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=== desrt needs a book for the plane
[12:57] <HiddenWolf> desrt: social skills for dummies? 
[12:57] <tseng> ouch
[12:57] <HiddenWolf> desrt: it might be a shock, meeting the people behind the nicks. :)
[12:57] <desrt> HiddenWolf; nah.  i've done these conferences and stuff before
[12:57] <tseng> HiddenWolf: hell, he is rooming with me
[12:57] <desrt> HiddenWolf; but by the sounds of it, you could use the book :)
[12:58] <tseng> HiddenWolf: there's the shock
[12:58] <tseng> (you are, arent you? pisano said it was good)
[12:58] <HiddenWolf> desrt: no offense ment, obviously
[12:58] <desrt> HiddenWolf; social skills for dummies said you shouldn't randomly insult people you don't know :p
[01:00] <HiddenWolf> desrt: it probably does, but where is  the fun in that?
[01:03] <HiddenWolf> Anyway, I should be off to bed.
[01:03] <HiddenWolf> Good night everyone.
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[03:20] <ProN00b> quite some people say 6.06 was a bad release, comments plx
[03:21] <sladen> ProN00b: {{needs citation}}
[03:21] <tseng> quite a few people say that ad hominem if a falacious argument
[03:21] <tseng> </irony>
[03:22] <sladen> ProN00b: quite a few people say 6.06 was a good release, comments please
[03:22] <tseng> I will admit that I see alot of people who didnt test the beta make a big fuss about their pet bugs
[03:22] <sladen> ProN00b: I think if you can ask a more useful question, you'll likely get more useful answers
[03:23] <ProN00b> tseng, well, the number of bugs people just run across are more than in the last release, i have heard and encountered this
[03:23] <ProN00b> sladen, i just wanna get an overview of what you think about that issue
[03:23] <tseng> we can't respond to such a vague generalization
[03:24] <tseng> vaguely generalized, we disagree
[03:24] <ProN00b> its not vague
[03:24] <tseng> its very vague, what bugs?
[03:24] <ProN00b> people are feeling like there are more bugs in this release than the last
[03:25] <sladen> people (who?) ... bugs (which?)
[03:26] <ProN00b> do you expect me to analyze the forums and compare it with the forums after the last release and correct those values with ubuntu usernumbers ?
[03:26] <tseng> jeez
[03:26] <tseng> yes, since you posed the question
[03:27] <tseng> not that i expect the forums to provide valuable first source data anyway
[03:27] <tseng> its an informal discussion
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[03:28] <sladen> ProN00b: one of us is going to have to analyse the forums and find the usernames and bug numbers;  since you're the one asking the question and the one already with the information it would be useful if you could do that;  since there is a lot of data, it would take me a long time and I'm still unclear what sort of answer to what sort of question you'd be happy with
[03:29] <tseng> I have ... 5 pc's running dapper
[03:29] <tseng> no nagging bugs
[03:29] <tseng> about 4 more servers
[03:29] <tseng> no, 6
[03:30] <ProN00b> its just that i heard people saying things like "<iXXXXXXy> ubuntu dapper drake is half almost baked.    they tried to make it 'idiot proof'  but only proved them selves better idiots." (actual quote from today) and this is maybe second or third time i have heard people expressing it so extreme... and i also feel the same way
[03:31] <tseng> that doesnt even sound like a bug
[03:31] <tseng> it sounds like you aren't a fan of certain intentional features
[03:31] <tseng> I would have agreed with you if that was your premise at the begining
[03:32] <tseng> hacking up gnome in the way we have is Not Cool in my book
[03:32] <ProN00b> no, not really
[03:33] <tseng> it takes me under 5 minutes to work around all that
[03:33] <ProN00b> second quote from the same person (i was talking to him about something like a maybe-bug, maybe behavior change (report filled by random person on forum)) "<iXXXXXXy> pXXXXXu the above is one of at least 30 'that i know of' issues that should not be in any 'stable' release.   that is a bug in the base system.   you don't release things like that and proclaim it to be  'linux for human being'  implying that other linux's are not for humans.
[03:33] <ProN00b>    and you don't release a system and call it stable that every one that installes it finds bugs...  like ubuntu dapper."
[03:34] <tseng> I am very glad he knows them
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[03:34] <ProN00b> tseng, what do you mean, what problems do you have with gnome ?
