[08:42] <GNAM> @schedule rome
[08:42] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Rome: 28 Jun 14:00: Edubuntu | 28 Jun 21:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 22:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 22:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[08:42] <GNAM> Marketing Team? auauusausa
[08:43] <GNAM> that's new
[08:43] <jenda> GNAM: you're welcome to come ;)
[08:52] <lukketto> GNAM: do you intend the meeting or the team?
[10:14] <digitalmouse> greetings programs!
[10:15] <jenda> hello digitalmouse
[10:16] <digitalmouse> hey there!
[10:21] <digitalmouse> whoops!  hit the wrong button :-p
[10:47] <digitalmouse> greetings programs!  you are a bit early to the meeting... it's scheduled for later today
[10:51] <Seveas> @schedule amsterdam
[10:51] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Amsterdam: 28 Jun 14:00: Edubuntu | 28 Jun 21:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 22:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 22:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[10:55] <digitalmouse> @schedule Hamburg
[10:56] <digitalmouse> oh wait.. that would be the same for Amsterdam too
[10:56] <digitalmouse> meh
[11:38] <sivang> @schedule Israel
[11:38] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Israel: 28 Jun 15:00: Edubuntu | 28 Jun 22:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 17:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 23:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 23:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 23:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[12:17] <Seveas> digitalmouse, in the unprobable even that that ever changes you can use Berlin as timezone ;)
[12:20] <digitalmouse> good point Seveas..  I was just trying Hamburg since that is a bit closer to me (I'm in Oldenburg, west of Bremen)
[12:20] <Seveas> digitalmouse, yeah but that's not an official timezone name ;)
[12:30] <digitalmouse> true true
[12:55] <tonyyarusso> Is there a mailing list or another way to get a reminders of upcoming meetings e-mailed to me?
[12:58] <digitalmouse> probably best to check often at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ under the respective sections.  someone could probably make an RSS feed that generates reminders.
[12:59] <digitalmouse> or integrate a calendar fuction into the wiki
[01:00] <tonyyarusso> Either one would be appreciated.
[01:01] <digitalmouse> a good point to bring up at a future meeting me-thinks
[01:01] <tonyyarusso> Sounds like a plan.
[01:24] <cbx33> @schedule london
[01:24] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/London: 28 Jun 13:00: Edubuntu | 28 Jun 20:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 15:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 21:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 21:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 21:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[01:28] <tonyyarusso> digitalmouse: Apparently I can get it as an iCal, just found that.
[02:01] <ogra> so how many people are we today 
[02:01] <ogra> looks rather empty
[02:02] <pips1> hiya
[02:02] <ogra> hey
[02:02] <pips1> just the two of us?!
[02:02] <DanielC> I'm just observing.
[02:02] <ogra> well, then it looks like its just the two of us and DanielC :)
[02:02] <DanielC> :)
[02:03] <ogra> ah
[02:03] <DanielC> one more person, whoo hoo!!
[02:03] <pips1> hi cbx33
[02:03] <cbx33> hey everybody
[02:03] <cbx33> I won't be able to stay the entire meeting I fear
[02:03] <ogra> well, i dont have much on the tech side today
[02:03] <Hobbsee> hey?  DanielC hope you werent meaning me - i know nothing :P
[02:03] <cbx33> but there will be minutes
[02:03] <DanielC> :)
[02:03] <cbx33> ogra I'm shocked :p
[02:03] <ogra> i'm personally rather busy doing ubuntu merges, so there is no particular edubuntu work atm
[02:04] <ogra> ltsp is merged with the modularization changes from debian
[02:04] <cbx33> oh yeh, I forgot we were in merge stage now
[02:04] <ogra> so development of new features will be way easier
[02:04] <cbx33> ogra, excellent
[02:04] <cbx33> that is great tech news
[02:04] <ogra> and ltsp is fully translateable now
[02:04] <ogra> thanks to debain as well
[02:04] <ogra> *debian too
[02:04] <cbx33> cool
[02:05] <ogra> we wrote a good bunnch of specs in paris
[02:05] <ogra> https://launchpad.net/people/ogra/+specs
[02:05] <ogra> ^^^^ list of them
[02:05] <DanielC> *click*
[02:05] <ogra> two are already approved, the others in review
[02:05] <cbx33> bimberi, cool
[02:06] <DanielC> ltsp dhcpd.conf :  good man!
[02:06] <ogra> most important is that we will have an autoconfigured dchpd in our next release after install ;)
[02:06] <cbx33> heheh yeh
[02:06] <bimberi> \o/
[02:06] <ogra> will add one additional question to the install though :/
[02:06] <ogra> but better than the current status
[02:06] <cbx33> yes
[02:06] <cbx33> very beneficial in my opinion
[02:07] <ogra> additionally the local device implementation is approved
[02:07] <cbx33> thats also great
[02:07] <DanielC> Definitely a good improvement.
[02:07] <cbx33> ogra, is ther eany news on local apps?
[02:07] <ogra> and most important news from the summit....
[02:07] <cbx33> that's something I'm very keen on
[02:07] <ogra> ltsp.org will merge with our ltsp over the next two releases
[02:07] <DanielC> meaning?
[02:07] <ogra> so there will only be one ltsp 
[02:07] <DanielC> cool
[02:07] <ogra> based on our work 
[02:08] <pips1> wow
[02:08] <cbx33> that's great news
[02:08] <ogra> merged with the features they have 
[02:08] <DanielC> What are the current differences between ltsp.org and what edubuntu has?
[02:08] <pips1> big applause
[02:08] <DanielC> clap clap clap clap
[02:08] <ogra> see the ltsp-convergence spec
[02:08] <flint> ogra I was talking to the fedora folks, and they and Eric Harrison had a different story...
[02:08] <DanielC> ok
[02:08] <ogra> the incidents listed there must be resolved over the two next releases
[02:09] <flint> ogra, what is the url of the ltsp-convergence spec?
[02:09] <DanielC> ogra, ltsp-convergence doesn't have any information.
[02:09] <DanielC> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/ltsp-convergence
[02:09] <pips1> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LtspConvergence
[02:09] <ogra> my personal next step is to establish the ltsp-daily-image-tarballs infrastructure
[02:09] <ogra> thats a prerequisite
[02:09] <cbx33> yeh
[02:09] <DanielC> pips1, thanks
[02:09] <ogra> then it will be very easy to install ppc chroots on i386 from the tarball ;)
[02:10] <ogra> that makes multiarch easier then ever ;)
[02:10] <cbx33> ogra, great !
[02:10] <ogra> localapps were not discussed, see the fat-client spec for reasons ...
 well, i dont have much on the tech side today
[02:10] <cbx33> :p
[02:10] <ogra> we need a authentication mechanism in place first
[02:11] <ogra> cbx33, :P 
[02:11] <ogra> turns out to be more than expected ;)
[02:11] <cbx33> ok
[02:11] <cbx33> that's cool
[02:11] <ogra> over all the spec side was the best we ever had wrt edubuntu on any conference
[02:11] <cbx33> excellent
[02:12] <ogra> i had amazing feedback from ltsp.org as well as from jonathan jerome rodrigo and jordan about the teamwork and community stuff that happened there 
[02:13] <ogra> (i must admit i didnt go out with themm in the evenings to get the specs done)
[02:13] <bimberi> ogra: it must have been good to have them there, more efficient
[02:13] <ogra> flint, https://launchpad.net/people/ogra/+specs has the list of all specs
[02:13] <ogra> bimberi, yes, it absolutely was
[02:13] <pips1> ogra "teamwork and community stuff that happened there" ?
[02:13] <ogra> way more than on other ubuntu conferences
[02:14] <ogra> yep
[02:14] <cbx33> ogra, you work-a-holic you :p
[02:14] <ogra> pips1, well, usually people are just busy working 
[02:14] <flint> ogra, I had a chance to participate in a shoot out between k12ltsp and edubuntu.  I got shot. 
[02:14] <ogra> and in the evenings you sit at the bar and slurp your beer ...
[02:14] <ogra> but there was some edubuntu spirit this time
[02:14] <pips1> flint, ?
[02:14] <ogra> i dont know how to express it in words
[02:15] <ogra> flint, so you switch to k12 now ? 
[02:15] <flint> pips1, This thing called NELS... NorthEast Linux Symposium in Bethel Maine...
[02:15] <flint> ogra, I suspect that Jeff will switch. 
[02:16] <ogra> well, he'll get our ltsp anyway in april :)
[02:16] <ogra> one way or the other :)
[02:16] <pips1> flint, reasons?
[02:16] <flint> ogra, it loads from 6 cd's (their bad) but it wipes us off the map.
[02:16] <ogra> if he doesnt like the system i cant help it
[02:17] <flint> ogra, you have a better meta-system, this fedora core k12 ltsp distro just needs to be emulated in all ways...
[02:17] <ogra> i suspect rodarvus and richard will improve the edu situation beyond my tech skills a lot
[02:17] <ogra> pips1, k12ltsp is the redhat based edu distro
[02:18] <rodarvus> sorry, I arrived late (was on a phone call)
[02:18] <pips1> could you be a bit more explicit for the benefit of the rest of us? :-)
[02:18] <ogra> shipping the same stuff we do ... preconfigured ltsp edu apps etc
[02:18] <ogra> they are the eduredhat
[02:18] <flint> ogra, They have another symposium comming up at University of New Hampshire in July.  I want to present about the future of Edubuntu.
[02:18] <ogra> while we are the edu-ubuntu
[02:18] <flint> ogra, nicely put.  
[02:19] <flint> ogra, they won the day - on merit!
[02:19] <ogra> in fact the edubuntu idea comes from the founder of k12ltsp :P
[02:19] <ogra> he created the spec for it in sydney
[02:19] <flint> ogra, is that Eric Harrison?
[02:19] <ogra> yep
[02:19] <pips1> right, so this is some kind of sideshow of the "distro war"?
[02:20] <ogra> i never saw it as a war
[02:20] <flint> pips1, this is the best distro wins...
[02:20] <ogra> we surely are in our early stages compared to k12
[02:20] <ogra> but we are on place 52 on distrowatch ...
[02:20] <flint> ogra, the issue is that strategically launchpad and the ubuntu methodology will win out, the bad news is when.
[02:20] <ogra> so i guess our popularity will gain us more ground in the future
[02:21] <spacey> hi / sorry i'm joining so late
[02:21] <DanielC> This is sounding a lot like a distro competition.
[02:21] <flint> ogra, we are in a very difficult box.  6 CD's is about a DVD.  When are we on a DVD?
[02:21] <ogra> there is no competition in there 
[02:21] <flint> ogra, i agree completely with Ollie.  This is all about technical merit.
[02:21] <ogra> flint, we are 
[02:22] <flint> ogra, I came late.  when and where?
[02:22] <ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/6.06/release/
[02:22] <ogra> since the release already
[02:22] <DanielC> Could someone then explain this deal about ltsp.org and edubuntu merging and the thing about edubuntu being more popular, and them being edu-hat and us being edu-buntu?
[02:23] <ogra> it has only the contents of main though
[02:23] <flint> ogra, I used 40 install disks I made of 6.06 and they were CD's.
[02:23] <ogra> flint, well, why didnt you take the dvd :)
[02:23] <ogra> its available since dapper development started
[02:23] <ogra> but since we'll never ship a dvd it doesnt get much attention in advertisin 
[02:23] <flint> ogra, this was 6 CD's of LTSP base, you needed this to do the install.  I do not need the universe.  have you ever loaded k12ltsp?
[02:24] <digitalmouse> greetings programs!
[02:24] <ogra> also most of our users arent even capable of downloading or using a dvd due to bandwith or tech (no dvd player) restrictions
[02:24] <flint> I never had, 
[02:24] <spacey> whats wrong with 1 cd
[02:25] <spacey> instead of 6 or a dvd
[02:25] <ogra> nothing :)
[02:25] <flint> ogra, Olli, the features they had, and the silly thing worked out of the box with no patching!
[02:25] <ogra> patching ? 
[02:25] <flint> dhcpd3.
[02:25] <spacey> why would you need to patch dhcpd3?
[02:25] <ogra> flint, did you see the specs ?
[02:25] <flint> and then some...
[02:26] <flint> ogra, I saw the result.
[02:26] <ogra> edgy *will* work out of the box
[02:26] <ogra> without touching dhcp configs
[02:26] <ogra> dapper works ut of the box if you pick the right ip net on install
[02:27] <ogra> so i really miss to see the problem here
[02:27] <flint> ogra, I will be releasing a compelte document on this topic, based upon Jonathan's earlier work.  One of the chapters will be a comparison.  You are going to team with LTSP.org with is Jim McQuillan, which is good.  What about Eric Harrison?
