbach: can you file a bug about that one on partman-auto, attaching that log? for a change I can't immediately see why it didn't want to offer auto-resize there
[06:08] <dholbach> Kamion: ok, I'll do that - thank you.
[06:10] <Mithrandir> sfllaw: so the whole chart should be wiped on each build, right?
[06:11] <dholbach> Kamion: done: bug 47523
[06:11] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47523 in partman-auto "partman-auto didn't offer "Auto Resize" option on i386 Desktop Ubuntu 20060530.1" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47523
[06:11] <mdz> dholbach: did you really mean FAIL?
[06:11] <mdz> dholbach: or that you were unable to test?
[06:11] <dholbach> mdz:  I changed that already
[06:11] <dholbach> mdz: it's N/A now
[06:13] <highvoltage> janimo: the LTSP chroot now builds fine with Xubuntu. Whohoo!
[06:13] <janimo> highvoltage: great, thanks for testing! :)
[06:13] <mdz> ok
[06:13] <janimo> so you have a working ltsp server with xfce installed?
[06:13] <Kamion> dholbach: thanks
[06:13] <dholbach> de rien
[06:14] <highvoltage> janimo: well, it's currently scanning for an apt mirror, but it built correctly, at least. i'll test if a client actually boots a bit later, i'm actually at a birthday party with laptop atm, doesn't look to good ;)
[06:15] <janimo> highvoltage: ok ;)
[06:17] <infinity> Kamion: You did all the ports -alternates right?
[06:17] <Kamion> infinity: yeah
[06:17] <infinity> Kamion: But not ports-live?  (If you did, I'll just do them again when kohnen finishes thinking)
[06:17] <doko> carlos: another export problem: msgid "size *2 \\\\langle x \\\rangle" -> msgid "size *2 \\\\langle x \\^Mangle"
[06:20] <carlos> doko: that's a broken input string
[06:20] <carlos> doko: please tell me that OO.org is not soooo bad to have a string '\\\r' 
[06:20] <carlos> as a valid one
[06:21] <infinity> Kamion: Err, s/kohnen/castilla/ ... It's been a long day already.
[06:24] <carlos> doko: I need to leave now
[06:24] <carlos> doko: I will take a look later, thanks for noting that
[06:25] <doko> carlos: stay connected, so you can read a backlog ;-)
[06:25] <carlos> doko: sure
[06:27] <pitti> argh, l-support-en is not installed with amd64/alternate
[06:28] <ogra> pitti, you broke all edubuntu liveCDs as well 
[06:28] <xhaker> pitti: does rsynching images still work?
[06:29] <ogra> pitti, so your script lied
[06:29] <Keybuk> seb128: Ubuntu Desktop ... Evolution, click "Contacts" ... "Error loading Addressbook"
[06:29] <pitti> xhaker: sure
[06:29] <seb128> Keybuk: known
[06:29] <pitti> ogra: uh? it worked quite fine for the ubuntu ones
[06:29] <seb128> Keybuk: the message is ugly but actually it works fine
[06:29] <pitti> ogra: they are too large now?
[06:29] <seb128> Keybuk: it happens on the first use only
[06:29] <xhaker> pitti: then it must be my college blocking rsync :S
[06:29] <ogra> pitti, amd64 and i386 are oversized
[06:29] <Keybuk> seb128: won't it also do it for the user after install?
[06:30] <ogra> ppc seems to have survived
[06:30] <seb128> Keybuk: probably, there is just too many bugs for me to tackle all of them and upstream is not responsive neither
[06:30] <ogra> infinity, no point in building edubuntu DVDs until thats solved
[06:30] <pitti> hm, but what about the install CDs? I didn't touch any, neither ubuntu nor edubuntu
[06:30] <infinity> ogra: Meh, too late, they're half built.
[06:30] <ogra> pitti, install is fine
[06:30] <Kamion> infinity: no lives
[06:30] <Kamion> i.e. no ports daily-live
[06:31] <infinity> Kamion: Okay, thanks.
[06:31] <Keybuk> seb128: is evo still maintained by the indians?
[06:32] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK, the work is done for the Great VMware Player Kernel Package Migration.  I'll test in an hour or so when I'm at work
[06:32] <bgertzfield> infinity: or do you need the packages right away?
[06:33] <infinity> bgertzfield: A little later is fine, I have my hands full anyway.
[06:33] <bgertzfield> infinity: excellent. thanks again for the assistance!
[06:33] <pitti> Kamion: hmm, http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/cd-build-logs/ubuntu-daily-20060530.2.log doesn't indicate any overflow, right?
[06:34] <seb128> Keybuk: I'm not sure, there seems to be less people working on it. Jeffrey Stedfast was working on it again for some time and he moved to some other project again if I understood correctly
[06:35] <jdub> mvo: what do you think about vmware-player-kernel-modules-686 style metapackages?
[06:36] <ogra> pitti, all isos are fine apoart from edubuntu live, dont worry about ubuntu
[06:37] <ogra> pitti, i'll drop the two additional blocks you added at the bottom
[06:37] <ogra> (in the live seed)
[06:39] <ogra> pitti, that'd be bn hi ru on i386 and additionally ja ca cy form amd64, do you think that suffices ? 
[06:39] <bgertzfield> jdub: we worked out a better solution
[06:39] <jdub> bgertzfield: oh?
[06:40] <bgertzfield> jdub: all modules for all flavours in an arch will go into a single package that Provides: vmware-player-kernel-modules
[06:41] <bgertzfield> they're pretty small
[06:41] <jdub> bgertzfield: ah
[06:41] <jdub> yeah, that's cool
[06:41] <HiddenWolf> bgertzfield: the description for your vmware player packages is cut short, you might want to fix that.
[06:41] <bgertzfield> HiddenWolf: oh? what is the end of the desc?
[06:42] <jdub> bgertzfield: so the amd64 build of vmware is not just a 32 bit package?
[06:42] <bgertzfield> oh!
[06:42] <bgertzfield> HiddenWolf: I see
[06:42] <bgertzfield> jdub: the kernel modules are native, the user-space is just 32 bit for now
[06:42] <Kamion> pitti: nope
[06:42] <jdub> s/package/binary/
[06:42] <jdub> ah right
[06:42] <jdub> ok
[06:43] <Kamion> Riddell: Kubuntu daily is overflowing
[06:43] <jdub> bgertzfield: is there a spot to configure which network daemons run by default?
[06:44] <iwj> Kamion: can I delete those yaboot images now ?
[06:44] <Riddell> Kamion: hmm, ok, thanks
[06:44] <Kamion> Riddell: Kubuntu/amd64, Kubuntu/i386, Kubuntu/ia64
[06:45] <infinity> bgertzfield: So, it depends on libc6-i386 and such?
[06:45] <infinity> bgertzfield: I never did check the amd64 packaging..
[06:45] <Kamion> also Ubuntu/ia64, ubuntu-server/i386, Xubuntu/powerpc
[06:45] <Kamion> janimo: ^--
[06:45] <Kamion> infinity: could you look at the ubuntu-server oversizing?
[06:46] <janimo> oh, overflow :(
[06:46] <infinity> Kamion: ubuntu-server oversizing, saywhatnow?
[06:46] <infinity> Kamion: It used to be tiny...
[06:46] <ogra> janimo, you ??
[06:46] <janimo> ogra, well I had to put esound in ;)
[06:46] <Kamion> CD 2 will only be filled with 230349968 bytes ...
[06:46] <Kamion> (ubuntu-server)
[06:46] <Keybuk> 230MB?!
[06:47] <ogra> janimo, oh, right that as 100s of MB :P
[06:47] <Kamion> janimo: lesson: never fill CDs up to the brim with language packs
[06:47] <janimo> Kamion: how much do I need to take off from xubuntu ppc?
[06:47] <Kamion> CD 2 will only be filled with 521606 bytes ...
[06:47] <Kamion> ^-- xubuntu/powerpc
[06:47] <Kamion> pitti generally leaves 5MB clearance
[06:47] <janimo> Kamion: thanks
[06:48] <infinity> Kamion: A 230MB overflow sounds like a pretty big "whoops", given that the ISOs were only 230MB to start with a while back...
[06:48] <ogra> i you accidentially buil ubuntu server DVDs ? :)
[06:49] <dholbach> ogra: you're spell checker seems to have problems. :-p
[06:49] <infinity> Well, okay, they were 400MB, but still.
[06:49] <ogra> dholbach, nope, there is a big grain of salt in my keyboard ...
[06:49] <Kamion> ok, who added language-support-{lots} to ubuntu-server?
[06:49] <ogra> which just got stuck under the D
[06:50] <infinity> Kamion: That CD2 warning on -server is for the source CD.
[06:50] <infinity> Yay, false alarm.
[06:50] <Kamion> oh, so it is.
[06:50] <Kamion> language-support> sorry that was xubuntu, I knew about that ...
[06:51] <janimo> Kamion: took out lang-support-pt from ppc
[06:51] <infinity> That does remind me that I wanted to toss some random langpacks on -server and fill it out a bit, though.
[06:51] <infinity> pitti: <poke>
[06:52] <infinity> Typical. :)
[06:54] <infinity> -24 revision(s) pulled.
[06:55] <infinity> Go bzr.  Negative revisions.
[06:55] <Treenaks> infinity: no, it _pulled_ negatively.. it pushed!
[06:56] <Riddell> kubuntu ia64 is 115MB overflowed?!
[06:58] <infinity> That seems excessive..
[06:59] <Kamion> infinity: that means that somebody pushed a merge of lots of revisions
[06:59] <iwj> This dpkg md5sum diversion upgrade problem - does anyone here have it ?
[06:59] <Kamion> so 25 revisions -> 1 merge
[06:59] <infinity> Kamion: Ahh, so my revisions got collapsed?
[07:00] <mvo> iwj: I have not seen it myself, only got reports about it
[07:00] <Kamion> infinity: right
[07:00] <Kamion> people should try to pull rather than merge
[07:00] <iwj> mvo: I don't understand it at all.  It's completely mystifying.  I tested this when I did it and thought about it quite hard and now I test it again I can't get it to do it.
[07:01] <iwj> Furthermore, I can't see how that message from dpkg-divert could appear.
[07:01] <iwj> Because dpkg-divert isn't supposed to rename and do that check unless you pass it --rename which I don't.
[07:01] <infinity> iwj: What's the bug #?
