/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/06/01/#ubuntu-motu.txt

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KyralIs anyone else really annoyed with all the OMFG Dapper is coming out countdowns?12:59
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ajmitchyes01:03
ajmitchvery01:03
KyralYou wanna see me blow my lid, go to #ubuntuforums01:03
ajmitchno thanks01:04
Kyralgood, because my BOFH is in full effect01:04
=== ajmitch doesn't care any more
ajmitchI've got enough actual work to do to keep me busy for awhile01:05
KyralOh thats great, some idiot is threatening to report me01:05
=== ajmitch has to arrange getting a couple of servers moved across campus somehow
Kyralyah I also have been working on this program for like the past week and it still doesn't work01:06
=== Kyral catches his anger before he detonates in here
crimsundon't worry, it's never worth exploding over OMG $newVersion01:08
crimsunI just think of the poor kittens01:08
KyralI got them back01:08
crimsunand our staggering bug reports01:08
KyralI cat'd /dev/random to the channel :P01:08
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ajmitchvery mature01:09
KyralActually I did it to see if I could :P01:09
ajmitcheven more mature..01:09
ajmitchthere are plenty of things that can be done, that shouldn't01:09
KyralI told you I was in a bad mood01:09
ajmitchthen avoid irc01:09
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KyralJeez, these guys are acting like the HURD went stable suddenly01:16
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=== ajmitch should dist-upgrade the T2000
ajmitchexcept that it'll take a little while to do :)01:33
Kyrallol01:33
ajmitchmight as well get in before the post-release rush on the datacentre01:35
crimsunyou have a good 10 hours or so :-)01:35
ajmitchit'll take that long01:36
ajmitch326 upgraded, 14 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.01:36
ajmitchNeed to get 271MB of archives.01:36
ajmitchat ~50K/sev01:37
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Kyrallol01:38
ajmitchthis is why the server is getting moved01:39
KyralI actually have to get around to putting the HURD on that old box I have...01:40
ajmitchwhy bother?01:41
KyralYou know what else to stick on a Pentium 1?01:41
Kyralthat you got for free?01:41
ajmitchhow much ram does it have?01:41
KyralNo idea01:41
KyralI have never booted it lol01:42
ajmitchyou'll probably need at *least* 64MB to use the Hurd in anyway01:42
ajmitchlast I tried on an old box, it didn't even boot with 16MB01:42
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Toadstoolheya03:02
ajmitchhi03:02
Toadstoolhi ajmitch03:02
Toadstool/me's kinda tired after a 26h hours without sleep "day" but heya ;)03:03
Toadstoolotoh i feel like a moron when I see the real ubuntu devs work ^^03:05
ajmitchonly 26 hours?03:07
Toadstoolyep, and 5 days trip to Dublin which is a really nice place :)03:08
ajmitchheh03:08
xhakeromg #ubuntu is a mess right now.. too much traffic :P03:12
xhakerajmitch do you know any disk managment utility that is capable of showing the location of the files on disk graphically or somthing03:13
Toadstoolxhaker: you should have a look at #ubuntu-fr, 3AM and it's still crowded...03:14
xhakeri'm suspecting my dapper .isos are scattered through my disk03:14
ToadstoolI've never seen that much people so late...03:14
xhakeri'm moving to the home partiton to see the effect..03:14
xhakerToadstool: it's even later there03:15
Toadstool:)03:15
xhakertheir +1 or +2 from me03:15
=== xhaker lives in Portugal
Toadstoolwow :)03:16
xhakerthey're as in "they are"03:16
xhakeri'm proving it's late here by doing kiddie spelling mistake03:17
xhakers*03:17
crimsunwe have another 8 hours or so to go03:17
xhakercrimsun: what's left?03:17
crimsunxhaker: the announcement03:17
crimsunonly then will the chaos truly ensue03:18
xhakeri see kubuntu announcement is still being drafted out03:18
xhakercrimsum.. do you happen to know any utility that provides the feature i described earlier?03:18
xhakeri just want to see a general view of how my data is stored on the disk.. or maybe.. in how many chunks is some ISO split03:19
xhakerreminder: i will never use axel again03:20
crimsunxhaker: not off the top of my head03:21
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Toadstoolg'night everybody03:22
xhakercrimsun: would you think more than 40% fragmentation on a ext3 drive is bad?03:22
xhakerit must be.. rsync struggles03:22
crimsunyeah, that might be a bit much03:24
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=== ajmitch wouldn't think it'd be too bad unless the disk was quite full
ajmitchyou can't see how files are laid out in the disk since it's fs-independant03:37
crimsunah yes, if it's at 90% that would be bad03:37
crimsun90% full with 40% frag == yikes03:37
xhaker:(03:37
ajmitchscary03:37
ajmitchI've got a 93% full /usr/local03:38
ajmitchof course most of that is taken with a dd snapshot of an old disk03:38
ajmitchbut it's a ~410GB logical volume03:38
xhakeri guess sharing a 45gb ext3 partition with windows(games OS) is not so smart03:39
ajmitchno, it's not03:39
ajmitchtrusting windows to do the right thing with ext3 is asking a bit much03:39
xhakerit wouldn't be better using FAT03:39
xhakerDump: 2918/5931008 files (39.0% non-contiguous), 7705161/11831863 blocks03:40
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ajmitchxhaker: so that's a very empty filesystem04:00
xhakerit's non performant though04:01
xhakeri think the problem is that i downloaded the isos in 100 parts04:01
xhakerchunks, whatever04:01
xhakerusing axel04:01
xhakeri thought it would alloc the space smarter04:02
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ajmitchspace allocation is something for the filesystem driver to do04:02
ajmitchif you wrote it on windows, wouldn't surprise me that the driver decides to fragment04:03
xhakerno.. wrote it on linux04:03
xhakerrsync takes 10 minutes to start in that partition04:04
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ajmitchrsync does an md5sum of the image you're copying, iirc04:04
ajmitchhello bddebian04:04
xhakerajmitch but it takes only 1min in this other partition04:05
xhakerit must be something related to file location04:05
ajmitchthen it's broken04:05
bddebianHeya gang04:05
bddebianHi ajmitch04:05
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bmontyajmitch: have you had a chance to look at the Kerberos stuff I've been working on?04:30
bddebianHeya bmonty04:31
bmontyhi bddebian04:31
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turboSeXhas drake been released?06:11
crimsunno.06:12
ajmitchno.06:12
turboSeXany idea about what time?06:12
=== ajmitch thinks they should delay the release 5 minutes everytime someone asks
ajmitchturboSeX: when it's done06:12
turboSeX:)06:13
crimsunajmitch: welcome to debian sarge ;-)06:13
ajmitchcrimsun: hey etch *will* release this year06:13
crimsuntrue06:14
ajmitchit's even going to freeze soon :)06:14
crimsunmaybe I should say, "welcome to duke nukem forever"06:14
bddebianhaha06:14
turboSeXis it true etch will support xgl by default?06:14
ajmitchapproved etch release goals...06:14
ajmitch> - SELinux support06:14
ajmitch> - pervasive ipv6 support06:14
ajmitchsweet :)06:15
ajmitchturboSeX: I don't know, why don't you ask them?06:15
turboSeXajmitch: them??06:15
ajmitchetch == debian06:15
turboSeXajmitch: are you not the them?06:15
crimsunetch? xgl? god that's nuts.06:15
turboSeXajmitch: ohh, i wanted to say eft06:15
turboSeXajmitch: that was my mistake, it was a confusion06:15
ajmitch*nothing* has been decided on for edgy06:15
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ajmitchthere are suggestions06:16
turboSeXajmitch: i heard eft will be quite edgy (experimental), so will it support xgl?06:16
turboSeXi see06:16
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ajmitchhey dholbach06:16
ajmitchhow are you? :)06:16
turboSeXwhat about selinux in eft?06:16
bddebianHeya dholbach06:16
ajmitchturboSeX: maybe06:16
turboSeXis there any official eft channel?06:16
ajmitchno06:16
dholbachhey ajmitch, bddebian - hello everybody else06:17
ajmitchconsidering that we're all just finishing up getting dapper done, it's a little early for it06:17
dholbachand edgy will be VERY broken in the first days - muhuhauhuahahahaha06:18
ajmitchit'll be great!06:18
=== ajmitch can't wait to throw all sorts of things in ;)
Gloubiboulgamorning motu world06:18
bddebianHeya Gloubiboulga06:18
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Gloubiboulgahey bddebian06:19
ajmitchdholbach: so do you have pet goals for edgy that you want to work on yet?06:19
dholbachajmitch: lots of things to do, yeah06:20
crimsundaniel's going to fix all of apt-get.org, wooo!06:20
ajmitchyay!06:21
bddebianhehe06:21
turboSeXcrimsun: was it worth the six weeks delay?06:21
ajmitchbddebian is going to fix all the malone bugs!06:21
crimsunturboSeX: to me? certainly.06:21
crimsunall of malone? rockin'!06:21
bddebianajmitch: Suuure :-)06:21
dholbachturboSeX: ABSO *f.cking* lutely06:21
=== ajmitch is going to sit & drink!