[02:27] <ogra> additionally it looks like Mithrandir is working on a liveCD that would make ltsp support possible
[02:28] <ogra> so we even might ship a liveCD next release
[02:28] <ogra> what about eric ? 
[02:28] <flint> ogra, the man can package a damn fine distro. and the word is that he needs help.
[02:29] <digitalmouse> ooo... a live ltsp cd.. neat
[02:29] <ogra> one of his emplloyees is permanently in #edubuntu and even helps supporting people
[02:29] <ogra> flint, i wont resign and work on a rpm based distro
[02:29] <flint> ogra, he is a teacher, to my knowledge he employs no one.
[02:29] <ogra> he's free to join edubuntu development and bring his ideas to us
[02:29] <DanielC> What is this about working on an rpm distro?
[02:29] <flint> ogra, I am completely behind you on that (rpm --nodep yech!)
[02:29] <DanielC> Guys, I'm really not understanding what's going on.
[02:29] <ogra> DanielC, k12 is redhat based
[02:30] <DanielC> yes, I know that part...
[02:30] <flint> ogra, actually fedora based and thus free...
[02:30] <ogra> flint, so what are we discussing here, he knows we're here
[02:30] <flint> gang I went to the races with our car and I got left in the dust.  that is my report.
[02:30] <ogra> hes free to come over and make edubuntu k12edubuntu
[02:30] <ogra> (even though i'd oppose the name ;) )
[02:30] <DanielC> Could someone summarize what's going on?
[02:31] <ogra> you said something different before
[02:31] <ogra> you said eric needs our help
[02:31] <ogra> we could need his help as well ... its a question of what we base on
[02:32] <ogra> sooo
[02:32] <flint> DanielC, I am mentioning that two distributions of K12ltsp were at the NELS conference in Bethel Maine.  Edubuntu did not triumph in comparison to K12LTSP.
[02:32] <DanielC> flint: Ok, I'm slowly catching up...
[02:32] <ogra> that was a lot tech stuff, i think we should do discussions afetr the meeting in #edubuntu rather
[02:32] <flint> NELS has another conference in New Hampshire, and there is the NECC conference comming up.
[02:33] <pips1> so flint, you are saying k12ltsp currently offers more out of the box and should thus be advanced, rather than redoing an ltsp (edu) distro on the base of debian/ubuntu?
[02:33] <spacey> if there are some interesting points compared to other distro's it is more use if you write them up and send to list?
[02:33] <ogra> yeha
[02:33] <flint> ogra, Oliver, I spent a week thinking about this.  You have much on your shoulders, particularly management.  What can I do to help you make your product better?  The first thing I could think of was to tell you this.
[02:34] <ogra> flint, i have two new colleagues now
[02:34] <ogra> it should resolve as soon as we found our path, give us some tie to grow together 
[02:34] <DanielC> Ok, thanks pips1 and spacey. I think I've caught up now.
[02:34] <flint> ogra, I would propose that you duplicate my observations.  
[02:34] <ogra> *time indeed
[02:35] <spacey> ogra: who's new?
[02:35] <cbx33> I'm popping back in, sorry to clarify, ogra did you mean a live cd that can boot onto an ltsp network?
[02:35] <cbx33> or a live cd containing an ltsp root?
[02:35] <cbx33> I'm thinking the former
[02:35] <ogra> cbx33, nope a livecd with ltsp server
[02:35] <spacey> cbx33: i think for installation
[02:35] <cbx33> WOW
[02:35] <ogra> it wont be very useable 
[02:35] <cbx33> I would love Mithrandir forever
[02:36] <spacey> ogra: i guess it could install as well then?
[02:36] <ogra> i.e. you dont want to use more than one client actively
[02:36] <ogra> spacey, indeed
[02:36] <cbx33> ok sure
[02:36] <ogra> the disk IO is way to slow on a cd
[02:36] <cbx33> does our live cd support copying the entire cd to ram like knoppix
[02:36] <Mithrandir> my use case is actually not ltsp, but rather "share this live cd" where the live cd has all the parts needed to netboot other machines.
[02:36] <Mithrandir> cbx33: no.
[02:36] <ogra> but well, we'll have a libe installer cd then
[02:36] <Mithrandir> installing ltsp onto there should be quite easy, though.
[02:36] <cbx33> Mithrandir, ok cool
[02:37] <ogra> Mithrandir, which is a trivial small step away from using it for ltsp :)
[02:37] <bimberi> sounds like what knoppix does?
[02:37] <ogra> well, not as hackish i guess :)
[02:37] <bimberi> lol, kk
[02:37] <ogra> but similar, yes
[02:37] <cbx33> my use case is..I have a very powerful server, own by an outside company, we're not lalowed to reinstall/open it, but we can't use it for what it was built
[02:37] <Mithrandir> bimberi: knoppix is doing a bunch of the same stuff as we want to do, yes.  The difference is our live cd tries quite hard to not diverge from the distro as such.
[02:38] <cbx33> so I was looking for easy options forme, and others to use it
[02:38] <cbx33> for something useful
[02:38] <ogra> the idea is to have something to easily demo ltsp with
[02:38] <cbx33> ogra, exactly what I want it for
[02:38] <ogra> and to be able to ship the livecd
[02:38] <cbx33> I know every school in the city here has one of these boxes
[02:38] <cbx33> and half of them don't use it
[02:38] <ogra> currently we can only ship install because of the ltsp bits and the installer part for it
[02:38] <cbx33> ogra, presumably this is going to mean even tighter space constraints
[02:39] <ogra> not really
[02:39] <ogra> we have far more space on the livecd due to the compressed filesystem
[02:39] <cbx33> is it still planned for edgy to get rid of kdedu?
[02:39] <ogra> i.e. the livecd ships 6 languages, the install cd only one
[02:39] <DanielC> cbx33: what is kedu?
[02:40] <ogra> cbx33, not if we dont find replacements
[02:40] <ogra> which i dont see yet
[02:40] <cbx33> DanielC, kdeedu - a lot of the education apps rely on kde libs
[02:40] <ogra> we should target it for edgy+1
[02:40] <cbx33> which are large
[02:40] <cbx33> we want to replace with gnome apps to save space
[02:40] <ogra> and find people writing the necessary apps in that time
[02:40] <DanielC> cbx33: Ok, I know those. Like Kalzium and KStars.
[02:40] <cbx33> DanielC, yes
[02:40] <ogra> yep
[02:40] <cbx33> porting is an option in some cases no?
[02:40] <ogra> kstars is easily replaced 
[02:41] <cbx33> celestia?
[02:41] <ogra> but there is no such thing as kalzium
[02:41] <cbx33> ogra, true
[02:41] <ogra> cbx33, ever tried to port a Qt app to gtk ? 
[02:41] <Riddell> ogra: are you splitting out kdeedu language packs?
[02:41] <cbx33> ogra, you know about my gtk skills
[02:41] <ogra> a rewrite is faster in most cases
[02:41] <ogra> Riddell, i wanted, yes
[02:41] <DanielC> What's the objective for removing them? Is it just to make the ISO smaller by removing KDE libs?
[02:41] <cbx33> DanielC, yes to fit more stuff on
[02:41] <DanielC> ok, thanks
[02:42] <ogra> but for now i focus on xulrunner and we got 20MB for free through the seed clanup
[02:42] <cbx33> so if you're up for writing some edu apps in gnome
[02:42] <cbx33> go for it
[02:42] <cbx33> ogra, good job
[02:42] <ogra> so there might be enough space this time
[02:42] <cbx33> ogra, we have a split kdeedu don;t we?
[02:42] <ogra> we never started off with spare space into a dev cycle yet
[02:42] <ogra> split ?
[02:43] <cbx33> it's not the entire kdeedu
[02:43] <pips1> ogra, as far as I understand, the kde edu apps are all bundled together, so while it is easy to install them in one go, it makes it impossible.. erm hard to de-install individual apps that aren't wanted...
[02:43] <ogra> thats not true
[02:43] <cbx33> what I'm thinking is, is it possible to write maybe a few apps to replace those in kdeedu as we go?
[02:43] <ogra> there is a metapackage that pulls them all in
[02:43] <ogra> we dont use it
[02:43] <ogra> we only use the individual apps
[02:43] <cbx33> for example if I wrote a replacement for kbrauch
[02:44] <flint> ogra, would it be possible to do a kedbubuntu?
[02:44] <cbx33> we could swap
[02:44] <ogra> the biggest thing are the langpacks
[02:44] <ogra> flint, sure it would, feel free to do it ;)
[02:44] <pips1> so I *can* de-install individual kde edu apps in edubuntu via synaptic?
[02:44] <highvoltage> sorry for being late, got stuck in a meeting at the bank
[02:44] <ogra> pips1, indeed
[02:44] <cbx33> hi Hawkwind 
[02:44] <cbx33> hi highvoltage 
[02:44] <highvoltage> hi cbx33 
[02:44] <pips1> ogra, oic, ok, my bad
[02:44] <cbx33> sheesh damn tab completion
[02:45] <ogra> sooo, any other topics for tec ? 
[02:45] <cbx33> is there the possiblity?
[02:45] <cbx33> i mean is it worth
[02:45] <ogra> what ? 
[02:45] <cbx33> asking on ML or something for people to write some edu apps
[02:45] <flint> ogra, I know my news is not good.  I am sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings.  I had to stand there and take it from the k12 LTSP weenies. It hurt.
[02:45] <ogra> sureit is
[02:45] <DanielC> I'd like to understand this deal about ltsp.org and edubuntu merging.
[02:45] <cbx33> some of the apps are so small
[02:45] <cbx33> I bet we could have replacements by edgy
[02:45] <ogra> flint, i'm not worried about it and you should neither 
[02:46] <ogra> flint, they have years of experience in the edu sector ... i dont have any beyond my edubuntu work ... but we have someone who will solve that in edgy 
[02:46] <cbx33> :D
[02:46] <ogra> so just trust him to get his job done ;)
[02:47] <DanielC> Who do we have?
[02:47] <ogra> yes
[02:47] <DanielC> This is an example of my being lost.
[02:47] <ogra> he starts mid of july
[02:47] <ogra> i announced that last meeting :)
[02:47] <DanielC> ok
[02:47] <flint> ogra, is this Jane's husband?
[02:47] <ogra> yes
[02:47] <DanielC> ah
[02:47] <DanielC> Ok, I'm catching up.
[02:48] <ogra> he was educational lead of HP
[02:48] <ogra> so i really think he'll get it right ;)
[02:48] <DanielC> I hope he knows his stuff :)
[02:48] <pips1> talking about years of experience, don't forget to mention the Skolelinux folk :-)
[02:48] <highvoltage> i've met him a few times, he's a great guy.
[02:48] <highvoltage> i'm sure he'll so great work for edubuntu.
[02:48] <cbx33> me too
[02:48] <ogra> me too :)
[02:49] <ogra> so flint, dont worry it will all come together nicely over time
[02:49] <cbx33> been a bad week
[02:49] <flint> ogra, I am going to bet on the future at my next presentation in New Hampshire.
[02:49] <cbx33> but should be much better tomorrow
[02:50] <cbx33> I'm going to email canonical about the BETT2007 show
[02:50] <ogra> i wouldnt want to cope with skole yet, but i think edgy will be in a state to "compete" with k12
[02:50] <flint> ogra, what is jane's husband's handle on irc?
[02:50] <ogra> no idea
[02:50] <jsgotangco> ummmm
[02:50] <ogra> i havent met him yet
[02:50] <jsgotangco> i thought the meeting was much later
[02:50] <highvoltage> why is k12 better than edubuntu again?
[02:50] <flint> ogra, gotcha...
[02:50] <cbx33> highvoltage, it's not :p
[02:50] <cbx33> it's a perception thing :p
[02:50] <cbx33> hahah
[02:50] <pips1> highvoltage, I also want to know... flint, shoot!
[02:50] <ogra> highvoltage, because flint feels like ... after he had a "competition"
[02:51] <cbx33> edubuntu rules supreme :p
[02:51] <flint> highvoltage, jonathan, here is a partial feature list...
[02:51] <flint> Features that they had that we did not included:
[02:51] <flint> - worked out of the box, not patches
[02:51] <flint> - plugged in a usb memory stick
[02:51] <flint> - booted a client in 25 seconds
[02:51] <flint> - had teacher tool.