[07:01] <iwj> 46590, 42907
[07:01] <mvo> bug 46590
[07:01] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46590 in update-manager "[dist-upgrader]  Upgrading breezy->dapper: coreutils update fails" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46590
[07:01] <iwj> dpkg-divert: rename involves overwriting `/usr/share/man/man1/md5sum.textutils.1.gz' with
[07:01] <iwj>   different file `/usr/share/man/man1/md5sum.1.gz', not allowed
[07:02] <infinity> Err, it's undiverting backwards?
[07:04] <infinity> So it is.
[07:04] <iwj> I've managed to reproduce it but only by creating a file md5sum.textutils.1.gz.
[07:04] <infinity> iwj: The diversion is /usr/share/man/man1/md5sum.1.gz, not /usr/share/man/man1/md5sum.textutils.1.gz ... No?
[07:05] <iwj> The diversion is by dpkg of md5sum.textutils to md5sum.
[07:05] <infinity> Oh, it IS backwards.  I see.
[07:05] <infinity> iwj: Then the only problem is this:
[07:05] <iwj> It's completely batshit.
[07:05] <infinity>     rm -f /usr/share/man/man1/md5sum.textutils
[07:05] <infinity> (note the lacking .1.gz)
[07:05] <iwj> Oh, those rm's are wrong.
[07:05] <iwj> I didn't even touch those dammit.  I should have eyeballed them more closely.
[07:06] <iwj> There's still something else wrong.  dpkg-divert shouldn't complain if it's not being asked to rename.
[07:06] <infinity> --remove implies a rename, if it's removing a rename, no?
[07:06] <LaserJock> mvo: ping?
[07:06] <infinity> (ie, it just renames backwards)
[07:07] <iwj> infinity: No, diversions are always renames in that sense.
[07:07] <infinity> What else could --remove possibly do, but undo the original --rename diversion?
[07:07] <mvo> LaserJock: here, but I leave for dinner in <5 minutes
[07:07] <iwj> --rename means (is supposed to mean) `make the change in the filesystem as well as in the diversion list'.
[07:07] <mvo> LaserJock: can we talk after that (~30-45min)?
[07:07] <infinity> iwj: Yes, but --remove (IME) has always actually undone whatever you did in the first place.
[07:07] <infinity> iwj: So if you renamed, it un-renames.
[07:07] <LaserJock> mvo: sure, np
[07:08] <iwj> infinity: No, there is no flag in the database for whether the original call had --rename.
[07:08] <infinity> iwj: Oh, fair point.
[07:09] <infinity> iwj: Then I have no idea.  But --remove has always seemed to imply the rename.
[07:09] <infinity> iwj: In fact, I've relied on that behaviour in the past.
[07:09] <trappist> I'm trying to rebuild kdelibs to test a patch, and graphvis is a build-dep, but there seems to be no such package.  is there a package floating around somewhere that's not in the repos?
[07:10] <mvo> iwj, infinity: I'll read the backlog, need to run now
[07:11] <infinity> trappist: It exists if you spell it correctly (graphviz)
[07:11] <iwj> infinity: This behaviour has been changed by someone since dpkg 1.4.0.
[07:12] <ogra> *pitti
[07:12] <trappist> sigh.  I looked and double- and triple-checked that I was spelling it right and I still missed it.  thanks infinity.
[07:12] <iwj> In 1.4.0 you don't get --rename on --remove unless you ask for it.
[07:12] <iwj> In current dpkg it's been broken so --remove always implies --rename.
[07:12] <iwj> mvo: Never mind, I know what the problems are now.
[07:12] <iwj> *sigh*
[07:12] <iwj> Well, I'll fix the coreutils rm and it's obviously too late to fix dpkg-divert.
[07:13] <infinity> iwj: I'd imagine a fair number of things have changed in the decade since 1.4.0.. :)
[07:14] <Riddell> trappist: graphviz is in main, join us in #kubuntu-devel if you have KDE questions
[07:14] <infinity> iwj: Fixing dpkg-divert at this point qould require auditing the Debian archive for every maintainer script that relies on the current broken behaviour and fixing it. :/
[07:14] <pitti> yay network breakage
[07:15] <mgalvin> Riddell: #ubuntu-newsroom ;)
[07:15] <pitti> Kamion: sorry, if you answered something I didn't get it
[07:15] <pitti> mvo: ping
[07:15] <ogra> pitti, that'd be bn hi ru on i386 and additionally ja ca cy form amd64, do you think that suffices ? 
[07:15] <ogra> pitti, i'll drop the two additional blocks you added at the bottom (in the live seed)
[07:15] <ogra> (sorry wrong order of the sentences now)
[07:15] <bgertzfield> infinity: Packages are ready.  I'll upload to an apt-get repository on the outside
[07:16] <bgertzfield> infinity: Since you're not in a big hurry, I'll get them to you in an hour or two
[07:16] <infinity> pitti: What magic do you use to decide how to fill out a CD with translations?
[07:16] <infinity> pitti: The server CDs could perhaps use some langpack love.
[07:17] <pitti> infinity: I have a script for that. Do you need them right now?
[07:17] <infinity> pitti: I'm working on a few things right now, so "whenever"...
[07:17] <pitti> ogra: sure
[07:17] <glatzor_at_the_f> hi, could anyone please confirm the purpose of the repositories in Ubuntu: dapper - will never change, dapper-security - only security updates for dapper, dapper-updates - proposed updates and securityupdates for the installed proposed updates
[07:17] <glatzor_at_the_f> a guy from sun asked about this
[07:18] <Kamion> pitti: no overflow for Ubuntu first-class arches, overflows for some others though
[07:19] <pitti> Kamion: I'll file a bug and attach the logs then; I can install l-s-en from the CD without any problems
[07:19] <iwj> infinity: auditing> quite so.
[07:19] <mdz> Riddell: how is the current Kubuntu candidate looking?
[07:19] <Kamion> glatzor_at_the_f: dapper, dapper-security> correct, dapper-updates> data loss and other high-impact bug fixes
[07:19] <mdz> ogra: how is the current Edubuntu candidate looking?
[07:19] <Kamion> (but small, safe bug fixes, usually)
[07:19] <iwj> infinity: At this stage inventing a new flag to turn off the new (IMO broken) default would be the only thing to do.  Oh well, at least I know I can fix dapper.
[07:19] <ogra> mdz, live is overflown... testing i386 default install currently
[07:19] <Riddell> mdz: desktops are all good, alternatives are overflowing so I'm about to rebuild them
[07:19] <iwj> mdz, Kamion: heads-up, new coreutils on its way.
[07:20] <mdz> iwj: *beg your pardon*?
[07:20] <ogra> iwj, haha, good joke :)
[07:20] <iwj> mdz: see ^.  It breaks on some upgrades due to a typo in the preinst.
[07:20] <LaserJock> Kamion: in your opinion, could completely broken (segfault on startup or something similar) Universe packages be -updates candidates?
[07:20] <iwj> bug 46590 etc.
[07:20] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46590 in update-manager "[dist-upgrader]  Upgrading breezy->dapper: coreutils update fails" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46590
[07:20] <mdz> iwj: add to DapperReleaseRadar under post-release updates
[07:21] <infinity> LaserJock: Of course.
[07:21] <mdz> target dapper-updates
[07:21] <iwj> mdz: OK.  I don't have a clear idea of which breezy->dapper upgrades will fail as a result of this issue.
[07:21] <LaserJock> infinity: hmm, thanks. does UVF apply?
[07:22] <infinity> LaserJock: New upstreams in an already released distribution are frowned upon, yes. :)
[07:22] <Kamion> LaserJock: yes
[07:22] <mdz> iwj: fiddling about with fragile diversions in essential packages after Beta is considered harmful
[07:22] <LaserJock> ok, great. that clears a couple things up.
[07:22] <Riddell> Kamion, infinity: am about to rebuild kubuntu alternative CDs
[07:23] <iwj> mdz: Yes, quite.  However in this case I think a review of the debdiff will convince that the change is definitely not harmful.  But it's your call of course.
[07:23] <mdz> iwj: I mean the change which introduced this bug
[07:23] <ogra> Riddell, without -meta upload ? 
[07:23] <infinity> Riddell: Does that mean the DVDs need a respin too, to match?
[07:23] <BenC> are we only supposed to mark tests that were different from the last time?
[07:23] <iwj> There was always a bug.
[07:23] <Riddell> ogra: only ship changed
[07:23] <BenC> I've boot/install tested the livecd on amd64-k8, and boot/install tested on a G5
[07:23] <BenC> getting ready to do some sparc64 netboot/installs
[07:23] <infinity> BenC: Just pass/fail (and notes for failure).
[07:24] <Riddell> infinity: I don't think so, just some language pack sizing
[07:24] <ogra> Riddell, lucky you :/ i need a new -live
[07:24] <BenC> infinity: same URL as before?
[07:24] <iwj> mdz: I have no tests to prove it of course but I think the proportion of stuff that fails now is smaller than the proportion of stuff that would have failed before.
[07:24] <infinity> BenC: Yeah, it should be updated to refer to today's images by now.
[07:24] <BenC> ok
[07:25] <BenC> BTW, I cannot do any CD installs on sparc
[07:25] <BenC> none of my equipment can boot CDR
[07:25] <infinity> Crap.
[07:25] <mdz> BenC: talk to sfllaw and other sparc owners and see what can be done about that
[07:25] <Keybuk> seb128: I get the same Evolution Error on a fresh install :-/
[07:25] <BenC> and they are all SCSI cdrom's so no way to replace it :/
[07:25] <seb128> Keybuk: as said that's a known issue, you will get it on 100% of the install you do
[07:25] <Keybuk> meh; why is the UI e-mail choice now only between devolution and thunderbug :-(
[07:26] <BenC> sfllaw: ping
[07:26] <seb128> Keybuk: but that's only cosmetic and the only time you click, it actually works after that
[07:26] <sfllaw> BenC: Pong.
[07:26] <seb128> Keybuk: the file it complains about is created when it displays the message
[07:26] <Keybuk> seb128: cosmetic is "the icon looks too much like a rabbit"
[07:26] <infinity> Keybuk: Hrm?... Mine has mutt in the list.
[07:26] <pitti> mvo: bug 46338 is still there
[07:26] <Keybuk> not a "THE SKY IS FALLING" error message
[07:26] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 46338 in update-manager "language-support-en not installed any more" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46338
[07:27] <BenC> sfllaw: I cannot do CD boots on sparc, I can only netboot...my equipment doesn't do CDR
[07:27] <sfllaw> BenC: We appear to have a dearth of useful sparc machines.
[07:27] <sfllaw> Basically, it's fabbione.