[03:34] <tseng> not helping
[03:34] <tseng> the logout dialog is attrocious
[03:34] <tseng> the default themes likewise
[03:34] <tseng> i turn them off and go on with my life
[03:35] <tseng> if I have a bug I report it to launchpad or just fix it, instead of sansationalizing it on the forums
[03:36] <ProN00b> who did that on the forums ?
[03:36] <tseng> your last quote
[03:36] <tseng> I am tiring of this
[03:36] <ProN00b> oh, thats from irc
[03:36] <tseng> if you are serious about this, can you please compile a list of real data
[03:37] <ProN00b> hmm, do you have any idea where i can find gnome themes ? (icons and windows and stuff)
[03:37] <tseng> not something $joerandomuser threw out there
[03:37] <tseng> w/o no citation
[03:37] <tseng> and post it to ubuntu-sounder mailing list
[03:37] <ProN00b> whats that ubuntu-sounder thing for ?
[03:37] <tseng> its general ubuntu discussion
[03:37] <tseng> anything goes
[03:38] <tseng> but its very community-meta oriented
[03:39] <tseng> going to watch a movie, have a nice night
[03:40] <ProN00b> nn
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[12:02] <Tonio_> hi all
[12:02] <Tonio_> hey
[12:02] <_ion> Bono estente.
[12:03] <hunger> hi there
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[01:57] <dm> sladen: Hello, I'm new to ubuntu and just faced a bug that you filed to launchpad -- nbd-server and accept(). Who is now responsible for uploading the fixed package to dapper-updates?
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[02:36] <\sh> dieman: welcome to the city of love 
=== \sh wishes he could be in paris as well, but this time, the job is more important
[02:38] <Hobbsee> uh oh, glad i'm not there then :P
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[02:39] <\sh> Hobbsee: lol...
[02:39] <Hobbsee> unless there are interesting people ther
[02:39] <Hobbsee> e
[02:40] <\sh> Hobbsee: there are.. so hurry :)
[02:40] <Hobbsee> hah
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[04:20] <sladen> dm: I've filed a sync request
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[04:33] <knopper> Hi everyone. Question (I know I should try this on my own, but unfortunately, not enough bandwidth for even downloading a CD): Does the Ubunu Live CD/DVD come with an installer, and what does it do exactly?
[04:34] <HiddenWolf> knopper: it comes with an installer, which installs the system when you want it to.
[04:34] <HiddenWolf> knopper: #ubuntu is more appropriate for this question.
[04:34] <knopper> HiddenWolf: Srry, you may have mistaken this for a beginenr question. ;-) I actually meant "what does it do", i.e., are you using apt-get/dpkg for a package-wise installation, or are you doing an rsync of the live system to harddisk?
[04:35] <mjg59> knopper: The live system is somewhat copied in place
[04:35] <mjg59> It doesn't use packages, so it's not suitable for upgrades
[04:36] <knopper> mjg59: That's what I thought, so it actually does what the older version of knoppix-installer did, format a harddisk partition and copy / from the live system to the harddisk, then creating a fstab and lilo.conf (or grub menu), right?
[04:36] <knopper> mjg59: So, do you know if anybody is working on a package-wise installer for the Ubuntu Live DVD? This would eliminate the need for separate Live vs. Installer DVDs.
[04:37] <knopper> mjg59: I have a proof-of-concept that shows it's working fine. You can update Debian from a Knoppix 5.0.1 DVD, package-wise including resolving of package dependencies.
[04:37] <\sh> hmm..has someone an IBM T43 laptop at hand?
[04:38] <knopper> \sh: Sorry, just a few old IBM Thinkpads here.
[04:39] <\sh> I wonder if it's just me and my installation or it's a bug that sometimes it's not halting correctly...
[04:40] <knopper> Btw, which would be the right channel to talk to a few people who are at the meeting in paris next week?
[04:40] <mjg59> knopper: No idea, I'm afraid
[04:41] <mjg59> knopper: The right person to talk to about this is Colin Watson (kamion)
[04:43] <knopper> mjg59: He's idle for 15 hours, so I guess I'll have to try later. Btw, he is the one working on the ubuntu installer, right?
[04:45] <mjg59> Yup
[04:45] <mjg59> He's probably on his way to Paris at the moment
[04:46] <knopper> mjg59: Oh, already. Unfortunately, I can travel on Tuesday first, and will miss the first two days. But good to know he's there, too.