turboSeXcrimsun: regarding features, or only bugfixes?06:21
turboSeXdholbach: i see06:21
dholbachajmitch: gnome 2.15.x for Edgy, merge back with Debian (this is enough already) - catching up with 24967246246 of bug reports06:21
ajmitchcrimsun: how about 1 drink for every bug bddebian fixes?06:22
bddebianw000t06:22
ajmitchdholbach: oh yes, I've got a large backlog of debian stuff to do06:22
dholbachajmitch: I think we're going to get 2.14.x into dapper-updates and after that, there might be pet goals :)06:22
=== ajmitch has 2 main goals for egdy - network auth & selinux
ajmitchand learning how to spell06:22
=== bddebian has 1 goal. To win back dholbach's love ;-P
ajmitchhah06:23
ajmitchhe loves you!06:23
turboSeXajmitch: will selinux have some frontend?06:23
ajmitchturboSeX: what do you mean by frontend?06:23
turboSeXajmitch: some control pannel which could simplify some administration tasks06:23
dholbachturboSeX: internationalisation, UI was improved during that time and other specifications finished and of course bugs fixed06:23
dholbachturboSeX: so it was worth it, even if we now have a shorter release cycle06:24
ajmitchiff you mean runtime options like boolean options, modular policy loading, then probably06:24
turboSeXwhich xorg does dapper support 7.0 or 7.1?06:25
turboSeXdholbach: yes, the release cycle will be three months shorter for eft than it was for drake06:25
crimsun7.0.06:26
ajmitch6 weeks, not 3 months06:26
ajmitchwhich is just a month & a half06:26
crimsunyou know, whenever elmo begins a statement with "uh" I quake in my boots06:26
ajmitchyeah06:26
ajmitchI worry06:26
ajmitchhe picked up a few universe packages that have crackful files in them06:27
ajmitch1 of which I knew about but didn't have time to fix up06:27
bddebiancrimsun: :-)06:27
ajmitch06:41 < elmo> build/buildd/pointless-0.5/debian/pointless/usr/share/pointless/README universe/misc/pointless06:27
ajmitch06:41 < elmo> build/buildd/python-4suite-0.99cvs20050418/4Suite/build/share/Dashboard/4ss-netscape.css universe/python/python2.4-4suite06:27
ajmitchso many more bugs we could have fixed06:28
=== ajmitch was just too lazy
=== bddebian tried :'-(
ajmitchyou tried more than most of us06:28
bddebianI got in the game late on Dapper though.  Freakin' work got in the way :'-(06:28
ajmitchsoon you'll be able to do all of our main uploads for us06:29
bddebianDoubtful06:29
ajmitchwhy do you doubt?06:29
bddebianA) I'm still considering withdrawing my name06:30
bddebianB) I don't think they will take me06:30
crimsunman if I could punch someone via TCP/IP, I'd punch bddebian right in the knees06:30
ajmitchfight! fight!06:31
crimsunboth of those reasons are so bad.06:31
crimsunat least say, "I didn't buy infinity a pony"06:31
ajmitchthey are bad06:31
ajmitchinfinity will be forever sad about that06:31
bddebianC) I didn't buy infinity a pony06:31
crimsunok, C) is legit06:31
dholbachso how are the release party preparations going?06:32
crimsunmine are waiting til the weekend I think06:33
dholbachmine will be friday night06:34
crimsunexcellent!06:34
dholbachyeah, and I got QUITE a bunch of mails asking where my place is, so I guess it'll be crowded :)06:35
=== ajmitch has no party planned
=== bddebian either :'-(
Gloubiboulgathe -fr locoteam has planned an install party next saturday, which will end in bars and restaurants :)06:38
bddebianAck, I have to get to bed.  Gnight folks06:38
Gloubiboulgagnight bddebian06:39
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crimsunman, I'm beginning to wish our default background really was ponies06:41
dholbachinstall party - guys I had enough of install party the last days06:41
ajmitchhehe06:41
Gloubiboulga:)06:41
ajmitchcrimsun: we'd never be ponyless again06:41
crimsunGloubiboulga: it has to start in the bars06:41
=== dholbach signed up for edgy-changes
=== ajmitch should as well
Gloubiboulgacrimsun, I'll suggest the idea :)06:42
dholbachalias uch='dch -Dedgy'06:42
dholbach-Dedgy is just too weird to type :)06:43
crimsunhehe06:43
ajmitch-dodgy06:43
ajmitchI should setup an edgy pbuilder soon as well06:43
ajmitchmight as well just copy the dapper base & config06:43
=== dholbach -> shower
jabrawe have an eta for the release?06:45
ajmitchjabra: when it's done06:45
jabrafigured so06:45
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crimsunI am chuckling at people spidering releases.ubuntu.com by hand trying to guess the images' locations.06:49
jabraheh06:49
ajmitchhow foolish06:49
ajmitchnothing will happen until kamion & mdz are at the office, or they decide to hit the minibar at the hotel before lunch :)06:50
=== ajmitch wouldn't blame then
crimsun:-)06:50
ajmitchok, pbuilder setup ready for edgy06:51
ajmitchwe'll probably have a few weeks of intense workload with merge bugs06:51
ajmitchdebian should be slowing down development of the base system, so that should at least stay fairly stable for edgy until keybuk & co decide to do things like replace init06:52
=== ajmitch can't wait for a python-based init :)
crimsunoh man, that's going to be /pain/06:53
jabraso all the forums that say it is out already are just bs?06:54
crimsundepends what the forums say06:54
jabrahttp://ubuntu-releases.optus.net/.pool/ubuntu-6.06-desktop-i386.iso06:54
crimsunyou certainly can apt-get all the way up06:54
crimsunand the more scrutinizing ones will know which images to check instead of manually spidering mirrors :-)06:54
ajmitchjabra: it's probably someone renaming the latest daily image06:55
ajmitchsince there is no official release done yet, no push to mirrors, etc :)06:55
jabraya probably06:55
=== ajmitch confirms subscription to edgy-changes
whiprush_howdy ajmitch06:56
jabrathere shouldn't be a major tons of app upgrades for the release as I have been running dapper for sometime now06:57
jabraright ?06:57
ajmitchyo whiprush_06:57
ajmitchjabra: if you're up to date with dapper now, there should be no changes06:57
whiprush_jabra: the last update I got was vmware-player yesterday06:57
=== ajmitch should make his first edgy upload sysvinit, before it gets replaced :)
whiprush_ajmitch: will edgy open up soon or post-paris?06:58
ajmitchhopefully pre-paris06:58
ajmitchafaik it depends on infinity & cprov setting it up06:58
whiprush_ah06:58
ajmitchit's always been open before the dev conf06:58
ajmitchI remember doing a number of mono uploads with tseng at UDU06:59
whiprush_ah06:59
ajmitch& then complaining to lamont that the amd64 buildd was breaking :)06:59
whiprush_ajmitch: how's your SoC coming along?06:59
ajmitchah, yeah ;)06:59
ajmitchit's getting there, just getting the bits & pieces together that I need06:59
whiprush_have you decided on FDS or openldap?07:00
ajmitchFDS looks to be an utter pig to build07:00
ajmitchrequires non-free java07:00
whiprush_ah, I was under the impression that it was using gcj.07:01
ajmitchbuild instructions still ask for sun java to be used in places07:01
whiprush_ah07:01
whiprush_well, that kind of makes your choice easier, heh.07:01
ajmitchthey may be inaccurate & out of date, of course :)07:01
ajmitchhttp://directory.fedora.redhat.com/wiki/Building07:02
ajmitchsee the horrible mess07:02
ajmitch"NOTE: The java that comes by default on many Linux distros is GNU gcj/classpath. Our code does not currently build/run with this (we're working on it!), so you will need to install the IBM or Sun JDK in order to build the java code. On RHEL, the IBM JDK is in RHEL Extras. For other distros, you will have to go to the IBM or Sun web site, download, and install it."07:02
whiprush_I'm just happy that someone is working in this area. :D07:03
ajmitchheh07:03
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ajmitchit'd probably be a SoC project in itself just to package FDS :)07:04
whiprush_heh07:04
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ajmitchwell we do have sun's java in multiverse, so it's an option07:05
dholbachheya whiprush_07:06
whiprush_the admin tools in FDS are certainly impressive.07:06
whiprush_hi daniel.07:06
ajmitchwonderful07:08
ajmitchpeople have found the .pool dir where isos are put up for staging07:08
whiprush_dholbach: 6 stories in the digg queue on the .isos ...07:14
ajmitchthat's worrying07:14
dholbachI wonder what people are waiting for :)07:15
turboSeXajmitch: 6 weeks more for dapper + 6 weeks less for edgy = 12 weeks (roughly 4 months)07:15
ajmitchturboSeX: um, no07:15
whiprush_well, at least people are excited about the release. :D07:15
dholbachturboSeX:  6 + (-6) = ?07:15
ajmitchdon't count the 6 weeks twice07:15
crimsundholbach: = ponies.07:16
turboSeXajmitch: i was comparing dapper's to edgy's ("three months shorter for eft than it was for drake")07:16
dholbachcrimsun: YEAH!07:16
dholbachand 12 weeks are 3 months, not 4 months07:16
turboSeXajmitch: i am not comparing EDGY'S to STANDARD, but edgy's to dapper's. that's why i count it twice.07:16
turboSeXdholbach: first i said 3, not four. it was only now that i said 4, by mistake.07:17
dholbachah ok07:17
dholbachwell anyways, it's really 6 + (-6) for the moment - it might change with the release schedule to be planned at Paris07:18
crimsunyeah, I'm not sure why you double-penalized the six weeks07:18
ajmitchnothing about edgy is certain yet07:18
turboSeXcrimsun: how many extra weeks we had available for dapper than we will have for edgy?07:19
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turboSeXdholbach: yes, that's true. i am talking pure mathematics here.07:20
turboSeXcrimsun: the answer to this question will show you why i double-penalize the six weeks.07:21
turboSeXcrimsun: sorry, the question itself does it already :)07:21
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crimsunturboSeX: that only holds if you assume that it's not time-based07:24
crimsuni.e., presuming that october is still the target, we simply have six fewer weeks.07:24
=== crimsun totters off to update his git branch
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turboSeXcrimsun: i don't think i understand your objection, but i would express it this way: as long as the total number of months between the release of breezy and the release of edgy remains constant, whenever we add x weeks to dapper's cycle, we implicitely subtract x weeks from edgy's cycle. as i said, i don't know the *real* schedule, i am talking pure logics.07:26
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ajmitchturboSeX: there was also discussion of taking 2 weeks off the next 3 releases, instead of 6 weeks off edgy07:27
ajmitchstill undecided07:27
turboSeXcrimsun: so breezy's will be cycle+6 and edgy's will be cycle-607:27
turboSeXcrimsun: now the difference between the two cycles: cycle+6-(cycle-6)=cycle-cycle+6+6, which is 12.07:28
turboSeXcrimsun: of course, the REAL dates may change all of this07:28