[07:27] <mdz> iwj: that stuff has been a source of bugs for ages, but I thought it was finally in a stable state in Debian
[07:28] <fabbione> BenC: i did change that as we agreed before. just slam N/A
[07:28] <BenC> sfllaw: fabbione asked me to do the cd installs, since I don't think he can do cd installs either
[07:28] <fabbione> BenC: i will do CD's when i am back to DK next week
[07:28] <fabbione> it's not an issue
[07:28] <BenC> ok, NP
[07:28] <BenC> fabbione has sparc-cd installs covered :)
[07:28] <sfllaw> Uhm.  I think we might want to get some more working sparc machines.
[07:29] <sfllaw> Just a hunch.
[07:29] <infinity> fabbione: Uhh, we're releasing ubuntu-server-sparc.iso, we kinda need to test it.
[07:29] <fabbione> infinity: no we don't.
[07:29] <bddebian> heh
[07:29] <bddebian> Send me a Sparc, I'll test it :-)
[07:29] <BenC> sfllaw: I have an IDE (e.g. CDROM capable of CDR booting), it's just not where I can get to it
[07:29] <BenC> my U5 is still in storage
[07:29] <fabbione> sfllaw, infinity: we will delay sparc release
[07:29] <seb128> Keybuk: right, evolution sucks but we are no better alternative
[07:30] <fabbione> sfllaw, infinity: so there is not the same kind of hurry to test cdimages
[07:30] <sfllaw> BenC: Well, we've got a whole lot more hardware coverage on the other platforms.
[07:30] <sfllaw> fabbione: All right.  Thanks.
[07:30] <Kamion> sfllaw, infinity: above is a direction from both mdz and sabdfl, btw
[07:30] <BenC> sfllaw: we have a lot of sparc hardware, just that it's mostly legacy equipment that is not capable of cd booting
[07:30] <BenC> I have 6 ultrasparc's to test on, just not CD boot :)
[07:32] <BenC> I think it's more common for someone to netboot install a sparc than cd boot anyway (because not many people get their hands on a mastered CD for linux that they can boot)
[07:32] <bddebian> What's a model I would need to test with?  For future reference :-)
[07:32] <pitti> seb128: can you please ping me when you are done with the wiki page? it's my third failed attempt to get a lock (from different persons, though)
[07:32] <iwj> mdz: What they have in Debian is exactly what we have in Dapper.  I'll have to mail them about this typo.
[07:32] <BenC> bddebian: U5/U10 is a good test box
[07:32] <bddebian> BenC: Thx
[07:32] <seb128> pitti: done
[07:32] <zyga> hello
[07:32] <bddebian> Heya zyga
[07:32] <iwj> mdz: Of course we've had a different history (the diversion was released by us and not by Debian) so it's possible our users have more trouble with it.
[07:32] <mdz> sfllaw: please add rescue mode and integrity check test cases to the matrix
[07:32] <mdz> iwj: pre- or post-sarge?
[07:33] <iwj> mdz: I don't have my notes here but IIRC the diversion is in sid only, and not in current sid (since they applied my patch).
[07:33] <iwj> notes> I could dig them out ...
[07:33] <zyga> I'd like to report that mac mini 10.4.x os X install creates ubuntu-incompatible filesystem and partition table, it is not possible to dual-boot in such configuration
[07:34] <mjg59> zyga: ?
[07:34] <zyga> mjg59: there is no way to put ubuntu and os x 10.4.x on mac mini I have, os x installer creates some non-standard partition table
[07:35] <iwj> What do I need to do to get a copy of the autobuilder's package which seems to be sat in some queue somewhere.
[07:35] <mjg59> zyga: You haven't described the failure and you haven't uniquely identified the hardware
[07:35] <iwj> cf https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/i386/firefox-themes-ubuntu vs https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-php-firefox-human
[07:35] <ivoks> zyga: you are using ppc, right? :)
[07:35] <zyga> ivoks: right
[07:35] <infinity> iwj: Oh, I'll publish it.  Thanks for the reminder.
[07:35] <Kamion> infinity: hang on
[07:35] <seb128> pitti: got the lock that time? :)
[07:35] <infinity> Kamion: Oh...?
[07:35] <Kamion> infinity: might as well publish thunderbird-quickfile while we're at it
[07:35] <pitti> seb128: yep, thanks
[07:35] <Kamion> I'll just new it
[07:35] <iwj> infinity: Thanks.
[07:35] <Kinnison> -> dinner with mother
[07:35] <zyga> mjg59: unique hardware: mac mini 1.25GHz, installed from 10.4 mac mini os x install cd
[07:35] <zyga> s/cd/dvd/
[07:35] <infinity> Kamion: Was going to do that too, yes.
[07:36] <infinity> Kamion: But if you're there first. :)
[07:36] <seb128> pitti: np ;)
[07:36] <zyga> I really don't know how to describe the hardware more
[07:36] <iwj> infinity: If you could let me know when I should expect it that would be great so I can test this new firefox (don't ask).
[07:36] <zyga> the software bit is that no tool I have can see the os x-created partition layout
[07:36] <Kamion> accepted
[07:37] <pitti> seb128: bah, someone else broke my lock now. GRR
[07:37] <infinity> iwj: BTW, if you follow that source link through (click the version, then click the i386 build, then click on the "resulting binary"), you can download the binary now.
[07:37] <zyga> the installer asks me to create "partition label" of some kind, there are quite a few available
[07:37] <iwj> infinity: Ooo.
[07:38] <ogra> iwj, be careful, could be infinity is allergic to three O's and a dot currently ;)
[07:39] <ogra> even though your dot was at the end :)
[07:39] <iwj> Oh, there it is, hiding in one of those noise boxes in the corner.  Thanks, infinity.
[07:39] <Keybuk> infinity: "Everything will be OK"
[07:40] <zyga> mjg59: what else can I do to investigate this?
[07:40] <fabbione> pitti: did you finish to edit Testing/Current?
[07:40] <pitti> fabbione: no, it took me some time to merge my changes with the one who broke my log
[07:40] <fabbione> ok
[07:41] <ogra> pitti, hal should behave the same on all arches, right ? 
[07:42] <ogra> pitti, my usb DVD writer offers me every speed from 1x to 48x on amd64 and i386 but only 15x and 32x on powerpc :)
[07:43] <ogra> (in n-c-b that is)
[07:43] <mdke> elmo: pong
[07:44] <pitti> fabbione: done now
[07:44] <pitti> fabbione, dholbach: your amd64 installs are marked with PASS - have you really got language-support-en installed?
[07:44] <jdub> ogra: those curly endian errors, they'll bite you every time!
[07:45] <pitti> ogra: well, 'behave' only modulo keys and attribures
[07:45] <pitti> ogra: no idea about that bug, though
[07:45] <ogra> its just funny, i'd not really consider it a bug
[07:46] <fabbione> pitti: thanks
[07:46] <ogra> jdub, yeah, that might be it
[07:46] <pitti> sfllaw: sure that we need to keep the older test results? they make editing the page a pain since it takes very long to find stuff
[07:46] <jdub> ogra: pfft 8)
[07:47] <ogra> we should urgently fall back to the sigle pages for every derivative, editing that huge thing is a pain
[07:47] <pitti> ogra++
[07:48] <ogra> mdz, can you wave my edubuntu-meta through to fix edubuntu-live please
[07:48] <sfllaw> ogra: All right.
[07:48] <sfllaw> I will split them off.
[07:48] <ogra> next release, for now lets kepp what we have to avoid confusuin
[07:48] <ogra> *confusion too
[07:48] <sfllaw> Ooh.  Confused.
[07:49] <infinity> ogra: I'll send it through.
[07:49] <ogra> infinity, thanks
[07:49] <pitti> Kamion: I created and attached the logs to bug 47537
[07:49] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 47537 in debian-installer "amd64/alternate does not install language-support-en" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47537
[07:49] <mdz> ogra: what's up with edubuntu-meta?
[07:50] <janimo> infinity: is there a way to automatically rebuild a package and bump ubuntu revno without an upload?
[07:50] <pitti> janimo: no
[07:50] <ogra> mdz, pittis langpack addition was a bit optimistic for edubuntu-live :) 
[07:50] <pitti> ogra: still strange; did you add anything else, or were the sizes just wrong?
[07:51] <ogra> pitti, i didnt touch seeds or -meta since a while
[07:51] <ogra> surely not after you
[07:51] <infinity> ogra: I see no upload...
[07:51] <pitti> ogra: hm, still mysterious. sorry, though
[07:51] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK, I'm regenerating the vmware-player apt repository now
[07:51] <Keybuk> infinity: there is no upload ...
[07:51] <infinity> Keybuk: Oh, thpt. :)
[07:52] <ogra> infinity, 
[07:52] <ogra> ...
[07:52] <ogra> Good signature on ../edubuntu-meta_0.80.dsc.
[07:52] <ogra> Uploading via ftp edubuntu-meta_0.80.dsc: done.
[07:52] <ogra> Uploading via ftp edubuntu-meta_0.80.tar.gz: done.
[07:52] <ogra> Uploading via ftp edubuntu-meta_0.80_source.changes: done.
[07:52] <ogra> Successfully uploaded packages.
[07:52] <ogra> Not running dinstall.
[07:52] <infinity> ogra: Keybuk got to it before me.
[07:52] <ogra> should be there
[07:52] <ogra> ah
[07:52] <ogra> heh, approval race :)
[07:52] <Keybuk> infinity: actually I quickly moved it elsewhere while mdz queried it, to save your face ;)
[07:52] <infinity> Keybuk: I was going to check the changes and make sure it was just langpack dropping. :)
[07:53] <Keybuk> oh, I put an ubuntu-queue symlink in ~lp_queue
[07:53] <Keybuk> because /srv/la<tab>grr was annoying me
[07:53] <infinity> Yeah, that tab completion irritates me too.
[07:53] <infinity> Especially with the latency between here and the DC...
[07:53] <infinity> (~350ms, on a good day)
[07:54] <Keybuk> so mv ubuntu-queue/incoming/* manual-queue/incoming
[07:54] <Keybuk> etc.
[07:54] <Keybuk> much easier
[07:54] <pitti> infinity: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/langpacksize.txt
[07:55] <infinity> pitti: And these are in some vague order of "worthiness"? :)
[07:55] <pitti> infinity: right
[07:55] <infinity> pitti: How is that determined?
[07:55] <pitti> infinity: G is base+gnome, K is base+KDE, G+K is everything
[07:55] <infinity> pitti: Cause ubuntu-server has a different audience from desktop..
[07:55] <pitti> infinity: English, then the world's top 11, then alphabetically
[07:56] <infinity> pitti: (For instance, lots of pl and cz users..)
