/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2006/06/10/#ubuntu-doc.txt

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mdkePlug_: are you the chap who posted the mailing list recently?12:43
=== mdke is ashamed that there was no reply, and goes to do so immediately
Burgworkmdke, on my todo list, but I have been at work all day12:45
mdkeBurgwork: no prob, I'm going to reply now, work is but a distant memory12:45
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mdkeBurgwork: by the way, your idea yesterday for automatic talk pages: it might be possible to do it with the PageComment2 macro. It is basically a comment box which the reader can enter a comment into, and we might be able to make it use a talk page by default12:54
LaserJockoh, cool12:55
mdkeit basically creates a forum effect12:56
Burgworkmdke, that works12:57
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mdkewhat do people think of giving up with the /forum section on the wiki, it's not really working. WikiTeam/Issues seems to propose getting rid of it. We can work productively with forum contributors without it, I think01:11
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Burgworkmdke, I like it01:17
Burgworkthe idea, not the /forum section01:17
=== mdke nods
mdkeI'm making a DocumentationTemplate too01:18
=== mdke is getting excited about the wiki again
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mdkethere are some cool macros we can use01:23
LaserJockmdke: at least somebody's excited ;-)01:26
mdkeLaserJock: you need a holiday01:26
crimsun_no, he needs more work =] 01:26
mdkeLaserJock: I've heard Paris is nice this time of year01:26
LaserJockmdke: dude, I have to write specs, no play time for me01:27
LaserJockbtw, I added a doc spec today01:27
mdkethat will get you excited, no?01:27
mdkewhat spec?01:28
LaserJockhttps://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/scripting-for-users-doc01:28
LaserJockbut I haven't written the wiki part yet01:28
LaserJockheck, I've got half written forum posts, specs in progress, most of a package01:29
LaserJockand I'm trying to discuss work with my undergrad01:30
LaserJockParis is starting to sound nice :-)01:30
mdkeffs, ctrl click doesn't work properly in launchpad01:30
Burgworkmdke, does for me01:30
mdkeBurgwork: go to the list of specs, and ctrl click one which is down the page01:31
mdkeBurgwork: it is impossible to click the right one because the page jumps around while you click01:31
Burgworkworks for me01:31
Burgworkoh how I wish I was going to Paris01:32
LaserJockwhy?01:32
Burgworkbecause it will be cool01:32
mdkeBurgwork: ah, it only happens when I have the Find box open01:32
Burgworkah, ancient version of epiphany here01:33
Burgworkso no find bar01:33
mdke(and I am clicking on something which is highlighted as the result of a search)01:34
LaserJockyeah, I noticed the find + click was weird01:34
mdkemaybe it's an epiphany bug01:35
LaserJockBurgwork: yeah, I should be cool. I'm starting to get nervous. It has been so painless to setup I keep thinking something's going to go wrong01:35
LaserJocks/i?it/01:35
LaserJockman I can't type01:36
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BurgundaviaSeveas: got your msg. Sorry, I was removing the aptitude instructions. I have reworked to do both of our changes (different packages and removal of specific installation method)05:26
Burgundaviaanybody know who Warbo is?05:53
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nixternalhave no clue Burgundavia06:13
Burgundavianixternal: whomever he is, he likes to write a great deal06:13
nixternalhowever:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OrinocoMonitorKismet2005Hoary    has been completed...and I think it needs a name change and have that hoary one redirect06:14
nixternalwhere is he writing?06:14
nixternalis it good?06:14
Burgundaviajust too wordy06:14
nixternalahhh06:14
jsgotangcohey06:15
nixternalproposed name change for that:  OrinocoWiFiKismet06:15
Burgundaviawhat about under WifiDocs?06:15
nixternalit can go there06:15
Burgundavia /OrinocoKismet06:15
nixternalWifiDocs/OrinocoKismet06:15
nixternalgood deal06:15
nixternaldone...06:15
nixternalredirect the old page i shall06:15
Burgundaviacan anybody confirm that https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MappingWindowsKey no longer seems to work?06:15
Burgundaviathis needs a better solution: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackageCDs06:16
nixternali will look into that..because i want to remap mine...as of right now it doesn't do anything06:19