crimsunturboSeX: yes, 12 weeks is the total work, but that doesn't matter to us now that we're facing edgy07:28
turboSeXcrimsun: agreed, i was simply explaining my calculation07:29
crimsun(I understood that much; I assumed you were facing edgy instead of looking at total work)07:29
turboSeX(i see)07:30
ajmitchas long as feature freeze is nice & late, I'm happy07:31
ajmitchsince we don't need any long bug-fixing period :)07:31
turboSeXajmitch: why don't we?07:31
ajmitchbecause it's edgy!07:32
ajmitchwe don't need anything fancy like 'stability' or 'polish'07:32
turboSeXright07:32
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=== dholbach -> walk
=== ajmitch looks at the debian release update, notices that the toolchain & kernel will freeze in 2 months
=== Sp4rKy is away: go to taf
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crimsun"leaked beta iso"...08:05
=== crimsun falls over laughing
ajmitchhah08:05
ajmitchwhere did you see that?08:05
crimsun#ubuntu08:06
ajmitchit must be leaked, I mean we've always operated so sekr3tly08:06
crimsunhehe08:06
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ajmitchor that this hasn't been propagated from the pools yet, since the staging images we've had have all gone there anyway..08:08
ajmitch(or at least those that kamion has pushed there)08:08
=== ajmitch should leave #ubuntu for the next few days :)
ajmitchheh08:15
ajmitchbug 4719508:15
UbugtuMalone bug 47195 in Ubuntu "Please defer LTS goal to Dapper +1" [Normal,Rejected]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/4719508:15
neutrinomassajmitch: The great part about that is that it was filed on the 28th ...08:17
ajmitchI know08:17
ajmitchit's just a metabug :)08:18
crimsunman, Dapper LTS is just useless without ponies.08:19
ajmitchheh08:19
highvoltagecrimsun: we have ponies in Edubuntu :P08:19
ajmitchok that's it08:20
ajmitchI'm switching to edubuntu now08:20
crimsunoh man, Ubuntu's so screwed08:20
crimsunEdubuntu++!08:20
highvoltage:)08:21
highvoltagecrimsun: we don't really have ponies, sorry :(08:22
FujitsuHahah08:22
highvoltagecrimsun: but we'll have them in either -updates, or in edgy08:22
highvoltage(or from art.ubuntu.com)08:22
crimsunwell dang, that leaves me stranded, because none of the derivatives have ponies :((08:22
ajmitchwe'll really have to get ponies into edgy08:23
robitailleso we need to create  poniubuntu08:23
ajmitchdo you think it'll work well with shipit?08:23
=== imbrandon votes ++ for poniebuntu
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=== ajmitch files a critical bug about lack of ponies
crimsunin the installer, nonetheless!08:28
imbrandonomg #ubuntu is crazy, lol, /me is glad #kubuntu is still semi sane08:31
crimsunyeah, it has been that way for hours, too08:31
imbrandonyea i usaly dont go into #ubuntu but i had to just to watch the nuts08:32
ajmitchit's a little crazy08:32
ajmitchin a way release day is a letdown for us :)08:32
=== imbrandon stays in the #k- channels except #ubuntu-motu
ajmitchsince it means we stop getting new stuff08:33
imbrandonhehe true ajmitch08:33
imbrandonajmitch that just means looking forward top edgy08:33
imbrandonto*08:33
ajmitchedgy will probably be intensely broken for weeks at a time08:34
imbrandonsomeone needs to setup the ubotu to spit that !+dapper out every 60 seconds ;)08:34
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imbrandontrue ajmitch, vmware to the rescue ;)08:35
ajmitch& pbuilder08:35
=== ajmitch tends to use a chroot initially, and pbuilder for building stuff
imbrandoni need to learn howto set that up08:36
ajmitch& then when things have settled down a little, I upgrade my machines08:36
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ajmitchhey viviersf08:36
viviersfmorning ajmitch , all well ?08:37
ajmitchyeah, fairly well08:38
viviersfcool08:38
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_paniqseveas sucks09:28
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dholbachpaniq: there's no need for that language here09:28
crimsunum, please don't take offense, but that /definitely/ doesn't belong in here.09:28
paniq>:)09:28
paniqyeah yeah i shut up, allright.09:28
dholbachwe all respect the CoC in here.09:28
paniqinteresting abbreviation ;)09:29
dholbachCode of Conduct09:30
paniqi'm aware of what it is thank you :P09:30
paniqguess no party for me then, today. just hard work.09:31
paniqlaters09:31
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naraulsomeone please package vidalia for dapper?09:53
Seveasnaraul, for dapper it won't happen09:53
Seveasmaybe for edgy09:53
narauloh, ok09:54
naraulfor edgy then :)09:54
FujitsuOh sure, it can happen. Come on, there's a few hours to go! That's long enough :P09:54
amacits been frozen =)09:54
naraulthis is the source: http://vidalia-project.net/dist/vidalia-0.0.4.tar.gz09:55
naraulamac: edgy??09:55
amacdapper09:55
naraulamac: ok, for edgy then :)09:56
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=== ajmitch waits for edgy to open :)
TheMusoajmitch: I'm with you there.11:21
ajmitchneed to upload new crack!11:21
TheMuso...and for Parris. :)11:21
ajmitchyeah, except some of us can't go to paris..11:21
=== TheMuso has plenty of that. :()
Mithrandirajmitch: get to work! :-)11:22
TheMusoI couldn't normally, but Canonical can really be helpful sometimes. :)11:22
ajmitchMithrandir: yes sir11:22
TheMusoheh11:22
Mithrandirajmitch: seriously though, we should take a little bit of time to sit down and get the spec finalised and the infrastructure you need set up.11:23
ajmitchMithrandir: I know, I was going to wait a couple of days before discussing spec needs with you11:23
Mithrandiryup11:23
MithrandirI'll be away in the weekend so it's either today or tomorrow or after the weekend (which means Tuesday the earliest; monday being a public holiday here)11:24
ajmitchright, and jane wants specs by the 5th11:24
ajmitchwhich is monday11:24
Mithrandiryup11:24
TheMusoajmitch: Youch. Thats news to me.11:25
Mithrandirso today or tomorrow.  Your choice.11:25
ajmitchI'll be free all day tomorrow11:25
=== TheMuso has at least another 4 he wants to write up. :)
ajmitchTheMuso: the 5th for SoC projects11:25
TheMusoOh ok.11:25
Mithrandirajmitch: what times are you around/awake?11:26
TheMusophew11:26
ajmitchMithrandir: name a time, this week I haven't had any set pattern :)11:26
ajmitchI'm at UTC+12, usually in bed by 3AM here11:26
Mithrandirajmitch: I'm generally around from ~0700 UTC, tomorrow I'll leave at about 1400UTC and then be offline the weekend.11:27
ajmitchso about 0900 UTC?11:28
Mithrandirsure11:28
Mithrandirjust ping me then?11:28
ajmitchwill do11:28
ajmitchTheMuso: so what specs are you going to write up for paris?11:32
TheMusoajmitch: All accessibility related.11:32
ajmitchgreat11:32
TheMusoajmitch: Give Ubuntu a few accessibility features that even our commercial rivals like Windows and OS X don't even have.11:33
ajmitchsuch as?11:33
=== ajmitch might as well use this time to catch up on debian
TheMusoSpoken feedback while the system boots, so that you know if anything fails.11:34
TheMusoAnd whether and fsck fails etc.11:34
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MithrandirTheMuso: scary.11:34
ajmitchyou'd need to stuff a few extra things in initramfs for that, I assume?11:34
TheMusoajmitch: aybe.11:35
TheMusoMithrandir: Thats the only drawback to it. It is quite invasive.11:35
TheMusoBut as the way OSs stand now, a blind user only knows that their system is functioning when the desktop loads and their screen reader/braille display starts spitting out data.11:36
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ajmitchI might as well work on the selinux spec again :)11:41
ajmitchbeing an etch release goal, I think it finally has a chance for ubuntu :)11:41
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crimsunwhat, not Ubuntu Pony/Linux? Bah!11:56
ajmitchI know, very sad11:56
ajmitchwe'll have to have the Prancing Pony some other time11:57
ajmitchI wonder how the datacentre bandwidth is holding up11:58
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imbrandoncrimsun, Ubuntu GNU/Pony/Linux12:26
imbrandon;)12:26
naraulimbrandon: why pony?12:26
imbrandonrunning joke this morning12:27
ajmitchbecause everyone wants a pony!12:27
Mithrandirponies rock12:27
imbrandonnaraul, dont you want a GNU/My Little Pony (r) ?12:28
imbrandon!?!! [05:23]  [473]  #ubuntu+1 You need to be invited to that channel12:28
imbrandonwasup with that ?12:29
ajmitchimbrandon: yeah, I think seveas booted everyone out & locked the channel12:29
ajmitchsince dapper is released12:29
imbrandonheheh EDGY !12:29
imbrandonEdgy ponies12:29
imbrandonPonies on the Edgy ?!?12:30
ajmitchponies on crack12:30
imbrandonlol12:30
imbrandonguess i should wipe my dev/build box and get it ready for the edgy repos12:31
ajmitchwhy?12:31
imbrandonit'll give me something to do while i'm setting up the icecast server12:31
ajmitchwhat's so wrong with just dist-upgrading?12:31
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ajmitchmy box survived several years of dist-upgrades without being wiped12:31
imbrandonnothing i guess ;) my main box has but my build box i wipe it every 6 weeks or so and start anew12:32
ajmitchcrazy12:33
imbrandoni think this box i'm on right now ( my main one ) has survied since horay12:34
ajmitchheh12:34
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=== imbrandon wonders if Ubuntu Release will get /.'d
ajmitchprobably12:40
ogralikely12:40
ajmitchand edgy+1 will probably still release before vista is generally available..12:41
spaceyvista delayed again/12:42
spacey?12:42
imbrandonlikely ;)12:43
ajmitchwe'll see12:43
imbrandonat very leaste edgy ;)12:43
imbrandonif not edgy+112:44
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naraulspacey: actually vista was never delayed. it's all fud.12:46
spaceynaraul: anyway the later it comes the better :p12:47
spaceyor depends how you look at it12:47
imbrandonbut spacey Duke Nukem: Forever will run on Windows Vista: Forever  when its released *rolls eyes*12:47
crimsunyeah, but by then we'll have ponies. We win.12:48
imbrandonhehe12:48
spaceyi guess they have enough time to polish it12:48
naraulspacey: well, since i am against microsoft, i would say the opposite: the sooner disaster comes, the better :)12:48
=== imbrandon thinks sabdfl should name Edgy+1 "Pretty Ponies"
highvoltageheh. the 'pink' release.12:49
imbrandonheh12:49
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highvoltagehmmm... a pretty pony theme for edubuntu might not be a bad idea12:49
imbrandonhahahahha12:49
spaceynaraul: if early release means a crappy one then it would be better yes :p12:50
=== imbrandon calls the "My Little Pony(r)" companie to let them know of edubuntu's copyright infringement ideas ........