[07:56] <bgertzfield> infinity: Want me to send you a diff of the debian/ directory for the new vmware-player-kernel package?
[07:56] <pitti> infinity: feel free to shuffle around :) then you just loose the cumulative sum
[07:56] <infinity> Err, cs.
[07:56] <infinity> bgertzfield: I can manage that on my own.  I'm SMRT that way.
[07:57] <infinity> bgertzfield: Just give me a few moments to gather my scattered thoughts, and I'll grab the new packages and poke them with a stick.
[07:57] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK.  I'm uploading them to the outside now.
[07:57] <infinity> bgertzfield: There's no rush anyway, unless I missed the memo where we were going to ship these on the CD. :)
[07:57] <bgertzfield> infinity: No, no CD. :)
[07:57] <bgertzfield> Yeah, I know there isn't a rush, I just like to do a good job. :)
[07:58] <pitti> I'm off to further CD testing
[07:58] <Tonio_> hi
[08:00] <bddebian> Hello Tonio_
[08:00] <Keybuk> infinity: when you're done running the publisher, could you run it again?
[08:00] <Keybuk> who needs cron.daily when you have cron.infinity?
[08:00] <infinity> Keybuk: Yeah, I was planning on it already.
[08:00] <infinity> I should just put it in a while loop.
[08:05] <Keybuk> infinity: we could put publish-distro in a while loop, and just stop it every now and then to run apt-ftparchive? :p
[08:07] <infinity> Keybuk: Actually, if we can get the soyuz kids to guarantee that publishing and archive maintenance won't stomp on each other (they've been non-committal on this), that idea's not as insane as it sounds.
[08:07] <infinity> Keybuk: It's more or less how the rest of the machinery works, why not the publisher as well?
[08:08] <Keybuk> infinity: I'm told these days that things are definitely happening transactionallish
[08:08] <Keybuk> I've certainly not worried about whether or not p-d is running
[08:08] <Keybuk> we've only come across one "interesting behaviour"
[08:08] <Keybuk> (when you have a Pending already, e.g. a finished build, and try and change the overrides)
[08:11] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK.  Packages are updated:
[08:11] <bgertzfield> deb http://foxden.org/apt sid non-free
[08:11] <bgertzfield> deb-src http://foxden.org/apt sid non-free
[08:12] <bgertzfield> infinity: I updated both vmware-player (to have the .orig.tar.gz) and vmware-player-kernel-2.6.15 (to use one megapackage for all the kernel modules).  I'm testing the packages now
[08:13] <iwj> Has there been any movement on the stuff I report in DapperReleaseNotes/Kubuntu/UpgradeProblem ?
[08:16] <darius_> 30557
[08:16] <Riddell> iwj: no, that needs feature changes to adept
[08:16] <darius_> bug 30557
[08:16] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 30557 in linux-source-2.6.15 "cpu idle time in /proc/stat wrong" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30557
[08:17] <infinity> darius_: Yes, we know.  It won't be fixed before release.  Please stop announcing the bug every 24 hours.
[08:17] <darius_> infinity: I didn't think I had
[08:17] <infinity> darius_: I recall you pointing it outa day or two ago, and perhaps one other time before that.
[08:17] <darius_> infinity: heck, I don't visit here every 24 hours - but thanks for letting me know that it won't make release
[08:18] <infinity> darius_: Sorry if I maligned you by implying that you've done it every 24 hours for the last month or so. :)
[08:18] <iwj> Riddell: No, obviously we're not changing adept now.  As you see I suggest changing the release notes to document an upgrade procedure that works.
[08:22] <iwj> Riddell: So, is anything being done about improving the release notes ?
[08:23] <infinity> Oh crap.  We never did anything about changing the CD icon in Windows.  Do we care?
[08:23] <infinity> mdz: ^^^
[08:24] <mdz> infinity: no
[08:24] <infinity> Right.  I'll TODO it for edgy.
[08:26] <Riddell> iwj: I've upgraded with adept numberous times and not had any problems
[08:27] <infinity> Mithrandir: Are you doing DVD testing?
[08:27] <iwj> Riddell: Did you read my wiki page ?  Do you agree or disagree with these criticisms ?
[08:27] <iwj> Or are you saying that I imagined the whole thing being so broken it couldn't reboot ?
[08:28] <iwj> My point is that the user will have a much nicer experience if we tell them to get out a konsole and a copy of some dumb text editor.
[08:28] <iwj> Command line notwithstanding.
[08:30] <iwj> Riddell: Also, I take it 46404 isn't going to be fixed ?
[08:30] <mvo> bgertzfield: do you have binary package (for amd64) in that repisitory as well? I would give it a test then
[08:31] <iwj> Not that I'm sure it's RC but it's quite alarming and probably ought to be noted somewhere in an errata list.
[08:32] <Riddell> iwj: 46404 is fixed, I thought I put it in the changelog but maybe not
[08:32] <iwj> Riddell: I didn't look at the changelog I'm afraid.
[08:33] <iwj> If it's fixed then excellent.
[08:33] <iwj> I'll make sure to test it :-).
[08:33] <Riddell> no but malone should close it if it was
[08:33] <iwj> Still listed as `unconfirmed' here.
[08:33] <Kamion> er ... changelogs don't auto-close bugs in malone
[08:33] <Kamion> you have to do that manually
[08:33] <Riddell> iwj: dcop and other kde things can break after upgrading until you restart kde but that won't change if you upgrade from a command line
[08:34] <iwj> Riddell: Yes, but if you try to do the install and reboot from the command line you don't see any of the damage.
[08:34] <Riddell> iwj: and I've not had a problem with being able to log out/reboot after ugrading but I'll look out for that when I test it today and tomorrow
[08:34] <iwj> Also, please see my other comments about how editing your sources.list in adept is a pita.
[08:35] <iwj> I'll try it again.  It's possible that my naive attempts to do the tests after upgrading (like the release notes suggest you might be able to) broke it more badly.
[08:35] <Riddell> Kamion: hmm, I thought it did for some reason
[08:35] <iwj> Do you not agree that editing sources.list in a text editor would be easier than in adept ?
[08:35] <iwj> I mean, I hate vi but I'd rather use it than adept for this job.
[08:36] <iwj> I'm sure the users would be able to cope with nano.
[08:36] <Riddell> iwj: i've got my girlfriend using adept, I know I won't get her using nano or even a GUI text editor for sources.list
[08:37] <iwj> It doesn't even have search-and-replace !
[08:38] <iwj> And you _have_ to run apt-cdrom if you've got no network connection.
[08:38] <iwj> (Even if you do have internet downloading all of dapper might be too slow and/or expensive.)
[08:41] <iwj> So I think the bottom line is that not specifying in the release notes a sane way to do the required sources.list edits is an RC bug and because I've been asked to test the upgrade I have reported a fail for this reason.
[08:41] <lemsx1> brb
[08:42] <iwj> I can and will test the resulting system after the upgrade to see if it works but before I look at the upgrade process again with a testing pov, this issue should be resolved.
[08:43] <iwj> It could be resolved by (a) fixing the release notes to suggest something I think someone could manage to do without throwing the computer out of the window or (b) being told by mdz or someone that they disagreed and I was being overruled.
[08:43] <iwj> s/being told/me &/
[08:43] <Keybuk> infinity: need another publisher run
[08:43] <infinity> Lies.
[08:43] <Keybuk> ubuntu-meta in outdate
[08:43] <Keybuk> ^ed
[08:44] <iwj> Riddell: Are you planning on (a) or (b) or (c) ignore the test failure and hope it goes away ?
[08:44] <infinity> Yeah, checking if it built everything.
[08:44] <infinity> s/everything/everywhere/
[08:44] <infinity> Yup, looks good, publishing.
[08:45] <iwj> Riddell: Sorry to be behaving like an arsehole about this but I'm looking for some concrete and robust response and haven't had it so far.
[08:45] <Keybuk> RIDDELL!!!!!!!
[08:45] <bgertzfield> infinity: Just realized I included the wrong rev of the kernel package in the apt repository on foxden.org.  Fixing.
[08:45] <infinity> bgertzfield: S'ok, I've not gotten to you yet anyway. :)
[08:45] <Keybuk> Riddell: Kubuntu screen got locked by switching VTs on Live CD
[08:46] <bgertzfield> infinity: Lucky me ;)
[08:46] <iwj> Keybuk: I think I've scared him off.
[08:46] <Keybuk> iwj: you bad, bad man
[08:47] <doko> testing edubuntu and ubuntu dvd i386 images ...
[08:49] <iwj> Riddell: I have to go and have some dinner etc.  Let me know what we're going to do about these problems.  Feel free to contact the Management and get them to overrule me.  I look forward to it :-).
[08:50] <mdz> iwj: summary of the issue?
[08:50] <mdz> iwj: problem with the instructions, software defect, both?
[08:51] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK, I just confirmed the out-of-the-box install "just works" with the new combined kernel module package.
[08:52] <ogra> meh, ppc edubuntu install ended up without a lo interface
[08:52] <ogra> did anybody else see that ? (non networked install)
[08:54] <LaserJock> mvo: back?
[08:54] <mvo> LaserJock: yes
[08:57] <bgertzfield> mvo: ok, my apt repository is updated with the new kernel module package
[08:57] <bgertzfield> infinity: apt repository updated
[08:57] <bgertzfield> mvo: go ahead and grab the new revisions (I also bumped vmware-player to correctly use a .orig.tar.gz and fix a missing word in the description)
[08:57] <bgertzfield> have to idle for a few.
[08:58] <jdub> bgertzfield, mvo: you guys are teh rock. ;-)
[08:58] <bgertzfield> jdub: I live to give. :)
[08:58] <infinity> ogra: ping me when you release your lock on Testing/Current
[08:59] <ogra> will do
[08:59] <mvo> jdub: don't forget infinity, he is certainly a rockstar as well :-D
[08:59] <Riddell> mdz: he says the adept repositories manager is less user friendly than text editor on sources.list, which I disagree with, and KDE breaks after upgrade until it's restarted which is true but seems to have broken worse for him than I've seen
[08:59] <infinity> mvo: are you doing server/amd64 right now?  If not, I'll take it off your hands.
[09:00] <Riddell> Keybuk: switching VTs by hand or quitting X?
[09:00] <Keybuk> Riddell: switch user thingy
[09:00] <mvo> infinity: not right now, feel free (and thanks!)
[09:00] <Keybuk> Riddell: also Lock Session happens to have the same effect
[09:01] <ogra> infinity, done
[09:01] <ogra> did anybody test powerpc alternate already ? 
[09:01] <bgertzfield> OK, I'm out for a bit.