Burgundaviathanks06:20
BurgundaviaI am getting wierd results06:21
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Burgundavianixternal: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/control-center/+bug/1215306:23
Ubug2Malone bug 12153 in control-center "Cannot use Windows key in keyboard shortcuts" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  06:23
nixternalroger that06:24
Burgundavianow lets watch the artwork team try and organize a meeting!06:24
nixternalhaha06:25
Burgundaviawho needs soap operas when you have the artwork team?06:25
klepasBurgundavia: i just contacted cvd about it :)06:25
klepasBurgundavia: lollers06:25
klepasa meeting should be happening within the next week or so06:25
nixternalBurgundavia: that bug starts out with the fact the guy just upgraded TO Hoary...how can i confirm that one? breezy is the oldest here06:26
klepasactually... you folks are invited too06:26
jsgotangcocvd? will the sabdfl attend that?06:26
klepasyes06:26
Burgundavianixternal: I just tested breezy06:26
jsgotangcoah that's why06:26
klepashe's going to 'chair' it06:26
nixternali can test dapper/kubuntu06:26
klepasmake sure things stay on track :)06:26
jsgotangcotoo bad cvd isnt going to paris...heard she's 7 months on the way06:27
klepasanyhow... you guys are quite welcome... would be nice to talk to some marvelous people from a working, organised team :)06:27
Burgundaviajsgotangco: you serious?06:27
Burgundaviajsgotangco: that is going to make Mark's life fun06:28
jsgotangcoBurgundavia: yes she told me about it a few weeks ago in a phone conversation06:28
Burgundaviajsgotangco: you get to have phone conversations with them?06:28
jsgotangcothat's why clan is the one organising stuff at the moment06:28
Burgundaviaclan?06:29
jsgotangcowell not that frequent, only when there is a need06:29
jsgotangcoclaire newman06:29
Burgundaviaah, the other claire06:29
Burgundaviais hard at Userful right now. There is a major rethink of how we do things and the victoria office just lost somebody06:32
robhmm, I think I might have picked up another error in the packaging guide..06:32
=== Burgundavia considers asking Canonical to hire him
robIf a Debian package has been changed in Ubuntu, it has ubuntuX (where X is the Ubuntu revision number) appended to the end of the Debian version. So if the Debian hello package was changed by Ubuntu, the version string would be 2.1.1-1ubuntu1. If a package for the application does not exist in Debian, then the Ubuntu version is 0 (e.g., 2.1.1-0ubuntu1).06:32
jsgotangcosend a resume it might work06:32
Burgundaviajsgotangco: ya. I will play at one this weekend06:33
robshouldn't the 1 and 0 be the other way around on that last revision example?06:33
Burgundaviarob: no06:33
Burgundaviabecause if there is no debian version, we want debian -1 to overwrite any Ubuntu numbers06:33
robok, that doesn't read very well then06:34
Burgundaviano, it doesn't06:34
jsgotangcooohh germany won06:35
robjsgotangco, yeah06:35
Burgundavianixternal: if you want my eternal love, can you go around and move all the docs about wireless to under wifi docs06:35
Burgundaviaand poland lost06:35
nixternalsure can06:35
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Burgundavianixternal: make certain to check for redirects06:35
Burgundavianixternal: PageHits is good place to see if something is popular or not06:36
nixternalBurgundavia: that window key map i don't believe will work with kde cuz the .xstartup is ignored06:36
nixternalok Burgundavia thax06:36
nixternalthanks06:36
nixternal;)06:36
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Burgundaviawell, I have killed 3 pages from CatCleanup tonight. How many have you done?06:39
jsgotangcoklepas: surely you are aware that June 17-18 are the days people start coming over to paris with 18 in the evening having dinner06:40
klepasoh, that does suck06:41
klepasdo you think Thursday/Friday then might be more applicable?06:41
BurgundaviaLaser_away: deal with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackageBuilding06:42
jsgotangcoyeah i think thats workable06:42
jsgotangcoBurgundavia: we have a wacom tablet at work, how it connects (serial/usb) not sure but i will check when i come back to office06:43
Burgundaviajsgotangco: ok, thanks06:44
Burgundaviajsgotangco: I posted something to artwork06:44
Burgundaviakill? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NvidiaManual06:44
jsgotangcowould be interesting to see how it works im gimp and krita06:44
klepashas anyone had any luck with a lower-end wacom using Ubuntu and gimp?06:45