[04:46] <Mithrandir> knopper: the live DVD has both live and installer on it.
[04:48] <knopper> Mithrandir: Right, but can the live CD be installed _package-wise_, was my question.
[04:48] <knopper> Mithrandir: Or do you mean, the DVD can be booted in installer- and live-mode, with a different image?
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[04:48] <Mithrandir> knopper: the latter is correct.
[04:48] <Mithrandir> knopper: the live installer always just copies the read-only file system.
[04:49] <Mithrandir> (and then munges it a little bit)
[04:49] <knopper> Mithrandir: My idea was to have a single-image live DVD (consiting of unpacked .deb packages) which can still be installed package-wise.
[04:49] <Mithrandir> knopper: uh, how would you do that?  dpkg-repack hacks?
[04:50] <knopper> Mithrandir: I see, that's what I guessed. So, if the installer could just handle _unpacked_ .debs from the livs system, we could have a simgle-image live+install system that can be used for both.
[04:50] <knopper> Mithrandir: Kind of. It already works on KNoppix 5.0.1.
[04:50] <knopper> Mithrandir: I.e. you can update packages on an installed system, from the live DVD, including dependencies.
[04:50] <Mithrandir> it sounds brittle and slow at first thought.
[04:51] <Mithrandir> but being able to upgrade off a live cd would be sweet
[04:51] <knopper> Mithrandir: There is just an intermediate dpkg-repack for each chosen/dependent package that I deen to get rid of, and I thought, this may be a nice proposal for a BOF session at the meeting next week.
[04:52] <Mithrandir> I think we might be short on time, but please do jump onto IRC and remind us.
[04:52] <knopper> Mithrandir: Not only that, but in both cases, the installer and the live image, you share about 99% of the same data (except for configuration files), so it is a big waste of space to duplicate everything.
[04:52] <Mithrandir> they're differently compressed, though
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[04:53] <knopper> Mithrandir: I'll try to get ahold of Colin later, since he is working on ubiquity and could maybe add that feature for generic live DVD support.
[04:53] <Mithrandir> I wonder if it'd be feasible to do something like compute a delta between what you'd get from dpkg-repack and the original .deb and ship that somewhere..
[04:53] <Mithrandir> which would give you trusted installs too.
[04:53] <Mithrandir> he's not the only one working on the installer. :-P
[04:54] <knopper> Mithrandir: .debs are basically zipped, tarred, and ar'ed files, and the live CD consists f a blockwise (or filewise) compressed filesystem, so, about 1:3 compressin for both cases.
[04:54] <Mithrandir> (I've hacked a bit on ubiquity and am responsible for the live cd, fyi)
[04:54] <knopper> Mithrandir: Oh, perfect. :-)
[04:54] <knopper> Mithrandir: So, is there already a BOF planned for stuff like this, where I could just drop in?
[04:54] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: so we blame you for breaking it!
[04:54] <Mithrandir> yes, but differently compressed.  squashfs compresses the image a directory at a time, .debs are a package at a time.
[04:55] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: what's broken?
[04:55] <knopper> I was just in the progress of adding a proposal, which is a little late now since the deadline was 12th of june, but anyways.
[04:55] <Mithrandir> knopper: I'm not sure, there's a bunch of live cd discussions where we could possibly fit it in.
[04:55] <Mithrandir> knopper: you're planning on attending?
[04:55] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: well, i discovered that the italian stuff wasnt auto-installed when it was picked as a language, i think
[04:55] <Hobbsee> let me find which bug it was
[04:55] <knopper> Mithrandir: I already checked, but nothing yet that would really fit that idea of merging the installer and live parts.
[04:55] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/debian-installer/+bug/39483
[04:56] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 39483 in debian-installer "Kubuntu 6.06 final dvd doesn't install italian language for kde and other packages" [Medium,Confirmed]  
[04:56] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: I mainly did the keyboard thingy, not langpacks.
[04:56] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: ah okay
[04:57] <Hobbsee> he was just whinging that it hadnt been fixed even though it was there for 2 months, etc...when it was still set to need info
[04:57] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: I noticed you changed the state of that bug earlier today, yes.  I think Colin's going to be busy with ubiquity bugs this cycle.
[04:57] <Mithrandir> there's this "too many bugs, too few developers" problem we're having..
[04:57] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: hah, yeah, i know
[04:58] <Hobbsee> oh i dont blame you guys at all - i know you do a great job.  some users though...