[09:02] <mvo> bye bgertzfield
[09:02] <ogra> i ended up with no lo device on a non networked edubuntu default install over here
[09:04] <ogra> anybody else seen that on ppc ?
[09:10] <infinity> Erm.  I'm supposed to test the "rescue" mode of the desktop/live CD, but I'm pretty danged sure it doesn't have one...
[09:10] <infinity> Am I an idiot, or should that row be removed from the table? :)
[09:11] <infinity> (Answering both in the affirmative may also be correct)
[09:11] <ogra> heh, intrgrity check is a bit "jumpy" on the screen
[09:11] <ogra> *integrity
[09:14] <mvo> bgertzfield: \o/ works now
[09:15] <infinity> Oh, heh, someone did change the logo on the CD, I just wasn't paying attention.
[09:15] <infinity> Yay.
[09:16] <infinity> Kamion: "Ubuntu 6.06 amd6" <--- Is that the label limit for ISO9660/Joliet?
[09:17] <pitti> Keybuk: since you had that problem as well: the installer offers resizing if there's a single large ext3 partition (and a swap)
[09:17] <pitti> Keybuk: I just got that, it was the first time I got resizing offered (and it worked fine)
[09:19] <ogra> erm, Kamion i have no expert mode on edubuntu anymore ? is that right ?
[09:19] <pitti> sfllaw: am I right that the desktop CD doesn't offer a special 'rescue' mode?
[09:20] <infinity> pitti: I'm pretty sure it doesn't.  I just made the same comment 2 minutes ago. :)
[09:20] <pitti> sfllaw: shall I mark that line with N/A or remove it entirely?
[09:20] <pitti> infinity: :)
[09:20] <infinity> pitti: Feel free to just remove that row from the list.
[09:23] <ogra> infinity, seems edubuntu-live 0.80 is in the archive, if you dont mind i'd like a new liveFS
[09:24] <infinity> ogra: I don't mind in the least.
[09:24] <ogra> :)
[09:24] <infinity> ogra: Spinning.
[09:24] <ogra> thanks :)
[09:24] <Tonio_> mdz: ping ?
[09:25] <pitti> infinity: hm, we don't have alternate/server, shall I add it?
[09:25] <infinity> pitti: Err, what?
[09:25] <infinity> pitti: Oh, you mean doing "server" from the aternate CD?
[09:25] <ogra> heh
[09:25] <pitti> infinity: installing the alternative CD in 'server' mode 
[09:25] <pitti> right
[09:25] <Tonio_> mdz: we have a problem concerninf video streaming in konqueror
[09:26] <infinity> pitti: Yeah, sure.  Add that.  I'd prefer if we had just removed the option from the menu or renamed it to something else, but way too late now.
[09:26] <Tonio_> mdz: it crashes on almost all streaming file due to a bug in kaffeine
[09:26] <infinity> pitti: It is in the menu right, not just a command-line option for the clueful?
[09:26] <infinity> pitti: If it's in the menu, it should definitely be tested, IMO.
[09:26] <Tonio_> mdz: we have a fix readdy that just changes mimetypes asociations and that works pretty well
[09:26] <Tonio_> mdz: would you agree with such an upload (concerns kubuntu-default-settings package)
[09:27] <pitti> infinity: it is in the menu
[09:28] <Tonio_> mdz: I know it is not critical, but since konqueror is the masterpiece of kde and default webbrowser, it is probably to have it as stable as possible...
[09:29] <dholbach> hum, after I did changes with the oem user, I ran sudo oem-config-prepare and rebooted, created a new user, but the changes I made seem gone?
[09:29] <ogra> mdz, edubuntu shipit is safe (i386 install all fine)
[09:30] <infinity> dholbach: What changes did you make?
[09:30] <seb128> ogra: I'm going to do edubuntu on desktop CD amd64 now 
[09:30] <dholbach> infinity: changed background, created a symlink to the book excerpt
[09:30] <ogra> seb128, live ? 
[09:30] <infinity> dholbach: Changed the oem user's background?
[09:30] <seb128> ogra: ah right, you still use the old naming
[09:31] <seb128> ogra: yep, ubiquity
[09:31] <ogra> seb128, thats overflown, new lifefs'es are building ytm
[09:31] <dholbach> infinity: yes - was that wrong?
[09:31] <infinity> dholbach: Cause he gets deleted.  As does his ~
[09:31] <ogra> *atm
[09:31] <seb128> ogra: and install?
[09:31] <infinity> dholbach: You kinda want to be making system-global changes. :)
[09:31] <ogra> install is good to test
[09:31] <seb128> I'll do install amd64 then
[09:31] <ogra> thanks :)
[09:31] <dholbach> infinity: ok, I see :-p
[09:31] <infinity> dholbach: The oem user is only there so you have something to log in as.
[09:31] <seb128> np
[09:32] <ogra> i'm a bit worried about that ppc loopback device thing here
[09:32] <ogra> who else will do ppc testing ?
[09:32] <dholbach> thanks infinity
[09:32] <ogra> i'd like to confirm that it works in ubuntu and i'm just crazy or something
[09:35] <mvo> fabbione: how do I a netinst with ubuntu-server? or is this the normal install with "server"
[09:35] <pitti> erm, dumb question: how do I get expert mode on amd64? on ppc I have it in the yaboot menu, but it's not in the gfxboot menu and F6 doesn't help either
[09:36] <ogra> where do you have a gfxboot menu on ppc ? 
[09:36] <fabbione> mvo: no you need to setup tftpd/dhcpd to netboot/netinstall from archive.ubuntu.com
[09:36] <ogra> oh, nm
[09:37] <infinity> Oh wow, keyboard-detection sure if fugly without a framebuffer.
[09:37] <mvo> fabbione: I did that, I wonder if there is a special "netboot" image or if I use the one that I used to netboot the normal install
[09:37] <infinity> "Please type one of the following black squares"
[09:37] <fabbione> mvo: netboot images are all the same
[09:37] <mvo> fabbione: right. so I type "server" and get the server install there?
[09:37] <mdz> Tonio_: I already approved that last week; did it not get uploaded?
[09:37] <fabbione> mvo: grab the one from archive.u.c/ubuntu/dists/dapper/main/install-i386/
[09:37] <fabbione> mvo: i386? yes
[09:38] <Tonio_> mdz: only half of the changes.... riddell didn't use the good debdiff I sent him
[09:38] <Kamion> $ isoinfo -d -i cdimage/www/full/daily/current/dapper-alternate-amd64.iso
[09:38] <mvo> fabbione: ok, that is what I needed to know, thanks
[09:38] <Kamion> Volume id: Ubuntu 6.06 amd64
[09:38] <Kamion> infinity: ^--
[09:38] <infinity> kubuntu-default-settings (1:6.06-21)Add application/x-mplayer2 to profilerc to make KMPlayer the default Konqueror plugin
[09:38] <Tonio_> I have a package here correcting the issue, si if you accept, we can upload it right now
[09:38] <infinity> Tonio_: ^^^
[09:38] <infinity> Tonio_: Was that not the change?
[09:38] <infinity> Kamion: Ahh, so Windows is cutting it off.
[09:38] <Kamion> ogra: sorry, what about edubuntu expert?
[09:38] <infinity> Kamion: Suck.
[09:39] <Tonio_> infinity: for streaming we also need to associate realaudio mimetype to kmplayer
[09:39] <ogra> Kamion, there is no entry for expert in the install CD anymore
[09:39] <ogra> Kamion, was that intentional ? 
[09:39] <Kamion> ogra: powerpc loopback> did you skip netcfg by going back to the installer main menu, rather than by telling netcfg "don't configure network"?
[09:39] <Kamion> ogra: no, which arch?
[09:39] <Keybuk> ogra: you've just discovered the first test for worthiness of the "expert" option
[09:39] <Kamion> ogra: oh, is this a gfxboot-using arch?
[09:39] <ogra> Kamion, i left it fail on the broadcom card
[09:39] <Tonio_> mdz, infinity: and concerning audio streaming, the issue isn't resolved at all....
[09:39] <ogra> Kamion, yep i386
[09:40] <pitti> mvo: do you have any idea about that disappearing l-s-en?
[09:40] <Kamion> ogra: press F6 ("Other Options"), then F6 again to toggle between normal and expert modes
[09:40] <Tonio_> mdz: that's why I think a "last of the latest" upload is a good idea (if you are okay of course)
[09:40] <infinity> Tonio_: Argh, we're well into CD testing at this point.  I'd say these kinds of changes are ideal for dapper-updates.
[09:40] <infinity> mdz: ^^^
[09:40] <mvo> pitti: that is fixed now in my tests (i386 upgrade) 
[09:40] <pitti> Kamion: ah, thanks, that was my question as well
[09:40] <ogra> Kamion, i'm fine with it not being prominently available though
[09:40] <mvo> pitti: amd64 upgrade is still runing
[09:40] <pitti> mvo: did you upload a new version this afternoon?
[09:41] <mvo> pitti: no
[09:41] <ogra> Kamion, i just wasnt sure if it was removed due to the "server" mode removal
[09:41] <pitti> mvo: I still got it on ppc today
[09:41] <Kamion> ogra: nah, it's been in that position in gfxboot for months
[09:41] <mvo> pitti: hmmmmm
[09:41] <ogra> not in my last tests
[09:41] <Kamion> ogra: I'm sorry, it really has
[09:41] <ogra> there was an expert menu item
[09:42] <Tonio_> infinity: I didn't consider the shipit process.... is that the reason icons changes on xubuntu-default-settings have still been possible today ?
[09:42] <ogra> Kamion, i'm sure jsgotangco and cbx33 will proof me, they both tested it in RC from the menu...
[09:42] <mdz> Tonio_: we're much of the way through a many-hour-long regression test; we're only stopping now for true showstoppers
[09:42] <Kamion> Tonio_: those sneaked through without approval
[09:42] <mdz> Tonio_: I suggest queueing your upload for dapper-updates
[09:42] <Tonio_> mdz: okay, thanks !
[09:43] <Tonio_> Kamion: thanks for the info
[09:43] <ogra> Kamion, any ide about the ppc loopback device ? 
[09:43] <Kamion> ogra: well, I don't know, you can look through the history of tools/boot/dapper/boot-i386 in http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/bzr/debian-cd/ubuntu/ if you like
[09:43] <Kamion> ogra: could I see /var/log/installer/syslog?
[09:43] <ogra> sure
[09:45] <ogra> Kamion, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/syslog
[09:46] <Firerabbit> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/45223 someone on here seems to claim that if "pmi capabilities" inclues 'suspend' then the option should show up in the quit window, however on my machine it does not, is this a wide-spread issue?