imbrandonj/k12:50
imbrandonhighvoltage, would kinda be funny for the kiddo's though12:51
spaceyterrify them young?12:54
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highvoltageimbrandon: heh.12:56
crimsunuh oh12:57
=== imbrandon thinks Ubuntu should hire the Gieko Geko for Edgy commercials
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naraulwhat is the server cd?01:06
naraulthey mention a server cd01:06
naraulwhat is that?01:06
ajmitchthe server cd that you can download..01:06
naraulthere's "On the Desktop CD" vs. "On the Server"01:06
ajmitchit's in there with the rest of them01:06
ajmitchdifferent set of packages, different kernel01:07
ajmitchsome options like setting up a LAMP server01:07
naraulis it the alternate one?01:08
naraul"alternate"01:08
dholbachno, it's a separate one01:08
dholbachbut you can install a server from 'alternate' as well01:08
dholbachon the server CD you get more server stuff on there as well01:09
ajmitchserver stuff for edgy should be interesting :)01:09
narauloh, do you mean there's an "ubuntu-server" metapackage just like there's an "ubuntu-desktop" metapackage?01:09
ajmitchif anyone would be brave enough to run edgy as a server...01:09
ajmitchnaraul: no, the server option on the alternate cd installs ubuntu-standard, you then install anything else manually01:10
ajmitchthere's no meta-package at the moment for various server setups01:11
ajmitchjust the LAMP install option, afaik01:11
=== imbrandon dosent see the server cd
ajmitchimbrandon: it's there, below the rest of them on the release page01:12
imbrandonahh i was looking at cdimage.u.c01:13
ajmitchthey're also on cdimage.u.c, under another directory01:13
ajmitchhowever those builds aren't really as relevant now01:14
=== dholbach rejects motuuvf bugs
dholbachmuuhuhuhahahahaha01:15
crimsunwell, hopefully not /all/, since some will have to be merged01:16
crimsun(cf. wxwidgets2.6)01:16
crimsunwell, I guess it's no longer an UVFe req :-)01:17
dholbachok, then i'll remove motuuvf as the assignee01:17
crimsunright, that would work, too01:17
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ajmitchdholbach: so do you get a couple of days to rest, or busy preparing -updates? :)01:19
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dholbach2.14.x for -updates01:20
dholbach2.15.x + Debian merges for edgy01:20
dholbachno rest for me01:20
naraulwhy is ubuntu much more popular than kubuntu, considering that kde is more popular than gnome?01:20
ajmitchmore popular according to whom?01:20
dholbachnaraul: I don't think you can say that one is more popular than another01:20
neutrinomassdholbach: Any idea on when edgy repos will open ?01:21
ajmitchneutrinomass: when they're ready ;)01:21
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ajmitchedgy won't be a usable distro for at least a few weeks, I suspect01:21
ajmitchnot until well after paris, due to packages being synced in from sid, and the distro being uninstallable for periods of time01:21
Toadstoolheya everybody01:21
neutrinomassajmitch: No wonder Ubuntu is a derivative of Debian :P I'll probably set up a vmware environment or install on a seperate partition anyway. 2-3 weeks is a reasonable estimate right ?01:21
ajmitchneutrinomass: edgy will be open for upload within a few days, I suspect, but it'll be 'batshit insane'01:22
neutrinomassajmitch: Fair enough. Thanks :)01:22
crimsundput ponies-0.1_source.changes, woo!01:22
imbrandonhahahahahah01:23
=== ajmitch was one of the few people crazy enough to have upgraded to breezy when he went to UDU
dholbachcrimsun: so ponies are a native package? :)01:23
ajmitchdholbach: of course!01:23
crimsunyep01:23
dholbachcrimsun: I guess, according to you it's more native than others :-p01:23
crimsunhehe01:23
naraulajmitch: linus thor01:23
imbrandon;)01:23
ajmitch?01:24
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naraulajmitch: the question mark was for me?01:25
ajmitchyes01:25
ajmitchwondering what on earth you meant01:25
naraulajmitch: linus torvalds thinks kde is much better than gnome, so now kde is the official desktop environment of most geeks that respect that guy01:27
ajmitchnot from the geeks that I know, but all we have is anecdotal evidence01:27
ajmitchso it's not exactly something you can argue01:28
imbrandonnaraul, nah i use kde but i could care less what linus uses ;)01:29
naraulwhy doesn't ubuntu have a java packages repo?01:32
naraulthere are some nice open source java apps01:33
naraulazureus is one of them01:33
imbrandonaz is in the repos01:33
narauli use it every week01:33
naraulbreezy?01:33
imbrandonroot@voyager:~# apt-cache search azureus01:33
imbrandonazureus - BitTorrent client01:33
imbrandonroot@voyager:~#01:33
naraulimbrandon: breezy?01:33
imbrandonnope , but dapper is the stable dog now ;)01:33
imbrandonsun-java5-jre is also in the repos for dapper, i think that had alot to do with it01:34
naraulimbrandon: what about jedit?01:34
narauland which repo is this?01:35
imbrandondont see jedit , the dapper multivers repos01:35
imbrandonnaraul, packages.ubuntu.com you can search dapper repos01:35
imbrandon* or breezy / horay *01:36
naraulright thanks01:36
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Hobbseehi all01:38
imbrandonheya Hobbsee01:38
=== Hobbsee pokes around to see if everyone's passed out, as release has occured, so they can sleep
crimsunnope, fighting maintainer scripts atm01:39
Hobbseeah what fun :)01:40
Hobbseehi imbrandon01:40
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Whoopie Hi, I have a question regarding package patches: what are these relibtoolize patches for?02:29
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tennessyis it preferable for me to try the 64 bits version?02:30
tennessyor will i have issues?02:30
tennessyis it less supported?02:30
tennessyplease help me decide02:30
tennessySeveas: http://www.ubuntulinux.nl/source-o-matic appears to be down ("Fatal error: Call to undefined function: xml_parser_create() in /var/www/www.kaarsemaker.net/public_html/lib/class.xmlparser.php on line 50"). are you behind this?02:34
SeveasI know02:34
Seveasstupid admin updated php02:34
tennessySeveas: any idea how long this will take?02:35
Seveasnot too long02:35
Seveasbut in a few hours that server will be down for the better part of 34h02:35
Seveas24h*02:35
tennessythank you02:36
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buxysiretart: I'm hearing that you're going through NM superfast, that's cool!02:57
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siretartbuxy: :) - yes, I just send in my answers for T&S 1 :)03:09
ograsiretart, happy release day03:10
ograSeveas, where is the @release-party plugin for ubuntu ?03:10
ogra*Ubugtu03:10
UbugtuPARTAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!03:11
ograhaha03:11
siretartogra: congrats to the release! :)03:11
siretartparty on, guys!03:11
ograthanks :)03:12
zulparty on wayne03:12
siretartparty on, garth!03:12
Hobbseehehe03:12
=== Hobbsee cannot party :( - no one else around here who uses linux
zuland im stuck at work03:13
Hobbseehow dull!03:13
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adolsonI think the website needs to have a thing in the FAQ about Intel 64-bit CPUs, because it is confusing people even at my work, they are using i386 images now.. :\03:17
adolsondespite it saying it on the download page.. it would be good to have there too, I think.03:20
Mithrandirwell, they work fine on 64 bit intel cpus and apart from the bigger memory area, there's little incentive to use 64 bit mode on intel cpus.03:20
adolsonoh? so I shouldn't download it and reinstall then? there's a SUSE user in the office who says there's a big performance difference using 64-bit03:21
MithrandirI'd doubt so with intel cpus.03:21
Mithrandirand the performance difference isn't big, it's 10-20% on "most" applications, iirc.03:21
adolsongood to know03:22
Hobbseehi Mithrandir03:22
adolsonI won't waste my time reinstalling then :)03:22
Mithrandirhiya Hobbsee03:22
MithrandirHobbsee: feeling dapper today? :-)03:22
Hobbseeheh03:22
Hobbseedefine feeling dapper :P03:22
=== Hobbsee hasnt even been here for most of the day :P
tennessyis it preferable for me to try the 64 bits version?03:23
tennessyor will i have issues?03:23
tennessyis it less supported?03:23
tennessyplease help me decide03:23
Mithrandiradolson: the reason why you don't see a performance difference on intel cpus is they have implemented the extra instructions and such in microcode rather than "real hardware", so they're in a sense emulated.03:23
adolsonah03:23
Mithrandirtennessy: it's just as supported as the 32 bit version.03:23
tennessyMithrandir: really?03:24
tennessyMithrandir: what about drivers?03:24
tennessyMithrandir: what about nvidia, for instance?03:24
siretartMithrandir: so Athlon64 cpus do profit a lot from ubuntu/amd64 over ubuntu/i386? did someone did some benchmarks to compare this?03:24
Mithrandirtennessy: I'm running a dualhead amd64 setup with nvidia drivers.03:24