[02:51] <flint> - supported sound
[02:51] <flint> - Booted a mac
[02:51] <jsgotangco> cbx33: edubuntu is only a year old
[02:51] <jsgotangco> dont be so blinded so much of short success =)
[02:51] <ogra> flint, see the spec list its all on there
[02:51] <cbx33> jsgotangco, yeh and look how far we've come already.  I'm not saying that we're better
[02:51] <highvoltage> ogra: heh
[02:51] <cbx33> I'm saying we have so much potential
[02:52] <ogra> 10 mins left
[02:52] <flint> ogra, I was absolutely astonished at their product.
[02:52] <jsgotangco> cbx33: it'll happen if we have like at least 2 more developers
[02:52] <ogra> DOCUMENTATION
[02:52] <ogra> any news here 
[02:52] <highvoltage> flint: there's also a lot of things that k12-ltsp don't have. i have 200 schools that say they like edubuntu more than k12-ltsp ;)
[02:52] <cbx33> there was the edubuntu cookbook meeting?
[02:52] <ogra> (lets discuss competition later in #edubuntu)
[02:52] <highvoltage> right.
[02:52] <jsgotangco> ogra: none on my side, have been busy with g-a-i
[02:53] <ogra> any intresting news fromm the cookbook ? 
[02:53] <flint> highvoltage, I owe you a draft of this document I have based off the tuxlab book.  It is still beta.
[02:53] <cbx33> ogra, there was a meeting
[02:53] <highvoltage> flint: ok
[02:53] <pips1> well, I think it's time that we get that glossary for edubuntu.org... jsgotangco what's g-a-i ?
[02:53] <cbx33> and minutes were posted on the ml
[02:53] <ogra> well, did anyone attend ? 
[02:53] <ogra> ok
[02:53] <jsgotangco> pips1: gnome-app-install
[02:53] <cbx33> i attended the first
[02:53] <flint> highvoltage, I think I still have your email.  i will send it to you after the meeting.
[02:54] <ogra> ARTWORK 
[02:54] <ogra> we need an artteam leader
[02:54] <flint> ogra, I actuall LIKE the artwork we got!
[02:54] <cbx33> AliasVegas is considering
[02:54] <ogra> mark wants that every derivative has a leader of the artteam to make decisions etc
[02:54] <flint> ogra, fedora really sucked in this way.  They defaulted to purple bubbles this did suck.
[02:54] <cbx33> I think she's a little worried by the fact she hasn't been inthe community
[02:54] <ogra> and works with the ubuntu artteam 
[02:55] <cbx33> ogra, is there the possibility of creating job specs for some of these people
[02:55] <ogra> cbx33, well, most of the art guys in ubuntu havent either
[02:55] <rodarvus> who are the active artists of Edubuntu?
[02:55] <ogra> for a volunteer job ... well
[02:55] <cbx33> well, yeh
[02:55] <ogra> rodarvus, AliasVegas
[02:55] <flint> ogra, would it be right to say that the art leader is an inspired job?
[02:55] <flint> :^)
[02:55] <highvoltage> i think cbx33 has a point... perhaps 'job specs' for people who volunteer isn't a bad idea.
[02:55] <ogra> rodarvus, highvoltage does some stuff sometimes 
[02:55] <ogra> and me
[02:56] <rodarvus> Ubuntu and Kubuntu will have part time artists working on Edgy
[02:56] <highvoltage> it makes it easier for people to understand what's expected of them.
[02:56] <cbx33> at least then they know what is expected
[02:56] <cbx33> highvoltage, exactly
[02:56] <rodarvus> plus, as ogra mentioned, a edgy artwork release team
[02:56] <ogra> rodarvus, i doubt we'll get that in the bugdet (yet)
[02:56] <cbx33> i think if AliasVegas knows what's expected she'll be far more likely to get involved
[02:56] <flint> ogra, artists have know to become inspired for a price... (I am no artist :^)
[02:56] <rodarvus> ogra, yes, that was going to be my next comment :)
[02:57] <rodarvus> I'd really love to have at least a part time artist doing stuff for Edgy on Edubuntu
[02:57] <ogra> cbx33, leadint the artteam ... communication with the ubuntu artteam 
[02:57] <ogra> thats the job
[02:57] <rodarvus> meaning - I'll ask either mark or richardw asap
[02:57] <rodarvus> thats why I asked about the active artists on our team
[02:57] <highvoltage> it would be funny if his nick is actually RichardW :)
[02:57] <ogra> rodarvus, AliasVegas did the alternative wallpaper we ship
[02:58] <pips1> ;-)
[02:58] <rodarvus> ogra, do you know if he (she?) is a professional designer
[02:58] <flint> rodarvus, do you have any inclinations to do this art thing?
[02:58] <ogra> she's a great artist and took our critics and made an awesome wallpaper out of it
[02:58] <rodarvus> flint, no
[02:58] <cbx33> ogra, you know we've had a big family stuff, hence she hasn't had a lot of time to think about it
[02:58] <rodarvus> my wife is an acomplished designer, though :D
[02:58] <cbx33> but I'm pretty sure she'd love to do more 
[02:58] <cbx33> she's a very creative person
[02:58] <flint> rodarvus, I agree with you on this :^)
[02:58] <rodarvus> we can try to bribe her for the job, but no promises :D
[02:58] <jsgotangco> pips1: im sitting in this corner because i have no clue as to what is happening here at the moment so Im just going to listen here
[02:58] <ogra> rodarvus, she's professional artist (and cbx33's wife)
[02:59] <rodarvus> I really loved our wallpaper, btw
[02:59] <ogra> the chalkboard or the homies ?
[02:59] <rodarvus> cbx33, kudos to your wife :)
[02:59] <cbx33> I'll pass that on
[02:59] <cbx33> it was funny
[02:59] <cbx33> because
[02:59] <ogra> ok, we're out of time 
[02:59] <pips1> rodarvus, she did the homies
[02:59] <flint> rodarvus, art won us the day in comparison to K12LTSP.
[02:59] <cbx33> she did the first wallpaper draft 
[02:59] <cbx33> because she thought no one would like it
[02:59] <ogra> any community/management tasks 
[03:00] <cbx33> she was totally shocked when every loved it
[03:00] <rodarvus> sorry, I don't understand what 'homies' means in this context
[03:00] <ogra> or any other business ? 
[03:00] <cbx33> ogra, nope
[03:00] <ogra> rodarvus, the laternative wallpaper
[03:00] <rodarvus> oh
[03:00] <flint> highvoltage, mail to you in a minute.
[03:00] <pips1> homies short for home boys
[03:00] <rodarvus> now I get it, thanks :)
[03:00] <ogra> ok, going once
[03:00] <highvoltage> rodarvus: short for 'homeboys', as in, slang for 'ganster friends'
[03:00] <ogra> going twice
[03:00] <pips1> highvoltage, heh
[03:00] <rodarvus> wait
[03:00] <rodarvus> :)
[03:00] <ogra> meeting adjourned, thanks everybody
[03:00] <ogra> oops
[03:00] <pips1> wait
[03:01] <ogra> rodarvus, speak up
[03:01] <pips1> website?
[03:01] <rodarvus> I'd like to propose a (unnoficial?) announcement for request for people to take part on artwork for Edgy
[03:01] <ogra> what about it ? 
[03:01] <ogra> rodarvus, just mail edubuntu-users :)
[03:01] <rodarvus> and to have someone officially regarded as responsible, etc
[03:01] <highvoltage> flint: ok :)
[03:02] <rodarvus> will do it
[03:02] <rodarvus> just wanted to hear from you first if it is ok to do so :)
[03:03] <pips1> rodarvus, you might want to draft those requirements for artwork volunteers then?
[03:03] <ogra> rodarvus, note that AliasVegas has contributed heavily and reacted very good on feedback from the community, she's the one we have experience with ...
[03:03] <ogra> thast a big plus imho ...
[03:04] <ogra> indeed that doesnt show her management skills ... which are required for a teamleader
[03:04] <pips1> highvoltage, cbx33 how is your time looking for website work?
[03:04] <rodarvus> ogra, right, I agree
[03:04] <rodarvus> ogra, whoever is appointed for this task, will need lots of feedback from us (developers)
[03:05] <ogra> and from the community :)
[03:05] <ogra> they are the users that have to live with the artwork for 6months :)
[03:05] <cbx33> pips1, not too bad
[03:05] <cbx33> <#edubuntu
[03:05] <ogra> yeah
[03:06] <ogra> meeting ends here -------------------------------------------
[03:06] <ogra> thanks everybody 
[03:06] <pips1> oki
[03:06] <cbx33> you stole that ogra :p
[03:06] <ogra> hehe
[03:06] <digitalmouse> interesting stuff ogra, thanks
[03:07] <jenda> rodarvus: BTW, congratulations on your membership ;)
[03:07] <ogra> flint, do you come over ?
[03:07] <rodarvus> jenda, thanks :)
[03:07] <flint> ogra, right now...
[03:07] <rodarvus> I'm still waiting for membership on Edubuntu Members ;)
[03:08] <rodarvus> but that will have to wait for a Edubuntu Council meeting] 
[03:08] <ogra> rodarvus, nope
[03:08] <jenda> hehe
[03:08] <rodarvus> no?
[03:08] <ogra> thats included in ubuntu membership ;)
[03:08] <rodarvus> oh
[03:08] <rodarvus> :)
[03:08] <ogra> edubuntu-members is a member of ubuntu-members ;)
[03:08] <rodarvus> so no explicit edubuntu-membership for me? :)
[03:08] <ogra> not needed
[03:09] <rodarvus> meh
[03:09] <ogra> i'll just approve you so you can get your edubuntu.org mailaddress
[03:09] <jenda> ogra: wouldn't that make eduubuntu-membership imply ubuntu-membership, but not otherwise?
[03:09] <ogra> jenda, well, there is no need to prove your prerequisites a second time 
[03:10] <jenda> OK ;)
[03:10] <ogra> if you are in ubuntu-members you are valid for membership regardless if in edubuntu-memebers or kubuntu-members
[03:10] <jenda> ogra: come to speak of it, how is it with ubuntu.com email addys?
[03:10] <Riddell> s/valid for/have/
[03:10] <jenda> you are have? ;)
[03:10] <ogra> Riddell, you are not automatically in that teams
[03:11] <ogra> and i.e. the mail stuff only works for team members
[03:11] <jenda> wouldn't really make sense for every ubuntu member to be an edubuntu member...
[03:11] <ogra> exactly
[03:11] <highvoltage> pips1: sorry, i thought the meeting was over
[03:11] <jsgotangco> yeah
[03:11] <ogra> yeah
[03:11] <highvoltage> pips1: i just upgraded the drupal version again two days ago
[03:11] <pips1> highvoltage, great
[03:11] <rodarvus> highvoltage, well, it is, actually
[03:16] <jenda> ogra: would you happen to know about the ubuntu.com email addresses?
[03:17] <ogra> jenda, they should just work if you are an approved member
[03:17] <ogra> through launchpad
[03:17] <jenda> oh, does it forward automatically?
[03:18] <jenda> wow, really ;)
[03:20] <Klaidas> @schedule Vilnius
[03:20] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Vilnius: Current meeting: Edubuntu | 28 Jun 22:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 17:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 23:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 23:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 23:00: Ubuntu Development Team
[05:39] <digitalmouse> greetings programs! :)
[07:35] <jjesse> @schedule detroit
[07:35] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Detroit: 28 Jun 15:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 16:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 16:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 08:00: Edubuntu
[07:37] <mindspin> @schedule berlin
[07:37] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Berlin: 28 Jun 21:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 22:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 22:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 14:00: Edubuntu
[07:37] <GazzaK> @schedule london
[07:37] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/London: 28 Jun 20:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 15:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 21:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 21:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 21:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 13:00: Edubuntu
[07:37] <GazzaK> thats cool
[08:05] <jenda> @schedule Prague
[08:05] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Prague: 28 Jun 21:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 22:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 22:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 14:00: Edubuntu
[08:26] <GNAM> @schedule Rome
[08:26] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Rome: 28 Jun 21:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 22:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 22:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 14:00: Edubuntu
[08:27] <zul> @schedule Montreal
[08:27] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Montreal: 28 Jun 15:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 16:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 16:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 08:00: Edubuntu
[08:31] <sivang> @schedule Israel
[08:31] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Israel: 28 Jun 22:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 17:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 23:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 23:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 23:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 15:00: Edubuntu
[08:43] <shawarma> @schedule Copenhagen
[08:43] <Ubugtu> Schedule for Europe/Copenhagen: 28 Jun 21:00: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 22:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 22:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 22:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 14:00: Edubuntu
[08:59] <matthewrevell> evening
[09:00] <GazzaK> evening
[09:00] <thechitowncubs> Good afternoon :)
[09:00] <matthewrevell> :)
[09:00] <bimberi> '(early) morning :)
[09:01] <Bilange> hi! (for simplicity's sake :)
[09:01] <matthewrevell> Bilange: Good idea!