[04:58] <knopper> Mithrandir: Sorry, missed yur earlier question. I'm arriving Tuesday afternoon, so, probably really there from Wednesday till Saturday.
[04:58] <Mithrandir> knopper: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/larger-livefs touches on it, so I might be able to squeeze it in there, for instance.
[04:58] <Mithrandir> knopper: oh, cool
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[05:08] <knopper> Mithrandir: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/obsolete-installer-part (maybe someone wants to join in).
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[05:09] <Mithrandir> knopper: it's not added to the Paris meeting, so it won't be considered.
[05:10] <rubso> hi :0
[05:10] <rubso> :)
[05:10] <rubso> what is the system installer you use for Ubuntu/Kubuntu ? :)
[05:11] <Mithrandir> rubso: debian-installer (the graphical installer uses it in the backend)
[05:11] <\sh> live-cd: ubiquity / plain installation system (aka alternate): d-i
[05:11] <knopper> Mithrandir: I know, but it's a long-term project anyways, and I expect no solution quickly. ;-)
[05:12] <knopper> Mithrandir: There are enough other sessions to keep me busy for 3 days. :-)
[05:12] <Mithrandir> :-)
[05:13] <rubso> then Ubuntu is using an Improved debian-installer version, right?
[05:14] <knopper> Mithrandir: On the other hand... Ok, I found the "Add to meeting" button. ;-)
[05:20] <knopper> rubso: It would be the first real Debian-installer that actually works. ;-)
[05:21] <Mithrandir> knopper: uh.  d-i works quite well and has for a long time.
[05:21] <rubso> knopper: can you give me debian-installer source code to build it for a LiveCD? :)
[05:22] <\sh> knopper: plan to attend froscon on saturday/sunday, too? :)
[05:24] <\sh> rubso: it's konversation..
[05:24] <rubso> i know !
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=== fabbione is almost tempt to drive to Paris this night
[05:35] <\sh> fabbione: you are not flying?
[05:35] <fabbione> \sh: i am not going
[05:36] <fabbione> but i miss the guys
[05:36] <\sh> fabbione: why not? 
[05:36] <fabbione> a lot
[05:36] <fabbione> \sh: because my wife is too close to deliver our baby
[05:36] <fabbione> and i am not comnfortable to leave her alone
[05:36] <\sh> fabbione: oh wow...congratulation..
=== Mithrandir hugs fabbione 
=== fabbione hugs Mithrandir 
[05:37] <\sh> Og Maciel will have another baby in couple of months time, too...
[05:37] <fabbione> Maciel?
=== fabbione doesn't know her
[05:38] <\sh> fabbione: http://www.ogmaciel.com/?p=275
[05:38] <\sh> fabbione: she is a he ;) and father ;) so his wife will give birth...;)
[05:38] <fabbione> \sh: in this world.. you may never know!
[05:39] <\sh> fabbione: that's right :)
[05:40] <\sh> oh btw...is there already a plan, where the next summit will be? I need to know it at least a couple of months before, to plan my holiday and to save money for this happening
[05:41] <Hobbsee> (and when?)
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[05:42] <tseng> Hobbsee: a few weeks after the egdy+1 opens
[05:42] <tseng> Hobbsee: as usual
[05:42] <\sh> Hobbsee: most likely oktober/november like last year
[05:42] <tseng> the is a launchpad and distro team sprint in between
[05:42] <Hobbsee> bleh, okay
[05:42] <tseng> which no one else normally attends
=== Hobbsee doubts that she'll be at any of them then
[05:43] <Hobbsee> too bad :P
[05:43] <\sh> Hobbsee: you never know :)
[05:43] <Hobbsee> \sh: that's AU uni term time...
[05:44] <Hobbsee> so i do know that it wont be happening, at least for another couple of years :P
[05:44] <tseng> what year are you in now?
[05:44] <Hobbsee> 1st
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[05:44] <knopper> Mithrandir: (sorry for the delay, was writing another proposal), it's just me, I'm too much end-user to be able to use the regular debian-installer or synaptic. I think it's not suited for beginners. I'd rather use debootstrap and apt-get manually instead of any existing "graphical" installer for Debian yet. The only way I manage to install Debian with a graphical interface is booting KNoppix and running the knoppix-installer yet.
[05:44] <\sh> Hobbsee: honestly, if I hadn't this personal break down in the last months, I would give everything to go to paris this month...