Mithrandiradolson: for some media ops and such, AMD cpus in 64 bit mode are twice as fast, but that's just for a small set of apps.03:24
Mithrandirsiretart: yeah, somebody did the benchmarks and the conclusion was something along the lines of "varies a lot by app"03:25
Mithrandirbut in general is a tad faster.03:25
siretartah. I see03:25
adolsongood to know. thanks Mithrandir03:26
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tennessyMithrandir: what about vmware?03:31
Mithrandiryou can't use 64 bit vmware without running a 64 bit install.03:32
highvoltagethat's a pity. would've been nice if they could emulate 64bit under 32bit... and even ppc03:33
Mithrandirit's virtualisation, not emulation03:33
tennessyMithrandir: so i can't install a 32 winxp under a 64bit vmware?03:34
=== Yagisan mumbles that it doesn't like all amd64 systems
Mithrandirtennessy: I didn't say that.03:36
Mithrandirtennessy: since that works just fine.03:36
tennessyMithrandir: then i didn't understand what you said03:36
Mithrandirtennessy: you can't install a 64 bit winxp under a 32 bit vmware.03:37
tennessyMithrandir: i want to run a 64 bit install and to install a 64 bit vmware and i was asking how much faster that would be03:37
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Hobbseehi Kyral03:37
tennessyi mean, how much faster will the logical machine be?03:37
Mithrandirdepends on what you're running in it.  Probably measureable, but not "feel"able.03:38
tennessythanks03:38
Kyralmorning03:39
Gloubiboulgasomebody knows why webmin has been removed in dapper ?03:49
Gloubiboulgas/ in/ from/03:50
YagisanGloubiboulga: IIRC I think it was effectively orphaned in Debian then removed03:51
YagisanGloubiboulga: http://packages.debian.org/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?keywords=webmin&searchon=names&subword=1&version=all&release=all03:52
Gloubiboulgathanks Yagisan03:52
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bddebianHeya gang03:58
bddebianI'll re-iterate what I said in -devel.. :-)03:59
bddebianCONGRATS EVERYONE AND THANK YOU FOR ALL THE HARD WORK!!!03:59
Hobbseehey bddebian03:59
bddebianHi Hobbsee04:00
Gloubiboulgahello bddebian :)04:00
bddebianHeya Gloubiboulga04:00
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tsengyay dapper04:10
bddebianOh hush up you business travelling traitor ;-P04:11
tsengtraitor?04:12
tsengwtf04:12
bddebianNo tseng, no party :-)04:13
Yagisandappers out now ?04:13
highvoltageyep04:13
tsenger, yes04:13
=== Yagisan was wondering why there were no updates for a few days
bddebianheh04:13
tsengbddebian: at least i got a nice hotel room04:18
tsengdesk, sofa, big bed04:18
bddebianNice04:18
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Kyral_FreeBSDAnyone feel like helping me debug something?04:26
bddebianNot on FreeBSD ;-)04:27
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Kyral_FreeBSDIts not on FreeBSD04:27
Kyral_FreeBSDI just happen to be connected to IRC from the FreeBSD machine I'm playing with04:28
Kyral_FreeBSDAnd its for work, so the faster I get this working the faster I can get hacking on the Hurd :P04:30
bddebianw00t04:30
Kyral_FreeBSDHehe I know how to get bbdebian's attention04:30
Kyral_FreeBSDYou should have seen my comment on all the over the top Dapper stuff going on last night04:31
bddebian??04:31
Kyral_FreeBSD"Jeez, they are acting like the HURD went stable or something04:31
tsenghar har04:31
tsenghurd.04:31
=== tseng hides
YagisanKyral_FreeBSD: Hurd ? that have opengl ?04:31
Kyral_FreeBSDYagisan: It was a joke04:31
Kyral_FreeBSDthe HURD prolly won't be stable for like 3 more years04:32
tsenghasnt hurd been around for 10 years already04:32
jamessandidn't they say that 3 years ago?04:32
bddebianTry 3 more centuries ;-P04:32
=== jamessan ducks
YagisanKyral_FreeBSD: I know it's not finished, but for a laugh I want to see if some software a) builds, and b) runs on it04:32
Kyral_FreeBSDThe point WAS that they were going over the top :P04:32
bddebianA lot of software builds and runs on it04:32
Yagisanbddebian: software I have in mind has portablity bugs I'm hunting down04:33
Kyral_FreeBSDand I promised bddebian  I would help make an Ubunturd :P04:33
Yagisanbddebian: another system to break it on is helpful to me04:33
Kyral_FreeBSDbddebian: we should really change that name...04:33
bddebianYagisan: I have 3 public Hurd boxes if you want access04:33
bddebianKyral_FreeBSD: I know :-(04:33
Kyral_FreeBSDHubuntu?04:34
tsenghaha04:34
tsengDevelopment on the Hurd began in 1990, after an abandoned kernel attempt called Trix.04:34
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Yagisanbddebian: actually, yeah. Debian based ?04:34
ograand HURD comes next year, no ?04:35
bddebianYagisan: Yes, all Debian04:35
bddebianogra: :-)04:35
Kyral_FreeBSDWasn't Gentoo working on a HURD thing?04:35
Yagisanbddebian: nice, I can apt-get the build-deps in a pbuilder04:35
bddebianYes but development stopped a while ago.  Someone tried to pick it up again recently though04:35
Kyral_FreeBSDI hate debugging04:38
Kyral_FreeBSDI think I need another pair of eyes on this one04:38
Kyral_FreeBSDAnyone mind taking a look?04:40
Kyral_FreeBSDThere must be something really stupid I am doing04:41
bddebianKyral_FreeBSD: What is it?04:42
Kyral_FreeBSDThis daemon I am writing to check servers04:43
Kyral_FreeBSDpings every so often and emails the admin if its down04:43
Kyral_FreeBSDbut its not working quite right04:43
Kyral_FreeBSDI think I have a case of "being too close to the code" if you get my drift04:43
Kyral_FreeBSDthe tarball is at bocesproject.snell.clarkson.edu/~petermcv/shcd-1.3.tgz04:44
Kyral_FreeBSDyou'll need MuttNG for it04:47
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Kyral_FreeBSDFeel free to try it out..I need more testers anyway :D04:53
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medelin_I upload do REVU at first time05:05
medelin_and dont have login to revu webpage05:05
medelin_i try recover and get a encrypted message with my password05:05
medelin_so this message is cryted with public key different of mine key05:06
medelin_and I cant decrypt her05:12
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=== Kyral_FreeBSD sighs
Kyral_FreeBSDIs it possible for a network to be flaky for a nano second...05:46
YagisanKyral_FreeBSD: of course.05:48
Kyral_FreeBSDthen why the heck does it seem to happen in the ONE second I ping this damn machine05:48
YagisanKyral_FreeBSD: you may need stephen hawking to explain that05:53
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Tonio_hi06:48
Se7halo06:48
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phanatichi people06:56
LaserJockhi phanatic06:57
phanatichey LaserJock06:57
LaserJockanybody know when Edgy will open?06:57
Gloubiboulgahey phanatic, LaserJock06:57
zulLaserJock: soon...probably <TM>06:58
LaserJockor if it has even been discussed/decided06:58
LaserJockdid dapper open after UBZ?06:58
phanaticheya Gloubiboulga06:58
LaserJockI can't remember06:58
phanaticone week i think06:58
ograshortly before iirc06:58
LaserJockok06:58
LaserJockhmm, I've already got a lot of work to do ;-)06:59
ograwe first need new seeds, then the archive software must be taught to know about egdy ...07:00
ograthat will take some time ... i guess not before end of next week07:00
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=== Sp4rKy is back (gone 11:25:42)
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bddebianHeya phanatic, LaserJock07:18
Kyral_FreeBSDGotta love Perl07:18
Kyral_FreeBSDthey have a complete reference guide and tutorial all in manpages07:19
phanaticheya bddebian07:19
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LaserJockhi bddebian07:22
tuxmaniacLaserJock: bddebian : Hi once again.. Lets celerate.. My vacation and Dapper Drake both have rolled out on the same day07:23
bddebianw00t again :-)07:23
=== Kyral_FreeBSD yawns
Kyral_FreeBSDWhen I get my XenServer back up fully I will celebrate07:23
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=== tuxmaniac dances with champagne on his head
zultuxmaniac: then you can get ready for edgy ;)07:24
Kyral_FreeBSDActually...shit...I need to recompile my domU kernel07:25
LaserJockI'm trying to figure out how to get things in dapper-updates07:25
tuxmaniacKyral_FreeBSD: for once.. celebrate.. Life is just not Ubuntu.. Its about champagne too07:25
LaserJocknot time for partying here ;-)07:26
Kyral_FreeBSDtuxmaniac: Who said anything about Ubutnu07:26
Kyral_FreeBSDThe thing runs on Debian Stable :P07:26
tuxmaniacwhatever.. sorry guys07:26
tuxmaniacseems like a wrong channel to feel happy about ubuntu07:26
lucashello all07:26
LaserJocktuxmaniac: no no07:26
LaserJockI'm happy07:26
Kyral_FreeBSDbecause we are all very anbnoyed with people acting like the HURD went stable last night :P07:26
bddebianWhat are you talking about?07:27
Kyral_FreeBSDYou should have seen #ubuntuforums last night07:27
Kyral_FreeBSDseriously they were acting like the HURD went stable or something...07:27