[09:46] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 45223 in Ubuntu "Sleep not present in Dapper 6.06" [Normal,Needs info]  
[09:49] <infinity> Okay, they probbaly don't work, and I probably don't care, but if anyone has the hardware, Ubnutu desktop CDs for {sparc,ia64,hppa} are built and current.
[09:49] <mdz> Mithrandir: ping
[09:50] <Kamion> ogra: interesting, you didn't back up from netcfg, so it's not that bug ...
[09:51] <ogra> Kamion, want me to redo that install with the non wireless card instead (note i have no wired network around, so i cant test networked install) looks like its related to the firmware
[09:51] <Kamion> ogra: give me a few minutes to investigate
[09:51] <ogra> ok
[09:52] <mdz> Riddell: you said the desktop CDs for Kubuntu were good, but I don't see test results; please update the table
[09:52] <Firerabbit> I would be happy to investigate this problem further if someone can give me a little bit of background information on what changed that broke this.
[09:52] <ogra> infinity, how's my livefs build doing ? 
[09:52] <Kamion> ogra: can I see /etc/network/interfaces too please?
[09:53] <Lure> Firerabbit: have noticed this with RC when testing Ubuntu (Kubuntu user otherwise)
[09:53] <infinity> ogra: Still waiting on amd64 and powerpc.  I'll spin the ISOs as soon as it's done.
[09:53] <ogra> infinity, oh, thanks ;)
[09:53] <FireRabbit> Lure: does the KDE logout window also not include the option?
[09:53] <FireRabbit> or is the problem specific to GNOME?
[09:54] <Lure> Firerabbit: #ubuntu-laptop may be better place though (release is being prepared here)
[09:54] <ogra> Kamion, oooh, thats intresting, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/interfaces
[09:54] <FireRabbit> okay, I was not aware of that channel, thanks.
[09:54] <Kamion> not an installer bug then
[09:54] <Kamion> I'd try to figure out why the networking scripts aren't bringing up lo
[09:54] <ogra> i tried ifupping lo
[09:55] <ogra> but it just returned quietly
[09:55] <ogra> (without giving me a device)
[09:56] <LaserJock> infinity: I uploaded a 1 line bug fix for  mopac7 to Universe, can you process that when you have a chance? Thanks
[09:58] <infinity> bgertzfield: Around?
[09:59] <bgertzfield> infinity: Yes
[09:59] <infinity> bgertzfield: Okay, I still have issues with the vmware stuff. :)
[09:59] <bgertzfield> infinity: OK, what's up
[09:59] <infinity> bgertzfield: You've not allowed for upgrades in any way.
[10:00] <bgertzfield> I punted on the version issue mostly.  What do you suggest?
[10:00] <infinity> bgertzfield: If a kernel ABI bump happens, the kernel and LRM will upgrade, your modules won't.
[10:00] <bgertzfield> Is there a tight dependency from the kernel on the LRM ABI?
[10:01] <bgertzfield> My thought was when a kernel ABI bump would happen, we would update the vmware-player-modules package.
[10:01] <infinity> bgertzfield: vmware-player -> Depends: vmware-player-kernel-modules -> Depends: vmware-player-kernel-modules-$(latest-abi) | vmware-player-kernel-modules-custom
[10:01] <infinity> bgertzfield: ie: make vmware-player-kernel-modules a real (empty) package, instead of a virtual package.
[10:01] <bgertzfield> so you would suggest making an empty vmware-player-kernel-modules package with only dependencies?
[10:02] <bgertzfield> this won't fix the problem, though, right? $(latest-abi) won't force the user to upgrade the package
[10:02] <infinity> bgertzfield: Yeah, that way, when vmware-player-kernel-modules is upgraded, the new -2.6.15-24 package will get pulled in.
[10:02] <infinity> bgertzfield: Then they'll have both on the system.
[10:02] <bgertzfield> I see.
[10:02] <bgertzfield> So we condition it on vmware-player-kernel-modules getting updated.
[10:02] <bgertzfield> Makes sense!
[10:02] <bgertzfield> That'll be easy.
[10:03] <infinity> bgertzfield: Yup.  I look forward to seeing the change.  Then I'll be happy to sponsor these and get them in ASAP.
[10:03] <bgertzfield> infinity: Fantastic.
[10:03] <bgertzfield> I'll make the empty package Architecture: any
[10:05] <ogra> Kamion, this time i got an error message from ifup
[10:05] <ogra> Kamion, it complains about a malformed line 18 in interfaces
[10:05] <ogra> (missing essid)
[10:06] <dholbach> can somebody who burned "alternate cd, ubuntu i386" already check the "rescue" and "check" options and update those on the table?
[10:06] <Kamion> ogra: oh I see
[10:06] <Kamion> hmm
[10:07] <ogra> Kamion, not sure if thats really critical though
[10:07] <infinity> dholbach: I can do 'check' in vmware.  'rescue' might be tougher. :)
[10:07] <dholbach> hehe
[10:07] <ogra> sounds like something we can cover in the known issues section+
[10:07] <dholbach> i can plug the disk containing the isos back to my amd64 later and then burn and test it, it's not a big deal
[10:08] <infinity> Make my LAMP install go faster!
[10:08] <infinity> I really should have plugged one of Zofia's new SATA disks in to install to.. .Much faster...
[10:08] <thom> infinity: would it help if i got out and pushed?
[10:08] <infinity> Though, the crazy SATA/IDE mix on her system is good for testing grub-installer corner cases.
[10:10] <infinity> thom: You could always download ISOs and help test.
[10:10] <infinity> thom: Your name's still in enough changelogs here to incriminate you. :P
[10:11] <dholbach> haha
[10:11] <dholbach> yeah, thom, grab a seat and join in the efforts on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Current
[10:11] <iwj> mdz: both software defects and problems with the instructions; I think the best way to avoid the defects is to change the instructions to avoid the software.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseNotes/Kubuntu/UpgradeProblems has what I wrote about it.
[10:12] <elmo> mdke: it was about the wiki licensing stuff - could you catch up on the recent CC meeting, and give us some feedback?
[10:13] <mdke> elmo: oh, right. I'll have a look yeah
[10:13] <bgertzfield> infinity: how's this look?
[10:13] <bgertzfield> deb http://vmweb.vmware.com/~beng/apt sid non-free
[10:13] <bgertzfield> oops
[10:13] <bgertzfield> stupid xterm copy and paste :)
[10:13] <bgertzfield>  Package: vmware-player-kernel-modules
[10:13] <bgertzfield>  Version: 2.6.15.10-6
[10:13] <mdke> elmo: one line summary? did it go alright?
[10:13] <bgertzfield>  Depends: vmware-player-kernel-modules-2.6.15-23 | vmware-player-kernel-modules-custom
[10:13] <bgertzfield> there we go.
[10:13] <infinity> bgertzfield: And the depends in generated on the fly, I assume.
[10:14] <bgertzfield> infinity: naturally
[10:14] <bgertzfield> so if the user builds a custom kernel package, we assume they know what they're doing and they can track their own dependencies.
[10:14] <elmo> mdke: some people were concerned with making everything PD - wondering if we could default to PD, but make a list of acceptable licenses available for folks to choose from.  also concerns about embedding/attaching non-PD material (screenshots, themes, GPL code, etc.)
[10:14] <infinity> bgertzfield: Right, that was the idea.
[10:14] <bgertzfield> OK, great.  I'll give these a quick test and upload 'em.
[10:15] <infinity> Oh, it's not uploaded yet?  I was about to go have a look. :)
[10:15] <bgertzfield> it takes me a minute to upload them to the outside. I'll do so now
[10:15] <infinity> bgertzfield: Oh, a little late to fix it now, but I assume that 2.6.15.10-5 version number was derived from LRM? :)
[10:15] <thom> infinity: if i actually had machines available i would :/
[10:16] <bgertzfield> infinity: er, yeah.
[10:16] <bgertzfield> I wasn't sure where that came from
[10:16] <infinity> bgertzfield: Yeah, "oops". :)
[10:16] <mdke> elmo: yeah, I saw that on the agenda. I'm not sure if it's a problem in practice or not, I'll catch up on the log. Maybe an idea would be free-for-all on the main wiki, PD on the documentation wiki
[10:16] <bgertzfield> what exactly is the first part supposed to mean?
[10:16] <Keybuk> thom: borrow one of mjg59's thousands
[10:16] <bgertzfield> was it originally the ABI?
[10:16] <infinity> bgertzfield: LRM's version starts out at "KVER" (ie: 2.6.15), then gets revved every time I have to re-roll the orig.tar.gz for new upstream bits.
[10:16] <bgertzfield> infinity: oh. I see. but since I am upstream, I don't need that.
[10:17] <infinity> bgertzfield: Well, you would need to do sometihng similar if you update your orig.tar.gz, but it's still for kernel 2.6.15..
[10:17] <bgertzfield> infinity: ah. yeah
[10:17] <bgertzfield> ok, I'll leave it how it is. :)
[10:17] <bgertzfield> thanks for explaining how it works
[10:17] <infinity> bgertzfield: Or, build your version differently.. Say 2.6.15+1.0.1-1
[10:17] <bgertzfield> right
[10:17] <bgertzfield> Written down as a TODO. :)
[10:18] <infinity> bgertzfield: Yeah, you can revisit versioning in about a week when you upload 2.6.17 modules to edgy. :)
[10:18] <bgertzfield> woo hoo!
[10:19] <infinity> Am I just easily impressed because I get a kick every time I do an LVM install and it "just works"?
[10:19] <infinity> Probably easily impressed, but still cool.
[10:20] <bgertzfield> Scary. ):
[10:20] <bgertzfield> :)
[10:20] <thom> infinity: i'm the same way, actually :-)
[10:22] <ogra> YAY, edubuntu live isos have a sane size
[10:22] <Kamion> ogra: netcfg fix committed upstream
[10:22] <infinity> ogra: Oh, yeah, edubuntu ISOs done, BTW. :)
[10:22] <ogra> infinity, heh
[10:23] <ogra> Kamion, i really think we can keep that for the "known issues" 
[10:23] <Kamion> I'm not sure it makes sense to fix it now though; I think it must have been like that for some time
[10:23] <Kamion> ogra: yeah
[10:24] <infinity> pitti: Thanks for taking the amd64/alternate stuff...
[10:24] <infinity> mvo: Can you do ubuntu-server/i386 netboot as well, since you already have it all set up there?