[05:45] <knopper> Mithrandir: But you can still convince me it's possible. ;-)
[05:45] <Hobbsee> \sh: um, i never said anything about that...
[05:45] <mgalvin> jdub, jdub_: around?
[05:45] <knopper> rubso: You mean, of the knoppix-installer? It's a shell script on Knoppix, and I hate it, it's really awful and I would like to replace it by something better.
[05:45] <\sh> Hobbsee: so...you should give it a try and leave uni for at least one week for this event ;)
[05:46] <Mez> i think next event i'm gonna go to is (other than LRL) aKademy
[05:46] <fabbione> \sh: time is usually 2/3 weeks after the release.. release schedule will be done in Paris.. where... that's really up to how the sab wakes up in the morning
[05:47] <\sh> fabbione: yeah :) I hope it's not too far away...let's say sweden, denmark or norway would be cold enough ;)
[05:47] <Hobbsee> \sh: let me tell you, it *wouldnt* be worth coming home to, i assure you, if i were to miss a week of uni...
[05:47] <tseng> \sh: hah ubz2
[05:47] <fabbione> \sh: unlikely to be north EU.. too expensive
[05:47] <\sh> Hobbsee: with approval of your profs and parents, of course
[05:47] <fabbione> \sh: but i was hoping for dk at least once
[05:48] <Hobbsee> \sh: yeah, the latter would be the issue :P  and wouldnt happen.  "you're a foolish girl" would be minor in comparison to what mum'd say....oh well.
[05:48] <Mithrandir> knopper: synaptic has nothing to do with d-i.
[05:49] <knopper> \sh: Sorry, I won't make it for froscon. I have two exams to prepare till 26th. :-(
[05:49] <\sh> Hobbsee: let riddell convince sabdfl to talk to your parents in person ;)
[05:49] <Hobbsee> \sh: which would then scare the hell out of them.  i havent dared tell them that riddell has my number :P
[05:49] <Mez> Hobbsee - lol :D
[05:49] <Hobbsee> i know even that would send them thru the roof :P
[05:50] <knopper> Mithrandir: d-i is the thing that used to ask me if I want to install pcmcia support, and then fails the installation because of wrong dependencies (at least that was the case tw years ago, when I tried last, pardon my ignorance. ;-)
[05:50] <\sh> knopper: I just asked, I missed your name on the agenda :)
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[05:51] <knopper> \sh: My name is on the list that Claire sent by mail, it's not in the web yet. Probably because I said I wuld add me and Adriane in the wiky by myself, and then forgot about it...
[05:51] <\sh> knopper: no...FrOSCon Agenda :) 
[05:51] <knopper> \sh: r did you mean froscon?
[05:51] <Mithrandir> knopper: I doubt you used d-i two years ago.
[05:52] <knopper> \sh: Yes, sorry, I got an email from the Froscon organizers and had no time to reply. For about a month now. :-(
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[05:53] <knopper> Mithrandir: I tried to install Debian with the supplied installer, honestly!
[05:53] <Mithrandir> knopper: did you try to install Sarge or Woody?
[05:54] <knopper> Mithrandir: Woody, I think.
[05:54] <sladen> fabione and fabitwo </groan>
[05:54] <Mithrandir> knopper: then you used boot-floppies, not d-i.
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[05:54] <sladen> fabbione and fabbitwo </groan>  even
[05:54] <fabbione> sladen:  ?
[05:55] <fabbione> sladen: you mean fabbitwo = fork(fabbione); ;)
[05:55] <sladen> fabbione: babies!  and mini-fabbiones!
[05:55] <fabbione> oh yeah
[05:55] <sladen> fabbione: yup :)
[05:55] <fabbione> we need a new X maintainer :P
[05:55] <\sh> lol
[05:56] <knopper> Mithrandir: I used a "Rescue-Floppy" (!) to load the kernel, and then an installer popped up and asked me some questions that I answered honestly. I had to copy a new kernel in the midst of everything, though, because the included one didn't work.
[05:56] <sladen> :)
[05:56] <fabbione> i already have a thin client as present for him/her
[05:56] <\sh> fabbione: edubuntu rocks ;)
[05:56] <sladen> fabbione: get one of those micro Japanese keyboards and the fingers should fit from day one
=== _ion would have many suitable computers for a thin client, but no adequate server for them. ;-)
[05:56] <Mithrandir> knopper: that's totally irrelevant, the b-f codebase has been scrapped and d-i is designed in a wholly different way.