bddebianWho was?07:27
bddebianAnd why?07:27
Kyral_FreeBSDBecause Dapper was coming out07:27
Kyral_FreeBSDthey were LITERALLY counting down per minute07:28
Kyral_FreeBSDhmm now there is an idea...07:30
bddebianWTF would Dapper have to do with Hurd?07:30
Kyral_FreeBSDget a Core Duo and use the built in virtualization to put HURD on Xen07:30
Kyral_FreeBSDbddebian: I meant thats how they were acting07:30
Kyral_FreeBSDie, party mode major07:30
bddebianAhhh07:30
=== bddebian is a little slow on the uptake :)
Kyral_FreeBSDYou think I could use the virtualization in the new Intel cores to put HURD on Xen?07:31
bddebianYou could certainly try :-)07:35
Kyral_FreeBSDSeeing as I'm looking to pick up one of the new cores this summer :D07:36
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Kyral_FreeBSDJeez, this one is gonna take a while07:37
Kyral_FreeBSDmkfs.ext3 -cc -m 1 -O dir_index -v07:37
=== highvoltage heard something about HURD
Kyral_FreeBSDyou did07:40
highvoltagei wish it could go stable though :(07:41
Kyral_FreeBSDwhen I jump to a Core Duo I'm gonna try to use its virtualization to put HURD on Xen07:41
highvoltagei love the gnu project07:41
Kyral_FreeBSDhehe I do to07:41
Kyral_FreeBSDwhich is why I am a member of the FSF07:42
bddebianhighvoltage: So help us fix it :-)07:45
highvoltagebddebian: where do you work on it?07:45
highvoltageare you involved with ubuntu-libre aka gnubuntu?07:45
highvoltageKyral_FreeBSD: i'm also a member of FSF, member #306607:45
bddebianhighvoltage: I didn't know there was a gnubuntu07:46
bddebianI was considering an Ubuntu GNU/Hurd distro for a while07:46
highvoltagebddebian: there are some other poeple in ubuntu who's been working on something too07:47
highvoltagethey normally hang out in #ubuntu-libre, but there's not many ppl there atm07:47
highvoltageit was going to be called gnubuntu, but RMS said he doesn't like the word, so they changed the name.07:48
Kyral_FreeBSDbddebian: I said once I get my work underway and to the point where I can take a break then I will work on Ubuntu/HURD :P07:48
highvoltageubuntu gnu/hurd would rock07:48
bddebianUbunturd07:48
bddebianF* RMS07:48
highvoltagecan I post some links?07:49
bddebianOK with me07:49
Kyral_FreeBSDhmm07:49
Kyral_FreeBSDI may not need to rewrite this in Python to internalize everything07:50
highvoltagehttp://osdir.com/Article7951.phtml07:50
Kyral_FreeBSDPerl seems to have what I need07:50
highvoltagehttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ubuntu-libre07:50
dholbachOk fellas - I call it a day - happy partying07:50
bddebianLater dholbach!  Good work! :-)07:50
highvoltagegoodnight dholbach07:50
highvoltagei would give you a hug, but i'm not a huggy person07:50
=== bddebian gives dholbach a HUGE hug ;-)
highvoltagedholbach: but i will buy you chocolate or a beer in Paris :)07:51
tuxmaniacdholbach: dont utter the word party on -motu07:51
=== dholbach hugs bdhurdbuntu back
dholbachhighvoltage: I'll buy you one too!07:51
=== dholbach hugs highvoltage
=== highvoltage didn't see that coming :)
dholbach:-)07:51
bddebianhehe07:52
=== LaserJock give dholbach a hug
=== dholbach hugs LaserJock back
dholbachok see you!07:52
=== tuxmaniac feels lonely
=== dholbach hugs tuxmaniac
dholbachbye :)07:53
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tuxmaniac:-)07:53
Kyral_FreeBSDhmm07:57
Kyral_FreeBSDdirectly interfacing with SMTP via perl...07:57
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=== \sh celebrated the release already
\shyesterday evening and night with a lot of special "Maibock" beer07:59
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lucasvoI have problem with a tetex package, I can't download it (http://pastebin.com/751756)07:59
lucasvowhat's wrong with it?07:59
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lucasvooh, it's in the main repos. who should I ask?08:00
\sh#u-devel08:01
lucasvook08:01
lucasvothanks08:01
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ajmitchmorning08:12
\shok..going to celebrate ubuntu release the second time ;)08:13
\shlaters08:13
ajmitchheh08:13
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bddebianEnjoy \sh_away08:18
bddebianHeya ajmitch08:18
ajmitchhi bddebian08:18
ajmitchready to put us all to shame on edgy now, are you?08:18
bddebianIf that were true, don't you think some of the "real developers" would notice? ;-P08:21
Kyral_FreeBSDHehe, if I get enough time, Edgy will have the HURD :P08:21
ajmitchI'm sure08:22
ajmitchbddebian: you are a real developer...08:22
Kyral_FreeBSDActually getting running on the Xen CoreDuo would help in that regard08:22
bddebianOh BS, I fix .desktop files :-)08:22
Kyral_FreeBSDI wouldn't have to dual boot08:22
ajmitchKyral_FreeBSD: and have you got a distro with the Hurd up & running yet?08:22
Kyral_FreeBSDjust xm console hurdvm :P08:22
Kyral_FreeBSDajmitch: Nope, I have to finish work first :P08:22
ajmitchheh08:23
Kyral_FreeBSDwork == pay08:23
Kyral_FreeBSDpay == new CPU :P08:23
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ajmitchso you plan to do a port of ubuntu to a completely different kernel, which you're not even using yet?08:23
ajmitchfunny08:23
Kyral_FreeBSDwell08:23
kagouhi08:23
Kyral_FreeBSDseeing as Debian already has a lot done08:23
Kyral_FreeBSDI'll just start out by installing a debian base system and slowly recompiling from Ubuntu repos08:24
bddebianajmitch: ;-)08:24
ajmitchrunning into problems all the way :)08:24
Kyral_FreeBSDain't that the point?08:24
Kyral_FreeBSDI'm gonna learn a shitload fixing them :D08:24
bddebianAre you ready to fight the zealotry too? :-)08:24
ajmitchso how are you going to port the Hurd to xen?08:25
Kyral_FreeBSDajmitch: Core Duo has that nice built in virtualization08:25
ajmitchso?08:25
Kyral_FreeBSDyou don't need to patch the kernel08:25
ajmitchso you'll run one old-style hypervisor (mach) on top of another..08:25
Kyral_FreeBSDit should be as easy as installing it normally (with hold comments)08:25
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Kyral_FreeBSDOh it won't be primary08:26
Kyral_FreeBSDit will be some guest domain08:26
Kyral_FreeBSDand believe me I will have the power for it :D08:26
Kyral_FreeBSDHeh it will be the ultimate distro tryout machine lol08:28
Kyral_FreeBSDjust create another XenGuest08:28
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LaserJockhmm, I just had my first big IRC argument08:34
LaserJockI hate arguments08:34
ajmitchcongraulations08:34
Kyral_FreeBSDook you this long?08:34
Kyral_FreeBSDJeez I seem to get into flamewars everyday08:34
ajmitchyou have a skill for it08:35
Kyral_FreeBSDpfft08:35
LaserJockyes, I don't like conflict and am generally very calm and patient08:35
LaserJockbut I just had it when I've worked so hard this release and somebody said that Universe wasn't offical or supported in any way08:36
LaserJockI understand the differences between Main and Universe, but to say that my work is nothing, that being a MOTU is nothing :/08:37
ajmitchah, that one08:37
Kyral_FreeBSDAt least you don't get the "You used Ubuntu, so you are a n00b" one08:37
ajmitchyes, it does tend to disparage all the hard work that's been put in08:37
Kyral_FreeBSDnevermind that I have been using Linux for 4 years and maintain a couple packages08:37
GloubiboulgaKyral_FreeBSD, I see this one every day08:37
Kyral_FreeBSD*twitch*08:37
Kyral_FreeBSDLesse, I started on Slack, survived a year on Gentoo, and then got tired and wanted a break so I used Ubuntu for a while08:38
LaserJockand then a Debian guy pops in and says that Universe is not supported like Debian is08:38
Kyral_FreeBSDOh sometimes the Debian guys piss me off08:38
Kyral_FreeBSDLike one day this poor guy came in asking a question about Ubutnu and they jumped his ass08:39
LaserJockanyway, I need to calm down to my usual affable self :-)08:40
LaserJockarggh, but they said there was no guarantee of security fixes and updates08:41
Kyral_FreeBSDchill08:41
LaserJockI guess I shouldn't be working on the packages I was going to send to dapper-updates08:42
LaserJock:-)08:42
LaserJockmaybe we need a MOTU strike and see how they like it ;-)08:42
ajmitchLaserJock: why did that annoy you? they were quite right, universe security has been a best-effort job by some great people who've taken that job on08:43
LaserJockyes, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen08:44
ajmitchsaying there's no guarantee is not the same as saying that noone bothers to work on universe08:44
LaserJockright08:44
LaserJockthat was my point08:44
LaserJockbut it didn't really stick I guess08:44
ajmitchcanonical is bound to provide security updates for main, we're not under the same obligation for universe08:44
ajmitchpeople shouldn't necessarily trust universe to run their critical services08:44
LaserJockright, but they said it had nothing to do with canoncial08:44
Kyral_FreeBSDUniverse is like the AUR Unsupported08:44
LaserJockbut I consider it to be a lot to do with Canonical08:45
Kyral_FreeBSDor rather the AUR itself08:45