[09:01] <mindspin> ;-)
[09:01] <matthewrevell> hi nixternal 
[09:01] <Klaidas> good evening :)
[09:02] <matthewrevell> Klaidas: hi
[09:02] <nixternal> jenda: it seems one of my clients has gotten bit by the root of bug #1...i will be about 10 to 15 minutes yet...go ahead and get rolling...i will pick back up when i get finished here
[09:02] <nixternal> sorry.
[09:02] <Ubugtu> Malone bug 1 in Ubuntu Dapper "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/1
[09:02] <nixternal> bbiaf
[09:02] <jenda> haha ;)
[09:02] <matthewrevell> jenda: Howdy
[09:02] <jenda> OK, Ubugtu has rung the gong already.
[09:02] <matthewrevell> :)
[09:02] <nixternal> bbiaf ;)
[09:03] <thechitowncubs> Ha
[09:03] <matthewrevell> jenda: You chairing?
[09:03] <jenda> Strangers from distant lands... and all that jazz. We have now gathered here on the first meeting of the Marketing Team, at least for a long time. There are many people present who each have their own history of participation in the MT. Some have been working long on the ubuntupeople.com forum, others have dwelt on the mailing list - some are quite new and joined the team first right here on IRC. We have many issues on the agenda, which you can
[09:03] <jenda>  see here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam/Meetings
[09:03] <jenda> matthewrevell: we'll see ;)
[09:03] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: evening
[09:04] <jenda> Mr. T pities the foo who missed my opening speech
[09:04] <matthewrevell> jenda: roftl
[09:04] <jenda> The first point on the Agenda is: What are the Marketing Team's objectives?
[09:04] <matthewrevell> jenda: Okay, may I suggest that we agree to discuss objectives on the list rather than here, this evening?
[09:05] <matthewrevell> It's a rather big topic
[09:05] <jenda> yep
[09:05] <jenda> :)
[09:05] <matthewrevell> :)
[09:05] <matthewrevell> Any objections?
[09:05] <jenda> Anyone interested in this subject, please have a look at the MT wiki and think of what you'd like to see there.
[09:05] <jenda> 3
[09:05] <jenda> 2
[09:05] <jenda> 1
[09:05] <jenda> sold
[09:05] <jenda> Next point:
[09:06] <jenda> How the team communicates and works.
[09:06] <_sara> can we get a forum on the ubuntuforums
[09:06] <ompaul> jenda, it would be nice if there was a url in the channel 
[09:06] <jenda> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam
[09:06] <jenda> sorry
[09:07] <matthewrevell> _sara: Do you prefer forums to the mailing list?
[09:07] <jenda> _sara: the opinion has been voiced that it isn't necessary.
[09:07] <_sara> sometimes
[09:07] <jenda> We have the wiki, the list, LP and IRC
[09:08] <ompaul> how to bind that we have 
[09:08] <_sara> but it might not be necessary now that I really think about it
[09:08] <dotwaffle> I find mailing lists good, but only if there is a searchable mailing list archive. Forums are all well and good, but it leads to people giving short answers instead of structured thinking.
[09:08] <jenda> And to date, the forum has only caused resource fragmentation
[09:08] <jenda> The list has an archive.
[09:08] <Bilange> at the very least, please make a sticky thread on the ubuntuforums somewhere linking to our websites/mailing list and so forth
[09:08] <jenda> Link will be added to the wiki
[09:08] <mindspin> i agree with dotwaffle
[09:08] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: Possibly. My main objection to a forum is that all the other Ubuntu teams use the official lists, which mean that our official list is easy to find.
[09:08] <Bilange> just to make sure we have some visibility to the newcomers
[09:08] <jenda> Bilange: check
[09:09] <dotwaffle> jenda: Yes, but it's not easily searchable for references - personally my mailing lists get purged every 14-28 days (depending on thread activity)
[09:09] <jenda> Bilange: noted
[09:09] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: lists.ubuntu.com has archives
[09:09] <jenda> Anyone have experience with searching the list?
[09:09] <dotwaffle> matthewrevell: are they searchable? as in query style?
[09:10] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: Sorry, I don't know.
[09:10] <ompaul> maybe we should ask for that "feature" if it does not exist
[09:10] <bimberi> if not, it can be arranged surely
[09:10] <jenda> Exactly.
[09:10] <GazzaK> can the mailing list be intergrated into a forum?
[09:10] <matthewrevell> GazzaK: There are issues with that. It doesn't always work so well, either technically or culturally
[09:10] <dotwaffle> Let's just remember that forums are just a web version of mailing lists, and are harder to manage as you then can't see the flow of the thread and stub out offtopic comments through ignorance rather than active pruning.
[09:11] <jenda> Is there anyone with a good argument against a searchable archived mailing list being a full replacement for the forum?
[09:11] <matthewrevell> jenda: Not from me.
[09:11] <mindspin> newcomers
[09:11] <jenda> newcomers...
[09:11] <matthewrevell> mindspin: In what way?
[09:11] <Bilange> otherwise, there should be a dirth google trick working, as in "inurl:ubuntu-marketing search_words domain:lists.ubuntu.com" or something similar
[09:11] <Bilange> s/dirth/dirty
[09:11] <jenda> mindspin: I think spreadubuntu could offer a friendly enough interface for marketing team newcomers.
[09:12] <mindspin> newcomers sometimes shrugg when it comes to mailinglists
[09:12] <matthewrevell> mindspin: It took me a long time to realise UbuntuPeople was used for marketing team stuff. The mailing list is kinda the obvious choice for newcomers.
[09:12] <matthewrevell> mindspin: Because that's what the other teams use.
[09:12] <mindspin> I absolutely favour the mailinglist
[09:12] <bimberi> There should be one place where what the team is doing is communicated.  A mailing list is the best place (imo).  By all means have other "forums" (irc, webforums) but no decisions/initiatives should be considered 'official' until communicated on the list.
[09:12] <jenda> matthewrevell: agreed.
[09:12] <mindspin> we should deal with newcomers
[09:13] <jenda> When I joined ubnutupeople.com, I thought it was a fan site.
[09:13] <_sara> me too
[09:13] <matthewrevell> mindspin: What, in that they don't like mailing lists?
[09:13] <jenda> bimberi: agreed
[09:13] <_sara> newcomers just don't know about them, so we need a repository of info on how to join the team
[09:13] <mindspin> telling them to join the list and that it doesn't hurt ;-)
[09:14] <jenda> spreadubuntu might become the first stop for new user marketeers.
[09:14] <matthewrevell> _sara: Agreed that it needs to be as easy as possible to join the list. I'd say it's easier to find out about the list, particularly for existing Ubuntu people, than a forum.
[09:14] <coopster> jenda: spreadubuntu should have both a newbie friendly press-release type description of the marketing team and contact info, and a link to the list search
[09:14] <matthewrevell> mindspin: Yeah, a pain free guide would be ideal. Stick me down to write one, unless anyone else would prefer to.
[09:14] <jenda> the MT wiki should provide a fairly usable interface as well. It lists all the communications on the top.
[09:14] <jenda> coopster: we'll get to SU
[09:15] <ompaul> we have a mailing list, we had a forum it was not integrated into the mailing list, it does not exist, we have a few people if they all split across the two existing interactive media that we have (irc and mail) and don't have a way to bind the conversation then there is a serious issue in terms of what we should do.
[09:15] <jenda> matthewrevell: I'm writing it down as your job ;)
[09:15] <matthewrevell> jenda: superb
[09:15] <ompaul> now if you want to consider adding to that mix 
[09:15] <ompaul> you split the message 
[09:15] <coopster> jenda: well, seems relevant in that SU can be the easy to navigate intro to how to join the mailing list, and would work well with just using the wiki and ml for official chatter
[09:15] <ompaul> as for searchable email, the current email list for 6 months is 1 meg in total download 
[09:15] <matthewrevell> ompaul: Yeah. Irc is great for meetings, brainstorming and generally getting to know each other. The ML is best for thrashing out real business, outside of meetings. IMO.
[09:15] <jenda> coopster: it's the next point on the agenda
[09:16] <bimberi> matthewrevell: exactly
[09:16] <jenda> matthewrevell: +1
[09:16] <matthewrevell> \o/
[09:16] <matthewrevell> :)
[09:16] <ompaul> coopster, the wiki is less of a chatter place but a place to "store collective wisdom" 
[09:17] <Bilange> actually, the ubuntupeople has a good point: since I joined in the middle of threads/idea, it was way easier than on the ML to "scroll back" and read from the start
[09:17] <coopster> ompaul: agreed, bad term
[09:17] <jenda> welcome, nixternal. We postponed the first point on the agenda (ie. moved to the list)
[09:17] <nixternal> i seen...good idea because it is a big one ;)
[09:17] <matthewrevell> Bilange: That's an issue, but I believe that the benefits of using the official list outweigh that. We can point newcomers to the archives, in a friendly way.
[09:18] <nixternal> gobby or #ubuntu-marketing would be a better alternative for drafting objectives
[09:18] <matthewrevell> nixternal: I'd say the bulk of the work has to be done on the list, to give everyone the chance to contribute
[09:18] <nixternal> that too
[09:18] <matthewrevell> nixternal: Deciding on wording can be done in gobby tho'
[09:18] <Bilange> matthewrevell, in this case, we're missing an important feature, sticky/most important threads are going to be lost in the rest, unless we rely on the main wiki page or something to point newcomers to those important threads
[09:19] <bimberi> Bilange: yes, that's what the wiki should be for
[09:19] <jenda> Bilange: most important threads and results should be outlined in the wiki
[09:19] <jenda> A special place for that.
[09:19] <jenda> I'm noting this.
[09:19] <GazzaK> unless someone maintains a FAQ/Top Mails list?
[09:19] <matthewrevell> Bilange: Hmmm. I think sticky threads work for chat forums, and the like, but people get blind to them.
[09:19] <dotwaffle> Bilange: The alternative is to write a primer and a monthly "newsletter" psoted to the wiki saying whats been going on. Then people can feel better acquainted with the data before joining the discussion.
[09:19] <bimberi> nothing is sticky, till it's on the wiki :P
[09:20] <matthewrevell> bimberi: Ha :)
[09:20] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: Nice idea.
[09:20] <matthewrevell> GazzaK: Also nice idea.
[09:20] <jenda> dotwaffle: I don't think it needs to be monthly
[09:20] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle, jenda: Just kinda updated as and when necessary, yeah?
[09:20] <jenda> A special wiki page with outlines of what went on on the list is good enough.
[09:20] <matthewrevell> brb
[09:20] <Bilange> dotwaffle, you just gave me an idea. Ive seen on some newsgroup on the net a bot sending the same "welcome" message once every month/two weeks, to make sure newcomers has some starting point
[09:21] <matthewrevell> back
[09:21] <Bilange> maybe this could be applied on our ML?
[09:21] <dotwaffle> jenda: it needs to be frequent - so that if one hasn't been made in say... 2 months, it calls for one to be made nonetheless.
[09:21] <jenda> Bilange: technical detail
[09:21] <jenda> dotwaffle: OK
[09:21] <matthewrevell> Surely ad hoc is better? With most recent stuff at the top, blog-stylee
[09:21] <jenda> OK
[09:22] <Bilange> jenda, are you saying its impossible due to lack of resources?
[09:22] <jenda> I think this is decided.
[09:22] <dotwaffle> Not really editions of the publication, more of an updating of the recently discussed topics, what to know etc.
[09:22] <jenda> Bilange: I'm saying it's not the focus now - it's easy to add at any time.
[09:22] <matthewrevell> jenda: Yeah?
[09:22] <matthewrevell> jenda: Sorry, meant to type more before hitting enter
[09:22] <jenda> hehe
[09:23] <matthewrevell> Is everyone happy to go with a mailing list, using the wiki to offer a route into the important stuff?
[09:23] <jenda> OK, lemme sum this up so we can move on.
[09:23] <mindspin> yup
[09:23] <Bilange> matthewrevell, sure
[09:23] <bimberi> matthewrevell: +1
[09:23] <jenda> yep
[09:23] <nixternal> quick question...are we following the agenda in order or no?  did we go OT?   ;)
[09:23] <jenda> nixternal: we postponed the frist, this is the second.
[09:24] <Bilange> nixternal, what agenda? the bullet list on the MT/Meeting wiki page?