[05:56] <fabbione> sladen: nah.. better they start to stretch the fingers :)
[05:57] <_ion> sladen: And additionally {,s}he would learn Japanese! :-)
[05:58] <\sh> fabbione: use old big heavy ibm keyboards ;)
[05:58] <knopper> Mithrandir: But the d-i is still looking like ncurses/dialog, right? Alexander Schmehl is frequently showing Debian installatins with this at Linux expos. Sometimes it works for him.
[05:59] <Mithrandir> knopper: that depends on what frontend you use.
[05:59] <Mithrandir> knopper: but yeah, slang is the default frontend.
[05:59] <\sh> knopper: ubuntus d-i installation always worked without problems...(stable releases)
[06:00] <Mithrandir> anyway, I'll see if I can find some coke here to stop my blood sugar falling completely through the floor.
[06:01] <knopper> \sh: Question: Would you let a person who has no computer skills whatsoever, use this installer?
[06:01] <\sh> knopper: yes..I did already many times :)
[06:01] <\sh> knopper: and we did it during linuxtag 2006 at our kubuntu booth :)
[06:02] <\sh> knopper: less then 20 minutes including downloading updates and security packages
[06:02] <\sh> knopper: breezy that was
[06:03] <knopper> \sh: So, chances are that we have met there in May. But I have seen people failing at the tast to just hit return on any question. The partitioner is probably the hardest part. What about that?
[06:04] <\sh> knopper: well, that's the worst part...but we have a "resize windows partittion and partition automagically your hd" option, which is enough for people with no computer skills
[06:04] <knopper> \sh: I must admit that I mostly use Knoppix for Debian-installation, or plain debootstrap, as said before, so, I didn't take notice of any important d-i changes yet. I would like d-i to be able to install from an already installed partition rather than from a repository, then it would be worth considering an inclusion in KNoppix.
[06:05] <knopper> \sh: Automatically resizing Windows partitions, very adventurous... :-)
[06:05] <\sh> knopper: with "already installed partition" you mean the live dvd?
[06:06] <\sh> knopper: it works :) I promise..I did it many times :)
[06:06] <Mez> Kamion, ping
[06:07] <\sh> Mez: he is on his way to paris I think :)
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[06:07] <knopper> \sh: For example, but more generic. Let's say you have installed a quite complete (12GB) Debian system on /dev/hda1, and now you want to use this installation, to install a small subset of it (a thin-client configuration, for example) on hda2. But, you do not have any .deb packages, just the hda1 installation. YOu have te data and the package lists in /var/lib/dpkg, so, why should the installer not be able to do that, instead of
[06:07] <knopper> \sh: building a repository first?
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[06:07] <\sh> knopper: but I can show you during essener linuxtage or linuxexpo in cologne...or you come to the LinuxHotel from the 21st to 23rd July to our FAI developer meeting ;) 
[06:08] <carlospc> hi, anybody at paris?
[06:08] <knopper> \sh: Alexander Schmehl always tried to convince me that the Debian installer works, but everytime he tried to show me, it failed. Must be me. ;-)
[06:09] <\sh> knopper: hmm...you could do that, no doubt, but thinking of installing an unclean chroot (e.g. thin client). It's something which I wouldn't prefer as installation candidate
[06:09] <carlospc> i've just arrived to Paris to go to the Ubuntu Developer Summit, i don't know if there is already somebody at the hotel, help!
[06:10] <Mez> carlospc, there are people there :D - just head to the hotel :D
[06:10] <\sh> carlospc: dieman is in paris (actually I don't know if he is in the same hotel), ogra should be there as well (or I hope so)
[06:10] <Mez> and Riddell is there
[06:11] <\sh> can someone switch of the sun, thx
[06:12] <Mez> \sh - I'll do it later on tonight ;)
[06:13] <carlospc> I'm in Kyriad Paris Nord II
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[06:15] <\sh> carlospc: the others are at http://www.radissonsas.com/cs/Satellite?cid=1053502953893&pagename=RadissonSAS%2FPage%2FrsasHotelDescription&language=en&hotelCode=parzq (canonical staff and sponsored people)
[06:16] <carlospc> thanks \sh
[06:16] <\sh> carlospc: but you can try to ping Tonio_ and ask him where to go :)
[06:16] <\sh> or Lure
[06:17] <\sh> not lure
[06:17] <carlospc> oups 
[06:18] <\sh> but Tonio_try him :)
[06:18] <Lure> carlospc: Tonio_ is from Paris... 