ajmitchLaserJock: it is08:45
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LaserJockanyway, I understand what they are saying and for sure Main is not the same as Universe08:46
LaserJockbut to say that it is unoffical just doesn't make sense to me08:46
ajmitchI can understand what you mean though08:46
LaserJockanyway, it was just the wrong day08:48
ajmitch:)08:48
ajmitchyou've done a lot of great work for dapper08:48
Kyral_FreeBSDyup yup08:48
LaserJockI've been working on the "unoffical" and "unsupported" Universe somewhere around 40 hrs a week for months now08:48
ajmitchit shows, canonical now flying you round the world & all08:48
ajmitchthat's about 39 hours a week more than me08:49
Kyral_FreeBSDGood Job LJ08:49
LaserJockhehe, that's just because ogra and JaneW are  nice08:49
Kyral_FreeBSDhehe, honestly I thought I would get all this crap before you08:49
Kyral_FreeBSDthen school hit and... :P08:49
LaserJockI'm still a packaging newb08:49
=== ajmitch will have to spend about 40-50 hours a week from now on :)
Kyral_FreeBSDI've stopped packaging for all intents and purposes08:50
LaserJockI need to cut back to like 1008:50
Kyral_FreeBSDRight now I am perfecting my system admin abilities08:50
ajmitchI've got SoC & other work to do for edgy08:50
LaserJockI've seriously delayed my PhD by a couple months at least for Dapper08:50
ajmitchso it'll be a bit of main stuff08:50
LaserJockarggh, I'm turning into a deve elitest ;(08:52
LaserJocks/deve/dev/08:52
Kyral_FreeBSDhehe08:52
Kyral_FreeBSDI left so I wouldn't become that08:52
LaserJockI'm really not elitest, but I do see things from a different perspective08:52
ajmitchLaserJock: take a week or two off, relax08:52
LaserJockI think we should have a "take a user to work" day08:53
LaserJockwhere a random user has to spend a day working with us08:53
highvoltagehehe. that sounds funny08:53
LaserJockI want people to spend a typical day with elmo, or mdz08:53
=== highvoltage volunteers for that
ajmitchscary08:54
=== highvoltage finds elmo more scary than mdz
ajmitchcan you imagine what they'd be like after a day with elmo?08:54
LaserJocklol08:54
LaserJock"be afraid, be very afraid" :-)08:54
=== Kyral_FreeBSD will be back in some form, when he finds his definition of perfection
LaserJockKyral_FreeBSD: it will be Ubuntu, you know it will ;-)08:56
Kyral_FreeBSDThough more likely than not I will be "competing" with you guys :P08:56
ajmitchprobably08:56
Kyral_FreeBSDNah, it won't be Ubuntu08:56
Kyral_FreeBSDI already know that08:56
LaserJockKyral_FreeBSD: no competition, we will blow you outta the water ;-)08:56
LaserJockhehe08:56
Kyral_FreeBSDwhat have I said before08:56
Kyral_FreeBSDThe great thing about this Open Source world, is that we all have the right to choose08:57
Kyral_FreeBSDthere is no one true perfect08:57
Kyral_FreeBSDjust everyone's perception of it, and we have the right to use whatever we wish, without anyone stopping us08:57
LaserJockonly our own ignorance and stupidity :-)08:58
Kyral_FreeBSDEvery Distro has its benefits08:58
Kyral_FreeBSDevery Distro is someone's idea of "perfect"08:58
Kyral_FreeBSDJeez I sound like Obi-Wan Kenobi or something08:58
BazziLike Obi Wan, you sound.08:59
Gloubiboulga:)08:59
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Kyral_FreeBSDI will most likely revisit Slackware and Gentoo soon08:59
BazziWhile your points are definately true, too much choice hurts.09:00
LaserJockI do think it is a bit different, but I understand what your saying09:00
Kyral_FreeBSDNow that I have played with BSD, I can understand what DRobbins was trying to do with Portage09:00
LaserJockhence the port in portage ;-)09:01
Bazziports/portage is a nice concept :)09:01
Kyral_FreeBSDperhaps learn Perl and Python09:02
Bazzia more user-friendly gentoo (gentoo users will stab me for that) would exceed any available linux experience yet IMO.09:02
Kyral_FreeBSDmy ultimate goal...is to create my own distro09:02
Kyral_FreeBSDjust for me09:02
LaserJockBazzi: I found Ubuntu by looking for a binary version of Gentoo09:02
LaserJockKyral_FreeBSD: for me that would be an abysmal failure09:03
BazziHeh, the irony :)09:03
Kyral_FreeBSDLaserJock: Hehe, I will most likely fail the first few times09:03
LaserJockKyral_FreeBSD: I'd rather have people who know what they are doing do the OS for me09:03
LaserJock:-)09:03
Kyral_FreeBSDbut like I have said09:03
Kyral_FreeBSDI learn best by doing09:03
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Kyral_FreeBSDhence my drive for LFS09:03
LaserJockyeah, makes sense09:04
Bazzihence my drive for creating my own local repository and debs09:04
Bazziso same here :)09:04
Kyral_FreeBSDI got too complacent with Ubuntu09:04
Kyral_FreeBSDI lost my edge09:04
Kyral_FreeBSDArchLinux woke me up again09:04
LaserJockcomplacent? I must not have been cracking the whip enough :-)09:05
Kyral_FreeBSDI meant in terms of understanding the system09:05
LaserJockoh, I gave that up a long time ago, but then I'm a chemist so I can get away with it most of the time :p09:06
LaserJockChris, I really do hope you continue to hang out here every once in a while, even if you aren't actively working on Ubuntu09:07
Kyral_FreeBSDI will09:07
highvoltageKyral_FreeBSD: i hope so too09:07
Kyral_FreeBSDHeck I once I get SHCD working I'll need to package it :D09:07
highvoltageKyral_FreeBSD: mostly because of your HURD interests :)09:08
highvoltagewe need more GNU supporters in Ubuntu09:08
LaserJockwhat's GNU? j/k09:08
Bazziheh, an Ubuntu/HURD version would be sweet09:08
azeemit's Hurd09:09
azeemnot HURD09:09
ajmitchhi azeem09:09
Bazziw/e09:09
azeemAndrew!09:09
bddebianUh oh, you have awoken azeem :-)09:09
LaserJockI don't really understand what the big deal is with Hurd, TBH. What is supposed to be the advantage?09:10
ajmitchazeem: how's it going?09:10
azeemfine, am going to the UK for a weekend trip09:10
azeemajmitch: are you a KDE user09:10
azeem?09:10
ajmitchno, I use GNOME09:11
highvoltageLaserJock: well, there's technical differences, and then there's social differences09:11
BazziLaserJock: well as far as I heard it's a more clean approach to a kernel and more lightweight09:11
highvoltageLaserJock: it might be best to just read the propoganda on the hurd website :)09:11
LaserJockhighvoltage: lol09:11
Kyral_FreeBSDIts something new!09:11
Kyral_FreeBSDThats what!09:11
azeemajmitch: ok09:11
LaserJockazeem: how about you?09:12
azeemGNOME09:12
azeemif that was the question09:12
azeemwell, ion right now, actually09:12
highvoltageit will also provide some competition to the linux kernel guys.09:12
bddebianKyral_FreeBSD: New?  It's older than Linux ;-P09:12
highvoltageput some pressure on them to clean linux up a bit09:12
highvoltageit would really be nice if they did a bugfix version of linux.09:12
azeemI switched to ion for debconf, because I didn't want to get evil stares for displaying an Ubuntu desktop :)09:12
LaserJockazeem: yeah, that was the question. I float between gnome, kde and openbox. mostly gnome though09:12
ajmitchhighvoltage: it hasn't really put much pressure on so far :)09:12
LaserJockazeem: lol09:12
highvoltageion3++09:12
ajmitchazeem: I'm sure quite a few people would have been running ubuntu anyway :)09:13
highvoltageajmitch: well, in it's current state, it's far from competition level :)09:13
azeemajmitch: I was asking because abauer was wondering about the opensync-enabled kitchensync stuff09:13
ajmitchah right09:13
ajmitchI've got kde on the laptop as well09:13
chillywillycongrats on the release guys09:14
chillywilly:)09:14
bddebianHeya chillywilly09:16
LaserJockhmm, I need to figure out how to use screen as my window manager09:16
bddebianhehe09:16
LaserJockI can do one window at a time, but I haven't gotten farther then that :-)09:17
azeemit's hard to choose between ion and screen09:17
=== ajmitch hasn't tried ion
ajmitchhow useful is it?09:17
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ajmitchhi siretart_09:18
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hubhi09:18
ajmitchhi hub09:18
hubwhy do Debian developer complain about dpatch?09:18
huband what is recommended to use instead?09:18
azeemhub: quilt, maybe09:19
ajmitchthey complain when you add dpatch to a package which isn't using it09:19
azeembut dpatch should be fine09:19
hublike of handling a HUGE patch was easy09:19
=== hub think about the 171MB gzipped OOo patch
ajmitchhub: asking why debian developers complain about something is futile09:19
=== azeem tries hard not to think about it
hubazeem: I tend to use cdbs abd simple-patch-sys09:20
azeemthat's fine IMHO09:20
hubajmitch: at least that gave me the answer09:20
azeemhowever, if you modify existing packages, it might make merging harder later on09:20
hubthat it is "turning into dpatch" that they don't like09:20
hubazeem: yeah I get that.09:20
ajmitchyes, see joeyh's complaint from last year09:20
hubajmitch: I was reading that: http://www.kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/a_bad_taste_in_the_mouth_detailed_ubuntu_patch_review.html09:21