jsgotangcoi havent even tried it but i will next week06:46
Burgundaviasuggestions for a snack? I have a bad case of the munchies06:54
Laser_awayBurgundavia: is it ok to delete pages? how should I deal with stuff that should more or less go away06:56
Laser_awaywith packaging stuff, I don't think we need anythin in CatDoc really06:57
BurgundaviaLaser_away: if it has no links, then yes, go ahead06:57
BurgundaviaWikiGuide lists the rules06:58
Laser_awayI hate wiping out other peoples work, but that page for instance has nothing of value on it06:59
Burgundaviameh, I have no issue07:00
jsgotangcooh crud i am still in my locale07:00
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LaserJockBurgundavia: do you google the URL to find links?07:02
BurgundaviaLaserJock: yep, the whole url07:02
Burgundaviathen click teh 2nd link "find pages with this link"07:02
LaserJockah, ok07:03
LaserJockthanks07:03
jsgotangcospeaking of google, have anyone tried spreadsheets07:03
Burgundavianope07:05
LaserJockBurgundavia: done07:06
LaserJockBurgundavia: do we really need a Howto (not very well done) for building KDE from CVS for 5.04?07:10
LaserJockthat was imported from the old wiki :-)07:10
Burgundaviano, not really07:11
LaserJockdone07:16
Burgundaviahow big is a single layer dvd again?07:19
LaserJock4.3 GB perhaps?07:21
LaserJockHowToBuildDebianPackagesFromScratch is going to be a bugger I think07:21
LaserJockIt's from Hoary and I've pretty much covered the content in the packaging guide07:23
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LaserJockBurgundavia: could I take CatDoc off a page that I plan on using for the PG and then deleting later?07:26
BurgundaviaLaserJock: yes07:26
Burgundaviahey Madpilot07:26
Madpilothi07:27
LaserJockhi Madpilot 07:27
Madpilotgah... long f'ing day - 9-1 at job #1, 4-8 @ job #2... 07:27
LaserJockyeah, that is long07:28
nixternal<-- IDIOT07:30
Madpilotnixternal, ??07:30
nixternallol...instead of just renaming a page to move it...i have been doing it the long way07:31
nixternalcopy, paste into a new page and so on07:31
nixternalso what could have been a 10 minute job has been about an hour07:31
nixternal;)07:31
Madpilotnixternal, the 'long way' is better in some cases, it leaves the old page behind to set a re-direct up on07:31
nixternalwell ya...oh wait...that is what we wanted to do07:31
nixternalso im not an idiot ;)07:32
nixternalim still an idiot for thinking like an idiot07:32
nixternalback to work ;)07:32
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jsgotangcogee its so hot here lately07:37
Madpilotlucky you07:37
jsgotangcoits 33C!07:37
Madpilotthe weather sucked here most of the day, it only started to clear & warm up around 5 or 6pm07:37
Burgundaviabetter in oak bay07:37
Burgundaviait was sunny at abot 3pm07:37
nixternalTeamWiFi ??07:57
jsgotangcolol07:58
nixternalsounds like a serious wireless gang ;)07:58
Madpilotwe've got a WiFi Team?07:59
nixternalnot that i know of...but since you put it like that...is there even a network team ?07:59
nixternal;)07:59
nixternallets break down every possible thing with ubuntu07:59
nixternali will create a Kwallet team08:00
jsgotangcowhat's the focus on that?08:00
jsgotangco"people who use KWallet"08:00
jsgotangco?08:01
nixternalyour guess is as good as mine...but why not create it..seems like the "cool" thing to do :)08:01
jsgotangco=)08:01
nixternalthis wiki will drink you to drive08:01
nixternalor drink you to fly in some people's cases ;)08:01
Burgundaviahmm, CatCleanup is really coming down08:17
nixternalslowly but surely08:17
nixternalhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/LaptopTestingTeam/AcerAspire5003WLCiWifi08:22
nixternal^^ transfer also?08:23
Madpilotleave the LaptopTesting stuff where it is08:24
nixternalthen everything with the WifiDocs transfer is over08:25
nixternalall WiFi stuff is now located under WifiDocs/08:25
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dsashttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/GnomeComputerMenu kill ?09:10
Burgundaviadsas: pop the trunk!09:14
nixternallol09:15
Burgundavianight09:16
dsasheh http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pop+the+trunk 09:17
jsgotangcoohh yeaahhh09:20
nixternalhaha09:21
nixternalgahahah09:21
nixternaldsas: stay away from 2 and 3 ;)09:22
dsas2 and 3 were the definitions I were familiar with :/09:22
nixternalhahahah09:25
dsasDo I need to get an ack on every CatCleanup page I delete? Or should I just bin them if it's obvious?09:30