[09:24] <jenda> I believe we should not discuss the CC now - please read my note on the agenda and comment
[09:24] <nixternal> i thought the 2nd was "unify the team & achieve cc approval"
[09:24] <jenda> Bilange: yes
[09:24] <matthewrevell> nixternal: Got the first bit sorted :) 
[09:24] <jenda> nixternal: that's what we're discussing, without the CC
[09:24] <nixternal> roger that
[09:24] <jenda> agreed?
[09:24] <matthewrevell> jenda: Can you explain briefly...
[09:25] <coopster> jenda: i agree.  any member list we have right now needs to be pruned to only the active members
[09:25] <matthewrevell> jenda: ...what the process of becoming an official Ubuntu team is?
[09:25] <jenda> explaing what?
[09:25] <jenda> ah
[09:25] <jenda> matthewrevell: no i can't, haven't studied it.
[09:25] <jenda> Oh yes
[09:25] <jenda> thanks coopster, wouldda forgat
[09:25] <matthewrevell> jenda: AFAIK you have to show quite a lot before even applying.
[09:25] <ompaul> matthewrevell, it appears you do a job of work, you hand your needs to the CC and it goes forward from there
[09:25] <jenda> matthewrevell: I don't plan to apply any time soon
[09:25] <matthewrevell> ompaul: Cool.
[09:25] <nixternal> are we not an official ubuntu team?  we have LP, wiki, and members with Ubuntu support... ;)
[09:26] <matthewrevell> jenda: No, I tihnk we need to really prove what we can do first.
[09:26] <jenda> Let's not discuss that please - it's not important for the work we do.
[09:26] <jenda> matthewrevell: yes
[09:26] <matthewrevell> jenda: No?
[09:26] <jenda> We do what we can
[09:26] <bimberi> nixternal: i guess improving, formalising communication is part of that process
[09:26] <ompaul> jenda, there are several ubuntu members in the MT - getting it rubber stamped would not be too hard 
[09:26] <jenda> ompaul: once there is some results
[09:26] <jenda> coopster reminded me of an important point.
[09:27] <dotwaffle> Let's find out what we're doing before we get ahead of ourselves :)
[09:27] <jenda> Does everyone agree with member-list pruning?
[09:27] <ompaul> jenda, we have a need, there is a mission, we have goals, and you can't have a distro team after you do the first release 
[09:27] <nixternal> +1 dotwaffle
[09:27] <ompaul> :-)
[09:27] <mindspin> yup the membersilt thing
[09:27] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: It's good to know what we're aiming for :)
[09:27] <coopster> ompaul: i would think, results or no, having official team status is a plus, and we should do that provided it doesnt distract us from doing the things that make the results
[09:27] <_sara> yeah for the  member list pruning
[09:27] <matthewrevell> coopster: we won't get official status without results. Anyway, let's move on :)
[09:27] <coopster> k
[09:27] <nixternal> @schedule chicago
[09:27] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Chicago: Current meeting: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 09:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 15:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 15:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 15:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 07:00: Edubuntu
[09:27] <jenda> And does everyone agree with removing the wiki member list?
[09:27] <dotwaffle> what are the issues with the memberlist at the moment? Dud members?
[09:27] <matthewrevell> jenda: Yes
[09:27] <jenda> I'll contact all the people on it and ask them to join LP
[09:28] <bimberi> jenda: yes, go with Launchpad
[09:28] <jenda> dotwaffle: 70 of them
[09:28] <dotwaffle> jenda: I see. Ok. 
[09:28] <jenda> OK, any objections?
[09:28] <mindspin> yup launchpad
[09:28] <matthewrevell> jenda: no
[09:28] <jenda> OK
[09:28] <nixternal> whoa
[09:28] <jenda> settled.
[09:28] <nixternal> jenda..sorry
[09:28] <nixternal> hehe
[09:28] <nixternal> can't you put a person as inactive?
[09:28] <jenda> yes
[09:29] <nixternal> ok
[09:29] <nixternal> go on then
[09:29] <nixternal> ;)
[09:29] <jenda> but that wouldn't really serve the purpose, me thinks... to have 70 inactive 'members'
[09:29] <nixternal> if you don't get the response..put them inactive..don't delete just to be safe maybe
[09:29] <jenda> Next point: SPREADUBUNTU
[09:29] <nixternal> k
[09:29] <nixternal> go go go
[09:29] <jenda> nixternal: ok
[09:29] <dotwaffle> jenda: clarify statement please
[09:29] <bimberi> hopefully becoming inactive sends an auto-email
[09:29] <mindspin> jenda :are you talking about team members or mailing list subscribers?
[09:29] <jenda> I created a very, very rough plan of what I think SU should look like
[09:30] <jenda> bimberi: I'll send manually
[09:30] <jenda> http://crashhosting.com/Spreadubuntu-060628-jenda.odg
[09:30] <_sara> what is a odg file
[09:30] <dotwaffle> Open Document - OO.o will open
[09:30] <jenda> Excuse the quality, it's my first and was very quick
[09:30] <imbrandon> open document 
[09:30] <jenda> OD Graphics
[09:30] <bimberi> jenda: i'd call that a final myself :P
[09:31] <jenda> We need someone to create the website, and then we can work on the content. I think I can do a large part there of myself - it's just writing.
[09:31] <nixternal> umbrella ;)
[09:31] <jenda> (by which I mean anyone can work on it just as easily)
[09:32] <nixternal> jenda: i can do writing if needed
[09:32] <ompaul> jenda, from an accessabilty perspective more contrast :-) other than that I would shrink it to fit on a sheet of paper ;-)
[09:32] <jenda> nixternal: great
[09:32] <coopster> jenda:  i would think "donate" is a good thing to branch off of "What can I do?"
[09:32] <jenda> ompaul: please hush ;)
[09:32] <jenda> ompaul: that's a 10 minute sketchup
[09:32] <mindspin> what should it look like? 
[09:32] <jenda> just to communicate what I mean.
[09:32] <jenda> mindspin: it should look great ;)
[09:32] <dotwaffle> I feel thre key points need to be addressed: 1) Getting people to spread the disks - possibly talk to a PC magazine or something? 2) Getting people to create stalls at computer fairs etc 3) Possibly get a feature done about Ubuntu in a major paper in each country...
[09:33] <matthewrevell> I know we agreed to talk about general team objectives on the list, but I do think we need some discussion of what we hope we'll achieve with SU. it may seem obvious but there's no harm in discussing it.
[09:33] <mindspin> i mean Ubuntu-like (keep CD in mind)
[09:33] <jenda> Anyway - I'd like to see several inputs from several people. Any volunteers within the team?
[09:33] <matthewrevell> jenda: Sure thang
[09:33] <jenda> dotwaffle: those are the particular points to be described within.
[09:33] <jenda> OK
[09:33] <dotwaffle> jenda: ok, we should address points of focus individually now, then revise on the ML.
[09:34] <dotwaffle> jenda: sure.
[09:34] <jenda> I"ll paste what I said before to matthewrevell and ompaul in PM
[09:34] <mindspin> ok I could give a hand for html/CSS stuff, but I'm not really good in graphics and such
[09:34] <jenda> SU should have the two basic parts you see on the picture
[09:34] <jenda> mindspin: noted
[09:35] <jenda> That implies two basic goals:
 To welcome a new user who has just started using and loving ubuntu
 To offer to a user, who has decided to spreadubuntu, all that is needed to successfully do so locally.
[09:35] <Bilange> same as mindspin, plus some basics in PHP/MySQL. IANAA (i am not an artist) though :)
[09:36] <jenda> noted
[09:36] <mindspin> testimonials should be on the frontpage
[09:36] <thechitowncubs> I would love to help with graphics for spread ubuntu
[09:36] <mindspin> fine
[09:36] <bimberi> we could ask the Artwork Team for input
[09:36] <matthewrevell> bimberi: +1
[09:36] <GazzaK> And I will and am trying to spead knowledge in my local community
[09:36] <jenda> The idea is that people are best basic spreaders soon after they fall in love with Ubuntu
[09:36] <jenda> bimberi: yes, that was the plan.
[09:37] <jenda> mindspin: not sure about that, but it can be adjusted.
[09:37] <jenda> thechitowncubs: noted.
[09:37] <nixternal> thechitowncubs: help out Ubuntu Chicago while your at it ;)
[09:37] <matthewrevell> jenda: Is the idea to target new users, then?
[09:37] <mindspin> I think its a good welcome when you see you can share "the experience"
[09:37] <ompaul> http://www.freedos.org/
[09:37] <dotwaffle> A lot of canadians that I know found ubuntu not through normal channels, but in fact from Leo Laporte pimping it on Call For Help, a tech show in the US.
[09:37] <ompaul> sorry wrong place
[09:37] <jenda> matthewrevell: the idea is provide a DIYM interface
[09:38] <jenda> matthewrevell: which has an easy entry point for new users
[09:38] <jenda> You should be able to point "what is ubuntu" people to spreadubuntu.org
[09:38] <dotwaffle> is .org the best solution?
[09:38] <jenda> hoping that in a month, one in every fifty of them will think of convincing his family of installing the system, and the school in the next month.
[09:39] <dotwaffle> a .com should redirect there if possible.
[09:39] <coopster> dotwaffle: afaik we have .org and .com
[09:39] <jenda> dotwaffle: suggestions?
[09:39] <jenda> dotwaffle: try spreadubuntu.com
[09:39] <dotwaffle> all good, cheers
[09:39] <jenda> and .net
[09:39] <jenda> we don't have .org though.
[09:39] <jenda> will have to ask Jane how that's going.
[09:39] <mindspin> what about getting local domains which point to su.org
[09:39] <jenda> noted.
[09:39] <matthewrevell> jenda: What are your thoughts on getting people to spreadubuntu.org? 
[09:39] <ompaul> jenda, spreading - is one thing - what is, is done rather well on www. and how to use is done on docs/help/wiki 
[09:40] <ompaul> mindspin, na fragmentation 
[09:40] <jenda> ompaul: we won't go through how to use on SU
[09:40] <matthewrevell> Surely Ubuntu.com is the main destination, so assuming it's the right place for them to be, how do we get people to go to SpreadUbuntu?
[09:40] <mindspin> when i type verbreite ubuntu.de and will be linked to su.com where's fragmentation?
[09:40] <dotwaffle> matthewrevell: face to face referral
[09:40] <ompaul> jenda sorry I was reacting to: <jenda> You should be able to point "what is ubuntu" people to spreadubuntu.org <-- I now get your meaning there
[09:41] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: And that's all? I'm not saying that's bad, just think it's important to have an idea.
[09:41] <jenda> matthewrevell: that's secondary - if SU has a purpose and a form, pointing people there isn't a problem.
[09:41] <jenda> mindspin: could be done.
[09:41] <matthewrevell> jenda: But it is a problem :) It's *the* problem. 
[09:41] <jenda> spreadubunutu should be localised.
[09:41] <matthewrevell> It's not an insurmountable problem, though.
[09:42] <jenda> matthewrevell: it's secondary, IMO.
[09:42] <Bilange> graphically-wise: isnt it a bad idea to try to differ too much from ubuntu.com?
[09:42] <jenda> As long as we have a target audience and relevant content, users shouldn't be a problem.
[09:42] <ompaul> mindspin, the concept that spreadfirefox had initally - it had a really fast burn for a few months - it became a meme - and now has out lived its original meaning
[09:42] <mindspin> that's what I meant too what about ubuntus CD
[09:42] <matthewrevell> SpreadFirefox.com worked intitially because Firefox.com was nothing to do with the browser. So, it came up naturally in searches etc. The web and print are saturated with links to ubuntu.com.
[09:43] <coopster> Bilange: i'd agree, sticking to the basic layout of ubuntu.com is a great framework to start from
[09:43] <jenda> Bilange: not too much, but I want it to be easier - the front page.
[09:43] <ompaul> matthewrevell, yeap but a "spread" thing is like you have to try this 
[09:43] <Bilange> coopster, agreed :)
[09:43] <jenda> ompaul: +1
[09:43] <matthewrevell> ompaul: You mean it's spread by word of mouth?
[09:43] <jenda> SU is the "you have to see this" type of site.
[09:43] <jenda> matthewrevell: partly, yes.
[09:43] <_sara> it has to be atractive to the eye
[09:43] <jenda> Yes.
[09:44] <Bilange> actually, I never had a reply from the ubuntu.com webmaster, and mailed him on june 2nd or something
[09:44] <matthewrevell> jenda: Cool, fair enough. We have an answer - the primary way will be, for want of a better term, viral.
[09:44] <dotwaffle> personally, I think the Ubuntu.com is too unfriendly to average joe, spreadubuntu.com needs to be more of a "cosy" way of introducing you to the ubntu install process, maybe with links to the LULU book and the PDF to print yourself, so that they are mollycoddled throughout the entire isntall process.