hubajmitch: probably the one you are talking about09:21
ajmitchyeah09:21
ajmitchhttp://www.kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/dpatch_dbs_etc_etc_etc_etc_considered_harmful.html09:21
ajmitchalso09:21
azeemwell, patch systems are a pretty touchy subject to some people09:21
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LaserJockhehe, maybe I should ask debian-devel for contributions to the patch system section of the packaging guide ;p09:23
ajmitchLaserJock: we'll thank you for inciting a flamewar later09:23
=== azeem hopes this will all be gone for good with the arrival of wig&pen/dpkg-sourcev2
Kyral_FreeBSDIf I contribute anything in the near future, it will be Xen Kernel packages for Ubuntu09:23
ajmitchgood luck, it would not be trivial to integrate with all the other patches09:24
bddebianLaserJock, ajmitch: :-)09:24
LaserJockazeem: sounds cryptic09:24
LaserJockazeem: what will it do?09:24
Kyral_FreeBSDOh who said it would integrate the other patches09:24
ajmitchthen it wouldn't be accepted09:25
Kyral_FreeBSDpsh09:25
ajmitchand it'd be no better than the already existing xen kernel packages others have supplied09:25
Kyral_FreeBSDfrankly I'd like to see the Beyond patchset09:25
ajmitchthen talk to the kernel team09:25
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azeemLaserJock: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/07/msg00480.html talks about it a bit09:29
azeemwww.dpkg.org seems to be down09:29
LaserJockazeem: hmm, cool09:31
=== chillywilly does the happy dance as he upgrades to Dapper
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jamessanyeah, dpkg.org seems to have been down for a while now :(09:33
jamessanhad to use the google cache the other day to read up on moving conffiles09:34
ajmitchblame keybuk :)09:34
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hubwhen will the edgy repository be open>09:35
bddebianchillywilly: :-)09:35
bddebianhaha09:35
bddebianWhere's keybuk when you need him? :-)09:35
huband the debian sync?09:36
LaserJockhub: it'll be a while, they will need to change LP, etc.09:36
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ajmitchhub: when it's ready09:37
LaserJockyou can tell ajmitch is a DD ;-)09:38
ajmitchhaha09:38
bddebianhehe09:38
ajmitchso now all the bugs you fixed in dapper.. push the fixes to debian :)09:42
LaserJock"the loathsome dpatch" ?09:42
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bddebianBah, F Debian.. ;-P09:43
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LaserJockbddebian: today just isn't my day09:43
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bddebianLaserJock: Why man?09:44
ajmitchbddebian: so you want to package all the new upstream versions & new packages yourself then?09:44
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bddebianajmitch: Suure, why not? ;-P09:44
ajmitchfine09:45
LaserJockbddebian: I'm pissed off and tired :-)09:45
ajmitchI'll see you in a few years09:45
bddebianLaserJock: Why pissed off?09:45
bddebianOf course better than being pissed on, I always say.. ;-P09:45
jpatrickbddebian: haha09:45
LaserJockbddebian: long story, started in -docs went to -offtopic and then I was just calming down when I see that dpatch is crap and Ubuntu is of no use to Debian ;-)09:46
azeemI think joeyh is about the only Debian guy who doesn't like or at least tolerate dpatch09:46
azeemcdbs is a much different matter, though09:47
LaserJockto me it seems like Debian guys always talk about "This is the way we do it in Debian" when in fact they really haven't a clue what each other do or think, but then I'm a little grouchy today09:47
ajmitchazeem: simply because cdbs is a black box far too often09:48
jamessanthere is a fair share of people that don't like dpatch, I'd say.09:48
SpecLaserJock: that brings to mind .desktop files, some DDs fix 'em, others don't09:48
jamessanajmitch: agreed. I've actually been considering moving some of my pacakges away from using it09:48
LaserJockSpec: exactly09:48
LaserJockjamessan: what do they use?09:48
bddebianSpec: I've noticed some bug reports where they don't even want them09:49
jamessanLaserJock: quilt is gaining popularity, I think.  I really like it.  there's also the good ol' fashion 'handle patches yourself' method09:50
LaserJockyeah, unfortunately I think with .desktops it is much better to get the authors to include it than to ask debian09:50
Specwell, the guy I talked to was helpful, so not all DDs are evil ;)09:50
jpatrickLaserJock: I use simple-patchsys09:50
Kyral_FreeBSDSometimes I like how simple PKGBUILDs are09:50
ajmitchSpec: they're not?09:50
LaserJockSpec: no, not at all09:50
Specnope, not all.09:50
=== jamessan glares at ajmitch ;)
Specin fact, there could be some of 'em lurking around us *scared*09:50
ajmitchSpec: never!09:51
LaserJockyou just have to find the good DDs amongst all the cruft ;-)09:51
LaserJockdoes simple-patchsys only work with cdbs?09:51
ajmitchyes, it was an example written for cdbs09:51
ajmitchto show how a patch system could be used with it09:52
ajmitchpeople then decided to use it for real packages09:52
LaserJockwell, I think it is valuble to use *something* rather then having everything in the .diff.gz09:53
ajmitchbzr! :)09:53
LaserJockbut beyond that I'm not really sure what would recommend one system over another09:53
LaserJockI tend to stay away from cdbs because of the black magic09:53
LaserJockbut that is probably just because I haven't dug into it09:54
jamessanLaserJock: well, you can still do that yourself. no need for a patch system.09:54
LaserJockjamessan: right09:54
=== ajmitch is almost tempted to try out XGl on his system now that dapper is out
jamessanthat's how the Vim package was done before we switched to quilt :)09:55
LaserJockI'd really love to get some knowledgable MOTUs and DDs to help with the Packaging Guide for edgy *hint*09:55
ajmitchLaserJock: sure, I'll see if I can find some :)09:56
LaserJockdoh09:56
ajmitch:)09:56
LaserJockI really want to be thorough with the patch systems this time09:56
ajmitchdon't worry, I'll try & help out09:56
LaserJockI'm sort of waiting to see what Ian does with the Ubuntu Developer's Reference though, to see how much I can do09:57
ajmitchit scares me how there have been several thousand forum posts since the dapper release09:57
ajmitchhave you discussed it with him?09:57
ajmitchmaybe you could help write it?09:58
bddebianLaserJock: I'd love to help but I'm not knowledgeable :-)09:58
LaserJockbddebian: sure you are, this is for newbs even fresher than me :-)09:58
LaserJockajmitch: I talked to him a bit when I first started the Packaging Guide but he was so busy with Firefox, et. al. that I dont' think it got very far09:59
LaserJockajmitch: I'm going to try to offer to help again09:59
ajmitchhe's probably still recovering from the firefox nightmare10:00
LaserJockI think the combination of the Developer's Reference and Packaging Guide could end up being the most complete coverage of Debian pacakging available10:00
ajmitchit's amazing that it's so popular, really10:00
ajmitchright, and the 2 docs can cover different area10:01
ajmitchsigh, it's light outside10:01
LaserJockright, and I GPL'd the Packaging Guide so we can share info easily to make them complimentary10:02
ajmitchprobably not worth trying to get back to sleep10:02
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ajmitchusing FC5, I realise how much I should appreciate ubuntu10:20
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SpecWhat's the best way to rebuild vim with perl enabled?10:30
Spec(and make a package)10:30
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ograSpec, you mean like the vim-perl package ?10:37
Specbah, always making things easy10:37
LaserJocklol10:37
bddebianheh10:38
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zulcd /exit10:43
zuloops./.10:43
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Kyral_FreeBSDhehe I dig this "unless" thing in Perl10:56
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bddebianLater folks, Congrats again!11:22
crimsunthanks, deity!11:22
bddebian:'-(11:22
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crimsunwow, go irssi.11:41
crimsun/ignore -channels #ubuntu * JOINS PARTS QUITS NICKS11:41
LaserJockhehe11:44
Marcei have this without channels :>11:44
crimsunin all the years I've spent on irc, this is the closest I've come to feeling overwhelmed11:46
LaserJockwow11:48
LaserJockI wonder how the bots are doing11:49
crimsuna bit lagged11:52
LaserJockoh my, isn't there an overflow room or something11:52
crimsunwe'd fill that, too, probably11:52
crimsunthis is like ramping up for grad school all over again11:52
LaserJockwow11:54
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LaserJockit's like having 50 tvs on in your house full blast at the same time with different stations11:58
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=== Sp4rKy is away: dodo et taf

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