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SeveasBurgwork, but keep in mind that apt-get build dep should not be changed. There is no package 'build-dep'...09:39
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jsgotangcoapt-get build-dep packagename09:51
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mdkemorning10:44
pygihey mdke 10:44
jsgotangcomorning10:44
pygihey jsgotangco 10:45
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mdkeglatzor: what do you mean?05:58
mdke(changing channel)05:58
glatzoryou seemed to be annoyed by some of my bug reports that only referred to minor issues.05:59
mdkeglatzor: did I?06:00
mdkeI don't think so06:00
glatzormdke: then it's all ok :)06:02
glatzormdke: I didn't know how helpful reports about minor issues are for you, since the documentation is frozen06:03
mdkeglatzor: once we've organised our ideas for dapper, we'll go through them.06:03
glatzormdke: I have translated and so reviewed further 200 strings and 250 still are missing. But I don't know if I find the time in the next weeks to fill the corresponding bugs.06:05
mdkeglatzor: no worries. You can file them whenever you like in the next 6 months or so. Or you can grab our trunk later and submits some patches to fix any more problems you see06:06
glatzormdke: I don't know if I have got the additional time to even provide patches.06:06
mdkeglatzor: ok, no worries06:07
glatzormdke: do you know how the translation of the ubuntu guides could be reused for the kubuntu guides?06:07
mdkeglatzor: rosetta shows you suggestions for strings that are already translated elsewhere06:08
glatzorit is quite discouraging to see a lot of common strings that only differ by the package name and Ubuntu/Kubuntu06:08
glatzorI don't use Rosetta, instead I translate them locally using gtranslator.06:08
mdkeyou could use Rosetta, if you like. Or just upload a po for the Ubuntu guide to Kubuntu, it will merge strings that are the same06:09
glatzormdke: I will write an email to the translators list. perhaps somebody found a nice solution.06:16
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mgalvinhey guys06:20
mgalvinhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue2 is ready for a quick review if anyone has time06:21
mgalvingotta run out for a few min, be back in a hour or so06:21
mgalvin(thanks in advance)06:21
mgalvintrappist: ^^^06:25
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LaserJockcan I get a wiki expert's opinion of wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuScienctists ?10:00
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n1c0lasLaserJock: Although I am by no means a wiki expert I think it is an excellent overview10:03
LaserJockmdke or Burgwork: should ^^ be in CatDoc?10:04
LaserJockn1c0las: is it too long for one page do you think?10:04
n1c0lasWith Image Processing Tools you might include ImageMagick (sp?)10:05
n1c0lasLaserJock:The navigation aid on the top right hand helps a lot in this large page10:06
LaserJockyeah, I think I'd be totally lost with out the table of contents10:07
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LaserJockCorey!10:07
n1c0lasI don knwo if you did this on purpose but I also miss the tools to create tutorials or courses such as Moodle10:08
LaserJockhmm10:08
LaserJockI think it more targeted towards research but that is a good point10:09
n1c0lasIn a scientific environment there is much need for this type of courseware10:09
n1c0lasLaserJock: you're welcome10:09
n1c0lasI can see what your point is too, for this page10:09
LaserJockif we were to break it up into sub pages10:10
n1c0lasMaybe you could break it up and use Categories to pull it all together10:12
Burgundaviahey LaserJock10:13
LaserJockI was just looking for you Burgundavia 10:14
BurgundaviaLaserJock: and you have found me10:14
LaserJockI'm looking at wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuScientists10:14
LaserJockand I wondered if it should be in CatDoc10:14
Burgundaviaand now I am too10:14
n1c0lasLaserJock: the british linux magazine LinuxFormat has a review of several Astronomy packages on Linux. It is in the March 2006 issue.10:17
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LaserJockhmm10:18
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BurgundaviaLaserJock: it should be renamed to ScientificApps and renamed, yes10:18
LaserJockBurgundavia: added to CatDoc?10:23
BurgundaviaLaserJock: yep10:23
LaserJockdo you think it is too long?10:24
Burgundavianot really10:26
LaserJockok10:28
LaserJockI haven't really worked on it much10:28