[10:25] <mvo> infinity: sure
[10:26] <zyga> hello again
[10:26] <mvo> infinity: just noted that I burned the server cd for nothing, but thanks a lot for taking it :)
[10:26] <infinity> mvo: You can test too, if you want.  I don't mind double-coverage on the server stuff. :)  (I'm doing i386, despite mdz having tested it already..)
[10:27] <bgertzfield> infinity, mvo: 5 minutes 'til the "last" packages are up. (hah)
[10:27] <mvo> infinity: I will 
[10:27] <infinity> CD integrity check + vmware + loppback ISO = Yay.
[10:27] <mvo> bgertzfield: nice!
[10:28] <pitti> dholbach: ping
[10:28] <dholbach> pitti: pong
[10:28] <pitti> infinity: no problem, I can give my desktop something to do while I do ppc tests :)
[10:28] <infinity> Hrm, that was a special bug...
[10:29] <pitti> dholbach: do you have l-support-en installed with amd64/alternate? I don't (both with normal and expert install)
[10:29] <bgertzfield> mvo: made one change at infinity's suggestion to our last version, so we can track kernel abi changes better
[10:29] <infinity> Kamion: Ever seen the d-i CD integrity check loop?  (Did the check, said it was okay, hit "continue" -- the only button, fwiw -- and then it did the check again. :)
[10:29] <dholbach> pitti: i'll boot back and check
[10:29] <infinity> Kamion: It rebooted after the second check, so I wasn't stuck there forever. :)
[10:30] <mvo> bgertzfield: yeah, noticed (lurk-mode :)
[10:30] <bgertzfield> mvo: good
[10:30] <pitti> dholbach: I don't have much luck with l-s-en today :/
[10:31] <bgertzfield> oops. I made my empty package arch: any instead of all. rebuilding.
[10:31] <bgertzfield> those could really have had better names.
[10:31] <bgertzfield> how about "every" and "whatever"? so much clearer
[10:31] <bgertzfield> (just kidding)
[10:31] <infinity> bgertzfield: Heh.
[10:31] <pitti> dholbach: chroot should be enough :)
[10:32] <infinity> pitti: Err, what's supposed to install l-s-en?  d-i?
[10:32] <infinity> pitti: (based on the installer language, or..?)
[10:32] <pitti> infinity: l-s-en should always be installed, regardless of the language
[10:32] <Kamion> infinity: I thought Mithrandir fixed that ages ago
[10:33] <infinity> Kamion: Evidently not.
[10:33] <pitti> infinity: that works fine on ppc, and has worked on amd64 in the past, too, but not today (for me at least)
[10:33] <infinity> pitti: Is this also meant to happen on ubuquity installs, cause it doesn't...
[10:33] <pitti> infinity: funny, with ubiquity it works here
[10:33] <infinity> Oh, hah.  I'm sitting here wondering why the vmnet bridge isn't working...
[10:34] <pitti> infinity: just not with alternate
[10:34] <infinity> WOULD HELP IF YOU PLUGGED IN A CABLE INSTEAD OF USING WIRELESS, RETARD.
[10:36] <pitti> Kamion: uh, yes, I said no to 'download l-s' because I don't have network here
[10:36] <pitti> Kamion: (it's currently broken and I have to manually switch to modem)
[10:39] <Kamion> pitti: right, so it didn't :-)
[10:39] <pitti> Kamion: but l-s-en doesn't need to be downloaded...
[10:40] <Kamion> ah, yeah, I suppose that's sort of a bug
[10:40] <pitti> Kamion: anyway, it's probably just a confusing question
[10:40] <pitti> Kamion: I'll try another install completely without network, then it should work, right?
[10:40] <Kamion> mm, probably not, if you answer no to that question then it will not download any language-support-*
[10:40] <Kamion> er, will not install any ...
[10:41] <pitti> a present ethernet without functional internet connection is certainly corner-caseish enough to be ignored for the release
[10:41] <ogra> pitti, at least it works this way in edubuntu, i just had such an install here
[10:41] <Kamion> can you reopen that bug and clarify following this conversation?
[10:41] <pitti> Kamion: I already did
[10:41] <Kamion> it should be on pkgsel
[10:41] <Kamion> ok, thans
[10:41] <Kamion> +k
[10:42] <infinity> bgertzfield: How much do you know about your product? :)
[10:42] <infinity> bgertzfield: Oh, nevermind.  Driver error.
[10:43] <mvo> pitti: just verified, the "language-support-en gets removed" bug is gone for me on i386
[10:43] <pitti> mvo: *scratching my head*, well, good to hear :)
[10:43] <mvo> pitti: I'm doing amd64 now anyway, I check there too
[10:44] <pitti> mvo: maybe depends on the moon phase then, or whether the current hour is a prime number
[10:44] <mvo> pitti: yeah
[10:45] <zyga> lol
[10:45] <zyga> I remeber there was some one program that did depend on moon phase in a way ;] 
[10:45] <mvo> pitti: amd64 is ok too ... all very strange
[10:45] <mvo> zyga: which one?
[10:45] <zyga> mvo: just a sec
[10:45] <sfllaw> pitti: The documentation claims there's a rescue line.
[10:47] <zyga> mvo: http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/P/phase-of-the-moon.html
[10:47] <pitti> sfllaw: not on the live CDs, and since the actual live system is a pretty good rescue system, too, it wouldn't make too much sense, I guess 
[10:48] <bgertzfield> infinity, mvo: foxden.org apt repository updated
[10:48] <bgertzfield> going to ensure the packages work on amd64 now
[10:48] <bgertzfield> vmware-player_1.0.1-4 moves to .orig.tar.gz and fixes a missing word in the desc
[10:48] <bgertzfield> vmware-player-kernel-modules-2.6.15 ... -6 adds the new empty dependency helper package
[10:49] <Kamion> zyga: nethack does
[10:49] <bgertzfield> ahh, my old nethack package :)
[10:49] <bgertzfield> those were the days
[10:50] <zyga> Kamion: adom does too
[10:51] <infinity> bgertzfield: Kay, I've already context switched, but I'll re-check those in a bit.
[10:51] <bgertzfield> infinity: ok, confirmed everything is good on amd64
[10:51] <bgertzfield> infinity: sure. ready whenever you are.
[10:51] <zyga> Kamion: same on virtual moonphase and virtual birthday (try eating a hurtling cake as a hurtling on your virtual birthday :-)
[10:51] <mdz> iwj: the most interesting part of your message is the description of what went wrong after the upgrade, but it's also the bit with the least detail
[10:51] <sfllaw> pitti: Well, it is there.
[10:51] <ogra> infinity, how about edubuntu DVDs, now that you had a snack and refreshment :)
[10:51] <Kamion> infinity: bug 28033
[10:52] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 28033 in cdrom-checker "cdrom-checker-menu never reboots" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/28033
[10:52] <Kamion> should be reopened now I guess
[10:52] <infinity> ogra: You need new ones?
[10:52] <ogra> i have new live isos, so i would imagine so
[10:52] <sfllaw> pitti: I think it might be a little late to remove this functionality.
[10:55] <sfllaw> pitti: Hmm.  It appears to be a documentation fault.
[10:57] <Mithrandir> mdz: hi
[10:57] <Mithrandir> infinity: yes, but not right now.
[10:58] <bgertzfield> Mithrandir: thanks again for all your help yesterday!
[10:58] <dholbach> Riddell: sorry, I added a conflict in the wiki
[10:58] <Mithrandir> bgertzfield: happy to help
[10:59] <Riddell> dholbach: can you fix it?
[10:59] <dholbach> you're done now?
[11:00] <dholbach> Riddell: s'all good
[11:01] <Riddell> thanks
[11:02] <doko> is there a "package" to file bugs for help.ubuntu.com ?
[11:03] <LaserJock> doko: what part? probably ubuntu-docs
[11:04] <doko> LaserJock: start guide
[11:05] <LaserJock> doko: I suppose ubuntu-docs then
[11:06] <mdke> doko: that's a breezy guide though, we won't be fixing bugs for it
[11:06] <elmo> mdke: is the CoC in ubuntu-docs btw?
[11:07] <mdke> elmo: no
[11:07] <infinity> Gah, partman, you suck.
[11:07] <bgertzfield> partman's not fat; he's just big-boned
[11:07] <infinity> Kamion: "Erase entire disk and use LVM" is telling me to piss off because I already have LVM volumes.
[11:08] <mdke> infinity: maybe that's just an excuse to tell you to piss off
[11:08] <mdke> not a great one either... you've seen through it
[11:08] <doko> mdke: but it's still referenced on the toplevel help.ubuntu.com without mentioning the version?
[11:08] <elmo> mdke: could we have it in there please?
[11:08] <mdke> doko: yes. When dapper is out there will be a new website
[11:09] <mdke> elmo: it's a decent idea. Bit late for dapper mind. Would you envisage having it in the front page of yelp?
[11:09] <dholbach> Kamion: thanks for removing those two
[11:10] <infinity> Oh well, I think I did something to anger it.
[11:12] <dholbach> infinity: I think I ran into the same problem.
[11:12] <pitt1> moo
[11:13] <infinity> dholbach: It's tricky to trigger, mind you, so I'm just going to reproduce it later and file a bug.  It's not even close to RC.
[11:13] <dholbach> yeah
[11:13] <dholbach> when I removed the partitions it was happy again
[11:13] <infinity> Man, I so need to file a wishlist bug on d-i for this one.
[11:14] <pitti> Keybuk: I still get anacron on the ppc/live. Are you sure that's from pbbuttonsd? IIRC the changelog claimed that it got fixed recently
[11:14] <infinity> Every time it asks "is your system clock set to UTC" but doesn't tell you WHAT THE SYSTEM CLOCK IS SET TO, a kitten dies.
[11:14] <dholbach> so if one of a million people installing it runs into the problem, he's not going to cry in despair
[11:14] <infinity> "Well, I dunno, maybe it's set to UTC... Maybe not... You've not told me what time it thinks it is.."
[11:14] <pitti> infinity++
[11:14] <Keybuk> pitti: ls /etc/rc2.d
[11:15] <pitti> Keybuk: no anacron there
[11:15] <Keybuk> pitti: no anacron at all?  (as apposed to K*anacron)
[11:16] <pitti> Keybuk: ls -l /etc/rc2.d/*ana* gives nothing
[11:16] <Keybuk> pitti: then you have an old version of casper, thus an old CD
[11:16] <pitti> Keybuk: it's the very latest from today
[11:16] <Keybuk> pitti: Lies.