[09:44] <jenda> matthewrevell: check.
[09:44] <Bilange> my point is: im not sure if we can use "his" design on SU
[09:44] <jenda> dotwaffle: not the install process, no.
[09:44] <matthewrevell> I just wanna make sure we know, rather than assuming we all think we know and then fin dout we have different idea later :)
[09:44] <coopster> dotwaffle: agreed
[09:44] <ompaul> matthewrevell, a bit of that a bit of guerrilla marketing - so we pick a date ohh lets say Sept and we aim to hit the ground with it then
[09:44] <jenda> dotwaffle: we would link to the docs where needed.
[09:44] <jenda> It should introduce the user into what ubuntu is
[09:45] <dotwaffle> jenda: not jsut the install, but the meaning behind what Ubuntu is, why it is good for you, why you should try it, and then HOW to do all this.
[09:45] <jenda> and offer the first steps on a silver platter.
[09:45] <jenda> dotwaffle: yes.
[09:45] <dotwaffle> At the moment, Ubuntu.com is a very... Corporate affiar.
[09:45] <jenda> yes
[09:45] <bimberi> dotwaffle: and intentionally so
[09:45] <jenda> spreadubuntu.org is meant to be user-aimed.
[09:45] <chris-t4> Slogan: Do you Ubunutu?
[09:45] <jenda> nice ;)
[09:45] <dotwaffle> Specifically when they see "Ubuntu 6.06 LTS"... That's such a bad choice of title, IMO.
[09:45] <jenda> Anyway, i believe this topic is exhausted.
[09:46] <dotwaffle> Agreed.
[09:46] <bimberi> jenda: +1
[09:46] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: +1 for this type of user
[09:46] <matthewrevell> jenda: No, hang on
[09:46] <matthewrevell> :0
[09:46] <matthewrevell> :)
[09:46] <matthewrevell> Just a quick point
[09:46] <ompaul> dotwaffle, it is entitled to be
[09:46] <jenda> everyone listen to matthewrevell 
[09:46] <jenda> ;)
[09:46] <dotwaffle> i'm sure he'll be audioblogging it on lugradio at some point anyway ;0
[09:46] <matthewrevell> Canonical have hired/are hiring a new webmaster. They're likely to be *very* busy, but it would be nice to ask silbs who this person is, so we can maybe have some involvement from them.
[09:46] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: :-)
[09:47] <jenda> hmm
[09:47] <jenda> matthewrevell: I'll note this, but since it's new to me, I have nothing to comment on.
[09:47] <Bilange> matthewrevell, of if this person is too busy, at least ask him/her permission to make a derivate work for out SU website
[09:47] <matthewrevell> jenda: Cool, just wanted to raise it.
[09:47] <Bilange> s/out/our
[09:47] <ompaul> matthewrevell, they will be made known to all - as will the artists in residence 
[09:48] <jenda> OK - anything else to SU?
[09:48] <coopster> matthewrevell: i would agree.  it can only help.  after we get SU up and running, i would imagine canonical would be more than happy to have a link to us, it's 'free' content for the,
[09:48] <jenda> 3
[09:48] <jenda> 2
[09:48] <jenda> 1
[09:48] <jenda> done
[09:48] <jenda> nekt
[09:48] <jenda> The Ubuntu Magazine.
[09:48] <_sara> my turn?
[09:48] <jenda> _sara: you're up
[09:49] <nixternal> ahh.. _sara =tikal....hey sara..sorry didn't know it was you
[09:49] <dotwaffle> if everyone can hold off comment until it's all been explained to us first ;)
[09:49] <_sara> We have a skeleton 
[09:49] <_sara> WE ghave agree to amkle a theme oriented magazine and agree that the first issue is going to be on a general intor to ubuntu.
[09:50] <_sara> amkle?
[09:50] <nixternal> lol
[09:50] <mindspin> make?
[09:50] <jenda> heh ;)
[09:50] <Bilange> is that make?
[09:50] <jenda> _sara: please continue.
[09:50] <bimberi> ah, well done mindspin and Bilange - i was struggling :)
[09:50] <_sara> I feel that at this point in time we need to get someting out and the master TOc would finalized from that
[09:51] <dotwaffle> I disagree - I think a magazine would be a bad idea. A regularly updated website yes, but a magazine relies on people readin from issue #1.
[09:51] <jenda> _sara: one question - who else has been working on the magazine, and how for are you?
[09:51] <jenda> dotwaffle: not true, IMO
[09:51] <bimberi> _sara: is this a physical publication?
[09:51] <_sara> ok , we have some memebers nixternal, Kensendme, Jenda (of course) and others
[09:51] <jenda> I only read issues #1 and #4 of the UWN
[09:52] <jenda> more work for jenda? ):
[09:52] <jenda> *:)
[09:52] <_sara> we want ot have a html and a pdf magazine also
[09:52] <matthewrevell> mgalvin: ping
[09:52] <jenda> right - didn't we decide on a base html with exports to pdf and txt?
[09:52] <jenda> matthewrevell: I was just gonna.
[09:52] <_sara> ok maybe I need tro explain the diff
[09:52] <matthewrevell> _sara: Where would this sit alongside Fridge, UWN? 
[09:52] <bimberi> _sara: please
[09:52] <matthewrevell> _sara: Ah :)
[09:53] <Bilange> bimberi, dont you think the fridge is quite developer centric and not much end-user centric? I thought the UWN was here to fix that
[09:53] <dotwaffle> why pdf? Why be contrained to a paper format? The web was developed to create something that is easier to sift through. In that respect, UbuntuGuide.org does pretty much the job of a magazine such as ComputerActive in Europe.
[09:53] <matthewrevell> Hang on, let's let _sara tell us where this sits :)
[09:53] <jenda> dotwaffle: please, that's a technicality.
[09:53] <dotwaffle> ok, I'll be quiet ;0
[09:53] <jenda> :)
[09:53] <_sara> The UWN is targeted toward memebers that are already involved in ubuntu, developers. We want a magazine that would help people familiarize themselves with linux and ubuntu for desktop use
[09:54] <_sara> pdf, some people like to print things out and read while on the bus or subway, spread ubuntu, 
[09:54] <_sara> some members don't have internet access on their ubuntu 
[09:55] <mgalvin> matthewrevell: hey guys, sorry i gotta run out for a bit :-/, is it quick?
[09:55] <matthewrevell> _sara: Sounds like a good aim to have. Have you considered that it might be better to write articles for the publications that these people read already? (Assuming that's possible). It's big job to entice people to a magazine about something they're unfamiliar with.
[09:55] <jenda> ah )
[09:55] <mgalvin> :)
[09:55] <GazzaK> +1 to pdf format
[09:55] <matthewrevell> mgalvin: Just wondered if you'd be interested in the discussion of Ubuntu Magazine and how ti relates to UWN
[09:55] <jenda> Let's please leave the technical details out for now (formats)
[09:55] <matthewrevell> jenda: +1 We need to choose that after we know who's reading.
[09:56] <bimberi> Bilange: yes, that's fair (held off responding to give _sara the floor)
[09:56] <_sara> yeah we discuss that already, but we just could not find a magazine that has the level of graphical explanation taht we want
[09:56] <jenda> matthewrevell: I believe the magazine could be read, for example, by SU-drafted newbies.
[09:56] <mindspin> I agree with the idea of getting ubuntu into the regular press
[09:56] <nixternal> OK. Here in Chicago we have "FREE" news stand/boxes. Usually you see music stuff, IT stuff, the Onion and what not in there for people to grab and read while on the train to the city. I want to stuff one full of Ubuntu if and when the time comes!!!
[09:56] <matthewrevell> jenda: Cool.
[09:56] <jenda> it has the same type of spirit - building an UBuntu hype :)
[09:56] <matthewrevell> _sara: Right, cool. What sort of publications did you look at?
[09:56] <mindspin> nixternal: kinda expensive on the long way...
[09:56] <nixternal> FREE!!
[09:57] <jenda> nixternal: sure, fund it ;)
[09:57] <nixternal> the print is the only cost
[09:57] <_sara> We are thinking sometinh like an Ubuntunized Tux magazine
[09:57] <matthewrevell> nixternal: Let's chat about tha ton the ML, Mr Moneybags :-D
[09:57] <jenda> -technicality-
[09:57] <nixternal> my brother law owns his own print shop..so i could get a decent deal
[09:57] <mgalvin> matthewrevell: i am very interested in it, sadly i have to run out for about an hour or 2, i will catch the log when i get back and comment on the -marketing list
[09:57] <matthewrevell> mgalvin: Nice one!
[09:57] <jenda> nixternal: noted - you should'nt have mentioned that.
[09:57] <dotwaffle> Getting people to give away free CDs is one thing, but to print and distribute leaflets? it's easier for them just to say "goto spreadubuntu.com and click on the 'What's hot?' button". 
[09:57] <nixternal> hahah
[09:57] <_sara> yeah printing the magazine and hav ethe Loco treams distribut it with CD's
[09:57] <nixternal> it is for meh
[09:58] <nixternal> _sara: that is where i wanted to go with that..but didn't...thank you for stressing the LoCo point
[09:58] <matthewrevell> Anyway, let's activate the "Let's not get ahead of ourselves" button :)
[09:58] <dotwaffle> oh you mean pre-printed that we distribute?
[09:58] <mindspin> that means localized magazines
[09:58] <jenda> dotwaffle: +1
[09:58] <_sara> yeah, but that is in the future, for now  a magazine that anyone can print
[09:58] <_sara> Let me give you an example
[09:58] <jenda> but - let's not discuss the technical details PLEASE
[09:58] <matthewrevell> jenda: Such as printing?
[09:59] <jenda> yes
[09:59] <matthewrevell> Okay.
[09:59] <_sara> ok lets talk about the content, The important part
[09:59] <matthewrevell> I'm starting to think that might be the main differentiator of this, though.
[09:59] <jenda> _sara: I'd like to keep the meeting very general.
[09:59] <mindspin> In my view a magazine about a distro will not be read by joseph(ine) noob
[09:59] <dotwaffle> I agree that it would be great to have a magazine like Linux U+D, Linux Format or Linux Magazine to promote Ubuntu, but that's very costly and requires editors etc that would have to give up a substantial amount of time.
[09:59] <_sara> We aim to be more neewbie friendly
[10:00] <dotwaffle> _sara: is there an analogue that we can have a look at to see what you mean?
[10:00] <jenda> _sara: so - we should only go as far as the relationship with the fridge and UWN goes, the target audience - but not the content itself please. An ubuntu magazine meeting would be great for that.
[10:00] <_sara> analogue?
[10:00] <jenda> the tux mag, eg.
 We are thinking sometinh like an Ubuntunized Tux magazine
[10:01] <ompaul> jenda, that is a huge effort
[10:01] <_sara> Jenda sure, We could expand on articles with the UWN
[10:01] <jenda> ompaul: yes, we're smaller
[10:01] <jenda> so the mag will be.
[10:01] <ompaul> what I think would work great in this space is a simpler thing
[10:01] <matthewrevell> _sara: really? UWN is more a "what's happening now in the ubuntu community" thing,.
[10:01] <dotwaffle> _sara: sorry, an exmaple.
[10:02] <_sara> The UWN had an article on , but a newbie might need more information
[10:02] <dotwaffle> s/exmaple/example/
[10:02] <jenda> I expect the mag to leech a lot, wherever possible.
[10:02] <_sara> hold on
[10:02] <jenda> THe SABDFL has expressly allowed leeching on his blogs ;)
[10:02] <bimberi> yes, an example/mockup would help with understanding
[10:02] <ompaul> one mag that is released with the s/ware release - it says what it is where you can get it - what exciting new stuff is in there and and how you can give it to others and it is legal
[10:03] <_sara> The UWN had an article on TOmboy ( I think), but their explanation did not explained on how to use it
[10:03] <bimberi> ompaul: goes a bit stale though (like the release :P)
[10:03] <matthewrevell> bimberi: 
[10:03] <matthewrevell> sorry
[10:03] <ompaul> bimberi, that is the idea
[10:03] <ompaul> bimberi, new one once ever 6 months
[10:03] <ompaul> and continious job 
[10:04] <matthewrevell> _sara: Okay, cool.
[10:04] <mindspin> It should look like a eighties fanzine, cheap and selfmade it would be nice in concern with viral/guerilla marketing
[10:04] <matthewrevell> _sara: So, this sounds like a magazine section to SpreadUbuntu, almost. Going for the same people.
[10:04] <jenda> Anything else on the subject (in general?)