[06:18] <carlospc> i'm waiting his response
[06:18] <carlospc> ok
[06:19] <carlospc> i'm looking how to go to radisson sas hotel
[06:19] <\sh> hmm...join #ubuntu-fr
[06:19] <carlospc> many people are there right now
[06:19] <\sh> carlospc: it's near the charles de gaulle airport
[06:19] <\sh> carlospc: outside of paris
[06:19] <carlospc> I'm in Parq d'Exposicion
[06:20] <phanatic> carlospc: for public transport info, try www.ratp.fr
[06:20] <Lure> carlospc: I susepect they have hotel shuttle bus
[06:20] <carlospc> very near
[06:20] <phanatic> carlospc: you can find the route between your hotel and radisson sas
[06:20] <Lure> carlospc: "The hotel offers a free shuttle service to and from the airport"
[06:20] <carlospc> do you know if i have to stop in Charles de Gaulle 1 or Charles de Gaulle 2?
[06:20] <carlospc> let's see
[06:21] <phanatic> i think 2
[06:21] <\sh> at least you are in paris, france, europe ;) You can visit the graveyard where Jim Morrison is burried, or visit the eiffel tower or the moulin rouge ;)
[06:21] <\sh> or just drink a very good cafe au lait 
[06:22] <\sh> I'm so sad that I can't go there...grmpf
[06:22] <phanatic> me too :(
[06:23] <\sh> we could ubuntufy the centre pompidou (http://www.centrepompidou.fr/)
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[06:27] <\sh> carlospc: goldenear can help you too :)
[06:27] <goldenear> what's the problem ?
[06:28] <carlospc> I'm in avenue des Nations and i don't know how to get into Radisson SAS Hotel
[06:28] <jpatrick> maps.google.com
[06:28] <goldenear> carlospc: are you in paris ?
[06:28] <carlospc> yes, at Parq d'Exposicions
[06:29] <goldenear> Radisson is not in Paris but in a city around
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[06:30] <goldenear> carlospc: I'm try to see how you are
[06:31] <carlospc> Well
[06:31] <goldenear> carlospc: are you near te Trocadero ?
[06:31] <carlospc> wait, i'm going to ask
[06:32] <goldenear> ok
[06:33] <goldenear> carlospc: you can try mappy.com
[06:33] <goldenear> http://www1.mappy.com/?lang=en
[06:33] <\sh> goldenear: you can meet him, too :) and show him some nice places ;) from tomorrow on there is no time for that ;)
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[06:34] <goldenear> sure
[06:34] <goldenear> If he tells me exactly where he is I can meet him
[06:35] <\sh> [18:13]  <carlospc> I'm in Kyriad Paris Nord II
[06:37] <goldenear> Ok I see where he's
[06:37] <goldenear> that's not in Paris but in Roissy
[06:38] <goldenear> It's pretty close to the hotel
[06:39] <\sh> this one? http://www.undercovertourist.com/france/paris/hotels/k/kyriad-
[06:40] <carlospc> \sh, page not found...
[06:40] <\sh> http://www.undercovertourist.com/france/paris/hotels/k/kyriad-paris-la-villette.html
[06:40] <carlospc> i've asked here, at kyrad hotel and the have tell me how to get Radisson :D
[06:40] <jpatrick> remove the "-"
[06:41] <\sh> http://www.undercovertourist.com/france/paris/hotels/k/ here are all kyriad hotels in paris I think
[06:41] <goldenear> carlospc: you are very close to the Radisson :)
[06:42] <carlospc> yes, i just have to take the train to the airport
[06:42] <carlospc> there, there is a free bus to go to the Radisson hotel
[06:42] <goldenear> carlospc: how did you go there ?
[06:42] <goldenear> by airplane ?
[06:42] <carlospc> yes
[06:43] <carlospc> i took a plain from Madrid this morning
[06:44] <goldenear> carlospc: If you want to come here in Paris after puting your stuffs at Raddison, I can meet you :)
[06:44] <carlospc> thanks a lot for your help, i'm going to the hotel right now
[06:45] <goldenear> ok
[06:45] <mjg59> What's the dapper-updates procedure?