[11:16] <Keybuk> pitti: dpkg-query -W casper
[11:17] <pitti> Keybuk: 1.57
[11:17] <Keybuk> pitti: that's fucked then
[11:17] <LaserJock> infinity: that UTC clock thing gets me everytime
[11:17] <Keybuk> 1.57 should have /etc/rc2.d/K00anacron
[11:17] <mdke> elmo: ok, I've send a mail to c-c@lists about WikiLicensing, thanks for nudging me about it
[11:17] <Keybuk> pitti: are you testing with a cow
[11:18] <pitti> Keybuk: cow? moo?
[11:18] <Mithrandir> pitti: do you have oopses in dmesg?
[11:18] <pitti> Keybuk: no, no oopses
[11:19] <pitti> a lot of buffer I/O errors on hdc (CD-ROM), but that's about it
[11:19] <crimsun> I get an oops on i386 ([4294684.330000]  EIP is at finish_wait+0x36/0x70)
[11:19] <mdke> doko: yes, we've fixed that bug in the dapper docs (as discussed on -devel mailing list) don't be offended if I close the bug, we can't fix all the breezy stuff
[11:20] <crimsun> (seems to be related to kIrDAd, but it's non-fatal, so meh)
[11:20] <Mithrandir> pitti: any mention of anacron in /var/log/casper.log?
[11:21] <pitti> Mithrandir: ah:
[11:22] <pitti>  /scripts/casper-bottom/25configure_init: 33: dirname: not found
[11:22] <pitti>  `/K00anacron': exists
[11:22] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: you suck, then. :-P
[11:22] <infinity> pitti: Ah-ha.
[11:23] <infinity> Would have been nice if someone had tested that change.. *cough*
[11:23] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: oh, heh
[11:23] <Keybuk> infinity: I did test it, just not in initramf
[11:23] <Keybuk> +s
[11:24] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: so you didn't test it.
[11:24] <infinity> Keybuk: Well, yes.  I meant "test a daily after it was included".
[11:24] <Keybuk> oh well
[11:24] <Keybuk> it's not a regression on the previous behaviour
[11:24] <Keybuk> just silly
[11:25] <pitti> so, it'll make ppc installs horribly slow/unusable after 5 minutes, but oh well
[11:25] <infinity> :/
[11:25] <bgertzfield> :(
[11:25] <pitti> it has worked so far
[11:25] <Keybuk> pitti: that was the case before my fix too though
[11:25] <Mithrandir> pitti: why does this just touch ppc?
[11:25] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: would ${STUPID%/*} work in initramfs?
[11:25] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: ppc has pbbuttonsd which generates a "power" event on boot to let you know it's on AC
[11:25] <Keybuk> which kicks off anacron through invoke-rc.d
[11:26] <Keybuk> and because you just removed the S* links, rather than replace with K* links, invoke-rc.d still started it
[11:26] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: since ${%/*} is POSIX, yes.
[11:27] <pitti> Keybuk: hm, that won't make much sense, will it? unless we'll roll new CDs in the future
[11:28] <Keybuk> *shrug*
[11:28] <Keybuk> certainly too late to put the fix in now
[11:28] <pitti> right
[11:28] <Keybuk> especially given that the fix doesn't break it *more* than it was broken before
[11:28] <Keybuk> (broken fix)
[11:28] <infinity> No point in having it in -updates unless we DO roll new CDs.  THough I guess it doesn't hurt to push it on the off chance that we might.
[11:29] <Keybuk> infinity: we probably will for ubiq bug fixes
[11:29] <pitti> Keybuk: actually, if I started an install immediately, it went just fine; it just got stuck if I played with the live CD for some minutes; maybe anacron checks the load before it kicks in?
[11:29] <infinity> If we decide to do 6.06.1 or something.. I dunno.
[11:29] <Keybuk> infinity: 6.06.6
[11:29] <Keybuk> pitti: I believe it does
[11:30] <mdke> Burgwork: no, you need smurf
[11:30] <pitti> Keybuk: I agree, otherwise I would have never managed to finish any ubiquity installation (updatedb is merciless...)
[11:35] <infinity> Mithrandir: Can you queue up (and test locally) a proper fix for that bug for the just-in-case-we-find-a-showstopper-and-have-to-rebuild-anway case?
[11:35] <infinity> Mithrandir: But don't upload it, obviously.
[11:35] <Mithrandir> infinity: yes, willdo
[11:39] <Kamion> infinity: FYI, in case nobody said - we will be rebuilding for some bad Chinese issues in d-i and ubiquity
[11:39] <Kamion> I've fixed half the problem, about to start investigating the other half
[11:40] <Mithrandir> Kamion: does that mean I should do the casper fix immediately and get it in?
[11:41] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: no!
[11:41] <Keybuk> we want to change as little as possible
[11:41] <Kamion> I'd rather change as few things as possible
[11:41] <Kamion> so that the retesting process is as quick as we can
[11:41] <Mithrandir> Kamion: ok
[11:41] <infinity> Kamion: This one's pretty irritating, mind you.  Positive we can't sneak it in?
[11:42] <infinity> (Not that I have a PPC machine that boots CDs, so I can just pretend the bug doesn't exist)
[11:42] <pitti> Kamion: it means that the ppc live CD becomes unusable after a few minutes
[11:42] <pitti> not the end of the world
[11:42] <pitti> but ugly
[11:42] <Mithrandir> I'm amazed nobody has reported this bug before.
[11:43] <pitti> Mithrandir: I forgot about it after seeing that changelog :(
[11:43] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: I was the first to notice
[11:43] <Keybuk> last week, thus the quick fix
[11:43] <Keybuk> obviously eyeballing the diff and testing locally wasn't sufficient
[11:43] <Mithrandir> it means nobody has been using the live cd for more than a few minutes on PPC?
[11:44] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: at least, nobody has been _not_ using the live cd for more than a few minutes
[11:44] <Keybuk> anacron doesn't kick in under load
[11:44] <infinity> and since our testing cycle involves opening OOo and other such..
[11:45] <pitti> yeah, I noticed when booting the live CD, doing something else, and then wanting to test it
[11:45] <infinity> But regular LiveCD usage on the other hand, is more like "boot, look around, go 'ooo, this is cool', sit at desktop for a while, decide to try installer"
[11:45] <infinity> Which will be hell.
[11:47] <Kamion> I'm very much inclined not to, I'm afraid - any more mistakes at this point would be very costly
[11:47] <pitti> Keybuk, Mithrandir: X=/a/b/c; echo ${X%/*} works well here under bash and dash 
[11:47] <Kamion> (I'm having people double/triple-check all my changes here)
[11:47] <Keybuk> pitti: yeah, but so does dirname ;)  try under initramfs
[11:47] <Keybuk> I did _that_ level of checks on the currently broken shell
[11:47] <infinity> Keybuk: ${} is pure shell, dirname isn't. :)
[11:48] <pitti> Kamion: that means we won't do another full test cycle with  the new images?
[11:48] <Keybuk> ok, it seems to work
[11:48] <Kamion> pitti: we'll do another test cycle, but we need to be prepared for not having enough time for a *full* cycle
[11:48] <pitti> yes, that's what I mean
[11:49] <Kamion> so I'd like not to change things with wide-ranging effects
[11:49] <infinity> Kamion: I'm fine with the answer being "no", but if we fix the broken shell, the worst that happens is that it stays as broken as it currently is if we get it wrong.
[11:50] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: you can pull both sets of fix from sftp://chinstrap/home/warthogs/archives/scott/casper for edgy
[11:50] <infinity> Since casper clearly isn't 'set -e' at that point, or it would have broken horrible on the 'dirname: command not found'
[11:50] <infinity> horribly, too.
[11:50] <Kamion> infinity: I've tried to get in touch with mdz, and can't, so I guess it comes down to me - I think my answer is no, since at least this way we know what the problem is
[11:51] <infinity> Kamion: Fair 'nuff.  I won't push it.
[11:51] <Kamion> (I can imagine for instance that pbbuttonsd might get upset at a different invoke-rc.d exit code or something)
[11:51] <Kamion> (maybe it doesn't, but that kind of thing)
[11:51] <Mithrandir> I could rm the anacron binary instead.
[11:51] <Mithrandir> but as infinity says, your choice
[11:51] <Kamion> if people with ubiquity checkouts could pull my current tree and sanity-check the final patch in it, that'd be good
[11:51] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: that wouldn't help
[11:52] <Keybuk> in fact, that's exactly the kind of brokenness we want to avoid
[11:52] <Keybuk> rm'ing anacron would mean cron would start running /etc/cron.* again
[11:52] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: that branch is missing your 1.57 commit.
[11:52] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: no it's not
[11:52] <Keybuk> it's just one commit for both
[11:53] <Mithrandir> can you fix that, please?
[11:53] <Keybuk> no :)
[11:53] <doko> pitti: is not finding an USB stick worth reporting?
[11:53] <Keybuk> it's my branch, and I'll commit how I want to
[11:53] <doko> May 30 21:33:20 ubuntu kernel: [ 1161.366038]  usb 1-8: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 4
[11:53] <doko> May 30 21:33:23 ubuntu kernel: [ 1162.775905]  usb 1-8: device descriptor read/64, error -110
[11:53] <doko> May 30 21:33:49 ubuntu kernel: [ 1174.427425]  usb 1-1: new high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 5
[11:53] <doko> May 30 21:33:52 ubuntu kernel: [ 1175.836836]  usb 1-1: device descriptor read/64, error -110
[11:53] <Keybuk> it's one logical fix
[11:53] <doko> May 30 21:34:07 ubuntu kernel: [ 1182.743514]  usb 1-1: device descriptor read/64, error -110
[11:53] <pitti> doko: sure; we can't fix it right now, but maybe in-updates
[11:53] <doko> [...] 
[11:53] <pitti> doko: ah, that's known, many dupes
[11:54] <pitti> doko: sudo rmmod ehci_hcd
[11:54] <pitti> doko: in most cases it works with the usb 1.1 driver
[11:54] <doko> pitti: bug number?
[11:54] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: please refrain from breaking casper in the future, then.
[11:55] <Keybuk> Mithrandir: stop being a twat
[11:55] <pitti> doko: 27889, 32182, and probably some more
[11:56] <Keybuk> (*fight*fight*fight*) :p
[11:56] <Kamion> oh-kay
[11:59] <rddp> Are you guys in London having any official post release drinks at a friendly local pub tomorrow? I'd like to get you a round :)
[12:00] <Keybuk> tomorrow is a bit optimistic for "post-release" given the release is on Thursday
[12:00] <rddp> Ah its not quite midnight yet.. :)
[12:01] <Keybuk> unless you're forseeing "it's all gone wrong, let's go get pissed and try to forget"
[12:01] <rddp> well taht could work