LaserJockbut there was a bunch of work done on it yestreday10:28
LaserJockI'm really pretty impressed with it10:29
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n1c0lasLaserJock: it looks quite extensive10:35
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apokryphoshttp://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/licensing -> "The Ubuntu team is committed to Free and Open Source Software. The exact details of what that means can lead people into a very long debate indeed, often ending up with both sides in violent agreement."10:48
LaserJockhi apokryphos ;-)10:48
apokryphostypo? Violent disagreement? 10:48
apokryphoshello =)10:48
LaserJocklol10:48
LaserJockI think that might be a typo10:49
Burgundaviano, I don't think it is10:51
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apokryphoshardly a common expression, but furthermore doesn't seem quite right from the context10:52
Burgundaviayes it does10:52
apokryphos"you can have very long debates that end you up very firmly agreeing"10:52
Burgundaviano, that is wrong10:53
Burgundavialong debates often lead to disagreement10:53
apokryphosexactly10:53
Burgundaviathe current wording is good English10:53
Burgundaviaand conveys the meaning10:53
apokryphosI never argued the inaccuracy of the English10:54
LaserJockviolent and agreement seem a little oxymoronic10:54
apokryphosI argued that the writer there probably doesn't mean to say "violent agreement"10:54
apokryphosBurgundavia: are you sure you know what it says above?10:54
Burgundaviaoh, wait, hmm10:54
crimsun_it should be violent disagreement.10:54
apokryphos=)10:54
crimsun_violent agreement has a different but not opposing connotation10:55
Burgundaviayou are right, I misread that10:55
BurgundaviaI will fix it10:55
Burgundaviamy mind put in disagreement10:55
apokryphossame with the author of the article, I'm sure 8)10:56
Burgundaviafixed10:56
crimsun_LaserJock: they're not. Heated debates can be civil and can "conclude" with all parties concurring.10:56
LaserJockbut violent? that implies non-civil to me10:56
Burgundaviayes, it can get very non-civil10:57
crimsun_violent doesn't imply non-civil10:57
Burgundaviahave you ever seen debian debate a license?10:57
LaserJockyeah, a little bit10:57
apokryphosdepends on context; I wouldn't say it was necessary in the case of debate10:57
Burgundaviarandom stupid link --> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/5067912.stm10:57
crimsun_martial arts tournaments are violent and civil.10:57
LaserJockyeah10:58
Burgundaviayes, but license and freenes debates can quickly sink to non-civil10:58
LaserJockBurgundavia: lol @ pic10:59
LaserJockBurgundavia: I do think the "Ubuntu is an entirely open source operating system built around the Linux kernel."11:03
Burgundaviaand?11:03
LaserJockstatment is perhaps not accurate11:03
BurgundaviaI don't want to make huge changes to such pages without confirmation11:03
LaserJockwell that is the desktop guide so there really isn't anythin we can do about that right now11:03
LaserJockbut that was the only point that I found very valid11:04
LaserJockthe "All of the application11:04
LaserJocksoftware installed by default is Free Software." one clearly doesn't include the next sentence11:05
BurgundaviaI have got myself in a nice pickle. I have lost my visa card and my laptop power supply. I am leaving for a trip on Tues and need the power supply. But I can't buy a new one because I have no visa card :(11:05
LaserJockyikes11:05
Burgundavialast time I used it was the 11th of may11:09
Burgundaviaso it has not been used for fraud, but still11:11
LaserJockhmm, I wish I could get MLs as RSS feeds11:19
crimsun_which MLs?11:19
crimsun_LaserJock: allow me to {re,}introduce you to gmane. http://gmane.org/rss.php11:21
LaserJockoh, like debian MLs11:21
LaserJockman, gmane rocks my socks off!11:23
mptLaserJock, why just mailing lists? Why not all e-mail? :-)11:25
LaserJockwell, I just want to be able to skim through Debian MLs without having to subscribe11:26
LaserJockyes, the one I was looking for tetex-maintainers11:28
LaserJocknow, I feel like an idiot that I haven't used this before11:30
LaserJockcrimsun_: thanks dude, I don't know what I would do without you sometimes. Probably be in the technological stone age :-)11:37
crimsun_LaserJock: the intarweb is a big place. I don't know the half of it.11:38
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LaserJockhi manicka 11:45
manickahi11:45
LaserJockhmm, epiphany is bugging me now11:58

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