[06:45] <goldenear> I'm staying here
[06:45] <carlospc> today is going to be difficult, tomorrow after the spec day, i'm sure i will go to paris
[06:45] <carlospc> see you!
[06:45] <\sh> carlospc / goldenear: exchange mobile numbers ,)
[06:45] <goldenear> too late :)
[06:46] <\sh> mjg59: mdz/kamion approval? and bug report, debdiff...the usual
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[06:49] <goldenear> \sh: if somebody else is in paris and need help or simply want to meet me in a Caf no pb :)
[06:50] <goldenear> just ask
[06:50] <\sh> goldenear: we will manage all thatremotely ;)
[06:52] <goldenear> I know a very nice caf with wifi, if we meet there and somebody has a laptop with a webcam we could broascast the meeting :)
[06:52] <goldenear> but the technology is not yet advanced enough to share drink remotly :/
[06:52] <goldenear> I hope this feature will be in edgy+1
[06:53] <goldenear> lol
[06:53] <\sh> heh
[06:54] <\sh> brb 
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[07:07] <mjg59> mdz: Hi - the kernel update has (by fixing one bug) resulted in machines with nsc irda chipsets failing to suspend
[07:08] <mjg59> That can be worked around in acpi-support
[07:10] <desrt> mjg59; some weird acpi bugs have snuck into -25 that are causing all hell to break loose?
[07:10] <mjg59> No
[07:11] <mjg59> Not that I know of, anyway
[07:11] <desrt> crimsun was mentioning that there is some grand-screwage
=== mjg59 shrugs
[07:11] <desrt> in any case, i have a few more resume bugs that have popped up since the upgrade
[07:11] <mjg59> As I said, machines with nsc irda chipsets won't currently suspend
[07:12] <desrt> one usb-related and one hda-intel related
[07:12] <desrt> they're not fatal.  they just make resume take a long time
[07:19] <Whoopie> mjg59: could you point to a bug report? I'm interested in this because I also have a nsc irda chipset.
=== mjg59 fixes suspend on the craptop
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[08:17] <siretart> how to I learn if I have an nsc irda chipset?
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[08:28] <Whoopie> siretart: "grep NSC /sys/bus/pnp/devices/*/id" or "grep IBM0071 /sys/bus/pnp/devices/*/id"
[08:30] <siretart> first doesn't match, 2nd does match
[08:30] <siretart> thanks Whoopie 
[08:30] <Whoopie> siretart: then you have  thinkpad?
[08:31] <siretart> Whoopie: I have an R40
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[08:33] <Whoopie> siretart: could you sponsor upload for #38272?
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[08:35] <siretart> Whoopie: for edgy, sure. for dapper-updates: get permission from ubuntu-release first
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[08:38] <Whoopie> siretart: how do I do this? Who have I to contact?
[08:39] <siretart> Whoopie: https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-release, read: email matt and colin
[08:42] <Whoopie> siretart: ok, thanks. Can I write that you would sponsor upload if they permit it?
[08:42] <siretart> Whoopie: I don't think that would change their decision
[08:43] <Whoopie> ok
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[10:32] <jsgotangco> new player
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[10:38] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: hehe
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[10:52] <\sh> ok..it's working with windows...now it's time to switch back to linux...I can't even use a real irc client on this OS...
[10:52] <\sh> brb
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[11:15] <TheMuso> Anybody in here from the summit proper can tell me how to use the wifi down stairs that people seem to be using?
[11:17] <Riddell-awa> TheMuso: we're using wired downstairs in the conference room
[11:17] <TheMuso> ah ok
[11:18] <TheMuso> Anyways, won't be there tonight. Better get to bed, after a 28 hour journey. :)
[11:18] <Riddell-awa> sleep well
[11:18] <Riddell-awa> 09:00 start
[11:19] <TheMuso> I know. :)
[11:19] <TheMuso> What is the story with breakfast btw? Like what time etc?
[11:19] <\sh> before 9 :)
[11:20] <\sh> and smoking bof around 8:45 ;)
[11:20] <TheMuso> heh
[11:21] <TheMuso> and hope someone has got some ethernet I can borrow, as I didn't bring any. :)
[11:21] <TheMuso> Anyway guys, cya
[11:22] <\sh> btw....I know it's a strange question, but has anyone a cd of "warhorse" (1970er progressive rock group)..I'm searching one song named "I (Who have Nothing)" from the "Red Sea" album...
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