[10:04] <matthewrevell> mindspin: You should add "not" after that :0
[10:04] <ompaul> mindspin, that is so 20 years ago ;-)
[10:04] <mindspin> hehe
[10:04] <jenda> matthewrevell: spreadubuntu doesn't encompass everything, but it will cooperate.
[10:04] <_sara> matthewrvell, yeah Jenda not for now I would send an e-mail concerning our next meeting
[10:04] <matthewrevell> jenda: I'm talking in terms of the target audience
[10:04] <mindspin> retro-look
[10:05] <jenda> _sara: OK
[10:05] <jenda> I consider the topic closed in...
[10:05] <jenda> 3
[10:05] <bimberi> having seen the discussion, i feel there _is_ room for such a thing.  If people have the time/energy then go for it
[10:05] <matthewrevell> Let's continue the discussion on the mailing list.
[10:05] <jenda> dan
[10:05] <jenda> *damn
[10:05] <jenda> :)
[10:05] <jenda> 3
[10:05] <jenda> 2
[10:05] <jenda> 1
[10:05] <jenda> boom
[10:05] <jenda> next?
[10:05] <nixternal> How do we interact with Canonical, who is our Contact point?    simple...Jenda....we go through Jenda..he goes to Canonicall...chain of command is nice
[10:05] <nixternal> next?
[10:05] <jenda> wait...
[10:05] <nixternal> ;)
[10:06] <jenda> sorry
[10:06] <jenda> just remembered one thing concerning LP
[10:06] <dotwaffle> LP?
[10:06] <nixternal> launchpad
[10:06] <dotwaffle> opk
[10:06] <dotwaffle> ok
[10:07] <jenda> I set the team to give out 30 day memberships on the first time around. with year log renewed memberships. I'll explain why - then ask if anyone objects.
[10:07] <dotwaffle> seems rational
[10:07] <jenda> What we have now is oer 70 inactive members who just hang there.
[10:07] <nixternal> htrsy ofrs
[10:07] <nixternal> great idea LOL
[10:07] <nixternal> fingers weren't home
[10:08] <jenda> Now if someone joins, I don't want to go hunting them down to ask them if they really mean it.
[10:08] <jenda> I'll just give them a month long membership and if they show up during that month - it gets renewed.
[10:08] <_sara> makes sense
[10:08] <matthewrevell> jenda: Does the renewal happen automatically, somehow?
[10:08] <nixternal> +1
[10:09] <jenda> Now a year is a very long time, so I think it's reasonable in order to prevent corpse stacking.
[10:09] <_sara> +1
[10:09] <jenda> matthewrevell: no, admins do that.
[10:09] <bimberi> jenda: "show up" meaning?
[10:09] <matthewrevell> jenda: Nice phrase.
[10:09] <ompaul> that relys on you knowing they are there - if spread generates interest you will have a full time job hitting renew
[10:09] <dotwaffle> bimberi: presumably contribute
[10:09] <jenda> yes
[10:09] <jenda> in some way
[10:09] <matthewrevell> dotwaffle: Who defines a contribution?
[10:09] <jenda> I don't think membership is a status of any sort
[10:10] <jenda> it's only there to inform who works and who doesn't
[10:10] <dotwaffle> matthewrevell: how about "something other than mindless chatter and idling"?
[10:10] <bimberi> matthewrevell: exactly (again :) )
[10:10] <jenda> matthewrevell: it's not defined, it is judged, by the admins of the team.
[10:10] <_sara> How?
[10:10] <jenda> if anyone disagrees with the decision of an admin, there are always places to complain
[10:10] <matthewrevell> jenda: Well, it is defined, if only in the admin's brain sub-consciously :) My point, though, is that it's going to be difficult to know all and see all
[10:11] <matthewrevell> jenda: Being practical, though, it sounds like a good idea.
[10:11] <jenda> no one claims to do so.
[10:11] <jenda> (see all)
[10:11] <matthewrevell> +1
[10:11] <matthewrevell> :)
[10:11] <bimberi> actually it will encourage more communication - hopefully of quality
[10:12] <jenda> I mean, if tikal tells me person A has shown up and written an article and wants to continue, it's a sure thing.
[10:12] <jenda> Currently, the owner of the team is Corey Burger, and the two administrators are thechitowncubs and I
[10:12] <matthewrevell> Cool, it sounds like a good way to avoid a meaningless list.
[10:12] <_sara> ok, that way it works, more communication 
[10:13] <jenda> that seems to be rather arbitrary - so I think we'll adjust that with regard to activity within the team.
[10:13] <jenda> OK
[10:13] <jenda> done, next
[10:13] <bimberi> aww, i want a countdown </kidding>
[10:13] <matthewrevell> Contact point/interaction with Canonical.
[10:13] <jenda> 3
[10:13] <jenda> 2
[10:13] <jenda> 1
[10:13] <jenda> done?
[10:13] <jenda> :)
[10:14] <bimberi> \o/
[10:14] <jenda> er... I have "* How can we work with Ubuntu Weekly News and The Fridge?"
[10:14] <matthewrevell> jenda: Oh, sorry, yes
[10:14] <jenda> Ok... I guess this one waits for mgalvin
[10:14] <jenda> Canonical
[10:14] <matthewrevell> :)
[10:14] <matthewrevell> Okay, Canonical is recruiting a Communications Manager
[10:15] <matthewrevell> See ubuntu.com/employment
[10:15] <nixternal> UWN- we can contribute our idea, a-jenda...but everyone should try to contribute to UWN
[10:15] <matthewrevell> One responsibility is marketing
[10:15] <jenda> So far, jane has been the only thing I needed of Canonical, and she is interested in our activity.
[10:15] <nixternal> im bad, as i only check out the fridge for meeting times and dates
[10:15] <matthewrevell> Jane will be passing this sort of thing over to the new Comms Manager though, AFAIK, on a day to day basis.
[10:15] <jenda> Oh right, @UWN - we will be writing updates to it about the team activity. I took that as my responsibility for the start.
[10:16] <jenda> matthewrevell: I know, I envy the foo that gets that job </ot>
[10:16] <matthewrevell> jenda: Oh yeah, dream job mate :)
[10:16] <matthewrevell> Jane, as you say, is really interested in what we're up to.
[10:17] <jenda> I think that solves our canonical problems for now, don't youthink?
[10:17] <jenda> Any remarks?
[10:17] <matthewrevell> Well, I wasn't thinking so much aobut who ... more what.
[10:17] <jenda> ah
[10:17] <jenda> I think that will pop up as needed.
[10:17] <matthewrevell> I just think we should have a think, and discuss another time, about how we work with our friends at the big C.
[10:18] <jenda> I think we should first get the first projects up and then show them we mean it ;)
[10:18] <Bilange> how about another contact point in case Jane not contactable?
[10:18] <matthewrevell> jenda: Fair point :)
[10:18] <Bilange> (backup contact, or something)
[10:18] <matthewrevell> bimberi: I think this new Comms Manager will fulfil the role.
[10:18] <jenda> Bilange: think it's necessary? she's the COO
[10:18] <jenda> matthewrevell: +1
[10:18] <jenda> anything else?
[10:18] <jenda> 3
[10:18] <jenda> 2
[10:18] <jenda> 1
[10:18] <Bilange> COO?
[10:18] <bimberi> matthewrevell: er, ok
[10:19] <nixternal> chief operating officer
[10:19] <jenda> ok... next?
[10:19] <jenda> "How can we work with LoCoTeam teams to improve press coverage in non-English language media?"
[10:19] <Bilange> nixternal, thanks :)
[10:19] <matthewrevell> jenda: Now this is from Jane, so it nicely links up :)
[10:19] <_sara> First, is ther ea list of Loco teams
[10:19] <bimberi> _sara: yes, on the wiki ...
[10:19] <jenda> I have very good experience with working in open formats (svg is great) to allow easy translations.
[10:20] <nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoTeamList
[10:20] <dotwaffle> jenda: I think first we have to specifiy where are most important battlelines must be drawn - one certainly is in the far east, another in Germany/France, probably another in Scandinavia. I think the South Americas will sort themselves out...
[10:20] <jenda> Let's discuss the general issue please
[10:20] <bimberi> ah, thanks nixternal
[10:20] <matthewrevell> I see our role here as largely support to the loco teams
[10:20] <jenda> What do we want the LoCo teams to do, apart from translating the material?
[10:20] <nixternal> notice the Ubuntu-Chicago ;)
[10:20] <_sara> Maybe we just need to get in contact with them and figure out what they might need or want
[10:21] <matthewrevell> jenda: Contact local press that Canonical and the wider Ubuntu community can't reach, either because of language barrier or because they don't know about those outlets.
[10:21] <nixternal> there is a LoCoTeam mailing list
[10:21] <dotwaffle> _sara: We need to give them guidelines too though, what they ought to be doin
[10:21] <Bilange> train the LoCo members so _they_, too, promote ubuntu in their local area?
[10:21] <Bilange> train or give the proper tools, whatever you see fit
[10:21] <matthewrevell> Bilange: This is more specifically about contacting local media. 
[10:21] <dotwaffle> training is going to be hard, witht he physical barrier and all
[10:21] <matthewrevell> Give support, rather than train
[10:22] <bimberi> nixternal: no central one to my knowledge
[10:22] <mindspin> there are definitely marketing/press activities in the several countries
[10:22] <nixternal> there is one
[10:22] <nixternal> i subscribe to the LoCo team list since I am in the process of creating #ubuntu-chicago
[10:22] <jenda> bimberi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoTeamList
[10:22] <jenda> oh, mailing list ;)
[10:22] <jenda> yes there is.
[10:22] <matthewrevell> So, shall we take this onto the mailing list? Basically, work out what we can offer them and perhaps establish a press contact for each country/language, similar to what gnome has
[10:23] <bimberi> ah yes, loco-contacts
[10:23] <jenda> OK, spreadubuntu is the source of DIY Marketing material
[10:23] <_sara> yeah, we need to have  someone who speaks the language
[10:23] <jenda> We want the LoCos to translate that material.
[10:23] <mindspin> mailing list would be fine, I know some people here in germany who are on the list but not in the team
[10:23] <nixternal> +1
[10:23] <_sara> I think the transalationt eam would do that
[10:23] <jenda> _sara: the LoCo's will provide that, we can't possible cater for all.
[10:23] <_sara> I mean as a contact point
[10:23] <jenda> I'm on the list, and am a member of the Czech LoCo team.
[10:24] <matthewrevell> jenda: We want the locos to use the right material for the situation. It may be thta they produce material that feeds back into SpreadUbuntu.
[10:24] <nixternal> i have spoken to other LoCo team leaders, and it seems they do a lot lf translation in their teams...so it might be a good idea to get them involved in translating it..unless we want to "hire" some translators ;)
[10:24] <matthewrevell> But yes, SpreadUbuntu is a good place for this.
[10:24] <jenda> matthewrevell: yes, but they don't do that specifically as loco teams (except perhaps testimonials)
[10:25] <jenda> nixternal: we will hire from the locoteams - it is their interest and 'duty' to translate. Trust me ;)
[10:25] <matthewrevell> Okay, I think we've got a general agreement that we like the idea. So let's flesh it out on the list.
[10:25] <_sara> I am on the spanish translation team, and as far as I know we do all the spanish translation that ubuntu needs
[10:25] <nixternal> jenda: +1
[10:25] <jenda> matthewrevell: +1
[10:25] <_sara> +1
[10:25] <nixternal> +100
[10:25] <jenda> :)
[10:25] <jenda> done-doe
[10:25] <jenda> Anything else regarding LoCo Teams?
[10:25] <jenda> 3
[10:25] <jenda> 2
[10:25] <jenda> 1
[10:26] <jenda> splash
[10:26] <jenda> * Decide how this affects the Marketing wiki pages.
[10:26] <nixternal> wiki:   MarketingTeam <- main page...everything under it...i.e, MarketingTeam/Meetings....MarketingTeam/Members....stuff like that
[10:26] <jenda> Agreed
[10:26] <nixternal> +1
[10:26] <dotwaffle> ++3
[10:26] <jenda> the magazine and spreadubuntu have seperate pages
[10:26] <nixternal> plus every other team does it that way ;)
[10:26] <jenda> we'll fix that.
[10:26] <matthewrevell> nixternal: Not so much structure, fo rhtis one. More: our pages are out of date, let's get em refreshed :)
[10:26] <nixternal> yes jenda
[10:26] <jenda> matthewrevell: yep
[10:26] <nixternal> yes matthewrevell...tis why i am on the wiki team
[10:26] <nixternal> ;)
[10:26] <jenda> I'll work on SU
[10:27] <matthewrevell> Cool, next?
[10:27] <matthewrevell> :)
[10:27] <jenda> Now in this regard, i need to step back a bit.
[10:27] <jenda> Project Leaders
[10:27] <jenda> We forgot that.
[10:27] <jenda> So...
[10:27] <matthewrevell> ?
[10:27] <jenda> do we want/need project leaders?
[10:28] <matthewrevell> Hmmm ... yes, at the very least to champion each project.
[10:28] <_sara> just for the sake of structure and organization
[10:28] <Bilange> for the sake of spreading out the job, sure
[10:28] <dotwaffle> I think jenda and matthewrevell know what they're doing, if we go for project leaders (and I suggest we do) then they would be my candidates of choice.
[10:28] <_sara> definetly
[10:28] <jenda> So - let me propose a project leader for the Ubuntu Magazine.
[10:28] <jenda> Does anyone object to _sara leading it?
[10:28] <nixternal> welll...there would be more then 2 projects..hence more then 2 project leaders
[10:28] <bimberi> _sara: seems the natural choice from this meeting
[10:28] <jenda> Does _sara want to lead the Ubuntu Magazine?
[10:29] <nixternal> jenda: sara should lead it..she has been doing a hell of a job
[10:29] <_sara> ok,
[10:29] <nixternal> she motivates us ;)
[10:29] <matthewrevell> _sara +1
[10:29] <nixternal> +1
[10:29] <jenda> Any objections can be brougt up later :)
[10:30] <jenda> Till the end of the meeting ;)
[10:30] <dotwaffle> how much is there left togo?
[10:30] <jenda> _sara: You do have the CoC signed, right?
[10:30] <jenda> dotwaffle: a bit
[10:30] <nixternal> we need to work on creating projects b4 we talk about leaders though...but yes, for projects already created appoint away
[10:30] <_sara> what is the CoC
[10:30] <jenda> Code of Conduct
[10:30] <mindspin> !coc
[10:30] <_sara> not yet
[10:30] <jenda> _sara: we can go through that after the meeting.
[10:30] <_sara> ok
[10:30] <jenda> You will need to sign the CoC ;)
[10:30] <ompaul> The Ubuntu Code of Conduct to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere can be found at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/
[10:31] <matthewrevell> SpreadUbuntu has got to be Jenda, I'd say. I imagine the previous person running the SU side of things isn't returning
[10:31] <ompaul> _sara, if your stuck signing it, contact me - on irc or ompaul @ ubuntu dot com and I will give you a dig out
[10:31] <GazzaK> but to sign it you need a key, but this key is difficult to get if you know no other linux users/geeks :-(
[10:31] <_sara> i got a key recently
[10:31] <jenda> GazzaK: it doesn't have to be signed
[10:31] <ompaul> GazzaK, same again
[10:32] <nixternal> gpg --gen-key
[10:32] <nixternal> follow along
[10:32] <jenda> let's move along
[10:32] <jenda> I'm willing to lead Spreadubuntu.
[10:32] <jenda> Any objections?
[10:32] <jenda> :)
[10:32] <ompaul> nixternal, this aint the place - keys don't have to be signed - 
[10:32] <matthewrevell> jenda: None here
[10:32] <mindspin> nope
[10:32] <ompaul> but the CoC does have to be
[10:32] <Bilange> This whole key stuff is confusing me alot-- is there some background info about how this stuff works (and why this is important)?
[10:32] <nixternal> didn't say they have to...just lettin' um know how to create a key
[10:32] <jenda> Bilange: not here, not now
[10:32] <ompaul> Bilange, contat me after this 
[10:32] <Bilange> ompaul, okay
[10:32] <ompaul> I'll take anyone through it
[10:33] <matthewrevell> All agreed Jenda to lead SU?
[10:33] <nixternal> plug gpg --gen-key doesn't get a key signed
[10:33] <nixternal> +1 on jenda
[10:33] <jenda> OK...
[10:33] <_sara> +1
[10:33] <ompaul> nixternal, its the CoC that gets signed - please leave it 
[10:33] <bimberi> +1 jenda
[10:33] <jenda> Now - we have avoided the Media Project
[10:33] <_sara> Media Project?
[10:33] <jenda> matthewrevell?
[10:33] <matthewrevell> Have we?
[10:33] <mindspin> yup
[10:33] <mindspin> we have
[10:33] <ompaul> jenda, you have taken 1.5 hours to get this far :-)
[10:34] <jenda> _sara: The admin of ubuntupeople has closed down the project without notice - matthewrevell might know more.
[10:34] <matthewrevell> I'd like to set up a project that supports the Ubuntu community, and canonical where appropriate, it dealing with the media. Details are on the wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PressTeam ... not a team really, but a project of MT
[10:34] <matthewrevell> jenda: long enough dude? :-D
[10:35] <jenda> perfect
[10:35] <ompaul> a sub team of 
[10:35] <matthewrevell> Jane has expressed interested, as have a few people. I say we take it onto the ML to flesh it out.
[10:35] <jenda> yes, matthewrevell are you happy with coining it the Media Project? (as opposed to the Press Team)
[10:35] <mindspin> I'd like to join, I do part-time PR here
[10:35] <matthewrevell> jenda: Yeah, sounds good.
[10:35] <matthewrevell> mindspin: Love to have you :)
[10:36] <matthewrevell> jenda: Name can be thrashed out, if necessary, in ML
[10:36] <nixternal> move it to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam/MediaProject ???
[10:36] <dotwaffle> Media Relations Project? otherwise it sounds like we're making a video podcast...
[10:36] <jenda> OK... since most haven't read the wiki, there's no point in discussing further. I propose matthewrevell as the leader of that.
[10:36] <bimberi> "library of ready-made press releases" - great!
[10:36] <dotwaffle> matthewrevell.support++
[10:36] <Bilange> dotwaffle, +1
[10:36] <mindspin> +1
[10:36] <bimberi> +1
[10:36] <jenda> agreed
[10:37] <matthewrevell> Cool.
[10:37] <jenda> the MRP ;)
[10:37] <jenda> OK, topic close
[10:37] <jenda> d
[10:37] <dotwaffle> How about dotwaffle's band of media brothers - I like that even more ;)
[10:37] <jenda> One more thing - does the Marketing Team need a leader?
[10:37] <dotwaffle> It needs a point of contact for Jane etc.
[10:37] <jenda> I believe previous experiences point to: no
[10:37] <matthewrevell> jenda: Yes.
[10:37] <dotwaffle> Not a leader, but a point of contact, certainly - I think
[10:38] <matthewrevell> I'd say you're the obvious choice, but perhaps we should put this to the ML as it's the biggest decision.
[10:38] <Bilange> maybe leader isnt the right word for that position... "central point" maybe?
[10:38] <jenda> I can act as the contact for the MT - I have for at least two months now.
[10:38] <ompaul> it is called Contact Point
[10:38] <dotwaffle> contact_point.jenda.support++
[10:38] <matthewrevell> +1
[10:39] <Bilange> ++ (+1 for the non programmers :P)
[10:39] <jenda> matthewrevell: will you take that one on your shoulders?
[10:39] <jenda> Bilange: ah :)
[10:39] <matthewrevell> jenda: I'll raise it on the list tomorrow.
[10:39] <jenda> thanks
[10:39] <matthewrevell> np
[10:39] <dotwaffle> there are non-coders on here? shoo, shoo =)
[10:39] <matthewrevell> Okaay, let's get wrapped up, I want to see my wife at some point today :)
[10:39] <digitalmouse> I realize I am a bit late in adding my 2 cents, but I was a part of the early forum discussion and with the original poster had started on a CMS/template design for the magazine (a combination website/pdf download).  I would still like to contribute to the development of the website, as well as offer up my skills for pdf production (my background includes desktop publishing), and authoring the occasional article.
[10:39] <Bilange> dotwaffle, im not :)
[10:39] <jenda> matthewrevell: forget it ;)
[10:40] <dotwaffle> Bilange: Neither am I, raelly ;)
[10:40] <matthewrevell> digitalmouse: Let's take specifics to the ML or a magazine meeting
[10:40] <jenda> digitalmouse: _sara is the leader of the Mag now, and there will probably soon be a Mag meeting.
[10:40] <digitalmouse> I thought the mag was to be discussed here? (I notice it was earlier)...   but, as you wish.
[10:40] <jenda> OK, case closed?
[10:40] <matthewrevell> yup
[10:40] <jenda> 3
[10:40] <jenda> 2
[10:40] <jenda> 1
[10:40] <jenda> closed.
[10:41] <jenda> * Mailing list moderator(s) required to take strain from Jane Silber.
[10:41] <jenda> I propose each project leader to be a moderator.
[10:41] <ompaul> there is no moderator
[10:41] <jenda> administrator, then.
[10:41] <ompaul> that implies censorship
[10:41] <bimberi> spam-filterer
[10:41] <matthewrevell> ompaul: Well, it is censoring spam :)
[10:41] <ompaul> hehe
[10:41] <digitalmouse> politician then? :-p
[10:42] <jenda> sara_: that's a much more tab-completion friendly nick. THanks ;)
[10:42] <bimberi> eww
[10:42] <jenda> opinions, suggestions, volunteers, please ;)
[10:42] <matthewrevell> Okay, shall we see how it goes with project leads? Our friendly contact point can raise it with silbs.
[10:42] <sara_> sorry I got disconeected so I don't knwo where we are?
[10:42] <jenda> mekeke
[10:42] <jenda> noted
[10:42] <Bilange> (jenda, there was only one nick with _ as the first character, hence faster to complete.. I liked _sara more)
[10:43] <jenda> Bilange: but I don't type _ as often, so it's more diff. ;)
[10:43] <matthewrevell> Objections?
[10:43] <digitalmouse> as I mentioned before, as well as in the original forum thread, I'll volunteer for some mag-related duties since I've already started on CMS development and PDF generation
[10:43] <sara_> I haven't seen you pdf stuff. Do you have  sample?
[10:44] <matthewrevell> Everyone happy to clos ethis one?>
[10:44] <jenda> OK folks
[10:44] <sara_> +1
[10:44] <jenda> this topic is closed as well.
[10:44] <jenda> 3
[10:44] <jenda> 2
[10:44] <jenda> 1
[10:44] <jenda> done
[10:45] <digitalmouse> mostly my work is programming pdf-generation code that is pulled from database sources, but I believe I still have some desktop-publishing content that was converted to PDF... will have to dig up the old CD archive for that
[10:45] <matthewrevell> Excellent :) You can tell it's been a good first meeting as we've all come away with far more to do :)
[10:45] <jenda> Now, since that was the last topic on the a-jenda, I'd like to thank you all for coming - and wish you a good night!
[10:45] <matthewrevell> I must shoot. Been great being here, catch you all later!
[10:45] <Bilange> great meeting :)
[10:45] <dotwaffle> Anything I can be getting on with? Student with little to do for the next few months ;)
[10:45] <jenda> I'll try making a "minute" now.
[10:45] <jenda> [Nirvana] : you _just_ missed it ;)
[10:46] <[Nirvana] > hehe.. great
[10:46] <ompaul> AnyOne who wants to know how to sign the COC can join me in #Signing101
[10:46] <[Nirvana] > stupid time zones
[10:46] <Bilange> nirv: nice timing, jenda just said its over BEFORE you joined
[10:46] <bimberi> ah, i've seen matthew's post - there was a decision ;)
[10:46] <jenda> Bilange: I don't think nirv came here for the meeting ;)
[10:47] <Bilange> I guess you know more than I do :)
[10:47] <jenda> bimberi: I have two pages full of notes which imply decisions made ;)
[10:47] <[Nirvana] > jenda: I did, missed out on the time zone changing
[10:47] <jenda> ah
[10:47] <jenda> sorry, Nirvana
[10:47] <[Nirvana] > @schedule Toronto
[10:47] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Toronto: Current meeting: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 10:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 16:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 16:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 16:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 08:00: Edubuntu
[10:47] <bimberi> bimberi: no i meant the last point (list administration)
[10:47] <jenda> I can send you a log immediately if you wish
[10:47] <[Nirvana] > updating korgac time :P
[10:47] <jenda> bimberi: ah ;)
[10:52] <rodarvus> @schedule Sao_Paulo
[10:52] <Ubugtu> Schedule for America/Sao_Paulo: Current meeting: Marketing Team | 29 Jun 11:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 04 Jul 17:00: Technical Board | 05 Jul 17:00: Edubuntu | 06 Jul 17:00: Ubuntu Development Team | 12 Jul 09:00: Edubuntu
[10:54] <digitalmouse> ah sara is Tikal
[10:55] <digitalmouse> I see no mention was made of the work I've already started on the mag  :-(
[10:55] <digitalmouse> oh well